At this point I already am
#protection
sand egret
there ya go
undone sun
as i said before, it's the whole ideology of class design blizzard has
sand egret
the answer could simply be, "WoW aint for you anymore"
chilly brook
Except for me the whole game is half assed
undone sun
with the 2 devs they have working on all 36~ specs
neon tangle
agreed on the half-assed part
modern brook
🤷
sand egret
heh
sand egret
cuz that's totally how AAA dev works 🤣
hushed cobalt
im feeling a lack of dps on my part for being prot in dungeons (AD 13 and was ~15k overall)
undone sun
it's how blizzard works in recent years
undone sun
hmmm
sand egret
well, devs failed
exotic spoke
That from this week tsar?
hushed cobalt
yah
exotic spoke
Could be because of necrotic - either kiting on certainnpcks or not pulling as large of pulls as normal because of affixed this week
modern brook
Its deffo necrotic
undone sun
ofc, it's not weighted entirely on the devs
chilly brook
More like acting like you’re superior to your players and knowing what they want regarding changes they never fucking asked for
modern brook
you're kiting like a mother
undone sun
it's marketing , communication, and development that's the issue
hushed cobalt
i wanna say surviving isnt that big of an issue barring a few times where cough treants werent used.... or they didnt kill totem and had 4 stacks of the big dude bleed
sand egret
which is almost always on prod
undone sun
and that's on the publishers @sand egret
exotic spoke
Oh it isn’t, but kiting and smaller pulls will do that
undone sun
pushing unreasonable timeframes
sand egret
eh, that's prod
neon tangle
To be fair legion also basically had an extra year or two for work
hushed cobalt
doing UR14, using 410 rezans and a 400 diamond (tho have 400 jes and vial)
sand egret
unreasonable timeframes is literally the games industry
neon tangle
since they sorta abandoned WoD
modern brook
15k in ad sounds right to me tbh
undone sun
so did WoD, but we see how that went
sand egret
dealing with it is a Prod problem
final mist
Just because it's the norm doesn't mean it's right.
hushed cobalt
15k was AD, UR should be better i hope
undone sun
SoO was out for how long? and wod was a big letdown
final mist
And DPS will be lower this week across the board because of necrotic.
lusty grotto
shouldn't be the norm on a company like blizzard though... that shipped stuff when quality was 100% even if they had to delay
undone sun
people are saying it's fine
lusty grotto
back in the day
lusty grotto
agreed that its not
undone sun
poor excuse for a product to release by the devs
lusty grotto
this isn't a small indie company, excuse me for quoting that meme
modern brook
I mean thats the problem isn it
neon tangle
nobody in here really seems to be arguing that it's fine though
chilly brook
There seem to be plenty that are
fresh valley
name a point in the game where everything was "fine" and everyone was happy
because there's not
modern brook
UHHH VANILLA?1
lusty grotto
thats not what we're discussing
sick sentinel
lol
chilly brook
I would qualify Wrath as a “fine” product
lusty grotto
at at least im not
sick sentinel
legion was fine mop was fine wrath was fine
chilly brook
It was certainly acceptable
sick sentinel
most people enjoyed them
neon tangle
the amount of salt during wrath was crazy
chilly brook
Same with BC
neon tangle
"welfare epics"
exotic spoke
There are development problems and issues with class design.
I disagree with the causes - but the symptoms are the same.
lusty grotto
im just saying that the "norm" that blade mentions, isn't something blizzard should be adhering to
sick sentinel
well there are always people complaining about stuff and they should tbh in the end they pay the company to play the game but main thing here should be good arguments rather then just ''wow is dead'' memes
if you are enjoying the game it means its good being great is something else
bfa is just worse version of legion basicaly
lusty grotto
nobody is saying "wow is dead"
sand egret
The product is getting bigger, the demands are getting bigger, and the timelines are shifting up to deal with the emerging agile dev models that are snatching people left and right. What you see currently is Blizz trying to keep up (and failing) in this emerging market. It's actually a big turning point in the industry as a whole. Activision layoffs, today's ArenaNet (GuildWars2, same as the WoW model) are trying to go lean to be able to keep up
sick sentinel
go reddit once in a while 😄 you will see how many people crying about stuff
sand egret
being able to turn a monster like WoW on a dime to "adapt' to feedback is insane
neon tangle
@sick sentinel Legion was... imho a very different direction in a lot of ways
lusty grotto
i only go to reddit if i wanna laugh
sand egret
we're talking changes taking multiple weeks to get cleared
neon tangle
like, from the perspective of who your character is in the world
sand egret
Heck pushing a single balance change from dev > stage > prod is at least a week or two
neon tangle
and a lot flows from that, you aren't wielding unique legendary weapons, etc
fresh valley
they're trying to make things simpler to balance as well by getting rid of things like gear swapping in m+
neon tangle
class design flows that that, raid and dungeon design flow from that
lusty grotto
that's def not the point
fresh valley
and trying to treat pvp with bandaid 50% reductions
sick sentinel
well legion was good tho yes it had its flaws like way to get legendaries and had to grind for all of your specs and first version of artifact knowledge but along the way those problems were fixed and no one had issue because core idea of legion was good
plain ice
i mean.. working in engineering, it's quite annoying when you see people that are like "just change the code 4head"
lusty grotto
they want things simple to get more players
sick sentinel
i dont think i cant say the same thing for bfa
sand egret
@plain ice just add multiplayer! turn on the checkbox!
plain ice
LOL
sand egret
(actually had a user tell me that)
lusty grotto
i have that said to me daily
fresh valley
you know what wow needs, Battle Royal.
