@wispy plume idom + anima minor for the max hp flex
#protection
verbal eagle
dreamy epoch
Well i missed a lot of argument but i didnt realise you didnt need to use SB on 3rd boss ML, that will help a lot
sacred roost
for protection trinkets, why is chain of suffering listed 4th, that trinket seems like it'd be dangerous overrall?
tawny maple
That trinket sucks
warm plinth
It doesn't suck. It's a pretty strong defensive trinket. It's pretty niche though
twilit kraken
holy shit trying to solo dps down mechagon's 3rd phase cuz my entire party died while the bomb is about to go off is intense
twilit kraken
was insane, this was after 9 wipes already and everybody on comms was counting down when it was about to blow
orchid token
@sacred roost As ghash said chain of suffering is an excellent defensive trinket as it's an on-demand massive DR. But that makes it a pretty poor general use trinket since most scenarios don't require an additional on-demand defensive cooldown
warm plinth
Oh good, no pressure or anything right? XD
orchid token
If you're in a situation where you're struggling to stay alive through a specific part of a fight then Chain is an excellent choice to give you a button to press to stay alive but it's not something you'd wear often
twilit kraken
and I entered the phase at 10% hp, desperately blowing CDs to heal myself
grand drum
use chain on somebody you dont like
orchid token
for example it's extremely good for mythic queen's court if you are tanking during the zealous eruption since the other 19 people in the raid are stacked inside of a shield where they are taking very minimal damage while you're getting hammered by magical damage
So you can throw it on your cotank for no risk
It's like a super powered blessing of sacrifice that's controlled by the tank instead of by the Paladin
sand kettle
Hey is there a spread sheet or something of all the abilities you can spell reflect?
spice ferry
sand kettle
Thank you, I knew I saw it somewhere
tawny girder
Does anyone have the cursed heart weak aura for azshara can't find it anywhere
shadow tapir
damage on Heroic Za'qul is heavy, any tips other then shield block and IP up as much as possible?
tawny maple
@shadow tapir are you the MT or OT
pallid berry
is azshara font of power good for tank?
instead of alchemist trinket and bloodthirsty urchin
also does anyone know whats up with the devestator build with the fury azerite trait?
lusty grotto
never heard of devestator, however i have heard of devAstator
verbal eagle
If my block reduces an attack by 52% baseline, and I critically block, is it a full absorb?
lusty grotto
no
lusty grotto
crit blocks cap at 85%
sorry i don't respond well to spelling mistakes but i can summon @oblique garnet, he absolutely loves RF talk 😉
undone sun
👏
lusty grotto
and with that i 💤
pallid berry
also is azshara font of power good for tanks at all?
dim blaze
feels like a stupid question, but 450 gore or pocket sized computation device (with my punch cards its 412)
undone sun
👏
warm plinth
Are you using cyclo or overclock?
dim blaze
overclock
warm plinth
Are you doing M+ mostly, or raids?
dim blaze
both
warm plinth
Well for M+ this week, idol is pretty much crap since its heal is affected by Necrotic
dim blaze
oh true
warm plinth
But even in general I'd probably use overclock over the idol. Would be nice to have some other options but you're definitely gonna want to use the gore
Like you probably won't unequip that for the rest of the tier
dim blaze
sweet
warm plinth
Grats
hasty nova
going to bed happy boi's. i got 445 chest and 445 bloodthirsty urchin
warm plinth
Nice!
hasty nova
man raid lead said, last pull of the night make it count boys
thats unreal
whew
how am i supposed to go to bed
warm plinth
Good question
hasty nova
not toooooooooooooooooo bad lol
granted we had an 8:02 kill time
annnnnd
the other ppl who have killed that boss are better than me ^_^
oblique garnet
@lusty grotto ree
Everytime people mention it smh every day its getting as bad as leech
odd crown
does everchill anchor work on tclap?
ionic fern
@odd crown Yes.
odd crown
Tyty
shadow tapir
Sorry @tawny maple, was in the middle of the raid. I'm MT on the fight.
with :neversurrender:
ionic fern
Is Never Surrender a thing again for some reason?
distant crystal
got p heated
ionic fern
Damn, now i gotta scroll up.
spice ferry
probably about... 5 hours ago
distant crystal
there was like an hour long high tyrannical motherlode NS argument
ionic fern
Hmpf.
ionic fern
Tbh, i swapped to NS on my +23 tyrannical ML 2 last bosses..but only because we had a warlock so i could get TP'ed .
spice ferry
that was basically the consensus
but it quickly devolved into "if you dont have X r.io you can't know what your talking about"
ionic fern
😂
distant crystal
there was some "only worth it if you have rogues swapping sin"
dim blaze
412computation device (overclock) or 430 vial?
distant crystal
and some "it's never worth here's two logs i found that show NS IPs aren't even that big
"
and then the super hot take of "you should just run NS for the whole dungeon tping out isn't worth"
spice ferry
to be fair i do understand that logic.
ionic fern
Of running NS for the whole dungeon?
spice ferry
the logic to the argument
if 3rd/4th is the most dangerous for you, then it does kinda make sense to go in prepped for those parts
not saying I would or wouldn't personally, because I haven't got anywhere near high enough this season to warrant it
distant crystal
if you run NS then the trash at the beginning becomes your most dangerous part :p
spice ferry
yeah but it doesn't matter how well you run the first half and 2 bosses, if you get banged and cant kill 3rd/4th
it is tricky though either way
ionic fern
Okay, multiple things:
1)If you do that high keys then usually you have a dedicated comp + voice comms going on and calling out things.
