#tooldev-general | Path of Exile 1 & 2 | Page 54

simple ravine Nov 15, 2017, 2:42 AM

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this is the most uncompressed CR2 file format

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(Canon 5D Mark IV)

cosmic saffron Nov 15, 2017, 2:43 AM

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think that's loseless

gritty olive Nov 15, 2017, 2:43 AM

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thats what you use when you do photoediting

simple ravine Nov 15, 2017, 2:43 AM

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indeed it is

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but the raw files from my old 70D was ~25MB

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so it was quite a jump heh

chrome topaz Nov 15, 2017, 3:15 AM

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buy poecoin today

simple ravine Nov 15, 2017, 3:17 AM

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wat

mortal bone Nov 15, 2017, 3:37 AM

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https://coinmarketcap.com/currencies/poet/ ?

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@chrome topaz

chrome topaz Nov 15, 2017, 4:08 AM

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good

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eth/btc are hugest scams and i can't wait for them to crash, blockchain is an overhyped concept without a real use case

mortal bone Nov 15, 2017, 4:13 AM

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eh, eth has some real world applications

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btc is just a currency

simple ravine Nov 15, 2017, 4:17 AM

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I like the idea of moving funds without institutional (i.e. banks) intermediaries

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I do believe the blockchain niche is immature and needs a "dotcom crash"

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a big one

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I think China is doing the right thing of banning cowboy ICOs - that's the scam trap

chrome topaz Nov 15, 2017, 4:25 AM

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i disagree that it has any real world applications

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and there's some real shady people behind it

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and it also has a huge environmental impact

simple ravine Nov 15, 2017, 4:34 AM

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who are the real shady people?

delicate ore Nov 15, 2017, 4:44 AM

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@polar island @chrome topaz can you add the colon ratio notation for pricing currency? i'd like to be able to do ~b/o 0.43:1 chaos

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the fraction notation is kinda ghetto and makes people think you're only selling at those amounts, not just ratio

simple ravine Nov 15, 2017, 4:45 AM

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u can do 1/10

delicate ore Nov 15, 2017, 4:46 AM

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yeah, but you can't easily do 1.5:10 without doing 15/100, which makes people think you're selling in amounts of 100

simple ravine Nov 15, 2017, 4:46 AM

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confused

delicate ore Nov 15, 2017, 4:46 AM

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ok

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try doing that with some piece of currency

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on poetrade it will only let you buy in amounts of 100

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or at least send whisper messages for that much

simple ravine Nov 15, 2017, 4:47 AM

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that is by design

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because if I wanna sell 1000 alts, i dont want people asking to buy 25 alts

delicate ore Nov 15, 2017, 4:47 AM

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its unintuitive, i'd like to be able to sell at those ratios but not necessarily those amounts

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allow both then

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fractions for fixed amounts

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colons for free amounts

simple ravine Nov 15, 2017, 4:48 AM

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so why can't you do 1.5/10

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or whatever u want

delicate ore Nov 15, 2017, 4:48 AM

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won't let you

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the interface in game won't let you

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can

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*can't combine fractions and decimals

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i can explain in detail why i need that, im playing the arbitrage game and want to undercut my competitors by some small amount

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the problem is, that when i do, buyers see that, and think that i won't take quantities lower than my ratio shows

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yeah, try it

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wait

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the game doesn't let you do either yet

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but you could theoretically use the Note function and write that

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what i'm asking is for you to support taht

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custom ratios via Note

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i can, but will poeapp parse that?

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im going to put an exalt up for that amount right now

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on HSC

simple ravine Nov 15, 2017, 4:52 AM

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📎 image.png

delicate ore Nov 15, 2017, 4:53 AM

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📎 unknown.png

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sorry, couldnt snip

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what did you use to snip that btw? ShareX?

simple ravine Nov 15, 2017, 4:53 AM

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the custom note vs prefixed note is no differently exported to the river

delicate ore Nov 15, 2017, 4:54 AM

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yeah, i just want to make sure that poeapp and poetrade parse it correctly

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since the game doesn't officially support it

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it's not showing up yet

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also, would something like 0.43:1 chaos work?

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thats what i really want to be able to do, stuff like that

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er 0.43/1 chaos

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oh i typed wrong

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ha

simple ravine Nov 15, 2017, 5:00 AM

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then u just do 0.43 chaos lol

delicate ore Nov 15, 2017, 5:00 AM

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doesn't work

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gets truncated to 0.45 chaos

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or even 0.4 or 0.5 in some cases

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haven't fully figured that out yet

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i just want to be able to see their ratio, and undercut by some arbitrary, small ratio instantly

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without needing the buyer to think they have to buy a shitton of orbs to get that ratio from me

simple ravine Nov 15, 2017, 5:02 AM

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i had the opposite probem

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i type in 1/1125 alts

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or whatever

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and people would be "hi, can i buy 25 alts"

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"im like, no penny trades please"

delicate ore Nov 15, 2017, 5:04 AM

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what i suggested would be a nice mix, one notation for fixed quantity trades, another for free quantity trades

simple ravine Nov 15, 2017, 5:05 AM

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¯_(ツ)_/¯

delicate ore Nov 15, 2017, 5:07 AM

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right now, im trying to flip some big currency and it's cumbersome because i have to set large quantities to undercut people so i'm not getting as many sales as i would if i didn't undercut lol

simple ravine Nov 15, 2017, 5:08 AM

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perhaps that's why it's not working as you want it to 😛

delicate ore Nov 15, 2017, 5:08 AM

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i'm not undercutting by some abysmal amount

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but rather an amount that is actually a good deal in comparison

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its just too small to express in a whole fraction without requiring a bigger trade generally

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now to see if another idea i had works...

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@polar island it works in poe.trade but not poeapp btw

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i still dont see it on poeapp but its on poetrade

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took it down just now but can put it back up

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k

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plz consider my suggestion ^_^

simple ravine Nov 15, 2017, 5:17 AM

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fun fact about airplane travel.

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📎 image.png

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same route, different travel time

chrome topaz Nov 15, 2017, 5:18 AM

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I'm not sure what the point is

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you can't price stuff in 1.499999 because everybody would do that to "undercut" people

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the minimum resolution is 0.5 because some people have trouble operating fractions

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so it's simpler to allow them than to educate

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that you have to price 3/2 instead of 1.5

delicate ore Nov 15, 2017, 5:21 AM

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yeah, but for big currencies, even 0.05 or 0.08 can be a big deal in terms of discount

simple ravine Nov 15, 2017, 5:21 AM

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such as?

delicate ore Nov 15, 2017, 5:21 AM

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i would give an example, but it's the market i'm working right now so i can't really share one

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well i can think of another example later

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actually busy atm

simple ravine Nov 15, 2017, 5:23 AM

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you kind of gave an impression you were not, lol

chrome topaz Nov 15, 2017, 5:23 AM

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a 0.05 difference should be specified as 5/100

delicate ore Nov 15, 2017, 5:23 AM

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i took the time to do that, because i had the idea already in my mind. otherwise i would need to formulate an analogous example to what i'm doing

chrome topaz Nov 15, 2017, 5:24 AM

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or 1/20

delicate ore Nov 15, 2017, 5:26 AM

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thinking about it, my problem is actually solved with the revelation you can use a Note to mix decimals with fractions

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hopefully poeapp supports it soon too

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hmm partially

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think you could make the minimum resolution 0.25 @chrome topaz ?

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i agree that it really shouldn't go too low

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but that seems reasonable, can still provide decent margins when dealing with bigger currencies

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even 0.1 might be ok

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up to you, really

chrome topaz Nov 15, 2017, 6:06 AM

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exactly

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and no, i think 0.5 is fine

tropic shuttle Nov 15, 2017, 6:46 AM

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hmm. it takes about 6 clicks to clear a price on an item

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slightly irritating

delicate ore Nov 15, 2017, 6:46 AM

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takes 2

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ctrl+click to inventory, ctrl+click back to stash

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for non- stacked currency

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and other itesm

tropic shuttle Nov 15, 2017, 6:47 AM

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doesn't necessarily end up back in the same place. might not matter

delicate ore Nov 15, 2017, 6:47 AM

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yeah just drag for second step

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you can also clear by putting 0 of the currency type

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but then it won't inherit the tab's buyout

tropic shuttle Nov 15, 2017, 6:48 AM

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0 in currency makes it set to 0 currency

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it doesn't clear it

delicate ore Nov 15, 2017, 6:48 AM

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it actually doesn't display on poetrade or poeapp when you do that

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effectively the same

chrome topaz Nov 15, 2017, 7:14 AM

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takes 3 clicks in acquisition

simple ravine Nov 15, 2017, 7:16 AM

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heh.. marketing acquisition would be a pretty viable solution to maintain market share of poe.trade

chrome topaz Nov 15, 2017, 7:38 AM

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how so?

tropic shuttle Nov 15, 2017, 7:59 AM

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how big would you say the niche is for people who don't pony up for premium tabs?

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people running a fleet of mules?

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the alternative is that you add i18n support to poe.trade

simple ravine Nov 15, 2017, 8:23 AM

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marketing the convenience of managing ur sales through acquisition (making it easier to manager, etc)

chrome topaz Nov 15, 2017, 8:28 AM

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not sure how it would help poe.trade in any way

simple ravine Nov 15, 2017, 8:28 AM

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I was assuming that poe's own trade thing doesn't index the forums... perhaps it is?

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oops.

chrome topaz Nov 15, 2017, 8:29 AM

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yeah otherwise reddit would overflow with complaints

simple ravine Nov 15, 2017, 8:31 AM

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fair enough, apologies - my ignorance

delicate ore Nov 15, 2017, 5:42 PM

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@gritty olive can you add a feature to make an image of the current report?

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the whole thing, not just the see-able area, since you can scroll

compact isle Nov 15, 2017, 9:51 PM

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the ratelimiting header stuff is live now

chrome topaz Nov 15, 2017, 9:57 PM

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that's pretty cool you know what else would be cool online status for forum users and current league

simple ravine Nov 15, 2017, 10:10 PM

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would be cool if the river had modifier data that was easier for a machine to understand

obtuse citrus Nov 15, 2017, 10:14 PM

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cough also official data api plz cough

simple ravine Nov 15, 2017, 10:14 PM

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yes!

