I may look like a nugget but im no nugget, and not much, just office work
#classic-doom-maps-mods
haughty flower
silver lichen
Biiiiig yoshi
final citrus
By the way... Is it possible to generate a REJECT lump for a map without messing with anything else correlating to said map?
(also getting this chat back on topic here with this post)
final citrus
Looks like you can using ZenNode (I got a good REJECT table applied, but the maps needed updates, so it already took care of those)
For those of you wondering, I'm trying to update the press release beta levels so that way they can be played in modern sourceports without an issue at all.
mystic chasm
you can make a zero REJECT table in slade
for modern computers it really isnt gonna matter
unless the map uses some weird hacks
light prism
it is possible to generate reject maps that are more well optimized than what gzdoom would generate
but on average, yeah, not worth the hassle
unless youre doing some insane shit
final citrus
The maps needed updating anyway, so ZenNode rebuilt their nodes, vertexes, and anything that wasn't already part of the map data too (this included REJECT table generation)
I prefer having a proper REJECT table in no matter what anyway, not a zeroed-out one. Zeroed-out ones can cause demo playback issues via having random things in memory be used for the reject table.
Certain maps and demos therefore have issues playing back correctly unless you use either a special magic number or a proper reject table generation.
Even then, it still isn't guaranteed that the demo will be fixed on that map using the new reject table/magic number.
There's an entire Doomworld forum topic on the subject that happens to discuss this issue in more detail, along with a list of demos affected as a result and ways to play them back correctly.
stray crown
damn
final citrus
Ye
final citrus
The level WADs themselves increased in size a bit, but the size of the actual data for the maps decreased significantly.
light prism
SetActorPosition(1, GetActorX(1), GetActorY(1), GetActorFloorZ(1), 0);
for(int i = 0; i < 255; i++) { SetActorState(i, "Dinosaur", 0); }```no no no no no no no
light prism
+bathtub slides out of destroyed room+
mystic chasm
what is this a gif for ants?
foggy folio
Sorry About that I'm using discord on my phone
pseudo citrus
Hello there, I want to start developing WADs but I don't know how to start, what is the background I need to know? Can someone help me?
light prism
that is such a broad question
mystic chasm
There are a bunch of doom builder tutorials on yt, that's probably where you should start I guess, you can start making maps before ever even getting close to adding new resources and stuff.
Here are some resources to get you started, or download links atleast:
GZDoomBuilder-Bugfix
https://forum.zdoom.org/viewtopic.php?f=232&t=54957
SLADE 3
http://slade.mancubus.net/
These are like the two programs you will majoriliy use
I'm almost positive you will start with zdoom too so here is their fantastic wiki:
https://zdoom.org/wiki/Main_Page
if you are modding for zdoom you can figure out how to do pretty much anything you want if you are willing to read enough documentation on that website
As for background, you don't have to have a background in anything to start making stuff, heres list of things that learning about would help though
- Game design
- Level design, level flow
- Programming
- Computer Systems
- Data structures
- Mathematics, Calculus
- Sound design
- Color theory
- Art in general
- Player psychology
(I'm only mostly kidding)
dry ore
haha speaking of programming, what are the options with scripting in pwads and do they work in vanilla?
mystic chasm
Vanilla doom had no scripting abilities
dehacked was developed to allow changing codepointers in actor states that would allow "custom" monsters/weapons/projectiles
most (all?) ports (including chocolate doom) support .deh patches included in wads anymore
if you wanted to do the oldest of oldschool modding (that would work on the most basic of ports) it would be dehacked modding
for that I'd reccomend this utility:
http://www.teamhellspawn.com/exl/whacked4/
so if you are targeting, Chocodoom, PRBoom+, Zdaemon
Zandronum supports: DECORATE (replaced dehacked modding) and ACS which is a compiled language from hexen
and Zdoom supports all of that and also has ZScript, which is by far the most advanced and resembles C++ or Java really, and you can pretty much do whatever you want with ZScript, within the bounds of the game engine itself
dry ore
i have whacked4, what are some basic things i can do with it?
im thinking of sticking to vanilla mapping
mystic chasm
what are you trying to do with it; it's easier to tell you if your goal is in scope of dehacked than to try and tell you whats possible I guess
You can make custom wepons with custom animations and projectiles in dehacked
custom monsters, map objects
but dehacked relies on the codepointers that are already in the game
so for instance in vanilla doom2, you can make a gun shoot what the doom2 ssg shoots, but you can't change the number of pellets it fires, or change their damage
you can make custom projectiles, but you are limited in number to how many are in the original game
and you are limited by the number of "frames" you can have for all these things
dry ore
oh alright
and maps themselves cannot use scripts then for more advanced building? (in vanilla)
mystic chasm
No scripts in vanilla, everything has to be done with linedefs
dry ore
ah alright
mystic chasm
if you want oldschool-y but not vanilla and you want more availble linedef actions you can use BOOM format
which has generalized action specials
for example:
in vanilla there is no action special to have a floor LOWER apon shooting a wall
dry ore
oh neat
haughty flower
Boom's best utility is voodoo dolls.
Basically, voodoo dolls allow for activating multiple actions at the almost exact same time with the single flip or a switch or walking over a single linedef.
I used to be very dependent on those when I began mapping with Boom format, but I found I don't really need the mechanic.
dry ore
why would i want something to happen without being triggered tho? or did i misunderstand?
mystic chasm
I think you misunderstood
voodoo dolls are a (messy) hack at best but so is a lot of stuff in doom if you are sticking to boom compatible stuff
eventually you get tired of trying to figure out a way to trigger a bunch of actions at once and figure it's just easier to write a damn ACS script
dry ore
ive never used voodoo dolls ever and i don't really understand what they are or how they work to begin with
feel free to explain though!
haughty flower
Voodo dolls aren't "messy", they're very common, simple and easy practice.
