protection

[hushed cobalt]

Mini-mega zul boss in KR is funny on fortified

[uneven mason]

You mean "infuriating"

actually I'll admit

[sand egret]

i'm like well, we're not wiping so suck it up there snowflake. you're wearing plate for a reason

[uneven mason]

I got to DPS a KR 9 the other night

[sand egret]

and you're going to keep taking that bleed

[uneven mason]

and this Bear druid who had been talking shit about prot warriors

got melted in like 5 seconds

NOT SO EASY IZZIT

[sand egret]

lol how?

[uneven mason]

Zul

on fortified

[hushed cobalt]

My SB and IP are next to each other and I pressed SB by mistake and that was embarrassing

[sand egret]

yeah it was more of a jest that Bear actually doesn't have that particular guy that bad imho

[uneven mason]

right

I know

[sand egret]

esp if you can shift > Swiftmend > Shift during the cast time

😃

[uneven mason]

I got to co tank real Zul HC lastnight wit hthat same bear

there is a reason why I take 4 stacks

because he was dying at 2

[sand egret]

sounds like you got a real Yogi on your squad

[uneven mason]

Yeah he wants my mythic tank slot

I have a secret though

if they're like "Yeah warrior isn't working, we'll bring the bear"

[sand egret]

annnnd add this to: Reasons Blade Doesn't Do Raiding

[uneven mason]

I have a 364 Bear on deck

[median jolt]

Zul is a nightmare for monks because you cant stagger it and you have naturally very low armor

[hushed cobalt]

Oooo what if you could block bleeds on application and have it do reduced damage for the duration.
"Sure it stabbed you but it didn't stab you that hard"

[median jolt]

We take 4 stacks on mythic and bop it off but those few seconds after i take 4th is buttclenching

[hushed cobalt]

On that note is there anything else new about prot mastery? I read it might get changed or something and got intrigued

[oblique garnet]

Nope

[supple path]

Never really tested it, does BoP suppress the damage for duration, or straight remove it + drop puddle instantly or something?

[median jolt]

Removes it and drop puddle

[uneven mason]

@supple path Zul's bleed is physical damage, BoP fully removes the DOT due to making you immune to physical damage/effects

[frosty wedge]

so you can leap out, bop, charge back in

[uneven mason]

Yeah just make sure your BOP BUDDY is in place

[frosty wedge]

^

[uneven mason]

leaping out to OOR your healers and waiting 3 seconds for the BoP to hit basically means you may as well have just run off the side

esp at 4 stacks

[frosty wedge]

true

[uneven mason]

best tactic so far is 3 tank him

at least for prog

2 stacks each, on 3 tanks, ezpz

very controllable damage

[dusk locust]

what do you do with the crawgs though

does one tank have them the whole time and just also tank zul?

[uneven mason]

thats what BDKs are for

[dusk locust]

this is relevant b/c we're progging zul now

[median jolt]

We have a vengeance dh kiting only kiting crawgs for the rogues then monk+dk 4 stacks each and bop it off

If you run out of bops you can just intentionally die and get combat ressed

[astral crystal]

we 3 tanked, but the third tank, which is the crawg tank, never takes zul

[digital arrow]

i considered asking for a bop but that fear mechanic makes the fight so hectic for the healers and dps enough already

[astral crystal]

typically he only survives 3 rounds of defbuff application

[digital arrow]

so im hesitant

[astral crystal]

the fight is less than 4 mins long

[dusk locust]

not if you're my guild. we have 2 rogues max

[astral crystal]

fug i feel bad for guilds doing it without 4-5 rogues

[latent basalt]

Hey Fellow Prots!

[dusk locust]

we're late enough in prog that guilds like mine that don't have people with a buncha alts are getting to fights like zul

lol

[median jolt]

Just make sure you are in Range of them. If they arent complete potato and they know you will call for it should be no problem

[digital arrow]

sup SUPERGONZ

[dusk locust]

we've had to come up with our own strat

[digital arrow]

high fives supergonz

[wild spear]

@astral crystal the dude in your avatar works in my building. lol.

[astral crystal]

holy shit

are you for real

oh my god

[wild spear]

Yes.

[digital arrow]

just clicked on atticus' avatar for the first time and lol'd

[astral crystal]

that's probably the best news i've read all year, he has been spotted

[digital arrow]

tell him atticusw says hello!

[astral crystal]

lol

[wild spear]

I got the courage to speak to him in the elevator, but it didn't seem to register that his countenance has a following online.

He was like, "Oh."

[latent basalt]

thanks! I wanted to ask about Prot Traits. Brace, Iron, and Deafen are great traits. To prepare for Heroic/Mythic Uldir.. Which Traits do I want to focus on Stacking with my ARCHIVE?
Brace for Impact, Iron Fortress, Deafening Crash w/ Archive.. Any suggestions on stacking them? I am ilvl 350. (Trying to gear my tank asap to catch up to Taloc/Mother Mythic. - Thank you!!

[prisma crane]

DC is the most important

[latent basalt]

that gives me a 14 Second DEM SHOUT

Shield Block = 14 sec recharge

So 2 Def with 1 Archive would be BiS / Preferred?

[sand egret]

1 Def is what you want

the duration extension, which doesn't stack with multiple traits, is the reason why that trait is so good. From there pick your highest ilvl for your 3rd piece.

[pallid hollow]

Wait, i am a bit late, but you couldn't block ranged attack ?

[sand egret]

newp

until December 12th

[pallid hollow]

wtf, i have been playing Port warr since mop

[sand egret]

first thing I'm doing when patch hits is loading into a M0 ML, pulling the first three wrench throwers, pop Last Stand, crack a beer and gaze at my combat log.

[pallid hollow]

or you could just pop to ptr right now

;s

[sand egret]

that's a download I don't want haha

[pallid hollow]

just copy your whole wow to a new one

then "install" ptr on that folder

[sand egret]

meh, it'll come

but yes, ranged physical attacks seem to now be blockable on the PTR

[frosty wedge]

they are!

shoot and throw rock will no longer fuck us, lol

[dapper sky]

@latent basalt What isn't being mentioned is that with the avatar thunderclap cd reduction you can keep a demo shout up until it comes off cooldown again

The deafening crash doesn't stack for the extension so you only need 1 of the traits

[frosty wedge]

yeah, until 8.1, when DC gets nerfed

[dapper sky]

^

[frosty wedge]

it'll still be super powerful, just not AS op as it is now

[sand egret]

otherwise known as: balanced 😃

[frosty wedge]

if they wanted balance they'd give us something like arreats crater, lol

it's insane to me that there are like 29k people on this sdisc and its the same 15-20 of us always talking, lol

[final mist]

Many people are only here for information hubs.

[sand egret]

people are shy, joined once and it's just on their docket, think you smell funny, etc.

so, what do we think of the new Reaping affix?

