CWDT Spirit is hilarious
#1┃mirage-league
lament zodiac
stone belfry
red wharf
hm, impale state is still unknown then?
placid grotto
Yeah to the best of my knowledge
Doubt it will be changed much
They'll hit Cyclone and call it a day
Mission Accomplished ^TM
red wharf
you never know with ggg 😛
impale felt really strong melee dmg buff for low investment, i'd definitely put it on nerf radar
but i hope it remains relatively unchanged, so i can keep niche offmeta build to gear up quick and farm money on league start
placid grotto
Probably in the league after this one IMO
Give people time to stop playing melee so it doesn't hurt as much and (hopefully) test the changes
modern radish
OH BOY
theres a bit too much corpse stuff even though its necromancer
i know it fits the theme but i wanted more just general minion stuff
i mean
sitll the split thing and commancer of darkness is good ig
hmm
i guess
i really like the new unnatural strength thing
grab that as soon as possible
easier games forever
odd schooner
The onslaught node for minions on tree is crazy
lament zodiac
@odd schooner ye so many good nodes on tree now
modern radish
bone armour UWU
lament zodiac
+move speed also on tree
jovial narwhal
Hmm.. 2,4,6,14 Necro BV with Desecrate and an offering?
lament zodiac
+2 minion gems and +20% more minion life probably do more for zombie explosion builds than the corpse explosion nodes do
modern radish
i mean zombie spectre things will also be popular now i imagine
lament zodiac
corpse nodes are so fail imo
odd schooner
Theirs a good PP VD build in those corpse nodes
undone timber
corpse free shock ? there are a lot of shock effectiv nodes around imo its too OP
lament zodiac
Just get a skitter bot if you want shock? 😛
undone timber
CWC incinerate desecrate DD ?
kindred dagger
mmmh strange i feel like a bit disapointed by those necro change... its like they buff it quite some yeah but they didnt had any inspiration when reworking it so they just gave buff, period !
i dont feel any really creative touch in it, im pretty sure people will find way to make nice build out of it anyway but mmh really strange
heavy bolt
strange times
kindred dagger
At least we got more stable defense layers like damage reduction tides to minions and not only zombies now and new layers with the ES regen and so but still strange
lament zodiac
Did minions need inspiration? there are like 20 different minions and spectres are also 20 on their onw
lament zodiac
I am glad they just gave buff so we can do kill
modern radish
i like the new gems, at least
kindred dagger
im talking about creativness not a skill
modern radish
welp
lament zodiac
Its so awful playing a summoner not being able to see my game with all the clutter
only to realize bosses also take way longer to die
undone timber
i believe this rework will enhance build diversity, there are a lot of options, not just minion, you can make a tank-aurabot now
heavy bolt
diversity
kindred dagger
commander of darkness seems pretty bad now
lament zodiac
Yeah an aura bot with cwdt ES offering and the 8% ES regained on corpse destruction is gonna be hilarious
it doesnt seem bad Ild everything else is just better
kindred dagger
yeah when i saw the 4 and 6 keystone i thought about some tanky support necro
lament zodiac
Its a choice between an aura of +20 resistances or 30% just for yourself
Maybe if you only have like 1-2 summons you would take it over bone armour one
kindred dagger
On all of this the buff on mistress of sacrifice is what i found the best, buffing offering on you to 50% reduced effect to only 25% feels nice, for the rest feels strong just not too fun
undone timber
bone armour = D2 necro bone armour ? wet dreams...
kindred dagger
honestly the +2 to all minion gem doesnt feel a bit sad to you ? its clearly strong and free for a buff but cmon a little bit extra effect on it like your minions become fluffy and wanna hug you when there is no enemy around how cool would this be ? 
undone timber
lvl 20 to lvl 22 is much better than lvl 18 to lvl 20
the progression is not linear
spice cipher
Nah the +2 sounds lame but it makes sense for necro to have more powerful minions than other classes
kindred dagger
Especialy for minion yeah they really get a lot just by level
undone timber
+2 levels on top of that is tons of dmg and hp for minions
spice cipher
Wish there was a different way to bake that in but I guess maybe there wasn’t
lament zodiac
With a +2 minion wand its 22 to 24 sir
undone timber
even better 🙂
lament zodiac
My animate guardian wont die now
/s
The Minions dont take bonus damage whilst moving with bleed on tree node
undone timber
guardian with righteous fire ? 😛
lament zodiac
is going to save Mr Bean from dying Ihope
kindred dagger
The keystone is insanely strong, more survivability and damage for minions but as its for minion gem that mean all support as well that got the tag and we are going to have new support gem as well for minion so possibly a huge huge atomix buff..
But my point to be serious 2 sec is that its just a pure blank buff, like no effect or else nothing much to play with and aorund, no creative possibilities around this
lament zodiac
I was trying Guardian with Rfire with necro aegis phoenix and also a pheonix equipped
but do you really want your guardian to be losing like 80% of his regen?
doesn't he die enough already with 100% of his regen? xD
undone timber
yeah maybe its for elementalist-golemancer
undone timber
yeah that could be insane
lament zodiac
You ever seen a video of a man on fire running ?
undone timber
popcorn to die
lament zodiac
now imagine him exploding
aggressive burning exploding zombies
this is going to be a necro league
kindred dagger
Were you doubting about it ?
lament zodiac
Nope 😮
kindred dagger
Problably other things will be strong but necro will clearly shine, we just dont have any real info on the blight mecanics to tell what will be good as we dont know how the blight mobs are affected by us and how we are affected by them
But minions look clearly strong because of the fact they will naturally act as more "tower" as its a TD sub game this league
undone timber
minions, totems and traps/mines will be the best for the league
lament zodiac
Ballista
I wonder if skele mages/archers could be a meme blight mechanic build
I did a soulwrest last league as but gave up on it before they patched corpses and legion being awful to play
hopefully blight mobs will leave corpses
or GGG are massive fucking trolls
odd schooner
Dont forget VD
lucid stone
Is necro even better than it was in the leak?
odd schooner
Should be really good for league mechanic
lucid stone
Was there always life recovery rate per minion?
lucid stone
I missed that.
lament zodiac
Cant wait to make a Baron face tank build
lucid stone
Plus you could do indigon
kindred dagger
imagine doing a minion league and encounter doesnt leave corps 
lament zodiac
you can make the ultimate es tank I think
with cwdt spirtual ofering
and es leach from zombros
lucid stone
Doesn't matter if it doesn't stack. 8% mana regen is friggin huge
kindred dagger
mana + ES regen, clearly necro will have tank and utility possibilities
lament zodiac
best MoM class is now necro?
lucid stone
With regen rate nodes thats over half your mana per second
Best everything class might be necro. 0wo
You even get a free steelskin
lucid stone
You get 50% free resist as well
lament zodiac
Necro with Cyclone?
kindred dagger
Oh i just realised but rework ascendancy proabably means scion changes too, lets see what they will modifie that could bring some exotic stuff
kindred dagger
Not too much inspired sadly but tones of massives basic buffs
I guess we'll take it
compact junco
well the leaked changes are pretty small, so I bet excitement about them is small as well
kindred dagger
I was hoping a lot more for necro and minions and that was suposed to be the major changes...
