friend sent me this log
#protection
plain vapor
old night
okay so I'm gonna swap to the ignore pain tracker in this discord
do I wanna shoot for casting IP on yellow then?
since red is gonna clip
cinder nova
I mean you shouldn't be thinking that heavily about casting IP
old night
when I need to that is
plain vapor
vivid sage
does sense stream?
stone crag
yes
next goblet
That healer i told y'all about last night.. who wouldn't dispell on zul because "muh parse" actually dispelled tonight
stone crag
👏
next goblet
i lettem know what it was
oblique garnet
the blocktracker weakaura doesnt work for me o.O
lucid kelp
looking at my damage taken from Shatter's on Zek'voz makes me feel happy
fierce juniper
@oblique garnet What's it doing?
old night
worth sacrificing over 15+ ilvls of gear to get an azerite piece of deafening crash?
lucid kelp
yes
the last 'solid' number I got on DC was like 45 ilevels? But most people just say it's worth infinite ilevels cause it's so overtuned
thorn yarrow
It really is tho...
thorn yarrow
The sad truth is it has 2 core uses that paired with Avatar that losing it is not only crippling to mitigation but also damage output
next ermine
So mythic zekvoz is fun as prot...
oblique garnet
@fierce juniper I got it working it wasnt showing the duration at all
fierce juniper
👍
chilly brook
@next ermine that seems sarcastic? Are you not actually having a good time on Zek?
next ermine
I've been feeling meh on prot war this expansion and Zek has so much going on it adds to it lol
Feel like I get trucked eeven with CDs up on combo to
Though tonight was our real first prog on him so that's probably it tbh
old night
same boat as you spazzle
first night
I got fucked with a brick the entire time
idk if its just rough or if im doing something wrong
next ermine
It helped when we figured out the adds spawn in a set location every time
But that was a bit late into the night
Could also be I had 2hrs of sleep before raid :P
Lul
next ermine
It's just something that we never actually noticed lol. We thought it spawned based on boss location
Turns out, not the case >.>
chilly brook
Sorry to hear that you’re not enjoying prot
next ermine
I mean I enjoy the prot playstyle.
old night
@chilly brook is it honestly a rough fight for us or am I doing something wrong
old night
I'm on boss during purple rings
old night
alright
I still feel wonky with my rotation
I can't tell if I'm fucking up somewhere
chilly brook
TBH Zek seems like it has a lot going on but all you have to do as a tank is swap and move out of circles
old night
I feel like my cast priority is in line
trying to avoid devastate and hard casting rev when I'm off tank
alternating TC during avatar
chilly brook
Your DS uptime is low
old night
yeah I noticed I had gotten rid of a piece of azerite gear that had deafening crash on it
as it was a 30 ilvl upgrade
i restored it after raid to use it
all night I didnt have it on zek so that might be why I wasn't keeping it up with avatar
other than that griff, everything seem fine?
last week or two I've been struggling to find the right flow to the current rotation
chilly brook
Hard for me to deep dive rn on mobile about to go to sleep
old night
np
tight tree
I was feeling bad on mythic Zek even on brewmaster
chilly brook
Just message me and I’ll take a look tomorrow
tight tree
something something not getting topped before combo, still live with 1 hp
old night
ill send you my logs with the azerite after monday and see if it fixes itself
chilly brook
K
old night
thanks again man
tight tree
Just want warrior buffs so i can stop playing BM
chilly brook
I guess I’m just surprised because I love Zek as prot, I get to pad meters and I also get to make my BrM co-tank look like a pansy
Now if only my group could stop being stupid and stop standing in bad
tight tree
Think Blizz intended Zek to be anti-BM thing kinda like Vari-Matress
oblique garnet
Ah the age old stand in bad
sick sentinel
VOID ZONE
chilly brook
Too bad healing debuffs don’t matter when you can’t die to stagger lul
And there’s no other damage for tanks
Anyways night all
mental scarab
Dc trait on single boss fight, is it bether then 30 ivl ?
ember arrow
Pty sure dc is always worth it
mental scarab
Oh😭😭
static pilot
Huh, Prot warrior has rotational flow issues?
tight tree
yes IP on GCD flows like shit 🤣
worthy karma
And ds and charge
static pilot
Surely that would have been noticed in the beta?
worthy karma
It was
tight tree
we ARE in beta
static pilot
Nah, I think this is a recent development
Otherwise it would have been fixed before launch
worthy karma
Lol wut
Ip has been on gcd since it was added back in in beta
And we told them it was bad
Along with demo shout and charge
static pilot
Hang on, youre saying it's been like that since beta?
static pilot
Any they just left it this way for all of beta and three months after launch
worthy karma
Yes.
static pilot
Good. I made the right call rerolling then :)
worthy karma
I mean if you're just figuing all this out now, im wondering how you even ended up jere
Here*
static pilot
I'm a Skyhold regular mate, I'm just pulling your leg a little :)
Mostly I'm amused it took Ion this long to acknowledge that tank balance is fubar
worthy karma
We made many threads about prot during beta and very vocally warned them about the issues, and we only got one blue post in all of beta, and it was in may
Ah
Lol fair enough
Sarcasm doesnt always work over text lol
static pilot
Very true :)
sick sentinel
🙄
worthy karma
I think thats what pissed me off the most. We only got one blue post all of beta and it was near the start
tight tree
Inb4 they nerf brewmaster and not buff warriors. i will end up with 2 nerfed tanks. At this point i will stop tanking altogether and focus on arena.