Sounds pretty neat to me thus far

[frosty wedge]

sounds kinda cool, could be lots of things though

could be adds sometimes respawn - could be like those ghosts that appear you need to avoid for 5 seconds or they one shot people, etc

[daring marlin]

WG returning as an epic BG is gonna be a blast

[frosty wedge]

could be you walk over a corpse and it roots you/grabs yoru foot

who knows, lol

so far infested has been really a non issue

[sand egret]

well they told how it works

[frosty wedge]

oh I'm only reading the description, lol

[sand egret]

every 20% every mob you killed up to that 20% of enemy forces spawns an add

the adds are a special type of "Soul" which is one of 3 types

[daring marlin]

Infested is just kinda boring.

idk

[astral crystal]

wat

when'd they explain reaping

[sand egret]

so it will change how you pull since you may want to kill one mob at 19% to get to 20%

in an interview at blizzcon

[astral crystal]

l i nk

[sand egret]

": For reaping, Bwonsamdi has arrived in the dungeon and every creature in the instance, once you kill it, will arise as a Lost Soul, a Risen Soul or a Tormented Soul. At different intervals on the Enemy Forces bar, say every 20%, all those creatures will attack you all at once. The idea is that it will change the way you approach and pull the instance. "

that's what they're working with right now (DISCLAIMER BEING IT'S STILL BEING DEVELOPED)

[astral crystal]

whoa

[sand egret]

so it directly hits at pulling those mega 20%+ pulls

since mid-pull you're getting a new wave

[frosty wedge]

oh wow that's very Gothic the Harvester of them

[sand egret]

really thematic

[astral crystal]

that seems a little complex for dungeons that are on a tight timer

[sand egret]

im into it

It's no different than taking the extra time to CC + deal with Infested's imho

[frosty wedge]

who CCS infesteds? if there's only one in a pull you kill it first then kill spawns while AOEing/cleaving

[sand egret]

it could also change what pulls you take if one of those souls was like a PITA and caster mobs = one type of soul, etc.

some people do

since you can pull 2 packs then the 2 infesteds together

[frosty wedge]

the only time I cc infesteds is if theer are a couple in a row, CC, big pull multiple groups then kill multiple infesteds at once

yeah

I dunno, infested barely adds to the timer

[sand egret]

when/where you spawn the Reaping dudes will be key I imagine

[frosty wedge]

having to deal with the reaping mobs I can see being a way bigger impact

[sand egret]

yeah, but just with teeming they can adjust keys based on the affix

[uneven mason]

Warrior AE DPS - King

[frosty wedge]

are they scaling m+0 in 8.1?

[sand egret]

naw

[uneven mason]

Prob not

8.1 is part of the same tier more or less

[frosty wedge]

seems weird not to - people are already doing +20s

[sand egret]

I think they will in 8.2

[uneven mason]

8.2 prob

"People" less than 100?

Also they're not doing them in a traditional sense

[astral crystal]

yeah lol i dont think it's a significant amount of players

[frosty wedge]

sure, but its already doable with current gear

[uneven mason]

its doable with creative use of game mechanics

[sand egret]

then it'll be more doable for more than the very, very select few

[frosty wedge]

once people are in 415 gear it'll be waaay easier

[uneven mason]

right

[sand egret]

sure and they'll be doing +25s

[uneven mason]

they'll prob scale them in 8.2

[sand egret]

but I think a major scale will come in 8.2

[uneven mason]

they'll probably just scale the rewards from +10s to +15s

[frosty wedge]

but they're going to scale m+ rewards in 8.1 ?

[uneven mason]

to make that the new standard

[sand egret]

yeah

so maybe a iddy biddy scale?

[uneven mason]

then 8.2 will drop the +15 rewards down to +10 dungeons and recap at +10

that's their cycle thus far

[frosty wedge]

ah ok

[uneven mason]

right so a +15 will reward 410 gear, 420 in chest 425 azerite

[sand egret]

yeah and in 8.2 that is the +10 reward

[uneven mason]

and 8.2 we'll see +10s rewarding that

with no bump above

then when 8.3 hits

it'll scale down again

[sand egret]

yar

[uneven mason]

THAT is when you'll see m0 scaled

normal/heroic/m0

[frosty wedge]

fair enough

and yeah I did a siege last night and used that spotter mechanic - make sthe pulls before that second boss sooooo much easier

so azerite/gear is going up to 415 in 8.1 right?

so normal will drop 385, heroic 400, mythic 415?

[uneven mason]

no idea lol

I didn't pay any attention yet

beyond "warriors getting some QOL changes to shrink that - Fuck me in the ass - window"

[frosty wedge]

fair - just checked and it looks like 415 will be the highest, lol

[daring marlin]

Not until the raid comes out I imagine.

[frosty wedge]

yeah that's fair - it'll probably be capped until the raid opens

[daring marlin]

There will just be more avenues for heroic level asserite and gear in general.

[uneven mason]

but yeah, even my raid leader is like "Hey looks like prot is going to be pretty amazing next patch"

[frosty wedge]

mythic level azerite

[daring marlin]

Until that new raid drops

[uneven mason]

and I was like "we're literally getting some QoL fixes and 1 real buff, way to lemming"

[frosty wedge]

hahaha

[uneven mason]

But yeah, we're already amazing, thanks for noticing

[daring marlin]

Hilarious.

[frosty wedge]

shoulda been like "yeah we're going to be OP as fuck, should stop trying to make me play other classes now"

[uneven mason]

I kid tho

He's been BDK tanking the raid while I've been benched

tbh the reason why I'm being brought back is because he hates tanking

[frosty wedge]

lol

[uneven mason]

He's also like one of our top DPS

[frosty wedge]

I don't get why - tanking is sooo much fun

but then that's why I play prot, to each their own, lol

[daring marlin]

Tanking is more fun in dungeons.

[frosty wedge]

true

[daring marlin]

Raiding it’s significantly less fun.

For me, anyway.

[frosty wedge]

yeah, boss fights aren't really super fun unless they're hectic

I definitely prefer 5 man content

it honestly feels like there's an imbalance in dungeons vs raiding gearing atm though

difficulty vs reward

[daring marlin]

I want something like CMs again. Something a bit more rewarding than just M+.

When you don’t get a hydrocore that’s ok

But gimme some cool shit

[frosty wedge]

true

I just think a 10 in most dungeons is harder than every fight in H Uldir

[steel mauve]

To be fair the first raid is rarely ever complicated, usually its just really simple to get people back into "raiding fitness"

[frosty wedge]

minus maybe G'huun

[daring marlin]

It is.

100%

idk man this tier is fucking people more than EN and it makes me smile.

[frosty wedge]

it just sucks to feel forced to raid when all I want to do is spam 5 mans with a consistent group

[daring marlin]

I don’t get it cuz this raid isn’t THAT complicated.

[frosty wedge]

honestly though

[steel mauve]

The raid is pretty basic so far

[frosty wedge]

none of these fghts are hard

[steel mauve]

The biggest difficulty is mostly numbers tuning, you fuck up you die, or your raid dies, the strats arent that terrible

[frosty wedge]

true

[daring marlin]

I’m just excited for the new raid and the new M+ season

[frosty wedge]

but yeah, I think a 10 should give better rewards than H Uldir - also getting a weapon atm is so fucking brutal

[daring marlin]

And not being disappointed every week I don’t get a DC piece in my cache. :^)

[frosty wedge]

my monk was 370 using a 345 weapon - my DK is 368 with a 350

[daring marlin]

I lucked out on both of my dudes

[frosty wedge]

weapon drops just seem awful - at least on my DK I can just do Taloc

[daring marlin]

First cache gave me a 380 weapon

It’s that crit/vers? one from freehold

but w/e

Then my first wf on my dk got me a 375 2H

[frosty wedge]

yeah my warrior got 370 DC piece from cache, 370 shield from warfront cache and 370 1h from the do 4 mythics weekly

[daring marlin]

Just shit luck with asserite lol

[frosty wedge]

oh dude trust me I've been spamming FH on my DK

no luck

until I did a 6 for a friend last night and a 355 dropped

but I have the 355 taloc hammer now, so

on my monk it was brutal though - weapons for monk are in underrot, tol dagor, or from zek'voz

or king's rest

lol

man - the warrior discord is definitely my favourite... the DK one is... less helpful

[hot locust]

Sounds about right to me. I see nothing wrong there. :^)

[uneven mason]

I mean

The reason why birds are stupid is because it doesn't take a whole lot of brains to sneak up on a seed.