@dry ore basically, if you spawn two Player 1 starts in a level, the player will use the one that was put last to spawn in...
That means, another entity of the player exists with the map.
If that entity is hurt, the player will be hurt too, and if it picks up something, so will the player, etc. Hence the name "voodoo doll"
...and also, if it walks over a linedef of any kind, it'll trigger its action.
dry ore
can the voodoo doll move when you move?
haughty flower
Nope.
But Boom has a neat linedef action that makes floors scroll...
And moving any entities along with the floor.
So if you use that little action on a dummy sector with the voodoo doll in, put a few linedefs ahead of it to trigger some actions, it'll walk over them and trigger them one by one (usually fast enough to look like they're activated at the same time).
So you can use that trick to put a door in front of the voodoo doll, and make the door open when the player presses a single switch, resulting in the voodoo doll being able to pass through and activate whatever actions are ahead of it.
It's useful for switches, because you can only assign a single action to a switch.
It's really easy to make this function.
You can also use it for timed events.
Ever played Lunatic? Its last map features a 'timer', resulting in platforms revealing more monsters/opening up the arena after a certain amount of time after you enter the room.
That's made with voodoo dolls.
I'm probably not wrong to say that every single recent Boom wad you play uses voodo dolls.
Here's a video showcasing a wad that was made to show most of Boom's functions, if not all.
https://youtu.be/xzNTmd3HfG0 @dry ore
You can actually align the floor and ceiling textures with Boom but it's quite tedious to do so.
dry ore
oh awesome
i'll give it a shot
i'm guessing it won't be fully functional if i play it on choclate doom then?
haughty flower
Nop.
Only on sourceports that support Boom, such as prboom+, ZDoom family, etc.
Boom was made in 1997 by TeamTNT.
Some time later, a guy released a new modification of Boom called MBF (Man's Best Friend), which added two functions to Boom: Linedef actions that allow you to change a level's skies, allowing for multiple skies to be used in one level, and any texture to be used as such. The other function is the ability to make demons be friendly to Doomguy and fight alongside him.
Usually, people refer to technically MBF wads as Boom, because every sourceport that supports Boom also supports MBF's new functions.
Anyways, on another subject, I learned how to make "see-through" doors in vanilla. That is, doors that use textures that feature transparent parts that allow you to see through them (like MIDBARS and MIDSPACE).
I can make a little tutorial on that later since it can be tricky to get working.
And every tutorial online for it is shit.
This technique makes a single linedef become a sector.
Which is how it allows for you to use the middle textures that you can still see through on a door.
dry ore
i'd like to know how to make see-through doors
middle textures can't be raised or lowered can they? i've actually struggled with that
haughty flower
Nope. That's what this is little trick is for.
It can also be used to make see-through floors to be lowered.
Memento Mori 2 actually used a see through door in like, the first map, but it was a bad one and showed HOMs when opening iirc. There are many ways to make see-through doors. (The way I know is the best one ofc, wink wink)
I'll just get the rest of my sleep and when I wake up I'll make a vid tutorial on it.
dry ore
sure, thank you!
depending on your timezone i might not see it on time because i have work tomorrow
but tag me regardless so i don't miss it :)
haughty flower
Lol.
dry ore
i'd play that
haughty flower
My computer got real slow and GZDB wasn't loading the textures at all.
dry ore
i've had that happen for a split second
haughty flower
haughty flower
Working on a level inspired by an idea from a friend... "a level that takes place inside a massive machine."
zinc saddle
sorryforthespambutimhyped
mystic chasm
I don't understand the oversized hud trend
zinc saddle
I don't see how a visor hud is "oversized"
mystic chasm
because everything outside the greenlines is obscured?
thats like 15-20% of the screen
werent people complaining about oversized weapon models not long ago?
about them blocking a huge percent of the screen?
zinc saddle
I mean.. Look at UDV or CatsVisor
mystic chasm
๐คท
I don't want to stifle your ideas, just write me off as a boomer sip
late spoke
I mean, you can do what Halo did and make those parts of the screen translucent with a green hue like this.
zinc saddle
Yeah true. Tho rn I'm only working on the frame and potential element placement
late spoke
Gochya.
zinc saddle
But I do appreciate the feedback very much!
zinc saddle
Wut
zinc saddle
oof rip, anyway it's still waayyy in the early stages. Rn all of the ones that are compiled are saved solely as individual images on my phone
light prism
to be fair im already balls deep in resource making
zinc saddle
Noice. Just REALLY wish I could code my own stuff
zinc saddle
I have but I can't do shit correctly even with having read it because it all just zooms around my head with the rest of the random stuff flying around
light prism
you know what always helps me
zinc saddle
hm?
light prism
smoking a fuckton of weed
zinc saddle
pfft. Shame I'm on narcotic meds and have asthma
light prism
๐ฎ ๐ฎ
zinc saddle
ยฏ_(ใ)_/ยฏ
haughty flower
Tiddies
light prism
fiddle de-dee, tits on a bee
haughty flower
๐ ฑees
zinc saddle
If anyone would like to help, no matter how small of a contribution, feel free to either DM or @ me! And yes, you will be listed in the credits for assisting me with this.
light prism
do i get paid
zinc saddle
If my Paypal decided to not be a fucking fuck and actually work properly, potentially
foggy folio
By the way @light prism what is that model for? if you don't mind me asking
light prism
some guy made concept art and i sculpted/rigged/animated it
so for whatever
he gets dibs on it
haughty flower
Hypothetically
If a hot girl offered you erotic pictures of her as a form of payment for your work on a video game mod of hers, would you accept it?
light prism
Nope.
