Betas are fun
#🔌│tech
latent mural
well, only if they work as intended
latent mural
well
pale sigil
All I do is discord and YouTube
latent mural
you are coming from an iphone 6s
latent mural
2016
battery life should be vastly improved
samsungs screens back then already were pretty decent, so idk about that
pale sigil
Battery life was the main reason
It was like £50 to repair
Couldn’t be assed
Whenever my current phones battery died in say 2 years I will then
wheat plume
They said that most beta ROM users just wanted the new features and didn't give much feedback
solar hinge
I stay away from beta software on my daily driver :D
fallow bison
Beta really is only any good for a company when the user agrees that they send feedback when a crash / instability occurs. Most users just get the beta for the extra / early features, and don't send feedback to the devs.
I respec xiaomi for quiting beta builds like dat, thats a big step
zenith sonnet
750€ for a 3950X x2
200-300€ for a good X570 board x2
300-400€ for 32 GiB DDR4 3600 x2
200€ for a good M.2 SSD x2.5
600-800€ for a good display x2
120€ for O11 x2
200€ good PSU x1
200-500€ for cooling x2
This is getting out of hand, fuck
I need too think about that again
I can't reasonably spend 10k on hardware this year
But neither do I wanna buy crap I'm not happy with
timid chasm
Why x2
solar hinge
Is ram still that expensive?
timid chasm
Definitely not here
Well for 2 sets of 32gb sure
But that logic doesn't follow suite
solar hinge
Ahh right x2
timid chasm
Cause 750 is 1 3950x
solar hinge
Drunk german I guess
feral jolt
how do you get 200-500 for cooling
unless you are running blocks and loops thats pretty difficult
zenith sonnet
Well, I need two rigs 😐
timid chasm
but why
zenith sonnet
I got a wife 😓
latent mural
tbh
pcie 3.0 nvme is so fast that it makes very little difference
and if you want the best pice 4 nvme wait for samsung
fickle ore
lower latency with pcie 4
reef patrol
M.2 is not a standard for speed, it is a connector standard
It is either M.2 SATA or M.2 NVME.
R333333333333333
latent mural
ye
fickle ore
ehm
fickle ore
I know this, but I suspected he was gonna get m2 sata
latent mural
why did you think that
fickle ore
I dunno, brain fart
reef patrol
Honestly NVME isn't a must for gaming.
latent mural
if you spend that kind of money you should get it as a boot drive
fickle ore
Anyway get m.2 nvme, on X570, this is because the m2 nvme is straight to cpu without chipset in between. Dunno about the pci-e slots whether that one is for storage
and conflicts probably with gpu
if its pcie4
latent mural
x570 is pcie 4.0 only
reef patrol
Focus on price and size is what I say. I have NVME as boot in one machine and SATA SSD in another. Nigh impossible to tell apart loading and response times in a blind test for daily use.
reef patrol
If you can get an NVME at s small premium? Sure. But if you can grab a larger SSD for the same price, do that.
fickle ore
if he spend 10k on PC he should get nvme for boot imo 😄
wheat plume
apparently Windows 10 now prevents the google chrome installer working
-.-
even if you run as an admin
wheat plume
oo
still cave
zenith sonnet
To be more specific, I want M.2 , NVMe, PCIe SSDs
1 TB oughta be enough
I really dunno what those cost atm
Samsung 980 Pro or whatever it is nowadays
Probably
agile summit
Honestly I have 960 pro drives in
Unless you're running VMs, just do EVO drives
Way better pricing almost as fast and the difference in endurance is minor
Hell, commit sudoku and do a 256gb pro drive and as large of a QVO drive as you can afford
Get 4tb of SSD storage that way
Also I spent less than 5k on a threadripper machine with a max spec mobo last year
So don't overspend for literally no reason
I bought this because I was working hard and wanted to
No one needs this for personal only
Hell, i'd like to see benches between 3950x and TR1950x
I love my zenith extreme board
ashen spindle
tbf a lot of TR's benefits are more pcie lanes and such, not just higher core count
agile summit
Yes which is why I bought a TR1900x threadripper setup
latent mural
oof
agile summit
lol this was over a year ago
latent mural
is that even better than a 1800x
zenith sonnet
What are threadripper benefits?
agile summit
I paid about $150 over the cost of a 1800x setup for my TR1900x and zenith extreme
Way more PCIe lanes
latent mural
quad channel memory I guess
agile summit
And quad channel memory
zenith sonnet
One of the reasons I got the 5820K over the 4790K back then
agile summit
I can fill this thing with cards and storage beyond any reason
I'm only running 2x960 pro 512gb in raid 0 and 2tb of 970 evo
But I've considered running more later
I have had zero issues with it
Built it and it booted on the first try
That was nice
Zero RMAs
The other thought is that this will retire into being my home server for a long time after I retire it off of my desk
So next chip is going to be at least 32 threads
If not 64
zenith sonnet
Would you plan a CPU for 2, 3, 4, 5 years?
feral jolt
Ideally there would be a major leap in CPU architecture within 2 years
Intel architecture has been roughly the same for a few too many years
latent mural
4 to be exact
solar hinge
just catching up?
i think with zen 2 they're going past them.
