or the vendors that sell all the mythic items?
#protection
sand egret
modern brook
bal isnt saying "we have answers" he's saying "why isnt there a real answer yet"
wet compass
those were two of the things that had people on my list most excited
sand egret
those are in beta too
old night
half the complaints and feedback I've seen given on the subreddit in regards to us as tanks is super bad
wet compass
Guess what my battle net list is down to about 20 people on daily
grim prism
And just so we are clear, THE RELEASE BUILD on PTR also had the weekly cache multidrop, not just beta
wet compass
It was easily over 80 to 90 in the first month
grim prism
Still PTR, but yes there is a differe ce
carmine bison
and since they didnt drop in M+ it seemed reasonable that you would have more items in the chest
sand egret
uhj
wet compass
and those 20 people aren't all on wow
neon tangle
I think it's reasonable that blizz changed it because it made people sad
grim prism
I am well aware, i have to explain it to people here on a semi-daily basis
neon tangle
1-3 items feels -bad- when you get 1 item
wet compass
so always give 2
oblique wolf
@grim prism lets be real. semi-hourly
sand egret
I think they mesed up letting 1-3 persist that far into dev
carmine bison
it also feels bad having 340 pieces still because bad luck
grim prism
Thats just one cherrypicked example out of several that are WAY bigger issues
grim prism
@sand egret EXACTLY, with no communication thereof
wet compass
it was hyped up on wowhead for months
neon tangle
Or, give 1, like they always have, why do the number of pieces even matter?
modern brook
My biggest complaint with the communication is things like Ilevel
wet compass
which is an official blizz partner
sand egret
why would they communicate a mistake?
wet compass
because the azerite pieces from M+ only come from the box sadbox
sand egret
that they didn't realize? until they did, which they did communicate
modern brook
where they tell us one thing (we want ilvls to be a clear upgrade generally) and then give us another (lol azerite)
wet compass
so you need at least one azerite piece
neon tangle
@wet compass I think the fix would be dropping azerite pieces in m+ 😛
wet compass
that would make too much sense
carmine bison
theres no reason it shouldnt
fleet ridge
The whole azerite system I think sucks
sand egret
yeah, tis a bandaid fix
wet compass
yes, yes it does
fleet ridge
It's more rng then legendaries we're and people were furious
wet compass
scrap it give us back secondaries and give the neck the legion artifact path
fleet ridge
How can they think it's good?
grim prism
The only defense I can possibly think of @sand egret, is that they legitimately didnt realize- which would also explain people getting +16s and 400 drops on day one. But that also speaks to a major QC issue which is strongly indicated by other major bugs throughout the expac
carmine bison
i wish i had artifact and legendaries back, it was way better than this
fleet ridge
That's what confused me
wet compass
bandaid the fuck out of it and get through this joke of an expac
fleet ridge
How they thought this was better
earnest zinc
What they should have done is made the legion artifact baseline and added two rows with the legendary traits as options
old night
They're too stuck on slow level ups. Artifacts and artifact power, now we have heart and azerite power. It's a flop that everyone hates that they refuse to give up on
neon tangle
(I think Azerite traits are bad for the same reason that 1-3 items were bad: It makes people sad)
grim prism
Blizzard are shit at communicating with their customers. Thats my problem in a nutshell
neon tangle
You feel like your progress goes backwards when you lose traits to "upgrade"
modern brook
@wet compass thats a really bad mentality to have before 8.1
earnest zinc
Just tweak them a bit as needed
neon tangle
even if it's just losing a tiny shield or something
wet compass
they insist on making a never ending grind when they don't realize the reason that people played wow is it was a casual mmo
modern brook
yes the xpac has issues but saying that prevents blizzard from fixing issues
wet compass
without a never ending grind
fleet ridge
Also ability pruning also sucks
modern brook
you set up the expectation that everyhing they do wil be shit
and as such all your perceptions will be tainted by that
wet compass
Dude I just came back from Wildstar where we joked every raid stuff would be fixed when it was out of beta
This is more beta than that
fleet ridge
Lol
wet compass
Just had a warfront last night where the boss literally didn't spawn
grim prism
beta af
wet compass
we did the entire 20 minutes of bullshit knocked down the door and there was no boss
old night
FYI fel rush still DC's demon hunters
carmine bison
lol i already forgot about warfronts
modern brook
If you truly believe BFA will amount to nothing, and you havent canceled your sub you've made a mistake
old night
had a DH DC on fetid last night
fleet ridge
I feel like no expansion has ever felt this unfinished
modern brook
IDC how you pay, if you're not enjoying it why play.
old night
and our DH was like "oh its not that bad. I usually only DC once a month, way less than legion"
thin mortar
lol Horde wins again! @wet compass Lok'tar Ogar!
grim prism
Wow right now doesnt have one major problem, its dozens and dozens of small-to-medium problems exacerbated by awful dev feedback
old night
like, thats sad af
modern brook
BFA's core is good man
sand egret
@grim prism realistically what happened was the CL for the PTR build didn't include the CL where the system was "Switched" to how it would be on live. Thus, the release build still had the testing functionality (inflating drops so people didn't have to wait weeks and weeks to test gear progression). As the final RC build didn't have this change, players would immediately notice the dispairty (which btw, only gets noticed a week later via the first reset). Blizz's response was just this. 1-3 was created for testing purposes and it was mistakenly kept in.
modern brook
the raid's fun so far
wet compass
sounds accurate 😦
modern brook
the dungeons are all great
there are a lot of issues yeah
but saying the expansion is dog shit already
fleet ridge
Visually it's great all around
modern brook
thats just short sighted
wet compass
tol dagor sucks dragon ass
sand egret
I like it 😦
neon tangle
I like TD 😛
wet compass
you people are sick
sand egret
King's Rest is the best
thin mortar
favorite is motherload, least fav is probably waycrest. all others seem fine.
