vanilla-discussion

[bright karma]

i just linked the wiki like a few lines above

[waxen solstice]

I know this was joked about a few lines up, but is there anything on the scaling of hit vs crit past the hit cap? My teenage brain from 2006 is telling me that 1% hit for DW fury was better than 1% crit, but that dude was into Neopets so idk if I trust him

[frosty haven]

i'm pretty sure crit is better

getting auto capped is a big meme

and i'm pretty sure with enough AP, crit can outpace hit even below the 9% cap

[waxen solstice]

Interesting. I remember doing AQ 40 and the guy with 21% hit was untouchable on the meter

Maybe the rest of his gear was just that OP

Or everyone else was just bad

[frosty haven]

the skill level and gear back in the day was so varied

yeah

[idle shale]

You could have amazing gear with lots of hit on it too, and if your gear was still amazing compared to everyone else even if not "optimal" you would shit on everyone anyway

[worldly dust]

[fringe furnace]

Remember those endless threads in classic forums. After beeing Hit capped for yellow crit is affecting 100% of your damage whereas hit is only affecting about 50% (the white damage). Actually its a Bit more complicated because of rage gen and enrage/flurry uptime but as a rule of thumb crit is twice as good as Hit after hitcap

[frosty haven]

yeah its much more complicated than that

[bright karma]

i remember those 20% hit fury warriors

2005 meta 😆

oh shit i can't use external emojis

muh shitposting

[frosty haven]

no memes allowed

[lethal epoch]

Why are two people able to do RFD that’s doesn’t make sense. It seems like they might have made it a lil easier from what I remember

[frosty haven]

nah low level dungeons were always easy if you had the right gear/classes

i remember 3 manning dungeons as a group of 3 paladins

it was easy

[bright karma]

even the wow discord allows external emoji

[steel flare]

People underestimate how completely trash players we were in 2005, and remember everything being super hard. Just simply knowing the right skill rotations now days is more then we knew then.

On Beta we easily 3 man farmed corpsemaker :)

[frosty haven]

there were good players in vanilla, but they were very few and far between
majority of the time you had a group of 14 year olds with 400 ping and forgot to upgrade their best skill ranks

[steel flare]

Basically, yes. Haha

[deep bloom]

Is the private server experience full of great players? I'm interested to see how much better the average WoW player has gotten in 10+ years.

[misty bolt]

if you play the same game

for a decade

you will naturally be a fucking god at it

[deep bloom]

I'm sure there's a bunch of players coming back to re-live their glory days. They will be able to avoid standing in fire, know their rotation, etc... But I'm not convinced it'll be the whole population.

[frosty haven]

the game is not hard
it takes time and patience
but in general the playerbase will be far more competent this go around

[idle shale]

if you've played wow at all over the last 10 years, classic isn't going to be difficult

if you've never played wow before, you'll prob still suck lol

[modern garden]

i think it's very optimistic to think people would be better

[misty bolt]

if all you played is BFA you will suck, atleast on the levelling part. compared to the private server players who done it all 10 times over

[steel flare]

If you played BFA and think you can just AOE your way to 60, you will suck*

Lol

And by suck, you will die

[modern garden]

if by bfa you mean the game for the last like 8 years

[alpine path]

Since wrath it's been super aoe heavy

[steel flare]

As long as people stick to a 1v1 idea for killing mobs, they will be just fine. At least 1-40 on the Beta is much more forgiving then anything on Pservers.

[worldly dust]

the majority of private server players are fucking horrible. ive never, ever seen even one good player there, that did not regulary play retail

even in lfr you find better players

[misty bolt]

You fucking joking right

Search Monkeynews ya muppet

[terse fractal]

The majority of BfA player won't stay long on Classic.

[lost grail]

"The majority" aka one or two people from private servers with more than two brain cells to run together. When did the word majority turn into the word all

Meant in response to the last

[past tide]

We can agree most NA players are a meme both in PServers and retail lul

[worldly dust]

That is also true

They overestimate themselves by far

[crimson jay]

the majority of players are horrible regardless of server . you just don't notice as much on retail because you have a way higher player pool to choose from than 5-15k pop pservers.

[misty bolt]

The EU private pop are seriously good at classic, quite a good % of them

If youre playing NA thats the pleb bracket, dont even bother

[narrow valley]

Anyone online rn who knows classic prot warrior?

I have a theory about Tauren prot warr specifically and I’ve never heard about this strat before I thought of it at the grocery store, but since prot in classic doesn’t have any aoe damage abilities (and by extension no aoe threat generators) shouldn’t Warstomp or whatever the racial ability is called be in theory extremely effective for taking threat in zerg situations? Especially bc it costs 0 rage?

[distant saffron]

According to Kenco (The guy who wrote KTM), Battle/Demo Shout should cause aggro

[narrow valley]

What really?

[distant saffron]

yes

[narrow valley]

Fuck ok well that’s relieving to hear actually

I’m rolling Tauren prot warrior anyway bc I wanna be the first person in my guild to get thunderfury, but I’d be lying if I said I wasn’t concerned about getting and holding threat

I’m not a noob btw, I have tank experience, but I have next to no experience in classic

[distant saffron]

Not much AOE tanking in raids

Most of ur AOE tanking in dungeons will just be using a 2H anyway

[past tide]

There is some specific scenarios for aoe threat, in that note pick engineering

[bright karma]

https://itemization.info/item/18168

[past tide]

About thunderfury, just relax mate

Droprate is atrocious

[narrow valley]

I can think of several aoe tanking raid encounters tho. Onyxias lair whelps, nefarian fight (plus the suppression room), the spider wing and military wings of naxx have aoe encounters if you count naxx as aoe tanking (which I sorta don’t bc you’ll have 8 tanks for the military ward anyway)

[distant saffron]

Most of Mili wing you'll use seperate tanks for

the trash hits like trucks on drugs

[narrow valley]

And yeah it is but my guild and I are gonna be gearing each other up the whole way through, and since I want to be the main tank, when it inevitably drops ofc it’ll go to me

[distant saffron]

Spider wing is an AOE taunt and engi shield per tank, per spooder pull

[past tide]

Supresion room is aright, Onyxia trash dies before you aggro them most of the time

[distant saffron]

Nef fight is a case of burning them the fuck down

And ony whelps just die

[past tide]

The place where aoe aggro is actually important is AQ40

And 5mans for faster runs ofc

Gotcha, but as reference I've been clearing MC one year and half without a single binding dropping

Pretty bad luck but still

[narrow valley]

Really? I got a binding after like 5 runs which were mostly for farming dark iron ore

[distant saffron]

on retail?

[past tide]

Was that actually Vanilla? Honest curiosity

[narrow valley]

Which btw is extremely lucrative for obvious reasons but don’t steal my idea plx

Legion retail

[past tide]

Kappa

[distant saffron]

don't use legion drop rates as a source for anything lol

[narrow valley]

I started at the veeeery end of TBC

I’m not at all I fully expect the drop rate to be balls

I didn’t say I wanted to bumrush getting thunderfury, I said I wanted to be the first person in my guild with it, and I stand by that

It’s good to have longish term goals

[past tide]

Hell if I recall I did 106 lavs runs in Northdale just for Ironfoe

[narrow valley]

Only longish bc as soon as I get thunderfury it’ll become my responsibility to progress raids every single week, and I have some long term goals after thunderfury

[past tide]

Can't remember on Nost, probably wasn't counting

[narrow valley]

Jfc

It’s not that bad I’m somewhere in the 200s ish attempt for legion Midnight

Across several characters

[distant saffron]

tfw at least 2 splits per week for a whole year

And we've only gotten 3 bindings

I hate bindings

such a frustrating mechanic

[narrow valley]

That’s why it’ll be so epic when I inevitably get both bindings in one run :D

[distant saffron]

lol

I actually saw that happen once

was very funny

[narrow valley]

Classic is gonna be fucking epic

[worldly dust]

Oil of immolation 👌

15dps per target, also the helm from gnomeregan

[bright karma]

yeah oil of immolation is great

[nova knoll]

epic

[vestal mist]

hey guys i was wondering if anyone knew if effect healing gear affects bloodthirst?

[worldly dust]

no its not

[lavish shard]

Whats up, I'm trying to learn more on how to play a warrior in classic but there's only retail info in the guides/resources channel. Anyone have any good resources they can share?

