Yes
#protection
ionic fern
oblique garnet
Yeah i play fury till next tier
strong forum
i do 😠
oblique garnet
cba with this shit seasonal affix
strong forum
for like 1 key a week, then i afk
oblique garnet
you dont have 70 neck?
strong forum
breh even my alt has 70 neck
oblique garnet
^
warm plinth
I only have one toon at level 70 neck
strong forum
with like 3 days played
oblique garnet
i have 5
warm plinth
The next closest is like
ionic fern
68 iirc
warm plinth
67
strong forum
my 2 days played WL has 68.5 neck
sullen valve
Mwahi has to keep his neck the same level as his age is
strong forum
warm plinth
That's not fair. You started at 50
strong forum
😏
ionic fern
Tbf i don't do islands or emissaries/wq's.
oblique garnet
🤔
sullen valve
It's just a mwahi requirement @warm plinth
sullen valve
You should have seen the messages from mwahi when out went over 68
sullen valve
Big unhappy he is now never going to get 3rd minor
ionic fern
😂
strong forum
rip
ionic fern
I can sim it and pretend i got it.
warm plinth
I have 209d total on this account. Made it in Legion like...some time between EN and NH
idk if that's a lot or not
strong forum
still proud of this tho
warm plinth
Oof
oblique garnet
warm plinth
Whew!
warm plinth
oblique garnet
is that 432 recal?
oblique garnet
i only have 430 😦
warm plinth
I have that on the wrong toon 😦
My DH has a 445 I think yellow, haste/vers
And doesn't even use punchcard anymore
warm plinth
I use inkpod and 450 dice
Trying to get a juicy electromental but no luck yet. Just a 430
strong forum
you mean electro jar?
warm plinth
Yeah
strong forum
😏
strong forum
i love that trinket
sullen valve
notice abe comes in and everyone has a good time bullying mwahi
strong forum
good guy abe
chilly brook
@warm plinth that's ~40% of the time on my account but granted my account has been around since tbc
warm plinth
Yeah, I don't have my OG account active so I can't check it
ionic fern
@sullen valve 
sick sentinel
@ionic fern love the hat
undone sun
rip forever :Thyme:
warm plinth
😢
cold dragon
hey there, can we reflect dot attack from the husband in Waycrest?
nvm, found the google doc
exotic spoke
@wooden radish that cats adorable. Is that your irl friend?
left hatch
is there a tell or anything for 3rd boss ML's chemical burn
or does it consistently happen after a certain attack?
for spell reflect
sharp night
there's a timer for it
warm plinth
Little Wigs is bae
sharp night
but the pattern if you for some reason don't use littlewigs
left hatch
hmm never noticed it on dbm ill have to swap over to littlewigs
but the pattern is also appreciated
sharp night
is azerite puddle, chemical burn, puddle, burn, knockback, knockback
left hatch
ok so just SR after each puddle that you can
sharp night
yeah but it's not immediate
i don't remember the exact times but i can check the data files from littlewigs i guess
left hatch
mmk tyty
sharp night
so first puddle is at 4 sec, first chemical burn is at 12.5
then there's a 15 sec cd for both, then she does the double pushback so the cd is 27s
so count to 7-8 and then reflect after the puddle
running littlewigs makes it easier since you can just pop reflect when it has a sec remaining
distant crystal
get littlewigs
errant oriole
It has a cast Time just do it reactively if you re Not sure
distant crystal
enable verbal countdown for chemical burn
turn off brain
i did that in season 1
never miss a reflect bb
left hatch
yah setting up LW now (:
analog zinc
wait there's a spell reflect google doc
distant crystal
📌
analog zinc
who checks pins
distant crystal
analog zinc
there's nothing about it in the pins
exotic spoke
@sharp night you can reflect about 2-3 seconds after spray azerite and if you’re on top of her you’ll reflect it since it targets the two closest Itamae
You can get the timing down pretty easily and reflect every other one
sharp night
i know how it works 🤔
left hatch
it was me that was dumb (:
exotic spoke
Meh, the real question is what do I drink next
sharp night
i just reflect based on littlewigs timer though
exotic spoke
Whiskey, scotch, more beer?
sharp night
all of the above
exotic spoke
rooSellout
left hatch
im really glad i swapped to littlewigs tho, these dungeon timers seem MUCH more precise than dbm
exotic spoke
Nah, not yet. Have to get up early
Also - all of the above may end poorly for me
That’s a lot of beer on tap - and that’s just their beer not to mention other options
undone sun
neat
sharp night
oh
exotic spoke
It’s a nice place. Watch a hockey game, try a new beer, get some food.
sharp night
and they serve liquor too?
exotic spoke
And within walking distance (long) or a short Uber ride home
Yeah
sharp night
all the breweries/tasting rooms i've been to only serve beer
over on the west coast though
exotic spoke
East coast is best coast
sharp night
i mean if i'm going to a tasting room i really just am there to try their beers lol
undone sun
i haven't been to a brewery yet
sharp night
yeah i mean generally they don't bother with a full bar because beer license is cheaper/easier to get than liquor
so over here we just do beers and food, and then usually a big lot for food trucks so you can have some different food sometimes too
exotic spoke
But it’s not a tasting room :). It’s a full bar
distant crystal
you're not a tasting room
exotic spoke
Your moms a tasting room
undone sun
nice
distant crystal
Your*
distant crystal
exotic spoke
But yeah - hockey and beer it’s a great thing
exotic spoke
Yup. Had a braised short rib grilled cheese sandwich. would recommend
Then, going home, and going to do midlevel keys in carries and make gold. It’ll be great
Or play Civ - haven’t decided yet
undone sun
all of the above
exotic spoke
Sorry, that’s their opinion. And honestly - they are wrong
Because pickled onions and short rib made it amazing. Call it what you want. It was delicious
undone sun
🤣 classic
exotic spoke
Sure fine then. If you want to miss out on my grilled cheese I won’t invite you out next time @distant crystal
distant crystal
like you ever invite me 😢
exotic spoke
You’ll just have to miss out on Drinking Riki antics (note Sober Riki is not responsible for Drinking Riki, Drunk Riki, or Hungover Riki)
You’re right I don’t - because of that attitude
Also, are you even east coast @distant crystal
distant crystal
3rd coast >:)
exotic spoke
Waat?