So

[frosty wedge]

LOL

[lusty grotto]

i mean you could tell DK discord was a mess in legion when they had memes pinned

it was funny

[uneven mason]

they hae 2

[lusty grotto]

but certainly not helpful

[uneven mason]

2 discords

[lusty grotto]

really? i thought DH had 2

[uneven mason]

and neither is exceptionally helpful

they might've consolidated

[lusty grotto]

i only have Acherus

[uneven mason]

I consider going to the DK discord on par with reading Reddit

same with Paladin

[lusty grotto]

lol

[uneven mason]

Druids at least answer questions

[lusty grotto]

i have all tank discords

[uneven mason]

but thats mostly because they're so excited that someone actually came in to ask a question

[hot locust]

What's wrong with reddit 😡

[lusty grotto]

and then DH has Mardum and Fel Hammer :\

[uneven mason]

its like that lonely kid

[lusty grotto]

the hivemind is what's wrong with reddit

[uneven mason]

Lala nothing - as long as its an objective post, and not the REPLIES to said post

[lusty grotto]

look at this whole diablo controversy

you don't wanna play diablo on mobile? then don't download it .... but the hivemind is huffing and puffing for no apparent reason

[uneven mason]

Well

[lusty grotto]

it's stupid

[uneven mason]

that is more disappointment

[hot locust]

I dont think that's the reason.

but ok

[uneven mason]

its socks for christmas

[hot locust]

I don't really want to get into this argument in this discord.

but the community has a pretty good right to be pissed off.

[lusty grotto]

i don't think it matterrs

[uneven mason]

They literally have this discussion down in the blizzcon chan

so if we wanna talk about it

downthar

KEEP PROT PURE

[lusty grotto]

just being pissed about nothing really

[hot locust]

Anyone else got Dec. 11th marked on their calendars? :^)

[uneven mason]

Protection rise

RISE

[frosty wedge]

it's that they launched a giant mobile game as the big announcement at a conference aimed at hardcore PC gamers

[lusty grotto]

so?

[frosty wedge]

at this point blizzard should know their audience

[hot locust]

Again

Not this channel

[astral crystal]

im gonna be on a plane aug 11 rip

[frosty wedge]

lol

[lusty grotto]

rather not get hiveminded in the blizzcon channel

so that's that

[daring marlin]

Both Paladin and Warrior discords>the rest

tbh

[astral crystal]

pally discord is full of madlads

always good laughs there

[vocal nimbus]

pallies are soybois

[lusty grotto]

its too bad they have.... puts sunglasses no rage

[frosty wedge]

ooh I should join the pally discord

pally feels the way I wish warr felt sometiems

[lusty grotto]

ugh

[uneven mason]

Like a windchime being beat?

[frosty wedge]

I wish shield slam felt more like avenger's shield

[lusty grotto]

nothx

[frosty wedge]

lol

[uneven mason]

Like, Shield slam feels great

the only thing I wish we had on it was a ranged silenc...oh wait

[astral crystal]

the ONLY thing i would have in the prot warr repertoire is avenger's shield

because i feel it's consistent with our class fantasy

[uneven mason]

Gag order back plz

[astral crystal]

just let me THROW A SHIELD

[uneven mason]

Nha

let me throw a rock

and silence that fuck

[lusty grotto]

but then, how would we block attacks

saynotocaptamerica

[astral crystal]

enormous pauldrons

[uneven mason]

"New warrior ability, Throw rock, 25 yard range, interrupts any cast and forces the target to run to you crying"

[frosty wedge]

lol

[lusty grotto]

rock?

throw BOULDER

[uneven mason]

that too

Disrupting shout

who remembers that

[frosty wedge]

hnnnngh

[lusty grotto]

yeh

i gotta admit, seeing a gnome or goblin throwing a boulder would be hilarious

[uneven mason]

lets replace Menace with Disrupting shout

makes Intimidating shout a 30s CD AE interrupt/silence

[frosty wedge]

yep I'd be down

would almost make me stop asking for an LOS wall ability, lol

almost.

[lusty grotto]

hyaahhh - goblin throwing boulder

[sand egret]

why the hell would I throw a boulder when I could throw a party member?

that's what I want

will it primarily be used to mess with people. yep. would that be amazing. hell yeah.

[lusty grotto]

hmm you make a solid point

i would never use it to troll party members

never 😁

[sand egret]

bonus effect, all aggro they deal goes to you. Boom, Warrior tricks

sees a mob of casters
Innocent Gnome: "Going to LoS right, tank?"
grins
"Oh yeah.....why don't you come over here first...."

[uneven mason]

Know what warriors need

that kind've fits with our shit

"Throw MOB"

[sand egret]

hmm

I could throw a cleaving mob at Innocent Gnome.....

so that works

[lusty grotto]

poor gnomes

[frosty wedge]

or, pick up a caster and throw it around a corner, lol

[lusty grotto]

i'd throw goblins though, fuck that race

[frosty wedge]

or throw a mob up a hill then charge to it..

bonus points if the mob you toss interrupts things around it when it lands

[sand egret]

like an Innocent Gnome mage....?

[frosty wedge]

exactly

it'd be a super fun tool if it worked on friendlies

see a rogue getting trucked

throw him at the healer

[sand egret]

ohh sees Glacial Spike cast
tosses mob
whistles innocently

[frosty wedge]

would be a fun boost to utility, you're like the big brother to melee DPS, lol

[sand egret]

until dps just expects you to throw em: "OMG NOOB TANK WHY DIDNT YOU THROW WHEN I GOT AGGRO":

[wild bolt]

I really liked the ability idea that was floating here for a while about some way to "plant" with your shield, becoming immobile but also temporarily blocking LOS on a 1 use per encounter or so CD.

[sand egret]

themeatically sounds dope, but realistically that's an enormous headache to implement

[wild bolt]

Yeah I'm sure it'd be a coding nightmare

[sand egret]

you'll see more practical solutions first

it's more of a testing nightmare, imho

[frosty wedge]

it's really not - they already have that code

the giant shielding mobs in ML block all damage from the front

[wild bolt]

True

[frosty wedge]

making that a LOS shield isn't a huge change

[sand egret]

doesn't provide LoS

[stark sage]

there is also a lot of potential for bugs, and abuse with an ability like that

[sand egret]

LoS causes pathing reroutes, which

can be further manipulated

[stark sage]

imagine how many boss mechanics operate under LoS

[wild bolt]

Right, you can still cast a them, just 0 damage. The goal would be something that causes casters to have to come to us. And Keladan has a good point, might need a longish CD.