sand egret
the best is the cross-platform people
lusty grotto
at least once a day
sand egret
"BUT FORTNITE DID IT"
and we're sitting there like....and? that's a sony thing bruh
i don't expect people to know the innerworkings of what goes down, but I also expect people to understand that they don't know either
neon tangle
@sick sentinel anywho, my point is that there's a pile of things that I like more in BfA vs. legion
I like the basis of the class design in BfA, although it needed more work
undone sun
dart boards
neon tangle
Simpler things aren't necessarily worse, the talents we have now I don't think are worse than the options we had in Vanilla/BC
sick sentinel
every spec is just simpler legion version with less buttons without legendaries tier sets and op trinkets we had in legion BfA is just simpler and worse in many ways imo
the subject isnt vanilla or BC tho those times sucked compared to now
neon tangle
My point is that having a lot of buttons doesn't mean "better"
it just means having more buttons
exotic spoke
Rather than set the release date based on development they are developing to accommodate a release date
fresh valley
sick sentinel
you listened Ion alot
fresh valley
this feels relevant
exotic spoke
It’s why things feel rushed and incomplete imo
sick sentinel
making decisions matter more and simply cutting out decisions are two different things
neon tangle
@sick sentinel I think a good example (albeit an extreme case) are MOBAs
they have 6 buttons and a TON of depth and complexity
often a pile of viable builds and comps
sick sentinel
you still think that i want more buttons for better specs
i just said vanilla and BC sucked ass compared to now and everyone had insane amount of buttons they never used
neon tangle
"every spec is just simpler legion version with less buttons without legendaries"
- Roac, 2019
must have misread that
sick sentinel
yeah it is true legendaries and those buttons i mentioned gave those specs depth along many other things like artifact traits
neon tangle
I see sal typing
sleek root
Did I read that it's possible to spell reflect cyclone strike from Adderis in ToS?
neon tangle
so I'm gonna stop trolling
final mist
You did, because you missed the part where he said things were missing other than just buttons.
undone sun
sal is a big troll though 😏
final mist
Not incorrect.
sand egret
@fresh valley I fucking love that clip btw.
sick sentinel
I did it like 4 times yesterday
fresh valley
being an engineer, it is my life
sick sentinel
and I also killed myself once
sleek root
Got any footage of someone doing it? I'd like to see it
exotic spoke
Right roac. Let’s go back to a place where dps warriors get yelled at for deep wounds. /s
All kidding aside (I know you’re not implying that) I agree. There needs to be more depth. Either through abilities, sets, legendaries, something
Hell, adding reforging or more intricate gems (meta gems) could help
sick sentinel
overall ideas for classes and specs changed alot compared to legion i get it for example tanks arent god-like creatures that cant die o healers are just dps players who throw heals once in a while but i think its fair to admit we lost depth in specs and it is because we lost legendaries artifacts and tier sets
neon tangle
@sick sentinel ultimately I agree there should be more depth, I just don't think that BfA is fundamentally broken, you can have a lot of emergent complexity w/o adding back the stuff they took away
sick sentinel
we get azerite gear but they are all just buffs to your rotation so little of them actualy changes your rotation a bit or enhances it
neon tangle
and that there was depth removed when we came from legion
Azerite gear could be more interesting if it was as impactful as leggos or tier sets
sick sentinel
people miss the progression they felt in legion with getting legendaries opening artifact traits and they want reason to raid with tier sets and good trinkets from raids when you take that away from people just because you want everyone to have gear from anywhere that doesnt work
they brought azerite and said it will be new tier sets yet they work really different compared to a tier set
fresh valley
i love they took away tier sets. because now i don't have to do the chore of raiding and can focus on the gameplay i like: M+
exotic spoke
@sick sentinel I think part of that also comes from the fact that the best rewards are up front with Azerite gear versus later for artifact weapon
sick sentinel
tier sets meant getting new set every tier but azerite as it is right now just getting higher ilvl with same traits
that doesnt seem same to me or having any progress or change along the way of xpac
neon tangle
I think the "core" of azerite is fun, i.e. you have some system which gives you a few options for improving your character, hopefully more interesting ones than "ss does more damage", some way of separating tier set bonuses from the items themselves
also I think it's fun to have abilities themed to the raid/dungeon
fresh valley
and so far, there has been progression along the xpac. season 1 was one ring, felt super bad. season 2 has been 2 rings and a lot of fun min/maxing combo's
neon tangle
How they handled that left.... much to be desired
sick sentinel
yeah the core idea is not bad yet it is obvious they didnt work hard on it
2rings are fun
hearth of azzeroth is just a necklace that gains 2ilvl every trait
all of the trinkets in game are just terribly designed
fresh valley
season 3, we're not sure because exactly what it's going to be
sick sentinel
everyone uses stat-stick trinkets or on-use stat trinkets
sand egret
HoA is a tool to scale secondaries, tbh
sick sentinel
if the game keeps improving at this pace I might actually recommend it to some of my friends in the summer, probably
fresh valley
but it sounds like HOA is going to be more like the artifact with trait trees
merry cave
Legendary system was great it just wasn't balanced well
sick sentinel
no more draught or glaives or trinkets from antorus
grongs primal rage got fun-detected
exotic spoke
Felt back having to go back and farm fraught to be fair
neon tangle
Feels bad having to farm for a defensive row on my 415s
fresh valley
also roac, have you seen the gear they're releasing with the mini raid?
