I have to say that room was nice and easy as a paladin lol
#protection
warm plinth
Well I just meant having the constant 50% slow is all
brittle owl
big pump
exotic spoke
Speed pot and pick up all the shit
brittle owl
yup
exotic spoke
Then booty clap to pad
brittle owl
nah fam
warm plinth
Don’t forget LS+rally and Anima
random urchin
True. I just always cringe when I see such high stacks lol
brittle owl
meta into stam pot into anima
warm plinth
Ultimate pad
brittle owl
is the big clap
warm plinth
Stam pot, Jesus. You’re not fucking around
brittle owl
vdh wants a word about anima
exotic spoke
He’s not wrong. I just have to speed pot so I can’t.
I carry a stack or two of Stam pots on me just for that
90k anima hits are super fun
sand egret
holy shit i didnt even think about padding with Stam pots...
brittle owl
also its not target capped
exotic spoke
Step up your game bearsong
random urchin
And neither did I.... time to crank out some steam pots
brittle owl
random urchin
Stam*
exotic spoke
The real pad is popping a Stam flask right before and then a strength flask right after
chilly brook
My gold purse is crying from that idea
brittle owl
that's 400iq strat
chilly brook
That’s a 9 billion gold in the bank strat
exotic spoke
So much gold changes hands in my Raid it’s crazy
brittle owl
i really am curious
exotic spoke
Like 1M + a night
brittle owl
how much anima will hit for in 8.3
exotic spoke
We’re shocked that no ones been banned yet
The issue with the flasks is that I’d have to make Stam flasks then
chilly brook
Blizz can’t ban their active playerbase because they wouldn’t have anyone playing the game if they did xD
exotic spoke
I mean - it honesty could look like real money shit is going around.
brittle owl
theres a shitton of ppl playing atm
exotic spoke
When people are trading 100k - 200k at a time occasionally
chilly brook
Not really, at least comparatively to other xpacs
brittle owl
yeah true, besides launch this is the highest point in bfa doe
rn i'm basing my judgement to the amount of useless/besides the point whine in nazjatar
chilly brook
I believe the current estimation is 1.1 million
sand egret
that's a lot, for a 15 year old game
exotic spoke
But Classic
brittle owl
eh
chilly brook
And I wouldn’t completely count right now as the best gauge of current WoW population because of classic coming out and people resubbing since it’s in 7 days
brittle owl
can't wait for all the fragile 'vets' to get a reality check
chilly brook
What reality?
strong forum
People are selling m+ and raid boosts for several hundred thousand sometimes millions of gold
brittle owl
that classic wasnt hard
chilly brook
It’s very public what people are getting in classic
strong forum
Why would people from a guild be banned if they traded for that
chilly brook
It’s been all over twitch and YouTube what to expect
exotic spoke
Yeah o know Nome. Because gallywix gold managers often get temporarily banned / flagged
sand egret
im playing classic for the leveling anyway
chilly brook
Idk how it’s a “reality” check
exotic spoke
So I’d expect a similar thing
brittle owl
theres still a surprising amount of people
strong forum
Ye, the owner of one of the largest alliance boosting communities was in my guild
brittle owl
still harping on about 'real raiding/real hardcore'
chilly brook
I mean Vanilla was hard in a different way
strong forum
Until we swapped faction
brittle owl
it wasn't hard, it was 'slow'
strong forum
And he got investigated by blizzard
sand egret
getting 40 idiots to do anything is hard
brittle owl
slower paced is the word
chilly brook
I mean it was though
sick sentinel
Thing is
strong forum
But they didn't find the 'hard evidence' for what he was doing
sick sentinel
You need 20
brittle owl
and the difficulty wasnt jn the game system itself
chilly brook
Mechanical difficulty=/=overall difficulty
exotic spoke
I yeah, I mean temp banned is all Nome
brittle owl
yep
chilly brook
Yes it was slower
sick sentinel
People were 5manning onyxia before AQ came out
exotic spoke
You could do MC / BWL with 30 competent players easily
chilly brook
However it was more punishing in a lot of different areas
sand egret
enrage timers were a a thing on many a boss
brittle owl
people didnt know how to play tho
chilly brook
People aren’t trying to play classic for the difficulty though
brittle owl
yes
strong forum
I prolly wont even hit 60 before I quit classic again
exotic spoke
Nostalgia
brittle owl
its the 'game' aspect
strong forum
But I will nolife for like a week
sand egret
i just wanna play the rpg aspect
warm plinth
People are playing it because nostalgia is a hell of a thing
brittle owl
its a better game overall
strong forum
Have 2 week vacation :comfy:
chilly brook
I’m playing it because of the game design
brittle owl
- nostalgia being 50% of the appeal
chilly brook
Not because of nostalgia lmao
sand egret
im legit looking forward to 5-man leveling dungeons
exotic spoke
Game design was terrible by today’s standards
chilly brook
And 100% one area where the game is harder is leveling
exotic spoke
(I’m not saying BfA is amazing by any means)
warm plinth
Wait, harder now? Or harder then?
exotic spoke
Leveling was just a mindless grind that took forever
chilly brook
Harder then @warm plinth
warm plinth
Oh, okay
sand egret
eh, Pardo's decisions still hold up well in a lot of ways
exotic spoke
Thats it. Not hard - unforgiving and pointless
chilly brook
Unforgiving is hard?
brittle owl
nah it was fun, the world felt like a world
exotic spoke
From a balance point it’s terrible
sand egret
the landscape has changed, but the principles were pretty solid
brittle owl
not a fkin snowflake
warm plinth
I mean, I don't find drinking/eating after every mob fun but you do you lol
chilly brook
I 100% disagree with the idea that classic design is bad in modern day
exotic spoke
Unforgiving in that unlucky just sucks. Hey you had a runner. Well fuck you’re dead
That doesn’t fee hard to me. That feels fucking stupid
exotic spoke
Class / spec balance was fucking terrible
brittle owl
than the current game is
sand egret
also know that "balance" becomes more relevant as competition increases,
which wasn't exactly a focus of vanilla
warm plinth
Yeah I mean, when you went to BRD, you really didn't give a shit what class/spec you had
strong forum
There's no need for balance perse, cuz gear > everything in vanilla
sand egret
yeah, now it's liek DID YOU SIM!!?!?!!?!
strong forum
If you have full gear you're gonna stomp everything
sand egret
puts on glasses
Well achtulally this X trinket gives 45 more dps
chilly brook
There’s a lot of people looking at classic through the wrong lens
strong forum
That's not on equal terms
exotic spoke
A casual game that required huge grinds for any content? 