sand egret
but TG is really neat
neon tangle
motherlode is a lot of fun
wet compass
I hate tol dagor because you basically need a rogue or an inscriptionist
modern brook
but the rest i enjoyed
wet compass
and it's stupid
frosty wedge
I actually really like motherlode
carmine bison
you can use blacksmith keys in Tol
frosty wedge
naw xath - you can also bring a blacksmith
sand egret
mob placement is a bit wonky in TD for sure
modern brook
motherlode's packs are TIGHT which was pissy on teeming
neon tangle
I did not like motherlode on teeming fort quaking tho
thin mortar
@wet compass there are keys you can pick up around the rooms
frosty wedge
monelite keys work
wet compass
also the mob placement sucks
grim prism
@sand egret that is definitely a possibility, but I am a bit of a tinfoil hatter and I still think it's also a possibility that caches were changed to offset the increase in gearing speed caused by azerite tradeability
wet compass
and the fire boss is an annoying little fuck
sand egret
Haha well that's definitely not it
grim prism
There are so many major changes just being made seemingly on-the-fly
sand egret
but I like the creativity 😃
old night
My issue is that I'm trying to enjoy the raid as much as I can but I can't help but feel ultra squishy and that I'm being carried by my blood DK.
wet compass
I hate every dungeon on teeming tbh
wet compass
just play brew then you won't be 😛
frosty wedge
fort teeming is awful
old night
fun fact, im leveling my alt that is a brew
wet compass
Yeah in legion we weren't great but we felt good to play
sand egret
teeming in general is just a lack-luster affix
wet compass
Film is your brew already past 110?
old night
114
wet compass
ah nm
there's a way to basically afk level but you're already past the point you can
old night
like i get it. We are capable of raiding at any level regardless of the fact that others are more "meta"
old night
but it is rough as fuck in uldir
thin mortar
i'm actually not struggling in uldir
wet compass
I still have 6 characters to finish up before I post about it 😛
old night
zul even with a 3rd tank is tough as fuck and i still have no clue how to mitigate if my stacks get to 3 or 4 if shit happens to my blood for whatever reason
modern brook
I tihnk i said it this morning
I thought i was getting better
but im actually just getting better geared
old night
im not trying to whine. just venting
modern brook
Zul is a hard fight for prot iirc
old night
frustrations with how I feel this raid tier vs legion
modern brook
a lot of suggestions were "BOP off the bleed" and such
wet compass
I miss the devestator weave playstyle of legion
neon tangle
@old night I think honestly a lot of tanks are feeling the same way
old night
saaaaaaaaame
neon tangle
When I talk to people playing BDK, etc they all feel equally squishy
modern brook
well tanking was nerfed so that makes sense
neon tangle
I think that due to the tanking nerfs all the tanks kinda feel like "I was nerfed" rather than "we were nerfed"
modern brook
I'd agree
old night
yeah true
modern brook
and that mentality is magnified by how prevelent DK's are rn
old night
doesnt help my cotank is a DK. that amplifies my "being carried feeling"
modern brook
And brewmasters mitigation being so effective in a non-magic mitigation world
neon tangle
@old night My cotank is a DK too, but if you look at the healing / damage taken / etc we're definitely on par
old night
id be lying if I didnt say I'm leveling my brew "just in case".
neon tangle
The healers also say I'm as easy / easier to heal
modern brook
One thing I learned in Legion is like stablization points
the only tanks that are supposed to stabalize at 100% are dk and dh
sand egret
like, in the same way that BrM never really sit at 100%?
modern brook
yeah
wet compass
So I have an idea for a film project I might put together quick
sand egret
yeah I can see that for sure
modern brook
In legion it was whenever the garunteed bubble dropped
I think 35?
like if im a monk and im dipping below 35
sand egret
yeah 30 or so
modern brook
my healers need to step iup
wet compass
get some sweatshop footage put the sacrifice everything nike commercial track over it
old night
the raid rotation in bfa for BRM is even more faceroll than it use to be
wet compass
could be amusing
old night
its a joke how easy it is
sand egret
I remember a lot of healers not used to seeing a tanks hp bar that low freaking out
neon tangle
@old night tl;dr I feel you, I just think that it's more our self-perception (and community perception?) than actual issues
old night
i hope so man
neon tangle
also if we fuck up we die, so that's less good than other tanks
sand egret
content creators dont help
old night
^^ the reason I can't stand sco
sand egret
unfortunately, esp not ones that say "PROT IS TRASH"
old night
fuck his tank rankings
modern brook
Good for their key cause i'd deplete it
but for reasons totally separate from being prot
wet compass
I would decline you too I worry about 355+ trolling low keys
thin mortar
I do feel like we get punished much harder for making a mistake, but would like a better way to mitigate magic damage. did anyone else here do Kings rest last week? zul spamming spells at 60k+ a cast. T,T
sand egret
it was "OMG X IS TRASH TIER"
modern brook
I know we dont talk about sco's list here
carmine bison
yeah, how do you guys deal with shadow of zul in kings rest?
neon tangle
My hope/desire for prot warriors is that they will lower the gap between perfect and bad play a bit
Should help w/ perception
sand egret
@thin mortar yeah we're pretty weak to Magic intake overall
old night
friendly reminder he ranked us almost dead last during antorus when our healing was insane
neon tangle
and when I'm raiding while drunk
sand egret
it comes with the lack of self-healing
digital arrow
all u guys gotta do is complete the endless tank wave achievement and people will let u into their groups no questions asked
well thats just my experience
wet compass
I should really finish that one day I got to gold and got bored
thin mortar
^
wet compass
and just never did it
wet compass
like i did gold in 3 tried I think and it was like I have do this but 3 times as long fuuuuuuckkkk that
old night
i hopped on my brew last night to level it and I got hit with 3 pms that were all "finally switching huh?"
sand egret
if i'm bored, it probably means i'm doing TOO good a job tanking
wet compass
I could maybe do it on my druid is it account wide?
digital arrow
i'd wait till the defensive buffs come in anyway
modern brook
@old night thats like 100% of the reason i refuse to switch
digital arrow
iirc i think it is account wide
wet compass
my druid is still 110 and has decent legendaries if they are active in it
neon tangle
@sand egret Start using more revenge-es, keep your healers on their toes
wet compass
horde dh is also still 110
thin mortar
I've been prot since classic launch. not caving now.
