we only had like 5 attempts on him before our time ran out but wanted to come with some tips for next raid. Our biggest problem was positioning in p2
#protection
untold adder
old zephyr
350 jes holwler or 355 systematic regression tbhingy?
signal plover
Howler
amber siren
i mean they're both doing different purposes?
jes howler is a defensive trinket
systematic regression is a dps proc
sick sentinel
Normal Uldir pug, 2 wipes on mother, half the raid leaves lul
old dawn
@untold adder Mythrax was definitely the hardest fight I had in Uldir last night
You just have to make sure the adds stay split up. We popped lust for the first add phase just to make it cleaner
I slowly kited my add across the room, had the rest of the group stack on the other big guy and kill it
and then we started tank swapping for the severs
sick sentinel
Ez
old dawn
Everyone has to be together because of the add spawns.
spiral mirage
why does prot warrior have lower hp than others?
amber siren
we have less because we're proactive than reactive
old dawn
We take considerably less damage
old dawn
Yea <3
rough jasper
Done for this week.
nocturne river
Not my group, but some dedication here: https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/318807610323238913/487854373985058827/1234.png
forest tiger
guys, i have been playing warrior for a while and i have bad taste about it, i did 6 the underrot and i get big hits. My friends says that warrior is shit. Any ideas?
old dawn
👌 😂
warrior isn't shit just make sure to use your cooldowns ahead of time
underrot hurts on specific pulls
especially this week
old dawn
Your group isn't interrupting Unholy Frenzy
don't directly tank ticks, pre-pop a cooldown before pulling the bigger pulls, interrupt Unholy Frenzy on the skeletons
everything else should be fine as long as you're doing your rotation correctly
forest tiger
u can interrupt unholy frenzy or it should be stunned?
sick sentinel
Playing good prot is harder and bad prots give us bad rep
And hp pool does not matter that much when you criticxal block a terrible thrash and take like 25k damage while other classes take like 120k or some shit
amber siren
the skeletons hit harder in general, they're supposed to be nuked while interrupting/dispelling their shields
fathom field
I wonder if some of the arms warriors are going to respec prot for pvp when they realize our aoe damage dealer comes with a one second root 😀
sick sentinel
And 2 stuns, one being a cone aoe
fathom field
and a fear
We suck 1v1 but in bgs we look viable.
Its funny popping bolster when a rogue tries to gank you
forest tiger
where can i find best traits for warrior prot
cursive loom
check pinned mes
forest tiger
pinned?
frosty wedge
holy balls I have 0 loot luck.
I have gotten 0 pieces out of my last 4 m+ runs
You should be like, guaranteed one piece if you three chest it
formal cargo
any thoughts on Archive of the Titans?
forest tiger
Is this fine?
"Assuming equal item level and Middle/Inner traits, you want 1 Deafening Crash Icon Deafening Crash trait and 2 Brace for Impact Icon Brace for Impact traits."
sick sentinel
@forest tiger what do you want to know exactly? you ask if icyveins guide is not lying?
sick sentinel
u want 1 and not more Deafening Crash for prolonging shout debuff, and then 1-2 Brace for Impact trait
jagged bay
gz jaidor how was it
ebon torrent
man i fucking love thunder clap
errant dagger
i really wish their would a a build with devistator
jagged bay
cool 😃
tender phoenix
i just failed hard at a +2 is there a reason here?? (ilvl 339)
rustic cypress
if you were dying in a +2 your secondaries is really not the place you should start looking
rustic cypress
there could be a million reasons
who was your healer? did he do well? how was your damage intake? did your group do tactics correctly?
very hard for us to help you with such a broad statement
tender phoenix
so more of a "Git Gud Scrub" and question heals?
rustic cypress
not neccessarily, I just mean that we don't have enough info to identify why you were dying
tender phoenix
ah ok
daring marlin
I hate shrine so much
fathom field
ikr
rustic cypress
my guild has a running joke that shrine keys don't actually exist
none of us have gotten one so far
tender phoenix
my first key is shrine cba to do it tho
daring marlin
In the rare events I find a key that invites me
native kelp
i have 3 maces and 2 rezan eyes
daring marlin
go for dem 5+
native kelp
i have loot from 3 or 4 atal 5
daring marlin
4s too but still
native kelp
and a 6
daring marlin
Atal is ezpz just not so fun when you have poopoo dps
I know we do a lot of damage but still.
That’s a frost mage.
🤔
neat crow
is the trinket Lingering sporepods any good ?
void cove
hey guys, how are prot warrior getting on atm? ive tanked m+ up to +4 but i just seem to be taking a lot of damage sometimes, i'm trying to keep up shield block and ignore pain depending on the situation, just a pack of 4 mobs sometimes really really hurts
wide spruce
im curious too
everyone is saying warriors are the worst tanks atm, and im curious
i dont even see their sims online
void cove
difficult to sim a tank i guess
vocal nimbus
Blizzard wanted to make the tanks as paperlike as possible this xpac
Every tank feels squishy
wide spruce
the thing i feel weird about with prot is
vocal nimbus
I've tanked with brm warrior and bdk
wide spruce
i feel squishy, but i also have no way to stop magic damage or self heal, while other tanks do
void cove
ive spoken to the healer in my guild and they say warriors are the worst to heal hm
vocal nimbus
And every tank is 100% healer dependant
wide spruce
thats what i was told, too, ross
so far for me, it feels like we are entirely reliant on blocking physical damage
vocal nimbus
You dont have selfheals, bdks dont have damage reductions, monks just stagger damage
Different designs 🤷
wide spruce
would you say they are about even?
