protection

[last mason]

lol

like that?

i cant for the life of me remember what the last 4.5% was

[charred prawn]

warriors suck

[last mason]

but thats the gist of it

[oblique garnet]

can you post a screenshot of it?

[last mason]

yea

[outer dew]

if you're free in 30 minutes

i can post my routes

and explain some of my thought process on some pulls

and just share in game

[last mason]

This is scuffed, but

as i said, i forget where the last 4.5 came from

also any thoughts on why the logs give 404

and @outer dew id love that actually, but its 2 am here so I gotta get to bed. You available tomorrow at all by any chance?

[outer dew]

i'll probably be avaiable tomorrow

might be running keys at some points though

[last mason]

hahaha thats fine, I have lots of time tomorrow. It sounds like @oblique garnet streams, do you also?

id love to watch

[oblique garnet]

i stream very rarely

[outer dew]

hmm

i probably could

just been lazy to set something up

but it'd be fairly meh quality

[last mason]

hmmm i can get into all my other logs

just not that one, maybe its too recent

[oblique garnet]

could be corrupted file also

we had quite some issues with our logs recently

[last mason]

is that something on my end or the website's end

[oblique garnet]

no idea tbh

are you using addon to log?

or the wcl one?

[last mason]

using no addon, just going to the website afterwards

wcl

[outer dew]

fucking

get me out of

opulence late

maybe i should just switch to horde

lmao

btw, you saw that some people trying to rebuild WCG went to Alliance Sarg?

[last mason]

wcg?

and what guild u in btw? maybe ive seen it around

[oblique garnet]

wildcard gaming LUL

[last mason]

it broke up? wasnt that really toxic brm the rl for them?

[oblique garnet]

yeah

[last mason]

or so ive heard

[outer dew]

yes

and they're on sarg\

currently in wavvy

zzz

[oblique garnet]

tofu you having fun on opulence? 😃

are you even tanking it

[outer dew]

fucking

shoot me

yes

their tank left

so i filled in the spot

[oblique garnet]

we were hardstuck on grong for 3 days : ))))

[outer dew]

welcome to us on jadefire

:DDDDDDD

[oblique garnet]

rip

[outer dew]

had a dps go

"NOW THATS A MYTHIC MECHANIC"

to the jadefire mini game

[oblique garnet]

xDDD

[outer dew]

bitch

i did that in heroic as a tank

lmao

[oblique garnet]

im not at all excited for that

my guild really struggles on fights with mechanics that dont involve moving from b to a

[narrow abyss]

Tell me about it...

[last mason]

Also Would you guys take barrage or rng of the engi helm, when I’m only tanking in m+

On*

[oblique garnet]

Actually no clue on this one

rerolled away from engi

[fickle geode]

405 Vers/mas shield vs 400 crit/hate socket shield, What's bettr the block or the haste/socket?

bettr*

better**

[open bluff]

405

a socket is worth exactly 0 ilvls on a shield

[fickle geode]

alright

[neon tangle]

@last mason barrage is Better for dps

[outer dew]

barrage is okay as long as youi face tank

[neon tangle]

Synaptic for a lil extra damage reduction

implying that a warrior wouldn’t be face tanking

Mfw

[stone beacon]

'mornig folks
wanted to know is the Kraken's Eye of Strength woth

*worth wearing

[neon tangle]

Nope

[stone beacon]

i can bearly mantain 11k dps on sigle target
https://raider.io/characters/eu/dalaran/Ragnawolf
wanted to have some advise
thnx

[ionic fern]

Your traits are off . o.o

You could trippel stack BoM

[stone beacon]

BoM for a raiding prog ?

[ionic fern]

I'm running x3 BoM + x2 DC for raiding progress. 🤷

Also, you are running SiN instead of Heed my call .

[stone beacon]

good to know
actually was just tryin it

[ionic fern]

If DPS is your goal then you should go full on DPS azerite traits.

Just remember that it might also be your gameplay rather than gear.

[neon tangle]

Almost certainly gameplay

At ilvl 404

[ionic fern]

^

[stone beacon]

huum
Shield Slam on CD
clap on CD
DS combined with Avatar

sapam on devast

[ionic fern]

Logs would help more.

[stone beacon]

i'm really confused

[neon tangle]

Maybe post some logs here

[stone beacon]

k

brb

[ionic fern]

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/FXmRNDcAJKPG9gYh#fight=3&type=damage-done

Well that's wrong.

[stone beacon]

oh

[ionic fern]

That's wayyyyy too little TC casts on a 3:57 fight

For reference i made 4 casts less than you on a 1:23 fight

[neon tangle]

You're almost certainly devastating too much

[ionic fern]

Also you are using Devastate too-too much

[neon tangle]

i.e. looking at one of your avatars

You went 5s w/o casting a TC

during which time you pressed devastate twice

[stone beacon]

i'll rework on it ASAP

so less devastator more claps

[neon tangle]

I wouldn't even think of it like that

[stone beacon]

oh

[neon tangle]

SS > TC > Revenge (with proc) > Devastate

[stone beacon]

it will be like having a devastator every 7 sec or so

actually i spam it for the SS proc

[warm plinth]

You shouldn't even think about having Devastate. Devastate should just be what you cast when you can't cast anything else.

[stone beacon]

but not worth as i sees

[warm plinth]

Revenge and TC also trigger SS procs

[neon tangle]

Devastate is just your filler

Devastate literally does less than a single auto attack

[stone beacon]

and that's why i struggle to up my dps i think i focus more on the spam

any logs to compare with plz one of yours

on jade i.e

[neon tangle]

I would give you one of mine but I don't play warrior 😛

[stone beacon]

np

i appriciated the critics
was very helpfull

!!

[oblique garnet]

logs on what boss?

[stone beacon]

jade if possible

[oblique garnet]

hc/mythic?

[stone beacon]

HC

[oblique garnet]

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/kdfn8zMaFGLcwgqX#fight=2&type=damage-done from yesterday

[stone beacon]

very thankful

[neon tangle]

I wish my group got parses like that

jeepers

[oblique garnet]

i wish my group would dodge mechanics

[stone beacon]

one last thing
stats wise https://www.warcraftlogs.com/character/eu/dalaran/Ragnawolf
is it ok or a rework too ?