pallid axle
I'm glad this issues came around like on Legion every Random could do fine as Prot^^ nowadays all those wannabe just rerolled week one and didnt even tried to make it work , and yes u can make it work^^
tight tree
I did not reroll, i leveled 2 tanks from launch, just in case ;D
pallid axle
im atm 4/6 Tanks through Heroic XD Druid and Paladin still Hanging in Normal cause low Gear 😄
ashen flower
is archive of titans even worth taking or would u take callous reprisa l over it?
modern junco
archive is good, better than callous
ashen flower
resounding protection dont stack yea?
stray tiger
Stacks additively I think
ashen flower
orly
modern junco
ya
adds onto the shield amount
the healing one is better IMO for tanking though
if u have that c hoice
stray tiger
Best for tanking is yellow with armor
ashen flower
brace for impact/vault/ deafenming clash, those 3 traits are alright to have together ? or is there beter option
stray tiger
I think
modern junco
impassive visage
stray tiger
But you must wear it
modern junco
BOI/ LaserMatrix/Archive / Deafening for raid
stray tiger
Even if ya have 385 ilvl analog to 340 deafening crash
ashen flower
what thinkets u guys would take ?
oblique garnet
Depends
modern junco
veiled eye and jes howler
stray tiger
Deck and Rezan eye for me
oblique garnet
Veiled Eye/Jes Howler and Blockades
modern junco
blockades if u dont have those yea
rezan is good offensively as well as syringe/disc
stray tiger
But it really depends on ilvl of trinkets ya get
If you have eye 360 and Jess howler 370 - Jess better
ashen flower
i have all exept blockades 370
oblique garnet
If you want flatout dps increase go fathoms
stray tiger
Deck is well tuned now, give ya armor and heal
stray tiger
Rezan eye
modern junco
ohh ok yeah
ashen flower
k i go with rezans and jezz
thx for help lads
guess it shouldnt be problem to tank +10s with 368ilvl
oblique garnet
nope
stray tiger
With Rez eye procced I have 48% of haste, nearly uptime my shieldblock and dem shout
modern junco
ohh thats nice
ashen flower
i have 23.5% haste unbuffed
modern junco
40% without fray? dayum
oblique garnet
ofc with fray
stray tiger
I don't even have haste on shield and weapon
Under bonus are nuts
Uldir*
450 haste, will miss that at start of next raid
modern junco
yeahhh
stray tiger
What do you think guys, what blizzard will do with prot in next month(they said that there will be some changes on this spec in 8.1)
modern junco
my weap shield are vers/haste
err
vers mast
Idk what they are gonna do, I heard they are gonna change the mastery bonus
stray tiger
Not bad, have crit haste and crit vers
modern junco
not too shabby
oblique garnet
But i dont think blizzard will do anything big
modern junco
i mean band-aiding vanguard didnt really do shit so
oblique garnet
Maybe if all is right in the world they take IP off GCD
ashen flower
so what kinda healer we need for +10 to be able to keep us up?
modern junco
monks/paladins are best with warrior
ashen flower
well priest is kinda weak ST heal no?
modern junco
but any good healer wont have a problem
oblique garnet
^
sick sentinel
For me MW and Holy priest are good safe picks
stray tiger
Have no problems with Druid in 10 key
ashen flower
ok
oblique garnet
Did alot of +10s and higher with a shaman
sick sentinel
Because they have bubble and angel
modern junco
shaman is prob the worst lol
tight tree
Any good healer
merry cave
I've done with all heals, a good sham seems to go well with war tbh
tight tree
+10 is easy with current gear levels
ashen flower
ait
zealous gull
When talking about guardian and prot war, they specified that one issue with prot warrior is "rotational flow", so I'm guessing GCD/rage changes, perhaps IP off GCD?
oblique garnet
Good shaman will keep you alive ez
stray tiger
Shaman can trade ya shield btw
sick sentinel
So can hpaly
oblique garnet
Also this week you can go pretty much full ham with the pulls without really dying especially at 368ilvl which you had
ashen flower
well as much i seen sofar, only weekly prot war have big problems are bolstering weeks no?
