He's a lot more annoying to position and keep the slam away from the group if you have to actually hide behind the statue...I did it for a long time until I discovered the wave didn't scale.
#protection
fringe marten
lusty grotto
oh boy im finally exalted with all factions now, no more WQs wew
ugh nvm, alts
also my alliance rogue 😦
sand egret
just tank him on the edge then flip him post wave to aim follow up
fringe marten
And oddly enough Bladesong..'the' 'warrior' boss in M+ for us..is actually Elder Laexa, the first boss in underrot.
sand egret
i honestly had no idea it didnt scale and moved him everytime, no real problems here
daring marlin
lord stormsong
fringe marten
Yeah but you don't have to do ANY of that trash..you just eat the wave 'cause it's a joke.
sand egret
uh irs tree boo
fringe marten
Laexxa's reflects are even stronger. But yeah any boss where we get to abuse reflect is great. It takes some timing but you can nail that ? Rixxa Fireflame or whatever...that dot hurts her a lot. Also next to last boss in WCM.
No his 'real' mechanic is flooding the party with a bunch of aoe damage, and depending on affixes and key level that can get nasty (the tree)
lusty grotto
👀
round glade
plain ice
reflecting the adds after lord and lady waycrest.. feelsgoodman
fringe marten
Yeah, you just can't do it frequently enough...and they still maul your party/yourself.
oblique garnet
Reflecting the wasting strike on Lord Waycrest is even better
sand egret
if you’re saying a warrior boss needs reflect than lord/lady waycrest still wins
the blood bitch is, if anything, a dh/dk boss
fringe marten
The strongest reflects are on elder laexa and lord stormsong..you can literally see the chunks of their HP come off.
sand egret
well, a warrior’s key strength isnt SR
daring marlin
that was the topic at hand friend
sand egret
so, thats where I make my distinction
fringe marten
Yes and no...it's defintely not our biggest strength, it is however the only unique tool we offer.
fringe marten
I'll settle for the legion artifact trait where we reflected all spells during it's duration, rather than just one.
sand egret
so a fight where you literally block like nothing doesnt scream “warrior” to me
lusty grotto
that's reflective plating @fringe marten
supple path
Spell reflecting tons of damage into a boss's face is the closest we get to unique, desired utility yeah.
lusty grotto
i miss the gigantic nukes that you could reflect back
not that pansy spammable bs
make a 1Mil nuke please
supple path
Well that and the magical feeling of the last boss of underrot, wherein we victory rush forever and never say die.
fringe marten
OH lol..man I don't remember 90% of the names of those passive traits.
supple path
I want more debuffs to reflect, like that waycrest basement mob.
sand egret
rock lances can get into some grossly annoying nukes
supple path
I think I just want every dungeon to be underrot or waycrest.
fringe marten
Yeah, and in the same dungeon don't forget you can block the 'auto attack' of the final boss.
fringe marten
er
NOT block
Reflect
you can reflect the 'bomb shoot' or whatever the hell it's called..of the final boss in motherlode.
I legit hate that boss.
sand egret
ohhh ML, thought you were talkin bout WM
lusty grotto
reflecting masterminds in motherload is so good
fringe marten
Yeah, their HP flies down.
They aren't tough, they're just using the leech from Energy Lash to made themselves look tougher.
sand egret
leech globule leeches
perty sure lash doesnt
azerite empowerment also heals, so if you were on the 2x ill it coulda been that
pull*
fringe marten
I'm under the impression lash does. lemme check MDT
fringe marten
Yeah I was just reading it..maybe it's just the combination of azerite injection then
sand egret
most likely
that heals for % per second
and leech also will heal as it hits so it could be hitting stuff during a follow-up Lash
fringe marten
or the timing of it immediately after the leech glob...somehow had it in my head that part of energy lash was it also healed them.
Yeah that's what I'm thinking; so I had just thought lash was a leech+damage.
sand egret
newp, just a fire mindflay
fringe marten
But yeah, you can reflect the bomb shoot of the mech suits, and the last boss too.
hmm...I wonder if those will become blockable in 8.1? it's fire damage I thought so..shouldn't be.
Yeah it's not even a listed ability..it's just his auto attack I believe. It's not alpha cannon, or gatling gun, or homing missle.
Since it's just his auto attack it MAY be physical...meaning it'll be filtered by block in 8.1. which will be sick
shut summit
last boss of motherlode isnt physical
alpha cannon is what he shoots at you / what you can reflect
and wasnt blockable when i tested last on ptr
fringe marten
I thought alpha cannon was the red swirl that occurs on the ground in the second phase?
Is the attack he's using against the tank alpha cannon? then yeah it's fire and won't be blockable in 8.1
fringe marten
Drill smash I understand but there's red swirls on the ground during that phase...is that technically from the adds and just a different spell all together?
fringe marten
Yeah you just have to face the boss
shut summit
yea there are 2 swirls
sand egret
he spawns two swirls + adds then does his targeted shenanigans
fringe marten
Ah ok...then it's just alpha cannon we're reflecting, still has the animation of a little bomb though...same as the mech suits.
shut summit
still room for more as well cuz people interrupt randomly etc
ruby berry
Those are some pretty high numbers
cinder nova
TBH they make the weirdest shit blockable
oblique garnet
I even have my macroed mr sr to say that ts up and people still interrupt
fringe marten
Yeah even the group I play with, when I can...that I pushed with for a little...I'll tell them reflect is up and they'll still interrupt rock lance out of habit
cinder nova
Just make all non bleed phys blockable
sand egret
i want reflected spells to crit
cinder nova
Used to
fringe marten
Are you outputting those numbers from enemy damage take in Details...or literally making a text file of spells you reflect?