sick sentinel
but im hoping good changes to 8.2 with some class balances some changes to warfronts and islands to make them feel better rather then chores
fresh valley
the procs on it seem interesting
neon tangle
@sick sentinel also FWIW I really like the island changes they already did
sick sentinel
they are probably going to be undertuned
exotic spoke
I don’t disagree sadbox
sick sentinel
and most of them are just random damage procs
hope we see more of those stuff even from dungeons aswell having those little effects is great and gives people reason to do stuff
but they are a step in the right direction
fresh valley
i like the trinket that gives a bunch of mastery until the damage becomes too much
sick sentinel
and blizzard is now making many small steps towards the right direction tbh
the thing is
fresh valley
it's like adding a button without adding a button
sick sentinel
you don't walk a marathon step by step
exotic spoke
Is it Too little too late though
sand egret
it's almost like they're now hitting their backlog
sick sentinel
yeah lots of people quit already even if they didnt like me i stopped raiding doing m+ once in a while
I am still actively playing because raider.io is a thing
neon tangle
@sick sentinel gotta get that higher number
exotic spoke
I’m just sad I can’t even try to compete in MDI
astral crystal
man i WISH tier sets were back, only thing i would change is making tier not forge
sick sentinel
game isnt horrible like people say it is good mmo-rpg one of the best out there yet it can get way better then it already is which is sad
astral crystal
that would cut down on a lot of tforge nonsense
sick sentinel
my "social raiding" guild stopped raiding and now I am trying to get good at the game
exotic spoke
I doubt I’d make it last time trials... but I don’t even get the chance
sick sentinel
and also mythic raid
neon tangle
@astral crystal Tier sets are here, they're called azerite
sick sentinel
I would argue I have been slowly achieving the "getting good" at the game part
fresh valley
titanforging is the one thing I really do hate.
sick sentinel
i hated uldir and it killed the fun for me to get into next raid
neon tangle
and they can't titan/war forge
astral crystal
@neon tangle haHAA
sick sentinel
but battle for dazaralor is fun better then uldir
astral crystal
you know that's a disingenuous equivalency bud
it's tier-lite
if you want me to compromise
exotic spoke
So much better
sick sentinel
BoD is arguably one of the better raids they have made in the recent years
i liked NH aswell and antorus from legion
neon tangle
@astral crystal tbh I like the idea of azerite over the idea of tier sets, give you the ability to pick-your-own bonuses
sick sentinel
NH was horrible as prot warrior specialy for progress but raid was good
neon tangle
tuning the traits has been... pretty bad though
sick sentinel
and antorus was really fun aswell
exotic spoke
The tier sets had issues in legion because of the legendaries IMO. Some specs where locked into them.
Remove the legendaries and now guess what - you’re not locked into tiers
sick sentinel
yeah biggest issue of legion was having 4 piece and 2 piece legendary you were locked forever
and some specs were worse we had to use 4piece-2piece at start of antorus along side with 2 legendaries 😄
I had like 8 pieces locked in
and also the trinket from antorus another piece locked
4piece-2piece, 2 leggos, aman thul and 915 arcano
exotic spoke
Yeah pretty much.
sick sentinel
and the weapon
yeah it was an issue well i prefer having artifacts then hunting for weapons
i hated not getting shield for a month at start of xpac
like more than half of my gear was locked in place
yeah it was but being able to change gear beetwen combats still gave classes and specs depth
fresh valley
from a goblin standpoint, i loved the shield shortage. made well over 500k from crafted shield
sick sentinel
thats why most people didnt complained that much about being locked down with items
yes it isnt a good design but they fixed it good
imagine having ST azerite+trinkets and AoE azerite +trinkets
I would have to have like 4 sets of azerite AT LEAST combined between prot and fury
well easiest way to fix it is just give people free azerite change when they swap specs
done
but no you have to pay gold for it
for some reason
neon tangle
I can't imagine why they're doubling down on azerite respec costs
sick sentinel
i do wanna try fury or arms but i cba changing traits 7/24
exotic spoke
I can easily imagine that kaege. I’m used to prot set, arms pvp set, a couple different resist sets, a dps set (single target and aoe) and a variety of different odds and ins
sick sentinel
i play rogue aswell really wanna play outlaw but already because of raiding and m+ it costs at least 10k to swap to outlaw
sick sentinel
lol well they dont do much tho
oblique garnet
i have both bis gear on prot and fury 8)
sick sentinel
gives you haste gives you mastery
oblique garnet
Dont have to reforge ever
lusty grotto
rng tho
sick sentinel
i rather have something that will change playstyle at least a bit
and for rogues mostly spec-specific traits are better
meticulous scheming tho
exotic spoke
So while I don’t like the idea of carrying around 20 - 30 or so other pieces of gear (or in my bank because it’s easy to access)
I definitely don’t mind it
merry cave
There reason was they don't want people swapping every fight. Which is fucking asinine because if one of your raiders is wasting that much time between pulls there gonna get yelled at lol
hushed cobalt
UR14 +1'd, did 17.5k overall
IMPROVEMENT
sick sentinel
wha is next week
oblique garnet
tyrannical bursting skittish
sick sentinel
oh yeah just saw that
exotic spoke
Skittish bolstering tyrannical
oblique garnet
its only nono because tyrannical and 2nd boss
sick sentinel
I have a +17 UR timed., I am competely fine with not doing it next week
yeah 2nd boss takes so long
yeah i got one 17 UR done
first week it was so easy
with volcanic and raging
exotic spoke
Doing 16 tonight. Did a 15 ur yesterday. Getting back into the swing of things.
exotic spoke
Was pretty easy. Oh god yes it is
sick sentinel
we super scuffed it
hushed cobalt
the only time i went squish is when i did the 2nd skele pack after 2nd boss, i was fine then plopped
sick sentinel
like we were fucking around and having fun
oblique garnet
Kage imagine this
6 minutes left on 19 ur
You only need to kill the last 2 big bois
You somehow scuff it by having your healer and warlock die
Still 4 minutes left by the time they die
hushed cobalt
to the tentacles???
oblique garnet
Yes
hushed cobalt
good ole tenties
oblique garnet
Last reaping comes in
Warlock is dead we kill the last reaping but the healer gets knocked into the portal
Rip
sick sentinel
wait
neon tangle
Couldn’t you have just gone down
exotic spoke
Pebcak error for the lock
neon tangle
Why couldn’t you go down cause of the lock?
oblique garnet
Because he couldnt get to the boss because we skipped
neon tangle
Ahh that sucks
oblique garnet
And mass ress range isnt long enough
umbral forge
When you jump down only a fraction of the reaping mobs go with you, too.