[sand egret]

yeah, it's not a bad idea conceptually, but there's a lot that would be needed to be done to implement which begs the question: why not go after something easier to pull off that is less risky

[frosty wedge]

I'd imagine a CD the sae as gorefiends

[wild bolt]

Yeah but Gorefiend's can't cheese boss abilities

Not that that there aren't plenty of other ways to already cheese boss abilities.

(Paladins spring to mind...no offense Pink Bros)

[sand egret]

well here I would claim that there is potential for breaking not just cheesing

the breakage is where the real issues would arise

[frosty wedge]

I guess, but like, LOS is already a thing in most places, I can't honestly see if being that big of a deal

[sand egret]

LoS doesn't instantiate in the game

it's persistent

creating dynamic LoS checks would have to be added on top

[supple path]

Yeah I want to be able to cheese boss abilities.

Sounds like something I can call "utility"

Just toss a long enough CD on it that you can't do it every time.

[wild bolt]

I mean....seriously, everyone seems fine that Paladins have been crapping all over boss abilities for a pretty long time now.

[sand egret]

until the raid brings X more of that class

and suddenly you have 3+ prot warriors in a raid just to create some tower defense lane

[supple path]

is that any worse than 6 rogues on zul?

[sand egret]

so your ranged can fucking play Bloons up in her

yeah

[languid smelt]

I would be happy with a Hook & Chain ability that would tether a mob to us and it would either be an anchor or we could pull the mob by changing our location. It could work with Intercept, Heroic Leap and Dragon Charge (Open World).

[supple path]

Instead crusaders got it in diablo.

[sand egret]

Rogues "cheesing" is using their dps abilities and just going all in. This cheesing would be on an entirely diff level imho

[supple path]

I'd say about 100x as many encounters would be trivialized by a dPS who does 2x other damage dealer's damage than some LoS nonsenes that requires 5 tanks

[sand egret]

but that's when I go back to considering it almost exploiting at that point

[supple path]

If Blizzard was doing it properly, they'd just check most boss abilities as not being LoSable.

[sand egret]

it's not the bosses

[wild bolt]

What do we currently have to utilize LOS to avoid? Rezan is the only thing I can think of but I know I'm forgetting something

[supple path]

So...you're bringing 3 prot warriors to...fight trash...?

[sand egret]

no, you're bringing 3+ because you can create a route dyanmically in the fight where you can create an infinite LoS loop to never deal with an add-based mechanic

[supple path]

wow, that seems like such a common occurrence we should probably abandon the whole concept.

Also, my idea of a cd was more 5s up, 3m down than "33% uptime"

[sand egret]

if you're talking about giving dynamic LoS, that's the tip of the iceberg

every boss encounter also needs to ask the question: "What if they throw LoS _here?"

like I said, there's a lot to consider with the mechanic

[supple path]

Which would by and large mean "absolutely nothing because this boss has nothing that uses LoS so there are no LoS checks"

I mean I don't think Blizzard WOULD do it properly, but they absolutely COULD.

[wild bolt]

It's an important consideration, to be sure

[sand egret]

yeah they could do a lot of shit....

[azure perch]

Anyone wanna see a +16 siege shit show?

[supple path]

There absolutely should be some content where people think, "Oh man, we want a warrior on this fight because x/y/z."

[azure perch]

Prot pov

[sand egret]

but I prefer to think realistically

[wild bolt]

But I don't think it's any more or less game breaking than stuff other tanks are already doing

[supple path]

Beyond "running orbs on g'huun" or something.

[wild bolt]

I think everyone has abilities that have to be considered when designing encounters

[sand egret]

it's not like we dont

every spell that goes into the game has it's own Prot warrior specific flag lol

[supple path]

Frankly 2x prot paladins are going to ignore probably 10x as many mechanics as your worst nightmare here.

There's usually what, like 5-10 mechanics per raid that a paladin can opt out of?

[wild bolt]

Yeah true, @sand egret

[sand egret]

so if it's absolute value, we have it. If we're talking comparative importance, that's diff

[wild bolt]

I guess I would just rather try to see the approach be A - lets try it, B - lets see what it breaks , C - lets fix what it breaks before we get to the point of too exploitable - won't work. That seems to be the approach with plenty of other existing abilities, anyway.

[sand egret]

personally, Warriors being able to override Fixates would be something I could see them doing. Very powerful in certain circumstances

you forgot B.5

[wild bolt]

LOL, which is?

[sand egret]

"everyone bitches that Blizzard sucks and can't design and they can't believe how they could have ever released something so terrible"

[wild bolt]

😄

Small indy company

[sand egret]

because they DO do those steps

it's just not public haha

that's the definition of iterative development, after all

[wild bolt]

Very true. I like your fixate idea, btw.

[sand egret]

it's a thematic niche that hasn't really been explored in the game, similar to Enrage being it's own thing now

of course its power is entirely relevant to the content that's out there, mind you. They'd need to add more fixating mobs for it to be more than a "that's cute" feel

[daring marlin]

I WANT KUL TIRAN HUMANS RIGHT NOW!

[sand egret]

kinda miffed that the stache doesn't clip through helmets tbh

let alone appearing on druid forms. so lame.

[terse oasis]

is there any good tanking sim, or is it all just 'stack haste and dont suck?'

[waxen cradle]

Stack haste and don't suck sims do not have support for Prot

[open bluff]

even if they did, you can't reliably sim for survival without knowing every little detail of a fight and even then sims would only be valid for that fight

[terse oasis]

alright, i've got that first part of stacking haste down.. step two though..

[open bluff]

so tl;dr: you can't sim survivability on any tank

[terse oasis]

so i really enjoy the mobility/playstyle of warriors, aside from keeping SB/IP up, is there anything else i can do to make myself better in M+?

or is it just play more and it will come with time

[sand egret]

being better at what to/not interrupt, getting solid spell reflects off, knowing when you don't have to take damage

[terse oasis]

i feel like i get punched down way to fast for my gear

[sand egret]

those will come with time tho

what gear are you at / what M+ are you doin?

[terse oasis]

like my dk can just face tank/bonestorm

i'm fairly fresh on the warrior, about 340-345, doing 2/3s

[sand egret]

you should be totally fine for that

just don't pretend you're a DK haha

[terse oasis]

i'll keep after it, must be something i'm doing wrong.

[sand egret]

well for starters, you should be blowing CDs on like every pull

[terse oasis]

probably spending to much rage on revenge

[sand egret]

since with AM they're basically rotational and less "cooldowns"

[terse oasis]

usually i go avatar ->charge -> demo -> sb -> tc

[sand egret]

technically you can SB like during the charge

[terse oasis]

yeah? SB's off GCD right?

[sand egret]

ya

a common misconception is that IP can replace SB

[terse oasis]

and soon IP as well. which will make the 'i can't press the buttons enough' problem i'm having better.

Does it not? I'll usually try to keep and SB up, and use excess rage on IP.. but after the first two charges i'm just trying to keep IP up

[sand egret]

and from personal experience the "getting trucked" moment is usually a misplay where I bust out a IP when SB is wearing off and I need to spend 1-2 gcds to get the rage to get SB up and I get CRUSHED

instead of not hitting that IP to ensure I have SB up. SB's mitigation (vs blockable attacks) is wayyy > IP

ideally you want both up

but SB > IP

[terse oasis]

so SB > all other abilities

[sand egret]

against all blockable damage

[terse oasis]

I know i'm not using SpellReflect enough though, i hardly ever press it.