2)You know what you can handle and what not
3)Rixxa specifically can be handled with giving the DoT to different people and rotating CD's so there's actually no "need" to swap for that boss. Her regular "attacks" are far enough apart that they don't become too threatening on their own.
4)Last boss is roughly the same as Rixxa. There's a lot of downtime where he's not casting Alpha Cannon so you can keep your CD's for those phases specifically.
Overall the dungeon is still mostly physical melee damage - the 2 last bosses are just a teamplay effort and CD rotating.
undone sun
good luck
undone sun
🙄
crisp slate
How do you stop the summoners from spawning in the home stretch on Mythic Zaqul - any time we got to like 25% tonight we were getting an extra set of summoners. Is it based on a screwed up mechanic - can't figure it out from logs
inland bolt
oblique harbor
What is the best class for warrior protection? focusing on m + Ally
undone sun
race? dwarf
oblique harbor
was he thinking night elf or human, which one was better?
undone sun
he who
onyx vessel
Which one for horde tauren?
spice ferry
belf is still useful in a few spots
ionic fern
@inland bolt What?
rapid tide
How could, from a logical standpoint, Never Surrender ever be "strictly better" when it fully relies on being at low health.
For it to be "strictly better" it would have to be better in all circumstances including... well not being at low health
🤔
Unless you say "a niche talent is good when the fight magically caps you at 1% max health".
Because ye okay, I think it could potentially be decent then 😄
(and even then it wouldn't imho)
undone sun
Defending NS has always puzzeled me ¯_(ツ)_/¯
sick sentinel
People don't get that the reduced cd on last stand and the heal you get for pressing it are extremely relevant
undone sun
Exactly, it's always skipped over
crimson furnace
guys
ola
need help with 2 trinkets
anyone around that is a trinket master?
edicts of faitless 430 vs briny barnacle 440 with scoket
or rezan 435
onyx vessel
Edicts is amazing for m+
crimson furnace
ok, make sense, the fucking 440 briny is like 1.5 mill dmg over
in a dungeon
fucking joke
onyx vessel
Np
crimson furnace
best fucking class&specc community on discord
u guys rock
THUNDER CLAP 4 LIFE!!
sick sentinel
👢 🍵 👏
onyx vessel
tawny maple
I'm rerolling Feral druid just did 45k overall
willow scarab
briny secret OP with the trinket buffs from 8.2
my 440 outperformed a 445 inkpod from that guy who cam through and got rank 1 on every boss last night
brittle owl
briny is real good
crimson furnace
really??
brittle owl
yeah
crimson furnace
are u guys happy with it?
brittle owl
it's shit innthe same scenarios as inkpod is basically
on aoe if yhe mobs die while the dot is still ticking its worthless
but when adds live long enoygh
its pogu
and on ST its more than a decent trink
crimson furnace
i see
willow scarab
I feel bad using it because I hate it from last season
But it's actually really godo
and in islands it's pog
crimson furnace
im gonna try the edict in a freeholdd 16
got it last night
u guys use it as magic absorb or phis?
or depends
mint imp
for freehold i would use it as phys absorb only
but for WM i would use the magic absorb for example
strong forum
I have 430 briny but I think 445 raidance phial is stronger, especially on ashvane
And I just like phial
willow scarab
I wouldn't use an asborb trinket on ncerotic week
what % of your damage is phial? it really underperformed when i tested
willow scarab
True, in my ashvane kill my 440 barnacle only did 280k
neon sphinx
Heya guys, I started leveling a warrior.. I am just wondering, is there a Pawn string for the stat priority I can find somewhere?
neon sphinx
thats actually not true.. My main is a blood DK and there is a pawn string
but thanks for the reply
strong forum
Ye but that's wrong
neon sphinx
I am not here to debate you... you do you man
willow scarab
There isn't a pawn string for prot warrior
neon sphinx
again, not true for blood DK's
strong forum
After that you can focus more on haste
neon sphinx
ilvl is not king
strong forum
Big doubt
neon sphinx
they do have weights... but again.. not trying to debate you.. I just had a question.
willow scarab
Everyone will tell you that there is no string for prot warrior
stoic pilot
im surprised people still try to make pawn work when raidbots with top gear sim is even easier to use
anyways, stat prio is on icy-veins
if you want pure dps sim yourself
spice ferry
There is not pawn strings for dk
Anything you may have is completely wrong
You can sim yourself and make your own sure
But anything generic is wrong.
neon sphinx
well... my 80%+ parses and 65%+ Healing parses would say different.. but hey.. again you do you..
neon sphinx
ok kiddo
severe edge
flexing 80%? 😄
neon sphinx
i love you guys.. your such trash
rapid tide
I mean, the answer is simple: There is no real advantage in using Pawn Strings.
You can simply assign every stat a 1 to have a quick glimpse what item has more stats.
Maybe assign Haste a 1.01 or sth if you want to gear towards that.
