Map smol, must get big.
#classic-doom-maps-mods
elfin ruin
forest wagon
Is there actually a hard limit on map sizes at all?
forest wagon
Is there a reccomended max size for lines/sectors, would you say? I'm using the original Doom Builder for level design.
light prism
why arent you using GZDB
the only recommendation i would give is 'dont waste too many sectors on unnecessary detailing'
especially if that detailing is within a game area and you could get snagged or stuck on it
forest wagon
As part of the project, I'm doing it on my Pentium III laptop in Windows 98
My first 'game dev' computer; I made maps for CS 1.6 like 15 years ago on it
forest wagon
As I work in the game dev industry, its more a 'hey wouldnt this be cool to do, on my first dev pc with the knowledge that i have professionally'
also because its an interesting talking point for my dev blog 😄
light prism
why not go buy a 486 heh
for the real experience
and map using DeePSea
that would force limitations
forest wagon
Hah I thought about it, but it's also cool to come back to the pc that got me into my profession, you know?
light prism
oop lunchtime
forest wagon
Like shit, I didn't even know I still had it let alone that it worked until november, when I was clearing out the attic to get the xmas tree
light prism
back soon
light prism
whee
forest wagon
@light prism just in case you were interested
Only just started but ill be documenting it here
(I need a better name)
light prism
lol AGS
ah man unreal 1's railcamera intro
with the reflections and flares
that was cutting edge back in the day
forest wagon
Aye, I'm obvs about 6 weeks ahead of my blog, so that i dont ever go 'wops what do i do'
I've already settled on doom engine and have started doing basic tests with doom builder, slade, xwe etc
I'll be updating it 2 - 3 times a month
light prism
yeah doom engine would be the easiest i imagine
if doom builder actually runs under 98
forest wagon
Aye it does!
light prism
crazy shit
forest wagon
ill stick to doom builder, im not natively a programmer so ill take a few easier routes 😄
I'm a producer/project manager, my knowledge of programming is more limited to the requirements of my job role
light prism
really if you wanted to take a cheap route you could make a roguelike standalone quite quickly
forest wagon
I'm thinking a shortish Strife-inspired FP RPG
I like the hub/dialogue systems in strife
light prism
ah yeah
forest wagon
As Gutawer told me though, I wont have access to ZScript so thats gonna be f u n
as zdoom 2.1.1 is the latest version i can get working on 98
light prism
heh
i made a dialogue wheel style system :3
i wouldnt count not using zscript as a disability, you can still do a fuckload with decorate and acs
forest wagon
I'll come to you when i have custom enemy issues 😄
light prism
@forest wagon - "Can only REALLY make first person games, will be a stretch to get anything else out of the engine"
forest wagon
Aha, that tis but a piece of the narrative, my good man
for i will go 'omg i did more research and found all these cool things, imma choose doom engine!'
What is that game called?
forest wagon
I've already blocked out the blog post in notes, so ill be adding these to it!
oh thats yours
forest wagon
Mind if I give you a notable mention in my next post then? 😄
light prism
its a cover i did of one of the doom2016 tracks
past cradle
cool
haughty flower
Is anybody here knowledgeable of the horizon-portal feature of sector_setportal? For some reason, even with no texture on the floor, the line textures don't extend off downward to infinity.
unreal oyster
it makes a lot of sense that you wouldn't be able to find a copy of Unreal Engine 1, it's an awesome engine but i don't think it was ever opened up like UE is now
and the source code was, regrettably, never released, though Epic have expressed interest in doing that
light prism
mmm that is a shame
unreal oyster
it's weird because Epic have given the source code to people, just not publicly
the 227 patch guys have source to fix things
but i guess there's some licensing issues and the code would need cleanup for a public release
light prism
doom is where doom is at, yes
elfin ruin
Didn't a developer tool come with Unreal when it was released?
I have my Unreal discs still around, just need to fit a disk drive into my computer.
unreal oyster
yes but that doesn't mean you can make a full game with it
elfin ruin
It's also in a weird spot too since the source code is partially released to the public. There's several open source projects trying to figure out the remaining pieces.
forest wagon
Does anyone know the software package and hardware Robert Prince used for the soundtrack to the original doom?
prisma saddle
I know what they used for Sprite editing, but that's about it.
They used Deluxe paint 2 for sprite editing to be specific.
Atleast I think it was Dpaint 2, might've been a later version.
unreal oyster
Looks like he used Voyetra Sequencer Plus Gold
dawn barn
forest wagon
@light prism No no, just curious more than anything; I haven't been able to find out.
Ty ty
light prism
i used to use text-based module editors back in the day
cant imagine going back to that now
golden drum
Legit room.
light prism
who left all this gravel inside
prisma saddle
Who glued the gravel to the walls.
golden drum
We'll see if I told you that it would spoil the ending
light prism
someone help me test wormsdoom
elfin ruin
Testing goes nicely
light prism
im on the outside, i'm looking in
tender sorrel
forest wagon
@elfin ruin oh cool, thats a nice glass effect. Is it using Sidedef with a semi-transparent mid texture?
unreal oyster
Fairly sure Nash is redoing that in ZScript for his game so it's not quite been abandoned, though idk if/when it will ever come out for use in any old project
He's said that separating it into a kit for use in any project now would be hard because it's integrated into his game's systems now
Or something like that, I'm going off memory
timber bridge
damn that would be great if it was a mod
forest wagon
I think its more a modding tool rather than a mod
timber bridge
would make plutonia even more painfull if there's night, rain and other things
forest wagon
grabs chainsaw
forest wagon
Speak for yourself 😉
tender sorrel
elfin ruin
@forest wagon Yes, I use SHAWN2 for windows if I'm using just the supplied Doom 2 textures for one area. Just ticking the opacity to 25% does wonders. I've done it twice in this map so far actually.
forest wagon
Awesome, i dont use SHAWN but ill see if i can do something similar
timber bridge
SHAWN2's got the shotgun
elfin ruin
Imo, you're better off getting an actual window texture, but I'm just using Doom 2 textures and Gothictx for my map.
forest wagon
makes sense
elfin ruin
It works for my mapping techique which hasn't evolved much since 2000. Learning all of this new stuff is interesting to say the least.