[warm plinth]

Stats don't matter. Even if they did, they'd be the least of your concerns right now.

[neon tangle]

Generally speaking ilvl > the particular stat

what Ghash said

[warm plinth]

Focus on making your rotation better first, as that's always going to be the most important change you can make.

[stone beacon]

sure !

[neon tangle]

You could also do a bit of work on your block uptime too tbh

29/63 hits taken were w/o block up

Including 7(!) beastial smashes

[stone beacon]

i'm looking at it now

[neon tangle]

Comparing to @oblique garnet he took 12 hits w/o SB/last stand/shield wall up

out of 65

also, demo shout more

Late had 7 casts in a 2:57 fight, you had 8 in a 4:50 fight

[outer dew]

Late

You bitch

Made me confused AF

Looked at mythic damage intake

Vs your heroic

And was thinking what the fuck am I doing wrong

[stone beacon]

@neon tangle i'll rework the hole spec i think beggining with the rotation as @warm plinth advised
and @oblique garnet much appriciated for the logs !

[oblique garnet]

@outer dew yeah my mythic damage taken is off the charts too man mostly because the cotank was the mechanics boi and i was tanking 90% of the time

[outer dew]

same

lmao

was just getting spanked

[neon tangle]

My body is ready for m grong

guild wanted to finish heroic first

[outer dew]

You raiding as dk or war?

[neon tangle]

dk

[outer dew]

Grong as Dk seems miserable

[neon tangle]

even worse, guild is double-DK now

[oblique garnet]

grong as a dk is basically ams bot

[outer dew]

If you get thrown without an external

You cry

Because you gotta run yo ass back to hit that boss

And with how far some dps run...

[neon tangle]

AMS helps that a bit

How much does the throw hit for?

[oblique garnet]

200-100k depending on how far you go

[outer dew]

It's basically scream for hel0

If you miss your AMS

Because it'll kill you on drop if it lines up with fear

[neon tangle]

yikes

[outer dew]

And ya know

[neon tangle]

I wonder if I could cheese it w/ rune tap

[outer dew]

As a DK, cant mitigate if thrown to bum fuck Africa

[neon tangle]

like zek

on heroic I don't even get stunned since AMS soaks the whole hit

[outer dew]

who knows

me no play DK

[neon tangle]

I'm gonna mess around with it, napkin math says I could just absorb the whole throw and skip the stun

[honest canopy]

Holy Paladin got 425 TD shield with avoidance .:.

[hollow thorn]

That is literally impossible

[outer dew]

how2lie 101

lol

[honest canopy]

No?

It has int and str

switched

[outer dew]

it's impossible to get a 425 shield outside of raid

lol

[honest canopy]

Ha lol not 425 x

415 obv, missclick

[fading python]

A friend of mine was suggesting I should get as many Deafing Clap traits as possible, to do max dps in M+'s ... Is that a good idea?

[narrow sigil]

certainly good for m+

[hollow thorn]

More DCs only gives more DPS

No defensive values

BoM > DC

After the first one

[fading python]

Alright, thank you

[rustic owl]

hey guys, how are you seeing the uptime via logs? or are you using a different site?

for things like shield block

[warm plinth]

Select you, then damage taken, then hover over the ability damage % bar

It'll show % of blocked hits

[sick sentinel]

400+s gore block POG

[warm plinth]

Or just go to buffs and look at Shield Block uptime, but % of blocked hits is a better metric to look at.

NIce

[outer dew]

tbh

[sick sentinel]

farmed WM

[outer dew]

i'm thinking

of joining the mastery enchant gang

instead of stacking haste

lmao

[sick sentinel]

haste

dude

I know mastery gets better the more you have of it

[rustic owl]

ok cheers man

[outer dew]

that and mastery gems

are so fucking cheap

LMAO

bought stack of 200 for 3k

[final mist]

Do what you want, don't recommend it to people here though.

[outer dew]

but I didn't reccomend it at all

¯_(ツ)_/¯

[marble wave]

So ring 10ilvl> but with mastery as high stat is not bad?

Damage wise

[outer dew]

i mean

I wouldn't drop ilvl just for ring

all stats are fairly good

[sick sentinel]

yeah but haste dude

[outer dew]

only things i'm changing for example

are enchants / sockets

[sick sentinel]

like

[marble wave]

Rings always ilvl too? Even 5 ilvl?

[outer dew]

thing is

although everyone here tells you haste

in all honesty, all stats are good

¯_(ツ)_/¯

[final mist]

🤔

[outer dew]

no reason to drop ilvl for it

[warm plinth]

I don't think anyone here (with a brain) tells anyone to drop ilevel for haste

[final mist]

All stats are good, sure, but you should still use the bet one for enchants and sockets.

Because it's "free" <insert best stat here>

[outer dew]

but he's asking about ilv

ilvl

nothing about socket or enchants

lol

[sick sentinel]

dude how much more haste do you need

look at this haste

[outer dew]

aite

show me it

without haste buff

i don't want to do -20%

[marble wave]

Some of low haste numbers just feels bad to play. Like when tc have more than 2 gcd cd -_-

[outer dew]

LMAO

wtf

you're actually

[feral timber]

question guys how much up time should i have on ignore pain

[outer dew]

just rigging your stats

depends on damage pattern

[sick sentinel]

I have 11% haste without ITF

because of equiping highest ilvl

[outer dew]

lmao

after switching out enchants + ring

[feral timber]

like we are progressing on king rastikan and our prot warrior 25% overall

[sick sentinel]

dude

[outer dew]

ehh

damage is pretty constant in that fight

[sick sentinel]

why are you doing this

[marble wave]

Just thinkin about change 390 ring 300h/150v to 410 200cr/300 m

[outer dew]

uptime for IP is pretty high

[final mist]

Uptime for IP isn't what matters, but he's just not casting it.

That's it.

Which means he's likely not using SB or any of his other abilities correctly either.

[outer dew]

hey kaegae

[final mist]

@marble wave that's 20 ilevels, take it.

