2┃build-planning

[solid flume]

Did some googling and found this posted 7 years ago, is it outdated?

A critical hit applies stronger ailments than normal based on your "critical strike multiplier for ailments" which by default is 150% but can only be increased via the Perfect Agony keystone.

[craggy hearth]

is there any node that works with totem for warrior ascendancies? lol every node is 'you can , you use yourself, your hits etc etc' ?

[golden swan]

That's PoE1. Johnathan explained in an interview that in PoE2 ailment damage is based on the actual damage dealt by the hit. Meaning that things like crit inherently affect it, and there's no damage over time multiplier anymore.

[cerulean bear]

That was before the MASSIVE ailment nerf

[solid flume]

ahhh thats so good

[cerulean bear]

Initially dots exponentially scaled off of damage multipliers because they scaled off of the initial hit and off the multiplier a second time for the dot

so increased fire damage could scale a fire hit and the ignite from the fire hit

these were the times when poison was absolutely broken

[sharp glade]

quadratically not exponentially

[hoary bolt]

there sort of is, effect of x ailment is just rebranded mult

[terse pendant]

I think I'll be going Gemling Legionnaire as a minion build for my first character. I never really got into PoE 1, but PoE 2 seems so interesting, I have to give it a shot. The ability to even turn a Mercenary into a minion build is really interesting. It will mean I have to fenagle my build around the skill tree, but I am honestly unsure if I'll even mind doing so.

[cerulean bear]

but its less confusing this way

[hoary bolt]

thats fair yeah

[left grail]

do we know / have any idea if triggered skills still have costs?

[cerulean bear]

they do

[left grail]

nice

[hoary bolt]

probably

would be imba af if they didnt

[cerulean bear]

ben_ showed a video of someone using cast on ignite and it was very obvious that the mana was spent

[hoary bolt]

like if they didnt you could just use a low cost channeling skill, use inspiration on it, and trigger all your actual spells with Cwc

[left grail]

I had the idea to use Infernalist to convert casting spells into self damage, then use that self damage to charge up barrier invocation to casts spells.

• maybe grim feast + srs to actually sustain the self damage, or some other form of es recovery.

[hoary bolt]

trigger rate would be bad, but stil would be too strong

doesnt barrier invocation only count hits

[left grail]

Isn't pact a hit?

it might be coded not to be, I guess

[hoary bolt]

oh yeayh that should work

[left grail]

the specific skill I'm thinking to trigger is ember fussilade

[hoary bolt]

i was thinking about the self ignite

[left grail]

since fussilade already needs you to go "cast a bunch - stop"

which meshes well with invocation stockpiling casts

on paper, anyway

[hoary bolt]

sounds solid

you could also just use something like elemetnal invocation

[shrewd socket]

im running out of support gems that i can use on contagion/essence drain. any ideas what supports i could add?

[hoary bolt]

elemental invocation can trigger a single spell like 5 times at max energy

wait

[left grail]

issue is, it requires ~200 damage taken (actually taken, as in es lost) per cast, so trying to sustain this (or even proc it in the first place) could be a bit of a challenge

[hoary bolt]

yeah I think elemental invocation is better than barrier

[left grail]

we don't actually know es requirements per cast, but other meta gems suggest ~10 energy per 0.1 seconds of cast time

[hoary bolt]

you gain energy on ignite/freeze/shock

and can still stockpile up to 500 energy

so even a 1 second cast can trigger 5 times, and more if lower

[left grail]

yeah, it just figured it was an option in case the numbers work out such that the casts are self-sustaining without requiring another skill to proc it

(so, one fully charged cast costs enough mana to stockpile enough self damage for another fully charged cast)

[hoary bolt]

barrier still requires a button press though right

[left grail]

same as elemental invocation, yeah

[hoary bolt]

yeah that sounds pretty coool

would depend on your total life pool though

[left grail]

barrier needs specifically es

though the damage does scale of max life, yeah

[hoary bolt]

i meant es + life, was speaking in general terms

[left grail]

as I said, unknown if the math would work out

[hoary bolt]

whats max energy on barrier

500?

[left grail]

yep

and you need about ~400 energy for an optimal fusillade cast

[hoary bolt]

so 1600 taken to es needed at 75% res

and more at even higher res

[left grail]

I'm almost certainly not going to raise fire res, yeah

[hoary bolt]

wait nah its not 1:1

[left grail]

it's 5 to 1

yep, awkward

[hoary bolt]

yeah that presents an issue def

especially when factoring in res

so with just a standard capped res it would be 20:1 for damage received to energy gained

before res of course

[left grail]

needs:
~40 energy for 1 cast, translating to
200 energy shield lost for 1 cast, translating to
800 incoming damage for 1 cast, translating to
8000 incoming damage for 10 casts

(without factoring in meta skill supporting tree nodes, which exist, and/or increases in efficiency with higher level barrier invocations)

[frigid hill]

y'all think Wildshards support is worth it on Eye of Winter?

[hoary bolt]

so if 4k life, it would take 2 to trigger 1

yeah

if capping energy that is

[left grail]

the idea is to heavily invest into max ES, since beidat's gaze already gives a bunch of es based on max life

[hoary bolt]

yeah of course

[cerulean bear]

if what I've been told is accurate that projectiles shotgun in poe2 then ofcourse

[hoary bolt]

i keep saying life when I mean life/es total pool

in this case, just es

[left grail]

the good news is there's a node that reduces max mana (proc more often!) and increases es

enough stuff like that might make this workable

here's hoping

not going to be my starter though, too much risk involved

[hoary bolt]

you're talking about risk and im starting flicker strike invoker lmao

[frigid hill]

hmmm, I wonder if that rly is the case. if it was by default, would skills have to point it out?

[left grail]

starter plan was lightning rod, until I noticed the skill doesn't seem to have the lightning tag, which is super unfortunate

[lapis raptor]

Yeah I'm torn between acolyte and invoker

[hoary bolt]

invoker has great defenses

[cerulean bear]

interesting idk

[lapis raptor]

Acolyte has crazy damage and good sustain

Just skip the darkness trash

[hoary bolt]

im not too keen on playing osu and picking up dozens of the flame buffs

[lapis raptor]

Get instant leeches and into the breach and the double. So u don't need to worry about attack leeching

Then you get so much extra damage as chaos so u can go spell based if u want

[golden swan]

Johnathan saying outright that there's no mana leech for spells kinda killed my dream of an archmage Acolyte.

[cerulean bear]

just use WASD

[lapis raptor]

Go cold+chaos or lightning+chaos

[left grail]

darkness is actually interesting to me. It's 600 base ehp in emergencies, and if you avoid getting hit (or use Mind over Matter) it's a really big chunk of extra chaos.

[cerulean bear]

its too many points for what you get

[lapis raptor]

Doesn't seem worth imo compared to the other nodes

[left grail]

fair assessment

[cerulean bear]

its at most 30%more damage

[lapis raptor]

Dude with breach and double effect for flames

[cerulean bear]

and at worst a 600 shield

breach is the best node by far

[lapis raptor]

So 14%es/mana instant leech on pick up

And 140% extra damage as chaos

[left grail]

do we know if the flames are sustainable in arenas?

[hoary bolt]

not currently

[lapis raptor]

From what I've heard yes

But unsure

[left grail]

yeah, that's what made me iffy about it

[lapis raptor]

Also we don't know how we can support the skill or what works with it

[hoary bolt]

i think invoker is just super safe

[lapis raptor]

Invoker looks like fun man

[hoary bolt]

lots of spirit, lots of pdr from evasion, and then 2 damage nodes of which theyre all good

[left grail]

nods

[hoary bolt]

hell I might even try meditate

think people are underrating that one

[lapis raptor]

Idk I'm going for the coc shit

[hoary bolt]

my question is if the recharge from meditate counts as 'starting recharge'

[lapis raptor]

If I go invoker

[hoary bolt]

if so you could literally kickstart recharge on demand

even if not overcharging

[left grail]

rechecks napkin math
huh, even without having the lightning tag, based on current info (so, might be outdated on launch) if I'm willing to press more buttons lightning rod on a slow enough target still has a >1344% base damage / attack potential. Neat.

[compact atlas]

Does this count dmg to ES?

[hoary bolt]

it should yes

[golden swan]

Should do.

[sterile latch]

Im afraid picking flames with melee will be super cancer idk, too many questions

[frigid hill]

do we know how this part of comet interacts with meta skills? not favorably I assume

[hoary bolt]

probably yeah

an extra 100 or so energy required to trigger

[frigid hill]

yea probably

[hoary bolt]

what is base es recharge time now again

6?

5?

[left grail]

shrugs

[hoary bolt]

i know its longer than poe 1

[lapis raptor]

So invoker. U going ci? Or es/evasion?

[cedar slate]

Which node are you gonna take first as invoker?

[compact atlas]

Can someone that has PoE experience make a guess how good that point is ?