So he couldn't get down
oblique garnet
Nah all the reaping mobs go down
neon tangle
Just SS yourself and death run silly lock
oblique garnet
We didnt have crs left
neon tangle
(I realize it was prolly on CD)
umbral forge
Really?
We wiped on last boss once and had to fight through reaping adds on our way back.
Maybe something else happened
exotic spoke
So priest is down, lock released but couldn’t get back because of a skip. What did you skip?
exotic spoke
Ahhh yeah. He only had one invis pot?
exotic spoke
Even then it’s a long run. But if he only had one I have to ask why only one. And also, if he did, he should have asked a guildmage to throw one in the guild bank - he could withdraw it from the mobile guild bank
oblique garnet
We shrouded past it
lusty grotto
honestly hindsight doesn't really do anything for him 😛
exotic spoke
No, true it doesn’t. But it helps going forward - other ways to get past it in the future
oblique garnet
The route we had was good just individual mistakes
sick sentinel
@oblique garnet you are boost right?
lusty grotto
or was /snicker
lusty grotto
just playing l8
exotic spoke
I’m not questioning his abilities. I know he’s good is an understatement.
sick sentinel
if late is one of the highest io dudes
oblique garnet
No im not boost
oblique garnet
Probably yeah
lusty grotto
❤
sick sentinel
late what's your character?
lusty grotto
but yeah i would say so
sick sentinel
i play alliance man getting into groups is hard because there isnt any
highest i see in pugs is just 15
lusty grotto
😮
old night
whats your io late
old night
dear god
lusty grotto
yamo still not 2k late
sick sentinel
yeah but your S1 score is a lot higher
lusty grotto
time to turn on twitch notification to harass
sick sentinel
well I started doing mplus over +10 after 8.1 hit tho
edgy current
Hey
im tanking heroic mekkatorque atm, should i take Never Surrender talent instead of Bolster
Because this boss hits more magical
Bolster doesn't help much
sick sentinel
never surrender is never pick
undone sun
firstly you never take NS
oblique garnet
^
exotic spoke
^^
edgy current
Ah thanks lol
sick sentinel
there is not any occasion in the game that never surrender is better
undone sun
second, Bolster sill reduces the CD to Last stand
sick sentinel
currently
oblique garnet
You can only take never surrender for high tyrannical on last 2 bosses on ml
undone sun
which used as a defensive CD is still very useful
oblique garnet
And only if you have warlock in group to summon
edgy current
Anything special i should take for this boss ?
oblique garnet
Bloodsport helps
edgy current
i go into the fray, crackling thunder, unstoppabble force, bolster, rumbling erath, booming voice and anger management
neon tangle
@edgy current Also just make sure to taunt pretty early in last phase
exotic spoke
The real question is... what’s the incentive to push high keys if I can’t even attempt to join tournament realm 😦
oblique garnet
High keys are fun
sick sentinel
and arguably stormbolt
neon tangle
^^^ stormbolt somewhat more useful for that fight
exotic spoke
True, I’m getting back into them. But sucks that I can’t even screw around for time trials
neon tangle
I never took rumbling earth for raids anyhow
oblique garnet
Why not?
sick sentinel
excluding rastakhan there is no fight where rumbling earth is actually good, and even there stormbolt is better
neon tangle
you almost certainly have AoE stuns that you shouldn't be wasting the diminishing returns for
exotic spoke
I live in Maryland. It’s one of the areas restricted from MDI just like it was from arena tournaments when I pushed for gladiator.
State laws view any competition that doesn’t have a “free entry” option but pay cash as gambling basically
sick sentinel
that being said, there is not enough use for stormbolt anyway
oblique garnet
But mdi is free entry tho🤔
oblique garnet
US laws L U L
exotic spoke
It’s a stupid law
Yup. More so - only some states are like it.
My teammates / guild mates were like “I have rental property in VA (neighboring state) I can lease to you for cheap”
stark sage
i feel like blizzard could get the law to rule in their favor atleast in that case, you are paying for the game service, the competition is a free entry
but yeah thats big dumb
oblique garnet
Its too much of an hassle for blizzard
exotic spoke
Yeah, may as well try again but it’ll probably be the same answer as 9 years ago.
But it’s the stupidest thing. Especially since we’ve added casinos in state
Not that I think I’d end up competing at the end, but just the journey would be fun.
oblique garnet
Yes and no
sick sentinel
exactly
oblique garnet
What is it replacing
marble cipher
k
oblique garnet
Im assuming your alch trinket is atleast 400
grizzled aspen
what is the timing to spell reflect cyclonic strike?
grizzled aspen
and do i run into the cyclones or just stand there
oblique garnet
Stand and wait for them to hit you
grizzled aspen
okay thank you
wintry ermine
415 alch trinket vs 400 rezans (other being 420 diamond)
hasty summit
How do you guys reset the stacks on champions of light?
oblique garnet
Mythic or hc?
hasty summit
I heroic leap away when she starts casting wave of light, then use spell reflection when she gets to me, but it doesn't seem to work 100%
HC
stark sage
on hc its harder to do
wintry ermine
just use externals or if you want get someone to taunt with immunity
hasty summit
think it would be better to heroic leap a bit before she goes into wave of light?
steel mauve
we usually just tank the boss until the add phase comes up, nuke adds then the other tank taunts and holds until new adds spawn and switch back
hasty summit
all right, thanks for the tips
steel mauve
on heroic we never have to reset until that comes up, on mythic you can solo reset during casts, its much easier
merry cave
Make the dh go tank just in case. It ruins there parses plus you get to be lazy 👍
frosty hearth
At what point would you start tanking m +10 ? Need to know for my alt please and thank you
sick sentinel
like 385
frosty hearth
Ok ty
hushed cobalt
UR 15, didnt time (i need to pull faster between trash and boss)
learneding!
exotic spoke
You going with a dedicated / consistent group?
On comms and all that tsar
Also, how over where you?
hushed cobalt
healer and dps i have beed doing a handful of 13-15s in the last few days
the other 2 dps, aare hit or miss (so i think)
no comms
over by.... 1 big dude at the end
exotic spoke
Get on a discord that’ll help.