[outer dew]

what's your refresh on SB

with that much haste

[final mist]

More stats > "better" stats. Our secondaries are pretty close.

[marble wave]

@final mist thx

[sick sentinel]

my SB refresh is fine

[outer dew]

nono

i ask

[sick sentinel]

with 11% or with 5 stacks?

[outer dew]

11%

5 stacks is cheating bro

LMAO

[sick sentinel]

14s but it does not go into decimal

[outer dew]

15s for me

hmm

13s with ITF

[sick sentinel]

still

don't be retarded ok

[outer dew]

oi

let me live my mastery dream

[final mist]

No.

[marble wave]

@final mist what about 400 ilvl 160 h/300m 80 lifesteal?

lifesteal + haste worth 10 ilvls?

[sick sentinel]

the mastery dream is not real dude

[final mist]

Keep the 410.

[sick sentinel]

I would prefer getting one more thunderclap in my avatar

[final mist]

What's your other ring?

[marble wave]

@final mist 410 185h/290 v soketed

[final mist]

Use both 410s.

[outer dew]

hmm

so you get 9-10 TC's in your avatar?

[hollow thorn]

i wish i had socketed rings

[sick sentinel]

same

tofu I have rezans and quick nav

idk how many I get

depends on rezans

[outer dew]

SAME TBH

the amount of crit on my gear actually makes me sad

[final mist]

The fact that you have that and aren't using it makes me want to remove you from this server permanently.

[outer dew]

not even gemming/enchanting crit pushes me to 1.5k crit

zzzz

[sick sentinel]

go do a dungeon with 8% haste

and you will hate your life

[outer dew]

you'll have to stab me

before i remove ITF

lol

[oblique garnet]

im playing with IV

[marble wave]

and for trinkets, right now im running 400 vial + switch between 395 wm one\400 barnacle/400 jes (90 avoid) , any tips? mostly running for maximize dps, coz didnt push higher than 15 keys right now

[oblique garnet]

actually poggers

[final mist]

Won't be hard to stab him, he'll never have SB up.

[outer dew]

nah

my mastery will block it

🤔

[sick sentinel]

🤦

yeah, sure

getting 1.7k more mastery from bom gives me 9% block chance

your mastery will not block shit

[outer dew]

my mastery will do it, believe yo

[final mist]

Don't need 3x BoM if you're just constantly running 3k mastery, pepega

[outer dew]

lmao

[sick sentinel]

LOL

I am here struggling to get more haste

by the way

[outer dew]

if it makes you feel better

i was just kind of curious how low i could get my haste

lmao

[sick sentinel]

strongly debating if I should use gore over prism

I will for sure in lower keys

[outer dew]

hmm

what keys you planning to do?

wooooooow

this bm

[sick sentinel]

❤

I mean when we are pushing for score I will go prism

I am thinking anything lower than a +14 I will go block

[outer dew]

hmm

what's your ilvl + shield?

~408 running vial/gore or gore/rezan

I haven't felt a pressing need for survival when doing the +17/+18

[outer dew]

i hate your shield

with a fiery passion

lmao

also hate your crit

tbh, I'd probably run rezan/block

you'll probably survive just fine

hell

you probably survive better than me

you can finish off some pulls faster with BoM

zzzz

[sick sentinel]

tbf, since prism works like RP I like it less

[marble wave]

and for trinkets, right now im running 400 vial + switch between 395 wm one\400 barnacle/400 jes (90 avoid) , any tips? mostly running for maximize dps, coz didnt push higher than 15 keys right now

[outer dew]

are you running with a consistent group

or pugging?

been finding myself liking vial less and less recently

but I need to start logging to get data vs feeling it

juggling between vial on a trash pack that'll roll me over vs padding on reaping

sad times

[vapid rapids]

Hey all, beginner here, do u recommend DBM or bigwigs for someone just starting out tanking?

[ionic fern]

DBM is more of a hand holder.

Tho i prefer Bigwigs. You can test them both out and see which you like better.

[vapid rapids]

ive bein using bigwigs as dps, switched over from dbm guess il just stick with it

thanks 😉

[sick sentinel]

I have been using dbm for like 10 years so my opinion would not be objective

[oblique garnet]

Wait wait

you can reflect the cannon from tol dagor?

And it does the damage to shooter

[sick sentinel]

yes

[oblique garnet]

Time to do some pug tol dagors :^)

[silk mortar]

Feels even better when they dont know it works that way and is mind blown about it

Thinking they managed to shoot themselves

[outer dew]

Y'all

Have a wack mentality with keys

Lmao

God. Dpsing 10-12s are fucking miserable

[ionic fern]

i'm race changing into LFD just for keys. 😂

[outer dew]

wdym

race changing into LFD

Oh

Light forged dranei

[valid portal]

Guys i know racials are not important yada yada.. bur since im planning on leveling a warrior on horde for M+ tanking what offers the best ones? Was thinking highmountain since i have no class of them

[eager phoenix]

for tanking HM, blood elf, tauren, troll and maghar are pretty decent choices. if you ever feel like dpsing troll is solid.

[oblique garnet]

for m+ tanking blood elf

theres no better alternatives in terms of usefulness on racial

[outer dew]

Night elf*

Just roll Alliance

Smh

[sharp dew]

After 22 10+ Atal’s, I finally got a 400 Rezans and it came with socket+leech, grind of atal is over

[outer dew]

It's not

If it's not 425 with socket leech

Its trash

The grind never ends

[twin spade]

word

[outer dew]

Tbf, you're better off farming higher keys for more loot

10s are a waste of time

[oblique garnet]

^

and 400 rezan aint even that good

[eager phoenix]

need that 415 socket!!

[eager tartan]

31 runs for rezans gleaming eye

Feelsgoodman

Done with that shithole till s3 lol

[wintry ermine]

400 rezans vs 415 alchemy trinket (other trinket is 420 opulence diamond), I'm thinking rezans since they work well together, but not sure

[marble wave]

What a good example of meld using for tanks beside of skips?

[twin spade]

necrotic reset

[marble wave]

Necrotic dropped when melded?

nice one

[twin spade]

leaves combat so your stacks are gone

[marble wave]

@twin spade but if im melded in a middle of the pack im dropped agro too, so melees need to kite , or something like this?