dusk locust
rofl i've done that
sand egret
my friend who heals me knows immediately when I do that
neon tangle
My person style of fuckup is to accidentally face-pull and not be able to charge
wet compass
fuck first video for legion is 50 min
sand egret
cuz i just go "uh oh...."
wet compass
for endless
neon tangle
and then not have enough for a shield bloc
wet compass
I don't think I care enough about that title for that
neon tangle
and panic-last-stand
sand egret
lol haha yess
thin mortar
my favorite is when you tunnel and shield block when a boss turns to do a mechanic. >,<
dusk locust
lol or the panic shield block during last stand
neon tangle
@thin mortar EVERY SINGLE TIME on fetid
dusk locust
i'm taking a lot of damage better block
modern brook
that kills me Kauda
sand egret
oh man
modern brook
it deoesnt help that LS lasts so much longer than you think it does
thin mortar
lol, I've done that a few times myself @dusk locust
old night
15 seconds
i reread the tooltip the other day and did a legit double take
i thought it was way shorter
sand egret
I've right clicked off Last Stand in shame before.
modern brook
lol
thin mortar
rofl!
dusk locust
lol
old night
in our mythic taloc kill video you can hear me say "oh fuck me" while im tanking
neon tangle
I should really set up that weakaura
old night
my blood dk goes "what?"
modern brook
"@grim prism told me never to stack SB and LS, so one of yall needs to go"
sand egret
just "Oh shit!" and you realize there's like 2 mobs left and you just blew a full Last Stand
so you just right click it to get taht cooldown goin
dusk locust
during m+ once in a while i'll say "wow nice shield block usage there" on discord
neon tangle
@sand egret That's me in avatar every time
sand egret
YUP
neon tangle
Everything is dead, I'm giant and grey, w/ the orc damage buff thing above my head
sand egret
"BETTER BUST OUT MY FATTY DPS COOLDOWN"
completely forgets there's a HUGE pull next
thin mortar
I've been trying to talk my OT into just dpsing taloc. really don't feel like he's needed on that fight. lol
old night
im the off tank on mother, blood dk is on mother
ember crest
absorbs on goos?
neon tangle
@thin mortar It's dumb but I like OT-ing taloc as prot
modern brook
If your healers are up for dps popping the bubble dudes you probably dont need an off tank for taloc
old night
i feel straight lonely city
neon tangle
Running around getting globs
thin mortar
because you can still do 8k+ dps as OT, lol
modern brook
speaking as somone whos only downed heoric
neon tangle
it's the only time you get to use all the CDs on intercept in a raid lol
distant socket
Archive of the Titans in mythic+. yay or nay?
ember crest
eh what about orb to remove debuffs on boss after zul?
dusk locust
"I need to improve my demo shout uptime". casts demo shout against 2 trash mobs that are at 15%
thin mortar
just don't select any traits when you get gear. trust me. 🆒
modern brook
I mt everything 'cept devourer so far
thin mortar
I MT all but mother... I let the OT have that win so I can focus on drinking
modern brook
I think warrior can do both for dev
old night
yep
neon tangle
My cotank is a BDK, so he's slow af for doing stuff like the taloc globs
old night
he asked for thrash because deathstrike. I kind of prefer mt devourer. its a snooze fight
modern brook
so we swapped a week ago and havent looked back
neon tangle
not super useful going through on MOTHER either
I OT for zul too... cause avatar is legit for phase 1 crawgs
old night
YUP
neon tangle
why blizz make us OT bait
old night
i was MT for zul and he went "can we swap"
didnt look back after 1 avatar, revenge, and TC
its like gorefiends level of aggro
neon tangle
pretty much
it is also the source of many grey parses for me lol
except for zul, obvs
old night
LOL
my blood dk is legit
someone called out my gray parse on mother since im adds
and he goes
"you wanna tank prot on mother?" "no" "then shut the fuck up"
modern brook
Tanks are brothers through and through
old night
yup
thin mortar
I feel like anyone who is seriously looking at logs should negate mother such a dull fight for the first tank to go in.
neon tangle
My guild does not seem to think prot is bad, so that's nice
old night
hes super understanding. he told me "you're sitting where blood was at the beginning of legion"
neon tangle
We had some issues on h fetid for a bit
old night
he's not snooty about dk being great rn
neon tangle
So the BDK swapped w/ me for a round
thin mortar
we are fine in raids overall I think. M+ is a new beast in itself
neon tangle
and suddenly everyone liked me OTing it
modern brook
@old night you can tell who swapped for FOTM and whos been playing their class based on that tbh
old night
oh yeah
modern brook
M+ is weird.
I feel like we should be really good cause of how strong Sheildblock is and scales
old night
we work great together too. Im super super lucky
young iris
tanking TW dungeons made miss mannoroth bracers so much, it fixes so many problems with 1% hp per 10 rage spent
neon tangle
@modern brook Lots and lots of magic damage though
modern brook
yeah :/
thin mortar
demo shout and spell reflect only goes so far QQ
modern brook
IDK
thin mortar
did you win?
sand egret
woo!
neon tangle
This is most of my experience as well
junior ivy
we got to last boss with 5 mins to spare.
lost 2 dps to gattling gun
wiped at 5%
then wiped on him 5 more times
modern brook
lol rekt
old night
"lost 2 dps to gattling gun"
FUCKING PROT WARRIORS
modern brook
^ HOLD AGGRO ITS NOT THAT HARD
young iris
^
junior ivy
lmao
sand egret
yeah, you probably let shield block drop so they got shot
modern brook
I stand by the best combo in wow being DPS fuck up mechanics -> blame tank
sand egret
yup
young iris
dies to homing missile damn prot warriors cant hold aggro on anything
old night
LOL
modern brook
I've definitely been blamed for not holding aggro on the spiders in underrot
junior ivy
id take last boss to safe area
but safe for melee =/= safe for ranged
so the ranged would stay in bad spots and die..
thin mortar
@modern brook I had that happen to me on the little leap raptors in AD
modern brook
Real talk; i had it happen to me in Halls of Valor with the fuckin dogs
people dont understand fixates / random targets
neon tangle
so, on the note of tanking lil' spawning adds
sand egret
You ever been blamed for being the target of a heal? I have.
neon tangle
What do you do on the first boss of TD
?
