Just found out yesterday b4 article came
#protection
hollow thorn
dire wyvern
guildy said
hollow thorn
They are fast lmao
main vault
It’s hot fixed
Only works in open world and m0
I mean are they?
It’s been in since patch
Most people just learned about it
primal crypt
It hasn't been hotfixed
rich zinc
The toy is already fixed
main vault
It has
primal crypt
Just used it yesterday
rich zinc
Have you used it today
primal crypt
I just used it yesterday
rich zinc
That's not today
primal crypt
Brb, trying it right now
main vault
What time yesterday?
main vault
You could three pot
rich zinc
They havent hot fixed the dropping combat spot in motherlode though
rich zinc
Yeah
primal crypt
Lmao
dire wyvern
probably a lot simpler to fix the toy tbf
hollow thorn
Toy is a bigger issue tho
primal crypt
Toy is def the issue
main vault
Probably simpler yes
But when the mother load shit has been in the game almost a year now
It’s not THAT hard
hollow thorn
Almost a year lol
primal crypt
Activision doesn't care
hollow thorn
Exp is not even 4 months
primal crypt
Too busy with sale mounts
primal crypt
We're still in beta
main vault
They took Underrot offline for almost a week to fix it
primal crypt
Im waiting for official release still
hollow thorn
Well beta is beta, doesnt really count
main vault
It does when it wasn’t really beta and was the live game
All these systems and complaints everyone has
Have been screamed since Alpha
And they ignored it
So saying it doesn’t count is utter bs
main vault
Lulz
crystal creek
Toy working in M+ still or they take that out as well as raid.
rich zinc
A person I ran with said it was fixed in mythic+ too
crystal creek
ok, thanks.
gaunt dawn
Only works in open world
main vault
They fixed it for m+ and raid
gaunt dawn
Gliders 😢
main vault
I heard it works in m0 too but idk
upper dust
hollow thorn
Prot warrior is stupid 
crystal creek
Deafening Crash, Bastion of Might are your top 2 for M+
crystal creek
^ That's what I'm rolling.
hollow thorn
Doing as much dps as the dps, and taking no dmg 🤔
main vault
Why is that boomy bad 😦
sick sentinel
shhhh don't post pictures... they might be watching
modern brook
@hollow thorn dont drop ilvl for anything past 1st DC
but yeah bom dc archive are good options
hollow thorn
im not
sick sentinel
Archive also in MY+?
modern brook
Yeah why not Strength is sick af
it gives u bigger glutes and lets you ignore more pain
main vault
Lol
sick sentinel
then this azerit items are good: https://raider.io/characters/eu/thrall/Gairn ?
modern brook
looks fine to me
maybe less gutrippers but i like gutripper enough to not suggest that
sand egret
yeah, shit just shreds your abs. Stays true to its name, can do my laundry on these bad Larry's
Bull gets it, it's why I went Prot. The gains.
modern brook
I went prot cause i wanted to DPS but my friends needed a tank
Now i get to do both
also teeming off fort is fucking free
You can pull so much shit
I'm triple pulling like crazy and not giving a shit
easily most fun ive ever had tanking
sand egret
I haven't hopped on all week, but that is tempting
oblique garnet
Its fun
smoky oriole
Is it worth it to take DC x2?
cosmic cargo
some generics are quite good
smoky oriole
Or should i swap one out to Ancients Bulwark?
cosmic cargo
i think ancient's bulwark is crap though
dire wyvern
Unsure of how good the heal is but the vers part is good
if the heal is relevant then i dont see why not
dire wyvern
I mean, from a patchwerk perspective it isnt bad
smoky oriole
I mean its either i swap DC for Bulwark or Tradewinds
dire wyvern
its an average to high dps trait for a lot of dps classes according to bloodmallet, ofc thats assuming you are stood still and dpsing. So if the heal is good then overall it should be a fine trait
@cosmic cargo what is the hps at 385?
cosmic cargo
573
smoky oriole
still not a "huge" change
Everyone ive talked to about veins has different views. Some people say upwards of 8-9% uptime, some say it procced maybe once or twice
dire wyvern
yeh researching it ppl say no internal CD but proc rate can vary massively
5% uptime across 60 seconds at 2600 hps is like 7800 healing
dunno what the uptime on the bulwark heal is but would only need ~13 seconds of ticks to be equal to 5% veins uptime
in 60 seconds
impassive at 385 proccing every 6 seconds is 750 hps
so the heal is a bit worse than impassive if it is proccing on CD
tough to grasp how good ancient bulwark is without logs but it doesnt seem awful
thorn torrent
so im swapping to tank from dps what would you guys recommend on going war or dk
dire wyvern
for m+ or raids?
