if you want to tank
#protection
stark sage
toxic wadi
more like "if you want instant group invites" lol
vagrant cape
That's a very open-ended question.
grim prism
Yes to both?
vagrant cape
And rerolling into an offspec doesn't really make sense. You can totally do both
They both need a lot of haste
toxic wadi
right
vagrant cape
Just keep some extra azerite pieces and a good two hander
grim prism
The real question is why you picked arms over fury in the first place kappa
toxic wadi
well
merry cave
Arms is better in every way 🤷
toxic wadi
I like the class fantasy of arms more, the feel, not having to look for 2 weapons, how holding a 2hander in each hand is odd
grim prism
But yes by all means start tanking, if nothing else it will make gearing in M+ way the hell easier
neat harbor
Ok so
grim prism
Bonus: leave your loot spec as DPS
neat harbor
the real question
toxic wadi
Fury strikes me as a very edgy spec, and as policy I don't play edgy classes, such as DKs, DHs, warlocks, and rogues
neat harbor
how are you boyos feeling about myth +
toxic wadi
oh why leave it as dps?
grim prism
Fury is precisely twice as edgy as arms so i guess you got me there
neat harbor
I would be lying if I said I wasnt slightly nervous about tanking as prot in myth+ atm
grim prism
I just mean if you plan to main DPS. You can pug M+ keys like nobodys business as a tank and still get mainspec loot
toxic wadi
like I was in discord tanking and when I was talking to my guildmates my voice was shaking and cracking
sounded like a little girl
grim prism
Catfriend is a little girl and she plays prot
I feel fine about prot going into M+ honestly
neat harbor
yeah its a serious question tbh
grim prism
I dont anticipate any disproportionate difficulty
neat harbor
wondering if theres some stuff prot warriors just wont be able to survive.
grim prism
I think our weaknesses are overstated
toxic wadi
maybe magic damage?
neat harbor
right, magic stuff
and unmitigatible dots.
basically all the shit the trash does in kings rest
has me a bit nervous
grim prism
A subpar brewmaster will still die in M+
neat harbor
sure
then again noone who is subpar will be pushing keys
in any group more or less
grim prism
And frankly i dont get the magic damage argument sincr we have buckets and buckets of cooldowns
neat harbor
long story short, Im in two guilds, in one of them they basically all berated me for planning to play prot in myth +
grim prism
I mean if your goal is to push the highest key you possibly can, then play brew
neat harbor
part of me wants to prove them wrong in a serious way
the other part of me fears theyre right lol
grim prism
If your goal is to just get your weekly chest and have fun doing it, then play whichever you prefer
neat harbor
"you take tons more damage and are a liability to your group" was their core argument
grim prism
You dont take more damage though
neat harbor
to which my response was "fuck blizzard Im gonna do it anyway, and all this is yet to be seen"
grim prism
You shouldnt anywau
neat harbor
I just feel like prot needs a buff man
grim prism
In what regard
neat harbor
the damage you take to spells is so much higher than brew, which I also play rn
stagger is incredible and warriors do nothing to mitigate DoT damage
aside from demo shout and TC spam
we need 90% ignore pain back.
or something
wheat bronze
RIP Legion Spell Reflection
neat harbor
any fucking thing to survive dots easier
grim prism
It sounds like you are answerinf your own quesrtion here guy
Clearly you are having more success with brew
grim prism
I mean this isnt really encouragement but if you really find yourself getting trucked as prot in m0 then you are probably doing something wrong
The positive side of that is, there is room to improve
neat harbor
I wouldnt say I get trucked, in fact demo + Tclap spam to add to the buff duration is very good mitigation I would say
next goblet
just gota always have a DC trait
neat harbor
its just that without any sustain apart from last stand, in moments when you get heavily dotted, or when there is unmitigatible (block, avoidance) damage going out, I do at times get nervous about the incoming damage
next goblet
IP spam it?
neat harbor
that too
next goblet
lol
neat harbor
still
next goblet
cant really SPAM it i guess
neat harbor
having rage for IP spam is not easy like it used to be.
