protection

[uneven mason]

I was running HC Just to get the 4+ runes

and now

its like

1 or 2

🖕

[oblique garnet]

Its random

1-9

[uneven mason]

way to remove my motivation to do anything but my +10 for the week

[crystal creek]

I do them for the gold too.

[wild hamlet]

Just out of interest did anything change other than the IP on GCD?

[uneven mason]

we got a larger HP pool

[wild hamlet]

and has it made that much difference?

[oblique garnet]

Yes

[uneven mason]

SB CD was reduced by 11%

(16s base)

Its made a considerable difference

[oblique garnet]

Ranged block

[uneven mason]

for most folks

oh yeah

ranged block

++++

[crystal creek]

armor increase.

[oblique garnet]

Intercept off gcd

[uneven mason]

best change

gonna go run a TD 12 tonight

that ranged block

gonna make me cry happytears

[mild maple]

demo shout off the gcd when ;_;

[uneven mason]

never

[crystal creek]

lol

[mild maple]

I will whine forever

[uneven mason]

Demo shout feels good to press on GCD

[oblique garnet]

But then blizzard decided to fuck up things and change berserkers in kr to be immune to cc

[uneven mason]

15% damage buff, 40 rage, 20% DR

I think ti can stay on the GCD

[oblique garnet]

Added true sight to matrons in underrot

[uneven mason]

Avatar tho

Oh yeah I saw that

RIP

Well to be fair

[primal crypt]

my healer did not want to go back into KR after last night

[uneven mason]

Uderrott

was basically "Rogue required"

now its not

[oblique garnet]

It is

The timer is still really tight

[uneven mason]

you can do a skip with invis pots farther in tho

so no, not required

😛

[oblique garnet]

So now you just skip with rogue in the end

[uneven mason]

there is only a 5 foot "space" where you NEED invis on that last hall

but for teeming weeks

unless you have an idiot who facepulls from 20 yards away

[wild hamlet]

Hmmm I never even hit 120 in 8.0 as all the changes just had me like meh

[uneven mason]

well

you missed a great time

[wild hamlet]

wife is out tonight so I thought I might hop back in for a few hours

But wasn't sure what class to get back into

I love warriors but I just couldn't do it

it was so clunky

[modern brook]

are we discussing how underrot is the worst dungeon in the expansion?

cause its a fact

Kings rest is hard but we're not allowed to complaina bout difficulty after bitching that the game was made for 12 year olds for 3 years

[civic aspen]

i havent tried it this week without skipping the beginning after the stealth changes

[modern brook]

Underrot is just fucking stupid

and its even stupider now

[merry cave]

Dungeons in general feel a lot worse this week. Atal 14 trash was ruining us like never before

Not sure if I'm imagining it but definitely feels tougher than lasy fort rotation

[young iris]

im thinking there will be a m+ like legion since we already 4 months in and people are completing +20s

squish that is

[upper spoke]

anyone got name of island expedition addon that identifies potential loot from mobs?

[merry cave]

People do islands? 🤔

[young iris]

i think ive done maybe 10 ever

[crystal creek]

Hey the rare treasure map quest ain't bad, and they reduced the amount of azerite you need for the weekly.

[young iris]

weekly still gives the same reward or is that reduced as well?

[crystal creek]

Same reward.

just 36k azerite instead of 40k

[young iris]

not bad

[modern brook]

islands are legit fun

ppl are just big babies

[young iris]

i dont remember it taking more than 4-5 heroics to knock out the weekly, easy 30 mins of playing

[merry cave]

I disagree I find them really boring

[modern brook]

U just pull everything and try and break 100k sustained clappage

nice shitty opinion morg

[crystal creek]

What prot doesn't like pulling everything, popping Av & DS and clapping to victory.

[modern brook]

did u get it from reddit 😠

[silk moat]

How is the avatar + ignorenpain azerite trait working out for everyone

[merry cave]

Why is it a shitty opinion all because it's different to yours?

[mild maple]

Every time I do an Islands I'm struck by how boring it is and think of how much more fun it could be if Blizz tried a bit

[modern brook]

because its wrong

[merry cave]

No it's not wrong, it's different

[crystal creek]

Bastion? It's ok on big pulls.

[modern brook]

BoM is sick @silk moat ; really good in m+; kinda ass in raid

Its wrong.

[crystal creek]

Nice having the instant IP as you grab the pack.

[young iris]

I just pop some defensives, use the nuke, ez pz

[silk moat]

@modern brook what’s your deal now?

I see

[merry cave]

Right your clearly an intellectual with that argument

[silk moat]

Omg there’s 2 Morgs

This is bad

[modern brook]

^ yeah one with a legit question the other with a bad opinion

[silk moat]

Lol

[merry cave]

Pathetic

[modern brook]

[oblique garnet]

Calm down ppl

[silk moat]

So what are the 3 outer ring traits to run? DC, BOM , and the shield slam one?

[young iris]

[oblique garnet]

For m+ 2x BoM and 1 DC

[silk moat]

Ahh

[modern brook]

Raid DC + BFI and archive

[silk moat]

I read DC was going to get nerfed, but did they decide to leave it unchanged ?

[oblique garnet]

Nope still nerfed but strong

[mild maple]

Nerfs can't stop the DC train

[modern brook]

it got nerfed to a max of +6s

still absurdly good

[crystal creek]

Lot of the BfD have DC on them too, rejoice.

[silk moat]

🙌

[modern brook]

just not ~8% DR on its own good or whatever it was

[oblique garnet]

Im happy can get the 3xBoM 3xDC dream

[modern brook]

For maximum stompage?

[oblique garnet]

Yup

[modern brook]

I feel like 3xBoM, 2xIF, 1DC might be better

[oblique garnet]

Idk

[junior igloo]

For Uldir you want DC + BoM + RA activator.
Outside of Uldir you can replace RA with anything (BfI or another BoM are probably best, but it's not a huge difference like those 1-offs)

[modern brook]

I actually dont know how potent a damage buff DC gives

[oblique garnet]

Dc increases thunderclap damage

[young iris]

I kinda wish that Intimidating Presence feared mobs in place rather than the 50% slow, like how the old glyph used to be, but i guess its better than nothing

[oblique garnet]

Iron fortress is really underwhelming damage wise

[modern brook]

hmm

IF is ~500 per block at 405; DC is 437 at 405

Do u know if that 437 is +50% from the talent?

