we're actually good if you play right
#protection
next goblet
ionic fern
😂
next goblet
i mean i was fuckin up but now that i got my issue fixed, i've proved many wrong
digital arrow
Two nights in a row running AD mythic+ and still no shield drop goddammit. This 315 shield I've been stuck with doesn't mitigate shit lmao
static pilot
I don't think that's the last time it'll happen Fuzzy. Warriors are getting a seriously bad rep atm
digital arrow
chilly brook
One of my healers was talking about how much damage I was taking in heroic on the first two bosses
topaz badger
Hey Guys, does anyone else have trouble doing mythic+ with a disc? I mean, we did a +4 but we had a really rough time.
chilly brook
I proceeded to show him logs of other “better” tank classes taking 4k+ more DTPS than me
topaz badger
I'm at 343 ilvl atm and most of my stats are quite good
I only have like 3 crit items
2*
chilly brook
M+ is slightly rough because it’s the first week and everyone is well, not well geared
jovial sorrel
plus the adds hit like trucks so that doesn't help with the fact
chilly brook
CC is your friend
topaz badger
Well, my healer was being annoyed that he went disc instead of holy, would it have helped?
static pilot
Disc is currently considered very good for m+, but like Prot it can be hard to play since you have to be able to predict incoming damage
When everybody are still getting a feel for new dungeons that can be an issue
topaz badger
Kings rest has some really hard hitting enemies
static lance
i do my m+ with a disc priest currently. everything goes pretty smooth unless we hit a rough patch (extra adds or w/e) and i drop low. then he has a hard time bringing me back up to a safe level.
chilly brook
I really wish analyzer was updated for prot for BFA 😭
next goblet
only reason i have a blood DK is out of boredom
static lance
but i figure once we get more used to the dungeons, we'd be more familiar with the pulls and the incoming damage.
static lance
yeah. i've had some runs of mythic with mistweavers and paladins and those two can throw out some serious HPS when they need to.
disc has a slight issue with single-target burst healing
topaz badger
I just feel like something is wrong with scaling, because it seems like for dps the timer isn't an issue, it's only harder on healer and tank?
I feel like the mobs should have slightly more hp, and do slightly less dmg to make it hard on everyone
gray wolf
what if blizzard gave us gladiator stance back 🤔
static pilot
I dps with a DH and a resto druid, they don't seem to have any issues
topaz badger
well no, dps is no issue at all with the same ilvl
static pilot
Well, DH spends half his time running away but they're built for kiting
topaz badger
m+ right now only makes it harder on the healer basically
static lance
i'm not sure Xiro. I do like the challenge of having to stay on top of the incoming damage as tank/heals instead of just being 'tougher DPS'.
topaz badger
What's that?
topaz badger
what about dmg taken?
chilly brook
You can look at damage taken on logs but they don’t have a leaderboard of least damage taken
chilly brook
I mean tbh with warrior outputting damage doesn’t hamper your ability to mitigate
Unless you wanna spam revenge for some reason
topaz badger
#TanksHaveBraggingRightsToo
static pilot
Well, to max damage you'll be sacrificing IP for revenge
Or hell, even devastate
Fill every GCD with an attack
chilly brook
I mean 2 back to back top 10s tonight without sacrificing IP for revenge
topaz badger
Do you guys also feel like in m+ you have to watch your rage quite carefully?
or atleast in some dungeons
static pilot
Depends on the pull
chilly brook
Trust me I was pumping some made rage into defensive abilities on mother
hot locust
Its week 1, players arent playing to parse yet. :P
chilly brook
She hits like a freight train for some reason
topaz badger
like the last boss in kings rest, first he jumps away, and then he comes back and you need to pop shield block, I often found I didn't have rage to do it >.<
chilly brook
@hot locust you mean players don’t have the gear to say “meh fuck it”
hot locust
/shrug
static pilot
First intercept an ally, then charge him
topaz badger
oh, good point
static pilot
You should have two charges and that's a quick 40 rage
topaz badger
I should charge more in combat 😮
static pilot
It's clunky but it works
chilly brook
Either way I actually wouldn’t mind someone taking a glance at my logs to see where I could do better defensively
topaz badger
it's only so annoying when you're too close 😛
But, anyway, tanks for the tips. (pun intended) I gotta go back to work.
hot locust
@chilly brook Im about to go to sleep personally but if you want tomorrow I can help.
static pilot
Anytime
chilly brook
Would be appreciated want to make sure I’m doing the most I can to make progression easiest @hot locust
hot locust
👍 i'll message ya tomorrow when I am around the comp.
chilly brook
I’m really not looking forward to doing heroic g’huun
hot locust
haHAA
chilly brook
He hits hard enough in normal
hot locust
That shit hurts
chilly brook
Everything hurts in heroic lol
restive fiber
Is there any way to get serious Pawn-Strings for Prot? Raidbots hasnt implemented anything for prot atm - and the Prot-Strings that come with Pawn itself, are wrong (versa>mast>crit>haste oO)
chilly brook
G’huun is just gonna straight murder someone
hot locust
You dont know pain until Ghuun
hot locust
Tanking him p2 with an add is crazy damage intake.
chilly brook
Because simc doesn’t work for prot
restive fiber
Then, can i anyhow set own weights? that is can see atleast the prio?
chilly brook
And raidbots doesn’t work for prot because simc doesn’t work for prot
restive fiber
ye 😄
chilly brook
restive fiber
well.. ;D
next goblet
so whose going to prot war for mythic progression?
random jay
Well I'm loving prot, I'm pushing super high keys and streaming if my fellow warriors ever wanna hang, awetosis on twitch and https://raider.io/characters/us/thrall/Awetosis
raven kernel
U go bro
random jay
pushing slower than planned but gearing people up for free
sometimes gets you freakish procs
saw a 385 in a +3 today
random jay
its not so bad, sanguine in these narrow dungeons can suck but w/e u will figure it out im sure
sick sentinel
if u got a spot for an arms warrior im down 😄
empty birch
soooooo if you look at phantasmal echo then look at xalzaix's veiled eye....the trinket from EMERALID NIGHTMARE absorbs more damage than a bfa trinket
random jay
mickers im hella down man
sick sentinel
eu?