chilly brook
Define huge grinds
exotic spoke
@strong forum even with top tier gear it wasn’t balanced
sand egret
those can coexist
brittle owl
that's what i meant with reality check @chilly brook
chilly brook
Because you can have an overall casual game with less than casual stuff in it
strong forum
Literally none
brittle owl
^
exotic spoke
Pvp, raiding, prep for raiding, etc
sand egret
lol
chilly brook
Pvp
strong forum
There's no rating
chilly brook
Lololol
exotic spoke
I know they weren’t
chilly brook
If you think pvp in vanilla was hardcore topkek
brittle owl
wait for tbc legacy for meaningful pvp
strong forum
Unless there's a ladder, pvp is just a mini game
brittle owl
and even then
exotic spoke
But the Pvp was literally just a grind - not an indication of skill
brittle owl
sl/sl warlocks lmao
chilly brook
You can have grinds and it still be casual
sand egret
ironically, Pardo admitted himself that one of the biggest mistakes he made with WoW was creating Arenas
strong forum
You can pvp for fun, sure, but classic is not competitive
You can take it slow
There's no rush to anything
That's the good part about it
chilly brook
Raiding didn’t really require that much of a non casual grind
brittle owl
nah pvp in vanilla, not classic, was fun bcs of the skill gaps
exotic spoke
The pvp grind was not something you could really take slowly
strong forum
On retail I just wanna rush gear
brittle owl
back then
chilly brook
There were plenty of casual raiding guilds in vanilla
brittle owl
not so much now
strong forum
Classic / vanilla is smth you just fuck around with and have casual fun and waste time in
Atleast for me
warm plinth
What raids are in classic on release? Just MC?
sand egret
it was a world , not a theme park
chilly brook
Not sure
exotic spoke
Pvp was fun on so much that it was imbalanced. Globalling people.
Until you saw a frost mage... ducking die in a fire frost mage
chilly brook
Again you’re looking at classic wrong lol
warm plinth
Can't remember but I thought MC was the only one released with vanilla
sand egret
first patch was MC
exotic spoke
Or occasionally came across locks / mages with Max gear and even when I was in tank gear getting one shot / globalled
brittle owl
mc an ony were live on 1.1
exotic spoke
Again; I’m not looking at it wrong. I’m looking at it in my perspective
I’ve already done it once. I have zero intention of going back because I don’t think it was that good of a game in hindsight
It was great for it’s time - but it doesn’t hold up to the test of time imo
warm plinth
It was good enough that I enjoyed it and still play it. But would never go back.
chilly brook
If you played Divinity Original Sin 2 are you rushing to the end to have the best gear and best build you possibly can? Or are you enjoying the 100+ hours of content with your friends and making your own fun in a beautifully crafted world with your chosen build?
sand egret
different strokes for different folks
warm plinth
Those are different styles of play though
sand egret
at the end of the day
exotic spoke
The game starts at 60 imo
warm plinth
Some might do one, some might do another
outer dew
Yes. I'm rushing to the end
exotic spoke
Fuck the leveling. I’ve never enjoyed it. It’s always been a ducking grind
outer dew
I'm trying to cuck my other friend
warm plinth
There are people who get to 120 in WoW and do nothing but farm transmog and mounts
chilly brook
@warm plinth the point is if you’re doing the first you’re missing a lot of the design philosophy behind the game and ignoring a huge part of it
outer dew
Fuck him
exotic spoke
Overall - bad comparison imo
warm plinth
Yeah but if you're doing what you enjoy, then you're having fun at the game. Giving people options lets you choose what's fun for you and that isn't the same for everyone
strong forum
D:OS2 was amazing
warm plinth
Never played that game though tbh
strong forum
It's insanely good
chilly brook
It’s not though, vanilla was very much about being an rpg that you played with your friends
warm plinth
I'm just saying that not everyone has fun the same way
outer dew
With multiplayer
strong forum
Especially in coop
chilly brook
Not an instance simulator
outer dew
Nah
warm plinth
I've had fun leveling with friends in BfA
warm plinth
And I enjoyed dungeons more than anything else in vanilla
exotic spoke
Vanilla wasn’t imo.
The game started at 60. Everything before that was just a grind to get to 60
strong forum
If It hadn't had coop I'd have dropped it after 10 minutes
chilly brook
The leveling experience was a huge part of vanilla
outer dew
A fight I could do in 15/20 ends up taking an hour
strong forum
Im not an immersion player
warm plinth
Frankly I thought the leveling experience was great, until about 40-45 and then I was just like fuck is it over yet
exotic spoke
The leveling experience of vanilla was ducking garbage
chilly brook
🦆
warm plinth
I was definitely greatly relieved when they started nerfing the leveling grind in BC
strong forum
Every fight was only 15/20 min cuz I carried hard, the only fight that was 1.5hrs was the fucking guy on the oil platform getting hang
exotic spoke
Fuck grinding mobs because of a lack of quests.
Fuck not having enough money to buy a mount when you need it and running everywhere.
sand egret
I liked it for a few reasons tbh
warm plinth
And I'm more excited about the prospect of a level squish that makes every level have rewards
So I hope that happens
sand egret
eventually they'll just roll out free boosts for everyone as an option if you've already leveled a character so you can just make alts at max level
as that is the direction we're going in
chilly brook
I mean
warm plinth
The two things I want in WoW, level squish and the faction barrier eliminated
chilly brook
WoW is so much less about anything before endgame it’s unreal rn
It’s literally instance simulator
sand egret
yeah, it's where you can put in the most hooks
chilly brook
Idk why they even have an open world anymore
chilly brook
Inb4 blizzcon next xpac announcement “no level cap increase” “no leveling zones” “instant end game”
exotic spoke
IMO it’s been like that since vanilla for the most part.
sand egret
it hasnt
exotic spoke
I disagree
chilly brook
Except in vanilla you had to travel places?
sand egret
not since prob MoP/WoD
chilly brook
And the whole thing was like going on an adventure?
exotic spoke
Get to max level, run dungeons, instanced pvp, or farm pointless reps / or farm mats
I do the same shit now
chilly brook
Instanced pvp in vanilla
exotic spoke
And yeah you flew to places - so what. That doesn’t mean it’s open world
chilly brook
Omegalul
outer dew
Y'all also overlooking the fact that game culture had also changed
sand egret
we're not, people are just ignoring this fact so we've moved on
hence why I said 2019 in games
exotic spoke
Cause TM / SS was fun on potatoes.... not really
I played vanilla. It always boiled down to instance pvp for the honor grind, dungeons for farming certain things, raids, or rarely farming outdoor shit
chilly brook
Expect like, those instances, are basically an extension of the world. And that instanced pvp? Didn’t exist for a significant portion of vanilla
warm plinth
Yeah the only real difference I feel from then and now is that as a few people said, there was really no hurry for anything in vanilla.