sick sentinel
But I usually prefer running with MW/Hpriest since they have a CD for saving ur ass
oblique garnet
Well fortified and its purely dependant on what instance you are doing
sick sentinel
Bolstering is not a bad affix
That a pure DPS issue
If dps don't coordinate their dmg it's gonna be a long time to kill a few adds
Otherwise it's one of the best affixs imo
ashen flower
true
oblique garnet
This weeks affixes are seriously laughable
sick sentinel
For like most dung's yeah
oblique garnet
Also @ashen flower for +10s etc take veiled eye since it gives you a nice little "oh shit" time to react and gives your healer a break on big pulls
sick sentinel
But KR is gonna be a real punisher for pugs for the first boss and trash in the 1st room and bridge
oblique garnet
its not fortified the room after boss isnt that hard
ashen flower
@oblique garnet aint got veiled sry, got rezans eye
thought we talking about rezans
oblique garnet
Well rezan is allright
sick sentinel
Rezans eye is good but don't become dependent on it
ashen flower
im going rezans + howler , both 370
oblique garnet
imo take blockades for additional survivability
ashen flower
aint got blockades
sick sentinel
Best to go double tank trinket we already do enough damage as is, the extra haste is nice but if u can reach 12 second rt on SB more haste is just a bonus for me
tight tree
Tank trinkets? 🤔
sick sentinel
KR tank trinket and veiled eye
outer dew
I prefer my fathoms over blockades
tight tree
there is no tank trinkets 
sick sentinel
I only picked up block because I don't have a veiled atm
Otherwise I'd rock veild and mummy scarf
oblique garnet
But it doesnt matter since most pug groups only want bdk for m+10->
ashen flower
@oblique garnet that aint a problem, i got my 10+ keys , 1050 RIO
so i just run my keys
sick sentinel
Smart person right here
oblique garnet
Yeah i get what you mean but there are specific items i want from +10s and i only have one key ^^
outer dew
Running 10's isn't difficult
sick sentinel
It isn't but we aren't picked
outer dew
I can get my ele shaman to do 9-10's
sick sentinel
I had a shaman refuse to take me to a +9 because he didn't want to heal a warrior
outer dew
Lmao
I like warriors if I'm rsham
Don't have to worry about getting sniped by my own tank
Less hp = fatter heal meme
oblique garnet
Did a few tol dagors/manors +10 last night was 2nd or 1st in overall damage T_T
oblique garnet
Ye obviously 😛
sick sentinel
It's so annoying
The problem is also that because we are known for being in the worst state of all the tanks according to Reddit and GD no one wants to take us and dribbles into the game
So that lfr player who takes forums and Reddit as truth because some guy said it online and other people upvoted it must mean it's true
oblique garnet
Didnt also help that asmongold was wiping alot in freehold m0 with prot warrior because he didnt use any defensives
just wanted to do alot of dmg
sick sentinel
I love Jani the trash loa but I would never go to a guy who's not known for tanking for primo advice on tanking
And my piss is already boiling whenever I hear this because it reminds that i must have not gotten the memo about warriors being bad in legion and I'm over here like that John Travolta gif
outer dew
I mean
Community perception is always a thing
Like I don't think ele shaman is in an absolute shit spot
Just everyone despises the idea my alt is an ele shaman
sick sentinel
The problem is I never heard about that until the end of legion and I'm like since fucking when tho
oblique garnet
its because warrior wasnt FOTM
outer dew
I mean, you live with it and it's w.e
oblique garnet
its either FOTM or absolute dogshit according to reddit
outer dew
I played brewmaster in beginning of legion
Got shit for it whole of EN
Lmao
A priest that couldn't break 200k hps on a +10 for 2nd week of m+
oblique garnet
I didnt even play warrior in legion because we didnt need a tank
outer dew
That was a filter
And it was my fault apparently
when he let me get low enough where I outhealed the fucker
You need a thick skin in wow
Just play what you enjoy and fuck it
Most pugs lack brain cells to read their skills anyway
sick sentinel
Oh I know, it's more that I got angry because people said to me at the END of legion warriors were bad
I'm like fucking when the fuck was this and where was I then
Because I barely struggled at the start middle or end of legion
I literally felt no difference in legion as prot warrior
austere oar
compared to early legion
they took a severe nerf during EN
and IP was way too weak
build rage for 10 secs to absorb 1 melee, yay
daring lily
warriors in antorus had unlimited rage
oblique garnet
Warriors in bfa have unlimited rage
sick sentinel
I must be from alt universe then because rage has not been something I struggle with
Even before legion
daring lily
in BFA I find it harder to have the gcd's to use my rage tbh, but that might be me messing up my priorities
oblique garnet
If my avatar and demo are on cd ill just use ip to try and get those off cd asap
Even when im not tanking a boss
sick sentinel
IP is just the rage dumper honestly
U lose nothing from doing that esp if ur talented into AM
sick sentinel
At worst u don't have shield block up but God knows ur clawing at shield to be up at all times
He wanted to tank because fury was bad at the time and he sucked
The end
sick sentinel
As a warrior the only worth title is Lord/lady of war
oblique garnet
Dragonslayer if gotten when relevant
acoustic echo
bloodsail Admiral : d
acoustic echo
But tbh they will Change prot warrior , but i wouldnt set my hopes to high
sick sentinel
Demonslayer might as well be demon hunter
oblique garnet
All prot needs is ip off gcd
sick sentinel
Hope they dont.
oblique garnet
And charge
sick sentinel
If they change any thing for prot it will be most likly IP
What we don't know but it's gonna be IP for sure
acoustic echo
yeah ragecosts leech etc
sick sentinel
Fuck for all we know they just might remove it
acoustic echo
i really really hope
they dont do something necessary in the azerite
cause the azerite System currently is brken
sick sentinel
I mean have u SEEN the the newest protects trait
oblique garnet
Theres currently only 2 shoulder pieces with DC
sick sentinel
Shit made me lose it
acoustic echo
but remember you Need to those azerites in the first place
with the right item lvl
and that is currently a Little bit hard as you just Need luck
sick sentinel
Well I hope ur ready to be disappointed
sick sentinel
They might do what they did in legion and increase the gear in dungs
acoustic echo
there is a huge flaw in the system
oblique garnet
Just let people get azerite gear from dungeons its not that hard
acoustic echo
you can go mythic +300 in theory
but you wont get azerite past340
which doesnt make sense
acoustic echo
i thank you xD
i mean they even make world Cup for myth +
but you cant get more then 340?