when it was 90%, it was a cinch
grim prism
Shield wall reduces dot damage. Demo shout reduces dot damage if im not mistaken, havent checked the interaction. IP absorbs 50% of DoTs
next goblet
yeet
neat harbor
cause you would keep yourself up with ease
grim prism
Brewmaster is objectively stronger than prot in M+ right now
neat harbor
demo does reduce dot damage
next goblet
honestly we'd be so much better off with IP off the GCD
grim prism
Cant really convince you otherwisw
neat harbor
hear hear about the GCD
jovial reef
GCD? Free pitchforks!
next goblet
every other classes mitigation is off the GCD, only SB is for us
clever bolt
Cant decide if i want to lvl a warrior or a dk to tank m+ with. Prefer the style of tanking of warrior but unsure how they will perform. What do you guys say?
jovial reef
dk
neat harbor
Brew 😄
next goblet
@clever bolt you can do m+ as a warrior but you'll be 1000000000000x better off as a DK
neat harbor
lul
grim prism
It was brokenly OP in legion and mindless to play because you spammed IP on top of globals
jovial reef
grip will literally always be super useful
neat harbor
RIght, so it was a bandaid.
next goblet
they need to rework some of this active mitigation then
neat harbor
but you dont just rip a bandaid off like that
you gotta peel it slowly
give us like, some sustain to make up for it or something
a leech on a cooldown even
not DK strong but effective
grim prism
@clever bolt if you like it play it. Pinned guide has the basics and we can help answwe questions about the rest
clever bolt
Might say that my goal would be to tank what would be equal to roughly m+22 in legion
grim prism
We really dont need leech though, we already bricktank harder than any spec in the game
grim prism
And when the mitigation lapses, we have DH levels of mobility
Not to mention highest DPS of any tank
next goblet
i wonder if later xpac will devastator actually be better than BV?
grim prism
If they gave us selfheals on top of that we would be too strong
@next goblet why would it
next goblet
if they reworked it
rancid bloom
Hi, been simming my gear in raidbots, and just got an error while trying to sim my prot gear, any of you know how to fix it?
"Invalid SimC Input:
Player Turbolaila's role (tank) or spec(Protection Warrior) is currently not supported.
Error: No active players in sim!"
grim prism
Well yeah
next goblet
anything can happen
next goblet
that extra global just feels goofy to me though.. still
grim prism
@rancid bloom warrior module for simc is out of date and the prot section is broken
We have no working sims whatsoever
rancid bloom
Oh, it worked earlier, so thought I did something wrong. Thanks for the info. 😃
grim prism
For defensive gearing just prioritize ilvl
next goblet
@grim prism didnt devastator sim for higher dps than BV though at one point in the beta? i mean obviously it was beta but still
grim prism
There is a stat prio in the pinned guides
@next goblet i completely ignore PTR shit so I cant answer that lol
next goblet
oohh ok lol
grim prism
If it aint live it aint relevant to me
next goblet
fair enough
grim prism
I overthink shit enough as it is
Anyway @rancid bloom i dont have a timeframe for you, but we are looking into it
next goblet
also.. when would punish outperform ITF?
toxic wadi
Does Asmongold tank?
rancid bloom
Fuck, im afraid I might have fucked myself then for arms
grim prism
It is opensource, too
toxic wadi
or does Bajheera tank?
next goblet
asmongold tanks occasionally
grim prism
Sorry if that was unclear
rancid bloom
Nono, I probably misunderstood
stoic talon
has anyone else ran like 50 dungeons and not seen a single shield drop
sick sentinel
is there prot warrior changes on ptr? trying to follow the conversation haha
stoic talon
or WQ for that matter
plain ice
super fucking glad that i bought the BoE shield after week 1
sick sentinel
same, wish I bought the 355 with socket now lol
stoic talon
should drop next tues im hpoing
sick sentinel
haha and in the morning 350ilvl one on my server was 160k, now it was 400k LUL
stoic talon
300-500k on my server
sick sentinel
anyone know where they post ptr patch notes?
weapons and shields are pain in the ass to drop, I feel like when last boss drops for example: weapon and azurite armor, its like 95% on armor 5% weapon slot
vagrant cape
I wanna learn how to make an api so I can Sim for prot dps
toxic wadi
does anyone use KUI nameplates?