sand egret
vanilla had 2 games: pre-60 and 60. Current WoW has one game and a very, very long tutorial.
warm plinth
There's more pressure to get to max level and get gear now because a lot of the content is gated behind gear, either by actual requirements or community-driven requirements
chilly brook
Since you kinda have to go through and interact with the world to get to the instances
warm plinth
You have to go through and interact with the world to get to dungeons now
sand egret
that warlock value
chilly brook
Interact with the world is a very subjective word for current WoW
exotic spoke
Bull shit regarding instances as an extension of the world. An instance is an instance
Instance pvp was around for 2/3s or so
warm plinth
I mean, it's literally the exact same way to get to a dungeon now as it was then, except you move a little faster
chilly brook
Since you know you can fly to it and not interact with it at all
warm plinth
So I should be inconvenienced to get to a dungeon by running on the ground...for what though?
chilly brook
Or just wait in a city and interact with a menu and let other people do the leg work
sand egret
waits for group to find the chain to get into UBRS
still can't get the route to Dire Maul right
chilly brook
I’d say the difference between modern WoW running to the dungeon and vanilla is the fact that modern WoW is an awkward mix of convenience and attempts to make the world feel like a world
exotic spoke
Was vanilla great back then? Absolutely. I loved it.
I have zero interest in ever getting over level 10 when I go on and bullshit with friends.
I put forth that vanilla was so fondly remembered because it created a sense of community on the servers that is severely lacking now. If I could change one thing and one thing only it would be this
warm plinth
I just don't really know what I'm supposed to get out of running to the dungeon
And in fairness, Blizz was already trying to do LFG back in vanilla, though I guess you did still have to run to the dungeon.
exotic spoke
Waste time imo is all it is. I loved having to go to ashenvale for WSG queues.... oh not really
chilly brook
In that moment, nothing. But once you take it away, I honestly do believe it starts to eat at the overall experience
exotic spoke
Because what the fuck do I do with the 20 minutes I’m in queue for from Ashenvale
warm plinth
And then they had the battlemasters (still do actually), and you could queue from Orgrimmar
Think that was BC though
exotic spoke
Nah late vanilla I think
chilly brook
I mean I didn’t play vanilla, but I’m hooked on what I played of classic because of the social interactions and the actual gameplay design and philosophy
I miss the more rpg aspects of the game
warm plinth
When did you start playing?
sand egret
there was a lot of soft decisions that, as you alluded to, didn't really have an explicit impact until you felt their absence
chilly brook
TBC
sand egret
the issue is that the pace didn't keep up with gamer standards
exotic spoke
Like I said - social interaction / community was great. Otherwise no thank you
warm plinth
So I mean, you already had meeting stones (in their current form) at that point, so you already had people doing all the leg work for you so they could summon you.
Well, almost their current form. With the level restrictions
weary thorn
man I remember having to queue from the meeting stones outside of the dungeon. Some of the dungeons you'd have almost an hour wait time to find more folks
sand egret
one thing that is also overlooked that has basically gone from wow is the concept of Elites.
warm plinth
A lot of it is that it's just harder to keep people entertained without constant new shit these days. It's not even just games. Like if I only have one monitor, I am bored to death unless I'm in a dungeon
warm plinth
We're just used to being stimulated more
sand egret
why text when you can facetime
exotic spoke
I see a patch for battle masters with a note in 1.7
weary thorn
I hate facetime. I've got a face built for radio, not TV
warm plinth
lul
sand egret
lol
red wedge
WoW today is just Classic WoW minus all the shit that the playerbase complained about over the past 15 years.
warm plinth
I'm with Riki though; if I could bring back one thing, it'd be the community aspect
sand egret
for sure, but part of that community was built on the impact of being able to directly and indirectly interact with said community
exotic spoke
Everything else would stay there
I don’t need subpar difficulty fights where “dispelling” was considered a mechanic
red wedge
I agree with @exotic spoke and @warm plinth on that. Everything else about classic wow.. meh
exotic spoke
I had something like 200+ days played in vanilla by the time it ended
A large portion was pvp grinding
sand egret
part of the reason why the small server/community thing was felt, was because you could see the same asshat ganking in BRM every week and it became a thing (for example)
exotic spoke
Vael was soooo buggy with debuff slots lol
sand egret
vael was fun as fuck
weary thorn
working as intended
red wedge
I mean.. did you like those fights.. or did you enjoy doing those fights with your friends that also played?
sand egret
as a rogue
exotic spoke
“Ok - all priests mind vision the tank to clear the debuff” or use disgusting oozling
sand egret
that fight wast eh titts
weary thorn
no, I liked them
red wedge
Yea. That's good, then.
exotic spoke
Vael was fun because it was different.
weary thorn
molten core was slow enough that I could main tank it on a satellite connection. I had a constant 1.5k ms ping
red wedge
Unfortunately for me, the main fun was playing with people I knew... The bonus was that we all enjoyed the game at that time.
weary thorn
and I could still tank it for server 1st down
red wedge
I dont think I will feel the same way going back in now.
sand egret
community (in-game or out of game) was a huge driver for sure
exotic spoke
Yup
warm plinth
If you removed LFD/LFR, CRZ and sharding, you would have the community aspect again, at least as much as you could bring it back. Which is all classic is going to accomplish too. You can't change the general attitude of players just by giving them an old server. The toxicity, elitism, and general asshattery that is fairly commonplace these days is still going to be there. That's my opinion.
exotic spoke
Please don’t remove cross realms / sharding unless you merge servers
Please God don’t do that. I would be in a fucking ghost town
sand egret
but at least certain parts of it are going to be fun to go back to 10 years ago I still play Chrono Trigger every few years and that's old as shit
red wedge
I thought they already said Cross Realm wasn't going to be a thing.. and Server Shards were only for the first month or so until populations evened out...
weary thorn
I remember that feeling. Walking through the barrens and never seeing a single player for 40 levels
exotic spoke
Racial - I mean in retail.
red wedge
ohhh
warm plinth
I was just explaining that they could do that to BfA and it would have the same result
red wedge
Yea. lol
sand egret
but @weary thorn when ya DID find a player.....(esp in a PvP server) it was a war!
sand egret
i totally remember being like OH SHIT it's a hordie!
warm plinth
The reason you never saw a single player for 40 levels is because there was a 60 raid-geared rogue ganking everyone before you saw them 😂
sand egret
I had this one fucking orc warrior who was in ungoro leveling when I was
saw him on and off for a week straight
warm plinth
It was always so jarring getting ganked in vanilla too because it was just la la la la questyquestyquesty dies
sand egret
my fuckign nemesis
exotic spoke
I remember showing up to raid an hour early after being in the pvp group all day.
