๐ค
#protection
hot locust
sick sentinel
๐
hot locust
Lala also fails to kill G'huun until a whole week later than he should have. ๐ก
Lala fuckin' sucks.
sand egret
Lala...you're really not helping my cause to make you the Chuck Norris of the Prot channel....
jus' sayin'
sand egret
Oh shit yeah, I heard Sense one time used Shield Block and D/C'd because he blocked all the packets.
hot locust
Sounds about right.
digital arrow
LOL
hot locust
@raven kernel good luck! I have faith
neon tangle
my guild just got mother down this week, so m-g'huun in approximately never
sand egret
also heard Sense doesn't have Ignore Pain on his Warrior. Sense doesn't know the concept of pain to Ignore it.
lusty grotto
my guild got down heroic zek this week, so mythic in aproximately never.... and by guild i mean me by pugging
ran vectis 4 times this week
had bonus rolls saved
0 shields, 0 syringes
0 loot in all 4 runs
neon tangle
I got some 385 pants yeterday, so that was nice
I'm still at 368 equipped cause 355 trinkets + 340 DC piece
rip
lusty grotto
dang
broken kite
No
scarlet yacht
https://worldofwarcraft.com/en-us/character/area-52/Bowlby checking this madman out. and he tops on most fights
and noticed he has mostly mastery
broken kite
Haste is King
oblique garnet
Well idk
sand egret
maybe i'm missing something....how does mastery improve our dps?
hot locust
it's more like what stats you have barely matter.
just how much of them
and that guy is boosted ilvl
sand egret
yeah i see 383
broken kite
I guess he is gemming mastery
oblique garnet
Is it normal for warrior to have lower ehrps than a dk?
broken kite
I would think haste is better overall though
oblique garnet
On ghuun
neon tangle
@oblique garnet I always did vs. my DK
tiny sphinx
mast does increase attack power too remember
ivory barn
im sitting at this right now
neon tangle
I wonder what his block is
ivory barn
tooltip says "Blocking Reduces damage of an attack by X%
neon tangle
also referring to the guy with a ton of mastery
plain ice
gotta get your CoA rep up, friend
ivory barn
what do u get with CoA rep?
neon tangle
higher neck ilvl
ivory barn
im at honored atm
neon tangle
every level up to revered you get 15 ilvls / tier
carmine ibex
I haven't seen a shield drop in weeks. Finally got a 370 vector deflector last night.
Do a random +9 ML today and get a WF 370 ML shield.
less than 24 hours later.
supple path
Sounds about right.
My friend didn't get a weapon above 305 for the first 4 weeks of expansion...then got 8 in 24 hours.
neon tangle
what would you consider a reasonable period of time to go w/o getting any heals
like, while actively tanking a boss
supple path
Depends on the boss, doesn't it?
neon tangle
I died on G'huun and I didn't get a heal for like 15s
sick sentinel
Depends on tank player skill of its kit as well.
supple path
"Too damn high"
sick sentinel
Many variables.
carmine ibex
a reasonable period of time to go without getting heals is slightly less than amount of time that it takes for your health to deplete
supple path
It sounds sarcastic but it's true.^^
neon tangle
In this case logs just show my health dropping over 15s or so while actively tanking h-G'huun
sick sentinel
Unless n. N = blood dk.
neon tangle
until I died lol
supple path
I don't think 15 seconds of no heals on a raid boss like g'huun is even in question as a bad thing.
carmine ibex
if you died to lack of heals that implies it was unreasonable for you not to get heals in that period
its not even really a question of how long
supple path
Well tanks love saying they died to a lack of heals when they stood in a fire with their back to a mob, but yeah, that's a pretty clear case.
neon tangle
also no damage from anything but him
so not standing in the pizza or w/e
I think I need to talk to my healers a bit
same story on zul bleeds
steel mauve
my co tank and i bitch out our healers every week about externals, still doesnt get fixed
carmine ibex
you need to be focused on zul bleeds, healers often switch to the tanking tank and let the co tank die to the bleed on that fight
since it's counterintuitive for the tank not tanking to require more heals than the tank tanking
uneven mason
Yeah, there are 2 things that save you on Zul - being prep[ared with a BoP at a set location
and Guardian Spirit
carmine ibex
pain supression is helpful as well
uneven mason
because 60% extra healing is A MA ZING
carmine ibex
it's no bop
uneven mason
Pain supression means you have a disc priest
carmine ibex
disc is great on zul
uneven mason
Holy isb etter
neon tangle
tbh we have a holy priest
uneven mason
You can be like "Disc is Great on X" and the answer is "Holy is better"
neon tangle
I got a single renew from them
carmine ibex
I think that's debatable but I 'm not going to argue the point
uneven mason
Holy doesn't require badguys to be in range, it requires you to be in range. which is a lot easier than making sure both you and the bad guy are in range, also, Guardian SPirit
60% Bonus healing > 30% reduced damage from that DoT
neon tangle
I also just generally need to talk to them about external usage
neon tangle
they keep blowing them on m-zek after the tanks take the combo
uneven mason
but its not a Prot warrior friendly healer to be sure.
steel mauve
40% DR isnt it?
neon tangle
once we are now taking 0 damage
carmine ibex
disc has a higher skiill floor and ceiling so maybe you've just seen bad ones, I don't know. but "keeping badguys in range" really isn't even an issue
and GS is a better CD than PS, there's no debating that
uneven mason
It could be the priest is just better at Holy yeah
broken kite
We went a whole tier with 0 guardian spirit casts. Holy priest always attending. Good times :D
uneven mason
same priest - swaps specs
carmine ibex
disc has far far better throughput and efficiency than holy
uneven mason
which shows that there are some situations that they're more comfortable with one or the other.