Speaking of which... I never imagined that in 18 years that the majority of the community would hate corners.
forest wagon
In what sense?
elfin ruin
No corners in rooms, rounding them off to be more circular.
forest wagon
Thats interesting, i dont mind corners
unreal oyster
i think they're talking about the community's gradual move towards non-orthogonal layouts rather than rooms being generally rectangular with 90 degree angles connecting things
elfin ruin
I'm working on this, sort of painstaking to create a barrier that represents roundness rather than points.
unreal oyster
for example, MAP12 of Ancient Aliens
but, no, the community does not hate corners, you shouldn't be ashamed of using 90 degree corners occasionally
it's a good idea to experiment with weirder shapes but you don't have to have a complete abscence of orthagonality
forest wagon
Thats really cool
elfin ruin
Anyone know a method to block Archviles from targetting the player and instead lock it to just reviving monsters?
light prism
@elfin ruin put the archvile in a HOM pit
it will only be able to target the player if he is very close, but also will only revive monsters close to it
elfin ruin
Archvile is in an impassible, hitscan/projectile blocking box that doesn't block LoS so it can consistantly revive chaingunners. They're in towers that cover 360° of a room.
light prism
the point is that reviving is not vertically limited
if the towers are thin enough, the archvile cna be at he bottom on the outside
elfin ruin
Gotcha. I'll try that.
flat storm
is there anyway to draw a circle centered on a point? Like in Slade?
light prism
using gzdb?
flat storm
yes
light prism
draw a square
select its lines
hit shift-C
you'll see on the top bar there are some options
(number of vertices, angle, reverse, etc)
press enter to accept settings
ps lines will curve in the direction of their facing, so you'll end up with a weird shape if they're not all facing the same way
flat storm
ok. Thanks
hallow wraith
I usually try to make maps 1 room at a time
vocal crypt
I'm now thinking of some fortress style deathmatch map.
warped radish
Is there a good reason we can't mod Doom similar to how we mod Doom 2?
lavish hollow
@warped radish do you mean classic doom
If so, then it's because doom 1 just has less stuff
Doom 2 has a lot of doom 1's stuff, but more
warped radish
Classic doom, sure. Like adding new weapons, monsters, HUDs, full scripting, etc.
lavish hollow
If you're making a doom mod, you'll probably pick doom 2 because there's more things to replace/modify, therefore allowing more creativity
But with doom 1, you have somewhat limited options
(cuz of aforementioned less stuff)
warped radish
Doom as in Doom 2016
warped radish
Yeah, d1 and d2 are essentially the same.
lavish hollow
...what
There's only 1 doom 2
Oh lol
Anyways
It's mainly because doom 2016 has a lot of stuff hardcoded in
warped radish
So. The answer is No, there is no good reason. Okay.
warped radish
Well, I waited 1.5 years to ask that question, because I figured things would change. I guess not.
lavish hollow
It was pretty clear from the start that mod support was gonna be a pipe dream
It would take waaay more than a year and a half for decent mod support
warped radish
How clear is clear? Did the ad say "No mod support" in it? I don't recall seeing that. So, yeah.
lavish hollow
I heard "no mod support" before the game even launched, from several different places
warped radish
Okay.
unreal oyster
@warped radish there are very good reasons, but they're a bit technical, and most of them involve doom '16's use of the megatexture system
lavish hollow
@light prism he's talking about doom 2016
unreal oyster
if you've ever done 3d modelling in any capacity, you'll know the concept of a UV map, which tells the renderer where to put textures on the model's faces, basically
a megatexture is that mapping of a texture to a model, but for an entire level
and it includes a lot of lighting and stuff which is useful to helping doom run well since it can spend less time on light calculations
light prism
it is possible to modify quite a fair amount of parameters and such
and also from what ive seen you can get custom textures and stuf fin
unreal oyster
unfortunately, what it means is that you have to have a very, very powerful set of PCs to make that megatexture
light prism
havent seen any custom models yet though
unreal oyster
and i mean powerful, i remember john carmack saying that their farm for megatextures in 2013 was 300 cores or so
so suffice to say, even your 1080 Ti that can run the game itself super well wouldn't be able to run the level creation process well
it'd take a very, very long time
elfin frigate
Got a little question for those with more experience, on average what would you say is the time it takes to make a mod that would be like, 4 or 5 weapons with their own sprites/behavior/etc
light prism
completely subjective
lavish hollow
That really depends on your knowledge of coding and will to make the mod
Like, REALLY depends on it
light prism
COMPLETELY subjective
you could bash out in a day if you didnt care about quality of sprites
or it could take months if you went uber detailed
or longer if your behaviour was complex
elfin frigate
i see
warped radish
@unreal oyster Thanks.
@elfin frigate Depends on how much detail you want to put into it. For example, I made a new powerup sphere for doom2, in the form of a single wad. But this wad has many many lumps. Over 20 lumps of decorate code, a LANGUAGE lump, SNDINFO for sounds and falloff volume settings, several GLDEF lumps for all my effects like rings, particles, glitter, and some scripting lumps, and sprites.
Even for a monster, I created SuperCyberdemon.wad, and I go as far as even have effects for his feet to generate dust off the ground and shake the screen with Quake. I have DECALDEF for his missile scorch marks on walls, I even go as far to generate brightmap sprites for dark maps.
At that rate, it would take an entire day just to do one weapon, if not more days.
All the sounds like Pickup, Idle, Charge-up, Charge-down, Fire, Projectile Explosion, Expire, Cock (no ammo), Swap, etc.
