protection

[lusty grotto]

300k is a bit extreme

[warm plinth]

But people are hitting it

[chilly brook]

^

[lusty grotto]

uhh

[sand egret]

I'm curious, why is that perceived as bad

[chilly brook]

Wild changes in damage throughout an expansion?

[lusty grotto]

smh what fight and duration can you link with 300k aoe dps?

[chilly brook]

Due to gear?

[warm plinth]

I don't think it's bad, except that Blizzard is going to get back up to where they're uncomfortable with damage numbers again far quicker than before

[sand egret]

it's not wild

[warm plinth]

And then another squish happens

[sand egret]

wild is subjective

that is an increase over the expansion

I want to know why that's bad

[warm plinth]

And squishes every 2nd expansion is dumb

[chilly brook]

There’s a very substantial jump in damage over the expansion so far

[sand egret]

again

why is that bad

[lusty grotto]

this expansion has had adequate jumps

it hasnt been more or less than previous expansions

either way that's their problem, they are the ones that have to deal with the job that entails squishing

[sand egret]

I'm still wanting to know what the fuck constitutes "adequate" vs "wild" lol

[lusty grotto]

it's subjective

[sand egret]

that's my point

there's legit mechanical reasons to squish

[lusty grotto]

yeah i dont disagree with you :p

[sand egret]

but implying that it's all willy-nilly touchy feely is silly

[lusty grotto]

you guys forget that this is all stored/calculated by software, where variables have limits

[chilly brook]

Here I’m just gonna swap from phone to pc give me a minute or two

Can’t be asked to type this all up on the phone

[lusty grotto]

you cant just have some shit balloon to gazillions in calculations

[sand egret]

I get the retention argument, to a degree

[warm plinth]

I couldn't care less if we do Diablo 3 levels of damage tbh. Blizzard is the one that feels like squishes are necessary. And I dislike squishes, which means I'd like Blizzard to control how fast our damage goes up so they don't have to squish us every two expansions.

[lusty grotto]

you will have problems with hard limits on your variables

[sand egret]

they don't feel

they ARE necessary

for the reasons Nim said

[warm plinth]

They're only necessary because of how much power we gain. If they control that, then squishes are no longer necessary (or at least are necessary far less frequently)

[lusty grotto]

no

you're not reading what i said

[warm plinth]

I wasn't responding to what you said. I was responding to the general discussion.

[sand egret]

So, we can agree that squishes have to happen

[lusty grotto]

this is an example though, an integer (which is a number type) has a range of -32,768 to 32,767 (on a 2 byte int)

it is by far the most used number type

of variable

from there you have floats, bigints, doubles, so on

[sand egret]

the issue, allegedly, is the degree it scales within an expansion?

like between tiers?

or between expansion?

[sick sentinel]

Why are we talking about integers and other data types

[warm plinth]

The issue only exists because the scaling impacts how often squishes have to happen. If we could gain power indefinitely and have it not cause squishes, it would no longer be an issue (for me personally)

[sick sentinel]

I don't see the correlation

[lusty grotto]

squishes

you can scroll up

[sick sentinel]

That has nothing to do with squishes tho

[lusty grotto]

wdym

[sick sentinel]

Data types are just limitations in allocated memory. Why are we talking about ints, doubles, floats, and other data types when they don't have anything to do with squishes ingame

[oblique garnet]

You can definitely hit 300k aoe dps

[chilly brook]

Ok let's talk about ilvl jumps and why having 45 ilvl jumps every tier on top of an almost 100 ilvl jump after hitting level cap is bad

[sand egret]

so, what I'm trying to get at is the other reasons you squish, the soft effects. Namely, the power fantasy and how that lines up and feels. There's s point where a player can say "I used to hit for millions, now I hit for thousands. I'm a loser now!", which is valid to a degree. Granted damage is relative and rebalanced around all of gameplay, this is tuned on an expansion to expansion basis. Within an expansion is different, as it also affects retention.

[unborn island]

I think the first squish was because of the way they set all their data types way back when? But the legion one was just because of the numbers being meaningless

[lusty grotto]

i mean you have a server running calculations just for you to deal damage

you hit a data type limit and you get a fucked server

[sick sentinel]

100%

blizzard uses auto data types

there is no way

they wouldn't

you're game would have so many issues with memory and false allocations

if they had set memory allocations like that

[oblique garnet]

Your game*

[sick sentinel]

sorry your game

[sand egret]

naw, I am game

[sick sentinel]

I have been up for many hours

but the main issue still applys

what does data types

have to do with squishes

[lusty grotto]

wtf is an auto data type

[sick sentinel]

...

[lusty grotto]

applies*

[sick sentinel]

It's what most games use

and a lot of other applications

[lusty grotto]

depends on the engine and game

[sick sentinel]

WoW uses C++

WoW also uses C++11

They use auto or float/doubles

or long doubles or other variations

The point is that it has no correlation

[warm plinth]

When did Skyhold become Grammar/Spelling Police Plaza

[sick sentinel]

they would have to manually change every data type of the game to set the variables

for every single thing

Data types don't do your calculations for you Pepepga

[oblique garnet]

Never its just your and you’re is inexcusable ghash

[undone sun]

Lol

[warm plinth]

it's*

[lusty grotto]

data types don't do your calculations for you hmm...

[warm plinth]

😏

[sand egret]

zing!

gottem

[sick sentinel]

?

[chilly brook]

1. stat squish and bloating.:
   This should be fairly straight forward for most people. On one hand not having to do it several times over and over is less work for the devs, less to go wrong when they inevitably have to fix it etc. It also means for players it's easier to see at a glance what's happening on the screen, numbers are far more reasonable to read etc.

2. The way gear interacts with you and your character and your game experience:
   So let's talk about expansions where there were far less jumps in power with gear. The content stayed relevant longer for one. Items could stay relevant for several tiers leading to you having more to do in game and an actual progression path to take. One where it actually felt like you were accomplishing goals instead of having the last tier be relegated to something you never do again that expansion unless you're after one specific xmog piece. The only exceptions to this with modern WoW design have been items that were just simply wildly broken with how they interact with the spec or class. It also means you have less choice as a player with what items you're going to use with how stats are scaling, even if you like a trinket from the previous tier it will be worthless the next just simply because of the stats on it.