vocal nimbus
For the kind of content 99.9% of the player base does, yes
vocal nimbus
There are some tricks as bdk in some dungeons, i dont know that much
Im not a top player
wide spruce
i hear ya
vocal nimbus
What is true is that warrior is the less forgiving tank
wide spruce
yeah i can see that for sure
vocal nimbus
As in, a mistake as prot is punished harder than monk
void cove
in the top 100 mythic+ clears on EU warrior tank isnt there
stoic kite
I feel like a wet noodle in M 5+ 😦
void cove
first one comes at 136 where there is one, bare in mind these are only completions and not upgrading keys
wide spruce
what mythic level would that be at, ross?
vocal nimbus
The players at the top 100 probably werent even main warriors in the past
stoic kite
My healer says im harder to heal than her pally friends. not sure if im just bad or what
void cove
+11ish
stoic kite
344 ilvl
vocal nimbus
I bet those are players could clear that content as warriors too
amber siren
just for clarification, people aren't saying warriors are the best to push keys in, they're the same for your average mythic raider/normal M+ pushing
wide spruce
the only time i feel like im really accomplishing something, as a tank, is when i have a lot of melee on me, i pop my demoralizing, and i have shield block up
void cove
this guy completed in time +10 freehold
amber siren
As the difficulty gets higher the differences become more and more obvious
Unless you're pushing in that top 100
Who cares
void cove
well it's not about what can be done
wide spruce
i think the reason why people care, rybie, is because we want to see where we stand next to other tanks
stoic kite
What do you guys think the 340 or 345?
wide spruce
if the difference is minute, and it truly only gets noticed at very very very top levels, that makes it much better
lean fern
can i cry and complain here
wide spruce
but i feel like i see the difference at much lower levels of content, comparitively
amber siren
we're the same in legion, middle of the pack, no one has disputed that
wide spruce
i hear ya
amber siren
If you're having an issue in a 5 that's not warrior
lean fern
how standing there for 4secs casting gcd's is not killing my soul
void cove
the only reason i ask if prot warr is shit compared to others is that it really does feel as if theres a problem, and i'd like to know if the problem is me or if the spec isn't quite as good as the other tanks
lean fern
and cant recover
vocal nimbus
Every tank takes a lot of damage
wide spruce
same, ross! same
lean fern
when my 340 dbk
wide spruce
exactly, i feel like im missing something
lean fern
bdk can do so much more
wide spruce
other tanks look to have such an easier time
stoic kite
That's how I feel Ross. Idk if it's me or what
wide spruce
i dont think its us guys, i think prot warrs are below par
prot warriors in pve are becoming more rare than resto shamans in pvp haha
vocal nimbus
The spec plays weirdly but it isnt subpar
void cove
are shields extremely important as prot? my shield isn't super great honestly
wide spruce
very very veyr important, ross
amber siren
resto shamans are amazing in pvp what
wide spruce
it could be the difference between block stopping 20% damage, or 50% damage
lean fern
chrage - avatar - demo - IP... then is howmmuch now? 5seconds?
like idk whree
i just depleted a 6 waycrest
wide spruce
rybie, i love resto shamans haha. just saying they are rare, so hard to find them! xD
vocal nimbus
You cast avatar precharge
lean fern
with a really good healer
vocal nimbus
Avatar, charge, TC+SB, another global, tc, global, tc and so on
wide spruce
TC?
lean fern
thunderclaop
vocal nimbus
Thunderclap
shut summit
vocal nimbus
Deafening crash is a huge boost too
spark mortar
What are folks favorite piece for Deafening Crash in Azerite land?
fathom field
Well we should probably listen to him
surreal stump
the pc i dont have from raids yet
wide spruce
in my opinion, as far as prot warrs go. as a tank class, we have minimal utility to deal with anything ASIDE raw physical damage. we have no invulnerabilities, no SELF HEALS. which is fine, but i think because we lack that which so many other tanks have, we should gain something. give and take. we should be the beefiest tank, since we have no self heals and only deal with raw physical damage
spark mortar
I'm trying to find what's the best Mythics to be chasing.
wide spruce
what do you guys think?
supple path
Kraken shell pauldrons are what I'm using, crystalline carapace as second trait, bulwark of the masses as third. Siege of boralus
vocal nimbus
And warr's defensive cds are very spammable with anger management
amber siren
🤷 We are the best tank for taking large hits I really wish we would get over this self healing niche
void cove
i just looked at top 500 m+ eu and theres 10 warr tanks in it
spark mortar
Ooh that's a good combo @supple path
lean fern
@vocal nimbus yes to when ur at 30% from having no Sb an last stand.. wheres the recover
hmm?
spark mortar
Anything else you would recommend?
surreal stump
LMAO
vocal nimbus
SW+IP
supple path
My others are WQ nonsense.
lean fern
im sprry that a spell
vocal nimbus
Stun
void cove
ip is ignore pain
lean fern
IP is Intake pain - lose rage generation with a smaller penis then my 3yr o.ld nephew's
sry im just very tilted
wide spruce
so do you think it compares? i think thats the main question here, right? we pretty much only have reactive CD's . is it good enough to match up with other tanks, reasonably?
vocal nimbus
Warriors are very viable, yes
lean fern
/roar. 21k shield... /roar wait its gone..
vocal nimbus
If you depleted a 6 you did something very wrong
amber siren
our cd's aren't reactive just so we're clear on that
vocal nimbus
Or you were 330
lean fern
w/e
wide spruce
would you say a warrior tank has a reasonably similar chance of downing full mythic, right now? (assuming mythics were up, or just compare to heroics if you wish)
lean fern
i coulda have so many saves with my dk
amber siren
mythic raids? yes
void cove
i think saying if you depleted a 6, you did something very wrong is misleading
wide spruce
yeah sorry, i meant raids haha
void cove
anything could of happened in group
wide spruce
without it feeling like you are gimping the group by having a warr?