[twin spade]

yeah , you also reset aggro

but as prot it should not be hard to regain it

that said, Shockwave + Intercept + Leap should be enough to get a 9 Seconds debuff to run out

[sick sentinel]

Hey all, is going for mastery the best stat for m+ right now?`

[oblique garnet]

@wintry ermine Cmon man you dont actually have 420 opulence trinket

[cobalt trellis]

how good is opu in m+? usually dps in raid, wondering if its worth for my m+ prot duty

[twin spade]

opu is for survival, but holy fuck its great at that

[wintry ermine]

I have a 420 opulence trinket :p got it my second heroic kill

[twin spade]

put it on , log your M+ or raid and look at how much Absorb Opu provided vs ignore pain

calc rage spent on IP and put it into Vengance

[sudden gazelle]

So is bwonsamdis bargain just trash for everything but mythic raiding? 🤔

[brisk ferry]

no it's just trash for everything, inclduing mythic raiding

[sudden gazelle]

😄

Fast question, incite the pack VS bloodsport

for m+ content

[brisk ferry]

BS

[sudden gazelle]

alright thanks, was thinking about the benefit of the mastery

[brisk ferry]

I can't choose non-warr specific traits. But others might be able to weigh in on this better

after coming from BDK to BrM to Prot Warr, traits finally feel nice

[sudden gazelle]

yea for sure

Would you take bonded souls over brace for impact?

[primal crypt]

No

Our prot specific traits are actually good

[brisk ferry]

that was the point I was trying to get across lol, BFI is great

[primal crypt]

Good job

[brisk ferry]

I guess BDK have the freedom of not giving a fuck which azerite pieces they gamble, seeing as it hardly matters

[sick sentinel]

@sudden gazelle Incite the pack is an actual strong trait, if you just want offence and not defence this is one of the few occasions where you would go a generic over a specific

90% of time you go prot specific though

[primal crypt]

95%

[sick sentinel]

99%*

[primal crypt]

Still waiting to get my 3 Dc 3 Bom

:(

Im trying to get a good 400k burst on reaping

[brisk ferry]

somehow I've managed to have 1 of each trait on my warr lol

DC is everywhere though, at least that's easy to get

[sudden gazelle]

Would it be wise to socket/enhanct for mastery

if going for damage

[brisk ferry]

always haste

[oblique garnet]

@warm plinth you can get a vod for freefold with pugs LUL

[sick sentinel]

@oblique garnet have your regretted your decision to buy NA bfa or are you still following through with it

[oblique garnet]

I regretted it the moment i realized i have to do all the fucking questlines and rep farms

[long tinsel]

Pugs are getting smoked on the 2nd boss of freehold this week

[oblique garnet]

our pug did fine i think

i dont think anyone died

but tbh

that was only 10

@warm plinth vods up for fh

[lusty grotto]

you didn't keep going @oblique garnet ?

need to commit now 😃

[oblique garnet]

On the na one?

[lusty grotto]

ya ya

[oblique garnet]

Probably gonna do it at somepoint

But jesus its alot of work doing everything again

[lusty grotto]

lol

what quests do you need to do

ah right

[oblique garnet]

Everything

[lusty grotto]

you can't do island exps?

[oblique garnet]

I cant do anything

[lusty grotto]

jesus

[oblique garnet]

I need to unlock siege

And kr

And champions rep

[lusty grotto]

i forgot about that

yeah

[oblique garnet]

And i have no water strider

[lusty grotto]

at least its easier to get honorbound rep now with invasions

[oblique garnet]

Thats the easy rep

[lusty grotto]

kr is with the whole quest thing

but at least siege will be ez to unlock

[oblique garnet]

Kr questline is easier

Siege is the harder one since you need like 3-4 days worth of dailies

But idk why would i go through all that trouble when i dont even have a raidspot in NA xD

[cursive yacht]

Hey guys! Bwonsamdi bargain trinket is good? I gotit yesteday

[lusty grotto]

nope

its scrapper food

[oblique garnet]

For progress its good

For anything other

Not so much

[lusty grotto]

i disagree

its trash even for progress

diamond + RAGE are better

[oblique garnet]

Rage is not that good for progress

[lusty grotto]

haste on demand? lowers CDs and GCD? why wouldn't it be

[oblique garnet]

O

I mixed it with the grong one

[lusty grotto]

i made that mistake the other day too

yeah i mean mechatorque trinket

[oblique garnet]

Defensively bobsalamis bargain and diamond will be good

[lusty grotto]

nah

if you're getting railed to trigger its effect

you're gonna get railed harder

due to the bargain effect

its crap

[oblique garnet]

Its easy to get rid off

[lusty grotto]

rather have wall up faster, demo up faster, SR up faster

SB, etc etc

its haft 2.0

💩

[junior igloo]

SR isn't affected by AM

[lusty grotto]

its affected by Haste

not talking about AM

haste from RAGE

[junior igloo]

Well none of those abilities are affected by haste directly

SB is ofc

[sick sentinel]

at least it has mainstat

[junior igloo]

Haft was a trinket that spent the primary budget on a cheat death effect and only had a bit of crit as secondary effect.
It competed against trinkets that had high amount of stats as primary effect and armor worth 10 % damage reduction as secondary.

Bargain has full primary budget in strength and only spends the secondary budget on cheat death.
Competes against trinkets that have less than 1 % DR worth (in haste for example) as secondary effects.

Not really comparable situations.

[lusty grotto]

it's still crap

out of all of the trinkets in the raid, it's the worse one

[sick sentinel]

I would wear bargain over grongs

[lusty grotto]

i guess

[junior igloo]

It's pretty good defensively imo.
Better than stat trinkets for sure

[oblique garnet]

Now if only i could get 425 opulence trinket

Man can dream

[lusty grotto]

how can you say its better than stat trinkets like RAGE, when its effect is only triggered by a specific condition

once again the mythrax eye dilemma

it's doing NOTHING in your trinket slot until you "die"

[junior igloo]

Sure

[oblique garnet]

exactly why its good for progression

[junior igloo]

So the question is: how many more deaths (and battle resses) will you have without the haste from Mekkatorque trinket.

