thats what i thought
#protection
zinc mauve
upbeat folio
wtf.
prisma night
Yeah but its dumb
upbeat folio
is that real?
fringe marten
If Azerite dropped in M+ we wouldn't be having this conversation about "man I need better azerite gear"
zinc mauve
i dont understand why it doesnt drop in m+
prisma night
Im 360 but cant for the life of me get chest or shoulders above 340
stone crag
upbeat folio
and raids?
prisma night
Raid azirite gear is shit for us in terms of traits. Helm is the only good one
zinc mauve
hisoka if you can, switch to arms and get a person to duo with to try to get your arena rating high enough for the bonus drops
fringe marten
It doesn't drop in M+ because raiders last tier went "wahhhh Why even raid, you can get the BEST gear by doing M+..the ONLY thing raid offers is mediocre set bonuses"
prisma night
But id take the ilvl upgrade anyway
fringe marten
So their response was "ok..now your new spiffy damage traits come from gear you can BARELY get outside raiding"
fringe marten
And warriors are in a particularly bad spot for tanks. Prot paladin BiS traits are all FROM raids.
zinc mauve
welcome to azerite hell
prisma night
What? Most of the azirite gear sucks for us from uldir aside from the helm off mother
The only good thing is the ilvl
fringe marten
Hisoka, that's the point....you aren't married to one trait that has a large impact on your survival.
upbeat folio
bungee gum? been a while, i dunno.
fringe marten
So you can get new shiny gear from raw ilevel
prisma night
Bungee gum yeah
fringe marten
Near any raid warrior is using: mother helm, Chthraxxi pauldruns, Vectis chest.
like...we ALL have the same 340 shoulder man...
That has to tell you something.
zinc mauve
i was sad last week because our pally tank rerolled on vectis to try to get something for him, got the same shield he already had but he couldnt trade it to me because he used a reroll token
im doomed to keep using a 345 shield forever
prisma night
Feelsbadman
I got that same shield vector deflector last night 370
Had to suck some dick to get it from the gm though
zinc mauve
my guild hasnt cleared normal yet, but thats because small-raid uldir scaling is absolutely screwed
near shard
Got vector flector from the m+ quest 2 weels back
tight tree
Who else use shields really. Warrior prio on any hilevel shield should be default. It is more than stat stick for us.
amber siren
Paladins?
hexed lion
Wait so i thought reinforced plating go a little buff right>
amber siren
Hmmm
zinc mauve
a 10% buff, geo
prisma night
Yeah from a 360 to 370 shield it was 2% more block DR
hexed lion
but its shit still
6 strength per level
wtf
wait nvcm
im a retard (:
im in timewalking
prisma night
Lol
zinc mauve
its still only 5 more strength over the previous number which equates to a 25 strength bonus from the change
from something like 50 str per blcok to 55 str per block
idk if these wowhead values are updated
its a modest trait but still very meh
prisma night
So im retarded and forgot to spec back from reckless flurry trait when i tanked last night. It did 4% of my dmg on zekvoz. Fury trait op
zinc mauve
too strong
prisma night
How much dmg does a brace for impact do on avg? Id be curious to see from a pure dps standpoint
elfin apex
strong forum
Yes, if you are 1600 you get a 370 that's minimum effort for some decent value and good chance on good azerite
Takes like 15 wins in 3s for cap
sick sentinel
I'm ready to open my chest after work and get the third reinforced plating trait in a row
love that system
tight tree
They should offer us choice of 3 items and we get to pick one. That would be so much better.
old zephyr
haw about we get all 3?
old zephyr
even if it's always 3 of the same spot
or always 1 azerite AND something else
because yay 1 out of 50+ chaces to get a relevant Ilvl DC/week
tight tree
Or nothing, RICHMON
near shard
I got the waycrest 1h (380) with bleed effect no stats from cache. Is it better then my current 355/haste/vers weapon just bcuz ilvl?
mellow bridge
yea should be 1 azerite 1 non azerite piece imho
sharp raptor
Bois, question: Mythic zek'voz, how does warrior do for tanking full soak, doable or not worth?
old zephyr
depends on what you have as a Cotank/healer I would say
tight tree
Take full, LS+IP+SR second lash, + external (i did not done it, seen Sense vid lulz)
sharp raptor
LS + IP + SR + external all needed?
tight tree
Depends i guess. LS and SR are up for every combo, stupid not to use imo
sharp raptor
right
tight tree
And go from there, if dropping too low or dead - ask external/use SW
chrome falcon
I got another shitty dps trinket from my chest
Now I have a 380 vial and a 380 barnacle
tight tree
Just look at Sense on youtube, he have Zek mythic kill
I think he have cocoon for every combo
I have 395 disc from Zul ;D
hasty sapphire
i killed myth zerkvoz, just called a external and SR the second slash, and make sure to block the shatter
sharp raptor
2 mistweavers then
oh wait does SR completely avoid the damage?
like actually reflect it?
old zephyr
no 😃
sharp raptor
awww 😢
hasty sapphire
no, it reduces it
sharp raptor
yeah... oh well
chrome falcon
What do you guys think, 340 eye or 380 barnacle
Is 100 strength better than a 340 eye proc?
old zephyr
taking full combo means less overall damage (becaus eyou don't need to be healed when debuffed) but it will waste any HoT placed on you whereas spliting combo will require a bit more healing (so equivalent to more overal damage taken) but will allow HoTs to do their job
tight tree
Is this useable at all? Just str stat stick? Any good for Arms/Fury?
old zephyr
With very good coordination I supose it's best to split the combo and use external on the tank that will be active at the end
unless it's a DH/DK then take full
sick sentinel
@tight tree with that ilvl its good for both arms and fury ST
vocal nimbus
@tight tree thats really strong ni aoe
tight tree
I just need to stop being lazy and sim it. Not really playing DPS that much, so was slacking.