that's like someone offering you corn in the middle of a cornfield
also a pair of tits isn't going to pay the bills
unless they're attached to my own chest
haughty flower
What if it was a hot guy then
light prism
well obviously that changes everything
foggy folio
Thanks for the info fram ๐
light prism
foggy folio
Did he say what it is for?
light prism
assuming some kind of bee mission
abstract sonnet
bee movie 2
haughty flower
HDoom
haughty flower
I got an idea for a multi player game mode in doom eternal
Itl be like a competative horde mode where up too 5 players see who survive the longest against endless waves of demons just like in the box art cover of the old games (Players wont be able to hurt each other and hp wont be able to regain)
gaunt lagoon
UDMF I think it is
I'm not with the lingo or technical terms, I just learn and build ๐
gaunt lagoon
time to start work on the inside ๐
just starting construction on the grand staircase, 2 entrances from the boat deck done via portals.
light prism
light prism
final citrus
How exactly is a door supposed to be built in GZDoom Builder? I'm trying to make an exit door that requires all keycards to open.
haughty flower
@final citrus what format are you using?
final citrus
UDMF. I'm also using the Realm667 Various Keys pack
haughty flower
Thought you were a novice mapper.
Can't help you with that, then.
I really don't recommend you use UDMF if you're new into mapping. Too complex for newcomers.
final citrus
I am a novice mapper, though. I'm trying to experiment with the key pack to see if I can make an exit door with all the keys from said pack required
haughty flower
You probably need scripting for that.
final citrus
I'm not sure what would be used for side trim to indicate all keys are needed, anyway (like with the blue trim for blue key, yellow for yellow, etc.)
final citrus
No, it doesn't. I have it open in SLADE to check.
zinc saddle
Couldn't you take a look at maps that have that like Go2It or Lab Complex Entrance (I think?) from EDay?
final citrus
It would be trivial to make some that work with it, though
haughty flower
Maybe the textudes are on Realm667
Well, Go2It just has three doors one after another, each that requires a different keycard.
final citrus
Ye. So do some of the vanilla maps
haughty flower
But I think colton wants to have one door that requires all three new keys that he added into the game.
Boom actually has an option for that.
With Boom you'd have to replace the existing keys, though.
zinc saddle
Ohhh you mean as in like the paranoid people who have like 10 locks on the inside of a door?
final citrus
I'd like to use every key from the pack, including the stock ones, ingame for the exit
That and it'd require a HUD extension to make use of them all
haughty flower
A map with 6 keys...? I don't think people would like that very much.
zinc saddle
Yeah, not to mention where to place them
final citrus
3 keys stock+6 keys from the pack=9 total
haughty flower
Oh. That doesn't make it better if you plan on using all of them in one map, lol.
final citrus
A map utilizing all of those would be pretty big
Ye. I plan to use all of them here just as a test in a small test map just to see if the exit door will use them all
zinc saddle
just make a circle map or something like Wormhole where you have to go back and forth lmao
final citrus
I wonder if it's possible to have the key door trim rotate between all the necessary textures that could be used on a specific door. That'd be neat.
blue->red->yellow->green->orange->grey->pink->brown->black and back again (would be cool to see that in action, and DECORATE would be just the tool for the job)
I think that'd be a texture in and of itself, if I recall correctly (I plan to call it DOORRNBW)
final citrus
That's strange. GZDoom Builder doesn't even show the action I want to use for this particular door (blue key open, wait, then close)
I'm trying to get a hang of making doors first by making a simple blue key one before I go back to the other one
final citrus
(Never mind. I figured out what to use. I was using Door Open, not Door Generic.)
haughty flower
You can do a good map with 9 keys. Vile Flesh does practically the same but with switches.
It's got a smart switch-hunt game going so 90% of the time you know what a switch does even if it's not shown to you exactly.
final citrus
Ye. It'd be a fun challenge to try to make at least a half-decent map using all of those keys
And to try to make that changing texture using nothing but DECORATE scripts
zinc saddle
Speaking of Vile Flesh. That's what I just streamed the first 8 maps of with PB lul
haughty flower
Vile Flesh's amazing. I'm on level 25 and it's still impressive how immersive, diverse and full of exploration its levels are.
final citrus
I'm not sure how I should use ANIMDEFS to scroll through all the key door trim textures
I'll have to figure out what icon to put on the HUD when the keys are collected, too
final citrus
I got the trim textures to animate and the lock to work as it should. Now on to the HUD (if that's even possible)
zinc saddle
Hey maybe you could help me out with the combined HUD I'm working on XP
only if you want to I mean
final citrus
Does it work with the key pack?
Can anyone help me with having walls on top of doors (like for example with an exit door using the Doom EXITDOOR texture)?
final citrus
You know the exit door texture that's used in Doom 1 E1 and stuff like that?
I'm trying to put that door in right, but the texture's screwing with me when I do.
I for the life of me can't put it in right
It just shows up twice across the wall and it looks like crap
Does it show keys and the like? (and will it work with the key pack?)
Sorry if I'm bugging you here, but I was just wondering
haughty flower
@final citrus how come?
I know how it probably looks, post a screenshot of how it looks in the editor
final citrus
OK. Here's what I get when I try to make one in the editor
final citrus
My editor does this when I try to make the exit door @haughty flower
haughty flower
@final citrus Oh, you ought to make doors like this:
Gotta put a little space between them and the next room.
final citrus
That makes more sense.
At least then I can have it obscure the other part of the texture
final citrus
Or maybe I am, but it still makes sense
So essentially make zero sense and it'll be fine? ๐ค
light prism
yes
final citrus
um... k
light prism
haughty flower
lol
recorded it because why not, and im gonna redesign some spots and tune down ammo after the blue key
@haughty flower i think i could do what you explained to me, on 11:33 with the archviles and barons
I'm surprised you shotgunned those Cacos instead of grabbing and using the rocket launcher located in the optional room you put in. I thought that was the optimal strategy.
it is also for the sewer section but i pretended to not go for it, mostly to show off how you deal withouth it
I watched the bit the Archie and the Barons, you did exactly what I meant. Pretty cool huh.
i think i might remove the ssg secret or replace it with something else
The last room is really cool.