Going to BWL, and instead of going right to the instance I’d go left to the big rock you pass by and see as you head up the chain
/pvp /afk /sit
And wait and see who takes the bait
weary thorn
I made a guild named Stranglethorn Liberation Front, and all we did was hunt Horde in Stranglethorn Vale, because they were ganking ally toons so hard
exotic spoke
They come up, attack, and fucking die like a bitch thinking they could try and kill an afk Riki
weary thorn
STV was WoW's 'Nam
sand egret
I spent way too much time after my epic mount just escorting/bodyguarding lowbies
warm plinth
😂
weary thorn
hunting each other in the jungle
sand egret
log on, make my way to STV, read defense chat
make some moves
I legit miss that feelin ngl
sand egret
when the green dragons came out
exotic spoke
Bringing pvp aids to the raid....
Priest Accidentally zoning out in AQ and gets destroyed
“Well; everyone flag. On 10 we go out and crush them”
40 man raid zoning out to murder horde and save the priest
sand egret
my guild literally became mercs to protect other guild's kills
literally a 40 man mercenary company defending a raid fight
weary thorn
Onyxia had the same thing happen
sand egret
shit was a fucking bloodbath
weary thorn
wars out front of her cave
sand egret
oh but Green Dragons fought out of an instance
weary thorn
yea, I remember
those were gnarly fights
2-3 guilds per side sometimes on Dark Iron
exotic spoke
Pvp problems have pvp solutions
sand egret
that's why I became an expert in priest killing
i had a my stealth squad just target priests
we were a fuckin crew
loved that shit
exotic spoke
I mean I was too
Charge -> MS —> auto swing -> sword spec proc and they dead in a global 😃
Especially if MS crit
weary thorn
all bout that hammer stun proc fam
exotic spoke
I felt bad for this one priest in AB. Three times I did that - except all three abilities crit
Ducking Rip that dude
weary thorn
Y'all remember that dumb fucking ax that would make you randomly bladestorm for like 8 seconds or some shit?
exotic spoke
Whirlwind axe?
weary thorn
and you couldnt get out of it
yea probably that
like you'd just spin for 8 seconds
it felt like ages
warm plinth
Oh I do believe you're talking about the amazing 
warm plinth
exotic spoke
Oh fair enough
vernal stirrup
sand egret
oh my god that axe
what if our current Ravager talent just made us randomly Bladestorm
lololol
sand egret
is that what that does?
warm plinth
Yeah
sand egret
that's amazing
and totally explains why these warriors keep killing themselves on my kitty
empty spire
legit they should just make bladestorm a toggle ability imo
sand egret
Pro-tip: DONT Bladestorm when Thorns is up
empty spire
like in diablo
warm plinth
lolol
warm plinth
That's brutal
empty spire
my sources tell me you can spell reflect thorns
sand egret
LOL
that's even better
yeah, I melted a few warriors before I realized what was going on. Now I just bait the BStorm and smile
warm plinth
That's how I felt when I mained WW in Legion
Wait for burst, pop Karma, watch them die
exotic spoke
@hasty nova hey man, do you have a link to your ashvane logs from last week
toxic gyro
Even better when warrior plays reflect and pops it during your thorns
chilly brook
@red wedge I wouldn’t say wow today is classic wow minus the annoying things
It’s very much a completely different game
And it’s one of those things, you start chipping away at some things, it all starts to fall away eventually. I used to think the no changes crowd was huffing some special smoke but the argument is pretty solid after I actually had it laid out in front of me.
red wedge
What's in wow classic that's not in retail wow?
warm plinth
Wasted time 😏
red wedge
And I didnt say annoying things, I said things that the playerbase complained about. :P
i think? i dont know. my brain is already fried from work ;p
Yea. I said the playerbase thing.. There are a lot of things that I preferred how they handled it in classic wow compared to now..
But those changes were made because the playerbase wanted them, and blizzard was consolidating their game based on the whims of the average player
I very well see the reasons why some people may enjoy Classic WoW. Personally, though, I just dont think classic wow provides anything that retail currently doesnt.
weary thorn
I just wont* be spending extra money to play something I've already been through on every class
limpid pawn
added difficulty doing things
and more reliance on your own server/guild
that is exactly what degraded modern wow
chilly brook
Retail is really not an rpg at all in terms of how you build your character
limpid pawn
every single thing you queue up for is like a one night stand
you queue up for world quests, never to see the people again
same thing for LFG and most things
warm plinth
Classic wasn't difficult. It was grindy.
exotic spoke
Modern wow os harder than vanilla ever was
limpid pawn
and hell, even the way people join guilds
weary thorn
Everything I queued up for in vanilla that wasn't a raid was a one night stand
warm plinth
Every single spec/class is harder to play now than it was then.
limpid pawn
they just join for AOTC then bam, they leave for the new mythic guild that is like 1 or 2/8
then they leave those guilds for further progressed guilds
exotic spoke
That happened in vanilla too
limpid pawn
people are treating this game and everything in it like tinder
exotic spoke
Poaching players
limpid pawn
but it was HEAVILY punished in vanilla
weary thorn
Brollikk, that ain't new
exotic spoke
No it wasn’t lol
limpid pawn
right now, you can easily just LFG most of the medium difficulty content
which is what the majority of people do
like heroic content
so there is very little incentive to be "nice" to each other
weary thorn
There wasn't heroic content in vanilla
exotic spoke
You had, for the most part, lfg level content in vanilla
weary thorn
Yea, so that's not a comparison
red wedge
So far, none of the things mentioned since my paragraph of text are different when comparing classic to now. It's just how you view them differently.
limpid pawn
there were no cross realm things
red wedge
You still have RPG stuff if you level up in retail wow
limpid pawn
you were reliant on your own server for "lfg"
so your reputation on that server actually mattered somewhat
warm plinth
Cross realm is the only thing I agree with so far. Everything else is not true.
limpid pawn
if you were notorious for being toxic on your server
red wedge
Yea. And Cross realm just made it so people had more peopel to play with. It didnt really affect how you play the actual game.
limpid pawn
that actually had SOME consequence
exotic spoke
Then they need to merge more realms.
warm plinth
Frankly I don't ever recall grouping with the same person other than friends more than once
warm plinth
The only people I knew of outside of my friends/guild in vanilla were the people who were giant douchebags in trade regularly.
chilly brook
What is really rpg about retail in the leveling experience?
sand egret
oh we're back here again/
exotic spoke
It’s better cause it doesn’t take an average of like 20-30 days played to hit max level
weary thorn
What is rpg about beating chickens to death in goldshire for 30 minutes?