random jay
oh no, US
sick sentinel
damn unlucky
sick sentinel
what dungeon do you guys think is the easiest? guna spam one to bump my ilvl a bit then try the harder ones for BiS stata
restive fiber
@chilly brook I created my own String now, set the Stat-Prio to: (Haste 1.15, Versa 1.1, Mastery 1.1, Armor 1.05, Crit 1, Str 1) --- Will that work? :/
random jay
I prio haste a bit more, we are an actions per minutre tank so it really makes life better
minute*
hazy path
next goblet
atal'dazar
lilac hawk
Im new to warriortanking, been tanking alot on dh/paladin and it feels like my warrior takes way to much damage. At 343ilvl i struggle like hell in m+4. Specially on trash. Any newbtips for me? Using mitigations and cds like nonstop 😁
random jay
@restive fiber I will work on one, I was going by what you posted(roughly) but tbh haste is still insane
restive fiber
yeah i set it to 1.2 now.. or much higher? i mean its just for qucik orientation when getting new/equal Gear
random jay
@lilac hawk they're both right, the more damage you do tends to make your life easier, and yeah shield block when not last standing, spend rage like crazy with anger management, and never get hit in the back unless ur sure u wont get rekt
restive fiber
And on icy they say, the stats are really equal atleast - like when u have 120 crit and 100 haste, go for the crit :x ?
smoky wave
I've got a blockades, rezan's trinket at 345 and a Emblem of Zandalar at 345. Both Rezan's and Zandalar are str+haste proc. Emblem has a higher haste proc and more ppm, but not sure between blockades and rezan's. I'm fairly certain that blockades will be better but first time with gear I'm not 100% sure.
random jay
at this point @restive fiber , we aren't DKs in the public eye in lfg, so Item Level is king. I have some pieces missing haste just because the item level was so huge. Aim for haste but don't lose too much item level doing so
restive fiber
Yeah sure 😄 +10/15 ilvl>all :/
random jay
Icy is alot like Noxxic. Good for jumping into basics, but warcraft log studying or just trial and erroring yourself are way better in most cases
restive fiber
Aye i see.. thought the Authors of Icy and Wowhead etc are now the same ppl or atleast talk to each other? 😄
lilac hawk
Thanks, was alilbit dishearted yesterday with my new main (warrior) struggled like crazy on small pulls While my old pulls half the instances and goes out smiling without a scratch 😊
random jay
I lead a former us-100 team so lfg is not something I use BUT I can imagine most will pick a dk over warrior until item level sways them
restive fiber
most ppl nowadays see just ilvl and nothing else
random jay
I prefer running with all melee or hunters personally lol
restive fiber
😄
gray wolf
"oh this guy has high ilvl, gotta get him in"
i do perfer alot of monks
when i'm warrior tank tho
random jay
monks are terrific
gray wolf
they pop karma and you get a good 5 seconds of where you don't have to worry about shit
it's the best
sudden gazelle
hey, two brace for impacts and one deafening crash is the best combo for azerite armor?
vocal nimbus
yes
sudden gazelle
thanks!
static pilot
Anyone ever feel they're fighting muscle memory not to use shield block when Last Stand is active?
old zephyr
I do
static pilot
It would be nice if Last Stand actually gave a 15 sec shield block buff that you could add to with regular shield block instead of the two overlapping
It would also synergize with shield slam damage then
Won't dramatically improve the class but helps lift the floor a little bit
merry cave
Yeah I still mess that up at times
Funny enough playing dh more helped because I don't mash demon spikes like I do sb
static pilot
That makes sense, playing blood DK made me a lot more aware of how I use rage
smoky wave
aye, playing the dk made me much more aware of rage spending. sadly it also made me aware how much easier things can be.
static pilot
I'm leveling my DK now. Played it a bit during legion but atm I think it'll be my tanking main for BFA
I'm sure Prot is viable with the right player but I don't think I'm that player.
static pilot
👍
next goblet
and yeah playing BDK really teaches you resource management
static pilot
I did a Waycrest +4 last night with a God tier healer and it was still one long run of abject misery. One wipe and we made the timer but I just didn't enjoy it
next goblet
btw.. have you guys seen how many brewmaster parses there are over every other tank?!?
next goblet
its insane
a class nobody used to play
and now everybody does
makes me sad, brewmaster is one of my favorite tank specs along with prot warrior
but i REFUSE to play FotM for raid tanking
m+.. i just use what makes it easiest for the comp
static pilot
I've never tried BM and Im not really a FOTM chaser
But they certainly seem popular
next goblet
generally speaking because of grips i use my DK
static pilot
Grips are pretty damn handy
restive fiber
Leveling bm monk atm for M/M+ ._. so much easier
next goblet
i will say this though
mitigation on the warrior is amazing
its just the self sustain that kills us
i looked at some of the damage that was actually incoming to me with SB/IP both up
and its so tiny
frail tangle
hi guys! Yesterday i was asking some thing about the SD uptime of my prot co tank. Some of you ask me for logs. Here it is.
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/VgdLCJpBPHNQTm4Y/
and i just see that there is a log section in this discord....
tawny panther
I wouldn't mind them just decimating brewmaster perfectly timed after all the fotm rerolled gear up
But it's a rare class so probably leave it OP like legion
smoky wave
Looking at those logs he pressed shield block once in a 6min fight?!
smoky wave
by the looks he's just going dps. he uses devestate more times in one 6min fight than I probably do a whole dungeon
untold adder
hey. Any tips for mythrax?
frail tangle
ok, i'll have a good time tonight explaining him what's wrong 😄
fathom marten
@frail tangle woowww bro
He isn't using SB at like all in any of the fights
That's literally our main damage mit
He's using ip way to much
Just from melee has taking 400k dmg. SB would reduce this extremely
smoky wave
he's not even using IP that much is he?
frail tangle
just see something
i think that he press spell reflect instead of SB
just see using it on taloc fight
same with the dog
fathom marten
I mean nope not at all
13% uptime
Yeah he is apparently getting by with just using IP and last stand throwing in spell reflect from time to time
smoky wave
even then Esuvia, he doen't use it until 45seconds into the fight
fathom marten
You're healers must hate healing him
frail tangle
so it clearly dont know how to play...
