#lounge
rugged storm
ancient hornet
put water bottles in the freezer
freeze then
take one out and put it in front of your fan
and replace when melted
fathom wadi
buy an Egyptian peacock fan and waft yourself through history. For only 9.95 plus sales tax.
plucky pagoda
I keep my tower under an A/C
light spruce
You guys are all stupid. The solution to this is obvious.
Put the computer outside.
plucky pagoda
The heat builds up in the room without an A/C
ancient hornet
objectively yes, in practice when you time it well you can freeze the water when the temperatures are more ok (like at night) to help during the day
fathom wadi
live in Siberia. Free air conditioning.
Think of the overclock you can get in Siberia
I bet a Ryzen is a good 10% more efficient in Siberia ๐
ancient hornet
joke aside datacenters build themselves in iceland and co for a reason ๐
plucky pagoda
I mean if you're really hard up then a fan blowing on ice is pretty much a cheap evaporative cooler. freeze some gallons of water put them in a plastic bin and rotate them out.
fathom wadi
iceland is also a nice place to look around and say "the shop is miles away. Fancy a walk? No? Amazon again then..."
I love landscapes like that. Especially the volcanic ones
light spruce
Of course, evaporative cooling only works worth a shit if the relative humidity is low
rugged storm
it's fine in every other room except mine
plucky pagoda
We could start a go fund me for a $1 gallon of water and a $4 fan.
fathom wadi
Have you tried swapping the air from another room?
ancient hornet
I bet it's because your room is the one with the PC on 24/24 ๐
light spruce
Yeah, you kinda have to have air changes and/or a large enough volume that you can offset the output
plucky pagoda
Airflow through a house is something you need to think out if you're not using central a/c
fathom wadi
I stocked up on half a dozen fans when they told us it's our fault the world is heating up. I thought. In for a penny then....
light spruce
I would probably argue that it's important in both cases, but I'd say it's actually more important with central HVAC than with localized
plucky pagoda
Yeah, but with central it's usually already handled by an air return and ducts anyway.
light spruce
a window unit will cycle air... central, you're just shoving more air into a room
what is this fancy world where you have more than one intake?
I seem to recall a friend actually did have to put in a return vent for precisely this reason. But it's not what I'd call "standard installation" by any means
plucky pagoda
How many colors you think I should use to texture a landscape with just color nodes on layers?
ancient hornet
texture a landcape?
light spruce
Not enough information.
plucky pagoda
yeah
light spruce
what does anything else look like?
plucky pagoda
low poly, cel shaded
light spruce
Are you doing the classic main color + shadow or do you also have highlights?
plucky pagoda
No shading in the texturing.
Just solid colors applied procedurally.
Here, this is rough though and the layers are still all mixed up.
light spruce
I meant for whatever your regular models are
plucky pagoda
same,
light spruce
so just flat color
plucky pagoda
solid colors, with post handling lighting and shading
Like should I dived the stone into two shades? grass too?
Idk, I guess I'll just play around with it
light spruce
I'm not talking about the textures. I mean if a guy has a solid color khaki pants... does it just get a shadow on it or does it also get a highlight?
plucky pagoda
It looks like this
You could say a highlight and a shadow from lighting is accurate.
I shouldn't have worded it the way I did. It's dynamic lighting that gets adjusted in a post process material.
light spruce
I would say three per surface type. Two with roughly equal distribution with not more than a 10% intensity difference with each other. And a third that's like a "detail" color that maybe only shows up less than 20% of the time and is more like a 25% intensity difference from the others. Darker or lighter depending on the surface type.
plucky pagoda
Sorry, my kid is driving me nuts. I think I made it sound more complicated than it is. I just adjust the highlights and shadows in the post process material.
It's nothing fancy.
it's getting there.
fathom wadi
This is driving me nuts. I've done everything feasible to try avoid those shoulder torus shapes from outlining broken chains ๐ฆ
light spruce
One of the things you can do is do the basic cel shading type thing and then let the rest of the post processing go nuts on top of it.
plucky pagoda
I just bought a rigged jesus model, about to make something ridiculous.
fathom wadi
A sequel to Jesus Christ SuperCommando (by EvilX games) ?
plucky pagoda
Someone made a joke about jesus doing a fortnight dance and I was instantly like "I'm on this."
fathom wadi
"Let us Pay"
light spruce
it's called a "tithe"
plucky pagoda
ok, really disappointed that googling that did not find me a game.
fathom wadi
its really old now. Probably an archive one sec
plucky pagoda
if you want to see the best and most tasteless thing to come out of newgrounds , I suggest Mr. Happy Face.
fathom wadi
hmm it's not even archived. I wonder why
Maybe because it had some questionable parody on there I dunno
plucky pagoda
idk, found one mention of it on reddit and a dead link
plucky pagoda
LOL, that pope mobile
fathom wadi
They made ganja farmer too which was kinda meme level at the time
plucky pagoda
with the spikes and guns
light spruce
@zinc matrix https://www.raywenderlich.com/146-unreal-engine-4-cel-shading-tutorial that's one of the ways you can do it. Somewhere I have a project with some other batshit craziness that has multiple bands without using a LUT by manipulating the normal mapping and texture matched colored lines that stay inside the model.
light spruce
oh, so it's a retheme of paratrooper
PTROOPER.EXE
but did it have a crafting system and a skill tree?
light spruce
should have had a crafting system and a skill tree
I just realized that I'm assuming it had climbable towers. Let me guess: none of those either
That's definitely a thing I need to do. Along with unsubscribe from like 75 things on YouTube
I'll put that on my list of things that I absolutely will not be doing after I get out of the shower.
junior meteor
get him some shoulder armor
@fathom wadi
CyberRaceNeveSleeps
1 is there a way to add UI button to my phone app, to take UIless screenshot and save it into galery?
2 any of you are 3d artists modeling 3d objects? I made an app, want to know if you will benefit from having this app too or its just me...
light spruce
And then I combed my beard backward to look like more of a lunatic
foggy path
This is the kind of groundbreaking feature more AAA titles need
I wrote a grammar structure based movie title generator algorithm... lol
Similar to markov chains it has a tendency to generate overly long ones though which is a bit inconvenient
light spruce
well ... the images have the classic Hollywood "floating head" going on
foggy path
lol
I thought about adding some kind of system where it could have heads and bodies and it would be able to attach them together to stop the floating head effect...
but it's probably funnier this way :D
although a cat head on a human body would be pretty funny too
light spruce
I like to use predictive text on a software keyboard to see both a) how off the rails I can get a sentence and b) how long it takes to fall into recursion
foggy path
Yeah, I probably need to bias towards choosing "Noun" as word type if it goes past a certain word length
light spruce
like today seems like a great day to have a great week to have a great day to have a great week IN HELL
foggy path
since it can only end the title in a Noun, ending it on "The" or an adjective would make it even more nonsensical than now
light spruce
The Utter Despair of The
foggy path
although I guess I could allow it to end titles in adjectives as well, given things like "The Fast and the Furious" exist
but it would probably just do something like.. "The Red"
or... "Your Lethal"
:D
light spruce
Existential Crisis An
I use a random name generator to name projects and systems that I'm working on.
foggy path
yeah I have some other experiments with that in this project
I have a markov chain based movie tagline generator :P
light spruce
Gorilla Hitman is my current testing ground project
foggy path
haha
that sounds like one of the movie titles my previous algo used to generate
it was literally just random_word + random_word
gotta add "gorilla" and "hitman" into the nouns list...
light spruce
https://www.behindthename.com/random/random.php?number=2&sets=1&gender=both&surname=&usage_rap=1&usage_trans=1&usage_wrest=1 that's what I use which just vomits out some unholy combination of rapper, transformer, and professional wrestler
foggy path
haha
light spruce
And then I'll pick two things out of it.... because, much like your title thing, "Flava T Cripple-Hit" would be a bit long-winded
Incidentally, this is the exact same system I'm using for naming things in my Subnautica playthrough
foggy path
You can name things in Subnautica now?
light spruce
You can name beacons, the Seamoth, and the Prawn. I haven't built a Cyclops, so I don't know about that.