[sand egret]

you really want to have SB up as much as you can when taking damage. Last Stand (you should be running Bolster) is used after you run out of SB charges and SB is about to wear off

Spell Reflect is great and don't forget can be used as straight magic reduction even if you can't reflect the spell

[terse oasis]

because of anger management, does it make more sense to use LS early on since rage spend brings it back faster?

[weary python]

What are the general thoughts on where Prot might sit on the tank heirachy in 8.1 with the changes coming?

[sand egret]

well if by using that LS you end up sitting at 2 charges of SB while its up, then naw

I generally go SB x 3 > LS

[terse oasis]

okay

[sand egret]

since the 3rd SB will be up shortly after the 2nd one expires

(with higher haste that window is lower)

[terse oasis]

so for the IP/Revenge balance, do you try to always have an IP up and only use revenge if you'll cap on rage? or more free with it?

[sand egret]

@weary python depends what content, but we've got great mitigation and we're only getting better. We still are hard to compare to the utility that other tanks can bring

[terse oasis]

the 'i dont need a healer' utility?

[sand egret]

mass grip

but yeah

[terse oasis]

ah

[sand egret]

grip and other shit

but as for Revenge, depends on what you're tanking. I try to keep IP up as much as I can (after SB of course) which ends up being that I spend not too many globals on normals

[terse oasis]

So right now, mostly lowish keys, but looking to move into moderate keys (8-10s)

just feels like healers at my level (might just be getting unlucky) are falling behind on moderate to larger trash packs

[sand egret]

hmm

[terse oasis]

i'll be at 5k-ish HPS, they'll be at 10-12k

[sand egret]

assuming their healing is adequate, there is a lot of importance on good prot play to succeed

whereas a monk can fall asleep and still be fine

[terse oasis]

high skill floor? yeah.

[sand egret]

I can't stress the following fact enough:

Protection Warrior is the only truly proactive tanking class.

[terse oasis]

the DK is about the same, keep bone shield up.. death strike once in a while. it's why i'm bored of it

[sand egret]

if you're not looking at a pack thinking "ok ill use this CD, then this, then ill stun and kite, then call for this"

[frosty escarp]

Honestly, even though prot has its weaknesses atm, doing GOD Aoe dmg is really fun

[sand egret]

then i daresay you may not be doing it quite right.

👢 🍵 👏 is how we say hello around here, so I'd say we all agree with that haha

[terse oasis]

@frosty escarp can confirm, avatar + demo + tc spam makes me tingle

being on the top of the meters is hilarious

[frosty escarp]

I've been un/lucky to get all my prot azerites first, and I still find the clunkyness to be fun lol

I have a 120 Monk tank, and its so dam boring id rather just play my prot

[terse oasis]

i've tried a few of the tanks, and so far the only one i've actually found myself wanting to keep playing was the warrior

guardian just felt.. bad. dk was boring, same with monk.

[frosty escarp]

I am the same, I just have not tried DK tank yet but tried all the other ones

[terse oasis]

so now i just have to 'git gud'

[frosty escarp]

i just like wearing a shield, i feel weird without one

[terse oasis]

it would help if i wasn't stuck pugging. .but such is life

[frosty escarp]

btw, what is a good single target dmg you guys can do @ around 375ilvl?

[terse oasis]

paladin's an option.. but idk.. when i play paladin i think i should be a healer at all times (vanillia/BC mentality i guess)

[frosty escarp]

i just never really wanted to play prot pally

[terse oasis]

i didn't mind it leveling, but just can't get into it

to keep playing at max level

[frosty escarp]

i feel ya, i wanna play more than 1 but i feel like i need to just stick with warr

[daring marlin]

Out of the plate tanks I like Warrior the most. DK is only a little interesting cuz of brez, grip and control undead cheese in AD and KR.

[ripe dust]

So what type of sim program can we use for prot warriors is there one?

[stark sage]

there is not

[ripe dust]

shitty

[nimble root]

Race choice doesn't matter much right?

[steel mauve]

Nope, play what you like

Hightmountaintauren masterrace

[nimble root]

I don't like how helmets look on highmountain haha

that's what I am now

[sand egret]

ahem

Spicy Boi

and soon-to-be Fat Burt Reynolds

[ripe dust]

lol

[split thorn]

Guys I'm upgrading from 330 shoulders to 375. But with this I dont get Deafening Crash. Should I bin the new shoulders or keep my old ones? -45 ilvl

[sand egret]

oof. Well def hold on to the 375 regardless

since come December that’ll be the answer...

[split thorn]

I see. Ill just hope I get the Harbormasters once Proudmore will have the emissary with the cache

this was the Storms Wake ones, Shoalbreach

Alli btw 😃

[sand egret]

its tough since like DC is insanely good but thats also close enough to being worth upgrading based on ilvl alone

thats one hell of a jump

[split thorn]

I'll go a few mythic+'s and decide if the +7k hp and 130str is worth it

Ive been stuck to these shoulders before I even ran heroics

so it's one hell of a jump but the reason I didnt get 355s or 360s is cause of the trait

but now with +40-45 ilvl upgrade there's my threshold

[sand egret]

shove them in your bank and pretend they dint exist for a few weeks

[split thorn]

the new 375s?

[sand egret]

the 330

[floral grail]

i heard this was a better place to get information other than WARRIORS ARE THE WORST TANKS EVER

[split thorn]

ah well I'll spam thunderclap with BL and Avatar and watch as DS slowly fades away without getting upped

[sand egret]

i know its sacriledge to say but woof

[split thorn]

Ill survive

but living? nah

not for now

[sand egret]

Lala was doin M G’huun with out it so its not like you’re just gonna die

[split thorn]

Oh cool

btw there are no DC traits in Uldir so that sucks

Dread Glad Duelist shoulders 385 ilvl had DC

saw it on a buddy of mien

[sand egret]

its mathematically superior but for most use cases its prob not the reason you’re takin a dirt nap

[split thorn]

I guess

[lusty grotto]

they still do

but you get 385 with high rating

you can still get them

conquest rewards don't go away, you can catch up

[sand egret]

yeah if you grind out conquest you’ll get wm

[split thorn]

eventually yeah but by that time 8.1 is out and everyone is flashing their new pieces

haha

[sand egret]

by then you’ll be able to pick your pieces you want to buy

[lusty grotto]

nah it's not that hard to grind it

its the 2nd reward

[split thorn]

so you're saying as long as I get the conquest cap and with high enough rating

[lusty grotto]

just do random arenas and daily non-rated

[split thorn]

I can get the shoulders?

[lusty grotto]

you don't need rating the base is 370 iirc

[split thorn]

damn ill look it up

[lusty grotto]

just ilvl goes up with rating

[split thorn]

thanks for the help btw guys. Eased my mind

[lusty grotto]

i could be wrong though

[sand egret]

so there’s a new item each week

but the previous week doesnt go away

so week 1 is reward A, week 2 is reward B

[hidden kindle]

someone talking about spell block on the PTR, anyone noticed anything aboit that?

[sand egret]

if its week 3 and youve done shit, you can cap and Get A then cap and get B then C within that week

[split thorn]

Ahh makes sense

so the catching up mechanic is there you say

cool

[sand egret]

yeah thats how I believe it works

[lusty grotto]

"spell block"?

what is "spell block"?