Thanks
chrome falcon
You can't sim prot
lunar skiff
hey i dropped 360 hast/versa and i have 375 crit/versa, what should i go ?
chrome falcon
375
lunar skiff
not focusing hast ?
frosty knot
Do you think I can be lazy and just use the same non-azarite gear I use in fury for prot
Since they both haste
frosty knot
Sounds good, thanks a bunch
chrome falcon
none of our abilities really have an impact on keeping us alive
just go higher ilvl
old zephyr
all secondaries DO have an impact they are just very close
old zephyr
read the pin it's writen in the guide
chrome falcon
ok buddy but i can guarantee you every yellow who has ever posted in here has said at some point "just take the 15 ilvl upgrade"
lunar skiff
and what about 5 ilvl upgrade
chrome falcon
not much point being in the discord if you're only going to listen to the mods might as well just add them to friends and PM them
depends on the piece and the stat balancing
old zephyr
every Ilvl increase is better than stat distribution
lunar skiff
mate how the fuck a crit/mastery should be better than hast/versa
old zephyr
only exception ever is Deafening crash azerite trait wich is worth 25-35 ilvl
lunar skiff
with 5 ilvl upgrade*
chrome falcon
stamina
these are what keeps you alive
not getting more casts of our garbage low impact abilities
mellow bridge
old zephyr
crit gives pary wich is actually very good defensively, just not reliable.
mastery gives critbloc (same) and AP for bigger IP
lunar skiff
ok i agree with you, no point to have more uptime on sb
chrome falcon
Look dude you clearly already made your decision before you asked us
old zephyr
more uptime on SB is good, it's just not THAT good compared to the others
chrome falcon
So go ahead, be suboptimal and die, reinforce the idea that all prot warriors are bad players
frosty knot
We are aren't we?
No, but despite everyone saying prot is broken I still find it fun
chrome falcon
I'm starting to wonder
frosty knot
But it's only fun when using devistator
old zephyr
Oh god, not again
wintry ermine
is there no way to get azerite shoulders with DC above 340 except mythic cache?
chrome falcon
😃
wintry ermine
ohgod, its even worse than that, the only azerite items with DC above 340 are in mythic cache (chest and head aswell) unless I'm not seeing something
my mythic cache just got more disappointing
tight tree
Anything, not just shoulders. No way to get.
Shit system is shit. I'd take RNG legendaries over this any day.
chrome falcon
^
At least with legendaries you know for a fact you'll EVENTUALLY be ok
Even if it takes a while
this way, our gear is down to the whims of blizzard (who seem to assign traits to gear randomly, without actually understanding which traits are important to the classes)
amber siren
I mean the first few months of legion you were stuck with only 2 legendaries for a while
legion wasn't perfect at the start by any means
wintry ermine
yeah I'd like the legendary rng at legion start over this
restive mauve
is there a way to reflect necrotic
chrome falcon
no
restive mauve
i somehow managed to get the second boss in freehold 9 stacks of necrotic
sick sentinel
anything new on the ptr?
cosmic magnet
For the mastery?
sick sentinel
y
chrome falcon
nope
wintry ermine
did they change mastery on ptr?
chrome falcon
that would be absolute trash
the most likely thing is that they're changing how block works and updating the mastery with it
sick sentinel
i see it coming bro
wintry ermine
would make sense
sick sentinel
remember that 1000% mastery buff to arms, oh my lord... i think they have absolutely no clue what to do
sick sentinel
prot is in an unfinished state, as many specs.they maybe giv us a shitty bandaid buff,and i think they just buff ip from worthless to ok
teal linden
Was lucky enough to get the head drop from mother, 370ilvl
Would you spaw it, but while losing DC?
Swap*
old zephyr
What ilvl is your DC
teal linden
340
old zephyr
I would keep dc but It's about the same
teal linden
I could just farm either the Kraken from boralus, or get ctraxxi but here was lucky again with the 385 drop from chest
Shame I can't be asked to farm that Ap to get all the traits
Gemhide at 28 tho :/
next goblet
pvp shoulders give DC
old zephyr
Now if you have à lot of stacks on the matrice the Mother helm is prob better
cosmic magnet
What are you thinking, if the new mastery is someting like that: Block heal you up to 25% of the blocked damage , crit block give you 50%. Increase your block chnace by X% and Increase your attak power by X%
For me that's make sense to give us some self healling and because they remove the crit block on our spell that give us 100% block chance ( I'm french so I don't have the english name of that )
wintry ermine
then we are just more block reliant...
I want to become less block reliant, so there's not as much difference between things that can be blocked and not.
thats the "bad" part of protection warrior at the moment in my opinion
topaz cove
heal for 1% with every 10 rage spent?
cosmic magnet
Yeah it's true that if you don't block your getting useless. I haven't see it like that
@topaz cove I guess no cause the heal need to be increase by mastery % so it will be: heal for X% every 10 rage spend, i guess it will be SOOOOOOOOmuch overpowered
topaz cove
Ah yeah true
storm isle
Depends on how they scale mastery
topaz cove
if it got near 3% would be very OP
storm isle
3% is 6k hp on someone with 200k hp
cosmic magnet
Just imagine with 30 or 40 % mastery , you heal you 10% hp every time you use revenge, shield block or ignore pain
topaz cove
yes but 10 rage isnt very much
storm isle
So 60k hp for 100 rage
storm isle
Yeah just up the rage spent then
dusky mica
Imagine you had an ability called Deathslam that applied ignore pain, healed you for 30% of your hp and did all your damage.
storm isle
To 25 or 30
cosmic magnet
If they scale 1% for 10% mastery to my point of view it's will be op
wintry ermine
hahahah @dusky mica
storm isle
Is that DK?
