#1┃mirage-league | Path of Exile 1 & 2 | Page 175

copper kernel Jun 2, 2019, 2:52 PM

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let alone flicker bleed

violet nymph Jun 2, 2019, 2:52 PM

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they're changing bleed

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they stated this, we just don't know how

fallen tulip Jun 2, 2019, 2:56 PM

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hopefully it gets more potent

violet nymph Jun 2, 2019, 2:59 PM

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i mean

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they can only buff it

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they couldn't possibly make it worse

dusty cove Jun 2, 2019, 3:07 PM

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#MakePuncterGreatAgain

verbal mirage Jun 2, 2019, 3:31 PM

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bleed is being buffed, but we need to see how good it is

half bloom Jun 2, 2019, 3:32 PM

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is there a PoB jewel type of thing for the new Berserker?

verbal mirage Jun 2, 2019, 3:32 PM

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i don't think pob is being updated til after the patchnotes

half bloom Jun 2, 2019, 3:32 PM

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yea ik

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some people have custom jewels to simulate ascendancies

verbal mirage Jun 2, 2019, 3:33 PM

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fancy

half bloom Jun 2, 2019, 3:33 PM

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wanted to see if there's one for Berserker

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 3:52 PM

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We made one yesterday on a random crafted flask

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Trying max Rage, Max Blitz, and or Aspect of Carnage

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Carnage is way more DPS in most cases. Max Blitz vs Triple Rage were very close in power level

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We tried it on a random pure Phys any Melee skill tree

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going crit

leaden wraith Jun 2, 2019, 4:10 PM

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i mean like

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if you ahve max blitz vs carnage it should be the same

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 4:16 PM

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No because the blitz node also reduces your crit chance quite substantially

shadow thistle Jun 2, 2019, 4:20 PM

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when are patch notes?

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 4:26 PM

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If you're crit...

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Why do people insist on going crit with a node that gives reduced crit chance?

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The point is insane clearspeed anyways, no? Like even if you do more damage with Carnage you go way faster with Blitz

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 4:32 PM

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You need to crit to even get the charges in the first place

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to maintain the charges you will have to have at least 400% increased crit chance and/or increased base crit chance

livid apex Jun 2, 2019, 4:35 PM

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What do you mean 400% increased

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10% reduced x 20 charges = 200% reduced, but you get 110% increased on the way to Blitz

smoky fiber Jun 2, 2019, 4:36 PM

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you'll also have much higher attack and clear speed, so you'll get crits WAY more often as well

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 4:37 PM

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You want it to never wear off because losing 20 charges at once will feel very bad

smoky fiber Jun 2, 2019, 4:37 PM

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if it lasts 10 seconds it'll never wear off probably, even with 0 crit investment

livid apex Jun 2, 2019, 4:37 PM

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Just get 20 aps templarLul

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 4:37 PM

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so you need to stack Accuracy on bosses

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Sure that would work, but at the same time you want the crit for dps

smoky fiber Jun 2, 2019, 4:38 PM

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doesn't matter much if you don't have crit multi

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 4:38 PM

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it doesn't last 10 seconds though

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it's only 5 seconds

smoky fiber Jun 2, 2019, 4:38 PM

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oh they said how long it lasts?

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5 seconds is kinda short, probably need a little crit investment ^^

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 4:39 PM

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Yeah, the default for charges is 10 seconds so that's what most people assumed, but then Mark made a comment in a forum thread about it

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I think 5 seconds is just too short for almost every build

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I think it's a meme

smoky fiber Jun 2, 2019, 4:39 PM

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eh

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I think it'll actually require crit investment though, which'll feel bad

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probably ~100% increased crit chance on a 7.5% chance base or so

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 4:41 PM

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I wanna do self-cast temp chains flicker strike with it though

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I don't think it's a good node, but it's hilarious to have 40% more attack speed

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 4:41 PM

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You just go crit melee and you'll be fine -200% is not that bad

smoky fiber Jun 2, 2019, 4:42 PM

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you really don't want to invest in crit multi with that node

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 4:42 PM

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Many spell crit build use controlled destruction

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why not?

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it' still always worth it

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just crunch the numbers

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Crit is one of the most effective ways to scale dps no matter how high it is

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 4:43 PM

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The thing is if you want to go fast and hit hard as zerker there's an obvious choice which is Rite of Ruin + Carnage

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Blitz is for meme clearspeed builds

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 4:43 PM

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I think Carnage + Blitz + Rage will feel slightly better

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but we'll see

smoky fiber Jun 2, 2019, 4:44 PM

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I guess you'd pretty much always use assassin's mark so

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 4:44 PM

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not having Blood Rage Degen + 5.5% degen from Rage will be a bit easier to sustain I think

smoky fiber Jun 2, 2019, 4:44 PM

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if you can get +1 or +2 max power charges you could fully mitigate the node like that

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 4:44 PM

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Exactly

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And you already get crit/crit multi from the first node

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 4:46 PM

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Going max 5 seconds between packs is rough though

smoky fiber Jun 2, 2019, 4:46 PM

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nah

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 4:46 PM

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Like you need to be in a map layout you know really well

smoky fiber Jun 2, 2019, 4:46 PM

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reave stacks are 4 seconds I think?

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 4:46 PM

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It really depends on the map

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 4:46 PM

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I'm sure its fine in like Toxic Sewers or Underground Sea or something

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For general mapping it must be rough

smoky fiber Jun 2, 2019, 4:47 PM

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I've never really had a probably maintaining reave as long as you're playing high tempo

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 4:47 PM

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Chris stated in Baeclast that he likes the idea of tailoring your build to specific playstyles with exactly this in mind

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Also referring to the choice of what maps you want to run

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And high tempo is what Blitz gives you

smoky fiber Jun 2, 2019, 4:48 PM

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they did say indoor maps are going to have much higher legion density

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 4:48 PM

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Not true

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What they said was: Legion Generals will spawn more tightly packed

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 4:48 PM

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I remember dropping Vaal Reave fairly regularly

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 4:48 PM

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so the more difficult monsters will be closer together with fewer monsters in total

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 4:49 PM

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If you can ramp up super fast it's probably OK, if you have 10% net crit it could be damn rough to get to 20 stacks

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 4:49 PM

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Yea but you won't end up with that low crit

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 4:49 PM

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Sure, if you go crit zerker

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Does zerker have any accuracy on its tree?

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 4:49 PM

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You can easily get to 500% inc crit on a 7.5% base crit weapon with Zerker + Tree

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even with -200% you will end up over 20% crit chance without a diamond flask

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 4:50 PM

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Yeah, for crit builds I think stacking up won't be too hard with any fast, large aoe skill

smoky fiber Jun 2, 2019, 4:51 PM

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rare mobs with double hp, twice as many crits until you can one shot them

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 4:51 PM

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Jonathan also mentioned blue mobs getting an HP buff

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that'll be interesting for racing

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 4:51 PM

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Lol that's crappy logic, everything around them will die and you'll get like 1/5 as many crits on rares as a result

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 4:52 PM

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in terms of it still being worth to kill the pack

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 4:52 PM

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Yeah, depends on the size of the buff

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Also whether it's across the board or only in maps

smoky fiber Jun 2, 2019, 4:52 PM

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yea, most of the time you wouldn't kill rares cause it wasn't quite worth it, now I guess we're just not killing rares ^^

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 4:52 PM

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Blue Packs are where it gets interesting though

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 4:53 PM

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Wait you were playing a build that didn't kill rares?

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I've never skipped regular rares

smoky fiber Jun 2, 2019, 4:53 PM

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in early game?

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 4:53 PM

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do you ever, while leveling?

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 4:53 PM

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Oh nvm, while leveling yeah

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I do sometimes while leveling if it's a low HP mob

smoky fiber Jun 2, 2019, 4:53 PM

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wonder if it'll affect essences and stuff too

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or like abyss/breach mobs?

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 4:54 PM

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they talked about that and I think there was some sort of balancing mentioned

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 4:54 PM

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I think it does affect everything

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 4:54 PM

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especially in regards to regen mods, shield mods, etc.

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 4:54 PM

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they were joking around about unkillable Bestiary mobs and stuff

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 4:54 PM

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Essence beasts are fun...

smoky fiber Jun 2, 2019, 4:54 PM

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I feel like some abyss/breach mobs were tankier than map bosses already lul

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 4:55 PM

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Some of them are, Syndicate members too

proven wadi Jun 2, 2019, 5:20 PM

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if its like normal charge mechanics, when they expire, all of them expire

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 5:27 PM

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Yea, it goes down to 0

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Same for Challenger Charges

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it's just how charges work

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 5:27 PM

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The difference between 10s and 5s is huuuuuge though

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 5:28 PM

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Yea it always has buildup time once you lose it

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 5:30 PM

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They're buffing fortify though, which helps counteract maybe

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 5:35 PM

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Blitz + Triple Rage will make you super fast anyway

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That's why people will start doing that

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Not sure if carnage is even needed even if it's more dps

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You won't need 5s to backtrack with that leap slam speed

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You'd need very strict loot filters obviously

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if you can still control it properly it will be faster

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Just like headhunter does

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 5:41 PM

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I think a lot of people are looking at this from the perspective of, like, "Berserker has these tools to do great damage and stuff, how can I maximize my zerker damage and make a good character"

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When the right thing to do is probably, "I need a baseline amount of damage in my clearspeed setup, how much attack speed can I stack while doing that much damage"

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Like, you don't end up at Blitz + Rite of Ruin by min-maxing zerker damage, you get there by min-maxing clearspeed

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 5:42 PM

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Totally

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and you will be running very specific maps with that setup

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not just any content

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 5:43 PM

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Yes, it's for doing like 40 second Toxic Sewers or something

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Flicker Strike, Consecrated Path, Reave, maybe Lacerate depending on how it's reworked, Wild Strike, Bladestorm, could do Cyclone but no movespeed buffs on zerker so maybe not

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@spring spindle why are you deleting all your posts?

violet nymph Jun 2, 2019, 5:58 PM

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Consecrated path is gonna be so good

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Chieftain sustains endurance charges with it, slayer never dies with it, berserker goes zoomzoom with it

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 5:59 PM

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Any melee skill with easy targeting and big aoe should work fine

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Frost Blades?

violet nymph Jun 2, 2019, 5:59 PM

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You know what doesn't make sense to me

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Juggernaut and raider exist, and sustain their charges repectably, but witch's only power charge sustain is a garbo node on occ nobody uses

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Assassin is the only power charge ascendancy, and he's a hybrid class

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 6:01 PM

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I mean it used to be that reliable sustain was rare and special

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Then trickster got it and now everyone expects it

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 6:09 PM

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Has anyone been toying around with a Bowserker here?