Do you gather them up? or let dps take care of them?
thin mortar
for necrotic you mean?
young iris
something fixated or I have aggro? let me run the complete opposite direction of the tank
wet compass
wait why did you wipe at 5%?
old night
I had a healer get mad at me for lifegripping me on a charge on maiden in ToS
wet compass
can't you basically duo that boss with a healer?
neon tangle
@old night I had a healer lifegrip me while I had the zul blood debuf
old night
got yelled at for "not recovering"
wet compass
oh fun
old night
that RL is gone btw. lasted one raid tier
I got life gripped over blood by a trial on mythic taloc last night after cudgel
wet compass
lifegrip is too powerful a tool to be in the hands of healers
old night
i died
sand egret
I got yelled at for being dispelled to early
wet compass
should be in the hands of tanks damn it
sand egret
like....I got yelled at....for a HEALER...dispelling ME early...
wet compass
It's not fair that only the healer can make the dps die for being afk
old night
well dont be dispelled you boob
sand egret
breh, the hell am I supposed to do? dodge their cursor?
thin mortar
warrior should get a "Boot" ability, that will punt a friendly or enemy target 20 yards away. lol
modern brook
have u tried being extra-spelled?
sand egret
CANT CLICK ME BITCH
young iris
sometimes lifegrip does wonderful things https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KNNSXk_fuE0
old night
I had two bad lifegrips in maiden
wet compass
use the annoyance cancel thing stops you from being able to be lifegripped
old night
I got lifegripped over the big hole and died during guitar hero ball phase
sand egret
Warriors should get that toss ability that the mobs in Freehold have
old night
RL yelled at me for heroic leaping
sand egret
Garrosh has it in HotS
prisma crane
someone had an epic life grip on KJ in ToS
wet compass
what ....
old night
and didnt believe I got gripped until she checked logs and saw I got lifegripped
sand egret
Imma be throwing people all day
old night
by her
prisma crane
caught the guy out of the air during orb knockback
old night
again. She's gone now lol
dusk locust
real talk having that toss ability would be great
modern brook
Toss (person)
sand egret
talk about a real warrior move
young iris
yeah cant get rage when youre getting flung on people every 3 seconds
sand egret
"chill over there, chump"
dusk locust
dks get a grip in, warriors get a toss out
neon tangle
@modern brook I love it, it's zero effort kiting
modern brook
we overpulled before first boss on a 13 once
dusk locust
and it works well with our mobility
old night
I told my blood DK i wanna be fast ball specialed by him. Just roll me up and throw me at a boss wolverine style
modern brook
everyone died it was me and mage eft, im hands off keyboard and mage invised
wet compass
I refuse to do freehold
old night
hes a human, im a dark iron btw
wet compass
fuck those mobs
wet compass
I want a bitch slap like the freehold mobs have
modern brook
In that vein im surprised they havent made a cast time melee spec yet
wet compass
you mean like slam?
young iris
like how slam used to work? no thanks
sand egret
pfff
wet compass
and how you had to have a swing timer
sand egret
yeah that was a hot mess
wet compass
and how it fucking sucked
sand egret
turns out...being in melee and NOT doing anything sucks
old night
i hated that
young iris
slam would stop your weapon swing during the cast, it was hot garbage
old night
the day marok posted "yeah we don't need it anymore" i almost cried from joy
modern brook
Infairness, most melee dps do nothing anyways
sand egret
eyyyyy
old night
@modern brook nah, they drop their hardened arteries on me
they have a job
then ask why I die
modern brook
theres a joke in my guild called "down by 9:07"
waxen cradle
its like WTF tank why did I fail at mechanics and you die git gud
modern brook
because we started a normal gul'dan that we had on farm at 9:00 w/ a bunch of newer players
sick sentinel
is this better than my current ones?
modern brook
Lasted till 12:34
literally the worst expereince of my life
melee dps never learned how to not drop flames of sargaras on me
sand egret
@sick sentinel I'm not trinket wiz, but that new one doesn't seem super good. Esp not compared to your Haste one
old night
@waxen cradle funny story about that. our holy pally was healing me on mother (blood dk and I swapped to try something diff). Im tanking. I call for sacrifice. I dont get one. I call again. I don't get one. I die. RL goes "why didnt you sac Film" she goes "he was at 50, he didnt need one at that high of health"
young iris
@sick sentinel you need to sim it, looking at trinkets in a vaccuum with no other idea what gear you have is impossible to recommend
old night
^^ same
sand egret
yeah i'm the opposite
old night
I hate activation trinkets
sand egret
I like syncing that with Avatar
waxen cradle
@old night WoW that's nuts, but still not surprising as people like to pass the buck of blame
sand egret
sorry, THAT trinket I'd sync with Av but in general proc ones I like more
@old night , tanks got to stick together, yo
young iris
Syncing trinkets with Avatar? Swift 1-shot? The reason behing GCD changes? Thats a paddlin'....
modern brook
I thought activated trinkets were on GCD for a while cause the first one i got was a channeled ability and didnt work with my avatar macro :/
waxen cradle
Well in terms of pure primary stat gain is it better as far as that is concerned but its definitely not better in terms of how much haste you have and the value of the haste proc itself, but as a dps trinket for AoE situations I could see it being useful
sand egret
I remember I just hopped into tank for my guild back in legion for ToS (the two Torture Bois) and my first stint (not the BEST geared and never did the encounter) I was tanking the melee dude and he ends up hitting me like crazy hard (I guess it was a thing with that boss?) and I get flattened. Sure enough, everyone in the raid was throwing tanking pointers at me until my co-tank was like "yeah, that shit just hits hard. it happens." and everyone just shut the fuck up. It was great
sick sentinel
@waxen cradle well that's putting against the haste trinket, how about putting it against the crit trinket?
waxen cradle
The Crit trinket as well would be useful for lining up with Avatar as already stated
modern brook
probably better to just line it with avatar
old night
having a good cotank is so critical
sand egret
Let's call a spade a spade here. You take the crit trinket because you wanna see all those big numbers pop when you drop those bootyclaps.
