the-future

[feral plover]

Doom 1, 2, and 64

[clever bear]

Why would they make a game about the time with the sentinels? That’s possibly the least interesting part of the Slayer’s history. A game set further ahead would be better

[feral plover]

I actually think a sidegame, or a supplementary tale, could be really cool centered on that.

[clever bear]

I’d love to see a Dante style Hell in Doom, with different sections demonstrating unique (but consistently hostile) environments. Like obviously some of it would be classic fire and brimstone, but there could also be stuff like a region that is frozen over, and the Blood Swamps could come back, and there could even be areas like a haunted forest or a big labyrinth of a sepulcher that is always filled with fog.

[mint plinth]

remade, with dm, coop and mods

[feral plover]

They already have those!

[mint plinth]

uh no?

[feral plover]

Yeah, the original games have those lol.

Official releases have deathmatch and co-op. Mods have been in the original games for decades.

[clever bear]

Deathmatch and co-op are in every proper port. The Steam port has a bunch of mods bundled with it and using it to set up a source port compatible with other mods (source port= emulator so modern PCs can run it) is free and relatively easy.

[mint plinth]

i was talking about a remaster/remake;

[clever bear]

Why remaster them? They still look fantastic

Also the low resolution and such allow for madness like God Machine.

You don’t know fear in the context of Doom until you’ve had so many mid to high tier demons coming to kick your ass that they drown out the music

Coincidentally my first taste of that was the Scythe level named “Fear”

[tawny glen]

Community Question where do you guys think about where the story should go what do you think the next doom game/games will be about? 🤔

[clever bear]

I want a new big bad (maybe the Lovecraft outer god whose name we can’t say) to make their own mutated demons through cloning or whatever and have weird gross hybrids like a demon with an archvile top half and a whiplash lower half or a pinky with writhing tentacles where the eyes should be

Or a hell knight with a cacodemon for a head

Really play up the body horror, maybe with their screams sounding like they’re in pain due to their mismatched parts

[tawny glen]

Could be remember we didn’t fully kill the mutated sephri and nobody knows what it could grow into

From ancient gods part one

[clever bear]

I don’t care a ton about the lore itself; just the scenarios, locations, monsters etc it justifies having in the game

[feral plover]

Would rather have a non-Slayer Doom side game before we worry about the next mainline entry.

I'd be super interested in a game like Doom 3

[woven siren]

gzdoom

fan-made remaster pretty much

and it also runs the vast majority of mods

and has coop and deathmatch

[woven siren]

especially if you add in smooth doom, gore, tilt, that PBR mod, and a new HUD

there's also andrew hulshult's idkfa album for the music

there's also Project SIDE which is sort of an all-in-one remaster mod

[mint plinth]

just because it looks good thanks to mods doens't mean it should be disqualified for a remaster/remake

lots of doom fans have been craving for classic doom remade in id tech 6+ for years

[feral plover]

It looks good even without mods though.

[mint plinth]

my point still stands, lots of games get remakes even if the og looks good

[feral plover]

The original Doom games have aged immaculately.

[mint plinth]

thanks to doom builders

[feral plover]

No

Vanilla OG Doom has aged immaculately. Mods or no.

Like even just playing it on PrBoom or with the Unity port.

[mint plinth]

i not disagreeing with you, but im not sure what point you making

[feral plover]

A remake would be kind of pointless.

[mint plinth]

that is your opinion

[feral plover]

Yes

I am indeed stating my opinion.

[mint plinth]

and many doom fans will disagree strongly

[feral plover]

Yeah, I would suppose so.

The original games have aged incredibly well, so there's not a barrier or anything - it's not like, say, Resident Evil, where certain design choices may bar modern players from trying them out. They're incredibly accessible.

[mint plinth]

some people just hate remasters/remakes, ill never understand why

[woven siren]

lol when i first tried out classic doom i kept looking for a remaster

[feral plover]

So it wouldn't be out of necessity. In terms of making the games better, I would argue that you can't get much better than the original Doom, and adding modern shit would betray the beautiful simplicity of it (hence why I dislike Brutal Doom). Now, you could do so anyway, and sure, it could stand up well as its own thing.

[woven siren]

mainly because i wanted higher resolution and mouse controls

i didn't know source ports were a thing until my friend told me

but og doom doesn't need a remaster

[feral plover]

But even then, the question would remain: why retread old ground when something new could be made? I personally would prefer that effort go towards a sidegame set in a different era or setting, like during the Sentinel years, or a Doom 3 style sidegame.

[woven siren]

classic doom's been released tons of times

not super mario bros or sonic the hedgehog tier but still a crap ton

[mint plinth]

Off course someting new can be made, but i say do fucking both

[woven siren]

why do you even want a remaster

the game is pretty enough with the software renderer and using source ports you can get modern controls

[solar crown]

they dont have the resources to do both in a reasonable amount of time

[mint plinth]

because i would love ot see phobos and deimos in idtech 7

[woven siren]

if you want stuff like modern graphics and mouselook, look no further than gzdoom

[woven siren]

ah

[mint plinth]

obviously you would need another company to do that, MS has cash do they not?

[woven siren]

doesn't doom 2016 already give you mars levels with modern graphics though

[solar crown]

yeah but then it wont be ID, so it's just some other randoms working on it

[feral plover]

Now I admit seeing those environments in modern graphics would be cool, but I wouldn't want that to take precedent.

[woven siren]

there's also that fugly doom remake mod

[feral plover]

Yes, but in a different universe. The modern Mars is very different from the classic Mars.

