wont that have a big impact on our uptime?
#protection
gray parrot
hot locust
its about 10-15% less uptime in raids.
fierce juniper
It's a ~15% reduction in uptime
gray parrot
that is big
cold wren
We get some uptime back though in aoe pulls? Due to faster rage dumping buffing AM?
royal oasis
In the grand scheme of things not really
cold wren
For DS
hot locust
we gained almost an equivalent amount of SB uptime
gray parrot
15% longer time taking 20% more dmg than before
sick sentinel
And more 5% vanguard bandaids!
cold wren
Rather than making us wait an eternity
fierce juniper
Well, to put it in other words, you go from having 18-20 second Demo Shouts (with Avatar) to 14 second Demo Shouts. So you're losing 4-6 seconds on those Demos. Not insignificant, but not that huge of a nerf either.
gray parrot
why nerf us at all 😦
hot locust
It needed to be nerfed.
hidden kindle
its better to nerf DC and compensate in other places
hot locust
Its still pretty damn important.
sick sentinel
It should not be worth 45 ilvls
gray parrot
im still using 355 shoulders cause i cant find it on 370s >.<
viral garden
Arena pvp shoulders have DC
viral garden
1600 ranking and you can upgrade t OP 370
oblique garnet
id rather do rbgs
sick sentinel
Late they made it easier to cap conquest
sick sentinel
Rbgs tho
chrome falcon
Better for explosives
viral garden
Yea, and some addons to show you what CD'S enemy popped so you can go defensively or target swap
Turbo combo people effectice, arms + enhance + healer
Damn I cannot type on this phone, pretty effective *
gray parrot
there is a Gladius type addon for RBGs
i cant remember the name of it though...brings up the list of all names/classes/HP etc
works really well and is easily customized
gray parrot
yea Battle Ground Enemies sounds like the one I use
sick sentinel
there's an extension for kyrillic names aswell afaik
got a 375 azerite helm with defeanning!
secondary trait tho, earhtlink or shimmering haven ?
they are both B tier on icy veins
so not sure
uneven mason
Than they probably wont make a difference either way
cinder bridge
385 dc helm, got 385 iron fortress chest last week and got a 370 iron fortress shoulders
ready to still kinda suck
crisp stone
I really like shimmering, but I know many others don't
orchid gulch
I'd go with Earthlink for a variable but permanent boost over something I'd lose as soon as I have to move a bit
neat harbor
anyone know of an armor calculator?
like x amount of armor = y amount of reduction vs equal opponent
I cant find one for bfa
ionic ridge
I recall there was a block one, that accounted for armor aswell
I'll see if I can find it
steady dock
@neat harbor not sure if this is correct, but a quick search popped this blog post from ask mr robot: http://blog.askmrrobot.com/diminishing-returns-other-bfa-tank-formulas/#If_a_boss_is_attacking_you
steady dock
🤷 No idea.
However, formula seems correct
At least against regular NPCs at level 120.
orchid gulch
I don't know about AMR but if the math checks out it should be fine
worn ingot
I haven't touched PTR, are we real tanks again?
dark lagoon
with IP changes would it be worth giving that trait that buffs IP some thought?
astral crystal
if you werent playing prot before you probably wont be playing prot after the changes
neat harbor
I actually just want to konw the formula that is being used on the character stat display, IE vs an equal opponent/player and not a boss
chrome harbor
I honestly just view the changes as QoL changes rather then actually fixing the problems with the class. Sure its always nice to make the spec feel better to play, but they kinda missed the point as to why people are complaining.... kinda like they missed the point as to why blood dks are popular and just took a metal nerf bat to their HP.
hot locust
Blood DK hp isn't changing
steady dock
Neither is their armor.
hot locust
Veteran is just getting added to UH/Frost as 10%, and then they have the modifier for blood to keep it at 60%
remote tusk
Does IP stack twice again or is it still 1.3? Since the tooltip says 350% and up to 700%.
hot locust
1.3x
minor folio
that kind of sucks about the deafening crash nerf 😦
Anyone know how much time that takes away from it if you were spamming TC on cd?
fathom marten
orchid gulch
6 second extension as a cap, so 3 TC and it's maxed out @minor folio
So any TC afterwards would count as lost I suppose
minor folio
I meant like how many TC uses were able to get in live right now
with avatar
I can test it
chrome falcon
Marok says ~15% reduction in uptime but I'm pretty confident that's incorrect
lusty grotto
@minor folio
orchid gulch
That's a 13.5% decrease on DS uptime and a 15% increase for SB uptime as I read it
The math sounds legit to me
chrome falcon
Yeah see is this actually just wrong
5 TC casts while demo is up during avatar? What?
oblique garnet
yeah no you have way more than that
chrome falcon
You're casting TC every other global, you're telling me you cast 10 spells during your 20 second cooldown?
I've watched Marok stream and he does not weave TCs during Avatar, he often prioritises SS over it which I'm pretty confident is wrong
orchid gulch
I think he went for the 6 sec cap here with the new patch, which you'd reach after 5 casts according to this formula
chrome falcon
What? You reach the 6 second cap after 3 TCs
Not 5
It's 2 seconds per cast of TC
orchid gulch
Yeah, that's the part I was getting to when I was interrupted for a moment
oblique garnet
On mother kill in first room
hot locust
That also means it was a short fight.
oblique garnet
3 minutes
hot locust
The longer the fight that demo shout will average out closer to the 65ish mark
chrome falcon
3 minutes is pretty short
oblique garnet
true
sour osprey
chrome falcon
Anyway I really just take issue with this 5 TCs per Avatar thing, unless I'm misinterpreting what he said
With the sheer amount of haste you have in uldir you get way more than that
oblique garnet
exactly
copper tendon
read the pin
copper tendon
he is saying in the pin that its only 3 claps
chrome falcon
What? I'm talking about Marok's post about why the DC nerf isn't a big deal
I understand that it's only 3 claps after the change, that's not what I'm talking about
ornate sky
DS doesn't line up with avatar nicely anyway
chrome falcon
Yes it does
oblique garnet
^
ornate sky
am i bad
tulip arch
It should line up exactly every other ds
chrome falcon
They line up great
ornate sky
but AM affects that
chrome falcon
It affects them both...
prisma night
by the same amount
chrome falcon
Equally....