Not really
If you think so you just fall in the trap
hoary snow
If raider got some crunchy, big-feeling improvements it would be nice. It doesn’t even have to be that powerful, just something to make it look spicy, but alas, unless the leak turns out wrong there it’s just a few touches
distant scarab
Combine that necro node with devouring diadem
for some INSANE fat full heals every 5 seconds
rugged falcon
I'm fine with the raider buffs, I already liked raider though as it was. They're not over the top but will make a difference
more changes would be cool too tho
low knot
@unreal star so whats that SL nerf?
low knot
is that a big thing?
unreal star
it effectively means your crit chance with slayer is going to be 93.75% of what it was
not a huge nerf but it can be felt
low knot
so is SL still superior for cyclone with it?
unreal star
yeah it's still a good option
low knot
i loved it for the 20% kill stuff
unreal star
right, it also got a bit of a nerf to its movement and attack speed if you've killed an enemy recently
which is a bit of a clear speed nerf
still should be nice. I'd either go slayer or champion
champion if impale is still good
radiant lance
So the necro leaks were correct right?
unreal star
yes
worthy basalt
nice then I can trust the sabo leaks
unreal star
they might change some things before release
worthy basalt
which were pretty crazy
modest walrus
@radiant lance almost, just minor changes since then
low knot
btw i did readed somewhere that poison builds comes back. is it true?
unreal star
what did they change I didn't pay much attention
radiant lance
Yeah I just took a quick look, at the airport
Looking forward to playing some necro
unreal star
poison (and all damage over time) seems to be getting a nice buff
they added multiplier stats all over the tree
then of course there's assassin
low knot
hm?
unreal star
assassin is getting reworked to make crit poison much better
so yeah it should be good with assassin
low knot
i was jsut thinking if i should stick to my cyclone builds or maybe try a poison one
unreal star
I'm gonna try something new for sure
minion builds since I haven't done one in a while
tired of seeing cyclone everywhere
midnight kraken
Necro dominating blow as a build?
unreal star
why not guardian
low knot
so its not that poison or cyclone is superior to the other?
unreal star
I mean we haven't seen the numbers on poison all that much
also cyclone can be poison
low knot
could it be good?
unreal star
probably
low knot
better then impale?
midnight kraken
Welp
midnight kraken
When GGG wants to make new op meta to negate old cyclone meta, but players decide to use cyclone with new op poison meta
low knot
what did make poison so OP in the past?
copper kernel
isnt the aoe super scuffed now
unreal star
there was double dipping before
midnight kraken
it is
unreal star
it is and it's still better than pretty much any other melee skill so
low knot
scuffed?
unreal star
with stuff like facebreakers it might have even gotten a buff
low knot
what is double dipping?
tidal frost
way back when a signle +10% dmg could say; make your wpeaon hit for 10% more; for 110%; then the poison woul make the 110% dmg do poison dmg; which would get a nother 10% boost
that sort of thing is double dipping
low knot
but i would assume they did change that?^^
tidal frost
yes. nothing will get extra dmg twice from one stat
low knot
isn't then poison just like any other dmg type and not anymore OP?
vast berry
Does necro match perfectly with leak?
modest walrus
it does
it's the exact same except for Bone Barrier giving you lvl 20 Bone Armour instead of lvl 1
rose pasture
So new spectre gem adds up vs +2 to gems nicely it seems..
cedar pewter
Leak is confirmed
past obsidian
Hey guys I'm disappoint
past obsidian
I mean technically they should be weaker
cedar pewter
said the league mechanic's totems weren't even worth bothering with
once you're even a little geared
Didn't say anything before incase it was faked lol
kindred dagger
Nice so now you wont have to do maps shenanigan for spectre level
past obsidian
+2 minion gems was the best they can do?
kindred dagger
Same here thats a huge buff but a sad one
past obsidian
It's buff that I didn't really like
kindred dagger
I really hoped for a more creative necro rework, basicaly they did nothing but over tune numbers
past obsidian
I think the bone armour one was cool
Like your defenses scaled with your minion count
That one was cool
But +2 minion gem is so awfully boring
tidal frost
Still need gem data
proven wadi
not all ascendency notables have to be flavor af
past obsidian
You have fortify is kinda meh
But it allows access to classes who can't use fortify
+2 minion gems is not really something interesting
eager terrace
it's whatever... I only don't like it because it felt like +gem levels was one of the few things that was restricted to gear
kindred dagger
Not sure about thats as i dont know what is it but at least its a bonus skill so we'll see. i see 2 good point in this rework first the offering that took +25% effect on you is clearly great and then the part where you can earn more buff for tanking and regenerate is interesting, but overall the char is pretty much the same there isnt really new ascendancy rework and interaction especialy with minions its just pure basic buff
vestal escarp
SPECTRES
past obsidian
@eager terrace Next patch, elementalist gets +2 to elemental gems
@kindred dagger bone armour is at least interesting
more minions = more defenses
I like that node design
kindred dagger
Oh ok yeah that feels fine
cedar pewter
I think there's a lot of flavor. It's fine one of the nodes isn't flavorful
tidal frost
2 gems isnt wordy enough so it seems boring.
proven wadi
i agree that the gem level thing is kinda bland, but i like its powerrrr
past obsidian
@tidal frost To me it's like, +gems is usually restricted to gear
I honestly do not like an ascendancy getting that
kindred dagger
Its not one of the node its just supoed to be a rework but they didnt really make anything new they just changed numbers which is a buff so cool but when you talk about rework you want new cool stuff especialy on a game like POE
restive wren
They already changed a lot of +socketed gems to +all gems. Why can't they stick it on passives?