[woven siren]

i see

[woven siren]

https://www.moddb.com/mods/doom-remake-4/images

[mint plinth]

This isn't a new chapter Id would be making, just a prequel basically

[woven siren]

eugh

[mint plinth]

besides, do you hate the wolfenstein games?

i thought 3/4 of them were made very well

[woven siren]

also the doom levels simply would not work properly with modern stuff

[mint plinth]

younngblood was trash though

[woven siren]

they weren't designed for that

if you've seen all the crappy doom remake attempts you'd know what i mean

[mint plinth]

uhg, obviously the classic levels woudn't not be abstract...

[feral plover]

I really liked Youngblood aside from some weird design choices for the sake of the multiplayer shit.

The modern Wolfenstein games are great but they're not remakes or anything, they're sequels.

[mint plinth]

you have have a actual hanger on e1m1

[feral plover]

I feel that remaking the original Doom would necessitate changing everything about it that I like for the sake of realism.

[woven siren]

knee-deep in zdoom scratches my itch for a doom remaster anyway

[feral plover]

I like the map design in the original Doom - I like how abstract it gets. Remaking it and making it ~realistic~ means removing it.

[woven siren]

yep

[feral plover]

I personally dislike GzDoom when it comes to playing Doom itself. I prefer PrBoom or the Unity port.

[mint plinth]

well a remake of classic doom woudn't delete the OG

[glacial dove]

Would appreciate if the unity port ever fixes its damn resolution

[woven siren]

the game's art style is beautiful enough

[feral plover]

I agree, but then what would the point be? It'd end up just being a worse version of the original.

[woven siren]

i only play vanilla on gzdoom for nice-looking screenshots

gzdoom can be very pretty

[mint plinth]

every doom game is worse than the OG, you can get better than classic

[woven siren]

though the main ports i use to play are crispy doom and dsda-doom (i use crispy whenever the map runs on it)

[feral plover]

Well not necessarily, I'd say Eternal is better than Doom 1993.

[glacial dove]

Remaking classic doom has 2 problems. It would be such a huge change from the original formula people will hate it for such

Or

It will Mostly just be a graphical change but with modern movement and gunplay which will also be super maze like and be too complicated for people who need the linear aspects of the modern games

[feral plover]

But that's the only one.

[glacial dove]

Instead of messing with what works, just make a new game

[woven siren]

yeah but doom 1993 has a distinct art style and it would look a little generic if modernized

[mint plinth]

it would essentially be a new game, just a prequel about the doomguy

[woven siren]

wdym

[feral plover]

Yeah that's the other thing. Doom 1993's map design works better with simplistic graphics because they lend themselves to the game's mazelike map design. It wouldn't translate well to new graphics, so they gotta be redesigned, and at that point I would suspect they end up being just like the new games, which I don't want.

[woven siren]

exactly

[glacial dove]

There is also an almost infinite amount of time between 64 and 2016. They could make an infinite number of games between those

[feral plover]

Yeah

[glacial dove]

However Hugo did say they are giving slayer a rest for a bit so I’m expecting a new character

[feral plover]

(anyway if you want a more realistic view on Doom 1993's events just read the shit I wrote it's nice)

[glacial dove]

Ew reading?

[feral plover]

Which is also good. I like the Slayer a lot but I think Doom can follow more than just him.

[glacial dove]

Doom 3 is a good example that you don’t NEED the slayer or doomguy.

[feral plover]

Yeah Doom 3 is great.

[glacial dove]

As long as the new character is well written there is no problem

I also don’t want a doomguy clone

Oh silent protagonist too angry

Would be lazy

[feral plover]

Consider: You do need the Doomguy in Doom, but "Doomguy" isn't really a person as much as it is a representation. You play as a Doomguy in Doom 3. Just not the Doomguy.
All that matters is the general idea of a man or woman who is facing impossible odds and triumphs through glorious violence.

"Doomguy" represents more than just this specific character - it represents that archetype as a whole, and said archetype can be used for more than this one dude.

[glacial dove]

Eh it just needs to be a badass. I don’t like using doomguy as a label because it then goes back to the whole just a lazy copy

Doomguy himself should remain as one person.

While other people are just really resilient at wanting to live.

Using it as a label kinda underplays the original doomguy I feel

[feral plover]

Fair. I just mean the general archetype. I would put forth that all of the least successful Doom media, like the films, betrayed that archetype.

[mint plinth]

whatever we get, i want mods

[glacial dove]

No mods

Only suffering

[feral plover]

The Doom 2005 movie betrayed it, and the Doom Annihilation movie also betrayed it, which sucks a lot because I actually really want a female protag in Doom and Annihilation didn't do fan perception of that any favors.

I still like the Intern-focused story I came up with, that would work well I think.

[mint plinth]

well thankfully the movie studio doesnt have the rights to the new doom games/story

only Doom 3 names and film rights

and the logo

[glacial dove]

My issue with doom annihilation was the actor was all “ who needs a doomguy”

Sure, she’s not entirely wrong, but then proceeded to be such an emotionless person who hardly did anything

[feral plover]

Yeah

That's what I mean. The idea of a Doomguy still needs to be there, it doesn't need to be restricted by gender or character. But the core of Doom is inherently that idea of you against the forces of Hell - overwhelming impossible odds and triumphing over them anyway. Neither movie had that feeling, and neither movie felt even a little bit like Doom

[glacial dove]

I would still like a aliens fireteam esque doom horde game

Even if it’s a small spin off I think it would do wonders

[feral plover]

That could be cool.

[glacial dove]

It would give the horde mode people what they want

The co op people what they want

[mint plinth]

horde mode is great, but it will need randomization and different types of "modes" . And by modes I mean a endless mode and a not endless mode

It didnt take long for me to get bored of the lack of randomized monsters in Eternal horde mode

Thankfully there was a mod for that which made it 100 times better; but last i checked that mod didnt get updated

Random campaign mode was great too, made things more interesting

[feral plover]

I cannot believe they fucked up Horde Mode so bad.