exotic spoke
Because that was the fuckingnaverage for most players
limpid pawn
what i mean is giving players "too many option" especially in terms of things like LFG/cross-realm
leads to the tinder-like environment you see today
warm plinth
People complain about lack of content WITH those things
limpid pawn
1 loss in arena = rage quit
1 wipe in mythic plus = rage quit
because - "hey, it's so easy to just lfg again"
red wedge
I mean, yea.
limpid pawn
that happened LESS in vanilla
because you had LESS options
(not that it didn't happen AT ALL)
exotic spoke
Again, that’s a community issue
red wedge
That still doesn't change my statement.
warm plinth
Where's the evidence there? I had people leave groups all the time after a wipe. It was a lot easier for them to find a group than for me to find a replacement for them
weary thorn
Rage quitting isn't new with retail either
limpid pawn
this game - has and always been about players/people
weary thorn
This seems like a heavy nostalgia defence
limpid pawn
it existed, but the problem is much worse now
that is my point
try seriously queieing up for arena and climbing rating as an arms war now
weary thorn
Had people rage quit in pvp or dungeons on the regular in vanilla
exotic spoke
Not worth playing classic justnfor that when there have been a ton of improvements to the game since then
chilly brook
To be fair it’s a community issue that’s exasperated by the way the game is now designed
exotic spoke
And it was better for that
weary thorn
Old school battlegrounds were fun af
exotic spoke
BC - Cata was amazing pvp (other than first season in wotlk)
weary thorn
4 day long AVs
warm plinth
Yeah..."fun"
limpid pawn
no. 4 day long AV's were not good
exotic spoke
Not for pvp grind
limpid pawn
that's a design flaw
exotic spoke
Terrible for tat
chilly brook
I miss arena teams
limpid pawn
arena teams though, were very good
weary thorn
I didn't give a shit about the grind. The rest of the game was a fucking grind
limpid pawn
forcing guild play - that is good
chilly brook
Arena team names 😍
limpid pawn
cross-realm raiding - NOT good
weary thorn
Vanilla was boring as fuck
exotic spoke
The game was a bigger grind than anything since then imo
limpid pawn
cross-realm is one of the worst things to ever happen to the game
also CRZ and sharding
exotic spoke
I loved waiting 20-30 minutes for a Bg that was over in 6-8 minutes
Lots of fun
chilly brook
The point is the more convenient it is for people to get groups the less social the game is tbh
weary thorn
All these streamers are going to sucker people into into watching them grind for a month
exotic spoke
So, make a consistent push group in m+
limpid pawn
make some things harder - to encourage more guild play
exotic spoke
Or raids
limpid pawn
and arena team play
chilly brook
What’s new? Now you wait 10 minutes for a bg that’s over in 6
weary thorn
All of this no community complaint can be solved by making your own damn group
exotic spoke
I mean that’s 1/2 to 1/3 the time
Also, you couldn’t do anything else while you where queued cause you where in the middle of no where
limpid pawn
people regularly make their own group
weary thorn
Then you don't worry about rage quitting babies
chilly brook
That’s not really the point I was making Major
weary thorn
Are you arguing for other people or yourself though?
limpid pawn
who rage quit because of how easy it is to re queue
no the system can be improved
right now it isn't good
weary thorn
By making the player pools smaller?
limpid pawn
ironically yes
weary thorn
Pass
chilly brook
The fact of the matter is the more convenient and accessible the game has been made the worse off the community has become
exotic spoke
Honestly have zero issues with the community
weary thorn
Most every game community is tits up, and it's not a game fault. It's a society fault, and a larger issue than can be covered in discord chat
exotic spoke
But I don’t pug most of the time and make groups with friends
warm plinth
Have you considered the fact that the people playing have changed, and thus the game had to change with it?
chilly brook
People have changed
No doubt about it
But that doesn’t mean that the argument behind the convenience having a negative impact doesn’t hold weight
limpid pawn
i am the gm of my own guild
so i understand and try my best to rely on the guild
but I also pug ALOT and try to do it in arena too
i pvp'ed a ton, arena master title in BC
warm plinth
Do you add friends? Do you talk to the people you play with in PUGs?
limpid pawn
pugging right now is just terrible in both pvp and pve, but ESPECIALLY in pvp
yes i do bro. but i still don't always group up with people i friended 100% of the time
chilly brook
I’ve been looking and haven’t had much luck tbh
limpid pawn
but arena, the situation right now is dire
warm plinth
Okay but you didn't in vanilla either right? Always play with friends I mean
limpid pawn
there is a HUGE shortage of healers queueing up, and most just rage quit after 1 or 2 games
weary thorn
I'll take the bad with the good on retail vs vanilla. I'd rather be able to run something when I have time, than to wait around for an hour to get a group in vanilla
limpid pawn
in vanilla people were much much much more liekly to stay till the end
weary thorn
^ I call rose colored bs on that
limpid pawn
uh... the system was designed for that in vanilla
warm plinth
I pugged all through Legion and through the first season and a half of BfA and I very rarely had a person leave a group, even if it wasn't going well. In either of our cases, it's just anecdotal
limpid pawn
harder to find group = you value the group more
weary thorn
People were still shit heels in vanilla
limpid pawn
its basic economics
weary thorn
And on large severs it didn't matter
limpid pawn
i play on tich. a large server is still a smaller pool than cross realm
weary thorn
Sure but still large enough that I only ever remembered a few names on my way to rank 14
chilly brook
Honestly for such a large server tich feels dead af
warm plinth
Idk, my paladin is on Tich. My DH is on Aerie Peak. Tich is definitely far busier lol.
limpid pawn
it's not super easy to rage quit and find a new group if you are limited to your own server
chilly brook
It’s busy obv but every guild I’ve been in seems fairly dead
weary thorn
These classic servers are going to be max pop. You will still have toxicity and rage quitting. That will not change
warm plinth
And they aren't going to be as small as they used to be either.
Blizz already said a "full" server on classic is far bigger than a highly populated vanilla server
exotic spoke
My guild frequently has 3-5 players (at a minimum on off hours) on at a time and on the weekends / evenings there’s almost always 10+. Usually 15+
limpid pawn
right now, the only way to survive as a guild is to over-recruit
weary thorn
Raid night we have upwards of 35-40 on
limpid pawn
especially if you don't have 20 people super dedicated
exotic spoke
Ditto major
limpid pawn
there is just so much BS
exotic spoke
Brollikk it’s been that way for a while
limpid pawn
"WE WIPED ONCE ON H AZSHARA - TIME TO FIND A NEW 4/8 MYTHIC GUILD"
exotic spoke
You recruit to replace burn out / real life things
weary thorn
@chilly brook a lot of those folks chill in our discord, so we don't have that issue. Lucky I guess
exotic spoke
That has never not been the issue.