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 6:09 PM

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I considered it, didn't go as far as making a PoB for it

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Someone on reddit made one I saw

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Chin Sol + Hyrri's chest I think

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I think Slayer might make an even better bow char?

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And Trickster is still good even though no one does it

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 6:11 PM

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I guess it's still not worth it because it slows you down so much compared to deadeye or pf

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Except for Glad I guess? Maybe that works

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 6:13 PM

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Glad is hard to justify over Deadeye though

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Like the defenses are still shit and Arena Challenger is hardly better than Tailwind

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I think Slayer and Trickster are cool because you can make a boss-killing bow build with like 1.5mil Shaper DPS and really good defenses

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And it's still a bow build so of course you can clear screens even if it's not quite as zoom zoom as Deadeye

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Like you can make a Trickster with 8k EHP and Soul Tether Belt for overleech, and eva based for like 1.2k ES gained when hit

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 6:22 PM

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Not much speed going on there though

quartz dome Jun 2, 2019, 6:33 PM

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Bowser-ker ?

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 6:35 PM

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😄

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Someone's gonna use that on a Paint Build

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 6:43 PM

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I guess the idea of a bow build that's not built for hyperspeed mapping seems weird to people 😛

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Also, isn't there basically the same amount of movespeed on all three builds?

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Zerker gets 20% increased movespeed

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Slayer does too

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Trickster only gets 10% I guess

tiny flint Jun 2, 2019, 6:59 PM

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Will specters be good in legion encounters?

wild arch Jun 2, 2019, 6:59 PM

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¯_(ツ)_/¯

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 6:59 PM

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I don't see a good reason why they wouldn't

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As far as I can tell the monster shell acts like its own monster, and spectres will target it until it "dies"

summer magnet Jun 2, 2019, 7:00 PM

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Zerker gets 30% ms

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 7:00 PM

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It's very much against the concept of player agency with summons

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they'll just attack randomly most of the time

summer magnet Jun 2, 2019, 7:01 PM

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10% for the base 50 rage stacks and triple that for the improved rage effect

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 7:03 PM

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A random thought: Right now you can sort of map with skills with mediocre AOE like, say, Blade Flurry

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Because you can just set up and channel and monsters run into your AOE like braindead zombies no matter how small the AOE is

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But in Legion, everything will be frozen

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If you're not actually hitting the whole screen, you just won't touch the monsters

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Heck, Cyclone is like this: a big reason why it works even without huge AOE is monsters run into it

sinful hazel Jun 2, 2019, 7:12 PM

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what order of nodes would you go for going rage and blitz in zerker? i assume rage 1, crit 1, rage 2, then blitz as the final nodes?

civic vector Jun 2, 2019, 7:15 PM

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I would go crit 1 rage 1 rage 2 and end on blitz

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But I also plan to ignore blitz for the leech node and have more of an all-rounder I think

fierce moon Jun 2, 2019, 7:16 PM

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if i play i think i might do rage 1 and 2, leech and warcry

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the instant hp gain and endo charges are cool

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and the other warcry can give 200% damage if there are enough monsters around

idle hull Jun 2, 2019, 7:17 PM

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I actually think blitz might be annoying to maintain, but we'll find out.

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Since it only has a 5 second duration

sinful hazel Jun 2, 2019, 7:17 PM

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well if blitz is too hard to maintain ill prolly grab leech and shift my tree a bit

idle hull Jun 2, 2019, 7:18 PM

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I'm personally hoping for champion to get some nice changes. Both slayer and berserker are too offensive for my liking.

fierce moon Jun 2, 2019, 7:20 PM

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you might be underestimating the warcry and leech nodes

idle hull Jun 2, 2019, 7:21 PM

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Eh those are both good regen mechanics, but they dont help prevent or reduce damage.

fierce moon Jun 2, 2019, 7:21 PM

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well with the warcry node you're going to be using warcrys

sinful hazel Jun 2, 2019, 7:21 PM

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"50% maximum leech" yes ill recovery 150% of my life each second ty

dusty cove Jun 2, 2019, 7:21 PM

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no such thing as too offensive on SC 😄

idle hull Jun 2, 2019, 7:21 PM

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Also I dislike using warcrys 24/7, so that wouldnt happen for me regardless

fierce moon Jun 2, 2019, 7:22 PM

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enduring gives big health regen, endo charges and 25% of hp back

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 7:22 PM

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150%? That's definitely not gonna happen

fierce moon Jun 2, 2019, 7:22 PM

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i feel you though

idle hull Jun 2, 2019, 7:22 PM

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@dusty cove For me there is, I REALLY dislike dying, even in SC. I'm not a great player, so unless my build is decently defensive I'll die a lot lol.

wide ridge Jun 2, 2019, 7:22 PM

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then berserker probably isn't for you?

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 7:23 PM

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50% increased maximum is gonna be exactly 10% of your HP per second, scaled by "increased life recovery rate" and doubled if you have Vaal Pact

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but nowhere near 150% per second for sure

sinful hazel Jun 2, 2019, 7:23 PM

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idk it

wild arch Jun 2, 2019, 7:23 PM

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I think what they're trying to do here is make the melee ascendancies excessively offensive so you can afford spending more points beefing up

sinful hazel Jun 2, 2019, 7:23 PM

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im pretty sure it is 50% of your life

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hemtatogy is 15% increased, same wording as zerker

fierce moon Jun 2, 2019, 7:24 PM

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@idle hull my last shot at convincing you is that you could go MoM to really make good use of the mana leech, and run herald of purity with spiritual aid and minion damage nodes

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to get some minions to take hits for you

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 7:24 PM

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The default maximum leech rate is 20% of your HP per second, any percent increases will affect that total, not raw HP per second numbers

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Hematology adds 6% of your HP/s to your leech rate, yeah

wide ridge Jun 2, 2019, 7:24 PM

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herlad of purity + blind is all kinds of good

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 7:25 PM

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err, 3%

sinful hazel Jun 2, 2019, 7:25 PM

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on pob they are both 15% of my leech

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 7:25 PM

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Do you remember how the old Vitality Void and Hematology used to be worded? Like +3% maximum HP/s added to life leech cap

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Yes, your leech is currently 20% of your HP, and Hematology adds 15% of that

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which is 3% of your total HP added as leech

sinful hazel Jun 2, 2019, 7:26 PM

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huh

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math is weird for this.

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it is still going from 60 to 70 or 80% oof your maximum life

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 7:28 PM

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Link your PoB? On a full invested character 60->70% makes sense

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20 is default, 30 is with zerker leech, doubled to 60 by Vaal Pact

sinful hazel Jun 2, 2019, 7:29 PM

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https://pastebin.com/rAHdDSrY i dont have the zerker leech on this rn

Pastebin

eNrlPGtz2ki2n4dfoXLV3cpUAla33l57t_DbSbAJ2Jlsvrja0BjFQsJ6gPGW__s93Z...

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huh

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the bot isnt enabled here

copper kernel Jun 2, 2019, 7:29 PM

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yep

languid path Jun 2, 2019, 7:29 PM

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📎 unknown.png

sinful hazel Jun 2, 2019, 7:30 PM

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ty

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 7:30 PM

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That makes sense, Vitality Void adds to max as well

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You'll add a flat 20% max HP/s by taking Zerker leech, you'll go up to 78%/s

sinful hazel Jun 2, 2019, 7:31 PM

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yup so about 80%

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thats a lot of recovery

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 7:31 PM

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Yeah, it certainly is

sinful hazel Jun 2, 2019, 7:31 PM

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add a elder belt with life recovery rate LUL

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 7:31 PM

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With that much leech, wouldn't overleech belt be better?

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So you don't have to ramp it up every time you get hit

sinful hazel Jun 2, 2019, 7:31 PM

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overleech gloves are synthesis only

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 7:31 PM

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Soul Tether is core

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It doesn't offer any other stats though

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Just a bit of EHP from whatever your ES pool is, but that's probably low

sinful hazel Jun 2, 2019, 7:32 PM

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would need gear reworking

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and woouldnt it just instantly fill as well?