[lapis raptor]

Or mom + es/ev scaling

[hoary bolt]

im not actually sure

maybe the crit pen one

or ignore I should say

[frigid hill]

it's not great imo, until we see more recoup synergy

[hoary bolt]

30% recoup is super strong what

[left grail]

there's a lot of leaked/teased recoup stuff on some areas of the tree

[hoary bolt]

especially with poe 2 not having as much recovery in general

[frigid hill]

admittedly poe2 is less about one-shots, so recoup is better by comparison

[hoary bolt]

yeah def

god im still so tantalized by the possibility that meditate just insta starts recharge

[left grail]

random rare in a t11 waystone would like to know your location

[feral marten]

Does poison also have to hit life to apply the poison, just like bleed?

[hoary bolt]

alright found it, es recharge is 4 second delay compared to 2 seconds in poe 1

if that actually works it would be sort of crazy even without the overcharge

[golden swan]

Don't think so. At least Johnathan didn't make a point of it like he did with Bleed so I'd assume not.

[heady palm]

Anyone noticed a lack of decent warcries + totems?
I wanted to build an active buffer warrior, but I'm struggling a bit

(open to support char suggestions too)

[frigid hill]

i kinda doubt they give us a repeatable vaal discipline

[left grail]

do you mean warcries to buff totems?

[hoary bolt]

its possible because es recharge is like 1/3rd of poe 1

and costs an ascendancy

[heady palm]

warcries to buff friends, and was expecting something like a rejuvenation totem, or something
not many auras either

[hoary bolt]

let me prayge

[frigid hill]

🙏

[hoary bolt]

also its not like vaal discipline, it would still stop on hit

just start on demand

[frigid hill]

true

[left grail]

maybe answered call can do party buffs, we don't know what it actually does yet. Might need to wait until after launch if you're not willing to gamble.

[golden swan]

Yeah support characters in general seem to be purposefully moved more towards, "I slow the enemy, I wall in the enemy, I throw down a fire wall for your gas grenades" rather than just passively giving out buffs. A deliberate design choice they said. Though Sceptres still have some ally buffing.

[hoary bolt]

screw it im taking meditate as my 1st ascendancy, I need to figure it out

[heady palm]

True - I was just hoping there's be more active things like:

• Target an ally to give their next attack 30% more damage with a cooldown
• Short warcry buffs

Many warcries are tied into slams

which kinda limit the builds imo

[hoary bolt]

infernal cry is any attack

[golden swan]

There was a leak about a link skill passive on the tree at one point, but I haven't seen any link skills so maybe they're planned for a character that isn't in yet.

[hoary bolt]

100% damage as extra fire

[golden swan]

Infernal Cry only buffs you though, not allies.

[left grail]

glances
there's a non-0 chance we'll have link skills - at least the one passive tree web app I'm using seems to have a leaked notable featuring link skill cast speed
edit: might not be on launch, though

[hoary bolt]

yeah I know, just saying

links are probably like maybe templar skills

wild guess

[golden swan]

Would make sense.

[heady palm]

Yeah - my dream scenario would've just been buff warcries (for allies), that'd become quite powerful via the ascendancy.
Maybe in the future tho

[left grail]

warcry supporter could focus on building up stun /breaking armour, now that I think of it

seismic cry seems ideal for that

[hidden tartan]

When is Lightning Conduit tooltip being implemented kek

[hoary bolt]

seismic does have great stun power

[left grail]

you'd need/want generic flat damage, though

[golden swan]

Interestingly, there are passives on the tree that buff your allies. They aren't massive, but if you're exclusively playing the character in a party then they seem pretty damn good.

[maiden karma]

That's it

I'm rejecting all nonsense and embracing the unga bunga

[left grail]

have fun

that's arguably the most important bit, anyway

[golden swan]

The true Juno mentality. Just throw blobbos at the problem until it goes away.

[maiden karma]

I'll either facetank uber bosses with warbringer or die

[left grail]

that does seem to describe the possible outcomes of that scenario, yes

[maiden karma]

The negative armour node can basically be treated like better impale

[hidden tartan]

Anyone knows if Meta gems such as Cast on Shock can trigger marks ?

[frigid hill]

is it impale? it doesnt scale?

[maiden karma]

Cause it will actually work with leech and stuff

[left grail]

... to me it reads that you'd still armour break enemies and the negative armour would then reset once they recover from that.

[maiden karma]

There are nodes on the tree that interact with break, like making it last longer

[left grail]

yep, which makes this interesting to build around

[golden swan]

Right, but the one node makes your every hit armour break. So you just keep breaking them.

The Ivan Drago build.

[hoary bolt]

https://tenor.com/view/i-must-break-you-fifidonia-break-rude-stalone-gif-14615906

[maiden karma]

Just go full blender and pray you hit the 50/50 block on anything that could kill you

[livid hamlet]

Crossbows will probably be pretty good right ?
Witchhunter honestly seems quite balanced in offence and defence with reverse culling strike -> Concentration debuff and explosions for clear

[frigid hill]

ya witchhunter looks reliable

[hazy orbit]

do you think hand of chayula could apply multiple curses? similarly to blasphemy

[hoary bolt]

going witchunter bleed crossbow is the real G shit

[livid hamlet]

i'm going in pretty blind tbh, i wonder how that will end

[frigid hill]

socketed Curses

[hoary bolt]

it will yeah, as long as you have enough curse limit

[frigid hill]

yea

[livid hamlet]

Was thinking explosions and hit, mostly for that sweet sweet Space Marine with shotgun vibe

[golden swan]

I don't know if it'll be good, but one of my plans is crossbow with Rapid Shot. Go Dex/Accuracy scaling for the attack speed. And just try to empty and reload once or twice every six seconds for huge damage from Many Bolts support.

[left grail]

The DNT tags guarantee this was WIP at the time of being leaked/shown, but I'm still hoping that this works like I think it does....Many Bolts Support Tier: 2 Requires: Level 1 Support Reqirements: +5 Str [DNT] Damage Per Bolt Reloaded Recently Support [DNT] Supported Skills deal 1% more Damage for each Bolt Reloaded in the past 6 seconds
there's no way they'd allow this kind of more multiplier though, right?

[livid hamlet]

i was like : Oh my god, there's a monk with staff, and then i saw mercenary and saw the glory of the emperor appear before me

[hoary bolt]

fragmentation rounds hits 10 times and combines them all into 1 hit, and also does 300% more damage against frozen enemies

giga for phys ailments

[golden swan]

Specifically with Rapid Shot it seems busted. I wouldn't be surprised if it's nerfed for live. Which would at least make my decision easier.

[hidden tartan]

Anyone knows if Marks can be used with trigger meta gems and do they work for spells even if they have attack tag such as Voltaic Mark?

[hoary bolt]

should be around 1000% DE at a middling gem level

marks should trigger yeah

[golden swan]

Long as their spells.

[hoary bolt]

and yes voltaic will work with spells

the attack tag is just for the explosion it does

[golden swan]

Marks DO have cast time.

[hoary bolt]

which deals attack damage

[livid hamlet]

Multiple Bolts from one burst can hit the same target - there's that but it doesn't say that it combines them all in one hit

[hidden tartan]

ye My bad Lord

just saw it

[livid hamlet]

So i guess it could work with poison, but not necessarily with bleed

[hoary bolt]

dont ask me where I got this forbidden knowledge

but they combine into 1

[golden swan]

Poison is max one stack by default. So it wouldn't be any different presumably.

[livid hamlet]

As in you don't remember or you don't want to share That sounds funky because nothing really works like that in PoE1 but i will believe

it doesn't really matter since it's not the vibe i was planning to go for my first character

but that's a nice tip, thanks

[livid hamlet]

What site is that ? I mean i go from poe2db

but okay , that's fair

[hoary bolt]

in-game screenshot

[hidden tartan]

Do you know how Cast on Shock thing works, if you have 2 spells socketed that have cost lets say 125 energy but you have 500 energy, would it proc both 2 times, or can we change it to proc mark once and other spell 3 times ?

[livid hamlet]

How old one tho ? Just don't be surprised if they change it before Live

[hoary bolt]

recent

[livid hamlet]

Okay, neat

[hexed frigate]

Hello guys, my friend's going to do a warrior but don't know which ascendancy, could you explain both ?

[livid hamlet]

strongest Dot build will still probably be hammer of gods with something else for clear

[hoary bolt]

the energy is based on the cast time of each spell

[golden swan]

It combines the cast time of the two and sets the max energy based on that. When you hit max energy it casts both spells.

[hoary bolt]

cast on shock maximum is just the cast time of all spells combined

it doesnt have a set static max

[frigid hill]

can supports that consume a debuff (broken armor, shock etc) be combined with skills that consume the same debuff? I assume not

[hidden tartan]

ohh so you have to fll energy for each spell, and then they all fire off at the same time?

[hoary bolt]

like other meta trigger gems

yes

[golden swan]

Right. When you hit max it spends all the energy to cast the spell(s).

[hoary bolt]

if you have three 1 second cast time spells, it would be 300 energy (assuming 10 per .1) and then when you get 300 they all cast

[hidden tartan]

Ye ye, Energy part I get, I was just wondering if you put 3 spells in to something like Elemental Invocation could you proc just the first 2 spells when you click it again if you dont have enough energy for 3

or having max energy is requirment for all meta gems to pop off in first place, which is more likely I assume

[golden swan]

"Cannot support skills that Consume Broken Armour." From the support that does so. So seems not.

