reason graf would be displeased with it is probably because it means more hacky shit to maintain backwards compatibility with
#classic-doom-maps-mods
unreal oyster
prisma saddle
Oh.
light prism
you can have animated brightmaps
royal wave
last I tried it didn't work
light prism
kevansevans: you have to animate a texture, and each texture gets it's own brightmap
what are you expecting
an animated brightmap on a static surface?
prisma saddle
Yeah, that'd be radical.
unreal oyster
if it's vital you can write a very simple shader to do that
just store all the brightmaps on one texture and cycle through them according to the timer
light prism
true
royal wave
Doesn't that desync when the player pauses?
unreal oyster
not if we're talking about animated textures, but with actors then yeah i guess
royal wave
This was long ago, i forget why I wanted this
light prism
if you wanted it for shadows then you'd still end up having to make a bunhc of custom textures
unreal oyster
animated textures don't pause with the game so those would sync up
royal wave
Another thing I think would be cool would be texture masks
you define a hex to be transparent
then say Texture A is to be drawn over Texture B
light prism
you could probs do that with shaders too
royal wave
Probably
but I'm someone who always pushes for the easier option
Lot easier to have a lump say "Texture A -> Texture B" than figuring out the math needed for a shader
light prism
the thing is there would be both regardless
you would have a simple definition that activates the shader
royal wave
you can already do what I'm suggesting with the texturedef lump anyways, but defining a specific hex to be transparent would greatly make it easier
light prism
or you could just have textures with transparent areas that have physical space behind them with other textures
unreal oyster
the thing with shaders like that is that you need to have both source images on the image that's using the shader
since you can't use two textures in a shader
royal wave
Plus that trick only works with mid textures
light prism
its noticeable but at 1px its only jarring if you're sitting right in its face
royal wave
Well guess what I ended up having when I thought of it
Also transparency still only works with mid textures
light prism
yeah, it is limited to areas that can have space behind them, true
unreal oyster
essentially what you do with shaders like that is you modulo the uv coord by x to get the coordinate on the left side of the texture, then add x to get the coordinate on the right side of the texture, then do whatever funky stuff in the GLSL code you want with both texels
royal wave
That could work
But then it'd be difficult to tessalate it
because then you'd need to add a break point at each seam and realign
unreal oyster
it would be cleaner if you could use 2 textures in a shader rather than just one, but that ain't an option
what do you mean by that?
royal wave
What you're proposing above is one texture, right?
That means, for example, you wanted a giant wall
All it'd do is just swap the pixels, so in order to hide the right/left side, you'd need to split the line defs at every spot it was meant to loop
unreal oyster
nah you wouldn't need to do that, the modulo by x prevents that
royal wave
then you'd have to manually align each section, because pressing A on it would just put the seams at where the texture actually ends
unreal oyster
the modulo moves the coordinate relative to the left hand side before processing
so it'd look shitty in-editor but work out in game
royal wave
hmmmm
Still doesn't defeat the easy of defining a color in the lump
but it'd definitely be more flexible if it could allow an arbitrary ammount of textures to use
light prism
probably easier to write a simple script to generate TEXTURES/ANIMDEFs animations
royal wave
Define a new player class to use
make sure the startitem flag does not include the pistol
light prism
royal wave
or that
light prism
do you want the player to never have any weapon?
royal wave
Though the playerclass method will allow the player to still use the pistol
light prism
or just replacing the pistol with something else
covert plover
no no you just start with the fist
royal wave
Then the playerclass method is what you want
covert plover
oh shit thanks just noticed it
royal wave
you will also need to tell the game to use the class as well
in your mapinfo lump, put this block in it:
PlayerClasses = "MyPlayer"
}```MyPlayer obviously being the name of decorate/zscript playerclass you make
covert plover
thanks B)
haughty flower
rip drpg turret, just stripped 4000 lines of codes from it. all gone ๐
light prism
gj
true galleon
imagetool macos pls
true galleon
can gimp convert to font lumps
light prism
i dont know, probably
royal wave
Slade can
warped rampart
So how would one go about adding an alt fire to a gun? Can I just add an "altfire" state to a weapon's Decorate script?
light prism
yep
AltFire, AltFlash, etc etc
youll need to define an ammunition type for it too
there are several properties and flags for that stuff
gritty sun
Would one be able to toss a wad/level in here and get an opinion of its current state?
light prism
don't toss your wad around in public
gritty sun
Amusingly unamusing.
gritty sun
I was more so asking if it was okay to just toss it in here and ask for opinions.
light prism
this is map-mod-dev, that is like half of what the channel is for
gritty sun
Okay, just making sure.
Tested mostly in GZDoom, but should be capatible with Zandro as well.
lavish hollow
@warped rampart gunlabs.blogspot.com
That site has an article for alt fires and such
gritty sun
@golden drum It does not. It was just designed for up to 2 players.
gritty sun
Incomplete.
golden drum
alrighty
Well anyway it seems pretty legit to me
I\Although I think the player should start with the little shotgun shrine thing infront of him
rather than it being to the players back
I missed it first few runs
gritty sun
The player starts in a drop pod, the weapon being there made the most sense.
I could try and move the player start back a bit so you pick it up as you move out of the pod.
light prism
Make it so your drop pod lands on a shotgunner
golden drum
the pod
Oh and also, it would benefit from a MAPINFO
But yeah maybe have multiple smaller pods with one containing the shotgun
like on halo
sort-of
gritty sun
I could do that.