I think efficiency yes
throughput
carmine ibex
yes throughput as well, holy can't compete with atonement for raw hps, unless the disc is bad
then it's terrible
uneven mason
Ah talking multi target
carmine ibex
you have to know all of the burst windows of every fight to know
holy has better single target heals
uneven mason
Yeah I don't care how much the priests healing is on 4 DPS + ME
I give a fuck about ME
because the DPS in general shouldn't be getting trucked, ever.
unless they're messing up
carmine ibex
yeah but you said "then you'd have to have a disc priest" implying in the raid, implying having them was bad.
there is unavoidable damage in almost every encounter
it's not about getting trucked
uneven mason
on Zul I've had bad times with the spec
carmine ibex
yeah i get it
i've had bad times with a lot of disc priests as well
because it's harder to play than holy
uneven mason
17 pulls on Zul - 2 Barrier casts
carmine ibex
but there is a reason why holy is getting buffs and disc is getting the nerf bat
because disc is op right now
steel mauve
i think like 4/6 of our healers are disc mains
uneven mason
when I repeated that for the 17th time (that they were not using barrier)
carmine ibex
if its played right
uneven mason
they finally got replaced
carmine ibex
yeah there are more bad disc priests than good ones
broken kite
????
carmine ibex
it's really weird to play compared to holy , holy is like a traditional healer, reactive, you see heal bars drain, you press buttons, they go back up.
carmine ibex
disc you absolutely can't do that
uneven mason
Disc is all proactive (so like prot warriors?)
carmine ibex
correct
neon tangle
I would like a good disc priest for fetid
carmine ibex
all proactive
neon tangle
that seems like it would be nice
broken kite
Seems performance is way ahead of "fine" when played well
carmine ibex
you have to time your heals like 6-7-8 GCDS in advance of burst windows
uneven mason
I'd like a good disc for fetid too, but I got benched tanking for mythic cause apperntly beating the paladin in self sustain and mitigation makes warriors bad
carmine ibex
disc performance is op when played well
actually OP
like far above all other healers
which is why they're getting heavy nerfs in 8.1
and zul is a fight very suited to their toolhit
toolkit*
as is mythrax, vectis, zek
g'huun too
neon tangle
real question, why is zul good for them? I not super sure what raid damage happens there
I am mainly too focused on watching my healthbar drop like a rock
carmine ibex
P1 has a ton of downtime, you can let dedicated healers like a restro druid heal all the chip damage and DPS important adds
light oasis
Everything does aoe on Zul. Dispels, big red circle
carmine ibex
then all the raid damage comes out during dark rev
on my priest I shoot from bottom hps to top HPS after the first dark rev, and I stay there for the rest of the fight
all the while doing good dps
keeping 2-3 atonements out for the small chip damage
light oasis
Ya I main mw and can pump dps early then go hard on tank healing p2
carmine ibex
yeah MWs are sick on zul
the only fights I really switch from diisc to holy are taloc (if we're short healers, otherwise i jsut go shadow), mother, and fetid (sometimes)
fetid is hit or miss because it's difficult to atonement after stomps
disc is annoying af on mother
and taloc is just a joke in general
but tanking M+ this week i'd also be super leery of taking disc priests
grievous is not good for disc
supple path
Disc priests are substantially more proactive than prot warriors, since it takes them a looot more globals to set up for 100% optimal healing during the spike.
carmine ibex
I'd take Hpals, H priests, MWs this week
i just tanks a +9 ML on my warrior with an absolute trash of a disc priets
0 barriers the entire dungeon, and 70% of his healing was shadowmend
no idea how to play the class
and I had the repair bill to show for it
shadow sequoia
is it just me taking way more damage this week compared to last week or is this week sucks ?
carmine ibex
this week sucks
uneven mason
Fortified weeks
carmine ibex
sucks really really bad
uneven mason
and grevious
carmine ibex
fort / grevious
uneven mason
like warriors have fuck all we can do about grev
neon tangle
fortified, and your healer is going to be distracted w/ other people
uneven mason
actually
neon tangle
I'm gonna aim to do 1 10 this week and that's it
carmine ibex
and some healers are not equipped to deal with it well
uneven mason
I'll correct myself
shadow sequoia
didn't they reduce it from 12% to 7% ?
carmine ibex
yeah, it seems it was reduced, but I still think it's overtuned
neon tangle
don't you lose bolster tho?
carmine ibex
grev is going to hurt worse at high stacks than not having SB up for a few seconds
carmine ibex
yeah
uneven mason
just situationally its something we can do
neon tangle
makes sense
carmine ibex
allows them to save themsleves or someone else
supple path
I was delighted to learn that heal potions and str potions are on different CDs now.
I now guzzle all the heal potions.
steel mauve
when were they on the same cd?
steel mauve
since before wod?
lusty grotto
i'm not even sure when they changed that
steel mauve
they werent in wod or later
steel mauve
no way to tell
sick sentinel
i guess i'll sim?
lusty grotto
you can't
sick sentinel
rly
steel mauve
not really, with BC crit was devalued
sick sentinel
why?
shadow sequoia
even health pots and lock healthstone are on different cds so you can use both
steel mauve
prot sim module isnt working so we cant sim
sick sentinel
so i'll just equip my best haste gear then
lusty grotto
yeah haste works great
sick sentinel
fury main
lusty grotto
makes deep wounds tick faster
lowers your cds
etc etc
crit wasn't devalued due to BC at all
sick sentinel
ive got 395 crit vers legs adn 375 haste crit legs
lusty grotto
in legion i mean
steel mauve
well it gained value once we lost BC, so im guessing it was devalued, haste was still our highest dps stat
sick sentinel
25 ilvls
lusty grotto
you use highest ilvl always
sick sentinel
always?