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cause only 400es is gonna get filled insantly

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 7:33 PM

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It does, but Life Leech doesn't end at full ES either (it never does, unless you take Ghost Reaver which changes how it works)

languid path Jun 2, 2019, 7:33 PM

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soul tether does not stop at neither full life nor full es

sinful hazel Jun 2, 2019, 7:33 PM

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oh wat

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umm

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ok

languid path Jun 2, 2019, 7:33 PM

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well

sinful hazel Jun 2, 2019, 7:33 PM

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that is wierd

languid path Jun 2, 2019, 7:33 PM

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more correctly

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life leech only stop at full life

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full es does not matter

sinful hazel Jun 2, 2019, 7:33 PM

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thats

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wierd

languid path Jun 2, 2019, 7:34 PM

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soul tether already takes care of the full life

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so it goes on for 5s

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 7:34 PM

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Yes, I think Soul Tether is underrated

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I made a trickster with it this league

sinful hazel Jun 2, 2019, 7:34 PM

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on another note im going blood magic flicker so my life is gonn abe constantly draining

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 7:35 PM

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Ghost Shrouds nodes and the belt give like a 2k ES pool of EHP on their own with some hybrid nodes, even with Acrobatics

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so you get like a 7k EHP trickster

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Who gets like 70% life recovery rate from Patient Reaper and 1k+ ES gained when you're hit from Ghost Shrouds/Evasion

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You have like 5k/s permanent leech with Ghost Shrouds

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And you're evasion with acro/phase acro so a lot of avoidance too

sinful hazel Jun 2, 2019, 7:39 PM

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thats a loot

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ill cross that bridge when i get to it. as it is right now it is a loooot of damage for the blitzs

proven wadi Jun 2, 2019, 7:41 PM

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i think i wanna try trypannon zerker of some sort. but i need to decide on a skill

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 7:41 PM

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I'd call it Trapanon

proven wadi Jun 2, 2019, 7:42 PM

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melee traps dont exist though

languid path Jun 2, 2019, 7:43 PM

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bear trap would like to have a word with you

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I know it's a spell

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but it's as melee as you would get

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 7:44 PM

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Not with a lot of trap trigger radius it isn't 😄

wide ridge Jun 2, 2019, 7:46 PM

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you have two 6ls. consec path with coc aoe stuff, and dual strike single target?

solid nova Jun 2, 2019, 7:48 PM

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Anyone else think they should do a partial revert on the arc chain distance nerf? Maybe bring it up to like 35

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 7:49 PM

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I doubt they will do that. Either it's supposed to chain between packs or it isn't.

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 7:49 PM

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Arc felt very mediocre on mines now

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The damage was still way more than enough but the clear wasn't worth it

solid nova Jun 2, 2019, 7:49 PM

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Problem is clue, sometimes it doesn't even chain well within packs

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 7:49 PM

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GC / Fireball were simply better

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 7:50 PM

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I haven't played since the nerf, if it's failing to chain within packs now, then yeah a partial revert sounds welcome.

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Do Fireball mines work? Do they target in any reasonable way?

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 7:50 PM

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Oh yea

wide ridge Jun 2, 2019, 7:50 PM

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projectiles aim at the nearest monster

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 7:51 PM

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You add Fork or Chain + GMP

wide ridge Jun 2, 2019, 7:51 PM

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traps vertually always hit

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 7:51 PM

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Or use Sire of Shards

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it offscreens a lot of stuff

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 7:51 PM

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I always thought of Fireball as a pretty precise skill

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like it needs a decent bit of manual targeting, gotta aim at the middle of the pack or else you only clear out half of it

wide ridge Jun 2, 2019, 7:52 PM

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traps themselves are aimed

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 7:53 PM

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so are mines

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 7:53 PM

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The two are different though

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 7:53 PM

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but with gmp quad mines

copper kernel Jun 2, 2019, 7:53 PM

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traps dont aim themselves

wet plaza Jun 2, 2019, 7:53 PM

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you have to aim traps

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mines aim

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 7:53 PM

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like Traps sometimes don't target

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 7:53 PM

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you fire out 20 fireballs at once

wide ridge Jun 2, 2019, 7:53 PM

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traps are aimed in that you put them in a specific location relative to monsters

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 7:53 PM

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it doesn't matter at that point

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 7:54 PM

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The problem is that if a trap is triggered by something other than monsters (like Sunblast or that thing that makes traps chain react) then they won't autotarget unless the skill autotargets

wide ridge Jun 2, 2019, 7:54 PM

#

really?

#

Thought it was always nearest monster

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 7:54 PM

#

Yeah, like I remember back in the day KB mines was great but KB traps was unplayable

wide ridge Jun 2, 2019, 7:54 PM

#

is it just random?

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 7:55 PM

#

It's "the thing that triggered me" for traps

#

which is monsters if you're triggering them by scaling trap trigger radius

#

Like, GC traps is not a thing

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 7:56 PM

#

It is

sinful hazel Jun 2, 2019, 7:56 PM

#

sould tether looses 140k shaper dps which still leaves the build at 600k shaper, some life and res but swapping blitz to leech gives 1.4k leech cap and the overleech shenanagins

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 7:56 PM

#

Check out NathanWalkers 500% ms lab farmer

#

one shots izaro with GC Traps

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 7:57 PM

#

I mean Izaro is a level 75 monster

#

You can "one shot" him with all sorts of stuff these days

wide ridge Jun 2, 2019, 7:57 PM

#

-.-

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 7:57 PM

#

GC Traps will have similar multipliers to GC mines ... it's not about damage at all

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 7:58 PM

#

Also, I think so long as you are actually triggering traps by monsters it's fine

wide ridge Jun 2, 2019, 7:58 PM

#

'can one shot one of the weaker end-game bosses' is not a downside of a build

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 7:58 PM

#

it's just that Lightning trap has better AoE and is already easier to scale

#

that's why people prefer that

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 7:59 PM

#

GC Traps has similar damage on paper to GC Mines but the targeting is much worse

#

like if the monster moves they won't target it at range

languid path Jun 2, 2019, 8:00 PM

#

and gc doesn't overlap at the cast point

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 8:00 PM

#

And for GC in particular you don't actually want to be on top of the monster you're targeting, unless it's a huge hitbox

#

Yeah, you want to be next to it

livid apex Jun 2, 2019, 8:00 PM

#

I wish they hadn't dumpstered arc so severely

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 8:00 PM

#

I understand doing it for Uber Lab

#

like on top of knowing exactly where a massive hitbox enemy will spawn

#

it will even space your traps out perfectly in a ring around him when you throw on top of him

sinful hazel Jun 2, 2019, 8:04 PM

#

gc traps is nuts confirmed

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 8:05 PM

#

Yes, if you're building a build to kill exactly 3 stationary level 75 unique monsters with large hitboxes and a perfect radius circle around them 😂

sinful hazel Jun 2, 2019, 8:07 PM

#

it isnt too bad clearing either with a bunch oof aoe. did a sabbo that could clear p[retty well for gc mines

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 8:12 PM

#

Oh hey someone made an ascendancy tier list creator

#

Here's mine: https://tiermaker.com/list/online-games/path-of-exile-ascendancies-100777/144472

TierMaker

Clueless's Tier List

Weeeeeeee

sinful hazel Jun 2, 2019, 8:13 PM

#

assasin is pretty meh isnt it XD

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 8:13 PM

#

It's like meme damage but no defenses to speak of

#

It does CoC pretty well tho 😛

sinful hazel Jun 2, 2019, 8:13 PM

#

so does like everyone else XD

copper kernel Jun 2, 2019, 8:13 PM

#

not really

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 8:14 PM

#

It's really expensive to make CoC work on anyone else

copper kernel Jun 2, 2019, 8:14 PM

#

ass is the best for coc/autobombers

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 8:14 PM

#

And usually doesn't even end up better

sinful hazel Jun 2, 2019, 8:14 PM

#

oh i thought you said discharge XD

wide ridge Jun 2, 2019, 8:14 PM

#

coc isn't THAT expensive

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 8:14 PM

#

Assassin CoC isn't

wide ridge Jun 2, 2019, 8:14 PM

#

I did raider coc in sff

livid lake Jun 2, 2019, 8:14 PM

#

scion is still good

#

still the best for jewel stacking.

wide ridge Jun 2, 2019, 8:15 PM

#

was above 60% crit with some claws

copper kernel Jun 2, 2019, 8:15 PM

#

thats....horrible

livid lake Jun 2, 2019, 8:15 PM

#

though significantly worse since the slayer change

wide ridge Jun 2, 2019, 8:15 PM

#

if you like. hit the cast rate limit, so I wasn't too put out

#

trigger rate*

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 8:16 PM

#

I mean it's nearly impossible to hit cast rate limit reliably with 60% crit

#

unless you're like doing stupid overkill on attack rate and even then not great

copper kernel Jun 2, 2019, 8:16 PM

#

youre also RNGs bitch

#

coc with less than 80 crit feels bad

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 8:17 PM

#

Like every missed crit is an entire attack cycle worth of no casting

solid nova Jun 2, 2019, 8:17 PM

#

Just play coc zerker! You'll come close to rate limit when you're attacking 46 times a second!

wide ridge Jun 2, 2019, 8:18 PM

#

You have very high standards

copper kernel Jun 2, 2019, 8:18 PM

#

well

#

yeah

wet plaza Jun 2, 2019, 8:18 PM

#

raider d-tier

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 8:18 PM

#

I mean, I don't doubt it works, CoC is pretty good even if you're doing like 30% less damage than you should

wet plaza Jun 2, 2019, 8:18 PM

#

templarLul

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 8:19 PM

#

I refuse to put raider in OMEGALUL tier, no matter how unpopular

#

you can make such a tanky char

livid lake Jun 2, 2019, 8:19 PM

#

tanky.. raider?