distant crystal
NOLA
undone sun
lol 3rd coast
exotic spoke
They are insufferable
distant crystal
just the best teams like LSU and the saints
wooden radish
@exotic spoke yes https://tenor.com/view/cat-driving-kitty-gif-3442688
exotic spoke
Awww shit son! Watch out! Lincoln’s Driving
distant crystal
i actually had to buy a dehumidifier today
it's been 70% in my house even with central air
exotic spoke
I rest my case
left hatch
is there an easy way to tell who the target is for things like Darkened Lightning on Goruk Tull, or the Shiv on Jes Howler
sharp night
shiv is random and instant
lightning should always be kicked, it's on the same cd as a single melee kick
distant crystal
lightning he should look at the target no?
or can that even be reflected, assume that's why you're asking?
left hatch
yah, according to the google doc it and shiv can be reflected
warm plinth
He targets people with darkened lightning
Like his target actually changes
I'm pretty sure
left hatch
mmk cool
warm plinth
Shiv is not that way though. He might turn real quick but definitely not fast enough to reflect it reliably
left hatch
it worth popping reflect before he casts just in case? or nah
warm plinth
I mean, no reason not to I guess, since there's nothing else worth reflecting on that fight
analog zinc
if you track Target of Target, it'll be obvious who he's gonna cast darkened lightning
melee should never kick when you have prot war
you should be in charge of it, figure out if its going on you or someone else, because you can easily react & kick if its not on you
warm plinth
3x BoM, 1x DC, 2x MS for M+
ocean valley
does bastion of might stack? also does deafening crash stack?
ocean valley
so get like one DC and then go for bastions/ignore pain ones
left hatch
the ignore pain one is worthless
left hatch
yes
ocean valley
😮
left hatch
Its bottom of the stack with the Revenge one
for M+ its one DC and a bunch of BoM but Iron Fortress isn't a bad sub in if you can't get BoM
for raid Brace for Impact is what you wanna stack after your DC
ocean valley
tru
left hatch
so the passive IF increase to your block > the bonus from SS
Bloosport (the ignore pain trait) is just a linear increase to something that isn't a primary form of damage reduction
it makes hps meters look good but, thats a terrible metric to judge your survivability anyway
Mastery from bom > critical block which is one of the craziest forms of DR in the game
block value is just flat out better anyway
left hatch
hell even stat procs are better than a slightly bigger IP
why Meticulous Scheming is in our ideal 'bis' for M+ setup
ocean valley
thanks for all the insight, sry for being a noob :3
left hatch
no worries (: this is the place to ask questions lol
sharp rover
mental scarab
Anyone that can send me a invt to the paladin discord? Link in skyhold dont work👀
lavish hearth
random juniper
so i have a question say in theory you have 3 bom 1 ms and 2 DCs would it be worth dropping the 1 DC for a trait like dagger in the back as its the only one appart from callous being available?
left hatch
the second DC probablly gives you more output, esp in M+ than a dagger in the back
Dagger sims much higher than it actual gives us, because it assumes you're always behind the target
random juniper
at 1 point i had 3 bom and DC
i dont raid so its purely for m+ if that helps btw morrison
left hatch
if its a tossup between Dagger and a 2nd DC I would take the 2nd DC
random juniper
but not 3 correct?
left hatch
depends what you miss out on
some generic traits are less beneficial than stacking DC, some are better
random juniper
i generally have no issue with rage in general its purely for optimising the gear better for m+
another question stupid i know but you said haste has no cap does that mean if i had 27% haste before into the fray and 18% crit i should leave it like that and not change for some crit?
left hatch
for optimizing gear I'd need specific examples, like what pieces you have access to, if you want a clearer answer.
For the haste question Haste would most likely still be more beneficial for you defensively than crit no matter what % you have pre-into the fray. For output purposes you'd have to sim what's better
easy solution is always ench/gem haste (with the exception of your 2 str gems and Force Mult on wep)
random juniper
for output purposes i dont generally have an issue with damage output as i have 12% vers which also pumps up the damage with gear wise i thank you for the info on enchants and gems as ive been struggling to decide
ripe mason
Can I sim for defensive trinkets? I'd like to see what'd perform better between a mythic urchin and a mythic edicts
undone sun
no
left hatch
simming is only for dps
random juniper
you also said 2 str gems would it not be 1 or for tanks is it different?
left hatch
i still use the 120 and 80 one
random juniper
would 2 120s not be better?
left hatch
you can only use 1 of each
random juniper
ahhhhh yeah sorry brain melt just got home from work XD
would rank 1 of nullification dynamo outrank the rank 2 of deeps essence btw this one i have no way of finding out spent an hour trying
left hatch
Null is super niche usage outside of raid
while Aegis of the Deeps is really strong, and yo'ull probably have that locked in till you get CnS
oblique garnet
If you are having isses with rage its usually fixed by using shield slam on cd as you should even in aoe
random juniper
so my final question tanking m+ what are the bis current essences for warrior tanking
left hatch
VoP Major and some combination of Aegis, Conflict and Strife, Sphere of Suppression, and Lucid Dreams
random juniper
dont have issue with rage late trynna optimise my warr tank as ive been going off what i think is decent but is wrong slightly
vop is always major then correct?
left hatch
at super high keys theres an argument to be made about CnS major for the rooting if you play around it
but otherwise yah 99% of hte time VoP major is bis
random juniper
thank you more or less what i had just need to ask though would you take cns over say null in m+ sorry final question XD
left hatch
I would take CnS minor over every essence in the game
random juniper
null over lucid? lucid meaning i get more vers which i already have 12% of?
left hatch
I personally prefer Sphere to Lucid, but yes Lucid is g enerally better than Null
there isn't a point where you have 'too much' of any secondary
random juniper
in other words the ones that help you with kiting are more helpful the higher you go correct?
left hatch
sphere is more for the constant haste buff, but yes that's also a factor
random juniper
all i needed thanks ^^
ionic ridge
Good luck on your endeavours @random juniper
random juniper
thanks ^^
winter loom
is or will there be with 8.3 a essence which will replace CnS or is this the best essence for a minor slot?