modern brook
^
sand egret
Crit will always have high value stat-wise for this reason
modern brook
If i ever say im playing prot for any reason besides aoe16k crits and spite im lying
waxen cradle
@sick sentinel The crit trinket is still better in terms of AoE damage to STarget damage as the only real value the Disc trinket has is in terms of cleave and AoE and the crit trinket already serves that purpose with Avatar and by that TClap usage
old night
Zul Trash 🍆
odd ridge
are there threat issues with MOTHER?
modern brook
I've had none
old night
@odd ridge which diff
odd ridge
Everytime we do her in Heroic, i rip threat off the active tank with auto attacks
old night
on Mythic I had a pain in the ass moment with bacterium
waxen cradle
@sick sentinel Long story short you get a control burst of AoE and STarget dps from the crit trinket and the other trinket is a self proc cleave style so I would stick with the crit one and only use the other for times when cleaving is good but full AoE is not but we kind of get both from Avatar/Tclap spam
modern brook
Are you prot OT for your MT?
odd ridge
And i dont have avatar or DS up either
modern brook
Is your main tank pulling sub2k dps?
modern brook
I deal ~6k outside avatar with a 75~ average parse
so if hes dealing signifincantly worse than that he's probably just fucking his rotation real bad
odd ridge
tonight i went in, didnt even attack her, stood with the healers and /dance and she turned and came at me
modern brook
if you have rogue/hunter you could be the target of a threat macro
plain vapor
scrye
modern brook
do you maintank the other bosses?
modern brook
as in the one to pull it*
odd ridge
No, i let him take first aggro normally
plain vapor
im the one who pulls and about 10 seconds into the fight she starts attacking him
modern brook
Weird
I've never had that problem
My guess is tricks of the trade going out on you
odd ridge
No rogue in group, hunters arent using MD
modern brook
My guess was wrong
waxen cradle
I do find I pull off other tanks rather easily if I use Avatar and do well not much else on the pull, but if I am just going to be dpsing until the taunt swap I might as well do something productive
odd ridge
the other tank is a DK, btw
odd ridge
he is, thats why im asking caust its only MOTHER it happens
it feels like a bug
i mean i literally stood with the healers dancing and she came at me lol
modern brook
Warriors are more threatening than boney bois, tbh
odd ridge
well @plain vapor said he has the same issue, so must be a random bug
modern brook
we have loud scream and big foot attack
odd ridge
lol
digital arrow
lol big foot attack
sand egret
well
plain vapor
anyone here do mythic zek voz yet? where are the ideal spots to place his donut ring thing?
thin mortar
Directly on the raid for aoe healing
cinder pasture
Yea I've got sort of the same problem, I'm running trough to the second room right at the start, and for some reason by the time Mother joins the second room I'm at 80ish% threat..from not having attacked her at all exccept for a shield slam or 2 right at start
grim prism
I missed my pings because I was working on a thing, but
old night
@digital arrow she finished
thin mortar
a "thing" we know when you mean
grim prism
tfw you LS at two charges then pop one anyway while LS is still rolling
old night
@digital arrow Alliance
Dark Iron dwarf - spicy boi
Kul Tiran human - just some dudes having a good time
Lightforged Draenei - gold plated assholes
Void Elf - goths who still play pokemon go
Horde
Mag'har orc - the main guy from wow but he got a spray tan
Zandalri Troll - Idk but they were definitely bullies in high school
Highmountain Tauren - this is just a photo of two canadians
Nightborne - This is what I imagine the bad guys from Kingdom hearts looks like
Bonus
Vulpera - crash bandicoot going to a rave in a desert
Sethrak - Slithery boi
modern brook
Void Elf - goths who still play pokemon go oof damn
grim prism
Please dont ever compare vulpera to crash bandicoot thx
Vulpera remind me of theatre kids from high school
modern brook
thats uncomfortably accurate
old night
i feel thats who they're marketed towards
modern brook
the whole time I was around vulpera during leveling i was like "man blizzard really wanted to push these guys as NOT CUTE We'RE DANNNNGEROUS"
grim prism
Playable slitheryboiz when, bliz
old night
vulpera are the naruto kids who ran around with a headband and marker whiskers
grim prism
Tortollans are like... my ancient jewish aunt and uncle 😬
old night
that smelled like b/o all the time
thin mortar
lol
sand egret
Zandalri Troll - Idk but they were definitely bullies in high school
LOL
this is amazing
digital arrow
reminds me of that one video of someones grandma naming all of the overwatch characters
without knowing anything about the game
digital arrow
win-win
modern brook
I just wanna know what pokemon go did to her
grim prism
Zandalari trolls are those kids that got expelled for bringing an airsoft gun to prom
sand egret
i legit sent this around to all my artists.....who are now all pulling up photos and trying to photoshop their shit
digital arrow
good way to kill time during a meeting lol
sand egret
this is amazing
sand egret
haha I'll try!
grim prism
Idk why all wow characters are highschoolers in my headcanon
modern brook
balsaq confirmed 34
old night
the thing that makes it great is that she doesn't play so her perception of shit is great "the main guy from wow" is thrall
modern brook
my b
thin mortar
lol, saw that dogc
modern brook
❤ my edit jokes are top teir
thin mortar
thall is a wuss. garrosh proved that in Soo
modern brook
Garrosh was a cool guy if you ignore all the uncool things he did
ehhh
Garrosh = big, orc-y, muscle man
hitler = bad stache
not quite
prisma crane
oof, i guess i should have put the /s
grim prism
Like that one storyline where he is borderline compassionate, instead of just being a comically overblown anime villain
chrome falcon
garrosh made some mistakes but thrall is largely to blame
old night
sylvanas listens to evanescence for sure
fierce juniper
chrome falcon
sylvanas is the lead singer of evanescence
prisma crane
aight
grim prism
@chrome falcon BRING MEEEEE TO LIIIIFE
chrome falcon
i wish garrosh turning evil was like
a tiny bit slower
and it would be an awesome character arc
old night
that reminds me, my blood dk has a weak aura that plays that part that goes "WAKE ME UP!" on his end when he casts raise ally
its hilarious
chrome falcon
either way he's the best character arc wow has ever had
chrome falcon
from shitty kid, to cool war hero dude, to kind of an asshole, to full blown maniac
i don't think any other character has had an arc that took like 4 full expansions
grim prism
You'd think they would have perfected the fallen antihero storyline after like... four or five rehashes
Arthas
chrome falcon
5 if you count wod but yuck
old night
good ol Gary
modern brook
Arthas wasnt supposed to be an anti hero tho
old night
im gonna call him that from now on
chrome falcon
i feel like arthas was WAY quicker
arthas was a good guy then he did a bad and then that was it full blown fucking maniac
thin mortar
I would have liked for an alternate garrosh-like character to come with us from dreanor. The good side of things he was about, hardcore war guy. but not insane. basically a younger saurfang I guess
chrome falcon
you could see hints of garrosh being batshit crazy during cata, even during wotlk, but it never exploded until mop
daring marlin
Garrosh did nothing wrong.