fathom marten
@frail tangle very clear unfortunately
raven kernel
Reeeeeeeeeee this is why ppl think wars suck
frail tangle
and he consider himself a "tryharder" LOL
fathom marten
Tell him to get into discord
frail tangle
thanks for all guys, i'll tell him tonight before raid
fathom marten
And look at the icy veins guide
Ask him if he's looked at the prot icy veins guide. If not he should and If he has tell him to reread that shit haha
raven kernel
I blame legion
fathom marten
Lol what
raven kernel
Anyone that played prot before legion knows to use shield block
ember arrow
Hm
fathom marten
Youd still hit SB in legion
raven kernel
Must be legion babies that only know how to press ip
fathom marten
And besides he's not even keeping IP up long enough to say that it is from old legion play
frail tangle
that was in MoP where you only use protective barier (not sure of the spell)
amber siren
legion babies is a thing now? 🤔
fathom marten
It simply looks like lack of understanding
fathom marten
I've only played prot war since legion
Before that it was resto sham heals, bear tank and rogue. (Since vinilla)
sour osprey
I want to make a double specialisation with prot (main) and arms, do you think i need to change all my stuff ?
smoky wave
I started prot in wrath. Am I a wrath baby? 😐
old dagger
so, I sometimes get to 100 rage with plenty of time left on IP and no SB to refresh
do I refresh IP or just hit revenge?
ember arrow
Depends
fathom marten
Depends
smoky wave
I should say depends, but I hit revenge without a proc and it feels dirty.
ember arrow
If ur ip is almost full, it wont really stack so revenge will be better in that case
@sick sentinel at least i annot get bis items from a ranfmdom pet wq
Already bfa beats legion for that
smoky wave
Nah, I prefer Bfa. I'm not a tank and self-healer anymore, I feel like a tank again.
undone sun
yikes
raven kernel
Bfa is multi spec friendly
ember arrow
I mean i like pet battles
fathom marten
I would spend it on IP probably, if it's not full, Or if the rev is free. Waste of a gcd because you're capping and free rev gives you no decrease in demo time.
sick sentinel
Why do you think they made pet battle wq more accessible to people who never did pet battle
They're lubing you up
Screen cap this
old dagger
ah okay
ember arrow
How
sick sentinel
Bruh
ember arrow
Get lvl 1 pets
sick sentinel
Literally get 3 zandalari Bois and wreck everything
raven kernel
They all arr
ember arrow
Enemy will scale to lvl 1
raven kernel
Level 1
ember arrow
Wq sscale wit u
sick sentinel
How are you losing to lvl 1 pets
raven kernel
I still lose cos enemy has higher speed
ember arrow
To lvl 1
raven kernel
Nah my pets r shit
sick sentinel
Get a single rose taipan and demolish every wq
ember arrow
#protection more like #petbattles
raven kernel
Protecc the pets
sick sentinel
Fighting bosses as a tiny robot is great
fathom marten
That's such an uninteresting aspect in wow for me.
I enjoy collecting toys more then pet battles
sick sentinel
Tbh most of the battles are shit
ember arrow
U dont like it dont play
sick sentinel
But collecting pets is fun
fathom marten
@ember arrow I dont but I'm still going to bitch about it😜
ember arrow
Real wow player
fathom marten
You're damn right
sick sentinel
I'll complain all the time
fathom marten
ember arrow
Oh i cant speak in this channel
sick sentinel
ember arrow
I dont play prot
sick sentinel
Banned
ember arrow
Almost forgot
raven kernel
Cya
sick sentinel
Its okay macro talks here all the time
ember arrow
Thyme too
sick sentinel
And he only plays with bad dragon dildos
I'm gonna become a m+ boi because raid sucks
But that means I need a new tank
I wonder if I'm still banned from acherus
sick sentinel
I got banned from all class discords at some point because of tankchat lobbying
Fucking fsy
smoky wave
I'm a little disappointed how on-topic #blood is atm.
sick sentinel
Ye because it's actually good so people that play it chat there
Same happened with fury when it became good for one raid in legion
And they immediately banned my baneposting
stray wedge
@sick sentinel 🤔
sick sentinel
Hi macro
ember arrow
What is baneposting
sick sentinel
Bruh
ember arrow
Bru
sick sentinel
I can't @stray wedge is watching
stray wedge
Go to #off-topic please
sick sentinel
He's going to shoot me and throw me out of the server
sour osprey
I want to make a double specialisation with prot (main) and arms, do you think i need to change all my stuff ?
sick sentinel
Well you to need to change at least 7 items
But if you have plenty of haste on your current stuff it'll be ok
sour osprey
Okay thx ^^
fathom marten
Just look at the guides man @sour osprey
If arms stats coincide with prot then you're good.
Not really that complicated
sour osprey
Yeah your right X)
void gulch
arms stacks haste too
its fine
get a blockades and whatever trinket
youre good to go
so many atal dazar runs
no shield
young oasis
Coined 355 G'huun shield last night, not bad all in all. Only need trinket and mace from Atal'dazar
And other haste+vers/mast shiat
smoky wave
could be worse, you could have accidentally salvaged your 325 shield, unable to recover, and be stuck with a 310 one.
amber siren
\
errant coral
lifespeed is a decent trait right? 😛
astral notch
So fetid hc thrash hits hard. My cotank is brew, is it best for me on the boss or taking thrash?
cosmic cargo
warr is good for thrash
stable elm
how do you feel about m+? is prot warrior going to be nerfed?
smoky wave
I hope not, the damage is what prot brings atm. If we do I'd like to see IP buffed or re-worked. Ideally I'd like to see some more utility back in banners or a ranged interrupt but I can't see that happening in a hurry.
wary cape
Any good resources out in the interwebz explaining the current status for prot warriors for this expansion?
smoky wave
Looking for something for yourself, or to point people to?
smoky wave
other than the pins not sure where to point you.
wary cape
had forgotten about the pins, thanks for the reminder
smoky wave
Mostly seems that we're underrated for M+. Capable and stomping damage meters but lacking self-sustain. Harder to play than other classes but rewarding when done well. make a mistake and you're very aware of it though. Raid wise doing well, great for some fights, but I've only got other people's experience for that
vocal nimbus
Either check the pins or ask for people's thoughts here
Either check the pins or ask for people's thoughts here
old zephyr
So far in raid, some fight you are king of the world.