vagrant cape
I do
plain ice
you don't need API calls for simc @vagrant cape
toxic wadi
How do I fade out all mobs that I'm not in combat with?
vagrant cape
I'm not sure. It's really annoying in tol dagor higher levels. I'll look into it when I get on my computer
toxic wadi
ty
grim prism
@sick sentinel MMO-Champion
Changes are datamined relevant blueposts are usually linked
opaque pagoda
I don’t know why people keep harping on IP being “mindless” in Legion
IP is just as mindless now
It was clearly more fun in Legion, you built rage and then had something obvious to spend it on, rather than this bullshit dance where you try to choose between building rage and spending it
If there was too much absorption in Legion, then that’s just a numbers tweak
fresh dragon
yo the "A piece of gear with a higher item level than what you currently have should be equipped regardless of its secondary stats."
is still valid?
im prefering haste->vers/mast items :V
glossy bramble
what are yall doing for jewelery
i have a 335 crit/vers ring, 335 ver/mast, and 325 haste/crit
fresh dragon
335 vers/mast for sure
glossy bramble
crit/vers kinda sucks but im wondering if its worth the ilvl to use it over the 325 haste ring
yeah vers/mast is a no brainer
fresh dragon
what ur ilvl?
glossy bramble
330
fresh dragon
im dubting about this part in the guide "A piece of gear with a higher item level than what you currently have should be equipped regardless of its secondary stats."
fresh dragon
well. haste is important
glossy bramble
quantity of stats and str/stam/armor will almost certainly outweigh secondary balance unless its like a 5 ilvl upgrade
chrome falcon
wear the 355
glossy bramble
haste/mast what
empty locust
Is there any plans to make changes to prot warr in the next patch?
chrome falcon
unless we're talking jewellry
glossy bramble
ilvl for armor isnt quite the same as ilvl for jewelry because the only thing you lose by downgrading ring ilvl is some stam
but str and armor are very good and mean you usually always want ilvl on armor pieces
final mist
Haste is never so important that you don't equip an item that is 10+ ilevels, unless it's jewelry / trinkets.
Same as in Legion.
glossy bramble
i probably would too mattacate
grim prism
@opaque pagoda because you just mashed it on top of what you were doing regardless of where you were in the rotation. It was quite literally mindless. Now you have to choose between building or spending, like you said, therefore it is no longer mindless. Pretty much every spec in the game has to choose between building or spending in a GCD-locked fashion. It's not bullshit dancing, it's how Blizzard builds classes lol
final mist
~5 ilevels is okay to swap around.
~15 for necks / rings.
Trinkets are a different matter entirely.
grim prism
@empty locust Blizz doesnt even talk to us about prot shit on Live. We have no idea
grim prism
That is a bad idea. Lol
glossy bramble
you should use the 355
empty locust
Cheers Bal, was wondering if there had been any posts suggesting any changes but I have not been able to find any
glossy bramble
str is a GOOD stat right
grim prism
Dawg
grim prism
Lmao
chrome falcon
feel free to send me any 355 gear you aren't using
fresh dragon
:
final mist
@fresh dragon Haste is never so important that you don't equip ilevel upgrades.
fresh dragon
:V
final mist
See what I wrote before.
glossy bramble
especially with into the fray
isnt that the choice talent rn?
you almost always get 5 stacks
final mist
ItF is pretty much the only talent in that tier, yes.
Punish maybe, but ItF generally.
grim prism
If it is advised that you should take ilvl over everything even if it means dropping haste for 5 ilvl, and it is assumed that the officers here more or less know what they are talking about, why would the immediate assumption be that 15 ilvl is okay
final mist
H A S T E
fresh dragon
@final mist even if im already high in ilvl??
grim prism
Especially when you just told someone not to use a 10 ilvl downgrade with haste on it for a ring
glossy bramble
your average ilvl doesnt mean anything
final mist
Yes? Why would that matter?
glossy bramble
its just the average of what you have equipped
theres no character ilvl breakpoint lmao
so would yall recommend using a 325 haste/crit over a 335 crit/vers?
ring
grim prism
You just contradicted your own advice in the past 5 minutes
Also being 340 isnt going to mean shit when M+ opens next week
glossy bramble
yeah haste is the best stat but its not THAT best
chrome falcon
i remember in Antorus i had like 35% crit and 16% haste because i got a ton of titanforges on crit gear and i was still super tanky even with low haste
chrome falcon
i'm sure we'd all like to wear gear that was pure haste but that's just not reality
grim prism
Even within the framework of your argument, if we are already talking about having too much rage gen at 340, how is adding more haste instead of armor going to help you mitigate more?
