protection

[exotic spoke]

Since you get maybe 10 attacks in.

[distant crystal]

oh yeah i forgot i got zaq's aze last week

[warm plinth]

Nice

[exotic spoke]

Grats waat

[distant crystal]

i wonder how much better it is than same ilvl crit/haste

[knotty stone]

i havent even seen it drop :/

[distant crystal]

my haste is so junky rn i hate dropping some 😦

[onyx vessel]

Imagine getting items you want to drop

[ionic fern]

That tbh

[warm plinth]

I imagine Zaqul's would be better for ST DPS but on AoE the stats of the other one would edge it out. But either way I doubt it's significant since weapons don't have a huge amount of secondaries anyway.

[distant crystal]

umm

wth

i just took a wow screenshot and it's upside down

[warm plinth]

lul what

[distant crystal]

lol

[sick sentinel]

Format was whack..sec

[onyx vessel]

Oof

[distant crystal]

weird, it's good now

[warm plinth]

Are you drunk?

That's sexy

[distant crystal]

only upgrade from cache this week

:D

[onyx vessel]

Socket

Pog

[sick sentinel]

I'm trying to decide if I should tank using a 450 Rezan's eye with a socket or if I should stick with the 435 Enthrallers bindstone. What do you all think?

Im assuming the 450 but Im not sure

[distant crystal]

idk what bindstone is but

[warm plinth]

Definitely REzan's

[distant crystal]

no

450

lol

[distant crystal]

what's your other slot

[warm plinth]

Rezan's is one of the best trinkets we have. Bindstone is basically the alchemist stone without the health potion effect. Smaller proc but longer

[strong forum]

Rezans is one of the best trinkets in the game

[distant crystal]

that's like a scuffed alch stone

[sick sentinel]

Its the heroic raid one..

10% health returned or somethint similar. I forget the name.

[distant crystal]

urchin?

yeah it's p good as far as healing trinkets go

[warm plinth]

Oh, urchin

[sick sentinel]

Tyvm for the info.

[distant crystal]

get yourself a coral to go with that rezan

[sick sentinel]

I'm trying 🙂

My Warrior has had very good RNG. Two 455's from the chest these past two weeks. He's slowly becoming a beast.

[warm plinth]

Dang

[sick sentinel]

Then this 450...like wtf

[exotic spoke]

Talk like that and maybe an accident will happen....

[sick sentinel]

Its a sign telling me to quit my mage

[warm plinth]

You probably won't even replace that Rezan's this tier

Unless you get a 455 or something lol

[distant crystal]

i've gotten the same belt 3x in various forges on my rogue main

all worse than benthic smh

[sick sentinel]

Benthic gear is ruining the upgrade process 😦

Thanks again for the info fellas. Enjoy your day

[warm plinth]

Benthic is why I'm extra glad I haven't gotten into raiding this expansion

[exotic spoke]

I should level up some of the benthic pieces I got.... for parses

[distant crystal]

i got the dreaded worst trinket in the game on main today

my'das 😦

[warm plinth]

Yikes

[modern brook]

I refuse to get into the benthic craze

because its not fun to farm

[exotic spoke]

But it is fun to see your dps numbers go up

So you balance it

That said - it feels bad replacing a 445 socketed bracer, 440 socketed belt, and 455 gloves.....

[ionic fern]

Oh the sacrifices you're willing to make to see that DPS number go up.

😄

I'm making them as well .

[exotic spoke]

Yeah, I mean if I’m not dying I should. I got three pieces yesterday now I need to upgrade them.

[dense flame]

Does anyone remember a time when raiding hardest difficulty gave you your BIS items?!?!?

[exotic spoke]

I mean.... if you want to be very specific then sure.

However the best defensive items come from the hardest difficulty. And the best dps items for m+ still comes from the hardest difficulty of content (barring Titan forging - but even then you have a better chance of getting a favorable forge from mythic than heroic / normal / lfr)

[somber sky]

i still use the diamond trinket i got from heroic titanforge :3

[exotic spoke]

What Ilvl is that?

[somber sky]

415

[exotic spoke]

What are your other options?

[somber sky]

but mythic titanforge gives 425k

rezan and my pocket triple slot

also i have azshara trinket

[exotic spoke]

If you get a 415+ urchin edicts I’d use that.

[somber sky]

pocket slot gives me more haste then my rezan

urchin op?

let me look up the item

[exotic spoke]

Urchin gives a good amount of HPS

It is currently ranked the top defensive trinket assuming equal Ilvl

[somber sky]

oh jeez

that's huge

i mean diamond gives me 90k barrier and it's pretty solid considering i've been pugging normals only. i main fury and prot on theoffside so i'm trying to get azshara gear for fury first

if i get dribbling inkpod, can i run it? or is that a big phat no?

or the aoe trinket. the phial

[mystic whale]

lemme chime in and say that a 420 diamond still beats a 430 urchin and edict

[near fern]

hey so, am i better off with a 410 crit vers shield or the 415 one from operation mechagon which has a little mastery and a proc

[somber sky]

:0

[mystic whale]

Ive had multiple mythic progression nights to test it out and

Diamond is on top, urchin is second but edict is better if the fight lasts a while

plus you can swap between magic absorb mode and physical absorb mode

[somber sky]

i men think about it. the 40k magnifies iff you deplete it in the next 40 seconds. so like would it be as useful in m+?

WHUT

realy???

[mystic whale]

the edict only shines in long raid fights. I dont think its very good in M+

[somber sky]

ohhhh i just saw it right now.

hmm so basically shield block

x3

[exotic spoke]

Astro, I have to disagree. Primarily because urchin plays towards our strengths. The heal over time to help recover after blocking

Also, I spoke with Marok about this and the theory supports urchin equal Ilvl over diamond

[somber sky]

i mean if you run that for physical block and the azerite esesnce that blocks magic then you're pretty set right?

[mystic whale]

urchin is close yeah

[somber sky]

do you guys still run CoS for the trident?

[exotic spoke]

Id put an equal Ilvl urchin over a diamond any day

[mystic whale]

oh hell no

if diamond could titanforge all the way up to 430, it would still be bis

UNLESS

absorbed damage is somewhat less valuable than healed damage ?

[cinder solstice]

Hey guys, I have only one minor slot available in my heart of azeroth which minor essence should I go first for M+? Memory of Lucid Dreams or Aegis of the Deep?