I've never played it before now
foggy path
Ohh right you could name those
Yeah I played it a while after it was free on EGS, was pretty good
light spruce
So, I dock the DSV-Roid Crush at Slick Biceps
foggy path
I think I named a planet "Hulk Hogan" in No Man's Sky lol
light spruce
my bigass spaceship in Empyrion was the "SSV Balls Deeperer"
"Fat E Arcana" A wizard of hip-hop or a hip-hop wizard?
"Hold up. I'mma drop some dope rhymes and turn you into a wet moth"
light spruce
I'm just going to spend the rest of my existence watching Let's Game It Out apparently
foggy path
I wonder if something like thispersondoesnotexist.com would require stupid amounts of training data to be integrated into a game ๐ค
light spruce
not sure. above my pay grade
tulip orbit
you get paid?
light spruce
... why do you think it's above my pay grade?
tulip orbit
I wish I was getting paid!
tulip orbit
๐คท
rich quiver
thorny dock
is that made in templeos?
what zomg posted lol
can't quite remember but it looks like its that crazy os where you can render 3D in ascii files essentially, maybe it's just your font lol
light spruce
it's available as a shader, actually
I used to put together ReShade settings for people. Had a friend ask me for an Arma 3 one. This is what I sent him.
median wraith
Twitter
rigid shoal
university
light spruce
what's wrong with that?
rigid shoal
Very rarely do I see Americans call college 'university'.
light spruce
"college" is mostly used as the concept with "the university" referring to the entity and/or campus
"I'm in college, so I have to go up to the university to get covid and die"
zinc matrix
Its over
rigid shoal
I'm in college, so I have to go up to the [college] to get covid and die
Said no American college student ever.
Shit, I know this girl who wants to go to college in-person early 2 months and is paying 12k for it.
light spruce
now you might use university campus and college campus interchangeably
zinc matrix
Some people code minecraft and get rich. Some people code whole OS and freeze on street
Answer: code less
light spruce
Source: am American. Live in college town. University is present.
Generally named "University of <state> (at <non-primary city campus>)" for state schools, "<Probably some guy's name> University" for private ones, and a community college is "<who the fuck knows> Community College"
And to make things more ridiculous, you'll have shit like "The School of Applied Sciences" which is an organizational division over several departments... and some places it would be "The College of <whatever>" instead.
zinc matrix
Ye man i feel u
Theres no hope
Do you think college is the answer to all questions
fluid bloom
I still don't know what a college is
if someone says they graduated from college I have no idea what that actually means ๐
light spruce
it's the same thing as a university
light spruce
Why is there elementary, grade, and primary school? Why is there junior-high and middle school? Why did the British decide that Humphry Davy wasn't allowed to call his discovery "aluminum" and insisted on spelling it "aluminium"?
fluid bloom
also why sodium instead of natrium!
and grizzly bear instead of brown bear
moose instead of elk
light spruce
What degrees you can get depends on the school and the programs they have available. Not all of them have masters or masters for everything. Same with PhD program
light spruce
there are different brown bears so... that one's kinda weird.
and an elk and moose aren't the same thing in North America
fluid bloom
yup
they call wapitis elks
original settlers got confused there
they thought the wapiti was the elk from europe
and started calling them elks
then they stumbled upon the actual elk, and since they already called wapitis elks they started calling the actual elks mooses
light spruce
but they're all fucking deer and you can eat them
fluid bloom
what?
zinc matrix
NOthing
soft night
nothing at all right
zinc matrix
Joni vs jani vs john
zinc matrix
i want to live forever
junior meteor
Come and Gift your Souls to Progress
zinc matrix
coome and give
you kno wi never get these chrismtas videos "its great to share"
no its not tbh ngl
zinc matrix
is there bigger script kid than John?
wet smelt
its only great to share when youre the one receiving
but when ur the one who's asked to give
"sOrRy Im ToO bRoKe"
mossy nexus
Naa. If you have something to share, and you know the person or people who receive it are going to benefit from it then hell yeah I'll share. It feels nice to really treat someone, even better if it's unexpected too.
zinc matrix
vvhat if they later ruin your life
sage tendon
Once there was a guy who made some fundumental software, but didnt do much with it. One day some blokes showed up and bought it from him for a small amount. Not so long after, it was running on most computers. The company that bought it became one of the biggest pillars in the tech industry..
It doesnt matter if you share it for free or sell it for a quick buck, in the end, you cant know the potential until its brought to that point
In the perfect world, there wouldnt be a monetary system, just humans doing human things, everything would be public, imagine the progress that would bring to the human kind
No big tech companies sueing others just to maintain their profitable dominant market position, but open-source comminuty driven platforms, equally accesable for everyone
wet smelt
Once there was a guy who made some fundumental software, but didnt do much with it. One day some blokes showed up and bought it from him for a small amount. Not so long after, it was running on most computers. The company that bought it became one of the biggest pillars in the tech industry..
@sage tendon microsoft type beat
mossy nexus
If the entire world spent all of it's military spending on humanitarian and ecology needs the world would be a much nicer place. If our driving force was learning about ourselves, the world and beyond instead of greed and collection of material gains. Until then, we still have Star Trek ๐
zinc matrix
calm down sons this world will be saved
first from apple by epic
then from epic by john industry
wet smelt
i think microsoft was big even before they bought minecraft ๐
@zinc matrix i think he meant ms-dos
"fundamental software"
and 2.5 bn wouldnt be considered small
fringe sundial
@sage tendon the most deployed software, in the entire world, is SQlite database
we are talking each PC has at least 5 different versions
and phones also have a few of them
and its even on airplanes and random devices everywhere
and this was a personal project of some guy, open source, who just wanted a database to embed in plane software, so he developed a tiny SQL db that didnt need servers or anything of the sort
btw unreal has it inside
D. Richard Hipp designed SQLite in the spring of 2000 while working for General Dynamics on contract with the United States Navy.[14] Hipp was designing software used for a damage-control system aboard guided-missile destroyers, which originally used HP-UX with an IBM Informix database back-end. SQLite began as a Tcl extension.
from wikipedia
you really never know
similar with Linux
sage tendon
ye well, i was talking about dos
zinc matrix
yeah he should sell it
foggy path
I wonder why it isn't enabled by default if UE has it
It seems they really want to enable everything you don't need by default lol
sweet matrix
How are you guys today?
light spruce
I'm dead inside
sweet matrix
At least your outside is good though right?
light spruce
BUT MY INSIDES ARE ON THE OUTSIDE
sweet matrix
Oh, there's your problem. Maybe you need some orange juice.. that always makes me feel better
light spruce
not without vodka
light spruce
and you can listen to Reel Big Fish non.stop.forever.
proud pier
So
Fortnite New Season Starts Tomorrow. Not on mobile (except personal Android store AFAIK). How much money will be lost?
