since you can a) get max value easy and b) predict moments easier when you'll need it
#protection
sand egret
chilly brook
Alright
old night
or jes and alchemist
lusty grotto
????
warm plinth
Haste is literally the top of the chain for survivability priority according to the guide. That would mean a lower ilevel piece with socket could win out for survivability.
chilly brook
Then I “can’t be fucked” to believe you
sick sentinel
akchemist jes is good, refracting prism is also super good for surv @old night
old night
DPS then rezans and stone?
sand egret
yeah prism and jes's may be the move from a pure survival
chilly brook
@warm plinth and it’s also explained that it’s so close together that ilvl is better than going for stats
sick sentinel
thats your perogative @chilly brook
lusty grotto
film already knows whats up
sand egret
yeah that seems like a good dps spread
sand egret
also means you don't have to use Jes' 😃
warm plinth
"Generally speaking". If we're going to ignore the stat priority list, why have one at all? It also says "more stats is better than having 'better stats'". Which means if you add up the stats on piece A with socket and stats on piece B without a socket, you should use the one that gives a higher total.
steel mauve
Theorycrafters already stated ilvl wins for dps on str pieces over sockets, ill take their word for math honestly
chilly brook
And the stat priority list is there for, like the bold words say, same item level gear.....
lusty grotto
the same theorycrafters that are helping with the Sim dev, might i add
warm plinth
I like how you just ignored the other part of what I posted 😅
sick sentinel
what lol
chilly brook
Reading comprehension is hard
sick sentinel
so you're saying 40 haste is the equivalent of 15 str @steel mauve
warm plinth
Which is from the same guide you're quoting
chilly brook
@warm plinth no I’m not ignoring it. More stats is better. Getting 40 extra haste doesn’t outweigh the gains in main stat, stamina, and other secondaries
Not to mention armor
plain ice
hey guys what food is best? want to make sure i am eating best food. i'd rather not read the guide. just tell me please so i have best food.
plain ice
🙃
warm plinth
But there is potential for certain item slots that a socket will add more total stats than the 5 or 10 ilevels you gain with the higher item level piece. If it does, then it's better than the lower piece, according to the exact same section of the guide you so condescendingly posted lol.
sick sentinel
wut?
5ilvls verus a socket
you lose 15 str
and gain 40 of a secondary
which in the case of dps is haste
???
its not a complicated concept
steel mauve
And you also gain secondaries for those 5 ilvls too
steel mauve
You dont literally just gain str for 5 ilvls, theres a lot of other stats you gain
Jesus its like argueing with a brick wall
lusty grotto
Another lova
lethal spade
I wish I could tank like a brick wall
lusty grotto
I can tank like a brick wall, how can I help
sick sentinel
like
you're just wrong
lol
8+15 = 40??
str is worth about 1.5
haste in general is worth about 2
sometimes more
lusty grotto
Huh
sick sentinel
sometimes less
lusty grotto
Worth?
chilly brook
@warm plinth wanna do me a favor and take a screenshot of two items within 5 ilvl of each other
lusty grotto
Where is this coming from
sand egret
the most yummu
chilly brook
Seems like a lot more than 40 of one extra stat for the ilvl gain
So what do ya know
You get more stats for an ilvl upgrade
It’s almost like the guide is written by people who aren’t dumb
sand egret
@lethal spade do you have any specific questions re: in-the-moment tanking? as a Prot our whole fantasy/spec is basically to be a brick wall 😃
sick sentinel
in this case, like was stated initially for survivability the higher ilvl piece is superior, for damage the socketed piece is superior
the guide ONLY considers survivability
lusty grotto
That much is true
chilly brook
@warm plinth your move chief
warm plinth
Item on the left gives 758 total stat; Item on the right gives 726. Socket gives 40, which would give item on the right 766 total stat, which is more than 758 if I learned basic math properly. Even included armor for your benefit.
lethal spade
Lol was looking a bit deeper in the guides and I see some flaws in my tanking. I'm 390ilvl and finding it hard to push +7s . Dont know if it necessarily my fault but just trying to be the hardest brick wall I can be
warm plinth
So...there's my move.
sand egret
@lethal spade that ilvl is definitely good enough. Most major things are: know your packs (which ones do the nasty) and know your abilities and be proactive. Prot is unique to the rest of the tanks as it is a purely proactive tanking class.
modern brook
Theres some hostility in #protection today
sand egret
we have no recourse to dealing with damage already taken outside of Victory Rush (and LS heal)
warm plinth
I'm not intending to be hostile; he's just annoying me by being so smug when he's not right (per my example above)
modern brook
🤷
@lethal spade at 390 you shouldnt have trouble pushing 7s
it tells me you're either a) using cooldowns wrong or not at all
chilly brook
So your answer is a cloak that is arguably one of the only pieces you can sacrifice ilvl for anyways
modern brook
and b) are unsure of what kind of damage you can be taking
sand egret
can we help this guy out before ya'll go back to the titfest over stats?
modern brook
^^^
warm plinth
...I don't think the argument was that a socket is always better, was it? I said that sometimes a socket can be better if it gives more total stats...