steel mauve
its all in our pins and in the icyveins guide
sick sentinel
im in stat prio thing in icy veisn
str was below haste etc
so i figured
ilvl wasnnt that importnt
but sure
lusty grotto
also str has both defensive and offensive value
vocal nimbus
Also, all secundaries are very close to each other
lusty grotto
right ilvl pieces except on rings and on Azerite with Deafening Crash (you need 1 always - not more not less)
vocal nimbus
The raw stat amount you gain from ilvl itself may prove better than "better" secondaries
lusty grotto
make it a priority if you want to tank well
since it extends demo shout and that's a huge defensive skill that you should maintain
sick sentinel
trinkets tho
got syringe and DMF dps trinket
and thenn a bunch of pvp trinks
360 ilvl
the ones with vers and proc primary stat
lusty grotto
DMF blockades and syringe is fine
sick sentinel
or on use primare
lusty grotto
if you dont have blockades just use highest STR
sick sentinel
i can buy blockaddes nnp
ignore all the double letters btw
macbook pro 2017 keyboard op
-_-
lusty grotto
Blockades + Jes howler are our 2 strongest one, in the trinket guide in the pins
defensively
sick sentinel
cool
lusty grotto
Blockades + Syringe is really good for M+
sick sentinel
i'll go grab a blockades
lusty grotto
and of course Rezan is ridiculous too
lusty grotto
doesn't matter
vagrant cape
there's nothing we can do about stats, so whatever you have is fine
lusty grotto
you need a better shield and a deafening crash piece ASAP though
sick sentinel
i'll work on it
vagrant cape
after a Dc piece
sick sentinel
in my chest ive got laser matrix
lusty grotto
after a DC piece yea
sick sentinel
as only available uldir trait
i need one right
im alrdy at 7 stacks
of the secondary
lusty grotto
no DC pieces in uldir
vagrant cape
that's fine, since no chest pieces have deafening crash
lusty grotto
right
sick sentinel
yeye
vagrant cape
chest is best place for uldir trait
lusty grotto
laser is fine for the haste
vagrant cape
have fun with those m0s
vocal nimbus
it pulls things out of combat
vagrant cape
that's true, laser matrix pulls packs you're not incomabt with
vocal nimbus
like in m+ and such
steel mauve
it pulls through walls and entire dungeons
sick sentinel
ah fuck
vocal nimbus
in zekvoz laser is a no-no too
vocal nimbus
for all specs
worthy dagger
Is Never surrender viable considering prots pretty much spam ignore pain
hot locust
No.
shut summit
nop
worthy dagger
I mean, 60s cooldown on Bolster is insane but you can lower it with Anger Management
clear sapphire
worthy dagger
Damn we are all fucked then, theres no talents viable other the usual we pick
soft kindle
Most specs have that
worthy dagger
Yeah but you can always squeeze something here and there, prots dont have an option
soft kindle
A lot of specs are in the same place as prot, talent wise. Varying levels of extreme
but same basic story. Not taking X or Y talent is just a silly choice, because you're going to be noticeably sub-par
little rain
Anyone else get a chance to read this swiss cheese of facts post on reddit?
post shoulda been renamed : "I'm a casual fotm player, I'm going to get nerfed, please support this post that's going to look through a microscope so I dont get nerfed"
This is the stuff that actually hard triggers me
soft kindle
ยฏ_(ใ)_/ยฏ
I think dk healing needs to be toned down a tad, but nothing massive. Rather see prot and bear brought up to the level of BrM and dk
than the latter two brought down
little rain
I mean, he used my logs, Glicks', and Toast's in one Atal'Dazar to try and normalize the classes
That's some omega small brain
worthy dagger
I just want my sexy prot warrior to be at least close to other tanks
vocal nimbus
I always thought that you could balance bdks utility with a simple proffesion item for other classes
We all know that bdks are slow, they can use skystep potions tho
Why not let engineers make something called "hook mine/trap/whatever" which hooks in a maximum number of mobs
Like a nerfed, maybe on a longer CD, mass grip
topaz ember
isnt the plan for dk to buff healing and nerf armour?
vocal nimbus
They nerfed armor and a talent that increased EHP
chrome falcon
Oh boy is it time for another argument about how nerfing BDK's numbers is a bad idea because it nerfs them in raids where they are perfectly balanced
@vocal nimbus This is 100% correct, if you aren't going to nerf BDKs then engineers need a 30 gold mass grip mine
chrome falcon
I think it's the best solution
You could even give it a stupid sounding name about magnets or something, blizzard loves that shit
uneven mason
5min CD ON Gorefiends
fair root
bdk's dont need numbers nerfs, they need utility balancing. making aoe death grips longer cd or costing runic power.
uneven mason
give Bonestorm a tick cap
@chrome falcon Call them Dyson Spheres
if they short out everyone dies
Dual meaning
chrome falcon
5 min CD on gorefiends would not be long enough
That's roughly how often they use it anyway
sick sentinel
Even if they don't short out everyone still dies
uneven mason
make it ONLY grip to themselves
chrome falcon
Make gorefiend's grasp a talent that replaces single grip
uneven mason
ooo
and gives it a 2min CD
or 3min
Or just I dunno remove an ability which has repeatedly been proven to be a problem point
vocal nimbus
Once again, blood theorycrafting in prot ๐ค
sick sentinel
Wasn't Grasp a talent at one point?
uneven mason
Nah
chrome falcon
It was for other Dk specs
sick sentinel
Really? Or am I thinking of a CD reduc talent for gc
uneven mason
it wasa CD reduction
sick sentinel
Ah ok
Didn't we have "attention grabber" in mocking ban and if u taunt at or near it, it would aoe taunt everything?
I think brm have something like thay
thorn yarrow
fair root
we still getting taunt reset on hleap in 8.1?
sick sentinel
No
They removed the "complexity" of shockwave by making it a talent
U think they are going to put something like that baseline and not be some catch with it
uneven mason
Prot talents in BFA kind've just felt liek they went "Well, what utility niceities do they have right now that we could totally gut and pass off as actual talents since the dead chimp we have working on Prot warriors in the "UTILITY CLOSET" hasn't come up with anything, Oh gut Thunderclap snare and remove Shockwaves CD reduction, sounds great.