tulip arch
It affects both equally
chrome falcon
So you get one DS outside of avatar and one DS inside avatar
oblique garnet
And you dont necessarily have to refresh your old ds before avatar is up now
prisma night
i screw it up and it is usually off by 5 or so seconds
ornate sky
if you have a 2min cd and a 1min cd, and AM takes 34s off.. you're left with 26s and 1m 26s
prisma night
but it does line up perfectly when done well
prisma night
no it doesnt
chrome falcon
You still get to cast one during the other
Which is what counts
Also, the relevant part is that you have a 45s and a 90s
when you take 45s off you cast one, goes on 45s CD, and the other will also be on 45s
obviously the GCD bullshit means there's a second or two either side
ornate sky
yes but AM takes 1s of each.. not a portion
so they can get out of line dependant on how much rage you spend
but one duration is much more than the other, so isn't a big deal
tulip arch
You have to remember you are also getting additional reduction on the second cast of ds too
dapper copper
mmmm if u lust on pull pretty sure u can delay Ds cause u stull have the debuff up when it comes off cd
dapper copper
oooo ok ic ye
chrome falcon
I'm not actually sure about that one though
If you're just looking for DS uptime it's better to save it obviously
dapper copper
That makes sense
minor folio
I think that its going to feel a lot better in 8.1 regardless
ornate sky
reduction on the second cast of ds doesnt change anger management unaligning cds from their perfect factor of 2
chrome falcon
It's going to FEEL better
minor folio
Being able use IP without suffering a GCD
chrome falcon
We probably aren't going to actually BE much better
ornate sky
2[x-1y] != 2x-1y
chrome falcon
We still suck at the same things we already suck at
ornate sky
x being cd of DS, y being number of AM reductions
dapper copper
Yeah that rage dump is gonna feel so clean with Lust, especially if u get revenge procs
found myself rage capped not wanting to ignore pain cause I already had a maxxed one
ornate sky
especially in M+
chrome falcon
Sitting at 100 rage with an IP up and a free revenge proc
What the fuck are you meant to press
dapper copper
xD
chilly brook
So you wanna know what’s funny?
ornate sky
no
chilly brook
My old guild that kicked me on Thursday for not wanting to do heroic when we should have been in Mythic (because we were only missing one person) disbanded not even a week later (yesterday) after doing heroic and citing a lack of ability to recruit and the leadership not wanting to deal with being leadership
dapper trout
how is that funny?
chilly brook
Oh trust me it’s hilarious
chrome falcon
yeah it's not really funny it's kind of sad having been in basically that position myself and only getting out of it because people stuck around
though i was never enough of an asshole to kick someone for complaining
that's... the opposite of how you get out of the situation lol
dapper copper
mmmm how far are u progressed cause we had two pugs for vectis and I was pulling my hair out
chilly brook
Hence why it’s hilarious
Every step of the way it was a failure of leadership
None of the officers recruited
All of the recent recruits were from a girl that actually cared
The officers were just a friends club essentially
dapper copper
Its overwhelming as fk to RL/recruit
the more u can help them the better
prisma night
we just started poaching a few people from another guild cuz they are only 2 bosses into heroic
dapper trout
its a thankless job
young harbor
yeah leading sucks.,
chrome falcon
yeah being an RL fucking blows
chilly brook
I was told I would be an officer and then got passed over because apparently having standards and expecting people to do it is elitist
ornate sky
what a funny conversation
prisma night
i yell at people anyway
ornate sky
raid leading is awful you don't even get to loot council stuff to yourself anymore
prisma night
dont gotta be rl to do that
digital arrow
well looks like the group was screwed either way
chrome harbor
as a RL, anyone that wants to be a RL is a red flag to me
dapper copper
The trick is, u dont need a title/position in ur guild to spam a macro in trade and check someones logs/raid history
chrome falcon
^^^^^^^^
young harbor
lol
chrome falcon
As soon as you see a raider trying to act like RL
You have to call that shit out and stop it
ornate sky
or give him RL and flee
chrome falcon
Well yeah
digital arrow
griff have u found a new guild yet
chrome harbor
ive considered that a few times not gonna lie
chilly brook
@chrome falcon it blows more putting all this extra effort into the guild and getting screwed over by the officers after it. I would get pulled into meetings for my opinion on people in the guild as far as if they should be a core raider, I’d get pulled in to help read logs and find the issues etc. and all this other crap and got shit on
chrome falcon
you can also use the classic "do you want to lead the fucking raid? because i'll let you lead the fucking raid dude"
young harbor
most people shut up after that
ornate sky
"yes"
chrome harbor
"I kinda wana focus on my parses anyway"
chilly brook
@digital arrow trialing with a new guild yea
I honestly don’t find raid leading all that bad
Oh they also made me raid lead several times
chrome falcon
@ornate sky I've never had anyone actually say yes so far
Have you ever tried raid leading an end of tier boss that is difficult to tank on a hard/squishy tank class
It's a real fucking adventure
chrome harbor
prot war raid leads unite!
oblique garnet
The trick is to normally raid lead with calm and relaxed voice and when you notice people fuck up big time multiple times in a row you just change your tone a bit and they usually fix their mistakes
prisma night
rl as a prot warrior in mythic would be annoyingly hard
heroic is way manageable tho
dapper copper
Raid leading fights is the absolute easiest part of leading a team, its the getting 20 people to show up having 3 buff classes and 2 vulnerabilty debuff classes and a decent melee to ranged ratio that is the hard part
chilly brook
So as someone who essentially got used by the leadership and then thrown to the side of the road, I find it funny that the leadership disbanded the guild because it was their failure and they had several people that were easily invested and interested in making the guild better and would have taken over
chrome falcon
Lots of RLs play prot warrior I've found
merry cave
It's the only way they get spots
chrome falcon
It's a pretty iconic class to be a raid lead, it sucks that we're a meme right now
ornate sky
stubborn prot warriors
lusty grotto
rip your snapchat @chilly brook
chilly brook
¯_(ツ)_/¯
lusty grotto
feelsbadman
chrome falcon
@dapper copper jesus man fuck the ranged/melee requirements in this game
lusty grotto
lol
prisma night
fuck that if the avg ilvl in raid is 371 you should be hard progging
chrome harbor
I find that even when I join a group and am not the RL I end up taking over, at least tanking wise. warrior dominant tanks imo
oblique garnet
Most people who play prot warrior still, have alot of experiences from previous expansions etc
merry cave
The hotp change looks so tasty, if protection doesn't get some utility might be a nice change
chrome falcon
It is so fucking ridiculously stupid
Blizzard makes every single class they've released since launch
Have a melee spec
And no ranged spec
Then they make every fight in the fucking game
Melee unfriendly
static lance
whats the hotp change?
