Braces with leech and crit/vets.
#protection
lime mantle
lime mantle
@west galleon because blizzard has a fetish withgoing one step forward 4 back.
oblique garnet
@full spruce i mean now that you have done that you have no reason to log on
full spruce
@oblique garnet I still have 10 m+ I gotta cycle and Mythic champs on 5 alts. Might try and push each one each day to jadefire cycle through. I can spam more heroics? But all of them need a lucky war or tf to make it worth.
Soon as guild kills jaina I can actually Mythic raid. Just twiddling my thumbs
oblique garnet
Yup
full spruce
Left prog Rasta to now sitting for 4 weeks
west galleon
rasta is ez
lime mantle
385ilvl item lel
west galleon
i believe in u
oblique garnet
Chasing for titanforges will burn you out
lime mantle
@west galleon t-thanks. I’ll report back Monday.
full spruce
Pally was 10k begins so I spent all afternoon and night doing Mythic islands. Gross
Behind*
lime mantle
@west galleon I’ll stutter at you if that makes you upset, your anger and annoyance only drives me further.
But yeah, Rasta mythic boys.
Time to have fun because my guild refuses to do opulence but cries I have no tank trinkets!
orchid token
@ionic fern yesterday I got hit by Jez knives and got ported through the floor by them
oblique garnet
Tank trinkets for mythic🤔
ionic fern
Working
As
Intended.
west galleon
not really anger or annoyance just disgust
ionic fern
😂
orchid token
Opulence tank trinket for anything 🤔
oblique garnet
Opulence trinket is nice
lime mantle
@west galleon it’s the same.
@oblique garnet it’s the same people who say I am squishy and I should use dps traits (when the choices are dc or bfi, or dc and fury swipes) then don’t heal me for extended periods of time and are surprised I die.
They also scream I go around with 2 dps trinkets
🤷
west galleon
pretty sure diff definitions but stop pinging me plz
orchid token
opulence trinket is nice for any situation where you need sustained throughput help in order to live
but those types of deaths are rare in a raid
you usually die very quickly if you do die
prism doesn't really help with that
lime mantle
They decide to not heal (and Druid forgets to hots) for 10s or more
orchid token
its benefit is spread so thin over time that at any given dangerous moment it will contribute very little
give me a trinket that takes the absorb of prism over a 1min period and give it to me as a 1min CD on-use absorb instead
now we're talkin
aka mchimbas but with actual meaty numbers on it
a 415 prism is what, 100k absorb every minute
give me that as a 1min CD on-use and that's a defensive trinket
oblique garnet
70k
orchid token
that sounds too low
oblique garnet
It is 70k
orchid token
yeah my 415 one is 12.3k every 8.3 seconds
lime mantle
As said before, they stop healing and then wonder how I died.
lime mantle
Denote they also don’t tell me when they stop healing
oblique garnet
Oh you meant it like that
oblique garnet
The max cap on the shield is 70k ish
strong forum
My diamond is exactly 2k/s in dungeons due to varying haste levels
orchid token
because you're talking about balancing it out to be the same amount of absorb over time
west galleon
considering it doesn't proc .2 no you round down
orchid token
okay you're not understanding the point
if you round it down then the extra bit you rounded away will just roll into the next minute
so if you're trying to claculate its absorb per minute you use the decimals
oblique garnet
Opulence trinket is good on jaina which has consistent damage
orchid token
yeah, im not talking about the max cap
im just saying, take the amount of raw absorbs over time you get from a prism and give yourself the ability to cram the entire value into an actual dangerous moment
instead of spreading it thin over multiple non-dangerous moments
if you're not in danger then prism is functionally useless
looks nice on meters but isn't actually helping
strong forum
So is any defensive trinket
orchid token
Not true
strong forum
Big true
orchid token
because an on-use can be used when you need it
If prism was an on-use absorb instead of a passive tickrate absorb then you could use it to prevent your death
cover some SB downtime
strong forum
I wouldn't use it then
orchid token
or a damage spike
strong forum
Cuz on use shield is garbage 99/100
orchid token
What
lucid bough
not really how it should
orchid token
that is literally not how tanking works
On use defensives are always better than uncontrollable passives
assuming equal overall power
west galleon
it's less mana needed to keep you up
orchid token
Because tanks don't die to overall damage taken
west galleon
pretty helpful
strong forum
Neither is a on use trinket that you never use cuz there's no spike damage
orchid token
If there's no spike damage then you won't use a defensive trinket at all
on use or otherwise
because you're not goign to die
strong forum
Exactly
orchid token
but in any fight where you can die, an on-use will do a better job at saving your life
oblique garnet
There isnt much tank damage on the raid
strong forum
If you die it's a fuck up from you or your healers
orchid token
90% of the time the absorb ticks from prism are just absorbing damage that would have been healed by your next rejuv tick from your druid
it shows as effective healing on the meters
but it didn't actually help you
strong forum
Lo
It's damage you didn't take
Period
That's like saying don't use ignore pain cuz it'll be healed by rejuv
Loo
ionic fern
In m+ it pays off since you're constantly taking damage.
west galleon
yikes big brain
ionic fern
In raiding i'd rather use a on-use absorb as well.
orchid token
Scenario A - you are at full health, not in danger. you absorb 12k with prism. rejuv ticks and overheals. you're at full health.