[somber raptor]

@thick verge mind PMing a invite too the classic warr discord. Mucho love.

[thick verge]

I got you @somber raptor

[sudden junco]

there's a classic discord?

[thick verge]

can I post a link here? maybe a mod could pin it?

here it is anyway, mods delete if not allowed https://discord.gg/UC4bV5j

[sudden junco]

hey, thanks @thick verge

looking forward to checking it out

i'm sitting bfa out, but classic streams have given me the itch like i'm a bad addict about to topple off the wagon

[vital crater]

@thick verge Thanks Vari I didnt know there was a Classic warrior discord so much amazing info ❤

[thick verge]

yw, no problem

[reef turtle]

Probably late to the party, but they're doing another stress test on Wednesday and everyone in NA/OCE gets access.

[main hemlock]

EU 💩

[strange dove]

is classic out yet

or what

i forget

[grave yarrow]

beta atm

[strange dove]

oh ok

[main hemlock]

not yet Mr cat

[cyan maple]

Also the stress test is 48 hours and to level 15 😛

[main hemlock]

not for eu 👌 🇫🇮

[split monolith]

Hey guys! Thinking about rolling a warrior for classic

[split monolith]

How do guilds determine which warrior uses deep wounds?

[distant saffron]

they all do

[sudden junco]

is the debuff cap a thing?

[frosty haven]

yes

its 16 in classic

[sudden junco]

That's what I thought. My memory is that deep wounds was verboten, but it's been 15 years.

Or maybe it's changed.

[distant saffron]

its a low priority debuff

won't knock anything important off

[frosty haven]

yeah it doesnt overwrite other debuffs

[sudden junco]

Ah.

Is that a new-ish change? Or was it always like that.

[frosty haven]

always

[sudden junco]

Huh. TIL.

[frosty haven]

afaik

[distant saffron]

was introduced in 1.6 I think

[frosty haven]

makes sense, i started in 1.7

[sudden junco]

Maybe it rings a bell.

It's been so long.

[distant saffron]

in 1.12 we also got a regular buff prio system

Cause theres a 32 buff cap limit on classic

[sudden junco]

Classic is going to be kind of weird because the game is so much better understood.

[exotic frigate]

Eh maybe, I think filling out a 40 man raid is tougher than people remember

What is gonna be awkward is loot I think, cause you have classes like paladin healers wearing cloth

Hunter, rogues, warriors fighting over weapons

[distant saffron]

Thats the fun bit tho

Feels super good when you get given CTS over the other melee

[exotic frigate]

True, players are different now though. People are used to being showered in loot

I've seen more arguments over loot in Legion than all the other expansions combined

[steady palm]

Lvling question: since /sitting doesnt work to abuse blood craze and enrage does that mean you might as well go Arms to get mortal strike asap and save a respec or is there still a point to fury until Whirlwind and then swap over?

[distant saffron]

Arms way stronger

[karmic cloud]

sit should work, as you're 100% critable

like charge, sit enrage, MS, GG

[worthy kindle]

@karmic cloud seems it is not the case:
Being critically struck while using /sit to sit does not cause abilities like Enrage, Blood Craze, and Reckoning to activate.
https://eu.forums.blizzard.com/en/wow/t/wow-classic-not-a-bug-list/50941

[misty bolt]

Sitting DOES work

you just have to time the standing up or spam X

[floral swan]

Can you expand on this? What is the timing approximately?

[misty bolt]

https://youtu.be/Op9kWkI4F-I

Unless they patched that idk, dont have beta access

[hollow reef]

was gonna run a Warlock for vanilla

then one of my friends is like "I wanna be a Warlock"

"Be a Warrior. Be our tank, again"

😐

[exotic frigate]

I have the opposite problem, I wanna roll warrior but mage keeps calling me back

[bright peak]

Damned dirty frost mage

[exotic frigate]

More like professional waiter. My favorite thing as a kid was to make water and food for my raid lol

[cyan maple]

Whattttttt, said nobody ever 😁

[hollow reef]

only thing holding me back from being a Warrior is that im a shit warrior

Warrior definitely required a pocket healer and skill in vanilla

[agile elm]

What activ midigate did warriors have in vanilla?

[balmy breach]

@agile elm shield block is a 6 sec cd but only mitigates next attack

So dunno if you can count that as active mitigation, in which case i’d say defensive stance and just the fact they are wearing plate

[agile elm]

Ah the god old days

[cyan maple]

Didn't it mitigate a second attack with a talent?

Some people would argue that while armour is passive mitigation, wearing a shield is active mitigation (at least much later on)

[crimson jay]

shield block's main purpose is pushing crushing blows off the attack table

mitigated damage from block value is rather negligible unless you run a full block set for trash

[modern river]

I'm never gonna stop being salty over Classic releasing a week after the end of my summer vacation.

I'm barely gonna be able to play it

[main hemlock]

Just break a leg

now you have time

[proven dove]

The classic break a leg strat

[modern river]

Cool.

I'll do that.

Thanks, guys.

[proven dove]

my question is regarding race, but not quite the,"what race is best for warrior?" scoped to classic/vanilla, i've read everything google gives me, youtube videos, and i read past conversations in this channel, so i'm not coming in blind. i shouldn't be thinking of race/racials as "best", but more what advantage do i want? more hp and stun AoE (tauren), extra CC breaker (WoTF), stun resistance. yea?

[distant saffron]

In a sense, yes

Figure out what you want to do, then find a race which has good racials

[proven dove]

@distant saffron what i want to do, as in pve or pvp and tank or dps?

[distant saffron]

Yeah

Horde is easy tho

Orc is best pvp, best dps, and best tank for 99% of guilds

[proven dove]

that does make it pretty easy

[slate basin]

Do Warriors have a fixed rage gain from auto attacks regardless of weapon speed?

Was wondering what weapon I should get from Marshal Haggard for the lv10 class quest weapon.

I was thinking of getting the dagger and spending the 10s on the Dagger skill since I might not get a replacement and I want to try tanking Deadmines at lv15, hence the need for a fast weapon.

[distant saffron]

its not based on wep speed, its based on dagae

*damage

also fast weapon doesnt always mean better

[slate basin]

How does warrior rage-from-auto-attack work then?

Also, I realize that it means my Heroic Strike is weaker if I get a faster weapon, I know.

I just wanted to know how rage gains worked so that I could possibly take that into account.

[distant saffron]

Damage dealt is converted to rage, based on a formula

More damage = more rage

Normalisation came around in TBC

[crimson jay]

they tried rage normalisation in TBC but had to adjust after it turned out to be a failure. 'true' rage normalisation came with Cata

[surreal robin]

Ye

Wotlk was pretty much rage starve untill late ulduar I think

[distant saffron]

wotlk was pretty funny

Fury awful until trial, then became pretty good

[crimson jay]

you played Arms in Ulduar anyway

[surreal robin]

That's why tho

[crimson jay]

kinda. also because of Arms rework which made the spec really work well in PvE for the first time (yeah, TBC Slam was a thing but no comparison)

[slate basin]

Slam is a literally "Do not even train it" ability, right?

Also, so I want to be looking at DPS for rage generation?

[frosty haven]

you can do well with a slam build

but its not used in the standard rotation

stuff that procs extra attacks is nutso for rage gen

[distant saffron]

@slate basin dear god fucking no

Slam is fucking amazing

[slate basin]

How/when are you able to use it, then?

[distant saffron]

Ok, lets look at it like this

[slate basin]

I think I was told in a Kronos Discord not to get Slam, but maybe that was just a recommended type of thing, like while leveling, and they were keeping it simple.

[distant saffron]

When you have a swing, you wait for the swing to end to heroic strike, right?

[slate basin]

Yes

15 rage baseline, and minus the rage that hit would have generated.

[distant saffron]

so, instead of waiting 2 seconds, or w/e your swing timer left

you slam

and wait 1.1 seconds

while levelling, its not great

[slate basin]

Lemme get the tooltip for Slam

[distant saffron]

but at end game, its insane

[slate basin]

https://i.imgur.com/lyuBEqI.png

So you wait 1.1 seconds between slams?

Or is that the cast speed after talents?