And I have no idea what the "MAPINFO" is.
golden drum
It's basically a text file in your WAD that contains some metadata for your map
But more importantly, it lets you set the name, music and sky for the map
As well as setting whether or not the player can jump or crouch
defaultmap {
lightmode = 2
}
map MAP01 "The Beacon" {
music = "D_e3m3"
sky1 = "SKY1", 0
sky2 = "SKY2", 0
next = "MAP02"
NoJump
NoCrouch
}
There's an example for you
golden drum
The run-down look of the underground base is really good
and how the walls are blown out and extend into caves
Pgud
gritty sun
What skill level did you play it on?
gritty sun
Okay. I've been trying to implement skill level as well.
golden drum
one sec
Time for an ultra-violence speedrun
Oh also, about the shotgun. You have to go around the pod to pick it up
feels kinda awkward
royal wave
Do people these days still account for difficulty?
gritty sun
I am able to pick it up from all sides of the pod.
light prism
I try to balance for difficulties
gritty sun
I don't know if others do, but I just figured it would be a nice challenge for myself while making it.
I know not everyone plays on the same diffculty, so scaling it seemed like an appropriate idea.
golden drum
Ye it gets savage on UV
Not a HUGE deal, but I think you should put in some extra shotgun ammo at the start
Because you get the sg, and it runs out of ammo 15 seconds in
gritty sun
Think I'll do that drop pod for the gun like you suggested and have some ammo in there with it.
golden drum
alright
oh btw is this just a one map thing or no?
how many maps are making for this wad
gritty sun
It will be a one map thing, but plan to have all 6 keys incorperated.
golden drum
oh nice
gritty sun
The first 2 versions were only 3 keys, but I had barely any mapping skills then, tried to make it a bit more advanced on the third version, but wasn't quite working how I wanted, so I'm just doing a complete rework with this version.
golden drum
Well it's definately turning out well
gritty sun
Thank you. Did you find the secret?
golden drum
The one where you shoot/punch the keypad?
ye
That's a cool secret
I did one similar to that before
gritty sun
*secrets
gritty sun
Yeah, I saw something like it somewhere and thought it would be a cool idea.
golden drum
this is actually a map20 replacement, since this is going to be part of megawad
Incomplete
Merry Christmas
The area within the first portal is completed tho
nvm
I broke it
one sec
don't play that one
I made a last minute change which broke the map
This one
golden drum
ye probably
Well I was kidding anyway
But nobody cares if you're on discord at work?
or is it phone discord
gritty sun
It's pretty decent so far Bugbait. Didn't know that Archie could be crushed til after wards though, so spent most my ammo on it. 8P
But it's weird that you can see the border to the water while under but not above.
light prism
haha, i did a map like that
there's an archvile but if you walk up closer to him the ceiling collapses and crushes him instantly
golden drum
Yeah I tried to find a way to infinitely stretch the bottom of the water as well, but I don't think it can be done
gritty sun
I haven't messed with deep water in a while so I can't give any sort of suggestion.
golden drum
you can see the border underwater, but above the water you see infinite ocean
It's a swimmable 3d floor if that's what you're asking
light prism
make it a regular transfer and you can have the underwater area have its own lin ehorizons
gritty sun
https://puu.sh/yweWz/94ec6f68cd.png
That look alright? (Still need to put the impact on the ground though.)
golden drum
maybe make it a bit smaller and more round
and les brutal doom
jk
brutal dooms fun
gritty sun
I mostly test it in that... xD
golden drum
Well just know that brutal doom doesn't take kindly to enemy death actions
gritty sun
What do you mean?
golden drum
You know how you can assign an action to be done when an enemy dies right?
light prism
if a monster is assigned a special, it will activate on death, however under brutal doom, the replacement method means that monsters may have their specials removed
golden drum
โ That โ
gritty sun
Ohh okay. I haven't done that yet.
light prism
as well as tags and other custom properties
gritty sun
Just when picking up an item.
gritty sun
I see.
gritty sun
light prism
+sniff+... its beautiful...
gritty sun
Unfortunately you can pick it up through the pod, but still looks cool at least. xD
Didn't want to make it too big either though.
light prism
might as well make it already open then
gritty sun
I suppose.
Decided on a halfway kinda thing.
https://puu.sh/ywghf/87e5e1ab8d.png
Like it slide down upon impact but all the way.
And there's a "First Aid Kit" where the shotgun was.
golden drum
was afk
Now THAT is lit
If you're wondering about whether it should be close, just keep it closed and make a linedef infront of the player's pods that opens it
That way it's even MORE noticeable AND you get to have it be closed
gritty sun
You can't see it from start, so having it closed from the start would be pointless.
golden drum
if you were wondering what to do with that
gritty sun
Or rather, from in the pod, you have to come out of it.
What about a line when you get close to it? Like it opens cause it detects the marines biosignature or something?
golden drum
hmmmmm
That could work
Just make sure you use ceiling move to and not ceiling raise
haughty flower
sweet, just fixed a runaway script in drpg while bulk withdrawing weapons. achievement unlocked! ๐
also recompilng with lastest gdcc fixed char save, so far....
light prism
thats always weird
when an update to the compiler fixes your bugs
i noticed once that compiling under 32bit gdcc fixed an overflow bug i was having
haughty flower
interesting, i'm compiling under 64-bit. hoping it hasn't broken anything since I had to change a thing to make drpg compile properly. gonna have to do a playthrough to test it out
light prism
hometime~
golden drum
@light prism We should get silvir helping with the megawad
Imma ask him when he gets online
gritty sun
I'm always online. 8P
But not.