tidal frost
Granting skills is restricted to gear.
eager terrace
not that either
cedar pewter
Commander of Darkness, Essence Gluttony, Bone BArrier, Mindless Aggression, Plaguebringer are all dripping with flavor. I'm fine with unnatural strength lacking that lol
eager terrace
necro gets bone armor skill from her ascendancy too
cedar pewter
I just wish mindless aggression also made all your minions aggressive unless a gem alters it
restive wren
IMO +gems is more interesting than %increased damage and life
kindred dagger
And btw the new minions gems feels pretty restrictive too
cedar pewter
The name makes it flavorful 😄
tidal frost
need gem scaling to actually judge it.
proven wadi
im talking about spectres
kindred dagger
We have too see the numbers but in the end they dont really add anything they are just stat buff, and allow you to force mob to defend or attack but at the cost of a socket so of an potential effect gem to your minions... i really not sure to be ok with that
I think they better would have used active skill when you could cast to tell your minions what to do, would have been much better an active, you would have been a real master of the dead
cedar pewter
I can't imagine spectres not worth stacking as much +skill as possible
Just judging off of what we know now about spectres
Levels are so huge
kindred dagger
Yeah +lv to gem is insanely strong not the point here
Problem is that its basic, i wouldnt mind that if there was an actual side bonus effect, maybe not for mininions but for regular spell, to alow you to have more ascendancy interactions
tidal frost
anyone have a speadsheet with spectre dps vs level numbers
restive wren
I wonder if it goes up to 3 maximum spectres if you push the level high enough
kindred dagger
I never played a full spectre build, what was used as main minions ? solar guard still or mixed spectres ?
cedar pewter
there's been a lot of variations over the years
It's hard to say what we'll use now
More than likely the ice lance guys in act 8 are probably teh way to go now
restive wren
solar guards are meta, but other spectres like Frost Sentinels and Goatman Fire-Raisers are really strong
tidal frost
a bit of which is from mob behaviour; which is controllable more now
cedar pewter
yeah frost sentinels them
kindred dagger
lets say after 3.0 everything before was nearly beta unbalanced game
cedar pewter
Frost Sentinels are really good but their damage is always just a tiny bit too low
but
this should fix that lol
restive wren
Kitava's Heralds can also be really strong but it depends on the AI. their ranged attack is amazing but if they try to attack in melee it sucks
cedar pewter
There's a mob you can only get once(at least in ssf) that's really good too
Act 7 map guys
they throw lightning balls
with GMP they have so much overlap it instagibs almost aything lol
restive wren
Frost Sentinels also destroy your framerate if you give them too much cast speed
kindred dagger
lol
kindred dagger
What doesnt in this game ?
cedar pewter
They go apeshit when they hit like 100 stacks of souleater lol
restive wren
Last time I played Frost Sentinels I had to take out spell echo
cedar pewter
and just sorta..berserk all over everything 😛
kindred dagger
seems there is a lot of fun with spectres
cedar pewter
tidal frost
if +2 gems just listed out bonuses to all the minions that +2 would give; would it be fine
cedar pewter
If you see, they're lacking a bit of damage though
make them level 93 tho...
:p
also increase their aoe
tidal frost
gotta make the lvl 93 worms build
cedar pewter
LOL
kindred dagger
Im really fucked in my brain, i was looking at the video full screen the guy got a gem leveling up and i tried to level it up 😂
cedar pewter
haha
past obsidian
@kindred dagger Oof
cedar pewter
That's pretty much the thing about spectres though
kindred dagger
Oh god this pause for a week until next season start is gonna be bliss 😄 and then madness start all over again... exile, still sane ?
cedar pewter
So many would be viable, if they just did a lil more damage
kindred dagger
One of the most minions build problem for end game was HP then damage for some, damage often related as a lack of minions cause they die
So if they buff minions, HP and this node +2gem shit that may solves parts of those problem naturally
tidal frost
main tree should be a bit stronger now. also timeless jewels
cedar pewter
I meant spectres
kindred dagger
didnt lookek much about the main tree
cedar pewter
there's lots of almost good spectres
midnight kraken
GUYS
midnight kraken
wrong channel
cedar pewter
is disgusting
kindred dagger
im waiting for the full release patch to have a better global sight
cedar pewter
lol
tidal frost
still searching for mob level scaling on spectre dmg. I need some data
kindred dagger
wrong channel what ? its the blight channel we are talking about changes
cedar pewter
I'd guestimate 68 vs 83 to be around a 80% more multiish
that's just estimating though
off to aram~ cheers
tidal frost
Im wondering on 80-90; for gem 20 to 30; a fire ball gains a 200% more mod for that.
tidal frost
with GG double corruptions?
midnight kraken
and arcane surge giving duration tag for +2 to duration gems to apply
eternal turtle
Why do the new ascendencys seem meh to me?
tidal frost
presumably because minions got buffed baseline and so theyre necessarily going to be worse than they could be
eternal turtle
Ok so why make ascendency worse for non minion builds then?
Necro was viable for builds other than minions before
tidal frost
which one was worse
tidal frost
raider was a number pass; they werent really going to change it. Im suprised it even got the exposure
eternal turtle
Cause people were expecting more maybe? I know I was
tidal frost
they didnt even list it in their list of reworked ascendancies
eternal turtle
I thought they said they were doing it at start of league or something
tidal frost
they said they were doing a pass at it; not a rework.
and it got a great boost for a not rework
it does need a rework.
eternal turtle
Guess it’s just hard to compete with great and unique ascendencys like Templar duelist and marauder have
tidal frost
they didnt nerf cast speed per corpse; thats all my goal was
eternal turtle
Why that matter?
tidal frost
if you make dumb mechanic abusing builds; its useful
and I Like making dumb buillds
can be a perma 200% cast/atk speed mod
midnight kraken
GGG: We're reworking minions to better scale with gem level so summoners will have something new to focus on.
GGG in HQ: Hope it'll be balanced.