Literally just. You make arena. Monsters in arena. They spawn forever. Done

[solar crown]

and switch up arenas once in a while

[feral plover]

And they couldn't even do that - it's score-based and not infinite, but despite being score-based the weapons are random so what the fuck? Why am I doing platforming challenges in HORDE MODE?

[mint plinth]

they should of also used the battlemode maps

[feral plover]

And further why does it have to be such an ordeal?

[mint plinth]

most of the BM maps are prefect for arena play

[solar crown]

and also the score is based on usage of a singular powerup that only appears once an arena, instead of your actual skill fighting

[feral plover]

It's practically its own fucking campaign on the menu, why? The whole appeal of Horde Mode is to drop in and kill demons and drop out whenever you want?

[mint plinth]

some new monsters would of been great too, and by new i really mean recolored variants that have various strengths and attributes

obv cant make new monsters

[glacial dove]

A lot of the special Side mini games was fun

The first time i played it

[feral plover]

Yeah they're neat the first time.

[glacial dove]

After the first time it felt tedious

Wish i could have turned them off

I do think the jumping between arenas is pretty cool

[elder viper]

People probably thought we would get Horde Mode similar to the one Proteh made but imo what we got wasn’t bad either, the platform challenges and random weapons are fine for the most part. Infinite waves should be option for the people that just wanna go at it though. Still disappointed they just recycled old arenas instead of making new ones. And if they couldn’t why not include Battlemode arenas instead?

[solar crown]

Making new arenas would be a tad too much effort for it

[elder viper]

Then Battlemode cause everyone’s played the campaign arenas 2 billion times

In the end though what we got isn’t to bad either

[solar crown]

Meh, it's a tad conflicting and just a clearer direction to go to with like a week of extra thinking would be perfect

Feels like the people who worked on it wanted their own thing and now it just is in a weird middle part

[elder viper]

I feel like the execution of ideas got worse and worse each major update following TAG 1

[solar crown]

Where it isnt really all too skill-point based, but it isnt all too replayable either

[solar crown]

Less and less time and people working on it

[elder viper]

Desire to hit the deadline

[solar crown]

Tag2 got rushed
Horde mode got tagged in cause people really wanted something like it and they already failed to deliver invasiom

[elder viper]

For whatever the next game is I hope Eternals combat philosophy isn’t so heavily enforced. I want the next game whether it be Quake or Doom to feel like it’s own original game rather then DOOM Eternal on a new engine with a new coat of paint slapped on it.

[solar crown]

That's what ID wants too

[elder viper]

Including Hugo? He loves his fun zone

[lapis bloom]

hello

[elder viper]

Little too much some may say

[solar crown]

Yeah, mainly based around his qoute

[elder viper]

hi

[solar crown]

"If eternal is like a racing car i want the next game to be like a monster truck" or soemthing

[lapis bloom]

the truth is I think that ancient gods is the end of the saga

[elder viper]

It’s not the end of Doom the devs confirmed it

[solar crown]

Of the slayer, not the series

[elder viper]

They did say that the Slayers story ends here so whether we’ll have a new protagonist for the next game is debatable

[solar crown]

Likely, they can't just do a doom 2016 part two ans WHOOPSIE DOO dpomguy just got out of his coffing raneomly again!!

[elder viper]

That would be anti climactic

[solar crown]

Nahh they need someone to set it up for next game

[lapis bloom]

no entiendo el inglés (i dont speak english )

[elder viper]

So far I’ve seen people say either Crash or BJ frees him

[solar crown]

Cause they make sense ig

I like the next game to have Crash since she is a pre-established character whos a girl too, bonus

[mossy lodge]

He needed to find Lean

[lapis bloom]

LEAN

[mossy lodge]

Doomguy runs primarily on Lean and Metal

[elder viper]

Crash is likely like hell weak old New Order BJ’s doing shit

[solar crown]

BJ would be strange since wolfenstein, ww2 fanfic stuff, meeting with sci fi demons sounds just uhhhh bit wierd

[mint plinth]

i really wish we got invasions

Looking forward to that more than anything else

[elder viper]

I’ve said this before I’ll say it again, out of every version of BJ ever MachineGames BJ is the weakest.

[elder viper]

To bad we’ll never get it

[mint plinth]

yah too bad, maybe in the next doom game

[feral plover]

Weakest like strength-wise or character-wise?

Because MachineGames BJ is one of the coolest and most well-written FPS protagonists ever.

[clever bear]

Yeah. I tried playing The New Colossus and the writing was good. In particular the nazi woman was very despicable. So despicable that I found myself too angry with her to enjoy the game so I didn’t play long

On the other hand BJ felt so terribly fragile gameplay wise. Especially with all the nazis being hitscanners apparently

[feral plover]

That's on purpose - in The New Colossus BJ is fucking dying.

The New Order is a bit more well-rounded, and I'd say a little bit better than The New Colossus. Better villain, too - Engel is fantastic, but she's no Deathshead.

[dull pumice]

Well i just hope in the future games that doomguy actually gets better writing i heard alot- of people say that he isn't well written and feels like a hollow shell and I'm starting to see that

And actual fucking feats to his powers like holy shit he is vague as hell

[feral plover]

That's not the case.

The Slayer has actual character to him, and you can gauge how strong he is very easily. It just requires some thought and paying attention.