[lusty grotto]

@sick sentinel

[warm plinth]

RIP Battle Cry+Draught of Souls

[chilly brook]

Should we really be doing 4x + the damage we were doing at the beginning of the expansion at the end of the expansion?

Isn't that just a little ridiculous?

[sick sentinel]

Um

What does stats and damage have to do with data types tho?

xd

[lusty grotto]

sorry here's the relevant part

bro

[sand egret]

So I ask again

[lusty grotto]

are you aware you get reported actual numbers on the combat log?

do those numbers just magically appear?

[sand egret]

Griff, why should I need to farm Emerald Nightmare in ToS because an item is relatively important now?

[warm plinth]

That's one reason I do like bigger power gains between tiers ^

Having to keep old tier sets or fucking unstable arcanocrystals through 3 tiers of content is moronic

[sand egret]

ultimately what you're describing is an issue with feel and retention of content. Do you want older tiers to be something you need to run in order to run current content?

[sick sentinel]

Yes of course, but what does data types have to do with stat squishing?

[warm plinth]

Or worse, having to go back and do that content to get one

[sick sentinel]

Is the data type just going to magically reduce the variable's number when doing a stat squish?????

[chilly brook]

I mean that's kind of an odd question to ask

[sand egret]

There needs to be a definitive line between "current" and not

[lusty grotto]

have you tried multiplying over the limit of a data type?

[chilly brook]

But that's the point

[sand egret]

how do you incentivize loot?

[chilly brook]

In a less aggressive world where ilvl isn't thrown at you like crazy more stuff is current

The loot is still incentivized

[sand egret]

how so?

[sick sentinel]

The point is they just use auto and it doesn't do anything for the actual stat squish. It's just memory allocation and that in itself doesn't actually do the stat squish?

[sand egret]

new loot that doesnt outperform old loot

[chilly brook]

Again that's a really odd question to ask

[lusty grotto]

i didnt say it does the stat squish

[sick sentinel]

You were talking about stat squishes

and you were also talking about ints

[lusty grotto]

i said it may be a reason as to why they don't want numbers ballooning up

[sick sentinel]

and other forms

[chilly brook]

Considering in older expansions like TBC where older content was still current, the loot was still worth getting

[sick sentinel]

of memory allocation

[sand egret]

and a shitty player experience for many

because back in TBC

[sick sentinel]

When they don't correlate

[sand egret]

you had to run month and even year old content just to do something that may even be out of date by the time you got there

TBC is not the best example at all to quote lol

[lusty grotto]

its fine mvpg let's just drop it i guess

🤷

[chilly brook]

God forbid there be a progression path instead of doing the same content for well over a year to get the same item just 45 ilvls higher every M+ season

[sand egret]

I understand the sentiment of trivializing old stuff immediately, but the other side of the coin is that you also want to do that

[chilly brook]

🤦

[sand egret]

I just don't think you get how these things work in a live environment

it's a very skewed view on progression

that doesn't factor in other perspectives

I get that's what you want

[chilly brook]

Acting like doing "old" content isn't compelling when everyone heralds M+ as one of the best additions to the game is kinda counterintuitive

[sand egret]

it isn't old when it's changed

affixes do that

[chilly brook]

it is when the affixes are literally the same every season except for one affix

[sand egret]

should M+ loot evolve between seasons, sure. The variety is there, but the reason people do M+ is not really for the loto

[lusty grotto]

@sick sentinel

there you go

WoW stores health values in signed 32-bit integers, <---------------------

that's of course for health values alone

[sick sentinel]

When was this btw

Hasn't the game been transferred over to a 64-bit int

[lusty grotto]

perhaps so

but do you see the "correllation" now?

[chilly brook]

If M+ isn't about the loot then get rid of the loot scaling in it

[sick sentinel]

Ye I see it know but that doesn't apply for anything now nor in the past before they made the game 64 bit architecture which is why I was confused, but that could also be false. I don't know if they actually did yet

[warm plinth]

I mean we must be on 64-bit now since bosses in legion had well over 2.1B health on Mythic

[sick sentinel]

Ye that's what I"m saying

[lusty grotto]

i mean

[sick sentinel]

which is why I was confused

[lusty grotto]

i only said it was a reason

i didn't say its specifically why squishes are done now

[warm plinth]

I know; I was just confirming that he is probably right on the 64-bit now

[lusty grotto]

honestly they should be 64 bit by now

[warm plinth]

Idk about all that stuff but it says the max is 2.1B and we had more than 2.1B in Legion so obviously we aren't using those integers anymore XD

[lusty grotto]

blizzard isn't that stupid lol

[sick sentinel]

http://prntscr.com/nw2xl1

that's 2^64

[warm plinth]

Whew

[sick sentinel]

or well 2^63-1

If you could get passed that number

[oblique garnet]

What is this conversation

[sick sentinel]

then you're doing something special

[oblique garnet]

Is this #protection

[lusty grotto]

yeah for sure i agree

[undone sun]

The squish after mop was becssue of the bit shit, it was then fixed during/after wod

[warm plinth]

I'll take this over the pissing contest in here yesterday

[lusty grotto]

wdym

hey its a legit reason why they needed a squish

[sick sentinel]

That's my bad tho

[lusty grotto]

but yes, if we're using 64 bit numbers

[sick sentinel]

I only started this game back in antorus

so that didn't even cross my mind

[undone sun]

It's actually one of the main reasons garrosh had as many phases that reset health

Legit

[lusty grotto]

i don't think its a reason anymore unless if scaling reaches a point where it should be reassed

but that's probably not going to happen

[sick sentinel]

I'm pretty sure they stated their reason why they did it

For bfa that is

[lusty grotto]

because who wants to play a game where numbers are pentillions or whatever

[undone sun]

And it's not for the same as previous

I do

[lusty grotto]

lmao

[undone sun]

Smaller numbers suck

😡

[lusty grotto]

haha

i can't imagine

[sick sentinel]

They said that the numbers were getting too distracting and I'm pretty sure said weren't as exciting? for a lack of a better term

[undone sun]

P much

[sick sentinel]

because it seemed all just

big

xd

[lusty grotto]

i mean i didn't mind it, but i also don't mind the smaller numbers

[oblique garnet]

I wanna go back to doing 10 dps 8)

[sick sentinel]

Doing 3.8m dps on mythic coven as an aff lock was fu

n

big pumps

[prisma crane]

wym? i liked hitting a 29M shield slam in MoP

[lusty grotto]

lol 10 dps is a bit too extreme

[undone sun]

Don't you worry, classic is around the corner

@oblique garnet

[lusty grotto]

^

[oblique garnet]

I know

Im so excited

[lusty grotto]

lmao

[undone sun]

😴

[lusty grotto]

that is... if you hit

[oblique garnet]

Bfa makes me sleep

[sick sentinel]

Go back to antorus

[viral tapir]

Anyone have a good prot pawn string?