[frigid hill]

ah they all say that, im blind ty ty

[golden swan]

Yeah, they just happen when you hit max. Except for the one I think that can be activated.

[left grail]

Lightning Rod math / speculation:

Shown to deal 28% damage per burst at level 2, last 12 seconds, burst whenever chained to.
Orb of Storms chains 3 times when using a lightning skill.
Chain support adds 1 chain and doubles chains (8)
Increase limit doubles active orb or storms. (16)
(Mana Tempest may tripple chain procs if it works with orb of storms, 48)

So, assuming sufficient lightning rods are set up around a target, any lightning skill use would cause the orb of storms to proc them for a maximum total of...
28% * 16 (448%) (1344% if Tempest works)

If the attack used to proc Orb of Storms itself also causes procs, add those as well.

Really needs a near stationary target (and many button presses), though.

Thoughts?

[hoary bolt]

invocation works differently

and yes probably you can trigger 2 before 3

[livid hamlet]

All in all this game seems mechanically much more complex than PoE1 or is it just me ?

[hoary bolt]

it also requires a manual press

[hidden tartan]

I assume it procs from left to right, depending how much energy you have?

yep

[hoary bolt]

yeah probably gem order just like in poe 1

and then next cast it probably will start with 3 posibly

[golden swan]

Oh not at all. It's just that we don't have as much information, or as much time with the information to figure it out.

[hoary bolt]

no idea though

it just seems complex because everything is new

and we dont have any practical knowledge because we havent played

i was trying to explain some poe 1 concepts to a friend of mine, and I had to stop myself because its all gibberish if you dont already know

[sage moth]

will infernalist bringer of flame node let me ignite with cold spells/dmg?

[golden swan]

Seems like that maths out? Basically limited to bosses though. And even then I wonder how feasible it would be. If it works though that's amazing damage.

[hoary bolt]

yes

[golden swan]

I guess maybe you throw Orb onto Cast On Shock and just spam Lightning Rod with increased shock chance?

Multiple Projectile support would make it easier to get the necessary total as well... and it wouldn't even lower the burst damage, just the projectile damage which isn't why you're using it.

[left grail]

Orb of storms can be automated, and I guess lightning arrow would be the clearing and triggering skill.
Cast on [] reserves 100 spirit, enhanced temp chains blasphemy reserves 45 (145) and is there to slow targets, and leaves enough space for another 30 reservation with one (!) 110% reservation multiplier support.

[hidden tartan]

What do you think, will lightning storm be able to proc Energy gain on Cast on crit ?

[golden swan]

Should do.

[hoary bolt]

should ye

[hidden tartan]

so isnt lightning shorm + ball lightning crazy for it? coz it doesn't say once per skill?

[hoary bolt]

its a duration skill, but its not a proxy

so no problem

[left grail]

wait they're distinct? I thought lightning rod burst was the projectile on hit effect, just repeated whenever chained to.

[tough hazel]

Quick question for the Infernalist - now that the new Ascendencies are revealed, the 3 nodes for "Reserve 25% of you max life" and associated bonuses, how does that interact with CI? Is it just impossible? Or it'll round down, and thus the reservation is ignored?

[golden swan]

Oh, huh. I guess? I guess I just assumed that the AoE wasn't projectile damage but the way it's worded I... guess it is?

[sterile latch]

think about what you'll gain even if it works :d

[tough hazel]

LOL TRUE! Duh!

[golden swan]

Shouldn't work, but yeah. Pointless either way.

[tough hazel]

Infernalist kind of sucks with CI and MoM then

[hidden tartan]

Like lightning ball hits every 0.2 sec and lightning storm hits 0.4 sec, so if you scale crit to something like 13.3% on those 2(meaning really easily), you hit 7.5 times per second guranteed crit every second?

[golden swan]

Though speaking of, max life Infernalist going for %spirit and reduced minion cost. Just FILL the screen with minions sounds fun.

[hoary bolt]

storm wont necesarily land every hit

but it should be great for building up CoC yeah

[hidden tartan]

what do you mean?

[tough hazel]

yea, that was the goal - playing with 4 others, they're all new - wanted to be more supportive with minions/auras for that reason ... infernalist seemed best at first

[golden swan]

It doesn't strike randomly, Lighting Storm specifically hits enemies in the area.

[hoary bolt]

wait it doesnt function like icestorm/firestorm?

[tough hazel]

but, CI/MoM/EB was going to be my tank portion ... and Infernalist has all nodes that counter that, or demon form to lose weapons

[devout dew]

ok need advice from people who are going Monk

[golden swan]

Nope. Just hits enemies in the area every .05 seconds. Limited to .4 seconds per enemy.

[hidden tartan]

yea? so 0.4?

[devout dew]

if anyone can help

[hoary bolt]

lay it on me

im def going monk

[devout dew]

between Ice and Thunder

which is going to be stronger

[hoary bolt]

both

im going for both

[frigid hill]

depends on ur skill choices

[hidden tartan]

So, you think ball light/light storm will be op if scaled with some crit? for coc

[devout dew]

so from what ive been told and shown u only go with 4 points

[frigid hill]

4 big nodes, 8 total points

[hoary bolt]

certain quarterstaff attacks benefit massively from power charges,

[left grail]

important note:
ice focus would likely have an easier time freezing/chilling, which seems to be a huge gameplay advantage, while lightning shocks for more dps on paper

[hoary bolt]

and this node exists:

[devout dew]

so then what would be the right choice

[golden swan]

I think it could be. It can crit a bunch of different enemies super fast, so that might be a nuts clearing combo.

[hoary bolt]

im going 1-2-3-8

but thats just me

[frigid hill]

me go this with eye of winter

[hoary bolt]

i highly rate the defensive power of the evasion > pdr node

[frigid hill]

ya it looks solid

[hoary bolt]

and a lot of extra spirit is generically strong

especialy for fitting in trigger setups

[devout dew]

so ur not picking either element tho

if ur going 1 2 3 8

[hoary bolt]

not on those passives no

resist ignore is very strong

and i have a hunch about meditate I need to test

[frigid hill]

is it? crit seems a lot harder to get

pen/resistance lowering seems fairly trivial

[devout dew]

so ur not getting Unbound Avatar either?

[hoary bolt]

you can guarantee crit with mantra of destruction

[golden swan]

Spells have a better base crit chance compared to PoE1 also.

[hoary bolt]

at least for 1 massive hit like from falling thunder

which is sure to be a banger of a skill

use combo finisher + fist of war on it

and rageforged

and then build combo with a fast skill like ice strike/tempest flurry with faster attacks and rage support

and then just tap mantra of destruction and nuke a boss

[golden swan]

If you wanna go Unbound Avatar grabbing both of the preceeding passives I think is just fine.

[hoary bolt]

mantra also counts as empowering, so you can use empowered damage for 20% extra more damage

and empowered cull

[golden swan]

Though if you wanted to choose one, the lightning one is maybe better since we know there's really good lightning scaling for Int/Mana characters.

[blazing swift]

any one got any ideas for flicker? XD

[hoary bolt]

im gonna run flicker

most likely

[blazing swift]

oh sick, i want too also! would you be alright sharing your ideas? 🙂

[hoary bolt]

let me link the skill setup and ill explain: https://poe2skills.com/share?data=N4IgdghgtgpiBcICyB7MBrAtEiYAEAygK4AOATjLCADQgBGRAlgDYAmCA2qAM7ovMIQAM2aMAxuhhk83AC5lGkmiG6kSKMrO6cQJKXtlEIzPGIAWEMgHM4tAO4wI6-DGaUYYWcbytoEGyAAugC+1Dx8zAKIdhAAbjB4KEJ4QmQocsqqJOqa2vAcIOIJdIyytiBWzBBijBCyjGhBoeH8gkLGomBWeLJmRGCsUplqGlo6QoxyickxZMpk-jBCGjbstGIoUHQoKYxgk2ZDIWEqEVEgULjyENM+MHJkRGL1jbRZOWP5IJTqDhSsPj8AVoPxQfxgALEREiTROvFaiFc7k83j2sRQYjqDTAw2yozyBXISVwCQUhmMyig0PqJDcpgs1nKGzIJG4CQ2YDZZFiWNeIDc3G4PiICxeOOOLRhiHMllWMi8QiEuI+BIuGgSrBFvPFzVOCMKYgSD0U5Xe+PGEDkUjwdS8Em0tAWAQleqlYGhzDeI1ynBd8Kl9Cq3BIhygAE9leavh4hDAYHQ3MpDowrGYymAIaYRWymiEgA

[devout dew]

can Flicker Strike be used with Quarterstaff tho

[hoary bolt]

yes

it has to be actually

[golden swan]

Flicker being limited to Quarterstaff made me annoyed off the idea. Anything I can't do with a Two-hander in each hand just annoys me.

[blazing swift]

nice ty!

