which is entirely wrong
#protection
dull pilot
was my opinion
undone sun
objectively
dull pilot
u can disagree
then started talking about the class
and u got a little bitchy
its ok happens to us all
ember arrow
wat
dull pilot
have a coffee
amber siren
He's not wrong though, that trink is hot garbage
ember arrow
saying a trink is bis, then just brushing it a off as your opinion
you were incorrect
dull pilot
fair play
valid pumice
I got it last night, the trink looks good at first glance but when you look at it its not actually gonna do that much
ember arrow
1.8k dmg split
my autos do 3k at least
and 5k heal on a 170k hp pool
unreliably
maximum 2 times per minute i believe
valid pumice
yeah think i read it averages about 1.4 activations a minute
dull pilot
hmm yea just did a 5 man did not seam as good as it looked
valid pumice
Like I said, when it dropped me and my guildy were like wow thats insane healing and dps wowzer but 1 min later realised its pretty meh
ember arrow
Yes because it gives alot of str
dull pilot
god i iwsh ip was not on the gcd
grim prism
man just wake me up next week
valid pumice
Is booming voice always > than devastator? I've started seeing a couple tanks running devastator now
grim prism
Yes, those tanks are bad
hearty sandal
Whats the ideal % of vers u want as a prot warrior?
grim prism
There isnt one
hearty sandal
higher the better im guuessing
merry cave
Someone saying haste proc is more damage than fang?? Lol
junior igloo
Higher is better for all stats indeed.
tawny panther
I thought spore for the heal might be alright the DMG is not high at all, but having strength on it is basically my bottom line for "is fine"
So to replace it, would the big red button just be better , if the heal is considered not good, cos that spore procs endlessly
Got both at 340, and the emblem gets the first slot but can always hope for a different drop
fossil spindle
Here to remind people to use WAs for IP and shield block. I had 2 prot warriors yesterday and both ate rocks most of the time. Dont be thay guy that gives prot a bad name.
sick sentinel
eat rocks ?
eager phoenix
you take a lot of dmg if you mess up shield block
fossil spindle
Low sb up time and rarely used ip. A wet noodle
fossil spindle
WAs, helps to track it. Use it. :)
sick sentinel
I already run mythics at like 20 fps won't that affect my perf more ?
willow dirge
not as much as being dead will
sick sentinel
I'm not dying if i'm carefull with the pulls tho
sick sentinel
yeh tell em
valid pumice
Gotta make sure your healers paying attention
rich folio
brittle timber
Because teamwork makes the dream work
sick sentinel
How's Overwelming Power for prot?
I guess stacks get eaten right away on AoE right?
silk mortar
Yeah, Believe it is one of our lower ranked traits
grim prism
Barely use IP this week, get shredded next week
dull pilot
+10 next week will be fun
dull pilot
sure u can will not be easy ofc
sharp lotus
no way im doing +10 i dont get what Im doing wrong, the more reckless i behave as far as pulling the better i do, but when i try to play collectedly and steadily i struggle
it feels like nothing matters as long as i can force last stands cd to rotate
valid pumice
Simple solution is to pull everything
sharp lotus
yeah but thats not whats going to help me perform on bosses and shit
sharp lotus
:]
tawny panther
How many packs are people pulling atm
grim prism
Depends on the pack
valid pumice
What bosses are you struggling on? I tend to find people try harder when I over pull as opposed to tactically pulling
tawny panther
I feel most of the time of you pull more than a few, casts are gonna cause a bad time
grim prism
Thats not going to serve you well in M+ @valid pumice lol
valid pumice
Hopefully by that time people understand I only have so many stuns
tawny panther
Unless you have good deeps but I've been pugging more last reset
Aside from my holy paladin. He just does absurd damage on pull (bosses though)
sharp lotus
im not really struggling in the fights, im struggling to perform where id like to. I think its because i dont take booming voicce
valid pumice
What are you taking instead?
valid pumice
I only use devastate when everything else has been expended
grim prism
BV is way better this tier @sharp lotus
sharp lotus
i dont know if this is a stupid idea but i wish IP wasnt on GCD, it doesnt stack
grim prism
Devestate hardly gets pressed
sharp lotus
ah shit they nerfed devestator too, im an ape
grim prism
And everybody here at some point in the past two weeks has said they with IP was back off global, but its not likely to happen so just keep ignoring that pain
sharp lotus
ayyyy
grim prism
👌
junior igloo
@sharp lotus
The problem is that Booming Voice is better than Devastator even if you never use Devastate. 😦
sharp lotus
the rage gen is that weak on devestator?
merry cave
I'd say the opposite if your still in a position your spamming IP your probably fucked for a 10. But if you can go full mongo dps not take much damage and not need IP doing a 10 is much more realistic
tawny panther
Good thing I'm a mongo
open bluff
devastator has no rage gen anymore i thought
tawny panther
I do press IP...sometimes
grim prism
Youre still going to need to start casting it effectively for M+. Being able to go "full mongo DPS" in m0 means nothing
tawny panther
Just to remind it I'm still watching it and judging it
sharp lotus
yeah but it can reset shield slam
open bluff
so can literally anything else
grim prism
^
open bluff
thunder clap? shield slam reset
revenge? shield slam reset
devastate? shield slam reset
open bluff
all devastator does is make your auto attacks hit harder
and make SS resets slightly more passive
grim prism
One way or another, your current rage gen is what it is right now and IP is the only consistent way to spend it with rev procs being so frequent. Its not like not-casting it is doing you any favors or makes you somehow better
merry cave
Not really with IP on gcd and it not being needed for m0 for me, using the gcd on damage > using gcd on ip
If it was off gcd id agree
signal plover
What do u mean not needed?