[sick sentinel]

Better than bfa

pawn isn't good

I wouldn't use it

[lusty grotto]

nein we don't use pawn sorry 😢

[undone sun]

Oh dont get me wrong, bfa does for me as well

[sick sentinel]

pawn isn't good for 99% of classes/specs in general

[viral tapir]

:pepehands:

[sick sentinel]

Most people don't know the difference between stat weights and stat priorities

or how stat weights work in general

[lusty grotto]

just gonna copy paste Kaegebot if he hasn't pm'd you

look at your DMs

[viral tapir]

So do i just sim my prot warr as dps in raidbots?

or how do i know what to aim for

[sick sentinel]

Guides

You don't sim tanks

[undone sun]

Defensively*

[sick sentinel]

You can for dps

[neon tangle]

*unless you -only- care about damage

[sick sentinel]

but not defensively

[oblique garnet]

Who cares about defensively at this point

[sick sentinel]

Basically it goes 3 BoMs, 1deafen, 2 if

[undone sun]

newer players ¯_(ツ)_/¯

[sick sentinel]

or that's what I heard atleast

[lusty grotto]

look at your DMs Jojje 😃

[oblique garnet]

Oh yeah that reminds me

[lusty grotto]

if not kaege will be in touch with you

[oblique garnet]

Whoever was the madlad that did 11fh with no traits and 310 shield

Your shieldblock uptime was atrocious

[warm plinth]

#shotsfired

[lusty grotto]

thats toxic late

[warm plinth]

But was it my prot war pug tank in timewalking 6 casts in the whole dungeon bad?

[oblique garnet]

It would have prevented alot of floorpov

You know like using shield block duringn ludvig

Like once or twice

[lusty grotto]

late you need some NA time to get that toxicity off

come yell at the chef

[warm plinth]

Agreed

[oblique garnet]

Eh

[warm plinth]

Don't be a tease Late!

[oblique garnet]

Yeah gotta wait for my tax returns

Cant afford 2 sub

S

[chilly brook]

That’s ok not worth to sub until classic :kappa

[sand egret]

just change your icon to an korean girl and get yourself a sugar daddy. It's allt he rage now

[oblique garnet]

🤔

That could work

Also use the male to female filter from snapchat

[sand egret]

we have the technology!

[oblique garnet]

Would it technically be a scam🤔

[neon tangle]

I'm going to say that "pretending to be someone you aren't to get money from someone else"

is prolly a scam

[lusty grotto]

hmmm

[neon tangle]

not that I'm against it

[lusty grotto]

classic will have eu/na split as well yeah?

[warm plinth]

I'm sure it will

[lusty grotto]

yeah wouldn't make sense if it weren't i guess

[oblique garnet]

You can play on either server tho

[lusty grotto]

yeah now in beta

[oblique garnet]

Nono

Even when release comes

[lusty grotto]

hmm did they announce that?

that's pretty big

[oblique garnet]

Its because you get the classic for free as long as your account has 1 active sub on retail

You can create classic on eu or na

[lusty grotto]

hmm that'd be interesting

[sick sentinel]

@outer dew

Teach late how to get a wow sugardaddy

[warm plinth]

Tofu is the master catfish

[sick sentinel]

He needs money to sub and server transfer

[sand egret]

and a moderate spending account

[lusty grotto]

lol

needs a better pfp

[oblique garnet]

Oi

Dont disrespect the pimp goofy

[lusty grotto]

idk i mean

thats a pfp for a sugar daddy

[oblique garnet]

Pfft

[chilly brook]

TBH can’t wait to play classic

[lusty grotto]

hard pass

[oblique garnet]

Nim

Trust me

You will want to play it

[lusty grotto]

nah

[oblique garnet]

Theres more to do in it than bfa

[lusty grotto]

i'm aware

[chilly brook]

Bruh even Venruki was like “I was wrong, Classic is dope”

[lusty grotto]

🤷

[sand egret]

tbh, I went back and played it. Even comparing it to Modern WoW is not even right

they're completely different games at this point

[oblique garnet]

Its like an mmo

[sand egret]

it's an RPG

specifically

[chilly brook]

It’s like a real mmorpg

[oblique garnet]

Yeah

[chilly brook]

Not an instance simulator

[sick sentinel]

Okay look

You might not like it

It might not be for you

I might end up not liking it

[lusty grotto]

i liked classic back then

[sand egret]

yeah, they're just totally different things at this point

[lusty grotto]

im not saying its gonna be bad

[sick sentinel]

But at least give it a fair chance

[oblique garnet]

Im playing bfa because i have nothing better to do

[lusty grotto]

i just don't want to relive that part of WoW

[sick sentinel]

During a content drought

[sand egret]

tbh I'm playing it because I got some friends I played back in Vanilla who are coming back to level with me.

[lusty grotto]

hmm

[sick sentinel]

Give it a try

[sand egret]

Like, I'm legit doing it just to level

[sick sentinel]

For fun

[sand egret]

and i'll probably stop

[sick sentinel]

Same

I'll just level

[oblique garnet]

Half of our guild is actually going to classic xD

[lusty grotto]

honestly i have enough on my back-log to fill me in on content draughts :p

[sand egret]

also so true. I was hard against it but my buddy hooked me up with a beta key and I messed around with it. It's so different that I was genuinely discovering shit again.