[distant saffron]

Cast speed with talenta

I mostly run either 2/5 or 4/5 slam

Ally needs 5/5 tho

[surreal robin]

Was that a thing in classic yet

[empty zephyr]

slam resets your swing timer,so u want to use it immediately after your auto,not worth it really,especially if u are horde ,spam hamstring with windfury

[distant saffron]

Or you can use slam instead of hamstring

45 damage vs 1k damage

[empty zephyr]

ye or not do that for same or more dmg thanks to shamans

[distant saffron]

Slam procs windfury as well

Lmao

[empty zephyr]

didnt say it didnt...

[wanton bison]

spamstring 😦

[distant saffron]

Spamstring is fine

[slate basin]

When Classic launches, I'm going to be duo leveling with a Paladin who will be healing my ass. Should I be leveling/speccing as Arms and going sword+board w/ Defensive Stance to tank?

I plan to tank all my dungeon runs (and obviously do open world)

I'm trying to figure out all these different builds I keep hearing about, but the one thing I keep hearing is that Fury is worse compared to Arms for leveling because of no hit-gear, and you don't need Prot talents to tank because your armor and Def Stance is enough.

[distant saffron]

Most of the dungeons you can just keep ur 2h on

Mobs hit like my gf

That is to say, non existant

[slate basin]

Lol

[distant saffron]

Put shield on for bosses and you'll be fine

[slate basin]

Noted.

Arms it is.

[distant saffron]

Arms 100% for leveling

[exotic frigate]

Is leveling really that bad as a warrior? I keep seeing this everywhere

With not much to back it up

[distant saffron]

its only bad if you treat it like retail

[exotic frigate]

Yeah I mean I figure I can't AoE farm like I did on my mage

But damn people are acting like its impossible

I don't remember leveling being anywhere near that hard

[misty bolt]

its shit compared to pet classes etc

[slate basin]

Regarding how rage gains per white hit are calculated:
https://i.imgur.com/EfHoget.png
https://vanilla-wow.fandom.com/wiki/Rage

What does the less-than-or-equal-to inequality signify?

As in, is that an upper limit on how much rage you can generate per hit?

You can't generate more rage per hit than 15*d/c?

[exotic frigate]

d represents damage

Eventually you'd reach a damage cap

If damage kept increasing you'd never hit a limit

Just did some maths, and it don't even matter because the left side of the formula won't ever equal the right

Hit factor and weapon speed won't make up for the 15D/4c vs 15D/c

[worldly dust]

Theres no limit but the size of your rage bar on how much you can generate per hit

[sand apex]

hi whats a good time for 1-15

going fast

[exotic frigate]

In general? Or on launch day lol

[sudden junco]

I was just sort of moseying through the stress test and did it in about 12 hours without any forethought or urgency. You could probably do it, with a coordinated group and a preplanned route in 8-10 I'd guess.

Also depends on class.

[proven dove]

@exotic frigate warrior leveling is tough, but really just slow because you're in melee range so you always take damage, have no self healing so you need to stop eat or bandage a lot

some scenarios you may pull to many NPCs and you're dead where other classes, especially pet classes (like @misty bolt said), have ways to manage multiple targets

[exotic frigate]

Yeah I suppose the times where I'm using ice nova on multiple guys with my mage I'd be dead as a warrior then

[vapid heron]

Thats why when I levelled I ran undead. It wasn't GREAT healing, but it helped with uptime a bit.

[slate basin]

I got stuck with things taking fucking forever in Elwynn, and with my limited amount of time, I only got to level 14. Didn't get to do DM.

[bright karma]

in situations like that you should just go grind uncontested mobs

it's impossible to do most of the regular quests on a F R E S H

[slate basin]

True.

I wanted to start doing that with the Watchers to get to 15.

But I had to go to work.

I probably could have at least entered DM before I had to leave, if I could have played until the servers were shut down.

[bright karma]

i wanted to get some hit testing going in the previous test and all the quest mobs/areas were tapped out and i was running out of time

so i just went to grind mobs that weren't part of any quest and hit level 10 quickly

[slate basin]

I wanted to play with more addons and keybinds and stuff.

I wanted to make my own WeakAura for expanded character stat information. I wanted to write down the average rage-gain per hit, and how much damage you have to deal per point of rage.

It'd just be a panel of info off to the side of the character pane (since, you know, we have wider monitors now and can afford that space).

[gloomy lake]

weakaura's in vanilla lul

[slate basin]

powerauras*

[lean agate]

wut

[dreamy ice]

weakauras was the spiritual successor to powerauras

[alpine bloom]

I’m probably gonna take a few weeks off work or use all my personal leave of absence for when classic comes out

To level my warrior and professions

Also, I might just go prot for the entirety of the level grind

[distant saffron]

I feel obligated to tell you thats a really stupid idea

[main hemlock]

There is no hurry tbh

[naive hamlet]

Why would you go prot Arms tanks in classic ranked just as good as prot tanks

[distant saffron]

Arms is the best spec by far for levelling

Prot is garbage on another level

[proven dove]

@alpine bloom a couple weeks off sounds excessive

[alpine bloom]

I know it’s a dumb idea

I just played prot in every expansion after vanilla and I wanna do it in classic

@proven dove I’m also joining either the Air Force or the navy so I’m gonna get that stuff done too.

I can go intel with either branch or nuclear engineering with the navy

Plus I hate my factory job so I’ll enjoy the time off for my birthday and classic

[proven dove]

@alpine bloom ok, i get that. initially i read it as classic takes a several week commitment. that's what i thought was excessive. whatever you decide to do, enjoy 👍

[proven dove]

I forget. Can you stance dance while sappped or feared?

[bright peak]

No

Better be in the correct stance prior to either

[sudden junco]

i know the baked-in threat api was added later, but are their nameplate addons that will shift the enemy health bar color based on whether or not the enemy is targeting you (as opposed to whether or not you have aggro) for classic?

[bright karma]

no reason that shouldn't be possible

there will also be nameplates with threat, it just won't come from blizzard

it will use some threat library that has all the threat values hardcoded

[charred otter]

Am I right in saying that defensive stance gives (0.9*1.3*1.15/0.8 = 1.68) 68% more threat than battle stance?

[distant saffron]

should be 69.5, iirc

[charred otter]

Hmm I can't get that number... am I missing a modifier?

[distant saffron]

1*1.3*1.15 = 1.495
0.8 = 0.8

all percentage changes in wow are multiplicative

Threat, haste, damage

[solemn leaf]

anyone know bis essences for warrs yet?

[charred otter]

classic channel btw

[solemn leaf]

oh rip

[distant saffron]

sorry, 86% difference

1.495/0.8

[charred otter]

Ah ok that's better
But I was taking into account that prot does 10% less damage in defensive stance

[distant saffron]

ok but that cant be an extra factor

Because a lot of your threat as prot is static

[charred otter]

oh unaffected by damage modifiers?

[distant saffron]

yes

Most of your abilities have static threat modifier

sunder max rank is 270 flat threat

so 270*0.8 in battle/zerker, and 270*1.495 in def

Damage dealt directly equals threat as well, but you never take that into account in the formula

[charred otter]

That's fair, not used to +threat on retail
I presume that's in addition to the threat from the sunder itself?

[distant saffron]

What do you mean?

sunder deals no damage, so every sunder you cast does exactly the same threat

Abilities like Shield slam deal damage, but also have a static threat addition

same with heroic strike/revenge

[charred otter]

a comment says it generates 5*armour threat, so 450*5 = 1350 threat

[distant saffron]

what

no

where tf does it say that

[charred otter]

no? ok

[distant saffron]

is that on wowhead?

[charred otter]

yeah

[distant saffron]

jesus that would be so OP

[charred otter]

1 star comment lol

[distant saffron]

Link me

[charred otter]

https://classic.wowhead.com/spell=11597/sunder-armor#comments

So it's just 270 then?

[distant saffron]

yes

lmao

[charred otter]

• defensive stance

[distant saffron]

ok 1 sec

I know where hes getting confused

total armor reduced is armor*5

because sunder stacks 5 times

where tf did he get 1350 from :Thonk:

[sudden junco]

450*5 doesnt even equal 1350

[distant saffron]

exactly

[charred otter]

yeah just noticed that too lol

[dusk ice]

rank 3 sunder is 270

[rustic umbra]

hi, why are so many 2h fury guides/videos (and even some dw fury guides) advising to take impale. isnt it really bad to have to take deep wounds because of the 16 debuff limit?