sand egret
like a 90k just sneaky by my combat text, hidden under some bullshit 10k crit
fringe marten
And just manually making a text file of it? That's what the screen shot was of.
sand egret
seems like it
fringe marten
Yeah our zonewide parses would be noticably higher if we had our reflected damage added in.
shut summit
yes
cinder nova
Why don't we
sand egret
if all party members could see the combat numbers for that SR...i bet a lot less people will interrupt it...
fringe marten
Actually I'm glad though
cinder nova
don't they get damage from kicks
fringe marten
If our reflect damage was added in, and pushed our overall damage even higher... People complain about what they SEE. The fact that it's pretty low key..but valuable, means no one really whines about it.
sand egret
just let em pop meta and twirl that fidget spinner
my guilty pleasure is laughing ay DHs who try and jump with Suds on and get stunned in FH
gets me everytime
fringe marten
We know it's there, the groups that run with prot warriors know how it works...everyone wins. You start SHOWING PEOPLE that we're reflecting some spells that are doing hundreds of thousands of damage.... the bitching starts.
cinder nova
The fact that blizzard doesn't detail what raid mechanics are blockable and reflectable irritates the piss out of me
sand egret
ya that’d be nice, but I totally see why they dont do it
cinder nova
Why
There's no benefit
It's not fun to find out what does and doesn't work, it's a chore.
We're gonna know eventually
Just get on with it and tell us.
fringe marten
It's one of the many reasons there's such huge discrepancies between well played prot warriors and bad ones. And since most players are bad to badly mediocre...it has the player base overselling how 'weak' protection warriors are.
lusty grotto
yeah i kind of agree with you there
fringe marten
We're ok..it takes a lot of work for us to be ok. And yes we don't have nearly the amazing toolkit some other classes have for M+, so we're a little behind as far as how far into the cutting edge curve of that content we can push.
oblique garnet
The guild i joined went from ”idk how can you do mythic content on prot” to ”man prot warriors are broken”
fringe marten
And no..we can't just take a ton of damage and stagger it out into a cleanly healable DoT, so we have to play a lot tighter with active mitigation..but we can still tank all the way through mythic uldir.
lusty grotto
figuring out whats blockable and reflectable is not an extension of skill, it should be built in somehow into the dungeon journal
sand egret
Tbh, this'll be like the 3rd time I've explained why one wouldn't want it in there/verbose details can be a detriment and I don't really wanna go down that road again
cinder nova
^
sand egret
it just ends in a bunch of yellin
lusty grotto
i missed this one blade
fringe marten
I rarely pug M+ keys, usually I'm with the same group of people I have on my contacts list...but every now and then I'll get bored and do one. You know literally half the time I pug a key I get "oh wow..I've never even SEEN a prot warrior tank yet this xpac"
random niche
Lol
lusty grotto
im still curious blade
fringe marten
To be fair nimpchip, they've never given verbose lists of exactly how each classes abilities interact with certain mechanics. that's WAY too much work..so it's to be expected.
cinder nova
How is it too much work?
sand egret
haha maybe later
cinder nova
It's literally writing on a page
sand egret
it just involves a lot of explaining of other systems
cinder nova
And they already programmed what does and doesn't work
sand egret
like ^ misunderstanding
oblique garnet
Tol dagor is pretty free this week if anyone is pushing keys
oblique garnet
Its not bad at all
cinder nova
You can't be seriously implying there's a nuance to setting a flag to say whether or not an ability can or can't be blocked
fringe marten
The dungeon journal is there to tell you what the mob can do...not how exactly your class will interact with it; that's on you to learn. The fact that they already break it into 'role' specific danger indicators and stuff is...already a lot.
sand egret
im not implying
oblique garnet
Since the adds die slowly and run away you rarely have to kite away to reset the necrotic
oblique garnet
Die fast*
fringe marten
No swole; there is time consumed in some person writing that into the journal for every class and encounter...that's why it's never happening.
sand egret
they do flee
oblique garnet
Having dk in there helps with the sanguine placement tho
sand egret
yeah I bet
and non Tyrannical makes the biggest gates not a problem
(people failing the last two)
oblique garnet
Yeah and the infested adds in there are a joke
fringe marten
in all the M+ I've done I've grouped with MAYBE one DK as dps....do they ALL just tank now?
cinder nova
If a small company like paizo can figure how to write HUNDREDS of Thousands of pages in books and rules to tell exactly that
And Blizzard can't
I think there's a way deeper issue
lusty grotto
blizzard is a small indie company
cinder nova
Lol
sand egret
@lusty grotto ☝ dis is why
fringe marten
The deeper issue is payroll, and work load.
cinder nova
I'm literally telling you a smaller company than blizzard can do and afford it.
sand egret
i'm literally telling you, you don't know what you're talking about
fringe marten
When I say payroll I don't mean 'lack of money' it's more like "ok this is what we want you focusing on, because this is what we want to be putting our resources into...Mr. or Mrs. Employee that doesn't get to decide what they 'wanna' do'
oblique garnet
I actually like grouping up with dk dps
sand egret
well, frost
cinder nova
It's data entry
oblique garnet
Since he can cover things on kr and on sanguine weeks
fringe marten
Right..do you think there's an employee that was hired just to do the dungeon journal...and was told "hey..fill it with ALL the info you want..and take as much time as you want"
sand egret
i mean, if you think that's all there is to it
then that's why I can't have this convo
lusty grotto
nothing is ever as simple as that
cinder nova
It's not- what fantasy land do you think people live in?
sand egret
as it literally involves me explaining how game dev works
uh
I work in a AAA studio
cinder nova
There's entire jobs just filling Excel sheets
sand egret
i literally do this every day
lusty grotto
i mean im a java dev, i understand
fringe marten
Legit I'm stunned the dungeon journal even EXISTS. I've played tons of mmo's over the time they've even really existed... most mmo's don't give you that much and feel you should have to experience, and learn the fight on your own.