[chilly brook]

It’d be nice to have more modern games actually stay true to the rpg roots

[sand egret]

some do

less of a market for them now

[lusty grotto]

they don't generate money

[sand egret]

i know they're making another BG

[chilly brook]

ESO is the only modern mmo that I feel does stay true to them

[sand egret]

eh, that's also not so true

[lusty grotto]

the target audience for these types of games have gotten old, and have less time on their hands

[chilly brook]

And it makes quite a fair bit of money

[oblique garnet]

How can i write guides for icyveins i heard they have keys for their authors?🤔

[sand egret]

less time, way more expendable income

just matters how you monetize

[lusty grotto]

right but in comparison with any other type of pick up game

they pale

i should rephrase that

darkest dungeon did well

[sand egret]

but even comparing it to other genre's is not even right

[chilly brook]

That being said I’m also glad there’s a resurgence in the crpg market

[sand egret]

since stuff like FIFA operates on a completely different model than like....Path of Exile

[chilly brook]

Divinity Original Sin 2 was 👌🏻

[lusty grotto]

i would like jrpgs to go back to the old battle systems, but that's not fucking gonna happen lmao

even the ff7 remake is like some action based thing

[sand egret]

glad you liked Divinity Griff

you're welcome

😄

[chilly brook]

You worked on ITV

It*

?

[sand egret]

for the last 3rd of dev

[chilly brook]

My man ❤️

[sand egret]

then I left there

[lusty grotto]

typical millenial job hopper

:p

[oblique garnet]

Blade can you hook your boy up with some jobs 😘

[chilly brook]

Lol

[sand egret]

not with that pfp

[lusty grotto]

i say that as a job hopper myself

[chilly brook]

I’m hype that they’re gonna be working on a new baldurs gate

[oblique garnet]

What is this unnecessary attacks against my pfp

[lusty grotto]

lmao

[sand egret]

yeahh I got a lot of old friends from 38 working there

[lusty grotto]

you need to get with the times Late

[chilly brook]

It’s a pretty crappy pfp tbh

🙃

[lusty grotto]

follow in Kaege and Tofu and Bull's foosteps and aim for that sugar daddy

[oblique garnet]

Im not changing my pfp

[sand egret]

be the change you want to see in your pocket

[lusty grotto]

😄

[chilly brook]

I bought pillars of eternity 2 and I’m trying to get into it but it’s pretty overwhelming tbh

Might just hold off on trying to understand it until it releases on the switch

[lusty grotto]

yo

switch rpgs are such an amazing idea

[chilly brook]

They’re great dude

[lusty grotto]

almost right out bought FF12

then i saw $50

still fought myself not to buy it

[chilly brook]

Skyrim on the switch is a pretty good experience

Same with dark souls

[sand egret]

if only that console wasn't such a potato

grumble grumble

[chilly brook]

Stardew valley on the switch is straight dangerous

[sand egret]

porting to the switch is the worst

[lusty grotto]

blade

[chilly brook]

Idk my only complaint with the switch is no Bluetooth

[sand egret]

and you can't change my mind

[lusty grotto]

cmon

dont think as a dev

just play games

:p

[sand egret]

i can't not

[chilly brook]

Oh and the battery which I guess is two complaints 🙃

[oblique garnet]

Yeah ports to switch are eh

But switch originals are amazing

[lusty grotto]

wtf

[chilly brook]

Let’s be honest

[lusty grotto]

they aren't "eh"

[chilly brook]

What they’re able to do on the platform is pretty amazing

[lusty grotto]

i def do hate not having bluetooth

[oblique garnet]

Im talking about optimization nim

[umbral forge]

I still can't get over weeb kaege. At all.

[chilly brook]

Like wolfenstein and doom for example

[sand egret]

the platform is great....WORKING on the platform SUCKS

[chilly brook]

Or warframe

[umbral forge]

WAIT WHAT

GRIFF

NO

GO BACK

[chilly brook]

I don’t doubt it

Go back to what?

[umbral forge]

your old PFP

[chilly brook]

Wdym

[lusty grotto]

well it's nintendo, they have always had tough to develop dev-tools

[oblique garnet]

Jettom stop calling people weebs its rude and untruthful

[umbral forge]

Late

Late

[sand egret]

tough to develop isn't the half of it

[umbral forge]

have you seen his pfp

[chilly brook]

What old pfp

[sand egret]

try when all of our acceptence criteria....is in Japanese

[lusty grotto]

cant you use the unreal thing on it anyway?

ohhhh

OHH

shit man lmao

[sand egret]

yeah.

[lusty grotto]

lmao

[sand egret]

wanna know more about the hardware architecture? bust out that rosetta stone, bitch!

[oblique garnet]

Yes i have seen his pfp Jettom

[lusty grotto]

yo talking about switch, i saw that darkwoods game

looks interesting

[chilly brook]

Wait what one?

[lusty grotto]

i know its in PC too but

feels like a good game to play on switch

[outer dew]

Nah

[sand egret]

and like....the controller sku's....

[outer dew]

Late doesnt have game

[sand egret]

BOOOO

[outer dew]

Cant work

[lusty grotto]

lmao blade

[sand egret]

their whole critical path definition?

BOOOO

[lusty grotto]

just hire a japanese american dev

[sand egret]

uh

👋

[chilly brook]

I don’t mind the joycons by themselves but my left one developed a pretty bad drift on the stick

[oblique garnet]

@outer dew yeah youre right i cant act like 18 year old girl

[lusty grotto]

NANI?

[sand egret]

(actually no, but I can speak moderate Japanese, which I had to flex WAY more than I shoulda on that team haha)

[lusty grotto]

but technical japanese is another thing

[sick sentinel]

Guys is there any good weakauras for tanking

[sand egret]

yeah...

[chilly brook]

Plenty

[sick sentinel]

ok thank you

[oblique garnet]

@sick sentinel what kind are you looking for?

[sand egret]

translating tech docs to my engineers with a vocabulary of a 10 year old ain't fun

"either this is talking about how many threads this can utilize.....or they're trying to order a pizza...."

