and then ankh totem
#protection
willow scarab
So they’re surviving the 20
I meant expected as in that kills them
I’m excited to die because our shamans have really good totem reflexes
last loom
the 0 % pull
we had to throw a br on a dps that died
so we had no CR for the 2nd tank that died
which meant
when first tank get b locked again
jaina started oneshotting all dps
and we wipe
willow scarab
Could have been on of those classic nobody alive but the pally scenarios
Would have been beautiful
willow scarab
Yikies
willow scarab
Prot warrior isn’t competitive compared to dps classes
outer dew
It means you're not generating as much rage as other thanks most of the time
last loom
on my warrior i go in with dps mentality i get orange parses on all hc kills
i dont do mythic on it so
last loom
https://gyazo.com/3408ebc6f90a058e43e2d6c748d72fb7 i only maybe played my warrior for like a few hours
willow scarab
We just extend Jaina no mythic logs for me
willow scarab
Why don’t you tank Jaina
sick sentinel
How many casters u got in ur core?
sick sentinel
Yes
last loom
y
sick sentinel
unless u for some reason want to torture urself with Veng
sick sentinel
Isn't their damage good but take continuous damage from breathing or something?
last loom
so relearning the fight whilst raidleading playing a spec i never play
not gonna be that great
they have the worst physical mitigation of all tanks
by skymiles
willow scarab
People said that about prot when I got my realm firsts years ago
If you’re dedicated and hate yourself enough - you can do it!?
sick sentinel
I think its more true for VDH unlike Warrior unfor
last loom
not saying its not doable lol. im saying due to the circumstances relearning fight, raidleading nand not playing the spec at all
undone sun
continuous damage from breathing that t alent isn't chosen
sick sentinel
I haven't seen VDH past +10
willow scarab
We did the boat stray
Which just got nerfed
So currently relearning entire p2 and intermission
sick sentinel
@undone sun Damn, I knew I was joking but damn
last loom
why relearn it?
last loom
wat
willow scarab
And we have to learn intermission (albeit easier than before)
last loom
did you cheese boat?
sick sentinel
Boat strat was to cheese phase 2
willow scarab
Yeah
last loom
thats dumb
willow scarab
250 pulls
willow scarab
Not my call
last loom
super easy
willow scarab
People freezing made it happen
last loom
idk
sick sentinel
and put a "blinder"
last loom
we usually
sick sentinel
forget about
last loom
get out of that phase with only 6 stacks
sick sentinel
its not the stacks
last loom
we blast through it
sick sentinel
Its the people freezing
last loom
double speed totem
willow scarab
We’ve never done it without someone freezing
sick sentinel
because they cant look straight or use a thing called the camera
willow scarab
We do double windrush
sick sentinel
Its one thing if ur running to kick jaina, its another when ur AT THE FUCKING BACK
Like my guys
last loom
warlocks can interuppt jaina
sick sentinel
Ur at the back, how the fuck did u freeze but the guy in the front is fine
willow scarab
I like when they freeze before even making it to the room
last loom
without any risk
willow scarab
We have rent pally do it
last loom
????????????????
sick sentinel
They rent a paly
last loom
mele kicking jaina?
sick sentinel
Duh
willow scarab
Bigger brain than warlock
last loom
thats like the stupidest thing i've ever heard
willow scarab
Imagine asking a raider to do 2 things at once
When ret can just press his bubble button and giddy up to Jaina
warm plinth
🔥
last loom
https://www.twitch.tv/videos/408610048?t=02h23m42s here timestamp our wipe
willow scarab
Why did you cancel block
next plaza
ok so... I have a 400 rezan's eye... and I forgot I was in fury loot and rolled a 425 Grongs rage... what do I do?
my other trinket is a 400 diamond lace
warm plinth
Uh...Grong's is less than ideal. However if you want to use it for more DPS, just make sure you use the effect outside of Avatar
It's not affected by any of our damage increases so just use it on cooldown for the most part as long as you won't be using it inside Avatar.
Also at first I was wondering what the big deal was on that twitch video; then I remembered that she's "dead" at 5% lol
spice ferry
Grongs does insane dps
steel mauve
I wouldnt say insane dps, i think its calculated to be decent at single target and used above 6 targets for good dps
spice ferry
It’s stronger than just about anything at ilvl. 425 is insane
zenith ruin
mates does [Reckless Flurry] work for us on the prot ? i mean the increase on AA
broken kite
Yes
undone sun
yes
zenith ruin
thank you
umbral forge
I wish we tanked with a 2H wep and a Shield.