#

rng defense isn't too good overall

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 8:20 PM

#

Yes, like max dodge 95% evade raider with immunity to ailments

#

dodge is RNG af

#

but Evasion isn't

livid lake Jun 2, 2019, 8:20 PM

#

yeah but i mean you're still going to eventually get hit

#

and with mitigation you will die

#

evading/dodging doesn't reduce the hit you take

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 8:21 PM

#

Yeah but not many things are one shots these days

copper kernel Jun 2, 2019, 8:21 PM

#

mmBoi

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 8:21 PM

#

unless you're in Uber Elder or something

#

go watch some rip clips at 25% speed

#

it's always like "ooh he got chunked here and then stunned and then the volatile exploded and he died to the ignite" or something

#

or like "oooh he whirled right into the path of an entire barrage of arrows" or something

sinful hazel Jun 2, 2019, 8:22 PM

#

or just

#

full life hanving fun "Molten Strike would like to know your location" suddenly beyond molten strike to 0 hp with no windup

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 8:24 PM

#

Yeah exactly, Dodge/Eva is an AMAZING answer to all the streamers who have ripped to the beyond molten striker recently

#

You get hit with like 10 balls at once

#

Avoiding 9 of them is sweet

wide ridge Jun 2, 2019, 8:32 PM

#

speaking of shotgunning, does having bad block recovery mean you miss some blocks, or is it just the delay before you can attack?

wild arch Jun 2, 2019, 8:38 PM

#

It's the delay

#

Speaking of shotgunning, thanks for reminding me about caustic arrow

patent canyon Jun 2, 2019, 8:41 PM

#

caustic doesnt shotgun tho

wild arch Jun 2, 2019, 8:41 PM

#

It does tho

#

The explosion overlaps up close

patent canyon Jun 2, 2019, 8:42 PM

#

it overlaps but only applies 1 instance of DoT

wild arch Jun 2, 2019, 8:43 PM

#

One of my meme builds

📎 Path_of_Exile_15_03_2019_15_48_36.mp4

#

Who cares about the dot

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 8:43 PM

#

Caustic Arrow is a clean AOE shotgunning skill yeah

patent canyon Jun 2, 2019, 8:43 PM

#

in that sense, yh

wide ridge Jun 2, 2019, 8:43 PM

#

you can ignore the dot and just hit the guy 4 times with a decent weapon skill

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 8:44 PM

#

Ultimately its low base damage hurts it a lot when trying to use it for hit damage

#

but it's possible

wild arch Jun 2, 2019, 8:44 PM

#

I liked this build with maloney's mechanism

#

1 click = 18 arrows

#

Now if I were to do this with berserker to have some actual dps... beastWoke

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 8:45 PM

#

So whaddya all think of crit Chieftain cyclone using Sandstorm and Effigon?

wild arch Jun 2, 2019, 8:45 PM

#

Chieftain

#

I mean... sure

#

I guess

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 8:46 PM

#

I would rather use Crit Slayer tbh

wild arch Jun 2, 2019, 8:46 PM

#

^

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 8:47 PM

#

I mean why not just use a high-crit weapon? The full fire conversion + effigon sounds so nice.

#

And Cyclone + Hits Cannot Be Evaded aura is damn nice

wild arch Jun 2, 2019, 8:47 PM

#

Why not turn a high dps weapon into a ridiculous powerhouse with 8% base crit?

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 8:48 PM

#

because I would rather just use Xoph's Blood instead in the amulet slot

civic vector Jun 2, 2019, 8:48 PM

#

It’s gonna be all about the BLS ConcPath zerker

#

Just use strength instead

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 8:48 PM

#

That sounds gross

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 8:48 PM

#

BLS Molten Strike Berserker

wild arch Jun 2, 2019, 8:48 PM

#

Trypanon zerker is the one true meta

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 8:48 PM

#

I fully expect Molten Strike to be utterly gutted

#

It's gonna be like Barrage

idle hull Jun 2, 2019, 8:49 PM

#

I fully expect molten strike to not really be touched that much

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 8:49 PM

#

if they dont touch it, its going to dominate

#

it and Cyclone tbh

wild arch Jun 2, 2019, 8:49 PM

#

If molten strike is gutted we still have ~~melee barrage~~ lancing steel templarLul

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 8:49 PM

#

Cyclone for clear and molten strike for tankyness/single target

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 8:50 PM

#

I think this is actually a bows league

wild arch Jun 2, 2019, 8:50 PM

#

That's so true

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 8:50 PM

#

If all your enemies are stationary, Cyclone actually kinda sucks

idle hull Jun 2, 2019, 8:50 PM

#

I doubt it tbh, molten strike has always been very strong, but it has meh clear speed. We all know the skill with the highest clear speed is the king.

wild arch Jun 2, 2019, 8:50 PM

#

Quill rain zerker anyone? vanity

civic vector Jun 2, 2019, 8:50 PM

#

Not anymore, Cyclone can stationary channel now.

idle hull Jun 2, 2019, 8:50 PM

#

@wild arch A thousand arrows a second, literally.

civic vector Jun 2, 2019, 8:50 PM

#

It’s basically fine against a still target.

wild arch Jun 2, 2019, 8:51 PM

#

The only acceptable number tbh

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 8:51 PM

#

@civic vector but even if you're clearing 80% of the screen that way, if monsters aren't moving into the AOE it will be slow

wild arch Jun 2, 2019, 8:51 PM

#

If the walls are not coated in 10 layers of arrows you're doing something wrong

idle hull Jun 2, 2019, 8:51 PM

#

Just slap knockback on it @wild arch nothing will ever touch you again

wide ridge Jun 2, 2019, 8:51 PM

#

cwc lighting warp/flamedash

civic vector Jun 2, 2019, 8:52 PM

#

@odd steeple we’ll see, my Cyclone char is gonna be slayer so the Cull will go a long way.

#

Also too, I love the indoor maps. Less coverage needed.

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 8:52 PM

#

I'm not worried about damage for Cyclone, and I think regular maps are gonna be fine

#

I just think it's gonna be a monster pain to free all the legion monsters

civic vector Jun 2, 2019, 8:52 PM

#

Yeah that’s why I said the second thing, indoor maps will be 👍

wide ridge Jun 2, 2019, 8:53 PM

#

all is proably not possible. I expect you beeline to the rares of one team, then dash across to the other

idle hull Jun 2, 2019, 8:53 PM

#

Soul rend will still be king

jovial quarry Jun 2, 2019, 8:53 PM

#

I'm tempted not to go melee league start to avoid the prices in the beginning

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 8:53 PM

#

You'll take like the full 17 seconds freeing all the frozen monsters, and then they'll all collapse on you and you'll murder them all in 2 seconds 😛

civic vector Jun 2, 2019, 8:53 PM

#

Just put gorefiends grasp in this game

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 8:53 PM

#

Smart choice is still spell casters unless Trickster and Occultist nerfed hard

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 8:54 PM

#

Yeah, I kinda want to do ED/Contagion Trickster at league start just to avoid the rush to buy Starforge and Atziri's Disfavour and shit

wild arch Jun 2, 2019, 8:54 PM

#

Oh shit

#

Guys

#

Lioneye's slayer

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 8:54 PM

#

Yes, bows league confirmed

wild arch Jun 2, 2019, 8:54 PM

#

Lioneye with 8% base crit is gonna be nuts

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 8:54 PM

#

Or Doomfletch's Prism Zerker

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 8:54 PM

#

Thay feel when non Ranger classes gonna our perform Raider in bow builds

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 8:54 PM

#

or Chin Sol slayer

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 8:54 PM

#

ranger

wild arch Jun 2, 2019, 8:55 PM

#

Shouldn't the champ announcement be here in about an hour?

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 8:55 PM

#

aren't they usually later than that?

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 8:55 PM

#

The only thing I expect from Champ is changing that 4 point Fortify node

#

Otherwise Champ is balanced

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 8:56 PM

#

But yeah I think champ and jugg are coming? (With the knowledge that Jugg is just a minor number tweak)

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 8:56 PM

#

Arent the Challenges supposed to be revealed today?

wide ridge Jun 2, 2019, 8:56 PM

#

occultist too

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 8:56 PM

#

Challenge rewards

wild arch Jun 2, 2019, 8:56 PM

#

Which bow would be best combined with hyrri's demise?

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 8:57 PM

#

dex stacking rare bow

wild arch Jun 2, 2019, 8:57 PM

#

What if you're stacking strength tho? marauderthinking

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 8:58 PM

#

Then you can use whatever tbh

#

Get Iron Grip

#

Good to go

wild arch Jun 2, 2019, 8:58 PM

#

Nope

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 8:58 PM

#

Then BLS 😛

wild arch Jun 2, 2019, 8:58 PM

#

Iron grip is inc phys

#

Won't do anything unless you do the crown of eyes and repentance gimmick

#

HMMMMMMMM

#

Ele hit quill rain zerker templarLul

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:00 PM

#

Go Ice shot, to paint the screen blue

#

Added bonus: you won't do enough damage to kill anything so lots of white monsters to chain and fork off of 😂

wild arch Jun 2, 2019, 9:00 PM

#

Rain of arrows to blot out the sun 🤔

#

So how is that crimson storm bow?

#

It looked kinda interesting but I never got around to doing anything with it

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:02 PM

#

It's actually pretty good

#

But bleed isnt

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:03 PM

#

I'm really curious if they're gonna buff dagger nodes on the tree

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:03 PM

#

It does add a ton of flat phys so might be good with Berserker

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:03 PM

#

I think Vulconus is criminally underplayed for what it iss

#

It's a 550 dps one handed weapon with 200% global increased damage and 200% global increased crit

wild arch Jun 2, 2019, 9:04 PM

#

I was considering dagger zerker

#

For easier crit

livid lake Jun 2, 2019, 9:05 PM

#

its just super slow base

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:05 PM

#

Yes, it's slow as balls

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:05 PM

#

Vulconus math wise is great but ppl hate rotating buffs

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:05 PM

#

And all the new attacks don't work with Daggers

wild arch Jun 2, 2019, 9:05 PM

#

Viper strike hype kudukuwobble

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:06 PM

#

And it's ALMOST super easy to build? If you could link Chance to Bleed to Herald of Purity it would be easy to build

#

But you can't do that

#

And so you either need to use the rotating buff

#

Or do like Vulnerability curse shenanigans to get your minions to apply bleed

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:07 PM

#

Werent there supposed to be reworking bleed/poison and the counterattack skills?

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:07 PM

#

Or just say screw it to that 100% increased damage and just be Avatar of Fire all the time

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 9:07 PM

#

Is anyone of you planning on playing in a private league in Legion?

wild arch Jun 2, 2019, 9:07 PM

#

Just make your movement skill bleed and boom problem solved

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:07 PM

#

Not starting out

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:07 PM

#

@wild arch it doesn't work, because you can't bleed if you do 0 physical

idle oracle Jun 2, 2019, 9:07 PM

#

Are you guys talking current league or next league?