cosmic magnet
"all your damage" what are you saying with this ?
dusky mica
it's called a joke, relax
wintry ermine
I'd guess something that would scale IP in absorb amount and % absorbed
dusky mica
I wouldn't mind losing crit block, the rng has always bothered me
wintry ermine
yeah same
cosmic magnet
Yeah, I'm in for a IP increase with mastery !! I love how this buff works
old zephyr
Every time you take Damage, you "enrage" increasing ip amount /réduction by X. Reset when you cast ip
Make ravager baseline and add a silence to it, replace it by manaroth like in the talents
uneven mason
Mannoroth wouldn't compete with AM..make AM baseline, give us mannoroths in place of it, make ravager worth using (Like I Dunno, 35% DR, ranged interrupt what have you)
I'd rather have a vortex type effect on ravager
old zephyr
Oh Yeah
cosmic magnet
@uneven mason We also need a self healling 😃
hearty portal
Give prot whirlwind, but when you use it they just pull nearby mobs closer to you
not a huge range but make it so you can use it frequently
tight tree
We need mitigation to be better to compensate self healing tanks, simple
uneven mason
@hearty portal That wouldn't solve the issue though
hearty portal
what issue? I'm not talking about mitigation
uneven mason
The reason why BDK is meta for M+ (and paladin/monk) is because they can do what they do without the mobs touching them
old zephyr
Every rage we spend have à chance to Grant victory rush ?
hearty portal
BDK is meta cause they have ability that, Heals mitigates and deal damage. all in 1 button press
Its extremly effective
they are just strong at Everything. thats why they are meta
mellow bridge
I mean it's not just that lol
uneven mason
Heh, no, BDK is meta because of D&D kiting and Gorefiends
tight tree
Death strike is like shield slam+ignore pain+additional heal in one global.
hearty portal
Block should be able to block everything from melee to range to spells, and then just improve IP. problem solved
uneven mason
BDK overall require more external healing than warriors
chrome falcon
LOL
uneven mason
but they don't require ANY healing in high M+ keys
sick sentinel
lol sustain
chrome falcon
I'm pretty sure that is the least true thing that has ever been said
uneven mason
Because they're just not getting hit
tight tree
Overall does not matter, what matter is when situation is bad healer can pay attention to other people, and dk can sustain.
hearty portal
how do they build threat?
sick sentinel
dots
hearty portal
that cant be enough
hearty portal
They must be hitting shit, or are Everything they do range?
uneven mason
They can kite around their massive snare circle while maintaining aggro and not getting hit
tight tree
In so many of my last runs i wanted to be BDK because healer was struggling to keep group up on AOE (withches tyrannical anyone?)
sick sentinel
runic weapon not targetable. AOEs can just be thrown down/cast or some shit.
inner trail
you can also kite as a prot warrior though, tc range is huge
uneven mason
TC is 20% snare
sick sentinel
tc is also a shit snare rofl
primal crypt
If ravager was built like dnd I would use it
hearty portal
you need Another class to slow shit tho but yeah
uneven mason
we HAD a 50% snare
sudden tapir
sick sentinel
TC MAYBE brings the mobs to near/around 100% run speed. :p
primal crypt
Dnd is so good
chrome falcon
Paladin has a talent that makes Consecrate a 50% slow and increases its aoe, and consecrate is already better than thunderclap
All we get is a small range increase
uneven mason
they literally ONLY took the 50% snare onTC away to give folks a reason to use DR
but DR is so weak compared to UF
sick sentinel
(and unstoppable force and avatar)
chrome falcon
This is prot warrior in a nut shell, all our abilities/talents are half finished pieces of shit that need to do twice as much as they already do
sick sentinel
(you know. hit hard AF)
uneven mason
More like, Prot warriors are amazing, but had a lot of what makes them "not meta" stripped away in beta and not replaced by anything.
tight tree
Well anyway, noone questioning the fact that warrs have low m+ utility.
primal crypt
Mocking Banner would be a nice come back
Or whatever that AoE taunt banner was
I can't remember now
Would help with necro
old zephyr
I really like the proactive game play in raids, but we bring nothing to the team that makes à différence
What if cammand shout also gave Damage buff ?
primal crypt
Like battle shout?
chrome falcon
anyone who tells you battle shout is useful is an idiot
tight tree
We need stuff to do, not clenching to maintain SB up, but actually FUN and USEFUL things. Surviving is bare minimum, i want to be able to do more.
uneven mason
10%
chrome falcon
there is an item
uneven mason
its literally 10%
chrome falcon
that gives 7%
primal crypt
...
uneven mason
....
chrome falcon
10% is 3% better than 7%
primal crypt
5% dodge
chrome falcon
are you guys trolling me
the unique benefit of battle shout is only 3% attack power
this isn't me being pedantic this is just reality
uneven mason
Its not even unique to prot, Arms is bookoo big boy DPS right now
and can bring it
basically, Matt what I'm hearing is "I don't understand the issues prot faces, so I'ma just make arbitrary comments downplaying the toolkit we do have"
DOOMDOOM
chrome falcon
I can guarantee I have done more endgame content than you
And understand prot warrior's problems a lot better
If you think battle shout is good utility idk how to help you
primal crypt
🍿
uneven mason
Oh ok
silk portal
👶 🍼
amber siren
log fight
ember arrow
Alot of utility can be replaced or circumvented
urban walrus
💪
chrome falcon
"battle shout only gives 3% attack power" is an extremely simple concept to grasp
uneven mason
- Battleshout is solid utility, but its a class utility, thus is irrelevant to the discussion on what would address the issues this particular spec faces.