zen 1 was catching up
zen 1+ was about there
feral jolt
Single core performance has been a good amount weaker until the 3000s
AMD would be a no brainer if everything was optimized
Cores themselves need a big performance leap
I though 7nm would bring it
Maybe next year
zenith sonnet
Single core is about 14% stronger now with the 3000s
Or whatever benchmarks will tell
That's what AMD got vs the 9900K
So at least that comparison should hold true
feral jolt
GPU performance has gone up a few hundred % since 2013. CPUs are just adding more cores and claiming hundreds of % performance increase when the reality is 10-15% a year
Give me my Moores law
Why is my 6700k still relevant
pale sigil
Ye it’s sad
zenith sonnet
My 290X from 2013 is still relevant, too
GPU didn't make hundreds of % either
And most of that is more cores, too
wheat plume
feral jolt
but multicore gpu can actually be fully utilized
and 4k 60+ fps gaming is not possible on a card from 2013
1080p is still popular thats why the 290x is still relevant
zenith sonnet
My 6 core CPU can also be fully utilized
DX12 or Vulkan have no issues hitting >90% CPU usage
zenith sonnet
X570 looks damn good
plush summit
XDDDD
karmic grail
A new one in aus costs $250
karmic grail
Yes but if I bought this one I probably would of resold
neat oriole
Scalpers aren’t exclusively Bogen
zenith sonnet
Wait, I paid 90€ for mine
I could actually make a business buying from the Logitech store and reselling 🤔
zenith sonnet
Bought it from the Logitech store with a 40% or something coupon
You can find them a lot
wheat plume
I managed to switch someone over to Pop!_OS from a minecraft server I play on
and he loves it so much , he said its like starting a new minecraft world after so long, so many possibilities !!
reef patrol
pale sigil
lol
wheat plume
:PP
pale sigil
Ayy this background is gonna be perfect for my in screen fingerprint when my M9T comes
fallow bison
I bet the sensor is below that emblem
wheat plume
XD then youll need to add to the top of the image
fallow bison
No your not scaling the image you absolute maniac
wheat plume
best gnome extension, change my mind 😛
wheat plume
hm?
latent mural
for the same price lol
zenith sonnet
Intel has worse parts for even higher prices
latent mural
x390 is similar in price
and then you pay more for the cpu
which could get slower as more exploits get public
zenith sonnet
I'm really excited about those Ryzen benchmarks
New display to look at:
LG 27GL850
plush summit
Lg (smashyourfaceonthekeyboard)
latent mural
price?
zenith sonnet
Got nothing on price
zenith sonnet
144Hz, QHD, 1m IPS, G-Sync TM compatible (aka Freesync), HDR10 (whatever that is)
timid chasm
yeah that'll be pricey
latent mural
yep
timid chasm
probably 400+
latent mural
especially th ultrawide
timid chasm
oh for sure those are stupid expensive
zenith sonnet
I don't expect it to be more than the others
latent mural
since it is 3840 x 1600
zenith sonnet
roughly 600-800
Yeah, that one is gonna cost
But it's also G-Sync TM (the real one)
Still looking for that perfect:
27-30"
QHD+
120 Hz+
Freesync2
HDR600+
actually good performance in reviews
display
Maybe 2021
timid chasm
not familiar with it
ohhhh
def not my kinda thing
I'm sure one of these nerds guys is familiar and has a useful opinion
wheat plume
how do I answer this without knowing what the software is supposed to do? ;-;
because different software needs different testing ;-;
plush summit
Dispute the question if you think it's unfair
wheat plume
i cant , this was in the END OF YEAR EXAM
but this could be a railway management system or a freaking automatic cat food dispenser , how tf could we know?
what software do we need to give guidelines for?
ashen spindle
make it something generic, isolate causes->avoid using stuff that breakks it -> act towards fixing it
etc.
wheat plume
thats too vague
like the question
wait
that could work
step 1: Dont code it wrong
step 2: profit
done....30 marks
ugh
ashen spindle
well the question is not meant for situations like "how do you fix lnk3440 error in visual studio" but rather in a "you are a dev, and your task is to fix this system you never worked on" so what are your steps towards fixing it
its about the methodic not the exact steps you do for the exact problem
fickle ore
why there isn't a x570 highend board with least amount of extra connectors to reduce price?
I don't plan to plug anything to the chipset
;_;
ashen spindle
bc thats what you can use b450 or x470 for
ashen spindle
false, some boards can support it on the first slot via bios update and the pcie4 lanes from the cpu
ashen spindle
what do you mean with wrong ram slots
fickle ore
I saw a reddit thread where thracks confirmed no pcie 4 for x470
ram slot configuration
ehm
ashen spindle
you mean they are not in daisy chain setup? doesnt really matter for normal use
ashen spindle
beyond 3733 mhz it gives you worse performance so why go higher and you can get 3733 on x470
fickle ore
why?
ashen spindle
because the infinity fabric scales with mem clock up to that point, over it it runs in 2:1 mode, so at 4000mhz its the same as if you use 2000mhz sticks
fickle ore
I'm gonna be fucked if the new samsung 1z-nm ram process is super good
I think
with x470
ashen spindle
how so
fickle ore
Perhaps that's modified with future agesa?
ashen spindle
its something in the chip so I doubt it ever changes
fickle ore
do you have a source for that? I'd like to confirm
ashen spindle
amd slides from the e3 event
and if you want some more info on vrms from older boards https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qn3rd6N9vGM
fickle ore
problem is if I buy x470 new, I can't update the bios since I dont have 2700x for example
so its not good
ashen spindle
idk if you need to update it for just using them? not sure
fickle ore
dno
ashen spindle
even if, order it from a store nearby and tell them to update it or ask support from an online store to send one with updated bios etc.
but I'm sure you dont need to update it to just run it
then again there are msi boards where you can update it without even a cpu in the socket
but idk if that is for x570 or if older boards have that too
ashen spindle
oh, then the bios updates gigabyte had might get reversed
fickle ore
it will
latent mural
why should that even be possible?
and manufacturers like gigabyte and asus will still update those if it is possible
fickle ore
doubt it, they get agesa from AMD
ashen spindle
well you can select gen4 on some boards since the latest bios updates on some x470 boards
but obviously nobody can test if that works or is basically just different text in the bios
fickle ore
yea but not on final stable release bios
ashen spindle
no im certain its on public bios version
ah
Users today may find a PCIe 4.0 option available in their pre-X570 motherboards. However, users should expect this option to be disabled when final retail BIOSes are released to implement full performance and stability for new 3rd Gen Ryzen processors.