modern brook
Arthas was a good guy that made a difficult decision that consumed him with vengence
grim prism
I think Kerrigan was the best one of all tbh
modern brook
SC1 or 2 kerrigan?
modern brook
yeah i'd agre then she's up there
old night
i saw something the other day that showed arthas during the culling of strat that said <morally gray> and then sylvanas burning teldrasil that said <not morally gray>
chrome falcon
sc2 kerrigan 🤢
steel mauve
sc2 kerrigan was ass
thin mortar
I'll agree with that, sc1 kerri was legit
had some real depth, but still owned her shit
grim prism
I played so much brood war as a youngin its not even funny
chrome falcon
there are definitely justifications for burning of teldrassil
daring marlin
All’s fair in love and war.
chrome falcon
they're similar to the justifications for nuking japan which i am definitely not going to touch in a video game discord channel
thin mortar
/blacksheepwall I see what you did there.
grim prism
Kerrigan was a legitimately well-written and well-executed character
@thin mortar ayeee
chrome falcon
yeah, the cinematic portrayed the ethics behind it EXTREMELY poorly
thorn yarrow
lets be honest Sylv baby raged at a wounded guards comment
thin mortar
I remember my first online sc1 match... I didn't understand what 10m no rush meant. so I rushed the guy and he was pissed. ROFL!
old night
if they keep putting out those slide-like artistic animations ill be so happy
modern brook
buteven the alternate reasons like "we didnt kill malf"
grim prism
I mean as far as burning teldrassil goes, I think it fit Sylvanas' character of having singular motives and an ends-justify-the-means modus operanti
modern brook
like maybe if suarfang did his job we wouldnt have murdered everyone
chrome falcon
^
old night
yeah, like, she herself says in her head she doesnt care about the horde in Before the Storm
like she only cares about the forsaken
grim prism
She wanted to subjugate Darnassus to cut off Kalimdor from the flow of Azerite weapons
old night
"alliance of convenience"
chrome falcon
she doesn't care about the forsaken
modern brook
Its also mentioned in the opening cinematic of forsaken
thin mortar
normally I would be mad at saurfang for not killing a filthy elf... but since it led to elf genocide i'm willing to overlook his mistake.
modern brook
IDK if its true postcata
grim prism
Failing to do so with Plan A, she resorts to "well i guess we'll just fucking burn it all then"
modern brook
but pre cata the guy was like "joined horde out of convenience, harboring very little loyalty to the other races of the horde"
grim prism
Darnassus subjugated, mission accomplished
old night
as an ally, if saurfang becomes warchief, ill be so happy for my horde buddies
saurfang is a fucking boss
thorn yarrow
@thin mortar its easier to kill a man then it is to hold fast to ones beliefs
grim prism
@thorn yarrow kill anyone lately?
thorn yarrow
especially in times of war
modern brook
THats what FMJ is about im p sure
thorn yarrow
Saurfang was all about honor an being proud of his people, they would have tossed his character completely out the window forcing him to kill Malf
modern brook
BFA confirmed full metal jacket fan fiction
grim prism
@primal crypt be sure to let us know what disgusting 390 drops you get this week
thin mortar
I wonder If saurfang hadn't lost to malfurion in single combat before then would he have been so undecided on finishing him.
old night
as an ally i get so mad when people brush anduin off as "boy king". His character arch is so fucking good but a lot of people brush it off
grim prism
I dont think saurfang was ever on board with killing malf tbh
thin mortar
I don't either
thorn yarrow
thats the point...
heady elk
Laser Matrix any good as a trait with the healing ?
thin mortar
but he started something and didn't finish it... tisk
grim prism
I guess i dont understand your original comment then
modern brook
The whole war of thorns with saurfang is that he wounded malf from behind because he was enjoying the blood shed of war too much
and then he's like oh man am i killer still or am i honor man the honorable
thorn yarrow
@grim prism if u look into Saurfangs entire lore backround it makes a lot more sense
thin mortar
I just hate elfs in general. we could have burned silvermoon for all I care. =\
thorn yarrow
having them kill Malf would have tossed literal years of work into a character
primal crypt
Make sure to bring bombkin with trees
and this week is a joke
bombkin and hunter
no raging...no necrotic
modern brook
IF we're being real, sylv shoulda just killed him
grim prism
Yeah i agree with that
primal crypt
ezpz week
modern brook
SYlv not taking advantage of the distraction caused by suarfang is incredibly out of character fr her
primal crypt
and of course a rogue
thin mortar
she was indeed at a loss before malf got ganked
grim prism
So youre giving him props for doing the honorabru thing and not killing malf?