junior igloo
If it was off gcd, you'd use both IP and Devastate, that wouldn't be much of a choice 😃
merry cave
@paw what i mean by that is at 345 i personally don't need IP anymore to live comfortably short of the really large silly pulls a
grim prism
So you can spend 30 rage every 3 seconds assuming you dont have a rev proc, which you (super rough estimate) have a 30% chance of having
tawny panther
I would say spending on pull for a revenge wouldn't be bad but once aggro is established there won't be any issues with aggro so go IP nuts in m+ , within reason
grim prism
Its not about taking damage, its about advancing anger management without capping rage
sharp lotus
what haste % are you guys aiming for btw
junior igloo
It's also rage dump to fuel Anger Management
tawny panther
As much as I can
hazy yacht
the moon
sharp lotus
got it
grim prism
If you pull as big as yoy say you do, you cant do that with rev alone
tawny panther
I'm still curious how many packs the pulls everyone is doing are
open bluff
MeiffertToday at 8:20 AM
It's also rage dump to fuel Anger Management```
real reason to spam ip right hereObvs it depends but roughly
hazy yacht
thats the only reason
grim prism
Dont spam IP and dont pretend you dont need it either
Both are oversimplifying at best, stupid at worst
merry cave
^
valid pumice
Really hard to say pack size when the packs are so varied, there are some that wreck you if you pull too many
tawny panther
Off top of my head (excluding kings rest) there aren't many that spring to mind that truly train you but I'm tired
hazy yacht
depends on if you're ifnoring mechanics or not
rather if your dpsis ignoring mechanics
sharp lotus
the underrot maggots make me what to cry
merry cave
All 3rd bosses room in boralus is fun for getting absolutely crushed Dan
tawny panther
Enforcers in shrine deep smash hurts. Interrupt on darkness thing. Mech jockeys in ML, I ignore every set of maggots anyway
merry cave
On that pull I certainly spammed IP lol
tawny panther
Hmm I'll pull that tonight to my healers delight
sharp lotus
i dont know how to counter the bleed stacks besides shield wall and ip, but they were eating through that
sharp lotus
race changing to dwarf for sure
tawny panther
Which means one stun at 7 and your gucci
merry cave
It's like atueman, you pull boss and all the trash comes running lol
tawny panther
You never have to fight a tick in underrot
grim prism
And if you do, stun then kite
sharp lotus
i promise you, with the players i run with, they are getting pulled, especially if i mention it
tawny panther
Right is always the answer to avoiding ticks
grim prism
Theres more to tanking than being a brick
hazy yacht
inb4 hunters
tawny panther
Momentum DH are worse than hunters I find now lol
hazy yacht
thats what actually upsets me right now. i can go braindead on a pally or DH and be a brick shithouse
tawny panther
Pally is a sunny beach when I go play it after prot
hazy yacht
not so much my beefcake
sharp lotus
yeah i always kite but i grab a few hits trying to establish aggro, its partially my own fault since i know how my friends will play (blow all cds and cc as hard as possible even if i say not to)
tawny panther
Autopilot to victory and laugh at the obscene things you can do with cheese n utility
hazy yacht
the despairity in ease of use is upsetting
merry cave
Kiting has always been a big part of m+ that's nothing new
grim prism
Disparity* although thats a hilariously apt typo
hazy yacht
still on pot o'coffe number 1, thank you
grim prism
Some people find braindead specs less enjoyable to play
tawny panther
Fun for different reasons but I play both so I'm happy
hazy yacht
while prot has had me playing at half mast most the time. having to be 100% in tune all the time can have the same effect
tawny panther
I only did m+ at the start before the community was really established so interesting seeing how getting into it goes
In legion obvs
merry cave
Prepare for bias 😂
bronze helm
I feel like my shield block downtime is way too high (haven't tanked since early legion)... I can't really do anything about it since cooldown but should I use more IP and save block rather than use it any time I'm getting meleed?
merry cave
'lf bdk for +2 run'
tawny panther
Eh I know enough people who, whilst they will moan, will go with me lol
hazy yacht
more haste
grim prism
@bronze helm take Bolster and use Last Stand rotationally
bronze helm
That's what I'm doing
grim prism
Also you should be running AM so you can demo shout every pack
bronze helm
Also doing that
tawny panther
And a deafening crash trait
grim prism
You just arent going to be able to block everything
hazy yacht
rage generation isnt the issue
bronze helm
But I want to though 😭
hazy yacht
i know, i finally got it on the helm i think
grim prism
You can take HR if you want, but it'll hurt more in the long run
tawny panther
Tis good
grim prism
The cooldowns help with unblockable damage
hazy yacht
last stand is just god tier
grim prism
Just gotta get used to the ebb and flow of it. You might be sitting on cooldowns inappropriately as well
hazy yacht
got a hast proc and was able to get 45 seconds of straight block yesterday
grim prism
🤔
bronze helm
Ive tanked a lot in past expansions, managing shield block is my only issue tbh
It'll come with more experience I guess
Just gotta get the hang of it
hazy yacht
3 SB, last stand, 2 SB
sharp lotus
yeah i am finding it weird juggling last stand with shield block
wait 3? i have been doing 2
hazy yacht
high enough haste you can get your third
sharp lotus
true
hazy yacht
simple enough with a bloodlust
bronze helm
Hmm I could be using a haste trinket... But I could also be using fang for ridiculous damage 🤔
bronze helm
Ugh I wish thunderforging never became a thing
bronze helm
Rng on top of rng
tawny panther
Titan :P
hazy yacht
yeah, mines gost me 500k gold so far
bronze helm
Of course it is. It was a mistake in throne of thunder and they doubled and tripled down on their mistake
In typical blizzard fashion
hazy yacht
yet crafted gear can;t TF
prisma night
does demo shout stack additively to shield wall? or how does that interaction work
or does it just choose the highest DR %
sharp lotus
should i grab a darkmoon deck?
hazy yacht
blockades is nice
past holly
Anyone been running heroics as arms but trying to get prot loot? I have prot loot spec checked but I’m still getting all arms loot for some reason.