fickle ore
ryzen 3 has usb 3.2, 10 gbps controller on die, opposed to 3.1 5 gbps controller on ryzen 2. Wonder if that on die controller would work at 10 gbps on a x470
ashen spindle
so maybe some hacks will exists at your own risk
zenith sonnet
X470 will get a bunch of backwards upgrades, but definitely not everything, and probably with limited support
ashen spindle
yea
zenith sonnet
You'll definitely get higher quality boards with X570 though
Even if you don't use all the new I/O features
zenith sonnet
Hope we can get 'good' boards in the 200s range, though
latent mural
hopefully
ashen spindle
doubt we get many on release though
latent mural
first "future proof" plattform imo though
has great features like 10g and pcie 4.0
so will be great anyways
ashen spindle
the main boards are amd saying they are now high end aswell+ 16 core ready vrms, and if you just want to run zen2 you can use older boards
so I wouldn't be surprised if there's less than 5 good 200s boards
till we get b550
latent mural
also true
zenith sonnet
More than 600-700€ for most top end boards is already confirmed
So, it's gonna be an expensive season
ashen spindle
well we also have over 55 boards so it would be a surprise if we didn't have some above that
latent mural
thanks google
ashen spindle
latent mural
still didn't get a price for the aorus master xtreme whatever
fickle ore
prolly gonna buy 250-300 euro board for x570, just cuz its designed by amd not realtek
ashen spindle
realtek? 
sure you dont mean the chipset from asmedia?
zenith sonnet
Anyway, it's bound to be good
zenith sonnet
They even delayed the CPUs for it
fickle ore
yea asmedia
ashen spindle
eh not really, they made it bc the IO die on the chip is basically the same thing as the x570 chipset chip
fickle ore
both made in china
ashen spindle
so they increase yields by a lot
fickle ore
for example on x370 there was like 1-2ms difference between different usb ports and they were designed like shit
no assmedia for me
ashen spindle
okay but are you acutally using anything that matters if its a ms later?
ashen spindle
I mean you dont want a x370/470 bc of it so it must be something that actually hurts whatever you do?
or else I dont see the point in not getting it bc of that
fickle ore
gaming
pale sigil
Holy shit Xiaomi are shady fucks
Their promo was that the phone would sell for 299.99 on the 17th and you could pre order before.... turns out to avoid having to refund people who got it was 330 they sent out the phone a day before it was reduced.
Meaning amazon wont refund the price difference (pre order guarantee policy)
wheat plume
why pay from amazon though?
pale sigil
Because it was being sold only on Amazon
wheat plume
waht phone?
wheat plume
https://www.banggood.com/search/mi-9t.html @pale sigil
ashen spindle
I mean regardless of that, why would you pay a price you dont want to pay/expect to get lower?
wheat plume
this is the global version
wheat plume
amazon uk??
pale sigil
And under warrenty etc
Fuck buying from China and having basically no warrenty
Amazon Spain atm
wheat plume
hmmm
pale sigil
Uk soon
wheat plume
they on UK amazon too
pale sigil
Because it was implied people who buy before will get it for 299.99 reduced
Not officially
wheat plume
so xiaomi didnt know this?
pale sigil
They are the ones who pulled this shady shit
wheat plume
hmm
pale sigil
Also why the fuck do j get so much screen tear even if I limit the FPS
crimson wigeon
Because limiting the framerate does not automatically make the buffers flip during vblank, you need to enable vsync
earnest osprey
G/free sync ftw
feral jolt
yeah you need to sync up the frame draw times with the framerate to get no tearing
zenith sonnet
Or move the tear outside of visible screen space
And enjoy tear free, low latency gameplay without v/free/g sync
RTSS can do that
ashen spindle
doesnt that still need a frame for calculation so its slightly delayed compared to no vsynch off?
zenith sonnet
Nope, it does not calculate anything
You manually set an offset
And move the tear that way
I think it requires stable limited FPS to work, though
ashen spindle
https://www.reddit.com/r/nvidia/comments/9wb5d5/rtss_720_new_ssync_scanline_sync_is_a_game/ based on this it needs a one frame delay
zenith sonnet
Well, just limiting FPS in RTSS adds a frame of delay
It's still the lowest delay limiting you can do
Outside of the game engine itself
And then only if the game implements if properly...
There is no superior solution to capping the frame rate to refresh rate minus 3 with adaptive sync enabled :/
ashen spindle
depends, for most cases yes, though iirc on >144hz monitors bit more than 3fps is ideal
I'm glad I dont recall to ever had tearing issues lol
never had to cap my fps anywhere, only did it in TF2 bc it was in the performance config anyway
zenith sonnet
I rarely have
But I have way more issues with latency
Vsync for example makes me feel sick
ashen spindle
ya I can see how that can the case, I'm glad I bought the gsynch monitor model 2 years ago even it was a bit more expensive, really loved it for everything so far
zenith sonnet
I want so many things in a display now...
But there's been so much new tech, too
Doubt we'll see a decent high refresh rate Freesync with good HDR display this year
Yet
The new Aorus ticks most of my boxes
Except it's crapDR400 and the overdrive sucks
zenith sonnet
https://www.rtings.com/monitor/reviews/gigabyte/aorus-ad27qd
Another review of it
Again, excellent points on motion
The only downside really being overdrive
timid chasm
599 woooo
zenith sonnet
Can't expect perfection for that price, eh?
timid chasm
I would expect it for that price in a monitor that's 1440 but that's just me
zenith sonnet
There isn't even a Monitor with QHD and HDR1000 on the market, nvm all the other features
latent mural
I am sure samsung has a qhd qled
which would fill the spec
but was released before the ratings were a thing
the CHG70 for example
freesync 2 qled 1440p
with 144hz
no wait
wasn't hdr1000 just about peak brightness?
zenith sonnet
Nah, there's more to the spec
Just the name is following the min required peak brightness
Except HDR400
Which actually means nothing
latent mural
oh, ok
according to the page msot hdr 10 monitors are hdr500
if they clear that peak brightness
zenith sonnet
HDR500 already requries local dimming, afaik
HDR600 should be good enough for games
HDR1000 is more for TVs and watching movies than games
That close to the display, 1000 nits feels like someone blinding you with the headlight
Asus is supposed to release a 27", 4K, 144Hz, HDR1000 display
The PG27UQX, in August according to tftcentral
Though I don't exxpect it can be had for less than 3 grand...