[mystic whale]

lucid

i dont think warriors gets lots of value out of aegis

[cinder solstice]

Thanks mate 😄

[exotic spoke]

And no Astro, I don’t think so. I specifically recall talking to Marok about this before I started going into BoD every week

Diamond was not ranked above urchin at equal Ilvl

[somber sky]

zorroxy what's your major?

[mystic whale]

id like to see those logs, honestly

[cinder solstice]

Vision of perfection

[mystic whale]

im just going off my personal logs here

diamond has always more absorb done than urchin has healing

[somber sky]

are you talking about bloodthirst urchin?

[mystic whale]

yeah

[somber sky]

well i guess it has a HoT

[mystic whale]

thats pretty much what it is. a permanent healing over time effect

[somber sky]

how bout i run bof?

[mystic whale]

bof?

[somber sky]

i'd be Roxomux, the undying

both*

[exotic spoke]

The point about diamond is that it is all used very shortly and then doesn’t provide anything. Where as the urchin is constantly ticking and helping smooth damage the whole time

[mystic whale]

oh yes, definitely use both, thats what i do on mythic prog

[somber sky]

😮 so i did a smart! 😄

kk i hope i get urchin

[mystic whale]

but yeah I know i got lucky to get a 420 diamond. if you get a 430 edict, be sure to use that over a 415 diamond or lower (or test it out and compare)

[somber sky]

i tested out the wowhead advice on azerite armor, nope'd the fuck out sicne i caused 65 deaths in a +9

got my usual triple DC and 11 deths

[distant crystal]

edict is fine in M+ wdym

it'll build up through the run, it's not like it resets on combat drop

just think of it as a really long raid boss

[random urchin]

Running 3 DC is kinda meh imo

I’d rather have IF or BFI for more block

[distant crystal]

diamond/edict have the benefit of being unsnipable

if you're topped urchin does nothing

but diamond also has the benefit of working on any type of dmg and adding shield constantly instead of being down for up to 20sec

[undone sun]

3dc definitely isn't the go to since the nerf and WH is less than recommendable

[somber sky]

idk i've been getting some decent dps and it keeps threat :? i'll see what else i could run to be as useful

[exotic spoke]

Threat shouldn’t be an issue for us because of the dps we bring. A lot of the other choices will depend on what you have available instead of DC

Personally, m+ wise, I’m going pretty much full defensive with the best traits I can right now as we push keys cause shit hits hard as fuck

[modern brook]

at ilvl 413, with only 1 neck slot I was able to hold threat in a key with 2 440~ DPS with meme beams

If you cant hold threat you're fundamentally messing something up

period

[exotic spoke]

If they pop meme beam on pull then yeah they’ll rip it. But that’s a them problem not a you problem

[modern brook]

(no md's either)

^

I just coordinated avatar with it

they'd pull it for maybe 2 globals but i'd get it back asap

[exotic spoke]

My dps like to do it. As pull is coming in and I couldn’t hold it. So they knew they had to be ready for it. Then once rogue got his - it was super easy as he tricks

And yeah pretty much bull after two Tcs it was good to go

[modern brook]

Yeah its really not a big deal

IDG why people are having such trouble with it

[exotic spoke]

As drago says

“If they die they die”

[modern brook]

maybe on like monk or something

[analog swift]

tbh

monk is easier to hold aggro than warrior

you always have RJW up

keg smash every 5 seconds with a BoF right after

[exotic spoke]

Who here recommended someone use ritual bandages as a defensive

Own up

[sterile mantle]

hmmm well this makes a hard decision for me lol

Just got a 440 Jes' Howler. Currently using a 400 urchin and 430 edict. How viable is howler in Keys and raids?

jusst looking for opinions...hard to choose lol

[exotic spoke]

440 however over urchin easy choice imo

40 ilvls is a lot of strength

[mystic whale]

yeah jes' howler is part of the good ones

and urchin isnt good enough to skip over 40ilvls

[hushed cobalt]

I wanna know what the absorb on a 455 ritual bandaid would be

Wowhead seems incorrect

[sick sentinel]

no amount of absorb would make that good

[exotic spoke]

^^

[upper spoke]

Rings: Ilvl > stats? 440 ring w/o haste or430 with haste/mastery?

[exotic spoke]

More stats > fewer better stats

[upper spoke]

Haste ring leaves me 26% haste. The 440 w/o haste 22%

can't believe it changes that much, tho

[exotic spoke]

My answer is the same. More stats is better - so use the higher Ilvl

[upper spoke]

Ok

[exotic spoke]

@lusty grotto I feel dirty.... ran TD on Sunday and got a 435 (I think socketed) howler.... with leech...

We going for the leech Dream

Which is to say - if the best gear available to you has leech then cool. But don’t actively seek it out

[cinder pasture]

@hushed cobalt There you go 😛

[exotic spoke]

Not worth imo.....

Worth more as an expulsom 😦 that just feels bad man

[light vale]

Question regarding bastion of might. I know the mastery portion of the ability stacks with multiple traits but does the actual ignore pain amount stack with multiple traits?

[distant crystal]

no

[light vale]

Ah ok. Thanks.

[warm plinth]

@exotic spoke My war is using a 440 or 445 bandages right now XD

[exotic spoke]

That sir, is RIP

[distant crystal]

hmm

what 2 essences for radiance

[warm plinth]

Yeah, but it was like 40 ilevel higher than what I had (which was also not a very good trinket)

[distant crystal]

vision null?

[warm plinth]

Null is definitely a no brainer for that fight I would imagine

[distant crystal]

yeah doing null major vision minor rn

[exotic spoke]

Swap that

To vision major and null minor and I think you’re golden

[distant crystal]

little adds are just wrecking my face

but i think that's just a matter of more kicks/stuns

ooh i bet the intim shout trait is good there

[warm plinth]

I doubt it'd be noticeable.

[exotic spoke]

Yes - they do that cause you can’t block them. Need better coordinated CCs / interrupts.

Your melee can’t all blow their load on the same one.

[distant crystal]

yeah trying to convince them to focus ST

got some meme beamers

and re: intim presence

should be like 125K dmg reduction

per addset

not too shabby

[warm plinth]

I mean that's less than 1 melee from the big add though

[distant crystal]

the alternative is vamp speed

neither are particularly great in raid but that one should be a lil better i think

[warm plinth]

Idk. I'm speaking from a lack of experience; it just doesn't sound that great.