chrome falcon
Fucking retards
ornate sky
and i would be pissed for you making drama and wanting to pug mythic during progression, instead of just clearing heroic and chilling
dusk locust
i remember we had 23 or 24 raiders or something and like 6 were out. i'm like "well i guess we'll do heroic" and some guy started complaining and refusing to go
fresh dragon
BrM got no nerf. nice done Blizz 💯
dusk locust
so i was like k bye
chilly brook
@dusk locust I think it’s a little ridiculous to expect people to come to a mandatory heroic on the day you should be doing Mythic because only one person is missing and you’ve done only half of the Mythic days you should have the last two weeks
And the raid ilvl is 371
chrome harbor
Yea i did a 10 man heroic last night cause no one showed up. single healed a few fights which was fun
chrome falcon
I own you for those 3 hours and if I say we're doing LFR we're doing fucking LFR
dusk locust
"nah bro i'm here for mythic bye"
dapper copper
mmmm 371 is pretty low for people to opt out of Heroic
chrome falcon
Fuck off if you don't like it
dusk locust
is not supporting anything
all you're doing is making the situation look even more dire and influence more people to leave
chrome falcon
Yeah they probably should have grown a pair and done mythic
oblique garnet
Matta you from eu?
chrome falcon
But if you refuse to do what the RL says you're just creating drama and making shit worse
I would have kicked you too
chilly brook
If I was told it was going to be a CE guild and we’re doing two days of Mythic a week, I’m not going to support something that I wasn’t sold
chrome falcon
Yeah Late
prisma night
why were 6 people out of the raid that day?
dusk locust
every guild goes through hard times here and there
oblique garnet
You need raiders?
prisma night
legit reasons or just didnt come
ornate sky
and expecting people to agree with you that its funny
chrome falcon
Just leave then, don't force them to kick you
chrome harbor
its not gonna get any easier with the holiday season coming up
digital arrow
cant nerf ion's main! (he does play monk right?)
chilly brook
Although tbh, this was after I was essentially fucked over by the leadership
chrome falcon
@oblique garnet Only if you play ranged
ornate sky
ion is a resto shaman since vanilla lol
chilly brook
So I was a little less than willing to help
digital arrow
oh lol
ornate sky
gurgthock
oblique garnet
I used to main warlock
dusk locust
hell after having roster issues last exp, now we keep a roster of at LEAST 26. i had a raider message me after getting sat that he didn't join a mythic raiding guild to get sat for a bunch of nobodies or whatever
like ok man
ornate sky
is his character name, on whatever server elitist jerks is on
oblique garnet
Its bit undergeared atm only 360
ornate sky
mal'ganis i think
chrome harbor
the fact that Ion hasn't made his deisgners put earth shield as baseline makes me think he doesnt have as much power as we think
prisma night
@dusk locust did 6 people just not show up that time?
chilly brook
@dusk locust personally I think it’s unacceptable to run heroic just simply because you’re missing one person who’s on the main roster and have people that could fill that position
dusk locust
if they had the roster they shoulda done mythic that's confusing
chrome harbor
Ive had quite a few ppl say they were sitting the expansion out and would be back for the next one or at a later patch if things were looking up
chilly brook
The week before, we were only missing two people and didn’t do Mythic
dusk locust
how large is your roster
chilly brook
Idk how large it was
ornate sky
fingers crossed for a nice azerite trait in 8.1.5
prisma night
enough to still do mythic?
dusk locust
well if you had enough people on to do mythic you shoulda done mythic
digital arrow
is canceling raid (or doing heroic when u are progressing myhic) a pretty common thing in WoW? i thought it was pretty flexible and pugging one person would be easier
chilly brook
We would have had enough
dusk locust
ok then that's a whole other bizarre issue
chilly brook
We had 3 people who were on trial period
chrome falcon
It's not super common at the start Pocky
digital arrow
than say, FFXIV raiding. whole group has to memorize how every member plays and subbing on person is awful
chilly brook
And that’s not counting the people who weren’t on main roster
chrome falcon
Later in the tier/expansion it happens pretty frequently
prisma night
yeah forcing heroic just cuz a few were out but still had the roster to mythic is dumb
ornate sky
"Heroic Leap causes 24 more damage and causes minions to be pulled 4 yards toward you" >cream
dusk locust
as the tier rolls on you have people burning out or switching gulds, and especially on alliance recruitment can sometimes go stale
chilly brook
Hence my problem
deft ether
If you’re finding you’re having trouble with leaders, other raiders and the like, perhaps ask yourself one question: Who’s always at the crime scene?
ornate sky
instead of these turd traits
chrome falcon
@digital arrow You can't pug people for any real bosses on mythic
digital arrow
which ones are the real bosses? the tougher ones u mean?
dusk locust
i remember being one or two short on occasion and choosing to pug
and having raiders sperg out about it
chrome falcon
Yeah you CAN pug for easier bosses
digital arrow
ahhh
chrome falcon
And it's better than not raiding in all scenarios
ornate sky
you can pug heroic easily pocky, as its flexible.. mythic is 20 only
chilly brook
I mean Zek’voz isn’t super hard tbh
prisma night
pretty sure anything past mother is not super pug friendly
digital arrow
i see
lost bay
am i right in saying that all dps trinkets still drop with prot set as loot specialization? gonna start gearing for the ip fix
chrome falcon
But you can
lusty grotto
i pugged zek 2 weeks in a row
prisma night
yeah mother and taloc are super ez mode
dusk locust
raiders tend to think that this officer thing is easy af and recruits are everywhere. "this is obvious let's just find our best 20 and bring them to all farm and all prog"
chrome falcon
Yes, all strength trinkets are on our loot table @lost bay
lost bay
nice
chrome falcon
@dusk locust Yeah dude just recruit lmao 😃
dusk locust
yeah
chilly brook
I’m not saying that recruiting is easy
chrome falcon
I've had to (basically) merge my guild 3 times since MoP
digital arrow
wow
dusk locust
and what am i going to do, have 26 on the roster and sit the worst 6 always
chrome falcon
It's hard keeping numbers up when every expansion has some bullshit system that half the playerbase hates
chilly brook
But our original officer who was supposed to be on recruiting etc. didn’t really do it, then left the game for school and then no one did it period for the last month and a half
dusk locust
they aren't going to stay
lusty grotto
i stopped raid leading after NH
strong forum
@ornate sky where did you read that
chrome falcon
@dusk locust Yeah, it sucks but the reality is sometimes you have to sit the good players to bring the bad players
dusk locust
precisely
lusty grotto
recruitment is fucking terrible when you're dealing with a circle of friends
chrome falcon
@dusk locust So that in 6 months when the good player has exams, you can bring the bad player as backup
ornate sky
didn't, just hoping for a good trait
chrome falcon
I killed mythic KJ with 2 of the worst raiders I've ever had
dusk locust
in fact just yesterday one of our better players is arguing he shouldn't be sitting for x farm boss because he's important for y prog boss
chrome falcon
Because we stuck with them and got them to a point where they were acceptable