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I'll buy you a beer or, lots, @compact isle . I need an excuse to escape swedish winter anyways 😄

mortal bone Nov 15, 2017, 11:03 PM

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I will also chip beers for proper data apis

simple ravine Nov 16, 2017, 12:07 AM

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@mortal bone If you're interested in new stuff from Microsoft, check out the Microsoft Connect keynote runnign now

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there's some pretty nice stuff they're announcing

mortal bone Nov 16, 2017, 12:08 AM

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I'll watch it

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https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/connectevent/default.aspx

simple ravine Nov 16, 2017, 12:08 AM

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aye

mortal bone Nov 16, 2017, 12:09 AM

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9hrs of material lol

simple ravine Nov 16, 2017, 12:09 AM

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yeah heh

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im glad they added the index to the right

mortal bone Nov 16, 2017, 12:09 AM

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Yeah, that is super handy

simple ravine Nov 16, 2017, 12:10 AM

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they hadsomething similar, but beneath the video

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they'll cut this up into separate videos after it's done as usual, im guessing

mortal bone Nov 16, 2017, 12:12 AM

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Yeah, I normally watch the cut videos after their talks

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There is normally a lot of bloat that I don't have any interest in

simple ravine Nov 16, 2017, 12:12 AM

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ya, i usually just watch the keynote live, and then wait for all the crap to get cut out

solemn crypt Nov 16, 2017, 1:36 AM

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guys, your thoughts on vs code live share and similar teletype feature in atom?

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i was laughing for like 10 mins after they were announced 😄

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and then sadness took a place

simple ravine Nov 16, 2017, 1:37 AM

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so if atom brings it first, is that a reason for it not to be available in let's say vs code?

solemn crypt Nov 16, 2017, 1:39 AM

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well, to be honest i don't really care who brought if first
i'm just curious what was the reasons behind it O_o

simple ravine Nov 16, 2017, 1:39 AM

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because people have been asking for it for ages

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and the 3rd party tools (tried 2 or 3) all were buggy and crappy

solemn crypt Nov 16, 2017, 1:42 AM

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like - really? O_O
ok, i'm might be not that big fan of different IT communities and can't be called a 'real programmer'
but, c'mon.. someone really wanted such a tool/feature to get live?

simple ravine Nov 16, 2017, 1:43 AM

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what do you mean?

chrome topaz Nov 16, 2017, 1:43 AM

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seems a weird feature to me too

simple ravine Nov 16, 2017, 1:43 AM

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there's a reason why me and my team tried 3 different products

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i'll leave it at that.

solemn crypt Nov 16, 2017, 1:45 AM

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i mean - this is nohow will improve your code quality overall, but instead will bring such a mess into the dev processes (simultaneously changing the code, huh)

simple ravine Nov 16, 2017, 1:46 AM

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it's called pair programming

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also, the notion of going through a complex problem with a remote colleauge using this instead of a screensharing app is more convenient

solemn crypt Nov 16, 2017, 1:46 AM

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for me is't looks more like a fancy ad, then the real thing

simple ravine Nov 16, 2017, 1:46 AM

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thus why we wanted to have such solution

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lol ok, live in your bubble

solemn crypt Nov 16, 2017, 1:50 AM

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my bubble is fine tho 😐 and i'm thruly open to the new knowledge, i just want to get the deep meaning of this %)
if you want just to share your code - there are lots of tools around (in terms of > complex problem with a remote colleauge)

chrome topaz Nov 16, 2017, 1:51 AM

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my bubble is better than your bubble

solemn crypt Nov 16, 2017, 1:51 AM

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well, seems weird for me.. like - really weird when two major tools announce the same feature

chrome topaz Nov 16, 2017, 1:52 AM

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yeah they both are text editors written using "web technology" i think that's enough reason to never touch them

simple ravine Nov 16, 2017, 1:53 AM

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you're using a chat application that is based on a web technology right now

chrome topaz Nov 16, 2017, 1:53 AM

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yeah and i hate it

solemn crypt Nov 16, 2017, 1:53 AM

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@chrome topaz adept of vim/far/other oldschool technique? 😄

chrome topaz Nov 16, 2017, 1:55 AM

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web tech aside, discord's either gonna turn to shit or shut down once they run out of money

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crazy how people continue to depend on it for their communication

solemn crypt Nov 16, 2017, 1:55 AM

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wanna talk about skype on linux? 😄

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post 4.3

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which was shutted down a few days ago

chrome topaz Nov 16, 2017, 1:56 AM

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i heard skype also moved to electron

solemn crypt Nov 16, 2017, 1:56 AM

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yep, long time ago.. but

chrome topaz Nov 16, 2017, 1:57 AM

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explains why it's such garbage

solemn crypt Nov 16, 2017, 1:58 AM

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atm discord is much better optimized and designed then skype (if we count that both were written with 'web technologies')

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well, to be perfectly honest, i was against every electron app not so long time ago (still not using skype cos of it, but still)

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but, c'mon.. is there any real alternative that can compete with 'web' in terms of UI?

chrome topaz Nov 16, 2017, 2:00 AM

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what do you mean?

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how easy it is to create UI? probably not

simple ravine Nov 16, 2017, 2:01 AM

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I'll put it this way.. HTML5 and CSS is not that bad. It's the javascript that sucks donkey balls.

solemn crypt Nov 16, 2017, 2:01 AM

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how easy and how flexible it is out of the box

mortal bone Nov 16, 2017, 2:02 AM

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The thing that gets me is, why aren't these text editors using a c backend with the html/css frontend

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League of Legends did it with their client. You get a ton of flexibility, and the performance from c

chrome topaz Nov 16, 2017, 2:03 AM

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because js is much easier to write than C

mortal bone Nov 16, 2017, 2:03 AM

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but it is super slow when making things like a text editor

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or anything for that matter

simple ravine Nov 16, 2017, 2:04 AM

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well, people hate on everything.

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im gonna focus on liking the things i like

solemn crypt Nov 16, 2017, 2:05 AM

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but, there's always some actual reason behind that 'hate on everything'

simple ravine Nov 16, 2017, 2:05 AM

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uhu... and then?

solemn crypt Nov 16, 2017, 2:06 AM

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we'll all stick to the things we like more 😄

simple ravine Nov 16, 2017, 2:06 AM

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the reasons are 80% of the time petty garbage complaints, imo

mortal bone Nov 16, 2017, 2:06 AM

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js is perfectly fine, and with WebASM shipped in every major browser, we may see some decent performing apps

simple ravine Nov 16, 2017, 2:07 AM

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but with the javascript, i'm 100% agreeing, it's not meant for serious computation, and im cringing when it's used in a UI context

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it's the 1-thread main-event-loop crap

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because it doesnt have a good memory model / concurrency handling

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they just stick their head in the sand and say "multi threading isn't a thing"

mortal bone Nov 16, 2017, 2:08 AM

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also rendering is annoying

chrome topaz Nov 16, 2017, 2:08 AM

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please consider reading through https://wiki.theory.org/index.php/YourLanguageSucks

mortal bone Nov 16, 2017, 2:09 AM

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good thing my main language isn't on there

simple ravine Nov 16, 2017, 2:09 AM

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@chrome topaz yea trust me, i've been ranting on javascript for 15+ years.

chrome topaz Nov 16, 2017, 2:09 AM

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that just means it sucks because it's irrelevant

solemn crypt Nov 16, 2017, 2:09 AM

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😄

mortal bone Nov 16, 2017, 2:09 AM

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brainfuck is the greatest language of all time

simple ravine Nov 16, 2017, 2:11 AM

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im just reading the c# sucks

solemn crypt Nov 16, 2017, 2:11 AM

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well, i honestly tried jfx, electron and qt for the recent year to write up a few pet projects, that pretend to be 'cross-platform' and all that kind of stuff
and, in terms of designing and describing UI - there were nothing better then pure html/css out there
maybe i'm wrong ot didn't find a 'correct tool', but that's my subjective opinion

simple ravine Nov 16, 2017, 2:11 AM

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and the guy who wrote that section doesn't know about oop best practices.

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closes window

solemn crypt Nov 16, 2017, 2:12 AM

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still want to try sciter when i'll have some spare time

chrome topaz Nov 16, 2017, 2:13 AM

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Qt is cross platform

mortal bone Nov 16, 2017, 2:13 AM

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Qt is pretty solid

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it definitely doesn't pretend

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.net core and mono is also cross platform for c#

chrome topaz Nov 16, 2017, 2:15 AM

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I once compiled acquisition for android just for fun and it just worked

solemn crypt Nov 16, 2017, 2:15 AM

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eah.. qt+qml is the subject to discuss from all my trio, but still

chrome topaz Nov 16, 2017, 2:16 AM

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the problem I have with qt is it reimplements the standard library

delicate ore Nov 16, 2017, 2:16 AM

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i've used qt and qml commercially for developing kiosk and touch screen apps

chrome topaz Nov 16, 2017, 2:16 AM

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so you have fun casting between std types and qt all day every day

simple ravine Nov 16, 2017, 2:18 AM

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Cordova :trollface:

solemn crypt Nov 16, 2017, 2:18 AM

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commecrial qt, sweet
'A commercial license keeps your code proprietary' https://www1.qt.io/buy-product/

mortal bone Nov 16, 2017, 2:19 AM

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spendy

chrome topaz Nov 16, 2017, 2:19 AM

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yeah you don't really need to buy it, the free one is under LGPL so you can keep your code closed if you link to qt dynamically

delicate ore Nov 16, 2017, 2:19 AM

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ok, i didn't know that.

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that's kinda crazy

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i can actually use it for some personal projects and not corporate projects then

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but

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i'd rather learn electron or react native

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to get with the times

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i've played with phonegap back in like 2013

solemn crypt Nov 16, 2017, 2:26 AM

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meanwhile, while the chat is active - back to the original question :)
thoughts on 'live share' and 'telepathy' features in vs code and atom respectively?
i've heard @simple ravine point, but still can't get it (i'm aries, mb that's the reason :D)

simple ravine Nov 16, 2017, 2:28 AM

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I'm an aries too

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I used to believe in horoscopes, but not anymore.

solemn crypt Nov 16, 2017, 2:31 AM

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i'm still trying to confuse new-school hr's with "i'm an aries, choleric and introvert. your thoughts?" 😄

tropic shuttle Nov 16, 2017, 2:46 AM

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(i'm taurus, and i think horoscopes are bull)

simple ravine Nov 16, 2017, 2:54 AM

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heh, fun pun

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yeah, i believed in them 25-some years ago, then I grew up

deft jolt Nov 16, 2017, 9:27 AM

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seems like

"corrupted": false,

was removed from the stash API. Only

"corrupted": true,

remains

pseudo ocean Nov 16, 2017, 10:06 AM

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well yeah, they can check for !corrupted

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which is the same

gritty olive Nov 16, 2017, 7:16 PM

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variable rest responses aren't a good standard though

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it should be consistent

tropic shuttle Nov 16, 2017, 8:16 PM

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Seems consistent with the policy of being declarative about what is there, rather than enumerating all possible properties and saying whether it’s present or not

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API design principles coming into conflict with game information exposure principles

gritty olive Nov 16, 2017, 8:55 PM

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That doesnt sound consistent

pseudo ocean Nov 16, 2017, 10:35 PM

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🤔

delicate ore Nov 16, 2017, 11:11 PM

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the poedb.tw dev is in here, right?