[distant saffron]

Deep wounds is LOW on the debuff prio system - it wont knock anything off, and gets knocked off by almost everything

[nova knoll]

where are the bis lists

I only have one

[distant saffron]

🤔

bis lists for what

[nova knoll]

warrior gear in general for classic per stage and etc

[distant saffron]

they are still being made

Ignore the currently released massive spreadsheet

[nova knoll]

I would have thought these nerds figured it out already

[distant saffron]

its so shit you could fertilise crops with it

Well, ions tweet has us pretty fucked up

[nova knoll]

I'm just going off of pre raid in general stuff

[distant saffron]

Preraid is just "get 6 hit (9 if you picked the moron races) and then fill with crit, value crit at about 30 AP"

[nova knoll]

I only orc warrior

[distant saffron]

best slots for hit are devilsaur, truestrike, and LH if you have it

if you dont have LH cause ur either too poor or a recipe hasnt dropped, use eye of rend and blackstone/brigam

[rustic umbra]

thanks@ babyhoof

[nova knoll]

what is LH

lion helm?

[distant saffron]

lionheart

[nova knoll]

ye

I plan on doing blacksmithing so hopefully I just get a recipe

[distant saffron]

it drops from either rag/ony, or some of the mobs in UBRS

super super rare

[nova knoll]

right

[distant saffron]

also side note, i'd only go BS if ur a horde MT

[nova knoll]

first major goal is the recipe for arcanite reaper

off that one dungeon dude

[rustic umbra]

assuming a dps warrior doesnt run with a tank warrior. how long does a mob approximetly need to live to be worth it to apply 5 stacks of sunder armor ?

or to formulate the question differently. how often do you have to use sa as a dps warrior?

[nova knoll]

just unbind everything but mortal strike and execute

[rustic umbra]

i much rather press more buttons then less 😄

[distant saffron]

even with a tank, you'll use sunder

the faster stacks go up, the more DPS you can do

If a mob lives for more than 15-20 seconds, its usually worth stacking

but depends on the mob, depends on your comp, etc

[rustic umbra]

thanks 😃

[limber pecan]

hey guys, how do warriors in rank 10 gear fare against other classes in rank 10 gear?

[keen umbra]

Warrior pvp gear is great and especially the R13 is insane. Don't know how it compares though. Mage PvP gear is also incredible at least.

[dreamy ice]

the best gear in vanilla was from naxx

for a warrior, by far the biggest bump you get is from your weapon, which is rank 14

it is going to be a lot easier to get a weapon like that from the raid than from pvp

it will just be a prestige thing

[idle shale]

Kinda depend on pacing though. The rank 14 gear was basically between AQ and Naxx gear, and it comes out a lot sooner than those in the phases.

Obviously actually getting to rank 14 takes a ton of time, but until AQ/Naxx the rank 12-14 gear is hella OP

[dreamy ice]

the nef sword is basically the r14 sword

if you can get that then r14 would be a small upgrade at best

[crimson jay]

people want the R14 OH for PvE tho

[bright karma]

R14 2H is better than ashkandi for pvp, especially if you're horde because of WF then it's way better because of the 3.80 speed

i'd say the first weapon that outclasses the R14 weapons for pvp is dark edge of insanity, but mostly because of the proc

[main hemlock]

bonereavers any good? never saw it back then xd

[bright karma]

BRE very good for pvp yeah

not so much for pve with blizzlike boss armor values, still good for trash cleaving tho because you never have full armor debuffs up on trash

[main hemlock]

i assume the armor debuff would get dropped off anyways or is it high prio

[bright karma]

it's a buff on yourself, not a debuff on the mob

[main hemlock]

ah weird, says its a curse but probs not right

or its jsut a weird thing

[bright karma]

yeah it's a curse on yourself

[solar matrix]

in PVP bonereavers is insane

[south kite]

is there going to be guides and stuff for vanilla? or is it time to review old archives and shit

[distant saffron]

No, no one at all will make guides

I hope you have a 15 year old memory

[proven dove]

@south kite Lots of guides are coming out. A streamer named “Alive” or “I am Alive” has been writing a bunch

[sudden junco]

Just wait for three sunders, apply face to keyboard, and roll like the old days.

[modern river]

https://gyazo.com/dd6c6564795d02d6fe1541e8a54f0bb0

So I'm guessing that this is the client that will hold the functional servers when the game officially releases?

People seem to be able to choose it but no servers are functional it seems.

[distant saffron]

yes

[modern river]

Alright.

[nova knoll]

been like that for a while

[solar matrix]

Yeah it was what they used for that all subs weekend stress test a while back

Spent the test setting up my ui/options/macros cause that SHOULD carry over for launch since same client/acct

[exotic frigate]

In theory, who knows though

[nova knoll]

god I just wanna play x_x

they need to let more people in

[solar matrix]

the beta died pretty hard

it was alive off momentum because lack of content at 40 and lack of new people being able to play

and the AV weekend fuckin finished it off

[modern garden]

it was like 99% streamers anyway

[cobalt otter]

AV weekend really killed it

they also just are not inviting anyone so

[solar matrix]

yeah exactly

[cobalt otter]

which is smart cause itll make people wanna play more on launch if they dont try beta but

it still blows

[solar matrix]

with very limited end game content and absolutely new blood

3 days of "nah you cant play" were enough to finish it off

[cobalt otter]

yeah

[solar matrix]

oh well, only 55 days 15 hours 6 minutes and 20 seconds

remain

[cobalt otter]

its okay

everyone knows classic will be great

cause blizz cant actually change anything about it

[solar matrix]

yeah good joke

[cobalt otter]

so they cant possibly turn it into bfa

[solar matrix]

layering :^)))))))))))

[cobalt otter]

right...

[solar matrix]

the real laughs

is gonna be when classic blows the fuck up

and blizzard tries to change stuff in retail to capture that success

and creates an even more disgusting abomination of a game

[cobalt otter]

i might secretly enable global emotes in here...

[solar matrix]

Do it I need to be able to classiccomfy

[cobalt otter]

Give me that emote actually

Post it here

The image

[solar matrix]

I'll give it to you when I'm back at my comp

[solar matrix]

weird

cant find the original

[turbid relic]

I need an opinion on how I should spec for leveling. I will be leveling as a warrior with 2 rogues. I know that’s trash, but it’s rl friends and we’re not speed leveling. I do want to do the best we can with that comp though. I want to be able to quest in the open world solo if they’re not online as well as tank dungeons for us.

I’ve seen comments say you can tank low level dungeons as any spec and it doesn’t matter for warrior. So if I go arms/fury would I still go defensive stance and use a sword and board for dungeons?

[sudden junco]

Arms is probably best for leveling, and yeah, you could go sword/board, but most stuff you can also just tank as 2h

[turbid relic]

Would I use Arms/2H in defensive stance and how long would I be able to get away with that level wise?

[sudden junco]

Depends on your healer, dps, and your gear, but i'd guess most pre-raid stuff. And def stance is probably a case-by-case thing. If you need the extra threat to keep mobs on you, sure. Go def stance, but if you're 2h tanking, you'll probably do enough dps so that it won't be a problem.

Nice thing about stances is that you don't just pick one and hve to stay in it until you hit a town again or something. Just swap as needed.

You'll figure it out as you level.

[turbid relic]

Thanks for the advice!

[modern garden]

@cobalt otter do it pussy

[daring reef]

Fellas, what are your plans for making money

Can't wait for the constant respecs trying to handle tanking / dps / pvp

[steady palm]

Grind beasts and skin initially. Swap to proper professions later. I’d keep respeccing to a minimum considering you don’t need a prot spec to handle dungeons or even off tanking in raids. I guess only real conflict is raid dps dw fury vs arms pvp. But considering BGs aren’t out in p1 you can probably stick to the one spec throughout.

[daring reef]

is it worth is an orc while leveling to walk to thunder bluff to train maces and staves

[past tide]

Used to bother with skinning till 40 in pservers, but after the beta all I'm going to lvl till 60 is first aid

You get enough cash just by spending it wisely, plus doing a lot of Dungeons.