From my own guide, I analyze the Slayer's character:

In the classic games, the Doom Marine is characterized as a man who slowly falls deeper into trauma and madness as he continues to clash with Hell. The death of his bunny and the sheer evil of Hell weighs on his mind for eons to come, and Doom 64’s manual notes his PTSD symptoms and the inability of the military doctors to help him. By the time we see him in Sentinel Prime, he is nearly incoherent, ranting and raving about the demons, their “huge guts” , and their vast numbers.
Despite his refusal to hear explanations or justification for actions he considers wrong, the Slayer is shown to be compassionate and caring. He’s filled with rage after realizing the number of casualties in the UAC Mars base; he actively goes out of his way to back up VEGA to the Praetor Suit before destroying its core; he fulfills Valen’s wish and destroys his son’s heart with the knife he was provided; he openly hesitates to finally kill Samur, suggesting he cares for him or is at least conflicted at the idea of killing him.
The Slayer is implied to have a degree of trauma still within him in the modern games. In regard to the various Daisy easter eggs across every level in Eternal, Hugo Martin gave his interpretation - **that the Slayer hallucinates Daisy as he is still traumatized by her death. **Similarly, the Slayer experiences flashbacks towards his time with the Sentinels in the Sentinel Prime and Taras Nabad levels of Doom Eternal, suggesting a fond familiarity for the civilization and the time he spent in it.

TLDR, the **Slayer as a character is defined by trauma and compassion. **His rage isn't mindless and selfish - he is, as a whole, filled with anger because of injustice and the tormenting of innocent people. In a way, the Slayer **represents revolution against unjust forces, not just an archetypal Enemy but a tyrannical government or corporation. **
His character represents the weaponizing of one's anger so as to improve life.

[dull pumice]

Ik he is strong and all heck he is on par with Kratos but you can't really pinpoint how strong he is perfectly

I has this argument with a friend in a lot of fucking times

And uhhhhhh i think he is right in few things

[feral plover]

He's like Captain America strong.

Fans heavily overstate how strong the Slayer is because they obsess over the memes about the Slayer being the biggest baddest motherfucker around. Not the case- the Slayer isn't immortal, nor is he all-powerful. He is very much able to be killed, and he's only about a super-soldier's strength. The Slayer's power comes from rage, persistence, and hatred - not brute force.

[dull pumice]

Yeah ik i got confronted on that as well by the same friend i felt like i was brain whashed

[woven siren]

doomguy is captain america strong or almost at least

the slayer's a bit higher than captain america in terms of power level i think

[solar crown]

Doomguy is just a regular (although sci fi) marine though

[woven siren]

yeah

i think he's on par with captain america (in the MCU and the 70's marvel comics that i read when i was 10)

[feral plover]

I was talking about the Slayer, yeah - most people aren't too concerned with Doomguy's power since it's generally accepted he's just a super strong guy.

My point is people compare the Slayer to characters like Bayonetta or Kirby because they have this idea in their head that he's an unstoppable unkillable immortal golem who can punch any demon to death instantly. That's not the case at all.

[woven siren]

yep

it's not like everything he's gonna fight is an imp

[glacial dove]

Don’t forget most other characters people compare slayer to have ACTUALLY killed gods

Slayer at best has killed an old dude without any powers in a suit of armor

[solar crown]

the biggest feats the slayer has was killing uhhhhh

[feral plover]

titan

or the icon of sin

[solar crown]

yeah that 1 titan offscreen but that did happened offscreen

[solar crown]

with which you mostly just use human or sentinel guns and then put the mcguffin in his head

[woven siren]

people buff the icon of sin a lot

then say "because doomguy beat him doomguy can beat {character}!!"

[feral plover]

the arc military could take it down considering all it took was shotgun blasts and rockets

[solar crown]

yeah the only thing doomguy has really got going for him is his regeneration and speed

[feral plover]

where do get the funny sword to stab? easy, use the crucible lol

[woven siren]

i think the slayer has magic fists that power up his guns

[solar crown]

that sounds like such plot bullshit

[woven siren]

yes

[feral plover]

any game is like this though

[solar crown]

"nono believe me guys he can make his guns shoot harder with his magic fingers hurr"

[woven siren]

yep lmao

[feral plover]

This too. The Slayer has killed many characters claiming to be gods (like, three), but none that actually exhibit godlike powers.

i wonder how darth vader would square up against the doomslayer or the icon of sin

[solar crown]

davoth technically is a god though, he just got made powerless

[feral plover]

-The Khan Maykr pretends to be a god; she's just a narcissistic robot.
-The Aranea Imperatrix is revered as a god; she's just a demon lord.
-Davoth is a Primeval, not a god; even if he was, he lost his powers.

Yeah Davoth is the murky ground there. He fits the idea of a god from a creationist standpoint.

But either way he has no powers anymore, if I took away God's powers and then I punched him in the face that's not much of a feat lol.

[solar crown]

if I took away God's powers
that's not much of a feat

[feral plover]

I mean the punching part lol.

If God's powers mysteriously disappeared and THEN I punched him in the face that wouldn't be much of a feat.

[solar crown]

the bible is just a watered down makyr lore, which is just propaganda which likely just swapped vegafather and davoth around so davoth is the inspiration for capital G God, so i would say davoth is still god

[feral plover]

davoth is a douchebag that's what he is

he took all my extra lives

[feral plover]

Well, what I mean is, Davoth fits the role of God as in "the first being that created all others".

He doesn't necessarily fit that as in "an omniscient, all-powerful, all-present entity".

In that regard he's much more of an Adam figure.

[solar crown]

no but a god doesnt necessarily need to be one tbf

[feral plover]

Yeah I get what you're saying.

[solar crown]

cough cough greek and norse gods

[feral plover]

This is part of why I love Davoth so much. From a narrative and thematic standpoint, he feels like a lot of biblical archetypes and ideas rolled into one. He's "god," but he's also Adam in the promised land. And he's Satan. And he's you, in their world.

It's very neat shit. I get that the boss wasn't the best but IMO his character is just really fucking cool.

i think he could've used a different face

[solar crown]

nah they just didnt need to rush the lore

and you know, actually make a connection as to why he looks like doomguy

[feral plover]

This is my only real problem with TAG lore.