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can't remember his name though.

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if you're reading this, can you let me know when you've done the datamining for the patch that just dropped? it has 3.1.0 content in it apparently.

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ah @velvet fog

velvet fog Nov 17, 2017, 1:35 AM

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.dat seems same as before

pseudo ocean Nov 17, 2017, 2:25 AM

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It's most likely just models and such in content.ggpk

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that's not currently being used by the engine

tropic shuttle Nov 17, 2017, 4:07 AM

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@gritty olive consider this:

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[
    {
        "displayMode" : 0,
        "name" : "Wand",
        "values" : []
    },
    ...
]

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This is from the json "properties" key of a wand. it's not weapon_type: "wand", it's not "wand" : true

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it's a declaration about something that is set, not one out of many options

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from an API perspective, this doesn't yield a consistent API, per your point i agree. what is consistent, is ggg's approach to information exposure about game content

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it almost feels like inverse yaml or a dsl

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oooh! another cloth map!

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subjugator or dominator? decisions decisions

simple ravine Nov 17, 2017, 6:38 AM

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you need to think avout the programmatic approach

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not just how you would read it as a human

tropic shuttle Nov 17, 2017, 7:31 AM

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my investment in convincing y'all that this makes sense from ggg perspective hits an all-time low 😉

gritty olive Nov 17, 2017, 7:39 AM

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It's just not proper api response, which is fine xD

pseudo ocean Nov 17, 2017, 7:44 AM

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I do hope they add some lootfilter updates for the elder/shaper items (flags)

tropic shuttle Nov 17, 2017, 7:44 AM

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so perhaps the right direction to take it would be: how do you formulate a good api which respects ggg's wanting to not reveal stuff

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ie, perhaps stuffing "corrupted" into the properties array would be more consistent

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reminds me: for requirements on armour and weapon: it's "strength" or "dexterity" if it's only one attribute, but it's "str" and "dex" if you have multiple stat requirements (hybrid items) -- this is one example where you could improve an api with no regressions in terms of information reveal

timid grotto Nov 17, 2017, 8:36 AM

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Does anyone know what render engine PoB uses? Or is it custom on top of OpenGL?

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I just can't find any file that handles rendering or any call to a library or anything... just calls here and there to functions like 'DrawImage'

fickle yew Nov 17, 2017, 8:40 AM

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@compact isle When seeing rate limits like this:

X-Rate-Limit-Ip:45:60:60,240:240:900
X-Rate-Limit-Ip-State:5:60:0,5:240:0

is there any chance the middle value in the state row could show the remaining seconds of the current window? Right now it's just always the same as the rule. It would make life a lot easier as a client. So something like:

X-Rate-Limit-Ip:45:60:60,240:240:900
X-Rate-Limit-Ip-State:5:53:0,5:233:0

when 7 seconds into both windows?

tropic shuttle Nov 17, 2017, 8:48 AM

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@fickle yew i thought it was 5:60:7 when 7 seconds in

fickle yew Nov 17, 2017, 8:49 AM

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As far as I understand the last value is only non-zero if you're actually rate limited.

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So you're blocked from making more requests for 7 seconds in that case.

tropic shuttle Nov 17, 2017, 8:49 AM

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oh my bad

fickle yew Nov 17, 2017, 8:50 AM

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My first pasted block is actual values from a real request.

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So indication of when my window started other than that I've made 5 requests.

tropic shuttle Nov 17, 2017, 8:50 AM

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is it a sliding window?

fickle yew Nov 17, 2017, 8:54 AM

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I don't think so, but I don't know for sure. It seems like a fixed window starting at the first request.

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In my tests I saw complete resets to 1:60

tropic shuttle Nov 17, 2017, 8:55 AM

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ok, well that's a good data point

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you could just track your usage client side

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i route all my requests through a service which handles local rate limiting

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can just block on it or use callbacks, whatever makes sense for you

fickle yew Nov 17, 2017, 8:59 AM

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Sure, I can implement that. But it'd still be simpler to implement a pretty good client if you knew how long the remaining window was.

tropic shuttle Nov 17, 2017, 9:00 AM

#

seems reasonable

fickle yew Nov 17, 2017, 9:00 AM

#

You get remaining time if you are actually rate limited, but every time you're rate limited you lose a minutes worth of throughput.

chrome topaz Nov 17, 2017, 1:44 PM

#

@timid grotto it's custom and these functions are implemented by simplegraphic dll

timid grotto Nov 17, 2017, 2:04 PM

#

@chrome topaz Thanks, I forgot I asked here (sorry). I also asked on #1┃endgame-help and answered myself there (in case someone else has the same question in the future and searches discord like I did). I finally found this topic which contains the source code for simplegraphic.dll (C++) and plans/forks to convert the render engine to qt (also C++
I think): https://github.com/Openarl/PathOfBuilding/issues/28#issuecomment-250057156 👍

hazy fog Nov 17, 2017, 2:05 PM

#

@chrome topaz how much are you dreading trying to add the new shaped and elder items xyz

chrome topaz Nov 17, 2017, 2:19 PM

#

what's the problem with them?

hazy fog Nov 17, 2017, 2:28 PM

#

🤔

#

they seem complicated, I guess they're not really

delicate ore Nov 17, 2017, 4:06 PM

#

@velvet fog did you see this? https://www.reddit.com/r/pathofexile/comments/7din9a/31_static_strike_buff/

mortal bone Nov 17, 2017, 7:33 PM

#

@hazy fog it's data. He may have to add a display option based on whether or not isElder is true or isShaped

hazy fog Nov 17, 2017, 7:34 PM

#

and a bunch of new mods

mortal bone Nov 17, 2017, 7:34 PM

#

Adding mods to the list is easy

#

When they come through the river and he hasn't seen them add them to a list

#

Curate said list to a searchable format and done

hazy fog Nov 17, 2017, 7:39 PM

#

essence items don't have a unique background

mortal bone Nov 17, 2017, 7:40 PM

#

No need, but the item itself is elder or shaped

#

These items can be crafted

obtuse citrus Nov 17, 2017, 7:40 PM

#

Some essence mods are actually identical to the regular mods (while some others are not)

mortal bone Nov 17, 2017, 7:40 PM

#

They aren't normal items

#

More akin to corrupted than essence

hazy fog Nov 17, 2017, 7:46 PM

#

more akin to atlas bases

obtuse citrus Nov 17, 2017, 7:46 PM

#

atlas bases are normal items

hazy fog Nov 17, 2017, 8:04 PM

#

so are these

#

normal special bases exaltThink

delicate ore Nov 17, 2017, 8:20 PM

#

@polar island @chrome topaz i have another proposal for item notes

#

instead of freely allowing notes, allow certain tags to be used in the notes

#

like

#

i could write "~b/o 10 exa mixed chaos fuse" and you guys could display that i'm allowing people to purchase my item with mixed currency of chaos or fusing equal to the total value of my item

#

syntax doesnt even have to be that

#

but yeah, i feel as if we should have that functionality in a trade site, the ability to set prices in multiple currency forms

#

or at least let people know that we accept other orbs for our items

mortal bone Nov 17, 2017, 8:25 PM

#

they can always just ask

#

kind of the point in not having an auction house

delicate ore Nov 17, 2017, 8:25 PM

#

hell, i'd even be fine with "~b/o 10 exa ~b/o 900 chaos ~b/o 2000 fuse"

#

and let that item be listed multiple times for each of those prices

#

once per currency type of course

#

yeah, but some people won't bother asking, i've almost missed out on trades by not saying "i'll take other currency if you don't have enough of this one"

#

can you imagine people with tons of some other type of currency, who want an item, but won't make an offer without the type of the asking price?

#

i literally just had this happen again btw, that's why im suggesting this

gritty olive Nov 17, 2017, 8:51 PM

#

What if I built a third-party auction house that didn't use bots

#

enlightenedchaosthinking

#

Put up item -> bid on item -> after set amount & bidding is over it is removed and the person who won can go exchange and it alerts the person who put it up that person is the winner via email or a desktop app

#

You could do this, and it wouldn't be against the rules afaik

chrome topaz Nov 17, 2017, 10:20 PM

#

how are you gonna enforce it? what if somebody wins my exalted at a bid of 1 chaos and I just put them on ignore

#

@delicate ore having it listed multiple times is problematic as it will make it even simpler to create spam listings

delicate ore Nov 17, 2017, 11:33 PM

#

@chrome topaz ok, forget about the multiple listings then, how about letting the buyer hover over the price to see all the prices the seller has set for the item?

chrome topaz Nov 17, 2017, 11:37 PM

#

that sounds like a feature i spend time and effort on implementing and then 3 people use it

delicate ore Nov 17, 2017, 11:54 PM

#

well if you don't want to do that, then could you list the acceptable currencies in the same way?

#

"~b/o 1 exa +chaos +fuse +chance" or something

gritty olive Nov 18, 2017, 12:03 AM

#

@chrome topaz no need to worry about that if you put into place an honor / ban system and another system which allows people who post items to set a minimum bid threshold

#

would enjoy seeing how people react to it at least 😛

chrome topaz Nov 18, 2017, 12:07 AM

#

sounds good but lets do it instead ASN.1-encoded

gritty olive Nov 18, 2017, 12:14 AM

#

    bidAmount     5,
    bidAccount    "xyz",
    bidItem            321576928
}```

#

does that make u happy

chrome topaz Nov 18, 2017, 12:15 AM

#

I meant for buyouts

gritty olive Nov 18, 2017, 12:15 AM

#

Do you internally use ASN.1-encoded for poe.trade?

mortal bone Nov 18, 2017, 12:18 AM

#

pretty sure he is giving rogue a hard time

gritty olive Nov 18, 2017, 12:19 AM

#

guess that means I am giving him a hard time

mortal bone Nov 18, 2017, 12:20 AM

#

or he just uses it to store buyouts is a very small amount of space

#

0..1 for b/o, price then price then currency identifier

gritty olive Nov 18, 2017, 12:24 AM

#

don't forget indicators of types take up abyte

mortal bone Nov 18, 2017, 12:25 AM

#

what indicators?

gritty olive Nov 18, 2017, 12:26 AM

#

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/X.690#Types

mortal bone Nov 18, 2017, 12:27 AM

#

Ohh, I thought you were talking about another piece of data from the prices

#

I was really confused

gritty olive Nov 18, 2017, 12:28 AM

#

we only get 16 bytes per row! every nibble counts!

mortal bone Nov 18, 2017, 12:28 AM

#

yeah

#

you only need ~6 bytes

gritty olive Nov 18, 2017, 12:29 AM

#

I just somewhat realized that bytes are modeled after digestion terminology interesting

#

I never thought too hard about the names

mortal bone Nov 18, 2017, 12:29 AM

#

lol

gritty olive Nov 18, 2017, 12:31 AM

#

Moreover, 1982 documentation for the Integrated Woz Machine refers consistently to an "8 bit nibble"

#

Thanks woz.

chrome topaz Nov 18, 2017, 1:05 AM

#

lol

simple ravine Nov 18, 2017, 1:39 AM

#

DEC64

#

all u need for numbers

chrome topaz Nov 18, 2017, 3:46 AM

#

"DEC64 is intended to be the only number type in the next generation of application programming languages."