ornate sky
i just really hate ranged mobs sat in sanguine
strong forum
Oh, yea I'm hoping for that too, but it's not gonna happen
chrome falcon
Our "avatar casts IP trait" seems pretty bad
prisma night
mythic guilds sound like pure anarchy
dusk locust
like sorry bro, we're on fetid devourer and i can only take 5 melee, so all this other melee that's sitting gets to come to everything else
chrome falcon
if you're not an officer mythic guilds look pretty organised
depending on the guild
dusk locust
which means some of the people progging fetid don't get to do some farm
chrome falcon
everyone in my guild knows that it's a huge clusterfuck
i like to think it's part of the charm
dusk locust
on every team, there's some player who is the least strong player
the solution isn't always to constantly replace the weak guys and train up new guys
chrome falcon
Yeah it sounds like the guys you're talking about fucked up
But you still deserved to get kicked for refusing to attend a raid
chilly brook
Probably
oblique garnet
Its sometimes easier to train the weak guys into stronger players
dapper copper
if ur an elitist, have no irl ties to a raid team, join the top guild on the server that u can meet the times for ggez problem solved
dusk locust
they're having roster issues and their raiders are refusing to come
yeah i'd kick that
oblique garnet
But if they are stubborn and refuse to accept the fact that they suck its hard
chrome falcon
I had a guy do that to me in Antorus and I didn't kick him
He ended up creating so much drama that we didn't clear the tier and nearly disbanded
dusk locust
i've done it twice
chilly brook
But my grade this week is better off for not going to heroic and using that time to work on a script
@dusk locust I wouldn’t say it was roster issues, more like issues with bringing people in that could have come in for raid and the main reason they were wanting more people was to shift from melee heavy to balanced
dusk locust
oh was the issue that they felt the boss would be near impossible with the comp they had?
chilly brook
Everyone that was in the guild was essentially there for raiding was “only in there for raiding” and we had well over 20 on
dusk locust
if i was doing fetid and the only people i had available were 8 melee i'd cancel too
lol
chilly brook
It’s Zek
dusk locust
how many melee
chilly brook
I’d have to look at logs to remember
chilly brook
Our issue on Zek wasn’t really our comp it was people doing stupid crap
dapper copper
lmao 9 melee
prisma night
idk why blizz fucks melee so hard
chrome falcon
Melee is just inherently worse than ranged
prisma night
yeah but mechanics can change that
chrome falcon
Like, by nature
prisma night
to a degree
dusk locust
tbh i'm done recruiting melee like ever
chrome falcon
It's very hard to make mechanics to punish ranged and not melee
chrome falcon
Yeah same lol
chilly brook
7 melee
dusk locust
7 is fine
chrome falcon
going to just tell the melee in BoD that we have 6 melee spots, period
dusk locust
i can't imagine a situation where i go "crap we don't have enough melee"
chrome falcon
it's sucks but that's how blizzard decided to make the game
prisma night
^
chilly brook
I would think 7 melee and 6 ranged is decently ok
chrome falcon
in 10m raiding you would never bring more than 2 melee
ornate sky
just get the ranged to stand in melee
prisma night
i think range vs melee comp is only super important on mythic imo
our guild has a TON of melee
chrome falcon
I'm not even mad that melee bad
prisma night
and we were still first one our server to down heroic ghuun
chrome falcon
I'm mad that melee are bad
ornate sky
ton of melee on mythraxx is fun
dusk locust
yeah
ornate sky
eye beam surgeon spec when
chrome falcon
also like
prisma night
a lot of spells got revamped i wouldnt say it was uneven
idk when those spells did, maybe that was later
chilly brook
As far as individual performance is concerned though this new guild certainly seems to be much better than my old one. But for some reason it took us a few tries to kill heroic g’huun and idk if that was on the fact that they had a lot of new people in the group or what
dusk locust
it takes everyone a few tries to do h ghuun
chilly brook
¯_(ツ)_/¯
dusk locust
our first night on h ghuun nobody could do basketball right
second night it was straightened out and we got the kill but the last phase was still shady af
oblique garnet
Yeah the last 5% was the hardest
There always was that one guy who died to the spores
dusk locust
usually half the raid dies early and the rest die slowly throughout the last phase
lol
digital arrow
haha im on h ghuun and yeah there is a lot to learn on each pull
prisma night
19 pulls for heroic ghuun, took more pulls to get zul
digital arrow
we got to 2nd phase on the 2nd night finally
chilly brook
G’huun takes a little bit if you’re new to it
Once you get it down it’s not too bad
digital arrow
heroic zul is the worst if ur dps is low. makes everyone hate the fight
oblique garnet
Ghuun took that long because we only had one warlock
prisma night
i wish we had more than 1
chilly brook
I will say though, I don’t think the healers in my new guild are nearly as good and I can definitely feel that
oblique garnet
Until one of our raiders got his warlock to 340ilvl
prisma night
i feel ya on the healers
we swapped all our main healers to dps and got new healers
thats why zul took so many pulls. they cant react to the p2 bleed
dusk locust
our healer core has always been great so that's nice
digital arrow
we only have one warlock too @oblique garnet and i am just now starting to see how useful they are lol
digital arrow
damn
chilly brook
Doable but it is a pain
dusk locust
two locks definitely help but you can do it with whatever
oblique garnet
Also pocky if youre running the orb just remember to jump inbetween
dusk locust
dotting up all the cysts is so good
chilly brook
I like seeing this
plain vapor
what is that
dusk locust
implication of ignore pain off gcd means what - we can ignore pain and dps to grab aggro as the primary benefit?
prisma night
pfft im lucky to see a few orange parses
dapper copper
how bout this one, this is literally best related story to all this
Heroic reclear off night(yesterday in fact) Not mandatory
have ~13 with an irl lock friend376,he decides to leave to play Blops just after we kill Mythrax....?????? we roast him, sit in queue 10 min for a lock, find one, have another irl friend(on raid team not in heroic group) playing blops with said lock, hes a 380 ww monk solo orb runner, doesnt help us, 4 pulls in, our lock leaves, so then we just call it for the night we’ll kill is later, I love Raid Leading
chilly brook
@dusk locust it just means we won’t have to sacrifice a global we could use on SS or Revenge
dusk locust
yeah
dapper copper
sorry for wall of text
dusk locust
raises the apm a bit which is neat
prisma night
just having a dump off gcd is nice
chilly brook
Well if it’s not mandatory I don’t think you can truly hold it against them
dusk locust
lol yeah we have a not-mandatory heroic sunday
usually have to fill with a buncha pugs who trickle out after mythrax dies
i set up orb groups, wipe once, people doing orbs leave
get more, repeat
chilly brook
In my case I can understand because we took something that wasn’t mandatory and made it mandatory on a normal raid night (heroic was usually on Sunday) and I said I wouldn’t go. So I can understand why I was kicked for that but at the same time there was also never any communication between myself and leadership regarding any of the supposed “issues”.