[oblique garnet]

Thats baseline

[modern brook]

https://www.wowhead.com/spell=272824/deafening-crash; https://www.wowhead.com/spell=278765/iron-fortress

^those are what I'm using for those numbers if its innaccurate whoops

[oblique garnet]

Overall dc edges out

Especially with BoM buffing avatar

And overall damage

[drowsy relic]

is this week not a "push" week?

not many high keys this week

[jovial forge]

Current stats should i drop some haste for more vers ?

[drowsy relic]

is that with the into the fray buff?

[jovial forge]

yes

[drowsy relic]

talent*

[narrow abyss]

Has to be

Lol

[jovial forge]

without i have 22%

[drowsy relic]

lol

[drowsy relic]

lol i thought mine was high at 21%

what ilevel are you?

[jovial forge]

377

all my gear is h/m h/v

[drowsy relic]

probs dont drop any haste tho lol

[jovial forge]

Though i had high haste lol

[bronze lance]

i think they though you had 41% unbuffed

or 44

[worthy dagger]

im going h/v

i hate depending on luck for anything

[jovial forge]

k

what about crit ?

i see alot of people using biometric cleaver over luminous edge

[worthy dagger]

cause its hard to get the edhe

not cause they want to

[jovial forge]

k

guess im lucky

[broken roost]

I have 0 versatility on my warr lol

500 crit rating, 1300ish haste and 1300ish mast

[worthy dagger]

vers is so good tho

i pop the trinket and i go up to 30% vers

and thats a lot

its a consistent form of damage and damage reduction

and i dont have to rely on luck to crit or block since i already have shield block for that

[broken roost]

Sure, I just don't have gear with versa

But I do appreciate critical blocks for 92% DR

[oblique garnet]

how do you have that much mastery? o.O

[mellow quartz]

isnt the max DR 85% no matter what?

[lusty grotto]

Ayo what up

@jovial forge your stats don't matter.

Go with high ilvl always

Don't balance around stats

[jovial forge]

k

[lusty grotto]

Not sure why nobody mentioned it because it has been said ad nauseaum here

But secondaries are close in value

So basically you don't go secondaries over ilvl

[uneven mason]

@broken roost @mellow quartz Yes, max DR from armor and Block is 85%, but you can have 85% DR from armor (not likely) then 85% DR from block (crticials can do this outside of mythic raids) and then * other DR for more reduction

[jovial forge]

thanks for the info nimchip

[lusty grotto]

Np

[broken roost]

Oh so block rating/mastery that makes non-crit DR do more than 42.5% does nothing? (For DR purposes)

Err that was poorly worded - crit blocks when blocks have 42.5 or more DR are capped at 85%?

[uneven mason]

Right

but you won't hit that

even with a 395 shield in Mythic raids I think you'll get to around 80%

below that sure

but it doesn't really DR Mastery that much

I mean, non crit blocks can go above 42.5%

I think vs heroic mobs my non crit block % Is like 50%

heroic dungeon*

[tender matrix]

Hi ! Question. Is any of the engineer azeritic perk better than our default perk ? (like Deafening Crash etc.)

[next ermine]

Nothing will be better than DC so that's ruled out for 1 slot

But to answer fully dont believe so. The icyveins guide hasbupdated info

[broken roost]

Hmm - my block tooltip says it blocks 46%, with double for crit blocks, using 370 shield. is that reduced is M+ or something?

I have IFx2 if that changes anything (my only 385 pieces :'(

[plucky viper]

sucks im stuck at work and all i wanna do is go home and level

[strong parcel]

is servant splitter waepon good for tanking?

[next ermine]

No

[steel mauve]

@broken roost you need to use the K equation to see how much your block effects m+ and raiding

Add 7100 to your block value and then take your block value and divide it by the big number

Servent splitter is terrible, its only good if its a much higher ilvl than what you have

[broken roost]

Hm okay I'll give that a shot

[steel mauve]

Are the k values of all the difficulties

Block value / (block value + k value) = block percent

[uneven mason]

@broken roost There is a value in the block % calculation which scales with content, https://www.icy-veins.com/wow/protection-warrior-pve-tank-rotation-cooldowns-abilities#block-rating

[normal trellis]

Question for fortified weeks: Would [Never Surrender] or [Indomitable] be better than [Bolster]? Or is [Bolster] BIS in every situation?

[rapid trench]

Bolster all the way

[modern brook]

Bolster gets better every time you think about switching its talent

[lusty grotto]

rofl never surrender or indom are NEVER better than bolster

NEVER

ravager on the other hand 😃

(i'm required to say that last line was meme as to not confuse new people or else i'll be banned)

[bronze lance]

indom is better if you need the life to survive a hit

[lusty grotto]

indom is NEVER better

what you said was only true in legion

this is BFA

you will never need Indom

[bronze lance]

ok well when a boss hits you for 201k and is unblockable and you only have 200k life

how would indom not be better? it would be better you would live

[lusty grotto]

because tank busters don't exist

[bronze lance]

its better if you need the flat hp

[lusty grotto]

since oh, how many expansions ago?

the closest thing to a "tank buster" is what? fetid combo or mythrax shear? and those are easily manageable with baseline skills

even in legion we told people indom was trash

[ember arrow]

@bronze lance if smt hits for 201k and u hotv200k hp

U use a cd

[lusty grotto]

shit there was a meme for lord sco and indom

[ember arrow]

Got*

[uneven mason]

@bronze lance At what point are you going to take that 201k hit? is it a boss mechanic?