astral crystal
guardian druid
thorn torrent
either or
dire wyvern
i only play m+ and im currently playing warrior over my dk main because its more fun, more dps and my healer finds it easier @thorn torrent
smoky oriole
That Ironfur buff ❤
astral crystal
but rage of the sleeper was removed FeelsBadMan
smoky oriole
🦀 Guardian Spells are Gone 🦀
dire wyvern
warrior also looks to be better than bdk for BoD
smoky oriole
I prefer Warrior over DK right now
thorn torrent
well thats good to know because just doing reg mythics last night at 353 on my dk the healer in each of my groups were having such a hard time keeping me up
smoky oriole
Yeah BoD is about more Mitigation than recovery
smoky oriole
DKs are incredibly spikey
dire wyvern
yah
if you dont have RP, boneshield stacks or a CD ready, going into a pack is rough
thorn torrent
i was in the dk discord yesterday and alot of them are also saying dk blood traits sucks
dire wyvern
yeh BDK traits are awful
thorn torrent
well looks like im lvling my war lol
dire wyvern
nows the time 😃
thorn torrent
well thank you guys for the insight
i was having a rough time trying to figure out which to play
dire wyvern
also arms + fury > frost + unholy atm
dire wyvern
i would swap from dk main (frost in raids and blood in m+) to warr main if my guild would allow it
but we have 2 warrs already
gearing my hunter atm for raid potentially
thorn torrent
im doing warrior main now lol then alt my hunter
dire wyvern
😂
dire wyvern
yeh i find MM the most fun too, havent set up my surv yet really tho as i dinged last week
will end up playing BM most likely tho but im not bothered
thorn torrent
my friend mains hunter and loves mm and is sticking with it and pulls about 15k
so not to bad for worst spec in game atm lol
dire wyvern
yeh just depends what level you're playing at
MM is far from the worst spec in the game after 8.1 changes
thorn torrent
its still pretty bad lol
dire wyvern
??
main vault
It’s dead middle on things like Fetid
So idk where this patchwork is
And at both 75% and max logs, is less than 1k above BM on Fetid
dire wyvern
Logs might show them as low but BM is also at the bottom too, and we all know BM is really good
thorn torrent
well i mean bm is only like 2 buttons so
main vault
BM can be really good
main vault
Just stop
dire wyvern
385 patchwerk sims
main vault
Those sims mean literally fuck all
thorn torrent
the main reason mm sucks is because of movement if they have to move mid cast rip dps for them
dire wyvern
BM is actually difficult if you wanna play at max potential tho
cosmic cargo
funny
main vault
Or Feral
cosmic cargo
literally the only issue with SV right now
dire wyvern
playing melee when you can play the most ranged favoured spec in the game monkaHmm
signal plover
Da fuqq is goin on in here
thorn torrent
idk i just sayed mm was bad and now everyone talking about it lol
dire wyvern
not what i meant in the slighted
cosmic cargo
well on most bosses SV is top hunter on logs
dire wyvern
most favoured as in, its ranged with 0 punishment for being ranged
dire wyvern
my point exaclty with not considering logs as the bible for dps specs
main vault
I mean
cosmic cargo
wut
dire wyvern
ofc its extremely useful
cosmic cargo
what's wrong with that?
main vault
Logs are a lot closer to the Bible than the bs you linked
cosmic cargo
^
dire wyvern
no shit
only reason i linked it was my original statement that MM is ahead of BM on pure patchwerk
signal plover
Idk if the Bible is a good comparison there 🍿
dire wyvern
Lets just put it this way, i think that all 3 hunter specs are gonna be better than FDK in BoD 😂
yeh balance is unreal atm
thorn torrent
i was just asking if i should go war tank or dk tank lol then we got onto hunters wtf
main vault
You started it
dire wyvern
lmao
smoky oriole
Yeah idk, i did a tanking dummy run and had 17% uptime on veins,
dire wyvern
Rav: so not to bad for worst spec in game atm lol monkaW
smoky oriole
So it varies wildly
thorn torrent
idk what your talking about thats not me
main vault
Veins is awesome
thorn torrent
anyone want to lvl with me lol 😂
signal plover
Some BM hunters probably do.
urban reef
How the fook did I end up in Hunters Disc? Oh wait... 🤔
thorn torrent
Dude hunters are the new warrior
You didn’t hear sv got turned into melee spec and arms is going to ranged
final mist
Please don't veer too off-topic guys.
long tinsel
Thanks Sal
compact sun
Hey guys, seeing as warriors might be used a bit more for tanking in the next raid, do you think the traits will be simmed with a dps point of view at some point? (or if they are already and ive just missed it)
tired zealot
still sad on what they did to tanking overall coming from legion
miss the healing bracers the most
main vault
Have to have an APL and all that before can sim
dusk locust
now that ignore pain's off the gcd it feels good. probably better that tanks aren't immortal anymore too
crystal creek
Currently Bastion of Mastery is a nice dps boost for M+. #seewhatIdidthere
dusk locust
you can go way farther than 10
silk moat
How much more health/damage do the dungeon mobs gain per level?
I’m used to just going in, pulling a lot and clapping the crap out of everything
crystal creek
It's more about your composistion, affixes, dungeon, dungeon knowledge than ilvl.
dusk locust
^
silk moat
Yeah..
main vault
377 you can do 12-15 with a coordinated group
dusk locust
not sure what the gain is offhand
main vault
It’s like 3% but not really
brisk ferry
final mist
The gain isn't really important, because you still need to know the ins and outs of a dungeon and be prepared to operate on the fly with your group.
You're never going to be able to waltz into a 15-16, pull 6 packs and AoE them down, no matter what your tank or ilevel is currently.
The biggest thing impacting what level of keys you're going to be able to do is your personal skill, your group's composition and skill level, and how prepared you are (both personally and as a group).