Some you can go in a corner and cry
sick sentinel
i feel like the scariest part for warrior is just building that initial rage to get stuff up , then its ok
thinkin of buying blockade trinket to help with m+
smoky wave
I find I've pretty much got sb up instantly, then popping demo gets the rest I need to get going
sour osprey
Do you have any idea of arena composition that can include a war prot ?
sick sentinel
doubt it, they are trying to keep tanks out of pvp
sour osprey
It is not good to play it on arena then ?
smoky wave
nah,wouldn't even try personally. simply not designed for it. you might get more out of the pvp channel, though they'll likely just say "lol go arms"
hollow bear
I took a fucking beating on MOTHER Heroic and we had to bring three tanks for the fight, just to taunt off each other when we reached 10% hp. Did anyone else get slapped?
final mist
You can avoid the frontal cone she does, which makes her one tankable, while the other tank goes through the barrier and tanks adds.
hollow bear
Yes I'm well aware, it was just the barrier aoe and melee attacks that shredded us (me and a DH cotank)
mild vigil
Is strength flask better than stamina flasks for all fights except Fetid?
final mist
Then that's either L2P or healing, or both, or any combinations of factors, Disco. You should be fine solo tanking Mother, but if your healers aren't healing you because too many people are crossing over at once, that's an issue.
Strength is better flask for every fight.
undone sun
mild vigil
Isn't stamina better for hight burst that can 1shot, when healers get time to heal you back to max inbetween?
final mist
Should never really be in that position to begin with, even on Fetid.
If you're getting 1-shot on Fetid, you fucked up.
hollow bear
Im suspecting its healing or general coordination as well, trying to find logs to compare now
pure otter
Nice
sick sentinel
No socket
jagged bay
gz!
compact sigil
true, not socket, but I'm not complaining either, I went from a heroic shield to that lol
raven kernel
so did we get hotfixed to be unable to reflect explosive corruption on ghuun? or was that horseshit
solid granite
does anyone got a weakaura for Brace for impact with the amount of block/dmg increase?
umbral willow
got [Lingering Sporepods] 380ilvl today what do u think about it for tanking ? 😃
solid granite
the str is nice to have - the effect though seems underwhelming
undone sun
very underwhelming
strong hill
@hollow bear first few pulls on heroic mother I was getting my bell rung or our dps decided to stand in the fire and dps higher. We two tanked it and I just used the the winds to carry me around. If you get through the first room cleanly the rest falls into place.
sick sentinel
Skip to last room or no balls
strong hill
Spell reflect the laser wall
compact sigil
yeah, our guild going into the raid this saturday, pretty excited to get in there
strong hill
Screw making blobs friendly those are freee victory rushes
shell nova
Tanking m+5 king rest, pulls magical skills broken my face XD, any idea, azerite traits?? Class?
And berserkers debufff omg deleted, im running for leave
valid gorge
which adds are melting your face?
solid granite
don't tank & spank in m+
frosty wedge
yeah, you need to be getting aggro and kiting a lot
solid granite
Avatar+TC once of twice & than jump around like a gummy bear
and LoS magic attacks if possible
junior ivy
im so ready for a +10. who's done one?
smoky wave
not even done a +2 yet 😦 hopefully get a chance tonight. Cat, how have you keys so far?
junior ivy
i've done a few +5s, and +4s and +3s
and one +9
the +9 wasn't as bad as i thought it'd be
smoky wave
yeah? I'm looking forward to working my way up. At what sort of key level do you start kiting more than facetanking?
fair crystal
depends on the key tho right
junior ivy
tbh havent been kiting much in any
in the +9 we relied more on CC
so there wasn't need to kite
i find it's hard to kite in the new dungeons, small spaces and so much extra trash and sanguine in tight places uigh
polar rain
which dungeon did u do +9 ?
smoky wave
great
junior ivy
freehold
fair crystal
nice
fair crystal
ouch
junior ivy
one dps lost internet and it took 25 mins for it to come back
smoky wave
I'd be happy with a +4 this week. Need more hours in the day.
fair crystal
7 temple
polar rain
we did +7 30 seconds too slow to be in time
so gotta grind some gear for +9 to work in time ^^
junior ivy
i havent even done a +5 in time yet lol 😦
fair crystal
found it so hard to do the room befor last boss
fair crystal
and yeah i Agreed it seems pretty hard to Kite in a lot of these dungons with TC only slowing 20% now aswell
solid granite
you can one-shot the last big pack in freehold just infront of the last boss
polar rain
by kiting across bridge ?
solid granite
no
polar rain
you can actually pull both packs and the patrol while mounted and then kite across the bride
that one ability will kill most of the adds
they arrive with half hp
polar rain
some aoe storm
junior ivy
ohh
polar rain
the casters do it and it dmgs their friends
solid granite
if you pull everything, they'll oneshot themselves
final mist
If you have a warlock, you can also pull the pats on the bridge, set up a lock portal to the top of the cliff, and pull the boss in that corner there without killing the last few packs
Not a summon portal, the other one
Skips the fuckers that throw you around
polar rain
@solid granite do you dont even need the bridge?
solid granite
you can also, in atal'dazar skip the nasty poison trash by using a WL portal through the wall
polar rain
pull everything and stun / slow and theyll die right there on the spot ?
gotta try that for sure
solid granite
na, pull everything -> most likely you die but so does the trash
junior ivy
um i did atal dazar last night and iuts not showing up on raiderio
why?
the dungeon i did AFTER IT shows up
i even got this from it
solid granite
dunno if related, but raider.io cannot 'getScore' anymore - so maybe Blizzard blocks their ability to get all the dungeons
junior ivy
hmm
solid granite
i'm still farming m+ for gear - i'm not gonna push now without certain items / ilvl
solid granite
this is my current status
junior ivy
realized half the groups had ilvl 350 requirements
and im only 347
so im like shit i really need gear
solid granite
yeah, i'm currently at 355 & still want at least a 355 shield & maybe some more haste/mastery items
dark junco
Damn lucky!