strong forum
Best for minor for almost all specs
And will continue to be, especially since we're getting 1 additional minor slot
winter loom
alright, so i will be doomed farming it. Thanks
strong forum
It's 4 weeks of capping 🤷♂️ there's worse things
winter loom
Yeah true, but getting to 1.4k is already absolutetly hard for a non pvp player tho
strong forum
I guess 🤷♂️
empty nacelle
yep
left hatch
with next to no arena experience and an absolute hatred of pvp I got to 1600 in like 4 hours on prot
its doable
and not even that difficult
just annoying
grizzled glen
winter loom
well, finding someone that sticks with me until 1.6k is difficult tho
lilac bough
Which of these you will use as secondary trinket? My primary is a 430 Rezan Gleaming Eye. Content: Mythic + only 13-15
sick sentinel
are ppl hyped about https://ptr.wowhead.com/spell=312215/nose-for-trouble
warm plinth
@lilac bough Jes probably. You can scrap platinum plating; it's garbage
lilac bough
Thanks
stoic pilot
does anybody know offhand if the red cards that drop from mechagon will be on the m+ loot table for those dungeons?
for 8.3
near ivy
the hm specific ones, nobody knows
broken isle
corrupted punchcards would be interesting to say the least
corrupted red + corrupted yellow
warm plinth
Doubt they can corrupt since they’re technically a gem
stoic pilot
was curious solely for the fact that i want that hm mecha card for pvp lmao
rapid belfry
Anyone with a wa recommendation for seeing the other tanks debuffs in raid? I've tried several without seeing it, putting the tank as focus but nothing. I queued as dps, but didn't see any load triggers that should prevent me from seeing it
warm plinth
Which one Meekuh? The increasing damage to 1 target one?
near ivy
for pvp, most likely defrag
oblique garnet
@rapid belfry if you put other tank at focus depending on your unitframes you need to check if boss debuffs are blacklisted for them to show
sick sentinel
@rapid belfry download the co-tank weak auras
For the fight
It should be linked in the wa bundle for the entire raid
I'm in phone rn but it SHOULD be linked here https://wago.io/bfaraid4
rapid belfry
Thanks @sick sentinel and Late, I have enabled dubuff on my elvui focus, but seems the co-tank that Kaege listed the focus part won't be necessary
sick sentinel
@stoic pilot currently, as the mechagon lower part of the dungeon is hardmode in mplus, I don't see the reason for them to NOT be in
Also, that changes like every other update
As in, they have no idea what they are doing
warm plinth
Wait, really? We have to deal with fuckin bots on every fight in the junkyard?
stoic pilot
On ptr did yellow cards drop from the chests?
warm plinth
Oh, lower, as in like inside
sick sentinel
Currently, shock bots also scale with key level
warm plinth
tfw no druid in my group lul
stoic pilot
That’s kinda lame tbh
warm plinth
What is Zap? The lightning on the ground or?
stoic pilot
Means 1-2 wipes = gg
sick sentinel
@warm plinth no
warm plinth
Oh like if you go into their circle
stoic pilot
No.
sick sentinel
No
stoic pilot
The buff bots around the intro
stoic pilot
That give you haste. Or a lightning zap
stoic pilot
Those 100% shouldn’t be a thing. Or if they are they shouldn’t drop on death
stoic pilot
It’s gonna end up like lower karazhan
First week it comes out and bosses get like a 90% dmg nerf on x ability
sick sentinel
Last boss is a tough dps check in high tyrr btw
stoic pilot
Still wonder if they’re just going to leave comp device in the dust or if we’ll be able to get it up to reasonable ilvl this patch
The um, robot one with 2x charge pillars?
sick sentinel
Again you got yellows in addition to loot
For a bit
So with that it should be competitive
stoic pilot
Should be fun to see I suppose
sick sentinel
Cyclotronic not as much
stoic pilot
Yeah
sick sentinel
Everything else yes
stoic pilot
I imagine the recal and healing one will be fun to mess with
stoic pilot
I use the comp device too much in pvp to swap it constantly unfortunately
sick sentinel
Yeah that sucks
warm plinth
Would be nice if you could at least get another punchcard trinket
sick sentinel
Get sporepods urchin instead of healing red card
stoic pilot
Red card is better than urchin
warm plinth
I need a better yellow card for my recal 😠
sick sentinel
Unluck
stoic pilot
At least from my testing
warm plinth
How do they figure ilevel for that, red+yellow/2?
stoic pilot
It did like 2x as much as urchin and sporepods generally keeps up with card
sick sentinel
@warm plinth I crafted about 80 cards
At 415
No card could beat ny 425 Crit/haste
Even 435 vers haste
warm plinth
Yeah my yellow is only 420, haste/vers
sick sentinel
(For fury)
warm plinth
The red ilevel is carrying it atm
Would be sick to get a 455 yellow just to say I have a 450 punchcard lul
warm plinth
460 yellow I'm guessing?
sick sentinel
Theoretically
warm plinth
Yeah
Mine is 428
Weird how it rounds sometimes but not others
Like 427.5 rounds to 428, but my recal comes out to 432.5 but it's 432
sick sentinel
Weird
warm plinth
Just getting trolled by recal 😄
analog zinc
does blue effect ilvl?
near ivy
nah
warm plinth
I don't even think my warrior has a blue card in his lul
Oh nvm, I forgot I got that one that mind controls mechanicals or something. I don't even know what it does
Never seen it mind control anything
near ivy
my blue is 404, so it would throw off the average if it counted
warm plinth
Yeah I don't even think you can get higher than a 404 blue can you?
near ivy
tittyforged 455 blue card :krey:
sick sentinel
@warm plinth it's a good blue
It supposedly makes the circles smaller before 7nth boss
warm plinth
Oh, really? I never noticed.
warm plinth
Wtf happened lol
distant crystal
coming out of 2nd downphase, tank n healer took too long to kill their add
ran out of kicks
warm plinth
RIP
distant crystal
2nd pull, tank n healer come out and tank runs to the wrong add, missed kick
warm plinth
Yikes
distant crystal
at one point we killed trash for 3 minutes waiting on brez
exotic spoke
Oof
distant crystal
while boss channeled
even after all that, we would've killed the boss in about 10m
warm plinth
Kinda weird because idr it being that bad on 19 tyr 🤔 Maybe it was fort
distant crystal
but healer killed himself with light of the martyr
lol
we were like "wtf did you get hit by tentacle" "no...worse than that"
well with 1 of your dps as boomy, you depend on the tank getting a kick right as they come out of downphase
and it's not bad
warm plinth
What strat do you use on the adds? You have 3 melee or something?