Ilevel means relatively little in the face of all of that.
thorn torrent
the spec on icy viens is the a good thing to follow?
dusk locust
yes icy veins is good
cosmic cargo
@limber tulip did mandl actually go through with it?
cosmic cargo
did he log or record? i wanna see
dire wyvern
It's mostly about dungeon knowledge imo
I did 15+2 on 380 vdh with barely any knowledge of how to play it or tracking anything like demon spikes lmao
keen galleon
It looks like we might actually be able to random our dungeon shouldersm
3 of the 6 options have BOM on them and decent to good traits elsewhere
crystal creek
Yep, lots of options for DC and BoM soon.
keen galleon
Yeah. If you want to run 3x bom you can't do the engie helm tho
Helm of Tempered Jade will likely be bis. Drops off 2nd/3rd boss, and you can do BoM / Callous Reprisal / Heed My Call / Gemhide
Which is a really strong package.
gilded vortex
What slots are you looking to get from dungeon vs raid?
keen galleon
Based on this, raid has bis helm and dungeons have bis shoulders/chestplate
crystal creek
If you're wanting to stack BoM, not everyone is going to.
Brace for impact is pretty good for raids. I also kind of dig iron fortress.
keen galleon
There aren't many good alternatives in raid for defense
Here it's janky af but it works ish
Desert Guardian's Breastplate is gonna be hands down bis
Crystalline + Gemhide on the same piece is very nice, along with either callous or DC, and then bom on the 3rd ring which even non-damage stackers will want one copy of
Plus all 3 raid breastplates have at least one bad trait row
Sea Swell Chestplate is the closest to good, but it's 8th boss so you aren't gonna get it at 415 until prog is over
crystal creek
that chest is from Temple though right? You'll either have to save up or get lucky random.
keen galleon
You'll save up most likely. The other 5 dungeon chests are garbage
crystal creek
I'll prolly go random for my first 415's, pray to rng. Then if I don't get what I want save up.
keen galleon
My plan is craft engie helm, random shoulders, buy chest.
But my raid also won't go very fast into mythic - if I expected to have the jade masters on farm immediately my plans would change
analog swift
I think saving up for the specific piece is something like 8 weeks of weekly 15s. (I’m ignoring scrapping because that’s pretty much negligible). I honestly don’t think but specific pieces is worth it that much when in that time you could have rolled 4 mythic ransoms
Randoms*
keen galleon
I mean it's worth it when 5 out of the 6 are much worse than raid pieces and the other is a strong bis
analog swift
Yeah that’s true.
keen galleon
Shoulders random will win hands down because 3 out of 6 are better than raid shoulders
limber tulip
Just wait till you buy and they retune azerite
analog swift
I mean we’re going to have to wait right?
I mean I’m planning on buying a random mythic piece first week with stocked up residuum just cuz getting that ASAP will be nice
cosmic cargo
ilvl will beat specific traits so rushing random will always be better
analog swift
I think random mythic will@be closer to 500
keen galleon
They said about 10x.
analog swift
Oops math is wrong sorry
cosmic cargo
prot warr has many good traits to pick from and T2 isn't very impactful
analog swift
But 1.6K
keen galleon
A random 400 ilevel should be 500ish yeah
cosmic cargo
T3 is where it can be more impactful i guess
analog swift
Let’s say you have 400 going into season 2. Do a 15 on the last week
I think the residuum will carryover from the final week
You’ll get something like 600 from it
Then 400 from a 10 the first week
keen galleon
Zeppe, the gap between bad pieces and good ones is quite significant now imho
analog swift
So 1K after the first week. Having 500 now isn’t a crazy stretch if you’ve been saving
cosmic cargo
looking at raid ones for example
except for T3
the gap is not huge
i'd take the worse of them at 415 over the best at 400 any day
analog swift
6 14s done each week since 8.1 is 468
I think a 415 to go into mythic would be huge
analog swift
I haven’t scrapped yet
keen galleon
I get your point.
analog swift
Just waiting until it’s pretty much useless but yeah. I think a rando early would be worth it
keen galleon
That said, I would definitely random shoulders, not chest.
If you can only roll one slot
analog swift
I just can’t see bis being worth waiting 8 weeks.
cosmic cargo
^
analog swift
Yeah yeah yeah
cosmic cargo
unless you're pushing high m+s and not concerned with raiding
keen galleon
..... what?
keen galleon
You average about 35 per week from scrapping (3 heroic azerite pieces/week)
So income is around 95 to 125.
sick sentinel
yo, cba to read above chat
keen galleon
115*
analog swift
I was ignoring scrapping for the moment
keen galleon
I mean yeah if you ignore 50% of the azerite income, it takes a long time
keen galleon
No it isn't? 1/3rd of invasions give an azerite piece
I wasn't counting scrapping anything from raid at all
analog swift
Then again bod every boss drops it so maybe more
sick sentinel
a 400ilvl will cost 3x the price of a 385
analog swift
Ok that’s fair. As I said I was ignoring scrapping in the meantime
analog swift
Yes yes we know the cost
keen galleon
If you do every faction assault you get about 3 azerite pieces a week.
analog swift
I was ignoring scrapping he wasn’t.
keen galleon
At heroic ilevel
sick sentinel
and the chest will give 10x the residuum you get now afaik
analog swift
Yeah
keen galleon
From what blizzard has said, ratios won't change, numbers will get real big
So however long it takes now SHOULD be about how long it takes then
analog swift
So ok you get 36~ per week now. Plus a 15 that’s 80. So 116 per week
keen galleon
Which makes a specific approx 5.5 weeks
keen galleon
And a random 1.5 weeks
analog swift
You’re right I did the math a few weeks ago befor assaults were out
keen galleon
Really the answer is still I'd rather buy 2x 415s as my raid starts mythic though
sick sentinel
if you scrap a 385 you get 35 residuum
keen galleon
So I win on a technicality and you win the real argument.