Empyrian and his crew in first 48h of new league: 34 lvl spectres
torn orbit
So what's the path for soulwrest with new necro? 2, 4, 6, 16?
eternal turtle
Manic more like first 8 hours lvl 88 spectres
marble fiber
did spectres and summoner get nerfed? there's no more soul weaver
tidal frost
the base gem is different.
base gem is stronger; soul weaver isnt fun; +2 spectre levels you got instead
midnight kraken
@marble fiber Does 34 lvl of minion gem lvl sounds like a nerf to anything related to minions? lol
tidal frost
some people are also glossing over +1 base spectres
midnight kraken
21 lvl gem + +2 to all minion gems from necro + empower lvl 4(+3) + skin of the loyal(+2 cuz empower as well) + 2x wand with +1 to all minion gems + double corrupt skin of the loyal for +1 to socketed gems(+2 cuz empower) AND +2 TO DURATION, ADD ARCANE SURGE IN 6l for a total of 34 lvl minion gem lol
Quote from wiki about arcane surge
Less Duration Support
and
Swift Affliction Support
(which apply their damage bonus), even if the active skill gem does not otherwise have a duration of its own.```34 lvl thanks to +2 to all minion gems from new necro ascendancy and 2x +1 to all minion gems from new minion mods on new wand base
tidal frost
I suspect the arcane surge hack wont be worth not having an extra support gem
marble fiber
double corruption skin of the loyal is a little much <.<
midnight kraken
By doing this you will get 32->34 lvl boost, we need to check the exact values to declare if it'll be worth
tidal frost
that needs to be a like 25% more mod each level
midnight kraken
Yo do either 32 lvl minion gem with empower and normal 4 support gems or 34 lvl minion gem with empower, arcane surge and 3 support gems
actually
1 support is minion dmg, 1 support is new AI mechanic
tidal frost
1-2 new ai
midnight kraken
I guess the minion skill can be supported by only 1 new AI support gem
Because how will zombies work as bodyguards + aggresive AI
tidal frost
should be 1 behavior + deathmark
midnight kraken
It could work
But I wonder if the AI gems will get a tag that restricts from using multiple of them
tidal frost
presumably theyll clear trash fine with a mediocre deathmark; then boss mark
it said in the video
I forget the detail
silver kettle
Very likely nothing until tomorrow now
copper kernel
odd schooner
Maybee
silver kettle
It's two teasers per day in almost all cases
tidal frost
Different combinations of these three support gems let you use different minions for different roles. An example might be using your Zombies with Meat Shield to protect you, your Carrion Golems with Feeding Frenzy to clear groups of enemies, and the Deathmark Support on both of them so you can send all of them in after bosses while you evade the bosses abilities from a distance.
silver kettle
And we've had 2
odd schooner
I guess each day one ascendency
clear adder
Do we have leaks for new uniques?
silver kettle
The leaked info was just passive tree
tidal frost
If minions are both Aggressive and Defensive, those effects cancel out, returning the minions to their original behaviour. All other bonuses from the support gems still apply.
clear adder
Ah, okay
midnight kraken
What were the bonuses?
tidal frost
so you can infact use all 3 if you wanted
clear adder
Wait, did aurabot scion actually get nerfed..?
violet nymph
where do you get the leaks info from ?
tidal frost
def does more dmg close to you; frenzy makes minion hits give a dmg and speed buff. deathmark makes the target take more dmg
clear adder
I think Scion's last build just fell to the fury of Necromancer lol
odd schooner
The Feeding Frenzy support gem makes supported minions aggressive, increasing the range that they'll seek out enemies. It also gives hits from the minions a chance to give you the Feeding Frenzy buff, granting more minion damage and increased minion attack, cast and movement speed. While you have the Feeding Frenzy buff, the supported minions deal even more damage.
Sooo....
Does that mean it might give all minions a buff when you have feeding frenzy and the minions with the gem extra dps on top?
lament zodiac
I feel like Necro Aura bot is now perhaps the best
Plague bringer 10% more/10% less damage taken is insane
midnight kraken
Minion gem at 34lvl + empower lvl 4 + arcane surge for corruption reasons + minion dmg support + deathmark + feeding frenzy?
Actually guys
I'm scared of dominating blow
a bit
lament zodiac
Dominating blow ? when you can have so many other summons really?
midnight kraken
Yeah actually
lament zodiac
Why would you even bother with dblow?
odd schooner
Dom blow still cant kill endgame bosses
lament zodiac
There wont be changes 😄
Although necro has way more duration now
so Dblow will be a bit better
lament zodiac
But still not enough to do bosses
midnight kraken
tha'ts nicec qol
lament zodiac
and the name lock skill is still crap
I wanna see some facebreaker/Dancing duo/spiritual aid/baron build with feeding frenzy zombies and using cyclone
midnight kraken
Well in betrayal dominating blow guardian was my started and with medium gear I had no problems in doing t14/t15 bosses
lament zodiac
ultimate facetank fuck you roll over everything build
midnight kraken
lol
odd schooner
Ugh yeah feeding frenzy will make dancing duo even faster
odd schooner
Lol yeah
lament zodiac
and 30% movement speed node
lament zodiac
nope
odd schooner
And all stuff on the ascendency is not aimed at specific minions
midnight kraken
They said you can use it and minion instability for timed minion bombs but
lament zodiac
and with cyclone range nerf it makes facebreaker cyclone good
odd schooner
How will degen gem work with dancing duo
lament zodiac
and spirtual aid is now insane
since all the minion buffs are non minion specific
and with the boen armour +30% life recover baron is insanely strong leech
and all of necro ascendancies make you not die
so you face tank everything
restive wren
DD still going to suck against phased bosses though
restive wren
yeah you basically need 5 worm flasks and a lot of reduced flask charges used
odd schooner
Nah reduced flask charges is qol not essentialy needed
lament zodiac
dancing duo benefits from stacking +phys dmg also
and new golem does that probably
restive wren
need to get 3 uses per flask instead of 2 or else you'll probably still run into issues
odd schooner
Only bosses that can get really annoying are the elder guardians
lament zodiac
its probably not tat bad tbh with cyclone
since you hit fast enough to proc rampage on uniques to get it going
and they will stack up rampage super fast anyway
odd schooner
And maybee delve bosses but i never delved with it
restive wren
when they're hitting the boss it's fine. the problem is invuln phases
lament zodiac
yeah but starting again after invul phase isnt that bad
restive wren
at least the Kitava bosses in maps have adds now though
lament zodiac
urg kitava
restive wren
you have to use the flask 8 times to get rampage started.
odd schooner
Tbh i skip most map bosses anyway, its not worth it
lament zodiac
you can start rampage by hitting uniques no?