[hoary bolt]

the quarterstaff passives are so good though

Basically im building both light and cold to shock/freeze and build up elemental invocation energy so I can trigger 5 copies of profane ritual at once

each ritual gives 1 power charge

[golden swan]

Yeah, some of the quarterstaff passives are basically tailored to it. Like the 'count as having one extra power charge for power charge spending skills' notable.

[left grail]

another build idea:

Armour break as fast as possible with Armour Explosion Support Attack, AoE, Trigger, Fire Supported Skills trigger an Explosion when they Fully Break an enemy's Armour as your main damage source because there's nodes that increase damage specifically on armour broken enemies (pile on is 60% on one node) (which this would always benefit from), and Increased Armour Break Support Tier: 2 Supported Skills break 80% more Armour would basically act as a "proc your damage 80% more often -> 80% more damage" support

And have a triggered frequently hitting skill consume the broken armour as often as possible.

Might be good if the explosion deals decent damage?

[hoary bolt]

and if you use corpse conservation and multiple charge you get fantastic charge sustain

[blazing swift]

ahh nice!

you jsut have to make sure you stop flickering to get them though right?

[hoary bolt]

yeah

downtime is minimized with less duration support

[golden swan]

Warbringer making your hits break armour I suppose in theory could make the Armour Explosion chain through packs if you have enough increased armour break.

[devout dew]

@hoary bolt Im looking at ur build so for skillpoint progression what would i do

[hoary bolt]

and if the activation of elemental invocation is instant you could time it 1 second before finishing your flicker

i have a tree around here I made

its semi incomplete because we dont know all the tree passives

[left grail]

it seems to be a new, triggered skill though, so I doubt it'd be able to chain, since it requires the supported skill to be the one breaking the armour

[sharp glade]

my build plan

[hoary bolt]

unless you mean ascendancy

[devout dew]

thats 2

[golden swan]

Ah, true.

[devout dew]

i cant read that lol

[hoary bolt]

will likely take the resist ignore passive first

[blazing swift]

same what i was thinking!

[left grail]

Idea was to use one of the skills specifically designed to break armour and just roll with it. (Since the explosion would also have base damage separate from triggering skill, more likely than not.)

[hoary bolt]

open it up bigger

[devout dew]

what website is that

[hoary bolt]

https://marcoaaguiar.github.io/poe2-tree/

[devout dew]

wish Mobalytics was working ><

i wish Mobalytics had guides out already ><

[hoary bolt]

basically just a community tree based on all the known notables and passives

still a ton of unknowns though

[golden swan]

Everything red is unknown. So like 80% of it.

[hidden tartan]

One thing I'm not sure is will Cast on Crit work same way like in poe one? Or will crits even outside of cast on crit give energy ?

[hoary bolt]

all crits will

the critting skill doesnt have to be linked

jsut the triggered ones

[golden swan]

Cast on Crit is a Meta Gem. Basically it's a reservation skill that you socket the skill you're using into it.

[left grail]

all crits would be default behaviour since that's just how meta skills work now (they check globally)

[hidden tartan]

But the more I think about it more broken it is, imagine a set up of lightning orb/ball lightning/lightning storm, and then you put conduit in to coc?

[blazing swift]

Xantho what would be your "rotation"??

[hidden tartan]

if it doesn't get some base internal cd this shit could proc 24/7

[left grail]

did they mention something about triggered skills not being able to (directly) generate energy?

I vaguely recall something like that.

[hoary bolt]

prob start areas with tempest flurry to gain a charge, then maybe flicker or falling thunder to get some kills and start generating extra charges

i havent figurred it out completely because i havent fully fit in flicker strike

[golden swan]

I think so, but I can't remember which interview it would have been.

[hoary bolt]

but for bossing falling thunder is great

[left grail]

(Part of why I felt like jumping through hoops with Barrier Invocation.)

[devout dew]

so then -- https://mobalytics.gg/poe-2/guides/monk-overview

[hoary bolt]

you want to max out on charges, then empower with mantra of destruction and then use falling thunder

[blazing swift]

yeah my thoughts too! and the skill looks so good haha

[hoary bolt]

if you plan on using combo finisher on falling thunder youll need a combo skill to build with

[devout dew]

im prolly going to mimic ur build Xantho i just need it to be in Mobalytics form ><

[hoary bolt]

where ice strike or tempest flurry will work

[golden swan]

No one is making a guide worth anything at this point. Even the people who've had access literally just haven't had enough time to try things and discover combos/uniques.

[hoary bolt]

not 100% necessary, but will help build charges and also build up combo for both mantra and falling thunder

im gonna be tinkerng with skills a lot on release

things will 100% change somewhat based on what works better

[blazing swift]

yeah for sure

[golden swan]

Really considered Mantra of Destruction with Hammer of the Gods as a boss killer. Hourglass/Second Wind/Combo Finisher. Just two big chunks and hope for the best.

[heady palm]

Do we know how retaliation / thorns works with blocks?
If I block -> do i deal full retaliate damage?

[blazing swift]

i think, its hard to know the best way to get power charges untill you play it and try different methods and see which one is less clunky and more reliable

[golden swan]

The retaliation we've seen on the tree is based on damage taken. So if you take no damage, you deal none back.

[frigid hill]

it specified damage taken, you don't take blocked damage unless you have glancing blows

[golden swan]

The one thing I wonder for Flicker Strike is if it'll be even worth it to bother with Power Charges. If the one notable where you count as having one extra just works, then you may not need to generate any.

[hoary bolt]

its cool that falling thunder is a slam, which opens up cool stuff

[frigid hill]

it says Consumes Power Charges so I doubt it but if it works that'd be sweet
edit: oh the node says "counts as consuming", interesting

[blazing swift]

whatcha thinking?

[hidden tartan]

will brittle still give crit in poe 2?

[hoary bolt]

fist of war for 1

maybe seismic cry with a stun building skill

to double up on damage

[naive nexus]

Does TIMESTOP prevent enemies from taking DOT Dmg?

[hoary bolt]

adding a bunch of stun with overpower support could work wonders

[golden swan]

Hopefully not, and I'd say probably not, but there's no way to know based on the wording.

[blazing swift]

fist of war support seems so good with falling thunder

[hoary bolt]

maybe with wind blast

which deals pure phys damage as base, so more stun build

wind blast + rage + faster attacks + overpower

could be cool

build combo and stun with wind blast, then absolutely annihilate them with falling thunder

[fresh dirge]

what 4 ascendancy nodes do you pick to maximize minion damage 😫

[hoary bolt]

also opens up exploit weakness support on falling

[naive nexus]

I want to go lightning/fire with timestop. But I think I’d have to go the other ascendancy if it blocks DOT

[hoary bolt]

which is like 50% more damage iirc

[golden swan]

Probably Infernalist. Maybe picking 1/3/7/(9 or 8).

[hidden tartan]

Do we know for sure if we can support Spells that proc from Cast on "Meta" spells?

[naive nexus]

Of course we can

[hoary bolt]

99% sure

[hidden tartan]

no coz more I minimax this coc thing more broken it looks

[golden swan]

Might be misremembering but I'm pretty sure that was given an affirmative.

[lofty grotto]

that's shitiest overview i even seen

[golden swan]

Remember mana costs aren't as ignorable as in PoE1 for starters. There's no mana leech for spells, and you gotta pay for each cast you're triggering.

[hidden tartan]

ye well im stacking mana regen/archmage anyway

and not using mom for 50% less recovery

Using es as only layer of defense

[copper forge]

What ascendacies are yall gonna play? I can't decide if I wanna go infernalist or deadeye....

[pseudo kayak]

What kind of playstyle did you have in mind?

[golden swan]

Almost definitely Gemling. It might be bland, but it seems like it's just so generically powerful that I have to try it.

[naive nexus]

I’m going CI with all those new sexy ES restart nodes!

Gemling will be amazing for trigger builds.

[copper forge]

Not really sure, something ranged and maybe not as squishy

[golden swan]

Oh I'm not even going for that. It's the double stat scaling. Almost everything else is just extra. Probably the max res though is the other points.

I'd say try Mercenary then. He's part strength on the tree so you've got good defense you can go for. Plus the crossbow has a lot of good crowd control options to keep you from getting mobbed.

[hoary bolt]

does anyone know if cast on melee stun still exists

its on poe2skills, but not poe2db

[pseudo kayak]

the ideas i have for deadeye and infernalist both are definitely on the squishy side

[vale burrow]

it is

[golden swan]

Cast on Melee Stun IS on poe2db.

[hoary bolt]

weird I cant find it

[fresh dirge]

wouldnt 3 with 7 make me die often?

[golden swan]

It's under skill gems not spirit gems.

[copper forge]

I was thinking energy shield with infernalist since it's int anyways, but maybe that's not as tanks as I imagine

[hoary bolt]

oh its in the wrong category

its in normal skill gems and not spirit gems

[golden swan]

Not necessarily. You don't need to cast skills super often if you're relying on your minions, so you needn't take the big hit at all. But even then you can cap fire res and make it pretty manageable.

[hoary bolt]

no way this is right, 10 energy on heavy stunning an enemy, but 100 energy to trigger a 1 second spell?

cant be

wait misread

per enemy power

[pseudo kayak]

Oh you definitely can make an infernalist tanky. I just meant the ones I've been thinking of, so they wouldn't be of use to you.