If its a boss mehcanic YOU USE BLOCK

[outer dew]

If something ever hit you for 200k

Don't be shit

[uneven mason]

Bolster gives you 15seconds of block

[modern brook]

If ur getting hit for 200k u coulda just used bolster wtf

[uneven mason]

Indomitable will N E V E R be better than Bolster

especially as long as Last Stand is tied to AM

[modern brook]

bolster is on the I HAVE MOR ELIFE NOW button

[uneven mason]

Literally 20% uptime on a 30% HP Gain

15s block even

Like in raw napkin math

Indomitable is only marginally (like 0.5% EHP??) behind Bolster

[bronze lance]

and none of yall have counted the point i made, well maye "use a cd" but the situation would assume you are doing that stuff already

[uneven mason]

mechanically, its worlds behind

[modern brook]

K

If ur getting 1 shot

[outer dew]

Aite

[modern brook]

through last stand

[bronze lance]

i agree, it would only be better in the situation you needed the flat hp

[lusty grotto]

there is no situation balanced around that Roch

[modern brook]

indom would not help you

[uneven mason]

If you're going to take a 201k hit while using CDs

Indom won't save you

[modern brook]

alternative take

[raven kernel]

If something hits prot for 200k other tanks are fucked

[uneven mason]

ever.

[modern brook]

if ur getting one shot through last stand

[outer dew]

If you die through last stand and shield wall

I don't know who will survive

[uneven mason]

I mean, we're not monks

[modern brook]

you are ~ 30 cahracter levels lower than you should be for whatevers hitting you

[uneven mason]

we don't do "passive afk tank mode"

anywho

I think we made our point gents

On to the discussion of "Never surrender"

Never Surrender is the talen that would be left over

after you fed a doberman chili

like buckets of it

then lit the ensuing projectile ejection on fire.

[lusty grotto]

LOL

[hard vector]

hey guys!!

[lusty grotto]

you mean chili with chocolate right?

cause that'd be a diarrhea super soaker

and then it dies sadly

depending on the amount of chocolate of course

[hard vector]

so i was just wondering wether the prot warrior buff makes any difference in 8.1?

[lusty grotto]

maybe

[hard vector]

my warriors been my main since vanilla, and i had to reroll this expac to monk because my warrior was shit

[lusty grotto]

it's a buff, so what does that tell you?

warriors havent been shit

[minor fox]

What trinket would be better for prot between rezan's gleaming eye and vanquished tendril of ghuun? (eye is at 370, tendril is at 375 with avoidance)

[lusty grotto]

players have been shit

[oblique garnet]

Warrior wasnt shit you were just bad

[lusty grotto]

Ghuun trinket is fucking terrible for all classes and specs

[oblique garnet]

Tendril is hot garbage and you should never use it

[uneven mason]

Tendril is literally an Expulsom

its worth the time to go shred it

[hard vector]

lol nah i think that blizzard fucked us this expac. Notice the difference straight away tanking Mythic raids on them both...

[lusty grotto]

its an expulsom but sometimes it isn't because... random

ROFL what

[uneven mason]

Trinkets are always expulsom

+++

[lusty grotto]

not for me

[minor fox]

I was asking since I've been hoarding the hell out of items

just in case something happens

[oblique garnet]

Yeah i mean i guess if youre tanking on 340 warrior vs 380 monk sure you can tell the difference

[lusty grotto]

don't horde ghuun, its bad FOR EVERYONE

[woeful badge]

guys I'm thinking of trying prot first time this expac how is the spec after the changes ?

[winter aspen]

Yo hows the buffs ?

Still trash or nah ?

[minor fox]

what about that crit vers ring from waycrest manor?

[hard vector]

well i leveled and geared my warrior first

[lusty grotto]

are hard to read

[uneven mason]

Lunch crowd are in

[lusty grotto]

yeah mac

for sure

[winter aspen]

I want opinions not pins

[uneven mason]

The opinion is, warriors were never trash

[hard vector]

no point in talking to these clowns @winter aspen it was never the spec that was bad, just platers

[uneven mason]

if you were having a hard time on a warrior, you needed to "gitgud"

[hard vector]

players ^^

[oblique garnet]

Literally the case

[lusty grotto]

Warriors weren't bad, players were bad

[hard vector]

bunch of elitist wankers

[winter aspen]

It was absolutely the worst tank in m+

[uneven mason]

We had a skill floor higher than the skill ceiling on monks

[lusty grotto]

can't manage demo uptime = bad, can't manage sb effective uptime = bad

[uneven mason]

Except for VDH and Druids

🙄

[lusty grotto]

not for your 7 keys it wasn't @winter aspen

[uneven mason]

Tanks in M+ was literally "is it BDK? no, Ok its bad"

[oblique garnet]

Pretty much

[winter aspen]

Add 10 to that

[oblique garnet]

Mostly because the lack of utility

[uneven mason]

^^

[lusty grotto]

anything not-MDI level doesn't apply to you and we have been absolute dps powerhouses up to 18

[minor fox]

I'd suppose a 395 crit vers ring is better than a 370 haste mastery one?

[uneven mason]

But yeah, I've had zero trouble as a prot warrior in mythic raiding

yes Preacher

[oblique garnet]

@minor fox yes

[lusty grotto]

it is @minor fox

[uneven mason]

haste dipped in value a touch

due to SB CD being reduced by 11%

probably high haste rings are only worth 5 now

[lusty grotto]

haste doesn't matter, it's a 20 +ilvl ring

[minor fox]

sorry for the slightly noobish questions, I've been a bit out of touch since I used to main prot in legion, but I then changed characters for bfa

[lusty grotto]

nothing changed in terms of gearing

we were ilvl > all in legion too

[uneven mason]

Well

[lusty grotto]

not well, that was the case

shall we summon Father Thyme back

[hard vector]

summon yourself a ballsack

[uneven mason]

high haste vs crit/mastery is probably worth 5

[lusty grotto]

the fuck

[hard vector]

you spineless cunt

[oblique garnet]

XD

[uneven mason]

Balsaq quit, I miss him

[oblique garnet]

The truth hurts

[lusty grotto]

Eyir we have problems here with @hard vector

potential brigade

[hard vector]

too right you do. i asked simple questions and you responded like a cunty

[lusty grotto]

? lol

[hard vector]

Cunt

so im just giving back what i got

[uneven mason]

You came in saying "IS PROT SHIT" and we answered - no, hasn't been, wat u on?