Do'em any time you can, specially with folk you trust and even if you want to tryhard it. Grind them with a dedicated group for maximum efficiency, besides the legit confy exp/gesr you'll get you will actually get a decent amount of cash per run

At 60 there are plenty of ways of earning cash. Some bother leveling an Alt just for it and certainly a case could be made to go for either one mage or hunt

But I just stick to mining/engineering, and doing mostly orb runs and res/jump runs in DM:E when they are available. My guild partially helps me with consumables (I'm a MT) and with the method mentioned above I get around 50gs per hour

[merry palm]

Is anyone just like, actually planning on playing classic to enjoy it and not necessarily be the MOST efficient possible?

Or am I in the wrong discord >.>

[solar matrix]

PLenty of people are

But the people talking about classic months in advanced in a random discord tend to be the type planning to min/max

[past tide]

So you should formulate questions that spergs may understand, example:

I want to play Classic as 80% normie and 20% efficiency

What should I do?

[jade fog]

Just play

And check some info here and there

[slender scarab]

Yo guys

I heard yall been doing some Vanilla WoW warrior math, and i've got a question

Taking into account that your a fury warrior, with no racial Wskill, and no edgemaster's handguards, in pre-bis gear. Post-9% hit, what is the most valuable stat?

I would assume crit chance, to try to get close to a 30% passive crit. But i might be totally off here, and im really curious what i should be aiming for after hitting 30% crit aswell, is it just STR after that? Looking at some Data on https://retro-wow.com/forum/printthread.php?tid=4288 it makes me think that hit rating might still be the most valuable stat, even after hitting 9%.

So, after 9% hit, what stat should you focus on most, Crit/STR? (or keep stacking hit till you reach 24% hit?)

[slender scarab]

@tardy nacelle any thoughts?

[solar matrix]

You might wanna join

the dedicated classic warrior discord

for that kinda indepth stuff

[tardy nacelle]

I have 0 clues about anything related to Classic, sorry

[slender scarab]

Oh shit, i thought this wasthe warrior discord XD

[solar matrix]

it's the retail warrior discord, just has a classic channel

[slender scarab]

My bad, can anybody throw me a link?

[solar matrix]

https://discord.gg/AR3YQY

[slender scarab]

thanks guys

[solar matrix]

thats the dedicated classic discord

ye np

[ruby kiln]

@tardy nacelle

hi

[tardy nacelle]

Grrr

[cobalt otter]

[solar matrix]

wtf why didnt i get any heals

vapes

[tender estuary]

proceeds to hearthstone out in the middle of an encounter against fallen avatar

[cobalt otter]

If you're really invested in Classic and wish to discuss it with others who share the same enthusiasm; check out the Classic Warrior Discord.
https://discord.gg/AR3YQY

[distant saffron]

👀

[modern garden]

🤔

[gleaming karma]

I heard that Babyhoof guy is a mod there, what a NERD!

[bright karma]

they'd let anybody be a mod these days

no standards

[distant saffron]

wow, magey

All this time spent creating accurate bis lists

Do I mean nothing to you?

:feelsbadman:

[gleaming karma]

:/

[distant saffron]

@slender scarab I'm out atm, but I'll answer u when I get back. TLDR that forum post is quite misleading

[supple plover]

So I never played vanilla and I’m interested in making a warrior. I found a private server that insta lvls you to 60... but all these abilities plus stances and having to know what abilities are locked behind certain stances looks intimidating as fuck since I’ve never really played a warrior in retail wow either. Is it as complicated as it appears?

[solar matrix]

I mean it's way easier when you get the abilities slowly over the course of 60 levels and a month

But warrior does benefit from a lot of macros for swapping stances/weapons which is a bit complex

[supple plover]

Yeah I can see that. Everyone suggested I do this to get an idea of what warrior is like but making 30 plus keybinds off the bat seems ineffective

[solar matrix]

Yeah it is a great way to get a feel for how a class works but getting the toolkit all at once like that can be rough. 30+ keybinds is pretty typical for most classes in vanilla tho

[supple plover]

Well I play rogue in retail. So I have quite a bit in my current setup. But that many keybinds on a class I know close to 0 about is insane for my head lol.

Like I don’t even know what abilities are priority and need ez access keybinds

[solar matrix]

i mean your only real options are trial and erroring your own keybinds

which will take a long while

or taking someone else's keybinds

which is super subjective so you'll likely end up with binds you dont like

[supple plover]

Lol yeah I’ll have to figure out what to make my stances since it seems super important to have those on ez access buttons

[distant saffron]

@slender scarab ok, couple of points first off.
No1 priority is 9% hit. Past that, you literally give no shits about hit. You won't be crit capped for a long fucking time, so dw about that.
Rough stat weights for P1 gear are about this
AP = 1
Agi = 1.5
Crit = 30
Hit = 8

Hit is never better than crit

We aren't rogues, our main damage source isn't whites, its yellows

[supple plover]

@distant saffron dude u came in with energy and i love that shit

[distant saffron]

??

[supple plover]

you had a detailed answer thats all

im not being sarcastic lol

[distant saffron]

ahh, cheers

[bright karma]

better make a high IQ race choice so you only need 6% instead of 9% hit

[fringe furnace]

More humans means cheaper edgemasters for gnomish masterrace

[supple plover]

whats best horde race for warrior? orc?

[bright karma]

for dps it's orc yeah

for tanking it's a more involved question

[solar matrix]

and for pvp

it's a big argument now

[valid cove]

Tanking it's Troll

[misty bolt]

Wha

Isnt it undead

[valid cove]

For what

You have shamans for tremors

[misty bolt]

Ah true

Why troll then ?

[valid cove]

more hit=more threat

hit as in

me hit things

not hit cap

[misty bolt]

But trolls are fugly

True tanks are tauren

[valid cove]

that mega hitbox in pvp tho 😢

[bright karma]

troll berserkering is very good for threat, but like you'd have to be in a high end guild to really utilize it and game it right

and also thunderfury is a sword so orc racial is a non-factor there

but for your average warrior in you average guild, overall orc is better for tanking

[valid cove]

I disagree

Berserking has far more benefits, average player or not than blood fury does

especially if you're an average player, blood fury can get you killed

[bright karma]

blood fury?

who's talking about blood fury

talking about the axe racial

most people will not utilize berserking correctly and will not have thunderfury

for them, orc is better

[valid cove]

"Overall orc is better for tanking"

[bright karma]

yeah, because of the axe racial

it's pretty huge when you're using axes

3% hit, 30% more damage on glancing blows, -0.5% chance to be dodged

at the high end troll with daggers or thunderfury is better

having to gear for 6% hit instead of 9% hit as a tank is pretty big especially early on, lets you swap pieces with hit for more mitigation/threat as needed

and the glancing penalty reduction is straight up more rage/threat

[sudden junco]

All hail our one true lord and savior weapon skill.

[red cipher]

Which off the dps specs would u consider to be superior atm?

[idle shale]

fury is by far the best dps spec

even out of the entire game

[red cipher]

is any of the benthic gear good for us? furys

[idle shale]

#fury

[bright karma]

coincidentally fury is also bis in classic

god the lack of external emotes is killing me here

[solar matrix]

correct

[solar matrix]

wrong channel lol

[proven dove]

really interesting to hear fury is better than arms. i remember everyone running arms in vanilla.

[idle shale]

arms was good until a later patch that redid some fury talents and turned BT into an actual attack. Fury had some real issues early on

also everyone was bad, and had no idea how to gear which also held fury back from becoming popular as quickly as it should have

[distant saffron]

^^

All the old posts and guides etc are just STACK HIT REEEEEE

[proven dove]

thanks @idle shale time for me to do some reading on this

[distant saffron]

when we now know thats pretty stupid

[solar matrix]

dont worry

everyone is still bad

[main hemlock]

13 years changes nothing

[candid star]

@cobalt otter Could i get inv for warr classic discord channel ?

[charred otter]

In pins

oh nvm

https://discord.gg/RbCZJtw

[gleaming karma]

Must not be a perm invite

classic naeno

If you're really invested in Classic and wish to discuss it with others who share the same enthusiasm; check out the Classic Warrior Discord.
https://discord.gg/RbCZJtw

[slate basin]

Why is there a Discord just for classic Warriors?

[frosty haven]

why not

[slate basin]

Like why not Skyhold?