🙂
neon sphinx
this may be my biggest mistake of the day coming in here and expecting intelligent people.. later kids
stoic pilot
watch out bro he's got 65% healing parses
joins discord, asks a question gets a firm answer, doesn't like it so he quits the discord lmao
i love people
spice ferry
@neon sphinx go ask the dk discord if you really won’t believe me, seeing as you value parses as proof of knowledge. And I have constant 99s in heroic and most purple orange mythic
rapid tide
I mean, it's their choice.
spice ferry
Hadn’t quit
rapid tide
If one does not want advice then you can't help it 🙂
spice ferry
I’ll fully admit my parses as warrior are average, but my dk was Solis’s
spice ferry
You do not
rapid tide
There is a difference between theoretical knowledge and execution 😄
spice ferry
Especially on something like pawn strings
rapid tide
Oh ye.
strong forum
He was wrong, got told on it, didn't wanna accept anything but a string. Left
🤷
Nothing of value was lost
rapid tide
I even offered him a String 😦
mint imp
Yeah, but calling us trash and kids... thats a bit across the line
spice ferry
I just love “I parse 80% I know what I’m talking about@
spice ferry
Gets shown 99s, basically said fuck off
strong forum
Ye his flex was fucking lamo
Even mythic that's not great
It's only above average
strong forum
Ye
I instantly assume mythic logs, cuz nobody with 2 brain cells flexes heroic logs first
rapid tide
Can I flex with my 96 Normal avg? 🤔
spice ferry
Partly why I specifically linked my heroic logs 😉
strong forum
Kek
cinder pasture
You just wait....I’ll flex my lfr logs one day
rapid tide
I remember back in Legion when I was a really big scrub I was quite proud of getting 100 ilvl parses in LFR
:))))
spice ferry
I just hate how because I started weeks behind on essence I’m fucked for parsing 😦
And didn’t actually look at what people were using to target them
rapid tide
tbf, I don't really mind parsing all too much. I can keep some random 90 average or whatever which is good enough to be considered "not trash logs" I guess.
spice ferry
I still have r2 nullification because fuck mecha
rapid tide
And anything beyond that I can just blame on me being a dumb dumb and that's fine.
stoic pilot
I get my rank 3 nullification in a few days
strong forum
I never knew about parsing until bfa prepatch, so I was really happy getting orange logs on antorus normal
Kek
spice ferry
Oh how you’ve grown
spice ferry
Eonar was retarded tonparse n
spice ferry
Some packs I literally couldn’t get to before our warlocks destroyed them
I honestly afk’d until half way through on mythic
Because i just spent my time running around to do nothing
rapid tide
I played that Tier on Feral so basically I pressed 3 BrS on each pack and went afk.
🤔
rapid tide
No.
It's a class effect that only effects a whitelist of spells that are class specific.
Trinkets are not affected.
civic holly
so as standard, trinket then avatar on pull?
spice root
@spice ferry Stirring trouble I see 😉
civic holly
im losing threat on ashvane pull
mint imp
does avatar or anything else increase dmg of cof essence?
rapid tide
Anything that buffs your Versatility, kobris.
rapid tide
Schism is really an exception to the rule of class effects not affecting non-class skills.
https://www.wowhead.com/spell=107574/avatar you can check the wowhead page to see exactly what spells are on the whitelist.
spice root
Oh cool, I didn't know that list existed
Schism is damage taken increase so it makes sense for it to work
mint imp
ok, so cof essence scales with Versatility?
spice root
It's also why Cyclo is so nuts for them
rapid tide
Yep.
mint imp
cool
so Jess Howler can be actually pretty good for ST dmg
if you line that up with few cof casts
rapid tide
Other trinkets are still probably a lot better.
😄
Also iirc correctly it was 2 minutes cd so only aligns with every other cof.
mint imp
yeah probably
wild sandal
For r3 cof, do you cast it back to back then every time it comes of CD or wait till 2 stacks again?
wild sandal
Ah okay
spice ferry
@spice root me? Never 😂
wild sandal
Was doing it wrong then
wild sandal
Yep, thanks
civic holly
is the big bubble hitting ashvane damage reflectable?
rapid tide
Albeit not knowing exactly I highly highly doubt it, it would be very much an exclusion to how Spell Reflect works.
civic holly
im being told that because null barrier reflects it that spell reflect should too
not sure how to test that or anything
undone sun
correct
rapid tide
That's something entirely different.
rapid tide
But I don't know, let someone more knowledgable chime in 😄
undone sun
reef needle
did any of you ever experience warcraftlogs not correctly counting buffs? me and our raidlead recently compared out two prot warrys of which one seemingly only uses shield block ~20 times in one entire night
he says he uses it constantly but somehow i feel like logs should be correct
so i just wanted to check if any of you ever noticed issues with wclogs
brittle owl
it depends on boss/tanking uptime. overall % is irrelevant, try comparing to when he was actually tanking the boss
you can double check by going to events and seeing if he is melee'd without block
reef needle
im looking at overall uses, not uptime
or thbis log on heroic + first boss https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/nNDbywhk6xm2W3GP#boss=-2&difficulty=0&type=auras&ability=132404
option a) is that our second tank is doing everything wrong or b) wclogs has issues
damage taken is about equal though
rapid tide
@reef needle from top to bottom: Shield Block uptime, Last Stand uptime (with Bolster == blocking), Actively tanking the boss.
You can clearly see big windows of tanking the boss without having either SB or LS up. DTPS supports that, he took almost double the melee dmg compared to your other tank.
I am quite sure Warcraftlogs is not bugged 🙂
Also why is he running Anima of Life and Death.
That's confusing me a bit.
He's running Major Anima, Minor Vision. Weird
oh
Also I was looking at the wrong tank on third column, whoops 😄
Now it's correct. Does not change much though about the conclusion.