#

ew ew ew

torpid mesa Nov 18, 2017, 4:26 AM

#

tbf its basically fixed point

#

hw fixed point would be cewl

#

well not fixed point

#

uhhhh

#

idk what you call it but int with exponent lol

tropic shuttle Nov 18, 2017, 4:46 AM

#

isn't that basically a double with a different mantissa size?

chrome topaz Nov 18, 2017, 4:52 AM

#

no

#

the base is 10, not 2

#

so when printing it as a decimal you won't get stuff like 0.0999999999999999...

simple ravine Nov 18, 2017, 5:20 AM

#

it's basically something similar to the special types you used when building trading software

#

that is optimized for processing and storage

#

so you'd have

etc

tropic shuttle Nov 18, 2017, 6:01 AM

#

if only everyone had 4 or 8 fingers instead of 5 on each hand

#

society would have naturally adopted binary-based counting systems

simple ravine Nov 18, 2017, 6:02 AM

#

lol what does it matter

tropic shuttle Nov 18, 2017, 6:04 AM

#

we wouldn't have adopted a number system that makes things like 0.09999999 occur

cosmic saffron Nov 18, 2017, 6:04 AM

#

didn't some mesopotamian civs adopt a 60-based system?

simple ravine Nov 18, 2017, 6:04 AM

#

you mean floating point issues?

tropic shuttle Nov 18, 2017, 6:04 AM

#

yes, the 60-base was awesome

#

i think it was babylonians

#

6 fingers would be as good as 4 or 8. we'd be better at fractions but binary would still suck

tropic shuttle Nov 18, 2017, 6:23 AM

#

we could also type "querty" without flexing a digit 😄

chrome topaz Nov 18, 2017, 6:23 AM

#

are you guys high

tropic shuttle Nov 18, 2017, 6:24 AM

#

sadly no. i still need to hit 90 this race

simple ravine Nov 18, 2017, 6:25 AM

#

lol, i'm across the pond, half-drunk, back at the hotel and now watching the new IT movie

gritty olive Nov 18, 2017, 6:49 AM

#

high on life bois

simple ravine Nov 18, 2017, 6:50 AM

#

this movie is fuuucked up

civic sluice Nov 18, 2017, 7:13 PM

#

anyone know if you can get the list of leagues that PoeNinja currently supports through their api?

mortal bone Nov 18, 2017, 7:55 PM

#

@civic sluice http://api.pathofexile.com/leagues?type=main

#

there is an official one

civic sluice Nov 18, 2017, 9:36 PM

#

I have just done an alpha release of my PoeSimCraft tool. If you are interested you can download it from https://github.com/DanielWieder/PoeSimCraft/releases/tag/v.1

delicate ore Nov 18, 2017, 9:37 PM

#

@civic sluice lol we were just talking about a simcraft for poe on reddit, gj

#

oh this is to simulate crafting, not combat

#

still nice

#

are essences coming?

#

and metacrafting?

civic sluice Nov 18, 2017, 9:41 PM

#

The basic plan is that Beta will be an improved results page

#

R1 will include metamods and essences

#

R2 will incorperate item data from trading sites

#

I'm willing to reprioritize things if there is demand for some features sooner than others

#

I'd also like to do a full UI rework at some point since this was basically my first WPF project

delicate ore Nov 18, 2017, 9:44 PM

#

opal ring is missing Life mod

civic sluice Nov 18, 2017, 9:45 PM

#

no items have implicits yet

#

since it really only matters for vaal orbs I didn't think it would be that important compared to other things

delicate ore Nov 18, 2017, 9:45 PM

#

i mean you can't select life prefix

#

in the mod list

civic sluice Nov 18, 2017, 9:45 PM

#

ah

#

I'll check that

delicate ore Nov 18, 2017, 9:47 PM

#

you should probably add a global Not for subconditions too

civic sluice Nov 18, 2017, 9:50 PM

#

It should be the last option

delicate ore Nov 18, 2017, 9:50 PM

#

i mean, i want to be able to do an if/and/count/sum and then check if it wasn't true

civic sluice Nov 18, 2017, 9:51 PM

#

that's fair

delicate ore Nov 18, 2017, 9:54 PM

#

you're going to add saving and loading of simulations settings right?

#

and of results?

civic sluice Nov 18, 2017, 9:54 PM

#

yes

delicate ore Nov 18, 2017, 9:54 PM

#

can you make it code-style? i'd like to be able to just go into a text file and type out the simulations i want to run

#

oh, in that case you should also offer a commandline version

civic sluice Nov 18, 2017, 9:55 PM

#

I'll probably have the saved data in JSON

#

and if I do that then I can do a command line version that takes the JSON

delicate ore Nov 18, 2017, 9:55 PM

#

works for me

#

just had a crash trying to go back and reselect the base type

#

you're going to add support for annuls, right?

#

and eternals?

#

oh, i know a feature you need to add

#

number of passes for the simulation

#

show the average number of crafted items, and perhaps the results by each pass

#

so like, you could do 100x simulations of 1000c budget

civic sluice Nov 18, 2017, 10:05 PM

#

yep

#

although you can increase the budget

#

so you can just do 100000c instead

#

so I might not do multiple passes

delicate ore Nov 18, 2017, 10:06 PM

#

ok

civic sluice Nov 18, 2017, 10:08 PM

#

at some point I will allow the user to change the limit of the sim duration

#

at the moment it's capped at a minute or so

#

although that will probably be through a config file

delicate ore Nov 18, 2017, 10:10 PM

#

found an issue

#

chaos and alcs always guarantee at least 2 prefixes and 2 suffixes

#

essences too

#

your app allows 1 to happen

#

also, subconditions seem to be not checking out right

#

my curent craft is:

civic sluice Nov 18, 2017, 10:12 PM

#

The name dropdown for them is broken

#

if that's what you mean

delicate ore Nov 18, 2017, 10:12 PM

#

i mean in results

#

im getting results that don't consider both subconditions

civic sluice Nov 18, 2017, 10:13 PM

#

oh, I'll take a look

delicate ore Nov 18, 2017, 10:14 PM

#

Opal Ring i84

Start:
Alc
While (Not T1 Cold & Not T1 WED)
Chaos
Wend
End

#

the t1 cold and t1 wed are in two different not subconditions

#

i guess i can check for T1 Cold and T1 WED in the items page

#

also i suggest adding meta properties to match operators other than And

#

and also, adding more of them, stuff like # of free prefixes/suffixes

civic sluice Nov 18, 2017, 10:20 PM

#

I have some meta affixes, including open prefixes/suffixes

#

it's the 3rd section

delicate ore Nov 18, 2017, 10:20 PM

#

oh i know what it was

#

they don't show up when in Tier mode

#

that's fine i guess, just need to use another subcondition

civic sluice Nov 18, 2017, 10:21 PM

#

yeah, I've disabled them for tier mode since most of them dont' make sense

#

I probably should allow the open prefixes/suffixes though

delicate ore Nov 18, 2017, 10:38 PM

#

also, to actually use the multiple item checking thing, then you need to support universal And/Or/Not for all subconditions in the setup page

#

you need to be able to say both, "if any of the subconditions are true" or "if none of the subconditions are true", in addition to the default "if all of the subconditions are true"

civic sluice Nov 18, 2017, 11:04 PM

#

huh, that took a bit longer than I expected to figure out

#

as it turns out the NOT conditional behavior is working as expected

#

you did this

#

While(!X && !Y)
While(!true && !false))
While(false && true))
While(false))

#

so when one was true and the other was false it exited

#

I'll add in that overall NOT condition so you can do this

#

While(!(X && Y))
While(!(true && false))
While(!(false))
While(true)

#

now that I think about it, that's probably what you were meant by the last comment

gritty olive Nov 19, 2017, 10:36 AM

#

@fickle yew I do have a a request, vaal gems

#

I guess gems are a little harder since level of gem & vaal

gritty olive Nov 20, 2017, 1:34 AM

#

@compact isle what does the third number mean? X-Rate-Limit-Account:45:60:60,240:240:900 X-Rate-Limit-Account-State:1:60:0,13:240:0

compact isle Nov 20, 2017, 1:34 AM

#

the timeout

gritty olive Nov 20, 2017, 1:34 AM

#

Aren't the last two timeouts?

#

compact isle Nov 20, 2017, 1:35 AM

#

the last one is like the punishment timeout

gritty olive Nov 20, 2017, 1:36 AM

#

Rip people with > 240 tabs

compact isle Nov 20, 2017, 1:36 AM

#

indeed

#

they have the option to exclude/only include some tabs though right?

gritty olive Nov 20, 2017, 1:36 AM

#

I will have to do a warning

#

Yes, they do

#

It's just they can also refresh their tabs

#

I will have to add a timeout for manual refresh

#

please wait 4 minutes

#

my app has become a mobile game

#

@compact isle rate limit is per session id?

#

or per ip?

compact isle Nov 20, 2017, 1:44 AM

#

for that one it's per account

#

hence the account in the name

gritty olive Nov 20, 2017, 1:45 AM

#

coolio

compact isle Nov 20, 2017, 1:45 AM

#

I don't think we do any ratelimiting by session

fickle yew Nov 20, 2017, 9:31 AM

#

@compact isle Did you see my message the other day about whether it'd be possible to see the remaining time of the rate limiting window (as 2nd chunk in the State header)?

#

Can keep track of it locally, would just make for simpler clients.

gritty olive Nov 20, 2017, 8:13 PM

#

Time remaining would actually be extremely beneficial

#

Sometimes you can't keep track of it, let's say the account views their tabs on the site, and you're also doing a request, you have no scope of whether the site request caused it to go over or you did.