At great personal risk
modern brook
yeah but when malph got back-axed, she gloated rather than murdered
thorn yarrow
@grim prism Im giving him props for sticking to his beliefs even at the cost of losing the battle yes, like my previous statement its easier to kill a man at war then stick to your beliefs. an the entire cinematic before the siege of Lord backs that further
modern brook
sylv has historically been a bitch that got shit done
thorn yarrow
Saurfang has always been the level headed calm thinker
hes powerful an dangerous because of that
thin mortar
I don't think he was to level headed when still under the effects of mammoroths blood
but yes, he is a very smart warrior
thin mortar
I quite liked when he saved us in wotlk and told us not to mention it to anybody (borean tundra)
thorn yarrow
I actually dont think he drank the blood
thin mortar
he speaks of having the blood haze in the last short stories they released
thorn yarrow
ya no ur right kinda hazy been awhile cant keep track of everyones lore haha
thin mortar
indeed
thin mortar
I do think that grommash was strongly misrepresented in the mag'har quest
like, that whole chain felt.... incomplete in many ways
thin mortar
would be better to youtube it film. there isn't a whole lot, but I don't feel I could properly explain via text
thorn yarrow
Dark Iron was very lack luster as well
thin mortar
dark iron was a copout to me... as you could already make red bearded dark dwarfs since classic. lol
heady elk
is a 375 Glad Trinket (Stam) > a 340 Je's Howler w a socket ?
thorn yarrow
thin mortar
howler is so fkn good. js
heady elk
you can't sim survival can you ?
thin mortar
there is no sim for prot atm that i'm aware of
thorn yarrow
atm I prefer Howler
overall its just a very strong trinket
an u will in raids pretty much always get the max effect
thin mortar
its good for DR and output
heady elk
use it on pulls or as a defensive usually ?
thorn yarrow
I use Howlers as a defensive
heady elk
kk thx. I've aquired so much offspec gear I figured it was time to learn to tank better
thorn yarrow
Im not sure about anyone else but I always play it reactive prot takes some pretty nasty hits
thorn yarrow
havent gotten a trinket from it cant say
boreal depot
gutripper or strength in numbers for M+ (7-11)?
plain ice
sick sentinel
Howler + Blockades remains BIS survivability duo.
balmy harness
what tier sets are you guys running for timewalking dungeons?
open bluff
Legion sets are the only ones that work.
chrome harbor
How’s the azerite in them work?
grim prism
Depends on what you find stressful
but personally i would say it's a 6/10 stresswise lol
it feels great when you nail a sick pull with godtier bricktanking, the problem is if you fuck up you lose 80% of your health in one global
undone hollow
christ
grim prism
BDK is where it's at for M+ right now
undone hollow
Im not going to be hyperfocused on pushing all the keystones
grim prism
do you raid?
undone hollow
Yes
grim prism
prot will probably do fine for you then
grim prism
heroic throw is good ranged pickup but that is ST only
snap aggro on pull with thunderclap is great
undone hollow
Whats the solution to aoe ranged pickup
grim prism
reroll
undone hollow
fair
grim prism
i like to leap, thunderclap, and intercept back to where i just was with a mouseover macro
solid mist
Big red button
grim prism
but in higher content it's usually just better to LoS
undone hollow
Not always possible in raids
sudden tapir
I’m surprised at how quickly I lose aggro in timewalking haha
grim prism
timewalking is fucked, i wouldnt worry about it
sudden tapir
I bet! 😂
lone knot
is the one-hand sword from waycrest manor bad?
old night
@undone hollow prot warrior is master tank. also our discord is poppin
lone knot
with 20 ilvl upgrade from a haste sword
it gives me strength and stamine but i quite dont know
xD
grim prism
@lone knot its pretty bad, higher attack power gives you more IPs though and 20 ilvl is a lot
lone knot
okay
thanks a lot 😃
but i lose 113 secondary stat value
haste and crit
still worth for 20 ilvl upgrade?
undone hollow
@old night Well, its a tieup between warriors, paladins and dks
grim prism
@final mist your thoughts on Servant Splitter at +20 ilvl over a bis 1h?
sick sentinel
splitter is trash.
pvp weapon if anything.
shitty procc rate too. you want secondary stats.
chrome falcon
^
1h weapons actually have very low stat budget
so you're not getting a lot of strength/stam by upgrading it 20 ilvls
keen spire
@undone hollow Paladins are performing well across all content right now. They might not be the "best" at any single thing (except their god tier utility) but they aren't weak in content, as far as I've seen.
I'm just one person though
just my perspective
undone hollow
Im looking for all kinds of perspectives
keen spire
I'm a prot warrior for life
prisma crane
important to note though @chrome falcon weapon dps plays a big role in our IP scaling, i'd be curious to see how that affects a weird situation like a high level splitter
keen spire
but I find that prot pallies just have an easier time at a wider variety of things @undone hollow
undone hollow
Im currently leaning towards DK
keen spire
I personally prefer the sexy mobility and whacking the shit out of people with shields
chrome falcon
prot paladins are capable of doing everything at the highest level right now
prisma crane
yea i gained more going up 30 ilvls in weapon than i did completely removing a trinket with 250+ str
chrome falcon
they can do any boss on mythic and push keys with the best of them
not as well as BDK though
ember arrow
what do you mean?
chrome falcon
uh are you replying to me
chrome falcon
i said that paladin can do any boss and push keys
but they can't do it as well as BDK can
ember arrow
all tanks can do bosses on mythic
chrome falcon
ie: bdk is the best
keen spire
lol Levko, you seem to not really understand what's going on sometimes
but that's okay man
you do you
chrome falcon
if BDK wasn't rancidly boring it'd probably be the best pick for a main
ember arrow
uhu
chrome falcon
the only thing it lacks is monk utility on mythic ghuun
and is obviously the best for keys
undone hollow
I cannot get myself to play monk at all
keen spire
So many people are like "omg bdk" but I'm like "yuuuuuck" lol
chrome falcon
Omg he went to low hp and then pressed death strike
keen spire
I'd rather play guardian
keen spire
lol
undone hollow
I would play guardian if I could still get the cool guardian form
chrome falcon
Any respect I had for "good" BDK play went away when Will of the Necropolis came in
undone hollow
although zandalari forms are rad
chrome falcon
Having a free shield wall when you get low to allow you to set up your big heals
Is fucking pathetic
undone hollow
Will of the what now?