I actually love TAG2's lore, I love the Davoth twist and I love how it was handled. My only issue is that Davoth having the same appearance as the Slayer isn't addressed - while my headcanon is sufficient, it shouldn't have been how I explain it.

[elder viper]

Eh not really imo, but to answer your question above, lore wise he’s supposed to be strong, he’s “Terror Billy” after all. Though some cutscenes mixed with the gameplay make him appear super pathetic. One moment he could have single-handedly gunned down an entire troop of Nazis next moment he gots bopped in the head by one and is down for the count (even though he just yanked entire missiles among a barrage of bullets. I get you can’t make the character as strong as they are in the lore for balancing purposes but someone of the ways BJ gets captured or beaten in cutscenes are so dumb and just make you think “If I was in control that wouldn’t have happened.”

[reef bolt]

Definitely. Just needed more spice. Dragon and all that

[rough kayak]

what do you guys think the next doom game will be?

[woven siren]

good

[rough kayak]

i mean like story. for me i think they might make the doom slayer past

[woven siren]

idc about the story ngl

[rough kayak]

ok

[woven siren]

i just hope the next doom game can run on my PC

[feral plover]

Id Tech is really optimized and generally scales well on a wide range of hardware. If Doom Eternal can run fine on a 1060 Max-Q, I'm sure the next game will be playable on older hardware in proportion.

[elder viper]

Most likely something regarding Samur and Urdak. I feel like people will get mad if Hell isn’t included though idk how Hell would work since it’s been sealed since Davoth is dead. Whether or not Doomguy will be the MC is also up in the air since he’s sealed up as well.

[elder viper]

Funny how id makes one technologically great engine makes one game on it and developed a new one that exceeds the previous one.

[frigid grotto]

I wonder how they will intertwine the Quake universe with DOOM's if they do indeed reboot Quake.

[woven siren]

i hope they don't

not everything needs to have a connected universe

[wanton wolf]

in future seen doomguy buy new pet

[mossy lodge]

Kinda like a companion in a Far Cry game? I’d like that

[reef bolt]

Most likely just be some Easter eggs

[nimble loom]

Quake 3 and champions had doomguy

[woven siren]

yeah but quake 3 and champions both take place in some obscure realm where random warriors from god-knows-where are chosen to fight each other

[nimble loom]

They still are there among quake characters in the game called quake, are they not?

[woven siren]

yeah

but the universes aren't really connected

[elder viper]

Doubt they will only way they could is by taking the Quake Chanpions route saying they just happened to be in the same dimension at the same time. Doubt Quake will be intertwined with Doom and if it is judging from how TAG 2’s plot came out it would be really bullshit

[gusty thorn]

Hey I'm new here

[clever bear]

Hello

[gusty thorn]

Hey

@clever bear hey

Did you know that if you tap dark mode a 9/10 times you get supper dark mode

[clever bear]

Okay

[woven siren]

didn't work

scam

[formal gulch]

It’s for android only, not for ios, windows, mac, or linux. Just android.

[woven siren]

on discord?

or in android settings

[formal gulch]

discord settings, the easter egg is only available on androidOS.

[woven siren]

ah

thanks

[midnight tulip]

I also just joined, from the UK, looking for people to play battle mode with or even other games (I have doom 2016 as well), DM me if anyone wants to play

[twilit pivot]

A creative mode in doom eternal as in classic dooms

[clever bear]

Yes please

[woven siren]

level editor?

[clever bear]

Right that’s what they’re referring to

[feral plover]

That would be absolutely amazing

[elder viper]

BRING BACK SNAPMAP

[elder viper]

#doom-2016 is a good place to find people to play multiplayer with.

[twilit pivot]

Yup but We can change the textures packs

[unreal oak]

do people still play doom 2016 multiplayer?

[reef bolt]

Not really

[elder viper]

Depends the platform. I still find full lobbies on PC and even Switch if I’m lucky (and decide to play DOOM 2016 on the switch)

[elder viper]

So like Ultimate Doom Builder but for 2016?

[clever bear]

Fun idea: have the chainsaw in the next Doom yield ammo, but instead of being a kill button on a cooldown, it does fast continuous melee damage like in classic Doom and ammo is awarded at specific damage thresholds. You’d still mostly use it on chumps but if you want to try and bully a pinky with it, you’re welcome to try. It also means that instead of giving you a geyser of ammo, it’s a smaller amount that you can reap more often

[solar crown]

would be actually cool if it also was a part of a better destructive demon system

[clever bear]

I’m mostly thinking about how it would be cool for it to be less of a thing you do when able but sometimes need to wait on and more of a risk reward system that you can use to push your luck for more ammo

[solar crown]

actual skill based system to regain stuff

[clever bear]

Would also mean that any enemy is a loot piñata if you’re brave enough but some are much safer marks than others

[reef bolt]

You can find 2016 matches but it's rare. I just ended up joining a 2016 multiplayer discord instead

[reef bolt]

Snapmap but refined would have been fine

[clever bear]

Snapmap but refined is still something I really want for Eternal. I know it’s unlikely but maybe it can happen

I’d especially like being able to build levels for classic mode (I like classic mode rules better than the normal rules for some reason)

[mint plinth]

yah i hope we get a SnapMap 2.0 and official mod support for the next Doom game.

At the very least, let modders add resources more easily. SnapMap had a lot more potential, but it HAD to be dumbed down the the lowest common denominator (Consoles). PC version needed its own version.

Should of let us Edit MP maps for Single Player and Coop, More customization with monsters (Like what they did for the MP Marine armors).

[feral plover]

They could do what arma has been doing with arma reforged with a more streamlined map editor for console and more complicated stuff on pc.