@unreal oyster Do you know if there are plans to improve that process? Not necessarily to stop using megatextures, but something to solve the problem of a person not having easy access to 300 cores, I guess.
unreal oyster
I don't know, sorry
warped radish
Okay.
light prism
how would you even do that
if you have access to a render farm, great, but even then it would still take fucking ages
especially compared to bsp node building
though a comparison is ridiculous
warped radish
I have no idea. 😃 I think we've gone too far ahead in tech, that there is no solution. It's better to stay low with lower tech., to keep the process simple, and more compatible with players around the globe that still use older/slower PCs.
This is exactly why Quake1 is still popular. Those players don't want to waste money on a new PC, just like people don't want to waste their money on a new car, or the next iPhone, etc.
light prism
but.. you dont need a new pc to play quake 2...
or 3... or 4...
quake1 is popular because of its gameplay
warped radish
gameplay is only good if you have good FPS though.
I'm talking about people that are still on older Pentium computers. I like the idea of supporting those.
And people on low-end laptops.
light prism
i sure hope nobody is still on an i586
they must be in a third world country at that state, how do they even have internet
lavish hollow
gameplay is only good if you have good FPS though.
ehh, I don't really agree
warped radish
Yes, third world.
El Jefe, that's one of the first thing pro players would do is setup their tweak config to lower all the settings to gain more FPS. Important for an FPS like Quake.
light prism
if youre some pro e-sports nugget then tweak your shit all the way
warped radish
😃
lavish hollow
@warped radish But saying it's "only good if fps is good" implies that fps is the only factor in judging gameplay
And I think that's a really bad way to judge gameplay
warped radish
Well, yes, the gameplay is good, but difficult to experience it with lower FPS, right?
lavish hollow
Of course
warped radish
I mean. You know what I mean.
lavish hollow
It's cool 👌
haughty flower
hello hello, i need some help regarding having dynamic max player health
currently i have an acs script that checks for SoulCount, which i already have changed several times, divides it by 2, and makes it the max player health
except it doesn't work even though i call it everytime a soul is picked up
haughty flower
oh shit it works, nevermind
covert galleon
haughty flower
it's just that i forgot to make the soulcount a custominventory iirc
oak kindle
hey does anybody have any tips on how to get motivated enough to make maps?
timber bridge
you can do the thing i believe in you
red peak
lie down and think of a situation
go to your editor of choice and build the situation
experiment with editor functions
haughty flower
hello guys. do you know if there is a single wad for master levels for doom 2 or i have to do it myself?
hallow wraith
there is a single wad
@haughty flower mstrlvl2.wad has all the master levels in it i think
haughty flower
@hallow wraith i'll try it out
zinc egret
It seems SLADE chokes on very large audio files..
Say MP3 or OGG files that are longer than 20 minutes.
zinc egret
That or the file size associated with it. And SLADE downright refusing to open the WAD file after it's over 300 MB
light prism
having 20 minute long audio... why
zinc egret
Music? Trying to use Aubrey Hodges' extended tracks?
My next alternative is try using the base OGG (likely quality 10?) and compressing them to a lower quality
zinc egret
Maybe using PK3 format as container might work
SLADE gave me an error trying to read the WAD file and now it opens?
knotty plaza
thoughts on this?
red peak
Very empty
knotty plaza
yeah
it's meant to be the spawn point
the marble icon is a door
leading to a boss room
knotty plaza
This is the final version. thoughts?
prisma saddle
The room just, seems too square.
hallow wraith
i can't think of what to make after the first 2 or 3 rooms
red peak
When in doubt, fill corridor with swarms of cacodemons
knotty plaza
yes
@hallow wraith I think at the end of the corridor, have a large dining room with former sargeants or imps at the seats.
maybe a hell knight too
hallow wraith
Ok ... im still learning how to make my level play and look interesting.... ive played alot of great wads in past and im still learning how to make my wads feel like those
ill try the dining table thing that sounds cool
red peak
I tried the table concept for one of my first levels
The folks at Doomworld didn't like it because the table got in the way of fighting
knotty plaza
tables should only be used, in my opinion, in large rooms or in small rooms with no enemies in.
which is why I said the room should be large
flat storm
I just put a simple 3d floor into my map, and now gzdoom flickers like crazy in game. Is this because I'm on an intel HD graphics card?
light prism
seems more likely you're trying to overlap that 3d floor on an existing surface
and the flickering is z-fighting of which surface wants to display
flat storm
it flickers everything on the whole screen, no matter where I stand
light prism
oh.. maybe youre inside the 3d floor?
flat storm
I'm just trying to do gallows like in Gothic
flat storm
a control sector pointing to the sector I want. I'm not sure if that's different
light prism
yes but what are the specific parameters of the line action
like type = solid alpha = 255 etc
flat storm
yes, that was it
light prism
are you sure its tagged to the right secto0r
flat storm
I think so
flat storm
just gzdoom
I think it might be an intel driver thing, even with the doom 2 iwad the menu flickers like crazy
flat storm
I did just try it in regular Zdoom and it doesn;t give me that issue
so I'm assuming its an intel driver issue
hallow wraith
i seem to have issues placing monsters in a way that they don't see the player automaticly? any advice?
also one the revenants i placed on the turret tower doesn't seem to be a threat
light prism
the only reasons that could happen are a) you have the monster set to 'dormant', b) the sector the monster is in is either disconnected or dereferenced from its surrounding sectors or c) there are visibility blocking lines between the monster and the player
light prism
it should still fire missiles but if he is high up they will just slam against the ground
depending on the size of his platform
light prism
that is not high at all
hallow wraith
does it need to be higher?