ancient hornet
probably not as much as we think
I wonder if Epic will comply and restore Fortnite to it's "not escaping Apple payment" state or not
the judge told them to do so or to stay blocked until the lawsuit is done so they don't really lose much
they just need to put the VBucks price at the more expensive version in the meantime
there was already a lot of publicity how users can buy VBucks for cheaper anyway?
jovial talon
They'll loose a few 100s M$
According to their current PR they're not planning to rollback anytime soon
ancient hornet
we'll see, I'm on the fence myself between those two outcomes ๐
light spruce
I can't believe no one commented on Reel Big Fish
that's the important takeaway here
carmine frigate
i havent played a game on my phone since snake on my nokia
light spruce
plot twist: hasn't had a phone since Nokia was made out of Nokium
carmine frigate
bet it still boots up ๐
ancient hornet
Google and Apple operate more or less in lockstep with respect to privacy.
interesting
zinc matrix
vhy apple players cant just login to fortnite on computer and buy
the vbucks
for cheaper
EZ
hearty sundial
so why couldn't vbucks be cheaper in mobile? It could be a mobile thing only ๐
ancient hornet
more expensive you mean?
because Apple and Google require a 42% markup to prices to get their blood money ๐
hearty sundial
Hmm you are correct. My calculations were wrong.
and boy 42% is really a big chungus amount of percentage.
now imagine being a foreign country guy who also needs his income to be converted to his own currency.
people should just stop making mobile games <.<
zinc matrix
its over for apple
plucky pagoda
Shocking, a company whose money is made almost entirely on harvesting user information takes a stance against requiring notifying users when information is collected.
rich quiver
expect lost is 50% of ads will be gone because of ios 14
subtle harness
What machines are you guys using? I'm trying to decide on multiple Intels 10c at high clock with having those as usable separate machines that way, swarmed and XGEed for compilation and build, vs a huge Threadripper to do it on a single machine.
Intel 10900K core at 5.1 is about 30% faster than each 3950X core, so being easier to cool 3x 10900K than 3970X, together with added bonus of being separately usable...
Thoughts?
rich quiver
facebook target ads are attack ads
ancient hornet
why does the facebook app need that?
you are already logged in no?
they don't need to identify you more
subtle harness
This is not good. We need apple in the market. It's one of those rare companies putting quality ahead of other things.
Imagine being forced to use an Android phone... :runsinhorror:
ancient hornet
imagine a world without Apple devices
updated OpenGL versions
Vulkan
no Metal
the dream
hearty sundial
Whats wrong with Android? I am using for 7 years I had no issues D:
subtle harness
Well, Metal is a far better API than Vulkan to be frank. ๐
hearty sundial
My father uses ipad and I have NEVER EVER seen such a problematic device before.
plucky pagoda
It would be a big mistake for Facebook to let itself get dropped.
proud pier
Shocking, a company whose money is made almost entirely on harvesting user information takes a stance against requiring notifying users when information is collected.
@plucky pagoda lol
hearty sundial
Facebook got an exclusive deal from Epics maybe ๐
plucky pagoda
Someone would jump into that space in a nanosecond
light spruce
I'm imagining being stuck using Apple's shitty phone launcher with their absolute dogshit organizational system
subtle harness
What problems you had on iPad?
But really, have you seen the performance?
rich quiver
they got until ios to update the app or remove the app from the store
proud pier
I really hate Apple, but I don't think they are doing anything wrong personally
Epic Game Store is a closed garden as well
But yes, PC does have multiple platforms to sell games
However, consoles don't.
broken sigil
But epic store is not the only store on the platform, that's a massive difference
proud pier
So where's the hate there?
light spruce
herecomesthecirclejerk
ancient hornet
Well, Metal is a far better API than Vulkan to be frank.
it hardly is and it's a pain that a single platform is playing different just to cultivate their illegal lock in
hearty sundial
Dude, even connecting a USB was total madness to it. Call me biased if one desires but hell man. You have to download an app JUST to get the items. Like hell? I am a PC user for 30 years. I plug in the USB, I get in the data. Why the hell would I need a random app that I need to find in internet JUST to get the items into my ipad?
ancient hornet
Epic Game Store is a closed garden as well
that is SO wrong
ancient hornet
you clearly have no idea what those words mean
proud pier
I actually do ๐
It's not an apples to apples comparison, I wasn't trying to make it as such
It's the same as FB vs Apple now though
subtle harness
One thing that worries me much more than Apple is consoles. Epic is not attacking consoles and not only consoles have the same 30% cut, but you also have zero - 0 - access to not only the store, but SDKs. You can't even learn to use them, let alone install anything yourself.
Apple has their SDKs and homebrew for free and you can publish for a trivial fee of $100/year.
So, Epic attacked Apple for their own sake only, they don't care about other things.
ancient hornet
EGS is in no way or form a Walled Garden
broken sigil
Even if it is on pc you have other choices
light spruce
@plucky pagoda So... bourbon and tortilla chips? Popcorn gets stuck in my gums.
proud pier
The thing about it is, what if you broke sweat and tears to make something awesome.
Everyone loves it.
You spent A LOT of time/money on this platform.
ancient hornet
then you become a monopoly and get broken down
proud pier
Honestly, it's up to you however you want to do with it
ancient hornet
for the good of society
ancient hornet
it's BS
proud pier
(probably others I don't immediately know about)
ancient hornet
people that own an iPhone don't have a choice
proud pier
They do
ancient hornet
- Android takes 30% too
- the issue is that people don't change phones often
proud pier
They can get an Android or Windows phone
ancient hornet
you are completely missing the point I see
plucky pagoda
None, that are widely used. Some other mobile OSes though.
proud pier
Everyone is taking 30% lol
This "30% thing against apple or google is silly"
everyone worth their salt is 30%
except Epic
ancient hornet
and ?
median wraith
na government takes the 25% and build roads
proud pier
(I didn't includes itch, because that's debatable if you can make any decent money)
proud pier
lol
No one cares about anyone else's platform
I remember back in the days it was 30% to devs
Big Fish Games and such
those glory days
ancient hornet
at least the intermediates had REAL costs to themselves at the time
median wraith
learn from MS Victor, and put absurd prices on Steam to cover the 30%
proud pier
Now we get 70%
ancient hornet
Apple has $200B saved in cash
they CLEARLY don't need ANYTHING remotely close to 30%
proud pier
These guys spent A LOT OF TIME/ R and D/ etc to dev these platforms
proud pier
This is actually pretty risky, basically you are saying that anyone who makes money because they are smart shouldn't and they should give money to others freely
ancient hornet
if you have too much power and misuse it, you are breaking the law
Apple has too much power
Apple is abusing it
=> illegal
proud pier
Everyone worth any decent amount of money can have too much power though
ancient hornet
and?
proud pier
As I said, it's silly reasoning
ancient hornet
anyone can take a knife and kill a passerby on the street so I guess we might as well not punish that at all?
proud pier
And very risky
ancient hornet
those big companies have too much power and so are a risk to society that needs to be reined in
proud pier
Future repercussions need to be considered.
ancient hornet
this is about the future
proud pier
If let's say, Apple or Google is required to drop any % of rev share
light spruce
the argument could be made that it's not even 30% for equivalent products because you aren't getting someone's version of a game; they're unique products. You also may not choose or be able to ship something on every platform. It's a dumb argument. Just like saying 30% is too much is merely an opinion and one based on incomplete data.
proud pier
You can expect huge repercussions
Less R&D, updates, more stringency for devs (or maybe even players)
Nah, it's not good
ancient hornet
oh god, Apple will not be valued at $2T anymore? Apple will not have $200B in cash anymore?
proud pier
As a dev, you should consider all possible outcomes
ancient hornet
what will the world go to!
light spruce
It's also a percentage of a chosen selling price which kinda goes directly against "price fixing"
proud pier
Don't let "oh I'll make more money, and they won't" be your reasoning
hearty sundial
Apple could still ask 80% of the income you make. You make an agreement with them and accept it.