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:07 PM

#

Legion

fading cedar Jun 2, 2019, 9:08 PM

#

do we already know which ascendancies will be changed in Legion?

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:08 PM

#

Check the reddit megathread, Frozen Fire

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 9:08 PM

#

Not yet... the last changes will be in the Patch Notes

fading cedar Jun 2, 2019, 9:08 PM

#

aside the ones that were announced, I mean

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 9:08 PM

#

except for Champ which will be up in a few hours

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:09 PM

#

There are "adjustments" to ascendancies coming

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:09 PM

#

We know there are a few more getting changes, and we know Raider is NOT getting changed

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 9:09 PM

#

I suspect there will be some numerical changes in some cases

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:09 PM

#

And by adjustment they means nerfs

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 9:09 PM

#

nothing they feel are worth being teased

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:09 PM

#

They would never tease nerfs lol

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 9:09 PM

#

I'd love to see a nerfed Trickster 😄

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:09 PM

#

"Here's an early look at the adjusted Trickster Ascendancy"

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 9:09 PM

#

even if just slightly

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:10 PM

#

What would you even change on Trickster

#

Imo that 2 point swift killer does a bit too much

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 9:10 PM

#

Just tweak some numbers on the defensive nodes I think

#

I don't even think the offensive capabilities of Trickster are outstanding

#

they're good

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:11 PM

#

Trickster was fine pre Synthesis so its def somethinf the matter with Eternity Shroud, Ghost Shroud or Swift Killer

#

Since they are the odd ones out

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:11 PM

#

Yeah, Trickster is insane right now because it's like the best defensive ascendancy for Hybrid, CI, MoM, and MoM+EB

#

That's just too generically strong

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:12 PM

#

And evasion too lol

#

Here's a hot controversial take

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:12 PM

#

Ehh, pure life-based evasion you can do pretty well on other classes

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:12 PM

#

I think taking acrobatics should reduce mana as well

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:12 PM

#

The ES recovery is the thing that pushes it over the edge

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:13 PM

#

MoM plus Acrobatics too good

#

Tho they seem to be moving MoM

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 9:13 PM

#

Make Acrobatics a Stance... reserving 25% mana

#

lul.

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:13 PM

#

Yeah, that's an insane combo

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:13 PM

#

If its more far left then it might balance out

#

Since you would have to travel to opposite ends of tree

#

Ie if they swap zealous oath and MoM

idle oracle Jun 2, 2019, 9:14 PM

#

So what exactly are the "Challenger charges" - "Blitz Charges" etc?

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 9:14 PM

#

I don't think MoM got moved

#

just the Mana nodes behind

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:15 PM

#

They're just what they say on the ascendancy nodes

#

(With the minor addendum that Blitz charges last 5 seconds instead of the normal 10)

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:15 PM

#

Challenger charges is basically just tailwinf

summer magnet Jun 2, 2019, 9:15 PM

#

it literally says what they do on the ascendancy tree

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:15 PM

#

Challenger Charges is Tailwind for attacks only, yeah

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 9:15 PM

#

We actually don't know if these Charges do anything

#

Because all the bonuses are bound to the Ascendancy

#

not the charges

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:16 PM

#

What do you mean, Likewize? They describe all the bonuses on the ascendancy node

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 9:16 PM

#

Right

#

they don't describe the charges

summer magnet Jun 2, 2019, 9:16 PM

#

they do -.-

#

read

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 9:16 PM

#

just the bonus the ascendancy gives when you have them

summer magnet Jun 2, 2019, 9:16 PM

#

no

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:16 PM

#

We dont know if they deplete one by one or all at once

idle oracle Jun 2, 2019, 9:16 PM

#

Where is this information at? Because I have read everything on the ascendency tree. Don't see it.....

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:16 PM

#

I mean, I get what he's saying, like Rage is a mechanic with reminder text to explain what it does, while Challenger Charges are a blank canvas with an ascendancy-specific buff while you have them

summer magnet Jun 2, 2019, 9:16 PM

#

https://gyazo.com/d61849c2951a18878e2652fb279325d4

Gyazo

#

they literally say "per blitz charge"

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 9:17 PM

#

Compare that to Raiders bonus to frenzy charges

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:17 PM

#

Let's not talk about Raider

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 9:17 PM

#

It doesn't say "Blitz charges grant..."

idle oracle Jun 2, 2019, 9:17 PM

#

"+2% More"???? How does that define anything?

#

So it already has a base?(undefined)

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:17 PM

#

Raider was outdated when Deadeye got Tailwind

#

It's 2 more to your speed

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:17 PM

#

The operating assumption is that there is no inherent buff associated with the charges, and the ascendancy provides everything

idle oracle Jun 2, 2019, 9:18 PM

#

Exactly, "+2% more"

#

tO WHAT?

summer magnet Jun 2, 2019, 9:18 PM

#

attack speed?

#

are you blind?

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:18 PM

#

So all Blitz does is 2 more to your attack speed

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:18 PM

#

To your character's attack speed

idle oracle Jun 2, 2019, 9:18 PM

#

You are ignornant, does not make me blind

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:18 PM

#

Like power charge gives 40% crit chance

idle oracle Jun 2, 2019, 9:18 PM

#

is it +2 more to a base?

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:18 PM

#

+40% to crit chance

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:18 PM

#

I think you just aren't familiar with how PoE describes stats, if that line is confusing to you

idle oracle Jun 2, 2019, 9:18 PM

#

That it already gives?

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 9:18 PM

#

My guess is that Blitz and Challenger Charges don't actually do anything

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:18 PM

#

Yes, attack speed is default 1.0

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 9:18 PM

#

only the Ascendancy does

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:19 PM

#

Err, set by the weapon

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 9:19 PM

#

because the wording for Frenzy charges is 100% the same on Raider

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:19 PM

#

The wording shoulf be

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:19 PM

#

Like a vanilla siege axe has 1.5 attacks per secont

#

And "Attack Speed" is a modifier that increases the rate of attacks by a percentage amount

#

"2% More" means "multiplicative with all other modifiers"

idle oracle Jun 2, 2019, 9:20 PM

#

Clueless, you are as your name defines. A lot of skills say "more" and adds to a base that is already defined.

#

This base is not defined

#

Does Blitz and Challenger charges have a base?

summer magnet Jun 2, 2019, 9:20 PM

#

it defined by your weapons attack speed

idle oracle Jun 2, 2019, 9:20 PM

#

Do you specifically know?

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:20 PM

#

There is no base

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:20 PM

#

Attack Speed is a stat. The node gives 2% more to it per charge.

idle oracle Jun 2, 2019, 9:20 PM

#

How do you know?

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:21 PM

#

Because its obvious?

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:21 PM

#

because we know what "Attack Speed" means in PoE

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:21 PM

#

What else could it be?

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:21 PM

#

and it means your character's Attack Speed stat

summer magnet Jun 2, 2019, 9:21 PM

#

He's obviously a troll...

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:21 PM

#

not something associated with charges

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:21 PM

#

It's like saying what does +40 increased critical strike chance mean

#

When you gain power charge

#

What base is it applying to?

#

It's applying to your crit chance

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:22 PM

#

devs are usually very precise, sometimes we don't know what a new term means (like in this patch, it happened with "Base Crit" and Chris Wilson had to come tell us what they meant by that)

summer magnet Jun 2, 2019, 9:22 PM

#

it's like saying "why is 2+2 = 4" ....

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:22 PM

#

but Attack Speed and "2% more" are both well-understood PoE terms

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:22 PM

#

The only thing you need to know is that this makes Berserker super fast at the cost of some crit chance

#

Not even that much. It's like 2 power charges worth

idle oracle Jun 2, 2019, 9:23 PM

#

What are the base stats to Frenzy, Endurance, and Power charges?

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:23 PM

#

They don't have "base stats"

idle oracle Jun 2, 2019, 9:23 PM

#

Yes they do....

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:23 PM

#

They provide buffs to your character

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 9:23 PM

#

They give a bonus per charge

summer magnet Jun 2, 2019, 9:23 PM

#

which is an considerable amount but easy to make up for

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:23 PM

#

Base stat to those are that every character starts with max 3 and duration 10s

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:23 PM

#

And you can read on the wiki what those buffs are

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:24 PM

#

Where as blitz you start at 0

idle oracle Jun 2, 2019, 9:24 PM

#

I have read on wiki what they do, I am asking you for the sake of my previous question

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:24 PM

#

0 maximum that is and 5s duration

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 9:24 PM

#

But what I've been saying is: We do not know whether Blitz or Challenger Charges provide bonuses the way Endu, Frenzy or Power Charges do

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:25 PM

#

They dont otherwise it would be specified

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:25 PM

#

Right, Likewize, and I think there is no way to know for sure but it's the best assumption we can make that there is no inherent bonus

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 9:25 PM

#

You'd think so

idle oracle Jun 2, 2019, 9:25 PM

#

I know Likewize.

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 9:25 PM

#

It's not the case on Raider

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:25 PM

#

Blitz just provides more attack speed and reduced crit

idle oracle Jun 2, 2019, 9:25 PM

#

You understand that, they dont

summer magnet Jun 2, 2019, 9:25 PM

#

didn't chris already explain that on the reddit post?

#

impretty sure he did

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 9:25 PM

#

Blitz probably provides nothing

#

Say you had Blitz charges on a Deadeye

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:25 PM

#

Challenger and Blitz both probably provide nothing

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 9:25 PM

#

how ever you'd get those

#

they would have no effect

idle oracle Jun 2, 2019, 9:25 PM

#

It is a possibility that is, but I like how people assume they know what they do, when they are not even out yet

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:25 PM

#

Blitz charges wont grant anything

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 9:26 PM

#

so it's not the charges granting it but the ascendancy node

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:26 PM

#

If its on any other Ascendancy

#

Unless other wise stated

#

So if they make a weapon

idle oracle Jun 2, 2019, 9:26 PM

#

Well Frenzy Endurance and Power does not state exactly what it does either.