hazy yacht
there's no difference aside from weapon slots 1 and 2
grim prism
There is some overlap in the loot table
bronze helm
The only loot difference is like 1 handers and shields instead of 2 handers
grim prism
Yeah
hazy yacht
haste is number 1 for both right now
grim prism
If you mean on azerite gear, you need to change specs to access the prot traits
They are still on there
bronze helm
Haste is number 1 for like 95% of all specs
hazy yacht
yeah
actually, if i sim my arms gear is puts my haste at like .031
.31 rather
so i'm there i guess
past holly
@grim prism yes I was speaking for Azerite traits. As I need deafening crash.
hazy yacht
thats rare as balls, finally got mine yesterday
grim prism
Yeah they are still on the pieces
past holly
Didn’t realize if you swapped specs you get a new pool of traits? Is that correct? On the same piece of loot.
grim prism
They are just grayed out
sharp lotus
wouldnt shield wall just reduce the dmg of the mob .6* (dmg*.8) @prisma night
grim prism
Open up the piece in the azerite window
prisma night
oh okay that would make sense yeah
grim prism
You will be able to see the prot and fury traits on that piece
You just cant lock it in unless you switch to that spec to do so
past holly
@grim prism ok that’s good info. Thanks a lot!
grim prism
Np
lofty condor
do you guys ever use Focus target in mythic dungeons?
vocal nimbus
not really
hazy yacht
i wish pugs would sometimes
sharp lotus
no
hazy yacht
nothing quite as infuriating as a two mob pull and seeing the arms warrior charge the one i didnt
lofty condor
Im having a hard time being able to process all the information available to me as a tank for big packs of mobs pulling
bronze helm
Define "all the information"
lofty condor
between threat management, active mitigation etc, a lot of times Im not able to notice a mob that isnt my target casting something I need to interrupt
grim prism
I use a target marker macro, and in high M+ last expac i would use a focus macro to safeguard my healer
It has its uses
lofty condor
for example in Motherlode
bronze helm
Threat management shouldn't be an issue, it's so easy to pick up aggro. For casting, get nameplates with a good cast bar
tawny panther
I use it on bosses with adds to watch cast bars. That's about it
sharp lotus
and for mobs like the ones in freehold that shoot with a gun and have no interruptable cast, just taunt them everytime its up
lofty condor
pulling a pack of 4 mobs, 1 casts the Transmute enemy to Goo, the other casts the Transform ability, both need to be interupted, but when there are 4 mobs its hard to notice all of it
sharp lotus
and heroic throw
compact mirage
Which weapon enchants are you guys running with? Stalwart Navigation for me.
lofty condor
if the mob is my target its fine
grim prism
You cant pummel every cast
bronze helm
Quick nav because ... Gotta go fast
grim prism
Gotta depend on DPS for some
tawny panther
Shockwave if in doubt. Particularly with the aoe CD
sharp lotus
shockwave, fear
hazy yacht
im doing quick nav for now. if i notice curvivability being an issue i'll go stalwart
sharp lotus
and immediately break fear with thunderclap
hazy yacht
i actually have that as a macro
grim prism
Yeah the fear is a good oh-shit button for casters
bronze helm
I mean you should tc on cooldown on aoe anyway, no?
grim prism
Just make sure you actually break the fear
lofty condor
TC breaks it every time?
sharp lotus
yee
lofty condor
ahhh nice
compact mirage
Yes
lofty condor
wow thats huge
compact mirage
Shockwave, Pummel, AoE fear and Tauren stun are my CCs for mythic atm
sharp lotus
you should thunderclap before hand to give them a slow
if they dont have one already
lofty condor
right ok
what do you guys think of Stormbolt for the added interrupt. less shock waves but an extra stun every 30 seconds. not worth it?
sharp lotus
the biggest thing with that fear is understanding its use too, like if you are in a situation where you are going to wipe then just roll the dice
hazy yacht
in a caster heavy place i like using menace
sharp lotus
fuck it, many mobs are immune to stuns
grim prism
Yeah the fear should not be a first choice
rose marsh
so far i like the double stuns for some of the trash
lofty condor
like in motherlode again, the tech jockeys and the hired assasins both need stuns for their abilities, Stormbolt seems useful there
Im pugging so I cant rely on DPS to stun all the time
sharp lotus
if you need to chain them yourself then the groups fucking up
compact mirage
Shockwave is fine for both though
grim prism
Friendly reminder that mech jockeys only need to be interrupted once
sick sentinel
Hi Guys,
Question: I have a 345 Armor piece from a WQ with the tank set bons (400 dodge rating proc for 8 seconds) Now I have a 330 iLevel belt, with which I can activate the set bonus, but I have a 355 iLevel crafted belt. I guess the set bonus is not worth 25 iLevels. What do you guys think ?
grim prism
Unless they hotfixed that
sharp lotus
gotta mark the jockies, and they only need to be stopped once if i remember correctly
lofty condor
they occur at different times though. The mech jockeys immediately need to be stunned then the assassins Flechettes needs a stun
grim prism
@sick sentinel 25 ilvl FOR SURE
rose marsh
prot dps is no joke
compact mirage
@sick sentinel ignore the set
lofty condor
at a later point
sick sentinel
ok thx! Then off it goes to the scrap bot 😃
Maybe at some point another piece procs in 355.... 😄
bronze helm
Pull a lot of packs, use fang, then avatar TC spam. Top dps every time.
sharp lotus
dodge = less melee dmg = less rage
grim prism
There is almost nothing more valuable than even 5 ilvl worth of primaries for us
sharp lotus
yeah avatar tc combo is actually hilarious. I do not understand why they gave that to us. Im not complaining js
compact mirage
Btw is there an option to link the wow char profile to the discord profile somehow?
bronze helm
Gotta compete with dh somehow
lofty condor
also, do you guys use any macros? I dont use any at all. not sure if I am missing out on anything
compact mirage
only the mouseover macros from the guide
sharp lotus
nah, id only use a mouse over intterupt or taunt macro
willow dirge
mouseover taunt and cursor heroic leap
compact mirage
for pummel, taunt, heroic throw etc.
