where the Qs at
#protection
lusty grotto
exotic spoke
^^ @unreal hound what questions do you have man
opal peak
who am I?
undone sun
¯_(ツ)_/¯
unreal hound
@exotic spoke just wondering if there is someone soo kind to show me in game some tank stuffs
i read the guides on icy etc
exotic spoke
Oh, yeah, I can’t - at work. But we can answer questions here
unreal hound
but still i kinda feel "weak" on my warrior tank
opal peak
can always watch some people on twitch and see the different ways they handle things
sand egret
weak in what capacity?
unreal hound
@opal peak i don't really understand watching other tanks playing since they press things too fast haha
sand egret
weak that you ain't putting up the numbers? weak that you're losing a vast majority of your hp every pull?
weak that your overall dungeon clears are slow?
opal peak
just find one that has an addon/WA that show's the casts they press
whole coral
hey, i just got that jes howler trinket out of my weekly chest. is it worth swapping 1 of my current trinkets for?
unreal hound
I got difficoulty in understanding where is your "focus" on abilities to use
single target and multi target
sand egret
the guide spells that out pretty well, imho
modern brook
@whole coral probably over either tbh. 20 ilvls o fmainstat is alot 😦
exotic spoke
If swap the 420 howler for the 400 eye. If you don’t need survivability trinkets then maybe the diamond. But probably still the eye
modern brook
^ exactly my thoughts
whole coral
meh, was thinking the same
sand egret
but most weakness comes from not splitting your thoughts accordingly
whole coral
but was hoping not to use it :p
sand egret
aka focusing on dps and letting your defense slip
or focusing on your defense and you lose all threat
cuz you didn't hit a TClap in 8 seconds
unreal hound
That's why i'm here blade, cause i have always been ok with the guides
for my mage, pala etc
i'm main arms
and still i find a sort of "block" in understanding warrior tank
sand egret
well let's get to the chase here. Elaborate on what makes you feel "weak"
opal peak
feeling stronger on warrior can just amount to playing it more and getting comfortable with rotating defensives while still maintaining dps rotation
sand egret
then I think we can work towards figuring out next steps
opal peak
like i felt plenty weak on war when I started despite understanding the concept and spells etc, i just needed to play it more
sand egret
if not, i'll prob just spit out the guide (which I assume you don't want)
unreal hound
The guide says for example: [rotation] shield slam - TC - revenge - devastate (and shield slam again if it resets)
wary lantern
didnt know there was a rotation lol
i always just TC on CD, revenge on proc, keeping up shield slam
shield block*
opal peak
less of a rotation, more of a priority
wary lantern
and slamming ´em to the face with shield
unreal hound
But i think that this rotation is quite strange since shield slam is a single target spell, TC is not, soo if i'm against a pull from M+ for example i should prioritize TC or keeping shield slam?
broken roost
Technically shield slam for more rage, but TC because we can
unreal hound
same for raid bosses, TC is good against them? Or shall i "avoid" it?
modern brook
You're not a dps
as mucha s the meters beg otherwie
our priority is generating rage
broken roost
The rotation is rage before all, but in practice in M+ you probably want to TC a couple times early to get threat, particularly with avatar
modern brook
SS generates more rage than TC ==> SS is more important than TC
unreal hound
The shout generates a lot of aggro too right?
modern brook
GEtting a SS cd reset proc, when SS is off CD is effectively losing 15 rage
unreal hound
the demoralizing one i mean
lusty grotto
but results in agro when using abilities that deal damage due to BV
unreal hound
mmm are u sure? I'm preatty sure that even if u cc the adds it generates treath
exotic spoke
It’s a gcd that doesn’t generate threat but it enables higher threat (damage) and is a defensive
undone sun
most CCs put targets in combat, nothing to do with threat
DS doesnt' have any threat gen
directly
unreal hound
k
modern brook
^
unreal hound
soo let's keep going, i'm a warrior tank and i want to build rage. For? Ignore pain and SB?
opal peak
yes
modern brook
yeah
U build rage to spend on Sheild block uptime
and supplement that offensively and defensively with Revenge and ignore pain respectively
unreal hound
i want to have all of them at the same time? or i just want IP or SB active at once?
exotic spoke
Primarily SB first. IP if you need defensive revenge if you don’t and want more damage
opal peak
IP is more of a smoother rather than active mitigation
modern brook
IP supplements SB
If u dont have Block up and ur taking blockable damage, it is your highest priority to get back up
modern brook
i was litterally about to grab the screen shot
exotic spoke
You won’t
modern brook
lusty grotto
ideally you want to ask questions about things in the guide
modern brook
exotic spoke
Damn. You did it
unreal hound
Dunno what to say man, I got problems with that guide, maybe is my limit
modern brook
Fuck u riki im the screen shot kid
lusty grotto
otherwise you're not giving me (at least me) confidence in having read it
exotic spoke
Lol
lusty grotto
yeah that just sounds like an excuse
unreal hound
i'm not new on guides, i got a frost mage and a a prot pala and i learned them all on guides
modern brook
I mean
lusty grotto
ok so what specifically dont you understand from the guide?
lusty grotto
maybe you can help us out to lay it out better
modern brook
you're officially just getting less accurate information; since ur taking a 3rd party's interpretation of a 1st party source of information
opal peak
honestly just give it another read through and go practice some play and get a first hand feel for the spells and what they do
exotic spoke
That’s a good way to approach it nimchip
sand egret
fwiw i got pulled into a meeting, but I totally wannna comment on this =/
modern brook
I'll react to ur comment post-meeting if u tag me blade
sand egret
just wanted to give Yrag my 2 cents since I kinda prompted this haha (didn't mean to go AWOL)
opal peak
tfw u comment on not being able to comment instead of actually commenting what you wanted to comment
ionic fern
🤔
unreal hound
It's not that I "don't understand" the guide, i'm not stupid xd I just read it and wanted some verifications on what i learned since i don't feel as confident as when i read the other guides
dw @sand egret ty for your time
opal peak
what exactly do you mean by i don't feel as confident as when i read the other guides ?