That was literally my entire side of the argument. Don't be salty because I showed you that I was correct.
sick sentinel
but it's not in the guide, so it HAS to be wrong 🙃
sand egret
Alibane, a huge component of our kit (when talented properly) is to be using cooldowns a lot. It's an integral part of our mitigation. Less of an "OH SHIT" button and more of a "what's next in my quiver of mitigation tools"
chilly brook
Clearly
warm plinth
Yeah, if you're using mitigation as an oh shit button, you messed up somewhere
modern brook
^
sand egret
our kit also rewards more "active" play (more rage = more burn = faster cds)
lethal spade
I think the problem is I'm aiming for max SB uptime over quality SB time. If I have the rage is Ignore pain good to use while SB is up
sand egret
that's a good mindset
warm plinth
Yes, Ignore Pain is primarily used as a supplement to SB
Or to counter magic/unblockable damage
chilly brook
Although at this point you’re actually banking on a difference of 8 secondary stat being more important than a main stat
sand egret
knowing when you dont need to SB is good, although on trash that doesn't happen to often as something is always hitting you
lethal spade
Ahhh... see I was using the separate
sand egret
ohhhh
modern brook
SB uptime is important
warm plinth
I'm honestly done with that discussion Griff. It's not a productive argument at this point. Think what you want. You win.
modern brook
Not capping rage is important
sand egret
no no, unless its magic, you want SB up
chilly brook
I don’t need yo to tell me that to think what I would like. I appreciate that though
modern brook
IP and REvenge are very similiar in that regard, they turn MAD points into defensive or offensive value
sand egret
IP = smoothing tool (doesn't mitigate, just redistributes damage) and SB = mitigation tool (reduces incoming damage)
modern brook
where as SB is the bulk of our mitigation
lethal spade
And in trying to keep them separate I was doing a bit slower play style spending less rage giving me less uptime on big cds
sand egret
someone hit my boy with the Block screenshot
warm plinth
Wait is it a new one? Or still the one from Antorus?
modern brook
mac gave me this should it ever be needed when he isnt around
sand egret
^ that's a brick wall taking a hit withut the diamond
modern brook
I think he has diamond there, tbh
modern brook
The dramatic impact is the 🐝
sand egret
i actually dunno what the diamond does, tbh
chilly brook
Diamond was an absorb iirc
sand egret
but yes, in sum, IP you generally want up all the time against blockable damage but not at the cost of having SB. Doing that is what is referred to as "pulling a Blade"
fair mulch
So on higher keys then, since we are on this topic, what is the Prot Warriors strategy for kiting? I am talking 10+ Or do we wanna keep our kiting to a minimum?
chilly brook
Not much of a reason to kite in a 10
sand egret
not to be confused with popping SB during Last Stand
chilly brook
Typically stay in and only kite if you need to
sand egret
I haven't had to kite yet in a +10
modern brook
Generally the strat for kiting for non DKs is "bring frost mage, and walk away"
we have big jump move to facilitate
sand egret
unless you count kiting as me intercepting the next pack as the stragglers follow
chilly brook
If you have to shockwave and leap out
sand egret
you have ~40+ seconds to just flex on a pack. the dps should reck it by then
chilly brook
Lol
lethal spade
https://worldofwarcraft.com/en-us/character/thrall/Alibane
Check me out if your interested in recommending gear
chilly brook
Oof
fair mulch
Yeah, I am having some trouble surviving on packs, I am 395 now and it might of been Teeming Fort but I wasn't able to hold the adds right before Poison totem boss in Atal
modern brook
Disgusting
modern brook
You're gross to look at @lethal spade
sand egret
that pack is also like...one of the hardest trash packs in BFA
outer dew
Or be NE
sand egret
at least top 5
lethal spade
@modern brook my gear? That's not my xmog
sand egret
if you don't death skip it, the thing that will wreck you is the bleed the big bois stack
plush pagoda
so stacking bites hurt from two of them
fair mulch
Okay I didn't know if I was doing something wrong when after 3ish stacks of the dot I was dying through shield wall
plush pagoda
those*
fair mulch
I have somehow managed to stack haste to the ummph degree without trying
sick sentinel
you dont need to death run it on the way in, just run around the to the river side
chilly brook
That’s kinda how BFA gearing works lol
sand egret
despite what was said above, ya can't block bleeds so you can totally watch your dot and stun > run until it wears out
chilly brook
It’s all just random
sick sentinel
on the way out just suicide yourself and have your group run past
outer dew
You can also just go left
modern brook
@lethal spade I dont see anything necessarily wrong with your set up
sand egret
holy moly a nightborne warrior
outer dew
And die on the left
sand egret
you are my hero
modern brook
If you have higher ilvl wrists they're probably better than fire res
modern brook
I like stormbolt > rumbling. 2 stuns is just more useful
outer dew
Cant even smeld
modern brook
also stops damage for a reasonable amount of time vs the fat bolster guy your dps made
outer dew
Too many stuns
sick sentinel
Well theres no point suiciding on the way in when you can literally just run around the outside of the boss room and jump into it and not aggro that pack
outer dew
Too.any dr
modern brook
Obv ur gunna want a new chest w/ 2
fair mulch
I really wanted to like Nightborne then realized they didn't share the model with the NPC ones and my friend started making fun of them saying they look like grandmas
modern brook
First boss in raid drops BoM/DC
probably want quick nav > galeforce for weapon enchant
lethal spade
@modern brook @sand egret thanks guys gave me alot to work on
outer dew
Or run with a rogue and smeld out
modern brook
o7
outer dew
Smeld everything
sand egret
np, come back if you have any questions
outer dew
Just smeld every reaping tbh
chilly brook
Shadowmeld seems like the least warrior thing you could possibly do 🤔
outer dew
Guerilla prot warrior
lethal spade
Bad group,would be so cool to have a vanish
safe oriole
so, the facts people spread are based on icy veins to 100%?