#

Time remaining would be nice to know in-case such a situation occurs

compact isle Nov 21, 2017, 1:20 AM

#

the time remaining until your hit count hits 0 again?

simple ravine Nov 21, 2017, 2:41 AM

#

I would recommend amount of requests left in time window

compact isle Nov 21, 2017, 2:44 AM

#

couldn't you just do max - hits?

simple ravine Nov 21, 2017, 2:44 AM

#

not if you have multiple applications that use the same quota

compact isle Nov 21, 2017, 2:46 AM

#

that will be displayed in the output already though

#

if you do 2 requests from app A and 2 requests from app B then it will say you've made 4 requests out of the max

#

max - 4 = how many you have remaining

simple ravine Nov 21, 2017, 2:47 AM

#

oh, my mistake

compact isle Nov 21, 2017, 2:47 AM

#

we don't track hits per application

simple ravine Nov 21, 2017, 2:48 AM

#

off-topic, this in-fllight wifi is a dumster fire (or it's discord), i had to open a vpn connection to even connect to Discord

#

meanwhile Telegram etc works just fine

#

How's OAuth coming along, @compact isle ?

compact isle Nov 21, 2017, 2:50 AM

#

not too badly

simple ravine Nov 21, 2017, 2:52 AM

#

great, i think that will be a good thing overall to have

tropic shuttle Nov 21, 2017, 2:53 AM

#

seconded

waxen ridge Nov 21, 2017, 2:53 AM

#

thirded

tropic shuttle Nov 21, 2017, 2:56 AM

#

@compact isle btw, i dunno if this is intentional or just a url rewrite oversight, but in most cases, api.pathofexile.com/ is synonymous with www.pathofexile.com/api/ except http://www.pathofexile.com/api/trade/data/items gets hijacked by the new trade site

#

re: api.pathofexile.com/trade is hijacked by www.pathofexile.com/trade rules

compact isle Nov 21, 2017, 2:58 AM

#

ah, interesting

tropic shuttle Nov 21, 2017, 3:02 AM

#

i assume the intent is to deprecate /api/ in favour of subdomain

compact isle Nov 21, 2017, 3:02 AM

#

I'm not sure

#

http://api.pathofexile.com/api/leagues

#

things like this work as well which is kind of fun

waxen ridge Nov 21, 2017, 3:03 AM

#

Harbinger and Abyss not found 😛

tropic shuttle Nov 21, 2017, 3:04 AM

#

https://api.pathofexile.com/forum/view-forum/bug-reports works if you ignore the ssl errors

compact isle Nov 21, 2017, 3:05 AM

#

yep definitely something up with the rules there

simple ravine Nov 21, 2017, 3:06 AM

#

📎 unknown.png

#

2017... love it

compact isle Nov 21, 2017, 3:09 AM

#

I like how you're sending messages without uploading data

simple ravine Nov 21, 2017, 3:10 AM

#

intriguing, i know

tropic shuttle Nov 21, 2017, 3:10 AM

#

or round-off if < 5Kbps

#

maybe your plane will land before your packets 😄

simple ravine Nov 21, 2017, 3:20 AM

#

haha

#

6 more hours

tropic shuttle Nov 21, 2017, 3:20 AM

#

ouch

simple ravine Nov 21, 2017, 3:21 AM

#

Los Angeles -> Stockholm

#

Everyone else sleeping. Perfect time to dig into some of the new .net core 2.1 low-level performance stuff they added

tropic shuttle Nov 21, 2017, 3:28 AM

#

best time for child_crying.wav

#

crank it up on your speakers

simple ravine Nov 21, 2017, 3:29 AM

#

lol

#

📎 IMG_20171120_191458.jpg

#

my spot right now...

tropic shuttle Nov 21, 2017, 3:33 AM

#

iex(10)> (PoeApi.Caller.leagues() |> elem(1)).body |> :zlib.gunzip |> Poison.Parser.parse |> elem(1) |> Enum.map(& &1["id"])
["Standard", "Hardcore", "SSF Standard", "SSF Hardcore", "Harbinger",
 "Hardcore Harbinger", "SSF Harbinger", "SSF Harbinger HC",
 "10 Day Mayhem (ORE004)", "10 Day Mayhem HC (ORE005)",
 "10 Day Mayhem HC SSF (ORE006)"]

#

woo woo

simple ravine Nov 21, 2017, 3:34 AM

#

Elixir?

tropic shuttle Nov 21, 2017, 3:34 AM

#

yep

simple ravine Nov 21, 2017, 3:35 AM

#

hehe nice

tropic shuttle Nov 21, 2017, 3:35 AM

#

time to de-constantize the league parameter in a bunch of my code

simple ravine Nov 21, 2017, 3:36 AM

#

what are you making?

tropic shuttle Nov 21, 2017, 3:37 AM

#

random shit that's fun to build when i have a data stream to play with

#

did an affix solver earlier this league

simple ravine Nov 21, 2017, 3:37 AM

#

what do you mean affix solver

tropic shuttle Nov 21, 2017, 3:38 AM

#

try to compute the underlying affixes based on the mods of an identified items

#

so maybe an item has 6 mods, but 2 of them are hybrid. maybe i can still craft on it

#

probably next league i want to start doing some ML

simple ravine Nov 21, 2017, 3:39 AM

#

i tried to do that, but was bangig my head against the wall too much

#

lost the interst in it

#

if you have something working, i'd be interseted in looking at your logic

tropic shuttle Nov 21, 2017, 3:40 AM

#

totally got it working, integrated the repoe stuff to severely prune the search space

#

but many items have multiple possible solutions

simple ravine Nov 21, 2017, 3:41 AM

#

yeah

tropic shuttle Nov 21, 2017, 3:41 AM

#

and after i got it working, i realized i mostly didn't care what all the solutions were, just "are there open slots"

simple ravine Nov 21, 2017, 3:41 AM

#

the trick is to find the one with the highest spawn weight, and display that one as the primary candidate

tropic shuttle Nov 21, 2017, 3:42 AM

#

ah, that's a good idea

#

... and then once i got that working i decided it was time to throw a dashboard together in angular so i've been poking at that for the last little while

#

been meaning to learn angular for a while. this was a decent reason

simple ravine Nov 21, 2017, 3:45 AM

#

cool.. you checking out Angular 5, or?

tropic shuttle Nov 21, 2017, 3:45 AM

#

yeah

#

a friend said i should get into react, but i don't want to reset my progress on angular at this point

simple ravine Nov 21, 2017, 3:45 AM

#

I havent touched angular at all to be honest, because i heard so much negative stuff about it

tropic shuttle Nov 21, 2017, 3:45 AM

#

it can't be worse than ember

simple ravine Nov 21, 2017, 3:46 AM

#

Yeah, we compared a bunch of libraries and frameworks at one of my companies, and went with React with Redux

tropic shuttle Nov 21, 2017, 3:48 AM

#

i get kind of nauseous looking at jsx, but then i've felt that way about many languages at first glance

#

even so, it's probably worth adding to my list

simple ravine Nov 21, 2017, 3:54 AM

#

yeah, so did I at first glance

next spoke Nov 21, 2017, 5:14 AM

#

I hear more positive stuff about Angular 2 (well, uh, 5 now) than React because of how clean Typescript is. I really enjoy React, but I'm definitely going to look into Angular 2

chrome topaz Nov 21, 2017, 5:20 AM

#

anybody got any suggestions for a python html parsing library?

tropic shuttle Nov 21, 2017, 5:37 AM

#

@chrome topaz a league or two ago, my character name was BeautifulSoup

#

this was relevant to the fact that i was doing this all in python at the time

#

(afaik, https://www.crummy.com/software/BeautifulSoup/bs4/doc/ this is what most people use )

#

probably perandus league

chrome topaz Nov 21, 2017, 5:48 AM

#

yeah i tried it long time ago and it was pretty bad

cosmic saffron Nov 21, 2017, 5:50 AM

#

that url does not inspire confidence

tropic shuttle Nov 21, 2017, 5:53 AM

#

i found myself doing a lot of stuff like this: ilvl_cell = [ g for g in record.descendants if g.name == 'span' and g.get('data-name','') == 'ilvl' ]

#

wasn't amazing. it gave me access to the dom.

chrome topaz Nov 21, 2017, 6:06 AM

#

it outright returned empty results for a lot of ggg forum pages

tropic shuttle Nov 21, 2017, 6:09 AM

#

unless there's some option, it's probably not going to execute any load-time javascript for you, so you only get the initial payload

#

http://pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/71278 stuff like this probably would be empty...

chrome topaz Nov 21, 2017, 6:15 AM

#

i mean for normal forum threads

#

i know it's not gonna execute javascript lol

#

very first version of poe.trade

#

      14 text files.
      14 unique files.                              
      39 files ignored.

http://cloc.sourceforge.net v 1.60  T=0.03 s (481.4 files/s, 28627.7 lines/s)
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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Javascript                       1             26             15             94
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funny thing is, it still works somewhat

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📎 poetrade.png

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you can see our friend <set:MS> here

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almost 5 years old

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yeah well poe.trade's written in python so that's not gonna work

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sounds good, I think I'll rewrite it in js first, then run every micro service in a docker container running on kubernetes

tropic shuttle Nov 21, 2017, 6:25 AM

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you don't have to run all of them. just the ones with sidecars that have a cool racing stripe

chrome topaz Nov 21, 2017, 6:27 AM

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I went to get my wallet and it's shaking for some reason

#

I think I tried pyquery some time ago too

#

Don't remember much about it

simple ravine Nov 21, 2017, 9:33 AM

#

lol, you boys...

deft jolt Nov 21, 2017, 10:57 AM

#

Finding Splendour variants is a pain

#

ive resorted to checking the armour/evasion/es values in item properties

simple ravine Nov 21, 2017, 12:02 PM

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home sweet home

solemn crypt Nov 21, 2017, 1:49 PM

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@chrome topaz lxml or bs, there's no third :|
lxml was faster on a bigger data sets last time i've checked, but it should be compiled from the source for windows if this matters for you

chrome topaz Nov 21, 2017, 2:31 PM

#

lxml is what I'm using it's kind of annoying though

mortal bone Nov 21, 2017, 4:01 PM

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@chrome topaz python 2 or 3?