[oblique garnet]

Whats the matter blade cant read japanese fluently? 8)

[sick sentinel]

Ones that are good for tanking

[oblique garnet]

Block tracker made by Marok and ignorepain tracker cover most parts

[sand egret]

a SB/IP tracker would be the top choices

interrupt trackers are super helpful

[sick sentinel]

I have both

what else

[sand egret]

well, you're asking the guy who uses 2 addons so I don't got much else

[oblique garnet]

Well your basic m+ weakauras are helpful

[sick sentinel]

what are those

[oblique garnet]

Like mob casts etc

From dungeons

Tells you what you got etc

[sick sentinel]

oh ok I have those

[outer dew]

@oblique garnet it's pretty easy uwu

[oblique garnet]

Yeah thats pretty bad tofu

[sick sentinel]

🎉 /2

[lusty grotto]

haha

[sick sentinel]

For spell reflecting the throw on grong

do I precast the throw

or do I do it right after he tosses me

[oblique garnet]

precast

[sick sentinel]

Will it do the 20% reduction or the entirety of it

[undone sun]

it reflects the dot, the throw itself is still physical

[sick sentinel]

the dot that hits like a truck?

[undone sun]

more of if you can avoid it, do it

[sick sentinel]

Is intercepting to your offtank a good idea

or does it damage the raid too much

[undone sun]

dont intercept https://i.imgur.com/cFAmdMp.png

[molten atlas]

is ancients bulkward anygood atm?

m+

[lusty grotto]

vs what traits specifically?

[molten atlas]

iron fortress

[lusty grotto]

neg

[molten atlas]

eh?

[lusty grotto]

negative

IF > that

[molten atlas]

so take the iron

ty :#

[lusty grotto]

yes prot specifics are usually better

there is some leeway for dps oriented ones but still

[molten atlas]

shimmering haven or heed my call

[lusty grotto]

hmc all the way

[molten atlas]

thought as much,

[lusty grotto]

youre not gonna stand still much in M+ for haven to be worth it

[molten atlas]

okaay okay

final one

vampiric or self reliiance

[lusty grotto]

hehe that one should be easy

you're a tank after all

[molten atlas]

gotta go fast?

[lusty grotto]

sure sure

self reliance is kinda eh for every class

it has some value for certain affixes but since its ring is so deep, it's usually not worth reforging traits

[molten atlas]

i mean - if you reforge you can rechoose all of them anyway xD

[lusty grotto]

right, which you won't do :p

[molten atlas]

welp

[sick sentinel]

Self reliance is good for casters

And ranged

That's it

[lusty grotto]

well that's true

i mean there's ranged in this game?!

[warm plinth]

Sure

Elemenetal shamans

Elemental*

[molten atlas]

lies theyre just axe throwing wwarriors

[lusty grotto]

ah you mean Jimmy the earth elemental

wait hes not ranged

[molten atlas]

idol of indescriminate consumption - decent?

[lusty grotto]

ghash bamboozling me

[sick sentinel]

@molten atlas good

[molten atlas]

• razans gleeming eye

[sick sentinel]

@lusty grotto hunters exist

[molten atlas]

hunters go survival for that raptor strike montage

[lusty grotto]

kaege dont lie

[sick sentinel]

Nim

Hunters

Are good

Hunter>ele shaman

Don't @ me

[lusty grotto]

i know i run with 1

me jokes

[molten atlas]

you seen shadow priests atm

ooft

[lusty grotto]

if only sliver didn't exist or was actually better though

[sick sentinel]

What's a shadow priets

priest

[molten atlas]

sorry

void priests

[sick sentinel]

Shadow priest utility ????

MD, dispel, what else?

[lusty grotto]

pw: shield

mc

[sand egret]

VE

MC negating Bolster is a lovely interaction

[sick sentinel]

MC does what?

[lusty grotto]

if you mc a mob it doesn't get bolstering

[sick sentinel]

Oh lol

VE is also good

I'll give you that

As in, last boss td

For example

[exotic spoke]

Mass dispel and life grips are nice

[lusty grotto]

ah yes life grip

riki nimchy run?

[worn vine]

@soft kindle help @sick sentinel learn to read please

[candid ledge]

Hey all, would I benefit more from Vampiric Seed rather than Resounding protection for M+? RP did 7,8% of my total healing in a 16+ WM atm.

[lusty grotto]

no

go RP all the way

[sick sentinel]

more healing is generally better

[worn vine]

idk try in higher keys

[candid ledge]

One RP is around 2,5 heals from VS, but that's during the fight, the other is in the end

[young marlin]

Prevention>Healing. RP is not healing nor is IP, it is the only way the game can classify it but in the end, preventing damage rather than healing it back is better

[candid ledge]

Im from 15-17 atm

[lusty grotto]

wrecktar is correct

[worn vine]

try it in a 20 and reactive healing is always better for tanks

[candid ledge]

Yeah that's what I thought, maybe it's just this week that felt I needed intensive healing

[lusty grotto]

we're in #protection here, not Archerus

reactive healing smh

[candid ledge]

Each pack felt like a train

[lusty grotto]

its fort week

[candid ledge]

Yep

[lusty grotto]

right im saying its fort week so that's expected

[candid ledge]

And it's also extra fortified mobs

twice the size, twice the fun

[worn vine]

3x DC and 3x BoM

this week

[young marlin]

Did a 19 KR and everything was putting me in the ground. Healer wasnt very strong but 1 melee from a champion wirh SB up doing 45% of your health before its enrage is hilarious

[worn vine]

get more mastery then

[candid ledge]

I am at 3xBoM, 2xDC 1x Tradewinds 😂

[lusty grotto]

who is this guy

lmao

"get more mastery" wtf lmao

[worn vine]

more mastery = more critical block

[molten atlas]

hes right

[young marlin]

Why would you rock 3 DC? You want as you always do in M+ 1 DC 2 BS and 3 BoM or more defensive 1 DC 3 BS and 2 BoM

[lusty grotto]

you have 3x BoM, you don't need more mastery

you go crit

[worn vine]

3 dc is more damage

[lusty grotto]

for parries

stop spreading misinformation pleease

[young marlin]

That however is the stupidest thing to say, get more mastery.