It's really weird. Didn't use a single SB on first 2 active tanking times, even got intervened by the off tank to reduce damage taken (so props to them for realizing something went really wrong)
crimson furnace
guys, Aegis of the deep as a minor...
it feels really good
anyone else tried it? instead of lucid dreams
rapid tide
What did it do again?
Flat dmg reduction one?
Ah Vers for enemies around you.
Ye, it's really good for m+ if you can pull big.
I think basically every tank at mdi ran it.
hallow phoenix
My crucible minor feels so good this week though
crimson furnace
going from 9% vers to 14% vers at 4 stacks
crimson furnace
i think I had 2 packs
where I leaped out and asked for a ring
to reset the statcks
the whole dungeon
MOther 17
mint imp
For M+ i usually go VoP major and aegis/null minor depends which dungeon
wild sandal
Which dung would null be better than aegis?
mint imp
waycrest for sure
mint imp
there is no such list i know about what % of dung is physical or magic dmg so you have to think about it yourself
do you pull a lot and is there more phys dmg - go aegis
less amount of mobs and more magic dmg - go for null
rapid tide
#268491842637660160 has a list.
the "Blockable/Reflectable Spells Sheet"
Has rough damage profiles for all dungeons.
mint imp
oh good, didnt know about that
spice ferry
You could easily do a key of each dungeon and log then break down the % of each damage
mint imp
yeah but you have to do the same +number key for each dungeon
spice ferry
Does that really matter? Your working out what their % breakdown is
Doubt that changes per difficulty that much
If you take out affix related things, do strictly mob/boss damage
Difficulty shouldn’t really impact it
Unless you compare a 5 to a 20
mint imp
ok
spice ferry
It might change a little per pull. Like does a mob get an extra cast off, but that should average out
dreamy epoch
In the warrior guide it recommends using the Subroutine overclock mechagon trinket over say a rezans as the poroc is stronger, is this still valid for keys? surealy the massive strength loss is not worth dropping rezans?
strong forum
Overclock has very high uptime I think
But ye im not certain about losing the str over it
That being said, I run neither
dreamy epoch
Like it is listed as the 2nd best trinklet for survivability, and im trying to figure out my best defensive trinket setup for pushing high keys this week
strong forum
Urchin + edict if you really wanna push being defensive
If you don't have that rezan + diamond
rapid tide
I found that a 430 Rezans gives me more avg haste than a 418 overclock
strong forum
Idk I've never used overclock because cylco blast op
rapid tide
🤷 I use Rezans. Also frees punchcard up for cyclo
dreamy epoch
I have 430 Vial (socket), 430 Rezans (Avoidance), 435 Sporepods, 400 Diamond Barrier, 445 Briny Barnacle (socket) to choose from, unfortunately no raid trinkets as they havent dropped for me. Been runnign vial/rezans but would like more survivability this week for higher keys
rapid tide
I'd go Rezans Briny for more ST focus. Vial is quite decent too
dreamy epoch
Im worried about high tyran motherlode this week as im doing a 19 tomorrow which is pretty aids to survive without the good raid tirnkets etc
but im guessing i just play rezans/vial, the diamond barrier maybe not worth cos of low ilvl idk
dreamy epoch
I feel like it still dopes a decent amount of effective HPS but mabe not worth dropping all the stats for
yeah
strong forum
I'm using my 415 diamond in dangerous dungeons
It's like 2.5k-3k hps / 5mil absorb over the course of a dungeon
So I assume the 400 is like 2k
Still very solid
Over the vial
rapid tide
I don't really like it tbf, would rather run a Bloodsport and just go double offensive. But that's just me.
rapid tide
Yeee but Like 2.5k hps won't save you on that boss imho
dreamy epoch
i feel like we dont really need the damage in my group so i just wanna make sure i dont get clapped instantly on that boss
rapid tide
You will need healer pumping anyways there
strong forum
3rd boss is always big yikes
dreamy epoch
Worth healer using well of existence i think maybe aye
strong forum
As I have not done her on high tyra I can't give much of advise there
rapid tide
Don't die :^)
dreamy epoch
I did a 15 fortified and i was getting destroyed, never mind tyran 19 so lol we shall see how it foes, might have to save 3 resses 🤠
strong forum
15 fort was fine last week
Don't remember being in danger that much
But ye tyra 19 will slap
dreamy epoch
i did have a useless pug healer in that run but
weary thorn
I've done a 17 Shrine and 16 Siege, and the 16 Siege felt worse on my warrior because of the poison ranged fuckers before 3rd boss (both this week)
weary thorn
the very same
dreamy epoch
yeah druid healer
rapid tide
Mhm. I mean, Druid can pump :D
You'll be fine just soak the dots correctly with SR/Rogues
(or other dps as seen fit)
rapid tide
Oh sorry meant boss 3 ML
weary thorn
nvm then
dreamy epoch
we do the debuffs fine its just the boss hits that chunk me xD
rapid tide
But the dot itself is only like 20k of sth iirc
Yeee, spell based auto attacks are just nasty
Looking forward to King Mechagon in m+
:^)
mint imp
will be fun
mint imp
Has any of you done the hard mode in Mechagon?
weary thorn
yis
rapid tide
Yes, why?
mint imp
any tips on King?
rapid tide
Follow the wowhead strategy.
weary thorn
IP, SR his normal shot when available
rapid tide
Ye. Just follow WoWHead strategy
It's easy and quick.