You’re also extremely exaggerating
limpid pawn
"CLASSIC WOW IS STARTING, IM QUITTING RETAIL EVEN THOUGH IM YOUR ONLY OTHER TANK"
chilly brook
Very lucky imo
exotic spoke
Our discord always has people in it
chilly brook
I’ve been looking for an active guild
exotic spoke
Brollikk sucks to be you then cause that’s not happening for my guild
weary thorn
On our m+ nights we have a channel for 15 slots that routinely has 3 groups going at once all talking shit to each other
Then other 5 slot channels for higher pushes
You gotta find the community you want instead of lamenting the shit one you might be stuck in
exotic spoke
It’s like dating
You need to find the right fit for both parties
limpid pawn
i understand you guys are probably mostly in good mythic guilds
but also understand that is not true for the majority of wow players
for me - who started a guild relatively recently
chilly brook
Dawg I’ve been looking on my server for the last 3 months
limpid pawn
the experience is vastly differnt
chilly brook
That community is a unicorn
weary thorn
Good might be an overstatement. I'm in a mythic guild I like
limpid pawn
also dating in the modern age with tinder and whatnot absolutely sucks for guys especially
and I already have a girlfriend of 4 years now, but I still stand by that
the tinder experience is very similar to the guild experience
weary thorn
Naw, dating isnt hard these days. Only hard if you have thin skin
exotic spoke
Agree major
limpid pawn
it's not "hard" dude, just a much worse experience for guys
weary thorn
If you let it slide off you when it doesn't work out then it's no big deal
exotic spoke
About guild and tinder / dating lol
If you can’t change it you don’t worry about it.
Can’t change the past so why worry
weary thorn
It sucks for everybody brollikk, saying it's worse for guys sounds like we are about to stray into nice guy territory
And I'm all out of fedoras
limpid pawn
major...
i am not saying anything like that
look up the studies on this. guys get 1 match per 100 swipes
weary thorn
Did I read "its worse for guys" incorrectly
limpid pawn
girls have nearly a 100% match rate
this is simply based on the strategy both genders take on tinder
warm plinth
How did we get from classic vs bfa to incels
weary thorn
I'm not getting into this, @warm plinth is right.
chilly brook
Women are very selective in general, things like tinder do make it worse. It’s an actual fact
limpid pawn
yes - this is exactly what i'm saying
read the parental investment theory
that is why
chilly brook
Not really trying to complain or anything
limpid pawn
again i'm not trying to sound like a "nice guy" or fedora dude from 4chan but this is just facts
and again - i have been dating someone for 4 years - but this is for sure facts
hasty nova
LOL
limpid pawn
just because you are in an elite mythic guild and didn't experience the hardships of modern wow, does not mean that is the same for the majority of players
that is my point
chilly brook
I’m a single prot warrior tank and ready to mingle with a group if you catch my drift 😉
limpid pawn
lol
weary thorn
I got into myythic guild by pug healing in m+ in bod
warm plinth
I'll invite you to my dungeon, if you know what I mean
oblique garnet
🤔
chilly brook
Ayyyy
weary thorn
Now I'm the main tank, slow down your assumptions
willow scarab
The only reason you're not in an elite mythic guild is because you're bad
limpid pawn
being a prot war right now for pug mythic + is probably one of the best positions to be in for pugging
willow scarab
@ everyone who palys this game
limpid pawn
right, let me pull myself up by the bootstraps
oblique garnet
Fuck azhara
chilly brook
I’ve actually not even been playing prot
warm plinth
Are you monking it up Late?
exotic spoke
Hi @hasty nova also I found your logs cause I’m a creeped
chilly brook
I’ve been playing Vengeance cuz it’s fun
warm plinth
It looks like it
oblique garnet
I no longer like it
hasty nova
@limpid pawn as a counter point to you, just because you experienced hardships and found those who agree with you. That does not equal that the majortiy of players are having the same hardship
warm plinth
😦
willow scarab
I'm keen to just get to it and finish the content
raid boring time to finish pls
zaqul at sub 10 and our week is done
exotic spoke
@willow scarab nuh uh! Its cause they are all dicks and don’t like people who are nice like me
chilly brook
I’m more inclined to say that most people have a hard time finding a good group @hasty nova
willow scarab
damn that's very true
chilly brook
Just mainly from the content creators I watch
willow scarab
I started playing again in december with no connections and now i'm top 100 US
warm plinth
Yeah nice people should automatically get invited to mythic raid guilds
exotic spoke
I could do it if I wanted but they won’t let me!
willow scarab
If you're good you'll find a mythic raid spot
warm plinth
If you actually care to find one*
willow scarab
True
weary thorn
It takes work
willow scarab
Also went from not knowing what a keystone was to 2800 last season
weary thorn
I didn't have a full time slot for months
warm plinth
People think they are just gonna luck into it without even trying
hasty nova
@chilly brook i would counter that most people have an easy time finding a group of their skill level. I think the misconception here is that, "no body knows what they are doing," says the guy who does not know what he is doing
willow scarab
If you're good and interested in a raid spot / pushing io / whatever, you'll find a way
chilly brook
Being good=/=automatically being able to find a Mythic raid spot
willow scarab
nothing to do with the state of the game or player attitude
warm plinth
No one said anything about automatically finding one.
exotic spoke
No but seriously, skill will rise to the top and be absorbed into a raid team
If you feel like you’re carrying the raid team you’ll find a new guild until it’s an even fit.
Joking aside Fume - I agree with you
warm plinth
You have to try
hasty nova
I agree with riki
chilly brook
Unless you’re willing to compromise and go with something that won’t accomplish what you’re after
For example my guild dissolved mid Uldir
No one was taking tanks
willow scarab
I think with the exception of tanks you can apply to any guild and get a spot if you're a good player
chilly brook
And there it is
willow scarab
tanks need to play a little bit of a waiting game because there are only 2 tanks in a guild
hasty nova
well that is the trouble with finding friends, girlfriends, guilds all things in life that deal with ppl interactions. You have to find people with a common goal and interest, that are also common to your own present self.
willow scarab
But it's not like tank spots are nowhere
exotic spoke
That said, I’m happy where I am. Could I find a better guild - yeah possibly. Do I want to? Nope. Cause I’ve know some of these people for 15 years
weary thorn
fum - took me a raid tier of fury warrior and tank filling to get my full time tank slot lol
sucked, but was worth the investment
exotic spoke
So I don’t try and I’m not bothered by it.
I’ll kill shit with my friends or I won’t kill it
willow scarab
I think the best way to find a guild is to have 99s on every fight + high io + good logs to show defensive / progression play
hasty nova
like you can't get into a 7/8M guild right now with a 380 ilvl. YOU CAN, but it's like 1%/100%.