[worn vine]

more mastery leaves you less succeptable for RNG

[lusty grotto]

smh

[young marlin]

RNG isnt what kills a Warrior. It is poor play

[sick sentinel]

guys

is it just me

[molten atlas]

actually

bad healers kill warriors

[worn vine]

also during fortified 3x DC = less time tanking = less damage income

[lusty grotto]

@soft kindle who is this Nappur guy?

[sick sentinel]

or do I fucking get trucked in +16 +s with 401 gear

[young marlin]

Okay @molten atlas is also right

[sick sentinel]

on these aff

[lusty grotto]

DC doesn't even stack defensive wise lmao

[molten atlas]

1 DC is all you want

[worn vine]

it does when you kill things faster so you take less damage

[young marlin]

And damage stack on DC is nothing compared to BoM

[molten atlas]

thats not how this works lol

[lusty grotto]

please stop 😢

[undone sun]

at that point it's incredibly marginal

[candid ledge]

I think he got your point

[sick sentinel]

[worn vine]

if you wanna be defensive just run 3x iron fortress and 3x brace for impact if you wanna take less damage but i thought we were playing bfa not cata tanks 🤷

[young marlin]

So after our long discussion... RP is better than the later

[lusty grotto]

this guy must be trolling hard

[young marlin]

Iron fortress just doesnt feel as defensive as BoM imo

[lusty grotto]

or trying to troll

you ain't wrong about 3DC, but that's about it

[young marlin]

The best in the business run 1 of 2 set ups

1 DC, 2 BS, 3 BoM

Or

1 DC, 3 BS, 2 BoM

[worn vine]

bloodsport is so lame though

[young marlin]

And for good reason, BoM is out best damage stacking trait

[lusty grotto]

Blood sport, no

[undone sun]

imo bs isn't even good for it's purpose

[mortal brook]

blood sport pog

[young marlin]

BS is best healing trait after AV

[undone sun]

¯_(ツ)_/¯

[molten atlas]

need that leaach x

[young marlin]

^

[lusty grotto]

ok this is very clearly trolling

[sick sentinel]

defensive wise

[molten atlas]

leach + thunder fap

[undone sun]

raw healing isn't exactly something warriors aim for

[mortal brook]

meh, prevent the damage in the first place with fortress or bfi instead

[molten atlas]

we must become DKs wdym

[sick sentinel]

is 3 BoM, 2 IF 1 D the best ?

What is this

fortress pog

[lusty grotto]

if you're trying to get advice, please pay no attention to this right now

[undone sun]

leech is trash, IP doesn't absorb really enough to stack for it

[sick sentinel]

Fury ishaving a civilized discussion

And prot is a shitzhow

The fuck

[mortal brook]

someone brought up leech what you expect

[lusty grotto]

dunno seems just a few trolls coming in

[sick sentinel]

[young marlin]

I know, people dumb these days

[sick sentinel]

that is rude

maybe he genuinely feels that way

[worn vine]

pretty rude maybe i enjoy 3x dc and 3x bastion of might

[young marlin]

I said dumb, not stupid xD

[lusty grotto]

3DC and 3BoM is not bad at all, just not worth if you're having trouble with fort packs

[soft kindle]

Hello

[molten atlas]

the only reason for DC is for the demo shout

[soft kindle]

why am I pinged

[young marlin]

If it works for someone, then their playstyle isnt wrong. But when you have to push higher because your playstyle isnt working... Then you can

[lusty grotto]

dunno i thought you knew these guys

[worn vine]

if you dont die in one hit then you can always be healed through it

[exotic spoke]

@lusty grotto sure. Grabbing a beer and dinner but sure I’ll do a nimchy run give me about an hour

[young marlin]

Wrong

[worn vine]

so why not run more damage to get the packs done faster

[soft kindle]

I see DC mentioned

are people being dumb

[mortal brook]

imagine nappur in #protection

[soft kindle]

It sounds like people are being dumb

[exotic spoke]

You take DC for more damage as well afterwards

[young marlin]

Are you timing 23+ keys Nappur?

[lusty grotto]

so hes a fury/arms tard or something?

[soft kindle]

n

guardian

[mortal brook]

he's a bear main \o/

[lusty grotto]

O

figures

[molten atlas]

ah

[sick sentinel]

the fact that anyone thinks this dude even plays warrior is beyond me

[lusty grotto]

thyme didn't even give a heads up

[undone sun]

¯_(ツ)_/¯

[mortal brook]

@undone sun pls

[worn vine]

@undone sun knows i have to get enjoyment somewhere because its not from maining bear

[molten atlas]

can never have neough @undone sun

[lusty grotto]

yikes

[exotic spoke]

After the 3 BoM 1 Dc shell you pick two to suit your needs.

[molten atlas]

^^

[exotic spoke]

Personally trying out the triple Dc soon

[lusty grotto]

why dont you enjoy bear though, some prots here do like it :p

at least its not VDH lmao

[exotic spoke]

And finding what fits for different weeks / key levels

^^

[worn vine]

oh i have a 410 vdh alt dont worry

[lusty grotto]

you're a masochist

[exotic spoke]

I found out that at high keys they tank by kiting... fuck that noise

[molten atlas]

if your speedclearing 7-10 3x DC might work

[sick sentinel]

prot warriors

anything works

[exotic spoke]

I mean - I’m taking 3 BoM 2 DC 1 If into 20s this week

[lusty grotto]

you can certainly 3DC on higher than that, its just not recommended for people struggling with fort packs

[young marlin]

Triple BoM triple DC will net you some big M+ damage #s and it wont matter till 18+ for you to see why you should run leech on gear especially with the +2.50% leech weapon enchant.

[soft kindle]

Additional DC is a thing if the other traits are garbage, but that's not exactly common. Multiple DC is not optimal beyond damage meme

[exotic spoke]

I would be doing 3 DC and 3 BoM this week if I had it

[lusty grotto]

@young marlin no

stahp pls

[sick sentinel]

TC was more dps for me than dc was

[undone sun]

fucking leech

really

[exotic spoke]

Leech isn’t worth a damn.