With current dps you only get 3 hardmodes anyways, potentially 2 with gigablasters
mint imp
oke should be fine, last time we did all HM bosses and ended just before King. Came back 2nd day and button to activate King HM was not there, i was like SHIT!
random urchin
Did hard mode last week. It’s easy as long as you can communicate the order to click things in.
rapid tide
Ye, you need to do it in one go
mint imp
yep wish i knew that before
mint imp
actually the 4th boss is also not easy
random urchin
We messed up on Kujo lol. Someone was standing in front of furnace when we cleared stacks 😢
rapid tide
Mhm. Super easy with dps
Just phase him before first bots spawn
Then burn him in the first %dmg
mint imp
people getting one-shot by robots and electric ropes between
rapid tide
You never see a single robot spawn that way
rapid tide
We have 2 people pop cds on pull to Phase quickly
Then the other pop theirs on the burnphase
It worked everytime thus far since week 2 and we really are far from pro
tranquil night
am i better of running 430ilvl Vision of demise or pocket sized C device with the haste proc ?
strong forum
" FitnessGram™ Pacer Test is a multistage aerobic capacity test that progressively gets more difficult as it continues. The 20 meter pacer test will begin in 30 seconds. Line up at the start. The running speed starts slowly, but gets faster each minute after you hear this signal. beep A single lap should be completed each time you hear this sound. ding Remember to run in a straight line, and run as long as possible. The second time you fail to complete a lap before the sound, your test is over. The test will begin on the word start. On your mark, get ready, start. "
lusty grotto
hmmmm
strong forum
Can't explain it
lusty grotto
must be an EU meme
strong forum
You weren't there, 3000 years ago
lusty grotto
shit i just realized its EU prime time
strong forum
Na it's actually universal, specifically on Vine
exotic spoke
I thought i was olds but holy shit Nome. You must be ancient
lusty grotto
hey riki you want the quote of the day?
exotic spoke
Was that anhold over from the shit that happens last night where I laughed at someone and just left because holy shit
That was cancerous trying to catch up so I said fuck it
ionic fern
strong forum
You heard it here 1st folks, on how to deal 0 dmg
exotic spoke
Obv- when there weren’t a lot of people talking about it - I honestly think Fum had the best approach
strong forum
And not survive
exotic spoke
For high ML keys. If your group hearths to change - you do too. If they don’t - you don’t
I’m curious on the average increase given
exotic spoke
It got really heated at one point from what I saw. Unnecessarily so
lusty grotto
yeah i saw the ghash thing
it happens
its why people sheep it and go for whatever top io / high parser goes
no questions asked
most people want the quick and easy
exotic spoke
I honestly feel that people interested in competing should learn poker theory.
Being results oriented is wrong - but most people go with that “eh it worked so it must be right”
Where as in poker - you can make the right play - and lose. Or you can make the wrong play and win.
lusty grotto
🤔
exotic spoke
Also hi mwahi
lusty grotto
i suppose that's very true
ionic fern
Hi.
exotic spoke
It’s all about odds / risk assessment / probability.
Sometimes rng just fucks You too.
mystic whale
so what trinkets are you guys using in mythic prog
ionic fern
Grongs/Blast mostly.
sick sentinel
hi
ionic fern
Hi.
strong forum
Blast + radiance phial
mystic whale
anyone ever using survivability trinkets ? haha
lusty grotto
yes listen to johnny kaege
exotic spoke
Gore crusted and cyclo for ashvane progression
Probably gore crusted / urchin for normal mythic progression
mystic whale
why urchin over diamond
exotic spoke
Because, it will usually be a higher Ilvl so more strength. It also works better as a defensive for us assuming equal Ilvl
The heal over time, effectively, is very nice with our mitigation. It just consistently tickets and synergizes wel imo. I also asked Marok, and he rated urchin higher than an equal Ilvl diamond
ionic fern
@lusty grotto but i do prog with grongs/blast. .:/
mystic whale
i have 420 diamon and 430 urchin and diamond vastly does more healing over pretty much every fight
all the guides seems to do like diamond does not exist anymore when they rank trinkets
exotic spoke
I’m just going by what i was told as well as conceptually how they work differently
Diamond is great for large single hits. Where as urchin is just consistently good at helping smooth damage
Throw in the fact that you have to get a really good Titan forge and that’s another reason. You’re losing 10 ilvls of trinkets. That’s not negligible
mystic whale
its a 42str difference
lusty grotto
all the guides?
mystic whale
ill probably be using both during prog anyway
lusty grotto
cause icy veins is the only one
exotic spoke
I wouldn’t personally
mystic whale
last raid i literally got every single tank trinket in EP
exotic spoke
Two defensives trinkets are blah
steep lily
Im using urchin at 445 + alchemy trinket. That feels pretty good right now
mystic whale
ill still be using cyclotronic on farm but it would feel like a disservice to my team to use it in prog
lusty grotto
do you think a trinket is gonna help your team
trinkets are good but do they provide enough surv for you to think that way?
something to think about
mystic whale
well bargain of bwonsamdi abd that eye from Uldir actually did haha
lusty grotto
good fucking lord
why? because they stopped that one death?
out of a 3 min fight, they were used once?
in fact, did they proc for you at all?