[elder viper]

The PC version of 2016 (and I guess Eternal) should have had Steam Workshop support. It would boost the modding scene. It would be the next best thing since the games have no official mod support and would be easier for the players who don’t want to add 3rd party files to their games

[mint plinth]

Yep, too bad but i think there were some legal issues due to midware with the ID6 engine. Not sure if that is a issue with ID7

But the moment they said that SnapMap maps were shared between PC/Console, it was doomed

[reef bolt]

Something like prodeus. The console version will have access to the pc made fan maps

[elder viper]

Prodeus is great

[feral plover]

Doom and Fortnite collab

[trim coral]

YES

[feral plover]

Didn’t they say that he was coming some time this year?

[undone briar]

Bruh

[feral plover]

I mean doom collabed with fall guys so it’s possible

https://tenor.com/view/fall-guys-doom-doom-eternal-cacodemon-fall-guys-game-gif-19950607

[rigid wren]

https://youtu.be/s0hWtoC7A4A Translation: Fortnite x Bethesda, everything that is coming... (with Doom slayer included)
I'm not completely sure about this, i found only 3 videos talking about it, but it could be a possibility

[elder viper]

The Bethesda crossover thing makes it only a possibility nothing confirmed on Epics part

[trim coral]

I mean even if they did I’d never get the skin bc I don’t have a credit card lol

[clever bear]

I think it would be good for the next Doom to drop the assault rifle type weapon in favor of something a bit less conventional and something we haven’t had in a Doom game before, like a grenade launcher or maybe a demonic hand axe that you can throw but need to go and retrieve before you can throw it again. I actually really like that second one. Bonus points if it has a mechanic where if it hits but doesn’t kill the target it stays lodged in them and debuffs them somehow until you retrieve it (like damage over time or magnetizes projectiles to the affected enemy). I think the heavy cannon/assault rifle is a bit generic for Doom more than anything else.

[solar crown]

i would argue that a normal shotgun is also generic

[clever bear]

To an extent sure but the SSG is basically THE video game shotgun and the pump shotty isn’t something you see as a primary weapon too often, especially these days.

[reef bolt]

A assault rifle with different functions would also work so people like me that enjoy it can still use it but give it functions beyond that. Something like plasma but far more useful. This would also bring back each individual weapon having a purpose of use outside swap

[clever bear]

Yeah PB is just stupid imo. Clashes with Doom’s combat design on a very fundamental level. The chaingun is a machine gun that feels more distinct since it’s beefier than anything a normal FPS protagonist runs around with. Making the chaingun more versatile could serve the AR function quite well.

[solar crown]

Doom’s combat design on a very fundamental level
.... which one?

[reef bolt]

I think 2016s rifle heavy rounds nailed it. And it was so much fun.

[clever bear]

Aggression and close combat being important rather than sniping

That was my other reason: too much overlap between an AR and the chaingun

[solar crown]

so ballista is against it aswell
arbalest especially but i guess you arleady agree on that one

[clever bear]

Yeah but less egregiously. Precision is fine but sniping isn’t

[solar crown]

fair, tbf they could easily split the unique mods of PR, CG, and HC and remove 1 the heavy canon

like change heat blast into a precise (without big zoom) laser shot like PB, and make it so that "heat blast" is a chaingun mod that blasts the overheat

[reef bolt]

With the 2016 version it was aim but also auto fire. Give it a higher chance of stagger for weakpoint burst and give it an advantage over chaingun rewarding accurate shots

[clever bear]

I don’t love the ballista but it at least kinda fits Doom’s vibe. They do both feel a bit Halo to me

[solar crown]

demonify the ballista

[clever bear]

Making the ballista more hellish would be a good idea

[solar crown]

more hell-looking weapons would always be sick

[clever bear]

My big point behind my initial post was to add something weirder more so than ax the AR. I just also think 9 weapons slots is probably too many and the AR makes the most sense to cut

[solar crown]

i mean, there are just 8 slots
the unmaykr just counts as a "mod" to the bfg, but i think eternal also has a bit too many supers too

[clever bear]

I know. I meant that if you added a weapon without also cutting one that would make 9

[solar crown]

oh like that alright

tbf adding another gun without removing one would be... kinda weird ngl
like, is it gonna also use rockets? cause that doesnt sound too great, cause what else can use rockets but a rocketlauncher. one of the other ammo types? then that would be a weird split...

[clever bear]

I’m overall very much in favor of the new weapon being much more hellish than the returning pieces, but I’d also like for it to do a thing that we haven’t seen in Doom before, like being thrown and retrieved, or doing damage over time, or whatever. A grenade launcher using rockets would kinda make sense (that’s what games like Quake have done)

[solar crown]

kinda but stickies are cool

and ngl things like DoT sounds like it would fit more for a weapon mod or equipment

[clever bear]

Tbf moving sticky bombs to a grenade launcher would make more sense than that being a shotgun thing. Also my favorite idea is still a thrown weapon you need to retrieve after throwing like a hand axe or javelin

[solar crown]

if it's doom, definitely an axe or a cool obscure weapon

would be cooler if it's something like the crucible, cause idk if a weapon like that would really lend itself to weapon mods too much either

[clever bear]

Alternative idea: the hand axe primary is a melee swing that does moderate damage at melee range. Risky but can oneshot many weaker enemies
Mod 1: throw the ax. Does low damage but sticks in the target and makes their attacks way less accurate until you take the axe back, making them a lower priority threat without taking them out of the fight altogether. Can’t use axe at all until you get it back
Mod 2: same idea except that instead of blinding the target, it makes projectiles that get near the victim lock onto them, causing them to both be easier to hit with rockets and potentially drawing fire from other demons when too close to their line of fire. Again, this makes them less of a priority without shutting them down entirely.