Though I don't think I can make anything that impressive to contribute.
golden drum
Well I'm a fairly new mapper and I'm contributing
And your twoplay4 wad was pretty legit
I need to start making a document to keep track of this
oh btw if you want to contribute, the format is zandronum udmf
doom2 is the IWAD of/c
gritty sun
What's the difference between Zandro and GZ anyways?
golden drum
Well you'd think nothing, but there are few differences
namely
portals don't work in zandro
slopes need to be done through triangles or line specials
also zandronum doesn't support 21:9 aspect ratio ;(
idk what you use for slopes
But I'm assuming you go the slopes tab in sector settings
prisma saddle
Zandronum is based on an older branch of GZDOOM meaning it is going to be more limited.
golden drum
indeed
hard elmBOT
Indeed!
gritty sun
I use the line tag slopes.
prisma saddle
Also, GZDOOM can use Zscript.
golden drum
Nice, zandro supports that @gritty sun
gritty sun
Okay, so so far nothing I've used can't be used in Zandro.
prisma saddle
But yeah, for singleplayer stuff GZDOOM is often the way to go, while for multiplayer Zandronum tends to work better.
If it weren't for GZDOOMs shit net code Zandronum would be kinda dead.
golden drum
I wish the gzdoom devs and zandro devs worked together to improve gzdoom multiplayer
So are you on board?
gritty sun
Do we have a time frame on when this needs to be done? Cause I'm interested, but can't really do serious work on it for another 3 or 4 months.
golden drum
Not really
We aren't even really organized yet
so far the people who are gonna work on it for sure are me and mistercat
I think there was somebody else too
Are there any map slots you want?
gritty sun
I don't care. I need to come up with an idea before I could decide that. XD
gritty sun
I want that one now.
haughty flower
Sounds interesting.
golden drum
Because IT IS
If you want in, just say so
The idea is a zandronum udmf megawad made by the people who frequent this channel
brb
haughty flower
What's the overall theme?
golden drum
I was thinking the map themes would be like doom 2, where the first third is techbase, the second third is city, and the final third would be hell themed
but idk what everyone else would want to do
Because I know alot of people hate the city maps
gritty sun
I don't mind the city maps. I prefer them over the hell themed ones.
haughty flower
Same.
golden drum
The map themes would prolly be less strict than in doom 2 tho
I mean I'm making a "city map" that involves portaling to a base in the middle of the ocean and a retrofitted ancient temple.
The portal hub is in the city tho
light prism
Dr.Bugbait: I wish the gzdoom devs and zandro devs worked together to improve gzdoom multiplayer
the problem with this is that its like saying 'i wish proto-monkeys and humans reproduced to improve monkeys'
zandro forked off zdoom a looong time ago
back when it was called Skulltag
and now each port uses an entirely different methodology for multiplayer
essentially what you really want is for zandronum to catch up to gzdooms development
or for gzdoom to adopt zandronum's client/server net architecture
either which would take a very long time to do
light prism
no, its not just a matter of merging
golden drum
omfg my messages got delayed to hell
light prism
the net method is entirely different and would need to be rewritten from scratch if you wanted gzdoom to adopt it, alternately zandro's current system is to slowly adopt functions from gzdoom
golden drum
that sucks
light prism
basically if gzdoom stopped updating, zandro will eventually catch up as it stands
golden drum
well hopefully zandro catches up
fresh arch
o/
haughty flower
I love the lighting but it's a bit tooooo flickery for my tastes
Longer intervals between the flickering would be best methinks
light prism
@haughty flower - it's just a sector light special, i cant control the interval
royal wave
Weeeeee
golden drum
Are those textures placeholders or do they tie into the theme of your iwad
unreal oyster
gonna heavily guess the former, considering they have a height marker (in filthy imperial, nonetheless!) and look exactly like valve's testing textures otherwise ๐
shadow bone
gollum.jpg They stoles it from ussss!
golden drum
#imperialgate
NO MORE IMPERIAL
Let's harass kevansevans until he changes it to metric. /s
shadow bone
smegol.jpg nuuuu, don't harras usss prescious!
you'd have to change the scale of the texture
I made those to match a "real world" level we were working on
royal wave
I already have a few dev textures myself, I just never bothered to change them out from my folder
golden drum
Oh okay so it IS a placeholder then?
royal wave
what was your first clue
unreal oyster
the use of feet, of course, because nobody would use those in a sane texture
golden drum
I was thinking it would be like testing lab or something
unreal oyster
it's barbaric!
royal wave
Imperial is just a unit of measurement
golden drum
Pretty sure a random stick off the ground is a better measurement system than imperial
royal wave
So you're telling me
If someone asked for something in 3 inches
you wouldn't be able to tell me because you can't read a ruler?
golden drum
I would die of cancer before I could complete the task
shadow bone
Imperial, in my experience, is a better yardstick for informal measurements because it's often based around human-scale units. Metric is much better suited for techincal stuff than everyday use
royal wave
Lol no it's not
golden drum
approximately
unreal oyster
the thing about measurements is that people will justify their system based on anecdotal evidence and provide it as objective reasoning, e.g i feel exactly the same way about metric being good for informal measurements because i'm used to it
royal wave
I don't even know the conversion value and can tell you it doesn't work that nicely
shadow bone
For example, temperature. 0F is "pretty cold", and 100F is "pretty hot".