And yeah if that's your alternative, sure. I just meant it's not worth seeking out.

[distant crystal]

i don't think null major will line up well with add phases

prob stick with vision/null

[warm plinth]

Yeah I don't think so. Riki is right; definitely better as a minor.

[mystic whale]

is null major ever worth it ?

[warm plinth]

Not likely

[mystic whale]

i dont think any mechanic can be cheesed with it

it rocks as a minor

[distant crystal]

if there's some content where there's a lot of magic burst every 2.3 minutes :p

it's prob tits

[mystic whale]

but there's just so many much better majors

[distant crystal]

cause you also deal dmg when the major bubble pops

or so i hear

[mystic whale]

yeah, its a huge chunk of my damage

[distant crystal]

if you can consistently consume the full shield on cd

it's prob nasty dps too

but idk if such content exists

[mystic whale]

honestly, in raids it does absurd amounts of damage

[distant crystal]

yeah i love it as minor on every fight

[mystic whale]

pretty sure it always bursts for full damage

[exotic spoke]

2k dps if it’s reliably procced. It’s really nice

[distant crystal]

yeah it doesn't burst full dmg unless you pop the bubble fully

[sterile mantle]

@exotic spoke so run edict and jes till i can get higher urchin?

[exotic spoke]

I absolutely would.

[distant crystal]

i misunderstood some talk in here before thinking it just did 2k dps regardless of how much magic dmg you absorbed

[sick sentinel]

Does cyclotronic undersim?

it sims equal to my 430 phial

with coral in the other spot

or are two on uses bad

[strong forum]

Phial oversims I think

And coral is amazing nonetheless

[oblique garnet]

1.4%

[shut summit]

how many pulls

[oblique garnet]

250 😦

[sick sentinel]

by how much does phial oversim

[shut summit]

not too bad, kill dat shit

[strong forum]

I'm just guessing I have no clue

[oblique garnet]

Its gonna die next raid whenever that is

[sick sentinel]

when do you use cyclotr then

out of avatar window?

before every avatar

[exotic spoke]

Rip late

[sick sentinel]

Is it worth losing BoM to use a 445 piece over a 435? The 435 being the Apogee goggles

i know ilvl is king, but wasnt sure if BoM is worth any ilvl like DC

no

if you want damage, bom probably

if yu want surv, 445

[exotic spoke]

No blindfire it’s not worth

[warm plinth]

It's not technically worth ilevel. But if you're going from a 435 with good traits to a 445 with shit, I would keep the 435

[strong forum]

I just use cyclo on CD if I can before Avatar and when I'm not actively tanking or I know its not gonna be fatal

[warm plinth]

Definitely use outside of Ava (and Demo if possible) since neither increases its damage. And yeah, gotta make sure you aren't gonna die to blockable damage while it's channeling.

[strong forum]

Tfw almost died to our 1st ashvane kill cuz of cyclo

Started casting cyclo while active tanking on like 2%

And dropped to 40k hp

[sick sentinel]

250 is manageable

[warm plinth]

lol whew

[strong forum]

Imagine almost killing azshara in 250 pulls and we are nearing 100 on orgo

:haHAA:

[sick sentinel]

Thank god I declined nome's ginvite

Uhm

Love you nome

[strong forum]

Well it's a shit tank episode

You could've prevented that

[exotic spoke]

Lol

[strong forum]

We had 30 wipes due to nobody wanting to be 3rd tank

Same as on ashvane

Literally nobody

[exotic spoke]

That’s a rip

[warm plinth]

My horde woyer is gonna pass yours soon Riki

[exotic spoke]

We made our monk healer go tank when we needed a third tank on ashvane (before we had dps to start doing 2 phase attempts) and our normal Bear wasn’t around

[distant crystal]

we had a dh dps go veng for a bit

[exotic spoke]

Oh definitely - I don’t have enough time or desire to level probablyriki

[distant crystal]

then switched to monk healer as brew instead, killed it shortly after

veng is pretty awful at it

it seems

[warm plinth]

I hit 70 this morning 💪

[strong forum]

Veng is pretty good at it, just shit Veng

[distant crystal]

idk he's one of our better players

[strong forum]

But now we recruited a new drood

[distant crystal]

he just like, falls over immediately after getting brezed

[exotic spoke]

Played classic. Got to 12. Remembered why I ducking hate leveling. Lost all desire to level any toon

[distant crystal]

before he can soak anything

[strong forum]

He's off tanking

[warm plinth]

Your first mistake was logging in to classic

[strong forum]

Soak? Oh you mean ashvane

[distant crystal]

ohh was i confusing fights

[strong forum]

Eh not really

[distant crystal]

ohh yeah orgo

[strong forum]

Veng is still pretty decent on ashvane

[exotic spoke]

It was fun to catch up with people for a bit

[distant crystal]

that same DH is doing add duty for orgo

[strong forum]

But better on orgo adds

[distant crystal]

working p well

[warm plinth]

Like 75% of my friends list has been on classic since I got back from vacation

[exotic spoke]

Nostalgia is real. But no desire to push content

[strong forum]

Vanilla is trash, change my mind

[distant crystal]

except when he tries to taunt the far add and taunts boss instead

[warm plinth]

Had one guy who hasn't been on in a year ask me why I wasn't playing classic. I was like I already played vanilla once.

[exotic spoke]

So Riki will likely stay on classic at 12 for a long time

[strong forum]

Leveled to 16, can't stand leveling

[exotic spoke]

Also, I had to shit talk and help stir the pot a little

[strong forum]

Quit

[distant crystal]

damn you made it to 16

i'm 13 and bored to tears

[strong forum]

Ye... It was a struggle

Rage quit like 4 times

Cuz of dodge/miss/parry

[warm plinth]

Accidentally pull 3 mobs, die

[distant crystal]

accidentally pull 2 mobs and don't have full health lel

[warm plinth]

lolol

[exotic spoke]

You want to know the worst part about leveling in classic?