You guys can plan out pulls prior to it - communicate oom / drinking / ccs /interrupts faster
hushed cobalt
about that, its back and forth with me because im sometimes too quiet, or sometimes im too verbal about people fucking up(not treanting/stun/etc) then i feel asshole-ish which leads to being quiet
resto druid that kitty weaves alot, and a mage
trying to get a guildie or 2 in that can do it, but they're not usually on at the same times
exotic spoke
Mute your mic. Listen to them.
In my experience If you group with friends you’ll be more comfortable and find a happy middle ground
teal galleon
Just a quick one guys, Treachourous covenant over Bastion of might? For raiding?
Thanks in advance
oblique garnet
No
exotic spoke
They can say what they are interrupting. Call out cooldown on you. Call for shout.
teal galleon
My bad
exotic spoke
You may have to go outside of your comfort zone - but it can be worth it
hushed cobalt
when i mute my mic, guildies i run with know when im muted (and presumably a lil hot tempered)
i also took a weak aura, and tweaked it for interrupts/cc/stuns
sick sentinel
this mind sound a bit weird
exotic spoke
Just ideas. I find communication is key.
oblique garnet
Communication is by far the most important thing pushing keys
teal galleon
Fair enough, thanks!
sick sentinel
but wank once before a mplus session, you are going to be super chill
hushed cobalt
LOL
oblique garnet
Its true
exotic spoke
I’ve been in 10 man Skype calls back in cata while on the rbg grind it can get heated there
hushed cobalt
comms would be better for those times when i wanna spell reflect
neon tangle
@hushed cobalt Is generally best (imho) to just ask for certain things
Like I have a monk healer, they were using ring SUPER early
popping it right as reaping happened
Now they just hold it until I call for it
hushed cobalt
chill, and sometimes really loud
exotic spoke
Having a beer before to help relax you could help too
Keep criticism constructive and don’t be aggressive with blame
I’m sadbozs example “hey, i think we might like to use ring a little later. Let them group up a little bit then push them back. But I’m curious about your thoughts”
Or whatever reason you think really
hushed cobalt
i only get testy (example with guildies) we're doing higher keys and not hte normal 10 for the week
like in a 12/13 and breaking cc thats way far away, or pulling for me
exotic spoke
Set expectations. Also the more you to them the easier they become and soon the 13s are like 10s
unborn island
Just did a low motherlode to relax...god some people are bad
No interrupts (we had 2 melee)
oblique garnet
Motherlode
Relax
Choose one
neon tangle
I hate myself every time I try and do a low key to relax
unborn island
Mage.. didn't use bloodlust
neon tangle
I thought it would be quicker to do low keys to farm hydrocores
oblique garnet
Only low key i can relax is freehold
neon tangle
v wrong
exotic spoke
Try doing TD. You can kill them at the cannons
sick sentinel
just use drums
neon tangle
@oblique garnet what's your definition of low key
unborn island
🤦
neon tangle
I guess to be fair like a 5-6 I can mostly solo
oblique garnet
10-15
exotic spoke
For you yes. For others no lol
unborn island
Although I did discover...
oblique garnet
I think its mostly just difference in experience
I have run fh for over 300 times now🤔
unborn island
Apparently stoneform now resets necrotic:)
oblique garnet
I just want the fucking mount so i can stop
oblique garnet
Do you have the mount?
daring marlin
@unborn island It has since 8.1 I think? They changed it to physical.
sick sentinel
no
unborn island
@daring marlin this must be the first time I have run with it since then, dont get to play a lot. That's like, the best thing I have heard.
prime rivet
Anyone have Glickz WAs?
undone sun
Who 🙃
sick sentinel
2x ironfotress or 2x bloodsport?
naive panther
Rop is actually really nice early on reaping if you have spread mobs and are in a hallway. To let them all group up.
sick sentinel
Rop?
sand egret
Ring of Peace (monk Talent)
sick sentinel
Oh thought he answered my question 😄
sand egret
the answer to your question is contextual, but the general answer will be IF
puts on glasses but technically if you’re facing unblockable damage Bloodsport wins as IF provides no value
neon tangle
@naive panther He just had a bad habit of dropping it on top of himself the second that reaping started
even on stuff like KR where stuff filters in
like it would be gone before 90% of the mobs showed up
reef warren
for a balanced setup between m+ and raiding, vers or haste for gems/enchants?
still haste i believe yes?
brave vine
i think haste = rage = damage + survivability
brave vine
well, he specified gems and chants
reef warren
i understand ilvl. I have like 4 sockets to fill, and want to make sure I'm putting them the correct way
neon tangle
in that case, haste for days
timber nest
is this any good? doesnt feel good tbh
broken gale
why is that bad? the negative aspect of it too deadly?
neon tangle
above everything, it's a 6 minute CD
broken gale
it's like cheat death from rogues though no?
could be really useful
although i can see other DPS trinkets being better for certain content
neon tangle
On top of the craaazy long CD you're pretty likely to die anyways w/ the healing absorb
vs. something that will prevent damage the entire fight
@broken gale For context, DKs don't take their cheat death which has no downsides and is on a 4 minute CD
umbral forge
That trinket is good for tanks who don't frequent class Discords.
If you fuck up it'll save your life. It's training wheels.