cuz a couple groups rejected me BECUASE i was a warr tank
amber siren
as long as you are playing well, same as any other class
vocal nimbus
Yes mango, warriors can raid perfectly fine
wide spruce
it just seems the consensus in game is that prot warriors are bad, thats why i came here in the first place
sick tree
We're viable
tardy oak
hilarious,...342 ilvl, tried to tank Shrine of the Storm +4 key
can literally
couldnt tank it
inland mesa
We depleted a 6 tol dagor last night because for some reason the howlers boss adds dropped sanguine everywhere
wide spruce
lot of magic damage there, i believe. we have 0 means of stopping it
without shield wall
void cove
reflect is 20% less magic dmg
frosty wedge
we have demo shout, and spell reflect every 25 secs
tardy oak
i am about to literally delete this abomination called warrior
vocal nimbus
Go read sal's faq, please 🤦
frosty wedge
no it doesn't
frosty wedge
we need some tuning
sick tree
we're more fucked over by the GCD changes
vocal nimbus
Spell reflect disappear when a single spell is reflected
sick tree
Honestly if IP gets a fat buff and if revenge gets something else baked into it
it would be nicer
tardy oak
@frosty wedge yes, they tuned arms PVP like in no time, what about protection?
frosty wedge
IP needs to be bigger and it needs to comne off teh GCD
fathom field
I just did 8 mil in dmg in an elite bg with this "broken" class
void cove
i think by how popular prot warr is atm, it's obvious to see its one of the weaker tanks
void cove
not to say it cant do ok
tardy oak
looooook at this
wide spruce
it DOES stop. "Raise your shield, reflecting spells cast on you and reducing magical damage you take by 20%. Lasts 5 sec or until a spell is reflected."
tardy oak
we fucking at the bottom
fathom field
Then start a different character
tardy oak
65% protection warrior deaths
fathom field
lol what
misty tangle
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/zone/rankings/20#region=2&metric=playerscore&class=Tanks not doing so hot in m+ either
wide spruce
thats not being productive. we arent here to say we dont WANT to play warriors, its a discussion on the current state of prot warrior
vocal nimbus
For fucks sake read the pinned faq
amber siren
Why is it surprising warriors died the most? We're a proactive tank, once you know what hits the hardest then you're fine
wide spruce
besides, this whole discussion is for our benefit anyways lol
amber siren
It's the first week dude
tardy oak
@wide spruce man i swear to god if i would see a warrior designer right now i would beat the shit out of it
because i have broke my keyboard
amber siren
lmfao wow
tardy oak
of agner
wide spruce
HAHAHA reystar
void cove
lol calm down
sick tree
Yknow
wide spruce
i think hes just joking around haha
wide spruce
but still, totally get it
tardy oak
342 ilvl cant tank +4 key?
sick tree
Cause of warriors getting a negative stigma rn
void cove
i can understand the frustration
frosty wedge
Yeah, I was just experiencing the whoe getting declined from m+ runs
wide spruce
yeah, its rough being rejective from tanking because of your class. i see that as a problem
fathom field
ikr
frosty wedge
like... I'm only 346, I get it, but I can 3 chest an atal 4 no problem
sick tree
Which is why healers dont like warriors rn
wide spruce
whether or not its completely game-breaking how lesser warrior tanks are, a couple people i've run into are blatantly against using warriors for tanks right now
tardy oak
@sick tree we take more damage than everyone else
wide spruce
i can see why its frustrating
frosty wedge
no we don't
fathom field
lol at this
tardy oak
our mitigation is like Mr Bean's ability to have sex
fathom field
We have the best mitigation
sick tree
We are beast at Vs melee attacks
frosty wedge
we take less damage than druids, less dmg that VDH, and BDK, but we aren't as survivable
vocal nimbus
You lot need to chill
vocal nimbus
This is getting out of hand
tardy oak
Ignore Pain best mitigation, lasts 1 seconds, costs 30 rage
wide spruce
i'll be honest, when i run my guild runs, its way easiest to just pick up a DK for mythic push. self heals, healers are happy, more utility. they can avoid a lot with AMS. they have benefits, warriors seem to have none that I have noticed
tardy oak
i see this as the worst mitigation
frosty wedge
errm, IP is 40 rage
tardy oak
even worse
fathom field
Lol
frosty wedge
😄
fathom field
You dont even know
wide spruce
just curious, what do you guys think warriors COULD use if we were all tasked RIGHT NOW with fixing them, without making them broken
frosty wedge
@wide spruce our aoe DPS is literally the only thign we have going for us
sick tree
IP off the GCD
wide spruce
keep IP stats the same, though?
frosty wedge
I ran a bugged mythic atal earlier with that double group by yasma
stoic kite
if I have 3 mobs on me and 1 caster in far back, and I charge to the caster threw the 3 mobs does that count as turning my back to them?
frosty wedge
and pulled 47k DS on that pack, lol
tardy oak
its weak
frosty wedge
DPS*
sick tree
I feel like I'd be able to survive more if I can just IP without a GCD
fathom field
Is this free on a different account
vocal nimbus
@stoic kite you can be hit while charging/ leaping in the back
wide spruce
it breaks immediately, whenever i need it the most though
sick tree
Maybe buff the ratio on it
tardy oak
btw prot paladins are so bad too?