[fresh dirge]

and with 8 any minion that doesnt cause ignite will start causing it?

[heady palm]

does the (witch) here mean its witch only?

[golden swan]

Right. Your minions will be able to ignite regardless of their damage type.

[copper forge]

What where you thinking of, now I am curious! Seems you've been going much more indepth into build planning

[midnight wharf]

All skills are usable by everyone

[silent prawn]

in the Witch gem site, basically where to find it in the Gem catalogue

[graceful stag]

if i have second wind and i use chronomancers refresh does it recover all second wind stacks

[midnight wharf]

The (witch) means it's part of the recommended gems for witch, but its access is not limited to witch class

[golden swan]

Should do, but it's uncertain.

[graceful stag]

my whole build hinges on it lmao

[golden swan]

The way Second Wind is worded I would say that's how that works.

[sage moth]

so what does magnitude mean when reffering to ignite im getting so many mixed answers when trying to figure it out

[graceful stag]

🙏

we'll see

[hoary bolt]

10% ignite magnitude = 10% more ignite damage

[heady palm]

Does this mean the fire tag specifically on the skill/spell?
Or could i put a Fire support on a melee phys attack and this would be triggered?

[hoary bolt]

fire spells speficially

[heady palm]

😭 my build nooo

[golden swan]

Ignite damage is based on the damage of the hit. So when it says all damage contributes to ignite magnitude it's saying that all damage is being counted to determine the ignite damage.

[silent prawn]

need to have Spell and Fire tag
I asked this previously if fire support adds fire tag 😄

[heady palm]

Ah, cool - thanks for letting me know 🙇‍♂️

[sage moth]

wouldnt that mean that the infernalist node that makes all dmg apply to ignite magnitude and chane to apply mean that a cold spell wouldnt add any ignite dmg just add to the multiplyer?

[hoary bolt]

wait I thought you meant effect, sorry. Magnitude should be just how much damage the ignite does

as a baseline

chance is also based on the damage the hit does

but is separately calculated

[sage moth]

yea i hope thats correct

[pseudo kayak]

Neither are my current planned starter, but I took some notes on a trigger spell heavy Infernalist and a quickly dismissed Flicker Strike Deadeye

[fast slate]

Chronomancers day 1: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pkMIkNMV76c&ab_channel=SimpCard

[upbeat raft]

I was initially going to go bloodmage, but I think I'll start with stormweaver, seems fun

[cerulean bear]

seems stronger* ftfy

[upbeat raft]

I've seen lots of people interested in going chronomancer and bringing the hammer down, I do hope that build works out

[graceful stag]

That's my plan

It'll either be giga broken or dog shit

Deciding what to spend my other 2 ascendancies on

[sterile latch]

since it's attack tag, you can put support mana leech on it right ?

[graceful stag]

Presence + temp chains seems op

I'm either going to go the recoup or temporal rift after that

[upbeat raft]

I'm sure you can make it deal good damage, but then how it feels to play, no one knows

[cerulean bear]

yeah but only the shockwaves will leech

[sterile latch]

ok so your weapon damage in aoe basically

this is kinda weird no ?

[cerulean bear]

yeah thats weird

but 100% attack damage for the aoe will be the leech

[sterile latch]

yes

seems good enough

[cerulean bear]

keep in mind you can only have 1 source of leech at a time so aoe leech might not be as great

[hidden tartan]

So pen can no longer go in to negatives right? so whats the point of stormweavers -20 extra res, if mob has lets say 60 res, and you have default expo 10 + 20 from weaver and lets say you use conductivity, so you remove it under 0 and then pen does nothing?

[cerulean bear]

yeah

[hidden tartan]

Looks like its better just to get pen?

[sterile latch]

but chayula §

[cerulean bear]

you pick a curse for lowering res or pen

[cerulean bear]

oh true

lowering res can go negative but penetration can't

[upbeat raft]

yeah -res = goes negative. pen = stops at 0

[sterile latch]

the bell should also work with :

even if it's not an ailment no ?

[heady palm]

Oh man I'm having such a tough time deciding what to play.
I kinda want a warbringer:

• Armour break ascendancy
• Resonating shield (armour break attack)
• Warcry
• Some buffing
• Scepter for the stonked co-op gameplay.
• Maybe some curses

I think having minions would also work great as a way to boost my dps, but I'm having trouble trying to squeeze everything in.

Any ideas?

[hidden tartan]

yes but you dont have that many sources to push to negative and even if you did it would make pen useless, and since pen is easy to get why waste ascendancie point? just get pen instead?

or am I missing smth?

[upbeat raft]

exposure is -res isn't it

so stormweaver makes it more -res, shouldn't be pen

[hidden tartan]

yes but you didnt read what I said 😄

[cosmic coral]

Hello, does reduced Cost of Skills apply for spirit reservation?

[hidden tartan]

My question was why even pick - res when pen is easier to get if you aren't planning to go big minus with conductivity

so if you go default - 10 default expo and - 20 from ascendancie, and if conductivity is maxed to -44 like in poe 1 sure

[upbeat raft]

I hope pen and the exposure work well together, where you can penetrate to 0 res and then push that to negatives. I do think that extra damage can be worth to some

if you don't think its worth then skip the node

[hidden tartan]

Pen happens after exposures

so if mob has 60 you would remove -30 from default and asendancie and then pen comes in

[upbeat raft]

then that node is worthless

[hidden tartan]

yes exactly

it seems to work well only with conductivity

[upbeat raft]

are we sure pen happens after in poe2

[hidden tartan]

99% sure

coz conducivity will first reduce monster res by flat amoutn

and hit comes in after that

penetrating the rest

[compact atlas]

Which one goes first in the calculation of dmg, -res or res pen?

[hidden tartan]

• ress

then ress pen

[upbeat raft]

well I hope ggg is notified that this asc node is dogshit

[cerulean bear]

keep in mind some uniques have stats too which could enable -res over pen as well

[knotty spruce]

https://tenor.com/view/lets-go-gambling-gif-4822326163116896763

[hidden tartan]

ye that was my point only way I see it working well is unqiues + conductivity

[cerulean bear]

pen is a simple approach to get to 0 enemy res, but -res is a higher investment for higher reward

[knotty spruce]

CANT FUCKING WAIT AAAAAA I LOVE TIME CONTROLLING POWERS SO DAMN MUCH

[upbeat raft]

I wasn't going to pick the exposure node anyway tho, stormweaver has too many good nodes outside of that one

[hidden tartan]

well to be fair its simple choices

double shock is 100%, for 2 points

and t hen you either go arcane surge or chill

depending on build type

[cerulean bear]

that assumes you can hit hard enough to get 2 50% shocks

[hidden tartan]

shocks work

different in poe 2

they no longer scale effectivness from dmg

[upbeat raft]

probably start with arcane surge and then take chill, for my first trials

[hidden tartan]

instead it scales shock chance

you always get base shock of 30% it seems

but chance to get it depends on ailment treshold

so bigger the dmg bigger the chance to get it, so if you do 100% of ailment threshold you have 25% chance to shock

if you do 50% of threshold 12.5

and so on

that's why stuff like Ball light,Lightning storm have % Chance to Shock and As though dealing % dmg, basically doing the same thing, coz they have low hits

[cerulean bear]

ahh that makes sense

[covert rain]

Anyone has clearer picture of how accuracy works now? If enemy evasion = 0 & distance = 0 then accuracy = 100%?

[scenic ivy]

Hmm, I might have to change up my starter ideas. I was planning on going infernalist. But it seems like the ascendancy is almost 50/50 in power and drawbacks haha. Having to manage life regen with demon form, having to reserve life to get your ascendancy buff, random ele taken as different ele and phys as chaos. removing mana at the cost of almost constantly taking fire damage. All they really get for "free" is the hellhound haha

Seems like the entire ascendancy is fighting you haha

Not to mention demon form is "bugged" right now by removing your weapon, so it'll mess up minions or just get outscaled by good gear

[cerulean bear]

There aren't many sources of damage taken as, so investing in fire res negates alot of the downsides of what you're mentioning

also the damage taken as just means that the damage is effectively calculating on fire res instead of cold or w/e

[scenic ivy]

Yeah I mean I guess this all goes under the assumption we won't have res capped

[cerulean bear]

I don't see why res capping would be very difficult

[scenic ivy]

I know they said somewhere that capping res is more of an endgame thing now. But unsure how late into endgame it is

And if we are res capped, I'm just not seeing the utility in taking cold and lightning damage as fire if all 3 are res capped, unless you pump max fire res a bunch

And even so, just taking phys as chaos seems rough if chaos res is like it is in poe 1

The buffs from infernal flame also seem nice, but just going off of that one clip we saw in the livestream, it seems like you cap out and overflow infernal flame like every 2 or 3 casts

[terse pendant]

I did not really get into PoE 1. Around how many skill tree nodes are we likely to be able to take in PoE 2?

[scenic ivy]

122

8 ascendancy nodes

[hidden siren]

decimating strike will proc witchbane?