hallow wraith
nope he moves around
light prism
well then he's just a shit revenant
hallow wraith
maybe the basement area needs to be bigger and ill put 4 revenants instead of 1
ill make the ledge bigger
i think its the support beams... i made the ledge bigger and now have 4 revenants and they are firing alot now
im slowly figuring out this monster stuff
it doesn't look castle basementy enough yet
light prism
needs more princesses in dungeons
hallow wraith
i want to make it shaped better
light prism
thats what she said
flat storm
welp the eagles are getting butt raped. Back to mapping. 😦
light prism
on stage?!?!
flat storm
stage, lincoln financial field, what's the difference?
light prism
eagles, THE eagles, whats the difference
light prism
gross
muted wing
Goddamnit. A_FireProjectile does not work in a zscript method anymore
as of 3.2.5
any ideas for a work around?
muted wing
nevermind, fixed
red peak
I've made a crusher setup that simulates a water pump and crushes a keen, which in turn opens a door via tag 666
It doesn't work, however
Can anyone help?
tender sorrel
can keen be crushed considering he hangs from ceiling?
if all else fails, add a barrel there somewhere
red peak
If I kill the Keen myself, the door opens
Wonder why the crusher killing it doesn't work
It also appears to be immune to barrels
vast shore
Hi
knotty plaza
Texture "SHCGA0", 114, 83
{
Offset -104, -85
Patch "CHGGA0", 0, 0
{
Blend "#808080"
}
}
Texture "SHCGB0", 114, 81
{
Offset 0, -83
Patch "CHGGB0", 0, 0
{
Blend "#808080"
}
}
Texture "SGUNA0", 54, 16
{
Offset 25, 18
Patch "MGUNA0", 0, 0
{
Blend "#808080"
}
}
is there anything wrong with this code?
wait nvm
I figured it out
knotty plaza
my god I was being stupid af
light prism
like most modding issues
vocal crypt
I'm doing a gay idea\
the monsters have 1HP
all of em
but so do you
Really I'm just bored
so I'm doing it for shits and giggles.
vocal crypt
fuck how do you change the player's starting health
nevermind
ah finally
you die in one shot
enemies die in one shot.
Now I should have a flashy minigun to mow monsters down in custom levels.
vocal crypt
hmm
anyway so the player can't get weapons?
So they can't get a shotgun from level 1 of Doom 2
maybe I should increase their damage as well, the enemies
vocal crypt
no
the monsters
ugh
sorry
How do I make the player not get items
since apparently getting health packs increases it to normal.
Unless I should keep that
but make weapons unobtainable.
vocal crypt
in the brackets, or before the brackets?
light prism
inside the actor definition but not inside the state definitions
in the same place where you have the properties like health and such
vocal crypt
Nice
should I also include a Chainsaw.
ooh
maybe I should make an invasion map with the 1HP thing.
and melee only.
light prism
bear in mind that with -PICKUP your player will literally not be able to pick up anything ever
so if you want to have a weapon you'll need him to start with it
vocal crypt
Did that
starts with fist and a chainsaw.
anyway.
hmmm.
I do need a theme for the map tho
can't have hitscans because that'd be a major PITA.
light prism
applesauce factory
light prism
well it has walls and a floor usually
ceiling is optional but preferred due to health and safety regulations
vocal crypt
should the players start outside and then enter it?
light prism
if they have protection
vocal crypt
should it be with hell textures or nah
vocal crypt
a hellish Applesauce Factory
gg
lol
actually thinking about it
the players should be defending the factory
eh
mostly because invasion
I'd expect a hell factory to be unregulated....hell.
light prism
no
are you dense
beaureacrats are evil
therefore they go to hell when they die
so a hell factory would be incredibly well organized and efficient
vocal crypt
okay
muted wing
bureaucrats
incredibly well organized and efficient
Pick one
light prism
fair enough
timber bridge
yea but the people getting tortured aren't the one giving orders
vocal crypt
oh fuq
that One Punch mod
woops
not one punch
the 1 health thing
with nuts.wad
okay for some reason imp fireballs can't hurt each other
or maybe they can
it's just there's so many imps it's hard to see
I could do some weird Arcade Doom thing.
light prism
no, imp fireballs wont hurt other imps
@timber bridge - Depends, I have read fiction where it is possible to rise up the ranks in hell
light prism
oh right non-fiction hell
cerulean frigate
Does anyone here know much about Python?
I'm trying to get a script to run
And it's giving me errors
haughty flower
Hi
cerulean frigate
I'm using one in Maya
It's a script to convert meshes to voxels
It tells me to load up the .mll file first into the plugin manager
Then to run the .py file in the script manager
When i try running the .mll file, i get this error message
// Error: file: C:/Program Files/Autodesk/Maya2014/scripts/others/pluginWin.mel line 658: The specified module could not be found.
(VoxelMesh)
And i think because of that, i can't run the .py file correctly
@light prism Any idea what this might mean?
light prism
mmmm
the voxelmesh module is not installed
python does dependencies a bit annoying
you need to install it manually
cerulean frigate
Alright
The video i saw just loaded up the two files without any problems
And i am using the correct versions for Maya
light prism
hmm i cant even find VoxelMesh as a python package
cerulean frigate
This is the script
When i run the .py file it loads the interface for it, but trying to use it gives another error
Error: AttributeError: file <maya console> line 128: 'module' object has no attribute 'voxelMesh'
Which i assume is because the .mll didn't load first hand
I know next to nothing about python
Am i supposed to install a separate file for the plugin to work when Maya loads it up?