[oblique garnet]

You asked if prot was trash we gave you the real answer then you went into denial saying the spec is garbage

??

[uneven mason]

and now you're all indignant because we made you feel bad, for being bad, and trying to blame the spec, and not your inability to play it.

[lusty grotto]

we didnt say Bellstar was shit

[uneven mason]

But in the end - Prot is fine

Prot is very strong for 8.1

[lusty grotto]

we said prot was bad because players were shit

[unique sonnet]

Yeah to be fair I always check pins before asking opinions and make it clearer the discord folks. Kinda in the wrong here, Bell

[uneven mason]

it was strong in 8.0

[hard vector]

so you took offence that i asked wether prot was still shit??

you fucking looser

[lusty grotto]

nobody but you took offense

it's "loser"

[hard vector]

its a game you limp dicked prick

[uneven mason]

We didn't take offense, we gave you an answer

[vocal nimbus]

<@&257983573498265600>

[lusty grotto]

<@&257983573498265600>

[unique sonnet]

Dude lol, chill out

[winter aspen]

Prot salt

[chrome wyvern]

We just need to remove all the other specs and make Warriors the only viable tanks again imo

[hard vector]

fuck you elitist cunts

[uneven mason]

But what would all the tanks due when they're required to find 200IQ

[lusty grotto]

guy is really mad

[unique sonnet]

Sounds like you’re the only elitist @hard vector

[dense pivot]

nonono, keep other tanking specs, just make them really really bad, like in vanilla

[winter aspen]

Some1 make a Virgin prot warrior vs Chad fury warrior pls

[stray wedge]

$mute @hard vector 6h being very rude in #protection

[turbid robin]

Done.

[dense pivot]

they shall suffer

[unique sonnet]

Thanks Hymdall!

[lusty grotto]

thanks Eyir, it sucks that people like that come around

[gilded tendon]

fuk u @lusty grotto

[lusty grotto]

😦

[dense pivot]

D:

[stray wedge]

LOL

@fierce juniper

[chrome wyvern]

Oof'd on

[unique sonnet]

Dayum

[chrome wyvern]

Nimchip destroyed by a bot.

[oblique garnet]

It sucks how Eyir treats nimchip😪

[gilded tendon]

fuk u @oblique garnet

[lusty grotto]

it's tough love

[stray wedge]

Adam you might wanna turn that off

[uneven mason]

Don't conjure Eyir

[lusty grotto]

Late did you sleep man

[uneven mason]

they get mad

[chrome wyvern]

time to ban the bot for being rude in chat also.

[unique sonnet]

In all seriousness though, I’m liking the GCD changes for Prot, and while I agree warriors were never shit, I think it made QoL for them. I look forward to playing something else that feels fun other than BrM.. not that BrM feels fun anyway

[oblique garnet]

I did sleep why?

[lusty grotto]

lol i mean 4am

[uneven mason]

8.1 shrunk our "I'm fucked" window

and lowered the skill floor

[oblique garnet]

Its 9pm nim what

[chrome wyvern]

imo the changes did not make us any better but it def smoothed it a bit

[uneven mason]

Basically - if you were struggling as prot in 8.0, 8.1 is less punishing

[lusty grotto]

it was 4am yesterday when you ran that Seth no?

[oblique garnet]

Oh yeah

[primal aurora]

🐍

[lusty grotto]

yikes

[uneven mason]

If you were good at prot - we gained some EHP and a smaller gap in SB uptime

[oblique garnet]

Its 13 now btw

Never pugging again

[unique sonnet]

Well I read that someone was saying that uptime on demo had a lot to do with it

[lusty grotto]

lol

[uneven mason]

Yeah

mastering demo uptime

[plucky viper]

man i have to do some work at work and i missed drama

[lusty grotto]

it does, demo is important

[uneven mason]

was the 400IQ prot

now they reduced that requirment

[lusty grotto]

demo is a big part of our mitigation now

[uneven mason]

for the avg player it didn't make a big difference

[chrome wyvern]

being able to chain demo into itself is pretty fun

[lusty grotto]

which is why DC is so important

[uneven mason]

since most were not 100% Utilizing DC

[unique sonnet]

So deafening crash is obviously a must trait

[uneven mason]

while for pro players the EHP gains in armor and hp negated the loss of of DS Uptime

[oblique garnet]

Getting the ip off gcd helps alot since you can spend more time gaining rage so you can make your cds shorter which in turn makes us tankier

[uneven mason]

and the SB uptime increase just overall put us in an amazing spot

[lusty grotto]

DC is the top trait by a margin, yes (this should be covered in the pins and in Marok's guide)

[uneven mason]

TBH I Just found myself pressing devastate a lot more

I didn't feel like my RPS increased at all

my "Potential" for RPS

increased

but effective was probably a gain of like 0.5RPS

[chrome wyvern]

Its nice to see actual prot trinkets in the new raid also

[oblique garnet]

Wait theres crit trinkets??

[lusty grotto]

there's only one BFD trinket that's decent defensively, from what i've seen

the rest are shit

[oblique garnet]

Idk if i will end up running defensive trinkets for progression

[lusty grotto]

sadly they did the whole half-potency shit for dps trinkets in BFD

[oblique garnet]

Need to spam alot of m+ at the start of s2

[lusty grotto]

for prot

throwback from legion

[chilly brook]

I’m surprised at how many people don’t find BrM fun

[prisma viper]

If I got a 385 shoulder with DC, and 385 chest with BoM, should I upgrade my 370 headpiece to random 385 today?