And if its about DPS, then why are you ditching 15 ilvl of strength
fresh dragon
guys whats ur hast rating??'
final mist
It has no bearing on yours.
chrome falcon
takkero if you refuse to wear your 355 pieces because they don't have haste
i am going to weep
please just wear the 355 piece, for my sanity
grim prism
If you refuse to wear 355 pieces because they dont have haste then please dont give anybody any more advice in this channel until next expansion
chrome falcon
you will do more damage and take less damage if you wear higher ilvl gear, with the exception of jewels and trinkets
glossy bramble
yeah you're dramatically over emphasizing how good haste is just because you read it was the best stat
haste is like
less than 50% more valuable than crit
and the str/stam/armor you get from a 5 ilvl upgrade outweighs the secondaries entirely
grim prism
Haste is only marginally the best SECONDARY stat
glossy bramble
yeah ^
i think we should get benefits from other primaries and just have them be very small
i want a 450 ilvl int robe to make me so smart that im a better tank
i just outdebate all the enemies
broken kite
Guys should I use this 350 with no haste or these 120 legs from WoD with haste????
grim prism
Depends, does the 350 have leech on it? We are very weak on self-sustain
fresh dragon
:V
sick sentinel
? ?
grim prism
i'd still take a 355 str stick over most any 340 tank trinket tbh
weary python
I don't remember what I'm using right now exactly. I think I'm using it on my arms spec but not tank
strong zodiac
Haste Mastery ring WQ up rn in Stormsong for Horde. Just giving a heads up.
novel steeple
How are warriors looking for raid tanks this xpac? Just coming back to playing again
grim prism
pretty good
lots of mobility, very very tanky when used properly, fun to play as well
it'll take you a minute to get used to IP being on the global, but it's not bad once you get used to it
dark junco
But no sustain
grim prism
raid tanks dont need self-sustain
weary python
So my prot trinkets are a 345 rezans and a 340 animated blood.
dark junco
So prob benched for progression
weary python
You think a 355 big red button should replace one?
final mist
@dark junco What's your basis on that?
final mist
I'd really like to see where your logic is coming from, because you sound like you have zero clue about what you're answering.
grim prism
i'd lose the vial for the button Zot
final mist
For a WF race, maybe, sure. Anyone asking is not in a WF race. and thus Warrior is a viable choice.
grim prism
the button gives you 1/4 of the strength bonus of the vial on 100% uptimer
thats not even considering the decay effect
dark junco
Alright, so in the next four weeks, there wont be that many warrior for mythic, after that yes there will
grim prism
🤦
final mist
There weren't many warriors for Mythic even in Legion, because not many people play the class as a tank.
broken kite
Lowest representation I think
dark junco
Cause other tanks are better in a competitive environement
final mist
And you completely ignored my point in that someone asking isn't a WF raider, thus the answer is always, "Warrior is a good raid tank", because we are.
You have zero indication that that is the case.
dark junco
We have no clue if they’re running mythics or not
novel steeple
I never said a thing about competitive environment. Just how were warriors stackign up in raids for this xpac so far.
weary python
@grim prism the o ly reason I'm hesitant is because of using the actual trinket and targeting it
I hate how you have to target the ground w/ it.
dark junco
In a vacuum, warrior is harder and less forgiving than other class, but if you’re good at it you can pull it off.
That better now?
final mist
@novel steeple We're 100% fine as a raid tank, and actually handle bosses well. We lack utility, of course (DK's grips in particular are looking good on certain bosses), but we are by no means "benched for progression".