- I don't give a shit what sort of endgame content you've done, from what you've been spouting in here, you don't have a solid grasp of where the gaps in our toolkit are.
they could remove battleshout, and it would have a small discernable impact on our survivability (IPs would be smaller)
urban walrus
Backseat class balance devs
chrome falcon
The gaps in our toolkit is that devestate is a shit ability, shield slam does nothing but let us cast ignore pain (a shit ability), revenge is a dps rage spender that rarely spends rage and does terrible damage
Thunder clap is our only actually well designed ability
That has impact
uneven mason
0_o
chrome falcon
Like I don't even understand what points you're trying to take
All you've done is say "you don't understand the issues!"
When you couldn't even do the basic maths of 10 - 7
uneven mason
Well I'm going to go with, we need a way to functionally deal with casters in M+ beyond "Lets find a wall"
And We need a way for our niche (mitigation) to apply in all situations, as our low health pool does not allow for unmitigated damage IE - Zuls bleed, and other DoTs, while we do have a tool for this situation, the cost is too high to reliably use it for a full duration.
those are really the only 2 big issues Protection faces
chrome falcon
Casters in m+ are easy
We have shockwave and fear
And voice comms, to call for interrupts and stuns
uneven mason
right over your head.
old zephyr
our CC is actually one of the best (aside DH OP silence)
chrome falcon
"Don't interrupt this cast, I'n reflecting it, then I'll get first interrupt, then I'll drop shockwave, then resto druid you typhoon, then they're dead"
That's all you have to do lol
uneven mason
So, dealing with controling the pull (this is a big deal in M+) is what makes us harder to work with in M+
urban walrus
Matt you don't understand, you can't cc lock mobs all the time they still cast/shoot/throw at us
uneven mason
charging into many packs in M+ is basicalkly a request for more packs to be pulled.
old zephyr
why chage then?
chrome falcon
heroic throw->wait literally 2 seconds->charge
primal crypt
Just fear them, you'll be fine
uneven mason
sounds logical
old zephyr
untercept Melee for rage
chrome falcon
alt: heroic throw->go around los->press thunderclap and have aggro on the whole pack
urban walrus
Ranged damage hurts us so much Vs other tanks
chrome falcon
Ranged damage hurts everyone
uneven mason
What is it that IJust said lol "We need a way to deal with ranged that doesn't involve, lets find a wall"
chrome falcon
I thought you meant shield wall (which is also a viable option)
uneven mason
OBtuse monkey.
old zephyr
Every tank aside DK has to fnd a wall though
chrome falcon
Alright that's a little bit mean lol
chrome falcon
C'mon now buddy I know you didn't manage to do a +10 in time yet but you don't have to go around name calling
cinder bridge
that would be da bomb
primal crypt
OH NOO HE CALLED YOU BUDDYYYYYYY
chrome falcon
Also, paladins/monks/druids can't """deal with""" ranged without a wall either
chrome falcon
LoSing casters has always been a core part of doing dungeons
urban walrus
Casters in melee range hurt us more than other tanks still?
cinder bridge
talking about LoSing casters/ranged when discussing prot war issues is so ridiculously out of focus of the actual problem I don't know where to begin
chrome falcon
@urban walrus Just interrupt them????? Fear them???? Shockwave them???
sick sentinel
Also, storm bolt.
chrome falcon
Gem isn't worth as much on legs
Since they have joint highest stat budget
Gem is worth a lot more on cloak, rings
Also, why are you gemming crit 😛
chrome falcon
Arms is 2 floors upstairs buddy 😛
primal crypt
😄
sick sentinel
🙃
chrome falcon
Ah gotcha
valid gorge
i'm not looking for arms advice
chrome falcon
Yeah just go ilvls
primal crypt
😂
valid gorge
i'm looking for prot advice ;)
chrome falcon
On legs/chest/helm just take ilvl every time I think
Unless like
You're going 370 haste with a gem vs 375 crit without a gem
valid gorge
I can see why, the strength difference is quite big due to it being pants
chrome falcon
Yep
valid gorge
I also don't really know how much better haste is than everything else
chrome falcon
Not much
valid gorge
part of the reason why I was doubting
chrome falcon
It's definitely the best but it's not so good that you worry about it most of the time
valid gorge
aight, fits me pretty well then
i can leave the crit gem in for arms and use the 380 for prot
=)
chrome falcon
The 370 sims higher for arms? That's kind of surprising
I don't know shit about that spec but still
valid gorge
It does
crit haste are BiS stats
without the socket the 380 would be better though
ember arrow
Matra i dont get your point about battle shout. Its free and requires no item. Even if thats irrelevant its a weird point to make. Wouldnt that be same as saying u dont need BL since itd only 5% more haste than drums?
round vortex
Reinforced plating any good now? after patch lol
ember arrow
10% better than before
ember arrow
Nothing significant
jovial reef
nerfs are a social construct
obsidian siren
Hey guys, recently swapped from arms to prot "main" due to roster issues, and we're currently progressing on HC g'huun, but i feel like i'm really getting shredded, should i link logs here or in the log review channel?
obsidian siren
yes boss
vocal nimbus
1xDC 2xBI
vapid loom
cool cause the other one got buffed
old zephyr
1 trick to know on ghuun is that you can reflect the spell that force you to drop puddles.
You want to reflect 2nd and 4th one (4th is mot important but if you want to cicle it with CD you can do 2nd as well,) so you can freely go and take the blood feast without doping nasty things into the raid
rugged plinth
@vapid loom when
midnight raft
According to the Illidan Novel - canon btw - it was a Prot Warrior who tanked Illidan. For this reason, I insist that Prot Warriors should 1-shot DHs.
midnight raft
I was a Prot Warrior those days.
I invoke the same .png
uneven mason
I was both
depending on the week
Raidleader does what it takes to keep the raid going, even if it meant going resto on your elemental alt.