HEy guys what could we do to sell Dragons Roar to prot warriors _ OH give it TCs snare component so it feels like they didn't lose anyting SOUNDS GREAT
Also @vocal nimbus We do Blood Theorycrafting here because all in all, Prot feels great to play, I'm loving it, It really feels that overall, the only thing that Prot really needs as a "buff" is to have Monks and BDKs "nerfed"
Since any actual buff would probably cross us into solidly OP territory, and I rather enjoy being the black licorice ice cream flavor of the month, quite the acquired taste.
leaden grail
recently started tanking on my warrior. havent done any raiding yet, but maybe half a dozen keys. having really big trouple surviving larger trash pulls. do you just start kiting really early as prot while maintaining aggro because you did so much damage with avatar in the first few seconds?
quaint kiln
Charge in shield wall heroic leap out and let the rogue evasion tank
Seems to work well
Youโll die a lot less
leaden grail
by having a dps tank? feels .. discomforting
uneven mason
Or just have the rogue Tricks to you
leaden grail
so the actual trick is just kiting really early yeah?
uneven mason
Or just shield wall, utilize stuns when SW fades then if anything is left up just kite
I mean, depends on your gear vs key
at 372 anything up to a 10 you can facetank most trash unless the trash is your healer.
leaden grail
370+ vs 10+
leaden grail
maybe i just didnt play around my cooldowns correctly
oblique garnet
There are some packs that on fortified are absolute aids
leaden grail
e.g. i died really really fast by pulling .. i think 3 maggot packs in WM on a +11
i mean i lived in the end but i dropped super low super fast
quiet kettle
grats @hot locust in colab with talic
hot locust
Thanks!
shut summit
๐
chilly brook
Well anyone looking for a newly displaced warrior tank (I can be a warrior DPS)?
clear sapphire
get kicked from raid?
quiet kettle
look in promotion channel
chilly brook
Removed from guild for not wanting to do heroic Uldir for a raid that has an average ilvl of 371
@clear sapphire
After we've had three weeks of only one night in mythic
When we're supposed to be doing exclusively mythic and we're a two night a week guild
sick sentinel
Did they not like mythic?
chilly brook
We were supposed to be a guild going for CE but apparently we don't have the roster to be able to raid Mythic the second night if one person can't make it
grand trellis
how to make prot the best tank ever, make dragon charge baseline
steel mauve
sounds like leadership did you a favor
supple path
oh god dragon's charge would be so amazing in m+
the amount of horrible, horrible things people would do with it makes me smile just thinking.
chilly brook
@steel mauve I was on my way out anyways tbh
digital arrow
i love dragon charge
simple lintel
Hey guys I had to tank H uldir last night for our raid. I'm NOT the tank normally. Long story short everything was fine all the way until zul. How do you guys consistently survive zul's 2nd phase. I had a hell of a time going through 3 rounds of that debuff
simple lintel
We did that once but then the 2nd round and after was really rough
fair root
we have markers on the outside to call where we are moving to and a monk dedicated to healing the tank dropping debuff
steel mauve
i mean a raid team needs to be upfront of their goals and ambitions and match them
simple lintel
I'm wondering if this part of the problem was we were missing 2 healers who we typically have. We had an Exodus of sorts with eight of our core Raiders.
steel mauve
thats how we were, stated up front we were previously a top 200 team but in legion we only cared about CE and didnt try to achieve top 200 any more
digital arrow
im having trouble with zul too, im not sure if i should drop the blood debuff closer to the group... my healers are out of range when i go to the opposite edge of the group
uneven mason
Thats on them
they need to be within range of you
No tank can walk it out alone (well, BrM, but fuck them)
digital arrow
yeah maybe it was band rng and they got that death sentence debuff
where they walk to the edge
uneven mason
I mean, I walked 4 stacks out like a boss
my trinket procced and I dumped 120 rage into IP then last stand + Rally + Cookie
he died before my 2nd run of 4 stacks became a "problem" to findout if I Could do it again
I had just lept out and he keeled over.
Getting a tank who properly can taunt on 3 stacks is like shitting after being constipated for a week.
What a relief
Cause 3 is no problem
oblique garnet
We have good heals so 4 aint that big of an issue on hc
Also veiled eye is a lifesaver on zul
uneven mason
mmhmm
since it stacks with IP
quite a bit of DR
right when you need it
generally the last tick and intercepting back out
oblique garnet
- cookies
uneven mason
Only time I've needed cookie iswhen I KNOW I won't be getting trucked by 1 healer
I have a HPriest that is basically my backpack that fight
and he got feared when I had 4 stacks
He got the fear but I felt the terror
oblique garnet
Better safe than sorry ^^
We fucked up once on zul by me having aggron on zul and the crusher didnt go down fast enough so it got 100 energy just as zul went to p2 and it got the 50% dmg buff but we still killed it without much hassle
uneven mason
at 355 (first kill) That would've been a wipe for us as well, now that most of the raiders are at 375+ Its like "Lol Crusher, k, Lust"
oblique garnet
oh you lust at p2?
uneven mason
yeah
we generally beat the 3rdcrusher by a few seconds
but if we have a bad set of fears/bombs
I should say
we lust around 45%
I suppose we could go back to bullying him
we've just gotten really used to doing it with lust to push
rather than lust on pull
oblique garnet
You have dks right?
uneven mason
While learning it we tried it both ways, and because lust is also a healing CD (of sorts) the extra oomph during that phase was out pacing the additional stacks
yeah
A Dk
single
uneven mason
My first kill was with no DKs
And it is rougher
we hada BrM
so a ranged silence + taunt (they run faster in) was almost a Deathgrip
oblique garnet
We just cc the hexers and mong it down most of the times
Now my guild doesnt raid anymore tho
Everyone just sorta left when we got ghuun down
cinder nova
Mythic?