You can't get a 9/10 smoking hot girlfriend if you have no money and are a 4/10 looking dude. THERE ARE EXCEPTIONS, but it's like 1%/100% chance.
willow scarab
you cover every base an smash it
exotic spoke
(And usually she’s batshit crazy if it does happen @hasty nova )
willow scarab
I don't know what that example is for
why should a 380ilvl get into a 7/8M giuld
Why would I hire an electrician to fix my pipes?
You have to be the person for the job
the 9/10 smoking hot girl is with a 9/10 smoking hot guy for a reason, if you want the 9/10 you have to make yourself a 9/10
??????
exotic spoke
Profit?
hasty nova
I was saying that to find ppl to play with you need to find someone with a common goal (raiding.pvp) and common current state (i'm 440ilvl have CE xp, i'm 395ilvl have AoTc xp)
get in where you fit in and if you want to fit in with ppl doing "better" strive and work hard to get better
weary thorn
fair point
willow scarab
That I agree with
limpid pawn
there is not a linear reward system for the amount of work you put in right now
hasty nova
yes there is
limpid pawn
there are plenty of people who barely make the cut for mythic raiding guilds NOT in mythic raiding guilds
hasty nova
i would totally disagree with that
willow scarab
I find that players gravitate into circles of players with similar goals but more commonly into simialr skill groups
limpid pawn
i am not talking about gear. i am talking about guilds here
willow scarab
idk man
hasty nova
me too
limpid pawn
and having players to play with
exotic spoke
A good group in m+ / raid team has:
Common goals
Common skill level
Common commitment
Common availability
chilly brook
¯_(ツ)_/¯
limpid pawn
it is entirely possible to be stuck in player hell
limpid pawn
as a mediocre/upper mediocre player
willow scarab
How do you get stuck
weary thorn
by not improving
limpid pawn
i am not saying I am stuck myself
exotic spoke
If you don’t share those features your group / guild / raid will not succeed long term
limpid pawn
but i have seen this plenty of times
hasty nova
well if your goal is to get into a better guild, your REAL goal, should be to make yourself a better player
then once you accomplish that
you will realize
willow scarab
If you can show through logs / io that you're an asset to a guild above you then you're never stuck
willow scarab
If a player is stuck it's because they think they're better than they are
And only the better players can see that
chilly brook
It’s pretty possible to be stuck
exotic spoke
You can get better. WoW is not a hard game - never has been
exotic spoke
Disagree. hard disagree
willow scarab
Guilds can go from a 24 to a 28 person roster without breaking a sweat
limpid pawn
you think there are enough good guilds to accomodate everyone who applies?
that is just stupid
willow scarab
4 extra raid slots exist for free
chilly brook
You can be stuck in 2/8m guild and have a lot of trouble even getting into something that’s 3/8
exotic spoke
Then make your own group of like minded / like skilled / same vision people
willow scarab
You just have to prove that you're good
That's the whole thing
You are where you deserve to be
exotic spoke
Then you need to get better and make yourself more appealing
warm plinth
I think people think they're better than they are most of the time
willow scarab
If you think you deserve better then you apply with a strong application and move upwards
weary thorn
What, nobody said everybody who applies needs be accepted
chilly brook
How do you prove it when you don’t get the chance 🤔
limpid pawn
and you think there are enough good players where everyone who decides to make their own guilds will actually have enough attendance?
willow scarab
I can still get 99s in a pug normal/heroic with bad kill times
hasty nova
Brolliskk that is exsactly the point we are making. Good guilds have ppl who quit, have real life issues come up, have a need for better tanks, have tanks that switch to dps or healer. GOOD GUILDS ARE ALWAYS RECRUITING
exotic spoke
You have the chance in your logs and in your IO
warm plinth
Get good logs, good .io, whatever.
willow scarab
You don't need to be boosted to get good logs and io
exotic spoke
I have people remove other tanks for me when I apply
warm plinth
And then apply with that to a new guild
willow scarab
also
chilly brook
Logs don’t automatically mean you’re getting into a better guild
exotic spoke
Because I pushed and farmed solo to get into good groups and get better
limpid pawn
fum, your points are dumb
willow scarab
PRIME time to find a new guild
warm plinth
No one said automatically
willow scarab
people are quitting to play classic
limpid pawn
fum is basically a player who represents the top 1%
exotic spoke
They are factual and honest.
limpid pawn
plays a ton, and plays well
hasty nova
no not that bro. creating ur own guild is way different then finding a good guild
limpid pawn
and says that other people should be exaclty like him
chilly brook
I had oranges and had a helluva time finding another guild
weary thorn
lol
willow scarab
No
limpid pawn
because he had outlier results
willow scarab
The point i'm making
weary thorn
jesus, I saw this coming
willow scarab
is I came back to the game 9 months ago
exotic spoke
You don’t put the effort in and you won’t get results
Jesus ducking Christ
willow scarab
And I had to step my way up to the guild i'm in
limpid pawn
but look at your parses. look at how much AP you farm per week
you really think you are an average joe?
and average joes should have your results?
that is just stupid
willow scarab
Average joe doesn't deserve 6/8M guild
exotic spoke
He made himself more appealing: you don’t and then complain about it?
weary thorn
Average joes are mythic
willow scarab
that's the point
limpid pawn
im not trying to nut ride you here
weary thorn
lmao
limpid pawn
but this is the truth
willow scarab
I got those logs to help me find guilds
limpid pawn
average joe's are NOT mythic
chilly brook
There are a lot of average players in Mythic lmao
willow scarab
I got 2800io last season purely to find guilds
exotic spoke
Then fucking be the change you want to see.
Invest the time and see the results
limpid pawn
99 parse means you parsed better than 99% of the population
everyone can't 99 parse
that is the definition of 99 prse
exotic spoke
If you don’t invest the time then don’t ducking bitch when you get overlooked
hasty nova
@limpid pawn you are making the point for us man.