lul
they should do it like , if you get past 15 or something in this patch you can get higher azerite
sick sentinel
At least u can get 370's outside of raids so there is that
acoustic echo
Balance it on the current patch
weekly chest is a possibility , i for example got the same 385 2 times in a row and those 340 pieces drag my item lvl down as hell
- most ofhe traits are just weaker then others
and they dont resemble old Tier Bonus in any case if you ask me
azerite feels like new trinkets
just my opinion
sick sentinel
And u have less health and strength which contributites to our vanguard passive
Which is why I really dislike vanguard because when ur wearing even 1 340 piece but have 2 370's but they don't have the trait u need that passive loses value
acoustic echo
aaaand the Chance of getting 370 is really low
even with Bonus roll
if you dont go for mythic raids
which most of the People dont
sick sentinel
Listen man, bad luck protection
sick sentinel
Ur right but does it have the right traits we need to tank well
cold dragon
Yeah they do. Just need to search. Of it won't be bis but t3 will be good
storm isle
i'm just sitting here hoping i wont get azerite in my m+ chest since i've allready gotten 3 different pices from it
acoustic echo
you can get every other Piece from m+ so for People like you farming it is an option
for me nat
sick sentinel
I'm sitting here wanting my shield or tank trinket from M+ chest
acoustic echo
i can do 1 10er key and then wait and hope and make Bonus roll on world boss or warfront
storm isle
i still have 340 wep no matter how many runs i do i do not get an upgrade
cold dragon
Why you don't farm? M+ is like super cool and chill
oblique garnet
All i want for christmas is 385 shoulders with DC
storm isle
i have 385 chest iwth DC i think so lucky
acoustic echo
i suck at pvp and i dont like it , ok my own fault but forcing to go for pvp for an Tier set
nah
im not statisfiied
cold dragon
They don't force. They give an option
sick sentinel
All I want is my shield TF to 400
sick sentinel
For me it can, my dad works at blizard
cold dragon
400 is highest I think
cold dragon
That bug with ppl not opening their legion m+20 chests. Some got 400
outer dew
Highest base is mythic at 385
cold dragon
No?
sick sentinel
Maybr
acoustic echo
weapons cant titanforged like normal gear
- 10 item
max*
you cant Titan forged a weapon more then 10 item lvl
i think they dont want you to go mythic 3 find an weapon that just gets insane more item lvl
or in lfr
oblique garnet
Did a +2 atal on my alt last week our healer got 385 titanforge trinket 8)
storm isle
😦
winter aspen
Should be capped everywhere
cinder bridge
who else is excited for rotational updates?!
prisma night
for a while shields could upgrade more than 10 ilvl but I believe it was fixed
uncut juniper
well what was Ion's exact wording concerning prot warrior updates in the q&a? "near future"? Which makes it like... in ~2 Weeks on the PTR maybe?
🤷
cinder bridge
not so distant future I believe
I'm just glad there is an acknowledged problem with rotational flow
frosty wedge
man... so I submitted a ticket about the emmissary issue and got back a "yeah sorry we fucked up and gave you the wrong level cache - we've fixed that now, but... not for you... next time though!"
tight tree
Well forums raging about this QnA, i am satisfied bc inc warrior buffs
frosty wedge
I didn't see any specifics... what buffs are we talking about?
pallid axle
isnt protwarrior still OP? 😦
tight tree
No specifics
gray wolf
define op
pallid axle
cause we could skill impending victory which ofc is a deathstrike so OP warriortank
next goblet
those who got 400 had it reduced or taken away tho
sorry responding to a chat 2hr ago lmao
so happy too, guild finally got passed heroic zul
<-- not a hardcore raider because work schedules lays the pipe to that desire, so i casually raid
ember arrow
Gz
old zephyr
Anyone could send me back the link Where method/limite interview said they hesitated using protwar for ghuun mm ? Can't find it again
next goblet
prot war in mythic g'huun? wut?
pallid axle
isnt just lethal and nurfed using prots on ghuun?
ember arrow
What
next goblet
does the shimmering haven trait stack?
stray marten
gray parrot
morning ladies
fathom marten
gray parrot
I identify as having the right to identify others
and I also got AotC last night, was too hype to fall asleep, and am exhausted as a result
so plz forgive
grim prism
I do not acknowledge your identity
next goblet
rotation changes inc for prot? MAYBE DEVASTATOR BASELINE AND IP OFF GCD?!? far fetched but a guy can wish right?
amber siren
devastator would just create even larger gaps in our rotation when ragestarved
no thanks
next goblet
make it baseline and give rage
it was nice when it gave rage
once the rage gen aspect was taken away.. garbo
thorny laurel
Bloodsport vs laser matrix in m+, What would you take?
ember arrow
nope
laser matrix cant pull mobs, it can damage them
i pulled mobs at 99% hp that were damaged by matrix previously
edgy mango
pallid axle
hmmm what do u thing about that : Bastion of Might (Prot): Avatar increases your Mastery by 40 for 20 sec, and instantly grants you Ignore Pain.