as in you don't trust them to be accurate?
unreal hound
anyway i'm not obliging anyone to answer to me, soo if u think that i'm just "fooling" you around you are free to go ^^
opal peak
or not confident in ur understanding of what u read
unreal hound
@opal peak i'll try to explain myself
opal peak
that's technically not right
outer dew
Aite
opal peak
opal peak
and again that's priority not rotation
lusty grotto
no classes in the game have rotations
but that's beside the point
anyway what don't you understand about it
outer dew
You prio whatever is first in the prio list not on CD
unreal hound
it's under the "single target" rotation, but when i read it i'm asking "why shall i prioritize a aoe spell agains a single target spell in a single target rotation?"
sharp night
it generates rage
unreal hound
ye sorry i'm calling it in the wrong way it's not a rotation
sharp night
rage > no rage
exotic spoke
Thunder clap generates rage. It does decent damage
undone sun
semantics
modern brook
^ and ur other option is to SS -> devestate spam
undone sun
regardless
outer dew
Because thunderclap does a lot of damage during avatar + talents
steel mauve
devestates damage sucks, its worse than your white auto's, TC's damage is higher than almost all of our single target spells
hot locust
because it generates rage and does more damage even on single target.
lusty grotto
thunderclap generates rage yes, and it also hits harder
modern brook
but like
undone sun
all has to do with UF and AM
exotic spoke
If you have demo shout up it’ll extend it with the right traits as well
modern brook
I dont want to be that guy
opal peak
devestate isn't a hard hitting ability - it's just a free ST attack that is used when nothing else is up
exotic spoke
It’s a builder not a spender
modern brook
but this is why:
lusty grotto
whoa whoa calm your bootyclaps bull
sand condor
I have decreed
signal plover
lusty grotto
ehhh
modern brook
@sand condor let me introduce u to bolstering
opal peak
also @steel mauve devestates damage sucks, its worse than your white auto's not that I've compared white's to devestate but i dont think that's correct
exotic spoke
Disagree - but I really hate sanguine
undone sun
for once i'll agree with bull
sand condor
Bolstering is fine
brisk ferry
I'm with @sand condor
lusty grotto
bolstering is fine with good dps, grievous is fine with a good healer and fish feasts
undone sun
nah, bolstering has the same issue as infested did
opal peak
bolstering also depends on dungeon
sand condor
Usually..
lusty grotto
welp i mean pug dps make bolstering a fucking nightmare too
sand condor
Grevious kills tanks
steel mauve
@opal peak
modern brook
grevious just makes u stop the chain pull so ur healer can drink
bolster stops chain pulls
@steel mauve yikers
sharp night
dev only does ~33% AP of damage
modern brook
devestate more like D- evestate
sand condor
Devastate deals 2 targwts tho
undone sun
what
lusty grotto
what
sharp night
???
opal peak
oh right but devestate can proc ss
steel mauve
what the fuck?
steel mauve
so can SS and revenge
undone sun
wrong
lusty grotto
back to your corner Vic
youre grounded
hand in your prot badge
time out for 5 mins
steel mauve
and no, devestate does not hit 2 targets
weary oracle
Hey there. Question regard Spell reflection, Does anyone has a comprehensive reflectable abilities in BoD and dungeons?
sand condor
What ):
undone sun
sand condor
Why am i grounded
lusty grotto
#268491842637660160 @weary oracle
unreal hound
anyway, thx to all, now i got things a little more clear, I'll go spam some dungeons and try to figure out things
modern brook
@unreal hound trust urself some more
If you read the guides, chances are your hunches are on point
lusty grotto
if you're feeling "weak" though, you might be better off reading the defensives part
sand egret
Ok so a few things:
- You're goal is to generate rage to spend it. SS and TClap are your main sources of Rage.
- Ideally your "rotation" is more or less finding ways to build as much as possible (so you can spend as much as possible, but that's another topic)
- During Avatar, TClap simply trumps all other spells with the "correct" talent setup even in multi-target. Ideally your rotation during Avatar is SS > TClap > Repeat but that's if you get 100% of your SS resets via the following TClap.
- As far as your "rotation" is concerned, your in-the-moment focus should be prioritizing your rage generation abilities.
- Defensively speaking, IP is a "smoothing tool" (namely, it doesn't remove the total amount of damage inflicted, but rather redistrubutes it to other resources i.e.: splits half to your hp resource and half to your IP). Shield Block is your "mitigation" which simply removes a portion of the damage entirely.
- You ideally want to have both up for blockable damage, but SB trumps IP if you have to pick between the two. @unreal hound
lusty grotto
jesus christ
modern brook
sick write up fam
sand egret
fucking sucked
lusty grotto
you know its a meeting when he wrote all that
modern brook
rip sorry to hear
exotic spoke
Brb... reading war and peace
rip
sand egret
live releases...amiritte
lusty grotto
yea war and peace for sure
sand condor
Blade: the art of warriors
modern brook
whatre u releasing?
unreal hound
ye but since i don't want to be the "stupid tard" that makes ppl wipe in dungeon, I want to have an overall good confidence before starting
and this is the first time I hadn't feel it
sand egret
it was a meeting about the release
unreal hound
soo it was quite "strange" for me, and wanted to ask here since i think this is an help group(?)