SSG secret is fine imo
The map seems finished. You sure it's still a WIP?
mostly finished, but i think im gonna make the after blue key section a bit harder
and design a small cave around the blue exit door, because just 2 hell knights is poopy
If in doubt
Revenants
i changed the imp arena with some revenants and hell knights, tried to adjust it harder there
pain elementals were useless there by being swarmed and blocked
Is it gonna be a single map release?
no, i have a plan for another map after it
Oh, cool.
but its gonna be hell themed
I'm trying to work on a techbase episode too.
cool
Been really into Vile Flesh recently, I wanna do something similar to it.
i see
been looking around and "no end in sight" seems something i could get inspired from for a hellish map
I think I've played that one before, hold up.
zinc saddle
oh hey, i'm even looking for textures to use to make a helltech texture pack :D
haughty flower
Don't remember much of it and there aren't many vids of it, is it a Doom 1 megawad? @haughty flower
zinc saddle
NEiS is a remake of Ultimate, yes
haughty flower
All 36 maps?
zinc saddle
I think
haughty flower
a remake? well its kinda inspired on Ult doom but yea
its a doom1 megawad
let me see
save for the tech parts in other maps, but mostly this one caught my eye that could run in chocolate doom
Does the map usually take almost an hour to complete or is this dude a turtle?Wow.
zinc saddle
No, the turtle would be me lmao
haughty flower
wouldnt know, but most maps are large and they took me around 10 to 20 mins at least the first 2 episodes i played, i just checked the 3rd quickly
Oh, fun fact: most of Sigil is vanilla compatible, and the parts that aren't can easily be made so by deleting a bit of the detailing/visual stuff.
zinc saddle
or just work in the double jump from PB lulz
haughty flower
lol, the first map gives me visplane crash
Know why? Because of the cracks in a small area of the map that is actually inaccessible.
zinc saddle
||idclip||
haughty flower
If you delete that single part, the map's completely vanilla compatible.
oh
I tried it out myself.
idclip will still give you a visplane crash in some spot
zinc saddle
aw
haughty flower
Why would you optimize your map for unaccessible areas, tho.
And I don't think it would.
Iirc the visplane explorer was completely clean when I deleted the room.
anyways, on other thing i have a question, do nodebuilders matter when making doom2 vanilla maps? does it affect lets say like making more tolerable the map for the static limits?
Iirc there's like, only one map in Sigil that would require a complete design rework to be vanilla compatible.
@haughty flower yeah. I wouldn't say you should worry much about it tho.
aight
The most changing the nodebuillder will do is LUCKILY shaving off a few visplanes, from my experience.
If you're not gonna make super complex/big maps, I wouldn't worry about doing research on it.
Most people use ZenNode for vanilla and limit removing, and DeePBSP for Boom.
ok
dry ore
huh, I never even got sigil to run on prboom+, how are some people getting it to run on vanilla?
I haven't tried myself but im curious now
the buckethead soundtrack won't work tho will it?
zinc saddle
I did get the weapon list to show but the document was really messy because of it so I'll be cleaning up the unneeded stuff later when I wake up
haughty flower
@dry ore oh, I got it to work on vanilla by modifying the maps themselves. Normally they don't run.
Sigil runs on prboom+, tho.
Pretty sure you can make prboom+ handle mp3s and oggs tho.
light prism
haughty flower
Gross, they puke at you
final citrus
Ye. I'm thinking of at least attempting to create a collector map of some sort that utilizes the Realm667 key pack somehow
foggy folio
Gross but still cool๐
dry ore
how do i make it so a monster doesn't leave a sector? much like the imps in doom 2 m10
using gzdoom builder
haughty flower
Yeah its cool none the less
@dry ore for basic stuff, click on a linedef and there will be an option called "Block monster", this makes it so any monster doesnt cross that linedef
dry ore
oh thanks!
haughty flower
Monsters cannot leave that sector but also cannot enter that sector
dry ore
so it doesn't matter which way the linedef is facing then?
haughty flower
Yup
So yeah if you make a simple square sector, toggle all linedefs with block monster, and monsters wont pass across or cannot leave it
dry ore
nice
dry ore
fuck i forgot to close the testing window...
gzdoom builder is gonna crash now no matter what i choose isn't it
thank god it didn't crash
that slime trail is t h i c c
haughty flower
F
dry ore
this key can easily be bumped, any suggestions? like a temporary invisible wall maybe?
final citrus
It could be rocket-jumped from there, too. Maybe have around the key be an invisible wall and have said wall deactivate when you lower the bars.
dry ore
how do invisible walls work?
haughty flower
just make the sector bigger so they cant bump on the key
i suppose this is on vanilla doom? so it cant be rocket jumped
dry ore
zdoom
dry ore
the ceiling won't stop you from bumping it though
also there IS a ceiling, it just raises when you enter the room, revealing the key
haughty flower
could put the key further from the player to not bump it
thats why i said thicken the sector mostly, when the bars go down, player could just walk up and pick it
and bars too, making them taller, if you really dont want them to rockt jump
doubt it would be necessary if a rocket launcher isnt present
final citrus
But wouldn't you then be able to double rocket jump onto the wall itself? ๐ค
haughty flower
die in the procces? yeah
i dunno how he is building his map on things so shouldnt discuss that matter of rocket jumping
final citrus
Soulsphere+blue armor allows you to survive a double, even a triple rocket jump
Megasphere preferred
haughty flower
in the maps that are generous to give you spheres to rocket jump and shit
mystic chasm
@dry ore Are you building a "The Chasm" clone?