wide spruce
i wouldn't mind maybe a redesign of Ignore Pain
sick tree
and increase the cap like 1.6 instead of 1.3
wide spruce
i like that, gyper
sick tree
Revenge needs another ability baked into it
wide spruce
i think the way warriors work is fundamentally flawed
fathom field
lol
woeful reef
Revenge needs to be free again and part of the rotation
fathom field
it is free with procs
wide spruce
ignore pain used to make sense, sort of. seems like a throw away ability, like they didnt want to get rid of it, but it just doesnt do much now
sick tree
Revenge should do something like
vocal nimbus
Revenge is part of the rotation
frosty wedge
yeah I don't think I nearly ever spend rage on rev
sick tree
Lower the CD of shield block
fathom field
did yall even read the guide?
sick tree
or something else baked into it
wide spruce
yes, screwhtemetadrinkbeer
vocal nimbus
Why dont you all take a minute to read the faq?
chilly brook
@wide spruce fundamentally prot warriors make a lot of sense
fathom field
Because ya'll are doing something wrong
amber siren
This is super embarrassing to read tbh, like 90% of these complaints are covered in the pins
vocal nimbus
You are kinda talking bullshit
wide spruce
you think so, @chilly brook ?
frosty wedge
honestly, I feel like we'll have that 100% uptime back next tier at current haste elevls
chilly brook
The problem is IP just doesn’t have enough of an absorb cap
fathom field
Yeah
frosty wedge
With ITF right now my SB is a 13 second recharge
wide spruce
i can see, that gritt
void cove
the pins explain problems, but worries are obviously warranted because of the popularity of prot warriors in mythic plus right now
chilly brook
Fundamentally everything is fine though
void cove
its as simple as thatf
frosty wedge
so there's a 1 second gap if timed perfectly
woeful reef
How do you figure that?
fathom field
math
frigid blaze
Going to be hitting up Fetid on heroic tonight. I've heard horror stories from healers who had to heal prot warriors. Any of you have thoughts to share on the matter?
amber siren
we had this exact same discussion in legion, there's always going to be a 'top' tank, buffing warriors isn't part of that solution, if something is easier to use people are going to use that
frosty wedge
2 charges and it lasts for 6 seconds
wide spruce
idk, ignore pain feels strange to me, @chilly brook . I feel like it shouldn't be an actual absorb number, maybe. idk
frosty wedge
2x6 = 12.... 13-12 = 1
fathom field
This is all in the guide and faq here
frigid blaze
Oi @chilly brook are you the Griff from Horsemen?
frosty wedge
if you pay attention to SB and don't clip it, you can have decent uptime
woeful reef
13 doesnt give you 2 charges back, you can SB 3x, last stand, sb 2x then you start running into big gaps, not 1s
chilly brook
I mean regardless of if it has an absorb cap or not it still fundamentally works the same @wide spruce
@frigid blaze no
tardy oak
void cove
so if something is easier to use, people will use it, is this not a problem with prot warrs then?
tardy oak
for raids
wide spruce
yes, but to me at least, the ability seems strange and clunky. i agree with the fact that it works the same, though @chilly brook
astral crystal
@frigid blaze trade with your OT if you're having issues
fathom field
So are we just here to whine and say the class is broken?
amber siren
@tardy oak I addressed that earlier, we're a proactive tank, once we know what the big hits are we're fine. Don't pull numbers out of your ass.
astral crystal
the way we did it was we justr witched when i was out of CDs
frigid blaze
I haven't tried it yet @astral crystal; just want to have some ideas of what to expect.
woeful reef
No, but we don't have to sit here and act like the class is perfect. You can be the worst tank class and still not be bad. Comparing to other tanks is fair. Stop living in a bubble.
fathom field
Have ya'll been drinking? its saturday
void cove
i came here to see if there were any problems with prot warr because of difficulties expressed in the former
if this comes as whine so be it
tardy oak
@amber siren i dont pull anything, i am sending you warcraftlogs that you use even yourself
void cove
but trying ti improve starts here
wide spruce
@fathom field no lol, at least thats not why im here. i think most of us are just here to get opinions. its just a discussion
fathom hollow
how do you do fellow prot warriors
orchid monolith
Do tanks Sim themselves?
fathom hollow
/wave
amber siren
@tardy oak Using raw numbers without explaining why those numbers are like that to push your agenda as to why prot warriors are broken is pulling things out of your ass
fathom field
yes
vocal nimbus
dunno why we had people storming from everywhere crying suddenly
fathom field
Man it seems most prot warriors just suck
vocal nimbus
You were given answers to everything and kept complaining
fathom field
Im tearing up +5s farming
vocal nimbus
These guys were flooding everything so much
chilly brook
@fathom field I disagree
woeful reef
You are comparing class performance by doing +5s?
Thats an incredibly low bar to set there lol
void cove
+5s... amazing
vocal nimbus
Some that came were complaining after depleting +5/6s
amber siren
^
fathom field
I mean
woeful reef
Well if they are having problems with +5 thats a performance or undergear problem, not a class problem
fathom field
there needs to be an iq test to post here
vocal nimbus
Thats what they were told
stoic kite
What ilvl req for +5
woeful reef
Also the lack of utility makes having your group assist with interrupts and such very important, no sigils and grips for us
stoic kite
I depleted at 343 :(
fathom field
I just see all these baseless things all at once
Its like a flat earther convention in here
vocal nimbus
I didnt want to snap just to remain politically correct 😄
fathom field
lol
woeful reef
Regarding the raid death link (https://www.warcraftlogs.com/zone/statistics/19#class=Tanks&metric=deaths), you can't necessarily pull anything from those numbers other than Prot War is by far the least represented class, which means whatever you want, and that generally warriors are dying the most. But there's no direct info you can take from it to explain why, so you can't just say its a class problem, there are too many factors involved.
vocal nimbus
🍿
fathom field
Lol
vocal nimbus
Why do you think there arent changes to warrior?