Which is just way off the chart
Nope, August is when AUO starts making those panels
God...
I have 99 problems, but too many choices isn't one of them
feral jolt
Why are you always talking about the expensive shit most of us cant have
zenith sonnet
I just want actually good hardware
And the expensive stuff is interesting
But most of the time not actually worth the premium
Over second or third tier
feral jolt
Yeah I just made my friend a mini itx build with an i5 9400f and 1660ti and he's amazed coming from a laptop with a "7700k" and "1070" that fried at 105c
latent mural
I know that
zenith sonnet
Might have help to dust the laptops cooling ducts and reapply good TIM, though
latent mural
my "1060" struggles with many games
feral jolt
Yeah it's just not worth it to game on a laptop. He's going to college across the country and I made him something he could bring home in a suitcase for month long breaks
feral jolt
Zotac? 4 euro
zenith sonnet
Less than 600, for sure
latent mural
ye
zenith sonnet
Is it new with warranty?
feral jolt
I could buy a b stock evga 1080ti for 629 dollars
zenith sonnet
Well, consider it a VII with worse drivers and so warranty
And set your price after that
zenith sonnet
Although, the 5700XT is like 15% slower and 450€ MSRP
latent mural
and I have a vega 64, so it would only be a slight upgrade
zenith sonnet
Much better deal
latent mural
true
feral jolt
5700xt should improve massively with driver updates
latent mural
if it gets any kind of decent cooler at least
zenith sonnet
Nitro+ will probably be decent as always
latent mural
if we get one, likely
feral jolt
The architecture still is new and unoptimized
zenith sonnet
Anyway, atm it's THE card to get
latent mural
that is the problem, you don#t know how good release drivers are
I am glad they ditched hbm
zenith sonnet
Probably good, this time :p
They showed a lot at E3
latent mural
so much cheaper now
zenith sonnet
The VII had good drivers end of Feb
latent mural
but rip the insane ocs of vega
zenith sonnet
So, wasn't too long
And the only thing that was really broken was Wattman
With cards drawing close to 300W instead of 200-220W
AMD feeding the memes
feral jolt
Are they even making a reference card for 5700xt
zenith sonnet
Would buy for the top binning silicon
feral jolt
Single fan? 😂
latent mural
blower
zenith sonnet
It just works
zenith sonnet
Often not ideal, but it works almost under every condition
zenith sonnet
They did reduce noise by about 10 dB
feral jolt
Wouldn't surprise me if they were holding all the top binning silicon for later
zenith sonnet
So they somewhat upgraded their blower cooler
latent mural
the anniversary ed is definetley binned
so if you want to watercool it you should get those
zenith sonnet
inb4 apple buys all the top binned silicon
feral jolt
Still could be B bins and not A bins
zenith sonnet
Doesn't look like it this time, though
latent mural
amd usually doesn't bin like that
it is complete luck usually
only when they themselves make a special version
like the 580
zenith sonnet
Is there like, a ranking for VIIs?
latent mural
?
feral jolt
Lisa is doing new things though
zenith sonnet
Wonder if I got lucky with my silicon
feral jolt
Never know what to expect these days
I sure hope I have an AMD processor in my next gaming build
latent mural
can't complain about mine personally
finally I can play fh4 and watch a youtube video at the same time
feral jolt
I'm going to buy whatever is the best deal that has top end single core performance
3600x looks nice
latent mural
well, you know the drill about new hardware
zenith sonnet
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1Iim9e_ejX3nkgxLIZ3vLu1seQ1m0lDTKUhClJpAO-Gk/edit#gid=0
According to this list
One of my cards is on the good side of average, the other one top 5%
😃
feral jolt
More importantly I want a very nice full featured mobo
zenith sonnet
Wonder how many 'under the hood' improvements it has
feral jolt
I really wish I had sonic studio 3 instead of sonic studio 2
The difference is big
I tried as hard as I could to hack it over to my z170
latent mural
as long as you don't have one of those boards where the networking drivers suddenly decides to eat your ram
my msi z170 had one of those
feral jolt
I might just have to get a creative soundcard
latent mural
so I used it without the killer network driver stuff
feral jolt
Msi is a brand I've come to hate after owning two of their products
latent mural
when they had an update they would move all the ram in the unassignable pool
otherwise the board was good
cost me 80€
bios was decent
carried my 6600k to 4.5 without voltage changes
at decent temps
all I could ask for
feral jolt
My budget msi laptop I only used for college was dead in 20 months
Dont understand how Microsoft word, excel and firefox kill a computer
My msi 770 didnt make it to 3 years
Playing battlefield 4 at 1080p killed it 😂
latent mural
Rip
zenith sonnet
MSI had their prime 15 years ago
They still make good stuff
With a lot of crap inbetween
They're just too large
feral jolt
I've come to think of msi as a shit tier brand. Zotac tier reliability
feral jolt
They seem slack on features and undercut prices as their trademark
People who dont know any better like me a few years ago might think it's the same as the one from a more reputable brand that's a few dollars more
zenith sonnet
Gigabyte, Asus, MSI, etc
They're all hit and miss
feral jolt
Give me that evga motherboard
latent mural
If they make a fully featured amd board, sure
feral jolt
I guess the top end Asus and gigabyte boards have the features
But some Asus boards are weirdly overpriced and have weird names
feral jolt
No
latent mural
Thet do lol
feral jolt
I dont believe it
latent mural
Why not
feral jolt
They are cheap and undercut
latent mural
Just because you had 2 bad products
Have you ever seen the z170 uefi from gigabyte?