sharp lotus
heroic throw is a good one i didnt think of
lofty condor
gotcha
grim prism
I use mouseover for heroic throw and charge
compact mirage
ah right, charge too for intercept
grim prism
Taunt is too important and easy to misclick in melee
compact mirage
btw you can intercept a party unitframe
grim prism
So i took the mouseover off that
sharp lotus
has anyone had issues with charging previous target? Its obviously a latenency issue, just dont know if its my isp
compact mirage
sometimes easier than finding the player in the game
sharp lotus
ie i will swap targets quickly and immediately charge, but it will charge the previous target instead of the one i have toggled
lofty condor
this might be a dumb question but Im brand new to tanking. do you guys usually click to target swap or tab?
next goblet
best way to farm some azerite? mythic or heroic islands?
lofty condor
or just depends
sharp lotus
no fuck tab
compact mirage
tab nearly all the time. click on initial selection before pull.
next goblet
ok
grim prism
I tab around after ive pulled but I definitely click before pulls or if i lose aggro
compact mirage
I have good nameplates though
lofty condor
yeah I tab as well
uneven mason
@sharp lotus You need to adjust your input for ping time, whats your latency at?
next goblet
tab target ftw
sharp lotus
@uneven mason its been flexing like crazy lately right now its 50, but it fluxuates from 30-150
grim prism
Friendly reminder that adjusting your input delay window has nothing to do with ping whatsoever
I dont know where this misconception came from that it should be set to match your ping
uneven mason
Right, but the input delay is the breakdown between when his client updates and when the server updates to an action
grim prism
Keypresses are 100% clientside
sharp lotus
you cant even change it anymore i thought
uneven mason
so if he increases his input delay, the charge will queue after the target change on the server.
its a console commnad
next goblet
this is why i love my prot warriors, y'all are smart unlike some other tanks out there
sharp lotus
fuck me
lofty condor
i think you can change it with advanced interface addons
uneven mason
the other option X is to just delay your charge
sharp lotus
@next goblet nah im a mong while actually playing
grim prism
The client sends whatever the most recent input was when the GCD rolls over
uneven mason
or change your charge button to be a [@target macro]
grim prism
Changing the input latency just gives you a larger or smaller window for it to considee
Or cast delay or whatever they call it
next goblet
lol @sharp lotus aren't we all mongs when we play? we're warriors.. but in discord its different
sharp lotus
why would @target fix the issue, isnt that default
does it make the client refresh or something?
uneven mason
right, so he's changing targets, and queuing the charge before the target change has been "accepted" by the server, if he makes the charge keys a [@-target] macro, it SHOULD more or less, include the current target information from clientside and not what the server had in tandem.
sharp lotus
ah okay
grim prism
But it would be queueing "cast charge @ current target" regardless
sharp lotus
so it just makes the spell specified when sending to the client
uneven mason
fuckoff with the flagging people you stupid UI
sharp lotus
err not the client the server
uneven mason
So, Balsaq when you put the modifier in the macro instead of just casting the spell it forces that information through, any of the @ type macros do that.
sharp lotus
instead of extrapolating information to pick a target for the charge
alright cool, thank you
uneven mason
so when you press charge it queues charge and gets the target, in the @ macro it gets the target and then casts charge
sharp lotus
good stuff
uneven mason
Like, Local vs Global variabls in JS (I think it was you who did some JS)
grim prism
I get what youre saying but wouldnt that force it through with the previous target's information?
uneven mason
No, it changes, in theory the order of operations
Like if you had a mouseover it doesn't cast the spell at your target, it gets what the mouseover target is and then casts
uneven mason
I don't get why this shit keeps pinging people, never had this issue before lol
grim prism
Eee
The time of accepting the cast*
Also i havent seen any pings from you so it may just be on your end
uneven mason
IT takes the @ mod into account before processing the cast
when I try and type out @-mouseover it pings someone called mo
same with target it finds someone named tar
But X you must be slapping keys pretty fast
uneven mason
it'll take your current target
sharp lotus
ty
wide juniper
Thoughts on Merektha's Fang?
uneven mason
and feed that, IN THEORY
Like, let us know if that solves it
because I've always operated under the assumption that the @ macros will change the get order to Target - then cast rather than "queue cast" get target "cast"
or rather
wide juniper
So much f'ing dmg
uneven mason
it gets the target from what is in the table currently
uneven mason
since each interaction your character does is stored in a temp table that takes a few ms to update
sharp lotus
used to be big issue in court of stars
uneven mason
thus the goofyness but yeah PM me or ping me with an update when you findout 😄
Because I may be wrong, and it'd be good to know if I am.
bronze helm
@wide juniper use fang until it's inevitably nerfed to uselessness
tawny panther
Where's it from
bronze helm
Snake boss in temple
wide juniper
Yeah
tawny panther
Can replace my spore with it if it drops
wide juniper
Got some decent loot last night, finally.
Still no howler or rezans
Got the mount from underrot
Ugly bastard
grim prism
I do know that changing your input queue to match the ping wont have any intrinsic effect on it though, fwiw @uneven mason
You can set your spell queue to 10 seconds, itll still cast instantly if you dont have a GCD running
grim prism
I heard it talked about a lot last expac
uneven mason
I snorted some meth and my brain was like "WAAAIT...that isn't it"
grim prism
One of those bits of meme advice that catches on for some inexplicable reason
uneven mason
yeah for some reason I was thinking because you COULD game that setting to be casting at near full speed on 2 targets during TBC
and the first part of WOTLK..
not that I ever did that...
on my elemental shaman
grim prism
😉
uneven mason
so the "casting at last target" had me thinking of the spell queuing
but that doesn't work with instant spells
sharp lotus
testing by quickly targeting a friendly npc then casting, the macro works consistently while pressing the spell its self sometimes gives "invalid target"
uneven mason
well if you're getting invalid target
sharp lotus
same target was used in all casts
uneven mason
that means it still has the friendly in queue
next goblet
so how many ilvl is deafening crash worth?