Got a 355 shield from underrot
Not haste mastery, but still a boost of 500 BV
uneven mason
Finally got a shield >< normal run, Warforged offa Ghuun (better than nothing)
sick sentinel
zul normal should i tank the adds or the boss
smoky wave
this is what I disliked about legion artifacts. It sucks not having a shield for ages, but it's soooo good when one drops, and it's nice seeing people get excited when they get one
uneven mason
Mickers the boss is untankable when the adds are up
You should (because warrior) be tanking the Crusher
sick sentinel
ah right thx, im just watching the vids now, do i just keep getting the crusher
uneven mason
put him on the boss, point him away from the raid (and yell at stupid melee who get in front of it) leap to an edge when crusher has 80 energy, wait for him to start casting, charge back ot the boss.
Yeah
I mean if there is a hexer in melee you can help interrupt
and AE stuns work on the crawgs
But on normal the crawgs should pop like they're made out of waterbaloons
free Victory rush heals if they spawn during avatar TC spam
sick sentinel
ah right ty, kind of going in semi blind i planned on dpsing but everyone already has their token arms lol
signal plover
Prot warr feels gud in raid imo.
uneven mason
Yeah
"Token Arms"
We have 3 DPS warriors in my raid
because Arms is fucking disgusting in Uldir
all that cleave
running energy on Ghuun as well
Warriors are best
wanton sentinel
Prot War feels solid in M+ too. Some stuff you have to brute force due to lack of BDK/VDH util, but TC AoE is real, and SR+IP is powerful.
dusk locust
feels good in raid, though it takes me a couple pulls to understand where the damage is sometimes so i can mitigate properly
valid gorge
SR?
amber siren
spell reflect
valid gorge
ah
uneven mason
@dusk locust that is 100% of Protection warriors, knowing where the damage is coming from and preparing for it.
I was having issues on Ghuun until I got the tempo down, then I felt like a brickwall. as long as the stacks didn't get too high on his buff.
We're going to have predictable gaps in our AM on most of these fights
rustic python
I still feel like tanks like Brew can just damage smooth far superior to us
uneven mason
next run I'ma start tracking them and put together a spread sheet (basically a - when you might want to call for pain supression guide)
That is BRewmasters niche tho
that is LITERALLY their purpose
ember arrow
SEVERAL PEOPLE ARE TYPING
uneven mason
Ours is to take the least damage of all the tanks
rustic python
Like when your getting hit by non-blockable damage.. you really feel like a wet paper bag.. IP is not picking up the slack and SR isn't what it used to be
smoky wave
I need someone to do that for m+ for me 😅
rustic python
Our job is to Damage Smooth
uneven mason
Exif - if you have a gap in AM uptime, and no CD covering it (I use SW for a predictable gap in block)
rustic python
Overall damage take is irrelevant
amber siren
BrM is on the very high end of the smoothing damage niche, doesn't necessarily mean the least damage overall though
cloud bone
I was getting trucked when my group tried heroic MOTHER last night
uneven mason
Were you standing in the cone?
cloud bone
couldn't figure out where the damage was coming from aside from the boss hitting me without shield block and there only being 1 healer
uneven mason
have IP up for when people cross the barbiers
cloud bone
nope never got hit by it
rustic python
If the fight is over and you take 1.3 million or 1.4.. it doesn't matter.. how well did you smooth that damage out for your healers.. without spiking - is all I care about
cloud bone
I tried to use IP and SR when i could
rustic python
Brew are kings of smoothing by design.. :\
cloud bone
but it was mostly when it was just one or 2 groups left with just one healer
amber siren
You're preaching to the choir on why BrM are the go-to tank for mythic rn
rustic python
a difference of 1 million is meh..
uneven mason
we get wrecked
rustic python
if they didn't spike - doesn't matter
uneven mason
a difference of 1million is 20%
when we make mistakes
but you are right
we are very good at smoothing incomming damage
rustic python
As long as their damage was consistently smoothed out the whole fight and they didn't need a big CD.. they did the job perfectly
uneven mason
TBH with tank swaps, I had a CD up all the time but for when my OT died and I had to hold the boss for 2 explosives
then I had a gap
and needed a pain supression
rustic python
on Ghuun it felt pretty shitty for me personally.. I cleared stacks both times and we swapped at 4
uneven mason
You're underestimating how much stagger smooths versus our block+CDs
rustic python
I tried to SR his one attack
cloud bone
how do you deal with down time between shield blocks and last stand being down when you're the boss tank?
do you just spam IP and hope
uneven mason
call for an external?
rustic python
basically.. Demo + TC spam
rustic python
lol "call for external" so basically ask your healers to carry your fragile butt across the finish line..
amber siren
what
uneven mason
That isn't how tanking works
amber siren
that's what externals are there for
cloud bone
should I be saving DS for those times or still be using it on CD?
uneven mason
Exif, you're kinda slow if you think calling for an external isn't part of tanking
especially now
rustic python
I'm being a little hyperbolic.. but my point is.. most tanks don't need that much hand holding IMO
rustic python
I really hope for a tuning pass
amber siren
prot needing an external in x situation doesn't mean a different tank doesn't need one in y situation
it's not blank and white
uneven mason
He needed them in different situations though
rustic python
We need externals because there's a fundamental gap in our rotation
uneven mason
Like, BrM was WAY better than me at eating Zul's DoT
rustic python
I don't think Monks need them as badly
uneven mason
but I took Myths melee hits like a boss
next goblet
why do i see so many prot wars rocking punish and gear with no DC trait?
uneven mason
(Once I figured out that his "front" is not where his front is and stopped getting hit in the back"
Because they didn't
cloud bone
yeah bosses where a tank swap happens I'm usually fine cus I can save shield block for when I'm actively tanking
sick sentinel
ok i actually have 0 fucking idea what to do on zul
uneven mason
🤢
cloud bone
wait what about myth's front?
uneven mason
Whats wrong Mickers?
final mist
@next goblet Same reason why you saw people taking NS and Indom last expansion.