Knowing that it was worse when I did it the first time in Vanilla because of so many other bugs / QOL changes that where added prior to 1.12

[distant crystal]

just run back 900 yds and try to find a safe spot to rez

nbd

[strong forum]

Just go D-stance equip shield and hamstring kite hahaaa

[distant crystal]

i'm a shaman

[strong forum]

Unluck

[distant crystal]

so it's earthbind and ruuuunnnn

[warm plinth]

Yikes

Shaman have spells in classic? 😏

[distant crystal]

i feel like if i make it to lvl 20 without sepukku

[grand drum]

all they have to do is cast frostshock

[exotic spoke]

Frostshock

[distant crystal]

i might enjoy it with gw

don't have frost shock yet

i think i get it real soon tho

[warm plinth]

Honestly I don't think I could level anything in classic besides a druid or a hunter

[distant crystal]

i started in BC as a shaman

cause i saw all the sick 1shot windfury highlight reels

only to realize that was no longer a thing

[warm plinth]

Mostly because those were the two I actually did level in classic and I can't imagine having to do it with anything worse.

[distant crystal]

so now i kinda wanted to get a taste of it

[strong forum]

I would love to just be level 60 and wait for pvp

[distant crystal]

but it's pretty painful

[strong forum]

Fuck leveling

[warm plinth]

Hunter leveling was legit tbh. Feeding your pet and having ammo is garbage but it's' ot that bad.

[strong forum]

Pvp I'd enjoy, or getting ez raid loot. But fuck me

[exotic spoke]

I leveled a warrior in classic. It explains so much as to why I fucking hate it and haven’t ever really leveled alts

[distant crystal]

well i have a lot of people tell me leveling is the fun part

[strong forum]

F-f-fun

[warm plinth]

Those people have zero standard for entertainment

[exotic spoke]

Miss an execute - go to zero rage....

[distant crystal]

which makes me wonder why i even bother since the levveling sucks

lol

[warm plinth]

BC leveling was a little easier; pretty sure BC launch was the first reduction in XP for 1-60 iirc

[exotic spoke]

I would pay to restore my character post bwl / aq/ Naxx just so I didn’t have to fucking level

[strong forum]

We're home boys. Only 6 parries 2 dodges and 1 miss on this mob. 1-3hrs per level and drink every 2nd mob.
Finally home

[warm plinth]

But legit what would make me the least likely to level in classic is seriously just the loss of AoE looting

[strong forum]

Or aoe dmg

Or gameplay

[warm plinth]

That's such a massive QoL improvvement

[strong forum]

Or buttons to press

Or actual flow of abilities

[warm plinth]

Like I can't even level a ranged toon in retail without the loot-a-rang

How tf can I do it having to loot every mob again

[strong forum]

That's fine, you can't kill more than 2 mobs anyway

[warm plinth]

I could on my hunter

[strong forum]

Cuz it's unnecessarily high hp vs low dps

[exotic spoke]

“Content in classic was wayyyy harder than retail”

“Ony And Mc cleared in 5-6 days.....”

[warm plinth]

Which was even worse because you have to fucking run up to the mobs you killed to loot them

[strong forum]

Just to be tedious

[sick sentinel]

@exotic spoke 5days and 1 hour

[warm plinth]

I really don't know why anyone would say content was harder in classic.

[strong forum]

Cuz they're oblivious

It's not hard, just tedious

[undone sun]

oh boy

[warm plinth]

Like I want some of what they're smoking

[undone sun]

this conversation

[distant crystal]

if leveling counts as content

[strong forum]

It's amazing right thyme

[distant crystal]

then i'd agree :p

[warm plinth]

Hi Thyme.

How's it going babe?

[undone sun]

hello

pretty g ood

[warm plinth]

You playing classic? 😏

[undone sun]

🤣

🤣

🤣

no

[warm plinth]

That's about the answer I expected

[exotic spoke]

I disagree waat. I don’t think length equates to difficulty

That said if people enjoy it - good for them. I hope they do

[strong forum]

Right answer thyme

Good boi

[warm plinth]

Well, leveling-wise it probably was actually harder tbh lol

Just because everything was disproportionate

[undone sun]

vanilla was hard

at the time, because everyone was inexperienced and it was very new for it's time

[warm plinth]

And there were actual elite mobs that required actual groups to kill

[undone sun]

but the game has evolved so much, that vanilla is basically a different game and much, much easier

[exotic spoke]

It’s because people where shit back then.

[undone sun]

exactly

inexperienced

[strong forum]

Exactly

[undone sun]

how i put it

[warm plinth]

Yep

[strong forum]

Finally people that get it

[exotic spoke]

Yup I was agreeing

Myself included. It was an amazing game for the time.

[strong forum]

Vanilla was great cuz EVERYTHING was new

[undone sun]

i didn't get into WoW till MoP ¯_(ツ)_/¯

[strong forum]

EVERYTHING was exciting, there was no scale and comparisons to be had

[undone sun]

but i don't think i would like the style back then

[exotic spoke]

But Jesus Christ, the grind was real for literally everything in vanilla

[strong forum]

Like, I started in tbc, and I loved tbc and think I had the most amount of fun every back then. But fuck me I wouldn't play it again

[warm plinth]

I had a ton of fun in vanilla, but I recognize for me personally that I would not enjoy it having gone through the subsequent years/changes of WoW

[strong forum]

Especially after the boredom that is vanilla

Especially after I have grown to like fast paced gameplay

[warm plinth]

If people do though, that's awesome.

I hope the folks who didn't play vanilla are getting some semblance of the experience in classic

[strong forum]

I'm just happy the elitists can stfu now

[warm plinth]

Because it was truly awesome

[exotic spoke]

I would play bc to cata again for one specific reason. I loved the pvp in those expansions more than anything else

[strong forum]

Cata pvp 👌

Was the best shit ever

[exotic spoke]

I was flag bitch in Cata. Didn’t do much in arenas

[strong forum]

I hate rbgs

So.

[exotic spoke]

But I was a damn good flag bitch

[strong forum]

:pat:

[exotic spoke]

Speedy woyer

Who did arms in other maps

I liked the coordination. Required in TBC but, in hindsight, I don’t know if I could do hour long (or longer) arena matches again

There was, at one point, a screenshot posted on a forum - I think elitistjerks or probably arenajunkies - Of a TBC match where a GM has to get involved because people’s weapons broke from attacking for so long

The solution was a roll off to resolve who won

[undone sun]

lol

there's definitely a novelty to it

[strong forum]

Ye, there was like a 23hrs arena

In tbc

That's how the 45min rule got created

Or 50min rule, idk anymore

[chilly brook]

I’ve run into more elitism in retail than I have in classic

[warm plinth]

Tbf there's more opportunity for elitism in retail. But I'm glad to hear that.