Ohhh, boomie, yikes
distant crystal
with 3 melee kicks tank n heals can fuck off and it doesn't matter
warm plinth
We have 2 melee and a hunter and on higher keys we let the first cast on the other add go off
distant crystal
yeah we were doing that too
your hunter only ever kicks once per phase anyway tho right?
so boomy shouldn't really change anything
warm plinth
Yeah, it's usually me early, rogue late on the target add, hunter kicks late 2nd cast of the other add, then I run over and kick 2nd cast of the other add late
empty nacelle
how do you know rogues dominate m+? when all interrupts are called kicks
warm plinth
All interrupts were called kicks in vanilla so that's not exactly new haha
empty nacelle
pff
warm plinth
Just easier to say than interrupts
distant crystal
some people call all caster kicks counterspell :p
warm plinth
Hey technically if you call it CS you get 2 of them right
😄
Counterspell and Counter Shot
distant crystal
i'm trying to think of what cs stands for in dota
empty nacelle
creep score
distant crystal
i know it's last hitting but idk the acronym lol
warm plinth
Usually tank/healer are asking us if it's safe though; kinda weird they'd be that slow 🤔
distant crystal
oh ya
distant crystal
lol
yeah it was kinda late, think the healer was a lil foggy
like 3am or something
warm plinth
What spec was heals?
distant crystal
hpal
warm plinth
Oh, yeah that's what we have too
distant crystal
he killed himself with light of the martyr in our last pull
warm plinth
:/
distant crystal
we did the no-death skip thing
i showed them how to do it and they nailed it first try, seems ez
warm plinth
Which thing is that
distant crystal
tank gets on druid's back
or on someone's 2seater mount
facepull everything after 2nd boss
and if they step on the little "point" on the stairs
everything evade bugs and resets like 10 seconds later
you just run through and run up the ramp and everything deagros
empty nacelle
hmm
warm plinth
So you run from 2nd boss all the way to 3rd boss?
warm plinth
Oh, so you're skipping the ritualists/enforcers/tentaclebois
warm plinth
Interesting
distant crystal
it's weird cause even the mobs that you aggro AFTER you evade glitch the previous ones
reset aggro
warm plinth
Yeah sounds like it's just one of those snap points that doesn't work "properly"
empty nacelle
ah okay
distant crystal
then 1 side of the tentacles in brother room
warm plinth
Like you can snap shit on the rocks by the ritualists and it almost always causes them to evade
distant crystal
and then all the eels + 3pack in last boss platform
yeah the deal is they try to snap to the tank
but the tank is on the druid's back and in a spot they can't stand
so they just evade/reset after a few seconds
warm plinth
Yeah we use the mount trick but for another reason. Makes death skips in ML easier lol
Good for teeming weeks when there's 800 masterminds
distant crystal
yeah i first saw it on Dratnos podcast
there was a clip of that rdruid grill doing it
Bubis
warm plinth
Of the shrine skip?
distant crystal
ya
warm plinth
Pretty neat. I actually came up with the ML thing on my own because my girlfriend and I used to level together all the time, and I noticed that whenever she was on my back/mount, she's always the one that would get hit by shit lol
distant crystal
yeah it's a weird interaction
warm plinth
And after a particularly brutal series of attempts doing a death skip on teeming week in ML, I was like you know, we should try this.
distant crystal
the person on the druid's back is always the one who facepulls
and not the druid
warm plinth
Yeah
ngl I did a normal route in ML the other day (was only on a 12 or something, but still) and it seems so much faster to just do a straight through run. I just don't know how obnoxious the R&D trash would be on high keys
warm plinth
Yeah I only did single pulls in the 12 too just because undergeared DPS, but idk. Always feels like doing all that trash at the start takes forever and a day
warm plinth
Yeah
I'm sure we're not gonna change route anyway so it doesn't matter lul
Might be some interesting routes in ML with Corrupted
Wouldn't surprise me if there's an obelisk in R&D somewhere
warm plinth
Yeah I'm sure if that's possible, it'll happen. I would imagine they'll have a rotation on obelisk locations like they do for emissaries though
warm plinth
Yeah lol
sick sentinel
@warm plinth on low keys you don't dskip
warm plinth
I know
I just liked the feel of it a lot more doing the dungeon that way
Made me sad that it's not the go-to on higher keys
distant crystal
I like the feel of you
warm plinth
😮
sick sentinel
HOT
slim pier
gachiBASS
distant crystal
😏
flint wraith
Wep from WM, za'qul or crit/mas ? all 430
distant crystal
zaq
analog zinc
zaq does almost as much damage as servent splitter but has actual stats
toxic wadi
Can I tank a +10 without reforging Azerite traits?
warm plinth
Yeah
near ivy
nobody is gonna bring a <1k dps player to a 10key with no tanking experience and no traits
you will get kicked
it is possible, arguably easy depending on your experience tanking to do a 10 without traits
toxic wadi
Oh ok
sullen valve
Daily reminder that wowA is good for prot warrior
winged grail
guys
I'm getting wrecked by 3rd boss in ML
I reflect one out of two dots
I keep ignore pain u
up
I still get destroyed
Anything I can do?
warm plinth
Healer should focus you and dispel you when you can't reflect. DPS can rotate defensives/immunities for the ones that don't get dispelled off them
winged grail
I have Urchin and Gore-crusted block (450 with socket)
sick sentinel
Have you considered taking less damage
undone sun
🏃♂️
warm plinth
🚫
sullen valve
Second Daily reminder that wowA is good for prot warrior
stoic forge
guys, is the defragmentation card better then the haste card ?