It'd boost our lacking damage when compared to other DPS speccs.
spice ferry
royal dove
should bring gladiator back as a whole new spec, spear and shield combo
spice ferry
hey guys what should i go with?
umbral forge
Erhm
Chest: DC/TC;BoM (whichever you like)
Shoulder: BoM/TC
Head: Iron Fortress & Shield Slam thing
spice ferry
thanks 😄
hollow root
so since prot warrior is about mitigating dmg and blood is taking dmg and healing up, what's the mechanics for the other tanks?
i assume brewmaster is taking damage slowly?
chilly brook
BrM takes more damage over all but it smooths it out over time which means they’re easy af to heal
chilly brook
DH is about getting slapped into the ground while crying about not having enough mitigation
Or healing
hollow root
yeah that sounds like dh
the other classes make sense though, I feel like it gave me a better understanding of prot and I've started to improve
chilly brook
Bear is about rolling your face over your 1-3 keys while also falling asleep
Paladins are prot warrior lite with group utility
umbral forge
Bear has changed a lot. They used to be about dodging and avoiding damage (bad)
Then in Legion they became mana-powered batteries of AoE and soak with a bigger health pool than anything else and a mastery that went like "increase your max health and healing received by x"
DH is the best tank in the game if it wasn't for the fact a Tank also has to deal with taking damage, so yeah what Griff said
dense flame
desert gust
When dealing with magic damage, I assume that our defensives are SR > IP?
warm plinth
Yeah, as well as Demo Shout and Shield Wall, since they both work on all types of damage.
cursive dune
what do you guys think about CoS drops?
timid jay
Since when does court of stars drop
cursive dune
yea
warm plinth
I'm not really psyched for any of them at first glance
silk mortar
It's cool to have that many items have effects but still unsure about them
warm plinth
The Legplates of Unbound Anguish sound kinda cool
Though sacrificing health as a tank is kind ehhh
Abyssal Speaker's Gauntlets would be exciting if the shield wouldn't break in .5 seconds
Wait, how do those formulas work? Guessing it's vers% is what is added, so @ 390, 10086 x [1+5(percent vers)] so 10086x6= 60,516 shield?
old night
@warm plinth have you killed mythic rasta
warm plinth
I have killed 0 bosses in any BfA raids my good sir
warm plinth
I would love to but I have not learned much about that one.
old night
all good buddy
timid jay
@warm plinth not unless you have 600% vers 🤔
rapid trench
What do you need help on in particular
warm plinth
I didn't know how they plugged the number in to those formulas
It's been explained to me in another server though
timid jay
Base shield * (1 + %versa)
rapid trench
I meant the mythic rhasta question ;)
warm plinth
Yeah I assumed with 5% vers it would be 1+5, not 1 + .05
Which is where I got my answer from
timid jay
Example
30000 base shield, 20% versatility
30000*(1+0.2)=36000
As much as I'm memeing in here, I can at least clear up the math
😂
warm plinth
Yeah that doesn't seem very great to me. Would break really fast for a tank.
timid jay
How much absorb is a IP nowadays?
old night
50
timid jay
50k in decent gear or you mean 50%?
old night
%
warm plinth
I think he was asking the amount of damage each cast absorbs
timid jay
ye
warm plinth
And then it would depend on if IP is gonna get consumed first or if that particular item is gonna do the weird 50/50 split
Though I can't remember the other item that did that at this point in time. I'm tired.
timid jay
Cant say I remember all of those interactions 🤔
warm plinth
I know absorbs get consumed first but I'm not sure if IP would go first, or the gloves would go first since they're a full absorb instead of IP's weird shit
ember arrow
@timid jay 👋
timid jay
👋
timid jay
It was so inconsistent it annoyed the hell out of me
warm plinth
Yeah, it's not consistent so I guess we'll just have to wait and see how it works out
stone beacon
distant crystal
@stone beacon scrap em both cuz no leech
hasty quarry
what was once a useful place
jade holly
@old night you are talking about the bwon debuff?
nova gale
This week in m+ @oblique garnet https://youtu.be/v7ssUivM-eM
sick sentinel
@old night ghash knows a metric fuckton of things about prot just by reading the discord but he doesn't actually play that much
wicked ruin
In m+ when should i refresh ignore pain? At half the IP shield left is too early right?
ionic fern
👏
next goblet
is the grong trinket any good for prot?
turbid robin
Hey ma dudes, im a Zandalari troll warrior and been reading some. most say go with krag'wa for the extra mitigation. but what are your thoughts about it?
glacial olive
who's been saying to use krag'wa? 🤔
turbid robin
icyveins/wowhead
old zephyr
the gonk gang would like a word I think
halcyon perch
Good mornin peeps, anyone got a sec to look at some logs and help me figure out where im goin wrong?
sick sentinel
@turbid robin basically nobody here is using krag'wa
By order of popularity I think its paku>bobsalami>gong>kinbul(for some reason)>kragwa
Personally I really prefer paku
turbid robin
@sick sentinel I'll stick to Pa'Ku then, maybe try Kimbuil someday but seems to be way to much rng procc based to get it to stack.
sick sentinel
@wicked ruin you basically want to never cap rage but you also prefer not overcapping your IP
If you are expecting a big hit then you can cap it though
@turbid robin yeah, paku rocks because proc rate scales with haste as far as I am aware
@next goblet grong trinket is garbage
It's a reminder that you should be in prot spec when you kill grong so the trinket gets out of the loot table
next goblet
I figured, just thought id ask before i vendor it.. Socket proc too.. RIP
boreal haven
Greetings ! New to Prot and have a Q . : How do you Guys handle the Situation in M+, if you dont have SB and LastStand available ?
hasty quarry
^^
honest canopy
Friends
we wipe on rasta today
We fortitude the first caress
then we tank totem
the tank dies all the time
i am not doing bowsandi
sick sentinel
Are you using wall or an external?
ionic fern
@boreal haven what kind of pull is that where you don't have enough SB or LS? o.o
In any case you can plan around as Cosmo said or just kite/ask for externals.
honest canopy
I am not doing shit
its the DK
hes dying every time
"its the strat"
they die to reset stacks
🤔
boreal haven
Nothing special. I started about a week ago and did some M+ and got hitted hard because no SB available.