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cElementTree is a really fast implementation of ElementTree that you just need to change an include for

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From what I know, it is about twice as fast as lxml and uses a third of the memory

chrome topaz Nov 21, 2017, 6:36 PM

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2, but I should migrate to 3 someday

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dealing with 2's unicode strings is the bane of my existence

deft jolt Nov 21, 2017, 7:02 PM

#

HarbingerLeagueShards
    Arcane
HarbingerShards
    Brutality
    Storms
Shards
    Focus
    Time
    Directions

Any real reason why harbinger shards are divided into 3 itemtypes in the icon url?

tropic shuttle Nov 22, 2017, 3:09 AM

#

where is this from?

deft jolt Nov 22, 2017, 6:13 AM

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http://web.poecdn.com/image/Art/2DItems/Weapons/TwoHandWeapons/Staves/HarbingerShards/Shard3.png

tropic shuttle Nov 22, 2017, 8:15 AM

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I would probably avoid trying to read too much into it

delicate ore Nov 23, 2017, 2:21 AM

#

in what folder are the assets that PoB uses

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nvm found them

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so, can windows developers explain something to me

#

what's the difference between %AppData%\Local and %ProgramData%

#

i don't really get when you'd use one over the other

simple ravine Nov 23, 2017, 2:24 AM

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if you resolve those paths, you'll see whats up

delicate ore Nov 23, 2017, 2:25 AM

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i know those are the intended storage spaces for data local to the program (and local to the machine, unlike Roaming)

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but when do you use one over the other

simple ravine Nov 23, 2017, 2:26 AM

#

AppData is tied to a user, meanwhile ProgramData isn't

delicate ore Nov 23, 2017, 2:26 AM

#

oh

simple ravine Nov 23, 2017, 2:27 AM

#

AppData => C:\Users\username\AppData(Local or Roaming)
ProgramData => C:\ProgramData

delicate ore Nov 23, 2017, 2:28 AM

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should have figured just from the path

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rather than trying to look at the contents

simple ravine Nov 23, 2017, 2:28 AM

#

like I said 😉

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https://stackoverflow.com/a/27181428/1447764

simple ravine Nov 23, 2017, 5:34 AM

#

c# ❤

#

speeeed

#

Span<byte> headerBytes = stackalloc byte[sizeof(int) * 2];
while (_fs.Position < _fs.Length)
{
    _fs.Read(headerBytes);
    RecordHeader header;
    unsafe
    {
        fixed (byte* bt = &headerBytes[0])
        {
            header = *(RecordHeader*)bt;
        }
    }
    //...
}

mortal bone Nov 23, 2017, 5:35 AM

#

unsafe

simple ravine Nov 23, 2017, 5:36 AM

#

pretty sure it's almost as fast without it with the new Span<T>

mortal bone Nov 23, 2017, 5:36 AM

#

I have no problem with the keyword. I find it funnny when it is used though

simple ravine Nov 23, 2017, 5:37 AM

#

what's funny about it?

mortal bone Nov 23, 2017, 5:37 AM

#

odd choice in name

simple ravine Nov 23, 2017, 5:37 AM

#

it describes what it does perfectly

mortal bone Nov 23, 2017, 5:37 AM

#

depends on what it surrounds

chrome topaz Nov 23, 2017, 5:37 AM

#

so they're reinventing C?

simple ravine Nov 23, 2017, 5:38 AM

#

unsafe has been there forever

mortal bone Nov 23, 2017, 5:38 AM

#

unsafe is just a way you can use pointers

simple ravine Nov 23, 2017, 5:38 AM

#

what's new is the new Span<T>, which is a safe way of dealing with native memory in a managed context.

mortal bone Nov 23, 2017, 5:38 AM

#

not exactly reinventing c

simple ravine Nov 23, 2017, 5:39 AM

#

and to ensure it's pinned to the stack, and not shoved to the heap

chrome topaz Nov 23, 2017, 5:40 AM

#

hopefully, strict pointer aliasing is next, to reach feature parity

simple ravine Nov 23, 2017, 5:42 AM

#

I believe that the JIT engine is optimizing for some pointer aliasing for your managed structs at least

#

what I am hoping for is IL-analyzer that would tell me if my for loop should be broken up into smaller pieces to leverage L0 cache etc - those type of analyzers would be pretty neat

chrome topaz Nov 23, 2017, 5:44 AM

#

if you're worried about CPU caches you should be writing it in C/++ IMO

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also, the joke here was that strict pointer aliasing blows ass

simple ravine Nov 23, 2017, 5:45 AM

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L0 cache isn't your typical cache

chrome topaz Nov 23, 2017, 5:45 AM

#

what?

simple ravine Nov 23, 2017, 5:46 AM

#

micro-ops cache

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is still applicable for c#

mortal bone Nov 23, 2017, 5:46 AM

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L0 isn't a term that holds much meaning

simple ravine Nov 23, 2017, 5:46 AM

#

why would you say that?

mortal bone Nov 23, 2017, 5:46 AM

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I have heard it in 3-4 different contexts

chrome topaz Nov 23, 2017, 5:48 AM

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what the hell is L0 cache?

simple ravine Nov 23, 2017, 5:48 AM

#

📎 image.png

mortal bone Nov 23, 2017, 5:48 AM

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depends on who you ask

chrome topaz Nov 23, 2017, 5:49 AM

#

you're writing code in C# and you are worried about uop cache?

mortal bone Nov 23, 2017, 5:49 AM

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a lot of people use it to refer to the register file, some use it as a term to mean filtering L1 cache, etc. lol

simple ravine Nov 23, 2017, 5:50 AM

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not worried, but interested in it for my cpu bound operations

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and yes, c# can haz speed as well - especially new .net core

#

im pretty sure every term has been misused, Emmitt

mortal bone Nov 23, 2017, 5:50 AM

#

why not just use c?

simple ravine Nov 23, 2017, 5:51 AM

#

lol?

mortal bone Nov 23, 2017, 5:51 AM

#

may as well write some asm if you are that worried

simple ravine Nov 23, 2017, 5:51 AM

#

who said I am "that worried"?

mortal bone Nov 23, 2017, 5:52 AM

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not worried, but interested in it for my cpu bound operations

simple ravine Nov 23, 2017, 5:52 AM

#

I said it would be neat to have an analyzer that would point out where I can optimize my code

mortal bone Nov 23, 2017, 5:52 AM

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if you are running into cpu bound operations you are going to need something a bit better than an analyzer lol

simple ravine Nov 23, 2017, 5:53 AM

#

do you even know what kind of analyzer I'm talking about? it sounds like you're not.

chrome topaz Nov 23, 2017, 5:53 AM

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the kind of that does not exists lol

simple ravine Nov 23, 2017, 5:54 AM

#

similar analyzers exists, and are easy to add to your c# projects through nuget packages or visual studio addins

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i don't see a huge problem in creating one

chrome topaz Nov 23, 2017, 5:55 AM

#

would it ever make sense to break up a for loop into multiple? I'd think the decrease in speed caused by cache wouldn't be worth it

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I mean data cache

simple ravine Nov 23, 2017, 5:55 AM

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yes, there are cases

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there are limitations though, to when it's applicable

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one limitation is your loop can't have branching

chrome topaz Nov 23, 2017, 5:57 AM

#

can you link some of these cases?

simple ravine Nov 23, 2017, 6:00 AM

#

there's a few talks on it, search youtube

chrome topaz Nov 23, 2017, 6:02 AM

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I checked both "L0 cache" and "uop cache" and don't see any talks

simple ravine Nov 23, 2017, 6:56 AM

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This talk touches somewhat on the subject, but others as well: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oxjT7veKi9c

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pretty good talk all-around, actually

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/cc @chrome topaz

chrome topaz Nov 23, 2017, 7:06 AM

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watched the relevant part and it seemed pretty low on details or references or anything

simple ravine Nov 23, 2017, 7:08 AM

#

well, if you want to dive deeper, go do the research... i don't have the links handy anymore, it was a long time ago

chrome topaz Nov 23, 2017, 7:12 AM

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https://stackoverflow.com/questions/39311872/is-performance-reduced-when-executing-loops-whose-uop-count-is-not-a-multiple-of

simple ravine Nov 23, 2017, 7:24 AM

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yep...

#

"For fun, I just ran perf stat against a short run of Firefox where I opened a tab and clicked around on a few Stack Overflow questions. For instructions delivered, I got 46% from DSB, 50% from legacy decoder and 4% for LSD. This shows that at least for big, branchy code like a browser the DSB still can't capture the large majority of the code (lucky the legacy decoders aren't too bad)."

chrome topaz Nov 23, 2017, 7:25 AM

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at this point they should just burn x86

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start from scratch

simple ravine Nov 23, 2017, 7:25 AM

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agree.

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well, there's a reason why you want 32 bit in some cases - if you do a lot of 4-byte primitive atomic operations

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but norally, an x64 executable should run faster

chrome topaz Nov 23, 2017, 7:28 AM

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I mean x86-64 as well

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javascript is starting to infect CPUs now

simple ravine Nov 23, 2017, 7:29 AM

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hehe, imagine the work that it would require for operating systems etc

chrome topaz Nov 23, 2017, 7:29 AM

#

https://developer.arm.com/docs/100069/0607/a64-floating-point-instructions/fjcvtzs

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I want to get off this wild ride

simple ravine Nov 23, 2017, 7:29 AM

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yeah, it's hilarious

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how javascript can influence hardware manufacturers to create special instruction sets

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start over, and just introduce DEC64 and be done with it.

woeful ferry Nov 23, 2017, 5:18 PM

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Anyone know a lot about web hosting on VPS linux machine?

shell elk Nov 23, 2017, 5:18 PM

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I've hosted a website on a linux machine once

woeful ferry Nov 23, 2017, 5:19 PM

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Do you know if linux machines can come preconfigured or

shell elk Nov 23, 2017, 5:19 PM

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Depends on the VPS host

woeful ferry Nov 23, 2017, 5:19 PM

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does the OS need to be fully configured and stuff

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Cause we want to buy a vps for hosting but

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our current vps had everything done by the company cause we upgraded from their shared hosting package and we had no linux knowledge so they agreed

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but now we need a new and better service from another company

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but we have limited knowledge and right now is all the amazing black friday deals

shell elk Nov 23, 2017, 5:21 PM

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not quite sure of your situation, but either:

learn linux yourself
ask the company you're looking at if they provide that service

woeful ferry Nov 23, 2017, 5:21 PM

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well I have a programmer who knows how to navigate linux and install things but

shell elk Nov 23, 2017, 5:22 PM

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pay someone to configure the server for you

woeful ferry Nov 23, 2017, 5:22 PM

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i dont think hes ever setup a linux machine from scratch

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its time sensitive due to black friday

shell elk Nov 23, 2017, 5:22 PM

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You usually get a Linux OS of your choice that you just SSH into with the credentials that they provide, install your web server packages, and put your website in the right folder and voila

woeful ferry Nov 23, 2017, 5:22 PM

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not sure where i'd find someone trust worthy to do that

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yea but dont u need to configure the linux os

shell elk Nov 23, 2017, 5:22 PM

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You don't have to compile the kernel or anything

woeful ferry Nov 23, 2017, 5:22 PM

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install updates, security stuff

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firewall ports

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etc

shell elk Nov 23, 2017, 5:23 PM

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not really 🤷 also that's a problem for the future

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you update packages every now and then, your programmer dude will have time to learn until then (it's not much to learn)

woeful ferry Nov 23, 2017, 5:26 PM

#

also he was complaining that our old host had restrictions on things like numproc

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and kmemsize and such

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being limited by the host

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or maybe mysql connections limit

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is there a terminology i can search for that means unrestricted for that type of thing?

shell elk Nov 23, 2017, 5:27 PM

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not really - linux VPSes are usually really similar

woeful ferry Nov 23, 2017, 5:27 PM

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the same way managed/unmanaged means someone will help u or not

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fair enough

shell elk Nov 23, 2017, 5:27 PM

#

you can get different distros but it won't really change any of those things

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mysql connection limits can always be configured by yourself

woeful ferry Nov 23, 2017, 5:33 PM

#

and is it possible to move a OpenVZ linux server from one machine to another via root access?

simple ravine Nov 23, 2017, 5:35 PM

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just use a PaaS solution if you want to live worry-free

woeful ferry Nov 23, 2017, 5:35 PM

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well the website is already developped fully

simple ravine Nov 23, 2017, 5:37 PM

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and?