dapper copper
Griff if u truly believe I cant hold this against my irl friends in my raid team where we all know if those two are there we 1 shot the boss, thats an x d
chilly brook
I do though it’s not mandatory
I wouldn’t go to heroic if it wasn’t mandatory unless I wanted something specific
dapper copper
Remember they are jerkin it in Blackout on blops
chilly brook
I too like to play other games besides wow
dapper copper
I love people
chilly brook
Especially because I don’t feel like there’s much to do outside of raid
dapper copper
Kappa
dusk locust
i live in m+
chilly brook
I would if I wasn’t a warrior and didn’t feel like dealing with the community perception
oblique garnet
I need to find a proper team for m+
chilly brook
^that as well
chilly brook
If I was a blood DK I’d do M+ all the time
oblique garnet
Did few pugs today and every healer was surprised how easy it was to heal prot warrior
chilly brook
Seems like a normal reaction lol
dusk locust
i have a healer alt, and by far my best experience was w/ a prot war
no contest
guardian was worst
plain vapor
hmm, seems like the best way to parse on mother seems to be holding the boss the whole time. from personal observations
sand egret
i like to not use SB for the first few pulls just to tease the stereotypes only to shatter them later
i'm also not a nice person
chilly brook
It was funny last night we were doing heroic Zek cuz they were trialing a bunch of people and the monk tank kept taunting after shatter and I was like “it’s ok I can take the full combo” after the first time I did he was like “wow this really is a prot warrior fight isn’t it?”
dusk locust
hah yeah the full combo is not a big deal at all
oblique garnet
doesnt every tank take the full combo?
chilly brook
@plain vapor yea pretty much, that being said in Mythic it’s not all that bad if you pull 3/4ths of the raid through on the first go
plain vapor
we use that strat yes
chilly brook
@oblique garnet I’ve seen a lot of monks need a taunt after shatter because the next hit will kill them
oblique garnet
Huh
chilly brook
Something something stagger is bad at magic
plain vapor
i thought last week being the tank that goes over with the group onthe first go would be better for the massive aoe. much better to hold boss and just do massive aoe on the 2nd pass thru when everyone crosses over at once
chilly brook
He was also amazed that I could SR the explosive corruption or w/e it’s called on G’huun
plain vapor
ezzzzzzzzzz money
chilly brook
Mother?
oblique garnet
Yeah every tank kept taunting ghuun from le until i told them to stop taunting and wait till i tell them to taunt
dusk locust
i always parse average for dps and parse 95+ for healing
plain vapor
ye
dusk locust
i'm a scaredy cat apparently
dusk locust
i had #1 healing parse M zek for a bit
lol
had a routine to cover every combo hit with ignore pain
chilly brook
Yea that would help a lot
dusk locust
i forgot to spell reflect on that pull
chilly brook
I’m able to do it if I time my Last Stand correctly beforehand
chilly brook
Lol
plain vapor
know whats the worst feeling. when you are doin crazy good damage and are about to parse well but then everything crashes and burns and the raid wipes at like 10%
feels awful man
dusk locust
tru
chilly brook
Big oof
plain vapor
woulda got a 99 on zek 😭
chrome falcon
I had rank 1 on fetid for about 5 minutes 😢
chrome falcon
Think if I get best possible RNG on add spawns I can make it
I also outdps'd Sense by a colossal TWO damage, but he's back ahead of me now
never lucky tbh
rustic python
"we need to buff prot warriors"
Deafening Crash Thunder Clap deals an additional 30 damage and extends the duration of your Demoralizing Shout on affected enemies by 2 sec.up to 6 sec.
Lol
rustic python
🤔
chilly brook
I mean to be fair we did get another vanguard buff
oblique garnet
And ip off gcd
rustic python
oh boy.. an extra 2% health.. but lost 20% mitigation uptime by like 80%
chilly brook
And block physical ranged attacks
hot locust
We're definitely not weaker come 8.1 than we are now.
rustic python
How so?
chilly brook
Well we’ll have gone up essentially ~10% EHP from what we were at the beginning of the xpac
hot locust
So I don't know why we are so laser focused on the DC nerf when we all knew it was going to happen eventually.
graceful mason
because people have to bitch no matter what
chilly brook
And we’ll likely see a few more changes
graceful mason
we could get a huge buff and it'd still happen
rustic python
yea but deafening crash was like the only way to increase damage / mitigation .. capping out at 6 seconds is brutal
hot locust
More block uptime is a bigger increase than more DC uptime (unless the damage is unblockable)
rustic python
If your nerfing that but giving us a few fluff buffs.. it's kinda just putting us back where we were
chrome falcon
@hot locust Because the buffs that are coming with it are barely enough to cover what we're getting
chilly brook
@hot locust @graceful mason TBF I’m not overly happy about it, and I personally would like to see IP actually have a buff to compensate
rustic python
Demo is flat mitigation from all sources right?
hot locust
You are way overreacting to the DC nerf.
chrome falcon
You already had 100% block uptime on most bosses if you weren't bad, especially with increased haste coming from higher ilvl
graceful mason
me too griff
chilly brook
Yes @rustic python
woeful otter
So, as a guy who has been playing wow for a long time, but never as a tank, how do you recommend I start tanking with a prot warr? Any newbee guides?
chrome falcon
graceful mason
But what they're doing is balancing numbers to make the DC spam playstyle inline with some of othe other talent/playstyles
rustic python
Between Last Stand / Shield Block our uptime is almost 100%..