Things were o so simple then
chilly brook
Yea you actually got loot and it wasn’t gated behind an rng box that you could open once a week
spice musk
Is the Haste Gem really better than a Epic Str Gem?
midnight raft
Correction: Somebody else got loot, you got 50 DPK Minus for not having the exact the Class Leader said was 100% necessary despite you tanking better than they did.
spice musk
mh okay why is ilvl than 99% stronger i really dont get it xD
latent tide
Because an ilvl upgrade has more than just haste
chilly brook
^
latent tide
armor, stam, str, these things together cause an upgrade
chilly brook
If you have your choice of stats it’s haste
If you have an ilvl upgrade you get more than just one stat
latent tide
^
steel mauve
Total stat budget, take all the stats on a piece of gear, add it all together including all secondaries, str, armor and stam, and its always an upgrade due to how close our secondaries are
tall needle
What’s the best piece of advice you can give a new prot warrior?
tall needle
I’ve been looking at them some
tight tree
Also be ready to get declined from PUG groups for being a warrior.
tall needle
Lol I’m ready for that
chilly brook
Best advice? Be liberal with your cooldowns and don’t expect people to be happy that you’re a prot warrior
tight tree
Thats the spirit! 
tall needle
Luckily I made this guy to start playing with some real life friends. I felt like they tried to get me to go blood DK but I’ve never enjoyed DK
tall needle
The thing I want to do the most is M+ and I’m a little intimidated by M+ at the moment to be honest
dusk locust
best thing you can do in m+ is learn what all the mobs are doing to you
what's worth interrupting/stunning/fearing and what isn't
chilly brook
If you’re going to do m+ on a prot warrior make sure you build the team around your weaknesses
mellow bridge
e.g.?
chilly brook
Get someone that has a heavy snare
chilly brook
At least two of the classes should have a cc ability like repentance, sap etc.
And yes boomie is quite nice because of the treants
AoE stuns are really nice as well
sour iron
it's kinda nice that cc is more important in mythic+ than just dps charts in some cases
marble pelican
Question, when does that world boss in AH reset? or how often?
old zephyr
Boomie, monkn mage, and rogue/DH to skip things
amber siren
poly isn't a hard cc
chrome harbor
all them slows n freezes
old zephyr
no but the heavy AoE and slow are super nice
chrome harbor
frost mages are killer for necrotic imo
tall needle
How does DH allow you to skip things?
old zephyr
you can use the cage and pas next to the mob without trgering combat
tall needle
Ah
chilly brook
Basically you should follow the group building concept that Shakib (DH tank) follows
Build around the weakness and coordinate CC
old zephyr
exemple on shrine of the storm : the 2 dudes that spawn Big tentacles.
Cage one a pass on the edge n that side
what are thoses shakib concepts? i'm curious
sick sentinel
question : can we use legion legendaries in timewalking?
chilly brook
Well DH tanks are super squish so he basically builds group utility to counter that. Always uses CC during pulls whether that’s a soft cc like poly or hard cc to stop damage while also dealing damage. Then allows the DPS to do their damage while kiting because of the snares that they bring etc.
Granted we can face tank a lot more than a DH but you should be able to read when it would be better for you to kite
old zephyr
just use a lot of CC, and a lot of CDs anyway
if you are in a bad spot, it's probably too late for a CD. just use them when available
modern brook
I thought i was getting better then i missed dodging lasers on MOTHER and took~5% hp damage and i realized im not better my stats are higher
feels 🏸
chilly brook
Lol
frosty wedge
this week's affixes are so much easier than last week
also +8s feel easier than timewalking End Time
modern brook
@frosty wedge did you do them at the start of the day yesterday or the end?
cause there was a scaling issue that i think was hotfixed
frosty wedge
@modern brook timewalking? did them early
tropic star
are we fixed forever yet?
frosty wedge
it was almost impossible to kill a ghoul before they closed in on her
mellow bridge
what's the timewalking event?
frosty wedge
they should upgrade everyone that completed the quest beforethe hotfixe's items to 370 instead of 355, lol
modern brook
Its an event that makes you feel bad for tanking even though you didnt play back in cata
frosty wedge
do 5 quests, get a 355 piece
modern brook
Cata
frosty wedge
Cata
mellow bridge
Reset was just today here in EU and I havent been on yet
tawny lantern
What does timewalker drops now? 355 or 370?
modern brook
hence my shit joke
tawny lantern
I mean the quest
modern brook
355 i answered this first because I'm the fastest
frosty wedge
oh, the quest is 355
frosty wedge
np
modern brook
np
frosty wedge
are people running storm bolt for m+? or rumbling earth for more group stuns?
modern brook
I run rumbling earth but i think stormbolt is the right answer
old zephyr
i run the fear thing lol
modern brook
Storm bolt gives you a 3rd interupt
and shockwave should be up each pull even without the CDR
old zephyr
so I can use it as an extra AoE CS without mobs reunning
frosty wedge
yeah that's my thinking
vocal nimbus
Stormbolt
modern brook
TBH, i dont know what the fear talent does
frosty wedge
cool, thanks guys
vocal nimbus
The fear talent is not worth it
frosty wedge
the fear talent makes it last 4 secs longer, and makes things tand still instead of running away
old zephyr
fear last longer, and mobs cower in fear (don't move) instead of running
vocal nimbus
99% of the time fear will be broken anyways
modern brook
Its not about the CC as much the interupt
old zephyr
yeah but that 1% sucks
modern brook
same reason purple sigil is nuts on dh
old zephyr
yeah
vocal nimbus
Just heroic thorw that one
modern brook
I misinterpreted your point soul, sorry lol
Is there ever a time to take Safeguard?