[frosty haven]

skyhold is more focused on retail

[slate basin]

I suppose.

[frosty haven]

there isnt dedicated theorycrafters here for classic

[slate basin]

Ah.

[frosty haven]

better to find a community more specialized if you need some real number crunches

[slate basin]

Well I'm glad I popped in to see that there was one.

[frosty haven]

👍

[modern river]

I've said before that I'm going to be tanking as a Warrior in Classic. But what about the leveling part? How are you guys going to level to 60, and how are you going to transition over to tanking after that?

Now you just spam the dungeon finder as whatever.

[solar matrix]

level as arms, you can tank anything outside of a raid in that

and you'll level MUCH faster

[distant saffron]

go find 4 friends

spam dungeons from 18-60

🤧

[modern river]

I can do that?

How much will dungeons give in terms of leveling speed?

[distant saffron]

theyre really, really fucking good

[solar matrix]

🤢

[sudden junco]

Depends on your goals really. Classic leveling is actually pretty fun just to meander, and you can do pretty much anything as arms. If you're going to try to no-life it, spamming dungeons will help.

[simple summit]

I never played vanilla, I was a BC baby and played hunter. Is vanilla warrior really as nightmarish and gruelling as people make it out to be

Am torn between rogue warrior and mage for classic

[sudden junco]

Depends on what you want to do.

It's not a nightmare.

Leveling you're not as self-sufficient as, say, a hunter

But you can still do it

And you have the added benefit of never needing to find a tank for a dungeon

For dps, warrior scales more with gear than most (all?) other classes, so you start off a bit weaker in raids and then tops meters later on.

If you have specific worries, maybe ask about those, but it's not a nightmare by any stretch.

Are your goals to just level to 60? To do 5 man content at 60? To PVP heavily? To raid casually? To speed run Naxx with world buffs and a bunch of other min/maxers?

[simple summit]

I haven’t thought about all that tbh.. just kinda wanna play and experience classic

But if it’s gonna be tedious then maybe warrior isn’t what I should roll

[sudden junco]

If that's the case, just try a few levels of each and go with whatever you find fun

I have vanilla experience with hunter and warrior at 60 and mage at mid 30s, and i preferred leveling on hunter, but max level on warrior more

[frosty haven]

its really not hard to play warrior, levelling is on the slower end but its not hard
people will love to group with you as long as you know what you are doing
being the best tank and DPS spec out there

[sudden junco]

mage just wasn't for me

[simple summit]

I want something with fast and engaging gameplay

Fury warrior in legion comes to mind, so does havoc DH

Havoc isn’t hard or complicated by any means but it’s fast and engaging

[sudden junco]

i have only played a warrior in retail, but in general things are a bit slower in classic vs retail

and by 'in retail' i mean 'pre bfa'. end-xpac prot warrior was super button-mashy, and classic warrior is a lot more... contemplative

[fringe furnace]

@simple summit then you won‘t have a lot fun in classic

It‘s way slower everything

And during leveling you will die at least twice as often as every other class

[simple summit]

Rip

As long as combat is fast paced I don’t care that the actual game overall is slower

It’s more of a classic rpg with the exploration and skills etc etc

[fringe furnace]

Combat starts beeing kind of fast in raids

Main skills have 6 and 10 sec cd

And in between you spend rage on an on next hit attack

But even then it‘s more about rage management

The current arcade style button spamming started later

Like 4 or 5 expansions

[frosty haven]

a geared fury will be pretty high apm, nothing compared to bfa but its one of the highest apm specs compared to the others in classic

with enough attack speed and crit, you will be hitting heroic strike a ton to try and spend rage

[simple summit]

What about rogue

Does that have high APM

[bright karma]

don't forget all the consumable/buff management

that's a whole separate subject in vanilla

shitton of consumables to be used at different times / the right moment

[dreamy ice]

heroic strike every MH swing really

and there is a lot of stuff going on but tbh the skillcap won't be very high, if you have a raid with 40 people with low ping who all know how to play everything is going to melt

90% of the stuff discussed in this channel over the last few months would have been a revelation to the people running naxx when it was current content

• being horde makes a huge difference in terms of rage and dps in general

[idle shale]

yeah I mean you can go pretty tryhard in vanilla with consumables, but it won't matter for anything but parsing

we were one of top 10 US guilds all of Vanilla and we had retarded raid comps, bad specs, we were all terrible, etc. There's really not going to be a lot of challenge to Vanilla, but that doesn't mean it won't be fun.

Most of current WoW doesn't offer much challenge either.

[dreamy ice]

yeah and i knew a guild who made it most of the way through naxx (and cleared AQ40) with a raid of 15-20 people and the rest basically pugs

after a month or two it will settle into a familiar rhythm where it's basically the same as retail wow just with differing human hour requirements

after that it just depends on economics basically

[simple summit]

@dreamy ice how does being horde make a huge difference

Like negative or positive

I’m assume you’re talking about blood fury

[sudden junco]

windfury

totem

[bright karma]

😍

[sudden junco]

i think a lot of the challenge with classic will be more social in nature than mechanical

outside of min-maxing for speed clears and such

[nova knoll]

too bad the patch we'll be on is after the weapon speed normalization

[simple summit]

What is weapon speed normalization

[sudden junco]

some instant abilities (like mortal strike) used to deal damage based on a formula that took the weapon speed, in seconds, into account. this meant slow weapons, like arcanite reaper (3.8 speed) could deal massive hits instantly. this also made itemization kind of wonky, because a seemingly weaker 3.8 speed weapon could trump a 'better' 3.2 weapon or something. in one patch they changed it so that all 2h mortal strike type calculations used 3.6 seconds

I forget the 1h speed, but I think it was 2.4

This link kind of gives the gist, but take the formulas with a grain of salt https://worldofwarcraft.fandom.com/et/wiki/Normalization

[simple summit]

So even a 2h that’s 20-30 ilvls higher would hit like a weapon that’s lower ilvl?

that’s... dumb

[sudden junco]

I don't know that it'd be 20-30 ilvls higher--the ilvls in vanilla were a lot lower, but it did create some unusual gearing situations. i don't know that it's dumb, gearing in early wow was a lot more interesting to me for reasons like this, but it was unintuitive for sure

[bright karma]

streamlined gear is dumb

if we're talking about dumb things

[simple summit]

Why is it dumb

It’s a clear progression path

[bright karma]

because it's boring and unexciting and makes previous content worthless

[fringe furnace]

Yepp clear progression path is for People who don‘t want to think

In Classic even talents can make or break a gear decission

[bright karma]

also ilvls are largely meaningless in vanilla Bane

they used to itemize stuff by hand back then

[fringe furnace]

Priests for example have a talent which gives them 25% of spirit as sp dmg

Choosing this talent will alter the way to weight gear

[bright karma]

you have items from BRD that are BiS until AQ40

and items from MC that are BiS until Naxx

[fringe furnace]

Having to care about hit means you don‘t just use an item because it’s little more strength when you loose hit this way

[sudden junco]

and TF which is BIS until 70

[fringe furnace]

Op legendary 😂

[sudden junco]

Not OP when your MT gets one binding, quits, you gear up a tank to fill the gap, and then you get the other binding.

Womp womp.

[fringe furnace]

Luck is a bitch

[simple summit]

@bright karma that makes it more boring. Gear you get from 2 tiers previous is BiS for so long? Makes all loot irrelevant and unexciting

[fringe furnace]

Why it’s not like it’s all just one or two pieces

[sudden junco]

different people like different things. film at 11.

[nova knoll]

I think it's cool when lower weapons can be better

when it's always 1:1 no thinking it's kind of boring

[lucid bluff]

i mean.. to each their own, but saying that things are just 1:1 upgrades as boring kinda makes no sense, it pretty much always gives you something to work towards while the former just is ur hard bis for.. well forever just about lol

how is using the same thing for the entire duration (or just very long) of vanilla less boring

granted, the unique weapons that have that kind of chance to shine e.g like ironfoe or empyrean, untamed/bonereaver etc... are cool effects, i dont see how its any less boring

in terms of gearing up

[primal kite]

It isnt boring because you dont have to farm everything again once a new raid releases. You have your quick strike ring and your onslaught girdle from mc and it will last you until the end of vanilla. Your gear is not automatically shit once a new raid releaes.