sand egret
namely people who've never released a game freaking out that shit can break
and me having to tell them that shit happens and that's why we have patches
lusty grotto
lmao
modern brook
@lusty grotto good joke
unreal hound
ty @sand egret for your post 😉
sand egret
anywho, you should still ask here mate.
lusty grotto
i have a story but ill leave it for off topic cause its quite long
and its currently pissing me off
sand egret
more specific the question the better
modern brook
^
lusty grotto
"help us help you"
modern brook
super vague questisons like "why do i build rage" are really tough to answer in meaningful ways
sand egret
general questions generally get met with general answers (aka "the guide")
modern brook
and the guide goes into a lot more detail than most people realize
unreal hound
ty for your patience anyway
unreal hound
ye bull i think that too
modern brook
what are you releasing BLADE :^(
lusty grotto
a mobile game imo
lusty grotto
haha
unreal hound
but i'm not soo good in understanding english soo sometimes it's harder for me to understand some points
sand egret
i'll take 1st party over mobile anyday
sand egret
yeah, honestly practice will do you a lot of good
and another thing I like to tell new prots
"Be proactive, not reactive"
modern brook
^
sand egret
we're the only tank in WoW that is 100% proactive
modern brook
Dont be afraid to use Last stand rotationally
thats probably the biggest mistake i see new prots do
unreal hound
ehm, where is the difference balde? XD
sand egret
i'm glad you asked!
modern brook
Anger Management + Bolster make it VERY quick
blade wtf dont make me ask 4 times
😠
sand egret
we have no ways outside of victory rush to deal with damage we already took
exotic spoke
We have no real self recovery
If you don’t know how to mitigate the damage ahead of time you will die. You must be proactive and anticipate the damage
sand egret
thus we need to prepare for the damage we take (popping cooldowns) instead of dealing with the damage we take after the fact (like Death Strike or Light of the Protector)
unreal hound
I'm Italian @lusty grotto
sand egret
so, inherently there is less room for mistakes
unreal hound
Ok, soo, as prot warrior, the less dmg i take, the better is
lusty grotto
pro - before the fact (anti?)
sand egret
you want to mitigate the damage before you take it every time
magic hazel
If you are unsure, try www.deepl.com to translate certain parts of the guide.. its pretty good
sand egret
so plan ahead
unreal hound
All the english i'm using is english that i learned by playing :')))
exotic spoke
Trylun, does that website work for most languages?
exotic spoke
Cool, I’ll have to keep that in mind
unreal hound
Runescape memories haha
lusty grotto
the only problem with sites like that is that skill names are rough
sand egret
proattivo vs reattivo (?) 😄
lusty grotto
sounds like it
magic hazel
Translating the first paragraph into italian .. maybe you can tell me how good it is?
lusty grotto
my spanish half at least recognizes it
magic hazel
I Protection Warriors eccellono nei combattimenti con grandi quantità di danni fisici o dove è necessaria la mobilità. Gran parte del danno che subiscono è mitigato dal blocco, rendendo la loro assunzione di danni liscia e prevedibile. Inoltre, forniscono una sana quantità di utilità, che si tratti di controllo della folla o di raid buffs. Sono un serbatoio formidabile tutt'intorno, il che li rende una scelta degna sia nei raid che nei
modern brook
uhhhh
lusty grotto
see protection warriors wasn't translated
modern brook
Si, pepperoni linguini fetta macaron!
unreal hound
ye the translation is good
lusty grotto
Guerrero Protector in spanish :0
exotic spoke
That’s pretty bad bull
modern brook
fuck you riki
exotic spoke
Lol
modern brook
my italian is basically perfect
exotic spoke
Bring it! You ... me.... the never ending duel
modern brook
⚔
magic hazel
I can only talk about its german translation skills and they aint half bad 😄
lusty grotto
what is this? Chicken vs Peter?
unreal hound
the problem with the translation are the "specific terms"
lime mantle
It’s Guerrero proteccion
exotic spoke
Cause if you get me low some how I’ll heal to full or damn near close to you.
So fight me bro
unreal hound
that was a preatty good translation
lime mantle
Like 99% sure
unreal hound
Guerriero di Protezione
sand egret
anywho, I hope you got the jist
mint adder
lime mantle
I used to play inspanish and I am 99% sure up to wrath it was protecion. @lusty grotto
lusty grotto
im puertorican
unreal hound
the fun part @magic hazel is actually to hear you reading an italian translation haha
lusty grotto
literally main language is spanish
but if that's the blizzard translation, its pretty bad
lime mantle
@lusty grotto I am Spanish lmao
exotic spoke
Could it be dialects of Spanish? Different phrases / emphasis / etc. like compare your Spanish to Catalonians
sand egret
which spanish
lusty grotto
guerrero de proteccion might be a better translation
magic hazel
Los Guerreros de Protección sobresalen en peleas con grandes cantidades de daño físico, o donde se necesita movilidad. Gran parte de los daños que sufren se mitigan mediante el bloqueo, lo que hace que su ingesta de daños sea suave y predecible. Además, proporcionan una cantidad saludable de utilidad, ya sea para el control de multitudes o para los aficionados a las redadas. Son un formidable tanque por todas partes, lo que los convierte en una buena elección tanto en redadas como en mazmorras.