chilly brook
My main gripe with it is I feel like we’re losing a element of skill cap to the spec
graceful mason
so the regular folk dont get destroyed as badly
rustic python
nerfing dc that hard
chilly brook
But I’ll deal
rustic python
is redonk
chilly brook
Not if we see an IP buff
daring patrol
You want to show me logs where you're blocking 100% of incoming melee? Because you're wrong
chilly brook
TBH I would have liked to see more CD reduction on SB than just 2 seconds as well but that’s just being nit picky
chrome falcon
People saying it's a disaster are overreacting
rustic python
I am rarely taking unblocked white hits or abilities unless I was rage starved or fucked up
final mist
"We're the only class where that drops 80 ilevels for a specific azerite trait, but Blizz isn't allowed to nerf it and put some power back into the base spec, that's not fair" is what I'm hearing from most of you
chrome falcon
But people saying it doesn't matter are DEFINITELY underreacting
final mist
It's a good change that was needed
digital arrow
lol my co tank makes me taunt instantly after shatter and i usually take the entire combo 😦
delicate prism
Sure, but they aren't putting power back into the spec.
daring patrol
They are though
rustic python
I don't see Ip on GCD and blocking range attacks as a good offset to losing DC like that..
chilly brook
An EHP buff is power back into the spec 🤔
chrome falcon
The problem is Sal that we need buffs, period. These buffs compensate for the DC nerf, which leaves us... basically where we are now in terms of power
Which is pretty bad
final mist
Except they don't
rustic python
Ya
daring patrol
You guys are downplaying the 2 seconds off shield block so much. It's a large buff.
rustic python
DC was a huge game changer for damage / flat non-blockable mitigation
graceful mason
we dont really need a buff for mitigation tbh.. we need utility and a reason to bring a prot warrior
chrome falcon
It still doesn't put us where we should be
chilly brook
Well I wouldn’t say IP off gcd is huge tbh
oblique garnet
I have 11 sec recharge on SB in uldir now
rustic python
IP costs too much rage and is sucky
final mist
Mistakes are less punishing now as well which is even larger
finite quail
I don't see how ip is huge. Ip rage cost is high
oblique garnet
With the buff to it i get it down to 9
chilly brook
It’ll play better but it’s not going to effect your overall survivability
delicate prism
I'll get excited when there is more than one talent spec option
versed whale
where should we be
final mist
My point is it's still relatively early in the PTR, we're getting good changes and all I've seen constantly is "DC got nerfed, warriors suck now even harder" which is flat out wrong
rustic python
IP went back to being a trash oh shit button.. 50% mitigation oh wow .. we are still gonna get dunked on by Brew
chrome harbor
something I like is that we're already GCD locked so having IP off of it opens the rotation up a bit
rustic python
I'd rather have DC
rustic python
it's off GCD
final mist
And you also think IP is an oh shit button
chrome harbor
I think having a spec propped up by a trait is a dangerous practice
final mist
Which is wrong
chilly brook
And it’s not an “oh shit button”
rustic python
It costs too much rage I was being hyperbolic
chrome falcon
@chrome harbor I would agree with you if we weren't getting a targeted azerite vendor
plain vapor
i like the changes so far
chilly brook
It doesn’t really cost too much rage
rustic python
it does
chilly brook
If you think it does you use Revenge too often
chrome falcon
IP costs a lot of rage
rustic python
I never use revenge unless its free
chrome falcon
For what it does
final mist
And you don't spend Rage on IP?
rustic python
I do
chilly brook
Sure it costs a lot of rage
rustic python
but its expensive
chrome harbor
with legion artifacts we saw how balancing a spec around a expansion gimmick hurts in the long run, I dont want to make that mistake again
chrome falcon
Especially considering SB costs so fucking much now
final mist
We have more than enough Rage to spend on IP and everything else
rustic python
SB is way more important than IP and IP burns off in a single hit basically
it's so weak
and expensive
chrome harbor
SB is more important on blockable dmg
chrome falcon
@chrome harbor I think they horribly fucked up with the removal of artifacts though, half the stuff from artifacts should have been baked into base classes. I viewed artifacts as patch notes, not temporary gimmick power
rustic python
I'd rather be a brew
bold mirage
I wonder if there is still a rework to mastery coming or if this is it
chrome falcon
Go play brew then dude
final mist
So go to Peak and stop complaining here
rustic python
I don't wanna relevel / gear
chilly brook
Costs too much but you can have over 50% uptime on it for a 6 minute fight
chrome harbor
@chrome falcon agreed, we should have just absorbed our artifacts instead of destroying them. The more specs I start to level the more clear that becomes
chrome falcon
"We have more than enough Rage to spend on IP and everything else" I don't know if I agree with this lol
chilly brook
You’d be better off tbh
delicate prism
imo there should be a second "talent tree" where you get to pick which two legion artifact abilities you get to be active.
rustic python
if anything I think I use IP way too much.. my healing parses are usually really high
chrome falcon
If this was true wouldn't we no longer be struggling?
clear arrow
D.C. nerfs definitely make the spec less fun imo, and nerfs our most valuable thing at the moment, our damage. But yeah it would suck to go a whole expac depending on a gimmicky azerite trait
final mist
Because we are "weaker" than other tanks
That's mostly because mistakes are extremely punishing more than anything
rustic python
I'm fine with DC nerf but the buffs don't come anywhere close as good enough
final mist
Except they do
chrome falcon
"Enough" is relative, I think the disparity between ST and AoE rage generation is absurd right now
rustic python
we are basically net zero
chrome falcon
We are better than net zero
chilly brook
I wouldn’t mind seeing an overall damage buff to compensate
chrome falcon
In most scenarios
But not much better
And again
There is still literally no reason to bring a prot warrior
To anything
clear arrow
The buffs are pretty significant defensive wise. And damage wise tbh. That's a lot of global
rustic python
Yea prot is pretty much dead
chrome falcon
We need nerfs to other people more than we need buffs to ourselves
prisma night
yea bringing us inline survival wise still wont up representation much
graceful mason
Until I hear a raid leader say "Can you log into your prot warrior for this fight?" I wont be completely happy but that has nothing to do with mitigation/ehp
chrome harbor
would a dmg/rage buff to shield slam help ST while not effecting AoE dmg/rage gen too much?
ornate sky
of course?
finite quail
Prot war pretty good for zekvoz haha
chrome falcon
I would like us to actually have a reason to press Shield Slam
oblique garnet
Jokes on everyone else i am the raid leader i log on to whatever i want 8)
rustic python
a brew master is better than us in everyway.. both damage smoothing and mobility.. you don't need to be so dense
delicate prism
we could have unlimited rage but IP still gonna suck donkey nuts
chrome falcon
Compared to legion where we had like 3 different shield slam synergies
chrome harbor
i mean i know these seem obvious but as someone whos not a game designer trying to armchair design there might be something im missing
ornate sky
because BrM is OP and broken in its stagger mechanic
chrome falcon
@rustic python WOW DUDE BRM IS BETTER THAN PROT? SICK TAKE MY FRIEND
WE HAD NO IDEA
versed whale
sigh... i thought im in the warrior section, not in the whining sissi brigade 😕
chrome falcon
Holy shit someone should go over to peak of serenity and let them know their class is good
I don't think they've heard!