Anyone telling you that is flat out wrong.
novel steeple
I've played a warrior before for fury and prot. Prot for normal/heroic and fury for mythic. I just haven't kept up with recent changes so was asking here
@final mist thanks much. Just need to be able to tank for friends and such. casual raiders and all that
grim prism
i more or less summed them up, but marok's guide in the pins is very imformative
dark junco
Then yes, you’ll be alright if its casual normal or heroic
hot locust
You'll be just fine even in mythic.
dark junco
^ don’t know yet.
final mist
🤦
hot locust
If it was going to be a problem I would have swapped to another tank.
grim prism
yaknow kral for someone who was so unjustifiably upset at moderators for not fixing an open-source simming program that you have access to, you sure dont seem very invested in the spec
sick sentinel
lol this discussion again
dark junco
Cause I’m the only freaking one trying to do some shit about it and i’m salty
grim prism
discussion is being generous
novel steeple
thanks everybody for the info. it helps greatly. Kral, if you are so anti warrior tank then go somehwere else. This has always been a place of helpfulness and community in my experience and people like you just bring it down
final mist
Just because you haven't seen us doing something about it doesn't mean we aren't doing something about it.
grim prism
youre being misleading
final mist
You're being ignorantly honest.
dark junco
Broken since 2016
sick sentinel
'do some shit about it' huh?
final mist
SimC was working for quite a while in Legion.
grim prism
O P E N S O U R C E
dark junco
Yeah and pinged to set up a gofundme to be able to get a coder to fix it, no influencer seems interrested to get one going
broken kite
Wat
vagrant cape
I'm all for opinions about the shortcomings of warriors as long as it's more of a discussion than "they're bad"
final mist
I do not know how to write SimC's code, and neither does Marok, nor does Cosmo. I am learning it slowly, but it takes time. The backend of Prot's SimC is what is broken, not the APL (all three of us can write APLs just fine). We are thus waiting for more experienced writers of other classes to lend us a hand, which is taking time.
That doesn't mean we aren't doing anything about it.
dark junco
Can you pin that please
final mist
If you care that much, learn the code and do it yourself, lend a hand, and stop bitching about it while you spread misinformation.
🙅
vagrant cape
What's broken on the backend? I really wanna take a crack at it
dark junco
Thats usuful to hear
final mist
Everything is broken, because nothing in the code was changed from Legion.
grim prism
theyve already told us they are working on it. they have given concrete action items that are being worked on. there are already people working on it. they told you this last time
final mist
I'm also sure I've been quite open about it.
In this channel, even.
Multiple times.
grim prism
@vagrant cape it's C++ and it's on github
dark junco
Yeah but if its not pinned can’t track done 500 messages a day
grim prism
thger's a blocktext if you scroll up a day or two that has some concrete action items in it
final mist
It's not quite C++, from what I gather it's version is unique to SimC.
dark junco
Yeah, cause I asked to get one to try to find a coder
final mist
Wait, someone told you this before, Kral, and you're still acting as if it's not being worked on?
grim prism
literally nobody said that
dark junco
And asked for a list
final mist
It won't get fixed until the other writers are done with their classes.
THat's not "It's not getting fixed, get fucked nerds"
That's, "It'll get fixed eventually, please be patient".
vagrant cape
So I don't have much coding experience but I'd love to learn more about it for the sake of simc. So is the problem more that someone needs to put in all the abilities, traits, talents, etc, or does someone need to put in the proper if/then statements to make the rotation "perfect"?
grim prism
abilities arent properly implemented and are outdated for prot
final mist
The if/then statements are the APL - that's the front-end, what you see when you load stuff into SimC (the actual program).
vagrant cape
Ahhh
final mist
What's broken is the back end, where things are coded to work (ex. T21 still sims as a DPS gain for us, because it was never changed to the armor buff it is now, BC still exists for the Sim, etc).
We can write APLs, the back-end is what the issue(s) is.
vagrant cape
Ah, so it got fucked with all the bfa changes
Are the new formulas an issue at all? What with the squish and all
final mist
Just having a new expansion and no one on the Prot team capable of fixing it. Same as what happened in Legion, basically.