[past tide]

"makes gear irrelevant" playing BFA I can't bloody remember 99% of the shit I've looted. With even greater ideas like now the benthic lottery. "To each his own" nah, gear is boring as hell nowdays and that's partially the issue why retail sucks. When you get a trinket in BRD that u use almost until Naxx40 that's huge. You can feel the weight of said item and remember it's name. When I get a "bis" trinket in BFA I know it still sucks because is not enough ilvl or lacks a socket. So I have to grind my arse until the RNG gods decide to smile me with the same item but with better stats. Oh and the best part is having to do that every bloody season for the same God damn item. Talking about irrelevant, is hard to care about loot when you switch it in less than a month when a new patch hits.

[mighty magnet]

did someone say, blessed blade of the windseeker?

[simple talon]

Casting the same ability as a frost mage in vanilla and having a perfect rotation lol

[slender scarab]

Ey, don't forget to evocate and pop your mana gem.

[earnest carbon]

When is release date btw?

[warped plank]

@earnest carbon August 27th

[earnest carbon]

Gotya

[nova knoll]

stress test today or nah

just wanna play a good game pepehands

[solar matrix]

p sure the test for today

got moved back

like

weeks ago

[nova knoll]

yeah that's the only mention I've seen of it

don't see why

[distant saffron]

im gonna assume because they havent figured out the details

or are still fixing issues from the last test

[nova knoll]

too busy making WoW mobile

[strange dove]

is classic out yet?

[distant saffron]

Yes

[solar matrix]

!release

shit discord

[gloomy lake]

27/08/19

[nova knoll]

when is the final stress test

still no date?

[simple talon]

Is blacksmithing beneficial to warriors, prbly right?

Yea the gear looks mad nice

[distant saffron]

Everything can be made by someone else

The only "beneficial" profession is Engineering

[simple talon]

If everyone takes that attitude there’ll be no one to make something but yea I get you

[nova knoll]

nah it will balance out because then people will reap heavy benefits from the others

but nonetheless I expect engineering to be the most popular because it is the best one

just can't decide where I'm going to allot my professions

I might just have my gold farming mage be the blacksmith as weird as that would be. prob not

[simple talon]

all 3 of my toons will be miners for sure

Just to get ore while leveling

[nova knoll]

yeah my warrior will probably be mining and engineering

and maybe mage as mining and blacksmithing

[crimson jay]

keeping up mining while leveling is so annoying tho

[simple talon]

Yea true without a mount

[nova knoll]

just buy a mount

uhm. if you're mountless... just buy a mount?

[simple talon]

Only get a mount at 40

[nova knoll]

meme

[simple talon]

For like 100g which is a lot

idk what u mean by meme, mounts aren’t available until 40

And gold is hard to get

until the economy grows 15g will be a lot for weeks imo

Gotta buy skills

every level

[crimson jay]

only buy what you really need

[simple talon]

Still I remember in the 40s not being able to afford skill ranks lol it gets expensive

[nova knoll]

I was referencing a meme, you boomer

[simple talon]

Sounds like something a liberal born in the 2000s would say me me

was talking to a 15 year old who was excited for classic, was really funny, that’s like being excited for a talkie film

It’ll take a month for most adults to hit 60 and at least 2 weeks for a no lifer

Assuming they sleep

[ivory veldt]

I'm just keen to play something which is more RPG flavoured than the current action-RPG flavoured WoW (I started at start of TBC and didn't get through all that much raiding content before WOTLK). I will probably still end up focusing on retail because as an adult with a mortgage, something I can drop in and out of conveniently (read casual) is a game where I'll probably have a more fulfilling experience

[simple talon]

I just plan to play classic in my spare time if I get bored of running keys

[wraith dock]

yo - so I plan on playing prot warrior but I'm seeing that 2h fury until 40, then arms to 60, then prot? Is this right?

[distant saffron]

Just go Arms to 60, then stay arms until you start raiding

Arms is better for dungeons, solo content, etc

[gloomy lake]

bear in mind that lionheart helm exists, if you're running BS and get the recipe you'll be making yourself a bis through naxx helm + charging plebs out the arse for it

[lost grail]

That's my plan at least

[nova knoll]

Oh wait this isn't a shitpost channel

[solar matrix]

No, that's the arms channel

[jade fog]

🤔

[nova knoll]

[dreamy ice]

[jagged isle]

@solar matrix 😡

[bright karma]

external emotes when

[idle shale]

Never

[midnight thunder]

found out that as human with swords and 8% hit u can still miss against lvl63 with bloodthirst. but only with BT. spammed hundreds of harmstrings and no miss
apparently BT uses flat 300 weapon skill
any thoughts on this?

[crimson jay]

9% hit

[distant saffron]

You literally cant

Stop using nostcore servers to test

[crimson jay]

and no Beta so how you testing

oh, what bby said

[distant saffron]

Hes using a nostcore repack

So, literally every incorrect melee mechanic

[crimson jay]

<insert external emote>

[distant saffron]

BT not using weapon skill is a nost falsehood because nost dev's dont know how to research melee

[midnight thunder]

so 8% as human with swords should be right

[distant saffron]

No, 6%

[midnight thunder]

nice

ty

[crimson jay]

(9% hit without +weapon skill) - I wasn't precise on that

[topaz cedar]

so as far as classic goes, I want to tank (since I have been my entire wow career). When I played in vanilla I was like 11-12 years old and I never really tanked or played at a high level. I want to continue to play a warrior to tank effectively and be a must have for end game content BUT I have heard that warriors have a very rough time leveling. I was considering rolling a Paladin / Druid so I can tank 5 mans - 10man effectively and that they can also heal quite well and have hybrid specs so you can heal and tank without even changing talents. SO basically I am asking are warriors that much slower at leveling than a druid / paladin or can they pick up speed by certain leveling methods or something?

[steel lance]

It's not that bad to level and they pick up some speed around 30-40 when you get access to sweeping and MS if you're going arms.

[topaz cedar]

downside to a paladin is you will never be able to raid tank

[distant saffron]

warriors really arent that bad to level

[steel lance]

Gonna be honest here tho, if you don't have the patience to level a warrior, maybe classic tanking isn't a great fit for you.

[tired galleon]

Ok, first things first. The reason why warrior was so much slower was also partly due to us the players being a lot worse at it. If you go an efficent build, your warrior leveling wont be as slow as it was for myself with my my weird back'in'the'day spec. Also, we are only talking about a difference in days - so forfeiting warrior for another class cause' leveling is too hard just don't make sense. Just make sure to get some gear fit for warrior and you will be fine. Now, if you just want an excuse to play something else - just do it, it's a game after all.

[distant saffron]

paladin levellling is a lot more painful than warrior

just dont be stupid and pull 6 gazillion mobs and youll be fine

[tired galleon]

Atleast at low levels - AA and judgment 😛

[steel lance]

Paladin is boring and slow but easy tbh

[topaz cedar]

I would much rather play a warrior. I have just been seeing some guides saying warriors are the worst to level and vanialla being so long ago I cannot recount for how it actually was.

[steel lance]

They are the "worst" in terms of speed and ease but I find it far more enjoyable

[distant saffron]

most guides out there are really, really bad

They are written by people who have either never played vanilla, or have no clue about the class in question

[topaz cedar]

what class would you say can tank harder content while being mildy under geared? like say you are 35 and you want to go tank RFD which is around level 40?

[steel lance]

That's true too, so many of them are based off half truths

[distant saffron]

case in point - the wowhead tank guide that was released about a week ago

it was so bad, we spent 2 hours laughing at the first 3 pages

@topaz cedar druid and warrior are equal pretty much

[steel lance]

Saying spineshatter is better than crul

[distant saffron]

ur gonna be using a 2H most of the time anyway

[tired galleon]

Icebarbed spear, ftw.

[distant saffron]

@steel lance ill never forget reading "Anticipation is a mandatory talent in all situations" and crying

[steel lance]

It was hardstacking def over everything I was like...hm no thanks

[distant saffron]

runed golem shackles as prebis wrists

[topaz cedar]

now if you are off tanking or just one tanking a boss, would it be best to have say two 1 handers or a 2 hander to swap stances to dps? And I also heard there is a Fury Tank Spec? or is that just for players with a ton of gear

[steel lance]

Don't need stamina if you can't get hit :)

[distant saffron]

@topaz cedar in raids?