[cerulean bear]

going ci limits the downside to only energy shield total as fire damage and basicly becomes 20% less physical damage taken

[sharp glade]

ci will be hard in poe 2

[cerulean bear]

its got its ups and downs, but there are definitely options that make the ascendancy really strong if you invest in them

agreed, but just a point

[knotty spruce]

so hear me out. As chrono why bother building hp or resistances or anything when you just stop time and dodge

simply go full glass cannon

[cerulean bear]

do it

[sharp glade]

smoothbrain take

[cerulean bear]

play hardcore too

[unique mural]

does some1 know, how many asc. skill points we will have? 🙂

[glossy hearth]

anyone know if they mentioned casting a persistant skill (like fire storm) on weapon swap is snapshotting the used weapon after swaping away from it?

[scenic ivy]

8

[knotty spruce]

real as fuck

[unique mural]

Sure`? Damn.. thats a lot. Thanks!

[cerulean bear]

Its 4 main nodes so focus on those

[scenic ivy]

Yeah. Note that you have to take the travel nodes as well. So it's 4 notables in total

[unique mural]

ahhh great. Thanks again 🙂 Now im spinning the wheel of fortune lol

[terse pendant]

Thanks for clarifying. Seems my plan to do a Gemling Legionnaire minion build will use around 24 nodes to get around the tree. Though, I suppose they aren't wasted, as I imagine raw stats are still quite useful.

[sharp glade]

gemling summoner sounds like a meme, like champion summoner in poe 1

[cerulean bear]

if you grab double stat bonuses then its not bad at all

[iron basin]

pathfinder poison minions

[sharp glade]

doesnt work

[silent prawn]

how do you know?

[sharp glade]

pathfinder poison doubling node only applies to your poisons not minion poisons

[terse pendant]

When I saw Gemling, I thought it could make a pretty fun minion build. I guess we shall see, as that is what I plan to do for my first character.

[glacial raven]

lol I'm also planning to go gemling summoner

specifically SRS gemling

[terse pendant]

SRS?

[pale anchor]

any toughts regarding blood mage minion cu cks?

[glacial raven]

summon raging spirit, only called raging spirit here

[sharp glade]

0 synergy

[raw flower]

Yup. Don't. Play infernalist.

[pale anchor]

rly?

why is that

[cerulean bear]

better support with srs minions and the hell hound

[glacial raven]

I plan to go incendinary shot and raging spirit for full uptime on SRS

[sharp glade]

apparently at endgame we can have about 20 skeletons

[glacial raven]

and just fire/burn support

[sharp glade]

doesnt work need to be spell not attack

[cerulean bear]

also skele archers with the gas clouds will explode if youre running fire stuff

[raw flower]

There's pretty much nothing minion related on Bloodmage. Infernalist has additionnal spirit (vital for perma minions), offers a minion skill defensively interesting, good defensive options.

[olive tide]

incendiary shot wont proc srs

[terse pendant]

Interesting. So, you are going to primarily still use crossbows?

[glacial raven]

aw

[raw flower]

I cannot stress enough, if you wanna focus on minions, DO NOT PICK BLOODMAGE, it's a trap, you'll have a bad time.

[cerulean bear]

blood mage just gets strong defensive layers through leech, progenesis, and a massive life pool

but no damage bonuses

[fast slate]

do totems count as minions?

[sharp glade]

progenesis and leech are her strongest nodes

[raw flower]

No.

[fast slate]

what about as allies then?

[cerulean bear]

if you aren't investing into crit

[pale anchor]

@raw flower so how should i pick ascendency notes in order as infernalist

[olive tide]

progensis seems insane for bloodmage.. probably the only reason to pick it.. unless u want to make mobs bleed from spells

[sharp glade]

nah 1% crit multi per 40 life is pretty bad, even assuming 4k hp at endgame its onyl 100% increased

progenesis is insane tho

[cerulean bear]

I think I'd go 10-3-7-9

[cerulean bear]

if you go mom then progenesis is wasted

[sharp glade]

...why would you go mom on bloodmage

[cerulean bear]

also the goal is to stay overleached for double effect from gorespikes

[cerulean bear]

mom archmage with lifetap

[sharp glade]

sounds terrible

[cerulean bear]

no longer manage mana costs whatsoevere

[scenic ivy]

You'd have to path through altered flesh to get to beidat. So you wouldn't be able to get both pyro and seething

[olive tide]

if chaos res is relatively easy to cap then i think the infernalists number 1 ascendancy point is a sleeper.

[sharp glade]

it probably wont be

[formal meadow]

Anyone else think infernalist is spread a bit thin?

[cerulean bear]

oh right misread

[sharp glade]

altered flesh will be a tough point to get to beidat

[glacial raven]

ok so basically i need to put a cast on ignite on the incindenary shot with a fire spell inside

[sharp glade]

20% of phys taken as chaos

[raw flower]

I'd recommend 10, 1, 3 and 4. Try to get +% to maximum fire resistance to optimize Altered Flesh. Stack life for defense and spirit stacking. At some point, try to get good es gear for the last ascendancy point (which should be really endgame, so no worry when you start). EDIT: having good chaos res will also be a must when picking the 4th ascendancy point. Do not pick it if you're not ready. No rush.

[sharp glade]

oof

[silent prawn]

but 20% less phys

[cerulean bear]

10-1-3-4 then

[sharp glade]

infernalist I will go hellhound->altered flesh->beidat's will, and then either pyromantic pact or beidat's hand if ES is worth investing in

[silent prawn]

with CI it is just 20% less dmg

[fleet turtle]

invoker's "meta skills gain 35% more energy" what does energy mean in this context?

[olive tide]

bro honestly im considering 10, 1, 7, 8 for infernalist.. but im so worried the hellhound just dies over and over

[sharp glade]

the hellhound seems like the strongest node

[neat dew]

https://tenor.com/view/we-do-a-little-speculation-we-do-a-little-speculation-gif-sharks-office-speculation-gif-24940290

[cerulean bear]

Pyromantic pact on a minion character is pretty worthless

[raw flower]

It's okay, it will spawn again on its own.

[sharp glade]

it can let you cast without caring about mana

[cerulean bear]

you can give it supports as well

[olive tide]

yes.. but 4 sec reload means ur not getting that 20% for 4 sec every time it dies.. could be a gamble

[cerulean bear]

cast what? as a minion character you don't do squat. Thats the point xD

[sharp glade]

curses?

[raw flower]

Energy is a resource integrated into most meta gems, usually you gain energy via the trigger and something happens when max energy is reached.

[cerulean bear]

i guess

[unreal girder]

I mean, dont you still cast curses, bone shit, that minion sacrifice stuff etc?

[sharp glade]

^

offerings too

[cerulean bear]

but enough to warrant needing that much mana?

[scenic ivy]

and fire spells if you want to have SRS

[bold raft]

Or you can forget all that and cosplay as a sorcerer using all fire spells lol

[unreal girder]

probably not

[sharp glade]

ppl in betas have said mana is rly tough

[raw flower]

Nobody knows the survivability of minions in endgame, but if your hellhound supported dies over and over, the whole minion build is in trouble, not just the hellhound ^^

[cerulean bear]

the whole point of the node is to invest in fire res to mitigate the downside and then keep cycling

for those who spend alot of mana

[glacial raven]

wait, DD is a fire spell

[cerulean bear]

its physical isn't it

[sharp glade]

no its fire

but no aoe or projectile

so no srs summon

[cerulean bear]

its both

[silent prawn]

what is "High" in terms of mana or life?
90%?

[glacial raven]

it is aoe

[sharp glade]

top 35% i think

[cerulean bear]

what do you mean?

[raw flower]

Getting more spirit through life scaling is definitly the best node for summoners. Spirit is everything.

[raw flower]

65% onwards

[silent prawn]

ok thanks

[sharp glade]

from the endgame showcase video we see an endgamei nfernalist with 3.5k hp and 560 spirit. whihc meanas he got about 140 spirit from it

[cerulean bear]

basicly the opposite of low

[olive tide]

DD wont proc SRS? i think it does.

[silent prawn]

it is a fire spell

[glacial raven]

ye it should

[cerulean bear]

it should

[sharp glade]

you need radius to proc srs

[raw flower]

He got exactly 140. 3500/25.

[glacial raven]

SRS -> cast on minion death -> Detonate dead

[cerulean bear]

which it is

[sharp glade]

best to just use flammability with aoe investment

[cerulean bear]

detonate dead has a radius of 2.6m

[olive tide]

as long as its a spell and has fire tag itll proc srs

[sharp glade]

i rounded the numbers

go watch the video

i am not allowed ot post it here

[cerulean bear]

This means bloodmage archmage would actually make sense then

[raw flower]

I mean, 140 spirit is incredible for a summoner.

[glacial raven]

but maybe I'll just do a funny Volcano spam SRS

[sharp glade]

140 out of 560ish

[olive tide]

volcano isnt in the game yet

[sharp glade]

and you give up a lot of survivability for it

[cerulean bear]

by not having a shield?

[sharp glade]

not having 25% of your life

[glacial raven]

so basically the poe2skills website is trash for making builds?