You don't like it? Don't do it.
ancient hornet
one simply doesn't get in the Apple position without extremely exaggerated gross margins on everything they do
proud pier
Aye, this is what contracts/agreements are here for
You can choose not to go on the platform
ancient hornet
clearly they could lower their share and the iPhone prices by a lot and still pay for EVERYTHING they do
proud pier
If you do, you need to follow rules
ancient hornet
rules are <<< law
hearty sundial
One could say Apple's 30% is absurd. And one could be correct. But it's RATHER obvious that people don't actually REALLY mind it.
proud pier
Nope ^
ancient hornet
if you have too much power, you aren't allowed liberty to do what you want anymore
new rules apply to you
people don't mind it also because Apple forbids any app from making it more obvious how stupidly insane it is
30% share is a 42% increase in the price of an item
hearty sundial
People could just stop using Apple then.
light spruce
You need better arguments.
hearty sundial
And guess what, it would actually hurt Apple to not be able to get income.
fallow finch
Hey guys
How can i know if this item is commercial usage allowed ? https://sketchfab.com/3d-models/broom-fd007cd7f27648678e263c137f30a6c8
hearty sundial
It's always a negative thing when someone says "well I won't do anything with Apple but Android or PC!"
ancient hornet
Apple has like 60% gross profit margin ๐
they are out of scale ๐
one doesn't get that much profit margin without gouging EXTREMELY their customers
(which means users and app sellers here)
light spruce
opinion; conjecture
ancient hornet
opinion?
ok it's 40%
for their whole thing
still insane for a company of that size
hearty sundial
while I still think 30% is too much for today's standards, companies like Apple will only lower that percentage when people truly just start using other iOS and whatnot.
light spruce
again, opinion. not statement of fact.
hearty sundial
not because a multi-billion company smacks them.
proud pier
Another thing to consider. Let's say by some chance Epic does win against Apple and Google. And they reduce %.
What happens when Epic (or Tencent) wants more money from consoles? Now consoles who thought they were safe (and supported Epic) may be screwed. Future repercussions.
ancient hornet
https://www.investopedia.com/articles/personal-finance/093015/whats-good-profit-margin-new-business.asp
https://www.apple.com/newsroom/2020/01/apple-reports-record-first-quarter-results/
slippery slope argument
and anyway
if Epic wins their case it's pretty specific since they define the "iOS App Store market" itself as the target
proud pier
I'm not against Epic winning here.
ancient hornet
if a judge rules that consoles are monopolies too and they are abusing their position
light spruce
just restating repeatedly with more conviction doesn't make it an absolute truth of the universe
ancient hornet
then so be it
proud pier
I just think everything needs to be considered.
ancient hornet
I doubt it'll happen though
proud pier
And in the end, I hope us developers don't get fucked.
ancient hornet
we are already getting fucked
hearty sundial
I got the feeling we might. ๐
ancient hornet
it can't go worse ยฏ_(ใ)_/ยฏ
proud pier
No, it can.
ancient hornet
Apple App Store market might better be defined as a Monopsony than a Monopoly
hearty sundial
the thing is. when, multi-billion companies smack each other's butts, they can just put rules that damage each other to win, which only damages us.
imagine Patreon going "no more supporting Unreal Engine projects".
because for whatever reason they found reasonable.
sure, Epic would lose money, but devs would be the ones going down
ancient hornet
rules are rules and anti trust is a MAJOR component of having healthy capitalism and economy
hearty sundial
"healthy capitalism" just made me giggle, thanks!
ancient hornet
if some market is too important that you cannot break it, it needs to be communized and managed by state actors
quiet narwhal
@fallow finch read the license on the page
ancient hornet
In line with this, the Supreme Court ruling did not only advance support for an Apple monopoly among iPhone users. It also supported the possibility that a monopsony existed against Apple apps developers.
https://www.boldbusiness.com/digital/apple-apps-store-monopoly-monopsony/
my take on that is that, if Epic loses, lawmakers will adjust laws so that they apply, at least in EU
and in regards to the 30%
Twitter
and Apple bulshitting about "changing phone platforms all the time"
Twitter
that one will be interesting to see how they intend to prove that ๐
hearty sundial
lets just hope epic makes its own phone
call it Unreal Phone
why not
tis c00l
a phone that can play unreal engine games etc faster because ios is unreal too etc.
hearty sundial
see? a true heaven awaits us
also unity games shouldn't work on it
"due to technical reasons" ofc.
ancient hornet
what we need isn't another incompatible platform or apps lock in per platform
what we need is Steam portability of our games between PC and smartphones
as users ๐
rich quiver
November 13 is maybe the date that ps5 release
undone light
I thought I'd work smart and try drawing up a font for my game project. But turns out that you can only draw fonts using vectors instead of raster. So all my menu button text is going to have to be hand-drawn.
foggy path
you could just draw a vector font, no?
zinc matrix
imo you should be able to ssell steam games easily
obviously most steam users dont play 99% of their games
and cant sell them
undone light
I don't know how to draw using vectors, so that is a big time cost. Then there are other technical issues when handling font for buttons.
zinc matrix
just type text in textfield?
foggy path
There's tools that can convert bitmap graphics into vectors. Maybe worth checking
undone light
I'm planning to use bubbly / pop out buttons for the game, so text fields wouldn't work to begin with. (Text that is sometimes withina boundary, then pops out of the boundary when hovered over)
foggy path
But tbh if you only need text on a few buttons or such, it's probably easier to do images for the buttons
You'd only really need the font if you have a lot of dynamic text
undone light
I got overly lazy when hand-drawing text and just blindly thought "I'll make an alphabet and re-use it"
lapis gulch
I have a question for you guys, I would really like to create a game that I can sell commercial even if it is only $5.
The question is how complicated should you go as a SOLO person if you want to start such a project?
I'm just thinking about what I should do exactly to make sure that a game is good enough to earn money.
I was planning to build a kind of metal gear solid game with a cover system and a mission where you have to steal something and sneak past the guards and get away again.
About 3-4 maps with this mechanic packed into a game and sold it.
Is that enough?
How exactly would you approach something like that? Or would you rather just go FPS + a few zombies and no idea where to run through a labyrinth.
foggy path
I think that sorta stuff is kinda hard to answer
it really depends on what the perceived value from your game is - does it look like it's worth 5 bucks to a person who plays the types of games you're making?
lapis gulch
The question as well is how long does it need to be i mean i can make 1 mission like 20 or 30min depends how much you sneak around or how many options i allow to get to the target point. and package like 3 maps of similiar size into it.
But i am not sure if i shold use a KIT what have most of the logic allready in place or if i shold do it from scratch.
The point is if i use finished KIT i have less work but i have almost 0 knowledge how to fix anything thats probably not working. So if the games comes out has lot of bugs i probably dont even know how to fix them.