final citrus
That and you could carry the necessary health over from other maps to make it possible too
dry ore
nope, this is just one section with ledges but they're not nearly as narrow lol
also i don't use z-axis mouse movement so i wouldn't know, does zdoom really allow quake-like rocket jumps?
because if so i will definitely patch that
mystic chasm
Yes
Aim, shoot, and jump
Only weapon in zdoom that doesn't have vertical aiming by default is the bfg I believe
(when mlook is on)
dry ore
interesting
i only use zdoom for wads that aren't supported by vanilla doom but i keep my configuration as vanilla as possible
haughty flower
i think your only choice is to either make the bars thicker or higher
the invisible wall thing probably wont work properly without scripting
mystic chasm
Why do t you use like prboom then?
dry ore
i usually do, but i encountered some texture errors in my pwad so i decided to stick to zdoom for now
though i might remake the first map once the pwad is close to completion, if i ever find out what causes that particular bug
mystic chasm
Tutti-frutti?
mystic chasm
And you checked the powers of 2 sizes?
dry ore
how do i check
mystic chasm
Open them in slade
dry ore
alright
haughty flower
you know how to select a texture right
open the menu and find the texture in the list
then below it is the size
mystic chasm
I want to know how big the patches themselves are
haughty flower
ah
mystic chasm
Should say like 64x128 pixels
dry ore
i selected every entry between the start-end patches
dry ore
those "bugged" computer screen textures are all 55x54
mystic chasm
That's why they're bugged
dry ore
should 64x64 be the minimum then?
mystic chasm
They're not powers of 2
dry ore
ah
alright, i see
however i did not make these myself, i downloaded doom1 textures and imported them into my doom2 maps
haughty flower
that's what i said lol
dry ore
yea
mystic chasm
Doom*
haughty flower
under the texture selection in doom builder there's the pixel size
mystic chasm
Ok then yeah you can fix it in TEXTURE1
dry ore
they're cut versions of the original textures though
not sure why the original uploaded did that
but it's causing problems on any non-zdoom port
mystic chasm
You can try fixing them by just changing the texture dimensions in TEXTURE1
Not sure if the patches themselves also have to be in powers of 2
If they do then at that point you can block them out to 64*64 with borders or something
dry ore
mhm
will have to look into that when i've got more free time, i have work tomorrow and it's getting late
haughty flower
gn
dry ore
i hope that maybe i'll be able to convert my maps to vanilla format after all, but then i'll have to edit a lot of textures to fit
mystic chasm
I had 2 weeks to finish that speed map I started and still didn't get it done
Plus it was in vanilla and about a quarter of the way through I really started hating vanilla
I should switch to boom
mystic chasm
No, they just force you to use nasty hacks instead of doing what you wanted easily
Actually I really like scripting, and boom doesn't support that either
I was just trying to do something more old school
dry ore
scripting only works on zdoom right? or does prboom+ support it as well?
mystic chasm
Pretty much zdoom only
dry ore
so far i've only used it for changing the sky textures but i might use it more in the future
probably won't be too hard figuring it out
mystic chasm
Scripts are so nice triggering like half the level to change in 1 switch
zinc saddle
dry ore
so basically have multiple triggers happen at once?
zinc saddle
Nah. Just fucking around at work
dry ore
๐
mystic chasm
You can do lots of neat stuff with ACS it's just shy of a full programming language
zinc saddle
Shame idk shit about coding wait no that actually might be a good thing
dry ore
i've studied c# so this shouldn't be too difficult, however i lack ideas for anything other than basic map making
haughty flower
can a black midi be played in Doom vanilla? ๐ค
final citrus
Possibly, but it'd be resource intensive and you'd need to make it usable with the Doom soundfonts/MIDI2MUS converter
light prism
Wat.
mystic chasm
wat
haughty flower
Uh, I think it's dependent on the midi player.
mystic chasm
don't most players crash on black midis?
gaunt lagoon
mystic chasm
also about black midis:
you're usually better off converting them to like ogg or something
for filesize
(if you're using zdoom)
haughty flower
I suppose you couldnt even play one due to file size limitations on the midi/mus handling in the og engine
Everything looks cool except the black space that blocks everything else
haughty flower
You could do that or make it hide when minimizing the status hud
zinc saddle
Oh. Then only the yellow would show
mystic chasm
ok, then remove the yellow too
zinc saddle
lol
mystic chasm
so are you just overlaying a picture over a screenshot?
or you actually have something scripted?
zinc saddle
I'm using the DE HUD as a base and replacing the god awful ripped visor. This is just moreso for a visual concept rn
light prism
imo you should add an alpha value that can be adjusted from the menu
zinc saddle
Great idea except I have no fucking clue how to code anything myself
light prism
read the wiki you scrub
zinc saddle
Have. Still don't get it with how my mind is :') hooray for autism
light prism
scrub the wiki
zinc saddle
slowly grabs a sponge
light prism
i said scrub not gently sponge bathe
zinc saddle
also grabs some sulfuric acid
final citrus
uhhh... Why are you sponge bathing the wiki? With acid of all things?
mystic chasm
not a real doomer until you sponge bathe with the wiki
zinc saddle
Right, that's with a full tint for the visor and not just around the black
mystic chasm
ooohhhh
you should do a faux-80's-retro-futrism motif
make it look how they thought futuristic stuff would look in 1981
zinc saddle
uh?