winged grail
How do I take less damage from third boss of ML ?
near ivy
wear edict
undone sun
use CDs, Externals
left hatch
don't use rage on shieldblock
cinder storm
spell reflect every other targeted cast
near ivy
tell healer to, and quote, "git gud"
exotic spoke
Depending on your group comp you can help a lot with the casted spells and what the healer needs to do
@winged grail
For example, Im a dwarf, i typically run with another dwarf and have a rogue
I soell reflect one Druid dispels one
I eat one and dwarf it - Druid dispels the other
I spell reflect one Druid dispels one
Other dwarf takes one - Druid dispels the other
Spell reflect - dispel
Etc
Those dots need to be gone ASAP
novel temple
@sullen valve what’s good for prot?
sullen valve
Wow analyzer
novel temple
Ahhh
warm plinth
Knew that sounded familiar 🤔
novel temple
I haven’t played in a few months
I’ve been stuck from boot camp and at sub school without my PC
warm plinth
wowanalyzer isn't new; just hasn't supported prot warrior for very long
novel temple
And I didn’t give into buying a laptop on Black Friday either
But I get my PC back on New Year’s Day so I’m Gucci
warm plinth
Are you a jarhead now?
sullen valve
Third reminder of the day wowA is great for prot warrior
undone sun
Too many
sullen valve
I thought about it and it was even better than before
warm plinth
Oh, so you're in the navy?
warm plinth
Guess that would explain "sub school" lul. Reading comprehension is hard though
novel temple
It is
warm plinth
That's pretty cool. I had an aunt and uncle in the Navy. Can't remember what my uncle did but aunt was one of those people in the jumpsuits on the aircraft carriers directing the jets
warm plinth
And then my mom and dad were both jarheads; dad was an air traffic controller, also on the carriers, and my mom was a jeep mechanic and then went on to work in the JAG office in the army later on.
You gonna get to go to all the exotic places in your position?
winged grail
@exotic spoke Thanks for this - quick question, what do you mean by "other dwarf takes one"? Can you bait it?
warm plinth
It chooses the two closest people
warm plinth
Warlock imp, dwarf racial, mass dispel
winged grail
Btw I didn't even know you could dwarf it, so it's very valuable
warm plinth
Spellwarding if you have a paladin running it
But since you're a prot war I'm guessing not since I don't think the other two specs have that available
winged grail
it requires quite the coordination - tough to pug it seems
warm plinth
Well, if healer dispels on CD, you can at least control whether you get targeted or not by just backing up a little bit when she's about to cast it. Typically if you have 2 melee they'll be right on top of her anyway and backing up should cause it to go on them instead of you
winged grail
Wouldn't that kill the 2 melees though?
warm plinth
Well, if healer is doing their job, they should dispel one of them. And then the other will either use a defensive or die like an idiot 😄
warm plinth
What level keys are you doing?
winged grail
19
warm plinth
Pugging?
winged grail
Yup
warm plinth
Idk. Just insist on voice in ML or something haha
winged grail
Yeah I guess I should do that
Thing is, even outside of the DoT, she hits me like a truck
Like, a BIG truck
warm plinth
Ideally you're the only person who should be taking damage, so the healer should just be able to pump heals into you
winged grail
Going SUPER fast
Then if I use Edict
Maybe it can help a tiny bit
Idk
I should get conflict & strife too I guess
warm plinth
Yeah, both of those would help a decent bit
winged grail
How long to get C&S lvl 3? I have it at lvl 1 and 1000 rating
near ivy
3 weeks at 1600
warm plinth
At your rating I think it's like 15 weeks lul. 1400 will cut it down to 5
analog zinc
1.0-1.2k is 1 per week
1.2-1.4 is 2 per week
1.4-1.6 is 3 per week
1.6-?? is 5 per week
warm plinth
1800 gives you 6 but it's not really worth it at that point
Since it'd still take 3 weeks
analog zinc
you need what 2100 to skip a week?
warm plinth
Think so yeah
frosty spindle
So
I’ve never tanked before. I want to try it. Was thinking BDK or Warrior. Can’t decide which tho. Even the DK Disc Server praises Warriors. Are you guys really that OP.?
I won’t be pushing anything higher than 20+
quiet crane
anything can push to a 20 however you're gunna have a much easier and amazing time with a warrior
sick sentinel
Question. What are our best essences for pushing mythic + and what trinkets would you guys suggest
ocean valley
hi, im about to tank EP For the first time and was wondering if anyone could explain the tank mechanics rq to me for each boss in DM like how many stacks to taunt off
hardy mesa
Would any of the new essences in 8.3 be good for prot warriors?
stark scroll
@ocean valley https://www.tanknotes.com/
sick sentinel
Directions to tank ep: stand there and hit boss
ionic fern
@sick sentinel in general VoP/CnS/Aegis/Sphere/Lucid are the essence mixes you wanna use depending on what you have.
Trinket wise - Gore/Rezans for a more offensive/overall use and Edicts/Urchin for a more defensive setup.
frosty spindle
Can't find it anywhere, but what Race is BIS for Ally.
Strictly pushing keys only.
ionic fern
Class or race?
ionic fern
I guess you ment race since classes are faction wide.
frosty spindle
Just boosted a Warrior with SL preorder. No clue what Race to go with.
ionic fern
If you're in a dedicated group NE with Shadowmeld is decent for some skips.
Other really good ones are Dwarf/Dark Iron dwarf for the bleed/poison etc removal.
ionic fern
Are all of your group members NE's tho?
Or just you?
limpid pawn
zaqul down 😮
left hatch
any tips for high UR? struggling on cragmaw
ionic fern
Only thing that's dangerous on Cragmaw is Tantrum and for that you just gotta rotate CD's.
E.g first one = Shield Wall, 2nd one = Healer CD(Tranquility for example), 3rd one = LS,4th one = Healthstones/pots + shout.
Remember to pop IP as well during it and don't outrange the healer.
left hatch
hmm ok, besides popping rally is there anythign i cando to help the group?
biggest issue seems to be the rest of the group gettign trucked during tantrum
or a steady trickle of blood ticks
ionic fern
Nope, literally nothing
It's their job to rotate their defensives, ask for external from the healer, use pots/HS etc.