restive wren
once you start rampaging you gain stacks by hitting uniques, but to get it started you have to get kills
restive wren
only the dervish gets stacks by hitting uniques
lament zodiac
still should be a hilarious build
and 2 stock spectres means easy frenzy apes
without having to get +spectre items
or bubble boys for even more invicibility
odd schooner
Technicaly wyrmsign gives you rampage at max endurance charges
restive wren
gotta stay at max charges though
restive wren
actually I'm not sure what the interaction with wyrmsign and other sources of rampage is
lament zodiac
well I mean you could
but if you wanna use spiritual aid and cyclone its not good
oh and cast whilst channeling srs/skeletons
because I NEED MORE BOYS
odd schooner
Lol
lament zodiac
maybe skip auras and get a HoAg
restive wren
don't forget summon phanstasm on kill
lament zodiac
cyclone baron is the build
odd schooner
Duo wont make much dps without auras
lament zodiac
I dunno
restive wren
probably need Yriel's Fostering too
lament zodiac
I think you can still get all the gem slots
for +phys dmg to minions
so DD will do dmg still
also its baron remember
probably not worth HoAg since I doubt you will ever even hit anything but bosses
although if you get Mistress of Sacrifice and Flesh Offering you can serious Gotta Go Fast
Cyclone like a Tazmanian Devil off a 90s cartoon
odd schooner
Yeah new necro has a lot of speed
You should be able to reach dual PP cap with it easily too
odd schooner
But a really good VD/unearth build is possible
lament zodiac
Indeed
odd schooner
If that 8% over 2 sec is counted as base mana you could scale it very high
Indigon maybee
lament zodiac
Does unearth dead work with the staff that adds 4 projectiles and fires them in a nova?
odd schooner
Sire of shard yes but why would you do that?
lament zodiac
So you can stand in the middle of blight and blow up everything everwhere?
Sire of shards, Gmp, Lmp, Unearth, Echo, Faster casting, unleash
tidal frost
3 dmg
lament zodiac
and a 6 link with VD
sly tusk
On Garbo internet, was leak 100% accurate wrt necro?
eager terrace
pretty much yeah
they changed the "level" of bone armor from level 1 to 20
which doesn't really mean anything
limpid wigeon
depending on the tags the skill has it might mean something for global gem levels
tidal frost
it was alpha file leaks; any discrepancies are from updates.
eager terrace
so that 30% mana:damage node would be like 52% inc dmg for my FP totems
tidal frost
gem levels only effect gems
limpid wigeon
52% inc dmg from one node is worse than i thought it would be
but still pretty decent
eager terrace
yeah if it is only that good for my kind of build it seems pretty much only for mana guardian
it looks like its a hidden notable
so its probably more expensive than some other good DPS notable
limpid wigeon
yeah
i do hope that the annointment only passives arent too rare
the psuedo ancestral call one and the - flat physical damage taken ones seem really good
eager terrace
I guess it's about the same as 30% crit multi
at least for the PoB I'm looking at anyway
so actually pretty good
but I still kinda want to take flash freeze for that proj speed
limpid wigeon
can you link the album for me
eager terrace
eager terrace
oh arcane capacitor
that probably need to go in my build
that's right above overcharge in templar
limpid wigeon
thunderous salvo is very interesting
changes the dps calculations for unleash efficiency
lapis topaz
Several of the oil keystones are real cool
eager terrace
I haven't seen any I'd take over an existing notable
but I don't really play a lot of builds so I dunno
limpid wigeon
some of them are absolute must takes
eager terrace
in FP totem context I'm leaning towards flash freeze or disciple of the slaughter
or just a defensive notable
limpid wigeon
i think thunderous salvo is pretty solid but im way too lazy to figure out what it actually changes
in terms of effective dps
eager terrace
soul of steel would actually be pretty valuable to me
limpid wigeon
it basically adds 0.71 seconds to your optimal cast time and is a 74% more damage mod
very weird to calculate
soul of steel is very strong
but for the builds that already path near that part of the tree
its not worth annointing just to save 3 points
eager terrace
yeah
limpid wigeon
tribal fury is BIS for any strike build i think
eager terrace
my setup just doesn't go anywhere near there
and I'm 40% MoM with low phys mit
so it's pretty juicy
compared to like constitution
limpid wigeon
tranquility is BIS for CI builds
and ES stackers in general
somewhere around a 110% increased damage node
eager terrace
yeah tranquility looks pretty doink for ES stackers
fair prairie
some things exists to be terrible that way we know what the good things are
violet nymph
just like most uniques are terrible it goes with the game design
fair prairie
yeah with the unique thing they might go too far on how much crap you have to wade threw lol.
twin rampart
fair prairie
they do seem to be trying to fix that by making the older ones better over time
limpid wigeon
probably
north dragon
tidal ruin
doryani's touch ignite prolif meta when
violet nymph
https://youtu.be/VKDvQBe1vEo 1v1 MANAGER ON MINEMEN GONE SEXUAL WTF
vague cosmos
Have we gotten any leaks on the new Ascendant node reworks yet? Been cruising for a couple hours trying to hunt them down to no avail.
static token
I saw a could
https://imgur.com/a/4TYyGdQ
Assassin and Necro, probably all we'll see updated.
vague cosmos
Of course my blind ass looked right over those, thank ya kindly.
torn orbit
I just read the leak for sab and wow this is a bit underwhelming
I was thinking it'd have something like 50-100% reduced Mana reserved by mines but now I'm just confused. How are a miner's defenses going to work? Now that laviangas isn't an option due to the reservation, how are we even going to be sustaining mana?
Before, you could combine mom with laviangas to have both defenses and mana upkeep in one, but are we really going to be stacking regen?
static token
Last I heard we didn't have any idea what the values were. So it could be dirt cheap to sustain.
torn orbit
Even if the costs are on par with attacks, that's still unlikely to be good enough. Mines don't have access to leech, after all
And it looked in the trailer like you could reasonably see half your mama pool reserved
marble zodiac
the mines in the trailer on a 5L looked like it reserved less than 15% with 11 mines out lol
marble zodiac
had bots ~25% and clarity
torn orbit
Business as usual with mom then I guess
static token
Ya, looked like they already had like 50% reserved with no mines out. With mines it was barely a noticeable amount more.
languid path
local man freaking out without numbers
wet plaza
Mines have access to leech now with gloves
fallen tulip
Spectres got a bigass level nerf right?
static token
The gloves are life leech, not mana.
fallen tulip
Just throw blood magic on mines
static token
Eww
wet plaza
Oic I didn't have mana issues on previous miners tbh
Miners generally don't have the life you wanna reserve shit with
static token
Ya, doubt mana is going to be an issue at all. And you always have EB.