outer dew
Personally enjoy doing that to my DH
chilly brook
Based on a lot of things
The IV guide is literally curated and written by top tier warriors
modern brook
I believe icy veins is maintained by Marok whos name is green and has a crown next to it so we trust him
chilly brook
Who also happen to be in/own this server
sand egret
he's also great at "showing his work"
chilly brook
Prot is Marok
lusty grotto
pretty much yes @safe oriole
safe oriole
overall icy veins seems like total bs tbh
sand egret
why so?
safe oriole
this could pe the special case
lusty grotto
what part in particular?
sand egret
like the website in general?
lusty grotto
oh you mean other guides for other classes?
chilly brook
I guess prot is just total bs then :kappa
lusty grotto
well icy veins was kind of crap before BFA
sand egret
yeah, that's up to how they're maintained, unfortunately
lusty grotto
but then they contacted class discord leads and it became the best for some of the classes
sand egret
luckily Prot's is pretty spot on
chilly brook
To be fair I used IV before BFA and it served me well
For pretty much all the tanks in legion
chilly brook
¯_(ツ)_/¯
chilly brook
Still parsed 90s on BrM
modern brook
🤷 imagine following the guide
lusty grotto
oh i mean particularly for warrior
modern brook
Imagine not playing the spec correctly but following the guide 
^wow community, 2003-2019
lusty grotto
i dont really know about the other classes, i just hopped on their discords
chilly brook
I mean, it did me fine for prot as well
And I remember people in this discord pointing to the IV guide
lusty grotto
i dont remember pointing anyone to the IV guide in legion
@undone sun did you?
:p
modern brook
I only used noxxic in legion
lusty grotto
ROFl
chilly brook
Yikes
lusty grotto
bamboozled
modern brook
?? 99 parsed so get at me
chilly brook
Was that site ever good?
modern brook
lol no
chilly brook
Like I remember it being a meme as far back as Wrath
modern brook
I'm pretty sure it just picked talents out ofa hat and said these are best
lusty grotto
i dont remember it being good, well i guess it was good to identify badly informed people
get meme'd peoples
chilly brook
Lol
safe oriole
yes for other classes
lusty grotto
ya
chilly brook
It’s such a trap too if you don’t know what to look for
lusty grotto
it was kinda crappy before
safe oriole
in legion the on for prot pally only correct info was choice of leggos
safe oriole
and bdk one was shit in uldir
silk moat
How is everyone doing with this week’s affixes ?
silk moat
Yeh
lusty grotto
its just pug unfriendly affixes
silk moat
Pugged a 12 temple of Seth that DPS wasn’t killing evenly on and an 11 Shrine that a DPS ninja pulled us to death
Not good so far
silk moat
I have an 11 shrine myself that I’m dreading running again
lusty grotto
hehe
safe oriole
ret pally is good to have in grp tho
modern brook
😬
safe oriole
their word can help a lot with topping
silk moat
Good tip
safe oriole
had one in grp that did 25% of heals
cursive yacht
is icyvein not accurate on azerite traits? i've 2-IF, 2-BFL, 1-DC and Goggle SSC is it good or should i look for 3-DC and 2BoM?
safe oriole
I aim for 3 bom, 1 DC and 2 BFI
sand egret
icy veins is on for traits @cursive yacht
that setup is fine
pretty solid actually.