It can be good for you if you/your guild are prone to dying tanks
neon tangle
^^^^^ Tank deaths are 100% preventable this xpac
broken gale
what a nice little quip there bro
umbral forge
I used it until I started going here and learned prot warrior after all
Or well, began learning?
neon tangle
I mean if you want to burn a trinket effect for a maybe-save-me-once-every-6-minutes
more power to you I guess
supple path
A trinket like that may have had a place back when you could still swap gear in m+, but now, not so much, yeah.
neon tangle
Or if you were likely, at all, to get 1-shot this xpac
(even then this particular trinket is the shittiest of the chest-death options...)
broken gale
yeah i'm not necessarily advocating for it, but I certainly do NOT think it's BAD
far from it, it'll have its use for people with limited trinket selection
supple path
It's bad in that 99% of the time the effect doesn't do anything useful.
broken gale
not dying is pretty damn good every 6 minutes
supple path
But I'd wear it over some other 25 ilvl lower trinket
broken gale
but that's just me, i have no dying problem otherwise
supple path
It doesn't guarantee you'll live and it's not guaranteed to proc every 6 minutes. If you never 'died' it did literally zero.
Doesn't mitigate damage like secondary stats do, doesn't add damage, etc. Just prevents death in narrow circumstance.
neon tangle
maybe if it was just a "don't die" but it's a "don't die from this one attack and HOPEFULLY don't die now that you're at 50k health and have a healing absorb"
broken gale
i'm sure there are certain raid bosses in BoD on Mythic that this trinket could come in handy just for that fight
but otherwise, yes it's very useless outside of that
not bad though
neon tangle
Literally none, the one fight where you take single big attacks is m Jaina
supple path
BoD's really not a tankbuster raid
neon tangle
and on that fight you literally die on purpose
broken gale
blockade soaks?
broken gale
oh me too 😃
neon tangle
also of a trinket is useful for 1 fight, maybe, on mythic, in the hands of players who are 8/9 mythic
I call that bad
for learning players if you're 50k hp and have a healing absorb and your healers just let you die I don't have a lot of hope for your survival over the next 5s
supple path
I mean I almost never used that huge channeled absorb trinket in legion and it was sooo much better for that sort of stuff.
lusty grotto
i just had
the greatest exp with pugs ive had in a long time
couple of mistakes but shrine timed
pugs did great, interrupted great, did decent dps
resto druid did kitty dots
steel mauve
the bargain trinket has a spot on pure progression where you are getting used to the fight or the healers are unvcomfortable with a fight, since it can save a bres or a wipe, other than that its pretty bad
broken gale
i hate that
even when you manually enter their player name and server, you can't add them
lusty grotto
yeah
sand egret
cuz we're already friends, Nim
lusty grotto
ROFL
sand egret
ignorin' me all run then comin' around actin' like we friends
snaps fingers
mmmhmmmm
lusty grotto
:[
final mist
The Bwonsamdi trinket is bad in every situation.
Never touch it.
Crucify people that use it unless they don't know any better, in which case teach them to be better.
sand egret
But....what about the situation when you're next to the scrapper and you need mats......
jus' sayin'
sand egret
rood
outer dew
ashen maple
do bonded souls stack or do you only want one?
lusty grotto
do you have any prot traits? or are you just replacing the extra DC?
but yes they do stack
ashen maple
do you just want 3x bastions? lol
ashen maple
im runing bloodsport instead of bastion
lusty grotto
plus crit blocks and a free IP
ashen maple
on one piece
dusky summit
quick question. does bonded souls still work with no one around you. It doesn't HAVE to link to someone right?
lusty grotto
shrug bonded souls is a no for me dawg
not prot specific
and prot specific traits are better
@sand egret have you seen my collection?
😄
and btw @ashen maple 3x BoM is the go-to for M+
sand egret
jesus....
ashen maple
what about raids?
teal radish
got a quick qestion for u friends
candid ledge
Survival-wise, should 415 Knot be replaced with 410 Jes with Leech?
teal radish
i have a 405 jes howler and i just got a 400 animated blood
candid ledge
Gonna get roasted about that leech
teal radish
what do yall like to use?
candid ledge
For m+ though and those spicy DPS I think knot
candid ledge
since 1 min cd for almost every 2nd pack
lusty grotto
use vial then
teal radish
k cool
ashen maple
does anyone use iron fortress?
lusty grotto
of course we do
ashen maple
DC or IF for raids and m+
lusty grotto
i suspect you still have questions when it comes to traits
there are answers in the icy veins guide
anything not in the list is usually not as valuable
you always want at least 1 DC
this is also in the guide
ashen maple
ill have 3 DC if i dont go IF lol
lusty grotto
an extra 6 seconds of demo shout DR and 15% extra damage with Booming Voice
oh yeah sure go IF
lusty grotto
bricked yet another seth key
because people can't do orb room
idiots passed on top of a lamp
alt+f4 time
kept dpsing my mobs
dim blaze
primal crypt
omg we did it bois
narrow abyss
Gz
potent anvil
naive panther
would love a 415 everchill
long tinsel
Is having 2% versatility bad?
open bluff
no, it just means you aren't very versatile
long tinsel
Right. I feel like all my gear is crit
open bluff
as long as you're equipping your highest ilvl weapons and armor, your stats don't really matter
long tinsel
It's my rings
10 ilvl difference on a ring I just got and brought my vers down to 2%
Just wondering if I should not be equipping that
open bluff
you should, unless the vers ring has a socket
long tinsel
It does not
open bluff
more stats > better stats
long tinsel
Tru
open bluff
i wouldn't scrap/de the old ring just yet though in case you feel you need some extra vers to survive magic damage, but it's definitely not worth sacrificing ilvl for vers in 99% of situations
long tinsel
Yeah that's what I was thinking. I feel like I'm always getting melted against magic
open bluff
everyone's gotta have a weakness somewhere unfortunately
but yeah, unless you're 100% sure you can't be playing better/saving cds for the nukes that are killing you, i wouldn't jump for the vers ring
stats are only a secondary solution the vast majority of the time; if someone's getting rekt chances are they could do a better job managing cds/rage
long tinsel
Yeah thats a good point. Thanks Avalith
shadow spruce
so my 400 shield has 79crit/51haste, but my 405 has 75crit/58mastery + 82 armor, 9 str, and 19 stam, which should i wear?