mystic chasm
zinc saddle
ohhhhhh
zinc saddle
๐
mystic chasm
actually I'm taking that idea
zinc saddle
pfft
mystic chasm
:D
zinc saddle
Well I had an idea when I saw Hobbs and Shaw but it means I'd need to know how to ZScript
zinc saddle
zinc saddle
The Last Starfighter
mystic chasm
you would have thought I'd seen that by now
zinc saddle
lmao
mystic chasm
really dig the retro-futurism, but most people base their concepts on 1950's designs, and the 80's made everything way grittier
modern wave of science fiction
zinc saddle
oof
mystic chasm
where cyberpunk originated from
modern scifi moved away from societal problems and into the psyche
zinc saddle
tbh i haven't paid much attention to things like that in movies
mystic chasm
oh... i was thinking books
zinc saddle
(โฏยฐโกยฐ๏ผโฏ๏ธต โปโโป
final citrus
If only this didn't take forever...
mystic chasm
Zennode not working for you?
zinc saddle
Woooo most of the hud is done :D. My hope it to get it working as best as possible by I'd say next Wednesday since I only work tomorrow then I'm off until I get my new schedule on Wednesday
mystic chasm
I still think you're obscuring way too much of the screen
zinc saddle
shrug Its better than the original frame of the DE HUD
haughty flower
That occupies so much of the screen. Don't think it's a good idea.
To make a Doom feature resembling a meme from modern shooters.
There's also those stripes. That's just unnecessary, man.
light prism
if its going to take up that much room it should be very translucent
heck look at doom 2016, you put on the helmet, it should this screen-covering hud for a few seconds, then it all completely fades out
you know why?
ionic plinth
because its annoying
haughty flower
is there a way that i can put a default texture when doing new sectors for upper and lower textures on gzdoom builder?
light prism
check the options
ionic ember
Is there a mod for prboom-plus that adds blue blood for the cacos & green blood for the barons + hell knights? I know there's a few for GZDoom because of DECORATE, and Doom Retro as well as Crispy Doom have baseline support for the blood thing too.
final citrus
@mystic chasm Forgot to answer this when you asked, but I'm rebuilding all the reject tables to fix anomalies, and it requires me to use RMB, which doesn't work on an x64 system, therefore DOSBox is my friend here.
final citrus
You could say that I'm going back and at least attempting to fix some of the original id maps for Doom and Doom 2. (There's one project on the ZDoom forums that attempted this in the past, but never got very far into it)
haughty flower
Wait this looks.....familiar. https://store.steampowered.com/app/521110/Zombie_Birds_First_Encounter_Halloween/
Buys
Extracts
You fucking serious with these paint-overs?
๐
Oh well i guess it will go full circle
iron holly
Welcome to Steam
odd hare
Even more - that game is clone of Moorhuhn
dry ore
^i thought i was the only one who instantly thought of that game, i completely forgot it existed until i was going through my old files a few months back
light prism
haughty flower
@odd hare @iron holly did you knew there is a moorhuh clone where you can actually walk? i didn't until yesterday https://store.steampowered.com/app/837040/Redneck_Kentucky_and_the_Next_Generation_Chickens/
@dry ore
dry ore
nope, I didn't know that
light prism
nope
digital wolf
epon
iron holly
@fading path What's all this?
fading path
previews for my .wad, Unfamiliar
iron holly
Oh cool
Next time, can you maybe say what it is instead of dumping a load of pictures, thanks
fading path
hang on i'll redo it
iron holly
Nahh it's fine
fading path
sorted
upper island
In Doombuilder X what is the difference between the Eternity and ZDoom UMDF formats? Starting a new map and would like to mess around with some of the UMDF stuff
light prism
pfff telling people what youre making
i would assume line specials mainly @upper island
digital wolf
What are you TC-ing?
haughty flower
Doom 2
blissful surge
oooh I really like it!!
echo echo
Conversion was the wrong word; I meant megawad haha ๐
haughty flower
Partial conversion seems to be the right word.
mystic chasm
it looks like quake
or very cool
i thought the first screen was a quake screenshot
haughty flower
Reminded me of Quake a bit, too.
mystic chasm
so speaking of quake now, how do you guys feel about 3d models in doom?
and do you feel different about them in where they are used?
so like 3d models for weapons,
3d models for decoration
and 3d models for monsters
light prism
the architecture looks like doom3 ruins
mm, if you are using 3d models, you should be using it for everything (except some effects where you can get away with billboarded shit, like fire, fog, etc)
otherwise stuff becomes very obviously out of place very quickly
mystic chasm
i think the only thing that bugs me about 3d monsters is that there is no interpolation in rotation when a monster turns to chase you
unless you zscript it in
unless your force lerp off in everything anyway
make it all look like stop motion
light prism
yeah you have to write em for it
or animate wide arc turns and just leave it for little ones
there is actually interpolation but it only occurs over 1 tic so it still looks way too fast
haughty flower
dry ore
lmao
light prism
i would assume some blood port but that shit is technically possible in gzdoom using line portal trickery
haughty flower
More magic
This is also our mod
And the ultimate trickery... Horizontal platform moving
https://youtu.be/BZ0ce_IrGJk
This is a gun that I have made for my other mod hyperion
haughty flower
Chu chu engine
final citrus
I'm having problems running OMGIFOL. Python either won't recognize the libraries or it'll error out with code errors
ashen linden
How do I change the level the exit brings you to in doombuilder when using skulltag doom/doom format?
final citrus
Is it a multi-position exit?
For that, just tag the exit with whatever spawn position you wish
Assuming that there's a spawn position on said level and that this is a multi-level level and this is what you want, this should allow for different exits from the previous level taking you to different areas of the next
light prism
hexen-style exit lets you choose the map and start position, yeah
surreal meteor
haughty flower
You should probably give more, or at least any information about your mod to potential playtesters.
zinc saddle
like what i did with my hud in the readme, i explained where i got sources from and that'll i'll be omitting those as i draw up new graphics and that since it's only testv1, that i'll be working things around constantly until i'm satisfied
light prism
zinc saddle
spoopy
haughty flower
I woke up to this and got spooked legitely
vague bear
Locked vent, red key card needed
sleek sundial
How do I add respawn points in snapmap?