And then seen what the good mainboards are for z390
zenith sonnet
Why shouldn't there be full featured AMD boards?
zenith sonnet
Oh, yeah
zenith sonnet
X570 will have freaking expensive boards
feral jolt
Built a computer for my friend with a gigabyte board once it didnt seem bad but I didnt do any stress tests and it wasn't for anything fancy
feral jolt
What should I buy from gigabyte
feral jolt
Are gigabyte GPU better than evga and have comparable warranty?
latent mural
No
zenith sonnet
I don't know
Do they have Aorus GPUs?
feral jolt
Yeah I think for like 1300 dollars
latent mural
The cheap end of gigabyte is decent
zenith sonnet
The AD27QD seems to be the best display on the market right now in its class
feral jolt
I think if I was gonna blow 1300 dollars away it would be on a 9900kf and that 500 dollar evga motherboard for it
zenith sonnet
You can spend some of the savings on a 700$ X570 board
zenith sonnet
3950X still faster single core
Let's wait benchmarks
But clock for clock the 3950X is a decent bit faster
And probably has more OC room
feral jolt
I dont think so
It's a bit faster than the 9980xe
But the 9900kf is only 480 dollars
You're thinking of the 9980xe
9900kf is the 9900k without internal graphics
With what seems like top binned silicon that reaches 5.0 on all cores
zenith sonnet
How many cores?
feral jolt
9980xe is a 3 ghz 18 core
zenith sonnet
The 9900KF?
zenith sonnet
So it actually competes with the 3800X
latent mural
Tbh the kf is usually a few € more expensive than the normal one
So it's basically useless in europe
feral jolt
I dont think the 3800x will be defeating the 9900k
zenith sonnet
But it's also 200€ cheaper and should be quite close
There's the 3900X still, and it beats the 9900k both single and multithread
I also hope reviewers use good memory
Zen 2 has 3600MHz support out of the box
feral jolt
I'd have to buy new ram if I went ryzen
zenith sonnet
Running it with 2666 because intel can't go faster wouldn't be fair
feral jolt
zenith sonnet
According to spec. OC is always an option
feral jolt
I'm at 3200 on a 6700k plug and play xmp
latent mural
Will x570 still have problems with memory over 3733mhz?
zenith sonnet
Well, that's OC
You can do benchmarks with and without OC
zenith sonnet
Not sure
3600 is probably the safe bet
feral jolt
Just bought new ram so I looked it up
zenith sonnet
And a hell of a lot more affordable
latent mural
3200 flarex for ryzen
feral jolt
Went with 3200 since theres no cheap 3466
feral jolt
Do ryzen memory controllers still hate you for having 4 dimms
zenith sonnet
LOL
3600X @ 4.5 beats the 9900KS @ 5.0
feral jolt
Sunny cove beating out the 7700k at 5.2 at only 3.7
feral jolt
S stands for slow
zenith sonnet
Guess that answers our question about whether the 3800X or the 9900KF is better
zenith sonnet
It's still running 5GHz
latent mural
And that is single thread
zenith sonnet
The cores don't change
latent mural
4c8t i7 
Since it is intel it will likely be more expensive than the 3800x too
Tbh if those are real benchmarks which aren't heavily biased intel is rip
zenith sonnet
Lower power draw for the AMD parts
feral jolt
Unless sunny cove is dirt cheap
latent mural
True
Which I heavily doubt
And still
They need to have doubled efficiency in comparison to before
zenith sonnet
And we don't even know if those Zens don't just as easily clock to 5.0
latent mural
The 9900k is pretty much the most you can get out of a consumer plattform
zenith sonnet
Oh, wait, I'm just noticing the Intel ES in there 😂
latent mural
Rip
zenith sonnet
It's way too much of an outlier
If that's true, then gg AMD
You tried :p
Although it might also just not clock past 4.0
latent mural
I wonder what the boost of the intel processors is
zenith sonnet
Who knows
latent mural
If it is capped at 4-4.5 they could still be good
feral jolt
Idk but if that's a base clock it has a lot of headroom
feral jolt
That's what the article says they did
latent mural
Ye sure
latent mural
And some real benchmarks
zenith sonnet
Easy 50% over current gen clock for clock
latent mural
I really doubt that
zenith sonnet
Maybe it reported base clock while boosting?
feral jolt
Idk I think its 10nm isn't the 9900k 14nm
feral jolt
So that's the difference
Finally new Intel architecture
God knows when it hits the market tho
latent mural
You can usually get either 30% more performance OR efficiency
And 30% more performance out of a 9900k
Means 30% more power
The 9900k was already scratching the limits in all regards
feral jolt
Looks like they went with efficiency for now so they can slowly release slightly faster processors each year 😂
latent mural
If that is the case rip intel
feral jolt
pale sigil
Ye
feral jolt
Yeah I'm aware it's a rumor
Seems realistic for 10nm Intel though
Another article says it popped up briefly on passmark
2625 single thread score
Edging out the 8700
Not quite as impressive but still it's a 15w tdp CPU putting those numbers out
earnest osprey
The thing is,
Ice lake isn't going above 15w tdp basically
Maybe a little higher, but intel was telling everyone how they couldn't get anything above mobile grade parts to work
feral jolt
Maybe renaming it sunny cove is an indication they made a breakthrough
zenith sonnet
Maybe it's a pun on how it's going to be hot as the sun if you try anything fancy
Maybe they pushed those 15W into a single core @3.7GHz
Then the result might be believable
feral jolt
U rite
They have a good year before anyone expects them to put out a product so they might come up with something
ashen spindle
well the original ice lake uArch is also different from sunny cove
sunny cove is the first uarch where they decoupled uarch from process node
feral jolt
Why is the passmark from a month ago calling the same processor ice lake while the new one calls it sunny cove 🤔
ashen spindle
original ice lake was done just like the previous ones, fit for what they wanted to use
bc it used to be ice lake chips on ice lake uarch, now ice lake is based on sunny cove
similar to how Rome is based on Zen2 for example
pale sigil
After countless hours of people moaning
Amazon refunded the difference as it was unfair
For changing the price to 299.99 meer hours after sending out pre orders for 330
latent mural
Anyone knows what is the lightest and smallest itx case that can fit a dual slot 29cm video card?