fallen tulip
Shouldnt have any now either unless you go for like +500% mana cost
wary stratus
you can't use EB for mines in 3.8, it reserves mana which doesn't interact with EB at all
they probably just nerfed mine mana costs across the board when converting to the new system
static token
They have both a mana cost and a reservation. But EB will still help with the cost part of that and all other mana costs. Just need to have enough unreserved left to max out your mines.
wary stratus
honestly if they do have a mana cost it must be fucking ridiculously low, because I can't see it at all in the gameplay video
and if it is that low, a single -mana cost craft on a ring/amulet should put it to zero -- meaning all it does is reserve mana
even when they spam mines at the end for the boss their mana barely moves
wet plaza
Which makes scolds completely worthless unfortunately
tidal frost
things with mana reservation cost thier mana reserve;
wary stratus
yes, but they're thinking it has both a regular cost and a reservation cost
and that they could spend ES for the regular cost
tidal frost
yeah; its recular cost is its reservation cost
wary stratus
I think they're wrong but I don't have the skill gem info so /shrug
tidal frost
things like auras cost 50% of your mana
you need to have the actuall mana to reserve; not just the max mana
wary stratus
the whole discussion was about eldritch battery, you can't reserve ES was my point
I already know how mana reservation works
I fully expect mines to work exactly the same way something like clarity would in terms of mana reservation
fallen tulip
Indigon works with spamming auras so shud b good with mines too
exotic lake
Question : wtf is that ES ncrease to spell damage node?
runic fractal
You mean one of the special anoint points?
exotic lake
hum idk, it's called tranquillity
"inc and reduction to max ES also apply to spell damage at 50% of their value"
So basically 50 ~ 100% inc spell damage for ES players
limpid wigeon
pretty much
more than 50%
i dont know a single es stacking build that doesn't have at least 200% increased
runic fractal
@exotic lake Yes, that's one of the currently hidden nodes you get from anointment
runic fractal
If you got nothing els to get, then yeah.
runic fractal
You should still easy hit high es
exotic lake
Even though traps << mines now
Yeah but the big issue of ES is recovery
oh wait
isn't there a ES flask too now?
low knot
@unreal star so if the poison doesn't have that double effect then isn't it just like any other dmg type and not anymore OP?
exotic lake
Yeah but the 50% less regen and leech is meh
I don't like having to run a away each time I want to regen
i guess ES leech still is okay
fleet garden
@low knot could you rexplained what you'r talking about pls ?
low knot
i did asked last night if it was true that poison builds comes back with blight and why poison was that OP in the past. and they said something about a double....idk the word anymore but that dmg applyfiers did count 2x
languid path
if you're talking about double dipping then it hasn't been the case for like 2 years
patent canyon
double dipping
languid path
but poison is fine
and nobody ever said poison is op
so I don't know where you got the idea
fleet garden
Oh i see what you want to say
low knot
i was just wondering if i should stick to my cyclone or try one of the enw poison builds
fleet garden
Bai is talking about how scourge arrow "evolve" at first it was meeh but this league is was kinda very powerfull do to NAC-DOT
languid path
scourge arrow was always strong
low knot
i didn't realy know what that arrow "evolve" is but thats fine^^
fleet garden
Yeah ofc
runic fractal
@exotic lake It's still a huge regen, that doesn't go away while first starting.
This is huge for ES
fleet garden
Hi LoA :p
runic fractal
o/
exotic lake
Yeah, especially for Necros, since they shouldn't take damage that often
low knot
@patent canyon yeah i guess i will just stick to cyclone. will just wait somedays until the patchnotes are out so that i know if to chose a impale or normal cyclone
exotic lake
But for instance, in a fight like Uber elder, Rechazrge is shitty
@low knot Or poison cyclone? :D
runic fractal
In a fight like Uber elder, you rarely get hit, isn't this perfect then?
exotic lake
Isn't recharge stopped by dots on the ground?
low knot
it would be a possibilty, but i don't think anyone build that^^
runic fractal
When first the recharge starts, it isn't stopped again for a while. That's what Wicked Ward does
patent canyon
they are stopped by any damage
but it helps if you start regen and step into goo
then it doesnt stop
exotic lake
Yeah but it still needs to start
runic fractal
No, Wicked Ward doesn't stop when recharge has first begun
Also, Degen on the ground is something you control.
There should barely be any
low knot
are there any leaks for impale nerf or something?
patent canyon
not yet
exotic lake
There's a leak on slayer cirt (>7.5%)
runic fractal
@exotic lake If you build around Recharge start, then it doesn't take very long.
low knot
yeah i know about that^^
exotic lake
Yeah, it's true I-'ve never built around recharge, so it was always a side recovery next to leech or regen
runic fractal
You can get some on tree, you can get 20% on each ring, and you can get 40% from watcher's eye discipline
low knot
now i just need to wait until i know if to go champion/gladiator/ slayer and with or without impale
fleet garden
Before we all unleash our build
patent canyon
build assembly in 4
runic fractal
😄 My build is basically build. But there's gonna be slight changes of course
fleet garden
kinda "stuck" with item for the moment but already know what to focus thanks to you
runic fractal
That's what's important ^_^ You're using rare rings, right?
fleet garden
1 rare shaper and the mark of the elder
runic fractal
Oh, yeah that's right 😄
runic fractal
Btw, i was made aware yday, that you're using 2 curses, but actually only got one.
So i'd probably suggest to anoint the +1 curse on tree :p
However, there's a chance you don't need Assassins mark btw. If you're getting Assassin and take the chance to gain a charge, then you don't really need the curse ^_^ And then you're all good
fleet garden
yeah i'm still hesitating for the last
and the only curse we got is assassin mark's i don't see any ohter
said nothing mybad , it's the despair from the flask
runic fractal
😄 Check this:
https://i.imgur.com/eOHBqj1.jpg
Dire Torment, it's found in the bottom left corner. A new node for your build, not currently on the tree
@fleet garden
fleet garden
This will be clearly nice
runic fractal
Dirty Technique, a few above, THAT*S INSANE for you 😮
fleet garden
How to make someone hesitate xD
runic fractal
No hesitation required, tha'ts just a Must Have node, just like Swift Venoms is 😮
fleet garden
let's me create a flask with this
runic fractal
Not sure you can, the over time multiplier probably doesn't work right now
fleet garden
only the poison duration change something lel xD
runic fractal
The fast dmg mod works, but not the over time :p
Probably doesn't work in pob at all, even after release. But we'll see 😄
runic fractal
Wait, the msg "r e e" is a forbidden word?
fleet garden
i think it has been directly del
runic fractal
I think it's the discord bot deleting it, but that's stupid lol
fleet garden
"r e e" for me ( as i'm french ) mean i'm back x)
fleet garden
it's the shortcut for saying "revenu" wich mean i'm back
runic fractal
Well, in french. But in game relating, it's instead of writing rip.. Why is that a banned word?
modern radish
oh wow
runic fractal
<@&174997701513969665> Can you shed some light on this?
silver kettle
Ree? Because of its origins in making fun of people with autism
runic fractal
What? That's stupid, and i say that as a freakin autist.
silver kettle
Well you're welcome to your opinion. We didn't always filter it, we started after getting complaints
runic fractal
You got complaints for that word? Can't possible be from autistic people then.