The other point is if i create everything from scratch i would take MONTHS or YEARS to just get to the point of like KIT that i can buy for some bucks.
foggy path
Well, length is also one of those "it depends" things
You can have a really really amazing 30 minute game
or a super mediocre 3 hour game
and overall in such a case the 30 minute one might be more enjoyable for its players
that kind of thing also depends on the type of game you're making, some games lend themselves better for shorter playsessions, and others longer
lapis gulch
Yes for example if i use the KIT with a nice designed map and i try to "implent a mission" goal so the most stuff i have to do would be creating awesome map that you can use for your advantage, IS that enough to even sell ? I mean in my eyes its not AAA qualty or not SUPER perfect for example the animations etc they not alle TOP NOTCH but it could be fun to play around sneak around and play for a while, but still i am not sure i need to deliver more or less or sometimes i see other games that look so banana that i am like .... what this sells?
median wraith
@fallow finch well you only need to read the licenses are listed at the bottom of the models https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/4.0/
lapis gulch
My motivation came littel bit after i saw memory bright and some background infos he had like 2 months for the logic and around 1 year for the maps to create and total it was liek 6y i think he sayd.
What i saw in the game is followingstuff:
- menu > start game
- some videos with some talking
- tutorial start play thing where you can test your fuctions
- some random AI dogs and soldiers that aproach you just just gun them done
- 1 boss with some skills
- a small puzzle with this circles to rotate
- some more random small ai
- an end boss
The logic behind the player was mostly a FPS logic with 3 types of wepaons pistole riffle and that sword. and combo skills for this things.
I dont know if that sounds a lot but it sounded pretty fast forward the hardest thing are probably to make your combos work with your charachter and that you have AI that is littel bit brainy not like zombie.
and he litteraly got like 2-4mio over steam with that game.
foggy path
yeah all sorts of games can work out, it's a combination of many things that determines whether people will enjoy it or not
nova herald
Don't feel bad about humble beginnings.
foggy path
it's difficult to say up front whether an idea is good or not
usually it's a good idea to try and make a prototype of the basic game mechanics
foggy path
this way you can start testing it out to see whether it's fun or not
fallow finch
@fallow finch well you only need to read the licenses are listed at the bottom of the models https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/4.0/
@median wraith Thanks mate i 've read it but it was little bit confused for me but now its clear
lapis gulch
Jeah thats right i am just not sure if i rather shold start creating the game myself like every logic or rather use a KIT the thing is i littel bit newer to unreal engine that means i know littel bit of everything but not enough to like "yes this is there" more like "its somwhere here lets youtube it"
I currious if i rather shold try to build it myself first to get littel bit grip of the engine since if you work with a KIT you probably have no idea what everything does and you just sitting there without any clue.
foggy path
If the kit is cheap and/or contains what you need, might be worth starting with that
You could build a prototype quickly with it, and then see where it goes from there
If the kit is difficult to work with, you could always add some custom logic to go together with it
Just because you started with it doesn't mean you can't add custom stuff into it :)
lapis gulch
True that so you would recomend useing it further build a prototyp and see if its "fun" somehow
But the prototy just with blockout right no real textures nothings just cubes and pipes and yes
foggy path
I think the important thing is to try and keep things simple and easy to modify
In my game project, I've changed many of the systems I built initially to work in different ways as the project has grown
It would have been difficult to make them work "correctly" up front because I didn't know what "correct" was
so I just built them to be simple and easy to modify, so if I had to make it do something else in the future, it would be easy to do so
lapis gulch
The thing that sometimes gives me headache is like "who the hell pays money for walkign around trying to find paper and escape" but the same thing in metal gear solid made most fun for example infiltrating a base without any alarm just kill everbody inside as silent as possible even there was no mission there i just repeated it over and over.
Best example was Code Zero or how it was called this 1 map with nothing else just a rescue mission and some soliders with a big base ... but i still played it for hours evenit was litteraly the same thing just different ways.
What i currently got is 2 tutorial video packs with the foundamentals of building worlds and one of the engine itself i think they pretty good just to get crash course of stuff i never used or didnt know they exist.
thin storm
zomg is right, start out with somthing simple, there is soo much stuff to iterate on. you can spend a week just on the muzzle flash vfx.
lapis gulch
True that i just follow usualy my own rule of "what ever i create shold be good enough to sell" Normaly if i do something in my other job i can sell it directly since its good enough for the market but it was allways dream to work with unreal engine and not just beacuse of that, beacuse they offer so much stuff every month, that its almost waste to not use it.
I am currious if you would recommend FPS over TPS or other way around.
thin storm
third person is super hard compared to fps. because you need all the animations and they need to be good in order to have fun playing with them.
rigid shoal
FPS is fucking hard.
thin storm
nothing is easy though.
lapis gulch
Wait what you mean FPS is hard Floss?
And yes thats something i feel too like the animation need to be lot better for thrid person.
Croaching or jumping or looking around is lot easyer on fps compare to TPS
thin storm
on the other hand, the ALS stuff makes it way easier. because you only need to make poses instead of entire animation sets. you also need a very good and cool character, while fps can be an unknown dude or girl.
lapis gulch
You talking about that? i was thinking to rather dont use that at all it says Advanced user and its not good for using in a project at all they even write you cant create game with that.
thin storm
yeah if you are new, try make a mario game or something to learn how stuff is down in ue.
lapis gulch
So i wasnt e ven sure i gonna work with it, the thing i tryed was the tutorial map and all the animation where super awesome worked wonderfull but not sure how thatstuff works there so much blueprints and stuff that i have no idea where to even start editing it
zinc matrix
guysss
rigid shoal
I think FPS is... at least double the difficulty of TPS.
lapis gulch
Really, but in what perspective ? like what exatly is harder?
rigid shoal
The art and the code. Pretty much all aspects.
lapis gulch
@thin storm would you recommend ALS even as newer person since it looks hell as complicated compare to like regualr stuff, even it looks 100 times better.
lapis gulch
Idk i made some top down shooter logic to learn first then som TPS i mean idk i never really checked much of the animation part
i denftly would need to read more about animation system
to understand more
thin storm
there are tutorials from UE staff on the the yt channel. they are really good. start with them.
lapis gulch
To be honest i almost thinking of working on Top Down shooter again ... that one was pretty cool i just abadoned it because no idea i hadn any idea what to do with it just shooting around wihtout goal is littel bit boring.
mossy nexus
If you use ALS it will add a significant amount of overhead in your performance.
lack of replication may be an issue, depending.
lapis gulch
you mean it cost more pc resource to work properly ?
mossy nexus
yes
lapis gulch
i not realy care that much about that what i more fear is that i am not understanding anything.
ALS sounds like you need the ALS project as BASE project and build from there
at least that what i read.
i am not sure you can implement it that easy into other existing project
mossy nexus
It certainly requires a significant amount of time to blend it with existing stuff.