You don't farm AP a lot,
you don't have good parses,
you don't put a lot of effort in,
there for the people who come to your guild or you play with should and will be the same as you
chilly brook
Like tbh there are a lot of people in Mythic that don’t belong
willow scarab
But my point is that you get the guild you deserve
willow scarab
I parse 99s so i'm in a guild that has other players who parse 99s
exotic spoke
If you put in the work you’ll get the results
limpid pawn
gus i am saying that the system shouldn't be imbalanced where the rich get richer and poor get poorer
warm plinth
You don't really need 99% parses to get guild invites though. There are a lot of guilds out there with people parsing gray and green
willow scarab
if you parse 50-60s you'll be in a guild that parses 50-60
limpid pawn
the middle folk should also get a chance
willow scarab
why would a 99 parse guild invite a 50 parse?
limpid pawn
right - middle parsrs should get middle parse guilds
weary thorn
SOCIALIST WOW IS NOW IN EFFECT
limpid pawn
but often they get grey parsed guildies and stuck with them lol
hasty nova
@limpid pawn i'm saying that the system works the way you want it to
warm plinth
But yeah you're not going to get into a guild that's 9/9 with all orange parsers if you have green ones
exotic spoke
You get a chance in better guilds by excelling in your current guilds / current content
limpid pawn
just because the system worked for YOU doesn't mean it is a good system
chilly brook
And then you have people parsing 90s in a middling guild that struggle getting into a better guild because they don’t have the kill experience
willow scarab
Work the system to your benefit
exotic spoke
Why the fuck would I take someone struggling in heroic into my mythic team - just to give them a chance
willow scarab
A lot of top guilds don't care about kill experience if you look like a solid player
limpid pawn
someone good can struggle in a heroic team
because of their guildies
and they aren't just abandoning them
weary thorn
Yea, mythic guilds are going to be discriminatory in their choices, they dont need to give subpar players a chance
willow scarab
If your logs are perfect but you're 1/8M you can be recruited into 7/8M
weary thorn
they arent raiding to help people
chilly brook
A lot of guilds on Tich certainly care about kill experience
exotic spoke
Their logs will reflect what they are showing - then that person decided the community is better than a better guild
limpid pawn
lol fum, how many people go from 1/8 to 7/8?
oblique garnet
I did
limpid pawn
one person?
lunar jackal
is the chain of suffering affected by necro too?
willow scarab
We recently recruited a 1/8M
oblique garnet
Well went from 2/9 in bod to 9/9
limpid pawn
is this something that can commonly happen?
willow scarab
now she's 6/8M
weary thorn
< I went from 0 mythic to 7/9 in one raid tier after coming back
chilly brook
I got told plenty of times even with orange parses that I didn’t have enough experience
limpid pawn
yes!
exotic spoke
We’ve recruited someone with literally zero raid experience and they are now our raid lead because they ducking kicked ass
willow scarab
From the perspective of someone inside a guild that is on the high end of prog
I can tell you it does happen a lot
limpid pawn
oh god. again with this
willow scarab
Like I'm on the inside here
limpid pawn
no fum, your experience doesn't represent the majority of wow experiences
exotic spoke
We’re giving you our fucking insight and you dismiss it
willow scarab
Okay
chilly brook
Maybe Tich is an outlier
limpid pawn
you guys recruiting a few people
willow scarab
but here me out
limpid pawn
doesn't mean most guilds do it
exotic spoke
At what point do you realize maybe we’re right?
honest frigate
I went from a guild that was completing first few bosses on mythic and that’s it to routinely getting cutting edge each tier since ghuun
chilly brook
But I’m telling you what my experience is
willow scarab
You find players with potential and boost them to bring them in for prog
weary thorn
wont happen @exotic spoke
limpid pawn
and a few people getting it means the majority of players who are 1/8 that never get that shot
honest frigate
Just gotta put the work in and dedicate yourself to improving
limpid pawn
meaning even when it does happen - it is an outlier
willow scarab
If you're 1/8 with perfect logs you'll be given a chance
1/8 with grey logs means your app is ignored
that's the thing
you end up where you're suppose to be
limpid pawn
fum, you are so out of touch with what actually happens with the majority of players
this is actually funny
oblique garnet
Majority of the players arent that good
chilly brook
Granted it was also probably not the best of times to be looking as prot wasn’t considered “top tier” and I was applying as a tank
weary thorn
you and griff seem to be the minority in this convo
limpid pawn
there are plenty of people that are exactly as qualified as you say
but not enough spots for them
warm plinth
Exactly, the majority of players aren't good enough to be a mythic raider
willow scarab
I covered that before though
limpid pawn
not enough spots
willow scarab
a guild changing from 22 to 26 roster is no big deal
exotic spoke
I’ve been in a guild that has a world top 50 kill.
I’ve done top tier pvp versus other players like reckful / sodapoppin / thegodofdmg etc
In most cases - you end up surrounding yourself with people of equal skill. If you’re not where you want to be then you have to change something
sick sentinel
This conversation is stupid
willow scarab
there are spots if the players are good enough
You make room for applications that look like assets
limpid pawn
this is actually very similar to the argument in our country regarding welfare vs meritocracy
i'm done with this
willow scarab
Why do you think every single guild on wowprog says "exceptional players encouraged to apply":
exotic spoke
You are fighting for spots - if you’re not the best for that role you won’t get it
hasty nova
@limpid pawn the system does work the way you want it too. @maiden cliff on griff's point- The hardest part of moving from a bad guild to mediocare guild is actually leaving it.
think about it, you and a bunch of people are all average you play together and one or two of you get good and start parseing better. Just because you have high parses doesn't mean you are going to jump to the top guilds. The same thing is true with raider.io. I remember when i was 1.2k trying to get into 17 keys. I thought I was better than I was, instead of jumping strait into those groups i did ten 11's. then ten 12's then ten 13's and finnaly I was doing all 17's. When i was at the 17's point i realized that I actually was terrible at 1.2k and that there was a reason i wasn't getting invites
the same is true for guilds, fumeiyo might be a special case jumping strait for zero to hero
exotic spoke
Except it’s a fucking game and I’m not carrying shit in raid. Earn your spot - don’t expect hand outs in game
hasty nova
but the permise is the same, you have to graduatlly move up in guilds
honest frigate
I dont see how this conversation is in anyway relevant to the prot warrior discord or fruitful in any way
chilly brook
@hasty nova my guild dissolved I was on the search mid tier
hasty nova
the hardest part about guilds is leaving them
chilly brook
3/8
willow scarab
75% of our conversation isn't about prot warrior gameplay
chilly brook
Other guilds said I had nice parses but they didn’t want another tank and I didn’t have enough experience
Their literal words
willow scarab
So you got burned once and that's every guild?
Keep applying? Wait till a good time for recruitment pops up like after the tier is over?
chilly brook
I didn’t say it was every guild?
limpid pawn
just 99 parse and go from 1/8 to 7/8 griff
hasty nova
@chilly brook @limpid pawn I will also say, you will never get picked for the olypaics if you don't go to an oplympic tryout. If you are not on one of the large servers and are having trouble finding a guild, that is the very first step
limpid pawn
it's ez
chilly brook
I just said it was very possible to get stuck
willow scarab
99 parse isn't hard just press your buttons
the people who are below 90 are playing defensively or straight up playing poorly
willow scarab
It's so easy to get 99s on prot warrior like it's a joke
it's not competitive at all
weary thorn
chilly brook
I had several oranges
hasty nova
getting stuck is possible and will happen.
chilly brook
I just got stuck in one tier