Scenario B - you are at full heatlh, not in danger. you take 12k damage without prism. rejuv ticks. you're at full health.
lime mantle
(Honestly my healers are very bad and assume using wall on taking bite or smashx2+throw as “randomly using” shield wall)
orchid token
both scenarios have the identical result
orchid token
constant damage is irrelevant
strong forum
Lul
orchid token
you don't die to constant damage
strong forum
M+ likes to differ
orchid token
the only difference between a tank who takes 40k DTPS and a tank who takes 37k is that the first tank's healers overheal more
strong forum
Mana likes to differ
west galleon
exactly lmfao
strong forum
Only if you have a druid
orchid token
prism is not going to save your healers any casts
west galleon
hots don't heal 40k
strong forum
Which 9/10 you don't
orchid token
you should look at yourh ealing breakdown sometime
orchid token
and count up how many actual direct heals you get in a fight
strong forum
In dungeons with like 4 groups pulled
orchid token
it might surprise you
strong forum
:^)
oblique garnet
Idk
strong forum
Raiding is fucking whatever
oblique garnet
Last week with all the giga pulls my dtps wasnt over 20k
strong forum
Grats
ionic fern
orchid token
and they overhealed 70%
ionic fern
That was on +23 WM
oblique garnet
Yeah dtps on warrior is really low
strong forum
I know that
orchid token
that was on paladin
strong forum
It's never really high I know that, my shaman barely has to heal me
orchid token
Atonement 16%
Holy Shield 12%
HOTP: 6%
chain heal bounces: 6%
Bulwark of Light 6%
and so on
the highest direct heal was healing wave at 2% of my healing
7 total casts
so
tell me again how prism saves healer mana?
all of that shit happens with or without prism
the only difference with prism
strong forum
Over the course of a dungeon prism does like 5m absorb
ionic fern
Okay, i think we're talking about two different scenarios..m+ and raiding.
orchid token
is that those heals overheal more
strong forum
It's5mil dmg you didn't take
orchid token
oaky?
just because it shows on the meters
doesn't mean it was useful
by the very nature of absorbs they always go before healing
so they always show as effective
orchid token
if you absorb damage and a healer's HOT later overheals a tick instead
the absorb was functionally useless
evne though it looks good on meters
sand egret
oooo this is a fun one....
orchid token
IDK, i still don't die to damage over time in M+
sand egret
🍿
strong forum
Overhealing in m+... That's new
orchid token
in M+ you die to spikes of damage when you mitigation is down or mob abilities smack you
just like raid
here's the thing
i dont disagree thatp rism is good in scnearios where your healer is struggling with throughput
i just don't see those scenarios beign common enough to justify prism in 99% of situations
because i can count the amount of times ive died to throughput related issues this expansion on zero fingers
brittle owl
in a world where idol exists
why would you use prism if you could use the latter lmao
oblique garnet
Because idol is not good
orchid token
if I die, whether it's M+ or raid, it's because an ability got fucked up, whether it was a mob ability that should have been interrupted or my own defensive that should have been active
strong forum
I prefer prism over idol
brittle owl
i mean, you can prefer to be suboptimal sure
oblique garnet
To effectively use idol you would need to be low and have 7 mobs around you
brittle owl
idol is a no contest
orchid token
Okay
oblique garnet
Which doesnt happen
orchid token
If you're not low
brittle owl
or 7 allies
strong forum
This
orchid token
you don't need defensives
orchid token
I can't think of a M+ situation where you won't have max target count
brittle owl
or raid
ionic fern
Okay, first of all..Idol is actually really good in m+ and you WILL get the most out of it in every scenario other than a boss fight.
oblique garnet
For the heal to matter?