Traducción realizada con el traductor www.DeepL.com/Translator
Hmm looks like it uses your phrase
lime mantle
@lusty grotto https://dle.rae.es/?id=URUdTVs 😃
lusty grotto
OH NO YOU DID NOT LINK THE RAE
sand egret
between ME-ES and SP-ES and DE.....those fucking up localization every.damn.time.
lusty grotto
yo se lo que significa proteccion
sand egret
ya'll germans are like YO LETS PUT ALL THE WORDS TOGETHER
sand egret
lata
unreal hound
ty again
lusty grotto
no hace nada de sentido unido a guerrero bajo el contexto
lime mantle
@sand egret matamoros :^)
exotic spoke
Had a Spanish teacher who was Catalonian (I think) and had the lisp they use in the region. Was incredibly hard for me to use it after 6 years learning from Mexican / Puerto Rican speakers
magic hazel
Well I am being told german is not meant to be spoken bout shouted.
lime mantle
@lusty grotto literally it does.
unreal hound
oh yeah a final question
lime mantle
Armas->Arms
Furia->Furry
Proteccion->Protection.
sand egret
furry. hek
lusty grotto
"guerrero protección" no es lo mismo que "guerrero DE protección"
guerrero de armas, guerrero de furia
you missed the "DE"
lime mantle
@lusty grotto Guerrero de proteccion->Warrior of protection.
Guerrero proteccion->Protection warrior 😃
unreal hound
what about food? the guide says that the Honey potpie could be usefull in M+, what u think? Shall i just to for haste food or something else?
lusty grotto
yeah youre not spanish
lusty grotto
youre translating literally
unreal hound
Y i know, but since we are here
sand egret
(but haste works0
modern brook
@unreal hound U go haste for every stat bonus; food, enchant, sockets etc
sand egret
i just eat whatever I have on hand, personally
opal peak
same... which is haste
unreal hound
that's nice for diet blade
sand egret
but i'm broke as a joke in WoW
modern brook
the exact reasons are covered in the guide, but suffice to say that haste is best in the most situations
valid knot
Hey guys, i got over 2k titan res now and im wondering what piece i should spend it on? Can they procc from vendor? Do we know if we can use it next patch? https://worldofwarcraft.com/en-gb/character/eu/ravencrest/venak
sand egret
so I just buy the cheapest shit
opal peak
crit is cheap af
sand egret
@valid knot between chest and shoulders I guess....but at that point I'd just save for a specific since you're full 415 and have pretty much an ideal trait setup (for M+)
undone sun
specifics 😬
sand egret
what else you spending it on?>
valid knot
I mostly only do m+ and pugging 1 boss mythic on my warr
sand egret
must.be.nice.
modern brook
BTW replace wArpath with Dragon charge
valid knot
So no point in trying to roll for another piece?
exotic spoke
So buy a specific one with better inner traits that matches what you need.
exotic spoke
If you random and need 1 piece you have a 40% chance or so of getting the one you want before you could have bought it specific
sand egret
point is, your already in a solid spot so have fun with it
modern brook
^
valid knot
So my other traits are optimal? For m+
sand egret
they're solid, yeah
valid knot
What inner traits should i aim for?
sand egret
like I said, you have the shell. You can min/max for a specific dungeon if you want.....but that's not something you're missing by any means
exotic spoke
You have the ideal generic set up for m+. 3 BoM, 1 DC, 2 IF
You can try out other pieces and other traits. But that’s the recommended starting point
modern brook
3x OP if u can :^)
lime mantle
@lusty grotto 1. I'm right (no shit, been playing prot since pretty much vanilla I know how the spec is called in the language I played up to cata)
2. yes I ruined my game by changing it to spanish just to prove this.
3. I expect my dogeza
4. I get hung up on the most stupid of crap.
lusty grotto
That doesn't say guerrero protección
lusty grotto
It only says protección
modern brook
Tan-que
lime mantle
Class-Spec
lusty grotto
Again you're missing the "de"
supple path
At least that language knows better than to mess with Avatar.
exotic spoke
Also, that’s what blizzard used. It doesn’t mean it’s the correct
lime mantle
@lusty grotto it has never been "de"
lusty grotto
Bro
lime mantle
literally no fucking class in this game is class-of-spec
lime mantle
Lol no it doesn't
supple path
Hail friends. I am a warrior of protection in my 120th season.
lusty grotto
You can't just translate word for word into english
steel mauve
sounds like the most worthless argument ever honestly
modern brook
@steel mauve par for the course, tbh
opal peak
tru
lime mantle
@lusty grotto for the second time today you don't grasp spanish
halcyon fable
Finally upgraded to a 400 weapon!
lusty grotto
Tu tampoco aparentemente
lime mantle
Guerrero de protecion!=guerrero proteccion.
lusty grotto
Ni si quiera pones acento
lime mantle
Protection warrior means guerrero proteccion
the "de" means "of"
it'd be like calling a black man a man of black.
carmine sparrow
Hey guys just a quick question when is siphoning better on MH?
lime mantle
the protection/proteccion is a thing that gives a quality to the warrior
supple path
Google translate translates both phrases as protection warrior and I think we all know that it's the highest arbiter of accurate translations.
lusty grotto
No
opal peak
when u have a ton of leech and want to meme
lime mantle
& I still expect my dogeza for you implying I'm not spanish.
modern brook
@carmine sparrow never
carmine sparrow
seen afew M+ warrs using it 😄
lusty grotto
Sorry you don't even understand what I'm saying in Spanish, nor reply in it
I'm done with this argument
opal peak
they just wanna b BDK
carmine sparrow
this picture kind of explains it all tho 😄
steel mauve
thats because they are either meming or trolling others, or they have a very specific gear set opr strat that requires it
supple path
Yeah it's basically a personal, playstyle-specific choice @carmine sparrow There's no magic "change to it at this point" bar
lime mantle
also I've laready shown you PLENTY of fucking proof the "de" isn't used
lusty grotto
You're not Spanish, I'm sorry
lime mantle
You've literally seen my fucking DNi
lime mantle
sudaca subhumano
lusty grotto
You're translating word for word again, in the context of Spanish that doesn't work
lime mantle
there
opal peak
hola señor
supple path
The only actual phrase you need to know is "comida por favor" anyhow. Goddamn mages.
opal peak
im spanish too 😃
fading python
If I wanna do big djik aoe dmg in M+, what sort of rotation /azerite pieces do I need to pull off?
carmine sparrow
so just use haste enchant MH?
supple path
BoM x3 DC x3 @fading python
lime mantle
@supple path wrong, you fucking racist.