earnest osprey
Dancase DA2, that streacom one, one more I forget the name of
earnest osprey
A cpu tower cooler isn't really any lighter than an aio liquid cooler
latent mural
just a bit
I want to build (another) portable pc set up
something carry on baggage compatible
and the nice people in the airlines are now limiting carry on to 8 kilos or similar
earnest osprey
You would have to go larger to get enough clearance for both a full sized gpu and full sized cpu air cooler.
Bigger case>heavier
ashen spindle
just drill some holes into everything 
earnest osprey
Nice
latent mural
I feel like that's what i said i'll do
because i was going to do that
@latent mural Why not a laptop if you want something which is intended for moving often?
I need the most powerful cpu that fits itx
the gpu is really just for occasional fun
so a laptop isnt suitable
earnest osprey
9700k with a dual rad aio is probably your best bet
latent mural
im waiting for the 16 core zen
zenith sonnet
+1
latent mural
i have a 6700k now
latent mural
yes
16 cores is probably as high as I'd need to go
I don't think you can have that spec in a mini-itx without compromises
ashen spindle
well there is an alienware laptop with a desktop 9700k
zenith sonnet
Zen 2 is also the best option for single threaded workloads
ashen spindle
nah it does start at "only" 2300
latent mural
Check out the LC builds mini-itx builds of Optimum Tech. LTT did an mini-itx LC build as well. But even with LC, I wouldn't count on the cooling to be sufficient enough to drive that 16 core and the GPU fully, since you're also limited on space
engimia nothing that fans cant fix
And keep in mind, it is a very hard build, and it still has some compromises
works in the node 202
No, you don't have space for fans and rads, that's the thing
It's a mini itx, you stick a full-size GPU in it, 16 core isn't even going to be possible without LC
But even with LC, you still need room for those rads
Im not sure about that
- optimum tech reviewed a recently a cpu block with built in pump, you should definitely check it out
earnest osprey
There is space in some
latent mural
the new 16 core is 105W actually, that's not much
earnest osprey
Like the one with the "top hats"
latent mural
hm.. I need something light then, never mind the size
got a portable screen just now, glorious 15.6" 1080 via display port via usb
3D printed case, and hopefully you can bring it <8kg, but didn't on-board luggage have size restrictions anyway?
And yeah, I'm aware of the 105W TDP, don't even think that's close to pushing the chip at full
the size restrictions are reasonable actually
it's about the size of a medium size mATX case
ashen spindle
depending on how hardcore DIY you want to go, you could get something like an open bench table, put that into a box for carriages and just take a cooler in a seperate box
latent mural
"airport security hates him"
no test benches
Even my 8-core Ryzen 2700X goes upwards of 150W watts under full load, 16-core won't be less
at stock?
At very minor overclock, 4.05 @ all core @ 1.325V
Nowhere nearly the limits of the chip which you can take with a luckier draw and better cooling
what about undervolting was that useful?
sorry, tiny screen
latent mural
Yeah, it was. Default all core clock is 3.95Ghz all-core under heavy rendering loads. I have it +100, and it's still a bit lower than stock voltages, which were about 1.35
Temps down, clocks higher
ashen spindle
with default XFR it goes to 1.4 or 1.5 sometimes bc the cpu adjusts it, but on average ryzen vcore is 1.25v
for default setting, non oc
latent mural
What do you mean? @earnest osprey It's well within the safe limits for Zen. In fact, even for long term, Zen+ is up to 1.375. Zen can go even higher
earnest osprey
I'm just used to what I got on a different platform I suppose
latent mural
@ashen spindle Definitely worth to note, that this is just short term voltage on some cores, and average voltages if you monitor HWInfo is still about 1.35 on stock. Running 1.4+ on Zen+ is not safe for long term
earnest osprey
my x99 mobo can't go higher than 1.31 v
latent mural
People have reported degradation at that voltages, unless you're on Zen
ashen spindle
well yea not for longterm, but the default xfr settings do go up there sometimes and thats how they were designed
earnest osprey
Im planning on getting an 8 core ryzen 3rd gen and ocing it pretty hard
latent mural
Oh yeah, it's up to the architecture a lot
Press big X to doubt
Ryzen series 2 was pushed almost to the wall (which is good actually, once you get over the fact that you won't be able to reach much higher than what you actually bought). With clocks being boosted so much, they have probably done pretty good tuning out of the box really
For Ryzen 2 for example, I can't reach 4.2 all-core clock, and the chip is 3.7-4.2. Only golden chips get to 4.3. I'm still happy with the results I got, don't get me wrong, but don't expect "intel" levels of overclocking, their chips are actually tuned pretty well out of the factory and XFR does a great job of maximizing them. Usually if you go manual, you can get it a little bit better
ashen spindle
I'd like to know if they are well tuned, or just more limited upwards due to architecture decisions on air cooling OC
latent mural
@latent mural Regarding your build, go something like the Manta or something similar and put as much LC as you can in it. Make sure you triple check and secure your LC since you want to transport it. Good AIO will probably be your best bet in your case considering your size restrictions
Something like the H100i, or one of the other top-performing AIOs
The many VRMs on the X570 boards are mainly for the ungodly 16-core processors. If you're planning to upgrade to a Gen 3 Ryzen 7, and you already own a good B450 board, there is 0 reason to upgrade the B450 board @earnest osprey already stated by many big overclockers and reviewers, like buildzoid and etc.