[strong forum]

I just very much like to make fun of it now

https://clips.twitch.tv/FairRespectfulDogSquadGoals

That was like 10min before I just alt+f4 on release

[sick sentinel]

We're finally home boys

[strong forum]

Dodge... Miss... High threat on shaman spells... Home...

[sick sentinel]

Earthshock has high threat

Because encha was supposed to be a tank spec

[onyx vessel]

7 sunders before dps attack

[strong forum]

16 debuff max

Now that's gameplay that makes many classes useless, peak design

[prisma crane]

used to be 8 debuffs

which is why people are now saying that they released the casual version of classic and that's the only reason it was cleared so easy

meanwhile "so easy" includes zero wipes, lmao

[strong forum]

People are grasping for straws to defend their 'real vanilla'

[prisma crane]

thing is

there's plenty to like about classic

but "difficulty" wasn't one of them

[strong forum]

Yup

[warm plinth]

I agree 100%

[strong forum]

Vanilla is the better rpg

Retail is the better gameplay

[prisma crane]

agreed, and was way better at maintaining actual communities too

but QoL changes arent a bad thing lol

[strong forum]

Yea...

[prisma crane]

that said, i'd totally be ok if retail brought back talent trees and 8 piece tier sets

and dungeon sets

[strong forum]

And pvp sets

And actually good pvp

[warm plinth]

I'll be fine with them bringing back tier sets if they eliminate item level 😄

[prisma crane]

oh yea, dump WF and TF

[strong forum]

They will

[warm plinth]

I doubt it.

[strong forum]

They will also do a level squish

[prisma crane]

let me ACTUALLY be able to get BiS gear again

[warm plinth]

I hope they do the level squish but I don't think WF/TF are going anywhere

[strong forum]

It's already confirmed, what do you mean

[warm plinth]

When did they say they were scrapping forging?

[onyx vessel]

Wf has been in game for awhile

[strong forum]

They will do smth about TF they're not happy with it

[warm plinth]

Since MoP technically

[onyx vessel]

But it was +6

[warm plinth]

With Thunderforged shit

[strong forum]

But they don't know how to replace it yet

They will change it, but they don't have a solution for it as of yet

[prisma crane]

they just need to let people "complete" content and take breaks, like...ffs... having downtime isnt bad

[warm plinth]

I'm super psyched for level squish, since I level a lot of toons

[strong forum]

I have 6 at 120

So I'm content

[onyx vessel]

I have 1

[warm plinth]

Problem is that people bitch when they're still playing between content patches and have nothing new to do.

[strong forum]

I only play 2 though

[onyx vessel]

Warrior is life

[warm plinth]

I have uh...13 I think?

[onyx vessel]

Nerd

[warm plinth]

I have lost count 😅

[strong forum]

I can already start bitching cuz I im 446 equipped and now need TFs

[warm plinth]

I only play 2 right now. Will be playing 3 when my horde war gets max level

[prisma crane]

"nothing to do" is way better than forced repetition for the sake of RNG falling in your favor

[onyx vessel]

446 big boi here

Im 437

[prisma crane]

if they want to go the TF/WF RNG route, they need WAY more loot to be dropping

[strong forum]

The only excitement I get out of wow currently is logging off

[onyx vessel]

Oof

[warm plinth]

I mean, even if more loot dropped it's still RNG. Look at Diablo. Tons of loot drops but almost none of it is better.

[prisma crane]

gimme fatty old talent trees, if there's one thing classic has showed me it's that they arent quite as cookie cutter as they once were, at least if you dont mind playing a weird spec

i like being able to be a hybrid of a class, actually a "Warrior" instead of [insert spec here]

[onyx vessel]

Im ok with current talents

[warm plinth]

I never felt like talent trees were cookie cutter tbh, when they were the larger ones. But there wasn't as much pressure to optimize for the average player then either.

[onyx vessel]

Just prot has alot of useless ones

[prisma crane]

there will always be useless ones

[warm plinth]

Yeah even in the huge talent trees days, there were useless talents

[prisma crane]

they're either so impactful that one will clearly win, or be so lackluster that it doesnt matter which you pick

at least with the larger trees

when you have talents that require 25 points first

you can at least pick different options below them to get to the more meta talents

so you can play around it

they are far from perfect

but at least bring back a more RPG element

current talents feel almost MOBA like to me

[onyx vessel]

Yup

Sadly its geared towards that way

Less rpg roots

[warm plinth]

I don't disagree but I don't think those talent trees would work in the game we play today

There's too much pressure to optimize even for average players. There'd still be cookie cutter builds.

[prisma crane]

don't lock abilities to specs but to your tree and have all base abilities available in all "specs" and they would

you can play dogshit specs and talents if you only want to do content that average players complete

i think the problem is when blizz tries to prevent min/maxing from players

let people jsut play the game

if top tier players are OP, so be it

oh, also

imo

another nice thing about classic was that random items were named and occasionally really good

i think that with 8 expacs people wont remember them the same as they do the OG ones, but

[strong forum]

You only remember good items

Or rather OP items

[prisma crane]

having flavor items isnt a bad thing, and literally hundreds of gray shit filling my bags from Nazj doesnt count

[strong forum]

Let's just all forget about nazj

That's a terrible inventory blocker

[prisma crane]

oh classic was full of shitty items too lol

idk, id just like to see it "feel" like an mmorpg again

classic is fun for now, but it wont live long

and tbh, even if it only lives for like 6 months, i'd consider a game lasting 6 months for someone a success

[strong forum]

It will die in 1 month

Then get some hype with phase 2

The pvp stuff will keep some players

Will die again in 2 months

Peak up for phase 3

And die again rather quickly

[prisma crane]

idk, i think the true lasting piece of classic will be wpvp

pve will be cleared so fast that it wont last as long

[strong forum]

Everything but naxx will die in 1 day

Especially after the people have their full gear

But yeh, pvp is the driving factor that will keep the game alive

[weary thorn]

Keep in mind that many private servers had periodic wipes that would help to keep players interested in progression. Once you are capped and content is cleared, that's it

[oblique garnet]

Even naxx will die in 1 day

[junior ivy]

hi prot people

[vernal stirrup]

naxx will be dead in 3 hours

[sick sentinel]

Hi cat

Sorry I ghosted you

[junior ivy]

better be sorry

[warm plinth]

No you're not

You evil person

[sick sentinel]