As in something other then what came with the file
light prism
yes, that is what a dependency is generally, a library external to the code itself
python comes with a program called 'pip' which connects to a database to find and install relevant versions of things you ask for
so you'd go to pythons dir and type like 'pip install voxelmesh'
cerulean frigate
And if it's not there, i have to track it down and install it?
light prism
you need to at least know what the name of the package is
i did a google for voxelmesh and cant find anything relevant so far
sorry eating
cerulean frigate
This is hard for me to figure out
I have no experience handling scripts like this
cerulean frigate
Can the .py file be the package i need to install?
light prism
no
if you open it you'll see at the top it probably says #import voxelmesh (as something)
at the top
that .py file is assumedly what maya uses to er.. convert meshes to voxels or vice versa, or whatever its for
cerulean frigate
Yeah it says "import maya.cmds as cmds
@package voxelMesher
Mesh voxelization UI class" at the top in the script editor
light prism
well err
find your python directory
there'll be pip in a subfolder
and do pip install voxelmesher
in commandline
cerulean frigate
Ok i just installed Python
Can't figure out where it installed
Does it make a difference if i installed Python 2 or 3?
Ok i found it in the script editor sub folder, but it auto closes when i try to open it
light prism
you need to open a command prompt there
do shift-right click in the window and 'open command line window'
then do pip install voxelizer
im just assuming thats what its called
cerulean frigate
All i got with shift right click was Windows PowerShell
I tried to use that command in it
Didn't work
This is the right place?
cerulean frigate
"Retrying (Retry(total=0, connect=None, read=None, redirect=None)) after connection broken by 'ProtocolError('Connection aborted.', error(10013, 'An attempt was made to access a socket in a way forbidden by its access permissions'))': /simple/voxelmesher/"
light prism
well thats a whole nother can of worms
sounds like your router or possibly pc/firewall or antivirus is blocking the port it uses
cerulean frigate
"Could not find a version that satisfies the requirement voxelizer (from versions: ) No matching distribution found for voxelizer"
I get that ^ even when the firewall is disabled
But it did get rid of the above error
light prism
well im pretty much out of ideas then
you need to find out the exact name or version of the module
cerulean frigate
Is there a place in the script i can look that says what it is?
light prism
you already said
VoxelMesher
but it might be like
spelled differently or have hyphenation or something
cerulean frigate
I thought it was voxelMesh
But that didn't work either
It's what the error message said it was looking for
cerulean frigate
I can try asking around some more
Thanks for all the help
The fix always ends up being something stupidly simple
light prism
or translated from chinese
cerulean frigate
That too
light prism
congrat-shoe-lations
forest wagon
I'm ofc further along than the blog implies but still, fun to document the story
forest wagon
Are you making a waifu based doom mod?
tender sorrel
Ive already made it, I keep making updates to it nowdays
it lacks rare armors
so I'm focusing on those at the moment, this being one of em
light prism
can i voice act tailor girl
lavish hollow
yeah have this British dude voice your female character
who I would think is French or something
prisma saddle
Mistercat sounds more like a Kiwilander than a brit.
lavish hollow
(Joke)
prisma saddle
And I just sound like a moron who can't speak good.
lavish hollow
You can't speak at all
Last voice chat we had you were just like "NGYAYAFJDKE"
I recorded it and played it backwards and it was the Pokemon theme song
golden drum
you just gonna take that, mistercat?
FIGHT FIGHT FIGHT FIGHT
light prism
take what
lavish hollow
I called you British
tender sorrel
well if i ever make a pop team epic suit ill call you
timber bridge
🍿 🇫🇷
forest wagon
Nowt wrong with being a brit m8
tender sorrel
timber bridge
kerrets
slow galleon
runs on doom2, replaces map10, and has four secrets
warped radish
Terminal, show screenshot of grid view in doombuilder?
light prism
one of the secrets is that its a terrywad
quasi parrot
i managed to lock myself out of the blue key room
slow galleon
lavish hollow
Green
slow galleon
it is my first ((serious)) wad/map?, so there might be issues with the level design
@warped radish here you go
light prism
that reminds me of 'the tallest' from zim
slow galleon
lol
warped radish
@slow galleon I would remove some of the blue bottles, and re-positioning slightly so they are not a straight line and appear more sporadic.
The 3 barrels is nice, but slightly too close to eachother. Sprites overlapping. Spread them apart by a few units.
The green trap door can close while player still stands in doorway. If play backs up, he is locked out forever.
The soulsphere room is flagged as a secret, however you have arrows pointing to that room and it's the only room for the player to travel next to, to proceed.
The keen doll is too high. Lower a chunk of the ceiling there.
Using torches to indicate color of locked doors is different. Most players may not like that, as they are more familiar with the standard key/skull textures.
The red key room has no difficulty. Blue room (before hand) was impossible to beat, because trapped in small room with 2 revs.
With enough dancing around, the 2 viles will eventually die. But I'm thinking maybe only 1 vile is needed to achieve the same goal of being challenging.
The yellow key door doesn't look like a door. Players have to scrub the wall to find it.
The exit door doesn't look like an exist door, and I was able to exit without finding/entering the yellow key.
Otherwise, the map looks good. Nice design and texturing.
slow galleon
@warped radish
The yellow key door doesn't look like a door. Players have to scrub the wall to find it.
it was supposed to be a secret room
The keen doll is too high. Lower a chunk of the ceiling there.
i'll probably just remove it
The soulsphere room is flagged as a secret, however you have arrows pointing to that room and it's the only room for the player to travel next to, to proceed.
made it that way, so i could kind of throw you off, and make you think there wouldn't be a secret in that room. i also wanted people to be able to find their way out, but struggle during the panic with the revs.