lusty grotto
documentation is still part of a dev's work
lusty grotto
but documentation is strictly for other devs
sand egret
that is one facet
lusty grotto
not for end-users
keen spire
Is that gengar?
sand egret
yep
lusty grotto
like end user documentation is usually a very specific postion
sand egret
😃
oblique garnet
Wasnt dungeon journal added in like cata or smth?
keen spire
I'm going to the Anaheim VGC tourney in 2 weeks
oblique garnet
Or has it always been there
keen spire
You going, bladesong?
sand egret
I live on the east coast
lusty grotto
i play pokeman go
sand egret
so no 😃
cinder nova
So, tell me why they can't add this info. What functionally prohibits them from adding at the end of a spell effect in the journal
"This can be blocked."
keen spire
fosho
lusty grotto
do yall have mythics on gen 6? i need like mew and shit
sand egret
but I think ill be out there for GDC again this year
keen spire
I said the same fucking thing dude
lusty grotto
yo dudes i'ma link my living dex, help me out
cinder nova
I don't. Annoys the piss outta me.
Then tell me in a truncated fashion as possible why
@sand egret
lusty grotto
the bad part about it is that new players dont know how to handle shit, and thus makes our stigma worse
but i understand blade
fringe marten
Oddly, even if they included that level of detailed info on each fight...I don't think it would close the gap on who's playing warrior well or not, at all.
oblique garnet
Well yeah but newer players dont know any of the classes properly
cinder nova
Probably not, but I don't care about that.
sand egret
the shortest version is
oblique garnet
They dont know interrupts etc
sand egret
Tool Tips aren't for you
mr. i'm on discord and prob use sims
or know what those are
you know what shield block does
you know what LoS is
tooltips aren't written for you as a usuer
lusty grotto
i mean, we're not talking about people here
i'm pretty sure 99% of people that talk in this channel know these things
oblique garnet
There are people who still dont know the tactics for m0
fringe marten
People who want to put in the work to know what is reflectable, or exactly how certain fight mechanics work to exploit/conquer them.. have already done so; and have a working knowledge of it already. If you put that stuff in the journal...the people who didn't care to know already...probably aren't hitting the spell reflect ability~
sand egret
not to mention
cinder nova
If not, why include them at all?
sand egret
you have information that is completely irrelevant to like all but 2 sepcs
specs*
because including them does more harm than good
lusty grotto
i guess it could also be a bit of hand-holding
sand egret
they could literally list every data modifier a spell has
(assuming they have the hooks, dynamic UI scaling, one hell of a Loc team... etc.)
but then you get into information overload territory
lusty grotto
thats true as well
sand egret
the seasoned users wont use it anyway, as they have access to more robust data
the new users wont be able to parse it
so it comes down to
cinder nova
But I'm not asking for every flag
sand egret
you are
cinder nova
I'm asking for two
sand egret
because its more work
for the reasons I just described
why does a warlock need to know what spells can be blocked
fringe marten
^ that's what I was just saying....people who want that level of detail seek it out regardless. The game has a large and active enough community that people care to put the info out there. For those people who think LFR is tough...the journal is there.
sand egret
"how do I block this spell?" -clueless warlock
"wait I can use shields?"
"wtf why cant i use shields"
cinder nova
now, I don't know if you realize this. They already do this. They have spells and abilities, with tooltips, that dictate what can and cannot be mitigated. As well as, abilities that cannot be immunized
sand egret
im aware
cinder nova
And that information isn't relevant for all classes. So, with that in mind, why shouldn't it be blockable listed as a modifier in the spell
sand egret
because a far, far greater swath can do that
fringe marten
And the fact that they even detail them, and show you flags like "Enrage" so people know it can be soothed...is pretty insane.
sand egret
it's not impossible
as I've said, I know that they wont do it
because it isnt worth it
maybe if they get a dev gap during a given sprint, sure
maybe if they decide to do a whole tooltip revamp in a future patch, sure.
but assuming it's a minimal amount of work is silly
fringe marten
Hey man... You got a phone don't you?
sand egret
and somewhat offensive*
cinder nova
I think it is a minimal amount of work. I think the amount of effort required is something that isn't undertaken because they don't care to do it or it's not profitable enough. Not that it's difficult.
sand egret
bah, and I said I wouldn't get into it either!
cinder nova
The fact that they already have flags from Magic bleed curse and other things proves that it can be done and has been done with some regularity. to add one more to that list seems odd that it would be some level of insurmountable or enviable task as to prohibit entirely
sand egret
well, then i'm just gonna say that is not how things work, but you're entitled to your opinion.
fringe marten
Swole, you realize any time they add more info to tooltips..things like, what is displayed in the size of the tooltip comes up...does it work in 4k? does the spacing of the words work out right...and once we get it right; it has to be right in like 15 languages. Someone has to proof read it, make sure it's not getting patched in with a ton of typos and mistakes (and some of those still make it in)
And those are only small parts of that process.
cinder nova
I'm going to go out on a limb and assume tooltips are probably just text fields, using typefaces not rendered art or bitmaps
sand egret
lol
lusty grotto
to be fair we don't know
sand egret
what do you think the Dungeon Journal is?
cinder nova
Gui
sand egret
my buddy still gets PTSD when I mention "soul shards"
since he was part of the squad who ripped that shit out
lusty grotto
oh lol
sand egret
OG soul shards tho
lusty grotto
yeah i remember them
sand egret
so does Pepperidge Farms
blissful pebble
Which tanking role would we typically fill on Zul Mythic?