[chilly brook]

Maybe I’m just a weirdo

[lusty grotto]

i was so happy to see that not be the case in Uldir

[oblique garnet]

Griff i did a split run on my monk

Half way through the raid i realized i had my WW weapons on

[lusty grotto]

what's your main content @prisma viper BoM won't help you in uldir

[oblique garnet]

It made no difference

[chilly brook]

Lmao

[prisma viper]

M+ mainly

[chilly brook]

I mean it made a difference

[oblique garnet]

BoM is bis for m+

[lusty grotto]

ok then that sounds like a good combo

[chilly brook]

Pretty sure you wouldn’t have been able to use Blackout Strike

😜

[oblique garnet]

@prisma viper if you get 2nd BoM piece youre lucky

[lusty grotto]

if you're surviving your pulls then follow what Late is saying

otherwise more defensiveness is good

yes we know mastery has crit block value (and attack power)

[oblique garnet]

If you can survive this weeks pulls you can basically survive any pulls on non teeming weeks

[lusty grotto]

but honest to god, these people having problems with fort on sub 10s shouldn't be recommended BoM

[unique sonnet]

@chilly brook I think the main reason why I don’t find BrM fun was because knowing that I could just basically afk during a fight and not press any mitigation just made it feel bad

[final mist]

If they're having trouble at <10, a specific trait isn't the issue.

[lusty grotto]

true

[chrome wyvern]

Ran 11 atal last night, forgot about the two stealthed rogues in a pack at the bottom of the stairs, instantly ate shit when they chain stunlocked me gg :'c

[unique sonnet]

With the nerf they just brought to us though it feels better to actually press mitigation, but still. Our kit is great, but it’s missing something fun

[lusty grotto]

im having fun out-dpsing people

😉

and obviously not taking that much damage

[modern brook]

BrM is missing Black out combo baseline

[little summit]

prot is stupidly fun in comparison to the other tank specs

[unique sonnet]

True

[modern brook]

w/o BO brm is like brain dead

like how prot w/o am is like real dead

[unique sonnet]

I mean, all we did in legion with it is just hit harder with tiger palm for extra dps with the added stagger pause

[lusty grotto]

how dare you bull

[modern brook]

IDK AM is like a core factor of why i like WArrior; not even just prot

[lusty grotto]

hmm

i guess i haven't really thought about AM that way

[modern brook]

Its just a big feedback loop

the better i play, the better i play

[lusty grotto]

you're right though

[outer dew]

wdym

[chrome wyvern]

blizzard needs to give us bladestorm and let us use thunderclap while doing it imo

[outer dew]

you guys aren't playing ravager?

[lusty grotto]

[chilly brook]

I mean tbh BoC was only really used for the extra damage

[modern brook]

[oblique garnet]

Isnt next week necrotic?

[chilly brook]

Pausing stagger wasn’t all that useful outside of very specific encounters

[modern brook]

yes? I think so

[outer dew]

[oblique garnet]

Time to bust out

[modern brook]

RE: necrotic

[outer dew]

LMAO

it just clicked

thunderclap

is sense

[lusty grotto]

👢 🍵 👏 have we forgotten our bootyclapping?

[modern brook]

💣 🍑 👢 🍵 👏

for when u get 3 bastions of Mights

[lusty grotto]

bomb ass bootyclap?

fuck i meant peach

[outer dew]

NSFW

SAL

BAN HIS ASS

[modern brook]

wait no

:^(

I've done so much worse

[lusty grotto]

lol

[modern brook]

I MEAN UHHH

[outer dew]

[lusty grotto]

Are you reflecting the ass?

Wait no that's a ban reflect nuuuuu

[oblique garnet]

oh baby time to kill mythrax : )

[outer dew]

mythrax easy bby

[broken roost]

ravager 50% party

[outer dew]

<3

[oblique garnet]

it would be if we would have the same 20 people on every raid

Smh people having lives n shit

[chrome wyvern]

Its the holiday season

[outer dew]

what next

[chrome wyvern]

and people like to lie and say they are doing shit

[outer dew]

you expect them to raid during christmas

[oblique garnet]

16hrs raid on christmas??

EZ

[outer dew]

lmao

DAY RAIDING CHRISTMAS

SPLIT RAIDS

[oblique garnet]

oh christmas is on monday no raid anyways

Cant wait to kill ghuun so i can just do m+ till next tier

[dusk locust]

wow isn't hard b/c of the bosses, it's hard b/c of the roster

[supple path]

Yeah, WoW raiding is basically a lesson in "how long does it take for 20 people to not mess up any mechanics on the same pull" rather than pure individual difficulty.

[dusk locust]

if you can get the same 20 people on consistently it's done faster

that's the hard part

[supple path]

Well yeah, proper roster is the initial gatekeeping thing that keeps 'most' people out.

[dusk locust]

i'm on mythic g'huun and have had to shake up orb groups 3 nights in a row now

[supple path]

Oh yeah always a ton more fun on the "please bring x/y/z of a/b/c classes" fights.

[dusk locust]

sure is

"this fight will require 4 warlocks" recruits 6

[chrome wyvern]

See the biggest hurdle is always the one guy that is here only to have fun

[dusk locust]

he logs in most consistently though

[oblique garnet]

Im having fun doing progression tho

[chrome wyvern]

or the man who fights the tanks on the charts most of the time but supplies raid mats to half the guild who cant be bothered.

[oblique garnet]

As long as he does the mechanics correctly its all gucci

[supple path]

Oh man, low dps consumable guy is a staple.

[chrome wyvern]

survival hunter who doesnt understand he is a melee now and eats orbs on ghuun like candy

tbh i miss the days of having 15 hunters in a raid

[dusk locust]

low dps guy who shows up on time, consistently. good dps guy who can't do mechanics. good mechanics guy who can't do dps.

[lusty grotto]

oh boy

[supple path]

Weren't those also the days where only 1 hunter in 10 knew how to do their dps rotation?

[lusty grotto]

yup

[chrome wyvern]

dude it was the best

Hunters were hilarious

[lusty grotto]

remember when hunters pulled the whole instance with barrage

[supple path]

"BfA"?

[uneven mason]

"Sidewinders"

[chrome wyvern]

idk how many times one of their pets would bug out and do a entire tour of a raid before coming back to the group with alot of new friends

[lusty grotto]

tbf i haven't seen it too much lately

[supple path]

My first 8 groups with hunters were like, all in motherlode.