[raw flower]

That depends, minions can be considered survivability too.

[sharp glade]

you cant make builds yet we dont knwo enough

[olive tide]

theres a couple druid and huntress spells that are mixed in unfortunately

[glacial raven]

sure i can,

[sharp glade]

in path of exile max hit is all that matter

[glacial raven]

it just won't be guaranteed to work

[sharp glade]

oneshots are the main enemy, especially when one mistake = pinnacle boss lost

[unreal girder]

who knows how itll go in poe2 tho

[raw flower]

In poe 1 indeed, apparently the 2 is more about attrition (which is why you only have 1 portal).

[unreal girder]

poe1 oneshots are because of enemy creep more than anything

[cerulean bear]

also why recovery is so much more valuable

[sharp glade]

i am willing ot bet its goign to be very similar to poe 1. Oneshots everywhere.

[unreal girder]

and because we cant die any other way due to sustain

[pale anchor]

Is someone planing playing titan?

[cerulean bear]

highly doubt that

[unreal girder]

nobody, just you

[pale anchor]

sadge

[sharp glade]

we will see but i am very sure its gonna go that way. The devs dont change

[unreal girder]

btw, is it weird that I plan to do witch hunter bleed, and swap bow for clear and Xbow for bossing?

[olive tide]

its ok, im the only deadeye enjoyer

[cerulean bear]

being shoehorned into certain design was the limitation of poe 1

they made poe 2 to get out of that design space

[olive tide]

everyone sleeping on ice shot and icy salvo

[pale anchor]

must feels bad to be bow bow cu ck

[sharp glade]

its more complicated than that but ok

poe 2 has logout macro as well I think?

at least it does for bosses

[raw flower]

Don't forget you have access to pure DR via hellhound, es scaling through beidat's hand, and phys mitigation through altered flesh. Defense is a big thing with the infernalist.

[unreal girder]

I feel like everybody knows deadeye is very good, we just kinda "been there done that"

[sharp glade]

yes but you lose 25% of hp

for the spirit

[sterile latch]

did you ride a rhoa though ?

[sharp glade]

it kinda offesets the hellhound dr completely

[raw flower]

I know,, just saying the downside feels like a fair trade off, having more than a sceptre implicit worth of spirit will be hella huge

[sharp glade]

Es scaling remains to be seen ow god it is in poe 2

[cerulean bear]

this assumes you're going pure life

[unreal girder]

is the rhoa even in yet?

plus anybody can run it if it is

[olive tide]

fairly certain its only for rangers

[raw flower]

Life scaling is almost entirely str/levels/gear, but es has awesome % nodes.

[sterile latch]

only rangers benefits from it

[unreal girder]

jonathan verbatim said it's just a skill gem

not even

anyone with ranged attacks does

[sharp glade]

a unique called midnight bargain does something similar in poe 1 and noone uses it. More minions for reserved life

[raw flower]

And since stacking life grants you both spirit and es, it's a no brainer imo.

[sharp glade]

we will see if ES can be good enough to keep you alive

[olive tide]

other ppl can ride it but cant shoot from it from what i understand.. but not even trying to mess with it tbh, unless its nuts

[sterile latch]

and i'm 95% sure he also said verbatim "only deadeye /pathfinder benefits from it"

[cerulean bear]

you're giving up a unique slot for that though

err weapon slot

[sharp glade]

and you are giving up an ascendancy node for the other thing too, potahto potayto

[unreal girder]

No, what he said is "it only gives benefit to ranged attacks"

He literally said you could use it as a melee warior it just wouldnt do anythint

[wintry ingot]

Any1 know if demonic form is %max life or current life?

[cerulean bear]

theres a massive difference betweena weapon slot and an ascendancy point

[cerulean bear]

max life would make more sense

otherwise the reservation node incentivize a low life playstyle with demon form

[worthy dagger]

does this turn all energy into power charges or am I tripping

[cerulean bear]

and stacking infinitely

[sharp glade]

the thing in poe 2 maps from what they have said so far, is that if you can logout in time, you still have 6 portals to get back into the map (as long as you are not in a bossroom) if you die then the map is gone. So max hit is gonna be super important to avoid those dmg spikes. Its why bloodmage progenesis is so good.

[muted charm]

% max life. Reservation doesn't take away from max life

[raw flower]

Really different magnitudes. MB gives +1 to a few types of minion, which you already have between 5 to 13 on a good build, for losing 30% of your life and preventing you from going CI. Furthermore, it takes the spot of an awesome wand. There, it's an ascendancy point, so there's no gear trade off, and you can presumably get 150 to 200 spirits which is easily going to be a third or more of your minion count.

[muted charm]

'you also cant gain adaptive amounts of spirit

its a you do or you dont thing

[unreal girder]

Doesnt logging out put you back where you were

[sharp glade]

there is a trade off with the ascendancy point. Instead of Beidat's will you could have gone for the 20% fire damage aura node

[muted charm]

so counterpoint.

That's stupid

it also lets ou get spirit on every item

and you can just go MoM+es anyways

[raw flower]

That's 4 points...

[muted charm]

Mom is being pushed as the resolute/precise technique of int

A good majority of builds will take it

[sharp glade]

hellhound+pyromantic pact+20% fire aura+altered flesh

[fleet blaze]

which class/ascend is going to be most like Slayer from POE1 in your opinion?

[sharp glade]

and not have to reserve anything

[vernal ermine]

titan most likely.

[sterile latch]

ok so did you ride a rhoa already ? :d

[cerulean bear]

I think warbringer will be closer than titan

[fleet blaze]

I wanna go a beefy tanky life leechy melee'er

[wintry ingot]

Ah, gotcha, then maybe Eternal Youth is a play to counteract demonic form, as long as you prevent health loss I’m thinking

[cerulean bear]

titan reminds me more of berserker than anything

[unreal girder]

No?

[hoary bolt]

titan is titan ya know

[cerulean bear]

sirgog just posted a video about warbringer imploding impacts

node looks interesting if the numbers are right

[sterile latch]

see, Deadeye is cool § not like the caster / titan stereotype are so much more original either :d

[sharp glade]

as an aside capping chaos res to make good use of altered flesh sounds like its gonna be hard

[muted charm]

theres a lot more levers to buff/nerf ascendanices now

[raw flower]

You are entitled to your opinion, but I definitly think you're missing out on what makes infernalist so great for minion builds. You'll have a bad time with pyromantic pact, trying to balance it out to have good uptime on seething body is gonna be a pain, you'll miss out on max spirit which is crucial...

[fleet blaze]

ty ill check it out.

[unreal girder]

They arent, but they havent been explicitly in poe1

[sharp glade]

i am saying the spirit reservation life node has a tradeoff

is it really better than 20% mroe dmg? and 33% more hp?

idk

we will see

[left grail]

infernalist minions without the spirit node seems like a bad idea if trying to optimize damage.

[muted charm]

hellhound is absurd

its a sentinel of radiance thats supportable with no donwisde

[livid hamlet]

Can someone explain the weapon swap mechanic to me ? How good are the additional weapon swap points ?

[sharp glade]

hellhound is rly good because it ignites the enemies, letting you use immolatin on your main minions

[muted charm]

weve seen its move speed its not slow as shit like radiance either

[sharp glade]

on top of everything else

[raw flower]

No one says otherwise, of course it's a trade off, but it's so good... I'd understand arguing over when it's a good time to pick beidat's hand, i'd pick beidat's will as a third point without thinking.

[edgy forge]

Do Gore Spike and Sunder the Flesh (Blood Mage nodes) apply to minions?

[sharp glade]

again, 25% reserved life is a steep price

[cerulean bear]

no

[raw flower]

That we agree on

[sharp glade]

especially in a 1 portal endgame meta

we will see how it works out

[left grail]

not disagreeing with that, but between pact only for the 20% extra damage (which isn't actually a more multiplier unless you deliberately avoid all other sources of damage as extra) and spirit, I'd personally pick spirit based on what's currently known.

[sharp glade]

might be good for trial of the sekhema farming builds, where actual hp isnt so importnt

[muted charm]

also ignites are probably the ailment that stacks

considering their base magnitude is 25%

[sharp glade]

no ginties doesnt stack

[muted charm]

which is less thhan live poison

[silent prawn]

it allows to build around additional elements for example.
They are not extra, if you know PoE1 they are basically quest reward points

[cerulean bear]

aren't all ailments base 25%?

[muted charm]

did they confimr

?

[cerulean bear]

ive seen bleed poison and ignite all at 25%

[muted charm]

where?

[cerulean bear]

don't have the source ofcourse, but thats what I saw

[muted charm]

anyuways

all ailments stack via "Methods"

either way

[cerulean bear]

none implicitly stack but are there sources of stacking bleed and ignite?

[muted charm]

jonathan had said there was a way to stack them all so i'd assume the ignite nodes have stuff like poison

[cerulean bear]

thats good to know

[muted charm]

are you sure they're all 25 though

that doesn't seem right

bleed has an inherent upside

[cerulean bear]

thats what I remember seeing

yeah that you can aggravate it

[mild pebble]

Any theories on which ascendancy will work best for an essence drain/contagion caster?