worthy dagger
prot + pally
prot wars spit on zuls face and piss all over him
and pally can just bubble himself and not die to stacks
wintry ermine
Crawg tanking imo
neon tangle
@blissful pebble depends on your co-tank really
neon tangle
Oh, I'll get there
Gotta bait them in first before explaining how DKs are better for tanking crawgs
long phoenix
can anyone explain how this mad lad is doing this?
it's not making sense to me, i'm seeing the last hit snipes for victory rush and such but the rest doesn't make sense
long phoenix
also looks like his ignore pain is actually doing something idk i just need more practice i guess
neon tangle
more mitigation == IP lasts longer
neon tangle
"really good play" is definitely a lot of it
boost is silly, and does all kinds of silly shit
soft kindle
Quite the silly lad
long phoenix
yeah, i need to do more research and practice to even come close to that
neon tangle
I'd prolly watch sense more 😛
I mainly see boost when it's related to weird padding / achieves
long phoenix
yeah i have been watching both of their video's
really made me want to hop back on my warrior
chilly brook
Well officially ended my sub today 😦
ocean acorn
RIP Griff
ocean acorn
LOL
oblique garnet
Probably wants a free boost
oblique garnet
I like running like lower keys for a warm up if im doing pug runs
sand egret
and mentally get in the zone
gotta have an iron will to stare down Trevor on the other end of that bridge and not flinch
oblique garnet
Nah if you run like a 6+ key at this point you are mentally prepared for the puglife when you do 14+ because the pugs are doing the same things
Also i want the freehold mount so running it on a lower key is ezpz
oblique garnet
Who the fk is trevor
sand egret
You know.
surreal stump
so mythic zul is fun
outer dew
lmao
some bad dps in this group
i'm keeping up some of them
lmao
fml
200k below 2-3 of my dps on zul
zzz
bold gale
Hi i'm tanking fetid now. do you guys have any tips for accepting death?
bold gale
Will do! thanks 😃
surreal stump
block block, last stand block block. demo ava spam ip and if geared enough hes only dangerous when enraged lol
bold gale
"if geared enough" sorry i'm not 400 yet
bold gale
I'm jk
outer dew
i didn't feel scared
bold gale
is demo + IP enough?
soft kindle
don't waste a block when he's about to stomp or breath
bold gale
I use a 2h sorry
soft kindle
I will literally IP your butt
soft kindle
I'm assuming you're main tanking it right
bold gale
no i'm tanking thrash
bold gale
dk
bold gale
are they? I guess I could see it with the blood shield
soft kindle
before 50% a good+geared bdk doesn't need a healer
tanking thrash
below 50% he only needs a healer to top him after double DS
prot's probably the second best mt for fetid
mitigate so much heckin damage
bold gale
okay we're switching lol.
if I do take thrash, is it possible for me to use 1 shield block for 2 thrashes?
steel mauve
no
soft kindle
Negative
bold gale
without heavy repurcussions
soft kindle
I think there could be an argument for HR being decent as thrash tank for a mongo who's learning, but AM build probably still overall better for it
bold gale
but it's so clossseeeee
steel mauve
thrash is at least every 6 seconds, and a lot of the time its longer because of the priority of thrash
HR isntt ever worth losing AM even for thrash on fetid
steel mauve
zat minimum thrash has 6 seconds between em, and nearly up to 20 seconds
bold gale
oh dear god this is SO much easier
soft kindle
Yarp
bold gale
is it worth repositioning the boss after he runs back from the adds or do you guys just keep him where he runs back?
soft kindle
as long as you're smart about it, usually worth to reposition methinks
No huge movements, but yeah
and if you and your dk can handle moving for masses, that's usually a plus
bold gale
sounds reasonable thanks for the tips
lusty grotto
please never mention HR
oblique garnet
Being the ot on fetid isnt fun when below 50% the hits do over 150k through block
lusty grotto
i dont know
that sounds easy to me
easy to grab my toes and wait for it
late dont dissapoint
waxen cradle
Nothing like grabbing your ankles and telling Fetid to give it to ya
surreal stump
i did the thrash, was fun, till the nerf and our dps pushed him to 50% before i even noticed lol
lusty grotto
grabbing your ankles is super fun 500IQ strat
astral crystal
nah we're past that
we're on the second big add before the second lasor
trying to tighten it up so tanks dont get murdered
before the third lasor i mean
next goblet
hey guys i have like nobody to play wow with anymore, guildies are never on unless its raid time, any discords where i can find people to play with? whether its raid, do M+ or pvp
uneven mason
I mean...mythic plus friends I think is a thing
There is a link in #148872210742771712
north bloom
iron fortress or archives for 2 stack of archives?
sick sentinel
the meme for some weeks was that I was "6inches short" each time
zinc mauve
@next goblet worst case scenario, find some randos and pug with them, maybe join another guild
merry bane
I have like 4 guild I do stuff with lol. great thing abotu cross realm
next goblet
yeah my builds just inactive lol
fast kiln
find some randoms he said 
rocky light
Hello, i am new too warrior and i wonder what you guys think about the buff in 8.1? Is it huge or is it only good?
ionic fern
Check the pins.
rocky light
I did but i wonder what other ppl think. But thanks .:)
soft kindle
Think prot looks a lot more enjoyable
outer dew
My app to trial at a guild is on the pretense that prot warrior will be good in 8.1
Lmao
lilac hawk
@rocky light prot will always be crap in the eyes of misguided plebs that blames everything except themselves.
soft kindle
tbf, before any buffs, it was a rough start
lilac hawk
Tru but still doable. Always been the funniest to tank with. No spells ang magical shit. Only me shield and armour
outer dew
@soft kindle oh in your opinion, if a guild is willing to trial you that's 8/8M US alliance for a tanking role. Do you take it?