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that's not any issue

woeful ferry Nov 23, 2017, 5:37 PM

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oh well i googled paas and i thought it was a platform to build apps on

simple ravine Nov 23, 2017, 5:38 PM

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https://azure.microsoft.com/en-us/services/app-service/

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oh, and you can use it for free

woeful ferry Nov 23, 2017, 5:42 PM

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its not quite what we want but thanks

simple ravine Nov 23, 2017, 5:43 PM

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what is it missing?

woeful ferry Nov 23, 2017, 5:46 PM

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its just not a linux box

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not to mention azure doesnt accept paypal

simple ravine Nov 23, 2017, 5:47 PM

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lol

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you can choose between windows and linux

woeful ferry Nov 23, 2017, 5:48 PM

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well whats the advantage of this over getting a linux box from any other company?

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cause im a noob and not getting it

simple ravine Nov 23, 2017, 5:49 PM

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it's a managed application hosting. you don't have to worry about OS upgrades and shit

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perhaps read more than the title of the page before dissing it

woeful ferry Nov 23, 2017, 5:51 PM

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i never dissed it. im just looking for what we have now but more powerful for same cost during black friday

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because i have no knowlegde of this stuff but im in charge of purchases

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and the only variable i know is what we have now works

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i gotta head to bed. thanks to you guys for answering questions . i appreciate it

idle imp Nov 23, 2017, 7:23 PM

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so i think im done with the parsing part for now, now to do some frontend and usability stuff

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will be fun cause this part i dont actually know so lots of figuring out ahead

simple ravine Nov 23, 2017, 7:57 PM

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nice, I just got done with my GGPK parses

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onto DAT files

tropic shuttle Nov 23, 2017, 8:26 PM

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writing some tests for my stuff because refactorings are getting more and more risky / error prone

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mocking/stubbing in FP is a bit of a brainfuck at first

#

how's stockholm?

simple ravine Nov 23, 2017, 8:27 PM

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let's just say i wish we had california weather.

tropic shuttle Nov 23, 2017, 8:28 PM

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haha, yeah. i'm heading up to canada for christmas. !looking forward to the weather

simple ravine Nov 23, 2017, 8:28 PM

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which state do you live in?

tropic shuttle Nov 23, 2017, 8:28 PM

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CA / sfbay

simple ravine Nov 23, 2017, 8:29 PM

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ah

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i wasn't too fond of san fran, when visiting there

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it was june and it was cold and rainy

tropic shuttle Nov 23, 2017, 8:30 PM

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the city itself has weird weather conditions due to the geography

simple ravine Nov 23, 2017, 8:30 PM

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and we stayed at the intercontinental, one block away from a mental hospital... problem is that the mental hospital was outside, with no doctors.

tropic shuttle Nov 23, 2017, 8:30 PM

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but the food service is great

simple ravine Nov 23, 2017, 8:31 PM

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yeah, was there for the velocity conference. santa clara was warm and nice

tropic shuttle Nov 23, 2017, 8:31 PM

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oh nice. went to velocity last year but not this year

simple ravine Nov 23, 2017, 8:31 PM

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my favorite city is san diego though

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but the service in santa monica was great.. stayed at a hotel called Huntley

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Reading GGPK File...
Total records in GGPK: 443790
Elapsed time: 00:00:01.3979859```

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not too shabby

tropic shuttle Nov 23, 2017, 9:18 PM

#

you spooling that out to file as well?

simple ravine Nov 23, 2017, 9:19 PM

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nah, this is just parsing it

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I would be amazed if I could both read, parse and write to disk in 1.4 seconds, considering it's 8 GB

tropic shuttle Nov 23, 2017, 9:19 PM

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indeed

simple ravine Nov 23, 2017, 9:20 PM

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disclaimer: that file's cached by the OS when read in 1.4 secs

chrome topaz Nov 23, 2017, 11:23 PM

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@woeful ferry if you get a choice, prefer kvm over openvz

#

dedicated even better but dunno what your budget is

#

you can get a scaleway box for like 3 eur/mo

woeful ferry Nov 24, 2017, 9:23 AM

#

@chrome topaz Thanks we 'll look for kvm. Not sure that we can afford dedicated. our budget is about 25$ a month maybe up to 30$.

#

but on black friday/cyber monday we might be able to score a 70$+ value for the cost of 25

simple ravine Nov 24, 2017, 9:25 AM

#

im just looking for what we have now but more powerful for same cost during black friday

I must have misinterpreted that. It sounded like you were going to sell something during holiday sales

delicate ore Nov 24, 2017, 9:26 AM

#

can anybody recommend me a laptop that can play poe decently since black friday/cyber monday is up

pseudo ocean Nov 24, 2017, 9:29 AM

#

you'd want a laptop with nvidia at least, amd gpu's plays poe horribly

simple ravine Nov 24, 2017, 9:30 AM

#

asus g series, maybe

#

also take a look at the rog xg station 2

#

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XbowuAFbslI

simple ravine Nov 24, 2017, 10:04 AM

#

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xpyx1vOF6qI @delicate ore

delicate ore Nov 24, 2017, 10:32 AM

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ha, i think im going to spend like 2 grand usd max

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got anything in that area?

#

oh i see

#

hmm which laptop should i get with that xg station?

#

i guess i could get that asus tablet on the website for the rog station

#

would encourage me to play Osu

simple ravine Nov 24, 2017, 10:36 AM

#

depends why you want a laptop in the first place

delicate ore Nov 24, 2017, 10:37 AM

#

game development

#

is that enclosure compatible with a macbook?

#

i'd just get a macbook air or something and use that, with bootcamp for poe

simple ravine Nov 24, 2017, 10:37 AM

#

not sure

delicate ore Nov 24, 2017, 10:37 AM

#

ios development is a huge plus for me

simple ravine Nov 24, 2017, 10:38 AM

#

just get a macbook pro then

#

https://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=ENE&DEPA=0&Order=BESTMATCH&Description=asus+gx501&ignorear=0&N=-1&isNodeId=1

delicate ore Nov 24, 2017, 10:40 AM

#

if i'm going to get that enclosure, shouldn't i get something with a good processor and shit gpu?

#

these machines seem like overkill

simple ravine Nov 24, 2017, 10:40 AM

#

I'd just get the laptop instead if you'd go for that one

delicate ore Nov 24, 2017, 10:41 AM

#

i mean that would save me money, looking at the prices

#

can get this and the enclosure

#

https://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=ENE&DEPA=0&Order=BESTMATCH&Description=asus+transformer+3+pro&ignorear=0&N=-1&isNodeId=1

simple ravine Nov 24, 2017, 10:41 AM

#

you normally get what you pay for

#

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Swn5qnZP20

#

that's a damn smart design actually

#

might have to replae my zenbook pro

delicate ore Nov 24, 2017, 10:44 AM

#

im digging this

#

that form factor

simple ravine Nov 24, 2017, 10:44 AM

#

disclaimer: that ethernet dongle is 100mbps, not 1gbps (at least for my zenbook pro)

delicate ore Nov 24, 2017, 10:45 AM

#

do they have a gtx1070 version of this?

simple ravine Nov 24, 2017, 10:45 AM

#

no idea

delicate ore Nov 24, 2017, 10:46 AM

#

ah they do

#

going to get that one probably

#

oh i just realized this is Linus

#

haven't seen his vids in a while

simple ravine Nov 24, 2017, 10:47 AM

#

I mean, if you don't have a desktop and wont move it around too much, get a desktop first and foremost

#

it beats anything mobile

delicate ore Nov 24, 2017, 10:48 AM

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i travel far too much

#

i would though

simple ravine Nov 24, 2017, 10:49 AM

#

I found myself buying oversized laptops. I never did much major stuff on my laptop, as they were mainly used in meetings and doing simpler tasks. So i opted for nice CPU, but lightweight zenbook

#

and then a desktop monster PC for everything else

keen owl Nov 24, 2017, 12:33 PM

#

Anyone knows where i can find a list of all unique items?

delicate ore Nov 24, 2017, 12:50 PM

#

https://gist.githubusercontent.com/poeapp/fd7297fd9af528804e77a8383a578ad0/raw/f57ca19c3cc075819d65a677fdb441ef5a931150/uniques.json

keen owl Nov 24, 2017, 12:52 PM

#

@delicate ore Thanks

pseudo ocean Nov 24, 2017, 12:58 PM

#

@simple ravine do you know anything about komplett's routers?