oblique garnet
Nah
Only 2/8m
Didnt have a solid 20man roster
Atm searching for potential guild but tanks are almost never looked for
uneven mason
Got sat for Mythic, cause prot warriors are bad, watching my guild get eaten alive by mother because the paladin and BDK are getting trucked by everything under the sun
If only they could mitigate and not die
Also professional level forcing your #1 DPS to swap to tanking Because you've been drinking the SCOolAid
"A bad BDK must be better than a Warrior who beats the Protadin on self healing"
Not bitter
Really
zinc mauve
o
uneven mason
cause 3GCDs later I'm reapplying Demoshout to Zul
dull pilot
cloud bone
make them build our shield wall
soft kindle
Fetid hits pretty hard
open bluff
welp, finally went and took my warr through a few normal bosses (only 353 and it's just an alt)
felt pretty good 
chilly brook
@uneven mason could be worse, you coulda gotten kicked because you didnโt want to do a mandatory heroic instead of Mythic because one person couldnโt make it and because the majority of the raid doesnโt need heroic and youโd be better off using that time that youโd be doing heroic on getting a head start on some school projects that are due next week
open bluff
even the mrs is saying she prefers healing my warr to my pally 
chilly brook
It's a matter of playing correctly or being a worse tank than the others
But people don't seem to understand where that line is
topaz ember
or playing the best but still being the worst
chilly brook
Well people that aren't playing prot that is
@topaz ember that's not even correct tho
We're better raid tanks than bear and DH
And I'd say about on par with pally
We're worse than a well played Blood DK
But not by much
And there aren't a lot of people that play blood well mind you
And then you have monk which a monkey could play one handed and not notice a difference between a good BrM and the monkey
open bluff
well comparing my pally to warrior, dtps was similar at similar ilvls on the same bosses
soft kindle
warr takes less damage, played proper, pally just has some healing
Which is better depends on the scenario tbh
open bluff
just a little less dps on the warrior, but part of that's due to not having seraphim and part of it's due to not having current expac pots on the warrior because lazy
open bluff
def
next goblet
i well played warrior can out tank a lot of things
analog scroll
U press shield block, then u pray for critical block
chilly brook
@open bluff which further supports what I'm saying we're on par with pally pretty much, ahead of druid and DH and behind monk and dk but surprise surprise everyone is
uneven mason
We're spot on with paladin actually
open bluff
yeah
i'm just preferring pally atm because i have the gear on it and it pushes a bit more dps, my raid can be pretty low on that from time to time
open bluff
and rallying cry
topaz ember
we bring leech for all
soft kindle
which is nothing to scoff at
topaz ember
how many vr did you cast?
soft kindle
what a slut
uneven mason
None
IP counts as self healing NEWSFLASH
Rather, Consumed IP counts
Proper IP use 
topaz ember
any leech?
uneven mason
uh, mebbiea little?
broken kite
We don't have group leech anymore @topaz ember
topaz ember
my god i have been away for 1 patch and i didnt even notice
uneven mason
๐ค We lost it 2 patches ago
topaz ember
when do we lose it?
uneven mason
prepatch
which was technically 1 I guess
So yeah, I'm also traited for healing
cause thats how my dice have fallen for gear
topaz ember
veil a trinket?
uneven mason
IV is not an unsubstantial amount of healing
soft kindle
mythrax trinket
uneven mason
yeah got a 385 socketed, couldn't argue with it
uneven mason
its got its uses
esp on fights wherey ou get trucked and your healers might find themselves uh......feared
topaz ember
i might swap loot spec for it i want to get back into tanking in 8.1
soft kindle
if the CD was just a bit shorter it'd be ๐
soft kindle
I'd take 1:15 or 1:30 tbh
uneven mason
I'm rarely under 40%
But its a solid str stick
and has that "mebbie I'll need it" appeal
Like watching a HDH Leghump 2 healers running back on Mythrax and get them both MC'd
that's a buttpucker
topaz ember
do we have any 8.1 changes yet?
uneven mason
We have one trait that makes avatar even more incredible
thus far that is the entierty of our changes
know what would be amazing
soft kindle
if you guys get Hot blood cold steel
uneven mason
if they made it so "Thunderclap increases the value of Ignore pain by the damage you deal"
It'd give us some M+ trash scaling
"Bigger pulls, bigger balls"
whelp back to watching VBasic tutorials ZZZzzz
neon tangle
I would mind the heroic or mythic version of that trinket
The norm is very underwhelming
uneven mason
yeah I'd say the 385 ilvl is what makes it really nice
I keep hoping for some 385 bandages
but thus far my M+ cache has hated me
I keep getting boots and legs
Like I have more pants in game than I do IRL
topaz ember
i would stil be running a 340 helm but i bought the 355 rep helm
neon tangle
Wait is there a 355 rep helm with DC?
neon tangle
Ahh, yeah Iโve got a 370 for each slot, just waiting on a DC item to be able to use them
uneven mason
I have a 370 DC item
neon tangle
With my luck Iโll get a 370 helm with DC and have to unequip my 385 helm
topaz ember
i got 385 shoulders
uneven mason
sadly I haven't gotten shit for Uldir drops in 370, besides the slot I have the 370 DC item in (Chest)
sick sentinel
Ulduar Pog
sonic fog
When did Demoralizing Shout went down from 45 secs to 15 secs cd?
just saw it and i was shocked
graceful mason
pvp talent
topaz ember
if that was baseline we would be the number 1 tank
sick sentinel
Sounds more like a monkeys paw
raven kernel
Swimming in rage if baseline
sick sentinel
Honestly that could make it 20sec cd baseline and remove demo shout from AM or some shit
uneven mason
I mean, at 20second baseline
we'd have 100% uptime
might as well just increase our mitigation vs all damage by 20% And save us the GCDs
sick sentinel
You know what? Just give is 20% damage reduction and leave demo is at is, yeah
pearl sinew
Hey all, I am a BM tank at the moment in early mythic progression. I was wondering how Warriors are doing in Heroic / Mythic raiding at the moment. I really miss him, but every forum is doom and gloom for warrs. Are they really that bad :(?
uneven mason
They're a lot harder to play than BrM
BrM is basically "tanking on auto pilot"
Warrior is "Better be a Zen master"
pearl sinew
Ahh got ya
uneven mason
We're not bad, just you can't fuckup
neon tangle
BrM is also like 75% of the mythic Gโhuun kills
uneven mason
There is a video released showing why though Sadbox
the difference between a professional level BrM
and a dead Chimpanzee at the keyboard is like 18%~
neon tangle
I mean yeah
uneven mason
"dude stands there and doesn't use any AM - still lives
neon tangle
Doesnโt matter though, results matter
uneven mason
I mean, prot warriors could tank Mythic Ghuun, but no guild is willing to take one lol
vagrant cape
Question for m+ this week. if people are getting rekt, do I pop rallying cry or not?
uneven mason
Greiv is sitll % damage ya?