sick sentinel
the best play is to get random 415s
and once you are decked out, then you grind for specific
keen galleon
Yeah
analog swift
And @keen galleon to your point. Every boss (I think) drops azerite gear making farming for scraps more lucrative
In bod
sick sentinel
if you are at a point where you are have a 415 on every slot and your guild are not shitters
keen galleon
That's true but I'm assuming real raids will be stacking dps with those pieces
sick sentinel
then you are going to get mythic azerite pieces to scrap
keen galleon
I doubt you'll be allowed to keep/break down your own azerite
Stacking a tank with azerite is fucking pointleas
Pointless*
sick sentinel
sure
analog swift
Wait you Guys don’t pretend to loot and let the gear go to your mailbox
oblique garnet
shows on the guild logs
keen galleon
I mean if I didn't like a raid's loot rules I'd just go find another raid
cosmic cargo
using the rule of handling like ML tradable pieces is pretty common
analog swift
I’m kidding y’all
keen galleon
I think it's super unfair but it's definitely common yeah
quartz lake
Is it dumb of me to use Shield Block to stop Essence Shear on Mythrax? I'm looking at my logs and I didn't mitigate half of them. wth.
Should I be using LS?
The only thing on my logs that's looking weird for mitigation
outer dew
Spell reflect
quartz lake
everyone other fight is good
I tried spell reflect,
but it showed me as missing mitigation
which confused me.
2 weeks ago
keen galleon
I mean I would definitely be using ignore pain for it?
outer dew
First sheer
quartz lake
outer dew
You stack IP/SR/LS is how I went about it
After is IP/SR/SB/SW
Next 9ne is kind of wimpy
And then you should be in transition on fourth
quartz lake
ok. thanks tofu
signal plover
I'd keep SB running as much as possible anyway cuz he can wombo combo u with a melee after shear if your cotank is slow.
But def at least SR each one
IP when I've got the rage yada yada
main vault
It’s not physical
So shield block does fuck all
But Essence Sefer isn’t dangerous at all
Is the melee before, after, and possible during
signal plover
Literally wot I said bb
tired forge
Has anyone look at how tanks will be in siege if zuldazar?
Is there a fair amount of magic damage?
tired forge
Yeah I think it's not bad
tired forge
But if there is a ton of magic damage it might be harder
neon tangle
honestly they're all pretty close at this point
tired forge
Yeah we aren't cutting edge but aren't bad
neon tangle
unless you are competing for famed slayer just play what you enjoy
trail whale
if you aren't even cutting edge it's literally irrelevant what tank class you pick
tired forge
Haha ok yes Imo it's bad
trail whale
play what you want
neon tangle
^^^
tired forge
Just started raiding again like 2 months ago so we are late this tier haha
But should be cutting edge next tier that's why I want to help wherever I can
Completely agree, not an amazing guilds by any sense of the word
neon tangle
you can certainly be a CE prot warrior w/o issues, especially in 8.1
tired forge
Yeah I have been loving prot 8.1
neon tangle
prot is on the upper half of tank specs, prolly right below monk
and imho it's always nice to have a second tank class available
and everyone who's doing CE this tier prolly has a monk
sick sentinel
DKs have been nerfed
tired forge
Yeah
sick sentinel
they have lowest ehp now
tired forge
Even more reason to have a monk haha
But like I said, it's only magic damage I'm worried about
Otherwise I know warriors are awesome
sick sentinel
tbh warr isn't that bad against magic damage
monk is really good against unexpected incoming damage, that's why they are used in prog
we still have reflect, IP, demo shout
as long as you know when the magic damage is coming, then warriors can deal with it
neon tangle
I mean, their whole tank kit is basically bad luck protection
tired forge
I guess ip off gcd helps a lot for magic
neon tangle
spell reflect is still a powerful magic CD, especially in raids where it doesn't get consumed
and it's on a pretty low CD
tired forge
Why wouldn't it get consumed, sorry noob question
If it doesn't reflect it doesn't get consumed?
neon tangle
If you can't reflect the spell it doesn't get consumed and just gives you the damage reduction
sick sentinel
because your are using it for the DR not the reflect
tired forge
Ok yeah that's great
neon tangle
effectively in raids warriors have a 20% magic DR on a 25s(?) CD
something like that
tired forge
I think 39
sick sentinel
25 sec
bronze lantern
25, kage is right
tired forge
30
sick sentinel
?
bronze lantern
mass spell reflect is 30, fucking pvp talents
sick sentinel
tired forge
Oh yeah I pvp fury so that's what I must be thinking
signal plover
Prot is gonna be gud in BoD. We can block ranged physical attacks which I think a couple bosses have.