0C ("kinda cold") and 100C (OMG DEATH) have no real correlation to an everyday human experience.
unreal oyster
again, that's anecdotal evidence being presented as objective evidence because of what you're used to ๐
unreal oyster
i would say the complete opposite, again
golden drum
I think
royal wave
In this discussion: The imperial users know how to use a ruler
unreal oyster
it's just what you grew up with
shadow bone
I know that. But how often as a human does that correspond to "how hot is it outside?"
It's great for technical work
but less relevant than an arbitrary "hot cold" scale
golden drum
Idk, I don't check to see how how it is outside before I go out there
golden drum
I don't see how that's necessary outside of planning ahead
unreal oyster
because it's not a degrees system
royal wave
K it literally C shifted 312 degrees
unreal oyster
meaning that you can actually do maths on it
shadow bone
And yes, I know this is all subjective
unreal oyster
kevans, i'm fully aware
shadow bone
I'm just presenting my subjectivty
golden drum
besides I don't see why we need to map really cold to 0 anyway
unreal oyster
but the thing about K is that i can multiply a temperature in K by 2 and have the answer be twice as hot
you can't do that with degrees
shadow bone
Below zero, chance of death. Above 100, chance of death. Fahrenheit is convenient like that
Inside that range most peopel willl be okay
Go outside it, and you're starting to get risky
ยฏ_(ใ)_/ยฏ
golden drum
what is 0 fahrenheit to celsius
unreal oyster
-17
unreal oyster
i could totally argue that basing a system on when humans literally will die is pretty pointless though
golden drum
celsius
unreal oyster
because those temperatures are rarely reached in a lot of parts of the world
unreal oyster
because i'm in britain, i take 0 to mean "anything near this requires a jumper" so it has a very good use to me there
golden drum
And that's Nova Scotia, canada
unreal oyster
again, completely anecdotal
unreal oyster
my arguments for C is just that it's always worth basing a measurement on something easily understandable if you possibly can
Metric does this, with super easy conversions
golden drum
ye imperial tends to be very inconsistent and subjective
shadow bone
For what it's worth I fully agree that Metric and C are more reasonable and well-defined systems. I just think imperial is fine for rough touchy-feely stuff.
unreal oyster
my argument is essentially that there's no reason that you can't have a system which is both scientifically useful and everyday useful
it's not like Metric countries have crises every day because people don't like the units being not close to the size of some guy's foot
golden drum
Well when I was complaining about imperial I was exaggerating a bit
It's still not a great system tho
shadow bone
Mostly because it's not a "system" at all ๐
shadow bone
That's why I usually stick with metric shit-tons when I have to get hyperbolic
golden drum
thjo with metric it just goes up by powers of ten
golden drum
bytes are in metric as well
unreal oyster
like, i can tell you exactly what 1 metre is, it's how much distance light travels in 1/299,792,458 of a second, whereas imperial is like "1 foot is the size of a guys foot and likely not the size of your own foot"
golden drum
kilo bytes, gigabytes, terabytes
so with shit tons of liquid i could use gigalitres and teralitres
it's flexible you know
It's a nice standard imo
It's nice to just know all of somethings units with only the base unit, because you KNOW it's metric based
SI units
light prism
imperial is great for starting arguments about measurement systems
golden drum
indeed
hard elmBOT
Indeed!
golden drum
Oh and btw one last thing
as for 100 km/h on a highway is much more memorable than 60 mph
or whatever it is
unreal oyster
also, to prove a point: all definitions of the foot are given in metres, while all definitions of a metre are not given in feet ๐
shadow bone
That's just because the people who write the definitions are all filthy metrickers ๐
shadow bone
I'm going to assume that's a colloquialism and say maybe.
unreal oyster
no, it's because metre has a very solid definition that isn't just "some guy in history's foot who isn't alive anymore"
๐
golden drum
oh wait nvm those are maritime units
light prism
"it's how much distance light travels in 1/299,792,458 of a second"
unreal oyster
at least that's what i assume a foot is defined by, if it was found by taking an average, that's still dumb because feet sizes can change over time
golden drum
Has anybody here traveled one furlong?
light prism
how would you have measured this without the proper tools, though
golden drum
one furlong is 10 chains
light prism
feet are readily available
light prism
light's speed is readily available but not easily measurable by the naked eye
unreal oyster
that's because the metre was redefined to fit a more solid definition once the tools were available
originally it was based on the distance from the north pole to equator being 10,000km from the french revolution
golden drum
one meter is about the length of the average persons armspan
light prism
which makes about as much sense as measuring a generic foot size
shadow bone
Until the capability of manufacturing to very tight tolerances was developed, imperial-style measurements were fine because you could make something "one handspan" and it's not like it'd have trouble fitting if someone with a slightly different hand made it.