Debating if I wanna move off sarg
Because if trial works out I gotta move off to KT qq
outer dew
5/8
outer dew
Low 500's
soft kindle
Yeah, go for it
if they're asshats, tell em to fuck off and find a better guild
but if you want faster or harder prog, only way to go is up
outer dew
This is true
At least cross realm is up ATM
Means I can trial without moving
If they're assholes it's not a terrible loss for me
soft kindle
he's making a decent case for HR that interests me, and I know it's still taboo to mention the talent but Darkee made it
and I know Darkee, and he's pretty fuckin good
outer dew
And is he arguing in general, for raids, or m+?
outer dew
I mean
I wouldn't see it as bad
But losing up time on demo shout Doesnt seem too fun imo
soft kindle
I don't think I can clip it
can I link the vod
actually, fuck it, yeah here https://www.twitch.tv/videos/342511760
4:52:25
zinc mauve
his argument is essentially with the talents that were taken, there are 0 gaps in mitigation (blocking) for tanking thrashes, which does indeed help with tanking fetid
junior igloo
@soft kindle
Shield Block duration is 6s, the time between Thrashes is 6s.
That means that you can only block 1 with a single SB.
With HR, you can block 2 every time, so it literally doubles the value of Shield Block, we have talked about it in this channel a few times.
soft kindle
I've only seen it talked about twice, and both turned into well
junior igloo
Having the option of taking advantage of these situations without sacrificing the insane synergy of Anger Management and Bolster/BV/UF is the reason we wanted the talents fixed
soft kindle
shouting matches, via text
I also don't frequent protection as much ,so I probably missed it
zinc mauve
the prot warrior he pointed out in taht video took impending victory instead of punish which is somewhat surprising to me
soft kindle
Aye, that surprised me
and he's saying that he was "supposed" to take devastator but forgot to switch it
zinc mauve
devastator is amazing for Single target
soft kindle
Darkee is normally really fuckin good, so I trust what he's thinking
zinc mauve
err not amazing, but best
outer dew
I mean, I can see the logic behind it
junior igloo
Well Devastator is strong for dps.
The value of BV drops a lot if you don't have AM
outer dew
But its for a niche situation isn't it?
soft kindle
Yeah this is simply just for thrash tanking
which you'd normally not do as prot, because we're so fuckin strong at main tanking it
junior igloo
I have suggested a few times that moving BV, Bolster and UF to the same row would break the synergy of taking all those talents and it would make different builds more competitive (obviously it is given that some baseline buffs would be given to compensate)
zinc mauve
without buffs in tandem to that change, rip warrior in mythics
just gimme my r a v a g e r buffs
outer dew
Lmao
junior igloo
Sadly Blizzard chickened out and decided to not make any changes or changes to mastery and only gave the passive buffs to vanguard + IP off GCD (which realistically means a little bit more dps and rage generation).
They are good changes that address our immediate issues, but the design changes would be better long term
soft kindle
now my question leads to, would this build be suggestible to someone asking for advise on thrash tanking, or would the standard set up still be the go to for most.
going off the assumption that someone progging fetid right now might not be the bestest of tankers
zinc mauve
if you are progging, it would be worth considering what is best for yourself, otherwise, you can tank with either
junior igloo
I'd honestly suggest that they main tank instead
soft kindle
well aye of course
outer dew
There's less management of CD's and the tempo
soft kindle
I had a guy in here who came asking for advice on it switch because he was thrash tanking and he had a bdk main tanking
zinc mauve
my feeble warrior brain cannot handle a change in playstyle. years of getting crit over the head has made my mind weak
soft kindle
but if they are thrash tanking for w/e reason, what you think
junior igloo
It's just so much simpler to main tank on mitigation tanks (paladin, warrior) and off-tank on EHP tanks (monk, DK).
Sure, you will take more damage overall that way (so it was not advisable very early on), but with sufficient gear on healers I'd rather take 10-20 % more tank damage and have a tank with permanent 300k hp + permanent mitigation always survive Thrashes without having to time anything
outer dew
Yes, but you know how stubborn some raid leads are
Where they believe that their way is the best way
I think the idea is if you're pigeonholed into having to perform this role for your raid
Would HR be a good idea to reduce the burden upon himself and perform
soft kindle
Yar
junior igloo
Playing HR means that you have to time your Shield Blocks well to block 2 Thrashes with 1 cast.
It's similar to monks timing ISB to stagger 2 Thrashes with 1 cast (ISB has 7s duration). When I looked at logs, almost noone is doing that. All the monks just play standard full up-time on ISB
soft kindle
So you think, for most
just stick with BV+AM build
for simplicity and easiness' sake
That seems fair enough to me
junior igloo
That I don't know. It really depends.
If you are good enough to understand why HR is good on that fight and how to take advantage, you can do it.
Not that many players still progressing Fetid go deep enough with their research I'm afraid. My alt group has killed Fetid 3 weeks ago and most people there aren't active on class discords I think
soft kindle
I'm not trying to badger you mate, just like talking about this stuff
zinc mauve
im somewhat active but i wouldnt be able to suggest balance changes to save my life, id leave it to the pros
but i will complain about intercept though
zinc mauve
prot warrior seems pretty good
soft kindle
Probably pally tbh
or if you want to go the total flip flop, dk
go from pure mitigation to pure healing
zinc mauve
i wouldnt be able to play any other class than warrior, im too used to just smashing buttons as fast as possible
outer dew
Hmm real woes
soft kindle
You'd love fury haha
outer dew
I don't feel like the other tanks ATM feel as intuitive to me as a warrior ATM
zinc mauve
so much faster
outer dew
Warrior feels natural to me vs messing around with other tanks
outer dew
Was memeing about with pala/do/monk
And it just didn't feel intuitive to me anymore
QW
Dk*
zinc mauve
live the underdog life
soft kindle
especially if they decide to have some form of replacement for RoA
outer dew
They believe prot is gonna be important for prog
- want to look for a new tank since theirs bounced after CE
ionic fern
I haven't checked the fights yet..are they melee heavy?