orchid token
^
strong forum
Prism lowers the chance of dropping low in the first place, not saying you should use it over offensive ones
brittle owl
it doesnt lmao
brittle owl
it's super inconsequential
oblique garnet
Yes neither does mine but i dont drop low and this week for example i always have victory rush ready when i do
orchid token
a 12k absorb isn't going to prevent that
brittle owl
maybe ina whole m+ run it saves your healer 1 instance to drink
orchid token
Okay so if you're not dropping low you won't use prism OR idol
brittle owl
if it does that
orchid token
so the discussion is irrelevant
ionic fern
Then you gotta do bigger pulls or higher keys @oblique garnet 😉
sand egret
OH HE SAID IT
orchid token
The discussion about idol vs prism has to be approached with the idea that you're at risk of death, because if you're not at risk of death you won't use either of them
oblique garnet
Did a 22 pulled 3 packs wasnt spicy
sand egret
🔥
sand egret
OH DAMNNN
ionic fern
3 ? 🤔
oblique garnet
Yeah our comp cant do bigger
orchid token
Prism saves a bit of healer mana at best, Idol will save your life. Pick whichever one is more valuable idk
oblique garnet
Not enough rogues for explosives
ionic fern
We did a 23 and pulled the whole raals room + some outside.
🤷
Anyways, i don't use Idol anymore.
oblique garnet
Ele shaman is hella bad for explosives
ionic fern
But it definetly has its uses.
orchid token
I don't use idol either, double on use forever
strong forum
Bro get this, I run double frost mage and ele sham, get on my retard level
orchid token
but if I needed to tweak my defensives up and use a defensive trinket, Idol is on the shelf ready to go and Prism is in the bin
strong forum
And shaman healer
orchid token
I've given away every prism I've ever gotten on warrior to the PvPers in the guild
brittle owl
why not use
orchid token
it's not evne worth having in the bags
old zephyr
idol?
brittle owl
going turtle is a meme in itself
ionic fern
I still prefer Prism in m+ tho. 🤷
oblique garnet
Dropping low on warrior is most likely getting hit in the back or fucking up your mitigation
orchid token
DTPS charts look like this
you're in danger in the peaks
not in danger anywhere else
so in that whole graph I was in danger twice
strong forum
No cuz spirit link :^]
ionic fern
The one time Idol actually saved me was in ML first reaping pull where we had a ton of melee mobs and the healer couldn't dispell me fast enough for the 2nd dot to fall off..there idol heal saved me.
Granted i could have kited but. 🤷
orchid token
Taking tiny absorbs off the entire graph isn't useful, taking big chunks out of the peaks is useful
Cut 5% off every point of that graph you make no difference
You're still in danger at the two peaks
you're still not in danger anywhere else
oblique garnet
Is that a raid or m+
orchid token
Concentrate an on-use trinket into the peaks
strong forum
Bro just spirit link :^)
oblique garnet
In raid you can be in danger sure
orchid token
either, DTPS charts look the same for raid encounters and M+
peaks and valleys
something that helps equally at all times isn't useful
because it doesn't help enough on the peaks
and it's unnecessary in the valleys
you want things you can concentrate into the peak damage events
and that means on-use absorbs and on-use heals
ionic fern
M+ is alot more steady damage taken tho depending on the pull
orchid token
still defined by the peaks
I'd honestly use mchimbas before I used prism
in any situation
although that doesnt mean I'd use mchimbas
strong forum
Loo
orchid token
but I'd use neither
prism because it's badly designed and mchimbas because the numbers are too low
strong forum
I bet you also stack triple DC for that sweet 450k extra overall dmg
orchid token
if they buffed mchimbas by 50% and cut the cooldown by 30 ecs or so to bring it up to the same total level over a minute, I'd use it for sure
ionic fern
I stack triple DC and triple BoM with Gore. 🤷
brittle owl
what's wrong with stacking DC for damage in muhplus lol
what's the issue with going for more dps?
strong forum
I hate triple DC, I did the math and it's by an average of 350 claps with 40% Avatar uptime is like 450k extra dmg
orchid token
the thing with your argument right now is that more damage is always useful no matter how small while more survivability is not
strong forum
Which is 1%
oblique garnet
Id use TC but havent got the raid pieces
ionic fern
😂
strong forum
1x IF is more dmg than 2 extra DC
ionic fern
😂
brittle owl
1% DPS increase >>>> 10% overall damage reduction
also since when does IF do relevant damage lol
oblique garnet
350 claps?
oblique garnet
If does quite alot with 3x BoM
lime mantle
@brittle owl read Iron Fortress
strong forum
Iron fortress is 1.6% overall, extra 2x DC is 1%
So how is that so insane
I don't get it
orchid token
Personally i have two IFs and one DC though that's just because that's how my best setup worked out, haven't got the pieces needed for a good triple DC set
strong forum
It's 900 increase with 2 extra DC 1800 during Avatar
oblique garnet
I need the raid pieces to make that BoM 3x 2x TC dream reality
orchid token
What's the base cd on tc, 6 sec?