And Is there a way to set up boss encounters?
foggy folio
vague bear
working on the air vent now
candid charm
how do i make a lowering platform in udmf
i want to make a platform that lowers when you use it and reveals a secret
light prism
a 3d floor?
light prism
you do it like you'd do it in pretty much any other format
you want it to raise again afterwards? use platform lower wait raise
otherwise just floor lower (to lowest, or by value)
light prism
thats what she said
dry ore
from what i understood, checking vanilla compatibility
red areas mean it'll crash in vanilla from visplane overflow
unless I'm mixing it up with something
@vague bear
vague bear
o
candid charm
@light prism im trying to do it like i would normally but nothing is happening
i just hear the sound and thats it
light prism
did you tick the activation type
oh
is there actually an adjacent sector which is lower?
candid charm
wdym
light prism
all platforms need a sector attached to them which is the 'lower' sector
that they lower down to
if not, where is it lowering to?
light prism
which action are you using
candid charm
vague bear
woah what are you using
candid charm
udmf
vague bear
thats different from gzdb right
candid charm
i dont want it to raise again
light prism
ok, then use Floor (lower to lowest)
light prism
candid charm
@vague bear screenshot the entire map
haughty flower
Neat
candid charm
am i being too evil if i make the first room in my wad have lost souls
vague bear
jeez
candid charm
vague bear
is that using the Doom 2 textures?
vague bear
oh
candid charm
this is my entire level right now
vague bear
I had to go through mine quick, without monsters cause it was around 90 MB the first time
I think my computer wasnt having a good time while I recorded that
haughty flower
Why'd you record in such high resolution?
candid charm
I always make sure my levels can be played the โclassic wayโ
So you donโt require jumping, crouching or mouselook to beat them
sleek sundial
I just published my first SnapMap
It is a remake of the Prison Of Elders from Destiny
Please check it out. This is the first map I have published and I spent a great deal of time on it
candid charm
i love how the blood splattered on this texture
zinc saddle
Out of pure curiosity (just let me know if this isn't allowed and I'll delete the message) but would anyone want me to try out their map(s) and possibly record it? I'mkindaneedingnewmapsetstorecordcusI'mrunningoutofwadsIhaven'tplayedthru
haughty flower
I dont see why would it not be allowed
zinc saddle
Well yeah, but you know. Some servers are like, dictator strict about things
haughty flower
Im slow at making complete maps so maybe one day
zinc saddle
aight
zinc saddle
Never heard of it
haughty flower
zinc saddle
o
haughty flower
Some maps are greasy and spicy and others are light in fats
In other words, hard and easy altogether
zinc saddle
ba dum tss
haughty flower
Youll get it once you start playing and see difficulty descriptions
vague bear
oh wow
I wish I could make complex maps like that
anyways here is how long it took me to beat my map on hurt me plenty
echo echo
Hey you'll get there! To be fair I've been making DOOM maps off and on since like 1997 ๐
zinc saddle
I've decided to stay away from mapping because I'd more than likely make up some Mount Pain level fuckery and be told questionable things XD
echo echo
Not gonna lie my first map ever was like a giant star shape with a Cyberdemon in each corner and a BFG in the middle ๐
zinc saddle
talk about a hell of a time
echo echo
It's what happens when you start making maps when you're 11 years old XD
zinc saddle
casually slides 1 lone backpack in the middle dis is all u get for da cybers
glhf : D
vague bear
I made this one really cool trap
zinc saddle
did you name it Natsuki XD
vague bear
entry way to my third map, which is just the exit to the second
zinc saddle
processive maps intensify
zinc saddle
it bluwue
zinc saddle
My Map01 - souls and souls and souls and souls and souls and . . .
vague bear
map 2, things get a bit more complicated
I really like the way my first and second map came out
I dont know about the name for it though
ยฏ_(ใ)_/ยฏ
haughty flower
@zinc saddle you should try to map then
zinc saddle
Nahhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
haughty flower
Well dont, whatever
zinc saddle
you really want a worse time to go thru Mount Pain? XD
haughty flower
Yeah why not, i like playing hard stuff, mount pain is really not that hard
zinc saddle
From pistol starting tho? With smarter and more enemies? And bleeding/critical when low health?
haughty flower
Yeah but im talking in terms of vanilla
haughty flower
Make the map hard in vanilla then you can have fun having aharder time by difficulty mod
zinc saddle
Except idk a thing about mapping oof
haughty flower
@echo echo ey, pretty nice.
@vague bear lots of veeery long hallways. Not usually a good trait.
haughty flower
Quite bland and lazy.
light prism
at the very least, you could use 64px corridors as a short connector piece between arena areas
but yeah it certainly shouldnt be the focus of a map
unless you're making a dungeon crawler
vague bear
I donโt understand why itโs lazy, I spent my whole day working on this thing
And correct me if Iโm wrong, ventilation shafts are long and narrow
haughty flower
I mean, you just drew a looong rectangle.
don't get me wrong, just because you did it fast it doesn't mean it's bad, but it's just an empty rectangle with nothing much to it.
Advanced mappers can take weeks to months to finish maps.
Unless they have it all planned out, or are speedmapping.
vague bear
Itโs not like Iโm going to release this to the public
haughty flower
If I had a coin for everytime someone said that as an excuse.
We're not trying to be mean or smth, just trying to help
vague bear
Yes I know that, but do you think I should release this to the public when I have all 32 maps
haughty flower
I don't think you should try making 32 maps now, you just started!
Either release single maps or a few together, like 5-10 maps, which would be an episode.
vague bear
So donโt make a full mega wad
vague bear
But I made that map in a day
haughty flower
And when newcomers do it, the megawad usually ends up being poor quality.