tight tree
My guild will not let me swap from BM now, after i saved so much time and gold by resetting bosses with port when wipe is called. They legit mad at me when i forget to put port down lmao
Fingers crossed for warrior to be OP in new raid, not going to happen tho
sick sentinel
Our MWm does it for us
tight tree
We dont have ;/ And no WW as well. I am only source of monk buff for raid.
sick sentinel
Then rip
I don't feel like raiding (I raid as fury) without a monk in the group tbh
sick sentinel
If you are EU and horde, check #promotion , we are attempting a Warrior ONLY HC Uldir
The bigger the dick, the better
It's gonna be glorious
steady slate
good morning! i could use some advice on how to handle the affixes this week in WM and UR. i tanked a WM8 last night and we completed it, but had 43 deaths and obviously blew through the timer.
for reference, here's my character profile. i logged out after we finished, so this setup is what i tanked in. https://worldofwarcraft.com/en-us/character/zuljin/Roaald
dire wyvern
If you specifically have trouble with the affixes then you should look to kite early and often along with coordinating/utilising things like DH stun or monk ring etc
Sanguine shouldnt cause any deaths, only make things slower
ionic fern
WM is a horrible place this week with the narrow corridors for sanguine. Especially the corridor around the pig boss..all the slugs stacking necrotic..dropping sanguine..infesting people.
steady slate
that's where we had most of our deaths
dire wyvern
Yeh move into the court yard if thats possible or just take those thin corridors slowly
steady slate
once we cleared piggie, it was a bit easier, but i still never felt like i was doing it right
tree boss was a joke
how long do sanguine puddles last?
i was handicapped a bit by my hunter, who was "helping" me by misdirecting almost every time i had to leap out and kite
normally i appreciate a hunter who remembers that misdirect is still a real thing
ionic fern
Atleast you diddn't have a druid healer who used Vortex to pull all the mobs back to Sanguine after i was trying to kite them out of it. 🤷
dire wyvern
lol
steady slate
lol no, i didn't have that. my restro druid was too busy trying to spam heals on me
dire wyvern
what was your comp?
steady slate
how many stacks of necrotic should i start thinking of kiting? i was going with 20, although at the beginning it was more. comp was me, resto druid, hunter (i think mm), demo lock, frost mage
dire wyvern
must have had trouble with witches with that comp, so many free casts
steady slate
everyone was on disc. lock was using mass stun along with my shockwave when i needed to kite, but there were plenty of spots where kiting seemed impossible due to sanguine pools
we lusted and burned. witches hurt, but died relatively quickly. bosses went smooth, but trash was a bitch
dire wyvern
yeh small witch trash i meant
steady slate
oh. yeah those things are awful
tight tree
Drag mobs along the wall for sanguine, get WA for necro stacks and kite to reset when high. Its annoying but not that bad usually.
steady slate
didn't have a wa for necro. i just got in the habit of checking my debuff. will definitely make one
sounds like my problem is just a L2P issue, which can be corrected.
tight tree
20 stacks of necro is too high imo, it depends of healer/gear also. I usually develop feeling for it pretty soon after i start run, then pull/kite accordingly. Big packs with lot of small mobs will stack necro really fast, so may worth get some threat fast then nope tf away and kite while DPS murder them.
tight tree
But i am not very good at m+ myself tbh, affixes just annoy me. I dont get why it is fun and typically only run m+ when guildies need help or for weekly. In UR , tank him in the alcove towards the wall so all worms he spit will be confined in small space.
When he tantrums, yeall at your group to stomp them all asap. Stomp skill > DPS on this boss 😉
lusty grotto
second boss should go down quick, its fort week not tyr
position him near rib cage
have group stand between him and rib cage
if your dps doesn't help when he runs around, you will be fucked sure
he shouldn't live long enough for a 2nd running around phase
group stands between rib cage and him so that he charges and stays in the same spot
UR is a joke this week, you shouldn't have problems
@steady slate
astral crystal
also helpful to call for your group to spread out before tantrum
so everyone has more or less an area they can cover
lusty grotto
yup
ionic fern
Just a heads up..if you're tanking him in near the rib cage ..Make sure you have enough room to get away from Indigestion to avoid the damage & avoid the ticks from getting thrown into the cage itself where people can't get to them before they spawn.
lusty grotto
i mean you tank him facing away from ribcage
the rest of the group is between cage and him
he shouldn't vomit towards rib cage
ionic fern
Misread, mb. 😉
astral crystal
you cant dodge indigestion damg
ionic fern
You can "dodge" it just by taking like 2 steps back.
Outrange it would be a better word i guess since all you do is when he locks onto you to cast it..you just step back and it won't reach you.
lusty grotto
hehehehheeheheheheheh
next goblet
anyone else get lag on a FP when flying over zuldazar?
next goblet
its only on FPs.. nothing else lol
lusty grotto
🤷
drowsy geode
Hello everyone, quick question that i cant seem to find up to date information on, i had seen there was a change to block (back in Beta) but not what it had changed, snice i've been playing DPS i havent had to worry about it, anyone know what the change was from Legion to BFA to do with it? i had heard that the more armor you had the less effect Block had
drowsy geode
thank god
lusty grotto
armor has no effect on block or viceversa
drowsy geode
So when I block now do I reduce the damage done by whatever my Shield's Block value is or is it a flat % that I block?
sand egret
your SB value gives you a % reduction to a hit it its blocked (and double that, up to 85%, on a crit block).