You forgot "mas cerveza porfavor"
fading python
So it is actually worth stacking DC now ?
opal peak
yeah nick
fading python
thats what I wanna do
modern brook
else no
supple path
@lime mantle I actually meant in game.
fading python
I assume u mean its bad for raiding Bull?
modern brook
@carmine sparrow yes just use quick nav
opal peak
So it is actually worth stacking DC now ? is very general - like in general u dont really wanna do that, but if literally all u care about is dps, then 3 of both
modern brook
2nd and 3rd traits of DC dont have a defensive application == every prot trait and some generics are better than it
so going 3 dc is losing 2 traits worth of defensive value
sand egret
see! now people can understand the pain of localization!
supple path
But they remain our highest dps trait for AE situations.
I'm amazed WoW doesn't have the autotranslate functionality that FF11 did 10+ years ago
modern brook
in favor of big djik aoe dmg in m+
sand egret
Cen, that was predetermined strings
lime mantle
@supple path festin plis.*
supple path
Yeah - but that was enough predetermined strings to communicate.
sand egret
exactly, but that's not auto-translate
fading python
I just couldn't help be a bit jelly seing a prot warr pull off 127k aoe dps on the trash just after Champions of light today
sand egret
that's calling a bunch of tokens to form a sentence )
fading python
seeing *
supple path
It was called auto-translate by the playerbase you nitpicking monster
sand egret
well functionally speaking, it's very different
one parses text, the other is just Build-A-Sentence Workshop
supple path
I mean sure an actual tie-in to Google translate that provided a live translation of your chat window would obviously be better.
sand egret
but I agree, the feature was dope
supple path
But not even having the pre-built vocab is bizarre
modern brook
@fading python 3x bom 3x DC will get you there tbh. mooost content doesnt require a lot of survivability min maxing froma gearing stand point assuming ur actually playing the spec well
sand egret
learn some portugese 😃
supple path
I learned how to ask mages for food.
modern brook
u mean drunk spanish?
fading python
@modern brook I'd like to believe so, but since im here seeking advice, its a bit of a sign that im not the greatest
sand egret
well the funny part about that protection translation tit-for-tat is that I literally had that problem a few months ago
modern brook
The general suggestion for M+ gearing is 3x bom 2x IF 1x DC
it balances fat aoe damage with surv
fading python
is BoM really that good ? 🤔 TIL
sand egret
and because one string count is significantly longer than the rest, the UI didn't function well with the extra " X de Y" translation, so we opted to unify the Spanish dialects because users showed they could get the understanding of it.
modern brook
the downside of bom is that it is a dead trait outside of avatar
supple path
3x BoM at 415 is 25% raw attack power + like...37% mastery?
modern brook
so misplaying with AM kills its effective ness
supple path
So it gives you a big damage boost while ALSO providing a short-defensive burst that lets you almost always comfortably facetank for the full duration of avatar
sand egret
the defensive boost is quite significant, imho
fading python
So a opener would be Ava -> DS -> TC -> revenge -> tc (shield block /ignore pain ) -> tc?
supple path
Avatar -> TC -> Dem -> TC -> Rev -> TC
modern brook
3x bom'd avatar -> SB with rage gained fromavatar == 0 damage taken from blockable sources
sand egret
Charge + Avatar > TClap THEN DS. You want that initial aggro from a juicy tclap
that one gcd is going to get a dps dead if they go ham
fading python
true true
supple path
Also better to maximize how many Tclaps you get during avatar
undone sun
buffs on gcd is terrible gameplay
dont @ me
sand egret
this edgy guy
undone sun
🤣
sand egret
we ain't got thyme for that
supple path
Every time someone gets battleressed during avatar the thought of reapplying battleshout makes me want to self-harm.
modern brook
?????????????????????
sand egret
oh, lol i dont give em that shit
modern brook
who the fuck Reapplies shouts
fading python
lol
sand egret
i aint losing dps for that scurb
modern brook
someone has to make up for that idiot's lost dps
supple path
If I'm honest I actually do wait until it's time for a devastate to recast it.
modern brook
I'd devestate still tbh
supple path
haha right
fading python
I mean.. all their trinkets and enchants are on cd.. so what difference does 10% ap make
sand egret
eh, I prefer to cultivate the tears of my dumb dps so I can use it later in my coffee
modern brook
honestly i just shout at the end of every pull
fading python
devestate during Avatar?
opal peak
just wait till u drop combat
modern brook
cause i never remember if i did it
supple path
It lines up with being post-avatar usually yes, Mikru
sand egret
it makes stuff light up on my bar
opal peak
if u have no SS up and no revenge proc and aren't capping rage
fading python
ss ...? ffs I can't remember all of this
supple path
shield slam
sand egret
Shield Slap
opal peak
lol
fading python
u know.. when u play classic, wotlk and bfa all at the same time, u are bound to get confused
sand egret
if by SS you mean a Sad Sap because I can't spend rage due to a fucking revenge proc
then yeah, you spot on!
fading python
sad face
modern brook
revenge more like it wasnt a devestate guys
did u ever watch ur Deep wound tick
900!
sand egret
wtb Revenge procs to refund Rage instead of make it free.
opal peak
Pog
exotic spoke
You right blade
fading python
I'd have to move my revenge button to another keybinding cuse I end up prioratizing it over all other buttons - no rage for IP or SB
sand egret
but then we're openly admitting AM is too clutch to the spec, which they won't do
fading python
Does anyone dare play with Ravager?