vagrant cape
if I pop it, they get health, but it's harder to get grievous off
yes
and grievous will still do the same %
uneven mason
probably not a super great idea IMHO
mind you, if you're getting wreckt, pop Rally/Last Stand and then cancel aura them
neon tangle
I say this as a prot warrior, if I had a fully geared BrM in a M guild Iโd stick with that until 8.1 for prot warrior
vagrant cape
oh yeah, if I had a geared BDK I'd for sure be playing that
but I'm too lazy to take it from 100 to 110
110 to 120*
uneven mason
Like, I'm tanking on par with equally geared BrM/BDK/Paladins (taking less damage on avg tbh) but I got sat because community perception
Funtimes
neon tangle
Pretty much
uneven mason
Likeapples to apples I literally am equal in healing and damage taken with my paladin cotank on our HC Ghuun fights
vagrant cape
it's such bullshit. It's like bias anywhere else. We have to prove ourselves while people assume that other tanks are more qualified
like, I have to supply logs and prove that my mitigation is solid in order for my raid officers to consider me for tanking mythic uldir
uneven mason
it was funny too he was all like "Well I deal with the Explosive better"
and I'm like "You know I can spell reflect that shit right?"
vagrant cape
explosive as in the m+ affixes?
uneven mason
- Opens mouth to sound like a badass, 2. Proves he knows nothing about warriors and is suggesting I don't tank mythic because he sucks a lot of Method cock
the debuff on Ghuun
its late and I have a migrain ><
But this homework won't finish itself
neon tangle
Yeap, โwarriors canโt deal with magic damageโ, โI take 75% less damage than our monk in void lashes...โ
uneven mason
and is due in 55 minutes
Yeah but the monk can't die
unless you know
you don't taunt
....
I did that once
neon tangle
Lol
uneven mason
"I can survive anything"
OH, like a melee hit after eating both stacks? OK lets try that
Because I know I come out of that at 90% health
lets see how you do
My favorite, picking up a Yogg add after eating a full combo, have the Hpal bitch that I was hard to heal "Its like my Holyshock did nothing"
๐
alrighty, saltshaker is empty.
fringe marten
Has anyone tried using Impending victory (combined with the azerite talent for it) for this week? Losing 15% haste is awful..but gaining a 20% heal with a 16k+ absorb shield..to combat grievous?
I'm gonna' try it in a low key
onyx vessel
Prob not worth
sick sentinel
not worth.
just get a bunch of mage food or darkmoon feasts to spam after/between pulls.
https://gyazo.com/e12f00c75fda47d7303fb4ff1cfaa22c Sense powerful
fringe marten
Well, I've already done a few 12's and such this week, and I'm already about 1400 rated..so if I want to gain score this week I need to approach things differently or 'hope' to find a higher rated team to push with.
sick sentinel
the 15% haste loss for a top off heal cannot be worth the recharge you'd lose to shield block, along with synergy of other abilities usage into your CDs.
fringe marten
Yeah that's what my gut is telling me Bethrez
sick sentinel
once a 30s top of, which does no good if no target available unless you rush towards another pull, after the previous.
fringe marten
but it's not only a 20% heal but a 16k absorb shield. I don't think losing 15% haste is worth..slowing down gcd's, shield block..etc.
But healing is such a big deal this week..
I'm going to do a Tol Dagor 9, something weak and cheesy..see how I like it.
I have 22% haste without it..which is still not as good as 37% =\
manic perch
i must be the worst warrior tank here lol i cant even finish 10 on time this week get absolutely mauled
manic perch
shrine and kings rest on fortified is just so damn hard
junior ivy
mhm im probably doing temple 11 tomorrow ๐ฆ
manic perch
good luck bro, that is just as hard we RIP a +8 but also all of us screwed up at some stage but that lat boss with griev ouch
raven kernel
idk about my KR 13 key
amber siren
no? why would IP be the best when a DK or DH could heal it off
manic perch
i have a guildie that wanbts to do +10 KR, i know we will never make it, just wondering if its worth the 2 hours in there......
raven kernel
depends on power of friendship
manic perch
yeah guess i need to be the good guy and go get my ass pounded in kr 10 like a hooker at frat party
dapper sky
What is the general strategy for taking the entire combo for zekvoz?
manic perch
ip up for 1st void lash with demo shout
then shield block up with ip if u can for shatter demo will still be up
then reflect last void lash with ip again if you can demo will still be up
then burn rage like madman till u have all up for your next turn again @dapper sky
hushed creek
With bracers griev was just no problem, now... It's so sad we cant do shit to help healer get us up.
dapper sky
Gotcha, thanks. That's basically how I was handling it.
fringe marten
hm. the WA I set up for impending victory was if it was available, or off cd..and I was at or under 80% hp. it did 1.86m healing in TD 9, as a comparative last stand did 1.11m and Ignore pain did 2.15m. I could feel the loss of haste and it cut off a noticable chunk of my zonewide dps.
I loved having a little self heal...i definitely missed the haste.
Bury the hatchet (the shield proc from impending victory) did 670k..so overall the shield+actual heal was above ignore pain for the zone.
orchid sky
Guys do you think what they will change in prot warrior ?
sick sentinel
they changed entire rotation on NH patch so anything can be expected from blizz
possibly higher rage generation either buff or bit of a rework for IP is what i am thinking of
quiet kettle
im thinking a buff to IP (likely reduced rage cost), a potential shield block buff (slightly reduced cd, ie 12s recharge to like 10s recharge), and probably a buff to non-used talents cause u know we only have like 1 talent setup
sick sentinel
last thing i will think is blizz reworking talents we have right now tbh
ravager is there for so long its kinda a meme prot having dead talents
but who knows as long as they make a fun rotation im in
quiet kettle
while its true every spec has dead talents (for entire xpacs or more) prot has always been consistent in most of the talents being useless
topaz ember
i work at blizz new leaked buffs are indom now gives 15% stam revenge costs no rage and we removed the 100 talent row and just give +2% armour as base to compensate it
fringe marten
Is it just the lack of legendaries, class changes or what.. but healers seem to REALLY be hating grievous much more than legion.