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:26 PM

#

We have no idea for sure what Challenger nodes inherently provide, but we do know for sure that Gladiators with that node get 2% more Attack and Movement Speed per Challenger Charge

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:26 PM

#

"You have +5 max Blitz charges, gain 5% increased attack speed per Blitz charge"

summer magnet Jun 2, 2019, 9:26 PM

#

i pretty fucking obvious tho.. the only way to gain blitz or challenger charges is by taking the node.

idle oracle Jun 2, 2019, 9:26 PM

#

Neither do challenger or Blitz charges.

summer magnet Jun 2, 2019, 9:26 PM

#

it's*

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:27 PM

#

We have had items provide charges before

summer magnet Jun 2, 2019, 9:27 PM

#

it's a different story with endu, frenzy and power charges

idle oracle Jun 2, 2019, 9:27 PM

#

How are you sure?

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:27 PM

#

It's "obvious" maybe, but it is an assumption

idle oracle Jun 2, 2019, 9:27 PM

#

Did you test it?

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 9:27 PM

#

I disagree Dane, there are many ways to get certain charges

idle oracle Jun 2, 2019, 9:27 PM

#

exactly my point

summer magnet Jun 2, 2019, 9:27 PM

#

yes

#

but theese are bound to specific ascendancies

#

rage is a whole other thing

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:27 PM

#

For now

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:27 PM

#

I mean Zuko, my argument with you is that you seemed confused what "2% more attack speed per challenger charge means"

idle oracle Jun 2, 2019, 9:28 PM

#

You didn't test it or read what it does, so you are explaining it like a fact when it is an assumption

summer magnet Jun 2, 2019, 9:28 PM

#

because they already explained that they are adding rage skills

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 9:28 PM

#

While I agree with the notion that there probably aren't other ways in this patch that you might acquire them

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:28 PM

#

It's an assumption based on info provided

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:28 PM

#

that's perfectly clear, it provides 2% more character attacks per second depending on the number of charges you have, no assumptions needed

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:28 PM

#

Thats what the discord is for

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 9:28 PM

#

It does not mean it will be impossible or that we know if they provide any bonuses

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:28 PM

#

I feel like if it provided any other bonuses it would have been specified

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 9:29 PM

#

I agree Bomb

idle oracle Jun 2, 2019, 9:29 PM

#

Clueless, no... That is another assumption... I understand what +2% more" means.... My confusion is "Is there a base stat, or is it just adding to your current stat?"

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:29 PM

#

So say if you could use Generosity and give charges to other classes... They would get no bonuses

idle oracle Jun 2, 2019, 9:29 PM

#

I stated that multiple times in my argument

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:29 PM

#

... It's an entirely independent buff. There is no possible buff that Challenger Charges can provide that change the way that line of text works

summer magnet Jun 2, 2019, 9:29 PM

#

it works as it usually does with 2% more

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 9:29 PM

#

Or if Conduit would apply to all Charges

idle oracle Jun 2, 2019, 9:29 PM

#

"IS THERE A BASE STAT?" my only question I ever asked 10 times

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:30 PM

#

There is no base stat

idle oracle Jun 2, 2019, 9:30 PM

#

The answer seems to add to no one knows.

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:30 PM

#

We answered that already

idle oracle Jun 2, 2019, 9:30 PM

#

How do you know?

#

Can you cite proof please?

summer magnet Jun 2, 2019, 9:30 PM

#

we already answered it

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:30 PM

#

Because we have a brain

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:30 PM

#

We have no idea for sure if Challenger Charges provides a base buff. Either way though, we know exactly what the line of text means

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:30 PM

#

We can make logical conclusions

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:30 PM

#

because it doesn't modify any Challenger Charge buffs, it modifies your character

summer magnet Jun 2, 2019, 9:30 PM

#

holy moly what a fucking troll

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 9:30 PM

#

This is just a misunderstanding of the wording I think

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:31 PM

#

If I am wrong about it then it was on GGG to display what the charges do by default (as in outside of the ascendancy)

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 9:31 PM

#

"more Attack Speed" is a known term. It will always apply to your Base Attack Speed, whether it's unarmed or with a weapon of any kind.

idle oracle Jun 2, 2019, 9:31 PM

#

Okay, so there is no where defined that it has a base stat.

#

So like I said, no one knows.

summer magnet Jun 2, 2019, 9:31 PM

#

k listen Zuko

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 9:32 PM

#

this instance of "more" will always refer to that and not some "base stat" of Blitz Charges

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:32 PM

#

You could ask thay about any stat

#

Does Tailwind apply to a base stat.

#

What does %faster mean?

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:32 PM

#

Like, that line of text could say "2% more attack speed per siphoning charge" and then it would work with Disintegrator Staff. It could say "2% more attack speed per Spirit Charge" and then it would work with Lightpoacher, do you see what I mean by "That line of text has nothing to do with the bonuses, if any, that Challenger Charges provide"?

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:32 PM

#

Etc

idle oracle Jun 2, 2019, 9:32 PM

#

Tailwind is not defined as a charge, it is a passive ability

summer magnet Jun 2, 2019, 9:33 PM

#

it doesn't matter if it says "increased" or "more" the stat it is modifying is always your base attack speed. which default is 1.0 (unarmed) or wahtever attackspeed your weapon has.

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 9:33 PM

#

What Clueless said is a good comparison

idle oracle Jun 2, 2019, 9:33 PM

#

Your argument is invalid "DahBomb"

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:33 PM

#

Yes, Zuko, "2% more Attack Speed per Challenger Charge" is also a passive ability

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:33 PM

#

Ok then consider it as a passive ability then

#

That's prob what it really is

idle oracle Jun 2, 2019, 9:33 PM

#

DependableDane, I am in no way concerned about how that works.

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:33 PM

#

Considering thats what the Gladiator one exactly is

#

Only difference is that you can give Tailwinds to other as a buff

idle oracle Jun 2, 2019, 9:34 PM

#

MY ONLY QUESTION STILL.... Does the charges grant a base stat?

summer magnet Jun 2, 2019, 9:34 PM

#

If you ain't concerned how that works why do you keep asking the same question over and over again

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:34 PM

#

They dont we answered that already

idle oracle Jun 2, 2019, 9:34 PM

#

I could care less about what the bonus is from that node

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 9:34 PM

#

Zuko, I think "base stat" is the wrong wording

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:34 PM

#

The answer is no one knows for sure, but I would assume the answer is "no"

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 9:34 PM

#

Weapons have a "Base Attack Speed"

#

a "Base Damage"

#

While frenzy charges e.g. provide a bonus

idle oracle Jun 2, 2019, 9:34 PM

#

I kow clueless, I have said that 5 times now

#

People are still not listening to me

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:35 PM

#

Sure, but you still seem confused by what "2% more Attack Speed and Movement Speed per Challenger Charge does"

idle oracle Jun 2, 2019, 9:35 PM

#

My question has been answered

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 9:35 PM

#

There's nothing considered "base" about frenzy charges

idle oracle Jun 2, 2019, 9:35 PM

#

Clueless, you really are clueless.....

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 9:35 PM

#

at least not in wiki/poe vocabulary terms

idle oracle Jun 2, 2019, 9:35 PM

#

I DONT CARE WHAT THE NODE SAYS. It was that simple

#

Stop trying to explain 2% more

#

I don't care for it

summer magnet Jun 2, 2019, 9:36 PM

#

there should be some kind of restriction towards how many times you can spam the same stupid shit in the chat without any reprecussions.

dusty cove Jun 2, 2019, 9:36 PM

#

yes charges have a base value

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:36 PM

#

that line of text passively modifies your character, based on the nominally unrelated fact of how many Challenger Charges you have

dusty cove Jun 2, 2019, 9:36 PM

#

and more is a stright + to whatever that is normally

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:36 PM

#

Can you give an example of what base means to you?

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 9:36 PM

#

that base is in no way related to the charges @dusty cove

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:36 PM

#

No troll legit question

#

Feels like we are operating on two definitions of base

#

Because when I think of base I mean the base of the weapons or the skill

#

So 1.2 base attack speed or 6% base crit

#

Of a weapon

dusty cove Jun 2, 2019, 9:37 PM

#

look at say raider. it gives more to frenzy charges its a stright additive

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 9:37 PM

#

Oh hell no

idle oracle Jun 2, 2019, 9:38 PM

#

40% increased Critical Strike Chance per Power Charge This is a base stat. Every single power charge gives this

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 9:38 PM

#

It increases your attack speed IF you have charges

#

it doesn't change what the charges do

idle oracle Jun 2, 2019, 9:38 PM

#

With no node required

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:38 PM

#

Let's be clear: there are two ways that are conceptually similar to grant a modifier based on a buff. For example, Deadeye has Tailwind which is a buff with an inherent effect, and also has a modifier to Tailwind that makes Tailwind up to 100% more effective on itself.

dusty cove Jun 2, 2019, 9:38 PM

#

it dose. charge info gets updated in your char sheet

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:38 PM

#

Then yea, Blitz provides nothing "base" as assumed by the description

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:39 PM

#

Raider has a buff that modifies itself based on the number of Frenzy charges you have, but that buff has no effect on what Frenzy charges provide, and would work whether or not Frenzy charges provided anything at all.

wide ridge Jun 2, 2019, 9:39 PM

#

it'd be a bit sill if blitz gave 2% more attack speed, 20 times (1.02)^20

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:39 PM

#

Our only evidence is what GGG wrote

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 9:39 PM

#

Okay, we know we can't trust the UI with anything ever since they made it clear that 100% chaos res is not what CI does

idle oracle Jun 2, 2019, 9:39 PM

#

Lilan, Can I ask you something? Because these guys are trying to play Dr. Phil on a question that does not exist.

#

@dusty cove Does Challenger and Blitz charges have a base stat?