[undone sun]

stop

[soft kindle]

did someone

lol

[mortal brook]

where's the montage

[molten atlas]

stack leech

[soft kindle]

alright we got

[molten atlas]

become a DK

[lusty grotto]

inc

[worn vine]

god what did i start

[exotic spoke]

Also, can’t get leech ifnyou cant get tertiary stats

[soft kindle]

mad pepega shit in prot today

[sick sentinel]

wait, we're not all stacking leech? :^)

[soft kindle]

cya 👏

[worn vine]

im going back to dreamgrove

[molten atlas]

im staacking leech

[mortal brook]

indestructible is the superior tertiary 📌

[young marlin]

Well 23s are much easier with leech so yes.

[molten atlas]

oh no

[sick sentinel]

ive heard avoidance is best

[mortal brook]

eyyy

[sick sentinel]

go full offensive gear/traits then stack leech... maximum value

[worn vine]

not even i could single handedly start a discussion as stupid as leech's value

[sick sentinel]

do more damage and heal from it more

:^)

[exotic spoke]

@mortal brook I agree. I have an indestructible 415 shield and it’s fucking amazing

If your gear never takes durability loss - can you really die?

[mortal brook]

\o/

[undone sun]

@potent anvil you can't hide

[molten atlas]

if your sheild is indestructible then you dont take any damage if you block

[lusty grotto]

i count a couple of budget BDKs in here

[potent anvil]

I was trying to type something in WoW, but didn't realize I was still on discord. I caught myself early

[mortal brook]

my bdk has no leech! hype

[lusty grotto]

blasphemy

[sick sentinel]

my bdk's name is big dink

[fringe plank]

What tier 3 are you guys going for in m+? Azerite Globue seems good for aoe

[molten atlas]

What sort of budget bdk isnt stacking leech

[potent anvil]

Also, you don't need leech for high keys. I've done 23s without it. If that's what's going on, I haven't kept up.

[young marlin]

Self healing with DS doesnt heal you with leech. Bam

[exotic spoke]

Back to the base discussion that matters and isn’t a shut show. I personally am trying to get more aoe dps since I’ve realized I don’t need the physical damage mitigation

[lusty grotto]

depends on what you have @fringe plank

[fringe plank]

tier 2*

[molten atlas]

it still comes down to this - if your pushing high keys and need extra durb buiild around it

[worn vine]

honestly i stack leech on my bear

[molten atlas]

if your just farming 10s then grab extra damage

[lusty grotto]

i mean what other traits you got

[worn vine]

also @molten atlas it really comes down to using the correct form of you're

[molten atlas]

obviously callous reprisal

[sick sentinel]

cant tell if memeing about CR

not really a bad trait

CR is not nessesarily bad

[undone sun]

better than BS

[mortal brook]

not a bad trait. not a great trait. an equippable trait

[sick sentinel]

I had TC last week for more damage

[young marlin]

Its bad because of how difficult it is to maintain stacks sometimes

[sick sentinel]

but I switched for CR for this week

because I was getting trucked in WCM lmao

its not really hard to maintain your stacks

first of all if you are switching to CR for defense, look elsewhere

[molten atlas]

im usually spamming revenge procs anyway

[sick sentinel]

@sick sentinel it's about not having enough uptime

[young marlin]

Brace is better for defense than CR

[sick sentinel]

to justify it

[fringe plank]

Does anyone know that WA that shows DR on stuns next to nameplates?

[sick sentinel]

and it is a good amount of damage, as I spam revenge

I am just defending its use. I am not saying to use or not to use

I use on weeks with chad pulls

cause prot warrior

I have like 1200 crit rating

so it's free all the time

because I just parry shit all the time

[molten atlas]

^

[sick sentinel]

would you say you crit your pants on occasion

[molten atlas]

stack crit

do more damaage with 3x DC

ezy pzy

[exotic spoke]

Ahh beer... let’s borrow happiness from tomorrow for today

[sick sentinel]

there is no happiness

we are tanks

[molten atlas]

i dunno

happier thaan a bear main

[worn vine]

what you got against bears

[sick sentinel]

bears meta next season 👀

[molten atlas]

say it isnt so

[soft kindle]

It isn't so

[molten atlas]

thaank you

:D

[undone sun]

🤣

reaching for the stars there

[sick sentinel]

vdh meta

prove me wrong

[oblique garnet]

leech?

[molten atlas]

LEEEEEECH

[undone sun]

vdh's meta isn't even good, how do you expect them to get into the meta

🤣

[terse dragon]

Will last stand (bolster talented) block the meele attacks that give reap soul

[sick sentinel]

vdh meta

as in

their only cd?

@terse dragon no

[lusty grotto]

you still get reap soul even after blocking the melee hits

[molten atlas]

block - blocks auto attacks / empowered aa's

[lusty grotto]

that applies to any melee hit that applies a debuff

[terse dragon]

When do you guys use last stand?

Start of big pull?

[lusty grotto]

to cover sb gaps

mostly

[molten atlas]

after 3 sheild blocks

[terse dragon]

Got it

I am so dumb

[molten atlas]

3x SB - last stand - 3x SB

[terse dragon]

I thought for months it was shield wall that was blocking meeles

[lusty grotto]

there are some situations where you can use it out of order

[molten atlas]

if your getting burst hit laststand

[lusty grotto]

its not always gonna be 3x SB LS 3x SB

[molten atlas]

^ is best covereage though

[lusty grotto]

just gotta remember you're blocking

[molten atlas]

coverage"

remember against some bosses - 3rd boss in ML , she hits with fire damage so you only use ignore pain

[terse dragon]

Blocking will cause me not to take the meele hit? Or just reduce the meele attack dmg?

[lusty grotto]

reduce

[terse dragon]

Hahahs I got to 2.2k score not knowing this shit

[sick sentinel]

if you parry the reap soul attack

you take no damage and no stack

[molten atlas]

or if you dodge"

[lusty grotto]

same with dodges, but prots can't dodge unless you win the lottery with a NELF

or whatever class has a passive with dodge

[molten atlas]

i have 3% as a human ;-;

[sick sentinel]

we have a 3% base chance

[lusty grotto]

true true

[sick sentinel]

but I have like 30% parry

[terse dragon]

So how much block rating does the last stand buff give

[worn vine]

100%

[lusty grotto]

it doesnt

[molten atlas]

i should racechange into dwarf though

[lusty grotto]

last stand does not give block rating

[molten atlas]

need that 10% DMR

[lusty grotto]

it gives 100% block CHANCE

[sick sentinel]

it gives block chance

not rating

[terse dragon]

Ok so is it bad to stack Brace for impact azzy?