Do i handle this Time with DemoShout ?
IP feels like it lasts for 1 GCD
jovial haven
@boreal haven use shield block and then ip to smooth the damage, when you don't have a SB up use LS/SW if you don't have anything available for some reason ask your healer for an external cd (pain sup/bark/bubble) by time those wear off you'll have sb back up. and use demo shout on cd
@honest canopy if your raid lead isn't a tool they will be open to suggestions, have them look at logs, see what others are doing. If consistently wiping giving it a try for a few pulls isn't gonna hurt anything
honest canopy
Hes not a tool
its just that we killed it last week with this strat
Usually you take one CoD then swap right?
I see a lot of logs
boreal haven
Thx @jovial haven
jovial haven
i'm not sure tbh, i don't do mythic and the heroic i run i do as dps to derp lol
but if you're havin that much trouble on a rekill it can't hurt to try somethin different
honest canopy
Not only that
I check some logs
some just have one CoD done
also, if we dont have 4 doors, they call wipe
we are at 62% or so with 3 doors up ppl have to stand afk
ionic fern
We did that do.
honest canopy
The CoD thing tho
Is SW , LS, Externals (Cocoon, Painsupp+SB etc) enough to stay alive trough one?
Cus I feel I wouldnt die
ionic fern
It's enough to survive throuygh one if you get topped before it happens.
crisp pecan
all IF attributes stacks?
ruby jacinth
m+ trinkets bwons+diamond ?
narrow abyss
Not bwons. Rezan vial goreblock diamond alch whatever u got highest ilvl on
sick sentinel
The only reason I would even use Bobsburger trinket is to see how often I drop to activate it's effect and from their take whatever information i can gather from that and go from there
jovial haven
it's not worth even doing the tbh it has what, a 2 min cd?
smoky mesa
What do you guys think would be reasonable changes to break the m+ dominance outside of a new affix in s3? Not that blizz would listen to feedback anyway..
sick sentinel
The already said it's going to be naga/azshara related
So u can expect something water based
sand egret
thunderclap (with glyph) is super effective against water types. we gonna crush s3
sick sentinel
Ok Battle Pet master
sick sentinel
@jovial haven even with a 2 minuten CD, if that's it's cd, u would activate it on 30 minute run 15 times(if done purposely)
the only time where a CR was a valid external is on zul bleeds and on jaina p3
all the other times a strat should not include a CR, just better play
sand egret
@smoky mesa but realistically, you answered your question. The season enabled favoring AoE (Reaping) and the season scaling from 1-2 not being so dramatic. Players got to +10s and beyond in a flash and are now in the key range where hp pools are scaled so high that dps checks are reality. Thus, the tank who’s AoE is batshit rises to the top.
and block is stupid strong
jovial haven
pretty sure that's what it is @sick sentinel , my pally has it. only reason i say that is cus when it procs i get a 2min debuff. that toon has bad luck with trinkets lol
empty inlet
bwonsamdi trinket is bad becaues the shield part of the trinket is very poor agaist trash in dungeon
smoky mesa
That's true, but bears, pallies and potential DHs have reasonable aoe dps. They are still not commonly used. Knowing blizzard we could end up with a stupid over the top nerf. Although they did well with all the small buffs to prot defense.
empty inlet
paladin is actually in a good state right now just overshadow by warrior because they are stupidly op
paladin without a doubt going to be the best m+ tank when warrior gets nerf
jovial haven
yea, i don't like the trinket @empty inlet but its 1 of 2 high ilvl trinkets the pally got so it's stuck with it for now
rose moat
smoky mesa
Arent there still more high keys done with DK than pallies?
empty inlet
those dk are players who are too lazy to reroll
old zephyr
I feel like dk are better than palies from à healer perspective
ionic fern
Doubt it.
charred matrix
Hey. Is there a haste-cap for Prot Warriors atm?
sick sentinel
Nope
jovial haven
ionic fern
Paladin has enough self heals & now with the new ring they can stack decent traits.
charred matrix
Thanks boys
jovial haven
i don't play my pally much other than emissaries and 1 key a week but it's 401 with decent traits. I just like to have more than 1 character to play to keep from being bored lol
smoky mesa
Guess we'll see tomorrow/in the next days what will happen with traits etc in 8.2.