And ofc the healer actually has to be decent.
So if you agree to use defensives on the first one then the healer shouldn't use his big CD during the same one for example.
ocean oracle
Any prot war tank twitch streamers you guya know of?
ionic fern
raider.io has a list of all the top prot warriors m+ wise - you can check from there, they usually have twitch'es linked to it.
ocean oracle
Thanks very much. Love your work mate :)
sick sentinel
Hey what do you think about news essences? Because VoP got up too
ionic fern
There are some interesting ones but they are still bound for changes.
Like Strength of the Warden and Formless Void.
silver copper
how hard is prot to learn tanking with>
ionic fern
Not that hard.
Brewmaster monk is more forgiving with mistakes due to stagger tho.
I'd advice you to start by reading a guide from #268491842637660160 and checking what your abilities do.
After that basic knowledge you're good to go and get some experience.
left hatch
None of the tanks are really 'hard' perse, its just a matter of trying them out and seeing what you click with
after that the more experience you geton it the better you become
rapid belfry
I didn't like brm cause I constantly had to be in range hitting something to generate charges for ironskin/purify, is it a similar mechanic for warrior?
left hatch
it won't increase your shield block uptime, but yes you need constant uptime for rage gen -> other cd reduction
ionic fern
Your mitigation requires Rage.
You get Rage from hitting/getting hit and using your abilities.
left hatch
but having less downtime should be a goal for any class tbh
rapid belfry
But it felt very unforgiving on the monk, if I fucked up a kiting. You got in the flow of it eventually, but not something I could drink too irl
felt I had to be sober to do m+ on it
left hatch
also not really sure how you were playing brew if you had to constantly be in range of something to gen brews, the only thing that reduces brew cd is Keg smash, which is a pretty hefty range
and generally you arn't expected to keep up constant defenses while kiting, thats the point of kiting is to OOR things so they stop doing damage to you
rapid belfry
tiger palm also reduces it by 1 sec
rapid belfry
after dinging warrior a week a go, although I thought it was gonna be way easier to tank with, I still feel better on it then I ever did on the monk
guess it fits my playstyle dunno
left hatch
in terms of 'tankiness' in M+ they're roughly equivilant
so itll come down to whatever feels better for you, you'll perform better on something you 'get' over a FOTM spec you dont
brittle owl
they're not exactly equivalent atm
there's a huge gap between brm and the other tanks as it stands
next patch that gap will be shortened significantly
coupled with emissaries gone brm utility toolkit will fall out of favor, and prot will pull ahead of it in terms of tankiness inside m+, save for a few select encounters
next plover
Not equivalent, no. But the leader boards do show that Prot Warriors are capable of keeping pace with BrM in the right players' hands for the current patch.
Which tends to support Prot Warrior going to be a good choice for M+ in 8.3 as BrM comes down several pegs and loses an affix which great favours them in management
Raids on the other hand are anybody's guess
Although BrM will still be the likely top choice for progression fights
sick sentinel
a semi-stupid question: will it be possible to farm Vision of Perfection from the M+ version of Mechagon?
analog swift
As of right now on the ptr yeah
maiden canyon
is there a spellreflect spread sheet for 8.3 up yet? i recall there being something like that for the past tiers
jagged bay
sick sentinel
@ionic fern my dps enrage me irl every time so I get alot of rage that way
strong forum
Smart
sullen valve
Daily reminder. WowA it exists and it had amazing statistics for prot warrior
exotic spoke
Awwww hi @wooden radish
frosty spindle
Is the Icy Veins Guide good for Prot.?
I know IV isn’t right for some classes, just wanted to make sure it was for Prot before I go over it.
warm plinth
Yes, it's good
frosty spindle
Okay. Thanks.
Excited to try Warrior. Almost went BDK instead, but last minute boosted the Warrior instead
frosty spindle
Yeah I went in there and asked which tank I should go with for first time tanking even all of them in there said go Warrior.
Lol
red swallow
Playing Blood DK is like eating non-seasoned food. It works but eugh
frosty spindle
Just watching some videos now. That MarcelianOnline guy and WoW at night. They’re good ones to watch yeah.?
red swallow
Should be fine yeah. Just don't take everything in the guide as law
frosty spindle
Yeah. Per every guide. I’ve just never ever yanked before, so I feel like there’s a metric shit ton of information I need to look at
Never played Warrior or tanked in 15 years of WoW. Have been a caster 90% of the time.
warm plinth
Videos are kinda risky tbh. I've never heard of either of those things
Problem with videos is you make them and then shit changes and the info in the video may not be good anymore
frosty spindle
Yeah. I really just wanted it for rotation
red swallow
Icyveins definetly the best for that imo
frosty spindle
Is there any buffs/nerfs coming for 8.3?
warm plinth
Rotationally nothing has really changed, unless it's a video from like S1
There's a slight buff to one of our essences, but that's it
frosty spindle
I’ve never played Warrior. So idk the Rotation at all. I’ll go scour IV next
chilly brook
Even from season one the only difference is IP is off the gcd and you prioritize shield block in single target or when you need rage over TC in avatar
@warm plinth maybe I just need to make an updated video guide
red swallow
i would wait until 8.3 in case they decide to do something
wooden radish
@ionic fern is the best guide writer
red swallow
u never know
strong forum
I also thought about making a proper video about prot war since people seem to like those
chilly brook
Tbh it doesn't take much to knock out a video guide
strong forum
But actually cba
wooden radish
i want a @fierce juniper video about prot warrior
chilly brook
I think I probably spent the most time just keyframing text and implementing blur underneath the text for some sections
Then again I spent the first like minute memeing on the other tank classes
warm plinth
I always thought they should just make a modular guide to go with the icy-veins guide. Like have it segmented into much shorter videos instead of a massive 30 min+ guide. That way when changes happen, it's much easier to just reshoot the part that needs to be changed.