open bluff
405
never ever ever sacrifice ilvl on shields
no matter what
not even for a socket
not only are they a decent chunk of armor, but they're your only source of block rating; you can't make up for block with +3 secondaries
lusty grotto
^
open bluff
the only time you care about stats on a shield is if you're comparing identical ilvl, otherwise the answer is always higher ilvl
open bluff
Phrasing imo
sand egret
here we gooo
narrow abyss
Haha gz
dark lark
quick question: the only trouble ive had in freehold this week are the big packs with harpooners
when i kite with big stacks
i just get pulled back in
do i have to range it like crazy?
modest wedge
or see it cast on casters
dark lark
and then just get poked it back in lol
modest wedge
and take the opportunity
modest wedge
that or what i said earlier
that should be very irrelevant ability. it should not make u die even when u do get dragged back
or just pop speed potion
dark lark
literally the only trouble ive had with necrotic this week lmoa
*lmao
in the easiest dungeon
modest wedge
jebait it by running away and when u get harpooned just leap
should be the easiest way but there is plenty of others
dark lark
thanks
sick sentinel
Short story
Decide to pug a quick key, first thing in the morning ( no coffee and no breakfast yet)
"Cursed with a 16 Shrine, planning to time this LUL"
Let's go
guy makes a discord for comms
DH, Shaman(key owner) and I spend 20 mins making the route
everything goes well
reach first boss
healer and russian rogue die to surging rush
literally what
ionic fern
Love how you mentioned that the rogue was russian.
sick sentinel
rogues are a special kind of breed
you have to mention where they come from
russian rogues are different from greek rogues and so on
modest wedge
hopefully u had a good breakfast after :D
tardy berry
This week in siege of Boralus amirite?
hearty chasm
I can't find a pawn string anywhere for protection, i guess u can't use pawn for prot? Can u even sim damage taken?
sigh
quiet crane
You can’t aim for survival and pawn strings are bad you shouldn’t use them
Sim
@hearty chasm
quiet crane
Yes but prot sims even for dps atm are wonky so take with a grain of salt, you can ONLY also sim for dps you can’t sim for survivability there’s just to many variables
Ignore the sim part... dunno how that got in there when I was talking about the pawn strings
undone sun
even then, you'd have to resim every new piece you get
and reimport a new string
ResidentSleeper
cut out a step and delete pawn
quick elk
I know for the US Necrotic is done. is over . but really hated the affix this week. As a warrior what can you do on your own to reduce stacks / allow the to fall off. I will admit some of the pugs i was in had no knock backs so that could have been why i hated it so much
sacred anvil
On use str trinket -> more parry -> slower stack gain
Heroic leap talent is almost always a stack reset if you have place to run
Ofc higher DPS helps a lot
lavish oracle
I've been churning out lightfoot potions for kiting this week
sacred anvil
Aim to have dudu/shammy for typhoon, vortex, treants, earth ele, thunderstorm
eager phoenix
Lightfoot, Leap and Intervene solid ways to haul ass but basically all classes have something to help you out be it slows, stuns, taunts, roots or knockbacks. Also I feel it did help if you were really paying attention to stacks you can often times get out of Dodge before it becomes a "oh shit" moment. I only feel it was a bit scetchy in specific areas of some dungeons. Like the 2 big packs before 3rd in SoB.
quick elk
didn't think of potions usage, thanks really helpfull as always
freehold was a example where even when i lepts away theere is that big mob who just refuses to be slowed knock backed
i reset once and then only barley survived after that
i guess there is a reason ppl normally inv them
invis
My healer friend said if i back pedal with backs the stacks go up slower . i tired it a few times didnt really feel like it made a difference. is there any sense to that?
real yarrow
somebody knows if "iron fortress" does stack?
old zephyr
it does
Rule of thumb : If the value of something in a trait increase with Ilvl (or center ring), it stacks
real yarrow
ty alot 😉
old zephyr
I heard the DR from Callous reprisall stacked as well but I did'nt tested that
undone sun
yes
scales with ilevel
multiple ways to find out as well, 1) go to wowhead and find the spell associated with the trait, moving the ilevel slider usually shows which 2) Hover over middle trait in the piece. Numbers that are highlighted in green are also the numbers that will scale with extra multiples of the trait. 3) Link the trait in chat and whichever stacks scales( and vice versa)
unborn island
@quick elk just race change to dwarf and win, join the master race
modest wedge
im just a human :,) 1% dr
sick sentinel
@hearty chasm pawn is bad
ruby ridge
Does anyone know how to get your nameplates to show reaping aggro properly? I'm currently using tidy plates, but happy to switch to anything that works. I saw that @shut summit somehow got this to work between his last 2 streams. He seems to be using Plater, but this problem is still listed as an issue for them. 😕
sick sentinel
@old zephyr CR % dr stacks
undone sun
afaik it's a problem with reaping mobs, not addons
ruby ridge
yeah, the threat api
modest wedge
i have the same problem. i have accepted it. at least i can see if there is any normal mobs left
ruby ridge
haha, i guess that's a good optimists view 😄
nova birch
if i'm able to stack iron fortress or brace for impact in raiding which one is considered 'better'?
modest wedge
BFI gives more deeps
sick sentinel
Bfi is better ST
modest wedge
and slightly less defence
modest wedge
oh yes
sick sentinel
There is literally the guide
#268491842637660160 got updated today
Make sure to link it every other message
nova birch
ah didnt see updated faq sorry, makes sense to me thanks people
undone sun
what changed 🤔
sick sentinel
I know a bunch of fury stuff was added
zealous crest
guys, my goal is max dps, as tank. Should I go for Vial of Animated blood or Jaina hc trinket?
ionic fern
AoE or ST? Aoe = Vial, ST = Jaina i guess.
sick sentinel
If you do consistent big pulls like I do, then jaina
ionic fern
Wait, isn't Jaina ST?