People are stupid.
dusk locust
i'll get surprised by damage sometimes but once i know about it i can deal with it
next goblet
fair enough lol
dusk locust
first time i did fetid i died twice on normal, second time was on heroic and i was fine
uneven mason
@cloud bone Myth's melee box is off a bit from his model, he'll hit you in the back if you're too close to his center
I was getting wrecked by his melees because they were ignoring shield armor/block
backed up a bit on the next pull and was 100% fine
cloud bone
Is it just myth that's like that or are other bosses like that too?
cus I got trucked through SB on fetid
with the thrash skill
sick sentinel
we got to 40% when zul becomes active and insta died
uneven mason
Pixel Fetid is just rough for tanks to deal with
But I mean, check your log, if you had SB UP and you didn't block it, than yeah that is possible.
next goblet
^
uneven mason
that's how I noticed the issue with Myth
But it could be like when Sense died on their clear
SB faded like 0.02s before Trash happened
the icon was probably still up on the UI
but server side the game was like "NARP Here's 500k"
dusk locust
fetid i pretty much find that i need either shield block, last stand, or shield wall up. otherwise i'll call for an external
uneven mason
Basically our gaps are predictable - learn where they are and call for a external ahead of time
or tank swap
to cover them
(I Mean, his melee is going to truck you without block no matter what)
old dagger
hey guys, is there an heroic dungeon I should farm for a weapon? Or should I just farm heroics in general to hope and find a weapon?
uneven mason
Easiest solution is when you're going to have a gap in block uptime, you have a paladin come stand on the main tank and bubble - eat 2 Trashes and you should have block up again
You can't specifically queue for a heroic more than once a day
@old dagger whats your ilvl?
frosty wedge
atal'dazar is king @old dagger
uneven mason
AD or TD
wary gyro
tol'dagor, temple and atal'dazar are the dungeons i know of off the top of my head that drop decent 1 handers
uneven mason
are best 2 dungeons for prot warriors 1h, shield and trinket all in one dungeon
old dagger
323 but with horrible stat weights
strong hill
@old dagger atal would be where I would focus on
grim prism
Id spam atal +2s
frosty wedge
^
grim prism
Easy af to clear and good drops
strong hill
^
old dagger
haven't done mythics yet, Im scared haha
strong hill
Ya atal is pretty forgiving
old dagger
but I'll give it a shot
wary gyro
what ilvl is your shield
uneven mason
a smidgeon harder than heroci
old dagger
my shield is the the BiS one, got lucky on trash in a normal
frosty wedge
yeah they're really not that bad, you just have to actually do the mechanics
wary gyro
then you should be fine for tanking a +2
digital arrow
ive been tanking +2's with a 315 shield and it's been a struggle
old dagger
okay, I thought they were very hard compared to heroics and also time limited
digital arrow
well not really but the healer has to work extra
grim prism
They are a little harder, and time limited
frosty wedge
only mythic+ are time limited
grim prism
^
frosty wedge
regular mythics are not
wary gyro
AD is extremely forgiving though
grim prism
And m0s are basically just heroic with more mechanics
You pay attention to what trash has to get kicked and you are fine
wary gyro
actually they dont have any new mechs on mythic right now just more damage
wary gyro
yeah that
frosty wedge
right, but you can ignore the mechanics in most heroics
cloud bone
Yeah it looks like I didn't have shield block up for the hit and just got trucked
digital arrow
unstable hex is so annoying to kick in AD, it only casts for like a tenth of a second
hexed onyx
out of curiosity, is there a curated less of boss/dungeon spells that are worthwhile to spellreflect in M+ or anything people can share?
wary gyro
it also has to be hard ccd
digital arrow
lol trucked
uneven mason
@old dagger you ahve to CC in +2s at first, you can't just truck them
cloud bone
on warcraft logs is there a way to tell what your cd timers would be like?
uneven mason
What do you mean Pixel?
cloud bone
like if I had a shield block charge available but didn't use it
sick sentinel
on zul is it bad to have the 2 hexers near eachother
sick sentinel
i think im getting this fight now
uneven mason
look at your "last used"
if SB is > 13seconds
chances are, you had a charge
if LS is > 1min
chances are you had a charge
grim prism
Yeah i dont think you can explicitly view cooldown timers
Just see when you casted what
uneven mason
yeah, you can look at your casting timeline
then compare that data with the damage intake
see where your gaps are
I Mean, knowing your gaps is a huge portion of prot
cloud bone
my last used SB was 7 sec my last used last stand was 70 sec
where would I see the casting timeline?
grim prism
For stuff like SB or LS what you can do is
uneven mason
So look for your buff uptime Pixel - in that time frame
grim prism
Open your "buffs" tab, click yourself to see just your buffs, then click the "+" icons on the rightmost column
uneven mason
if you double used block, you probably were blocking some dead air
grim prism
Itll pop up a new display above the main chart
uneven mason
which you never want to do, especially not on fetid
grim prism
And you can click "display"(?) to change it from "decorator" to "main" to colorcode the main timeline according to when you had buffs running
Then if you click out of buffs and go to "damage taken" tab
You can see exactly where you spiked, and if you had a buff up for it
I might be getting the titles of the tabs slightly wrong but thats the gist
WCL OP
Logs are love
cloud bone
It says terrible thrash was up for 4 seconds but doesn't it only hit once?
grim prism
Not sure, i havent raided at all this expac :^)
jagged bay
how much hits do you guys mitigate during bossfights? i have like 70%+ is that fine?
uneven mason
Oh decorator? Is that new for BFA Balsaq?
grim prism
Yeah thats definitely not bad @jagged bay
jagged bay
cool thanks
uneven mason
That sounds about right Twin, depends on the fight tho
on Ghuun I was mitigating around 55%
because fucking magic damage
next goblet
so g'huun drops our BiS shield im assuming..
merry cave
Ghuun hits like truck holy shit
next goblet
since its haste/mas
uneven mason
OMNOMNOMNOM Its normal but its ok in my book @grim prism
final mist
@hexed onyx there's a blockable and reflectable spell list in the pins.