IP off gcd is awesome for magic dmg
And fuckin SB recharge is shorter it's looking sexy
There was also several famed Slayer prot tanks in 8.0 and I expect there to be more in 8.1
signal plover
(if uve got the time to have a solid alt then prolly having a pocket BDK for grip memes)
sick sentinel
just IP was pain in the ass
signal plover
Agreed I've been prot through all of uldir and it's been fine
Better than fine on some bosses (zek who?)
sick sentinel
Fetid was a breeze
just taking thrashes to the face like it's nothing
when I needed SB to recharge
sick sentinel
I was just thinking, with bolster/explosive in 2 weeks, why don't bombs give bolster
Food for thought and all that junk
oblique garnet
the neutrals used to bolster
hollow thorn
ye, thank god it doesnt anymroe
echo sierra
azerite triets for offensive prot warrior?
crystal creek
M+? BoM is the go to.
echo sierra
ya for m+
oblique garnet
1x BoM 1x DC 1 Archive probs
echo sierra
dc?
main vault
You don’t play War
echo sierra
im main warrior lol but im arms :p
crystal creek
Double Coconuts.
jk, Deafening Crash good sir.
marok's guide on icy veins talks quite a bit about DC.
oblique garnet
I both hate and love that trait
I hate having to drop ilvl for it
But its so good
crystal creek
Just a couple more weeks, then it should be handed out like halloween candy with it being on so many pieces.
keen galleon
@sick sentinel did you catch the change to bolster in motherlode? The preexisting mines always bolstered, but now the ones spawned by the big mechs do too
Cuz obviously motherlode 4th boss trash wasn't shitty enough
echo sierra
thanks thanks :d
crystal creek
so now we really death run up the hill? awesome.
hollow thorn
Just have a 390 one 4Head
keen galleon
Yeah on bolster week it's basically impossible to justify not doing a death skip
crystal creek
I had some RNJesus with residuum and got DC shoulders.
hollow thorn
You should always deathskip ML if u want a good time
keen galleon
My group has some uh
Technical issues
With death skips
So I usually try to avoid them
crystal creek
got the death part right, working on the skip.
modern brook
Same TBH
oblique garnet
im sure @hot locust can second this aswell
sick sentinel
I almost made a death skip work with a pug
modern brook
Liar
signal plover
almost
sick sentinel
The mines from the mecha always bolstered
sick sentinel
All the mines have always bolster regardless of where it came from, it was never new. U might have never know if u death skip it but they always bolstered when shot out
modern brook
Last week was especially bullshit though
because the pull after 3rd boss was infested engineer + mech
sick sentinel
The sanguine I don't know or remember since I don't push on sang weeks
modern brook
so you had to focus the engineer garunteeing 2-3 bolsters on the mech
which again- just death skip that part
but i think thats why ppl noticed
sick sentinel
Just cc the eng and pull back the mecha
It's what I did and got my 16 timed on Tuesday
sick sentinel
Nope, then can be stunned and banny
analog swift
Wait you guys don’t double death run?
crystal creek
True story.
modern brook
shitters dont do much higher than 10s
11s and 12s sometimes
13s is when they start being filtered out agressively
sick sentinel
Timing X level key is eaiser than timing a 10
modern brook
X=10 :^)
sick sentinel
modern brook
crystal creek
oblique garnet
same tbh
crystal creek
It's not shit to do those, it's just you get a lot of shitty pugs at that level.
oblique garnet
you can carry most +10s alone to atleast +1
keen galleon
And it absolutely did not used to bolster. Only mines that existed at the start bolstered. Spawned mines did not.
It's possible I missed a hotfix sometime in November but I did a ton of bolstering motherlode earlier in the expansion and never death skipped
It would be impossible for us not to notice
Everyone in my run and everyone else I've mentioned it to has agreed its new
sick sentinel
Because I'm not online or at my computer, I would check because all mines always bolstered
This is not new to 8.1, and this wasn't new before the changes to the adds in 8.0
keen galleon
Oh I found it. They bolster if killed, not if soaked.
sick sentinel
Yup
keen galleon
That would do it. I used to run with a full melee group.
The only mines we ever killed were pre-spawned mines.
What a bullshit distinction.
keen galleon
I wouldn't be upset it it was every goddamn breath not like, only breathing in thru my nose not my fucking mouth jesus
inland vortex
whats the different in sockets when it comes down to shields? ex. going 375 + socket vs a 385 no ideal stats
sick sentinel
allways ilvl over all for shields
inland vortex
ty
crystal creek
Ilvl for shields due to the block and armor.
vocal nimbus
where's that from 🤔
crystal creek
Huh, so stand in pepperonis?
hot locust
I imagine the reflect doesn't hit G'huun as the pizza is considered an environmental effect. Could be wrong though lemme check logs.
You'd also need to make sure to only get hit by 1
silk moat
Whatsa shitter
loud lintel
Guys I'm trying to push key 15, should I go for damage or defensive trinkets? Thank you
sick sentinel
I'm running triple 390 BoM and a 385 knot + alchemy stone and I'm fine
Underrot trinket does not say a lot
The good one or the bad one?
loud lintel
The good
sick sentinel
You're fine
loud lintel
I'm running DC, bfi, if. All 390
Well I has no problems with 12 but I has to be as prepared as possible for 15
lavish oracle
If the cage mobs in TD die during the boss, do they not count for %?
main vault
If he releases them no
hollow thorn
How high do i need to go until shit gets hard in M+
16s are a joke when im playing prot lol
lavish oracle
Honestly, I was watching a 22 last night and the warrior didn't have to kite anything
prot just doesn't get hit hard unless it fucks up or theere's some serious magic damage involved
hollow thorn
Only thing ive struggled with is the casters in Shrine
lavish oracle
Yeah, there are some LoS tricks you can pull with them but otherwise they wreck us
potent anvil
Prot warriors generally dont have to kite as long as they're rotating their CDs except on mixed damage packs.
As long as you keep your shield ilvl up to date and your overall ilvl, nothing hits too hard until high fortified.