sick sentinel
If you cater your route for HUGE pulls and CD stacking
Then vial
Vial is burst aoe
Jaina is consistent aoe
That takes a bit to stack up
zealous crest
what would be ideal combo for trinkets? I got 415 socketed Rezan, so what you think about option 2
sick sentinel
And by a bit I mean like 10 TC/Revenges, assuming
Fully stacked Jaina does like 1k dps per target
@zealous crest opulence trinket is absolutely insane, gore block is pretty good and a knot from the world boss of darkshore can be absolutely massive to pair with your rezans
Let me correct about jaina trinket
It's 900 damage every 2.5 sec per target fully stacked
Still pretty good
360 dps per target
old zephyr
I use knot, and It's very good. Lines up with 2 out of 3 avatar
eager tartan
415 rezan, lucky basterd
sick sentinel
Thats what I am thinking of doing rn
zealous crest
got low score couse I only did AD 😄
sick sentinel
Farming all dungeons that drop rings
zealous crest
so I need to /w wall of text every time I apply to AD 10+ 😄
sick sentinel
Or get a good rio
I get insta invites to anything I list for
Actually no
@zealous crest you think you are done?
You're not
Time to farm WCM
For a gore block
sick sentinel
I have both rezans and gore block at 400 with socket
Idk if I should farm for forges
I mean, raid trinkets are wack
And I am not getting mythic jaina on farm anytime soon
wait what is the anker not best dps trinket?
Literally read
What I said like 10 mins ago about it
Tldr it's good
sick sentinel
And I have to be in fury lootspec in the raid until we kill jaina
So no opu trinket
ah sry was reading now 😄
junior igloo
@sick sentinel Why is that?
marble cipher
it's not like there's good fury specific stuff on Opulence though, is there?
eager tartan
Fury is kinda fun as spec either way
marble cipher
they're also on prot loot list
junior igloo
But if you get a tanking trinket, you lost your chance of looting fury item 😃
sick sentinel
Exactly
marble cipher
true, I guess 😉
marble cipher
I got my opu trinket yesterday, from HC though, I don't raid mythic on my warrior (but on my monk)
sick sentinel
@eager tartan my choice
marble cipher
405, still very good to have for tanking M+
marble cipher
Fury is good fun, agreed, I also play it quite often
sick sentinel
So I got in the highest ranked team that accepted me
eager tartan
Fair enough, I'm more of a tank main don't really mind the class that much
marble cipher
And applying to guilds as a tank is a massive pain
sick sentinel
Once we get BoD on farm I could go full on lootwhore for prot I guess
eager tartan
Well I mind playing a druid atm and dh weaboz are not my cup of tea
marble cipher
Almost all half decent guilds have their tank team set up already
sick sentinel
I have been a melee dps forever
marble cipher
I was lucky to get into a guild that had double BDK as tank team, and they wanted a monk to supplement
sick sentinel
Started tanking in bfa
eager tartan
I got lucky, the one I am right now is a two day guild with decent progress and was looking for a tank
marble cipher
That's lucky indeed, not a lot of those guilds available at any time
eager tartan
Had to migrate though but I have stupid amounts of cash
marble cipher
Send me some 😉
eager tartan
Hell I even got richer with the transfer granted the prices on draenor were more expensive
marble cipher
I always giggle a bit when I see people running around with that guildname 😄
I'm in <Greggs>, also Draenor
sick sentinel
Do you know who else is on draenor?
My friend who is in a shit guild called order of the silverflame
But also
@oblique garnet is on draenor
marble cipher
Oh, didn't know
sick sentinel
I was going to transfer to draenor but I went to kazzak instead
Not completely sure if it was the right call
marble cipher
When I transferred, those were the exact two servers I was doubting about too
Applied to guilds before transferring, and Draenor was what it went to
oblique garnet
Greggs recruiting?
sick sentinel
@oblique garnet if you check the "I'm actively looking for a guild" checkbox in wowprogress
You are will start getting battle net friend requests daily
Thats what I did
10 battle net friend requests in like 7 days
With 3/9m prog
Also apply to shit
Like all the shit
junior igloo
Surely this Chipstocks guy could be easily replaced by a decent tank, @marble cipher 😄
eager tartan
Like hitting chiks on tinder 4head
marble cipher
A guildie of ours recently ticked that box on wowprogress, and added every possible option to his profile.
He now speaks 6 languages fluently, can raid all day, every day and is open to transfer to anywhere.
He already regrets his little experiment 😄
modest wedge
can i search m+ groups from wowprogress? or is it just lfg(uild)?
marble cipher
@modest wedge don't know if this is worth anything, but spotted it this morning on reddit.
https://www.reddit.com/r/CompetitiveWoW/comments/auy14h/lf_m_tank_eu_to_push_15/
hearty chasm
guys i've been using this macro rn: #showtooltip
/castsequence reset=5 Avatar, Demoralizing Shout
/use 13
but is there any way i can make it cicle through the cd's ? like if avatar isn't up i could push it and DS would still work?
sick sentinel
Oh god what is this
marble cipher
/cast Demoralizing Shout```
Shouldn't it fallback?No dude
sick sentinel
Just use them separately
You need to avatar, (charge),thunderclap demo shout, use trinket , thunderclap
marble cipher
tbf, I also link my trinket to avatar though, but it's probably slightly better to delay it till after the demo shout, agreed
sick sentinel
You lose uptime
marble cipher
yeah
junior igloo
That macro shouldn't even work, you'd need a cast-sequence with some resets, since they are both on the GCD
marble cipher
kek, it's that one that I'm using 😉
sick sentinel
Anything else, please dont
marble cipher
cause mekka has ramp up, others just activate?
hearty chasm
understood, new to tanking here 😃
marble cipher
makes sense
sick sentinel
You are fucking yourself SO MUCH if you macro it with avatar
eager tartan
Just join the fight on the forums and cry for a demo shout out of gcd 👌
junior igloo
Well, that might be a little dramatic
sick sentinel
You have to make it dramatic to get the message through
marble cipher
DRAMA!!! 🍿