No, those are basic SimC stuff, like class-wide. It's Prot-specific stuff.
dark junco
could we set up a go-fundme and try to get a coder to fix thoses? That’d speed things up no?
ember arrow
mereeeeeeek
dark junco
And like I said yesterday, I want it to get it done
final mist
It's open source. You can do whatever you want.
strong zodiac
Which is superior between Lifespeed and Winds of War? Both listed as A tier on icy
final mist
Learn the code and do it yourself, if you're that worried about it.
dark junco
No one is checking promotions, nor will me, random warrior, will get any traction outta it
final mist
I'm learning the code, but it's back burner for me because I'm busy both IRL and on WoW.
dark junco
I’d like but I can’t.
ember arrow
well kral, the people here arent getting paid to do it
grim prism
right
dark junco
Yeah I know
ember arrow
so its not their "job"
dark junco
i’m not shitting on them
grim prism
what do they owe us more than putting up with our bullshit day to day
ember arrow
^
sick sentinel
^
dark junco
I know, never said that
ember arrow
i didnt say you did
dark junco
I’m not mad at them, cause I don’t expect them to fix it, I just want it to get fixed, and the easiest way seems to as a community pay a codder to do it
ember arrow
we're gonna fix the APL, and we will make the mexicans payfor it
grim prism
Azralonians
broken kite
Make the blood dks pay for it
grim prism
lets see... which classes have a WALL ability
ember arrow
grim prism
... uh oh
undone sun
@final mist how's the analyzer coming along
final mist
😬
undone sun
🤣
ember arrow
@junior ivy https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/465038584097800194/484359852223627264/image0.png
oops offtopic
oh well
green isle
😡
undone sun
😄
sinful niche
Is there a BOE main hand worth buying before going into Uldir? I have a 350 Oswains with leech but sitting on a 325 Crit/haste main hand
candid cove
just teebus but its not exactly amazing
sudden tapir
Wasn’t their a 7th legion world quest that coughed up a 340 one handed yetserday
There*
grim prism
@sinful niche the shield is way more important, and frankly i wouldn't bother spending 300k on a 25 ilvl upgrade the week before M+ anyway
if you were upgrading a 325 shield to a 350 you might be able to justify it
astral crystal
grim prism
but i wouldnt bother since you'll easily get one by spamming M+ anyhow (which will be easy as a tank)O
chilly brook
@sinful niche there's a 350 1h axe
fringe marten
For alliance prot war, is Dark iron dwarf superior defensively to regular dwarf?
chilly brook
@sinful niche
Whether it's worth it to you or not is a different story that I can't answer
little star
candid cove
Gotta open that original
little star
ye its hard otherwise
chilly brook
Sorry you don't have a 21:9 monitor
little star
who sais i dont, its just very small when opened in the app
opening original is more than fine but thought it relevant since you can use sharex or gyazo to make the part you want smaller and more readable
¯_(ツ)_/¯
chilly brook
¯_(ツ)_/¯
broken kite
Crop dat
ancient horizon
are protection warriors good in mythic dungeons.
hot locust
Yes.
fresh idol
wrong chat sory
topaz zenith
I'm actually going insane, I cant handle ignore pain being on gcd at all
fresh idol
sorry
cloud bone
i've gotten used to it at this point
it's actually not that bad since most of the time Ip isn't getting chewed through instantly
mostly just have to worry about keeping it up rather than stacking it
ancient horizon
ok thanks.
what stat do i look for
right now i am 114 but when i hit 120 what are the main stat i need to look at.
undone sun
str>haste>mastery>verse>crit
steel mauve
i mean i dont find IP being on the gcd all that bad
it took getting used to the playstyle change after legion, but it doesnt really bother me
ancient horizon
yeah so far i am use to spamming ip as much as i can when it pop up.
dark junco
My issue is mainly preventing it from dropping since its on GCD and I oftenly forget I can’t just do it whenever
raven kernel
It's fine if it drops
You don't need 100% ip uptime
Shield block is the one you focus on
And IP as rage permits to help smooth out the dmg intake
hollow kite
does iron fortress stack?
raven kernel
If it's a heavy magic dmg pack then pop last stand to let bolster deal with melee swings and channel your rage to more ips
@hollow kite it should by all means
tardy panther
Question about WQ for prot. I main arms, but never see any 1 handers or shields. do i need to change spec for reqards to change?