On average

[lusty grotto]

what bosses specifically will a tank be in danger of dying outside of WF guild progressions, with known boss abilities and such?

or rather

[oblique garnet]

Grong

[lusty grotto]

that's 1

[oblique garnet]

Jaina

Conclave possibly

[sick sentinel]

you don't want it for jaina

[junior igloo]

If you never die, why even consider defensive value of trinkets?
Just sim for dps

[oblique garnet]

Rastakhan

[sick sentinel]

because you actually want to die there

[oblique garnet]

Yeah its bad for jaina

[lusty grotto]

i didnt say i never die meiffert

[sick sentinel]

Guys. I did a 11 WM last night. Avatar and 👏 all the reaping packs was probably the most fun I’ve had in WoW in a very very long time

[lusty grotto]

people know the SR trick on grong now, minimizing chances of death

i understand its value if you go into a fight not knowing what to expect

that's true progression

so yes i agree a cheat death is good there

[oblique garnet]

You get one shitty combo combined with tantrum youre gonna get trucked in it

It basically has a potential to save you from a mistake

[lusty grotto]

ok fine

i still think its crap, same as mythrax

that's never going to change

but if you guys feel it has value then im ok with whatever

[oblique garnet]

You thought mythrax was garbage??

Friendship over

[sick sentinel]

I actually like mythraxx was A LOT better than bargain

[lusty grotto]

youve been around long enough to know that i did

[junior igloo]

If you never make mistakes and your healers never make mistakes and you never lag-spike etc., the trinket has almost no value, you are right about that.
But for most people it will realistically save you more deaths -> battle resses -> pulls -> progress time than most other trinkets.
Though it has been pointed out to me last time we discussed this that this trinket exists: https://www.wowhead.com/item=165807/sinister-gladiators-safeguard
And that one is probably better (shorter cooldown, you get some value before dropping to 0, and still saves in most close-death situations).

[oblique garnet]

Nim thats true

[lusty grotto]

that's kind of like mythrax eye isnt it

[junior igloo]

yeah

[oblique garnet]

But my memory is selective

[lusty grotto]

yeah i guess its the same effect

[junior igloo]

Mythrax trinket did more hps because stronger shield and proccing more often

This is a something in between the 2

[lusty grotto]

i'm with kaege though those 2 are better than bwonsamdi for sure

can you get that last one at a 400+ ilvl range though?

[sick sentinel]

yes

[oblique garnet]

I wonder if you could get 425 mythrax🤔

[sick sentinel]

pvp chest

[lusty grotto]

with enough rating i suppose

[sick sentinel]

yes

[lusty grotto]

i think mac linked a 400 veiled eye

dunno if it can TF for higher, probably not?

[sick sentinel]

it can

[oblique garnet]

Diamond and mythrax🤔🤔

[lusty grotto]

oh

[junior igloo]

Also, as a sidenote - Bandages from KR prevents a lot more damage than the additional cooldowns from haste on Mekkatorque trinket.
So then it comes down to whether you prefer the pro-active Bandages that you can use on your own terms vs. the auto-reactive nature of the other 2 trinkets that proc when you drop low.

[oblique garnet]

Kage have you done any arenas with prot?

[lusty grotto]

what's max TF nowadays, i thought it capped due to tier

[junior igloo]

425

[sick sentinel]

nah I don't have any arena buddies

[lusty grotto]

why would you arena as prot

[sick sentinel]

it is good in 3s

disable machines

[oblique garnet]

Its ok in 2v2 aswell

[lusty grotto]

425 regardless of source?

[oblique garnet]

Won a 2v1 against uh dk and disc priest xD

[lusty grotto]

healer + dps in 2s... yikes

[oblique garnet]

3x BoM + prism is actually disgusting in arenas

[junior igloo]

Yes, I believe that anything that can TF (so no weapons or azerite for example) can go to 425

[lusty grotto]

right

[sick sentinel]

bom is nerfed in arena tho

[lusty grotto]

why did i think older tiers wouldn't go up

[oblique garnet]

Its halved

But 900 mastery aint joke

[lusty grotto]

pvp templates nowadays

[sick sentinel]

there are no templates lol

some things are jut a bit nerfed

[oblique garnet]

And they changed prism so you wouldnt get fully stacked shield but you get it during the preparation as prot xD

[sick sentinel]

weird

[lusty grotto]

so the explanation i remember was that templates did exist, but they were changed so that they were just lower versions of your secondaries

basically what you're saying

[sick sentinel]

templates are a legion thing

[lusty grotto]

but they do still exist

there are damage nerfs for specific things

mana regen nerf was the one that hit.... yesterday?

that had Cdew stop his stream

[oblique garnet]

Oh jesus what is that nerf to resto pvp

Mana regen by 55%???

All the healers got their manaregen nerfed that badly o.o

[lusty grotto]

yeah

[sick sentinel]

yeah because they basically live forever

[lusty grotto]

so the explanation for that

was that it was bad for viewer experience to see Dampening teams

that extend games so as to get higher dampening percents

[sick sentinel]

it is also bad for player experience, it's fucking boring

[lusty grotto]

depends

truth be told the regen was a little too much

maybe it was needed

[sick sentinel]

especially for druids

[lusty grotto]

but def not that much

[oblique garnet]

So the rise of the tanks in pvp is happening

[lusty grotto]

not prot pallies

teehee

[oblique garnet]

Warriors

[sick sentinel]

the peel we give is at ridiculous levels

HC leap stun, shockwave, root every thunderclap

[oblique garnet]

Also the consistent damage

Like if you get too close

You cant get away

Thats why i was having a blast doing arenas with my healer friend

In 2s they always went for him

And id just start cleaving both down while my friend just runs away

[daring patrol]

riftworld codex bugged at the moment?

[lusty grotto]

what you mean?

[daring patrol]

been seeing tanks using it in M+

[brisk ferry]

you mean Naowh?

[lusty grotto]

shrug

[brisk ferry]

cause he was boosting his warrior lol

had nothing else

[oblique garnet]

He actually has nothing else

[fiery pendant]

yo gents, got a 410 jes' 410 button and a 370 rezans, do i just use the two 410s for the str or keep rezans on and use one?