on a kill
mystic whale
ona kill no
lusty grotto
not on a failing attempt
ok then realistically speaking
they did just about nothing
mystic whale
well if you want to put it that way
lusty grotto
basically they gave you static str
mystic whale
"This is the pull that we actually kill this boss we're progressing on. ill remove the trinkets"
lusty grotto
that's not how it goes at all
mystic whale
i mean they helped us eventually reach the kill zone
lusty grotto
and we're talking specifically about the 2 trinkets i fucking dislike
mystic whale
by not wasting what would have been a brez
lusty grotto
so you were gonna die out of your own fault?
mystic whale
i didnt keep a diary about Uldir and BoD
but go ahead, where are you going with this
lusty grotto
i mean that's part of the process
exotic spoke
Bwomsamdis bargain was blah. Those “once a fight trinkets” aren’t that good
lusty grotto
did the boss hit you hard enough for you to be helpless without those trinkets
because otherwise, its something either you can fix or your team
exotic spoke
If you don’t trigger them they are a stat stick.
If you do trigger them you could still easily die the next couple seconds and it’s still a stat stick
ionic fern
If the boss hits you hard enough to be helpless once..then he's gonna do it again anyways..😂
exotic spoke
Where as you can get more defensive benefit out of anything else that adds secondaries + that may actually prevent them deaths
lusty grotto
i think its important to note, that if the trinket gave you that one push into a new phase so you see it, your team still seems like they could be better at transitioning no?
steep lily
I like those for early prog, think I used it for first night or 2 of jaina before swapping it off
lusty grotto
look
im biased
everyone here knows i fucking absolutely dislike eye and bwonsamdi
like legit disgusted
i think a defensive trinket that smooths out damage is better for progression
because tank healing is a bit more controlled
exotic spoke
The only case I like things similar to bwomsamdis is in competition like MDI.
You’re doing stupid pulls and the margin for error is very low. This adds a little extra buffer that can be the difference between winning and losing
lusty grotto
so your team can actually look into minimizing other errors
ionic fern
I mean..everyone dislikes cheat death trinkets..they are pointless. It requires you to die as a tank which is a mess on it's own. Plus the damage output of bosses is nowhere near there to be considered deadly in a normal raiding environment.
lusty grotto
but i think the point he tried to make is that it helped him in progression
im just trying to find out why he thinks that
i just dont consider cheating death on a tank to minimize brezzes part of learning the encounter
i suppose it depends on the fight
there are fights in past expansions where it could have been acceptable to think so (like a burn down last phase etc + tank busters)
like maybe even Jaina
exotic spoke
Also, I’d like to point out anresults driven outlook which isn’t necessarily correct - and likely was actually wrong to do
lusty grotto
anyway the point is that using dps trinkets feels like a disservice to his team
which i would agree with
except for the two he mentioned :p
but honestly fights in BFA are not that hard to tank, that defensive trinkets might give you a bit but not enough to justify feeling like you're ripping off your guild
like how someone said: first few pulls yeah go defensive trinkets. Then (a) are you taking extraordinary damage that you need to continue to use them? (b) would the "small" amount of dps gained by using a dps trinket help out in a different way? these are things to consider.
exotic spoke
Most dps trinkets also provide defensive benefits too.
exotic spoke
Wrong way around nim
lusty grotto
whoops true
exotic spoke
Dps trinkets providing defensive benefits
lusty grotto
yes yes
exotic spoke
See gore crusted / knot
exotic spoke
I said some defensive benefit - not necessarily the best / ideal / perfect / major
lusty grotto
gotcha
sand egret
Ooo my fav topic
tender burrow
is it end of work yet, dragging like fuck
sand egret
I love cheat-death trinkets, conceptually, but WoW isn't designed around defensive break-points. They're too bottlenecked. I'd love for a world where as a tank, I could just try and be the brick shithouse fantasy, but damage is a universal attribute in this game and thus ultimately dictates gearing
exotic spoke
Nah man. But under 2 hours here for me. We shut down early on Friday’s in summer
lusty grotto
7 hours to go
sand egret
at least I get free lunch today
hidden plaza
Huh it is Saturday already
tender burrow
its 10am
lusty grotto
^
tender burrow
stop the witch craft
hidden plaza
12:15 am :)
lusty grotto
but but murica
tender burrow
so i am going to try and tank some m+ the weekend first time in like 2-3 years
wish me luck
exotic spoke
@sand egret I get free breakfast and lunch every day at work
tender burrow
get ready for " shit lord tank" post on reddit
lusty grotto
what you mean tho, i only see plushies and memes
if i was a senile old man with dementia, i would probably pay attention at gameplay criticism in reddit
yuck
tender burrow
yea i don't really care, i am excited for classic warrior tanking
lusty grotto
the hivemind is retarded
tender burrow
that shit was fun
exotic spoke
You have fun with that....
lusty grotto
im not because i did it
exotic spoke
I disagree but it’s an opinion so yeah
lusty grotto
and i dont want to tab sunder ever again
tender burrow
it wasn't to bad
analog creek
Is battleshout tanking nerfed in the version of classic going live?
lusty grotto
it shouldn't be
sand egret
wooof
lusty grotto
maul?
lusty grotto
swing timerssssss
analog creek
If I play classic I'm going to force a bear on someone
lusty grotto
parry hastened truck slamming your face in
sand egret
im fudging on a bear for my buddies
lusty grotto
'member parry haste?
sand egret
i do miss the pre-60 dungeon shenanigans
lusty grotto
yikerinos
floral sphinx
which is a better tanking trinket urchin or faithless?