*think
blissful imp
Sounds decent, boring like all the rest but decent
Know what would be a sweet trait (although must have for M+)?
Battle Shout now Interrupts any cast within 15 yards.
Boom! Fun, interesting trait that changes the way you play but not super OP
pallid axle
pvp^^
blissful imp
ANY AND ALL CASTS
Not broken because we used to have that ability
And battle shout has a cooldowns already
blissful imp
Yea, I guess we should just stick to passive buffs on traits. Can't make it after abilities other than to make things do more damage
We might break the game with FUN
pallid axle
new trait idea: Mighty Warrior(Prot): Battle Shout makes the boss laugh so hard he dies. Cooldown Increased by 100%.
blissful imp
Wait, you play BDK don't ya levko? Stop trying to keep us down! You are getting nerfed and we are gonna get buffed and we gonna start getting all the chicks and you just gotta deal with that alright?!
gray parrot
i cant figure out how my partner tank BDK takes so much more damage than I do
pallid axle
pain and gain
blissful imp
They just do, they heal it back though
gray parrot
i've narrowed down the log to JUST times when Ghuun is out...he tanks the debuff part and I tank till 5 stacks
and the damage taken diff is astounding
pallid axle
some DK dont push there bloodshield up so thier deathstrike heals more and does more dmg
fickle geyser
u take things to face and then pop back up
ember arrow
@blissful imp hmm?
yes i will play the better tank
if prot is better than bdk i will paly it
i never claimed to hate the idea of prot warriors
what does taht mean?
that was a trait in legion that's gone since artifacts exploded @pallid axle
mellow bridge
ember arrow
plugin
ember arrow
its a plugin for "Betterdiscord" called "citador"
@gray parrot being astounded why dk takes mroe dmg than warr is ... outstounding to me
warr is a metigation tank
dk, with boneshield up has 10% less physical DR than warr
gray parrot
in my defense i have never tanked and the last expac i played was Wrath XD
thorn yarrow
yikes
ember arrow
ontop of that, it has one cd that does DR, IBF. our main def cd, VB, doesnt reduce dmg in any way
im not blaming you
just explaining the situation
gray parrot
I appreciate it
thorn yarrow
Lev is a good boi
ember arrow
basically in a good run, as bdk you heal 50-65% of your dmg taken
thorn yarrow
he helps those baby turtles
ember arrow
in raids warr has similar numbers
instead of healing it back
you metigate similar amounts of dmg
gray parrot
ember arrow
in raids, tanks are balanced fairly well. what seperates them is utility and easy of play
gray parrot
this was my H G'Huun last night
so then we are pretty even in terms of damage tanked?
ember arrow
yes
gray parrot
ok
ember arrow
can you post the log?
thorn yarrow
❤ haha
gray parrot
im still learning a lot, obviously (new to tanking)
but when i try and compare to the other tank im like.....dafuq
thorn yarrow
its ok I had to try an give a guy how I tanked heroic Zul to help him since he also tanked with a Blood DK an was having trouble with the stacks
ember arrow
@gray parrot ok
he metigated 35%
you metigated 41%
even though his DTPS was twice as high
his hps, was 5 times more than yours
gray parrot
is it better to shrink the time frame window you look at in certain fights
?
as in this one...I dont tank anything till GHuun pops out...im running orbs and interrupting before that
so I shrunk my window to start at minute 2:00
ember arrow
look
my dh and me we metigated same % up to the decimal
even though he took 13k damage per sec
and me 21k
@gray parrot it may be helpful, but in my case, i do tank the add at start
next goblet
dont we usually take a lot less damage than other tanks?
im sorry im coming in mid convo
wintry ermine
Look at EHRPS, thats a good metric to check out
next goblet
im sorry.. what is EHRPs? i know what EHP is but...
wintry ermine
Effective healing required per second
next goblet
ahhhh ok
gray parrot
where can one find EHRPs?
wintry ermine
above the chart (next to self absorbs
next goblet
you know wuts fukt?
i had to dps H zul last night cuz our other tank was there last night
but i had to tank the trash because he for some reason couldn't handle it..
hes a VDH
likewut
ember arrow
@wintry ermine u mean external absorbs?
gray parrot
what is a good way to figure out what EHRP I should aim for?