#

Svive Cirrus Router

chrome topaz Nov 24, 2017, 4:04 PM

#

@woeful ferry i suggest hetzner https://www.hetzner.com/sb

obtuse citrus Nov 24, 2017, 4:33 PM

#

hetzner is good and relatively cheap, recommend it as well 😛

#

though there are some better vserver offers out there, but the dedicated ones have really good terms and are cheap

woeful ferry Nov 24, 2017, 5:55 PM

#

oh wow you need to bid on servers? hmm im worried my noobness is gonna hurt me here but ill read up on it

pseudo ocean Nov 24, 2017, 6:06 PM

#

wat

#

those are really old servers

#

https://www.hetzner.com/dedicated-rootserver/matrix-ex

#

if you need cheap ones

woeful ferry Nov 24, 2017, 6:07 PM

#

yea but your link is out of my budget. you missed the previous conversation about that

woeful ferry Nov 24, 2017, 6:30 PM

#

im not the programmer so forgive my lack of knowledge with the terminology but

#

theres definitely lots of stuff going on back end yea

#

think of poe.trade website but for diablo2

#

as well as ladder rankings

obtuse citrus Nov 24, 2017, 6:51 PM

#

the bidding on servers is to get old servers for cheap

#

the new ones have a fixed price

woeful ferry Nov 24, 2017, 7:02 PM

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and the bid price is for 1 month? and then u lock in that price each month?

obtuse citrus Nov 24, 2017, 7:14 PM

#

once you've won you keep that price forever

#

well, until you cancel the srever

#

which runs for 1m at least

#

though it's not really bidding in the tradtional sense

#

they just lower server prices every so many hours until it doesnt go any lower or someone picks it up

woeful ferry Nov 24, 2017, 7:31 PM

#

interesting

#

oh but they dont even come with an os installed? you need to configure everything yourself right?

simple ravine Nov 24, 2017, 7:36 PM

#

@pseudo ocean no.. I use Ubiquiti edgerouter and for wifi Asus RT-AC68U, but I will probably upgrade the wifi now that we have a larger home.

obtuse citrus Nov 24, 2017, 7:37 PM

#

you install the os via their control panel

#

they have a bunch of linux distributions

#

if you want windows you'll have to shell out some money for that

pseudo ocean Nov 24, 2017, 7:37 PM

#

I couldn't find any wan-to-lan speeds on their products, customer support kept linking me wifi mbps speeds lol

woeful ferry Nov 24, 2017, 7:38 PM

#

do they have windows in trial mode so you can use your own key?

obtuse citrus Nov 24, 2017, 7:39 PM

#

doesnt seem like it

simple ravine Nov 24, 2017, 7:39 PM

#

lol, never heard of Svive before. looks like total garbage

obtuse citrus Nov 24, 2017, 7:39 PM

#

I wouldnt recommend windows for servers anyway

woeful ferry Nov 24, 2017, 7:39 PM

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im mostly looking for linux anyway but sometimes I get windows for other stuff

simple ravine Nov 24, 2017, 7:40 PM

#

nothing wrong with window server

obtuse citrus Nov 24, 2017, 7:40 PM

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everything is wrong with windows server :x

simple ravine Nov 24, 2017, 7:41 PM

#

lol, you're one of the cool guys who just say that, or do you have actual experience dealing with windows servers professionally?

obtuse citrus Nov 24, 2017, 7:47 PM

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I've used windows server before and the only reason I'll ever use it again is if there is no other choice

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but if you really love it for some reason I'm not going to stop you from using it

simple ravine Nov 24, 2017, 7:48 PM

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what's wrong with it?

obtuse citrus Nov 24, 2017, 8:33 PM

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expensive and restrictive licensing, lack of fine tuning to the extend you can with linux, really shitty built in fire wall, personally I think it's less productive and a pain in the arse to use, that it comes with a GUI, generally the closed source, proprietary solutions versus open source for a number of things you might want to run or use

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MS has been trying to bandaid some of the problems with putting linux tools on windows

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the main reason I see to use windows server at all is if you have some kind of windows infrastucture and really need windows for that purpose or some software that doesn't work on linux

simple ravine Nov 24, 2017, 8:36 PM

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we run a bit of servers in our business (last time I checked, it was 250-260 servers)

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the windows servers have had better stability than the linux ones

gritty olive Nov 24, 2017, 8:37 PM

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I've never liked windows servers

simple ravine Nov 24, 2017, 8:37 PM

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they also perform better (request throughput, and so on)

obtuse citrus Nov 24, 2017, 8:38 PM

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lol

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I've had way better preformance on linux, so long it was properly tuned for the task it was used for

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but to be fair, some applications are optimized for windows and not ported properly to linux so some specific programs have very large performance differences between the two

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but again was mostly closed source software

simple ravine Nov 24, 2017, 8:41 PM

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and the same goes for linux

gritty olive Nov 24, 2017, 8:41 PM

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I'd rather configure linux, much easier

simple ravine Nov 24, 2017, 8:42 PM

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one thing that windows is lacking, is container isolation which isn't up to par with linux's

obtuse citrus Nov 24, 2017, 8:44 PM

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I dont know whether it has improved but windows firewall is basically garbage

simple ravine Nov 24, 2017, 8:45 PM

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lol, compared to ufw that is so awesome

obtuse citrus Nov 24, 2017, 8:45 PM

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iptables solved so many network attacks without the need for dedicated firewalls

simple ravine Nov 24, 2017, 8:46 PM

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well, software firewalls are pretty much garbage

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works great for your random script kiddie, but once you're actually attacked, pfSense, firewall-1, iptables etc will not have a great time

obtuse citrus Nov 24, 2017, 8:56 PM

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depends what you mean by "actually attacked", a large DDoS attack will cause a struggle anyway, and iptables is -extremly- efficent for targeted attacks.

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besides it can be useful for local rerouting and other stuff

simple ravine Nov 24, 2017, 9:00 PM

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i guess it depends on your situation, for your average site will likely be fine and won't have large targeted attacks

obtuse citrus Nov 24, 2017, 9:00 PM

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all it takes is to piss off someone with some computer knowledge

simple ravine Nov 24, 2017, 9:02 PM

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heh... it takes a little more than some computer knowledge in my observations.

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it requires dedication and resources to manage a large botnet

obtuse citrus Nov 24, 2017, 9:02 PM

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you can buy botnets though

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more specifically "rent"

simple ravine Nov 24, 2017, 9:03 PM

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yeah, the rent-a-botnet is a thing, indeed. but the larger attacks will require some serious dough

obtuse citrus Nov 24, 2017, 9:07 PM

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but besides DDoS doing specific attacks can bring down a service anyway

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but that generlaly requires knowledge of the software involved, it's usually targeting specific bugs

simple ravine Nov 24, 2017, 9:10 PM

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normally you will need 0-day vulnerabilities, which you can find and buy if you're not able to do the research yourself (which I personally wouldn't find feasible), it's gonna cost you enough money to steer away 99%+ of pissed-of-people

chrome topaz Nov 24, 2017, 9:50 PM

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@woeful ferry it's the only ones that fit your budget. you don't bid on them, how it works is every X minutes the price decreases. then you can buy it and you will have it at that price per month

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obviously, if it decreases too much, somebody else could buy it before you

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and yeah they are older than hetzner's normal offerings but also cheaper

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oh I see Omega_K2 already explained it

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you can buy a DDoS attack for pennies

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and when you have a 1 Gbps pipe and it's all flooded with udp traffic, a software firewall won't do shit

simple ravine Nov 24, 2017, 9:54 PM

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1 Gbps isn't considered large in my perspective though

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and the cost isn't linear

chrome topaz Nov 24, 2017, 9:54 PM

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it's just an example from my experience

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hetzner used to have 0 ddos protection

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all you get in case of an attack is a nice email telling they'll null route your server if the attack starts affecting their network

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but now apparently they do have some anti-ddos

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thankfully i don't yet know how effective it is

simple ravine Nov 24, 2017, 9:58 PM

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i thought u were behind cloudflare

chrome topaz Nov 24, 2017, 9:59 PM

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that's when i turned it on

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i didn't like the idea of cloudflare initially

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but it's not like there were any other options

simple ravine Nov 24, 2017, 10:00 PM

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the only other option I could see instead of cloudflare á la revese-proxy , would be BGP, and it'll cost you quite a bit

chrome topaz Nov 24, 2017, 10:00 PM

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well i mean free/reasonably priced options

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yeah

simple ravine Nov 24, 2017, 10:01 PM

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I believe starting at around $2K/month

chrome topaz Nov 24, 2017, 10:02 PM

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yeah that's way too expensive

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anything over $30/mo i'd be like ehhh i can probably reimplement this myself for cheaper

simple ravine Nov 24, 2017, 10:03 PM

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yeah, not something you'd want for a hobby-esque site for sure

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if you're handling people's money and such, it's useful. reputation damages of going down by itself can be detrimental

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and you normally get a bunch of other fluff for those 2k as well

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It all depends ™

chrome topaz Nov 24, 2017, 10:05 PM

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if you're dedicated enough, you can ddos anything

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at way cheaper the price than it'd cost to protect it

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it's a good thing that people who have the skill usually don't do that

simple ravine Nov 24, 2017, 10:06 PM

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try see how much it'd cost you to run 100Gbps+ DDoS attack for let's say a week

chrome topaz Nov 24, 2017, 10:07 PM

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you don't need 100 Gbps

simple ravine Nov 24, 2017, 10:07 PM

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if you have cloudflare / incapsula enterprise, you're gonna need more than 100 Gbps

chrome topaz Nov 24, 2017, 10:07 PM

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you ddos expensive pages

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100 Gbps is basically if you have a hammer everything looks like a nail kind

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if you're smart you bring down application level

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and there's nothing they can do other than optimize it, cache more, buy more servers, etc

simple ravine Nov 24, 2017, 10:09 PM

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that's why you have both layer 4 and 7 protection

chrome topaz Nov 24, 2017, 10:10 PM

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yeah sure..

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as i said, if they are dedicated enough, shit won't help

simple ravine Nov 24, 2017, 10:11 PM

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and for 99%+ of sites out there, those attacks aren't worth these people's time

chrome topaz Nov 24, 2017, 10:11 PM

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there's python scripts on github to bypass cloudflare bullshit

simple ravine Nov 24, 2017, 10:11 PM

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well, cloudflare is bullshit 😛

chrome topaz Nov 24, 2017, 10:12 PM

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which is under 200 lines

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the problem are web devs and IoT devices

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and web devs are the problem because they are writing IoT devices stuff now...

simple ravine Nov 24, 2017, 10:13 PM

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the problem is people learning to program without fundamental computing education

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"I picked up this python for dummies book... I'm now a professional programmer"

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coding bootcamps etc

chrome topaz Nov 24, 2017, 10:14 PM

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it is a weird feeling that somewhere an IoT vibrator might be DDoS'ing your website

simple ravine Nov 24, 2017, 10:15 PM

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LOL

chrome topaz Nov 24, 2017, 10:17 PM

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here's a recent example https://statuscode.ch/2017/11/from-markdown-to-rce-in-atom/

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an xss in slack desktop app? you better hope they have proper Content-Security-Policy (they don't)

simple ravine Nov 24, 2017, 10:20 PM

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I'm so tired of Slack in general.

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We've moved a bunch of our chats to Telegram

chrome topaz Nov 24, 2017, 10:20 PM

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y u no self host

simple ravine Nov 24, 2017, 10:21 PM

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because it's 2017