ashen spindle
pcie 4 is a reason if you can make use of it
latent mural
engimia: AIO liquid cooling is a no go
I mean, I guess. But if you're changing just your CPU, you wouldn't really need PCI 4
Erm, why?
no unsealed liquids permitted in carry on
also, to a limit of 100mls
That's why I recommended AIO bro, unlike other types of liquid-cooling, it's a closed system
earnest osprey
I have a 5820k man
latent mural
sealed as in a plastic bag placed seperatelly
You cannot take the liquid in our out of the system
Unlike with custom water cooling, in which taking out the water for maintenance through a valve is an absolute must
their x-ray machines detect liquids by density
sometimes it works sometimes it doesn't though
earnest osprey
Gen 3 ryzen will be my entry to amd lol
latent mural
All custom liquid cooling is open and can leak. AIO is the closed systems, if you can take something through security it would be AIO
i know what an AIO is
but the problem is that their machines can detect liquids
it detects uniform materials
shows what's plastic, what's organic (bomb/cheese) and what's liquid
And if liquid is absolutely out of the question, you can definitely stick a full-size GPU and a cooler in the Manta, but I don't know if you're going to be able to cool the 16-core with air. Personally I prefer air myself, and was a bit disappointed when Optimum Tech mentioned that the 16-core might be LC must. But we must wait for the chip to see
i can always stick a noctua fan on the outside 🤔
ashen spindle
yeah no you can definitely cool the 16c with air
latent mural
I'll check out the manta then, thanks
zenith sonnet
It shouldn't produce much more than 105W of heat
AMDs TPD is pretty reliable, unlike intels
earnest osprey
Intel mobos have forced overclocking usually
Like stuff done on the board that makes the cpu run at a higher speed/ turbo settings
ashen spindle
nah, that was only really an issue for one generation and everyone complained so they stopped doing that
earnest osprey
Pretty sure it's still being done.
ashen spindle
dont forget some holes in the cpu and gpu 
earnest osprey
Since I have nothing amd at this point, going for x570 makes more sense to me
latent mural
@zenith sonnet Okay, so my Ryzen 2700X produces 150W+ when under full load at 4.05Ghz. Why and how do you expect, the 16-core Ryzen 3700X to be less than that at full load, with 8 full more cores? I JUST manage to cool with my Dark Rock Pro 4, which was the biggest air cooler on the market. Granted, I still have more to go on fan speed, but it only takes me a few degrees less
TPD was ruined years ago
zenith sonnet
How do you measure the heat output?
latent mural
TPD is supposed to be a measurement of heat, but nowadays it simply doesn't work. For example the "105W TDP" is more than double covered by the "250W TDP" of the Dark Rock Pro 4, but I can barely cool it at 1.325V with that cooler
And that's 1.325v, while the chip is safe up to 1.375V long-term.. so...
earnest osprey
For the whole system it's pretty easy since all the power at the wall will go into heat. From the cpu only, well, need to isolate power used by cpu, or heat output from cpu
zenith sonnet
Dunno what you did to make it draw that much power
latent mural
What do you mean?
150 watts? That's pretty normal for the chip, as I mentioned, it's not even pushed to the max
zenith sonnet
earnest osprey
Your dark rock pro is probably not operating at 250W tdp due to case temperature.
zenith sonnet
They don't even get it close to 150W under torture conditions
And it's running 1.29V there
latent mural
And if you think the 16-core will be less, you're mistaken. Just check some talks about the 105W TPD of the 16-core. It's one of the things AMD was critized about
Well 1.29 =/= 1.325
=/= 1.375. They probably weren't running 4.05 either, or they had a a very very good chip to take it that low at those clocks
earnest osprey
Cooling capacity of a cooler is dependent on how much warmer it is than the air cooling it.
latent mural
ashen spindle
around 10-15W of the tdp is also for the IO die, so the actual TDP for the cores is lower
latent mural
I have 6 case fans @earnest osprey and my case temp is 50C. Plus when I'm doing the stress tests, usually only the CPU is working, I'm doing a P95 test so GPU ain't even outputting heat
zenith sonnet
Well, you can't say TPD is wrong if you OC your chip and it draws more power than listed...
latent mural
It simply doesn't work as simple as "105W TDP chip", "250W TDP cooler", well surely it will cool it at full max at 50-60C right? Nope.
I mean, my voltages are even lower than on stock @\
zenith sonnet
Then you should look at your case airflow
earnest osprey
If the case is 50 C, getting a 10 C delta for 60 C is pretty hard.
zenith sonnet
Is TIM applied properly?
latent mural
I would be really curious to revert back to stock XFR and re-test but I can't be bothered right now
Yeah, it is and it's Kryonaut. Seriously just check some results online guys if you don't believe me
I have good and expected results for this cooler and chip
latent mural
If you want to push the even the 8-core chips to the absolute max, you're going to need some form of LC. If you want the 16-core to the full-max, it's very probable that you will need GOOD LC. If you're willing to take some sacrifices (hey, 4.05 GHz all-core is still not shabby at all, it's only 0.15-0.25 below the golden chips) you can take air
At 50C delta? What do you mean?
zenith sonnet
Even my NH-D15 can't keep my 5820K drawing 140W or so watts under 70°C full load
latent mural
^
It does actually keep it at 70C at full load, and the NH-D15 is supposed to be a tad bit better performing than the Pro 4. As I said, my case cooling is good
zenith sonnet
The TPD is of Ryzen chips is still accurate
At stock settings, the 3950X won't draw much more than 105W all core load
latent mural
You're not supposed to keep your case at "10C or below" to reach 250W TDP. That's just non-sense, it's not realistic expectations. That's why I'm saying you can't just take what manufacturers plaster on TDP nowadays and compare 1:1. It is some sort of indications, especially comparing between same manufacturer, but it's just to get a rough idea. Things are made only worse by the fact that everyone seems to rate TDP their own way
earnest osprey
?