[undone sun]

not really ideal

[terse dragon]

That gives block

[oblique garnet]

depends

[molten atlas]

its fine if you dont have better traits

[sick sentinel]

BFI good for single target damage

[exotic spoke]

Wu-Tang is for the children!

[mortal scaffold]

hey guys whats the best horde race for prot warriors?

[exotic spoke]

If you need more defense it’s not terrible. But typically we don’t need more defensivesn

[molten atlas]

blood elf

[terse dragon]

Ideal setup for m+ is 3 DC 3 BoM?

[exotic spoke]

@mortal scaffold whatever you think it’s cool

[molten atlas]

:(

[mortal scaffold]

im tauren atn but i dont like the bigness

[exotic spoke]

@terse dragon 3 BoM 1 Dc and pick two to suit your needs

[molten atlas]

@mortal scaffold blood elf

[neon tangle]

@terse dragon Jus to be sure, "ideal" doesn't mean to drop ilvl, etc for it

[exotic spoke]

Hendreks I play alliance but personally my alt horde warrior is goblin. I like the looks and I like the haste

[undone sun]

dwarf

[neon tangle]

and 3xDC isn't really ideal

[stoic pilot]

fun to use though

[neon tangle]

there are other traits that do more damage, and at the same time give you more defense

[molten atlas]

yeah iits situational

[exotic spoke]

But the aoe dps it gives

[sick sentinel]

👡 ari troll checking in

[stoic pilot]

I wish I had some TC in place of my 2x dc

[neon tangle]

@exotic spoke There are traits that give more aoe dps?

[stoic pilot]

But it is nice doing 35k+ dps this week

[exotic spoke]

But the memessssss

[molten atlas]

just have BoM x3 and atleast 1 DC

rest is preferance

[exotic spoke]

^^

[molten atlas]

as much back and forth about how op leech is its still a preferaance

[neon tangle]

Is there a back and forth on it?

[undone sun]

if you can get it for "free" on same ilevel and statted pieces, sure go for it

but it's objectively worse if you dont

[sick sentinel]

"6)Leech is a meme and should be treated as such, it's good when you have it on gear you would use anyway but you shouldn't drop ilvls for it"

[molten atlas]

^

i mean its not a meme

but dont drop ilvl for it

[somber sky]

i just recently rolled a prot warrior from my fury. what exactly should i keep on cdr all the time apart from the ignore pain? and is it okay to keep my big defensives active when fighting big trash?

[undone sun]

🤦

[molten atlas]

:(

[sick sentinel]

@somber sky read icy veins

#268491842637660160

[somber sky]

i'm on it

thanks!

[molten atlas]

actually

[worn vine]

has anyone tried simming with AMR recently for dps?

[exotic spoke]

@sick sentinel what would you pick for your two “choice” traits if you want to maximize dps for pushing keys - and dontnneed survivability

[undone sun]

🎣 @worn vine

[sick sentinel]

TC

[somber sky]

do tanks sim?

[undone sun]

gr8 b8 m8 i r8 8/8

[sick sentinel]

@somber sky eh

[exotic spoke]

Fair

[sick sentinel]

"do tanks sim" if you are a chad yes

[somber sky]

i mean

[sick sentinel]

alpha chad prot warrior sims

[somber sky]

i like being a chad

[undone sun]

for damage, yes we can sim

[sick sentinel]

beta cuck prot warrior does not

[undone sun]

defensively, no tank can or will

[worn vine]

i sim on AMR

[molten atlas]

https://www.wowhead.com/protection-warrior-mythic-dungeon-guide#azerite-chest-slot @somber sky

[somber sky]

but i can't cus i'm a cuck fury warrior

@molten atlas thanks!

[sick sentinel]

beta* cuck

NO

NO

NO

NI

'NIO

[molten atlas]

^_^

[somber sky]

nu

[sick sentinel]

NOT THE LEPAN GUIDE

[undone sun]

🤣

[sick sentinel]

PLEASE

[undone sun]

block cap lepan

[exotic spoke]

RIP

[molten atlas]

your welcome @somber sky

[somber sky]

wait what why?

[molten atlas]

shh

[soft kindle]

Some dumb shit

[exotic spoke]

Go to icy veins

[somber sky]

what's giong among you chads

[soft kindle]

tldr

[sick sentinel]

it's GARBAGE

[exotic spoke]

Markos guide is better

[stoic pilot]

It’s funny cuz

[exotic spoke]

Maroks*

[stoic pilot]

His blood dk guide was Garbo too

[soft kindle]

Well not garbage , but it's got some pretty big inaccuracies

[sick sentinel]

dont follow a guide

best way to get good at the game

[lusty grotto]

please delete that @molten atlas

[stoic pilot]

Yeah just follow your heart

[molten atlas]

i was just reading this well crafted guide

am back

[exotic spoke]

Honestly - a guide is great for new players. Here’s the basics. Know theses before you break / bend the rules you just learned

[lusty grotto]

poor people looking for advice

[exotic spoke]

Especially for prot

[lusty grotto]

😦

[worn vine]

https://i.imgur.com/pCmhRkh.png

@undone sun

[undone sun]

stop

[worn vine]

thats a tough boy

[sick sentinel]

i is TUF

[undone sun]

TUF boy

[oblique garnet]

the only good thing about lepans guide is the thing where he tells how to deal with different mobs dungeons

[exotic spoke]

Wtf is that?

[oblique garnet]

if that even had it

[lusty grotto]

lmao amr

😄

[sick sentinel]

amr gives most accurate sim

[lusty grotto]

i honestly feel bad for the people that make it

[molten atlas]

wait

are you telling me

[sick sentinel]

@oblique garnet do you see lepan's stat prio?