strong forum
Doesn't matter
Just take your 550 claps overall in dungeons
40% of that x1800
60% x 900
Boom there's your insane DC damage increase
It's not as much as you think it is
ionic fern
You do realize that DC increases damage outside of Avatar as well right?`
brittle owl
^
strong forum
Didn't you read what I wrote
I'm going by raw trait values
Inside and outside of avatar
ionic fern
Quality math. I'll get home in around 5h and we can argue about it. ❤
strong forum
How is that so hard to grasp
And you can't tell me I'm wrong cuz it's literal facts
oblique garnet
700k extra damage
sick sentinel
I think it's more than 1800
lime mantle
@ionic fern @strong forum ping me when the symphosium of discussion starts
strong forum
1x bombs does 2-3 million
sick sentinel
because 20% from avatar+ a fuckton from bom
oblique garnet
^
lusty grotto
not counting how weapon damage/mastery factors in
strong forum
Literally said going by trait values
lusty grotto
raw calculations can give you an idea, but it's not nearly enough to say "im right"
sturdy sable
Get this. They have this website where they've mathed out everything for you already
sick sentinel
also breaks cc and also procs on the furthest target when he is running to you and hit the floor and make you feel bad
also the speed proc has saved me multiple times
sick sentinel
sometimes you need to tho
oblique garnet
Oof
strong forum
:pepegahands:
Like I said bruv, resto sham ele sham double mage
Giga cucked
Sometimes alt rogue
lusty grotto
uhh
oblique garnet
Hex n loss🤔
strong forum
Sheep bolsters
oblique garnet
Yup
strong forum
So does hex
oblique garnet
Actually fucked comp
oblique garnet
Incap does
oblique garnet
Cage doesnt
lusty grotto
that's a bug then, no cc that doesn't put you in combat should bolster
strong forum
Ye
lusty grotto
and sheep does not put you in combat
strong forum
Sheep puts you in combat
oblique garnet
Yeah but poly and hex puts you in combat
strong forum
They do
oblique garnet
Yes it does
strong forum
Loo
lusty grotto
i mean
i literally ran TD this tuesday
sheeped one of the dudes up to last cannon
we ran through
no combat
mage wasn't on combat either
oblique garnet
Did you shroud?
brittle owl
only CC that doesn't proxy aggro
is cage and sap
everything else at least proxy aggros
brittle owl
sheep and trap iirc aggro the mob
lusty grotto
poly puts you in combat
brittle owl
AFTER the effect runs out
oblique garnet
Aye
brittle owl
dunno about hex
lusty grotto
hex def puts you in combat
brittle owl
yeah, just don't know if it behaves exactly like sheep/hunter trap 🤷
brittle owl
shouldn't tho, if you sheep first, then pull
lusty grotto
^
oblique garnet
It does
strong forum
Sadly does
brittle owl
because the mob as long as it is in the first instance of sheep
is not yet in combat
strong forum
It's weird I guess
brittle owl
can't argue tho cause i didn't test it ever 🤷
strong forum
Cuz it goes aggro after it drops
oblique garnet
The moment you pull any mob connected to the sheeped thing its in combat and will bolster
brittle owl
would explain it i guess
oblique garnet
Can confirm this when we had 13 m sister slapping our ass
brittle owl
had a rogue go in the first room in shrine to get "explosives"
proceeds to pull the templar and the second pack of small dudes
whelp, hf killing that templar
16 x bolster monster
lusty grotto
zone out tho
oblique garnet
Oh wanna learn a trick on how to deal with that
brittle owl
nah
brisk ferry
yeah just reset it
oblique garnet
Let the protectve aura go through while pulling all of them
oblique garnet
You wont kill the initiates before the mob dies therefore no bolster
lusty grotto
rofl
lusty grotto
i know you arent
lusty grotto
did you forget there are people that insta interrupt everything?
brittle owl
that exact pull isn't the reason you time or fail a shrine key tho
brittle owl
that tip wouldve been nice to know before the blob nerfs tho
brittle owl
y i know
strong forum
Literal dead key
brittle owl
shrine was more of a pain at the start of S1
since people were even more clueless than they are now
hence why small stuff like that would come in handy
shrine is still by far
the most difficult key to time out of all of them
oblique garnet
Shrine is pretty easy if you know all the skips
sick sentinel
Shrine is a cakewalk now with all the skips
oblique garnet
2nd boss is also a joke with the range dps safespot
sick sentinel
Assuming you have the Rune while Galecaller is buffed you can just sit rune and ignore interrupts and not spawn tornaders
oblique garnet
Eh
Even if you interrupt all of them as long as your rdps is safe with healer its easy to dodge
(I do not trust them to dodge tornadoes)
brittle owl
idk shrine makes people's iq go below sea level i guess
lucid bough
oh i dont know what that safespot is
brittle owl
last week rando pugs were dying to surging rush 1st boss
sick sentinel
Had a 2,700 rogue die to cleave in a 15 SoTSh
oblique garnet
On the right side where the initate pack is
Stand there
Youre in range of both bosses
Ez
cant get clipped by tornadoes
lucid bough
alright thanks
sick sentinel
Problem is- who takes ranged in a melee Meta? :> Double Outlaw, and token caster.