fathom field
they are just complaining about random stuff going from issue to issue
vocal nimbus
The only issue warrior has in the present is that it feels weird to play
fathom field
no utility...squishy...omg farming +5s is so easy...bliz sucks....Vomit
vocal nimbus
I left mine as an alter because i cant get used to it
I still play with it but 🤷
Its around 340 something
potent peak
i like how prot warrior playes but sometimes i feel like the tools i have to deal whit stuff is not enough 😦
tiny rapids
The only thing we truly lack are magical defense.
fathom field
What tools do you need to succeed?
fathom field
We have three ways to mitigate magical damage
chilly brook
We have better magic defense than any tank other than DK
vocal nimbus
Other tanks dont even have anything
tardy oak
according to @fathom field why then is warrior underperforming for Mythics+ and nobody picks it for progressive raids?
tiny rapids
Spell reflect shield wall and?
austere oar
well only major problem is GCD imo, in combat you are "do I want to dps or do I want to protect myself" every 3 seconds
ebon torrent
prot is good again bois
fathom field
...uh oh here comes the random next complaint
tardy oak
maybe you are even better than Sco
fathom field
they beat me to it
rocky tiger
@woeful reef @void cove I came in here after 8.0 hit but before BFA launched with the same concerns, got told I was scrub tier and didn't I know that prot was playing awesome now. shrug. I still levelled my warrior but I'm maining brewmaster this xpac after 15 years of MT as prot. If the class straight up doesn't feel fun to play then that's subjective but valid.
chilly brook
I’d bet a majority of the people in here complaining haven’t even touched heroic yet
chilly brook
I mean I’ve already downed bosses in heroic as prot we’re literally fine
tardy oak
i think your bets are coming purely from assumptions , else prove your source
final mist
The average Warrior sucks. You need to play well and any mistake is a huge detriment, and forces you to rely on healers to keep you alive.
That's why Warrior "sucks".
tiny rapids
I strongly believe warrior doesn't suck.
final mist
Warrior is defensively very good if played well, and has extremely high DPS (especially in M+).
vocal nimbus
Reystar, you are the one making assumptions
fathom field
YES
chilly brook
@tardy oak hit me with your logs then
void cove
@rocky tiger thanks for the response, i answered my own question with looking at actual facts, that other classes are just a little better atm generally, it's turned into some they and we conversation, the people that are elitist and think there isn't a problem (even if it is a small one) and the people that think the world is ending
amber siren
"If Sco said it then it must be right" fucking yikes dude
chilly brook
I’ll gladly hit you with mine
woeful reef
The problem is there is no risk reward, you aren't significantly better than other tanks when played perfect. But when you play less than perfect you are significantly worse.
fathom field
lol
vocal nimbus
Can we tell people they suck?
final mist
The point of this channel is to help people.
Not insult them.
If I see you insulting people, you can and will be reprimanded for it.
vocal nimbus
What if they are not willing to be helped
rocky tiger
@void cove Prot has no room for lag, distraction, human error etc atm. It's an extremely skill capped class atm and I find that to just be not fun to play. I'd like to be able to have a brewski while raiding and not feel like I'm going to impact my ability to raid well.
final mist
Then that's their problem, but I do not want this channel to be toxic.
fathom field
scroll up to see the madness sal
tiny rapids
And it shouldn't.
vocal nimbus
There were some patience tests 15 min ago
fathom field
lol
tardy oak
@vocal nimbus alt tab
final mist
Then rope a mod in, don't take things upon yourselves to be rude just because someone is "wrong".
potent peak
can anyone tell how to deal whit those ticks in underrot since the debuff they give is nasty even whit all cd's up they go through me (resto druid is healing me)
tardy oak
while @@fathom field could meanwhile look for a decent nickname
fathom field
...
vocal nimbus
@potent peak you dont need to pull them
chilly brook
@tardy oak so since I’m not getting logs I guess I’ll just stick to my guns that you’re the one who is actually making assumptions on prot without actually doing the hardest content available to you as prot
potent peak
i know but incase they get pulled
vocal nimbus
If you want to pull them just tell the party to use defensive cooldowns
They are manageable
tardy oak
@chilly brook i main Arms, Protection is just my offspec, just like Blood, just like Brewmaster, all i see is that Warrior is weak as fuck
potent peak
ok thanks
vocal nimbus
Dont facetank the ticks tho
chilly brook
😂
final mist
@tardy oak Then you aren't playing correctly. If you have logs, I can help.
tiny rapids
I avoid ticks. Since we take 2 gcd to Avatar and thunder to get sometimes. I avoid ticks every time.
chilly brook
Warrior weak😂
vocal nimbus
The dot will destroy you
chilly brook
Ha
When you’re taking on average 6k less DTPS than other tanks
Clearly we’re weak
And when Arms is actually a great DPS spec
And when you’ve cleared a 10 as a warrior
austere oar
Tbh there are no weak specs, it depends much on the healer you got behind you, I've done some 7s with a BrM that went catastrophic bc I had a Hpally who couldn't go higher than 9k hps even without necrotic
tiny rapids
Other times you can as protection warrior do half of the dungeon without a healer
chilly brook
@tiny rapids on pull you should be popping avatar before you charge in
austere oar
i mean Warr absolutly shred vs pack of melees since you're the best suited tank for these situations
(dk excluded)
tiny rapids
@chilly brook I have no problems with my gameplay, I already know this, I do that I just said I avoid them
fathom field
lol
tiny rapids
Ticks aren't worth.
vocal nimbus
The first ones arent worth it
fathom field
What specifically arr you struggling with as a warrior
vocal nimbus
But i feel like its faster to go through the second tick group
tiny rapids
A tad faster perhaps.