If your cooler is at the same temp as the air cooling it, the cooling efficiency is zero.
latent mural
Maybe it will be around 105W all-core, on the 3.5 base clock
earnest osprey
Uh yeah
Maybe.
Anyways
I have my 5820k 4.4 ghz @ 1.275 volts, a 240m with two nf-a12 fans on it
Seems to work
earnest osprey
Really?
Ltt was telling me 4.5 @ 1.3 volts should be typical
Lmao
Maybe they got lucky
zenith sonnet
Nah, I can only do 4.0 GHz at 1.3V 😦
earnest osprey
ouch
latent mural
F
earnest osprey
I might have been able to do 4.5 if I had the asus x99 that goes a bit higher than 1.31 volts
But that would have been toasty
zenith sonnet
The one I have? :p
zenith sonnet
99% of the time, the issue is too much ripple from the PSU
Better quality PSU should help
zenith sonnet
Is mediocre overdrive enough of a reason to not buy the overall best display in its class?
Particularly given a lack of alternatives without even bigger flaws?
Will we see anything new in 2019 yet?
I'm so confus 
@latent mural @ashen spindle
ashen spindle
what do you mean with overdirve, blur reduction?
I know at E3 LG showed some IPS monitors with just 1 ms GtG time that are supposed to come out this year
zenith sonnet
Overdrive affects pixel response time
It has great overdrive in the 60-120Hz range, and great overdrive in the 120-144Hz range
But the balanced setting is too slow for 120+Hz, and you get blur, and the speed setting has visible ghosting in the sub-100Hz range
Which sorta makes it difficult to enjoy the full VRR range
Can you get a link to the proposed specs of the LG ones? I think I had a look, but something something
(sorry, on mobile, thanks)
zenith sonnet
When is this year? ;(
Except missing HDR600 it has all I'd like in a display
The Aorus doesn't have HDR either, so it's not a meaningful loss, there isn't a HDR capable display in that range yet
I'll wait for the LG
Thanks
feral jolt
How noticeable is 1 ms vs 4 ms
zenith sonnet
It might still have terrible real world performance, but it's a chance at something better
Very
feral jolt
Does it matter when my frame draw times are 8 ms
zenith sonnet
Those are best-scenario values
4ms displays have up to 20ms response times without overdrive
And 6-8ms with maximum overdrive
feral jolt
Well that's cool because my frame draw times are 6-10 ms
zenith sonnet
You'll have to look at real world benchmarks, those values are practically meaningless
Response time needs to be faster than your refresh rate, or you'll get a lot of moving picture blur
But high overdrive introduces ghosting at lower refresh rates
So the real solution is adaptive overdrive
Which follows the VRR trend
feral jolt
Yeah I get ghosting with extreme overdrive setting on x34p
feral jolt
Yeah the overdrive is almost worthless because the ghosting
I can have it on the lower setting just fine though
And if the monitor is warmed up I can turn on extreme and get 10-15 minutes before the ghosting comes
zenith sonnet
But I also hope it has a software like Eizo's G-Ignition or Gigabyte's Sidekick
Those overdrive settings are optimised for various refresh rate ranges
Extreme might only work at a steady 120+FPS
feral jolt
Yeah I end up at 90-110 most of the time
Wouldn't have bought a monitor like this for csgo or whatever though
I knew what I was getting into running 3440x1440 on a 980 ti lol
Never expected a steady 120
zenith sonnet
Ugh, it's more than likely your CPU is also limiting you
Depending on the game, but my 290X was a fair match to my 5820K, and with the VII, the CPU is virtually always the bottleneck
The only thing that maxes the GPU before the CPU is like the Ashes benchmark on the Insane preset with Vulkan or DX12
But then I still hit 90% CPU utilisation
ashen spindle
yeah on csgo theres a good chance the cpu is limiting
zenith sonnet
@ashen spindle Preorders for the LG are supposed to open on July 1st, so we might see more info soon
ashen spindle
neat
zenith sonnet
They've got quite a few models planned, it seems
Most of them 32"+
That solves one issue :p
3950X is 3 months out...
X570 will have plenty of time to be tested by then
Everything else will also have to wait
gg
Gotta keep living with what I have 😂
wheat plume
Apparently since miui 10 beta isn't going to be a thing anymore , I won't get anymore updates
So I have to manually go back to the stable ROM
Unless anyone ekse knows anything different
Maybe they will auto put me back to stable in an ota?
Idk
zenith sonnet
Wouldn't they just update you to the next stable?
wheat plume
Don't think that's possible
The get on the beta updates you had to manually install the update package
It basically factory reset the phone after installation
zenith sonnet
They'll have to transition users somehow
Unless they want a mess of abondoned users not getting security updates any more
@ashen spindle From today, lol
https://www.tftcentral.co.uk/blog/updated-lg-27gl850-27-gaming-display-with-144hz-nano-ips-panel-and-adaptive-sync/
ashen spindle
nice timing lol
zenith sonnet
Looks really promising
But it has a tough nut to beat with the Aorus AD27QD
ashen spindle
but tbh I'm not really following monitor tech too closely, I dont need a new one and its not the most interresting topic to follow currently
zenith sonnet
Lol ja
Anything new about Ryzen yet?
Apparently a 3600X @ 4.5GHz beats a 9900K @ 5.0 GHz in single threaded workloads
ashen spindle
I'd assume most reviewers are testing the chips now so maybe some leaks but dont think anything big will leak
no point for that to happen now before the nda releases
zenith sonnet
I doubt reviewers have them yet
ashen spindle
nah some have them, dunno about all/most
zenith sonnet
Huh
3 weeks in advance is quite early
Means AMD actually is building stock right now