oblique garnet
Ele shaman > outlul
strong forum
I do, :haha:
sick sentinel
I don't doubt Ele shams
oblique garnet
Also BM hunter
sick sentinel
But I've yet to play with a good one.
brittle owl
double outlaw is stupid on live tbh
strong forum
Cuz my guild only consists of hunter mages and shaams
Or priests
Giga gimped
Well or they are just retarded
Which is the bigger problem
sick sentinel
I usually run Prot, MW, 2 Outlul, and 1 Boomer
strong forum
Imagine having non brainlet DHs...
Can't imagine
Haven't seen a good Dh in months
brittle owl
most have rerolled
oblique garnet
I mean
oblique garnet
Its because you dont do keys with me 8)
sick sentinel
I can't wait for Prot nerfs so all these nerds who are FoTM go away :>
brittle owl
prot fotm rerollers aren't going anywhere lul
strong forum
Fuck fotm
brittle owl
prot won't be nerfed like DK
oblique garnet
It will
sick sentinel
Feral druids pump tho
oblique garnet
Feral is good tho
strong forum
Can hardly beat me yet
sick sentinel
"Undergeared"
brisk ferry
wait wow wow wow, feral is good??
sick sentinel
Sleeper spec
oblique garnet
Pretty much
sick sentinel
Bear druid is next meta, just wait bois
sand egret
Primal Wrath is dope
brittle owl
no utility doe
brisk ferry
hoh damn, maybe I'll finally have a non-tank alt
sand egret
people slept on that shit
brisk ferry
that is true
honest frigate
🤔
sand egret
if only that spec didn't have a pet..
oblique garnet
Most of the people actually sleep on retripaladins
sand egret
Ret is nutso
brittle owl
ret pumps
oblique garnet
When they are stronger than uhdk
sand egret
i dont think people sleep on ret
sick sentinel
Just imagine if they took the 5 target cap off WW for fury and made it work like Blade Flurry :>
sand egret
def not as much as like other off-metas at least
brittle owl
ret is stronger than udh on any non mdi pulls
oblique garnet
In eu you dont see retripaladins ever
brittle owl
but for the mdi udh is still better
oblique garnet
Its not
sand egret
ah, I see a fair share popping up now
brittle owl
it is lol
oblique garnet
Retri does way more than uh does in mdi pulls
sand egret
the Zandalari had something to do with it me thinks
oblique garnet
But unholy gains the str for st aswell
honest frigate
Ret is weak outside of 2 min wings is the problem
oblique garnet
Thats a common misconception
honest frigate
Whereas unholy benefits from reaping meta into bosses for festermight
brittle owl
conparison : udh makes every target burst , retri bursts only from the player
udh scales quadratically
ret scales linearly
steep slope granted
but udh has higher dps potential given enough mobs
sand egret
the spec starts to take off at like what, 20 targets?
brittle owl
15 or so
sand egret
depending on the dungeon, it's really reaping fodder
still nuts, but a tad situational
brittle owl
yes but you don't take a class for reaping
udh needs specific pulls to work
outside of mdi it wont be as good as people think
sand egret
then there's also all the other shit Ret can bring...
brittle owl
ya
sand egret
then it starts to get more convincing 😃
strong forum
Ret can blast insane damage
gritty stream
whats a good indicator that im doing ok as a tank?
honest frigate
No ones saying ret is bad, but it’s damage output over the course of a dungeon when compared to meta classes for pushing keys is suboptimal
strong forum
But only inside wings
gritty stream
Once
brittle owl
woggers
oblique garnet
Thats the difference between uh dk and ret is you dont have to cater the pulls for ret
strong forum
Without wings ret is ♿
brittle owl
i memed on ret for a week
strong forum
And I do play with one from tme to time
gritty stream
honestly im not sure if im actually tanking... cause there is always a DH that comes in and just does his thing
sand egret
well, are the mobs hitting you?
sand egret
then that's a problem right there haha
sand egret
Avatar shouldn't make that an issue, at all.