I didn't get notif about your message

Or I was doing mplus

Or both

[junior ivy]

you just hate me

[warm plinth]

Look at him scramble for excuses

[junior ivy]

i know eh

[warm plinth]

catfriend just fucking said eh

Do you say aboot cat

[junior ivy]

ive never heard canadians say "aboot"

what ive noticed

is americans say "a-boat"

and we say "a-bout"

but you guys hear it as a-boot

cause you guys suck

[warm plinth]

I would say Canadians are the a-boat ones

Tbh

But it's not quite that

[junior ivy]

i was talking to my friend earlier about how much i hate people who pronounce pillow like "pellow"

[warm plinth]

It's more like you say a-bout but you make the o long

[junior ivy]

do you agree

[warm plinth]

Yeah. But I live in Missouri where people call window sills window seals and crayons crowns

So I have to deal with that shit

They can't even pronounce their own fucking state's name properly

[junior ivy]

a lot of people here say "cousint" for "cousin" and i hate it too

[undone sun]

lol

[junior ivy]

do you guys say milk or melk

[undone sun]

milk

[junior ivy]

i say melk

😦

[sick sentinel]

I am confused

[strong forum]

:Kkona:

[undone sun]

though, i don't recall any major differences in the way californians say words, so ¯_(ツ)_/¯

is your milk in a bag @junior ivy

[junior ivy]

i usually buy it in plastic cartons

but it comes in bags too

[undone sun]

interesting

[junior ivy]

my parents always bought it in bags

there used to be juice in bags too

these were the shit.

i miss them.

[warm plinth]

The fuck is that

[junior ivy]

juice bags

[brittle owl]

👀

[junior ivy]

you rip the corner off with your teeth

and drink it

[undone sun]

💦

[brittle owl]

that's fkin disturbing as shit

[junior ivy]

you could aslo freeze them

and its like a slushie kinda

on halloween everyone gave out juice bags

youre all jealous

[undone sun]

we have something similar

[warm plinth]

Why does Canada make everything weird

[undone sun]

the freeze kind

called otterpops or freeze pops

[junior ivy]

wanna know a weird canadian thing

that i didnt always know was only canadian

if you win a prize in canada, like say, theres a contest on pop bottles to win something, or like a bag of chips has a chance to win a dumb prize

well in order to collect your prize

you have to solve a math problem

and submit it to the cashier at the store

[warm plinth]

Uh...what? Why lol

[junior ivy]

its usually like an 'order of operations' problem

its our gambling laws

by having a math question it becomes a contest of "skill"

instead of luck/

[undone sun]

ahh

[sick sentinel]

LMAO

[warm plinth]

So you get chosen to answer the problem to "win" instead of the random chance of actually winning

[brittle owl]

thats

a retarded loophole

[warm plinth]

That's such a weird ass workaround lmfao

[junior ivy]

like winning is random, but to actually collect the prize, gotta do mathg

[undone sun]

if it works... it works

[junior ivy]

math*

[warm plinth]

But idk, maybe Americans would be smarter if they had to do math more often.

[brittle owl]

"math"

[undone sun]

probably @warm plinth

[warm plinth]

I mean, you don't see the people on Facebook getting every order of operations problem ever wrong?

It's fucking math for 'Muricans

[junior ivy]

hahah YES

those friggin things

[brittle owl]

not just for murricans

most people get them wrong

[junior ivy]

i see canadians fuck em up too

[brittle owl]

because most people are borderline illiterate

murricans have more people on facebook by volume, so they just seem dumber

[warm plinth]

Fair enough

[brittle owl]

when in reality, the proportion stays the same in every country more or less

[undone sun]

unlucky me

[warm plinth]

I get them all right so it's fine. 😏

[junior ivy]

theres a perception that theres more dumb people in america but i think its more of like, theres a subset of americans that take pride in being dumb

and thats less of a thing in other countries

like anti-intellectual attitudes

arent as popular elsewhere

[vernal stirrup]

yes that's part of it

[junior ivy]

even if we have just as many idiots

[undone sun]

just a louder group, yeah

[vernal stirrup]

proportionally you may have as many, but America has a lot more people than you as well

[sick sentinel]

Dum and proud

[undone sun]

Ignorance is bliss

[brittle owl]

nah it's more like

a % of a given population is dumb

or below what would be considered 'normal intelligence'

[spark mortar]

Hey gang - are the best Azerite traits for us still 3 x BoM if achievable?

[brittle owl]

murricans have a high pop and are a lot on social media

[junior ivy]

but quality of education and cultural attitudes towards education differ between places

[brittle owl]

nah

only asia stands out

rest of the world is roughly the same

and yeah maybe countries in africa are on the other end of the spectrum - for now

[junior ivy]

i dunno, i find it rare to run into canadians who look down on school and university compared to americans

[brittle owl]

they catching up real quick

[junior ivy]

but just my own experience

a lot of americans seem to resent education and knowledge and stuff, i dunno how to explain

haha

but its weird and i dont see it here

[vernal stirrup]

I've never personally met an American who doesn't like education

[brittle owl]

depends on where you live

[vernal stirrup]

and I live there

[junior ivy]

i only hvae online

have

[brittle owl]

if you live in a big city

where qol is high

theres a higher density of educated people there

[vernal stirrup]

I live in bumfuck nowhere in oklahoma

[brittle owl]

if you live in a shithole

there's a lower density

[junior ivy]

like i know there are places that dont teach certain topics cause of religion etc and where people think university is like brainwashing camps so they look down on it lol

but thats probably just a particular group online

[warm plinth]

I don't know anyone who talks down on education. There are people who advocate for less pressure on kids to go to college though, since depending on your field it may not matter.

[brittle owl]

people online are a special group though

[warm plinth]

For the purposes of a career

[brittle owl]

social norms don't really apply in the online world

[warm plinth]

The internet lets people say the stupid shit they regularly think and it makes them worse people.

[brittle owl]

cause anonimity

[junior ivy]

ywha its just online ive seen people say theyd never let their kids go to university cause theyll be brainwashed into being communists

and weird shit

lol

conspiracy theorists i guess

[warm plinth]

Even on social media where you're not really anonymous, there's just something about not being face to face that makes people say whatever moronic crap that comes to their mind.

[brittle owl]

there's also the fact that

the louder you are

the more likely youll recieve validation

[junior ivy]

and ive seen too many documentaries like jesus camp

where parents despise education

[warm plinth]

Yeah, that's why the vocal minority is a thing.