golden drum
that's not what it's bhased on tho
unreal oyster
actually no it makes a lot more sense
10,000 is a nice power of 10 and is based on something incredibly static
the thing about a length is that it will always be somewhat arbitrary due to its nature
so the best measurement systems make the base unit as non-arbitrary as possible
by 1. using something static and 2. making that distance an easy to remember number
golden drum
the length of a centimetre is about the langth of the top part of one's pinky
pretty sure
unreal oyster
it's like, the second also now has a rigid scientific definition after we decided that we needed something static so that the value of a second didn't drift over time
golden drum
also you can get a ruler app for your phone
unreal oyster
now it's defined as "The second is the duration of 9 192 631 770 periods of the radiation corresponding to the transition between the two hyperfine levels of the ground state of the cesium 133 atom."
radioactivity of atoms won't change, so it's rigid
royal wave
When are models going to support alpha textures
unreal oyster
it's been discussed recently on the zdoom discord, but i don't think it's in sight at any point right now
basically the depth sorting needed would be quite a lot of work or something like that
golden drum
when the models stop being so beta
lavish hollow
I will now only refer to TMC as "Mister Pedantic"
unreal oyster
also, completely unrelated, but it's been recently revealed on the zdoom discord that a zandronum/gzdoom merger is happening and gzdoom is getting C/S
light prism
neat
unreal oyster
and, by merger, i mean, all zand code will be dropped and new C/S code will be written for quality purposes
lavish hollow
Heard about that a week ago, I know an admin from zandronum.com
royal wave
Damn!
unreal oyster
but the zand devs will officially join the zdoom team
yeah, i heard it a bit back from the zdoom devdev forum which i have access to
golden drum
Hopefully all the server stuff from the zandro menus are added in as well
unreal oyster
but i didn't want to say anything until a dev said anything publically, if ya get me
lavish hollow
Same here
royal wave
GZDoom 4 here we come Baybeee! I have insider sources that Knack 3 is being built in it!
light prism
has to re-write wormsdoom from scratch again
royal wave
knack 2 was already released you piece of shit
unreal oyster
TMC, considering its the zand devs that'll be working on the C/S code, i assume they'll keep it backwards compatible
i mean, they'd basically have to
shadow bone
unreal oyster
else MP guys would just stick to some zand fork
unreal oyster
cali, search in the zdoom discord from: Rachael#3767 zandronum
lavish hollow
I can't get an announcement post but I technically can show you some messages between the Zandro devs ๐
royal wave
ZDoom discord is a bit more... exclusive than we are
lavish hollow
I got banned from there lol
royal wave
We're nothing more than the /r/Doom discord, despite being... idk what the word is
golden drum
lolwut why
light prism
lol 'exclusive'
unreal oyster
kevans, if you mean the "you need a zdoom account" thing, they don't really do that anymore
haven't done so for a while
royal wave
Oh nah?
lavish hollow
Made a slightly risque joke @golden drum
royal wave
I take that back them FUCK THE PLACE UP BOIS
shadow bone
Never really in the first place, it was just highly recommended
unreal oyster
yeah, that too
shadow bone
Also:
EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
light prism
The moderation is overkill, everywhere else is friendlier
golden drum
I'm gonna join it anyway
shadow bone
No, you just butt heads with the mods more often than the rest of us
golden drum
I like salt
unreal oyster
guys, i was just referencing it to give my source, i'd prefer if we didn't make this into a cross-server drama thing
shadow bone
I've literally never ever once in 14 years had a problem with ZDoom moderation.
lavish hollow
I never had issues with the mods until I joined the discord, either
golden drum
Can somebody put up a link?
royal wave
"I never had problems with the mods before" tell tale sign you're not aware how bad of a person you are
light prism
Please, continue speaking as if you know me personally
royal wave
Please, continue speaking to me like I've never seen this behavior before
shadow bone
This can only end in a bad place, let's change the subject please.
royal wave
I mean what do I know about having to actually deal with people as a moderator
unreal oyster
i'd prefer if we didn't make this into a cross-server drama thing
lavish hollow
I'm also a moderator of several servers, so is Mister Cat, no clue what you're talking about
golden drum
I think we shouldn't make accusations based on this little evidence
besides, both good and bad people can have many or no problems with authority
light prism
I feel like accusing me of being a 'bad person' just for getting banned on one discord server is ridiculous and insulting
royal wave
I think we shouldn't make accusations based on this little evidence We're actually looking over the screenshots of why they were banned in our staff room
golden drum
It means nothing
royal wave
Having a good chuckle m8's
So please, tell use again why the rules should be bent for your special needs
golden drum
Why was he banned?
shadow bone
Not important
royal wave
Both were banned for pretty much being asses after being told to knock off being an ass
golden drum
That can be very subjective, and from what I know of you, you seem to be a very sensitive person
shadow bone
Anyway, enough. This is way past #classic-doom-maps-mods
golden drum
I agree
I don't see why we're throwing salt around about people we barely know
We need to chill, amirite or amirite
shadow bone
You barely know, maybe. All of us have been on multiple servers for a while.
royal wave
That was the second time an admin said to stop
shadow bone
And yes, stop please.
golden drum
tru tru
shadow bone
I'm in a pretty decent mood today, I don't want to lose it
light prism
I think im almost done with my map-mod-dev map
golden drum
Me neither :(
golden drum
I'm not
that was sarcasm
I think
idk
anyway I have 1/4 of my mkap done
but ye
So tell me about your map
lavish hollow
describe it in text nyegga
golden drum
Thge "light shit" thing?
light prism
its pretty short
golden drum
?
lavish hollow
how can a floor be short
golden drum
my map or yours?