tiny rapids
Let's not confuse personal path choices with struggle.
vocal nimbus
I'd rather make the group use a def cd with the ticks
tiny rapids
While I do with shaman and monk, great cc
digital arrow
scraping up as much gold as i can so i can just buy a 350 shield for 200k
i give up
fathom field
Thats a legit struggle there
tiny rapids
Give 1 week and you will buy for 50k
fathom field
Shield drops suck
tiny rapids
@digital arrow buy gathering reagents and sell high, u will get 350k easy
With big stack
fathom field
350k easy?
woeful reef
You could also spam Atal +2/3, pretty easy and lots of groups always looking for tank
digital arrow
whoa @tiny rapids can u tell me more?
i'm still new-ish
are those its own category in the AH?
tiny rapids
It's just that, buy things like riverbud, cheap and resell with stacks 200, with profit. But let's leave like this, it's not the right channel, pm me
fathom field
So what other issues about prot warriors make us weak. Specific issues we can talk about?
digital arrow
thanks for the tip
vocal nimbus
Those guys left
digital arrow
so desperate right now lol
fathom field
All of them?
vocal nimbus
Just drop the issue
woeful reef
^
fathom field
Ok...
tiny rapids
Yeah, drop the issue. Not worth
woeful reef
Go watch Marok stream
final mist
Just move on. And when people like that come in, the correct response is to ping myself or a mod, not try to debate them.
They're trolls, nothing more.
fathom field
Is there like a website directing them here all at once or something?
Cause they hunt in packs
final mist
It doesn't matter.
fathom field
I typed marok stream into youtube and got a video of elon musk on joe rogans podcast.
woeful reef
lol, just right click his name over on the side
Sloot is also streaming prot war atm
vocal nimbus
Isnt marok raiding with brm?
I would instantly change back to prot if they changed the playstyle somehow
Im not a design expert to tell what has to change but it just feels weird
past ledge
Hey guys, im having big problems tanking m+ keys with necrotic, any advice?
amber siren
just make sure you're talented into bounding stride and pop your dps cooldowns at the start to keep aggro while you're kiting
past ledge
Man i just did fetid heroic, this guy hits like a TRUCK
stoic kite
what ench for wep
shut summit
quick nav
eager patrol
fetid gnar @past ledge
fathom field
Sense. Teach us your ways.
inland mesa
I know ilvl is king on gear, but what about rings - have a 355 crit haste - 151 haste, vs 340 haste vers - gain 26 haste, 34 stam, lose 227 vers
wispy sparrow
past ledge
how much dmg does shield block take off?
slate vine
Depends
atomic gazelle
past ledge
you need a healer
topaz ember
I'm about to do a +9 under rot any quick tip i need to look out for in regards to trash?
slate vine
Amount blocked depends on your attack power (mastery and strenght), exact value can be found in your character sheet in game. Mastery increase you chance to critically block (double the amount blocked) and your shield block spell makes sure you block 100% of the melee attack against you for a set amount of time
otherwise (with shield block off) you'll be blocking 30% or so
past ledge
what about last stand with bolster
final mist
THat's not what you block is based off, Beatdropper.
slate vine
Shit, got it wrong ? my bad
final mist
Mastery increases your block chance (AP does nothing for chance either), as well as your crit block chance.
steel mauve
pretty sure just the block on your shield is what determines the amount blocked
final mist
Your shield has a block rating number - that, along with the enemy's internal k value
Like so:
Block Mit% = Block rating / ( Block rating + K )
slate vine
Yay, ap for block amount, and mastery for block/crit block chance
final mist
Ex. Bosses in Uldir have a 6300 K value, so your block mitigation with a 350 shield is:
4075 / (4075 + 6300)
No, AP has nothing to do with block
It's just the block rating on your shield
slate vine
Okay
steel mauve
STR effects dmg and parry
slate vine
Shit, wasn't attack power linked to block rating in legion ?
final mist
No
slate vine
(might be off, sorry about that)
final mist
Block rating didn't exist in Legion
steel mauve
you only had a flat amount you blocked in legion
and the only thing that effected that was a set bonus i believe
flat % you blocked
inland mesa
no one wants to weigh in on rings? D:
final mist
No, no set bonuses affected block amount. Only thing that did was an artifact trait.
past ledge
alright so back to my question, how much dmg does shield block take off?
slate vine
So what affects amount blocked, and block chance now ?
topaz ember
Block
final mist
- Shield Block just gives you 100% block chance.
- Mastery gives you Attack Power, and increases the chance of you critically blocking.
- THe only thing that effects how much you block is the block rating on your shield (and some Azerite traits that increase block rating)
The amount you block differs from person to person, because of no one having the exact same shield.
slate vine
So you could have bis ilvl380 gear with a 280 shield, and you would get more trashed by adds than an ilvl350 gear dude with a 350 shield (if we exclude armor ratings)
past ledge
so my shield have 4075 block on my shield
steel mauve
im thinking of wod with a set bonus that effected block vlue
value*
i dont know maths but you would probably be correct beat
our biggest upgrade is our shields, the better the shield, the better we take damage
slate vine
and strenght is fully out of the equation
steel mauve
str literally just effects parry and dmg
final mist
Strength increases your Parry, Armor, and Attack Power.
steel mauve
ill rephrase
final mist
Strength does not effect block.
steel mauve
str effects ap which effects IP\
hot tree
there we go
would it be possible that we become much stronger in the expac due to hast increasing alonside our demo shout uptime due to azerite trait?