sand egret
the boss equivalent to :
"oh no you didn't...."
analog creek
Parry hasted attacks are the best, especially when the melee stand in the cleave and get you both killed
sand egret
Urchin @floral sphinx
faithless with the benefit of being more niche for its pure magic swap
sand egret
oooo
lusty grotto
i would probably play classic again but really casual
lusty grotto
not like naxx guild fucking raiding, fuck that shit
lusty grotto
yeah but i don't have time
sand egret
whenever they're on
floral sphinx
thanks
lusty grotto
literally don't have time
shit is too slow, per design, in classic obviously
i just dont think i can do it again
sand egret
yeah, it's going to be kinda a side-game for me
i fully expect to take months and months to get to 60
analog creek
If they merged live with classic with account bound items, mounts transmog ect, I'd 100% play classic
exotic spoke
I’m going to log in and troll in trade and that’s it
sand egret
and im 100% fine with that
exotic spoke
But then it’s not classic Archaous
analog creek
Not much incentive for me otherwise
No you misunderstand
Acquiring shit in classic, that 'unlocks' it on your live account
lusty grotto
like what
exotic spoke
Oh - yeah I’d be ok with that
lusty grotto
t3 you can get on the BMAH
analog creek
Mostly looking mounts and naxx tmog
sand egret
im getting triggered thinking about that shit
exotic spoke
Items for transmog in retail that you earn in classic
sand egret
stupid black quiraji battle tank
lusty grotto
corrupted ashbringer maybe?
sand egret
stupid fucking exam
exotic spoke
MoM
sand egret
can't believe I took that shit
exotic spoke
Etc
lusty grotto
meh i dont really care about that
our guild had one of the 3 in our server
scarab lord
winty
exotic spoke
I want the weapon I got rid of....
sand egret
i was gonna get it
analog creek
Anathema/benediction
sand egret
but had to take an exam
analog creek
The hunter shit
lusty grotto
isn't there a MoM graphic in the WotLK naxx?
exotic spoke
Already have most of T3. Can’t get the belt to show up
lusty grotto
im pretty sure
sand egret
I think so
analog creek
The removed mounts would be a big thing
exotic spoke
Yeah but still
analog creek
But they did say already they wont be doing any of this
exotic spoke
It isn’t the same nim. Even if it’s the same it’s not the same
analog creek
But that's what it would take to get me invested in the nightmare of a game that was classic
exotic spoke
I mean - vanilla wow was great for it’s time
I loved it. But I wouldn’t want to play it again in a serious manner
analog creek
Right, by any modern standard it never would have survived beta testing
tender burrow
yea i can't go fully into it. too old now with job, wife and kid
i don;t have 10 hours to farm black lotus
or a 4 hour UBRS run
sand egret
tbh, i feel like nowadays it won't take nearly as long
analog creek
The biggest problem with classic, is the time investment. Gamers today are not aware of what that actually means.
As in how much time they need to dump into classic to accomplish anything
sand egret
people underestimate the general "bar" for the average player is like waaaaaay higher
analog creek
3:1 is a good estimate. 3 hours logged in for every one hour raiding to show up prepared
sand egret
"dont stand in fire" was a legit, novel concept at the time
lusty grotto
i mean i get that people know exactly what to do in specific scenarios and how to optimize runs
sand egret
"dispel" = an entire raid fight
lusty grotto
but its STILL time consuming
sand egret
"kill adds at the same time, oh and there's a fear"
analog swift
I mean I have guildies who are legit saying there isn’t enough loot in BFA and they don’t like the grind so they are going to play classic
lusty grotto
people that didn't play vanilla will get hit hard enough on that
sand egret
and my personal favorite
analog creek
Ubrs runs for bloods for 40 people to get onyxia attuned is no short task
sand egret
Don't Stand Near People: The Fight
lusty grotto
especially people that didn't play vanilla that complain about AP grinds
vernal stirrup
they could mean there isn't any draw for the loot in bfa
vast sedge
Big wake up call for them coming lmao @analog swift
analog creek
I ran ubrs atleast 8 times before I got my blood, 2-3 hours per run
analog swift
Inorit
vernal stirrup
I legit don't think I'll see Mc for a few months
sand egret
well i'd imagine I'd just stockpile any drops I'd got from Maraudon when doing it normally
dull cypress
2 trait Ablative Shielding worth ?
analog creek
Then add another hour to get back out to BFE to turn it in
sand egret
people did NR runs because they had the need after the fact
lusty grotto
there are people that will without a doubt rush those things
sand egret
so I imagine people would run that shit while leveling and bank the drops for later
warm plinth
@dull cypress what are the other options?
lusty grotto
dont be surprised if you see guilds hitting quest locked content early
sand egret
instead of getting to 60 THEN farming for NR
dull cypress
@warm plinth unstable flames
lusty grotto
yeah but that's part of optimizing runs blade
vast sedge
Go UF
warm plinth
I’d take unstable
dull cypress
i can use 3 unstable, ur 2 ablative and 1 Strength in Numbers
sand egret
unstable is prob one of my fav traits on that tier, not gonna lie
dull cypress
i dont know if worth that critic
analog creek
BWL will be somewhat timegated by onyxia attunements too. Dont forget your ony scale cloaks that you want most of your raid to have for nef
lusty grotto
yeah
analog creek
2? Cloaks per week
lusty grotto
but don't worry, leveling alone will be long, except for people that have all the time in the world
warm plinth
Unstable is a great trait. And ablative is really not needed
dull cypress
thanks
vernal stirrup
I don't pick up defensive traits almost ever
sick sentinel
do you guys preffer unstable or overwhelming?