[lusty grotto]

that rezan is just too low ilvl

if it was closer i would say keep it for defensive value

i mean i guess you could still keep it in case you need it

[oblique garnet]

Wouldnt drop 40 itemlevels for rezan

[fiery pendant]

yeah figured as much

ty

[keen galleon]

I would be farming atal hard tho. Button feels pretty subpar

[sick sentinel]

farm atal, farm WM

[lusty grotto]

don't forget underrot!

[sick sentinel]

He has a 410 jes

Double on use is big yikes

And I don't like vial anyway personally

[lusty grotto]

jes is 2 mins though

not 1m30s

[quasi pagoda]

Whats a good dungeon to farm for a onehander wep?

[sand egret]

AD drops a 1hander

a shield and basically everything you'll need. It will even save 15% or more on your car insurance.

[sick sentinel]

You basically just want ilvl on weapons because everything scales with weapon damage

Yes, even IP

[primal sable]

Do you guys use the raidbots DungeonSlice option when simming?

[sick sentinel]

We dont sim prot

The APL is not working yet

[steel mauve]

Its on but a major WiP and wont be accurate

[sick sentinel]

Well it is, not properly

[modern brook]

AD has BIS for like every slot cept like wrists iirc

dungeon is dope

its also free af

all the bosses kill themslves and you ignore skewer as a mechanic

[lusty grotto]

it's also very hard to get invited to a good 10+ group with unless if your io is very high for some reason

probably because people just spam requests asap a group is up

[modern brook]

because good 10s dont exist

10 is the worst level to pug

[quartz pond]

hmmm thats weird

my current tank score is 400

and i get invited real fast

when it was 0, i applied for a 11 underrot that said "checking rio"

[sick sentinel]

I know a bunch of people that type "checking" and they don't because they are lazy

Makes low io ppl scared

[vapid rapids]

Another noob question : how do shield block and IP interact? Is incoming dmg blocked first?

[stark sage]

yes

[halcyon crystal]

can someone tell me why warrior is op in kings rest?

[stark sage]

all damage reductions happen simultaneously, then you apply absorbs

@vapid rapids

IP is kinda weird since its both

[vapid rapids]

Cool thanks a bunch

[sick sentinel]

@halcyon crystal Who told you warrior is op there?

[modern brook]

R.io addon shows the higher of your two @quartz pond

between s1 and s2

so if u ended s1 at 1.1k it says 1.1k

even if ur current tank score is 400

@halcyon crystal because Blood dk gets demolished by blade combo and we dont

thats why ppl say prot is broken

despite that dungeon being bdks playground

[dense plover]

Just got Abcuebt Tysjarr sea charm at 385 how good yall think it is.

[sick sentinel]

What is it up against

[modern brook]

^

[lusty grotto]

I meant above 10 @modern brook

[quartz pond]

Yes I know it shows my highest

[lusty grotto]

Its also because AD fills crazy fast too

[quartz pond]

They can still look and see I have 0 tank points

[lusty grotto]

Which is why carries list as AD keys

[dense plover]

Just wondering in general. Seems like a really low uptim ebut I dont know the PPR

[lusty grotto]

Ya btw if your score lists with an asterisk at the end, it's displaying s1 r.io

[modern brook]

🤷 its a stat stick @dense plover

Its great as long as its more stats than whatever statstick its replacing

Proc based verse is pretty whatever compared to other trinkets

My goal trinkets are diamond + fat Knot or vial

[primal sable]

i have a thicc knot on an alt dk

makes me sad whenever i log into it

[sand egret]

@dense plover If you're talking about the Tuskarr Sea Charm...mine averages like a 40% uptime.

(which is pretty high comparatively to a lot of other trinkets)

[junior igloo]

@halcyon crystal @modern brook
When people say prot is broken in KR, they mean paladin 😄

[modern brook]

🤷 i think warriors p good in it during tyranical; but i cant comment on paladins ive legit never play them lol

i imagine bop-ing the axe boss is super good though

[lusty grotto]

I mean

Axe boss isn't hard, I guess it works for boping mongos that can't dodge

Bop is certainly useful for zerkies though

Especially if you run without pet classes lul

[modern brook]

axe isnt hard cause of whirling axes

axe is hard cause of the dot

axe is hard cause of whirling axes if ur playin with rags though

[dim kindle]

Hey guys, i was wondering which trinkets are most usefull for warrior between rezan and jez?

Currently wearing opu+rezan

[modern brook]

Opu = oppulence tirnket?

[dim kindle]

yea, diamond mybad ^^

[modern brook]

assuming equal ilvls I'd probably stay opu rezan

But i am of the camp that really dislikes jes

Its a good on use

[dim kindle]

Yeah, both are 400

[modern brook]

i think Op rez and op jes are both good answers

jes +rez if youre doing content that wont kill you

[dim kindle]

Alright, thanks 😄

[analog swift]

Hey bois can we intercept mid throw on mythic grong to a totem or something so we don’t dick over the raid

[dim kindle]

Dont think so, your stunned when he throws you

[lusty grotto]

Nah you're not stunned when you're in the air

How exactly are you dicking the raid though

[steel mauve]

You can use spells in air, but only after about 1 second in air, ive used spell reflect in air before landing for impact

[analog swift]

Weird I can use transcendence as monk

[steel mauve]

Im pretty sure the impact will still do damage you just wouldnt be a mile away from your co tank for fear

[analog swift]

As monk I try to transcendence to a safe spot to keep dps on adds and then I can get in range in one roll to the tank so he doesn’t get feared

[dim kindle]

As DK you can IBF before he throws you

[cold owl]

You can reflect the grip dot, which is fun. All that and more in the guides and resources, but that reflect has to be one of the most satisfying ones from a damage reduction pov.