As an aside I’d really appreciate the mods just come with weapons instead of being separate as secrets.

[solar crown]

ngl i think it would almost be a bit too overwhelming if you got the 2 mods alongside the gun itself. maybe make it less hidden would be kinda good

[clever bear]

Mostly I think the fact that

1. Secrets give you permanent power boosts instead of temporary boosts (ie; megaspheres, extra ammo, etc)
2. Artificially gating major mechanics behind upgrades that will make replaying earlier levels trivially easier
   Are both pretty unhealthy for a skill focused game by their very nature.

[worldly bolt]

well in a since u dont just go across the map and snipe its used for weak points and is used alot while in actual combat

[worldly bolt]

theyd be likke that new ricky and morty games guns but with demons

[reef bolt]

Heart of hell doom 3

Really cool design

[worldly bolt]

it should be a glaive

[clever bear]

Okay but multiple other weapons can already do that while making more sense in close combat and also PB is used for sniping targets on the opposite end of the arena, which is still not a great situation

[solar crown]

sword-spear, ehh doesnt sound all too metally

[clever bear]

Ooh what about a scythe you throw instead of an axe?

[solar crown]

that would be cool too

[clever bear]

Presumably a scythe with a relatively small shaft (so I guess more of a big sickle) so it doesn’t look too weird when thrown

[worldly bolt]

theirs a game on roblox called hell reaver and its great and doesnt even look like roblox. in that u have a scythe that has a shield u can activate and needs 3 charges to use

its basically doom roblox addition

[solar crown]

bit like a kusarigama then
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/993907247883239486/999068474087329882/unknown.png

[worldly bolt]

those look sick

[solar crown]

epic embed fail

[solar crown]

too bad they are kinda useless

you can't use it against armoured enemies at all

[clever bear]

Ideally without the chain since the idea of having to go where it landed to retrieve it after use is kinda the point of it being thrown

[solar crown]

yeah didnt meant with chain, was just reference

though i think a throwing axe with axe handles on the bottom and top would be cooler ngl

[clever bear]

I figure that the mods could be called “blinding blade” and “cursed blade” since the idea of making the target weaker in those ways is the crux of their effects

[worldly bolt]

honestly i think a weird glaive with blades on both sides that u can throw and spins flat so it can slowly travel and hit enemies in a small area

like destroye blade but not

[solar crown]

like a double sided dagger or something then?

[worldly bolt]

kinda but bigger

[solar crown]

big dagger

[clever bear]

In general I would hope that future weapon mods are focused on stuff other than “do a bunch of damage.” That feels a bit redundant. It’s a shame that the utility mods in Eternal mostly suck (except meathook and chaingun shield ofc) since imo at least they’re the coolest ones conceptually as they flesh out your tactical options in ways that don’t boil down to “hit them really hard”

[worldly bolt]

what if we just give doomguy the battlemode marauder axe

[worldly bolt]

not every mod is likethis tho

theirs remote det, destroyer blade etc

[clever bear]

No but several are, and that’s kinda boring

[solar crown]

weapon mods should offer something unique
gone with this "gun now fires faster" and stuff bullshit please

[clever bear]

Also remote det, micro beam, heat blast, etc, are awesome but are just not very useful in practice and that’s kinda sad

[worldly bolt]

honestly i can thin of like 3 mods that have that kind of mentality being turret chaingun, full auto shotgun, and maybe rocket volley but not really

[worldly bolt]

rip plasma rifle

[solar crown]

atleast they are mostly quite unique, but it's too bad they just arent good either...
wished the game had a post-release rebalance ngl though that would take too long

[clever bear]

D Blade is definitely something that at least sort of boils down to “hit them very hard”
Same with PB, the ones you mentioned, and Arbalist. That list includes 3 of the 4 most important mods in the game. Yeah my problem is less with how many and more with them not being worth using most of the time

[solar crown]

D Blade is definitely something that at least sort of boils down to “hit them very hard”
that is definitely true, but i would argue that it now changes into a piercing laser-blade that requires heavy charging that it is unique enough

[worldly bolt]

agreed

[clever bear]

Meathook and shield aren’t the only utility mods, but they are the only strong ones

[worldly bolt]

debatable but i can understand

[solar crown]

name another strong one then

[worldly bolt]

what do u mean by utility tho

[clever bear]

Honestly I think it would be worth making each weapon only have one mod if that meant they were more balanced and didn’t have as much tactical overlap.

[worldly bolt]

every mod has utility oppourtunities

[clever bear]

Utility meaning that damage isn’t the primary function

[worldly bolt]

honestly i think remote det is very strong

[solar crown]

it's actually simply just not

[clever bear]

Like how meathook helps you move around or how remote det and micro beam can stunlock an enemy.

[solar crown]

you first gotta wait till your rocket has travelled to the place you wanna explode it. and even then it does both LESS damage then a regular rocket for some reason, has bigger damage falloff, and it's only a soft falter, not even a hard falter

[worldly bolt]

so? even with it only being a soft falter it still gives immense damage opportunities especially with the ssg

[solar crown]

Using the ssg should already soft falter enough enemies in the game from the damage, let alone after a rocket with full damage hits them

[worldly bolt]

it might be weak on its own which is true, but its so strong because u can pair it

[solar crown]

Let alone the fact how many hard falters there are

[clever bear]

It would be neat imo if the chaingun primary had the limited stunlock feature (meaning it only works on some demons) as a throwback to classic Doom as well as meaning it’s okay for mods to not have that ability.

Or for that to be something only one mod gets

[reef bolt]

With maybe an overheat so you use it wisely

[clever bear]

That could work.