Where do people consider that word as an insult? It's been in gaming for years.
Oh comeon, it was a link! 😦
You can actually urbandictionary it, and while it seems to refer to autistic a few times, it's actually not referring to autistics in such a way.
Besides, it's used a lot more to refer to normies, than autistics it seems.
It has soooooooo many referrals 😄
eager terrace
I think we get enough memespeak as it is
midnight phoenix
personally i have never missed one of those comments when it gets deleted
i never go fuck me that was insightful i wish that was still there
runic fractal
Well no, it's a small word, and using rip is just as easy in most cases, at least when i use it, it can easily be replaced with just a rip instead.
I just find it rather bizarre that people complaint about it.
when your mom tells you to do somethin, just say "r¨¨!". it means all kinds of things. how i use it is to basically say "get the f*** away from me". so when my mom busts in my room and says "i need you to do blah blah blah" i say, r¨¨!
Hilarious xD an example found from urbandictionary
fluid moat
For pob, the damage over time can work easily
change damage over time by "more damage with X"
like if you have 30% damage over time multiplier, just put "30% more damage with bleed"
runic fractal
Is that the same? Isn't a more multiplier more than over time multipler?
fluid moat
yes, it's the same
runic fractal
Interesting 🤔
torpid sonnet
its only the same if you have only one source of dot multiplier
fluid moat
no?
torpid sonnet
multiple sources of 'more' damage are multiplicative, but multiple sources of dot multiplier are additive
fluid moat
yes, but if you have a total of 30% dot multiplier from 4 or 5 nodes
it's the very same than 30% more damage with dot
despite having multiple sources of it
runic fractal
Lets just assume the current non-ailment dot is gonna work with poison.
You just add them up, and add them as a more multiplier?
What about the new assassin node, or tree node, that gives ailment dot per crit?
fluid moat
the dot ailment per crit is another story
it's much more complicated
well
for poison
for bleed, since you aim to calculate the highest bleed you can do, i just treated it as "common" dot multiplier in my pob
the dot multiplier in assassin is the same
runic fractal
But poison stacks indefinitely, does it not?
fluid moat
yes, that's why it can't work to treat the dot ailment on crit the same as dot ailment
runic fractal
I see
wild arch
Do you think the returning projectiles notable could be used for a no pierce/chain KB setup?
Run up point blank and hit them with return explosions
runic fractal
I don't think KB can return, it explodes on impact?
I might be wrong tho.
wary stratus
if you're trying to boost your single target DPS with returning projectiles, you're wasting your time
it's specifically designed so that it's useless without multiple targets
wild arch
It's useless with multiple targets anyway
wary stratus
it's not useless against multiple targets, it just requires unrealistic conditions to actually help your DPS
wild arch
Can't decide what build to go as starter .-.
runic fractal
Cobra Lash?
wild arch
It's just a fancy spectral throw limited to daggers and claws
runic fractal
That 100% poison
wild arch
I mean
I was hyped up for poisons at first
But if the leak is legit then they changed nothing on assassin
wary stratus
I'm hoping they reveal some better poison skill tbh
runic fractal
Whaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaat
wary stratus
and that's definitely not true, assassin got a lot more poison damage
you need to look a little closer if you think nothing changed
wild arch
That's just number changes
wary stratus
what mechanic changes do you think it needed exactly
wild arch
The elusive node feels pointless
Investing into an unreliable decaying defense mechanic doesn't sound good
wary stratus
don't invest into it, nobody's forcing you to
it provides flat damage reduction as well
at least via mistwalker
runic fractal
And the dmg numbers for poison is really good on Assassin now.
wild arch
Alright so you ignore the elusive nodes
runic fractal
No, not really.
runic fractal
I chose between Deadly Infusion and Elusive.
wary stratus
assassin got a much larger buff (for poison) than raider, by far
runic fractal
You're high on something
wild arch
Although raider has that mini exposure now
wary stratus
poison in general is also gaining a new damage multiplier stat
wild arch
So is ignite supposedly
wary stratus
and new support gems
wild arch
Nothing so far
wary stratus
bleed literally got changes last patch lol
grizzled moth
oh, mb
wild arch
If you dw axe/sword then it's pretty decent
grizzled moth
I must have ignored that part of the patch notes for 3.7
wary stratus
I don't remember all of the changes since I don't care about bleed
wild arch
It was all in the tree
wary stratus
but I know there's "Bleeding you inflict deals Damage x% faster" all over the tree now
wary stratus
they also changed some skill gem stuff to benefit bleeds
what's that slow ass skill that hits twice
fallen tulip
Earthquake?
compact junco
lacerate
wary stratus
yeah lacerate
fallen tulip
Perforate?
wild arch
Puncture
wary stratus
they changed Lacerate and made it significantly better for bleed
and the multistrike change was hugely beneficial to bleeds
wary stratus
I wouldn't be surprised if bleed damage literally tripled last patch tbh, so I wouldn't expect it to get buffed further this patch lol
wild arch
While you run around tagging shit with pestilence
wary stratus
they have other priorities
compact junco
well, they buffed poison in 3.7 as well, and yet they buffed it again now
and noone is still playing bleed so i wouldnt be surprised if they buff that as well at some point
runic fractal
But they are buffing bleed in 3.8?