There are other locomotion assets out there, can't really say how good they are though. I have MoveIt! which is cpp based, it's fairly new so doesn't have all the bells and whistles like others yet. It's decent in what it does.
thin storm
you can just migrate it like all the other stuff, but getting your character to work properly and if you already have player logic, you have to rewrite/transfer all that stuff to the als player bp. takes time.
but like nothing is easy in game deving. lol
mossy nexus
except procrastination
thin storm
excatly.
lapis gulch
I see ok then i try my luk further play littel bit around since i really really want to do something with unreal engine and i see so many great videos that i almost shold do something with it hahah. The only thingy that triggers me is when i have a super good idea but like "no idea to even create it" Its deftly not easy at all.
thorny dock
honestly you would have more time trying to figure out how to get ALS to work then you would trying to learn how to set up something similar your self
at least in my experience
lapis gulch
The thing that is mostly important that i getting littel bit low ideas is the GOAL of a game like why you play it... running around just shooting enemys sounds like dumb somehow ... even some games litteraly based around that theme and are nice to relaxe just go around and shoot for fun.
thin storm
youtube.com/c/UnrealEngine/playlists?view=50&sort=dd&shelf_id=17 start with one of these, they are old but gold.
lapis gulch
jeah i subed to that there lates 2 videos are insane
the lates one editor tools ... that ideas they offer there would make stuff so much cooler
like auto rotat auto scale etc randomize stuff thats something u usualy do from hand
and they explaine it very well
lapis gulch
can you link stuff here or do you need to make the url like mentatz without www.
fathom wadi
you can link stuff. Not really NSFW stuff tho. Don't think many people do that tho.
lapis gulch
that was something i created very long time ago i just stoped since i didnt realy know what to make with it out of it like whats the goal of it
it was mostly idea of metal slug with fancy explosions
foggy path
That looks cool
There was apparently a 3D Metal Slug... I was reading the SNK Metal Slug history book, never even knew
It wasn't very successful though
zinc matrix
mehh
lapis gulch
Jeah i just used the sounds and the weapon styles i like it it but i would never use them in final game since the sounds probably have copyright
but it was pretty fun to play even that thing above i created i probably follow that tutorial again since it was heavy blueprint based and gave me lot of knowledge
the HP / ARMOR / RUN energy i made it similiar to fortnite at least back then it looked like that
Sometimes "simple" is better then "ultra complex fancy"
foggy path
oh cool I didn't even realize it had sound since Discord doesn't play sound in imgur video embeds :D
lapis gulch
jeah you can hear some of the picup sounds
the only thing i miss was like to make BLACK thing on the gloor after it hit
lapis gulch
not sure how thats called
foggy path
This is worth checking if you're a fan
lapis gulch
How do you call that anyway ? Imapact traces or what the unreal term for that?
you know the holes in the walls for example that stay for a while
foggy path
That would be done using a decal I guess?
lapis gulch
i think i am not sure
but it deftly would be cool to make some parts destructable
I thin that was unreal tutorial as well they even explained the WEPAON master blueprint with children for the individual smaller wepaons.
ancient hornet
Unreal >>> Quake 2
foggy path
I think Civvie actually said in his Q2 video that Unreal was a better Quake 2 than Quake 2 lol
fresh heath
Quake 3 == Unreal Tournament
foggy path
I wonder why there's a klingon in that magazine cover tho
like, was there a Quake 2 -killer Star Trek game?
fresh heath
Yeah
foggy path
Which one was that?
fresh heath
Klingon Honor Guard
foggy path
Uhh.. doesn't that run on the Q3 engine :D
fresh heath
Klingon Honor Guard was the first game other than Unreal itself to use the Unreal game engine.
fresh heath
I wonder if Epic will ever come back to Unreal the game
It'd be cool to play Unreal 3 on Unreal Engine 5
foggy path
Wasn't Unreal 2 kind of a big flop
seems somewhat unlikely they'd pick up anything in a sequel sense
fresh heath
Yeah, Epic outsourced it entirely to Legend Entertainment
foggy path
what I would really love to see is a sequel to TekWar lol
fresh heath
At the same time they were focused on Unreal Championship and Unreal Tournament instead
foggy path
not really tbh, last UT I played was the one where they introduced vehicles
fresh heath
There was supposed to be a new Unreal Tournament on UE4, but Epic stopped development before it even reached alpha
Paragon and Fortnite were more important
Then they dropped Paragon, and now it's all about Fortnite
At least Paragon I don't mourn, I'm not into MOBAs
rigid shoal
I didn't play it, but Paragon could have been really cool.
Could have been a better SMITE.
ancient hornet
they dropped UT because nobody plays that kind of shooter anymore and they had no idea how to freshen the formula to fix that
foggy path
Seems like a sensible decision tbh, arena shooters are a hard sell nowadays
Lawbreakers tried to freshen it and flopped big time
ancient hornet
and then Fortnite happened
though they could continue UT anyway but what's the point if they have no clear idea
foggy path
Lawbreakers was actually pretty good but I guess it just wasn't enough
thin storm
that star trek game was actually good. I remember playing it.
foggy path
need to give it a spin sometime
Elite Force is pretty great
there's a lot of kinda trashy Trek games but some of them are fun trashy
like Starfleet Academy lol
thin storm
I never liked star trek but this game was good for its time. dont know if it holds up to this day.
foggy path
some of the old Trek games are great
Star Trek the 25th Anniversary and its sequel Judgement Rites are really good point and click adventures
somehow I had never even heard of those until a couple years back
easily holds their own against even LucasArts classics imo... the only kind of meh part in the two is the space combat segments
fresh heath
Always wanted to play Elite Force, but never could get around to that
foggy path
yeah I don't think you still can get that one on digital retailers
lapis gulch
Unreal tournament best !
but you rember the old game PAINKILLER ?
whit the wooden thing you shoot in players
thin storm
okay thats cool, I mean I grew up with point and clicks. maybe I check them out.
lapis gulch
that was fun hahha
foggy path
@thin storm they're both on GOG and can go pretty cheap during sales, definitely worth checking imo :)
fresh heath
Elite Force is attached to Jedi Academy in my mind for some reason
foggy path
fully voice acted too by the original cast which is great
fresh heath
Probably because I saw them around the same time
They were also both running on the same engine
rich quiver
https://twitter.com/panic/status/1298667584179433475 teejay finally will release his game
fresh heath
Twitter
fathom wadi
thats whats great about SIGGRAPH and Carmack's twitter. I indulge in both and rarely come out understanding what the hell was said ๐
foggy path
maybe I should follow more stuff like that and less stuff like kinofabino
but then again kinofabino is the best
lol
sage ermine
omg this post
I want to be first in, but I'm too polite to say what my sense of humour desperately wants to say
so I'll just do it here ๐
foggy path
The first is a common gateway, where my character can walk from my engine into your engine.
sage ermine
aw hell, I'm gonna do it anyway
foggy path
okay this is one of the first things in there
and I'm already like... what am I reading
:D
Maybe I am tweaking stuff
I think he's definitely been tweaking...
lol
but ngl the gateway idea of being able to go between games is pretty cool
not gonna happen... but still
:P
sage ermine
I'm going to hell
fresh heath
An idea guy is generously "opensourcing" his amazing ideas for the benefit of the community 
fathom wadi
Why should data be 5gb when it can be 10mb? Remember that folks. Remember.