I ran crackling thunder for a while before i realized its actually pointless
old zephyr
if you need an extra external but I don't have any situation in mind RN
Use bounding stride for mobility
topaz cove
Do you never find a use for the extended range?
modern brook
in wpvp sometimes
topaz cove
Can be helpful when kiting, but yeah 4xtch is probably right with taking bounding stride
the CD is Heroic Leap is too long without it
modern brook
crackling helps with dead zone issues in wpvp; but in pulls i rarely have trouble hitting with the clap
I'm using leap rn, but idk i keep thinking it gives a charge so im burning leaps cause im retarded
amber siren
safeguard is a very good external that's up very often, if you don't need the mobility for some particular reason you shouldn't be passing up on it
chilly brook
That way I can do 12k+ DPS on the fight 🙃
topaz cove
@modern brook I really miss my leggo shoulders
modern brook
💪
topaz cove
Leaping halfway through a dungeon was great
topaz cove
we're still pretty quick, aslong as we have a DH to intervene to 😛
modern brook
describing intervene to my guildies was a fucking adventure
old zephyr
"you can charge allies"?
modern brook
they kept ranging me when I'd try to charge them to avoid cudgel and shit
topaz cove
rofl
chilly brook
We might be “quick” but good luck soloing the first boss of Mythic HFC without our speed lego’s
chrome harbor
dragon charge base
fixt
course I can see a lot of ppl going full DH and charging off the platforms
topaz cove
lool
old zephyr
isn't that what monk do?
sand egret
yeah that'd be me
old zephyr
rolling off platforms?
chrome harbor
lol monks, DHs, hunters in the opposite direction
modern brook
YEah monks do 2 things
sand egret
did that last night on my hunter
modern brook
tank better than us and roll off platforms
sand egret
if there is someplace to fall off, I wil find it
but yes, onne charge on leap crushes my soul
old zephyr
the don't tank "better" they tank "smoother".
sand egret
I want my shoulders back
modern brook
issa joke
chrome harbor
healers tend to like smoother
old zephyr
they can't take full zev'koz combo because stagger will kill them.
It barely scratches us
sand egret
sometimes, when no one is looking....I turn on warmode and go Fury just so I can leap twice
modern brook
wait no plz stop its a joke i dont want to be the one that starts this today
amber siren
oh boy
chrome harbor
too late, like a dragon charge off the cliff
modern brook
if i waited ~an hour some reddit kid would be here to complain and i wouldnt have this weight on my shoulders T.T
old zephyr
quick let's send bear memes to avoid that
chrome harbor
which i did do a few times when I first started lvling in warmode
you get some distance and momentum on that fall....
topaz cove
Anyone else die constantly at lvl 116 from jumping off a cliff and forgetting Heroic Leap only has one charge and 10s left on the CD?
sand egret
my life
modern brook
Yes
chrome harbor
thats when you quickly try to charge a rabbit or something
modern brook
though i blame zuldazar being actually the worst hub zone in existence
topaz cove
frantically ^
sand egret
honestly
modern brook
its like they attempted to put every inconvenient thing in one zone
topaz cove
Rofl
chrome harbor
"Surprise mother fucker" -Ground 2018
topaz cove
Remember shallow puddles? Stormheim remembers
modern brook
I hated the rain in stormheim
sand egret
I like to call it...charging the ground.
modern brook
it didnt look nice and it hurt my eyes
topaz cove
Zuldazar is the only zone I've been to where I 100% follow the road
Or I end up on some bullshit ledge trying to leap up it
valid gorge
haha
topaz cove
only to slide down and have to take the road anyway
chrome harbor
still beats Val'sharah
valid gorge
that mountain in tiragarde sound that had the world boss on it last week
god fucking damnit
sand egret
Zuldazar is also a zone where if you auto-run and look away for 2 seconds....you're falling off a 2 mile high cliff
topaz cove
I'm used to not looking away for 2 seconds playing prot
valid gorge
if you don't follow the road you end up trickjumping all over the place and failing anyway
modern brook
💪
chrome harbor
Ive glidered into a few trees and then had to hope I landed a leap with all the leaves in my camera
sand egret
I like to pretend I'm "hip" and "cool" with the meta kids these days....then I whip out my shield and show to the rest of the world i'm still prot.
modern brook
😠 💪 :mcafee: - the 3 dsiciplines of warrior
chrome harbor
im dumb and always level/quest as prot for some reason. I just like it
but I wish there was a BotW-esque shield surf
topaz cove
I levelled as prot as well
sand egret
I do it mostly b/c kill times and the mog
modern brook
Also can we discuss how people pretend there's horde bias
when alliance got the penguin sledding zone?
chrome harbor
and a bumblebee mount
sand egret
see: Horse mounts
topaz cove
I'm so shit in arms and fury I do less dps than I do in prot ST
sick sentinel
Me 2
chrome harbor
theres no bias, I think Blizzard just keeps track of both side's story about as well as they do bugs/tunning
modern brook
In fairness; Avatar booty claps are absurd
sand egret
best argument i've seen is that we got Dark Iron
modern brook
I do more than frost mages on aoe pulls
chrome harbor
dmg does seem to be our niche, though I wouldnt mind trading some of it for a bit more mit
sand egret
we just scale well
modern brook
Really our niche is shieldblock is an absurdly strong mitigation tool
sand egret
in high # of mobs due to booty clap not diminishing
chrome harbor
best 8.3 tanks confirmed?
sand egret
8.5
topaz cove
SW, LS and praise Odyn
valid gorge
wasn't that actually a thing in Molten Core during Vanilla
valid gorge
killing Garr and Geddon at the same time
sand egret
8.5!