steel mauve
i think we'll be extremely stronger later on due to gear, every warrior spec has basically always scaled well with gear, thats just who we are as a class, we usually end up in a really good spot
hot tree
rn im not seeing how any block tank can be stronger overall than self heal tank
steel mauve
until they add in another tyrant boss 😉
prisma crane
considering bleeds and range attacks and magic are so prevalent, im having a hard time disagreeing with you Swizz
hot tree
my one "call " is that we are good on ghuun
sick sentinel
KR is hell for prot war
hot tree
because ghuun has strong physcials
past ledge
hey guys, the Nerubian voidweaver ignor threat ? or are they tankable ?
sick sentinel
And shrine
past ledge
in Zekvoz
hot tree
but if you look at the spreadsheet that sense made for uldir, bsically nothing is blockable
undone sun
I don't think threat seems to matter on those @past ledge
hot tree
spell bloackable*
past ledge
so tanks dont need to pick em up
undone sun
The word for that is reflectable @hot tree
hot tree
@undone sun ty its late
steel mauve
spell reflect still drops magic dmg, but theres never been a large amount of spells reflectable in raids
hot tree
i know but i was counting on there being more now that magic defense is more rare, that this tool would have us bring more to the table, but if you removed it even it wouldnt put us up or down the ladder
back in the day it was total reflect, this time its reduced dmg and i feel it shoudl have more application
echo galleon
Any tips for M+ underrot
steel mauve
im glad it actually has use, even back then it barely reflected spells but it also didnt reduce dmg
echo galleon
Did you just answer ur own question
past ledge
lol
sick sentinel
did i?
green isle
yes
green isle
there you go
sick sentinel
they could put ignore pain out of GCD
echo galleon
Or both
steel mauve
im kinda used to ip now a days
sick sentinel
rotation is just to slow
cow of gcd
coz
If they remove ip from the GCD I might actually take off devastator lol
past ledge
what talent build u guys going for raids??
kindred flint
whats the most desired azrite trait for the Head peice?
steel mauve
the one in IV guides
and idk if you should look for a specific trait on a specific piece of gear but ideally you want one DC and 2 BfI or IF
sick sentinel
look harder
cloud cosmos
What do you guys use when you want to survive, IP seem fcking dogshit
cloud cosmos
exccept from huge cooldown
sick sentinel
Run
cloud cosmos
LUL
sick sentinel
And los
You can also reflect some targeted big boy spells
I have reflected 51 k once
silk bridge
DKs came in and took your jobs
sick sentinel
THEY TOOK OUR JOBS
silk bridge
easy
silk bridge
build a wall and make ebon hold pay for it imo
sick sentinel
inb4 you play in a dead realm
cloud cosmos
dude i feel like paper as war prot
i get almost one shoted
don't have time to generate rage
sick sentinel
I'm doing fine personally
silk bridge
what realm are you on?
cloud cosmos
Talent tree is also disgusting me
sick sentinel
Haven't tanked bigger than +6 because I am farming gear
I'm on twillight's hammer EU
Name's Kage
weak zephyr
do warcraft logs parses mean anything for tanks?
supple path
To a degree. Large underperformance will be pretty obvious.
ancient reef
Whats best place to try amd get a shiled drop im using a 300 now
sick sentinel
Try to do all your m0
ancient reef
Only ilevel 330 not sure im ready
junior ivy
ive been using jes howler trinket for like 2 weeks now
and i just realized it has an on use effect
it hasnt been on my action bar
i never used it ever
sick sentinel
I play an orc and jes has a 2 min cd and my racial has 2 min cd and I macrod them lol
@cloud cosmos big red button?
cloud cosmos
yea
odd fiber
Did spell reflection get a silent buff?
vagrant cape
In what way, aang?
odd fiber
+5% spell damage reduction
vagrant cape
Is it 25% now?
odd fiber
i thought it was 15% at launch
vagrant cape
Nope. Always was 20
undone sun
it was 20% at launch
odd fiber
okay
topaz ember
My guild wants me to play arms so i'm going t try gearing both
undone sun
it was 15% during beta
odd fiber
that's what im thinking of then
raven kernel
thats a nice way of saying we dont want warrior tank
vagrant cape
@junior ivy the problem with using a macro in bfa is that normally you'd macro it to a dps cooldown. Since those are on the GCD now, you waste globals by macroing the trinket. The best method is to use your cooldowns (avatar and demo shout) then use the trinket immediately before your first damaging ability so you don't waste any uptime and fit in as many globals as possible.
sick sentinel
And my guild told me to go prot
raven kernel
i was gonna be dps main but our OT turned out to be not very good so i stepped up and took over
prot main now
kappa
sick sentinel
Well my story is a little bit brighter
cloud cosmos
i don't get why avatar just have damage buff, like we are supposed to tank, a small buff to tanking on avatar should be great, and also flavorful
vagrant cape
Damage = threat = help tanking.
raven kernel
avatar is relevant tool now since they made threat much harder
odd fiber
Avatar is really useful for aoe threat
vagrant cape
Also damage = dead stuff = stuff that does 0 damage to you = 100% damage mitigation
sick sentinel
Also half cd on TC
cloud cosmos
i mean sure, but still its not flavorful
raven kernel
well ok
sick sentinel
So you can keep up demo shout
raven kernel
but idc about flavor
sick sentinel
Also you become BIG BOY
cloud cosmos
yeah its good with Gamon, you are massive as fck
sick sentinel
And if you gave avatar+bl+gamon you don't fit though doors
vagrant cape
It's plenty flavorful. Our class fantasy is charging in an fucking shit up. Getting bigger and stomping the yard fits right in.