that value is found on shield and some traits
sand egret
not talkin bout the skill
lusty grotto
well i'm not sure if hes talking about SB though
he said "when i block" so
it could be either, or
sand egret
yes, when you get hit that hit is:
checked for if it will block (100% when SB the skill is up) and the amount is determined via yhe Shield Block rating (% reduction listed in your char sheet)
found on shields and traits
that block has a % chance crit (double the % reduction per block)
which is based on Mastery
lusty grotto
and passive blocking is a chance based on mastery as well
i.e. without SB or Bolster
sand egret
yes thats the other part of mastery
lusty grotto
the part nobody really cares about lol
drowsy geode
So if I block without it being a crit block it'll be reduced by whatever my Shield's Block Value is and that is double on a Crit Block
lusty grotto
no
it will not be reduced by your shield block value
its a % of damage reduction
not a specific number
otherwise it would be fucking terrible
sand egret
the value, like haste on gear, translates to a %
so just dont think its a flat reduction of the ~ 4,000 on your shield
drowsy geode
I think that's what may be confusing me then, because my tooltip is saying I'll block 3000% of a hit on a block
lusty grotto
be careful of some addons
that don't have formulas updated for BFA
i'm at work so i can't check my char
but is this a default ui tooltip?
drowsy geode
It's an addon
lusty grotto
🤔
sand egret
it you look at the basic ui, the “Block” stat shows you the % reduction. Double that (up to 85%) for a crit block (the chance determined by your mastery)
drowsy geode
I haven't changed much since Legion so that'll be what's gone wrong
lusty grotto
yeah... you might wanna check for updates in the ole twitch
i'm pretty sure the formula for Block dr is the same as armor
so like DR = Block Amount / (Block Amount * K value) - block amount not value
lusty grotto
due to difficulty
but wait, i thought the K-value was the same for both armor and block
or is it different?
hmm 🤔
still that formula could give you want you need, just make sure you're using the total block amount @drowsy geode
i can't find the goddamn list of K-values i had saved
drowsy geode
Cheers guys, it's appreciated
final mist
@lusty grotto k-value is the same for both armor and Block, and scales throughout different difficulties.
Ex. K-value for LFR Uldir is less than Mythic Uldir.
lusty grotto
yeah i know the difficulty part
final mist
Dungeons have their own K-value.
final mist
K-values are the same for both armor and block though.
lusty grotto
hmm interesting
i had a site with k-values listed but i can't find it anymore, is there a go-to site?
vocal nimbus
Base: 6300
M/M+: 7100.1
Uldir-normal: 7736.4
Uldir-heroc: 8467.2
Uldir-mythic: 9311.4
armour DR = armour / (armour + k)
vocal nimbus
K for m+ is the same for every level as far as i know
lusty grotto
right
vocal nimbus
But not all of them right?
lusty grotto
How do people find those out? Lots of parses off ptr or something?
I'm guessing just solve for k on a block
vocal nimbus
Just reverse math
lusty grotto
Or just solve for k on a non block on armor
final mist
They can be datamined and such as well.
We have all of 8.1's K-values, except for M+. Still undetermined on that.
lusty grotto
Cool
vocal nimbus
Also Sal, wanted to ask you about the mastery rework rumours
lusty grotto
Was it an overall increase?
final mist
Rumours are rumors until they're proven true or false.
Also, there's a famous quote from Abraham Lincoln#
"Everything on the internet you read is true."
vocal nimbus
I wasn't following news with much attention
final mist
And yeah, K-values increase higher than what you see now.
vocal nimbus
Just curious if anything new came up from blizz
final mist
It was most likely just a tooltip error that slipped through to PTR.
sand egret
I bet someone clipped the string in the text file or it was clipped via some automated thing by accident
lusty grotto
Wasn't it something due to leveling? Something I heard about
modern brook
What are thoughts on the IS Azerite trait?
projected to be* worth running 1 since we dont have any traits we really want to stack?
lunar siren
I've got to tank Mythic zek for my guild later as our tank is going to be a bit late, and dont really play Prot in BFA much, are either Void lash or Shatter blockable, or reflectable?
steel mauve
Reflect lowers the dmg of lash, always block shatter
daring marlin
and you should
lunar siren
Will reflect stop the healing debuff?
lusty grotto
what in the f
steel mauve
No it wont
daring marlin
Pool rage for when the combo is coming for IP as well and you shouldn’t drop below 70%
lusty grotto
what is this intim shout trait lol
lunar siren
Cool, ty guys
uneven mason
Justice- The prot paladin that thought having you tank on your warrior would become an issue, getting slaughtered over and over by our first night pulling Fetid on Mythic...while your health hardly budges, thrash or white hits...tanking about having the BDK step in for the paladin this time +++
lusty grotto
did you talk shit, i hope you talked shit to him
uneven mason
I mentioned that the cushions for the bench are over 👉
lusty grotto
"so hey i thought i was gonna become an issue...."
lusty grotto
lol
uneven mason
Like
he's eating externals up like pez and just flat out dies once they run out
I wish he wasn't though
I wish he was as strong as paladins were supposed to be
lusty grotto
is he sera?
uneven mason
but you can't "self heal" through getting 1 shot
lusty grotto
LOL
uneven mason
I mean he's even immuning
lusty grotto
jesus he needs externals with GoAK and AD?
uneven mason
I dunno still, just first night
lusty grotto
and BoP/LoH
lusty grotto
does he have SotR up lol
lusty grotto
uhhhh... hmm
uneven mason
yeah
lusty grotto
maybe have him go blessed hammer
lusty grotto
i mean sotr is kinda fucking good for magic damage with holy shield
should be inconsistent otherwise it would be broken
but yeah sotr isn't like SB
still haste is king for them
i haven't done a lot of Prot Pally in bfa
but i suppose they could cover gaps with AD/LotP
uneven mason
yeah I'll figure something out
lusty grotto
its block value after all
astral crystal
yes, you cover gaps with lotp basically
lusty grotto
err chance sorry
astral crystal
sotr sotr lotp sotr
lusty grotto
blessed hammer might be best there
uneven mason
lotr is a heal tho right?