Not everyone learns the same way, so it would make sense to have multiple mediums for people to take in the guide
strong forum
Ye I thought about an in-depth
chilly brook
IV for what it is, is probably the best way to present a written guide
strong forum
And a crash course cheat sheet kinda one
In video form, just like a 5min bam you take that for that, rest fuck off
And a 30+ one explaining all reasons for which talent and what and bla bla
chilly brook
Tbh if your video guide is 30 minutes you're doing it wrong
red swallow
Videos should be short and sweet. Written guides can be more lengthy since you can move around the stuff freely imo
chilly brook
I think mine was ~15 and that's with some extra fun fluff thrown in
warm plinth
Yeah but who's to say it was a good guide :p
warm plinth
XD
chilly brook
Not to mention it was the only bastion of light on YouTube during 8.0
Those dark days of community perception
warm plinth
Seriously though, I've watched some really good guides that were 15 mins, and I've watched some really good ones that were an hour. Long guides can be fine; it just depends on how you go about it and what all you're planning on covering.
Usually the longer ones are healer guides that actually go over what spells to prioritize in what type of situation and things like that
sick sentinel
@strong forum don't make a video
They get 0 traction and get outdated too fast
Remember @chilly brook video?
chilly brook
Most guides I see that are more than 20 minutes are overly simplifying things and teaching things that shouldn't need to be taught or going way too far in depth and overthinking things
Wdym my video was accurate for an entire tier, I just never updated it because I stopped playing after my guild imploded
warm plinth
That's your perspective though. Some people need it simple and spelled out for them
In-depth guides are worse because a lot of times they don't say that they're going to be tearing every little thing apart and they're often a jumbled mess
warm plinth
Yeah but that's the whole point right? It's a lot easier to remove a line here, or add a few lines there in a written guide. A video guide, unless you want it to look like crap, has to be re-shot
Which is why historically they're not super reliable long-term
chilly brook
@warm plinth there's a guy on YouTube that focuses on tank guides and I forget his name but he goes into the literal tanking basics on every single class, which imo is the wrong way of going about it. That should be something you make a separate video of instead of making a 3 part guide where your first part is the same for every class
I personally would prefer to reshoot a video and do some video editing and voice over than type up a guide and edit the text
But that's more to do with the fact that I'm a video editor and went to school for video production
But stuff like gathering the footage is easy, just record bits and pieces of raid night or keys
warm plinth
And that's fine. But objectively, it's easier to change text than video. Like that's just a fact. And that was the whole point of this conversation and why my initial thought was to have a modular guide because shorter videos are easier to redo than having to reshoot an entire 30 minute guide (or however long) every time something changes. Especially if it's like the start of a tier where shit is changing every other day.
chilly brook
I'm not going to disagree with you there
And that's also why you don't rush a video guide 😛
I'm sure I'll probably do one in 8.3
analog swift
tbh, I think Dratnos has some of the best style for guildes 5~ minute video covering the basics, then do a voice over view of a key you're already doing
sullen valve
Second reminder of the day (mainly bc boss isn't in the office) but wowA is amazing and support prot warrior :)
But also on the idea of guides if you do make a video guide you'd need to put BIG disclaimers saying which patch its for and then basically unlist the video when its inaccurate so you don't spread false info and then make a new one. Which is a lot of work
warm plinth
Yep
frosty spindle
I’ve played a ton of classes in Retail and Classic and both the short vids and long vids are always good. The longer ones are helpful for the new people because most of them want as much info as possible before playing the class. I think the 20-30min ones are best tho.
Someone should make an updated Key tank vid.
For new tanks, like myself, for routes and whatnot
chilly brook
@sullen valve I mean most guides have the patch in the title and thumbnail so if you click on an outdated one and follow it imo that's your fault not the posters
warm plinth
I think the lack of route guides right now is mostly due to beguiling tbh. A lot can change about your route based on which emissary is prevalent and what the affixes are that week.
Might see more next season. I loved the Thorough Tank guides in Legion
chilly brook
Personally I would prefer route video guides over the hey here's a picture
warm plinth
Yeah that's what Thorough Tank's were. Actually had a run of the dungeon playing in the background, explained mechanics of notable trash mobs and bosses, etc.
chilly brook
But imo dungeon design in legion was a lot better for that as well
warm plinth
That's true too
chilly brook
And potentially we might have even more changes this next season to routes
Since you can do wonky things with trash skips with it
warm plinth
Yeah that's also a good point
Especially if the positions of the obelisks are going to rotate
chilly brook
Send the dps and tank to one obelisk and have your druid stealth to another and you activate both and meet in the middle with both mini bosses for example
strong forum
Pro gamer tip here
chilly brook
I wouldn't mind taking something like that on but I don't do enough m+ atm
strong forum
Wait till 8.3 with keys
chilly brook
At this point I'm just gearing my dk
gaunt dawn
whilst you do that, let me AFK in your islands 🙂
chilly brook
I should have brought my laptop to work
rapid belfry
How do you deal with TD last boss? I can't see shit when I stand where the tanks usually stands, any tricks to see something? Alternative way of doing it for the tank?
do you have a macro that sets the cameraview distance at a certain level that lets you see stuff more?
chilly brook
Turn on your monitor
Sorry couldn't resist but honestly just look for the different shades on the ground
analog zinc
are you standing on the stairs?
chilly brook
And if you're on the stairs and still having problems you might need to estimate based off of the position of the pie slice on the ground around
empty nacelle
you can estimate the size based on the pizza slices you can see further away
analog zinc
try this
rapid belfry
will try that one @analog zinc >D And yes, I did it on stairs, and every other tank do stairs as well
analog zinc
imo stairs is worse
this setup is harder to do
but when you're all in position its so much better
analog zinc
ye its fine but the side setup is better
analog swift
for stairs i generally run out a bit further
you're rarely moving on the boss anyway so a bit extra movement is fine
distant crystal
noggenfogger 🙂
hollow bane
Hey, did Someone try preorder Shadowlands 120 boost? Hows this working?
maiden canyon
You boost to 390 ilvl
winged grail
I just did a ToS and used Spell Reflect during Cyclone Strike (not targeting me) and it still killed me although I heard the spell reflect sound, is there anything I'm missing?
frosty spindle
@hollow bane I pre-ordered last night and used the boost on a Warrior. 390iLev iirc.
stable coyote
For tanking essences in the guide on icy veins I see one set, but when I look at raider.io I see the top tanks use a different set. Is this because of the higher keys?
distant crystal
@winged grail other boss might have consumed the reflect with a cast
also can happen if you're moving around during the cyclone
after it reflects it can still hit people/you
gotta be planted
limber pagoda
Didn’t know you can spell reflect that?!
toxic gyro
It does massive dmg as long as ure not the one being targeted
When u reflect 5-6cyclones it’s
haughty forum
Will someone who does M+ only be at all competitive in 8.3 with someone that goes 1-3 bosses deep in Mythic every week?