#

BEFORE the "+2% more attack speed, etc"

summer magnet Jun 2, 2019, 9:40 PM

#

Zuko is just looking for someone to tell him he is right.. leave him be and he'll go away

solid nova Jun 2, 2019, 9:40 PM

#

No

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:40 PM

#

The answer is no everyone said that already

dusty cove Jun 2, 2019, 9:41 PM

#

they have a nill value so yes they have a value

idle oracle Jun 2, 2019, 9:41 PM

#

No one has said that, everyone keeps trying to tell me what "+2% more" means.

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:41 PM

#

Everyone here has answered that question

idle oracle Jun 2, 2019, 9:42 PM

#

My statement still stands.... No one has answered it, they keep trying to explain "+2% more" go back and read chat.....

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:42 PM

#

5:34 PM] Clueless: The answer is no one knows for sure, but I would assume the answer is "no"

wide ridge Jun 2, 2019, 9:42 PM

#

you take the number of charges you have, multiply it by the buff for one charge, get the actual number as a lump sum

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:42 PM

#

That was my answer

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:43 PM

#

Everyone said no but you kept asking how do we know

wide ridge Jun 2, 2019, 9:43 PM

#

that is how all other charges work

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:43 PM

#

Others have said similar things, or are more confident and just said "No"

summer magnet Jun 2, 2019, 9:43 PM

#

we also answered that blitz charges or challenger, does NOT have a base value in the charge themselfes. This info is based on info provided by GGG. End of story dude.

wide ridge Jun 2, 2019, 9:43 PM

#

if they did, the tool tip would say

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:43 PM

#

^

#

Like it does with Rage

#

But since it doesn't

#

We are to assume it does nothing

summer magnet Jun 2, 2019, 9:44 PM

#

i even used rage as an example earliere aswell rofl

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:44 PM

#

Now if it does do something then GGG is at fault

summer magnet Jun 2, 2019, 9:44 PM

#

Let's put it this way. Zuko.. patch notes are in 3 days.. look it up then.

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:45 PM

#

I dont think this will be explained in notes

#

Prob something you would have to test in game

#

When League is out

idle oracle Jun 2, 2019, 9:45 PM

#

June 7th

#

it is on poe main page

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 9:45 PM

#

I think it is safe to assume that they do not grant any bonuses. Much like Spirit Charges or those of Disintegrator.

summer magnet Jun 2, 2019, 9:45 PM

#

patch notes are not june 7th, league start it

#

is*

idle oracle Jun 2, 2019, 9:46 PM

#

5:45 PM] Dahbomb: When League is out
[5:45 PM] Zuko: June 7th

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:46 PM

#

Yea thats when we can fully test it

summer magnet Jun 2, 2019, 9:46 PM

#

did you read what he wrote otherwise?

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:46 PM

#

If nothing will satisfy you except an ingame test, then yeah, you will have to wait til June 7th

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:46 PM

#

I dont think this will br addressed in notes

idle oracle Jun 2, 2019, 9:46 PM

#

No I was on another discord.

summer magnet Jun 2, 2019, 9:46 PM

#

or did you just consistently take shit out of context?

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:46 PM

#

At least to your satisfaction

summer magnet Jun 2, 2019, 9:47 PM

#

do*

brittle fulcrum Jun 2, 2019, 9:47 PM

#

So just for clarification for Berserker's Gain 1 Rage on Hit with Attacks, no more than once every 0.3 seconds., does this mean that I won't be able to instantly cap my Rage after 2 monster packs?

shadow delta Jun 2, 2019, 9:47 PM

#

The node says that each charge provides X values. their is no base stat to the charges as no other ascendancies and characters can generate them.

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:47 PM

#

Yes

#

They did it on purpose

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 9:47 PM

#

Not with this alone

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:47 PM

#

Yes, Bluelit, I think it's to make it more momentum based

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 9:47 PM

#

There will be skills that generate Rage

brittle fulcrum Jun 2, 2019, 9:48 PM

#

k thanks for the clarification!

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 9:48 PM

#

Chain Strike is supposed to, right?

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:48 PM

#

The charges are what keep Berserker somewhat in check because otherwise it would be too easy to be at max dps all the time

#

That wont stop the PoB warriors from maxing out all charges tho

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:48 PM

#

Yeah, I think it's supposed to be a "keep fighting all the time or you lose your power" type of frantic class

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:49 PM

#

Max Blitz, Max Rage, Berserk on, full Frenzy

#

Yea

summer magnet Jun 2, 2019, 9:49 PM

#

it should be fairly easy to keep 50 stacks tho

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 9:49 PM

#

Picking up Loot? ... No.

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:49 PM

#

Basically if you move out to dodge you may lose charges

summer magnet Jun 2, 2019, 9:49 PM

#

dodges are instant now remember that 😛

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:49 PM

#

There is an active skill called Berserk that degens charges but gives bonuses

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:49 PM

#

And you can choose how much to buy in to that, whether just with Rage for slow momentum build, or go all out with Blitz for "Don't break for even 5 seconds or you will be nerfed to ground zero"

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:49 PM

#

Yea but when you are dodging you aren't attacking

shadow delta Jun 2, 2019, 9:50 PM

#

Angry

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:50 PM

#

Berserker is going for balls to the wall offense

summer magnet Jun 2, 2019, 9:50 PM

#

nah, but i assumed you can dodge and attack again within 1-2seconds wit hthe new updates

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:50 PM

#

With some drawback

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:50 PM

#

Speed and momentum. That's it's niche.

summer magnet Jun 2, 2019, 9:50 PM

#

on baeclast it looks pretty instant

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:50 PM

#

Almost all of them have some drawbaxk

#

And speed

#

Attack speed that is

dusty cove Jun 2, 2019, 9:50 PM

#

i miss berserker being best spell caster

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:50 PM

#

Fast glass cannon

summer magnet Jun 2, 2019, 9:51 PM

#

that was unintended tho

dusty cove Jun 2, 2019, 9:51 PM

#

unintended is best intention

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:51 PM

#

Dodge is instant, you can only cancel an attack in the upswing or downswing though, not in the damaging window.

brittle fulcrum Jun 2, 2019, 9:51 PM

#

yeah with Rage generation being slower than before, idk if I can see myself using the Berserk skill frequently

#

unless I have other sources of Rage, like that new Chain Strike

summer magnet Jun 2, 2019, 9:51 PM

#

you can generate rage with skill gems aswell

#

i believe they said there would be 2 rage generating skills

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:52 PM

#

Yes, you shouldn't worry about attack speed for rage gen now, I think, just consistently fighting

idle oracle Jun 2, 2019, 9:52 PM

#

To counter the glass cannon effect, couldn't you use the warcry nodes with steelskin?

brittle fulcrum Jun 2, 2019, 9:53 PM

#

woulda preferred the old 1 Rage on Kill with higher chance to gain Rage when hitting a rare/unique tbh

idle oracle Jun 2, 2019, 9:53 PM

#

Understanding steelskin is not a warcry, just talkins as an additive

dusty salmon Jun 2, 2019, 9:53 PM

#

Im worried that melee will become clunky, especially singletarget

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:53 PM

#

Yeah, I think it's all part of the balance though.

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:53 PM

#

But then you would have to take warcry node

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:53 PM

#

Like you have 40% more attack speed on a node on Zerker, if you could also instantly get 75% increased attack speed it would just be gross

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:53 PM

#

And give up a ton of damage and speed

solid nova Jun 2, 2019, 9:54 PM

#

New immortal call actually sounds amazing with jugg and an eternal apple

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:54 PM

#

@dusty salmon well, single target is already clunky so it's hard to get worse

dusty salmon Jun 2, 2019, 9:54 PM

#

If you find a loophole it will be patched 2 weeks in, leaving you with a fully farmed useless char

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:54 PM

#

Berserker with Debeon Dirge gonna be legit tho

dusty salmon Jun 2, 2019, 9:55 PM

#

Becaude they no longer respect releases it seems

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:55 PM

#

I mean, unless you find some way to break the 85% phys mitigation cap I don't think they would do a mid-league nerf to it

idle oracle Jun 2, 2019, 9:55 PM

#

Not really, the warcry node grants damage and attack speed to nearby alies.

dusty salmon Jun 2, 2019, 9:55 PM

#

Both betrayal and synthesis had massive changes mid-league

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:55 PM

#

To items or ascendancies?

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:55 PM

#

It does but not as much as the other offensive nodes

dusty salmon Jun 2, 2019, 9:55 PM

#

Yes

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:55 PM

#

They change enemies for sure. But they try not to do balance changes, what are you thinking about?

idle oracle Jun 2, 2019, 9:56 PM

#

true, so a defensive swap. Would still not be that bad.

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:56 PM

#

You can always Chain Strike

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 9:57 PM

#

The only changes I can think about were buffs, like the change to fix ED applying when you pierce, or the radius and application rate of Soulrend

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 9:57 PM

#

I really wonder how clunky Chain Strike will feel

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:57 PM

#

Yea

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 9:57 PM

#

Hitting terrain, aiming problems...

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:57 PM

#

Not really main movement skill viable

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 9:57 PM

#

Fast moving enemies too

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:58 PM

#

Wait can it not pull if there is no enemy?

#

That would suck then lol

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 9:58 PM

#

We don't know

summer magnet Jun 2, 2019, 9:58 PM

#

im pretty sure hitting terrain is not gonna be much of an issue with 3.7

#

if you watched the last baeclast episode, you will know they deminished the areas you can hit

dusty cove Jun 2, 2019, 9:58 PM

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Chain Strike ? i feel out of the looooop

summer magnet Jun 2, 2019, 9:58 PM

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so no more shield charging stuck on a wall etc.