[junior ivy]

adn want their kids as dumb as possible

but that was for religious reasons

to keep them religious etc

like definitelyt a small subset of people

[brittle owl]

nah

not small

[warm plinth]

Anyway, in just 50 short levels I'll be gearing up a warrior again 😄

[brittle owl]

biggest group of people are like that, in general

[warm plinth]

Can't wait

[brittle owl]

lel

"intelligence" usually follows pareto balance

[junior ivy]

i started school today

community college

my program has about 50 students

2 of us are girls.

RIP

[brittle owl]

stem?

[junior ivy]

IT

[brittle owl]

ye

so thats why

😂

count the no of people that will graduate btw

and then take into consideration that you're already a small percentage of the population that does go to college

should give you an idea as to how educated people are in general

spoiler: not very educated

[junior ivy]

yeah depends on area though

when i lived in montreal it seemed liek everyone had a bachelors degree at least

but here in nova scotia its like not even close

[brittle owl]

you're missing the point

the median in any given country for bachelor degrees is like

5-10% of the population

it's surprisingly consistent

[junior ivy]

apparently canada is one of the most educated countries though

[brittle owl]

out of those, maybe half of them are actually competent

[junior ivy]

and its about 20% or more

i just looked it up

22.4%

[brittle owl]

that is actually high tbh

[junior ivy]

but my province is probably like 5-10

[brittle owl]

doesnt really matter

you wanna think macro

cause you're most likely not going to work in a field that directly benefits the comunity

but rather a "smaller" role in a bigger picture

[exotic spoke]

Hi catfriend

Also, anyone know of an easy way to figure out AP from the armory?

[junior ivy]

hi riki!

[crystal hare]

Is there a classic warrior discord?

I have some prot questions on classic haha

[junior ivy]

just ask here

[oblique garnet]

no

Theres #vanilla-discussion for that

[crystal hare]

How do you gain threat on multiple targets in instances?

[oblique garnet]

This is for retail questions

[junior ivy]

@undone sun or @warm plinth or @sick sentinel or @exotic spoke will answer

oh.

well.

NEVERMIND THEN

[oblique garnet]

By spamming demoshout

[crystal hare]

Ok sorry

[junior ivy]

dont apologize

[oblique garnet]

Its fine

[crystal hare]

Is that the most efficient way?

[sick sentinel]

I was ponged

[crystal hare]

Well I guess so since its what you answered with haha

Thanks!

[sick sentinel]

Don't pong me if I'm not needed :C

[junior ivy]

you were needed

he had a question

[oblique garnet]

kage doesnt know how to play warrior in classic

(8

[junior ivy]

kaege knows things

[exotic spoke]

Battle shout tanking was real

Spamming battle shout to hold aggro on all of the skeletons / drakes in nefarian

[left hatch]

been outta the loop for a few weeks, and seeing conflicting stuff on WC logs
What are people running for M+?
guide says vision - aegis - memory but a lot of top ppl on io are using Anima or crucible minor

anima major that is

[oblique garnet]

No

Dont use anima major

[sick sentinel]

Use vision major +cns rank 3+sphere rank2 or 3

[left hatch]

really? sphere wasn't even mentioned on icy

ok

guessing memory is trash?

[spice ferry]

1st meticulous or a second reckless for st?

[oblique garnet]

Sim it

[exotic spoke]

Anima Major is fun but it’s not the best option

Vision is better

[sick sentinel]

Why tf isn't sphere minor suggested

[onyx vessel]

Cns rank 3 tho thats alot of work for a minor upgrade

R2 is fine

[exotic spoke]

I dunno kaege. It’s listed as situationally as I recall

[left hatch]

its been taken off as situational

and has the note that anything not listed is not worth considering

so iunno

[onyx vessel]

As a minor sphere null and cns are best

[hasty nova]

sup guys

wow i was just coming here to ask about essences for m+ too lol

yeah i just hit 65 today, i am thiking vop major, null minor and not sure on 3rd

shphere is what i p[ut in there

wasn't sure if any one else had a big suggestion

for fort weeks i'm thinking this is best build

[onyx vessel]

Cns r2 is good

[exotic spoke]

Holy shit it isnt. wtf

[hasty nova]

on tyranical weeks i might go cof major, vop minor, null minor

what u thinking riki?

[onyx vessel]

Vop all the way bb gurl

[exotic spoke]

Full defensive and bigger pulls isnmy current mindset. Personally VoP, aegis, nullification

[oblique garnet]

null is mediocre in m+

[exotic spoke]

Not for dps but for the shield versus magic damage

[hasty nova]

aegis

[oblique garnet]

aegis is worse than cns

[exotic spoke]

I don’t have CnS rank 2

Otherwise it would be there instead of null

[onyx vessel]

Cns r1 kinda sucks

Oof

[oblique garnet]

Dont @ me

[exotic spoke]

I don’t even have sphere either Late.

[onyx vessel]

I have r3 sphere

[sick sentinel]

First of all

Unless you're consistenly doing 8mob pulls

[onyx vessel]

Prob best as minor for m+

[sick sentinel]

Aegis is worse than cns

Secondly

Sphere doesn't scale with damage taken or number of targets

So you not only need to consistently break it but also it's a dps loss to other stat essences

[exotic spoke]

We consistently do larger pulls now - which is why I’m going more defensive. Even if it was only 4-5 do you rank rank 1 CnS > rank 3 aegis?

[sick sentinel]

Rank 1 no

Only rank 3

[exotic spoke]

Yeah, only have rank 1 right now for CnS

[sick sentinel]

Rank 3 aegis>rank 2 cns in mplus

So

[exotic spoke]

Yup. That’s what I thought

But yeah - running VoP major, aegis minor, and null. But I’m not sold on null - could see swapping to lucid dreams. when I get rank 3 CnS I’ll probably use that instead

[novel temple]

I would say for m+ go with vision major, cns, and aegis

[sick sentinel]

Riki's cns is r1 tho

I would go lucid instead of cns

I kinda miss it lmao

This atal 20 caught me off without as much rage as I wanted today

[novel temple]

I haven’t tested it but I feel like I’m overcapping in rage all the time

Without lucid minor

[sick sentinel]

I used lucid major for a month

And I'm just used to spamming the shit out of IP

[spiral ravine]

VoP major - Aegis - Sphere r2 / CnS r2 / Memory. For m+ which would be the best option for the 3rd minor?