I just assumed that enemies coming in groups and ammo limits would be enough for that

[reef bolt]

I'm thinking overheat would be better if used for heavies so it doesn't nerf the encounter

[clever bear]

Okay. I also figured that it would work on, like cacos and PEs and maybe revenants, but not much else

Kinda like how those guys have really high pain chance in Doom 1-2

[reef bolt]

Yeah!! That would work. Love that idea

[clever bear]

The fact that barons and hell knights in Eternal are weak to chaingun fire always felt kind of random to me

[reef bolt]

Ah yes my weakness... lots of bullets

[clever bear]

Like cacos being especially vulnerable to a machine gun kinda makes intuitive sense because they look kinda soft and don’t have anything like armor, but barons are seemingly made of burning stone in Eternal so you’d think they’d be resistant to the machine gun if anything

[reef bolt]

That's why I like the stun idea. Heated bullets maybe warming the barrel

[clever bear]

On that baron note, it wouldn’t necessarily be good for gameplay but the idea of ice grenades doing bonus damage to barons specifically would be really fun, like the ice was extinguishing the fire in them for a moment and the fire is like their blood

[solar crown]

Ngl i like the idea more of barons de-icing faster cause of that instead

[reef bolt]

Looks like the chaingun fires 7.62x51mm AE which is actually a super hard hitting round

[clever bear]

I think that explosives would make more sense as a weakness for barons and a resistance to bullets since they don’t seem to be made of flesh like the other demons (and bullets are designed to be good at damaging flesh)

[reef bolt]

Well this rounds are actually made to go through body armor

[clever bear]

Huh. Cool.

[reef bolt]

Same round nato uses but the chaingun fires it using a rail gun system also so it goes faster. Faster rounds are made to go through armor armor plates and enemy cover

[clever bear]

What are you basing the rail gun part from?

[reef bolt]

Codex lore

[clever bear]

Okay

[worldly bolt]

well what abt stone imps

even with it being shotgun shells why isnt it explosives too

[clever bear]

I honestly forgot that they exist. Their weakness to shotguns really makes no sense

[worldly bolt]

that would be cooler instead of just shoehorning a reason to use full auto

[clever bear]

Shotguns are for messily shredding flesh, not busting bunkers or piercing armor

So them being the one gun that is efficient against stone foes is really backwards

[reef bolt]

I'll agree there

[worldly bolt]

i feel like its kinda an excuse to use full auto

[reef bolt]

It is

[clever bear]

That’s the literal intention behind it

[elder viper]

I wouldn't get the skin cause I find Fortnite boring

[elder viper]

The lore says there heavily resistant to everything but full auto? Not complaining I have to use full-auto in-universe speaking you telling me a rocket, literal turret and energy blasts don't do shit but fast firing shotgun and chainsaw do? Why can the chainsaw slash em?

[clever bear]

That’s my point. It makes absolutely no physical sense that a shotgun would be more effective on them than rockets, grenades, and armor piercing rounds. Shotgun pellets aren’t good at piercing such materials. Shotguns are for shredding, not piercing or exploding.

[reef bolt]

They just wanted us to use full auto. Which makes me feel they realize they need more weapons with a purpose in the future

[clever bear]

Full auto is a cool idea on paper but yeah it just isn’t very useful in practice

[worldly bolt]

its only semi good if u have salvo

[clever bear]

Yup. Even then it’s so niche that most players don’t bother. If it had more of a clear unique purpose I’d like it more. Like Microwave Beam isn’t all that good but at least it has a specific thing it does extremely well so there’s at least a legitimate reason to want to use it

[elder viper]

unDer tHe mAyo

[clever bear]

Lol

[solar crown]

stimps are ID's bandaid solution to the fact that full auto sucks

[clever bear]

Yup

[solar crown]

cause they are too scared to actually change the mod to make it better. the only "buff" it got was that it also isnt awfull to use now

[elder viper]

spirits are to make up for Microwave Beam

[clever bear]

I feel like there was surely a better way to flavor it than stone flesh though. Like, IDK, gelatinous flesh

[solar crown]

yeah, but at the very least you arent using PR for anything else anyways

[elder viper]

plasma rifle got shafted hard in Eternal

it feels so much less impactful then every other weapon

[clever bear]

Micro Beam isn’t useless without spirits. It’s not good either but it has uses at least, like being a baron stop sign.

[solar crown]

if PR was actually used for anything else and heatblast was also a decent mod in it's own right i would complain that spirits are equally stupid there

[elder viper]

Or really an anything stop sign

[clever bear]

Part of why I like Classic Mode in the master levels so much and wish it were a campaign option is because it sometimes sticks you with middling or bad mods and forces you to make do.
Yeah it’s an anything stop sign, but ime it’s especially useful for barons due to them barreling towards you and being kinda tricky to falter

But yeah in Classic Mode you can’t typically rely on the strongest mods because you don’t even have them most of the time

If it were an option outside of master levels I’d pretty much only play Eternal in Classic Mode

[reef bolt]

Plasma really needs more love in next doom. It deserves better like it's previous versions

[solar crown]

true

hopefully they expand on the plasma shield aswell

[elder viper]

I hope they bring back Stun Bomb. I find it to be more useful then Microwave Beam.

Eternals Heat Blast is better then 2016’s though imo

[reef bolt]

Later game for sure especially with mastery and auto charge. Stun is neat because of the cannon or seige combo. One of my favorites

[hasty jungle]

YES!! Such an iconic weapon I wanna use it more

[elder viper]

The Plasma Rifle already felt weak in 2016 only strong thing about it was Stun Bomb. Eternal feels slightly stronger but mostly feels like shooting bubbles at your enemies. Classic Dooms had impact.

[reef bolt]

Heat blast also. Really good late game. It had it purposes. But main fire I'd just use to kill off a glory quickly

The alt fire for 2016 plasma was extremely powerful. One of my favorite weapons in nightmare

[hasty jungle]

i think 2016 is better idk