dusk locust
wait isn't it external healing required per second
or have i been completely looking at it wrong
grim prism
No youre right
wintry ermine
external*
sorry my bad
its just a metric to check out when comparing different tanks, BDK and warrior are pretty close on most logs I've looked at when looking at that metric
dusk locust
my co-tank is a BDK and i'm consistently lower than him on EHRPS
ember arrow
where can you find it
dusk locust
you have to go to the damage taken tab
dusk locust
yeah
ember arrow
but
uneven mason
that HP pool
grim prism
You only want to compare to warrior EHRPS
uneven mason
thats all external
dusk locust
none of it b/c that's external
ember arrow
ohhhhhhh
uneven mason
Healers have to truck the sht out of BDK
ember arrow
well not really tbh
uneven mason
"But warriors make us go OOM" /s
vocal nimbus
Not really
grim prism
The metric is the same across all specs but you should compare apples ro apples when possible
wintry ermine
well warriors take spikes sometimes, which means less effective heals
gray parrot
its there in Damage Taken
ember arrow
ohh
i was in healing
mb
i never heard healers complain about healing bdk in raids
i know i know, anecdotal evidence
but
i played bdk for 1 year now
dusk locust
It’s kind of a perception thing due to the huge health pool I think
ember arrow
bdk dont have most hp
uneven mason
alot of time for HoTs to work
ember arrow
vdh>bdk
wintry ermine
376 warrior here, 216.5k unbuffed (going by warcraftlogs) 😃
dusk locust
Man my secondary stat balance is terrible after equipping all high ilvl stuff lol
uneven mason
stats are pretty close to meaningless compared to ilvl
midnight ferry
Is it true that 11 to 14 key not give extra chance for loot
uneven mason
TFW folks ask how Warriors can function
and TFW you get sat in favor of other tanking classes because the Raidleaders are drinking the fucking SCOolaid
EHRPS HC Zek
🖕
81% mitigation
wintry ermine
349 ilvl vs 366 tho
midnight ferry
"In addition, roughly every 3 difficulty levels past 15 will award you with an additional piece of loot. (after 15 it's an additive 40% chance per key level for extra loot. +16 has a 40% chance of extra 1 item, +18 has a 100% chance for an extra item (20% chance for two) and +20 has guaranteed 2 extra items for 5 items total."
doesnt say anything about 11-14
uneven mason
I think they scaled it down to 11+ in BFA, that was iirc, in Legion
since loot scaled to 15
midnight ferry
ok
uneven mason
but yeah haven't heard nothin definitive
@wintry ermine wasn't commenting on the BDKs damage taken, was commenting on the fact that as a tank I literally took less damage than some DPS
Like Legion again
frosty wedge
@uneven mason Did the rogue or mage move at all for that entire fight?
uneven mason
probably not
frosty wedge
lol
wintry ermine
next ermine
Wait
wintry ermine
(I'm Mauk)
next ermine
Oh ok
dusk locust
or had, i'd have to look if i still do
uneven mason
they transitioned last week
even though I was by far requiring less helaing than the other 3 tanks
but you know that koolaid
When they open up with "Can you go arms, because the paladin doesn't have an offset, the DK sucks, and Oh MONKS ARE THE BEST SO WE NEED ONE OF THOSE"
dusk locust
noo i'm #2
uneven mason
when the monk has twice the deaths I do
frosty wedge
to be fair mac - that DK healed back 2.6 million of the damage he took himself.
uneven mason
😡
that metric I showed
was EHRPS
he still required nearly 4x the healing I did :p
limber wigeon
Our blood dk struggled on zekvoz last night really hard
limber wigeon
Yeah, it was hitting him for 185k, it was hitting me for 78k
uneven mason
and by the time the healing debuff is off
next ermine
Blood dk op for that mass grip though
uneven mason
they've lost the massive charge on it
frosty wedge
naw, his dmg taken pers econd was 13k vs your 7.8k... but he healed himself for 5.7kps
uneven mason
They are pretty awesome with Gorefiends
let me tell ya
that boy sucked for tanking
but grip was sure handy for Zul
frosty wedge
so you took about the same amount of outside healing
gray parrot
Question....how are you guys comparing EHRPS?
frosty wedge
and he was 20 ilvls under you
gray parrot
i looked at a comparable warrior in terms of ilvl and how long his guild took to kill the same boss
his EHRPs is much higher
limber wigeon
Also important to compare etmi, which can also be found in logs
limber wigeon
Effective theck-meloree index
gray parrot
limber wigeon
It's a metric showing how spiky your damage intake was over a 6 second period
uneven mason
@frosty wedge So counting his healing, he had 8360DTPS
wintry ermine
@frosty wedge what numbers are you looking at, if you check the logs Mact heals for 1.67M and Xall 2.43M
wintry ermine
and damage taken was 3.44M for Mact and Xall had 6.31M
uneven mason
if you flat out ignore my self healing
"WARRIORS DONT SELF HEAL"
TFW
legendary healing parse
manic perch
where do you see etmi ?
limber wigeon
Hover over the plot of damage taken. It's at the bottom of the tooltip
frosty wedge
my bad I had like 5 log windows open - so yeah, you required a bunch less healing than someone 17 ilvls lower than you. Don't get me wrong - I love my warrior and it will always be my main - but I can't fault guilds going into progression bringing tanks that are objectively in a better place
we're fine in raids, in m+ we're decidedly less attractive to bring than a few other classes
limber wigeon
Here, compare damage from my mythic log last night
frosty wedge
Things like this have ebb and flow as blizzard's balance team blows
limber wigeon
grim prism
@gray parrot you need to filter the logs for raid size
uneven mason
@frosty wedge Again - it wasn't a comparison to the BDK, it was the 81% mitigation I achieved during that fight, TRUST ME I know the BDK was undergeared (and sucked)
grim prism
His EHRPS is higher because heroic is a flex raid and his party has way more people in it
Bigger party > bigger scaling > bigger damage
uneven mason
if I could manage to play at that level every fight, I think I Could break through the community coolaid
and show folks how strong warriors really are.