cursive yacht
i've a lot of block with that setup
modern brook
nice 👌
sand egret
so the thing to note is that the guide points out that it ranks those traits defensively
cursive yacht
true @sand egret just saw that
sand egret
you hear BoM tossed around because a) it's super fun to do a bajillion damage and b) damage/crit blocks are more important in M+
modern brook
🤷
sand egret
so for M+, many opt for BoM as having multiples of it does turn Avatar into another defensive cooldown vs blockables due to the insane crit block rate we get via mastery
modern brook
if we're aruging across 415's I think 3xBom 2x BFI/IF 1x DC is the go-to M+ set up
analog swift
Are we not going engineering helm then 2x dc+2x bom anymore???
modern brook
1xBom 1x DC 3x BFI 1x BS the go to raid set up
🤷 engi helm is sslick but not required
cursive yacht
you have DC on engineer helm
sand egret
engi helm gives DC, so by nature it's a strong piece
analog swift
Doing 17K overall on a tyrannical bolstering week
sand egret
since that's a strong trait so a guaranteed spot is big for gear planning
analog swift
The engineering trait the gizmo is pretty sweet
modern brook
engi helm has 2 benefits: the inner ring is dope, its a garunteed 415 DC peice
thats about it
lavish oracle
I think Bloodsport is underrated, its pretty sick defensively
modern brook
great if you have it
sand egret
also has DC 😃
cursive yacht
i use SSC for the 5% reduced dmg. But the uptime is not very good. Ill try RNG i think
sand egret
BSport does not get enough love, true
modern brook
not worth profession swappnig for
sand egret
one of the best traits vs magic 😃
lavish oracle
Which is where we need the defensive boost, too
modern brook
analog swift
^^
sand egret
not wrong 😃
modern brook
BS best trait if the mongo damage traits werent also so good defenisvley
sand egret
saw a few Blood Rite vs Bloodsport questions yesterday....no love for BSport at all
marble cipher
Does prot warrior drop ilvl for BoM? A second BoM that is? 415 VS 385
modern brook
PPL advocating for blood rite do not play prot warrior
sand egret
nej
marble cipher
Kk
sand egret
i dropped a BoM for that exact swap
marble cipher
Thanks
sand egret
(got a BFI/IF tho)
marble cipher
I'll get BfI CR
marble cipher
Yeah, I'm kinda on the fence with CR
modern brook
ihate CR
sand egret
i used it for a bit
modern brook
such a pain to maintain in ST
marble cipher
Seems ok, but, seems low too
sand egret
noticeable increase in AoE damage
sand egret
yeah you spelled "uninterruptable" wrong 😃
modern brook
Stormbolt, with :hammer: inbetween all the letters
lavish oracle
The problem with CR is that Revenge isn't always free when you need it
modern brook
having a healer with :ambulance: between all the letters
sand egret
yeah, it's problem is that it's added maintenence
in AoE it's a non-factor
but in ST it's kinda annoying to get into a moment where you have to choose between rage on SB/IP vs maintaining the debuff
modern brook
CR is even worse in AoE outside a vacuum
marble cipher
the defense part of CR doesn't stack I guess? the %
sand egret
it does
modern brook
IF synergizes with every other trait
marble cipher
oh, k
modern brook
BOM + IF = more crit blocks = x2 damage IF
sand egret
that trait
modern brook
sorry read it wrong
sand egret
actuallllllly is hilarious
modern brook
BFIx3, DC, Bom [filler]
sand egret
as its a metric shit ton of crit
sand egret
it's proc rate is wonky
marble cipher
already have one CR
modern brook
BFI is our highest st damage trait, DC increases BV 15% Damage increase, Bom is added damage during our damage steroid
Last trait can be anything, probably Bom has most value for ST damage though
sand egret
but defensively CR wins that Shinigami
modern brook
@safe oriole
marble cipher
and what about this one, can change my other CR to this, and take CR on the new item (over the crit proc one)
sorry for the question spam though
modern brook
CR is still better than neutral picks because of consistentcy
modern brook
random stat bonsues are nice but its hard to judge damage intake around procs
your 2 stacks of CR provides a solid 3% damage reduction + increased damage on our Rage dump
consistent and clean and easy to work with
lucid bough
justo go triple bom and laugh
modern brook
ITs still garbo trash compared to other prot options
but prot traits are comparably pretty good compared to something like Blood DK
modern brook
so on the whole Prot traits tend to be better than their neutral options
naive panther
Pretty sure reckless flurry is higher st than bfi.
sick sentinel
On any of their toons? Yikes
marble cipher
@narrow abyss advanced tooltips
narrow abyss
ty
restive pivot
Hey guys i need your invaluable guidance.
I am still facing aggro issues.
I will give a specific example.
In freehold I heroic throw’ed 1 ettin, and taunted another ettin.