jovial haven
the interview Ion did after first set of the mdi he talked like he didn't think warriors needing a nerf was gonna be the solution, so may not really have a lot to worry about. they may tune some numbers yes, but i don't think they're gonna bring the nerf bat
fallow terrace
Hey guys. What kinda % hits blocked would you guys consider sufficient for raiding. I see some things say 90% but I don't know how that sort of up time is possible. Is that super out dated
sick sentinel
It's possible, just get better at active mitigation
fallow terrace
Well is it total hits mitigated or just blocked by SB
smoky mesa
@jovial haven that's right hence my initial question to people who play the class extensively what they think would be reasonable changes
old zephyr
@ionic fern maybe I've just played with better DKs 😃
fallow terrace
Cuw if ip goes into it that's different. I haven't raided on my warrior it's just for m+ but I'm going through my guilds other tanks logs
Can one of you who mytjic tanks at a higher level possibly link me some logs for comparison
jovial haven
@smoky mesa i could see some number tuning with thunderclap/avatar to bring warrior dps down some, but hopefully they are beginning to realize that the true issues lies within the other tank classes. Pally does good dps, bears/dhs need help, blood dk needs all spec traits reworked. Not just dps wise but for survival reasons as well. If they were to make the needed changes to those tanks, you would see more of them. Blood dk you still see a lot of, because utility and self heals, but their traits are garbage
smoky mesa
True.. let's see if blizz has a similar idea for 8.2
main aurora
for hidden appearence of artifact warprot we have to equip the artifact right 😮 ?
or diesn't matter
empty inlet
bdk is literatly paper
lusty grotto
anything higher than 60% is good @fallow terrace
as in 60% effective uptime
it is quite possible to hit 90% with swaps
fallow terrace
And do you mean that for SB only Nim. Or just any mitigation like IP included
lusty grotto
no
blocking includes last stand
with bolster
IP is certainly NOT included
you do not block with IP
fallow terrace
Right I wanted to make sure we are talking block and not just mitigation
Do you have any logs you may be able to send Nim so I can look at a better warriors logs as comparison as well
lusty grotto
no
jovial haven
blood dk isn't paper, but they could definitely use help @empty inlet , i mean when you're better off picking generic traits over spec, there's a problem. And the fact that blizz has left it like this for this long is another problem
empty inlet
just look at warrior in top guild's log
lusty grotto
looking at logs right now is kinda useless
everyone outgears content
you're probably gonna see a lot of warriors running deva+rf just to cheese parses
so its def not a good time to look at logs
signal plover
🤔
lusty grotto
in general the effective uptime of block has remained the same through out some time
including past expansions
that's one thing that has remained kinda consistent, keeping in mind how SB's cd is affected throughout
sand egret
not to nitpick but IP is a smoother not mitigation @fallow terrace 😃
signal plover
I'd say the majority of logs are non-meme logs still
modern brook
Not a nitpick imo
IP is to stagger
Well at least in the sense that relying on only it is a good way to die
sand egret
well and that the sum damage is always taken, just distributed. opposed to SB where its basically stagger + 100% purify instantly on a Crit Block
empty inlet
i should join a key where i play last surrener and never press shield block
i wonder how much my healer will hate me 😃
modern brook
As a resto druid main
I would just leave the key after u died the 4th time ause u arent letting me be a cat
🤷
modern brook
d'or
old zephyr
My autocorrect is going rogue
lusty grotto
imagine having block up
and crit blocking
80% of the damage gone
then imagine not having block up
and getting rekt
because you have minimal stam and armor
empty inlet
LUL his ilvl
lusty grotto
there's nothing to talk about there
old zephyr
Lol
lusty grotto
its all physical attack mobs
empty inlet
😃
old zephyr
I know people that would love to get a FH 16 timed 😃
sand egret
doing a +16 with 286 cuz block is busted AF....I mean that should at least raise an eyebrow
old zephyr
inc nerfbat
empty inlet
not exactly 286 though but still insane
he has alot more stats than just wearing everything 286
old zephyr
grievious can't hurt you if you don't have HPs eh
empty inlet
truth
old zephyr
the secondaries though
lusty grotto
ah yes
empty inlet
hes on to osmthing 🤔
old zephyr
he's basically on a non-affix week withouth his gear, but still
lusty grotto
lmao
its hp total though
would be easy if it was just remaining hp
it would disappear as you lose health
old zephyr
grievious is especially easyer on low max HP because you get toped off instantly by anything, clearing the stacks
lusty grotto
yeah
old zephyr
mut regular mobs bashing your head in doesn't change though
old zephyr
i'm pretty sure he is also "kiting" quite a lot of these hits
lusty grotto
at least in the clip he isn't
5 second mark, look at how he dips without block
he also gets immediately iron barked
old zephyr
he also only pulled like 1 or 2 packs
wich is WAYYYY under what you'd do in freehld
but still
lusty grotto
That's 1 pack
In front of the bridge to harlan
Iirc
That being said, that's 1 pack of fort mobs
But yes, that's obviously way lower than you would pull in fh
old zephyr
ha last stand, too much HPs to survive grievious 😃
lusty grotto
he uses it after he dips
weary veldt
is crystaline carapce or strength in numbers better for m+
sick sentinel
Carapace is good for that bit of damage it gives
I'd use it over number since carapace gives some armor when it triggers too I believe
modern brook
Carapace is IF on a middle trait 🤷
I stand by it being one of the best middle options
modern brook
thats Toxic blade
sand egret
this aint the Rogue discord
void heath
Hello guys ^^ anyone of u who got a pawn string for prot warriors?
jovial haven
yes @void heath delete pawn
wary lantern
its better to sim
jovial haven
just take highest ilvl until you have multiple pieces that have same ilvl then simply ilvl>haste>everything else
mint kindle
Anyone know the build for prot pvp?