[sand egret]

Spell Reflect or Shield Block

or WHAT IF WE CAN BLOCK MAGIC RIOOTTTTTT

lol, but yeah whats Spell Block

[split thorn]

has Shield Block been able to block ranged attacks in the past or am I looking at the wrong stuff?

ranged autos

[sand egret]

no. in 8.1 yes

[split thorn]

cool

[sand egret]

@floral grail and yeah, this is the place but we still get a few of those haha

[queen owl]

is there a list of all changes upcoming, both documented and undocumented?

[uneven mason]

[floral grail]

for you pro prot wars out there, do those changes sound pretty good as far as increasing their representation in m+ dungeons ?

[hot locust]

Representation, not really.

Does it help make the spec function much better in M+? Yeah.

[sand egret]

In general they’re solid. In terms of m+, it’s arguably easier to do it with tanks that have the utiility

but people are going to want to optimize if they can, if you’re sitting next to 3 other BDKs in the queue....

[floral grail]

so at that point its not so much class balance through numbers...but fundamental flaw in class balance through utility skills?

[outer dew]

It's a balance of having friends most of the time

[sand egret]

Personally? I see it as a discrepancy that favors a few tank classes. This advantage (like all advantages) were used by the top-end to succeed. This has a trickle down effect that starts to affect the rest5

[outer dew]

For most people, it's just get a group of friends and run together

[split thorn]

friends whats that

where does it drop

[sand egret]

combine that with how punishing Prot is comparatively (more people experiencing "fail warriors") you have a perception shift.

for the vast majority of players, the answer your looking for is: you're going to be just fine in M+ tanking as Prot 😃

[fringe marten]

Them 8.1 changes~ I'm looking forward to no longer having to kinda' flinch on Queen Patlaa in King's rest on fort weeks. Did a KR 15 this week...she's not jokin' around.

[oblique garnet]

Apparently you can survive 2 shatters without dying on mythic zekvoz

[fringe marten]

Not surprising...block with additional mitigation.

My guild can't kill zekvoz lel. (I have tanked him though)

Speaking of raiding...I don't think sense pushed any keys this week...I snuck passed him on M+ rankings.

Next week is gonna' be really easy too...tell those korean warriors to stop logging in for that week.

[oblique garnet]

Oh yeah usa gets reset tomorrow

I still havent done any keys this week

[fringe marten]

This week is...relatively speaking, very easy. I hate Fortified weeks, but for the most part the affixes are easy to deal with.

Next week will be the best push week so far in bfa for prot warrior at least.

[oblique garnet]

Whats next week

[fringe marten]

Tyran, Raging, Volcanic.

[oblique garnet]

Oh

[fringe marten]

Raging barely effects us, there's a handful of mobs that..if they get a cast off in their last 30% will ruin your group otherwise raging barely bothers us. Tyran I prefer (mostly) to fortified...we shine tanking 1 strong mob rather than a mix of trash, some of which casts. and Volcanic is GG.

[oblique garnet]

Yeah i know

[buoyant inlet]

hey in the 12-15 key range (around 375 ilvl) do you guys still recommend stacking haste (gems and gear pref) or start mixing in more versa and mastery?

[oblique garnet]

Theres people doing different builds etc not one is superior over the other

[sand egret]

oh snap, just got the proc for the hidden artifact appearance. worddd

[median wigeon]

any opinions on alliance race for mythic mythrax ? or in general cause im not feeling human atm

[sand egret]

Spicy Boi best Boi

[astral crystal]

dank iron bong

[sand egret]

(self-cleanse + huge str steroid is really solid)

[median wigeon]

yeah that self cleanse has looked really good

[sand egret]

no idea for mythrax specifically but in general its amazing

esp vs bleeds

other benefits of Spicy Bois

[median wigeon]

its either that or gnome im thinking but idk if the 1% haste and extra resource is that big

[sand egret]

• faster movement in dungeons
• mole machine for all the old raid transmogness

[outer dew]

panda

because spite

lots and lots of spite

[sand egret]

but then youd be a panda

[vagrant cape]

@median wigeon It's not huge for prot, but for fury and arms, gnome is the highest DPS race for alliance warriors. So if you offspec at all, gnome is very good

[sand egret]

but then youd be a gnome

[vagrant cape]

true.

can't do any dps if you don't get invited to raids

[sand egret]

yep

[vagrant cape]

can gnomes be shamans? I hope not

[sand egret]

nope

[vagrant cape]

thank god, the universe would implode with the repulsion of that class/spec combo

[sand egret]

you kidding me? that's the only thing Shamans got going for em now

ba-zing

[vagrant cape]

-a

I'll go crawl into some quicksand now

I just started watching the "lost honor" cinematic

if anduin raises his arms above his shoulders, his pauldrons will crush his own skull

[sand egret]

that's why he's got a helmet, duh

[vagrant cape]

not in the cinematic

[sand egret]

well he dont raise his arms there

dude ain't suicidal...

[amber siren]

Anduin is swole ad 😩

Af

[vagrant cape]

that's why he didn't try to block saurfang's punch I guess

[sand egret]

he dodged it

just too fast

[vagrant cape]

priests have dodge?

[sand egret]

in 8.2

that's the easter egg

they get Evasion baseline

[vagrant cape]

I think it's more likely that Saurfang is a fury warrior and just missed an auto attack

anyone wanna play maplestory 2 with me until 8.1?

[lusty grotto]

after running vectis 18 times

and shield drops from week event

with socket 😄

[digital arrow]

lol spicy bois

[daring marlin]

I'd go DI dorf

but waiting for dem thicc hoomans

[distant river]

how are prot warriors looking right now? I'm just coming back since like a week after launch

[daring marlin]

same as they were

[supple path]

Serviceable in both raids and non-bleeding edge m+, but notably inferior to BDKs in mythic+, and to a lesser degree BRM in raids.

[daring marlin]

JUST FINE

[dapper sky]

Prot op. BrM weak

[fair brook]

Is raid releasing right at the start of 8.1 or a couple weeks in?

[lusty grotto]

probably a couple of weeks in

1 or 2

[fair brook]

any blue on that?

[lusty grotto]

no

speculation

[onyx vessel]

Releases 11 of dec raids not out till 2019

So prob a month

[jade socket]

@fair brook early jan

[fair brook]

ty

[jade socket]

week of 14th is my guess

15*

[opal dew]

alright im too indecisive to picks for this and over analyse my classes too much when picking one so ill ask straight. Is a prot warrior worth picking? will they be better in 8.1 or likely still ignored for most groups

[astral crystal]

realistically you should expect the stigma to stick until there's some community memer who streams the spec often enough

and even then the damage is pretty much already done so don't expect much in terms of public opinion to change

[opal dew]

Do the 8.1 changes make it much better or still bottom tier tank

[chrome falcon]

If you have to ask, you aren't doing content hard enough for it to matter

Prot is fine

BrM and BDK are just heinously overpowered in raids/m+ respectively

[opal dew]

Ive never played a tank is mroe my thing

Always Dpsed

[vagrant cape]

@opal dew prot warrior is certainly the tank closest to a dps in terms of damage output

and in 8.1 I think we're honestly gonna be kinda bustedly OP

IP off the GCD, blocking ranged attacks, and more shield blocks AND more stam/armor is just gonna be bonkers

we're gonna have no more holes in our mitigation uptime

[stiff gate]

they said at blizzcon they're looking at utility/mobility spells coming back off GCD, what all does that affect for us? intercept for sure, but what about utility spells like rally