uneven mason
a lot
ember arrow
25
next goblet
dammit
uneven mason
to surpass the "average" DR provided by the extended DS its closer to 40 ilvls
but that doesn't take intoaccount the raw HP increase to EHP provided by stam
next goblet
so i could dump my 310 shoulders for 340 and give up DC?
instead i'd have iron fortress
2 iron fortress
uneven mason
for fights where the 40~ seconds of DS uptime falls completely into a high damage window (don't think Uldir has anything like that) it makes a 340 DC item > 385 Uldir drop
hmm
grim prism
I would keep the DC over 30 ilvl
uneven mason
the DS uptime is REALLY strong in dungeons
uneven mason
I'd keep DC
next goblet
until i get 340+ shoulders with DC
uneven mason
On avg though, you'll be better off taking IF or BFI 370 item over a 340 DC in the end
gentle rain
What's DC?
uneven mason
more reliable regular survivability
grim prism
Deafening Crash trair
frosty wedge
yeah same - or go farm heroics for dc gear
gentle rain
Thats the demo shout +2 for every TC
next goblet
really IF and BFI can be better than DC?
frosty wedge
with 30 ilvls difference it may be worth taking for overall survivability
but CD is probably still better even then
DC*
next goblet
thats one that i'd have to play with
uneven mason
Having a higher ilvl peice will come out to be better for smoother damage
but DC will be very good for dealing with extended spikes (like situations with stacking dots)
DC will also continue to lead in nearly all situations provided in M+
next goblet
gotcha
gentle rain
Does DC stack with other DC?
uneven mason
Damage does, not the extention for DS
gentle rain
eh
grim prism
Honestly its going to come down to whether or not the burst reduction of DC outperforms flat reduction. DC is going to win out pretty much always in M+
Raids are potentially another story since mechanics are generally spaced out fairly well
And you wouldnt get as much of the benefit
next goblet
i feel like im gonna have 3-4 sets of azerite gear in my bags at all times
a set for tanking dungeons, a set for tanking raids, a set for raiding as dps, and a set for dungeon dps
grim prism
Nah
Just make sure you always have a DC in the bags
Because thats going to be your best option in the majority of content
old zephyr
We'll have to run mm+ for DC right ?
final mist
DC is still really good for raids, not just M+.
grim prism
Including raids (depending on how many ilvl worth of upgrade we are talkimg)
final mist
Also azerite gear doesn't drop in M+.
next goblet
it drops in the weekly chest tho doesnt it?
final mist
Better hope you get a nice titanforge from your weekly cache, boys
grim prism
Yeah it is still your most powerful trait in raids, it just gets even stronger in M+
old zephyr
Oh so Since there is no DC in uldir we are slave to rngsus
final mist
Basically, yes
ember arrow
@final mist wait so azerite armor doesnt drop from m+?
Why are there tables with azerite ilvl
cloud bone
which is dumb
we gotta wait for the weekly reset to be disappointed that we didn't get what we wanted
ember arrow
So that halves the potential loot basically
U get from m+
Since many drops are azerite no
fierce halo
Weekly chest can contain up to 3 pieces of Azerite gear
final mist
You're not guaranteed anything more than one though, which is shitty.
So I could go three weeks of getting one piece of loot from the weekly cache, and someone else gets three pieces three weeks in a row.
Great system tbh.
final mist
Great system tbh.
grim prism
SPIN TO WIN BAYBEE
fierce halo
I would like the chance to increase by amount of Dungeons done. Like if you do 25 10s you will get 3 Azerite items or something
grim prism
grim prism
Why do 25 10s when you can just do one 20 :^)
final mist
Gotta farm AP obv
fierce halo
I meant 10+, so it is something you can't get carried to since it takes a lot of Dungeons and not just one
grim prism
So beforehand i thought disallowing gear swaps was a stupid decision
But I will say
Considering how much variety there is in azerite options for some specs, i get it
grim prism
Yeah and azerite gives us some leggo-tier powers
Like 30+ sec of demo uptime straight
astral crystal
Which one exactly gives you leggo tier powers?
grim prism
next goblet
i mean the little "prydaz" mock is nice
astral crystal
But I wouldn’t call that legendary tier
next goblet
if you manage to get 3 stacks of it..
astral crystal
Psa im butthurt because our azerite traits are kinda meh compared to others
grim prism
You'd be able to pick the best gear for every individual boss though
They dont want to have to balance around that
And i dont really blame them considering how well they balance
Not just you but also the DPS you bring
bronze helm
Reading some of the convos there are way too many of the same accronym meaning different things
uneven mason
wat?
frosty wedge
like what?
grim prism
Mixing up DS/DC is fine since they are basically the same shit for prot kappa
ember arrow
Disconnect???
frosty wedge
DC = Deafening Crash
frosty wedge
AND offensive
ember arrow
amber siren
amber siren
rage against the meme
grim prism
Im gonna spend all of casual friday exporting my nitro emojis and posting them as embedded images
ember arrow
You are the hero we need
frozen nova
Hey folks about to start up with my alt prot warr how is it looking in BFA so far?