The red key room has no difficulty. Blue room (before hand) was impossible to beat, because trapped in small room with 2 revs.
i thought it would have been overkill for the red room, and the blue key room wasn't even a thing when i made the red key room. so that probably has something to do with the balancing
With enough dancing around, the 2 viles will eventually die. But I'm thinking maybe only 1 vile is needed to achieve the same goal of being challenging.
the challenge was supposed to drive you to find the yellow key. (thats what i was thinking)
The 3 barrels is nice, but slightly too close to eachother. Sprites overlapping. Spread them apart by a few units.
will do, and thank you.
thank you for your insight, and thank you for playing! :)
haughty flower
@tender sorrel omg hentai doom?
oak kindle
doesn't that already exist
lavish hollow
Yes
knotty plaza
the question is why does it exist?
quasi parrot
Is there any resources or guides that are easily accessible for what to do and what not to do with mapping, or how to use certain door types and things like that
quasi parrot
Alright, i figure i can get most things down through simple testing around and from what i can remember from a years ago, but ill definitely have some issues
warped radish
@quasi parrot https://zdoom.org/wiki/tutorials#External_links
quasi parrot
@warped radish oh cool, thanks
warped radish
Yup
There's also some guides called "What NOT to do in Wads", "How id Software did it", "Traits/features you DON'T like seeing in levels". Or at least, that's what I remember them being called, but I can't seem the find them. But I remember reading cool things from the "How id Software did it" guide. Everytime I google that name, I end up finding a mapwad instead of a guide.
quasi parrot
Man my hallways always turn out more narrow than i expect
light prism
256 minimum dawg
quasi parrot
that seems a bit large doesnt it
light prism
that is four doomguys wide
well
four and a bit
thats enough for you to comfortably dodge around things and pass enemies
i mean, for comparison
this is 128px wide/high
(maybe not in the preview but in game)
warped radish
Vienna, I personally do 192. 128 is the norm though, and I did 128 for many years before, following what the original maps did.
light prism
the original maps were pretty tight in places
episode 1 had a good variety of closed corridors and open areas
slow galleon
so, i made another map, feel free to try it out, and give me your feedback on it!
-runs best on zdoom
-doom 2
-may experence skybox issues on gzdoom
this is my first time messing with a skybox, so if it is aweful i am sorry.
warped radish
Someone else will have to. I only review maps once a year.
warped radish
Nice, Mistercat.
light prism
this is an okay wad
slow galleon
darnt you got me
prisma saddle
I don't know how I feel about the first revenant.
light prism
its very linear though
tender sorrel
timber bridge
oof
warped rampart
So, are A_Raise and A_Lower required when I'm making a weapon?
I want to have custom raise/lower animations
warped radish
@warped rampart sort of. here is how it's done: https://pastebin.com/j3YspKLs
Note the Goto Ready+8 you would use that in any places you normally have Goto Ready. You need that +8 or however many frames your animation will be.
Uh, that weaponup sound is commented out because there is already Weapon.UpSound "weapons/Up" setting for the weapon itself.
and uh, having weapondown sound may conflict (i guess not if you had a custom animation for a_lower) with Weapon.UpSound of other weapons you're switching too.
warped rampart
So, if I'm reading the example correctly (which I'm probably not), the Select state has kind of an instantaneous A_Raise?
warped radish
Yes, it's my understanding that is needed. It's okay though since it's a blank sprite with 0 tics. The "Ready" state has your custom a_raise animation.
The GGNU frames.
Once those frames are played, the Ready state continues to loop on the GGNG frame.
warped rampart
Can sprites from another state (i.e. GGNU) also be used in the Ready state, or will I need separate sprites for those?
warped radish
Sure. If I understand correctly, you don't need separate sprites.
warped rampart
Ah, gotcha.
Sorry for asking so many questions, I saw Beautiful Doom use custom select animations and kinda flipped because I didn't know that was a thing. I'm wanting to put it in a mod I'm working on
warped radish
Like, that GGNG A sprite could've been GGNU I.
Just comes down to how you want to organize and name your sprites for the different states your weapon will have. G for gun. U for up. F for fire. etc.
let's say you have a custom a_lower animation (for your Deselect state). you may just re-use the GGNU sprites, in reverse order. heh
It's fine. After 5 years in, I have enough material and knowledge now to answer these questions.
light prism
'sprites from another state' is irrelevant, you can call whatever sprites you want whereever you want
sprites do not 'belong' to a state
warped radish
^
warped rampart
In my head, it made sense that if I tried to use a sprite from the Fire state in the Ready state, it would cause errors, for some reason :P
light prism
it will look funny probably, that would be the only error
warped radish
in the past, I've used the doom2 rocket launcher missile sprites MISL A,B,C in my own stuff, just for testing. lol
vocal crypt
fuuuu
don't know where to take my one health mod
other than an AK47 gunning down enemies raking up a score.
light prism
what is love
half adder
Hey does anyone know how to make a rolling/sliding projectile in ZDoom? I can't really seem to figure it out. I need to avoid floor hugger cause I want this projectile to be able to slide off platforms without immediately jolting down. But projectiles that don't bounce just explode upon floor contact. And bouncing doesn't exactly seem to fix it either?
warped rampart
half adder
I need to avoid floor hugger cause I want this projectile to be able to slide off platforms without immediately jolting down
half adder
ive tried a lot and im starting to think it's maybe impossible in this engine? Either way, it's gonna require a hacky method possibly
light prism
im pretty sure there is a combination of bounceflags that will allow for this
half adder
I came up with one hacky method that calls A_Recoil each frame, and this does work almost as I want it to, but problems come up with Monsters shooting the projectile. Players shoot it perfectly, but monsters seem to shoot in in a static direction almost
Is there a bounceflag that ignores floor bounces?
cause that's more or less just what I need
light prism
you can just modify the BounceFactor
half adder
I need the projectile to not ever call Death upon touching floor
I tried something like that
light prism
it will depend on the bounce type too
half adder
but I remember it using up all the bounces and exploding on the floor anyways
I was using Hexen mostly
half adder
I'll give classic a shot
light prism
you can also make bounce states
so if you want it to explode on walls just have a Bounce.Wall: goto Death
needs the +USEBOUNCESTATE flag
so i would say classic bouncer with usebouncestate, with a bouncefactor of 0, and the above wall method
half adder
yeah I'm already doing usebouncestate
Your method seems to work! It just somehow never dawned on me to use Classic BounceType
thank you very much Mister Cat (:
light prism
toxic terrace
Two thumbs up says the president.