quartz pond
Welcome to prot 2018
rustic python
I was responding to someone specifically.. why are you screaming ?
chilly brook
If anything I would say that we have plenty of rage to spend on IP
chrome harbor
real tanks wear plate imo
chrome falcon
Why are you still here if you hate prot so much
finite quail
We are about to do fetid on mythic tonight. Should I use my prot war at 380 or my blood dk at 364 lol
chilly brook
rustic python
I've played prot since vanilla and it's sad to see my class die
astral crystal
yeah prot is great at the fetid memer
rustic python
why are you screaming?
astral crystal
hope youre using reorigination array
finite quail
So I just need to main tank it?
steel lotus
Prot isn’t dead tho especially with 8.1
quartz pond
The ip change is hyuuge
prisma night
who says its dying?
astral crystal
take thrashes
chilly brook
Screaming?
prisma night
wut
chrome harbor
I co tank with a bear so i had to main tank fetid, my aggro wouldnt let me offtank
chilly brook
Lolwut
clear arrow
I'm pretty sure we just got big buffs yo
rustic python
MattacateToday at 11:40 AM
@Exif WOW DUDE BRM IS BETTER THAN PROT? SICK TAKE MY FRIEND
WE HAD NO IDEA
I will be tanking g with a dk
rustic python
screaming
plain vapor
be the offtank for fetid
steel lotus
Prot is gonna feel so good again having ip off gcd
ornate sky
nerf to DC is fine, we will have a few more seconds off it from AM, we have less gaps in shield block, we can block ranged, we have more base armor
steel lotus
Imma really appreciate it after losing it kek
plain vapor
can just take his thrashes with just shield block
chilly brook
Idk if we’ll have a few more seconds off
plain vapor
until 50%
chrome harbor
not gonna lie, i forgot about the range block and got happy again
plain vapor
ez pz
ornate sky
and we can use IP during avatar windows
chilly brook
We’re not getting a rage buff
ornate sky
we are
rustic python
So non-blockable damage mitigation goes down though because demo was a flat 20% and we lose uptime
carmine ibex
#blockTheRock
chrome falcon
IP off GCD is a small rage gen buff
ornate sky
more GCDs available is a small rage buff
dusk locust
yeah
chilly brook
That’s assuming every gcd you can generate rage
chrome falcon
Emphasis on SMALL rage buff
chrome harbor
"Shield Block can now do the things that is shown in the icon art, IE block arrows"
astral crystal
you cant really take anything anyone in this channel says seriously anyway; some months ago people were defending IP on the GCD because other tanks had a GCD AM, now they're talking about what a seriously needed change it was etc. people always go with the flow and pretend they always believed what was best
oblique garnet
Is amazing
chilly brook
Which isn’t the case
chrome falcon
We're going to devastate a lot more in 8.1
ornate sky
and non-blockable damage has gone down to magic/bleeds
carmine ibex
#blocktherock is the most exciting change imo.
rustic python
we lost magic damage mitigation
carmine ibex
and DC needed to be nerfed.
plain vapor
what is blocktherock
chilly brook
@astral crystal to be fair I said I would be fine with IP on gcd if they buffed it and if it was taken off it wouldn’t help our survivability in any real way
dusk locust
any gcd where you would have ignored pain instead of shield slamming or thunder clapping you can now do both
rustic python
They could of buffed us more with the DC nerf
oblique garnet
Throw rock can be blocked
sick sentinel
hm.
ornate sky
correct and they still could
sick sentinel
so can Shoot finally.
oblique garnet
Yes
sick sentinel
making KR much easier for us
rustic python
IP gobbles so much rage though
sick sentinel
and SoB
astral crystal
@chilly brook i'm just saying in genera, including channel mods
rustic python
for what it does
chrome harbor
I think people realize that the GCD on IP isnt the issue, but its a QoL change as it made the spec feel constipated
oblique garnet
And so many others
chilly brook
I would agree with you though @astral crystal
prisma crane
normalizing rage gain would be nice
sick sentinel
block rocks, arrows, bullets my dudes.
light oasis
Is there a mechanic where you need over six seconds of continuous magic mitigation? I’m pretty new to prot so legit wondering
graceful mason
Pretty sure everybody knows this channel isnt for productive conversation
dusk locust
sure there's shadow of zul in KR
ornate sky
well, over 18s
carmine ibex
I tbink we will see more changes. They didn't announce #blocktherock so I'd wager there is still tank tuning being done.
chilly brook
I do think that IP still needs to have double it’s volume
chrome harbor
its productive by comparison to anywhere else youd have the conversation
carmine ibex
overall I think were better off than we were with these changes.
prisma crane
IP doesnt need double the volume, we just need more rage in ST and less in AoE
astral crystal
yeah IP having a little more absorb would be fine, but if it took an alpha/beta/live/patch cycle to get it off the GCD, i wouldn't hold my breath
prisma crane
As Lala said in his writeup, IP now isn't any less effective than it was in Legion, but now we get 1/3rd teh rage we used to
chilly brook
I would have still preferred a rework of IP to not have an absorb cap at all
ornate sky
ignore pain should be passive and 50% of the damage spread out over 8 seconds
prisma crane
i dont want to be a monk @ornate sky
digital arrow
lol
astral crystal
lol
digital arrow
f that weaksauce
chrome harbor
so an active stagger?
chrome falcon
I would have liked the IP design where it eats rage when you take damage
Could have been interesting
ornate sky
no i said passive, i meme'd
chilly brook
I mean I liked the beta version, 12 second duration and 12 second recharge. Reduce damage but eats rage
prisma crane
if you take off the absorb cap of IP, people will just stack it to stupid numbers while not currently tanking, it wont work
chrome falcon
Hard to balance though and no-one on the team seems to care about us
rustic python
I appreciate the changes they made.. but I assumed we were getting big buffs to bring our numbers closer to other tanks.. with the DC nerfs it really doesn't feel that way
ornate sky
yep, beta IP was way more interesting 😦
chrome falcon
Double IP should be a BIG moment if you save up for it
ornate sky
second healthbar
chrome harbor
oh I like the changes as well, infact I want nothing more then for them to hotfix it asap
chrome falcon
Considering it costs most of our rage bar
chilly brook
@rustic python we’re the best raid tanks rn behind blood and monk, both of which have been acknowledged by blizz to be overtuned
prisma crane
ultimately we're buffed, but imo not in the right ways, IP change will feel nice, and the only thing i'm actually happy about is blocking ranged physical attacks
chrome harbor
is blood overtunned in raids tho?