undone sun
fuck no
sand egret
wait ffor it
undone sun
it's garbage
sand egret
waiiiit for it
fading python
oh boi
undone sun
and AM is miles better
sand egret
woah woah AM isn't that bad
fading python
do it for the lolz
sand egret
it's at least lightyears better
fading python
how many
undone sun
just a whole lot of them
fading python
fair answer
undone sun
feels NA man
opal peak
NA best way 😃
modern brook
it needs to be brought down and put on a classwide baseline
fading python
<fun detected>
opal peak
should be baseline - tru
but no nerf 😡
what needs a nerf is TC 100% dmg increase and half CD 4Head
modern brook
prot at 10rage /s is way too efficent for a baseline passive
its currently only balanced out by being a talent tax
lusty grotto
mission accomplished
sand egret
AM baseline (into mastery ideally) would allow you to scale AM via gearing....buuuuut I worry we'll just end up taking Mastery > all and honestly I like how we are pretty loose with gearing
exotic spoke
Hey! NA isn’t all bad.
We’ve never lost a World Series, super bowl, or Stanley cup
Lol
undone sun
lol
sand egret
you guys were the personification of my localization woes, Nim
lusty grotto
insulted me 99 times
opal peak
i dont actually get how u play war without AM - like having defensives/activ mit available
lusty grotto
and still blocked me lol
sand egret
and I fucking loved it
undone sun
very carefully @opal peak
opal peak
would never play it over monk - sleep through 100% uptime on isb
modern brook
prot in its current iteration functions as a tank because of AM
opal peak
tho tbh, i do miss having like 4 minute isb buff with charges to use for purify 😃
supple path
Playing warrior without AM would have a lot more "okay, doing a small pull to let CDs reset" nonsense.
opal peak
nah
exotic spoke
So, how much do you want to bet that it gets nerfed bullfango
opal peak
it would be a lot of kiting
sand egret
imho, prot in its current iteration "feels" complete because you have control over your mitigation
opal peak
u stay in for avatar, then run while CD's recharge
modern brook
@exotic spoke it wont
sand egret
in a world where we have no reactive abilities, we need that control
modern brook
UF will be gutted because we're not allowed to parse better than dps
WArrior will fall back into at least its not vdh teir
exotic spoke
@modern brook you say that. But how can you be so sure?
sand egret
and a 100% scaling factor is shit for the future
opal peak
i mean UF is busted
modern brook
bears will take over as best M+ tank
sand egret
period.
modern brook
thats my 8.2 predictions
opal peak
the return of bear gods Pog
sand egret
why you think i'm on my bear
supple path
VDH will get their niche when blizzard finally makes a bunch of "jump over the laser" mechanics.
sand egret
been on that move for this whole patch
exotic spoke
I for one welcome our new Druid overlords
modern brook
Bears RN Are budget warriors with more utility and less raw damage reduction
sand egret
I'm actually hopeful for VDH, it's got some issues but the issues are really clear cut
modern brook
as far as mass AoE damage goes
exotic spoke
@supple path aight... I got leap bro
modern brook
since 8.2 will still be season 2, mass aoe is still the meta
vdh needs an identity besides ITS GOT WINGS
cause as is rn its just the worst parts of every tank mished into one
neon tangle
VDH will always be the meta
exotic spoke
VDH feels like it tries to merge two styles and fails
neon tangle
it's literally one of their abilities
modern brook
@opal peak let me rephrase
there will be no seasonal affix that inherently prevents stupid ass triple and chain pulls the way infested did, and the way season 3 has the possibility of doing so
opal peak
well it more made it annoying - didnt "prevent" it bc u just cc and pull away
opal peak
but ya
modern brook
reaping heavily weights AoE damage
sand egret
bull, my "random party members can be hit by allies damage" will put a damper on that strat 😃
modern brook
thats like why we're going to get nerfed
opal peak
it makes it more meta
opal peak
but a tank that can live fine and do a lot of aoe will always win out
exotic spoke
I look forward to the trinket that will damage allies and enemies to heal me
modern brook
exactly why bears will be good in a post unstoppable force era
sand egret
Whaaat, it's not like we may get a particular active ability on your neck
modern brook
strong damage; mostly dot centric
neon tangle
@opal peak I mean, BDK dominated s1 and their damage was still garbage
modern brook
== still dpsing while kiting, which makes up for the only downside they have over warrior -> weaker mitigation
opal peak
i mean they dominated bc they were unkillable until nerfed
distant crystal
also bonestorm
supple path
Yeah, the ability to do larger pulls can outweigh personal DPS
distant crystal
and gorefiends
opal peak
but they also werent "garbage" dps imo
neon tangle
I die a little inside every time someone thinks that bonestorm is what bade BDK good in s1
opal peak
maybe compared to prot war
distant crystal
it was one of many things that made them good
supple path
blame every single BDK in existence for their /shout BOOOOONESTOOOOORM macro.
modern brook
BDK were meta because of grip, 90% slow battle rez mind control and your healer can DPS lifebloom -> rejuv-> wild growth ->DPS every single pull
exotic spoke
Yup
modern brook
in short; they were strong tanks with great utility
opal peak
when u have a tank that can solo 75% of a tyr boss
sand egret
also: players have experience setting up pulls without BDKs for a whole season (as everyone is running Prot). I think players in general will be better at setting up big pulls without grip going forward
supple path
Wasn't WotN like a 10+% hit to survivability?