ember arrow
@frozen nova 
frosty wedge
@frozen nova Strong as long as you know what you're doing
grim prism
@frozen nova we like it
ember arrow
Ping
grim prism
Crazy DPS, good mobility, very strong mitigation
You just need to be able to use that full toolkit because we dont have the ability to facetank on 100% uptime
frosty wedge
yeah i was topping out pretty much every trash pull all night last night, feels good, lol
grim prism
Pinned guide has the basics and we can help with the rest
frozen nova
Cool thanks guys
frosty wedge
I really want a belt to drop so I can not waste my hydrocores on a belt instead of legs to replace this 330 that will not go away
ancient horizon
Hello all
frosty wedge
oh for sure, but I have more than enough mats to make either 355 belt, or legs
grim prism
Whats good Ava
ancient horizon
Not much just relearn my class
grim prism
Hows it been working out for you so far
ancient horizon
Good the thing is i do not have bolister as one of my talents it seem weak
grim prism
Oh but its very strong
ancient horizon
Really
frosty wedge
yep.... 100% block for the entirety of lasts tand
grim prism
We dont have the ability to keep block up all the time, and block is our primary source of mitigation
frosty wedge
meaning you can have 100% block plus spend your rage on IUPs for incoming dmg
ancient horizon
Ok i switch it today and see how it works
grim prism
The talent guide in the pins synergizes very well with itself, its pretty much the only truly viable build we have this tier
Be sure to have anger management as well
That way you can cast demo shout every pull
frozen nova
Is heavy repercussions just not good then loved that talent in legion
frosty wedge
AM is just better
raven kernel
some people take bounding stride on 2nd row but thats the only real thing u can change
grim prism
HR isnt bad, just not as good
frozen nova
what about devastator over booming voice?
raven kernel
in raid you may take Punish on some bosses
grim prism
Nope
ancient horizon
I am using safe guard oj talent 30
ancient horizon
Ok
grim prism
Safeguard on 30 is totally fine too. You will probably get more use out of boundinf stride in casual groups, but safeguard is by no means bad
ancient horizon
He 114 right now
grim prism
Id take stride for leveling anyway since you wont really have much to safeguard in world content or normal dungeons
ancient horizon
I use the talents you subject when i get on raidiing and mythic plus
Ok i can chnage them today
frosty wedge
oh mna, when I was levelling I had the legendary that gives leap 2 extra charges
I miss that so much.
grim prism
F
ancient horizon
Yeah i am enjoying the lego but i imagine it will change soon and i get killed really quick
grim prism
Yeah pretty much
frosty wedge
as soon as you ding 116
grim prism
117 and 118 felt pretty gross
grim prism
Ironically you may have better scaling if you ARE naked
Thanks blizz
(I accept no responsibility for the results if you try that)
ancient horizon
I going to have go get to use to pulling small mobs and crowd control
uneven mason
Take rings and necklace off - you'll truck mobs when you freshly hit 120
in world content
don't do that in dungeons
erm rather
put them in the bank
can't be in bags
grim prism
Between bolster and demo shout you can make some really absurd pulls. Precast avatar before you pull so you dont have to waste the global on an "empty" cast and you should be able to nuke shit before you die
uneven mason
because mobs scale with ilvl
ancient horizon
Oh ok
grim prism
At the very least, youll start to have victory rush procs rolling in before the mobs kill you
And once that happens you are usually in the clear
Itll take some trial and error
ancient horizon
Oh ok
So i pop avatar first when i have aggro then go to town on them
Ok
I try to save last stand and the oh shit button
grim prism
Yeah, thats not really the niche for it anymore with bolster
It is just as rotational as shield block now
More or less
final mist
You shouldn't save CDs.
We don't have, "Oh shit!" buttons.
Especially not with how low every CD is thanks to AM.
grim prism
Yeah, the playstyle with anger management is to use the CDs rotationally. Sitting on them to "save them" only ensures you will fall behind. It is self-defeating
final mist
Get in the habit of using LS rotationally and using SW for times when you know you're going to take a lot of damage without it, and you'll never be in that situation to begin with.
wide juniper
Sit on them for mechanics, if needed, not oh shit buttons.
final mist
The only time you "save" CDs is when you need them for specific boss abilities, and even then that's not saving them, that's delaying them.
grim prism
Thats just planning. Lol
final mist
Ex. If you know you're going to need LS in a minute and a half, use it now, it'll be up when you need it again.
grim prism
Being smaht
final mist
No reason to not use it now when it's going to be up again when you need it for real.
Part of being a tank is playing smart and reducing as much damage as possible - your healers (and your healers' mana) will thank you.
We aren't reactive tanks like the others, so get in the habit of using your CDs as a Warrior. It's important.
grim prism
It takes a little getting used to coming from previous expansions
wide juniper
No shield block charge and you need mitigation? Last stand or Shield wall will work
grim prism
Its a lot of fun once you get the hang of it
grim prism
Also get used to casting demo shout as often as you reasonably can. Open pulls with demo so the mobs start off debuffed and you have rage in the tank from the beginning
ancient horizon
The only thing i do not like for sw is the 6 minute cool down
grim prism
SW should be 4 min and its closer to 2.5m with AM
ancient horizon
It seem useless and i do not know when to pop it
wide juniper
SW is far from useless my dudey
grim prism
SW is the only cooldown you have that is close to an "oh shit button"
Everything else is rotational
wide juniper
Your CDs should be pretty minimal if you're not maxing your rage
I cannot type for shit today...
frosty wedge
yeah, if the situation calls for it I'm never worried about blowing a cooldown like you used to have to - use it if you need it, use them in rotation, etc
gone are the days of waiting 25 minutes for another boss attempt so all the tanks have SW back up, lol
ancient horizon
Ok thank you all for the advice
wide juniper
Only thing I would say is to know when SB/IP are sufficient so you're not burning SW/LS on mechanics you don't need to.
frosty wedge
true - having a WA up for them has helped a lot
wide juniper
Also, kiting is your buddy sometimes. Never underestimate kiting.
grim prism
Also consider that demo shout and SW reduce unblockable damage and dots where block/LS do not
uneven mason
LS and SW are excuses to pull extra packs
uneven mason
They should be used frequently, especially once you're above the 310-315 gear hump in M0s
ancient horizon
I am using wa for all my toon i have
uneven mason
to just speed things up hehe
wide juniper
Good deal
ancient horizon
I do love the warrior wa
uneven mason
Back to doom and gloom Favon?