chrome falcon
No
chilly brook
Blow for blow we’re equal with Paladins
chrome falcon
The reason blood is popular in raids is because all the m+ players are maining it for gear
chilly brook
@chrome harbor they are
ornate sky
these changes are great for M+, blocking ranged and lower sb recharge
ornate sky
damage from avatar/ds hasn't changed
rustic python
I understand DC had to be changed.. but I would of liked it to be baselined or something.. it was our only interesting mechanic and now it's been fucked into the dirt.. and all we got was a few tuning qol changes.. nothing her is blowing my socks off and our damage is still gonna be trash
chilly brook
Still requires less EHRPS than us
prisma crane
@ornate sky yes it has, you wont have BV up the full avatar duration
chilly brook
So yes Blood is a better raid tank
ornate sky
oh true, 😦
chilly brook
Unless it’s played badly
prisma crane
you must be referring to ST
chilly brook
🤔
prisma crane
and i still wouldnt say trash
rustic python
single target I mean
chilly brook
I bursted over 16k on mother last night
rustic python
is trash
prisma crane
cuz aoe we're top/next to top
rustic python
yea yea yea
chrome falcon
our ST damage is fine lol
oblique garnet
11k on mother is bad as a tank?
chrome harbor
bear dmg is trash id say, ours is if anything on the lower side of meh?
oblique garnet
ST?
rustic python
I'm talking single target
chrome falcon
@oblique garnet it's pretty bad
rustic python
Prot cleave is amazing but single target is crapola
chilly brook
Finished Fetid with over 10k
oblique garnet
🤔
rustic python
prot pally destroys us single target
chrome falcon
It's good for a prot warrior
rustic python
and keeps up well in aoe
chrome falcon
100%
chrome harbor
#BuffShieldSlam
chrome falcon
prot pally does not keep up in aoe
at all
we absolutely obliterate everyone in aoe
chilly brook
Over 9k on vectis
rustic python
depends how big the pack is
chrome falcon
one thing I am interested in for 8.1 with the new affix
is maybe we can pull a million mobs
and do so much more fucking damage than bdk
that we pull ahead of the utility of mass grip
probably not though 🙃
rustic python
DK Grip is so amazing utility wise
chrome harbor
or in 8.1 we get banner back /hides
ornate sky
change charge to clash 8-)
rustic python
we lost our 3% heal from legion
ember arrow
Its not about our dmg
rustic python
Tank Damage matters
ember arrow
Gg is good because it lets others do more dmg
prisma crane
insp pres was good in raids, not in M+ @rustic python
rustic python
true
chrome falcon
Well blizzard doesn't seem to want to give us anything else @ember arrow so i'll take what I can get
rustic python
just make it a talent though.. so we can choose it if we want
ember arrow
Wat
rustic python
situationally
ember arrow
U get many buffs
chilly brook
Guys I think prot warrior is doing horrible damage /s
ember arrow
Still cry
rustic python
nerfed DC
chrome falcon
I'm not crying lul
I'm just saying we're not getting utility any time soon so hopefully our damage is enough to keep us competitive
rustic python
I am crying
astral crystal
i agree honestly, utility is our main issue, particularly for m+
chrome falcon
@chilly brook# our ST damage is pretty bad, linking a log of you doing well against OTHER prot warriors doesn't mean much
astral crystal
rallying cry isnt as useful as a hard displacement
chrome falcon
We have good raid utility
manic sentinel
Our damage is fine, and they just put out a short list of what they found on the PTR. That isn't final, there is still more to be done
Yall worried ab nothing
astral crystal
bears just got ursol's, pretty cool
chrome falcon
That's what we were saying for all of alpha and beta edri
I'm taking nothing for granted
rustic python
@manic sentinel by that logic we shouldn't of worried on PTR.. cause they weren't finished yet :^)
chrome harbor
isnt rallying cry also usable by arms/fury?
rustic python
yes ^
chrome falcon
Yes
prisma crane
@chilly brook at your % there, here's heroic fetid https://www.warcraftlogs.com/zone/statistics/19#difficulty=4&dataset=95&boss=2128&class=Tanks
chrome falcon
But no other tank has raid utility as strong as Rallying Cry
Situationally ofc BoP and mass grip are broken
rustic python
lmfao
astral crystal
g r i p
chrome falcon
But Rallying Cry is always good on every boss
prisma crane
go to max, and we're top
rustic python
every warrior has battle shout and rally and it doesn't stack
you dont need prot
take arms
manic sentinel
They specifically said they were working on something for help in the magic damage department, so until that comes out they haven't finished with changes. At least that much is certain
chrome falcon
@manic sentinel When did they say that
prisma crane
want to help? reflective plating, it's not even new
rustic python
Lower CD of Demo shout and I'll stop crying
manic sentinel
on one of the QA's
rustic python
where?
chrome harbor
true, idk I think id like to see a sort of return of banners, at least skull for quick burst dmg and demo for group dmg reduction, obviously messing with %'s to balance it out
chilly brook
@prisma crane looks pretty even to me
pastel halo
Is anger management too OP? seems like the other two need to be completely scrapped since they'll never compete in their current state. Maybe I mean too OP compared to the rest of its row.
manic sentinel
lemme try and find which one
astral crystal
i mean getting IP off the gcd is a magic mitigation buff
chrome falcon
@pastel halo Yes, AM is way too powerful to be a talent
There is no reason to take anything else over it, ever
rustic python
@chrome harbor Monk's got our banner and made it a second tank called dave
ornate sky
atleast point AM should be baseline for all three specs, and nerfed
chrome harbor
that dumb ox is really just the mocking banner i thought
ornate sky
it completely dominates arms too
rustic python
Arms gets AM
pastel halo
I'm trying to think of something to replace the other 2 t100 talents but they'd have to be ridiculous to see play
past sluice
Is protection warrior going to be any better in 8.1?
lusty grotto
druid crying in the corner
ornate sky
only reason fury doesnt use AM in raids is because its cds suck
rustic python
Yea these buffs are disappointing.. our damage is already abysmal on single target.. we are just gonna go lower now with DC nerf.. fuuu...
wicked ridge
didn't roar get nerfed into the ground
lusty grotto
after the bitching and moaning of Mythic KJ utlity
prisma crane
@astral crystal that's only true if you have the rage to support it
rustic python
if they aren't nerfing other tank dps.. it's gonna feelbad