My buddy, who is a resto shaman, got a 980 one last night
I was not happy
grim prism
Okay so when you click the plus and it pops up the new display, itll have "type" and "graph" as options
Leave type as "decorator", i misspoke
uneven mason
ah
final mist
His first sentence, "Wow, shit secondaries but lots of int!"
grim prism
Change "graph" from "separate" to "main"
uneven mason
And you're all like "BUTMAHARMUR!"
cloud bone
I did but still 😛
grim prism
You CAN change type from decorator to filter, which will only show events which occur while the buff was running. For instance, if you change the type for LS from decorator to filter, you can see if you cast SB during LS and exactly how many times
uneven mason
And for every time you cast SB during LS you have you hit yourself in the hand with a hammer.
So you don't do that anymore
strong hill
@cloud bone triple shield block pants from legion would be great for thrashey boss 😝
uneven mason
Why?
1 extra block for the entire fight?
(you understand that charges renew sequentially right?)
cloud bone
I forgot that's why they weren't as good leggos
I think the extra block would be good in some situations tho
uneven mason
If you had large gaps in your tanking uptime (Zul)
Ghuun you'd make use of it
you could I mean, gain some leeway with using 2 SB charges then LS to let 1.* refresh since the 3rd charge would be waiting and gain around 9~ seconds of additional uptime on block
cloud bone
having 2 SR would be good tho cus more magic mit
frosty wedge
is anyone running 1xDC 2Xbloodsport for ghuun?
strong hill
Very amazing on ghun
frosty wedge
lol
strong hill
@uneven mason what boss mod are you running ?
uneven mason
?
frosty wedge
Just seems like that would be a legit combo
uneven mason
"Weak Auras"
grim prism
<3
strong hill
Weak auras!! What sorcery is this 🤔
grim prism
Theres usually a WA pack for every tier
grim prism
I only use boss mods for the timer
uneven mason
I use only the crucial timers tho
grim prism
And make WAs for the important shit
uneven mason
I tend to dislike the "TAUNT NOW" crap it blares at me
grim prism
I turn off all that shot
uneven mason
because we tend to find our own comfort zones
strong hill
Ya my dbm decided not to announce thrash a couple times last night. I got trucked
grim prism
Sheeeit
uneven mason
WHy are you even trying to use DBM to track thrash
its literally evey 6 seconds
you could use a fucking metronome
grim prism
Well.. you probably need to update it if it didnt call it anyway
strong hill
I swapped the sound to cthun “ you will die “
uneven mason
metronome btw, underutilized tool
strong hill
Seemed appropriate
cloud bone
for G'huun how many stacks were you guys swapping at? me and my co tank just decided to pretty much taunt on cd
grim prism
I believe they call that an "analog swing timer" @uneven mason
undone sun
4-5
signal plover
Pretty quick taunts
uneven mason
Mines digital @grim prism
uneven mason
"They've got an app for that"
signal plover
Yeah we did 6 in normal but we're def gonna drop it to 4-5 for heroic.
Now just gotta kill Zul...
uneven mason
For normal we were swapping whenever we got the explosive debuff
cloud bone
yeah those stacks hurt we could take 4-5 but we thought it was better to just get like 2 since there isn't really a downside to swapping that much
signal plover
Yep same
strong hill
We did it every time he cast the explosive debuff @cloud bone
signal plover
I think that's why he has no cleave
uneven mason
Seemed to make sense
sick sentinel
i cant seem to survive p2 zul
uneven mason
we also tanked him on opposite sides
sick sentinel
i get to 3 stacks and insta die
uneven mason
Don't take 3 stacks
vocal nimbus
We ended making circles around the lower arena to drop the corruption without running away
signal plover
Ya warriors get rekt above 2 stacks
uneven mason
If you take 3 stacks you need to get an external and be tunnled by a healer
vocal nimbus
When kiting goon next to the wall the try was much cleaner
static lance
yay finally got the shield from atal-dazar.
blissful imp
I turned all dbm timers off a long time ago. Very few of the timers are even right, the bosses announce everything they are doing in advance anyway and have very set ability patterns. Can't stand all them air horns and shit going off when you can just memorize the ability rotation
uneven mason
Some things are not "projected" though
like I have the timer for add spawns on Ghuun running
so we know when the 2nd young comes up
final mist
I swapped to BW from DBM a long time ago for the same reason.
BW is much less, "in your face" about everything.
undone sun
same
final mist
And much easier to customize everything to your needs.
blissful imp
I've hear BW timers are better. But every boss fight has a very defined rythm. 4 pulls and you should have a good idea of what ability is coming next and about how long it will be till then
blissful imp
At least it's easy to memorize as a tank because our mechanics are usually piss easy (taunt at 2/4 stacks)
sick sentinel
lol me dieing at 3 stack just watching dk tank 5
blissful imp
I only have DBM for pull timer, heh
sick sentinel
feels good
final mist
Sometimes bosses don't have defined ability rotations, though. Mythic Argus was an example of a boss where he would overlap several different abilities.
You can't predict that without timers.
Varimathras was another example, where he'd push back his Strike for other abilities, which you also can't predict without timers.
blissful imp
Those timers would be off as well then? So if your watching a timer saying he's gonna do x ability in 5 seconds and you use a defensive and he delays it by 3 seconds you could get smacked and it's the timers fault
tawny panther
Is bw worse than dBm in any way ?
blissful imp
So you just wait till the boss announces he is doing x and ignore the timer
undone sun
preference
sick sentinel
ok mythrax is my favourite pug boss
blissful imp
So why even have the timer?
sick sentinel
like half the raid jumped down and died to him
undone sun
dbm vs. bw is entirely preferential
tawny panther
I've just always used dBm but if I can customise bw more easily might go for that. Assume you can set sounds if you want them
Sometimes it's nice to air horn you for a big ability just in case you are watching dps for mehcnaics
blissful imp
Should be able to customize sounds with dbm too
amber siren
afaik you can customise dbm & bw to p much do w/e the other one does
just out of the box settings are different
uneven mason
They're not generally
I mean they use the same triggers and the same information generally
it really does come down to personal preference
DBM has more stuff enabled at base, BW has marginally less options to customize warnings
grim prism
+1 for BW being better out of the box
mellow basin
Why are we taking so much more damage than other tanks.. I feel like we can’t be effective tanks without high rage regeneration
plain vapor
i dont feel like we take a lot of damage
uneven mason
0_o so much more damage than other tanks?