Last few patches I could rely on titanforging to keep me roughly equal with my friends who can raid.
tame garden
Define competitive
haughty forum
Like the last few xpacs I was the better tank & higher dps because the slight advantage they got in raiding trinkets didn't matter as much.
near ivy
you know how you define competitive
tame garden
Someone who only gears through m+ would be roughly 2 key levels below a similarly skilled raider
near ivy
you are the only person who can judge if doing mythic is worth it to you
toxic gyro
Nerfclap was doing hc only and was top warrior
haughty forum
Which is the core of my question really.
My schedule doesn't let me raid but it DOES let me do 20 M+ or so every week.
tame garden
You'll be like 5 ilvl behind on average and miss out on raid trinkets/weapons/azerite
near ivy
no?
look at current tier as an example
mythic raiders, even without benthic equipped, are like 448?
m+ can easily get you 440+
haughty forum
I quit in October so I am not 100% caught up on news, I just know they got rid of TF because raiders were complaining or something.
near ivy
they got rid of TF because they introduced a new system
and trust me, of all the people complaining about loot, it hasnt been raiders
cough jdotb
tame garden
M+ will drop farmable gear 10 ilvl below mythic raid. The weekly chest will drop mythic ilvl gear. Throughout the tier I'd expect to be about 5ilvl behind mythic raiders if you dont mythic raid
haughty forum
Only if the group does 15s though right?
distant crystal
it'll be kinda weird that the lowest key level that drops the heroic+5 ilvl gear
is also gonna be dropping like 4-5 pieces
haughty forum
I run ~1am central time so the pickings are slim in groups. I don't know if I could have cleared 15s last season without having gear better than 430
tame garden
Its gonna be a long tier dont sweat being a bit behind at the start
distant crystal
we were noticing last night that two boomies with same dps had ilvl parses that were higher for the higher geared one
cuz benthic
slim pier
who woulda thunk
tame garden
Yeah ilvl parse was even more worthless than usual this tier
haughty forum
I guess. It just seems like only the first 10/15 each week is going to give loot 7 days later and then everything else the rest of the week is for fun and not gear.... kind of just annoyed but maybe having the exact right corruption gear will be okay enough to keep doing M+...
tame garden
Corruption will make it worth farming
distant crystal
unless you're trying to push world first keys you really won't need mythic raid gear
tame garden
At least for the first few weeks
haughty forum
I just want to keep up with my friends who raid a couple bosses each week.
tame garden
You wont really fall far behind someone doing a couple bosses
haughty forum
Did probably 400 or so M+ dungeons this season and always had a SLIGHT chance of gear.
tame garden
This is the price we pay to remove titanforging
Eventually you are as geared as you will be
Play an alt or take a break
¯_(ツ)_/¯
tame garden
Personally I plan to play many alts this tier
distant crystal
working on 7th toon rn xD
haughty forum
They didn't make it account wide, did they?
tame garden
No but they nerfed some of the requirements
haughty forum
I'm not even exalted rep on my main. Come home from work, log on and do 3 keys, log off. That's my season 3 experience... hah.
chilly brook
Feels bad calling it at 6/8m
chilly brook
Didn't think we'd have time for azshara
tame garden
Thanks classic
frosty spindle
Classic is Life
distant crystal
👉 🚪
chilly brook
But hey I guess I have the next few weeks to just ignore my main and play my dk now
Get unholy geared up for next season
woven venture
Checked pinned messages and didn't see so sorry if I missed it. Wondering what essences I should grind first for a mostly m+ war tank I'm starting to play? My instinct is VoP and C&S look good for majors but I just don't know. Thanks!
sick sentinel
I don't like aegis on tyrr
Too much time spent on 1 stack
Or affixes that don't let you pull a lot
But that's personal choice
distant crystal
just pull trash into bosses 4head
also pulls will prob be bigger on average next season
so aegis gets better
ionic fern
In general yes but it's for all around m+ essences that you should try and aim to get.
@sick sentinel where you been?
warm plinth
Chasing e-girls
ionic fern
👀
opaque pewter
How strong are we going to be in the new raid ?
sick sentinel
WTF ghash
No I've been taking a break +on holidays now
Also skyhold was too much for me
warm plinth
Hey you said it, not me
sick sentinel
Ik I'm joking
exotic spoke
@opaque pewter we’ll be fine
People that are making predictions are more often wrong than right regarding the tanking meta.
Also, the seem to be discounting the physical damage intake tanks will take
opaque pewter
People keep going on about the magic damage in the raid. So was asking cause of that.
exotic spoke
You won’t be tanking 100% of the time so that helps mitigate it. Our physical mitigation will be very nice for the normal damage. They are; IMO, exaggerating the differences
ionic fern
While there are some bosses in the new tier where magic damage is a decent/most of the damage taken, physical damage is still relevant on the majority of the bosses and this is where warriors shine at. Even with magic damage warriors still have tools to deal with them like SR/SW/DS/IP/LS. Remember that all the tanks will get hit harder by magic damage and are more healer reliant.
Warriors will not be the "go-to" pick for the world first runs and rushing guilds etc but we'll be just fine in the new tier. People are just blowing the magic damage part of the new tier out of proportion.
Copy-paste from..idk last time someone asked
marsh silo
how much ilvl are sockets worth?
exotic spoke
It depends on the slot. For rings I count about 10 for most other slots 5ish. And for weapon / shield they aren’t worth anything
sick sentinel
@ionic fern wanna see something cursed
@exotic spoke @warm plinth @distant crystal too
warm plinth
Always
sick sentinel
sick sentinel
Aw
sick sentinel
Same
toxic gyro
Is it even legal? That trinket
tame garden
😭