lavish hollow
Actually his mouth is closed
He can't say anything
Plus he's already giving two thumbs up, why would he feel the need to say as such
Does he intend for the thumbs to be added up
Four thumbs, dare he?
timber bridge
and by the way the FBI memo was released
vocal crypt
How do you replace the intermission music
When I try it I just get the normal D2 one.
warped radish
name your music lump as D_DM2INT
warped radish
@vocal crypt
vocal crypt
Alright
vocal crypt
didn't work
warped radish
make sure you load your wad.
what wads are you loading, and show a screenshot of your slade or xwe
light prism
i saw this lady last night at the event i was workin who reminded me of la tailor girl
timber bridge
inb4 it was actually that girl
light prism
well she was short, stocky but voluptuous, and had long red hair
so pretty accurate yes
timber bridge
shortstacks 👌
light prism
she even had the hotpants / halter top going on
which in retrospect was probably not a great move for that body type in real life
shadow bone
Tangential because that reminded me of a terrible outfit choice I saw recently (Yes, I know this is off-topic but hopefully doesn't derail too badly)
So imagine the bustiest girl you know, wearing a turtleneck.
light prism
what a waste
shadow bone
Then imagine her wearing a low-cut tshirt over that turtleneck
Then imagine her pushing her be-sweatered boobs out of the low-cut tshirt
Like, completely out
light prism
what a waste of a good shirt
light prism
well, thats subjective, not particularly attracted to insanely massive honkers myself
unkempt wadi
that sounds like the exact kind of outfit i would design for a character and i'm taking it
light prism
make her wear a thong over jean shorts with fishnets and gumboots
unkempt wadi
question: was it a short or long sleeved t-shirt
this is important because only one of those could ever look good
ember smelt
prisma saddle
Yup, plenty.
unkempt wadi
in the mapinfo lump
GameInfo
{
TitlePage = "[yourimage]"
}
hot
slow galleon
it looks good
vocal crypt
I'm stuck with no direction for my one health mod
I was thinking of some ArcadeDoom thing, but I think that's been done before
Could do classes with a different type of weapon
only one tho
vocal crypt
fuq
can't seem to find anything on replacing music during the text screens in Doom 2.
light prism
yeah, do a mario style thing
where you have an ability while you have max health
rather
have it so you can have 2 health max
vocal crypt
a life system thing?
light prism
yeah
vocal crypt
inb4 having more than one gun is an ability
light prism
iunno, destroyable blocks is what mario did
so why not something related to level geometry
light prism
like being able to jump
to reach alternate paths or something
breakable walls
or is this purely meant for gameplay mod and not mapset
vocal crypt
gameplay mod
I can't do mapping
And I'm trying to figure out the music thing for those text screens
rather, the name of the song file
light prism
D_DM2INT?
vocal crypt
no, that's Intermission IIRC
I'm talking about the text screens that happen before a level, like level 7 of Doom 2
hexed sky
minecrap
prisma saddle
I might make a blob dinosaur themed slaughter map.
timber bridge
doom scp? 
light prism
screw that
timber bridge
careful that screw could lead to an XK end of the world class scenario
or some [REDACTED] shit
light prism
theres not much more that can be done with an scp game
all the well known ones are in containment breach
all the weird ones have no apparent gameplay value
like how do you meaningfully include half a cat in your game
or the fact that I am a toaster
and all the memetics and shit
even containment breach could only do so much with memetics
'look at something, die after a while'
flat storm
is there anywhere else to download OBLIGE besides sourceforge? still dont trust that place
flat storm
the malware business a few years back
light prism
oh
vocal crypt
ugh...still no direction with that one health mod.
Might actually go with classes with a different weapon
different orientation
like one class is melee, one is guns, another is explosives.
Dunno
throwing shit at a wall and see if it sticks
light prism
have you tried eating glue
dusk terrace
uhh is there a way i can make sprites smaller
warped radish
Isn't there a scale parameter?
light prism
you can make actors smaller with the scale parameter in their decorate
however this is hud
so you need to define the sprite under the TEXTURES lump
and use xscale and yscale there
vocal crypt
is there a way to make certain items spawn when playing a class? Ex. only want an AK47 to spawn for X class, but not for Y class.
gritty sun
In doom builder you can set it that way as long as you have the map in a udmf format.
split obsidian
Hey, I'm looking to start working with GZDoom Builder and would like some starter tips
Anyone got any advice, like places to start, resources, etc?
Like which game configuration do i use. Should I be using UDMF or something else?
light prism
use udmf
it has the most customisability
hotkeys, (S)ector mode, (L)ine, (T)hing, (M)ake sector (converts a closed line shape to a new sector)
Ctrl-(D)raw
shift-(C)urve (curves a selected line)
split obsidian
Ok.
And how about custom weapons?
I am very new to this so maybe custom weapons should be saved for later, but I am just wondering so I have the knowledge when I implement them
I've heard that SLADE is better at implementing weapons than GZDoom Builder. Is this true, and if so should I use Slade for weapon coding and GZDB for everything else?
light prism
yeah thats not really part of gzdb
slade is a lump management tool primarily, that has a map editor built in
gzdb is a map editor that has a script editor (for ACS)
you dont NEED a lump management tool however, you can literally just open notepad and save to a correct file/directory structure
doesnt even need to be zipped, you can literally just drag/drop a project folder onto g/zdoom.exe
split obsidian
Ah. Would using Slade make things easier (or at least a bit more comprehensible) or should I just stick with notepad
light prism
it does make some things ostensibly easier
like aligning offsets on sprites
however with practise you can do that without it too
split obsidian
Ok, thanks
I'll likely use it for now, at least to get a handle of it.