Clapped once when they are together
And taunted the first ettin
lusty grotto
why taunt again
restive pivot
In that case i did not.
lusty grotto
and keep bootyclapping
primal crypt
Ilvl difference?
lusty grotto
well iirc, Shield Slam is our highest threat generating ability
primal crypt
Do they outgear you?
primal crypt
Then it shouldn't be an issue
restive pivot
I am 394
primal crypt
Clap and shield slam
If you dont clap shield slam people can still take aggro off you
restive pivot
Could it be because i dont enough shield slam ?
lusty grotto
shield slam > bootyclap > revenge for threat gen imo
primal crypt
Claps
lusty grotto
just whack em with your shield
primal crypt
Clap revenge
lusty grotto
ya
primal crypt
Shield slam you priority targets
outer dew
Does your nameplates track threat?
lusty grotto
yeah what tofu says is useful
ocean acorn
Ya i had to stop doin dungeonz with my ret paladin cuz he just opens with wings and wake and i cant hold aggro on him if i dont establish some first
stark apex
Should I tell my Mythic groups I haven’t tanked before ? Should I run through routes on M0 first ?
lusty grotto
yeah that's normal shpicey
restive pivot
Do you know how to do it with elvui?
outer dew
No
lusty grotto
i lose agro on reaps to rets easily
outer dew
Well
restive pivot
U guys use kui ?
outer dew
What level keys do you run?
ocean acorn
Doesnt even let me clap twice
lusty grotto
i use elvui
restive pivot
10-15
ocean acorn
I run 14-15s but trying to push
primal crypt
Kui
signal plover
Getting to pulls ahead of DPS is key as well
stark apex
I do 10s but only as dps isually
lusty grotto
you don't have to do m)s
m0s
just do lower keys first
get a feel for it
if you're doubting yourself then sure m0s is fine
ocean acorn
I try to plan where reaping happens with mdt before i enter
Cus havin q good los spot for caster mobs helps me alot
lusty grotto
yeah
i dont generally plan anymore
but at least having a good idea on where we can LoS helps
ocean acorn
It takes way less time now
lusty grotto
also fuck ML on 3rd reap
lusty grotto
nah before
ocean acorn
Or vefore cuz depends on route
lusty grotto
i try to have it happen before big pack in front of rock dude
i do 2 reapings before 1st boss
because 1st boss room and the house in that first trash area is pretty great for LoSing
nova rune
where tf do I put all these spells
ocean acorn
I do one big pull at start for 20%
lusty grotto
imo, 2 reapings in start is best... you can just death run after
you absolutely do not want a reap to happen in the last area
that area is fucking stupid also for LoSing
ocean acorn
Ya i can see that but i usually have it at like 90 ish then kill last boss then kill mobs
lusty grotto
aye that's usually the go to for everyone
ocean acorn
Skippin that last one is a good time saver
lusty grotto
i just stick with, pulling almost everything at start so you dont have to deal with worse trash later on... and obviously reapings
primal crypt
You have to be careful if you're close to 100%
lusty grotto
yup
primal crypt
Blowing up the bombs on the way count as % lol
old night
plan it out with method dungoen tools
primal crypt
Could trigger reaping anyway
lusty grotto
OH
ocean acorn
Mhm
ocean acorn
Thoughts on this week affixes?
lusty grotto
or close to them for that matter
ocean acorn
Lol alliance
outer dew
Nub nimchimp
lusty grotto
HEHEHEHEHE
lusty grotto
the things ill do with this trinket
i would, for funsies
wait for DH to be 50%
pop trinket
old night
I just think its cool
lusty grotto
DH gets fucked due to Treacherous
night ermine
am i doing something wrong? maroks spell reflection tracker doesnt do anything for me
outer dew
Lmao
lusty grotto
what are you testing it on @night ermine
stoic summit
do rings follow the ilvl > all rule still? so like, 400 vers/mas ring >> 385 haste/vers ring?
old night
nah
night ermine
ive done 5 m+ so far on my warrior
lusty grotto
don't sac more than 10 ilvls
night ermine
its loaded and its not showing me anything
lusty grotto
15 ilvls should be a no for you dawg
old night
@lusty grotto what about 30 😆
old night
I only dropped 2% haste btw
night ermine
waycrest manor
little hawk
bargain any good for raiding?
old night
down to 17 so still cozy af
lusty grotto
bargain is scrapper food
little hawk
As I tought
lusty grotto
trying to think of a boss in WM that can be reflected other than witches
outer dew
Lord waycrest
outer dew
Needs to pop for cyclone strike tbh
lusty grotto
rofl
night ermine
just imported it again to see if its maybe working now, thanks for the help @lusty grotto
lusty grotto
if you're having problems with it, maybe tag Marok though
lusty grotto
?
daring marlin
bm me all you want ❤️
long tinsel
Lol! Well thanks guil! I constantly have dps dying on that fight
neon tangle
shit I've died on that fight
night ermine
how much damage does it deal? 5x 45k?