Unless he's like 30-40 ilvls higher or some crazy shit
brittle owl
sign you're doing decent: people don't yell at you
sign you're doing good : people add you to battle net
gritty stream
@brittle owl out of respect for my peers i do launch a disclaimer in group saying if im bootyhole say and ill swap out
sand egret
it sounds super cliche but it's really necessary
brittle owl
ok maybe stop of healer is oom
lime mantle
@fresh valley dps are weak willed and forgetful, they are sheep to be herd.
brittle owl
also don't overthink things
lime mantle
Keep it simple retard.
brittle owl
tanking is objectively easier than all other roles in raids, and it's not hard in m+ either
gritty stream
all in alltho, its fun so far, queue times are something else. im only ever played DPS and well it feels like i bought a fastpass at a theme park
sand egret
K.I.S.S.
brittle owl
certainly not as hard as healing
or as difficult as actually being a good dps (optimising prio damage while kicking stunnin when needed)
sand egret
I can't remember the last time I waited long in a queue 🤔
lime mantle
@gritty stream my protips;
Don’t do queue content.
Have confidence.
Don’t have your ass so deeply filled with your cranium that you can’t grasp criticism tho.
gritty stream
@gritty stream im all ears for criticism, if im being retarded i hope to fuck someone is gonna say so
brittle owl
and don't be one of those people that use meme setups because "it's my style"
gritty stream
so far ive used icyveins
lusty grotto
some criticism is flat out wrong though, so learn to identify correct criticism
lime mantle
@gritty stream the fact you self pinged made my day btw.
Also do@follow@guides but try to grasp why they say what they say.
lusty grotto
for example if someone mentions siphoning or leech
brittle owl
class discords have you covered as far as class knowledge goes
also what danie said
it's way more important to understand the why
then the what
lime mantle
Ie don’t do “GOOD PLAYER DID X SO X IS GOOD BECAUSE GOOD PLAYER DID X”
gritty stream
@lime mantle point proven, you call me out on being a mong , didnt even realise i did that
lime mantle
@gritty stream it’s fine, it made me happy so it’s all good.
But yeah try to@grasp why people@do the things they do. Also make a macro to tell the healer to drink.
gritty stream
i spent a good hour reading through the guide learning all the different ascecpts.
turns out its not as complicated as i thought.
lime mantle
Tanking is very fucking easy
brittle owl
ya
sand egret
it's not hard in concept
brittle owl
people overcomplicate it alot
sand egret
its doing it while constantly dying
that you can mess up
and when you do
EVERYONE knows
cuz you ded
old zephyr
the basics are easy.
the hard point is getting to know what you can do, what you can't, and with who you can do iy
sand egret
thus, take it slow and build your muscle memory
when you don't have to think about SB
modern brook
muscle memory???
sand egret
and it just happens, is when you just think about the rest of shit
gritty stream
yeah, ive changed my keybinds multiple times so that i have some what of an order
lime mantle
Tanking is having a big dick, it’s nice and everyone knows you have a big dick because you are packing.
Everyone also knows when you have a stiff dick and have been checking out the chick in front of you.
modern brook
wtf are we talking about
sand egret
yeah it's the main reason i fuck up my SB/LS timing
brittle owl
is this not the chode discord
lime mantle
@modern brook my examples have to be as bizarre, filthy and insulting as possible.
sand egret
I have my SB on a shift modifier (like an idiot) so due to it off the GCD I tend to hit LS by accident since I hit (Shift + E ffor SB but that also triggers a Shift +1 for LS)
brittle owl
the phallic discord image tends to suggest that
sand egret
so i'm forever fucked
brittle owl
am i in the wrong place
sand egret
10 years of muscle memory to unlearn
brittle owl
i was sure this was the chode disc
modern brook
🤷
do i look like some kind of nerd who knows what kind of mouse he has
24 dollars; got it from k mart
It said it had a gold usb port
lime mantle
Look has the numpad on the side!
modern brook
but im 90% its just regular and painted
lusty grotto
ive been fat fingering lightfoots
i have them bound to `
sometimes i feel like i intercepted but i just chugged a lightfoot
cause my intercept is 1
lime mantle
Is there any difference between light foot and draenor pots?
lusty grotto
probably not
i use draenic invis pots as invis pots cause they are better than any other, plus you get them for free every day with an alchemy station in the garrison
18 seconds and can walk on top of mobs
lime mantle
Light foot is 150% vs draenic 70^
lusty grotto
well there you go
i just use lightfoots cause they are easy as hell to make
but now i know they are better
lime mantle
Albeit I can see the argument made about there being no real difference
Foot is better (80% more speed)
Doesn’t add swim speed tho
stable orbit
Need help figuring out rings
Ornate (HP 340,180) Parry is 11.39, damage reduction 4.34, Resounding protection 19356, Prism 9840/49200
Igneous (-10ilvl, HP 339,020) Parry 8.23, damage reduction 5.55, Resounding protection 19707, Prism 10059/50297
Is the drop in HP and parry worth for the more defensive mitigation and bigger barriers?