[vagrant cape]

and our mitigation is the strongest of the tanks

god I hope rally comes off

but it probably won't, honsetly

honestly*

of all the utility spells, it makes a TON of sense to be ON the gcd

it's a big button and it's not reactive

[stiff gate]

Ignore Pain and Intercept were my biggest ones, really frustrating that Safeguarding someone cost me a gcd

[vagrant cape]

you should be thinking about when you're going to use that

especially in raids

[stiff gate]

in m+ i use it as kind of a last resort oh shit when someone looks like they're going to die tbh

[vagrant cape]

not intercept, rallying (for clarity)

[stiff gate]

yeah

[vagrant cape]

yeah, rallying I use when I see really high bursting stacks or we're all forced together during a quake

[stiff gate]

mmhm

[vagrant cape]

or just generic "oh shit."

moments

but in raids that shit is like clockwork

[stiff gate]

i dont mind avatar on gcd, and rally is fine i guess. the only one left thats frustrating now that IP and intercept are coming off is demo shout

[vagrant cape]

I know just when to pop it every fight for the most part

either because it's in an angry assignment or the RL calls for it

and it's usually pretty consistent

[zinc mauve]

you learn to be able to read your groups health and judge your healer and whether they can heal in time

just using it to soften damage helps the healer a ton as well

it's our best utility, helps a ton in raid because it is raid wide

[icy wadi]

Is there any way to see how much I am blocking in a mythic dungeon like what details! does for the "Overall Data" for healing and dps?

[fringe marten]

I just finished a AD 10 for a buddy and I'm looking...best I can find is like block uptime?...

[cinder nova]

Um.

Log it?

[icy wadi]

Yeah, I could start logging it

[cinder nova]

If M+ logs the entire dungeon collectively and also shows points for boss fights

You could see your overall blocked hit %

[fringe marten]

Deadbones..what is the goal if the info you're seeking?

[icy wadi]

Curiosity! lol

[fringe marten]

oh...it would be an insanely high amount of damage filtration.

what I really want to be able to start tracking is parrying.

I want to know if I should keep using these high crit proc trinkets..or go back to haste.

the logic says the crit trinket is better...for overall throughput and damage avoidance.

and I also want to be able to add reflected spells to my overall damage =p

[sick sentinel]

@vagrant cape they specifically said that rally will come off GCD

Look at wowhead

[mild maple]

How is Disc of Systematic Regression on a single target compared to a generic stat trink of similar ilvl? Presumably the Disc gets better with many targets

Wait actually missread the trink

damage is split lol

[jade socket]

Disc gains value on multi target @mild maple

[mild maple]

Oh really? I read split-among as the damage being fixed regardless of targets

[jade socket]

It’s a hidden passive

The split damage is increased by 15% on up to 6 targets

[mild maple]

Oh nice

[jade socket]

It’s basically the only aoe trinket in the game atm

[stone crag]

hidden passive because tooltip updates require patches 4head

[sick sentinel]

I am so glad the next reset will actually give us some easy affixs

Because apparently healers can't handle chain pulls from a warrior

[zinc mauve]

what kind of healer are you bringing?

im not having any issues chain pulling with a disc priest

in +12's mind you

[sick sentinel]

"Oh no I need to sit for Mana at 50%, I'm about die stop pulling"

Always complaining

[zinc mauve]

50% mana is enough for anything except maybe a boss fight

i just wait till they sit down to drink and then pull

[sick sentinel]

The healers vary, I'm trying to time my last 4 +11 but apparently healers have to be dragged by their teeth

Since I only pug

[zinc mauve]

rip

[outer dew]

I mean

[upbeat folio]

They are spoiled by DK tanks.

in pugs.

[sick sentinel]

Crazy part is

[outer dew]

You just watch for them to start a drink or pull a decent size

[sick sentinel]

They and the rest of the group die more than me

[zinc mauve]

DKs require more healing that a good prot warrior

[upbeat folio]

k

[zinc mauve]

external healing mind you

[outer dew]

I mean, my healer throws rolling hots on me.

[upbeat folio]

That's definitely truie.

Well, sort of.

I find the situations are just different on my DK.

[outer dew]

Only gets scared when I get smacked by magic damage

Or hit by ranged attacks

[upbeat folio]

He's also 20 ilevels lower than my warrior, so the experience is also different.

[outer dew]

ML and KR scares me

Wrenches are not to be fucked with

[upbeat folio]

Next patch that will be less of an issue.

ROCKS BE GONE

[sick sentinel]

I swear this reset if I see these pug healers crying about fucking chain pulls I'm going to pop a fucking nerve

[outer dew]

I mean

[sick sentinel]

It's raging/volc

[outer dew]

Do you force your groups into discord?

[sick sentinel]

No

[upbeat folio]

Don't need to. +11 is not worth that.

[sick sentinel]

What am I going to tell them

[outer dew]

I mean, I prefer for smoothness

[upbeat folio]

I usually won't go above 10 without a healer I know, though.

[sick sentinel]

Don't die?

[outer dew]

CD check

If I'm gonna pull big

Do we have CDs to burn?

Do I have a darkness ready?

Do we have treants?

Can we survive this if we pull ?

Calling out kicks makes shrine much simpler

Rather than going. I got this, I got this

I just go. Me. dH. I got reflect. Rogue, me, etc

Smoothing out a run like that is what usually keeps you in groups for invites

[sick sentinel]

I'm not in groups to make friends

U either know what to do or u dont

[outer dew]

Yea, but having a group helps you push

[zinc mauve]

@upbeat folio comparing the 3rd fastest siege of boralus run vs the 4th fastest (BDK vs Prot Warrior)
prot warrior required 1.5k less external heals while doing nearly 3k more dps

[outer dew]

And have more access to keys

[zinc mauve]

2 seconds slower

[outer dew]

Like you can know everything

Doesn't help you sync CDs

If my dps don't have their CDs for a big full

We're losing a large chunk of time

[zinc mauve]

just having your healer on discord helps so much

[outer dew]

Being in comms really sets your pace

[zinc mauve]

having your dps up in there for syncing up interrupts helps a ton

asking for stuns

[sick sentinel]

At best the only use I've ever had for disc is to call kicks

[outer dew]

I even will have my healer or dps or pull for me

Because sometimes I need a cc on infested and just hit the add so the pack comes

[sick sentinel]

Nah, people should know that

[zinc mauve]

you can also call for no interrupts so you can spell reflect

[outer dew]

???

[zinc mauve]

most people dont even know prot warriors have spell reflect

[outer dew]

Your dps don't know how much you can handle

[upbeat folio]

@zinc mauve What are you trying to convince me of?

Just the EHPS requirement?

[sick sentinel]

Regarding infested, if ur dps/healers have to be told, cc the add that heals

[zinc mauve]

skilled prot warriors do not require more healing compared to a BDK

[sick sentinel]

There is a problem

[outer dew]

Sure. But they don't know if you want to do it for that pull

[sick sentinel]

I shouldn't have to tell u to use common sense

[upbeat folio]

Does representation and viability come from this one number?