modern brook
^ thats how i remember it
lusty grotto
now lets just imagine what theyre gonna do about rogues
modern brook
i hvent been watching the MDI
but i'll be surprised if every group isnt running prot rdruid double outlaw filler
steel mauve
it was a couple of % hit, not double digits
neon tangle
it was around a 9% EHP nerf -including- WotN, overall damage taken was maybe 1-2%
lusty grotto
there were a bit running single rogues
modern brook
double rouge is just cheating
opal peak
man rogues are gunna get an outlaw nerf
lusty grotto
triple melee teams though
opal peak
then ur just gunna see ass rogues
lusty grotto
i feel bad for casters
opal peak
doing almost as much
lusty grotto
yeah rogue dps isn't the problem
supple path
I still want them to give shroud to another class too.
lusty grotto
its SHROUD
distant crystal
rogue dps is why people bring 2
neon tangle
unlimited bonestorm would have been far more useful in s2 with reaping and bigger pulls
modern brook
Rogue DPS is a problem
supple path
Like warlocks or something
neon tangle
and the extra stamina
distant crystal
rogue utility is why they always bring at least 1
modern brook
because Rogue DPS is way too big; and other classes have literally nothing to compete with it
lusty grotto
Unholy is better if you pull bigger
opal peak
my guildy is pretty much avoiding playing outlaw in m+ bc he's like - outlaw will get nerfed, so might as well get new meta down now
supple path
But having the highest DPS class ALSO be the only class to allow significant skips is uh...not good.
lusty grotto
proven by the mdi runs
modern brook
I dont think this season is warranting nerfs to any specs
Reaping heavily weights aoe specs
distant crystal
to pull big enough for unholy to beat outlaw
sand egret
feral shroud!
modern brook
🤷 shroud is conveinence, invis potions exist
distant crystal
you have to pull risky as hell
lusty grotto
yes that's true bull
distant crystal
shroud can skip farther than invis pot
modern brook
shroud + sap is sick af
distant crystal
and it doesn't cost a combat potion for 5 minutes
supple path
Invis potions have a serious opportunity cost and are inferior yeah.
modern brook
Sap being one of 2 cc's that dont put u in combat is sick af
lusty grotto
inc tofu
unreal hound
first dungeon done, I'm getting into this. A quick question
distant crystal
i am alliance, but stoneform 😃
opal peak
rip
sick sentinel
if you invis pot to last boss you only lose 2 pots :))
lusty grotto
lol
modern brook
rip ur hands fam
lusty grotto
magical jazz hands
distant crystal
that's how you get those bruce lee fused knuckles
unreal hound
I should prioritize TC or Revenge when it comes for free?
sand egret
in avatar? TC
lusty grotto
in everything
unreal hound
both cases
lusty grotto
tc
modern brook
^
sand egret
yeah,
distant crystal
everything else is just something you use between each TC
lusty grotto
i mean that's why its over revenge in the guide
modern brook
TC generates rage
Proc'd Revenge is rage neutral
so TC;s better (also i think tc does more damge out of Avatar too but idk so whateveR)
undone sun
free revenge is just a punch in the face
sand egret
honestly Revenge free is like "word, nice to have?"
but i kinda wanna spend rage....
y u parry??!
unreal hound
Let's suppose i'm MAX rage, still TC instead of free revenge?
lusty grotto
just IP for no reason np np
distant crystal
free revenge is like "damn, that won't reduce my cooldowns"
modern brook
u shouldnt be max rage because ip is off gcd
sand egret
"better ignore more shit"
neon tangle
@unreal hound press IP and then TC
distant crystal
IP and/or shield block
modern brook
^
distant crystal
never cap
modern brook
like heres a fun scenario
lusty grotto
errr... dont use shield block while you have one on you
modern brook
Ur at 90 rage and have a full IP and avatars off cooldownand u have bom
Guess what u still IP before u avatar
distant crystal
it pandemics doesn't it
lusty grotto
yeah but you dont wanna do it
distant crystal
or, not even pandemic just fully stacks the duration
lusty grotto
cause the mob might start casting and then you wasted effective uptime
sand egret
cuz it screws you over
lusty grotto
a mob might be stunned and you wasted effective uptime
modern brook
stacking SB duration falls into the catagory of "effective uptime"
sand egret
25 seconds down the line
lusty grotto
plethora of reasons
modern brook
which is covered in the guide ;^)
distant crystal
i mean, the healer might grip you away from all the mobs, so never use shieldblock lest it get wasted
seems like funky logic
sand egret
if my healer does that
modern brook
I mean i get what ur saying
sand egret
im getting a new healer
empty inlet
or you know
modern brook
but thats a shit example
lusty grotto
why the fuck is your healer gripping you
supple path
Never apply the second charge while you still have it active if something MIGHT happen that makes it bad - because there's literally no actual trade-off to getting it up earlier.
distant crystal
not capping rage
sand egret
bruh, you NEVER take a warrior out of a pack of mobs ESPECIALLY if Avatar is flowing
modern brook
@distant crystal in ur example ur fighting 20 mobs at once
distant crystal
as it should be
sand egret
(should be burning 3 HEK HEK)
lusty grotto
technically 3 SBs
lusty grotto
ah but bull meant spamming it
empty inlet
lets be real here you wont always have last stance
lusty grotto
so bull is correct
oblique garnet
You will
modern brook
I mean the exact scenario he described
was "big fat aoe pull, last stand near or off cd"
oblique garnet
With proper play last stand is on 1 minute cd
modern brook
"why dont i pop both SB charges and then last stand"
oblique garnet
So it should be up everytime youre actively tanking
unreal hound
We got a sort of "guide" on how to tank the bosses of each dungeon?
empty inlet
i cant even get avatar every pack on a 21
sand egret
and your whole mitigation sequence is ~ 52 seconds
unreal hound
or someone can suggest me one?