I'm 389 and I don't have troubles in the 18-19 range either this week or last.
strong forum
Anybody know if you can reflect malignant growth on ghuun only on heroic or also on mythic
lavish oracle
Limit Max and Darkee were talking about it the other day, apparently it works on mythic too
strong forum
Hm rip, coulda made our kill easier
hollow thorn
Ive been doing 16s at like 386 and i feel like im being slaped by wet noodles
potent anvil
Yeah, you can do higher keys for sure at that ilvl
lavish oracle
I need a group to run with, basically no one PUGs higher than 14
strong forum
Tfw used to be #16 World and now #124 cuz stopped pushing...
primal crypt
@potent anvil you running fury still these days for dpsing?
potent anvil
yep
primal crypt
nisuh
remote summit
385 alchemist vs 370 socketed vial for dps?
strong forum
I would say vial cuz it lines up perfectly with every 2nd Avatar
hollow tundra
How good are protection warriors now on a 1-10 scale? If you compare to Legion.
hollow tundra
Mythic + and raiding?
strong forum
Ye
Compared to Legion we're stronger now I'd say
With the insanity that is block
And keeping in mind that every tank has to be healed
hollow tundra
Sounds good, i thought that the legion prot rotation was great fun playing. Haven't touched BFA yet though. 😃
strong forum
Takes some getting used and I punishing if you fuck up
somber dragon
so... how do we deal with necrotic properly, that's really the only thing that truly scares me about our kit (unless there's some huge magic fuckfest fight in the next raid too lol 😄
jumpy-kitey-win?
warm plinth
We're one of the most mobile tanks in the game. Kiting, kiting, and more kiting.
And/or roll one of the dwarf races or a night elf 👌
somber dragon
i have a healer in the same physical room, so i can probably cheese the fuck outta intercept
warm plinth
Intercept him through the monitor so your toon is outside of the game world. GG
wide girder
Tricepsion
somber dragon
and my (non)apologies, the current 120 warrior is a green Orcboi for life 😄
strong forum
How to deal with necrotic 101
wide girder
Triceratoption
warm plinth
Nah I don't care really. I like dwarves personally; my horde warrior is gonna be a HMT
strong forum
Horde 🤢
warm plinth
I decided I'm leveling one of each class this expansion
sick sentinel
Brace for Impact
stone cloud
OP or Lifespeed?
steady karma
sick sentinel
Pretty much gotta ask sense
lavish oracle
Anyone hear about this temple bug that lets you keep the buff from the last boss in M+ if you clear it in 0?
sick sentinel
OH BOY
lavish oracle
Not sure how it works was wondering if anyone knew
Don't have a temple key to test it with
ancient reef
Does the dark.iron racial clear necro
shut summit
@ancient reef ye
analog zinc
explain, how are you good now
sick sentinel
We aren't, stop asking
analog zinc
but how did you go from being barely more used than bears to being more used than DHs
warm plinth
Public perception is finally changing?
DH are pretty bad compared to Legion and people finally realized we do mongo damage?
We've been good the whole time. People just took their time learning it I guess. There's no definitive answer, since we barely changed in 8.1 beyond QoL changes.
sick sentinel
Heres the best answer we can give you
People like you asking, how come we are so popular now is the reason we were so unpopular before.
sharp dew
380 howler vs 370 rezan strictly ST dps?
open bluff
rezan
sharp dew
aoe same thing or howler?
sharp dew
so basically just a good survival boost for m+ and a little dmg from it
sick sentinel
Haste benefits us more than Vers
And howler has too long of a cd AND the amount u get and share with ur group isn't enough to keep a slot for it
If u can proc howler far enough away from the group by urself, it can be more valueable both dps/defense wise but u can end up learning really bad habits because of it
lavish oracle
Yeah, the dark and terrible secret is that prot was never bad, just unpopular
nova rover
Gotta ask, I mean we did get through it, but how do you guys handle zul heroic?
lavish oracle
You mean the debuff in p2?
sick sentinel
Have enough rage up for IP during the stacks
Time ur SR/SW
Remember to use LS/RC at the right timeas well
lavish oracle
Demo shout, IP, a dedicated healer and a BoP if you can get it
oblique garnet
take 4 stacks jump away call for bop
sick sentinel
Man i've been having so much success with double crit trinkets
Never thought id join the parry team
main vault
I mean at this point you can take way more than 4
I pugged last night and we just zerged boss and took stacks til we died
I got to like 7 or 8 pretty easily at 368
ez kill
sick sentinel
monkaS
nova rover
Yea p2
I have done it as a bear, and 11 stacks? no sweat
On a warrior I got 7 bop and dead
And thats if I have every cooldown going
usually its 4 maybe 5
bronze moon
So i main prot but been playing healer the last week. Why do these other prot warrior do more damage than me or more damage than the whole group? Stack crit or something?
i seem to see tank azerite too, but ive seen some with dps middle/archive
warm plinth
Assuming similar ilevel, you might just not be doing the proper rotation or not using CDs effectively/as much as you can.
bronze moon
Hmmmm.
lavish oracle
@bronze moon what talents are you using?
warm plinth
Stats shouldn't have a huge effect, and I would almost guarantee no one is stacking crit on a prot warrior.
bronze moon
Maybe since fort teeming they can stay in and more aoe targets
er tryannical teeming
I mean I/m not claiming to be a genius prot warrior, but I'm around 1100
warm plinth
That's a possibility. You can pretty much face tank most non-caster packs this week.