[cerulean bear]

#2┃general message

[muted charm]

lots of assumptions need to be made

[livid hamlet]

I mean i was thinking specifically from the witchhunter ascendancy.

i'm thinking probably just going witchhunter it seems decent baseline strength and balance of everything around

[muted charm]

we don't know how non ailment dots scale primarily

is the biggest problem

[livid hamlet]

And just pew pew pew

[muted charm]

they may even crit

[cerulean bear]

Thats the one for ignite

[muted charm]

for all we know

[sharp glade]

even if minions suck, i want to walk around with a squad

[hidden siren]

decimating strike and witchbane looks like it could be great for bosses

[cerulean bear]

You see that link I posted?

[muted charm]

yeah

poison explicitly says it doesn't stack though

[fleet blaze]

yea i mean, i think it's pretty obvious just from a dev perspective that POE2 armour calcs are not going to be the same as POE1 especially when including a node like imploding impacts. sure it 'might' break the game but it'll be hotfixed within the week. so while i get the sentiment i don't think it's going to be as dramatic as this guy is making it.

[muted charm]

that's what weirds me out

[cerulean bear]

ofcourse, but the question is at what point do they stop it. The theme of armour break is pretty solid and if youre class negates a major defensive layer to an enemy and then adds say 30% more damage on top of that, thats pretty solid

[livid hamlet]

Yeah decimating strike and witchbane for bossing and pops for clear, that feels like a pretty strong setup

[cerulean bear]

defensive support exists as well, so it could be interesting

[muted charm]

@cerulean bear do we have poisons damage number somewhere?

[cerulean bear]

it shows on the wiki currently, but I don't remember where I saw it. Thats the one I'm most confident is 25% though

[terse pendant]

How well does PoE generally handle sub-optimal builds? As I did play much PoE 1, I never got to the end-game. Can I reasonably doof around and still do alright?

[cerulean bear]

we don't know for this one

its still so early

[hidden siren]

ur going to have to take culling strikes so ur guaranteed to deal 10% max hp easily

[livid hamlet]

In PoE it was pretty brutal tbh

[hidden siren]

really good for pinnacle bosses

[fleet blaze]

yee yee i like the class and appreciate the @ to my request. was just pointing out i dont think it's going to literally break the game as he suggests.

[sterile latch]

badly handled, but this one has better recommandations

[cerulean bear]

Yeah I agree too.

[sharp glade]

from how unforgiving the devs have said even the campaign is now....

[hidden siren]

10%-35% potential max hp dmg is insane

[normal jungle]

Does Maxroll website will have builds you think?

I'm new to PoE I don't know which website I can check for builds

[livid hamlet]

@hidden siren yeah and witchbane gives me tankiness as an option, outside of phase shifts if i can keep up the damage.

Now the question is what the hell am i doing there

Probably still crossbows but staves look kinda cute

[cerulean bear]

Because only half the classes are in right now, theres also alot less options for players so what we currently have should be a little more robust

hopefully

[hidden siren]

im going all in on xbow

[livid hamlet]

everyone is new to PoE, you can check fextralife since they had an earlier start, but just discover things on your own, it's more fun that way

[sharp glade]

i am gonna use a scepter and a shield

[livid hamlet]

everyone will suck at the start

[cerulean bear]

if their wiki was released from the hackers

[hidden siren]

base ms on merc sucks so unless u build defenses i like to stay ranged

[sharp glade]

not really, if you understand poe 1 its probably gonna be easy to figure out poe 2

[hidden siren]

merc can fire while moving right

[livid hamlet]

i understood PoE1 decently and i as far as PoE2 i don't get shit

[sharp glade]

yes because very little is revealed xD

[livid hamlet]

That's fair

[maiden karma]

Everyone can attack while moving

[livid hamlet]

but still a new joiner doesn't need to figure out all the mechanics

[hidden siren]

im just hoping base merc doesnt get nerfed bc of all the gemlin summon builds people want to do

[sharp glade]

dont fear nerfs

[livid hamlet]

you can get to maps on first character if you just took every life node and got every resistance and put the biggest multiplier into your sockets

[sharp glade]

if its going to happen its going to happen

just enjoy your playstyle and the game

[livid hamlet]

now resistances aren't as important, life isn't on the tree and skill gems are a mess

[silent prawn]

witchhunter doesn't get extra points. he gets to place 20 more points in weapon sets instead of the normal tree passsive

[livid hamlet]

well not a mess but unknown

[livid hamlet]

yeahh i'm aware, i just don't know how valuable that is

[sharp glade]

there is no way resistances dont end up just as important as in poe 1, regardless of what the devs promise

its impossible to balance elemental damage for characters with 50% and 75% res

[livid hamlet]

For endgame sure, but they said early it's not as important

[muted charm]

@cerulean bear can't see poison/bleeds number anywhere

[silent prawn]

it would depend how much "split dmg" you want to do.
like more points on grenades and bolts

[cerulean bear]

They have to balance content around some sort of resistance

[sharp glade]

poe 1 resistances dont really matter because the game is too easy

[livid hamlet]

That's why i liked last epoch resistance, still important but not as much because the calculation was just different

[sharp glade]

in campaign

[livid hamlet]

Tell that to my first character who couldn't get past brine king

[maiden karma]

DB hasn't had any new gem info for 3 days now

[livid hamlet]

i had like 1100 HP tornado shot deadeye

[sharp glade]

merveil is harder than brine king

[muted charm]

though from what weve heard

sources of ailment effect of all varieties are going to be massive

[livid hamlet]

brine king has way more oportunities to mess up before you get there

[muted charm]

so i wouldn't put it past us to be hitting 100% shocks

[livid hamlet]

you only say that because you know poe1

[muted charm]

100% poisons 100% ignites

[sharp glade]

to hit a high chance of applying the ailment

you need to do a lot of the corresponding dmg type as well

[terse pendant]

Thanks. Guess we will see how my planned build works. I can always make a new character if it is a flop.

[sharp glade]

you cant ignite with 1dmg hits like in poe 1

[livid hamlet]

No plans, we yolo it

well xbows and witchhunter is some plan i gues

[sharp glade]

also

GGG may say there are no "life nodes" on the tree

but im pretty sure str attribute nodes will end up being exaclty that

[hidden tartan]

Anyone knows if Elemental storm hits enemies or is it similar to Vortex in Poe 1, so it's not affected by penetration?

[livid hamlet]

I mean str giving some pity life

is not comparable to what you had before on the tree

[frigid hill]

If we have a totem out and weapon swap to a non-mace weapon, is the totem disabled/unsummoned?

[livid hamlet]

if the calculation is the same, you will get what 300 str from tree ? That's 150 life, an equivalent of decent body armor

previously 100% increased was a benchmark for anything non 6 portals

[fathom folio]

Is it 9 skills total, or 9 skill gems total?

For example, could I have 9 skills from gem + X skills from items and ascendancies? Or do skills from items and ascendancies also "eat up" a slot?

[cerulean bear]

https://youtu.be/LRL30Ib9RIU?si=0RCOIFZp0crEUI__&t=296

[sharp glade]

it htis

hits

[raw flower]

2 life per 1 str. Not pity life. If a node gives 30 str, that's 60 life. Nothing to scoff at.

[cerulean bear]

timestamped

[sharp glade]

i cant post the tooltip 🤐

[sharp glade]

thats crazy....

2 life per 1 str....

[raw flower]

9 skill GEMS

[fathom folio]

Sweet, thought so but wasnt 100% sure. That's nice

[raw flower]

So you can have more skills.

[terse pendant]

Yeah. My general plan is to do a scepter Gemling minion build. So, it is going to be a bit questionable. lol.

[livid hamlet]

oh i thought it was the oposite.
THen yeah str might be necessary but you still probably won't get more like 250 life from tree ( just spitballing ) which isn't that much compared to impact of PoE1 life wise

[sharp glade]

an endgame character we saw had like 3.5k hp

[hidden tartan]

I mean are you sure? Because all other abilities like lightning storm, ball lightning, have specifically Written "Hits Enemies" while for Elemental storm it says "Deals damage every 0.25 seconds" not "Hits enemies every 0.25 seconds" ?

[sharp glade]

deals X dmg means it hits

[livid hamlet]

what setup tho , we know nothing about the defensive layers

[sharp glade]

infernalist

[wanton juniper]

Would it be crazy to Not go slams with Titan? Maybe the little passive boost and the stun perks. I don't know what id do yet for aoe though

[livid hamlet]

how armor works, what avoidence there are

[hidden tartan]

100% sure?

[livid hamlet]

3.5K pathfinder can be immortal in PoE1

[raw flower]

The rare %life nodes might be really good. Stacking attributes does seems strong for that reason.

[muted charm]

I'm a bit worried ggg over corrected with ailments rn ngl

[sharp glade]

i am saying the 3.5k nmber to give some perspective how much the str flat life will be

[cerulean bear]

like as a nerf or buff?

[outer marlin]

Is it gonna be worth going freeze for storm weaver or is shock going to be much better?