light prism
mine
golden drum
You should send the wad
light prism
I'm at wooooork
golden drum
in moonbase alpha voice
?
fuck
fuuuuuuck
huh
wtf
are long strings of letters auto-deleted?
lavish hollow
yes
light prism
yes
golden drum
Understandable
haughty flower
yes
light prism
breaktiiiiiime
golden drum
sned wad n pks
open dom and slad
Am I the only one who cares about romeros design rules?
golden drum
ye
While designing levels for Doom, Romero documented several rules, among them:
always changing floor height when I wanted to change floor textures
using special border textures between different wall segments and doorways
being strict about texture alignment
conscious use of contrast everywhere in a level between light and dark areas, cramped and open areas
making sure that if a player could see outside that they should be able to somehow get there
being strict about designing several secret areas on every level
making my levels flow so the player will revisit areas several times so they will better understand the 3D space of the level
creating easily recognizable landmarks in several places for easier navigation
copied from the doom wiki
lavish hollow
making sure that if a player could see outside that they should be able to somehow get there
wut
golden drum
Like the secret on e1m2 i guess
lavish hollow
what about e1m1 and map01
golden drum
the secret with the acid pit and mega-armor
lavish hollow
both of those have outside areas you can't get into
lavish hollow
so you mean just outside in general, not in a specific outside place
golden drum
well idk
I'm not John Romero
Sadly
besides, I think these are more like guidelines than rules
I usually have some of these in mind when I map
mainly the ones about landmarks, contrast and floor textures
I need to work on the backtracking bit tho
brb
anybody who can speak other languages here?
golden drum
nice
@light prism do you know of anybody on this server who knows other languages
also, brb
light prism
no, i just think its a tad unnecessary
golden drum
Unnecessary maybe, but if there are some polyglots among us I think we may as well
anyway it was just somrthing I was considering
brb
besides it gives me an excuse to learn the LANGUAGE lump
light prism
you could learn the language lump anyway
make a 'pirate' language selection
like minecraft
golden drum
Also I assume we'll have lvl clusters and transmission screens
Just things like "The portal opened. Steeling myself for the chellenge ahead, I enter and before me lays the horrors of hell"
light prism
"Yarr, matey, ye walked the plank into the next cluster"
golden drum
or soemething like that
ye\
actually how does one even select the language
does it detect your system language?
light prism
yeah, i think so
golden drum
Imma search for a way to force a language on gzdoom
haughty flower
It's a bit of work, but it's worth it I suppose.
golden drum
indeed
hard elmBOT
Indeed!
golden drum
It's not that big of a deal if we can't but if it's an option I think we should take it
@De Tongan Mahn#2682 do you speak any non english languages?
german perhaps?
wait nvm
not german
durr
light prism
He speaks Tongan
light prism
im surprised there isn't a dynamic light type that shifts between R/G/B values
unreal oyster
Like, in a rainbow? You can do that with ZScript
light prism
I know you can script it
I mean there isn't a native actor that has some properties to do it
like there are flicker/pulse variants
unreal oyster
Right yeah
light prism
that use the size/secondary parameters
i guess because there aren't enough parameters
here
i made this for Lazorical but he wants to do zscript instead apparently
so free base for hud-layer GUI in ACS
haughty flower
lol no I only speak English, my name and pic is based off an inside joke.
light prism
i have lived with tongans before
haughty flower
Some of them are really nice down to earth people heh.
warped rampart
Where in a .pk3 would I put sprites for projectiles? I know it would go in the SPRITES folder, but is there a specific subfolder it has to go in?
light prism
subfolders are ignored
organize to your own specifications
sprites/projectiles/poop/
warped rampart
Also, I just realized that what this guy did was he took the vanilla sprites and skewed them a little bit so they look like they're angled :V https://forum.zdoom.org/viewtopic.php?f=43&t=34294
I should probably try doing this myself
Or maybe they were rotated a bit?
I dunno, what do you guys think? I'm starting to think it's both a skew and a rotation. http://www.3dshots.nl/wads/Double_Weapon_08.png
warped rampart
Maybe they are?
I'll try a skew
And Neccronix's hand sprites should work great
I hope
lavish hollow
Those SSGs aren't tilted anywhere near enough to be making that shot
warped rampart
So, I'll try skewing the sprites a bit and adding/removing some pixels to simulate the look of an angle
lavish hollow
I guess you're abandoning the whole voxel thing?
warped rampart
Yeah
I think editing existing sprites will be a lot easier to do
Looking closer, yeah, it's rotation
misty bramble
My general strategy for rotating sprites is to scale it up like 20x
Then rotate and scale it back down
warped rampart
Yeah, I was just thinking how I was gonna pull off a hipfire look easily while still making it look good
light prism
bear in mind that any modification is a degradation
so scaling it up is not necessarily going to help
warped rampart
So how would one rotate a sprite and still make it look good?
light prism
depends on the tool used
in photoshop i would turn off any kind of rescaling/antialiasing and do the rotation and then manually touch it up
rescale/antialiasing is what the whole scale-up->rotate->scale down would be trying to avoid, i would guess
warped rampart
holy shit this looks like trash
misty bramble
Scaling it up generally helps the pixels stay sharp
but you need to use nearest neighbor resampling
light prism
use no resampling at all for sharpest
light prism
I wonder if they will write in zandronum's database read/write functionality for the merger
that shit is madd useful
misty bramble
You have to resample if you want to increase/decrease the size of an image
Nearest neighbor preserves sharp pixels
royal wave
There. I make my own doo doo head textures that are totally notjust edits of Calis textures that do not come with a unit of measurement. WhO kNoWs WhAt SiZe ThEy ArE? iT's A mYsTeRy!
prisma saddle
The reason why you typed it like that is a mystery.
haughty flower
mYsTErIouS
red peak
@warped rampart Try to get the bottom of thr sprite to bend to the side, too.