grim prism
Most people here have been saying they take less damage overall
plain vapor
proper play means you take very little
uneven mason
I take 20% less damage than my co tank on avg
grim prism
Prot definitely mitigates more on paper
grim prism
You are probably making rotational errors
uneven mason
so it can feel like we're taking a lot
and if you make mistakes
and not use the right tool
you're going to die
The better question is "Why are we punished for mistakes more than the other tanks"
mellow basin
If I have no rage generatio (ie not getting enough melee hits) my damage mitigation goes way down
grim prism
What talents are you using
mellow basin
The icy veins one
grim prism
Do you have logs
uneven mason
You shouldn't be rage starving unless you're pressing revenge when you shouldn't be
mellow basin
I do but I’m on my phone rn
uneven mason
If you're not actively tanking - don't spend rage unless you're going to cap.
grim prism
You have the exact same rage generation as everyone else here if youre using the IV build. Chances are you are spamming spenders
uneven mason
If you have to spend rage to avoid capping, and you're having problems with damage intake - get a full 1.3 IP up before you take the mob back.
wary gyro
dont cast revenge unless you have a proc for it its almost never worth it
uneven mason
I Mean - you could literally remove revenge from your bar more or less and a lot of warriors would probably find that their survivability increased
wary gyro
yeah unless you have a proc or absolutely need it to pick up adds theres no reason to cast it over devastate
plain vapor
but i need to parse 🤔
mellow basin
Ok
grim prism
cant parse if youre dead rofl rofl rofl
wary gyro
devastate does almost the same damage as revenge to a single target anyway
blissful imp
TC generates rage???
wary gyro
TC generates rage
sick sentinel
i wish tc gave 10 rage
blissful imp
Lol
wary gyro
i miss the glove legendary
mellow basin
Yeah but I’m not using globals on my defensive in favor of tc
grim prism
I wish prot had BoP and spellwarding and grip and a bigger healthpool and IP off GCD and no cooldown on Rev
chilly brook
Anyone got any log knowledge they’d like to share?
undone sun
what a dream..
sick sentinel
sweet is that the next hotfix
grim prism
@mellow basin glad we could help solve your problem lol
mellow basin
Huh?
blissful imp
In comparing myself to other raids over similar size I take significantly less damage than most other tanks
grim prism
``Yeah but I’m not using globals on my defensive in favor of tc
So stop doing that
Problem solved
mellow basin
But why do I need to have a rotation filled with active defensive
Most tanks don’t need to do this
blissful imp
Filled? It's one button
grim prism
Because you will die if you dont
mellow basin
Shield block IP
blissful imp
Shield block is off GCD
grim prism
SB is off global
blissful imp
Do you even play warrior?
blissful imp
No, it's off gcd. You can hit it any time
uneven mason
Its used when you need it (actively taking melees)
grim prism
First you said you were ragestarved and then you said you were wasting globals on defensives
mellow basin
It’s still in your rotation
round fox
@blissful imp lol
fossil spindle
Lol
uneven mason
IP is on GCD, used as a rage dump and smoothing tool
grim prism
Dawg... being off-global doesnt mean you dont press it
grim prism
It means you can press it literally whenever you want
uneven mason
that every time you cast revenge
you call yourself an idiot in /say
and see how many times you say that
grim prism
I.e. you can SB at the exact same time you press Tc
"Most tanks have a defensive off global"
mellow basin
It’s still part of your rotation
mellow basin
Semantics
uneven mason
SW off GCD
sick sentinel
are our mitigation cd's long compared to other tanks?
mellow basin
It’s something you have to press and maintain
blissful imp
Are you clicking your abilities? That would be the only way it's in any kind of "rotation" cause you can't mouse click 2 abilities at once
grim prism
Most tanks need to press buttons to maintain defense???????
mellow basin
Jim I hope you get benched
grim prism
Hello
undone sun
alright calm down
mellow basin
For being prot
blissful imp
I mean, I press my buttons so unlikely
tawny panther
Short @sick sentinel cos of anger management
blissful imp
You should stop mouse clicking abilities
dapper copper
Yo, I raid 1st time tonight starting 0/8N anyone wanna DM me some very specific encounter tips?(I’m 351 prot warrior)
wary gyro
last stand is off gcd as well i believe
grim prism
^
uneven mason
351? just starting normal?
take your pants off so your healers will have something todo?
uneven mason
GURPS nudity is defense traits +++
grim prism
Dawg ikar how old are you my dude
uneven mason
Old
final mist
Hmm.
uneven mason
@grim prism My introduction to gaming was AD&D 1st edition.
uneven mason
I was able to do algebra by 2nd grade because of that game.
strong hill
@uneven mason who was president when you started gaming
uneven mason
Regan
native coyote
not that old then 😉
signal plover
Regan lol
uneven mason
Its more like I started gaming early in life
grim prism
Nope just more bads being bad
Im doing everything right but dying instantly because prot is bad etc
uneven mason
I Mean, you had the correct response Balsaq
"Why do we take so much damage?" - "We or just you?"
chilly brook
@mellow basin lul do you play Blood DK or something where your mitigation is literal brain dead chimpanzee status?
grim prism
Noooo dont re-engage
chilly brook
I can’t help it
chilly brook
Real talk though anyone have the time or knowledge to look over logs specifically defensively
Wanna minimize damage intake
thorn fox
My guild is still progressing normal atm. On 7/8. Ghuuns hits like like a truck. I’ve gotten past the point of thinking prot is bad because I see others succeeding in what I’m failing at. Just gotta clean up my mitigation usage and it should be fine. Although I sure could use a better shield (which ghuun drops lol) mine is 325 T.T
grim prism
I dont know shit about the fights but i can help with general stuff assuming i can get WCL going on mobile
Which is 50/50
chilly brook
I’ll repost in logs channel
grim prism
@thorn fox spam those m+ my dude
uneven mason
@thorn fox what part of the fight are you having trouble with?
thorn fox
Atal Duzar is my BFF IRL
dusk locust
it's not clear to me when to taunt swap on g'huun
grim prism
Its just a matter of time
uneven mason
On normal
chilly brook
I’m not really worried about damage output btw