analog creek
Any trait that gives armor for a warrior has a low value compared to most other traits
vernal stirrup
I take overwhelming
lusty grotto
generally OP
warm plinth
Overwhelming is better than anything else in that ring
sick sentinel
same
lusty grotto
but UF is a close 2nd
sick sentinel
like what if you have like 30% haste without into the fray
would you still take it
warm plinth
Yes
vernal stirrup
yes
analog creek
OP loses value when the frequency of damage taken increases
naive panther
Overwhelming is just too good
lusty grotto
for raids, i would take OP
analog creek
Still strong, but a lot of power is lost
naive panther
I wouldn’t say a lot
vernal stirrup
I'd still probably bring it for meys
naive panther
Igcd
naive panther
I use it in keys still. Big pulls still strong
sick sentinel
if yo ustack 3 of them you get like 2500 haste
dull cypress
2 UF 1 OP is best then 3 UF ?
warm plinth
Yeah
lusty grotto
probably yeah
vast sedge
Ye
vernal stirrup
yep
I'd anyone else using 0 defensive essences btw
I'm just rocking vop crucible
strong forum
Not many people are using defensive essences
naive panther
But it’s also a offensive essences. It doesn’t tick down enough to not be strong offensively.
Vop still sims high cleave
random urchin
If you have 3 BoM VoP bulls double duty as defensive and offensive
vernal stirrup
I guess
random urchin
Pulls*
strong forum
I still don't know which essences to take for m+ with 0 BoM, feels so weird
lusty grotto
technically still VoP
exotic spoke
I’d still take VoP as a minor and this week I’d take CoF major
vernal stirrup
I'd probably still go vop, just because avatar uptime 
exotic spoke
But that’s me
strong forum
I've been trying out literally everything
lusty grotto
also remember there are a lof of r3 essences that provide defensive secondary stats
strong forum
Nothing solid
warm plinth
I still don’t know what my purpose on this planet is with 0 BoM personally Nome
warm plinth
It sucks
lusty grotto
rip nome
exotic spoke
You pass the butter ghash
wary lantern
everyone knows that ripple in space is BiS essence
vast sedge
Using AuG for queen azshara and I used it some for early early orgo but it’s unnecessary now and prob was then
strong forum
50-55% uptime on Avatar isn't insane
random urchin
You guys are starting to make me worried. Rolling for a 445 on Tuesday, no BoM would make me sad
vernal stirrup
but the claps bro
sick sentinel
I got probably the worst azerite from my lottery
strong forum
Powerful 25k claps
vernal stirrup
my 445 didn't have bom either
lusty grotto
i mean first 445 i rolled was BoM-less
strong forum
2x 445 rolled 0 BoM ama
exotic spoke
I mean it’s not bad for single target.
lusty grotto
im sorry for your loss Nome
truly sorry
worry not with gear come higher keys and therefore more residuum
and also no need for azerite in raids so more residuum
exotic spoke
I’ve had 3 445 not give BoM. One was shoulders which has amazing odds of giving BoM
vernal stirrup
you said " with gear comes higher keys"
warm plinth
warm plinth
Probably because you posted it in a Discord channel with 20k people in it and didn’t have a name in the message.
vernal stirrup
I mean it wasn't that funny in the first place but it's a public channel
warm plinth
🙄
analog creek
10s terrify me this week tbh
warm plinth
Oh speaking of this week
sand egret
This week is ez pzzzz
warm plinth
One of my group members logged that UR @lusty grotto
lusty grotto
im not as good as you blade
warm plinth
I already did a 40 push
lusty grotto
im sorry
analog creek
Gl with first boss, he nearly one shots at 21
lusty grotto
im only a 38 key level player
exotic spoke
The monk I did a 12 with yesterday was freaking out
Asked me to reset at 20 stacks and I’m like “nah”
warm plinth
Nim isn’t even over 1800. He doesn’t have an opinion
lusty grotto
stupid dwarves
sand egret
haha Riki, I had the opposite healer in mine
warm plinth
And I haven’t done a 19 ML so I don’t have one either.
analog creek
My healer will remind me about stacks when I hit 40
exotic spoke
In low keys especially - I don’t think of resetting / dwarfing until at least 30
sand egret
"stay in there and take it"
lusty grotto
"good i can dps"
warm plinth
I want the healer that’s like “it’s only 40 stacks, quit being a bitch”
exotic spoke
Yeah - the rdruid I run with will eventually just stop healing for the pull and start kitty dpsing
sand egret
pulled the whole snek room
lusty grotto
kitty dots, MW conclict&strife hits, glimmer spam ftw
sand egret
he goes "your problem now"
just hops into kitty
fuckin loved it
i also found a HUGE pumper in this SPriest
analog creek
The necrotic is laughable, the bursting when I have high stacks is what scares me. And in 10s, it's an real struggle, especially with a 'typical' healer that gets into a 10
exotic spoke
I mean - if I have 70%+ reduction in healing and I’m not kiting it’s better to kill shit faster and clear the stacks right?
vernal stirrup
bolstering is way fucking worse imo
warm plinth
I mean if I have 70 stacks and I’m at 80% HP I feel like I’m okay