at least in raids
limber wigeon
Mine is a mythic level comparison with a dk that is more geared than me
uneven mason
but alas, I'm only mortal and well within the 5% error margin
frosty wedge
the issue is that you need to play at a god tier level to keep up with a different class that's 17 ilvls behind you
uneven mason
But I wasn't keeping up with him
I was so far past him that if hit was Mario kart i'd have lapped his ass
grim prism
What I usually do for comparing logs is to filter on raids that have the same role composition (or at least same number of players) and then find the log that has the most similar kill-time
This ensures all the numbers are more or less lined up
limber wigeon
I mean, mythic is guaranteed the same damage and same number of players
grim prism
Right but
That isnt what @gray parrot is doing
Oh I see, you thought I was talking to you
My bad
I didnt peep your logs
spice musk
i mitigated 85% of any damage on Mother
grim prism
Also note that you'd still want to screen for killtime in order to get a helpful ETMI comparison
And actual strats, e.g. who tanks what and when, can skew the results pretty heavily, which is part of the reason KRSI went away. So eTMI can be kind of wonky unless you really know what you're looking at
Not that there is anything intrinsically wrong with TMI as a metric of course
uneven mason
Just need
to have apples-apples
meaning, executing the fight with the same team
its a way to measure improvement in yourself for sure
uneven mason
APPLES, WE"RE A FUCKING COCONUT
gray parrot
ty @grim prism its hard to compare this stuff lol
well its hard to narrow everything down to get something relevant to compare
grim prism
Once you get used to the clunkiness of WCL you can do some pretty cool shit
Kind of like playing prot except more rewarding
gray parrot
yea but comparing damage stuff is way easier on WCL
comparing tank stats just is not as simple
grim prism
Well
Tanks just dont have one holistic metric for efficacy like DPS
It's easy to say "great, you didn't die and you did this much DPS"
There's about as much complexity to comparing either one once you start drilling into more granular shit
Did the DPS apply to the right targets, did they use the right cooldowns at the right phases, are they doing their rotation properly while also doing mechanics, etc
You have to do the exact same stuff to a tank log, you just don't have the option of going "this number is bigger than 94% of all players therefore I did great"
limber wigeon
I miss the days of the random wcl taking metric they ranked players with. It was so bad, but so fun.
grim prism
EHRPS, TMI, DTPS, all just tell parts of the story
@limber wigeon that was KRSI; they nuked it partly because resolve was removed from the game, and partly because it was way too cheeseable
limber wigeon
Oh yeah, it was a terrible metric
grim prism
While also not really solving the problem that TMI is only part of the story
chrome harbor
anyone that cotanks with a bear have issues trying not to pull threat while still trying to gen rage ?
frosty wedge
Why on earth is anyone letting that person play a bear right now? lol
like, we need a little bit of love, but bears are unplayable
also, I've definitely had issues ripping threat off of bears in pugs, but I can't be sure if that's just because pug, or because bear
astral crystal
limber rivet
i finally did it boys. My dark iron got to 120 last night, stylin and proflin in his heritage armor and tanking with his absolute mulch tier gear. Now i just need to learn to not suck onthe hardest tank to play that has to use 80 buttons to achieve what other tanks do with 3
👍
graceful mason
dont worry from the way ion talked about prot we're going to get nerfed into the ground as far as skill goes
rip AM
steel mauve
We arent nearly that bad
limber rivet
sadly theres like...a serious lack of good shields that go with dark iron set
unforutnately those data mined dark iron hammer/shields were not given to us with the set 😦
fallen quiver
dark iron SMOrc?
limber rivet
face is the place
chilly brook
Gib trolls plox
inland mesa
Ugh almost got zul last night in first 2 hours of pulls, other tanks kiting crawgs while warrior is what lol melee attacks, hold my beer
inland mesa
Yeah
inland mesa
No, if we had more it would have died last night :( we have two, an alt and our worse one. This week one quit for real life the other quit due to work schedule change or we would have had 4
chilly brook
Rip
inland mesa
By end of night we were still pushing before 2nd hexxar with only 2
inland mesa
I can see kiting the crawgs if you don't push and around spawn 3/4
chilly brook
Such a stupid fight
inland mesa
But for first 1/2 sometimes 3rd if a few died off from debuff it was so easy to just block it all and make it be a bunch of little tickles
Rogues yelled at me that I was doing too much dps XD
Might swap me and the dk
chilly brook
Yea from what I’ve heard prot gets non crawg duty cuz the crawgs die if you are
inland mesa
Yeah I had to stand there lol
And when they come in from 2 directions and are respawning it's annoying where dk can lol blood boil
chilly brook
I really can’t seem to get invested into any other tank tbh, was trying to get some gear for my prot Paladin because my gm was like “so what’s your alt in case we hit a wall”?