That being said, he put some effort into writing all that. Maybe they have passion
fresh heath
I keep forgetting to press that "Shrink to 10mb" button for each of my assets ๐
fathom wadi
David Brevik released It Lurks Below a while back and thats only 50mb. Of course, it's pixel art, but still. Why do CG with 5gb of data when you can use 50mb for the entire project?
gilded vigil
I don't like bloatware. Why must a character be 5 gigs when it can be 10 Megs? If gateway is gonna work, bloatware has to die. wise words that every developer should remember, so dont forget to press the shrink to 10 mb button for every asset
profit
sage ermine
Now I have to spend an hour of my life trying to say something useful to make up for my humour
fresh heath
I am open-sourcing an Asset system on Unreal Forum that I call a Self Contained Asset. This must be reusable and editable, and must contain every sub-asset that makes that SCO Asset complete as if it was a living thing. It must be Drop 'n Play ready. Meaning that there must be one click needed from the user, but in future the asset would be clickless, it would default to passive A.I. and with one click, you could change it to Controllable. Every asset must have passive A.I. always on, so if I dont move (e.g) a character, it will go through it routines as if it was a living being.
brazen birch
Anyone have any good youtubers to watch for beginning in UE4? I'm just starting off and kinda understand blueprints but not very well
fresh heath
Can't wait to get my hands on that asset system... oh wait, it only exists in that person's head
brazen birch
I do, they're fun
gilded vigil
Can't wait to get my hands on that asset system... oh wait, it only exists in that person's head
@fresh heath cant wait for that person to open source their head
sage ermine
brazen birch
Thank you ๐
sage ermine
You could do a lot worse than that one ๐
brazen birch
I guarantee I will lmao
fresh heath
dim ruin
ugh, that poor guy. Someone just pm him and let him know its probably best to just delete that. Or use a throwaway account or something
Now I wanna watch one of his screenplays to encourage him to go back
deep moat
hehe.. coming from film - yep.
light spruce
today's new game show: When Will the Power Go Out?
dim ruin
oh shit, you in the south?
light spruce
Yeah. Quite a ways from the coast though. Rain's already started up here. It's mostly just the part where there are roughly 80 trees for every half meter of power lines
thin glacier
rich quiver
Microsoft will buy tiktok us
foggy path
Not Oracle? :P
rich quiver
they bet way to low for any big company
foggy path
I have no idea what Oracle would even do with it tbh
rich quiver
Twitter
foggy path
They have zero consumer facing products...
rich quiver
@foggy path make the same as the chinese version but US
foggy path
No I mean in the sense that Oracle has no consumer facing business
so having a random social media business seems very out of place for them
rich quiver
but have connection with the NSA and FBI
foggy path
Yeah, it does feel like a pure play on "we want this data so we can sell it to advertisers"
rich quiver
that why also facebook and amazon both bet for it
but the antitrust lawsuit cancel there bets
foggy path
it makes more sense for those two and microsoft because they all have consumer facing business already
light spruce
Have you tried turning it off and back on?
mint onyx
zinc matrix
Ubisoft Cup
Ubisoft Cup
light spruce
More like ASS CUP amirite
zinc matrix
light spruce
Man, this dipshit over here just poured half a cup of water all over the counter
Forgot to open the lid on the coffee maker
when you fuck up two separate steps of making coffee ... you really have to ask yourself ... "Is it even worth writing code?"
fluid bloom
light spruce
[F]
sage ermine
weird that dude deleted his post
gleaming hill
Error. No missiles remain. Donald already gave them away for free.
sage ermine
What button do you press to give them a palette of cash?
ancient ingot
F1 ๐
gilded lichen
Muahaha!
zinc matrix
e
hi
konkki
i c u
nah chill
hmm
Weird, looks like god of wind joined forces with god of lightning
but y knw ths r this thingz called
piorunochron
https://i.imgur.com/wTox2zC.png it defends from lightning
it would be fun swimming there boatless'ly right now in the center
light spruce
1.78 inches of rain tomorrow. And then Saturday the heat index will be over a hundred.
Everything is garbage
lucid walrus
WORMSIGN
zinc matrix
no
solid aurora
lol
when fortnite in one season
does better avengers games
that dedidcated
game made by dedicated studio
light spruce
reading that made my brain hurt
zinc matrix
both are made by dedicated studios rnt they
subtle harness
Anyone got 3970X?
ancient ingot
eww no
subtle harness
eww?:P
tulip orbit
I'm having trouble braining this morning ๐ฆ
thin glacier
rich quiver
cursive crypt
Not in hurry, might wait for few years for better discount. Post-purchase.
thin glacier
@zinc matrix thatโs just Toe-bendinโ Tom
zinc matrix
gilded lichen
I don't get it, what saving is he talking about?
tulip orbit
Weee, I changed an array to a map. So much fun ๐
tulip orbit
the obvious solution is a gallon of coffee
thorny dock
I actually saw a scientist speak from his home the other day on the news about the pandemic, and he had a mason jar of coffee in the background. It made me feel much better about my self
carmine frigate
during WW2 europe ran out of coffee real fast, i never heared anything about a toilet paper shortage
zinc matrix
the obvious solution is a gallon of coffee
gl drinking one in the evening lol
lapis gulch
Can someone help me to find something i forget how its called?
There was a Dungeon generator plugin thing for UE4 that builds maps "procedural". But it was not Dungeon architect. The one i saw you could add Enemy ai as well and they would create whole maps even with enemys. And you can create like KEY MOBS that drop a key to unlock a door and like BOSS ROOM where the final boss is.
Does somone remeber how that thing was called i search since hours cant find it anymore.
zinc matrix
Sounds like whole game
lapis gulch
jeah it was very advanced you could even decide on a start point and end point and the map will build with this 2 points
or eve nrandom generate new maps everytime you change map
it was very powerfull but i forgot what name it was just saw it on youtube
i wanted to compare the both and see which one i gonna buy. But i first need check the other thing. Since so far i see on Dungeon Architect you would need place enemys manual etc
dusty turret
Where would be the best chat for finding character movement help?
dusty turret
Thank you ๐
light spruce
Like a G6, like a G6
light spruce
Yeah, I'm pretty sure no one knows what the words are to that... because I'm also pretty sure that 80% of them are not real words.
"-- and I'm Troy 'Butt Soup' Barnes"
plucky pagoda
light spruce
I've started writing pseudo code for blueprints ... I can't decide if that's a good thing or a bad thing.
abstract haven
@rich quiver they probably have signed a contract to publish it with M$ or sth, epic dont set the price of the product
light spruce
Yeah, that's what kinda concerns me
I clearly can't stop devolving into a smoothbrain
zinc matrix
Damn i woke up too early again and with runny nose
fallow finch
idk i heard something like this before
ancient hornet
Path of Exile will be on the EGS for next season
funny ๐ฎ
would be interesting to compare the EGS patching system to Steam one
wet smelt
idk im kinda not hyped
gilded lichen
This is good
ancient hornet
gilded lichen
However I prefer to play POE without steam or another layer of bullshit
ancient hornet
seems some users have difficulties with GGG's own payment processor
that could be a way for them to buy MTX and give more money to GGG in the process
gilded lichen
I think since GGG belongs to tencent it might be a reason as well
ancient hornet
I don't think there needs to be such reason
they want exposure, that's all
the MTX thing is purely for users to decide
gilded lichen
Is POE a good game?
ancient hornet
it has enough of a big following to say it probably is a good game, although maybe not for everyone
zinc matrix
guys
gilded lichen
wehat
zinc matrix
ive bit bigger cake than i can chew
fluid bloom
today I learned that your income tax rate in Romania is 39% if you're earning minimum wage ๐
that's a ridiculous amount
fluid bloom
in Finland you' have to earn close to 80k a year to get that kind of income tax rate
light spruce
No, I'm pretty sure that's how you use a bow
Source: Have bow on wall
haven't we all
gilded lichen
Suicidal bw?
devout atlas
Guys wassup with this lawsuit that keeps popping up? I mean is Apple being pricks again or is this some kinda preemptive thing from Epic?
alpine fern
you could say that epic started this and they could have just not
but their goal is to stop apple from taking a 30% tax of the entire ios market, so everyone with a brain should be hoping for epic to win
plucky pagoda
It's not nearly that simple.
alpine fern
yeah it is
devout atlas
I don't get why Apple wants to oust all UE4 content out of it's platform tho
light spruce
It's that simple if you have exactly zero critical thinking skills
mossy nexus
to punish Epic ๐
devout atlas
that's like Epic saying they'll dump Apple's SDK from the deployment tab....everybody loses.
plucky pagoda
That is the consequence if Epic loses their developer accounts and the access they have.