warm plinth
Yeah that's not that unusual tbh. Watch some of Sense's streams/vods. He is in 2nd/3rd place a lot overall
lavish oracle
Are you running unstoppable force? Had someone ask me the same question earlier this week and it's because they were running best served cold instead of UF
bronze moon
For damage though, priortity is tclap, revenge prof, shield slam?
running unstoppable force
warm plinth
If you're going for pure damage, and don't need the extra rage for IPs, you would use Revenge even without a proc
lavish oracle
Nah, you should pretty much just pop it on CD
warm plinth
It's up fast enough that you shouldn't really have to worry about not having it when you need it.
lavish oracle
I'd use SS first because revenge can reset SS
But it wouldn't cause that much of a discrepency in damage
warm plinth
It would probably depend on target count, but you do get SS resets from Revenge as well so that factors in a bit.
lavish oracle
The biggest difference is gonna be from thunderclap useage
bronze moon
i feel bad not getting brace for impact procs
warm plinth
Yeah you're automatically losing damage if you're not using Tclap every other global during Avatar.
bronze moon
Do you know where I can find trinket discussion for m+?
warm plinth
I don't think there's a list anywhere, but if you're unsure of what to use, you can ask here.
We can't sim for anything, so there's not a list like a lot of classes have.
warm plinth
No worries.
bronze moon
snse with the 20% crit
native forum
Well you should Avatar demo shout and use your Jes Howler or on use trinket, you can put out nutty numbers
I usually put out 50k + dps on large mobs with that
I also run triple gutripper
sick sentinel
Also @bronze moon due to the new azerite trait(Bastion of Might) we are doing a lot of damage if u run double BoM with a DC trait
In m+ specifically, since mastery increases our attack power, which affects our damage
And with the raid a few weeks away, running triple BoM at 385 and triple DC, our aoe will outclass maybe even DH for aoe
During avatar of course
native forum
the damage stack tho not the duration increase
sick sentinel
That's the point
Because DC increases our TC damage, triple DC even outside avatar will boost it's damage
warm plinth
So the new ring of traits is going to be basically the outer ring again?
native forum
just go for ilvl right?
warm plinth
Word
solid owl
when's someone gonna make it so that we can sim prot
native forum
any reason to run devastator this tier?
signal plover
Nope
warm plinth
Can't imagine a situation where it would give more rage than BV, and it doesn't come close to the damage output.
native forum
yeah the damage out is the main reason i suppose
dusk locust
got'em tuesday!
signal plover
Awww snap u sly dog
signal plover
Well played sir
dusk locust
we got pretty good at getting to p3, and i discovered late that nobody was saving cds for p3
signal plover
Oof
dusk locust
killed it on the 7th pull tues
we're trying to re-clear for the people who missed CE
just had the most scuffed alt raid imaginable
dusk locust
we actually changed how we were tanking p3 very slightly
and it made it feel way better
killed it shortly after
signal plover
Noyce
dusk locust
way too much boss movement before that
signal plover
Dope dude. Aight I'm outtie just wanted to check on my twin
wind steppe
Any good youtube channel or stream that showcases prot done right?
Trying to get better
m+
oblique garnet
Sense
warm plinth
^ He has VoDs you can watch on Twitch.
Link is in his Discord profile; he's one of the golden boys over there >
oblique garnet
also youtube channel
next goblet
374 ilvl.. not much of a m+ tank but doing a +8 KR.. what mechanics are cancer to warriors?
warm plinth
Ask @sick sentinel about KR 😂 "spectral bolt spectral bolt spectral bolt spectral bolt"
sick sentinel
FUCK SPECTRAL BOLT
hot locust
Don't lose threat to your dps and then they can kick for you. :^)
oblique garnet
Demon hunters are pretty fun
hot locust
vengeance?
next goblet
oh i dont drop threat 😛 im a good tank
oblique garnet
havoc
dusk locust
@outer dew haha oh boy
warm plinth
Havoc is definitely more fun than it was in Legion. Legion Havoc rotation: CSCSCSCSCSCSCSCSCSCSCSCSCSCSCSCSMETACSCSCSCSCSCSCSCSCSCSCSCSCSCSCS
Well, except the end when T21 brought Demonic further into the limelight
ionic fern
So, we somehow managed to kill Fetid in 20 tries and suddenly found ourselves on Zul..how does one deal with the Rupturing blood stacks?
I get BoP for the first one but after that we're kinda out...my co-tank is a Paladin so he DS the first stacks..then i get BoP'ed and he BoP's his 2nd one but i'm stuck there waiting. 😒
warm plinth
If you have no more immunities, you die and get CRed
sick sentinel
you don't necessarily have to die, especially as a warrior you can sit the aoe healing / get focus healed on about 3 stacks pretty safely
just leap out as its about to expire
but make sure your healers are aware, but its easily doable if you don't have enough immunities/ bops etc etc
sweet flint
So i bought a 385 chest today i got the worst chest possible imo. got the revenge trait and the rest is just dogshit. would you guys recommend going down to ilvl 370 for better traits? (doing both m+ and mythic raiding progress)
warm plinth
@sweet flint Definitely not. 15 ilevels is an easy choice. Only time I would downgrade for a trait is if I didn't have DC and I was going to get a DC from the lower piece.
sweet flint
ye i thought so 😃 thanks!
olive kettle
Is it worth switching out a brewmaster for prot warrior on mythic ghuun progression for the p3 spell reflect?