sand egret
weary veldt
i mean we are a DPS spec
old zephyr
Where is that Screen shot when we need it ?
torn yarrow
hey guys...I was wondering if you take multiple DC traits for m+? 400 more dmg from TC doesnt seem too rewarding imo
lusty grotto
its good for dps
if you do easy keys its pretty decent
otherwise go for other prot specifics
sand egret
more than one DC is a pure and only dps gain. That being said, it's relative dps gain is pretty high per trait
torn yarrow
I mean I can choose from Bloodsport or a second DC...so might aswell pick DC then 😄
lusty grotto
i chose bloodsport
sand egret
that's a defense vs offense choice
lusty grotto
over a 2nd DC
sand egret
pure and simple
lusty grotto
and i chose IF over a 3rd DC
depends again on what you're doing
if you don't feel like you need to be more defensive
then by all means go DC
torn yarrow
well this warrior is meant to be for our meta m+ group
lusty grotto
you will find being defensive is good for pushing keys
as it allows you to pull more
sand egret
I swear these days I feel like the only tank that legit enjoys going down the "tank" route and not just be a closet dps
lusty grotto
meta =/= best traits
sick sentinel
What do u think this is, the fury/arms channel? We aren't a useless spec
sand egret
lol like I like BoM for the crit block part haha
torn yarrow
And I heard that leech is super extremely valueable?
sick sentinel
Oh no
sand egret
jfc
sand egret
i got this Nim
lusty grotto
who whispered this guy
i swear to god, i will find you and i will thunderclap your car in
and if you don't have a car
i will thunderclap your pc
or both
sand egret
Leech is an outlier
torn yarrow
okay well...someone told me that leech is worth like 25 ilvl
lusty grotto
hes a fucking retard
torn yarrow
guess not :D:D
modern brook
^
25 ilvl is like
Teir set dropping
What fucking raganaros-based retard is telling you this
lusty grotto
a stupid nerf/glick fanboy that doesn't know what the fuck hes talking about
torn yarrow
ye I know...I didnt believe it cause thats hella lot of stamina aswell...but if he told me that its like 10 ilvl worth...i wd have actually believe it
lusty grotto
i should check my blood pressure
that one really did get me
all yall trying to meme me dont
but some new dude asking about it
jesus christ
torn yarrow
how is strength in numbers looking then?
mortal brook
nim cares a lot about the community. he invests a lot emotionally and here ppl come asking about leech D:
SiN is great for boosting damage taken from bursting, explosive, and quaking
lusty grotto
strength in numbers compared to what
torn yarrow
I mean its good that I asked about it...cause otherwise I would still run around like a pleb 😄
compared to blood siphon and azerite globules
modern brook
I honestly dont even know what strength in numbers does
i just suggest stuff besides it so i dont have to look it up
lusty grotto
globules is bad
torn yarrow
lusty grotto
go blood siphon over SiN
little grotto
Should i prioritze stacking leech over everything else?
mortal brook
its low uptime as well
sand egret
does SiN give you health on proc or just adjust your top-end?
modern brook
@fierce juniper can we just pin the post "no" please?
torn yarrow
thx for helping guys 😃 its good to have people to answer your questions when you're new to a class 😃
sand egret
Toad, no.
mortal brook
scales it. if you're at 75% health, you get 75% health but at higher topend
little grotto
I was told by alot of people in my guild that leech was best for prot
modern brook
Find a new guild
lusty grotto
sure you were
mortal brook
its not worth dropping ilvl for, no
lusty grotto
its not like a dude said the same exact thing a few lines up or anything
little grotto
Whats your problem nimnuts
lusty grotto
you're not funny man
modern brook
'snot worth it nim
sick sentinel
So I decided to actually read read the lepan m+ guide
lusty grotto
neither is whoever is telling you to ask about leech
little grotto
Good cause im not trying to be funny
mortal brook
@INR is it as bad as the bdk guide?
sand egret
theres talk of haste caps
sick sentinel
The man actually said mastery is equal to haste
daring marlin
open prot chat
mortal brook
'i like stacking marrowblood!' - bdk guide >.>
daring marlin
what the fuck is going on here
sand egret
leech happening again
modern brook
I mean
If u read his explination
you can tell he thinks haste is only useful for block uptime
sick sentinel
Hey guus
sand egret
just a way that “sounds” smart in a skewed, constructed context
old zephyr
lepan said a lot of things
lusty grotto
Lord Sco said a lot of things
old zephyr
I don't think we agree with all of that
lusty grotto
hes the leader of the #1 mythic raiding guild in the world
he said
spec indom
and people laughed
sick sentinel
Omega
lusty grotto
but some did spec it
sick sentinel
Oh no
lusty grotto
it happens
old zephyr
too bad we don't have a Jdot warrior
daring marlin
idk man
lusty grotto
but we do have a good dude representing proper gear
daring marlin
He’s a pretty cool dude
lusty grotto
naowh is our JB
old zephyr
but is no gear proper gear?