[modern brook]

💪

Demo shout also doenst reduce the impact daamge, regardless of when its applied; the damage comes from the environment, not grong

[cold owl]

My life is a lie

[modern brook]

on the topic of TC-PROT I'm fairly certain that you dont cause burnouts from fireball reflects until the mage is a bird

in jadefire

🤷

Havent gotten anyone to confirm that

[analog swift]

@cold owl yeah I know you can reflect I was just hoping to not have the impact on the raid

[modern brook]

I found out u could reflect it cause i was trying to see if reflect lasted long enough to mitigate the impact damage if you popped it before the grip, for situations where my unga bunga dps didnt run it far enough to give me the global

now i just reflect the dot, and get healed up from the aoe's on the way back in

we have a holy pal sit with the other tank and i just rage off a fear if they over lap

[pallid dragon]

Burnout on reflect used to happen, has since been patched

And on the grong impact damage. I'm pretty sure the damage source is the thrown tank because when someone dies to the raid wide dmg, you get the kill credit and can victory rush off them.

[lusty grotto]

yea

whats so hard about having the targetted dude run out?

[graceful mason]

Wait are we supposed to reflect midair or reflect the grip dmg

[lusty grotto]

or do they simply not run out or something? what's your strat there, im confused

reflect before grip

not in the air

[pallid dragon]

Reflect before the grab

[steel mauve]

Prevent 150k dmg from the grab or 30% of 150k from the impact

[modern brook]

^

[outer dew]

Is there a brief window to prevent the impact?

And between those two, the impact is more important due to how sometimes thing line up

[pallid dragon]

Can't prevent impact, but you aren't stunned while flying so you can get a shield slam + IP off

[last mason]

@outer dew yo what’s the emissary reward today? Haven’t been on yet

[outer dew]

proudmooore

[last mason]

Is the reward anything worthwhile

[outer dew]

a whole 400 ap

[last mason]

So can skip it today lol, sounds good

[long phoenix]

Just got a 415 big red button is it even worth the gcd during avatar? says split dmg but improved if it hits mutiple so idk

[wary gyro]

Brb shouldn't be on the gcd

[brisk ferry]

it isn't

[sick sentinel]

Is this trinket the best for prot Atm?

[clear quarry]

According to Icy-Veins yes. Right now I have Jes Howler and Ancient Tuskar sea charm.

Is two use trinkets a good idea for prot warrior? I have never liked running 2x on-use trinkets. Im asking because I have Vial of Animnated Blood in my bags...

[sick sentinel]

They have a CD so can’t use both at the same time

No way in hell I’d use two personally, but I truly despise use trinkets anyway unless they’re an amazing CD which hasn’t been the case since wrath I feel

[clear quarry]

Jes is incredible, I have found.

And the Sea Charm is a strength trinket with a vers proc, and it has a consistent 40-42% uptime in keys. Its hard to give that up.

[modern brook]

You can use 2 on use more easily than other classes; you just line them up with alternating avatars

[sick sentinel]

Oh you can’t get sea charm as a 400 piece can you? 😕

Actually where is sea charm from?

[modern brook]

p sure its the turtle emissary

[analog swift]

@lusty grotto mostly my guildies run out but it was to help the fear issue during the crossover as well

[trail whale]

what fear issue?

[modern brook]

i believe they're talking about grong

[trail whale]

yeah

if the person who is targetd by throw runs out they just wait with the tank and walk back in if a fear is going off

so i don't see what fear issue he's talking about

[sick sentinel]

And does jes howler trinket give you all the vers stayed on it

So the 958 or whatever amount is on the ilvl piece does it split between everyone evenly or do you get all 958?

Any of you guys have a list of turtle emissary quest rewards?

I know it’s rings and trinkets but I couldn’t find a list anywhere

[clear quarry]

@sick sentinel my sea charm is 385 with a socket.

[outer dew]

useless trinket

doesn't even have

425 with socket and leech

tsktsk

[sick sentinel]

Lol

[modern brook]

https://www.wowhead.com/item=165785/tortollan-traders-stock#contains

[sick sentinel]

MY DUDE

you’re the man

[neon tangle]

@dim kindle AMS will also prevent you from getting stunned if it absorbs the whole impact

[modern brook]

u didnt look very hard it was the first result on google

[sick sentinel]

Wish there were a good str/haste one

I think I looked it up the wrong way lol

[outer dew]

what year is it

[long tinsel]

2009?

[modern brook]

203

Unga bunga 🐒 learn use ⬛

[lusty grotto]

black large square

[modern brook]

🐵

[lusty grotto]

😮

🍌

[modern brook]

🐵

[lusty grotto]

wait no that looks weird

[modern brook]

there needs to be more monkey faced emotions

sometimes im mad and also a 🐒

[cold owl]

🙊

[long tinsel]

🐵

[crimson river]

I'm going to shoot a quick question

Armor piece with socket vs armor piece but 5 item level higher

[halcyon crystal]

what can i do agains aggro problem

s

[crimson river]

You shouldn't have aggro problem

Look at the Q&A

[halcyon crystal]

im 383 on my alt atm and my friends are 412-416

[crimson river]

Well then it's also hard to hold aggro

[unkempt fox]

hey people rezan vs gigavold engine vs refracting prism all 400s 😳

[modern brook]

as per the pins

You do 15k dps if ur pressing ur buttons remotely correctly

holding aggro is not hard

if ur having aggro issues, you're doing something wrong

[crimson river]

Bullfango

Senpai

Answer my question

[modern brook]

Gig rezan if you're not worried about dying

Giga + prism otherwise

on use haste is better w/ avatar 🤷

all 3 of those options are good and you wont go wrong with any combination, imo

we want more stats not specific stats

=>sockets dont holda lot of value

depending on the slot depends on whether ist worth it or not

generally speaking its not

If you're unsure, more armor, str and stam is generally better than 40 of a secondary

backs /wrists and jewlery sockets start being worth more

legs arms and feet generally I wouldnt consider dropping more than 5 for.

[regal kite]

Rastakan trinket + AD one good for M+?

or AD + Opulence

[neon tangle]

rasta trinket is garbo

so AD + Opulence

[regal kite]

and for raid is rasta ok?

[neon tangle]

You're talking about bwonsamdi's bargain, right?

if so, don't run it in raids either

[sage locust]

Heya anyone that can confirm that the stat prio and ilvl prio is up to date on icy veins? Or should i consider prio something els?

[neon tangle]

it's up to date

[sage locust]

cool thx !