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 9:58 PM

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In the trailer there is a skill where he uses a chain to pull himself toward enemies and gain Rage charges

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 9:59 PM

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Haven't heard anything about that in the Baeclast?! Got a timestamp?

summer magnet Jun 2, 2019, 9:59 PM

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ye 2 sec

dusty cove Jun 2, 2019, 9:59 PM

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oh right that skill

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was thinking melee suport :X

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 10:00 PM

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So if your AoE is huge, and you oneshot, you gotta find 50 packs to get 50 rage. Basically high damage and big aoe negatively affects rage generation. -.-

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That's the point

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Berserker is about speed than big hits

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Cyclone makes sense for Berserker

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Same for stuff like Double Strike

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 10:00 PM

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Cyclone requires Movespeed though

summer magnet Jun 2, 2019, 10:00 PM

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@rapid solar https://youtu.be/575M-LKz6zs?t=2148

YouTube

Tarke Cat

Baeclast #40 Melee in Path of Exile Legion : An Inside Look with J...

In this episode we are joined by GGG co-founder and Technical Director Jonathan Rogers who gave us an exclusive inside look at the extensive melee changes in...

▶ Play video

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 10:00 PM

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Cyclone?

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Did we watxh the trailer?

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Seemed like it had good aoe

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That's why I am telling you guys

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Debeon Dirge Berserker Cyclone!

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And you get the warcries are instant node

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On tree

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So your cyclone isnt interrupted

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So you can war cry while channeling cyclone

summer magnet Jun 2, 2019, 10:02 PM

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i think i would prefer dual wielding for cyclone

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but i won't know for sure before patch notes

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 10:03 PM

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Jonathan doesn't say anything about not getting stuck with Shield Charge anymore

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 10:03 PM

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You could also do Nghamu Cyclone

summer magnet Jun 2, 2019, 10:03 PM

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he does

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 10:03 PM

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he only says the rubber banding won't happen

summer magnet Jun 2, 2019, 10:03 PM

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im not sure if it's abit later

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 10:03 PM

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Actual Cyclone does little damage but the balls do most damage

brittle fulcrum Jun 2, 2019, 10:03 PM

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if zerker is supposed to be the insane attack speed ascendancy now, then the cap on the rate at which you gain Rage seems anti-synergistic

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 10:03 PM

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So better with Berserker fast attack speed

summer magnet Jun 2, 2019, 10:03 PM

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but that part was where they started talking about how they made the colission models smaller, and path finding better

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 10:04 PM

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The cap is to balance ot

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Otherwise Berserker would have obscene damage all the time

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You can gain 3 charges in a second, more if you use chain strike

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 10:04 PM

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Yeah Euclidean pathfinding 💦 💦

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 10:04 PM

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And then maintaining isnt too hard

brittle fulcrum Jun 2, 2019, 10:05 PM

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eh, i'll be waiting to see other sources of Rage before concluding my thoughts on his rework

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 10:06 PM

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I think the cookie cutter Zerker will be Rite of Ruin, Aspect of Carnage and either War Bringer or Pain Reaver depending on whether you want warcries or 50% increased leech cap

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And the meme speed zerker will be Blitz and Rite of Ruin

summer magnet Jun 2, 2019, 10:06 PM

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@rapid solar - i just watched from where i sent. and It's literally saying "we are going from 4 way pathfinding to 8 way pathfinding." and then he mentions the shieldcharge thing

brittle fulcrum Jun 2, 2019, 10:06 PM

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yeah for my league starter I defo wasn't planning to build around Blitz

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stacking crit seems expensive when starting as a marauder

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 10:07 PM

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Yea, we'll see how it will work out

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I think you will still shield charge into terrain

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probably less than before

summer magnet Jun 2, 2019, 10:07 PM

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problaly but alot less

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 10:07 PM

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@brittle fulcrum I think a pretty cheap way to start crit will be to use Effigon + Sandstorm and a shortrange fire conversion melee skill

summer magnet Jun 2, 2019, 10:07 PM

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he did mention that being stuck on walls shouldn't be a thing anymore

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 10:08 PM

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How good is cannot be stunned while leeching if you dont have over leech?

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 10:08 PM

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yea but you won't be able to use shield charge anymore when you can't reach the target you click

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if there is anything inbetween here and there

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so basically instead of ramming into a wall you won't move at all

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it seems

summer magnet Jun 2, 2019, 10:09 PM

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i mean.. you can't have an autopilot

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 10:09 PM

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I think it's not great? @lament dagger but since Brine King is usually enough to be sort of OK, you could combine those two and not need any other stun avoidance and be OK with life

lament dagger Jun 2, 2019, 10:10 PM

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Ty

summer magnet Jun 2, 2019, 10:10 PM

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if there is a mountain between you and the enemy you problaly need to move your curser in another direction

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 10:10 PM

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The problem were those small rocks

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or masters in your hideout

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 10:10 PM

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Maybe some kind of counter-attack would be good if you have that setup, @lament dagger so that when you get hit with a stunning hit you counterattack and immediately break it by starting your leech?

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 10:10 PM

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those are a good place to test it I think

summer magnet Jun 2, 2019, 10:11 PM

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yeah problaly

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 10:11 PM

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Dunno how effective that would be, or maybe if you just have like BV + Life Leech on CWDT that would be enough to break most stuns?

summer magnet Jun 2, 2019, 10:11 PM

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we'll see how it is.. but if you get stuck on masters just don't shield charge near your masters? 😛

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 10:12 PM

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I mean I was a shield-charge aurabot for a guy chaining Toxic Sewers, and that was kinda annoying

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Curved passages + shield charge = yick

rapid solar Jun 2, 2019, 10:13 PM

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Oh yea Toxic Sewers will have improved a lot with the changes

karmic sphinx Jun 2, 2019, 10:13 PM

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@odd steeple phase run g@mer

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 10:13 PM

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@karmic sphinx this was before the buffs, I would much prefer that nowadays yeah

summer magnet Jun 2, 2019, 10:14 PM

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btw

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new vaal cyclone

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gonna be amazing 😛

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well standing still is still a risk ofc

wild arch Jun 2, 2019, 10:18 PM

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Vaal cyclone zerker templarLul

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 10:18 PM

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Literally just a blur.

wild arch Jun 2, 2019, 10:19 PM

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Add a couple of those jewels that add shitloads crit chance for vaal skills

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Ez max blitz

summer magnet Jun 2, 2019, 10:20 PM

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would be cool if you could somehow increase the time it takes to pull in enemies with vaal cyclone, and just make it a fucking storm drain of blood pouring out from the enemies you blend in your cyclone xD

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 10:23 PM

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new Vaal Cyclone effect? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gItHz1bGecA

YouTube

Mein MMO

Diablo 3 - Necromancer Skill - Blood Nova

Blood Nova: Unleash a powerful nova dealing massive damage to surrounding enemies.

▶ Play video

summer magnet Jun 2, 2019, 10:23 PM

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haha

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ye basicly :p

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i really hate d3 tho

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just like grim dawn, it's very poor in replayability in my oppinion.

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 10:26 PM

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I love D3. I mean I only play it for 24 hours on the weekend the new season launches, but it's fun af for that little bit of time.

summer magnet Jun 2, 2019, 10:26 PM

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different oppinions i guess 😛

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anyway we are in legion mechanics.. no D3 talk plz

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😛

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 10:27 PM

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Legion is Cyclone league. Diablo comparisons are temporarily forgiven.

summer magnet Jun 2, 2019, 10:28 PM

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i would love to see some kind of "druid" / "shapeshifter" class tho :p

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 10:29 PM

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There is, you manmode it up and wear Gruthkul's pelt and hit with unarmed vanilla attack.

summer magnet Jun 2, 2019, 10:29 PM

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ehhh, not quite the same 😛

gentle ermine Jun 2, 2019, 10:35 PM

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📎 TemperedbyWar.png

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 10:36 PM

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Is there a way to do the other 50%?

quiet geyser Jun 2, 2019, 10:36 PM

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This node is not the Champion i am looking for

summer magnet Jun 2, 2019, 10:37 PM

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neither is it the challenge rewards 😛

solid nova Jun 2, 2019, 10:37 PM

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Rf builds just got tanker

quiet geyser Jun 2, 2019, 10:37 PM

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RF Chieftain

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Gets all Fire Res on tree

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Only needs to get cold and lightning

modest wadi Jun 2, 2019, 10:38 PM

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What about Champion? we were promised that yesterday

quiet geyser Jun 2, 2019, 10:38 PM

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Yea probebly in 2 hours or so

modest wadi Jun 2, 2019, 10:38 PM

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rip

quiet geyser Jun 2, 2019, 10:38 PM

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Rember Bex is Community manager and i feel like shes an sadist

modest wadi Jun 2, 2019, 10:38 PM

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not cool ggg

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 10:38 PM

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RF chieftain gets like 160% fire res just from the skills/ascendancy

quartz dome Jun 2, 2019, 10:39 PM

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that's the sort of keystone that's gonna be seen in a lot of build even if they aren't built around it

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 10:39 PM

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gearing is gonna be so lopsided 😛

rigid scaffold Jun 2, 2019, 10:39 PM

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I'm trying to do the math for it, give me a minute

modest wadi Jun 2, 2019, 10:39 PM

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y zarro? its stupid

quartz dome Jun 2, 2019, 10:39 PM

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although depending on how it rounds you may need +1 max cold and lightning res

idle hull Jun 2, 2019, 10:39 PM

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📎 unknown.png

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 10:40 PM

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It's really good for shaper/uber elder cause they have Cold Pen but not Fire Pen

modest wadi Jun 2, 2019, 10:40 PM

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watch them give shaper/uber fire pen

gentle ermine Jun 2, 2019, 10:40 PM

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Is that just me or alot of Changes to the node area.

idle hull Jun 2, 2019, 10:40 PM

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Chieftan RF is looking like it will be invincible tbh

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 10:40 PM

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@idle hull that node gives phys as fire anyways, and most monster hits have some phys

modest wadi Jun 2, 2019, 10:41 PM

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bigger news is the changes to the surrounding nodes

odd steeple Jun 2, 2019, 10:41 PM

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But stacking phys as fire and max fire res is a good complement for sure