keen spire
rofl
ember arrow
i guess you didnt play bdk on challenging content then
keen spire
That's pretty fuckin good man
ember arrow
dont need to talk bad about dks just because warriors are floortanks atm
chrome falcon
Nah I'm pretty happy talking bad about DKs actually
chrome falcon
Sorry dude if your class has self healing that basically nukes you back to full health if you fuck up, and gets a free shield wall when you're low hp if you fuck up
It's probably pretty fucking easy
ember arrow
thats not how it works though
WOTN is based around staying at around 35% hp
also timing DS is crucial
ember arrow
not necessarily
depends on the dmg intake
you take alot of dmg> u press DS
warrior: u press SW>u take alot of dmg but prevent it
chrome falcon
Yeah if you can't see why one of those is easier than the other then idk what to tell you
ember arrow
if a class is harder while not being more rewarding
whats the point
if warr was like in legion, where i would be 20th dmg taken
chrome falcon
now you're just having a different conversation entirely
ember arrow
but difficulty is subjective
chrome falcon
no it's not
ember arrow
ofcourse it is, if you study fight beforehand, warr has easy time
if oyu think on dk you randomly press DS and that WOTN is broken
you just didnt do any relevant content
on a dk, that is
keen spire
The learning curve is much lower with DK in direct comparison to prot warrior
however, I do agree with Levko that difficulty is subjective
ember arrow
press Dem shout on cd, use SW for tankbusters, use LS to compensate for AM downtime
keen spire
I personally find tanking with a prot warrior easy as shit in comparison to a dk, mostly because the reactive style does not suit me in the least
ember arrow
i played warrior all legion, made a dk exactly because of that
to have complete opposite tanks
keen spire
High mobility and preventative style, vs low mobility and reactive style?
sounds pretty opposite to me
ember arrow
yes
keen spire
👌
ember arrow
exactly
addition of deaths advance makes it a very fun ability
or rather, the RETURN of deaths advance
vocal nimbus
I played warr all legion and now im playing brm, bdk and warr
chrome falcon
whatever, debates about easiness aside
will of the necropolis is still a really stupid talent
keen spire
^
vocal nimbus
So far i progged taloc with brm, mother with warr and zekvoz with bdk 😂
keen spire
it's as stupid as the passive for BrM that dropped a big health orb every time you hit 35%, so if you got good at oscillating between 36% and 35%, you could drop a shit ton of health orbs for a big moment
in legion
chrome falcon
But that actually requires a lot of precision and skill
ember arrow
IBF is a mediocre def cd with a long cd
chrome falcon
Like I'd be fucking impressed by someone who could consistently do that shit
chrome falcon
Having a free shield wall when you get low is just a safety net for mistakes
keen spire
true
ember arrow
its a 19% ehp increase
keen spire
but yeah, matt, let me tell you of my Kingoroth days with my BrM
ember arrow
wotn basically makes u have 119% hp at full
keen spire
I had a fight where I solo tanked him right after pull because my prot pally cotank dced
chrome falcon
yeah that sounds like BrM
I'm really surprised stagger scaling didn't get nerfed before uldir came out
ember arrow
king was perfect for brm
keen spire
at one point, all my healers but one were down
and there was a frost dk up with me, but brez was on cd for 2.5 minutes
I survived at 32-37% health, going up and down, up and down, for that duration until a healer was able to be rezed
it was fuckin epic
made me feel like such a badass
then I whipped out my prot warrior and never dropped below 80% and felt more badass /flex
xD
keen spire
haha yeah man
every time I think about trying to reroll to a different tank class, I check out their discord, and I'm like.. mann... this discord sucks. And I come back to Skyhold like "this is my home." lol
iron forum
maybe that's the key to blizzard balance, that its a pick one situation: be a good spec or have a good discord
cant have both
iron forum
honestly the only other discord ive ever really looked at was the shaman one, and currently it feels like hospice care or something there but I cant really blame em
broken kite
Lmao
daring marlin
@iron forum Seems like that in the #protection channel too at times.
hot locust
Lately yeah it does seem that way once and a while.
chrome harbor
oddly enough it seems the least rage-y
grim prism
Because we are spamming ignore
iron forum
well they did announce prot buffs coming which I think a lot of us are really holding out hope for. if those turn out to not to be worth a rats ass then I don't think all the ignore pain gcd castsin the world will contain the frustration
sick sentinel
This is the first time I'm tanking, I was always a dps and I'm excited for the buffs
can we actually spam ignore pain, i heard there is a cap
stone crag
there is a cap
sick sentinel
I have never actually felt how playing a powerful tanks feel like
neon tangle
Just cause it gets brought up a lot, I don't think removing IP from the GCD will fix anything
sick sentinel
how do i know the cap?
neon tangle
I am often out of rage anyways, so being able to fit in more of them won't do much for me
chrome harbor
I played a boomie in m hfc and they had me go bear one night when the ot couldnt make it.... it really gave me perspective
neon tangle
Most of my "real" tanking was progression during BC, so I'm fairly used to playing a lil' slower, being squishy, etc
sick sentinel
@sick sentinel it's around 125% of what one single IP gives you, better use the IP tracker weak aura
neon tangle
then some during wrath, then didn't play until BFA
so this feels totally fine / normal to me
sick sentinel
ok ya, thx man
neon tangle
yall got spoiled
chrome harbor
tanked on my warrior for everything but cata (dk) and wod (bear)
neon tangle
I did progression on a bear in BC, it was... interesting
chrome harbor
my mage did a lot of tanking in early wrath when frostfire spec was a thing
neon tangle
I was geared to shit tho, I could solo tank void reaver cause my threat was so high
sick sentinel
personally i find the warrior tanking the most of fun of all and the mobility is golden
neon tangle
^^ This is why I'm keeping my prot warrior regardless, the kit is the most fun to me
chrome harbor
oh its always felt the most rewarding
sudden tapir
My little guild is prepping for raiding properly and somehow we have tanks coming out of ours and shortage on dps 😂 never thought that would be my issue
Ears*
sick sentinel
Wait I tanked DS normal during late cata with my DK alt twice idk if that counts lol
neon tangle
@sudden tapir I've felt a lot of this tbh, almost every guild on my server is full on tanks
PUGs for uldir almost always full on tanks way before DPS, etc
sick sentinel
how do you motivate your hunter use md, kidding i just hope people do that naturally on each pack, even if the tank don't need extra threat , how can it hurt
open bluff
you let him die