But anyway, thanks, and If I need any more help I'll come back here
split obsidian
Stairs are a bit of a pain to make, what with the sides of every elevated platform being untextured.
Is there a more efficent way to prevent this untexturing other than choosing a texture individually for each stair or no
light prism
go into 3d mode and just select em all and paste
ctrl-c and ctrl-v work
shift-ctrl-c/v will copy/paste ALL info from one line to another (line action, parameters, all other properties)
shift-middle mouse will paste to all contiguous lines with the same texture
split obsidian
ok
light prism
btw in 3d mode:
t to toggle things, tab to toggle 'advanced effects' (gzdoom stuff, 3d floors, models, lighting, slopes, etc)
h to toggle hilighting of selection
b fullbright
g toggle gravity
mousewheel changes sector heights, holding ctrl-mousewheel changes surface brightness (any surface type in UDMF)
however doing it to a floor will affect the entire sector brightness
prisma saddle
Neato.
timber bridge
he will clean all evil
light prism
heh
slow galleon
light prism
show me what you got
vocal crypt
yeah, starting area seems a bit loaded for starting out with a SSG.
light prism
uh
theres just too many enemies at too many vectors
you have the whole spectrum covered really
meat shields, projectiles and hitscans
what i would do is uh
delay the monster closets
or make them regular doors
or give the player a chaingun
because with ssg you're lucky to take out one shotgunner at a time while trying to avoid all the other shit
and theyre completely surrounding you with no cover
light prism
nope
slow galleon
how?
light prism
im sorry did you not read my criticism
the first room is too busy and doesnt offer you any cover or chance to stunlock enemies
scroll up for the rest
slow galleon
i can do it
my friend can do it
it's not that hard
i don't even know why i am complaining about this, it's not like you're obligated to play my map.
thank you for your input
unreal oyster
Not to be rude but you won't exactly make other people want to playtest your map by having that attitude about simple criticism
You being able to get past a challenge is a given and it means absolutely nothing since you made the map
Everybody who makes a map is better at that map than people who are new to playing it
And apart from that, that leaves your friend, which is a sample size of 1, so, not anything to draw conclusions on difficulty about
slow galleon
@unreal oyster i just felt like he dropped the entire thing, not even wanting to try it after he saw there was a slight extremity in the challenge, not even giving the rest of the map a chance. not only that, he has a history of calling my maps "terry wads" without even playing them, so feelings are already not very sympathetic with this person in particular. it's not that i can't take criticism, it's that it is done by someone i already have an undesirable past with, and the fact he gave me a sarcastic remark after asking him a simple question didn't make feel better. if it sounded like my remarks (quoted),
wait so you haven't even gotten past the start?
were loaded, i am sorry. i do appreciate the feedback.
i switched the chaingunners with shotgunners, it's in the most recent upload. if anyone is interested.
light prism
the point is that the map starts you off in the center of a circular room with hitscanners lining all the walls, and you only have a super shotgun
even if it was JUST those enemies there is no way for you to not take at least some damage
but instead, as soon as you try moving around, all the doors open and you have barons, demons, imps all thrown at you at once
from all sides
look at chillax, it has thousands of monsters thrown at you at once, but you have room to dodge, manuever and take cover on those maps
there is NO cover on your map
and the odds of being able to succesfully manuever between the released hordes is pretty much down to the PRNG
its not like I didnt try, I played it a good 10 times or so
i would say its a pretty much unspoken rule that you dont completely surround a player with hitscanners
slow galleon
alright, so i got rid of two shotgunners in each cage, then replaced the leftover shotgunners with imps, now the 6 imps that were on the ground are 3 shotgunners and three chaingunners
vocal crypt
still lacking cover tho
slow galleon
the post is cover-ish. i mean, i intended for the place to open, and kind want to keep it open.
should i swap out the chaingunners with former humans?
vocal crypt
IMO yes, otherwise they'd rip your ass a new one.
vocal crypt
seems it's still a bit loaded at the beginning, with the player having an SSG. Maybe you can do timed traps or ambushes
or when the current enemies are killed such traps/ambushes are opened
slow galleon
what do you mean?
vocal crypt
A mod of mine
Nearly everything has one health
And different classes
Mod I'm making rn that is
"making"
icy compass
well i modded the universal gibs mod and got it working with the Chex Quest Quadrilogy 100%.
and I fixed the problem with it giving massive neon red blood blood splatter
gotta video if any1 wants to see how i modded it in action
vocal crypt
Seems like a palette problem
icy compass
and it was a palette problem. pretty ez to fix honestly. as it wont really a zscript problem. just had to alter 1 photo from white to black and it fixed the problem
to getit working for Chex Quest Quadrilogy tho I had to remove a few sprites then i changed the palette to quite a few from red to green and then had to alter a tad of zscript with a new hex code
knotty plaza
ACTOR ItemCrate : CustomInventory 6666
{
Inventory.PickupMessage "You obtained a weapon!"
Inventory.PickupSound "misc/p_pkup"
Translation "112:127=174:191"
+COUNTITEM
states
{
Spawn:
AMMO A -1
stop
Pickup:
TNT1 A 0 A_JumpIfInventory("Boss1Thing",1,"Boss1")
TNT1 A 0 A_JumpIfInventory("Boss2Thing",1,"Boss2")
TNT1 A 0 A_JumpIfInventory("Boss3Thing",1,"Boss3")
stop
Boss1:
TNT1 A 0 A_GiveInventory("BossPowers2",1)
stop
Boss2:
TNT1 A 0 A_GiveInventory("CyberPower2",1)
stop
Boss3:
TNT1 A 0 A_GiveInventory("SpiderPower2",1)
stop
}
}
this should give each specific class the weapon they need
because they're holding a custom inventory item
but it doesn't give any weapons
anyone know what's wrong with it?
and, it doesn't even pick up