modern brook
I just dont get how people can have gearing questions after how detailed MArok explains gear in the guide
Maybe im just especially inundated with it for how often i copy and past it
lusty grotto
im not annoyed by that
old zephyr
i think people don't read the guide
modern brook
I think people say "I read the guide but" like its some secret code to get real answers
sand egret
tbf retention is always going to be an issue, that is why this channel exists
lusty grotto
what does annoy me is people looking at logs/streamer/whoever and then questioning anything explained here
or in the guides
modern brook
@sand egret thats just not true. If you dont retain basic info, u refer back to it, you dont start a dialogue on it
sand egret
you can see a stat priority, know that it exists but not retain the logic explained as to how one got there
thus they come here
modern brook
If the question is something like "Should i stack more verse in Motherload or vs [raid boss]" thats a gearing discussion
sand egret
no guide is perfect, ours included
modern brook
if the question is "how many ilvls are sockets worth" thats a 3 second reference check
I cant recall the last time anyone came here asking why
only whats and hows
old zephyr
but, HOW are we gonna help them then?
sweet kettle
Jes howls?
lusty grotto
Bull it's a simple as to pointing them to the guide
modern brook
I help them by copy pasting from the guide :^)
old zephyr
not why
modern brook
because 
is considered rude
sand egret
i think the issue is when peoplle effectively ask a question that prompts us to basically dictate the guide to them
jovial haven
well something i noticed with the guide and people questions, didn't happen in here, was another discord. i asked if they knew what traits to aim for and they link the screenshot of what guide says, and they thought that bs was a really good option along with cr.
lusty grotto
It's instant gratification, people are used to it,its part of today's society issues
sweet kettle
People who know anything about how you are supposed to play this game know that all they need to do is go to the guide and then play the game people who ask why and ifs are people that are bad at the very least
old zephyr
First thing I do when I read a guide is ask why
sweet kettle
Classic question why is haste better legit are you an idiot that you can't figure it out yourself
old zephyr
because it helps me get a hold of the spec
lusty grotto
Yeah that's the correct approach 4xtch
modern brook
I mean IDT you need to be that agressive about it
lusty grotto
Yeah see
The fact were discussing this is good
Because we are smack right in the middle of both extremes
Which benefit whoever comes in here
jovial haven
i think the thing that tilts people is when someone comes asking because x streamer/player does this or because they didn't read the guide
wary lantern
i am lucky on depleters today lol
lusty grotto
That's similar to what I mentioned but it's not the same. It's the fact that these people come with the pretense that the guides are wrong.
jovial haven
i'll admit sometimes i just skim certain guides, but that's cus i am usually in that class' discord reading chat too so i pick up more that way
jovial haven
yea, a lot of people think they're outdated and wrong, or wrong because someone else they watch or look at is doing something different
old zephyr
the guide are not wrong, they are just beginners oriented
mortal brook
thotbot says haste is improtant to get more sunder stacks out quicker!
jovial haven
but noxxic said stack vers lol
lusty grotto
The guide IS wrong in several places
old zephyr
if you think you have a valid reason to not follow it, then you may indeed have one
mortal brook
who here has a pawn string for me!
modern brook
I remember the BoM saga
lusty grotto
Mastery == Haste being one
old zephyr
where is it wrong?
modern brook
here
sand egret
I generally only have an issue with blind faith. Whether it be to a streamer's word, or a discord or a class guide. Constantly asking why, even to established stuff is healthy. Being open to any potential answer is the hardest part, as it can often mean admitting that you may have been wrong prior. It's the last part that I think gets people as individuals come in here basically on a side-mission to prove others wrong.
old zephyr
if you just want to get going haste = mast is fairly valid
lusty grotto
we were talking about lepan's guide
old zephyr
like I just leveled this toon and want to go
modern brook
reflecting fireball doesnt apply the dot anymore
lusty grotto
how is mastery == haste?
modern brook
🤠
sick sentinel
Simple and what people want to hear
old zephyr
but I mean : if you read it as :
ilvl then get haste-mast wherver you have choice it's okay
modern brook
blcok v good :^)
old zephyr
because if you begin it's one of the best def stats after haste?
lusty grotto
if you're aiming for 3 BoM mastery loses its value
massively
in M+
its Haste + Crit for M+
why?
because you take a shitton of melee hits in M+, and parry is valuable
old zephyr
it is
jovial haven
Hast, is that german for haste? lol
old zephyr
yeah but having 3 BoM isn't exatly doable right from the start
lusty grotto
do you think people stop following Lepan's advice after they are geared?
also does he have a disclaimer that the guide IS for beginners?
see where i'm getting at?
old zephyr
I definitely do
lusty grotto
furthermore, mastery is certainly not equal to haste in any way or form
its good
but its not haste good
modern brook
ilvl though :^(
lusty grotto
right
modern brook
my more stats :^)
sick sentinel
And unfortunately it's use is less for what it does but for it's boost in dps
lusty grotto
i wouldn't say that
old zephyr
man the critblocks
sick sentinel
If we look at it from a non beginnier pov, we'd have to assume the player has a 400-15 shield
old zephyr
even though it does mean block value soft-caps at 42,5% you know (don't listent to that kids it's meme)
sick sentinel
Hard cap, like haste is for 20%
lusty grotto
(and again for any one out there, mastery has nothing to do with how much you block, instead it increases the chance you block without SB or LS up and the chance you crit block)
sick sentinel
old zephyr
WTF is that hard hast cap from?