neon tangle
"CYCLONE STRIKE ON YOU" "eh whatever I'm a tank" ded
outer dew
~10% HP on m0
west kayak
Is this for WM? Which boss?
long tinsel
First boss of Temple
west kayak
Ahh.
lusty grotto
this might be the greatest troll that these 2 ever had, or the greatest find.... either way they both wiin
cloud hound
grongs trinket interacts with avatar?
silk mortar
Trinkets doesnt scale with our damage increases no more
timber nest
how good is the alchemy trinket?
silk mortar
Only scales with secondaries
timber nest
@cloud hound grongs trinket only interacts with haste
silk mortar
(Most of the time)
neon tangle
can't argue with a "free" 400/415
sick sentinel
Go both
neon tangle
^^^]
ocean acorn
do both
timber nest
im blacksmithing
timber nest
would rather have blacksmithing for next tier if they add new craftables
sick sentinel
I'd drop bsmithing as it does not provide enough to be worth keeping
neon tangle
Eng helm gives you a guarenteed 415 az piece, way more valuable than pants or w/e
timber nest
thatd be a no go because I have crafted 415 legs + belt, with no replacements
sick sentinel
Pants/belt
neon tangle
415 helm > 415 trinket
sick sentinel
415 helm/trinket>some pants and belt
timber nest
true
neon tangle
plus dat bleed removal
sick sentinel
Also brez
ocean acorn
the brez has saved my grp countless times
neon tangle
I mean, BS + eng is fine too until you get replacements for your belt/pants
belt/pants vs. trinket is kinda a tossup imo
sick sentinel
Yes get replacements first
timber nest
im doing item restoration, i had a 400 haste/vers belt and 410 crit/mastery legs that i got rid of
so looking for those right now
sick sentinel
Ok
So close to full 400, need my chest, shield and back
Yet the game refuses to give me anything
timber nest
imagine not being 400 ilevel in 2k19 :/ feelsbadman
wary gyro
I'm still stuck with a 380 trinket because I have shit luck wit trinkets
wary gyro
Same
sick sentinel
I'm 402 so I'm good
wary gyro
I'm stuck on a 380 and a 390 for trinks
timber nest
probly keep rezans still when i get alchemy trinket? or gore-crusted cuz socket?
neon tangle
If I didn't have alch I'd still have 2x 385 trinket
lethal spade
Hands down what's the must have trink you want
timber nest
neon tangle
@timber nest I....honestly wouldn't bother making the alch trinket lol
timber nest
...
timber nest
i have the breath to make the 415 trinket right now... so i wouldnt sit on a 400 alch trinket
sick sentinel
Unless ur actively using health potions the alchy trinket loses 1/2 it's value
wary gyro
I'm stuck at 399 ilvl
sick sentinel
The strength proc from whenever I use it is pretty high
timber nest
whats the uptime look like?
sick sentinel
But also I have 1k health pots when I was leveling my alchy
neon tangle
I use health pots constantly, why not
sick sentinel
I don't have the actual number but in a minute i get minimum 2 procs per m
neon tangle
cheap as fuck
steel mauve
Uptime on alch trinket is between 25%-30%
lethal spade
Besides alch trink. What is your must have trink
timber nest
rezans
ocean acorn
that feel when u are only 39 neck and u need 41 for cauterize
lusty grotto
Vial, Rezan, Butcher Block, in M+
wary gyro
Rezans is the main one I would target from m+
ocean acorn
wb anchor
sick sentinel
What about anchor
ocean acorn
ya and the slow is nice too
wary gyro
Anchor is fun for even more crazy aoe dps
round vortex
I’m liking the haste trinket from Mekka Boi. Rezans + on use haste is beast mode
ocean acorn
it was 5% of my dps last night
lusty grotto
the slow is meh
lethal spade
Lol I am trying to get my Rezans or anchor to go with a 400 diamond
lusty grotto
it doesnt stack with TC slow
the damage though
problem with RAGE is
the ramp up
by the time its up to max haste, your avatar is over
neon tangle
I would like an anchor, but idk when my guild is going to kill h jaina
let alone mythic
lusty grotto
but it's a nice trinket nonetheless
wary gyro
Just pop it before ava like fury does with reck
neon tangle
I mean, the proc lasts a total of 18s, avatar lasts 20s,
it's not like early avatar is stronger than late avatar
lusty grotto
true
neon tangle
and 90s CD is ~perfect for macroing to avatar
sick sentinel
Yes, but in lower keys everything is dead by the time your avatar is over
lusty grotto
also true
neon tangle
I feel like optimizing for keys where stuff doesn't live for 20s is kinda pointless in the first place
especially if it involves pre-popping a trinket
sick sentinel
Well yeah
Listen
So long as u never use runes or battle pots in m+ ur good
And u can't convince me otherwise
I use pots what do you mean
Well that's just a waste of money
And resources
U have to RPG it
For the very very VERY last boss
I use prolonged power on trash and battle pots on bosses on keys I'm pushing score in
lusty grotto
10+ sure, 10 or below nah
neon tangle
and I need the extra umph to make it not suck
sick sentinel
I'm a frugal bitch, I'd rather use nothing on anything
lusty grotto
make em pay for your carry sadbox
rain tapir
if I wanna do clap championship does rezan gleeming + R.A.G.E go well togheter
lusty grotto
sure why not
rain tapir
man gonna clap em good
lusty grotto
bootyclappin it
neon tangle
👢 🍵 👏 for dayz
neon tangle
I prolly wouldn't flask/pot as much if I was opposed to buying the occasional wow token
sick sentinel
Even though my highest scored runs are like 3 mins under the timer or more
Because we were getting the same keys over and over
Bom
And try to find a 3rd BoM @sick sentinel , it's absolutely amazing for mplus
@cobalt trellis 1) dont sim prot please, 2)triat wise, DC/BoMx3
cobalt trellis
was not for simming, just for the list of traits i have available (and trinkets)
steel mauve
Hes not simming, hes literally wanting us to pick through all of his gear and tell him what to use...