modern brook
also spell reflect
topaz cove
Wish the window was a bit longer on that one
modern brook
I dislike how a) nothing can be reflected and b) the things that are dont always target you
but where its good its sick
feels warrior when you reflect some dot back at the guy
"fuck your magic nerd im here to be big and stompt the ground"
chilly brook
I mean in dungeons I SR abilities all the time
dusk locust
i like calling out "i have next interrupt" but i spell reflect instead
chilly brook
Third boss in KR for example
topaz cove
good idea Kauda
chilly brook
Or third boss in SotS
modern brook
Yeah I'm not saying its useless griff; just that its not always useful
old zephyr
first boss in UR
modern brook
Like on trash packs most reflectable stuff is random target
chilly brook
It’s really satisfying every 25 seconds smacking a boss for 150k from their own spell
modern brook
most shit in raid cant be reflected
old zephyr
them sweet 100K dmaage
chilly brook
¯_(ツ)_/¯
old zephyr
you can reflect ghuun explosive coruption
topaz cove
I felt so OP on Kruul when I got the spell reflect off
dusk locust
for whatever reason explosive corruption doesn't show properly on bigwigs for me
the first one does but the rest don't
earnest zinc
I tried my 340 brew in place of my 355 warrior and the brew wasn't much behind despite also missing the middle ring. Is balance really that bad or do I just suck at warrior?
chrome harbor
i just learned you can reflect lingering infection, I need to read these guides sooner damn
modern brook
probably the latter
old zephyr
lingering infection?
chilly brook
Brew will overall give an easier time
modern brook
Warrior tanking requires a lot of planning out your defensives before the pull; monk you just kinda get hit and drink beer
chilly brook
Prot will require more effort to get the same result
modern brook
and as is said here often; if a monk makes a mistake he's healed, if a prot makes a mistake, he gets a repair bill
topaz cove
Can anyone make a WA that plays a clip that says "I'm rubber you're glue" when a spell gets reflected?
storm isle
what's better. a 370 helm from Uldir or a 385 one?
modern brook
Probably not; idt you can track reflecting a spell
topaz cove
Damn
topaz cove
nah, not as satisfying is it
modern brook
Ask in #ui-addons-manager they're much mroe versed in what WA can do than i am
sand egret
👌
old zephyr
wait a minute how do you reflect lingeing infection?
chrome harbor
right before omega goes off apparently
modern brook
I thought you could reflect omega vector not infection
chrome harbor
you can avoid getting the debuff
modern brook
Oh nevermind im retatrded
old zephyr
does it transfer the debuf??
modern brook
It still passes it yeah; i tihnk it just denies the debuff at the end
chrome harbor
yea
old zephyr
I wanted to pass the increased damages to the boss lol
modern brook
❤
chrome harbor
im sure a lot of the boomies and ass rogues would too
uneven mason
But you can track the casts yourself, he'll go to cast it between his 7th and 9th stacks
So just swap every 4 is safe
earnest zinc
Where can I learn the breakdown of fetid devourer uptime?
modern brook
press shield block
earnest zinc
When I'm getting hit
uneven mason
got logs?
modern brook
are you maintanking or thrash tanking/
earnest zinc
thrash
earnest zinc
Thrash is more dangerous
chrome harbor
more fun*
uneven mason
actually
modern brook
I just press shield block when he's about to thrash
uneven mason
his melee hits are more dangerous
modern brook
SB->sb->LS (lasts for 2) -> sb
uneven mason
Main tank always takes more damage
steel mauve
Dbm tells you when to defensive when hes gonna thrash
uneven mason
So, Fetid has breaks in his melee attacks (which interrupt his stacks)
it also has a cast bar
signal plover
U could argue that either way
earnest zinc
Just hit shield block on thrash cast and that will be enough?
steel mauve
Ya i made a weakaura for his thrash cast as well, but dbm makes it audible
uneven mason
generally
steel mauve
Before 50% yes
modern brook
I also dont use SW rotationally inc ase im out of blocks or mad bar
chrome harbor
i always tried to have a block and an IP up
steel mauve
After youll want cds
steel mauve
Any ability he casts can delay thrash
uneven mason
and when he goes to eat an add (if you allow it on HC) will give you large breaks
you should have effective 100% block coverage
and near 100% coverage with DS
modern brook
^ i was gunna bring that up
uneven mason
effectively I think I had DS up for 89% Of his melee time
modern brook
maintaining 90+ uptime on DS is so easy
uneven mason
after 50% use Shield wall to cover any gap you have in DS uptime
modern brook
on that fight*
uneven mason
Yeah make sure you understand the difference between effective uptime (Having the buff/debuff active when it counts) and uptime (just using it to use it)
But @earnest zinc Do you have logs so I can show you where you track your uptime and how to figure out your effective uptime?
earnest zinc
That's an old one on normal
This week I used my monk since the warrior didn't need much loot
storm isle
anyone here knows what's the better azerite helm to use a 370 Gridrunner Galea or a 385 Helm of abyssal Malevolence
modern brook
Whats the trait on Malevolence?
uneven mason
Item level trumps everything unless Deafening Crash is involved
chrome harbor
keep all azerite though, traits are very volatile atm
uneven mason
for azerite gear the only trait worth more than a single tier is DC hehe
storm isle
okey so aslong as i have i DC i should just go for ilvl
uneven mason
and yeah
right
I've got like 10 pieces in my bank atm between 340 (DC items grrrr) and 385 (shoulders I can't wear because DC) gree
chrome harbor
I just hope they get tunning in a good place before BfA goes live
uneven mason
😄
modern brook
oof
earnest zinc
Azerite tuning is a meme
storm isle
allready got 385 DC item 😃
earnest zinc
modern brook
@uneven mason is there a resource some where that teaches you how to interpret logs for tanking?
uneven mason
You have my envy, and my ire
storm isle
this is the helm and it's traits
uneven mason
uh wowhead has a basic guide
whole coral
does crystalline carpace stack or is it best to just have that trait once?