lusty grotto
wtf
im at a loss here, there are traits and trinkets in there
can you be more simple and just list stats
brittle owl
pieces world first
hallow phoenix
Gj pieces
modern brook
wtf
lusty grotto
calm down
i like the fact that hes looking at those values
also what content is this for
i think its important to note
lusty grotto
That depending on content, parry may be more valuable.
modern brook
the whole post was "do i take a ring with -10 ilvls and more verse"
stable orbit
Mythic 10 and higher and BoD is what I’m currently doing
modern brook
and the answer is "probably not"
lusty grotto
im so used to people just fucking listing secondaries instead of all this shit
ok so
modern brook
🤷 the secret is the difference between 2% parry and .8% raw DR will not make or break anything worth discussing
take iLVL as per the guide if you really wanna argue it, drop ilvl because it feels better
lusty grotto
you gain 351 on RP and 1,097 on prism on versa alone it seems... that's very small compared to the HP and the roughly 2 parry you gain
you are calculating absorbs on a trait and trinket
as opposed to your core toolkit
a trinket that you might replace
a trait that could be reroll
modern brook
nice joke! haha!
wooden radish
😆
lusty grotto
in fact, there should be absolutely no reason to calculate trait/trinket values when compared to our core they are supplemental @stable orbit
modern brook
🤷 calculating defensive value at all is not worth while
lusty grotto
ESPECIALLY when it's concerning a ring
modern brook
too many exertnal factors
at the end of the day if you play well and arent vastly undergeared
you shouldnt be dying
stable orbit
Alright, thank helps a lot. Thank you!
lusty grotto
@undone sun cosmo is out of his pen again
stable orbit
Normally I do go overboard with the small details in stuff like this
lusty grotto
its not a bad practice
just gotta consider how meaningful everything you're calculating is
stable orbit
It’s how I played Daoc when you had to on gear
modern brook
WoW is a game for little babies played by big babies
timid jay
They made gearing for tanks basically only ilvl now
modern brook
you barely have to sim on most specs
timid jay
Some exceptions but mostly ilvl
stable orbit
And that part is what I don’t know, I only played WoW for the first time after BfA started
lusty grotto
just so we're clear
2 points into parry
whereas parry eliminates all damage
(also parry is a chance)
means that will have greater value albeit more randomly than a small amount added to absorbs due to trinket/traits
in a dungeon run for example, you will be more likely to parry as pulls tend to have more mobs in them
that's just looking specifically into crit vs versa
there are a lot more things to consider
stable orbit
The icyveins guide is why i actually have this question because the -10ilvl ring +348 sta, +244 haste, +206 vers, the 405 ring is 386 sta, +253 crit, +213 haste. As Crit is the "worst"secondary stat, that tells me i should use the -10ilvl ring
jagged narwhal
Yeah that's the thing for warrior. All the stats are very even
lusty grotto
also that part of the guide is generally written in regards to raiding
stable orbit
correct, that's why its in quotes, my question became based on the icyviens guide, just for clarification
lusty grotto
right
stable orbit
i will stick with the 405 ring with more parry
lusty grotto
crit is regarded the worse of the list for raiding, but all stats are close enough in value (this should also be in the guide)
please say crit and not parry though
parry is one of the 2 things you gain via crit
(the other being crit itself)
final mist
The general idea is “more” stats are better than “better” stats
I.E. if you have a choice between 100 Haste and 115 Crit, take the Crit.
stable orbit
I will keep that in mind
thank you for everyones help
Should I assume that azerite traits change things up a little bit over the more is better idea?
honest frigate
No a 415 piece > 400 piece always. The only exception is you always want one deafening crash. Other than that ilvl>all
lusty grotto
and that is due what you gain in armor + stam + str and secondary stats
azerite traits are added value to your pieces, but they are not as big as the combination of those
stable orbit
Good to know! i have 1 def crash, didn't know for sure if getting a 3rd Baston was a Large enough stat bonus to consider
final mist
You will generally want 3x BoM for M+, yes
Something like 1x DC, 3x BoM, two other traits
Doesn’t matter which you pick
jagged bay
hello have a nice weekend everyone!
lusty grotto
So the first DC used to be an exception to that rule because it extends a damage reduction skill (and a damage done buff with Booming Voice) directly, but even then we don't value it over ilvl anymore since so many pieces have it - this is only when gearing is concerned. You would want 1 DC always though on equal ilvl pieces.
so 6 seconds of extra damage reduction is more valuable than the DR you get via stats
thanks, you too @jagged bay !
jagged bay
thanks! 😃
modern brook
Twinrova is the new catfriend tbh
lusty grotto
nah
marble wave
How do some 20+ key pushers feel about nerf in next season?