[mental scarab]

I do like that warriors are topping the m+ stage now🐥🐥

[lucid bough]

TBH about time there is more than 1 tank in high m+ keys

blizz just needs to buff the rest of the undertunned tanks

[sand egret]

if only it were that easy 😛

[lusty grotto]

hehe @neon tangle we were talking about bargain this morning

[modern brook]

I was going to say what do you mean tanks are pretty balanced and then i remembered bears and vdh are on live and not PTR test classes 😬

[trail whale]

i'm pretty sure blizzard has given up on vengeance for this expansion

[modern brook]

they gave up on it in legion, tbf

[trail whale]

it was at least good in M+ in legion when it could actually keep itself alive and did good damage

[modern brook]

🤷

this isnt #vengeance so i dont wanna get in it

But I'm willing to argue thats a symptom of tanks being broken in legion

not vengeance beinga working spec

[neon tangle]

At least is isn’t bear?

[modern brook]

I actually think bear is better tbh

[neon tangle]

Yikes

[sick sentinel]

I what’s AD trinket?

[modern brook]

Atal dazar? Rezan's gleaming eye?

[sick sentinel]

Ohhh

[modern brook]

bear has bear-grip and consistent mitigation + intimidating roar or whatever

ie: unique cc

Sure they need to be pumped

but at least the damage intake is manageable

VDH has AoE silence and talentable gorefiends

and uhhh

a cooldown that does nothing to keep them alive

[neon tangle]

(Budget gorefiends)

[modern brook]

Everything a VDH can do a DK or a brewmaster does better

parry tanking => strictly worse than brewmaster dodge protection

THeir healing strictly worse than a DKs

their CC isnt particularly good or unique

especially compared to DK whos kit is still practically designed around dungeons

And like; you have to compare them to dk VDH's big thing is that like DK they have a large amount of self heals to let your healer not have to pump you

but their self healing is really pitiful; especially when not actively tanking

their mit is random

Its just a bad spec

WARRIORS though

we got big square and no ouchies

best spec ever

[neon tangle]

tbh I don't really understand why people think that big self-healing is "good" or lets your healers worry about you less

when taken in the context of the whole class

i.e. if you take 100 damage, heal 50 of it back, vs. just take 50 damage

nothing changes

[modern brook]

BDK lets your healer not have to use inefficient heals; like period

its healings relation to mana

[warm plinth]

Well, big self-healing in Legion was good because it was GREAT. When you can virtually ignore healing your tank outside of certain windows, that's powerful because it enables you to do damage instead of heal.

[modern brook]

IF you're running BDK holypal for example

and ur ever getting Sacrifice'd flash? whatever the fast small one is idk

ur a shit bdk

Like if a warrior dips to 20% HP the healer needs to pump him to get him back up quickly

where as if a BDK dips to 20%; he'll DS back to ~60 or so depending on situation

HEaler doesnt need to start spamming innefficent heals

Sorry Sal :^(

[final mist]

The difference is, a BDK is always going to be dipping like that - a Warrior's damage intake is going to be much more comparable to a BRM's.

[modern brook]

Oh sick i thought i was going to get scolded for not prot talk :^O

[neon tangle]

@modern brook again, if you take 100 and heal 50 vs. take 50

[final mist]

In any content that's actually difficult, the healer is still going to need to hardfocus the tank in some capacity anyways (Mythic raiding, high M+, etc).

[neon tangle]

If anything having a BDK is often more stressful for a healer since they need to understand their RP levels, etc

[lusty grotto]

i have a question

[final mist]

Just because self-healing exists does not necessarily mean that the self-healing tank is a good choice. DK was brought largely for it's utility to M+, not it's self-healing.

[neon tangle]

dipping to 20 when you can't DS is yikes

[lusty grotto]

is it meme time yet?

or did i miss it

[modern brook]

I retract everything i said

Sal's on point

DK lets you ignore hps because u just drop a 90% slow and walk away

0 dtps is op

[lusty grotto]

true

[modern brook]

VDH still a shit spec

bears ok

Warrior is op

wait no warrior sucks

[final mist]

Right, sure, except now you can bring a Warrior, never move the mobs, take 5 DTPS and put out more DPS than the rest of the DPS combined.

[modern brook]

more buffs plz

[final mist]

Utility!

¯_(ツ)_/¯

[sand egret]

to tie it in, the reason there is an even bigger disparity now, imho, is that healing isn't nearly as impactful as it was in Legion and the utility wins out

[neon tangle]

I mean the 90% slow also decays fairly quickly, and DKs don't have movement to really capitalize on it

[sand egret]

it does give you a 70% net gain on mobs

that's pretty big

[neon tangle]

the 90% slow is good because it allows kiting in the cramped dungeons we have right now

[final mist]

The disparity now is small, much smaller than it has been.

[neon tangle]

(also even at 70-90% you really can't kite as much as you'd expect)

[final mist]

DK is not nearly as prevalent.

[neon tangle]

most dangerous shit will just laugh and jog through it

I guess my tl;dr is that BDKs aren't good because of self healing, it's just a different mitigation model

[lusty grotto]

sadbox you have been a bdk long enough

[neon tangle]

and in any relevant content you can't heal for more than you're taking

[lusty grotto]

its time to let it die

shhh bby is ok

[neon tangle]

I'm undead

and a DK

I've died TWICE

[lusty grotto]

dust off that warrior

[sand egret]

by "now" i meant bfa and not 8.1

[lusty grotto]

you need a healthy dose of 25 gallons of 👢 🍵 👏

[neon tangle]

@lusty grotto Honestly I tried him again after 8.1

[lusty grotto]

im not a doctor, but a chef, and still recommend it

[neon tangle]

I still don't like playing it

[lusty grotto]

😢

[sand egret]

specifically in current dungeons where you can't just heal through mechanics like you could in legion. Brings more emphasis on the other "utility" you can bring is all

[neon tangle]

I can dig people liking warrior, but my reason for retiring him wasn't how powerful he was

[lusty grotto]

what was it, im curious... i probably heard it already but i can't be sure

[neon tangle]

I don't really like the warrior rotation, avatar cycles feel very crowded GCD-wise