crystal night
I feel like I take more damage with last stand up / Bolster talent opposed to when I have shield block up
uneven mason
because the healer as a relative value of health is healing you for less, same amount of water in a bigger bucket
crystal night
With shield block up my HP doesn't move
OHHHHJ
I see
Ty that makes complete sense
uneven mason
Also, we tend to get ballsy with LS up and don't press IP as oftne (at least I do)
ancient horizon
I try to spamm shield block as much as possible when it procks
crystal night
When avatar is up I find it hard to weave anything but revenge in between my T-clap haha just cuz i get greedy on damage
uneven mason
blocks are blocks
wide juniper
That may also be on thing you're noticing, @crystal night
uneven mason
blocks can crit independent of the source.
wide juniper
I'm almost certain they don't crit on LS
grim prism
LS has the same crit rate as block. Both increase your block chance by 100%
uneven mason
I'm almost certain I'm perfectly positive that you're wrong 😉
grim prism
Unless im sorely mistaken
uneven mason
We have no way to force critical blocks
grim prism
Which i dont think i am
uneven mason
its based on your mastery, any time you block it can crit, SB or Bolster or passive, the source does not matter.
wide juniper
I know we can't FORCE a crit block, but SB CAN crit, while I don't see anything saying LS does
I'll have to check some logs again.
uneven mason
Because critical block is an effect of our mastery not any talent or ability.
ALL blocks can crit.
crystal night
I always thought critical block was always have the chance to happen as your regular blocks
wide juniper
It does, yes.
frosty wedge
and any block chance above 100% is added to the chance to crit block isn't it?
wide juniper
I'll have to check for sure, with LS.
frosty wedge
ah
ember arrow
crit block = mastery %
wide juniper
But yeah, could be wrong.
frosty wedge
fair
uneven mason
Infact that was the reason why block was removed from the primary defense table back in mid cata
because warriors were stacking so much mastery that we had like 100% block, 75% Critical block
wide juniper
Those were the days
uneven mason
rather 100% "Unhittable" 75% crit block
wide juniper
face tank all the things
uneven mason
because it was a combination of dodge/parry/miss/block
and anything that rolled over was critical block
uneven mason
While paladins were still wearing their tanking diapers trying to become uncrushable, warriors were in the 102.5% unhittable club
willow dirge
take me back
junior ivy
how do i get cha,mpion equiopment?
junior ivy
yes 😦 sadly
dusk locust
it looks like professions make it but it doesn't seem worth it, unless i'm missing something
amber siren
it's mostly just the chance of mats
amber siren
probably
fierce halo
30, but what's 30 expulsum in the long run? It's worthwhile, but definitely not mandatory
dusk locust
i guess if you get enough ore, say, to make up for 30 before replacing that equipment
though i suppose i'm not really using it for anything else atm
sour osprey
What's the easiest way to level up smithing ?
sour osprey
no fast way then ? 😛
next goblet
oof, when you're up against 3 dps that outgear you.. tanking is rough
im talking
really outgear you
next goblet
absolutely
with avatar up
but i didnt have crackling thunder up.. which would explain why the mobs a little further didnt wanna stay on me lol
grim prism
Are you losing AoE or individual targets
next goblet
just individual targets, fail tab target on my part honestly
grim prism
Sometimes its DPS tunneling offtargets in lieu of raw volume
next goblet
first time doing motherlode
next goblet
i use bounding usually, i just like my extra mobility
grim prism
Not unless you want to pull the whole damn dungeon lol
next goblet
so prob a combo of inexperience in said dungeon and dps tunnelers
ill take it tho.. i got a big red button lol
grim prism
Crackle is nice on paper but it really falls off in comparison to the other two when you consider that most shit you pull is going to walk to within 8yds of you anyway
burnt iron
What are traits worth keeping for prot? i mainspec arms but i have so much unused azerite gear and don't know if i should just get rid of it all or not
burnt iron
ye i checked pins but it just links to icy veins guide and honestly i prob wont ever play prot just dont want to get rid of gear just incase lol
grim prism
The icyveins guide was written by mods here and is as up to date as the most recent changes
It is totally accurate for purposes of which traits are best
burnt iron
ah alright makes more sense, every other class i've played have said that icy veins sucks
grim prism
It varies
uneven mason
@grim prism Motherload is one of the dungeons I specifically take Crackling, better I pull them with TC before the hunter gets a chance to HUUURRRRRRRRRR and kill the healer.
grim prism
Its not like IV has dedicated staff that write the stuff
It just aggregates the info
In the case of our spec and this specific tier, IV is perfectly accurate
Other classes may vary
next goblet
btw i was blessed to see an indom/devastator/ravager tank earlier
THE MEME STILL LIVES
grim prism
Did they actually live tho
uneven mason
But have you seen a NS tank yet?
next goblet
not yet
i totally want to meme a dumpster spec just to see if i can actually pull it off
uneven mason
You can
next goblet
ill go 3312333
grim prism
You already play one :^)
uneven mason
Your healer will hate you.
next goblet
lol
uneven mason
If you want a real sense of what playing the MEME Spec is like
just remove your Chest helm and shoulders
and try and tank
grim prism
BuT hOw Do YoU SeLf SuStAiN
ember arrow
the self sustain thing
people dont udnerstand that healing for % of dmg
is same as dmg reduction
chilly brook
grim prism
Literally every tank except prot will solotank mythic effortlessly without healers because of self sustain, do you live under a rock
frosty wedge
What's the emissary today?
amber siren
na horde is 340 azerite
frosty wedge
Again? :/
regal island
yeah emissary na horde have sucked lol
frosty wedge
At this point I'd rather just a regular armor cache for a shot at other slots, lol
round vortex
Thank you emissary, for a chest piece with deafening crash. 😁
They don’t exist in dungeons I’m fairly sure lol and it was My last blue 😃 pogchamp
amber siren
Grats my dude
frosty wedge
Haha nice!