It looks off.
haughty flower
@royal wave I like how you go for a cartoonish type of graphics.
prisma saddle
I do like the vectors and such.
Reminds me of games like Another World and This is the Police.
Atleast, in static screenshot form.
lavish hollow
PlaiDoom
timber bridge
we've gone into plaid
timber bridge
top 10 worst pistols
haughty flower
The USP Match is pretty good, don't bash it D:
timber bridge
no in the game
shit sound
shit damage
shit accuracy
half life 1 pistol was better
it feels really bland imo
royal wave
Genuinely made it from scratch actually :P
lavish hollow
half life 1 pistol was better
Lolwut half life 1 pistol was garbage, fukin trip mines were more useful than it
vocal crypt
eh
HL1 seem to have more umph
HL2's pistol seemed like a pea shooter
must be the design and the sound
lavish hollow
Even with the HL1 HD models, I like the design of the HL2 pistol better
unreal oyster
lets compromise: both are shit
lavish hollow
Yeah that's good
unreal oyster
but, tbf, the HD models generally make the guns worse ๐
especially in a realism sense
vocal crypt
how much does the M4 9mm guns cost
royal wave
again you people must suck with it
lavish hollow
Just because we don't like something doesn't mean we suck at using it
unreal oyster
that's a massive leap you're making from "i don't like the pistol"
i can use the pistol
i just don't like the way it feels
it's the same way i feel about the plasma rifle in D4
royal wave
unreal oyster
the gun's useful, but its audiovisual feedback just isn't good
unreal oyster
which would be a valid argument, if HL cared about gun realism otherwise
royal wave
pap pap pap pap pap pap
unreal oyster
but like, just look at HL's weapons, especially HL1
they don't exactly scream "realism" ๐
unreal oyster
oh i'm not even talking about the experimental weapons, i'm talking about all of them, it's clear they didn't care massively about gun realism when they put a grenade launcher on the MP5 with no trigger mechanism ๐
royal wave
has shot one before
Uh it's kinda tucked away on the side
Because you know
it's mean to lob fucking grenades
Probably the one gun i won't defend is the shotgun. Pump action double barrels are stupidly impractical in a combat setting
unreal oyster
the model of grenade launcher is known, and it's definitely missing a trigger in the viewmodel
they even fixed this in the HD pack
royal wave
wow that's not the mp5 I shot
huh okay, learned something
then again, that's a really dumb nitpick
unreal oyster
yeah, in the HD pack it's not an MP5, it's an M4
but actually the HD pack wrecked gun realism in other ways
for example, it replaced the MP5 with an M4 and the Glock with a Beretta M9
which would be fine
but uh... those don't load the same ammo
whereas the MP5 and Glock do
so they completely fucked realism up there
i know that gearbox made the HD pack, but the fact that valve approved it shows that they didn't really care massively about gun realism, even with the firearms that do exist irl ๐
royal wave
I'm suspecting even then they had their hands off mentality
unreal oyster
yeah, agreed
royal wave
Spaz-12 still remains the worst offender
timber bridge
i don't like the HD pack
i prefer my guns blocky and loud
the pistol in half life 1 is accurate and has lots of ammo but lacks firepower against big or numerous enemies
light prism
take your gun realism and shove it
toxic terrace
I can say the MP5 was more quiet than the M4.
The Pistol was at least a good sniping weapon against guys that were far away.
light prism
the pistol in duke nukem is similar
it has madd accuracy at extreme distance
and no damage falloff
timber bridge
but shit damage once things heat up
toxic terrace
In Half-Life or in Duke Nukem?
light prism
yeah its great for sniping in multiplayer though
toxic terrace
Couldn't the crossbow do better?
light prism
in duke
toxic terrace
Oh.
haughty flower
What do you mean I'm NUTS.WAD?
*Fixed runaway script when using Absolute Monster Limit on a map with more than 9999 monsters.
lol
haughty flower
On second thoughts, I'm not gonna add a warning for that. Because who honestly plays on a map with 9999 monsters.
toxic terrace
There's a reason why that wad was named the "NUTS.WAD."
haughty flower
true
toxic terrace
Since it's a fairly old wad that released in 2001, I wonder if people had powerful enough computers to not even lag to shit.