[topaz cedar]

mhm I seen a warrior with two 1 handers tank Nefarion

[distant saffron]

yes, you can fury tank

[steel lance]

If you proper try hard off tank your guild might use nightfall on you

[distant saffron]

dont need to in most cases tho

offtanks keep nightfall and anni up, in all essence

[steel lance]

Yeah it's very normal to have off tanks use anni that debuff is poppin

[distant saffron]

only way to get boss armor to 0

[topaz cedar]

also when would a prot warrior swap stances other than to dps? I am assuming use Beserker to use Intercept if need be and than swap back to Prot?

[steel lance]

Berserk rage on fears

[distant saffron]

beserker to intercept/bes rage, battle for pretty much nothing

you want to be in def as much as possible

need that 1.495 threat multiplier

[topaz cedar]

okay that's basically what I thought

[steel lance]

Well you might want to battle for mocking blownig a taunt resists

But that can just be a macro

[distant saffron]

mocking :feelsweirdman:

that ability has wiped more raids than I can count

[steel lance]

Sometimes it's clutch

[distant saffron]

sometimes its fucking awful tho

[steel lance]

I mean it's better than just watching the mob run off and rip your friends in half

[topaz cedar]

okay I feel a lot better at leveling as a warrior now. I never end gamed dps'd as a Fury warrior though. Is there like a set rotation? or just keep BT on cooldown? spam Sunder?

[distant saffron]

thats the point where you tell your furies to l2p

BT/WW on CD, dump rage with hamstring/heroic strike

[steel lance]

Expecting the fury warriors to even understand what a taunt is

First mistake

[distant saffron]

twas fun being in vanguard actually

mob would go loose, every single fury insta switches

for bonus good boi points

:ristas:

[steel lance]

I'm so excited to see them all ask to join my BRD runs

No thanks mate that HoJ and ironfoe are mine

[topaz cedar]

explain a fury warriors rotation as simple as possible

thanks 😄

[steel lance]

Bloodthirst, whirlwind and spend excess rage on heroic strike pretty much

Maybe a cheeky hamstring if you're horde

[topaz cedar]

okay so WW would be considered a single target spell?

[steel lance]

Yeah

[topaz cedar]

ever go battle stance for a rend or something?

[steel lance]

Not for rend no, if you are super rage starved and get a dodge you can use OP but only if you have very low rage

Otherwise changing stances is just a rage loss

[topaz cedar]

that's ridiculous... Fury warriors are supposed to be one of the highest dps classes and their rotation is virtually 3 spells?

I mean a mage and a rogue at least have some thought behind them ?

[steel lance]

You'd think so but nah mage is even simpler

[topaz cedar]

low rank fireball spam right?

to farm for crits?

[steel lance]

Fireball or frostbolt depending on spec basically

Classic isn't mechanically difficult

[distant saffron]

Hamstring is really good, better than people realise

[steel lance]

Cheap and procs WF

[topaz cedar]

just the grind lol. I seen a video of a gold farming spot for a warrior and it was just in plaguelands killing bats because the greys they dropped sold for a decent amount. it was like 5g a stack or something but dear goddddd was it boring

[distant saffron]

Ham 9ver heroicn on horde, and on ally if proc weapon

[steel lance]

Classic is mostly about time investment and knowledge of some of how to abuse the system

[topaz cedar]

now is picking up blacksmithing a good idea? like are there cheap / BS only patterns that are good for preparing for end game content? or is the BS'ing pieces easily replaceable? I was thinking two gathering for profits

[steel lance]

Not a terrible idea but everything BS gives that is worth it is BoE

For DPS there's lionheart helm which is BiS forever and also Titanic legs which are also extremely strong, not sure when they get added tho.

Engineer is where the real power lies tbh, especially in PVP.

[topaz cedar]

really? also the grenades could help in dungeons

quick stuns

[steel lance]

Grenades, dragonlings, reflector trinkets, sapper charges

The list goes on they are very strong

[topaz cedar]

okay cool might go that way then

[steel lance]

I'm going mining engi

They feed into each other and I also just like mining anyway

[topaz cedar]

right, engineering does seem like it will help a lot more than BS'ing will. overall in open world and in dungeons / bg's

any recommended alliance races for warriors? i would assume dwarves with stoneform?

or a gnome for escape artist

[steel lance]

Depends what you want to prioritize

[topaz cedar]

tanking

[steel lance]

Human, sword spec is mega threat

Dwarf and gnome are strong for PVP and dwarf has some utility with stoneform to remove bleeds and stuff but that's very niche

As a tank anyway

[topaz cedar]

yea anyways I am just excited. finally get to do it the right way. and not have every weapon skill all over the place lol. 75 Staff skill, 150 one hand mace, maxed one hand sword etc

do we know what addons will be available in classic? like I am sure ElvUI / TidyPlates won't be a thing?

[steel lance]

They will, many retail addons have already been ported in the beta

[topaz cedar]

woah really? I mean the obvious will be Omen, Recount, Boss mods, and maybe a unit frame addon but if ElvUi will work than I might have to go ahead and take advantage of it. Was there a gatherer in vanilla? to mark like a mining route?

when I played I can't remember what I used, if any! I did not progressively play until mid WOTLK

[steel lance]

Classic is based off the 7.3.5 (possibly 8.0) client so you can probably expect most addons to be ported over eventually

Or at least something similar.

Best one is weakauras because it does pretty much anything.

[topaz cedar]

yeah but I feel like there is not much to track in classic? I mean as far as rotations go? I know a swing timer is definitely needed. What would you say are "mandatory" addons to make life easier?

[steel lance]

Well a quest addon if you want easy levelling, definetly want a item set addon if you're tanking for all the different sets you'll need and imo must have is a good nameplate addon.

So useful for dungeon tanking, and as I said weakauras can basically track anything so you could have threat % over the nameplates it something like that to make it super obvious.

[topaz cedar]

oh cool cool. yeah nameplate addons are crucial for tanking. something that also shows your debuffs / buffs on the target. Questhelper is the only questing addon I know about

or that I have used

[steel lance]

My go to addons are KUI nameplates, SUF, WA2, bagnon, bartender and whichever addon lets me move my buff and debuff bars, that's pretty much it.

Oh and details

[topaz cedar]

SUF?

[steel lance]

Shadowed unit frames

[topaz cedar]

oh right

man I can't believe classic is going to be this customizable

[steel lance]

It's nice that my retail and classic UI can look basically identical

[topaz cedar]

yea it definitely is going to make the transition smoother, I just feel that it takes away from what players actually experienced though

but none of that really bothers me, I just wana get in and start tanking Scholo and Strath

trying to think of any questlines that give some strong BiS pieces (or atleast BiS until raids)

[steel lance]

Stalwart girdle, preraid BiS from I think it's searing gorge

There's mirrahs song which is a pretty decent pre tanking sword from a scholo questchain to unlock kirtonos

Mark of the champion is a super OP trinket from maraudon

[topaz cedar]

the helm too is good right

[steel lance]

Or was I chosen? Idk it's Mark of something

[topaz cedar]

helm of the mountain if u can get good stats

[steel lance]

Yeah that's not a bad tanking helm but really you want gyths with fire resist

[topaz cedar]

really not looking forward to getting attuned though for MC and BWL and stuff. MC was some quest chains in BRD right?

There were these crystals i remember

or something with these big obsidian crystals i thought

[steel lance]

MC is super easy just do a lava jump to the end

You can do it in like 10 minutes

[topaz cedar]

what was the actual quest though?

[steel lance]

Just get the core fragment or something from the end of BRD

You can skip almost the entire dungeon pretty easily

[topaz cedar]

yeah i remember hopping from island to island or being in a group that did it to skip to a certain part

[steel lance]

Onyxia is the long quest chain and BWL is just finish UBRS tbh

[topaz cedar]

there wasn't an attunement quest for UBRS right? that was the 10man and LBRS was a normal 5?

[steel lance]

Although UBRS has a pretty bad attunement itself

[topaz cedar]

oh did not know there was one for it

[steel lance]

You needed the seal of ascension which you could start from a random ring drop off lbrs trash

Then get some lowish drop rate gems off the bosses in LBRS, then go to a cave a MC a dragon.