so this may be a dumb question, but does DC stack? like, the additional damage and 2 second extension? I've only got a single DC piece atm
grim prism
Nope
frosty wedge
ok cool
grim prism
The damage stacks
frosty wedge
that's what I assumed
round vortex
So I have brace for impact and iron fortress on the others with an optional piece to swap to bloodsport for magic fights 😃
grim prism
But the damage is not important at all
frosty wedge
yeah it's all about the DS uptime
round vortex
Yeah effect doesn’t. You just want 1 piece then go for brace / iron for physical fights and bloodsport for magic. That’s the dream
frosty wedge
dope - just wanted to confirm I wasn't missing out by running IF on the other pieces
uneven mason
I mean, if you have 3 DC pieces are are above the "worry about death" item level
stack that shit up
make your DPS cry
Remember, killing the attacker is the best defense!
frosty wedge
haha, yeah for sure, I have a 340 chest with IF and one with BS, then a helm with BFI, shoudlers are DC
sick sentinel
Rather have x2 IF x1 DC.
Get some 2k+ per block damage that can crit, more shield slam also.
Got head and shoulders with blood sport and azerite veins I think 340+
But no DC chest
grim prism
As fun as it would be, it'd be a little excessive if TC gave you an additional six seconds of demo on less than a six second cooldown
Although with blizz, you never know
sick sentinel
I'm fine x1. x2-3 be too op. Demo would never go down.
May as well be perma in combat were it that.
rose marsh
I only have two 340 helms, with reinforced plating or bloodsport.
Which helm would you guys use? I also have either 2x DC or 1x DC and 1x brace
for chest/shoulders
oh, i have callous reprisal helm as well, which is what im currently using...
grim prism
@rose marsh only ever use one DC. Multiples are wasted
wooden radish
@timid jay Can you help with some Warrior Theorycrafting? 
grim prism
@wooden radish whats up
viral jackal
oh baby hope i get a 340 helm - got shoulders already
can only be helm/shoulders/chest right? for azerite cache?
uneven mason
right
wide juniper
Might try to stack blood sport tonight
viral jackal
i just want a 340 shield or weapon 😦
uneven mason
am I reading bloodsport correctly, does that increase the amount absorbed per hit, or just increase the volume of IP?
fierce juniper
It's still 50%. Just increases your absorb size.
regal island
another week, still no 340 shield.
fierce juniper
So it's just like a Vers gain or what have you
regal island
Might be time to buy the boe boys...
uneven mason
Ok, remain fully uninterested in it hah
regal island
It does scale with Never Surrender so it's not horribad
sick sentinel
I have a collection of 340 armors I'm continuing to hold onto. Mix and match as I go for prot and arms.
grim prism
NS
regal island
eh NS is about the only thing i can see being helpful if i'm getting trucked by a boss
sick sentinel
Get plenty of gain from str, mastery, vers. Fat IPs as your ilvl goes up.
regal island
more CD's via bolster are nice but if boss is legit 80% of the time wrecking me NS will help more than anything else
stark sage
grim prism
But NS doesnt increase the amount of damage you are mitigating at any arbitrary time
regal island
Really? i figured NS would be the best choice when you undergear content.
grim prism
It just increases the cap on IP
fierce juniper
I mean, if you're gonna argue for not running bolster, Indom provides more average EHP depending on the situation
grim prism
It is still just a 50% reduction
grim prism
Right, it increases the total volume of the absorb
But it is still just a 50% reduction
fierce juniper
You said it doesn't increase the amount of damage you're mitigating.
That's false
you literally have more absorb
grim prism
Or is that incorret
stark sage
which makes you a bit more rage efficient and a bit more GCD effecient
uneven mason
But each hit still caps at 50% absorb yes?
ember arrow
@digital arrow how come?
stark sage
yes its still 50% asborb
ember arrow
i enjoy all dungeons so far
grim prism
Youre misunderstanding Marok
regal island
Yeah basically just makes the IP bubble wrap last a little longer when you're getting beat on.
grim prism
My bad for hazy wording
fierce juniper
It's still more overall mitigation
ember arrow
if you only need surv, then the amont of healing taken is irrelevant
then indom is better
uneven mason
Its more mitigation per rage, but not necessarily an actual reduction in damage.
ember arrow
but its not a comfortable position to be in
stark sage
it will make you tankier over having no talent chosen
grim prism
Right I just meant that in any infinitesimal section of time you are still just absorbing 50% of damage, so it wont intrinsically make you feel more resilient
The total volume is larger
But you still only absorb 50%
gentle rain
Why is IP on God! makes the spec feel clunky
fierce juniper
Right, I see what you're saying
I don't think that's a very useful way of looking at it though.
digital arrow
@ember arrow the trash before second to last boss is tough on me.. 2 groups of about 7 mages and i'm having issues trying to interrupt em on time
i think all of them cast
regal island
It's basically a stagger with a 50% max
uneven mason
That's like saying wrapping yourself in a see through plastic sheet makes you not naked @stark sage
gentle rain
Gcds
regal island
just flat asorbed though
digital arrow
perhaps i'll watch another guide video, can u guys recommend me any tank vids of storm mythic?
stark sage
if you are in a situation where you are depleting the bubble, NS will have some perceivable value
uneven mason
Helbrute that isn't how IP or Stagger works 😄
stark sage
its not good though
uneven mason
That is true
ember arrow
@digital arrow you can try LOSing mages, or outrange them, that usually works
otherwise bring groups with permaslow/aoe cc
ember arrow
i think wowhead has good dungeojn guides
digital arrow
it's a longass bridge
ember arrow
at least so far ive seen
grim prism
Is it the casters with the shadow debuff @digital arrow?
uneven mason
Stormes is the dungeon that you yell at your warlocks until they get their interrupting pets out
uneven mason
Make youre Group stay below the hump
digital arrow
ooooo
grim prism
You have to interrupt detect thoughts
uneven mason
and LOS them back one pack at a time
grim prism
Thats the dodge buff
uneven mason
Like aggro and leap the fuck way back so they chase you