wild arch
I've seen new bleed guides
But none for poison
Mathil even did a viper strike build but he scaled chaos hits
wary stratus
honestly unless they fundamentally change how bleeds work I can't picture them ever being good
they're not just going to keep throwing 100% more dmg buffs at it
compact junco
no he didnt, that viper strike build was poison build
and he did also SA build that was poison too
wild arch
compact junco
i played SA poison a lot in 3.7 and its really good
wild arch
Well now it will be better so I hope you like replaying builds
compact junco
yeah im going to play it again as starter
fluid moat
You can hit 3M dps with bleed right now
dusty cove
leaning towards deadeye cobra lash
fluid moat
4-6M next patch depending on rng (with current PA, maybe even more depending how it's buffed)
compact junco
i had 5M poison dps with SA with barely any investment in damage outside of darkscorn 🤷
wild arch
I played MS starter every league before 3.7
They are still to reveal more poison skill/s right?
wild arch
Let's hope it's decent
compact junco
cobra lash will be already pretty decent imo, at least for clear. not sure what else I would like to see for poison
fluid moat
a melee poison skill with some range
compact junco
maybe aura? even though for auras there is not really a space, and you already have hoag + malevolence and precision using up all your mana
fluid moat
like lacerate but for poison
wild arch
Or you could enter big brain territory and use lacerate for poison
fluid moat
without the more multiplier, it's useless
compact junco
well lacerate has only downsides for poison so that will not work :d
wild arch
Who said it has to work
compact junco
but bladeflurry poison should still be pretty decent imo
wild arch
And besides if you go assassin then your poisons will work with fucking basic attacks
fluid moat
yes, doesn't mean it works well
compact junco
i still like pathfinder way more for poison, becuase of clear speed. but for damage, ass will be really solid, it already was in 3.7 and now it has like 20-30% more damage at least just from ascendancy (compared to before)
quartz dome
everything works you just gotta BELIEVE IN YOURSELF 🌈
compact junco
bladeflurry probably
wild arch
Can't bladeflurry with hammers unfortunately
compact junco
then I guess eq is only thing that remains i guess
i dont think anything else has multis for all ailments, right
from melee skills
compact junco
yeah that is mostly useless :d
wild arch
Will DS combine both hits into 1 ignite?
compact junco
it should, as it does it in 1 hit
its sad that frenzy has more attack damage instead of generic more damage, then it could be decent as well :d
wet plaza
bleed bow glad is super cheap and good btw
wild arch
Brain rattler lightning ignite EQ
Sounds good initially but it's not gonna be anywhere near fireball >_>
Heeeey hold up
Legion jewels will still be a thing
And so will synthesis crafts supposedly
runic fractal
No
Synthesis crafting is NOT coming back
The only synthesis coming back, is the bosses, for uniques
runic fractal
Yes, as a Zana mission
runic fractal
You mean for 3-5 ways?
wild arch
I just want to get a maraketh jewel
runic fractal
ah
Weren't there talk about legion boss encounters could now drop timeless jewels? 🤔
compact junco
you can do like totem build or trap/mine build if you care just about that
wild arch
Anyone knows if the 0 soul build needs to go PF or if anything works?
wet plaza
PF due to flask effect
wild arch
Then again a delve starter might be more important
Farming bloodstained fossils yourself will be way better
Ok hold up
What the fuck did I just realize
Pestilence PF
runic fractal
Aren't those fossils like at dept 1k+ the most?
wild arch
No wait that combo won't work
fierce torrent
arent bloodstained fossils gonna lose price since legions arent common anymore?
static token
Why would that make them lose price?
copper kernel
because that was their main use
patent canyon
because you are no longer making glacier farmers
now all that is left is regular vaal skill builds
worthy basalt
they were still expensive before legion
runic fractal
There's no information on, what type of gem Carrion Golem is, right?
Str, int, dex
runic fractal
Didn't Mathil make that?
echo dove
@runic fractal not that I've seen, but I assume Str
delicate acorn
yeah
runic fractal
I sure hope so Aboba
echo dove
Could also be Int
delicate acorn
so i'm going to ignore his version
echo dove
there's already multiple strength
runic fractal
I'm praying it's strenght 😄
delicate acorn
because me copying mathil never works out
runic fractal
There's 2 red and blue, but only 1 green
delicate acorn
it's very likely int
runic fractal
Why would you ignore mathils version?
Just put it in pob, and make it into your liking. It's a reference point.
echo dove
I'd be so happy if they re-work the golem skills while they're at it, but with no info on elementalist I'm just going to assume they left them alone
delicate acorn
again: because whenever i go near a mathil build it's a disaster
so im going to take the only concepts i know - brain rattler, eq, inpulsa's - and make something myself
i don't even know what class he went
runic fractal
I'm getting it just fine.
delicate acorn
mathil's touch ruins builds for me
anything but the barest inspiration will end in failure
runic fractal
Then might as well not build it then.
Since he did rattler + inpulsa as well.
delicate acorn
that's a very simple interaction and doesn't count
but if i bother looking at his build i know it's gonna fuck up anything i do with it
runic fractal
Hold on, ima go make a screenshot!
delicate acorn
uh-huh
kindred dagger
Problem is that most of the time mathil build are optimise for himself, the guy going low hp low everything and hunga bunga dps no one can play his build
runic fractal
I know mathil is super good with mechanics, like dodging and shit.
But that doesn't prevent you from using his build as a reference, and actually improve it to fit oneself 🙂
But that's just my personal opinion :p
patent canyon
i would encourage to adjust his build to your needs even
everything is sorted for you, just need to get more life or something else you might want in your own build
wet plaza
Any recent mathil build had plenty of defences tho
runic fractal
He does actually build more and more survivability these times around.
wet plaza
For multiple years now imo
worthy basalt
although I have noticed that his builds are also getting more expensive
runic fractal
He's selfcrafting quite a lot of it.
But it has also gotten a lot easier to actually make currency
proven parcel
I can't really by watching the trailers how much currency the league content will generate. But it looks a lot lower than legion
static token
Seems like it will be fairly similar. Each encounter gives you multiple special "chests". Not like the handful of pocket change from Harbinger. Or maybe a veiled rare from Betrayal.
And we will probably be speed farming it the same way.
lapis topaz
The lack of splinters will make speed farming much less attractive
oils aren't going to have the same value
I expect the actual loot drops to be fairly comparable
static token
Maybe, really depends on how many of them you will need. But there will also be the pure currency. Plus they may well still drop Legion splinters, like Legion dropped stuff normally exclusive to other leagues.
lapis topaz
they'll drop some splinters occasionally but not nearly to the same degree. ALso HH+5way got nerfed significnatly