I'm working on a megawad right now, and it was like that at the beginning too
I made two or three maps each in two days
but then they just started taking longer and longer
because you get more and more ambitious, and that's a good thing because that's how you improve, right? But then you end up not releasing anything.
That's not how it is for everyone, tho. And like I said, when newcomers release megawads, they usually end up being low quality. That could be because they didn't actually receive any outside criticism.
So they couldn't know if the maps were actually good in the eyes of the public or not.
Like, just focus on making maybe 10 maps total. But 32 is too many for learners to worry about.
vague bear
Is the name of my mega wad bad? Completely Overclocked, it explains all the โofficesโ
haughty flower
I like it. Have you played many mapsets?
vague bear
No, only The ultimate doom, doom 2, plutonia, and TNT. Iโve played a bit of eviternity though
haughty flower
You should play more.
tiny hamlet
I have never played Doom
Barely the original one on mobile
But it was a free apk
So a bit wonky
vague bear
Ew chocolate doom
haughty flower
I can recommend you a lot of good ones.
tiny hamlet
I can't really afford any, maybe Doom 3 for tye xbox but that's it
Definitely wanna play the original ones
haughty flower
If anything, start with the classic ones that are still commemorated, like Scythe and Alien Vendetta. These two being some of my favorites.
tiny hamlet
Okay
haughty flower
I was talking to Mr Forbidden. You should start with the original games lol.
tiny hamlet
Also are there any Classic Doom ports for the Xbox like they did with PlayStation
Oh okay
I will try
haughty flower
Yeah, there are.
tiny hamlet
I would if i could
haughty flower
Well, you can't mod your Doom on Xbox.
echo echo
They just released DOOM and DOOM 2 for the XBOX, PS4 and Switch, they're $5 each
haughty flower
Hey Kelzam, you said you have been mapping since the 90s?
What have you released?
tiny hamlet
I meant for the original Xbox
echo echo
I have a few things somewhere on the Doomworld archives, single map projects here and there. Biggest thing was I was on the Doom 64 TC team that did the original TC over at Home Depot before Kaiser went on to release Doom 64 EX
haughty flower
Hm
echo echo
*Doom Depot not Home Depot XD
haughty flower
@tiny hamlet in the OG Xbox? Not sure about that. If you mean the 360 (which isn't the OG Xbox) then it is there, yes.
haughty flower
Do you not have a computer?
tiny hamlet
Nope
haughty flower
Oh well, F.
tiny hamlet
Literally got the og Xbox at a garage sale
haughty flower
Doom on cellphone is horrible.
tiny hamlet
Yeah but i just wanna experience the fun of the classic
haughty flower
For that you'd need a PC tbh.
tiny hamlet
Damn
haughty flower
Like, those controls on cellphone ain't fun at all...
echo echo
Speaking of the Doom 64 TC, I have an original map in there (we snuck in six new levels) and mine is Map 27: Forbidden Deeper. It's an oldie but I was really happy with how it turned out. Made custom traps and all sorts of fun stuff ๐ http://www.doom2.net/doomdepot/abs-download.html
(I went by Melfice back then)
haughty flower
I'll check it out later. I'm boutta head to bed. See ya.
echo echo
Night!
haughty flower
Nice avatar btw.
haughty flower
Kelzam
tiny hamlet
Yeah his is cool
echo echo
Thanks ๐
tiny hamlet
No problem
vague bear
So I might be working on the third map today, but I will try to make the hallways not as boring, and have shorter vents
Itโs still probably going to be square shaped though
echo echo
Keep at it! There's nothing wrong with starting out with simple designs when you're so new and getting a feel for mapping. I find the "lazy design" feedback to not be as helpful as intended - it's a good way to discourage new mappers who feel in over their heads or inexperienced. I do suggest trying to play more DOOM or custom WADs, though. That's how I picked up most of my experience. Just kinda studying shapes and things designers did to give maps visual interest and not appear flat; or taking note of what areas in maps I had the most fun playing or that seemed the most exciting. My first maps were a lot like yours, though, so keep on mapping! ๐
vague bear
dry ore
square-shaped rooms are fine, there's plenty of ways you can decorate them creatively
but i would avoid making them too large
vague bear
working on making it a room that leads to other places but I added stairs and this little room
probably going to do something else on the other side
thoughts?
I know the door texture is the wall, I didnt fix that yet
vague bear
now you get more ammunition
maybe thats a bit too generous
actually
I like it like that
dry ore
test it on all difficulties, see for yourself
you don't wanna make it too easy but you don't want it to be impossible either
i personally make sure my map has enough ammo to get 100% kills on the highest difficulty
im new to map making as well but I've played tons of wads and i know what a good wad looks like
vague bear
I was able to beat the 5 hell knights on UV
the ammunition that I put was plenty
requires maneuvering too
haughty flower
i just moved from doom builder to gzdoom builder just to have it force missing textures when creating new sectors inside sectors
what the shit
haughty flower
i think its because i had override textures toggled, but it didnt work as i thought it would work, now i see, it just confused me at first
and it had no texture selected
im not sure if it is me, but i think when i select a lower texture, it applies them instead in the upper when they are not needed there
light prism
haughty flower
cool beans
why the 3d camera gets always misplaced even when i have the visual camera thing on the map
light prism
it appears where your mouse cursor is when you toggle
once again, probably a togglable option
haughty flower
ah alright, thanks mistercat
winter carbon
Out of curiosity, do any of you have a color order to which keys players find first, or do you choose the colors at random/whatever looks cool in the room etc. ?
haughty flower
@vague bear you should another texture for the wall
haughty flower
Don't use door textures for regular walls.
vague bear
doortrak?
vague bear
Oh that
is that what you meant
I feel like 5 hell knights is a bit hard easy for a room this size
I know how to fix this
haughty flower
put revenants and archviles to make it hard