lusty grotto
new quote of the day
empty inlet
theres no way you can get last stance every pack
lusty grotto
budget VDH or BDK
distant crystal
i mean, my scenario was you're tanking a bunch of mobs, you still have some duration of SB up, and you're about to cap rage
modern brook
and the answer is cause "if everything isnt deaed in the 6s after last stand is over, u are, and you've gained absolutely no benefit for hammering them together vs using them appropriately"
lusty grotto
🤷
distant crystal
you may or may not have some IP up as well
lusty grotto
"running away" LMAO
oblique garnet
Just spend more rage
distant crystal
you use a spender
exotic spoke
I cycle in SW for those or spam IP to fill gaps
modern brook
Like ur goal is and always will be to maximize effective uptime of sb
modern brook
if ur actively taking blocakble damage and sb is almost out and ur about to rage cap fucking sb
exotic spoke
Waat, that’s not what lala and I are saying
modern brook
but u dont just hammer 2x sb and say "now i have 12s of sb and this is equally as effective"
exotic spoke
You use 3 SB, you use LS, and then you use 3 SB. Now what?
distant crystal
nobody ever suggested hammering 2x SB
oblique garnet
You use shieldwall after that
And then you use sb
And have last stand back
Ez
Or the pack is dead
distant crystal
i said if you're about to rage cap, you IP and/or SB, and off we went on this silly tangent
exotic spoke
You’re right, and when you don’t have SW just spam IP demo hope and kite?
oblique garnet
You have the defensive value of avatar also
distant crystal
you just clap and call for bark
empty inlet
if you dont have shield block oyu run
exotic spoke
True, just wanted to make sure I’m not fucking it massively is all.
But the general statement of “you’ll always have LS / SB” is wrong.
And yes, it is nim
distant crystal
i can't even
exotic spoke
What waat? Lol
distant crystal
even
sick sentinel
same tbh
lusty grotto
in order of importance: trying not to cap rage is not as important as effective SB uptime
or rather that's no order
distant crystal
so when you're about to rage cap, you might say it's reasonable to use SB and/or IP
distant crystal
and/or SB
lusty grotto
no
supple path
I think the basic objection is that you should be SBing independently of your rage cap. If you're actually approaching 100 rage, that means you have enough rage to use revenge + IP + sblock anyhow so may as well just hit an IP
distant crystal
sometimes you're gonna be taking blockable damage
and SB will be falling off soon
HENCE THE FUCKING AND/OR
jfc
lusty grotto
no
distant crystal
yes
lusty grotto
no
oblique garnet
If you are pooling rage you wont have last stand up for every pack
distant crystal
easily the dumbest conversation i've seen in this discord and i was here for april fools day
lusty grotto
honestly we're just discussing wording
exotic spoke
I’m gonna go have fun over —>
Until this is all finished
supple path
"There are situations where you may use shield block and consequently avoid hitting 100 rage." - true. vs "Use shield block to avoid rage cap." - misleading. People arguing for the second = no one.
lusty grotto
using SB shouldn't be next to "dumping rage" for lurkers, if the stars align where you can use SB without having it up to maintain effective uptime as you're maxing rage, then sure.
yeah pretty much Censuras
OH
okay
but i still think it can be interpreted incorrectly
long raft
Quick question, What would be better for tanking trinket wise, 415 Jes Howler, or a 395 Gleaming eye, or a 400 Butcher's Block?
long raft
Sweet thanks!
sick sentinel
if you had them all at the same ilvl then you would like to have eye+block for mplus
but the 20 ilvls are too much to drop
long raft
I also have the jaina trinket 400
sick sentinel
again, 15 ilvls are a lot
long raft
Hmm, the block that good eh
sand egret
Well, it's more than eye is really good, but not to make up the difference of ilvl between jes and eye
if i'm reading him right
sick sentinel
block>eye on mplus IMO
sand egret
well your statement reads weird then
sick sentinel
and eye>jes
willow scarab
What if you have 425 eye 415 block with socket 420 avoidance jes
willow scarab
Yeah
distant crystal
eye block
sand egret
eye block not even a question
sand egret
Jes can go die in a fire for all I care
willow scarab
Okay I’ve been doing it right
I DE lots of jes but kept this one
Felt bad to use but bad to DE
distant crystal
just put it on when you're in a triple windwalker + mistweaver group
yer a bard harry
long raft
Is it worth stacking the thunderclap trait?
sand egret
if you only want damage, sure
distant crystal
it's p good for dps
long raft
I know we want 3 Bastion of Might
willow scarab
That’s true
willow scarab
Sad that 3x dc isn’t viable in high keys
sick sentinel
don't say that, mwahi will come
willow scarab
Blood sport isn’t fun
sick sentinel
true
willow scarab
22KR went horribly btw
sick sentinel
I don't use bloodsport at all
long raft
Alright so i have the M jadefire helm, I can use either Callous Reprisal or Treacherus cove
sick sentinel
I would use treacherous tbh
willow scarab
Callous until you’re geared and exp
long raft
Currently my gear is 416
distant crystal
you should really rarely see the downside of treach
sand egret
all these wars geared to the teeth and asking the basics....and here my sorry ass can't get a fucking belt to save my life
willow scarab
Try it and log it see how often the execute is active
distant crystal
worst case your healer lets you float under 50% and the trait doesn't exist
willow scarab
And how often you have the buff
long raft
And i've been tanking M+ for a lil bit but i'm never to sure on the traits or trinkets. I always get conflicting info
sick sentinel
I would still use TC in 17s
willow scarab
I think you should just log it and see how you and your healer manage it
long raft
So one last question, How good is the Engineering helm for tanking?
sick sentinel
I have been using it
willow scarab
Has dps balance and defensive options
sick sentinel
since BoD launch