ionic fern
Tanks that can off heal (Prot pally/Brm) are a big help now on Grievous weeks..especially since their heals got buffed. So they can help top people after the combat to remove the debuff
static lance
healer output isn't as high this time around
fringe marten
Loving some ret paladin too...word of glory so stronk~
sudden gazelle
What are your thoughts on xalxaixs veiled eye? Got it yesterday at 370 ilvl
lavish oracle
Just bringing a stack of plain, no buff food helps a ton this week
small flicker
so is anger management just the best since haste gives us rage?
brittle timber
Anger Management is best because of obscene synergy with Booming Voice, Unstoppable Force and Bolster
river birch
Good morning guys, I am returning player and have a quick question probably have been asked before so apologise, does darkmoon trinkets are still worth buying? if yes blockades phantom or both? I've got 340 Jes' Howler thanks for advice
clear delta
Is blockades better than 370 Xalzaix's veiled eye? https://www.wowhead.com/item=160653/xalzaixs-veiled-eye&bonus=4798:1477
river birch
cool it is cheaper on my server a lot I would say ๐
clear delta
or 360 rezans?
onyx vessel
Isnt blockades bis for survivability regradless of ilvl
brittle timber
Blockades can only be one ilvl so......
Still, it's better than a heroic eye in most situations
onyx vessel
For me its bis cuz i dont get any good trinkets
river birch
thanks for advice
well trinkets and weapon are hard to get at least for me
and shield ofc
sudden gazelle
What are your thoughts on xalxaixs veiled eye? Got it yesterday at 370 ilvl
anyone?
broken kite
that was lucky ๐
lavish oracle
if you find yourself dropping below 50% life often to make use of the proc, its probably pretty useful, otherwise its just a strength stat stick.
Nice pants
sick sentinel
Well I decided against my better judgement to not only tank this week but also tank KR+10
It wasnt as hard as I expected but my healer, a disc, didn't help. Not a bad healer but man I could see the affix just not caring about his Mana bar
brave jetty
how's temple this week?
tulip pond
3rd boss can be rough this week
sick sentinel
3rd boss is hard if you dont make sure everyone grabs the right amount of stacks
I typically go for 20 stacks because thats when the damage is actually noticeable
but if u have a good group you might not ever end up getting that many
random finch
I use the xalxaixs eye trinket with razens the eye proc has saved my ass more then I can count it also always come in when Iโm at the downtime but have nothing left
sick sentinel
I just want either the normal or heroic veiled from uldir and then I need to get the trinket at 370 from KR
Cause im using blockades with 355 kr trinket and its good but I need it higher so I can do better
Since I find rezans to become pointless since im already at a 12 sec cd recharge with SB
fair root
370 rezans or blockades?
sick sentinel
It does, and @fair root depends, whats your other trinket
fair root
others 370 veiled eye (mythrax trinket)
sick sentinel
Unless you have ur Shield block recharge at 12/13 seconds baseline or get there with a 3-5 stacks of Into the fray, go block
otherwise use rezan
ionic fern
What's the haste needed to get Shield block that low? ๐ค
sick sentinel
45%
ionic fern
๐
sick sentinel
Or close to 45
And in any dungeon/raid chances of u being below 3 stacks of Into the Fray is almost impossible
The only possible way for that to happen is if you have range only, and you only have 1 add ur pulling
and having high uptime on SB for 1 add wont kill you
small flicker
do bosses give 5 stacks of into the fray regardless? I know vek did but that fight had adds
steady dock
Nah, 1 per unit, regardless of what the unit is
steady dock
Though... I don't know whether hunter pets count
steady dock
Raw, Mitigated afaik
steady dock
I love those numbers ๐
ocean acorn
lol
ionic swallow
A is absorb...missing in picture ๐
B-block
R-Raw hit
M- mitigated
% mitgated percentil
robust bronze
how much is brace impact worth comaped to reinforeced plating? cuz i have 355 piece with brace and 375 with reinforced plating
amber siren
only trait worth dropping ilvl for is deafening crash
sonic pilot
375.. How?
mellow bridge
370 with heart level high enough to get the +5 ilvl in the middle of the rings
robust bronze
my heart is 379 so
sonic pilot
Ah k
crisp stone
But then wouldn't it be a 360 piece ๐ค
robust bronze
cuz i tok the upgrade into account
onyx vessel
Well and archive
dire coral
So is prot a thing on PTR?
soft kindle
Would it not be?
dire coral
a buddy said he heard prot was doing really good on PTR but couldnt find any info on it, so was just wondering.
ionic fern
No big changes. ๐คท
steady locust
Mastery will change. But no info as of now, as far as i know...
ionic swallow
i heard that try new mastery with 200% healing from blockable dmg. But i dont see more information.
trim knoll
Hey guys! I'm looking for some advice about when to use Shield Block. Is it worth waiting about 3 seconds before the recharge to pop it, or should I be using both charges as soon as I can?
steel mauve
Use it if youll be tanking the full duration, like use it earlier if you are about to swap but it will fall off, dont use it last second and only tank 2 seconds of the new duration
brittle timber
Even if you use it early, it still adds the full six seconds...always
dusk locust
huh TIL. i thought it was a pandemic thing around 2 or 3 seconds left
torpid socket
Hello guys, I have a hard time choosing trinkets between those 3, could you give me some advice? (note that I'm at 16s cd baseline of shield block, 14s with 5 stacks into the fray, and playing only mm+)
mellow bridge
rezans and doom i think
brittle timber
rezan's and buy a blockades
torpid socket
I am, looking for more sustain
brittle timber
yea, if you're not worried about dying at all...use the big ole doom's fury
amber siren
then uncle's right, blockades and doom would be better
otherwise rezan and doom still
torpid socket
doom's fury gives +10% pary the first 3s of the 15s, then 9%, 7%, 5%, 3%, is that worth anything for mitigation?
with my current stats
amber siren
yeah it's fine for mit, main thing is that it's a huge 314 str stat stick
brittle timber
stat sticks are where it's at
dusk locust
after going primarily for ilvl i've ended up with more mastery than haste. think i should take an ilvl hit to get haste above mastery so the azerite uldir buff gives me haste?
torpid socket
thanks alot, I'll think I'll drop the bandages since everybody seems to distaste it, including me ๐ (the amount is decent but not the duration)
amber siren
@dusk locust honestly depends on what you're dropping to shift your stats around
dusk locust
probably something like a 385 armor piece in favor of a 370
i'd have to look at what i have available
brittle timber
I doubt it would be worth giving up actual armor...maybe 15ilvls on a ring at most would be worth
dusk locust
Ring would be a decent idea
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/FM9PwHgynDdX8qxG#fight=6&type=summary&source=2 I noticed the huge pile of mastery and figured I should fix it
brittle timber
At least mastery is a good stat
coral bramble
I know that when upgrading azerite gear, ilvl is normally king, but I'm worried trading away my only Brace for Impact (340 chest) for my second Reinforced Plating (370 chest).