haughty flower
my i3 6100 chokes to death on GZDoom, like 1 - 3 fps. I heard prboom runs it alot better though
a p4 might get 10 fps on it
maybe
light prism
turn down your graphic settings
royal wave
6th gen i3 not being able to run GZDoom? There is something wrong dude
I've seen Pentium 3's eat zdoom for breakfast
light prism
nuts.wad is the standard benchmark wad
umbral sail
๐ค
fresh arch
nuts.wad will never run smooth no matter how modern your computer is because the bottleneck is software
unreal oyster
That's not really true, it runs fairly smooth on PrBoom+
GZDoom handles it badly but that doesn't mean all ports do
royal wave
Think it has something to do with GZDoom being a more literal 3D engine
unreal oyster
AFAIK it's the sprite drawing
GZDoom is more complex as a port, so it has more shit to do
Therefore, it spends longer doing it
Even something small like checking for a flag that PrBoom+ doesn't have will get amplified when you have that many actors
When all the monsters are moving, calling A_Chase, updating their anims, etc... It gets sloooow
golden drum
It runs even better in GlBoom+
light prism
i bet there are pc's out there that won't bog on it though
even assuming gl, 2 polys per sprite
that's not a heck of a lot of polys, like gutawer says more of the actual shit going on is code related
unreal oyster
TMC, poly count doesn't massively matter for performance, it's the amount of draw calls
Which is why doom ports always run like shit compared to slightly later engines with GL
You have to make a single draw call for every single node and sprite
GPUs simply aren't designed to work like that
They're designed to draw tons of shit in one go
Which is why static meshes are dominant nowadays
They can handle complex detailing in a very efficient way
So yeah, even though 2 polys per sprite doesn't sound like much, it will lag a lot because there's going to be one draw call for every one of those sprites
light prism
yeah, thats what i mean, the polycount doesnt matter so much
but like you say, its all the flags and shit
that it checks for each call
golden drum
Quick question. Are 3d floor polyobjects a thing?
golden drum
Well that shoots down my whole idea for a map30
light prism
there are ways to make moving platforms but theyre all hacks
golden drum
like what
actually maybe I could use 3d models or something
idk
well then we'd lose software mode compatibility
light prism
voxels? ๐
there is probably a better way to do this in zscript now actually
since this method relies on actors having tids
golden drum
( อกยฐ อส อกยฐ)
Only in H-Doom
That pk3 only works in h-doom I guess
Gonna steal the music from nuts.wad
light prism
extree, extree, el jefe doesn't contribute to conversation, read all about it
lavish hollow
Look who's talking lmao
I could literally show ten different examples of you doing the same thing
light prism
tits to that
golden drum
I approve
lavish hollow
Ew
violet mountain
light prism
2spoopy
light prism
its running on acs logic so it's 1/35th second
its just a bump triggered script that sets the relative position of actors with tids above it
trim falcon
awesome
light prism
you can place one and give it args to determine its distance, angle and wait time
bold heron
hey so i'm trying to make a music and sfx replacement wad for btsx episode 1 to be loaded alongside it. the new sfx work fine but the music plays the original mod's music instead of my versions. help? :c
they should be
could the mapinfo for the original mod be causing it?
in a moment I'm not at my main pc right now. taking a snack break :0
i should add: the problem is with gzdoom. music plays fine in zandronum
i mean the sfx work but the music doesnt
and theyre the same kind of file
loading it on its own works fine, but loading it with the wad it's supposed to apply over doesnt work
bold heron
i just used the first one i found, wmd :0
golden drum
@gritty sun How's your wad coming along?
gritty sun
It's not at the moment. Been busy with real life stuff. As I said before, wouldn't be able to put any real work into anything for a few months.
golden drum
Anybody have any ideas for the title of the megawad?
light prism
Eleomesynathors 3: Rise of the Futur Revengeance
light prism
Debbie Does Deimos
golden drum
Daddy's Deimos Dick
light prism
Doomguy's Pie Surprise
golden drum
Hey what are the legal implications of using the music from nuts.wad
It's a MIDI replica of Kashmir by Led Zeppelin
royal wave
Older project I decided to revisit
light prism
nice, whats with the sprite though
royal wave
Screenshot of the game it was based on. It was top down, and I had to stich it together
prisma saddle
Ah.
royal wave
golden drum
What game is that
royal wave
Spooky Castle
Really obscure game distributed as shovelware
Mother found it at one of those PC game bins
prisma saddle
Ah.
royal wave
ended up being pretty fun
royal wave
Nah just top down RPG
prisma saddle
How Spooky is the castle in it?
lavish hollow
Holy heck that's spooky
light prism
its like zelda with zelda 2's instanced combat
prisma saddle
Doomy Castle
light prism
surely you could clone stamp out the sprites heh
light prism
royal wave
Doom buiilder is telling me this is wrong
{
default {
Radius 5;
Height 128;
+SOLID;
+SHOOTABLE;
+NOBLOOD;
Mass 99999;
}
States {
Spawn :
POSS A -1;
loop;
}
}```ZSCRIPT error in "defrag.pk3\zscript\decoration\General.txt", line 12. Sprite name should be exactly 4 characters long (got spawn).
light prism
there's a space between Spawn and :
inner zealot
Decorate likes things in a very specific way
timber bridge
top 10 spooky things
unreal oyster
That's not decorate
That's ZScript
Which has parser improvements in lots of places
But yeah, you still need to put the colon right next to a state label
royal wave
All of the sudden my DoomEd Nums work
Wow that is a stupid thing for the parser to nit pick over when the game handles it just fine
light prism
hrmmm
light prism
prisma saddle
Cat DooM.
light prism
prisma saddle
The way the cat transitions between animations looks a bit weird.
light prism
there are no transition frames, so yeah
i might just see if i can auto tween them heh
prisma saddle
He seems to still be walking a little bit after you stop pressing the button.
So it kinda just looks a bit weird.
light prism
yeah, thats how states work
i can cut it abruptly too but movement gets a bit janky if you dont do it right
light prism
light prism