It would mean it would be difficult to find a way to keep the engine updated for use on IOS.
devout atlas
I mean it's not like Apple isn't raking it in from UE4 games
plucky pagoda
How?
devout atlas
well, there's UE4 games on the storefront
if they cut them out, they lose revenue
and arguably market share cuz they won't be competing with PlayStore for those games
plucky pagoda
Not really. UE is a very small percentage of mobile games and games would still be made.
plucky pagoda
I've not seen actual numbers, but it would surprise me if it was that high.
devout atlas
I mean I don't really care, I'm not a fan of the mobile market, but it seems like a dick move to screw a bunch of teams just to make a point.
plucky pagoda
Even so, Apple makes its money from the appStore. It makes much more sense to cut Epic out if it's a choice between that and giving them their own app store on iOS.
When they where informed Epic would no longer follow the agreement what should they have done? They were literally told they had two weeks to agree to allow Epic to open their own app store on iOS.
light spruce
I'm sure if I shipped a wildly successful UE4 product, Epic would have no problem if I decided that ... you know.. their percentage is just too high and I don't want to pay it.
plucky pagoda
Not the same thing.
devout atlas
@light spruce yeah they may have a problem with YOU, not every developer using the engine though.
pearl compass
Someone should just make a game that sells games inside itself and sell it on the Epic Marketplace - watch how fast they reject that shit
devout atlas
That's not the point though.
pearl compass
But that is Epics point in their lawsuit though
If you can't sue over the thing that you actually need to sue over, trying to be a blackmailing asshole is not a way to do it
devout atlas
i don't care about Epics point, it's Apples point that I don't understand
pearl compass
Their point is it's our store play by our rules or get the fuck out seems pretty salient
light spruce
I think it seems pretty sandwich too
devout atlas
no, their point is: If you don't do it our way, then we're gonna cut your entire user base out, not just you.
If I was selling local pies and I had a problem with one supplier, I wouldn't just cut out everyone and start only selling imported pies. That's just dumb.
pearl compass
That was after they were literally threatened by epic to remain in the store
lol
That is not dumb, that is a business choice. Since when are businesses mandated to sell your product cause they have a store?
the logic in Epic's testimony so far is laughable
devout atlas
Dude, when you make a game using the engine, it's YOUR game. Epic has no rights to it. They aren't responsible for it and in return you aren't responsible for Epic's actions
light spruce
You can still ship your game
pearl compass
Epic has rights to it, my dude. You obviously didnt read the TOS too well
ancient ingot
This situation was foreseen many years ago when the App store was in it's infancy, but for one reason or another no-one would challenge Apple so now we are here.
pearl compass
You still pay Epic at a price point. Epic as no rights? lel
devout atlas
Well, according to Apple, you CAN'T ship your game if Epic loses.
light spruce
that's incorrect
devout atlas
epic has royalty rights, you own the IP.
pearl compass
Uh, according to Apple, you CAN'T ship your game if Epic loses. that isnt true.
devout atlas
If you make a child pornography game on UE4, you're the one responsible for the shitstorm, Epic won't get into trouble.
alpine fern
epic doesn't want apple to be forced to sell their games, why are you misrepresenting their case?
they are asking to be allowed to sell it themselves
pearl compass
That is a future you think may happen. Not reality
devout atlas
They stated they will cut out ALL UE4 games out
pearl compass
Yeah, ok. And I am God. I said it, must be true
devout atlas
not just Fortnite
light spruce
Misinformed. Lies. Trolling. Dealer's choice there.
pearl compass
The real problem here is you think somehow in this conversation we are litigating the case. That in itself is hilarious.
plucky pagoda
It's not that they are saying you can't make games with UE. It's that the natural consequence of Epic losing their access is that UE would not be updated for it.
devout atlas
i see
bronze axle
Epic was granted a temp restraining order preventing Apple from following through on their UE threat, at least for now.
devout atlas
I never thought we are litigating the case lol what are you on about
bronze axle
I posted the order in #unreal-news recently.
pearl compass
Here is what most liklely will come to pass. Epic will lose. Apple wont "ban" the engine, but Epic will "stop making it for a system that is inherantly anti-developer", since, really, there is not a lot of money in the app store for Epic -- only in the SKIN store.
The only people who lose, both times, are developers.
plucky pagoda
Which seems like it was granted because the Judge felt the potential harm to other devs was great enough to grant it. I don't think you can infer that the case will go one way or the other from the TRO though.
ancient hornet
I don't think that's the most likely at all
pearl compass
then pin it, and @ me in a year when it comes to pass and tell me I was "wrong"
ancient hornet
the worst case scenario I see is that Apple is force at least to show how much money they take on App Store transactions
bronze axle
@plucky pagoda Agreed. It is temporary, after all.
ancient hornet
if Epic loses that case and others like Spotify and things
it's likely that Apple loses ANYWAY
light spruce
A year is probably optimistic
ancient hornet
because I see EU/US change the law to make it apply
pearl compass
I see the EU doing that way ahead of us here in the US
devout atlas
What about google? Are they in on the action?
ancient hornet
Google is in for a different reason
mostly because they threaten phone vendors so that they don't include alternative app stores
devout atlas
but M$ have a platform yet they support Epic, at least with words
pearl compass
Kensei: I never thought we are litigating the case of course you are. You were 100% arguing a position for Epic.
We can sit here in debate all day, it doesnt mean anything.
devout atlas
what? I was questioning the logic behind Apple's threat, aren't you jumping to conclusions here?
when did I defend epics position
alpine fern
why are you here then, speaking meaningless words?
mossy nexus
Litigation requires actual people in courts n stuff. Pretty impossible in a internet chat room ๐
devout atlas
^
pearl compass
No it doesnt. You are drawing conclusions of fact from something you cant see. You are literally looking for holes in Apple's buisness model
mossy nexus
yawns
pearl compass
Is selling pies a fake analogy?
is the porn question, a fake analogy?
you are stroking for logic on how apple can do what it does, and epic cant
devout atlas
It's just an analogy
pearl compass
and analogies are used to compare and contrast povs.
devout atlas
yes, and?
plucky pagoda
MS didn't really come out and support Epic's entire case. It was more nuanced than that.
pearl compass
yes, and, you aint gonna solve it here asking "how can epic be wrong?" People have said it.
devout atlas
Dude are you reading what I'm writing or do my words come out differently on your screen? Let me put this as simple as possible: Why would Apple target ALL UE4 developers.
pearl compass
they didnt
devout atlas
all the articles jumping on the stories claim otherwise, everyone saying how all UE4 devs will lose access to iOS
plucky pagoda
I don't understand why the hostile tone. It seemed like this was a fairly calm discussion.
pearl compass
Its like saying the flour company stopped selling flour to Cake King. Why do they hate cake lovers?
devout atlas
no, it's like saying they stopped selling to all cake factories.
unless I'm not understanding something
pearl compass
Except APPLE isnt the ONLY place to sell things
devout atlas
of course.
mossy nexus
It's more like they said they want to stop Epic cakes from having access to the iOS ingredients
pearl compass
You can sell, buy and bake cakes elsewhere
devout atlas
Sure but that's just a statement. I mean if you could only deploy for PSN and not to XBL because of a lawsuit, would that not strike you as odd?
pearl compass
considering for years we couldnt deploy on anything other than XBOX cause of contracts, nope.