primal crypt
whew
sick sentinel
Listen
Its instinct at this point
I could literally have keystone master from mythic opening week, but most of my team was obviously raiding mythic and when you get the chance to actually run dungeons, ofc you will flask and pot and maybe rune to ensure success, right?
steel mauve
Oh i know, it still triggers me, but the ... was more so he doesnt want to do the work and just wants us to tell him what to play even though theres a guide on traits...
cobalt trellis
oh ok sry, didnt want to appear like that
steel mauve
And trinkets are a better question to ask but still list them here and mostly the higher ilvl ones since those will most likely win out regardless
cobalt trellis
i like going through other's sims/pastebins of sim and see if i can find something that the other person hasnt seen/ or in case of dps get a little bit of extra dps
didnt consider that "work"
sorry for that
sick sentinel
Problem with that, everyones set up is vastly different
sick sentinel
Its not that, just u won't find the "right" way
U might find being more defense helps u more
or using more cd based trinkets being more ur cup of tea
wise mirage
Do we enchant haste on the wep? I heard mastery is really good
mint adder
I’d do haste still
oblique garnet
haste always
dull pilot
neon tangle
It's pretty good in raids (although it depends on what your other option i)
and it's sketchy in m+
stark sage
icy veins should have it
hidden ether
sad box what prot trait would you replace it for?
neon tangle
Dunno, I'd have to look at a specific item
Generally speaking prot traits > generics, but 345 str is a big chunk
I'm guessing it would out-dps a bunch of the prot traits
hidden ether
was thinking it could be better then callous?
undone sun
@lusty grotto late to respond but no, not directly. They were listed in the guides and resources channel but If not all of the regulars didn't point to it as the most reliable guide
analog swift
Treacherous is fantastic for dps near the top for most classes
neon tangle
^^^
It's hard to say vs. something like callous reprisal due to the defensive component, in m+ having another 1.5% reduction against damage taken might give you a bit longer in a pack, etc
hidden ether
but how much DR do we gert from 345 strength?
terse scroll
Not enough to make up for that loss.
supple solstice
I saw a link to a spell reflection list somewhere, possibly here or a reddit post. Did some googling and reddit search with no luck. Anyone know of such a thing recently?
found it
in resource section, i was looking lower in faq, my bad
keen galleon
I would not run TC in M+. You spend a substantial amount of time under 50% in difficult content. We also have access to fantastic traits on the war side.
lusty grotto
Treacherous would be solid if it wasn't on the same ring as BoM
primal crypt
Treach Cov is a yikes
lusty grotto
Almost the same dps + defensive value makes BoM the winner
primal crypt
especially if you're doing "tough" content based at your level
keen galleon
Yeah from an individual piece analysis treacherous might win, but if you're talking bis pieces none of them have TC on them
True BIS runs some combo of 3x BoM + 1x DC and 2 of DC, IF, or maybe the shield slam one
Or callous revenge if you're willing to change up your rotation
I personally dont like adding an 8s maintenance buff that costs rage to maintain.