lusty grotto
yes
uneven mason
Can't heal being 1 shot
astral crystal
yes, you use it when you dip as low as possible
uneven mason
😉
lusty grotto
shield of the righteous is the SB "equivalent" kinda of, Light or Hand of the Protector is the heal - which is analogous to IP i guess or at least closest to it.
anyway back to warries
😄
merry elbow
Any thoughts on Never Surrender, Vengeance and Heavy Repercussions in 8.1?
uneven mason
Yes : DUmpster fire, burning dogshit, and AM is way too strong.
uneven mason
Longer winded response, NS is bad because it doesn’t scale enough to matter, if you’re low enough that it makes a substantial impact, it isn’t going to save you anyway, Bolster is also insanely strong by itself, then add the synergy with AM.
Vengeance still isn’t going to help, in DPS or RPS because you’re going to be casting Revenge when its free, and BV is still going to be higher RPS/DPS in pretty much all situations and reducing rage spent has the reverse effect due to our interaction with AM.
Heavy Repercussions isn’t BAD (Unlike ravager) but AM is synergistic with every aspect of our class.
merry elbow
Thanks for the response. Was hoping 8.1 would free up talent choices ☹
wintry ermine
if anything the new azerite trait made AM even better in 8.1
uneven mason
So in short, NS Is just bad, Vengeance doesn’t actually do anything for us (bad), and HR just competes with the best talent ever created
merry elbow
How so snorri?
wintry ermine
because the azerite trait is tied to avatar, and AM gives you more avatars
primal crypt
in 8.1 you can spam avatar with TC
TC - Ava - TC - Ava - TC
So you just walk around as a huge bronze statue all day
primal crypt
Yas.
pearl dew
Can be a true king of the mountain as a Highmountain tauren
lusty grotto
no you can't because mountain kings are dwarves
you'd be a tauren chieftain 😃
warrior: the only class in wow with 3 hero classes
in wc3
(somehow still below the two hero classes)
so everytime someone goes "BUT DHs AND DKs are supposed to be OP because they are hero classes in wc3!!", you should go: "bitch, we're mountain kings, tauren chieftains and blademasters"
uneven mason
New Warrior CC
Caber Pin
You throw your tree totem and pin a NPC under it for 20 s
sick sentinel
Perma Mountain King hell ya.
lusty grotto
christ i hate slow days at work
plain ice
that's what skyhold is for bro
lusty grotto
yes lets do that
oh hey
where has catfriend been
i havent seen her say anything in a while
where have you been @junior ivy
plain ice
me neither
tulip matrix
Any protection warriors that stream besides Sense?
ember arrow
Merek does sometimes
tulip matrix
Got a link for merek's twitch?
prisma crane
if prot was still fun, @junior ivy would def still be playing 🔥
lusty grotto
have you heard of Boost
junior ivy
Haha I dunno tbh
junior ivy
Getting up at 7 every day just makes me not wanna play lol
prisma crane
yea, i'm enjoying other things as well, though i still log in to raid
keen spire
Oh yes.
tulip matrix
@lusty grotto got a link for boost? Can't seem to find
lusty grotto
tulip matrix
Ty
lusty grotto
For limit you wanna watch maximum
tulip matrix
Most of them are mythic tank warriors 😦
tulip matrix
Think sense is only M+ streamer
lusty grotto
Boost
sand egret
they do M+
tulip matrix
Boost plays arms or other tank, not prot judging from vod
lusty grotto
No
sand egret
oh he definitely does Prot, i've watched him run M+ a few times
lusty grotto
You're so wrong
tulip matrix
Found a marok vod with m+ 😮
lusty grotto
Uhh what
lusty grotto
yes
but "talents that gave healing and stuff" isn't accurate
orbs die in 1 ss -> gives you victory rush
no talents needed
oblique garnet
@outer dew Btw i got a push group going this week so im getting a headstart 😉
lusty grotto
i might start streaming soon too, since i upgraded my net
i should have the upload for it now
plain ice
i'm wondering if there'd be an audience for a mere 1300 IO m+ pleb prot warrior stream
lusty grotto
If you want to learn by watching a video just watch Griff's
tulip matrix
Griff?
lusty grotto
@chilly brook
tulip matrix
Ty
lusty grotto
He has a YouTube video that might be helpful
lusty grotto
Plugging you in
tulip matrix
Watching it right now 😃
sick sentinel
it's very good
chilly brook
unfortunately probably won't see one for 8.1 😦
lusty grotto
To be fair not a lot will change for 8.1
chilly brook
Well what I meant is there won't be one until they can generate content that is designed to make someone want to play for x amount of time instead of have to play x amount of hours
tulip matrix
Anyone able to tell me which is better: Tidal surge or Reinforced plating. Only 2 options I got on my helm.
chilly brook
Should have a section on those in the video
lusty grotto
Spoiler: tidal surge is crap
tulip matrix
Ok yea so it's reinforced plating, even though it's the lowest tier talent
lusty grotto
^
tulip matrix
k
scarlet vortex
what is it that makes warrior so op in the new raid? i heard most guilds will be taking 2?
cinder nova
??? who told you that.
fickle citrus
yeah if you have info provide sources
dusk locust
he said guilds are gearing them just in case
fickle citrus
"I heard" implys sources
scarlet vortex
ah, kk kauda
dusk locust
i imagine most will still use brew on bleeding edge prog
neon tangle
Their main people are all 385, might as well have backups