sand egret
thought experiment: What If......overall net damage doesn't change but gets shifted to DPS and tank specs actually don't deal any direct damage but just threat. How many tanks would be out there? 🤔
additional hypothetical mechanic would be that our threat on a target also decreases the damage they deal to you, thus scaling our "damage"
Would you still tank?
sick sentinel
Shut up nerd
sand egret
so like you know that threat and damage are indepdent values right?
basically remove the damage component
old zephyr
isn't that what BDK does?
sand egret
naw, this is bigger
old zephyr
or doesn't in the case of damage?
sand egret
ok so like you literally do 0 hit points damage in a swing
old zephyr
but Imagine bears
sand egret
but still generate that same amount of threat
old zephyr
literaly AFKers
sand egret
the idea being is this would effectively remove the "dps" component of our kit from a TTK perspective, as it would just be another survivability metric
sand egret
i'm just teasing out the thought of a world where tanks were purely there to take hits and hold aggro, and not considered for their damage per se
old zephyr
everytime you swing you remov a bit of time from the encounter
sand egret
and how that would shift the tanking population
old zephyr
and when it reaches 0 you win
lusty grotto
i mean
old zephyr
if you hit harder you just have to survive less
lusty grotto
0 damage is different than early expansions but
its also similar
because you still dealt damage back then
just very little
sand egret
yeah that's kinda what i'm getting to
lusty grotto
i would still tank
sand egret
just the super extreme version of that
lusty grotto
there's a lot of downsides to that though, but im assuming all content will be adjusted
sand egret
yeah it's a totally hypothetical scenario so we're assuming things were balanced around this
naive panther
All tanks should do prot damage I agree. Scaling is bad right now from last year to this tier for the rest of the tanks.
old zephyr
I wouldn't
naive panther
Tier not year
old zephyr
but i'm not so keen on taking anymore anyway
lusty grotto
reaping goes away next season
modern brook
@sand egret no :^)
sand egret
the other end of the spectrum is that though, all tanks doing prot damage (aka normal dps damage)
lusty grotto
damage will not be as inflated
sand egret
but then we just get tank stacking
lusty grotto
i dont agree with that
all tanks should not do prot damage
that's our utility
if you all tanks do prot damage, BDK will be #1 yet again
sand egret
I hate that damage is our percieved utility
sand egret
it's a terrible edge to balance on
lusty grotto
but as it is, i don't mind
old zephyr
same reason you brng a druid and not a Holy priest in keys
modern brook
UHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
ebon hound
What about being invincible to anything blockable
modern brook
no its not
lusty grotto
no, that would be flat out broken
old zephyr
Oh wait
modern brook
If u remove cats, Druid still brings so much more than preist
ebon hound
No as in, that is our current niche, shrugging off all blockable dmg
old zephyr
yeah I know I know
sand egret
Tame Critter
lusty grotto
also stealth
jade holly
Priest is just hot garbage
quick ice
ever since that one bad dungeon with my guild I'm now a meme
they said theyd rather me tank on my boomkin because at least then i'd have treants
smoky mesa
2nd DC or Meticulous Scheming? Does anyone has xp with this trait? My testing ended up with an uptime of 15-20%
Mainly running 18-20 keys
remote tusk
I can't see this trait listed on Icy-veins. Is it any good for Protection?
It's this or Callous Reprisal
sick sentinel
@quick ice if u weren't trying or fucking up to much, gotta get better
@smoky mesa I'd say go MS
@remote tusk go cr
timber nest
@quick ice what happened in this dungeon
smoky mesa
Tracking shouldn't be the problem, I'll give it a try.thanks guys
remote tusk
Alright, thanks.. wasn't sure as CR is pretty bad and gaining 20% Mastery for 15 seconds didn't sound bad
sand egret
Sounds like your issue is at "CR is pretty bad"
lusty grotto
Cr is not bad
sand egret
and not saying "a chance to gain 20% Mastery for 15 seconds"
lusty grotto
Which is also not as good with 3 BoM
modern brook
THe big thing is that; defensively, random procs loose a lot of value for the reasons stated in the screen shot; where as offensively, CR is just better/more damage over the course of a fight
stiff bear
Sitting on soulspun, pauldrons of the great unifier and the champions mythic azerite gear now.. I only do some m+ with guild as prot. Anything i should try to swap or is it good as is? got double bastion, one deafening, double bloodsport
quick ice
It was an 11 that I just wasn’t ready to tank yet. I got absolutely shredded the whole time, but I’m new and just need to practice
Already talked to some people here about it, but guildies are still giving me shit lol
sand egret
if you're guild can't handle that, you may wanna reconsider guilds haha.
fast vessel
Brace for Impact traits stack ... any other ideal prot ones do the same thing (assuming 1 X avatar and 1 x deaf crash)
fast vessel
so 3 x all out traits is ideal
lusty grotto
BoM has partial stacking as well technically
sand egret
3x BoM if you're doing M+ and 1x DC
lusty grotto
Since it does not do 3 ips lol
sand egret
yeah the IP part doesnt'
but like the IP does grow due to the higher Mastery....so maybe?