uneven mason
If you hit a wall won't be because of Prot war
TFW we're still waiting on that love they promised us
sand egret
in due time
oblique wolf
limber wigeon
Really all I am looking for is increased talent viability and some utility built into some of our less interesting skills (heroic throw, beserkers rage)
Not terribly interested in any other major changes
chilly brook
@uneven mason oh I know that but I also didn’t mind having all tanks at 110 last xpac
frosty wedge
give us back gag order, and fix IP
sand egret
I wouldn't count too much on it, sounds like they're focus is going to be smoothing out the rotation (from what they said). That being said, I would expect them to decouple the power from talents to give us a bit more freedom to move around
chilly brook
xD
frosty wedge
yeah Griff - I have my prot at like 365, monk at 370, and a DK at 355ish - I had a bear levelled but he's a battlechicken now b/c bear is unplayable, lol
sand egret
I'll never give up my bear
chilly brook
Well it seems they want to make prot more fluid and “better” at survivability
sand egret
worked to hard on that damn skin
chilly brook
Bear was actually gonna be my main alt
But then I saw how hard they get hit and I was like “nah”
sand egret
doubtful
graceful mason
Then we're guna live the ravager life
sand egret
if anything they'll nerf it, but generally reduce overall CDs so the choice between having it and not isn't so drastic
so its net netural with the talent
but less without it
next goblet
damn got the crit/haste ring from freehold, 385.. but i have 2 haste/vers rings 😦
guess i'll use over my 340 thornwoven
uneven mason
its not really worth it to sacrifice ilvl
uneven mason
this isn't legion
next goblet
well dont rings have a little more leeway?
sand egret
sure, maybe not 45
next goblet
oh ok
sand egret
that's like a full tier difference haha
uneven mason
I'd really say I'd never sacrifice more than 5 on a ring
sand egret
talking entry mythic dungeons to mythic raid diff haha
next goblet
i also have a 350 regal loa equipped and a 370 infinite void in my bag
guess i should put on the void?
sand egret
the comparative haste diff alone prob outweighs the vers loss
uneven mason
again - Crit isn't bad
its just random
its not like haste is worth 100 and crit is worth 5
next goblet
true
sand egret
ya, wear the damn 385
next goblet
cuz parry lol
uneven mason
where the majority of damage will be subject to parry
next goblet
yeah i put the void and new ring on
uneven mason
andcrit has nearly no Diminishing returns
uneven mason
^^^
next goblet
nice thing is its the freehold ring so haste mainstat on that one ❤
OH
heres another one
uneven mason
am I the only one who triple stacks DC when doing trivial content?
next goblet
i got a blockades and 340 big red button.. got the 370 trinket from warfront.. what should i swap?
uneven mason
cause I like "filling my niche"
graceful mason
who has 3 azerite peices with DC to even try that
sand egret
I don't have the pieces to do that haha
next ermine
Swap button imo
next goblet
aight
sand egret
yeah, ditch the button i'd say
uneven mason
drop button, since at least the Warfront trinket has defensive value
next goblet
yeah i just like button for ranged pickups
next goblet
.<
uneven mason
well was
next ermine
I have a 380 syringe with socket and a 385 bandages
uneven mason
I resent you
next ermine
:)
uneven mason
well now that i'm benched for mythic nights, I guess I'll have more time/motivation to chain run 10s
chilly brook
@next goblet I’d basically say that for the most part don’t sacrifice ilvl for anything save blockades, a ring with a socket (in which case it’s probably like 10ilvl), or bracers with a socket (possibly worth up to 15ilvl)
However in general don’t sacrifice ilvl
uneven mason
Blockades starts losing value when you're comparing it to 365+ stat sticks
next goblet
my current bracers are 385
chilly brook
Oh and cloaks are kinda in the same boat as bracers
uneven mason
kinda
next goblet
when do i want to rock archive as prot?
uneven mason
socket is worth like what 6.5 ilvls on a bracer (40 stat)
next goblet
if ever
uneven mason
at +10?
sand egret
rock.......prot.....
throws rock.....
triggered
chilly brook
@uneven mason more, bracers don’t scale well with ilvl
At least if other specs are to be believed
chilly brook
Granted like I said for the most part just go with ilvl
uneven mason
for sockets heh
since the haste gain will probably beat the armor/str/sta for at least 5
raw stats tho, nah, armor will win even if you have a crit/mast vs haste/vers
next goblet
anyone know if shimmering haven stacks?
sand egret
pretty sure it does
frosty wedge
I hate the entire concept of shimmering haven
next goblet
like does the pool that drop stack the HP boost? lol
i always get scared because im like "OH SHIT IM STANDING IN SHIT" and then i realize that its haven and i get back in it
sand egret
yup, tis the biggest problem with it
frosty wedge
who the hell thought giving TANKS a trait that puts a thing on teh ground that you have to stand in.... in an expac where literally everything drops a pool on the ground that you don't want to stand in... should be throat punched.
sand egret
it's even worse in Motherlode
frosty wedge
yep
sand egret
that female goblin boss drops pools that are THE SAME
next goblet
well it was haven, heed, or earthlink
sand egret
LEARN2SHADER
next goblet
and earthlink doesn't seem all that good imo
frosty wedge
earthlink isn't bad?
next goblet
im not saying its bad
sand egret
heed makes sparks fly
next goblet
but i feel like haven has more benefit when it procs, and it procs a lot
sand egret
looks pretty