silk mortar
Im not one of those but im sure none really cares, it's a minor nerf
lusty grotto
it shouldn't matter because we don't even know what the next seasonal will do
marble wave
50% to talent is over or more nerfs coming?)
lusty grotto
check the pins
marble wave
Trying to play ppal for next season, but trade damage vs surv is so annoying -_-
lusty grotto
not sure why you think protadin has more "survival" but okay
sand egret
Yeah, for all we know is that the seasonal is like "Plate wearers with Rage bars do 10000% increased damage"
they have flashlights
that's a valuable survival tool
sand egret
just living in the dark
lusty grotto
its the power of christ
red wedge
omg
lusty grotto
the power of christ compels them
primal sable
Praise the light
marble wave
Nope, i know pwar has more surv , coz im closing all 20+ keys this season, just talking about ppal trade damage for surv
sand egret
ooo shit Pieces got WF
primal sable
Gotta look fancy while youre dying
sand egret
So, honestly the new essences are going to be more impactful to the tank meta than our UF nerf.
marble wave
But if the next seaso n is closely single tsrget, so protadin maybe has more value
red wedge
free RNG avatars sounds like fun to me.
lusty grotto
perhaps
marble wave
Fotm only
red wedge
isnt there a CD reduc attached to it too?
marble wave
No more
sand egret
yar
red wedge
/drool
primal sable
The only reason i would play prot pala is to chuck my shield around like captain america
red wedge
^
marble wave
@lusty grotto yeah, about sera
lusty grotto
yeah blade why the fuck did they make something so strong to begin with? what are we missing here?
lusty grotto
is it part of the iterative process? hey lets do something so stupidly good that players dont have a choice, "oops, we want to give you more choice - see Soul Cleave"
sand egret
Soul Cleave is legit rationale
lusty grotto
i mean
look
they aren't giving us any choice at all on the neck
its everyone will go with RNG buffs
or nothing
sand egret
maybe
red wedge
I cant see people not wanting to use that Major.
sand egret
depends on how the others shape out
lusty grotto
yeah that's what i mean
red wedge
The others that are out, so far, don't compare at all.
sand egret
but then again, let's say it's the 100% pick
it's basically just a passive buff across the board then
lime mantle
You can nearly reach a 100% avatar status.
red wedge
Yea.. but it sucks that it's a passive buff tied to gear.
lusty grotto
that's the thing though, why do it that way then claim you want players to have more choice into their talents version 8.2 selections
sand egret
those are two different things
lusty grotto
i mean traits/artifact traits in legion/etc are just an implementation of the old talent system
marble wave
Seems like nothing changed to m+ talents anyway
primal sable
If we're gonna get more uptime on avatar cant they make it look better at least
I dont wanna be grey all the time
lusty grotto
naw man
primal sable
Gimme glyph to turn avatar to vrykul
marble wave
But u didnt seems like statue, nope?
red wedge
Oo. Some Avatar Glyphs would be cool
sand egret
ahem, Nim. Avatar did not make you grey though, you were big, bold and more white than anything else
primal sable
Not all of us are boomers
sand egret
nawww that's white homie
marble wave
It looks like statue in wc3 ;)
lusty grotto
sand egret
homie is not all grey
and oh my god was a level 6 mountain king a fucking freight train of pain
no level 6 DH but definitely the best 6 on the human side
marble wave
These days nothing in wow looks like classic wc
neon tangle
@lusty grotto I don’t think they said they wanted to do it because choices
lusty grotto
they wanted to do what?
neon tangle
Add essences
lusty grotto
i mean
lusty grotto
they always ALWAYS fall back on "we didnt give the players enough choice"
lusty grotto
so they make several major traits that you can swap, but only one of them is the one people will use
neon tangle
They’re just doing their normal power creep shit, although honestly some of the essences feel like legion-levels of over the top right now
lusty grotto
then they will go back and "buff" the other major traits
sand egret
so there's a big distinction between "everyone will use" and "other viable alternatives"
lusty grotto
and pull the same soul cleave bs lmao
sand egret
that gets lost in places like here
because after all, if you're here, you're not looking at the game that way
lusty grotto
i don't think there's any distinction at all in this case
lusty grotto
that's beside the point
sand egret
depending on who you ask, 5% difference is either negligible or everything
it's actualyl exactly the point
lusty grotto
is that how you feel about our talents as well?
lusty grotto
do you think that its good design?
sand egret
so which are we talking about?
lusty grotto
let's remove the people that go other talents for example
do you think its good to have absolutely no competitive options in our talents
which then extends to
sand egret
what's competitive?
lusty grotto
do you think its good to have absolutely no competitive options in major traits?
lusty grotto
equally as impactful
ember cape
Whats BS?
sand egret
that is where I think they fall short
marble wave
Bs?