hollow thorn
Saw a reddit post about it
Limit GM did like 600k dmg per Spell reflect
thats pretty massive in p3
olive kettle
Yeah i saw him do it last night and he ended up with 4mill dmg just from the spell reflect in heroic and its double the dmg per hit in mythic
lavish oracle
Damn, so 8 mil out of 30 mil HP on mythic, that'd be insane
stone crag
hmmm
could SR from the start and it's not until now people are wondering about it for mythic 🤔
strong forum
No one noticed and made it public
strong forum
Well he does stream when I sleep so hard for me to watch :p
warm plinth
He VoDs all his streams though, so you can watch them whenever :p
warm plinth
I actually enjoy VoDs more than streams. I can skip out all the dead air if I watch VoDs. Time between instances and stuff.
stone crag
+1
junior igloo
I looked at Sense's kills and didn't find anything.
What do you SR?
olive kettle
When the malignant growths detonate you spell reflect as many as you can
junior igloo
oh, I didn't look for that, ty
I was looking for corrupting bite, wave or even putrid blood
vocal nimbus
In the pins
stone crag
short temple
this might be a stupid question. just wanna make sure.
A question about Spell Reflect. if u reflect a raidboss mechanic. will you still get the debuff? or do it depend on the debuff
stone crag
i can't think of a mechanic were you reflect but still gain a debuff
i may be wrong though
the main reflects that come to mind, none of the debuffs apply
warm plinth
Typically if it's an actual reflect (meaning you send the spell back at its target), you won't get the debuff.
vocal nimbus
Most of the time the effect of the debuff gets reflected too 👍
warm plinth
Well, in M+ or open world, yes, but not typically in raids.
stone crag
i think that was more situational than anything
had to say though, the one i had in mind was from ilysanna's ability from legion but that's blockable rather than reflectable
warm plinth
Yeah, most boss-type abilities did not apply debuffs even if they were reflectable, and a lot were reflectable that didn't even go back on the enemy. They were just negated.
sinful bay
does anyone here use Sense's elvui ? I imported the string but in groups the party is not showing
hollow thorn
Yes
crisp pecan
Hey, are you trying to cheat me? Youre dps folk not a prot
warm plinth
Prot doesn't take damage; we deal it 😉
hollow thorn
^
crisp pecan
last time i remember my prot adventure was Shrine 14 getting obliterated by this elemental just down the stairs in 8.0
crisp pecan
as for 8.1 affix it is going to be only better
since these reaping mobs do not use skills, only meele dmg
crisp pecan
like a zombie invasion right?
hollow thorn
which warriors has none of
I think its ghosts of the mobs or smt
we dont have much info
dont know if we kill them, run from them, or cc them
crisp pecan
all these tanking pros saying they reroll warr from dk
hollow thorn
might be different kinds of ghosts or just all the same
Prot is pretty good rn, especially the dmg
highest UR in time is with prot war
warm plinth
I mean, we didn't really get a huge buff to survivability or anything.
We got a bit more stamina, a bit more armor, and a slightly shorter SB cooldown.
The people who were doing 18-20s now were doing them before 8.1
who are*
dire wyvern
survivability has gone up a fair amount with IP off GCD, not only do you get more uptime on it but you can also dump rage better so you can use your bigger CDs more
cosmic cargo
3 small (not really that small to be honest) buffs kinda add up to a big buff
cosmic cargo
right, 4 buffs
blockable ranged is more situational than the rest
but when applicable its the biggest ofc
cosmic cargo
yeah but it really doesn't come into play most dungeons
stone cloud
whats a socket worth in weapon?
warm plinth
Nothing worth sacrificing ilevel for.
sick sentinel
not sure about weapon, but for shields it's ilvl>all
warm plinth
I'm not sure how you would get more IP by removing it from the GCD? If you needed IP, you would still cast it regardless, no?
dire wyvern
In m+ you would overcap rage and you would be hard pressed to sacrifice a dps gcd on IP
sick sentinel
You casted IP and was wasting rage gen by by not using other abilities or you were using other abilities overcapping rage
cosmic cargo
specially during avatar
merry cave
Ranged block was by far our biggest buff
cosmic cargo
every gcd during avatar is precious
sick sentinel
Avatar + big pulls made you generate fuckload of rage with no way of spending it
dire wyvern
yeh
merry cave
The IP change is very little compared to block change
cosmic cargo
in comparison it's huge i'd say
simply because majority of dungeons do not have ranged phys mobs
sick sentinel
Ranged Blocks/IP > Shield block CD > armor/stam buff
merry cave
The dungeons that do were almost undoable at high level though
Short of kiting the entire time
sick sentinel
and I would put BoM together with shield block
sick sentinel
well with S2 it would be the biggest change but it's not up yet
cosmic cargo
there's not really that huge impact
sick sentinel
KR, Siege, ToS
cosmic cargo
S2 is huge for warrior
right
because warr has by far the best spec specific traits
sick sentinel
Tol Dagor too I think have some ranged too
cosmic cargo
it does but they're not a big deal
cosmic cargo
imo bloodsport is overrated
merry cave
Tol has tons of ranged that mess you up
cosmic cargo
many traits compare to it defensively but it gives 0 offense
sick sentinel
Callous Reprisal is kinda meh tho
merry cave
Bloodsport is very strong when needed. high tyrannical motherload for example
It's situationally very good
Not a general use
cosmic cargo
that's a good exception yes