🤓
lusty grotto
Heh
fast vessel
okay, so since I only do M+ I want 1 crash 3 x Bom and whatever else works out?
sand egret
perty much
dont lose sleep over the rest
Prot traits are all solid, just hope you get a BFI instead of like a CR
considering how BoM is on every other piece, it isn't too hard to get that shell going
stiff bear
guess i try to get another head with bom on it then 😃 since thats the only piece missing it 😃
sand egret
im the same with my chest personally
got really bad on a roll from the vendor
and by really bad I mean, it's got sick raiding traits (BFI/IF) but I don't raid haha
fast vessel
cool, swapped mains so redoing mythic gear to prot to allow more cushion for guild key carries
thanks for the help
jovial haven
only piece that i have doesn't have BoM is head, still wearin engi helm
sand egret
gl mate
arctic sedge
hows prot warrior doing in high end keys?
modern forum
currently best tank for m+ at the moment
arctic sedge
fuck guardian im sticking to prot lfao
what sort of ilvl would be recommended for high keys?
sick sentinel
ye i was pulling your leg m8 prot warrior is meta
fallow terrace
What are you considering high
arctic sedge
for me high is like 12-18 i guess?
i returned like 2 weeks ago after a break since release of bfa
astral crystal
8.2 spoolers soon get hype
modern forum
hoping to get more buffs 😄
sand egret
@arctic sedge 400+ is a safe bet to get comfortable and get the ball rollin'
sand egret
3x TC, 1x LM, 2x WF?
arctic sedge
alright cheers mate
sand egret
gl
arctic sedge
im closing in on 400 anyway so thats no problem
old zephyr
Get à good Shield good Mates and you are good to go
outer dew
Si
lusty grotto
Hola
warm plinth
Nim heard you guys talking about bears
arctic sedge
got Sunburst Crest at ilvl400, doesnt have mastery tho
sand egret
Nim! i wanted to ask you a question. How is "devilsaur" translated in spanish?
lusty grotto
lmao
outer dew
Lmao
sand egret
i'm curious how they localize that
lusty grotto
danie gonna block me again
outer dew
Our lord and saviour the bear
lusty grotto
i have no idea how the localize it, i play in english
sand egret
since it's kinda a pun-thing
lusty grotto
Diablosaurio?
sand egret
maybe! I always appreciate localized puns, especially when they're culture specific
sand egret
oooo what's the demo part?
lusty grotto
devil = diablo though
prime example of why you don't translate word for word, yet another point going into danie's block nimchip bucket
sand egret
haha well I didn't mean to bring that back up
lusty grotto
:p
sand egret
but yes, cultural nuance is very important. even within similar dialects 😃
lusty grotto
yeah i guess
heres the thing though
ricans usually play games in english
so basically we are immune to retarded translations
sand egret
yep that's why mex-ES always causes problems with ib-ES
and is the bane of my existence
lusty grotto
if you were really curious you could ask danie for sure
hmm
yeah i mean
there are nono words that are ok in other spanish countries
trying to think of an english example
warm plinth
Where are you from Blade?
sand egret
well it's less of the words themselves that causes the issue, but it's actually the character counts
since one that has X de Y
lusty grotto
blade is murican
sand egret
is WAY more
lusty grotto
so am i
sand egret
I'm from Boston
warm plinth
Yeah I kinda assumed you were Puerto Rican at this point Nim
lusty grotto
lol
sand egret
Nim is Leechian
warm plinth
Which is just a 'murican with nice weather
lusty grotto
nice weather? ehh its hot as fuck today
sand egret
must be nice.
sand egret
it's like 40 here
lusty grotto
draught and shit
sand egret
and i needs to not be
lusty grotto
i like 40s
warm plinth
Do you have a Boston accent? Because that's gonna mess with me
sand egret
but i'm also from Boston, so complaining about weather means its normal weather
lusty grotto
both in temperature and beer
sand egret
careful with the beer comment, we're gonna get a bunch of our EU's in here telling us that room temp is the real way.....
sand egret
I think they're asleep now though
warm plinth
I bet Nim drinks that olde english malt beer shit
lusty grotto
room temp beer is fucking disgusting though
especially when they try to do it here
what the fuck man its 90 degree weather
warm plinth
lolol
I knew a dude who would get handed a cold beer and literally wait half an hour to drink it so it was warm
lusty grotto
hmmm i dont know what to say to that
warm plinth
"That's gross" is appropriate
lusty grotto
yeah but im also impressed
warm plinth
For not drinking beer for half an hour when it's immediately available? XD
sand egret
you can warm a beer in a matter of minutes
lusty grotto
lets not go down that road
sand egret
i am nothing if not efficient
lusty grotto
if you were casually gonna mention microwave
sand egret
naw just put it between your legs
lusty grotto
might as well just fart on it
sand egret
you're quite literally a 98.6 degree heater
lusty grotto
do it faster
you're already heating it up so its gross
just add to the gross factor
sand egret
shit. Tauren heritage armor is fly as fuck.
naive panther
That tank az power is garbage
sand egret
I missed that one
lusty grotto
BoMs
silk moat
thank you
wooden radish
@ionic fern is this Burning Essence Heart of Azeroth trait good? i'll hang up and listen.
tranquil cedar