[outer dew]

Like it's obvious

But it doesn't mean you want it pulled now

Sometimes I'll pull 3 packs, my dps don't know that

[sick sentinel]

I do understand tho, but it's just a personal thing of mine

[zinc mauve]

https://i.imgur.com/8b2tzVM.png
you heavily implied that it is easier on healings, I interpretted you as saying that BDKs are easier to heal, which, based on the information i presented, is incorrect

[sick sentinel]

I expect a lot from anyone because I want people to expect a lot from mr

[outer dew]

Sure

[sick sentinel]

So the fact that I'm getting less than what I'm putting out annoys me

[zinc mauve]

BDKs just have much better utility compared to us on top of being a reactive tank rather than proactive

[outer dew]

But your dps and you are desynced

Because the dps aren't gonna know my intentions

[zinc mauve]

its easier to say 'my hp has gone down, time to press my heal button' than it is to say "I pulled a few casters so I need to activate my mitigation after I stun them once so i can mitigate the damage from these spells"

[outer dew]

Like something I do this week

Is for atal, I lust heal boss

And pull all the trash into her

Not many people expect that

[zinc mauve]

tofu are you referring to the gold priest lady?

[outer dew]

Yeap

No infested this week

Very doable with lust/Boomie/DH

You pop off, cc chain, treants/ bean

Beam*

[sick sentinel]

Well it's AD, anything u do is fine

The best dungeon to have fun crazy tricks

[outer dew]

But that's the point

It doesn't work if you don't have the coordination

We're gonna overlap stuns if no coms, I'll pop last stand and what if he treants?

[sick sentinel]

Well ur running with a group u know

[outer dew]

I do it for pugs too

[sick sentinel]

I'm doing all of it solo as m+

[outer dew]

I make everyone discord or the boot

[sick sentinel]

Nah, that removes the challenge

[outer dew]

?? Doing the same pulls everytime doesn't really test the limits of how hard you can pull

[sick sentinel]

U can learn a lot from ur group at pull 1

[upbeat folio]

If you are having trouble, I mean, can it really hurt to get in voice comms?

[outer dew]

I'll go into my own keys with intention of bricking it

[sick sentinel]

But everyone is different, I can tell what my healers limit is

[outer dew]

Because I just want to see how hard a pull is

[sick sentinel]

My dps IDC about

[outer dew]

But your dps do matter. If you know that pack dies in your CD window

You're fine

[sick sentinel]

They are only there to pad meters and they know it

[outer dew]

If it doesn't, you're fucked

Do my dps know how to peel or knock?

Or when I need a knock

[sick sentinel]

They should know without having to be told

[outer dew]

???

What if they dump all their stuns at once

Kicks all at once

[sick sentinel]

Again, ur talking to a crazy person who sets unreal expections for others

[outer dew]

Because their reaction is to kick at the very end

But those things are what can desync you and CDs

Like I said, treants during my last stand

Makes me want to fucking scream

[sick sentinel]

That's ur fault then

I've never had that happen because I make sure to keep a mental reminder

[outer dew]

So you gamble on your dps pressing it vs knowing you need it?

[sick sentinel]

Overtime u should be able to know and learn when to expect it

[outer dew]

Some dps only use it for peeling, some only use on cd

Sometimes you just need to pump yourself up

[sick sentinel]

I've never meet one that did that

[outer dew]

Dropping on CD?

[sick sentinel]

Yup

[outer dew]

It's a one minute, they thrive on dropping on cd

[sick sentinel]

Well either they save it because using for 2 adds is useless when the next nearby add has 3-4

Or I'm very lucky

Which I doubt

Also I tend to not use Bolster at the start

[outer dew]

It also depends then, maybe my pull patterns are a bit more greedy.

[sick sentinel]

Yeah I'm not pull crazy

[outer dew]

I need to use bolster at the start to do some greedy pulls because I'm dragging out

[sick sentinel]

Anytime I go crazy at the start kills the momentum we have

Both literally and figuratively

[outer dew]

Or I'll bolster at the start of the full because I just want to Avatar/TC/Revenge spam

[sick sentinel]

I tend to save booster when I go my SB

[outer dew]

Larger pulls are not fun without comms

That I'll agree

[sick sentinel]

Yeah they can be done but fuck if the recovery is hard to land

[outer dew]

And sure. When I'm doing slow pulls. I'll 3x sb -> LS -> 3sb on chill pulls

[sick sentinel]

I tend to do small slower pulls because Ive noticed a pattern with pugs

Unless the dps are killing the adds so fast that I am not prepared to move on, then i have to go slow

Because the dps end up not handling dealing aoe

As well as I hoped

-cough- last group for ML w/ Frost/Afflic/Boomie -cough

[supple path]

Yeah, pull sizes are really limited in most pugs because there's always some horrible mechanical failure.

Doesn't matter if you can survive, 2 people will stand in a fire.

[sick sentinel]

^ pretty much

I can take 10 damage but my windowlicking dps is another story

Great at pading those meters but fuck u to move out of a incoming bomb

I'm just gonna be glad this week is finally going to be a chill one

Raging, just have a druid healer(which u should always have) and volcanic

Aka, the dumbass spotter

Can't wait for WM tommorow

[ionic fern]

Why would you always have a druid healer? 🤔

[sick sentinel]

Like a bdk, the Swiss army knife of healers

[ionic fern]

🤷 i prefer discs.

[sick sentinel]

They are good but what they bring compared to druids in m+ is a crazy difference

Again, bdks are really good because they heal and grip and brez

[ionic fern]

Most of the utility that resto brings comes from a Boomy anyways.

Well, in my case atleast.

😂

Depends on the grp setup i suppose

[sick sentinel]

Yea, it isn't wrong to bring any healer(except shamans apparently) druids just have better utilities than others

Also I just love druids more, for no biased reason at all

[merry cave]

Vortex isn't bad tbh

Saved my ass more than I can doubt

Count°

[mighty gulch]

Upgrade or no?

[dim pebble]

upgrade

[random finch]

The str alone makes it a upgrade let alone the nice effect of it

[mighty gulch]

ah ok

the other tank said it was really bad

[modest wedge]

its really good

[mighty gulch]

kk ty

[modest wedge]

its not a damage trinket but its a way to avoid death

and it should not trigger often. protection should not go below 40% many times

so its basically always up

[trim talon]

Ignore pain off the GCD yet?

[mighty gulch]

not until DEC 11th

[trim talon]

FeelsBadMan

[mighty gulch]

I have 2 tanking trinkets now

[torn sun]

Intervene off gcd as well

rallying cry too

[mighty gulch]

To the pally that helped me. Ty. Learned alot.

[uneven mason]

yeah those GCD changes are huge QOL buffs to war...not so much survival hah

[mighty gulch]

They're coming on the same date as the buffs.

[uneven mason]

but it'll lower the skill floor considerably, make the window where "Tomato stain" level errors are made

We'll we're only getting 2 buffs, and they're not huge, I'm going to bet that the GCD change to IP is going to go a lot farther than the extra HP and 11% SB uptime to make us more approachable as a tank

since right now, prot isn't bad, but you've gotta be super focused otherwise you'll get tomato pasted

[mighty gulch]

Ranged attacks are blockable now

Imo thats a massive buff

[uneven mason]

I mean, that really wasn'ta giant issue about those guys outside of super high keys

[mighty gulch]

throw rock and shoot hurts my dude

[uneven mason]

It won't address the fact that they're basically rooted in spot to us

They hurt, but no more than any other caster