[lusty grotto]

isnt barrage MM only now or something idk

[supple path]

And they all used that stupid AE thing to aggro 4 extra packs

[uneven mason]

Sidewinders was Legions "laser matrix"

[lusty grotto]

lol sidewinders

[uneven mason]

it'd literally pull shit from like 100 yards away

and straight up

like those dragons in HoV

or Seagulls

after you explicitly SKIPPED the first boss so you could kill serpentus without the birds

erm 2nd boss*

[lusty grotto]

it's a good thing we have a WQ that we can rekt seagulls with

i do it to the the tune of that yoda song

jump jump jump

[chrome wyvern]

Hunters,Boomkins and Priests always managing to pull the entire boat in MoS

[uneven mason]

WAT STARFALL HAS A RADIUS?

I thought it just fucking hit everything in the zone

[lusty grotto]

jump jump -a turtle made it to the water- jump

yeah it does mac

[uneven mason]

Starfall though

[lusty grotto]

it's newish

[uneven mason]

the savior of all Mythic BRF kills

"What Balconies? Nah, just fucking Starfall

[lusty grotto]

people that didn't know how to land on rafters

[uneven mason]

FLAP

FLAP HARDER

[lusty grotto]

listen

it was totally doable without flap

[uneven mason]

But seriously

Boomkin could kill balconies

from the ground

so why bring any other DPS

besides hunters

and Boomkin

(which is what they did)

"Oh we made another 100% Melee unfriendly endboss? Nah see they had a rogue"

[chrome wyvern]

yo

last expac

having rogues saying they cant switch cause their class is single target only

[supple path]

I'll forever remember the rogue who told me he couldn't expose armor because while it increased his personal DPS, it increased other people's DPS by relatively more so he'd drop on the meters.

The class to me is forever that moment now.

[chrome wyvern]

lol

[lusty grotto]

Roflll

Now that's some dedication

[uneven mason]

I Had a pair of rogues who wouldn't TotT anyone but eachother

so I told the tanks to start letting them die

[lusty grotto]

Lol

[uneven mason]

back when it increased damage delt

[lusty grotto]

Yea I remember that

[uneven mason]

Cause I was fury at the time

and was getting sick of pulling aggro

Started tanking shortly after

they uh

spent a month on the bench

when I brought em back in, they TotT'd me

[dense pivot]

lol

[uneven mason]

everytime 😄

[chrome wyvern]

I miss gladiator.

[uneven mason]

😡

We literally have Gladiator built in

why u miss something that doesn't let you tank

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/148897941883584512/517901074724552705/unknown.png
Better than gladstance.

[chrome wyvern]

I miss when I would not be in gladiator at the start of a pull and rip threat instantly from the real tanks cause I was using the glad rotation

[uneven mason]

🤔

You'd have GLadiator as a non tank, but be in defensive stance

so you'd do no damage for the whole fight

[chrome wyvern]

hell yeah bro

just like post nerf gladiator 😉

I was getting ready for that nerf hammer

[uneven mason]

I was glad like the first week, because fury and arms were garbage

then

They nerfed glad

but didn't buff fury or arms for shit

Mained a resto shaman

for most of WoD

[chrome wyvern]

tbh I was glad for a long while and even went back to it at the end of expac when everything was farm

[uneven mason]

mostly because the mythic team needed a healer

[chrome wyvern]

it was a really fun spec

[uneven mason]

brought the warrior back when fury got fixed at the end of BRF

[chrome wyvern]

I think the reason gladiator was nerfed was druid tears

blizz saw their precious furries hurt and warriors having fun and had to fix it fast.

[cobalt star]

I haven't played for a while, but seeing people talk about glad stance is getting me excited, are there rumors of it's return?

[wispy ridge]

NO

[dense pivot]

just grandpas are getting nostalgic

[wispy ridge]

glad stance SUXS

S-U-C-K-S

[sick sentinel]

I just miss :heroicstrike:

[dense pivot]

on next melee swing Kappa

[cobalt star]

That's sad to hear

[sick sentinel]

yeah. miss having a use for my mousewheel as prot. 😦

[dense pivot]

lol

[daring marlin]

more like

[chrome wyvern]

bring back dps having to wait until I got my stacks of sunder on boss

[daring marlin]

s a d s t a n c e

[sick sentinel]

nah. waiting is dumb.

[daring marlin]

hella

[sick sentinel]

example:

waiting for Classic

is dumb

[gray wolf]

i need 1 of them to get a 385 instead of a 375

[chrome wyvern]

real dps pull for the tank and pop all CDs and aoe then wonder why the tank sucks

[gray wolf]

i'll take my chances on a random piece

should i 🤔

[dense pivot]

roolll hte bones

[sick sentinel]

I wouldn't.

RNG more RNG?

you're falling for activisions plan.

:jew:

[gray wolf]

why not

¯_(ツ)_/¯

[sick sentinel]

😬

[lusty grotto]

hold up

didnt you hear

glad stance was merged into prot

[plain ice]

which piece do you have DC on? @gray wolf

[lusty grotto]

it's called UF + BV + AM

[gray wolf]

helm

[plucky viper]

glad stance....those were fun days

[chrome wyvern]

yeah but people expect you to tank now, blizz should let us toggle threat gen so I can let the raid down again

[steady slate]

What should I do on heroic Vectis? I was getting hurt bad on the second stack, and wrecked if the other tank missed a taunt and I took a third.

[worthy dagger]

u should get the 385 random only if you dont have a 385 already

otherwise its not worth it

chances are you wont get a DC 385 but good luck

this week is a buttcheek btw, terrible

[uneven mason]

@steady slate do you have logs?

[steady slate]

@uneven mason I didn't think to run any

[uneven mason]

Does your guild run logs?

[steady slate]

no. it's super casual. a few of us take raiding a bit more seriously, and it's normally enough to drag everyone else over the finish line, but heroic vectis just broke us

i'm going to start running logs. it just seems pointless when the people who most need to make use of them are the least likely to look at them

[outer dew]

@steady slate how geared are you?

@steady slate how geared are you?

And what ilvl is your shi3ld?

[steady slate]

371. shield is 360ish. i'll link my character once i remember how to find the armory

https://worldofwarcraft.com/en-us/character/zuljin/Roaald

i got the jes' howler in my chest this week. made me happy

[outer dew]

hmm

ya really shouldn't be trucked that hard

are you keeping SB + IP up during the time you main tank?