uneven mason
but its more understanding what your mistakes are (Marok has a section in the IV guide for that)
and then finding where you made them
So go through the wowhead guide
which tells you how to read them
and then use the information from marok's guide and measure it against the mechanics you're facing
and see where the stumbles are.
tawdry python
what do people this of this weeks affixes? better than last week? is the kiting tough?
modern brook
Does necrotic affect IP?
astral crystal
this week is extremely free
storm isle
Got myself underrot 9 again this week who hoo
uneven mason
I don't think so, it didn't used too
astral crystal
you can push keys easily
storm isle
druids are very welcome
uneven mason
but it may now. I haven't actually checked
chrome harbor
honestly as long as its tyrannical im happy
uneven mason
next key I run I'll log it and get an answer.
old zephyr
I Hate tyranical...
modern brook
I know shields are sometimes effected by healing shit (cause of disc priest mostly))
uneven mason
TFW the game has decided that Motherlode is the only key you should receive
astral crystal
tyrannical is fantastic for us yo
modern brook
unsure if ip counts as that
uneven mason
Well in Legion IP was not considered a heal or full absorb
old zephyr
people I usually run with have crap ST DPS and are prone to mistakes, makes bosses a pain
tall pelican
Whats the recommended ilvl to be able to do +10’s as a prot warrior
uneven mason
trash is way more deadly than bosses right now
chrome harbor
i had to do underrot last week.... fuck that place
uneven mason
Uh, 350 to feel comfortable, 395 to make your group accept you
chrome harbor
yea but you still gotta get there
chrome harbor
and teeming made my group facepull happy with quaking
storm isle
teeming in underrot was awfull
tall pelican
Lmao ok im 350 now with decent stats and trinkets ill see if my guildees wanna push one today
uneven mason
Teeming Fort QUake infested TD 🤢
Mind you Nick, +10 more or less requires perfect play
at 350
but, its doable
I Mena as a warrior
doing a +2 requires perfect play
storm isle
it's all about if you wanna do it in time
uneven mason
normal dungeons - perfect play
wet compass
so what god awful affixs are this week?
storm isle
Necrotic,Raging,Tyranical
chilly brook
Oh hey guys did I miss much?
uneven mason
No.
chilly brook
The meme 🙃
uneven mason
New item type for warriors
uneven mason
"Tower Shields - twice the armor of normal shields, reduces movement speed by 50%, cannot charge"
storm isle
or heroic leap
topaz cove
"Jump is removed, Heroic Leap now counts as jumping"
wet compass
no can only heroic leap
chilly brook
Don’t you mean twice the block :smugpepe
wet compass
and heroic and heroic leap has half cd
wow my mind wondered off in the middle of that sentence
storm isle
tower shield still cant block Throw Rock
hasty cradle
topaz cove
rofl
chilly brook
The fact that you take damage through a block never made sense for me
A block is literally a parry with a shield
topaz cove
yeah, for ages I thought it worked the same as parry
uneven mason
Well, Hit points are also a basis of how much endurance you have for combat
So it makes some sense.
which is why shields in D&D are just AC
chilly brook
“It’s attached to your arm somehow so you must take some damage from the transfer of blunt force”
But like
wet compass
I want door shields
chilly brook
So are weapons
wet compass
best dark souls build ever
steel mauve
I have a door as a shield 👍
grim prism
A parry uses the attacker's momentum to redirect the blow safely
Doesnt matter if theyre 5x bigger than you
wet compass
A block is basically a parry
grim prism
:thonking:
wet compass
you are shunting it away
wet compass
an ideal block actually has a significant amount of force behind it because the shield isn't stationary
grim prism
Whereas with a block you are bracing it against your head and neck to absorb the blow, because war no think
chilly brook
You literally use the shield to do the same thing as you would with a sword
wet compass
think of the shield slam animation
chrome harbor
explains the dmg sa a thrash tank even with block up...
wet compass
that's more like what an actual block looks like
grim prism
Its really flavorful guys. You just dont understand class fantasy
chilly brook
Lol
chrome harbor
I mean i can wear like 5 times my weight in plate and then leap across a room, i think theres some room for disbelief
blissful pebble
With a block you are stopping force, a parry is more a redirection of force to somewhere non harmful. Blocks only partially negating damage makes sense to me I think the inconsistency is that you can parry things that wouldn't be "realistically" parryable.
chilly brook
But a real block isn’t stopping force
A shield is a tool that more effectively allows you to redirect a blow or stop it
chrome harbor
I also cant hold up my shield to block all the time either, shits heavy
wet compass
a real block is a parry
topaz cove
most shields on my dwarf are comically tiny, so I really should be able to hold that up all the time
chilly brook
If you actually look at Shield techniques and whatnot it’s usually being used to redirect a blow while simultaneously striking back
But hey at the end of the day it’s wow
signal plover
Depends on the type of shield
blissful pebble
Nah a block is as the word suggests blocking or impeding the travel of something.
grim prism
Ive seeb Braveheart, does that count
chilly brook
I suppose it doesn’t need to make sense
signal plover
It's semantics anyway
grim prism
We do love semantics here
chilly brook
Doesn’t matter if you call it a parry or not
signal plover
Indeed
topaz cove
when wow gets physics based combat we can pick this convo up again guys
chilly brook
Lol
signal plover
Plz give riposte rating blizz
topaz cove
loool
signal plover
Gravity
topaz cove
Drustvar Witch begins to cast Gravity: Australia
Sorry
that was really shit
speaking of shit
bears
bur
chilly brook
Lul
wet compass
A block is a shunt
it's why real shields would never look like bulwark
you are trying to redirect force not keep it on you
chilly brook
^