But if you enjoy that gameplay its competitive with DC
lusty grotto
Eh the Dr is just a bonus, it's too small to consider uptime for it
keen galleon
TC barely outsims things like a 2nd copy of DC, and comes with a substantial downside
(Turning off at 50%)
lusty grotto
And rage spending on it opposed to SB or IP is very clearly a mistake
Yeah like I said
Tc is on the same ring as BoM usually
keen galleon
I mean I'm not sure I agree 3-4.5% is trivial for CR
lusty grotto
And BoM is superior as it grants added defensiveness with more or less the same dps
It's Lesser that you would gain from other rage spenders... Much much less
keen galleon
Sure but maintaining it is usually free its only occasionally gonna cost rage to keep up
sand egret
isn't it only 4.5% if you have 3x
lusty grotto
Yes
sand egret
well if you've invested that much into CR, might as well put it into the rotation
lusty grotto
I wouldnt move it up the prio
sand egret
i'm totally jumping into the tail end of it
but yeah, that 4.5% isn't something to hold a SB for
sand egret
I view it as consistent reduction in aoe situations and rng reduction in most ST situations where you're actively tanking
but I'm also in the camp that defensively, BoM is undersold 😃
but i'm just a M+ boi so auto-attacks are all i know
keen galleon
I already prio revenge pretty often but that's just me being a dps whore in keys
I really need to replace my engie helm so I can have 3x BOM :(
But I'm 2 weeks away from buying a hat qq
sand egret
i had to drop my BoM for a 5-ring 400 piece without it
was a sad day
got BFI/IF tho
so i can't be all mad
keen galleon
I'm full 415 now
sand egret
nice!
yeah i opted to spend on the rng 400 rolls (i don't raid) since it would give me a stronger baseline for azerite gear to do 10+s
keen galleon
BFI is the shield slam one right?
keen galleon
I like that one less than IF but its still solid especially if you always prio slam over tc
sand egret
I like that one more than IF,mostly because it's a ST gain over it
ST being the thing we're least good at
keen galleon
One copy of IF does almost 2% of my overall in dungeons
sick sentinel
Hello guys, taking up my prot spec in a bit for m+ mainly
keen galleon
But I also tend to run with strong ST players in dungeons
sand egret
yeah they're both solid
lusty grotto
@sick sentinel have you read our icy veins guide?
sand egret
one just scales more with auto-attacks
sick sentinel
hmm, I prolly have, cause I was about to seriously take it up
lusty grotto
before you ask anything consider reading up on it
sick sentinel
but I think this question might be outside of it
lusty grotto
ok shoot
sick sentinel
it's more specific if, on the engi helm, Synaptic Spark Cap trait, is prolly the best choice?
lusty grotto
bootyclap it
keen galleon
I use the grow/shrink one
sick sentinel
or is there a better choice for offensive m+ or defensive m+?
lusty grotto
oh, this is out of my knowledge
keen galleon
Bombs sims slightly better than grow/shrink for dps
mint adder
Grow/shrink gives haste right?
keen galleon
But grow/shrink has substantial defensive benefit
sand egret
well i'll be, a legit non-answered-in-the-guides question....
sick sentinel
how do you sim for prot, just run a patchwerk ST one? and use some logic?
mint adder
Do grow/shink imo
sand egret
you don't really sim prot
lusty grotto
its working @sand egret !
sand egret
tbh
sick sentinel
yeah I'm leaning to grow shrink too
keen galleon
I use dungeon slice sims and take them with an entire shaker of salt
lusty grotto
thats the correct way of taking it
sick sentinel
I see
sand egret
yeah
sick sentinel
o well thanks guys!
sand egret
it'll show you something
lusty grotto
jesus that sounded sexual
sand egret
but it doesn't really show the whole picture
keen galleon
Lol
lusty grotto
blade no!
keen galleon
"This dungeon slice sim ISN'T WEARING PANTS"
mint adder
Oh baby
sick sentinel
I'll wear my glasses
undone sun
sand egret
your mind went there, not me
lusty grotto
how dare you, im a chef
lusty grotto
is there any other way to be a chef?
sand egret
health code adhering ways, yes
lusty grotto
neg
sand egret
naw
sand egret
yep
keen galleon
I dont drop ilevel on azerite for anything
keen galleon
Except 1 copy of DC if you genuinely cant find it at your highest ilevel
sand egret
your inner meme'er will hate you, but it's the move
but then again i have 2x it so it ain't all bad
keen galleon
Yeah I'm not gonna lie BoM feels amazing at 2-3 stacks but objectively it's not actually that much better
It's just more visible
sand egret
i mean 2-3 stacks is actually where it scales better imho
as for me you start to get > 50% of your attacks as crit blocks
lucid bough
1764 mastery on avatar rn LUL
sick sentinel
Going treacherous covenant
keen galleon
Oooh 2x 415s and 1 400 piece right astra?
sand egret
(against autos)
sick sentinel
JK, gotta joke a bit
lucid bough
ya
keen galleon
#nice
lucid bough
got lucky today
lusty grotto
so sexy
sand egret
grats
lucid bough
crazy head from random azerite
keen galleon
I had to random a 2nd pair of shoulders. It sucked.
My first pair was literally worst option.
keen galleon
Uh
lusty grotto
my shoulders suck even more 😦
keen galleon
I wouldn't say that sucks
hidden ether
yeah i got the same one feels bad for my random 415
keen galleon
If you want damage from the piece run CR instead
lucid bough
i like the boost on IP
ebon hound
1k hps Pog