[steady slate]

was it just me mismanaging IP then? i know it's hard to tell without logs.

[outer dew]

also

[uneven mason]

So, thiings that I've noticed on HC Vectis

[outer dew]

are you getting hit by blood geysers

• omega vectors/

if you get a stack damage ramps

[uneven mason]

1. You shouldn't be getting any stacks of lingering infection AT ALL

[outer dew]

reaaaaaaaaaaaaaal quick

lol

[steady slate]

yeah, i took some omega vectors and blood geysers

[outer dew]

yea

that's why you would get trucked

lol

[uneven mason]

2. Make sure your healers understand that Evolving is a DOT

[steady slate]

and I'm sure I dind't have shield block up as much as i should

[uneven mason]

and that means you need to be healed AFTER the other tank taunts

[outer dew]

SB should only be when MT

oh

i guess another thing that might help

[uneven mason]

3. Continue to use IP after the other tank taunts, but not SB

[outer dew]

if you're helping taking omega vector stacks

SR before it ends

so you don't get the debuff

[uneven mason]

they nerfed that Tofu

[steady slate]

oh!

[outer dew]

really?

BOOO

[uneven mason]

you get the stack now

yeah

RIP

[outer dew]

that's so lame

[uneven mason]

indeed

esp since my guild is working on Mythic vec this week

[outer dew]

i mean

you still should SR it

[uneven mason]

RIght

[steady slate]

if i get to tank heroic next week, i'll make sure to run logs

[outer dew]

just less cool

[uneven mason]

Well tanks should never have Omega

[outer dew]

lmao

[uneven mason]

and never get hit by beams

[outer dew]

oh

current guild

makes tanks help soak it

[uneven mason]

RIP

[outer dew]

but it's w.e

[steady slate]

should i be soaking the circles?

[outer dew]

I don't really struggle

yes

[uneven mason]

yeah thats fine

[outer dew]

100%

lol

[steady slate]

because i did that

[outer dew]

pop SR for the dot too

[uneven mason]

Basically make sure block is up 100% of the itme whne tanking him directly

Also, one tank should be taking 2 stacks

and the other tank should be taking 1 stack and the add

[outer dew]

tbf

i meme and take two stacks

[steady slate]

i'm gonna have gaps, can't keep it up 100%, but i can certainly do better

[outer dew]

3-4 stacks

on heroic

err

no you won't

lol

[uneven mason]

on heroic I solo tank him.

cause its meme

so much easier than mythic

[outer dew]

you'll have breaks in between

[uneven mason]

but thats @386

[outer dew]

when you're not actively tanking it

you should have 100% up time

lol

[steady slate]

wait... so we were both getting 2 stacks and pulling the add in, so whoever tanked the add had two stacks as well

[uneven mason]

right

[outer dew]

add tickles

whoever wins the lottery

[uneven mason]

well

[outer dew]

on getting the add

lmao

[uneven mason]

add doesn't tickle

if you're undergeared

and have shit healers

who don't understand how DoTs work

[steady slate]

and terrible dps

[outer dew]

372 isn't really undergeared for heroic

[uneven mason]

true

add should die before 2nd Immunosupression acast

if they're getting 2 off

[steady slate]

at one point, we had three of the stupid things up and both tanks were solo killing one of them

[uneven mason]

its PROBABLY not anything you're doing

uh

yeah thats not you

[narrow abyss]

Uh

[outer dew]

that's

where you call a wipe

lmao

[uneven mason]

thats your raid being complete shit

[narrow abyss]

Yeah...

[uneven mason]

ADD > Boss always

on every fight

[narrow abyss]

Nothing you can do about that one bud

[uneven mason]

Like Immunosupression is basically reducing your health

by making hte healers have to heal a lot harder

On mythic progression

its basically a wipe if they're getting 2 casts

because your DPS Is too low

[steady slate]

yeah, we had some umm... opportunities for improvement. i thought my RL was gonna reach through discord and start choking people

[outer dew]

¯_(ツ)_/¯

you're raiding at a certain level

where i'm not sure why you're surprised

[uneven mason]

😄

but seriously

get a logging addon

and download the warcraft logs uploader

and log that stuff

loggerhead

is a solid addon

[steady slate]

yeah, i just need to remember to /combatlog when i start raids

or get that

so in a nutshell, i need to get back in the habit of logging, convince my raid team that doing mechanics is OK, and make sure i'm using shield block better

[uneven mason]

run loggerhead it auto logs once you tell it to do a zone

but yeah can't really critique what you might be doing wrong without logs

[steady slate]

so it'll look at mythic+ as well?

[uneven mason]

but from the sound of things

it will if you tell it to

but yeah sound of things, not what you're doing

tanks are going to die (especially warriors) if they are letting adds cast Immunosupression

[steady slate]

vectis was awful, but the other fights went smooth. I basically took no damage on FD. Felt great

[uneven mason]

FD tickle fight now

[outer dew]

lol

get to Mythrax/Ghuun

[steady slate]

i hadn't tanked it on heroic before.

[uneven mason]

tempted to offtank him as fury next alt run

[outer dew]

he'll make you call for daddy

lmao

well

for mythic anyway

[uneven mason]

Mythrax is mean shit

even on HC

he hits like a truck dual wielding trucks

[outer dew]

it's better this week

[uneven mason]

a bit

[outer dew]

35k average damage of autos

vs last weeks

40k*

bless

[uneven mason]

that's better than he was doing

when I had 358ilvl during progression

he was slapping me for like 60k through block

[outer dew]

well

that's' about the average

well

normal hit

is like 60-80k

depending if you fuck up

lmao

[uneven mason]

I was like 🖕

oh fucking up just meant I was inside his hitbox

and he hit me in the back

and I died

cause 0 armor

adjusted that shit fast

More worried aout him and Zul

than I am about fetid

Fetid on mythic is 100% about how good your DPS are at not humping eachother

and being able to burst

his damage isn't impressive

[zinc mauve]

never turn around

i learn that lesson 3 times a week tbh

ive also been killed while heroic leaping away from enemies because they hit me from behind really quickly

[uneven mason]

I didn't turn around but his hitbox was so large, that his melee point would endup behidn me

literally bypass shield block

even though I was facing him in front

+++

[zinc mauve]

wait wtf

so like, where the circle on the ground is?