[sick sentinel]

even if capped

[novel temple]

Right now I’m using vision major and crucible minor since those are rank 3

[sick sentinel]

Aegis+ sphere minors

@spiral ravine

[spiral ravine]

Thanks Kaege

[sick sentinel]

If you get cns

Rank 3

Go cns+sphere

[spiral ravine]

looks really good ya

alright

[novel temple]

I’m fearing the the grind for sphere

But I got cns this week since I finally found a partner to pvp with

As arms though

I’m probably just gonna make fury my main raid/m+ dps spec with arms being full pvp

[exotic spoke]

Could do lucid and rest it again. The 2 ppm just felt bad

[sick sentinel]

It's not 2 ppm tho

[exotic spoke]

I thought that’s what it was

[sick sentinel]

Are you sure tho

[exotic spoke]

When I was using it a bit ago. I’ll have to test it again

What proc ratebare you seeing kaege

[novel temple]

I know this is gonna sound crazy and bad, mostly bad, but I’m thinking about dropping the second dc for either bloodsport or for the revenge talent

[exotic spoke]

Not worth

[novel temple]

Rip

[sick sentinel]

worth for cr

[novel temple]

Cr is the revenge one?

[sick sentinel]

Not worth for bs

Ya

[novel temple]

Aye

I couldn’t remember the name, but I revenge in dungeons a lot too

Especially during avatar procs

Thunderclap revenge, thunderclap spam

[sick sentinel]

Cr is not necessarily bad

it's just worse than the others

[novel temple]

I’ve got a 440 socketed inkpod, with a 430 font

[sick sentinel]

And riki, the lucid buff has like 40% uptime or something

[novel temple]

And font feels clunky to use

[exotic spoke]

I’ll check the logs from the last time I used Lucid in mythic raid. But I think I had 12 procs in a 6 minute fight

How long is the buff from lucid?

[sick sentinel]

Font is good if you have others with font as well

So you all channel in unison

[exotic spoke]

So, lucid has an 8 second buff which would mean its 3 Ppm?

[sick sentinel]

That sounds about right

[novel temple]

Is that directed at me kaege?

Wait yeah

What about during a boss fight or pull in m+ and it comes back up

Mostly boss fight last week and maybe trash this week

[sick sentinel]

I don't do it during a pull

But some* bossfights it's okay

You have to plan around it

[strong forum]

I get 50-60 procs a dungeon of lucid

Given the average dungeon is 30minutes

You have your 2ppm for prot warri

It's higher for classes that have higher cpm

Lower for classes with lower cpm

For example havoc has fuckton of lucid procs

And shaman has very little procs

[sick sentinel]

higher for classes with high cpm and lower for classes with lower

Have you considered

It being a flat % chance

And not ppm

[strong forum]

It's 15%

But it comes down to 2ppm for prot warri so who gives a shit

[exotic spoke]

Something doesn’t add up. Kaege is saying 40% buff uptime but that does work out with 2 ppm

[sand egret]

well obviously Kaege is wack

[exotic spoke]

Get back in your whole diglet

Hole*

[sick sentinel]

I'm just better at video games

And get better rng

[strong forum]

Kaege adds up 10% more uptime on his buffs to look better.

You should know that by now

[sand egret]

also super out of the blue, but you mentioned the other day that Aegis doesn't overtake CnS until like 7-8 stacks which aint true 🙂

[sick sentinel]

Yeah my sphere has 105% uptime @strong forum

[strong forum]

See

Cns with full stacks is what, 420

[sick sentinel]

54*8

[strong forum]

Aegis at 7 is 420ish

[exotic spoke]

But 2ppm has 26.6% uptime. Where does the other 3.4% come from Nome

[strong forum]

He presses more IP

Idk

[sick sentinel]

I spam ip

[strong forum]

I'm just spouting stuff I hear and read

[sick sentinel]

To get rid of rage

[exotic spoke]

Lol

[sick sentinel]

Because I'm way too angery all the time

[oblique garnet]

^

[exotic spoke]

He hits his buttons harder

[strong forum]

He wants the classic experience, never being able to be above 20 rage

[sick sentinel]

And my revenges are free

[oblique garnet]

My friend was overcapping on rage in classic

[sick sentinel]

Damn fucking right I am

I'm smashing the fuck out of my keyboard

[oblique garnet]

You doing big boy numbers yet kage?

[sick sentinel]

Good enough

430 weap tho

[oblique garnet]

F

[exotic spoke]

Rip

Late, what are big boy numbers in your mind?

[strong forum]

35k+ overall I reckon

[hasty nova]

f

[oblique garnet]

Its up to 40k now because 3rd essence

[onyx vessel]

Im 437 with 415 1h and 415 shield

[strong forum]

My dps players don't even reach 40k

[onyx vessel]

[hasty nova]

my fuckling shield and 1h are still both 435 RIP

[sick sentinel]

35 lmao

[strong forum]

I didn't break 30k outside of meme keys yet

Truth be told I only do weeklies

Literally only raid logging

[exotic spoke]

Fuck me. I need bigger pulls then I dislike going full defensive in some ways

[sick sentinel]

I do like 33k overall

[exotic spoke]

25k or so in most 18-19s

[sick sentinel]

Without inkpod

[oblique garnet]

I mean i run with alchemist and urchin

[sick sentinel]

If I use my 455 inkpod

It goes a lot better

[exotic spoke]

430 block / urchin

[strong forum]

450 urchin + 430 block

Both with sockets

[exotic spoke]

Hate you

[sick sentinel]

Alch stone+430 rezans here

[strong forum]

:))

[sick sentinel]

No socket on rezans

[oblique garnet]

Did 39k in 19 last week 8)

[sick sentinel]

Or 435 block

Depends on the key

[onyx vessel]

I was doing a 12 temple with 3 azalons made it to 2nd boss wiped for like 4 pulls priest leaves we were already 20mins overtime

🤔

[strong forum]

Highest key I touched was 17

Only do meme keys currently

Cba

Games shit

[onyx vessel]

Brazilians

[oblique garnet]

You just have to giga clap all day everyday

[exotic spoke]

Did a 20 TD last week

[sick sentinel]

I can't time high keys

Because of a 300k hp boomie

[exotic spoke]

Timed 19 tos. Tos easy mode

[sick sentinel]

That's my friend