The raw damage reduction on the block increase feels to be of more value than the raw armor from the huge pile of str from the Reinforced plating + ilvl boost.
I'm just wondering if I'm being worried for no reason, or if I'm at all justified.
soft kindle
You're overthinking it my dude
The only trait really worth dropping buckets of ilvl for is DC
dusk locust
yeah that's the impression i'm under
hence my 340 shoulders (though apparently i should be pvping to get 355)
primal crypt
coral bramble
I lucked out with a 385 DC helm, but it still feels funky trading something that feels nice to use for some str stat booster.
Either way, thanks guys! ๐
frosty wedge
kauda - what's your current ilvl?
dusk locust
374
frosty wedge
ah, fair enough - have you been doing the emmisaries for 370 gear?
dusk locust
yeah. the latest one i don't think i've done yet
i'm locked into my shoulders though until i find a new DC piece
tropic star
if you are alliance, does the PVP emmisary have a chance to drop the hrode side dungeon gear
dusk locust
and i have mother helm which is pretty good
frosty wedge
true - is there no DC on any of the emmisary shoulders?
dusk locust
i'm not sure offhand
tropic star
Tirisgarde Sound emissary should ahve a chance to drop the Siege of Boralus shoulders
and then voldun should have a chance to drop the TOS Shoulders
both have DC
frosty wedge
naw that's not how that works I don't think - I think emmisary gear is just zone specific
it's not from dungeons in that zone
sand egret
^
coarse jay
Quick question to the more experienced prot warriors around here...AskMrRobot says I need to gem and enchant ALL Vers, but the stat weights in the guides say I should gem and enchant haste. Should I ignore AskMrRobot and keep on going haste, or should I change to Vers?
frosty wedge
"harbormaster pauldrons" are from tiragarde emmsiary I believe
sand egret
I wouldn't sim too much for Prot, personally
tropic star
general consensus is Haste is best of the secondaries
sand egret
Haste is great, as it's most noticeable impact is reducing Shield Block's CD. I personally love me some haste. That being said, the stats are really so close that it's kinda up to you to balance your character
I do a lot of M+ so I enchant/gem for mastery
frosty wedge
so yeah kauda you can get 370 shoulders from emmisary caches
tropic star
more rage, smaller SB gaps
astral crystal
lower gcd also btw
sand egret
yeah but that's just global haha
astral crystal
which makes prot seem pretty fluid
tropic star
I feel like getting the GCD as small as possible helps offset IP being in the gcd
astral crystal
it's huge imo
sand egret
but Prot suffers from a lot of stuff to do at once, so it's a good point
mild bough
feelsbadman
tropic star
what was the key
oblique garnet
im guessing that was to uldir
mild bough
yea h ghuun pug
tropic star
thats even dumber
coarse jay
thx for the responses. II thought haste was generally the right call (for all of the reasons you guys listed above)
sand egret
Shield Block the haters, I say.
tropic star
warriors are great at ghuun.
mild bough
yea spell reflects ftw
tropic star
I usually run the first orb, can spell relect the orbs
sand egret
smart people understand the value the war brings, if they don't see that you're probably already in for a bad time
mild bough
yea probably a blessing
mellow bridge
jesus
Just got here
first thing I read "smart people understand the value the war brings"
๐ค
plain vapor
for ghuun
mellow bridge
yea I saw that afterwards
sand egret
on a side note, there was a M+ focused interview on FatBoss I think, but the real gem was one of the top tanks on the show was asked about "how viable is Prot" and he was like..."Ya'll are probably going to meme me but I think it's totally viable, as much as DH's". Gotta say, it was nice to hear that haha
mellow bridge
for a second I thought I got into some political discussion here lmao
tropic star
i feel bad for DK tanks on the fight
waddling around with orbs to get them out
are there 0 chests that have DC?
plain vapor
i got a 370 from an emissary with one
jagged bay
hey have a nice weekend everyone ๐
amber siren
yeah there are some with DC
you can check pieces with specific traits in the icyveins guide
oblique garnet
Does honorbound rep emissaries contain DC trait gear?
merry cave
Yeah I got a 370 shoulders with DC from honiurbound xache and 370 DC helm from vulduni
tropic star
there were only 4 but none of them were from dungeons
so only chance to get a decent one would be from emissary from those zones then?
sand egret
Today is our feedback thread day right?
frosty wedge
indeed it is
sand egret
๐ข ๐ต ๐ !
oblique garnet
Voldunai has shoulders which have DC i dont think the head has
amber siren
another 5% HP buff Pog
sand egret
I just want whoever is writing it to drop the #BlockTheRock hashtag
shut summit
๐ฎ ๐ ฟ โ ๐ ๐ โฌ
sand egret
lol
"It appears Prot warriors....are sending some kind of code...?"
๐ค
"Ah, I think they totally want more buttons to press at a given moment!"
mellow bridge
#BlockTheRock
sand egret
#BlockTheRock
strong forum
Legion wasn't too bad, but that's me specifically, I enjoy high apm not everybody does
Imagine BfI stacking + t21 2p
Now that would be amazing
Old t21 2p
oblique wolf
sure, I just think the solution shouldn't be requiring us to have a higher apm
strong forum
I don't see any solution besides changing it to where we get rage from magic hits and are able to block ranged physical attacks
That's mostly what I want
Thinking about Kings rest specifically
oblique garnet
Having rage is not an issue