sick sentinel
Avatar is basically
vagrant cape
Especially as a gnome
sick sentinel
Big Boy, Big Damage
My brother used to tank as a prot warr in vanilla :O
As a gnome
steel mauve
technically, the more damage you do, the quicker the boss dies, the less damage you take, hence, avatar is a defensive boost 🤔
sick sentinel
And the dps can dps without taking a smack in the face
You do big boy damage
Then you intervene your healer
And leg it
inland silo
you generate a ton more rage with avatar up so you could kinda call it a defensive cd
and it gives you 20 rage
inland silo
its definitely more than just an offensive cd
sick sentinel
+20?
surreal stump
ahh yeah voldun rep booties are nice
sick sentinel
I didn't even do a +20 in legion lol
Well I was an encha shaman so nobody wanted me on their group but yeah
surreal stump
dude tell emthey stupid
inland silo
you got a key this week based on your key done last week of legion
surreal stump
enhance shammy brings purge
lust
off heals
fucking op trash tank when u die
lol
also fyi the elly shamen advanced earth elly can taunt bosses in dungeons is funny
inland silo
i mean in legion m+ shaman was just about the worst class in the game
sick sentinel
I just did my +15 for the chest and that was it
inland silo
idk about now
surreal stump
they scale badly
they need gear
bad haste
and so on
but still so much utility
sick sentinel
Now purge, off heals, and Earth friend are valuable
surreal stump
stun totem
sick sentinel
ALSO TREMOR
surreal stump
^
raven kernel
also EARTH SHIELD kappa
sick sentinel
But in legion...
sick sentinel
They do
surreal stump
nice
raven kernel
dps shams have it now
sick sentinel
With a bugged tooltip
It says "heals for 0 health "
But it shows up on healing done
surreal stump
yeah had it on me from elly , he was the one with the talented earth elly
taunting bosses so op\
necrotic? who cares earth elly dont!
4 sham group meta go go
sick sentinel
Depends on your dps
twin hazel
is it viable to only kill one?
sick sentinel
But if your have consistent dps and not burst dps
surreal stump
easy
sick sentinel
You just need to pummel him a lot more
twin hazel
yeh
sick sentinel
For healing soft enrage thrashes
surreal stump
3.5 top, 2.2 low end
twin hazel
so you took the 4th hit?
surreal stump
it was so i could control placement
sick sentinel
And took the thrashes
twin hazel
arent prot warrs good for the 4th hit?
surreal stump
get in spot he doesnt knock me back or ot
so is brew masters
so we had both good for it
surreal stump
the 8th or 9th thrash was an issue for me. and instead of swapping
junior ivy
i was lowering my +20 to a +11
surreal stump
we went with easiest route
surreal stump
cat yer screwed
junior ivy
any way to fix this
junior ivy
😦
surreal stump
log off for an hour from first time uzoned in
or try
running rando heroic
sometimes it fixes it
junior ivy
😦 😦
surreal stump
but doubtful prolly just takes long to run em
surreal stump
yeah it prolly took u what 10 min + to lower it to what it is?
surreal stump
go get food
sick sentinel
And come back
surreal stump
take break come back refreshed
sick sentinel
You will be good
surreal stump
or do like my no life self and load another toon and work on it while u wait
sick sentinel
Go check your auctions on the AH
surreal stump
yeah cause that 5 mil mount wont buy itself
sick sentinel
Those tcg mounts will not buy themselves
surreal stump
i gave up on those. altho i do have one of teh rockets was a gift
sick sentinel
If it was 100k a month I would have been playing wow only with wowtokens for like a year now
But, EU things...
Speaking of eu I should go to bed already, it's 6 am lol
surreal stump
lmao see ya
twin hazel
Shoulda bear take the 4th hit or MT?
I figure they are jsut a big pool of health so 4th hit
restive slate
does anybody know if they changed something with Battle Shout? My weak aura to tell me if someone in the party doesn't have the buff isn't working today. it was yesterday
surreal stump
is there another warrior in raid?
i know my old one used to not tell me anything if a dps war was in raid
cause in essence its his job lol
restive slate
nope, it's not that
surreal stump
i dont remember a tooltip or icon change recently
sinful bay
hello, I have never tanked before. which mythic dungeon is not too difficult for a beginner tank ?
restive slate
i just started to and started with atal'dazar myself
robust urchin
Waycrest Manor
restive slate
mainly because it had a weapon and shield to try and pick up
sinful bay
okay thanks. I will try these two
surreal stump
waycrest can be overwhelming if u get lost easily
i know some people who just 100% cant read a map
restive slate
pretty sure waycrest is my least favorite dungeon this xpac
surreal stump
id do atla has weapon up us horde side at least good weapon too
sinful bay
ok. do you think I can do +2 atal ? ilvl is 329
surreal stump
with cc and slow pulls yes. if you have group set up already
robust urchin
Maybe you can do it in a guild group
robust urchin
Yeah but no one is gonna take a 329 tank to an m+ in the tool
robust urchin
I get declined to +2 with 345
reef fulcrum
Waycrest and sanguine is a bad combo
robust urchin
+2 doesn't have sanguine
reef fulcrum
I know but this week has it
sinful bay
ok, then I have to do mythics first. I just thought of +2 because of id
robust urchin
Dude is asking for easy 2s and i think waycrest is rather easy for it
You can always ask your guild
reef fulcrum
Yeah, I agree
robust urchin
But getting a group in the tool might be hard with your ilvl
surreal stump
check wqs in dunegons and such for upgrades too
also tabbing out in nazmir sucks
cant run anywhere
sinful bay
yea, already did wqs and got some nice arathi loots too
surreal stump
thats good i woulda don arathi first since w's scale with what you have and i think arathi is base 340 even tho the two pcs i got are 360 and 345
sinful bay
yea, got 3 340s there and one 340 from the weekly quest 😄