[uneven mason]

yeah, hasn't happened since week #1 tho

and yeah you never leap directly from standing

you start straifing for a step

then leap

so it considers you sideways

[lusty grotto]

haven't you guys heard of strafing back?

[uneven mason]

I got nailed in the back on mythic mother during prog

trying to make it to laser grid safe spot

they were like "LOL Macs corpse just slid through te air sideways"

then floated down

they stopped LOLing when she sanitizing down the entire safe area

Also my RL thinks its funny to call the wrong side of the room for laser grid

to see if the DHs are paying attention

(Its the only way he beats them in DPS)

[oblique garnet]

Woop woop the big bad mythrax is down !

[uneven mason]

nice

[weary nacelle]

hey guys, good day, may I ask what do you think about BiS trinkets for Raiding tanking.. pretty much single target boss fight - i guess that would be survivability?

I guess blockades still counts as n1, but what would u put as 2nd one?

I have doubts between 370 Rezan's gleaming eye and Know of Ancient fury 385, the new trinket

Str wise, sure the 385 is better. But do i choose Haste or Crit depending on these two trinkets

[oblique garnet]

Rezan Blockades for survivability

Or Rezan and the Know of ancient fury

[weary nacelle]

im currently wearing Rezan + blockades, but since i got Knots now, i wonder if i want to wear it for raiding instead any of the other two

[oblique garnet]

Im currently using syringe and gore

but if you feel the need for extra survivability just use blockades

[weary nacelle]

i do have syringe as well, but i was thinking that survivability wise rezan + blockdes should be better

but Knots looks nice as well, due to the high Str and the crit which would come as a nice parry chance

so im really having difficulties making the decision

[uneven mason]

at 385 you're going to start passing up the passive stam bonus from raw stats

the new trinket is pretty good

and yeah

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/148897941883584512/509789259822006272/unknown.png
CRIT IS NICE

[weary nacelle]

Thank you, sir, this is helpful

[zinc mauve]

mactier what trinket you talking about?

the crit use trinket from the new warfront?

[lusty grotto]

yeahhhhhh

i dont use knot because of parry chance

i use it to bootyclap to the stratosphere on details

i have it macro to "/i Time to show these DHs who's boss here"

forgot the "yeehaw" there

also forgot the "...GTFO WITH QUAKING NOOB"

[uneven mason]

DID SOMEONE SAY 👢 🍵 👏 https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/148897941883584512/517901074724552705/unknown.png

[lofty prawn]

So wait hold up. Does the shield block change mean 100% uptime on sb?

[fierce juniper]

You can get 100% effective Shield Block uptime or very very close depending on the fight and if you do it correctly, but no actual 100% Shield Block uptime isn't a thing. It's fairly close accounting for Bolster, but not 100%.

[lofty prawn]

But with taunt swaps and stuff

possible/

?

[fierce juniper]

Yeah, that's what 100% effective uptime is.

[prisma viper]

In most fights you will get 100% uptime ye, because of taunt swaps, and mechanics, boss casting long spells etc

[fierce juniper]

i.e. you block 100% of blockable attacks

[modern brook]

@lusty grotto u should macro thunderclap to /y yee and shield slam to /y haw

[uneven mason]

Infact with RA levels of haste and the reduced CD of SB

I was tripping over charges last night

like I'd look down and be like "did I press SB? yeah ok WA is up, wh ydo I have a charge still.."

[signal plover]

Yeah it's hella smooth in raid

[uneven mason]

a bit jarring to adjust tbh

same with IP off the GCD

[modern brook]

Rage management is the worst ofr me to get used to

[signal plover]

Also Poppin off IP on demand mmm baby

[modern brook]

with IP off gcd

[uneven mason]

yeah

[modern brook]

I'm like so used to burning with revenge

[signal plover]

U can starve way easier

If u mongo

[uneven mason]

I'm used to tapping IP because of those clutch timings where you need IP to be up with a split second to go after hitting DS and HERE COMES THE BOSS MECHANIC

starved myself on tuesday a few times

Taloc does noticeable damage when you don't have SB lets put it that way

[modern brook]

I havent played since tuesday, im realizing

[signal plover]

My thumb mouse button is the happiest it's been in BFA cuz it doesn't get pressed 30 times when I need IP up

[uneven mason]

I moved to my 12 button naga now

since I can do all sorts of neat macros

with IP off the GCD

DS + IP + SR 🖕 Zek

[signal plover]

Ya I use a scimitar

[scarlet vortex]

is engineering worth taking up now? for the helmet

[signal plover]

Like the Corsair mouse not the sword

[hoary viper]

How is meticulous scheming right now?

[signal plover]

I'd say no crafting proofs r rly worth taking compared to herb/alch

I still run BS cuz I'm stubborn but rly I shouldn't

[uneven mason]

Alch/Eng

sum sexy helms

[scarlet vortex]

is the helmet actually good? trait wise

[uneven mason]

vers stone

iirc it was

[scarlet vortex]

want to know 100% before i invest in lvling it :p

[sick sentinel]

with the deafencing crash nerf, stacking 3 pieces doesnt seem worth it anymore, anyone have a good/best combo of azerite traits?

[lusty grotto]

nobody stacked 3 DC

it was in the pins

you only needed ONE

it was in the icy veins guide too

[open bluff]

only reason to have more than one is if you somehow had them as your highest ilvl azerite

[lusty grotto]

well that's true

[sick sentinel]

sorry, for m+

[lusty grotto]

no

not even for m+

[open bluff]

but you really only needed 1 period even before the nerf

[sick sentinel]

all the other ones still seem meh in comparison

[open bluff]

brace for impact is 👍

[lusty grotto]

you probably had to do some ilvl sacrifice to get 3x DC

cause there's no high ilvl DC chest

that was really bad for you

[sick sentinel]

had 2x 390 dc

[lusty grotto]

you shouldn't have done that

there's nothing to gain from stacking DC

except a bit more Tclap damage