rewards
amber siren
You don't need to change spec for wq equipment
junior ivy
i still get confused trying to keep ttrack of azerite gear and i get a new poiece and its like i gotta check outer and inner traits for 2 different specs
and it takes me ages to determine if its an upgrade
is there an easier wayy
feral vapor
Well for dps Specc it’s very easy to determine the better piece
What is your Problem exactly with choosing azerite gear?
toxic wadi
omg
I'm doing so much damage as prot in this heroic dungeon
I'm at top of meter doing 40% total damage done
junior ivy
problem is i get shoudlers. people are like 'do you need them' and i gotta pull out my 3 hand written lists of top outer and inner traits for each spec
and tryt and figure out if its better
and its like oh this has #2 outer trait and #3 inner but this has #1 outer and #4 inner
and i even have 2 separate lists for fuyr one for aoe one for single target
its information overload
wanton vapor
I fell bad that my 308 DH can hold better aggro and sustain self healing than my 328.....i must not be good at prot anymore
328 warrior*
digital vale
PROT is amazing reduction dmg
vagrant cape
I don't think any tank "sucks dick" compared to any other tank. Unless you compare them in specific areas
wanton vapor
Honestly feel like Prot is to dependent on procs to be able to do any AoE outside of TC
Demo up every 15-20 seconds to help keep rage building
raven kernel
Dh takes way more dmg than prot while not healing enough to cover the difference
wanton vapor
Yea but ive been able to pull more with my DH over my Warrior
And if the healer dies i just pop DS and still leive
raven kernel
My warrior can pull way more without fear lol
wanton vapor
With my warrior...IP is gone after 3 hits
steel mauve
All the tanks are really close to each other, with their own strengths and weaknesses
raven kernel
Relying on ip is your mistake
wanton vapor
IP is my oh shit
raven kernel
Block.
wanton vapor
I usually keep my block up when i can
steel mauve
Ip shouldnt really be used as an oh shit though, its just used to smooth out damage
wanton vapor
usually 2 second downtime each charge
raven kernel
Ip is only for smoothing yes
Block and demo shout are your primary mitigation
Also prot helps kill shit much faster than dh
So mobs live shorter
grim prism
Threat is a flat coefficient of damage @wanton vapor. If you are keeping aggro better on a DH at 20 ilvl less then it is something you are doing wrong on prot
raven kernel
Further reducing total dmg taken
grim prism
Also i dont see what you mean about being too dependent on procs to do good AoE outside of TC. TC is the AoE.
wanton vapor
I try to not cap rage so if i need to i use revenge but other than that i keep TC on CD and just roll with revenge procs
raven kernel
Tc should be upwards of 60% of your total dmg on aoe
grim prism
Right
wanton vapor
Speaking of TC....i thought Deafing trait stacked with other armors
grim prism
Oooh nope. Not the part that matters anyway
raven kernel
Dmg stacks, demo extension doesn't
wanton vapor
Well good thing i still dont have my Bis axerite armors....thought they stacked
Still rocking the Rezan trinket for haste...not sure if thats one of the better trinkets
undone sun
it is
neon prawn
Anyone having trouble with the last boss in tol'dagor on mythic? I've done him every week on mythic, but for some reason he is casting waaaay too many explosive bursts on the group
same group comp
grim prism
The healer should be topping those up regardless
Are you hitting each other with aoe or are you getting stunned
neon prawn
nope, we are tanking him on the corner with the ranged on the wall and the melee in the cubbies on either side
we don't have to move at all, and we can avoid the cannons
idk, compared to last week we were taking way less overall damage on explosive burst it seems. Idk if any changes were made to increase the frequency of explosive burst
twin eagle
Is it possible to still get the hidden artifact appearance? Not mage tower, specifically hidden.
amber siren
Yep you just need to get lucky
You can run the script if you google it to check if it's up
twin eagle
Is it like the arms appearance, where it's region wide?
grim prism
No changes @neon prawn
sick tree
Is there a new spread sheet of all reflectable boss spells?
neon prawn
in the pins
twin eagle
Thank you kindly @amber siren
amber siren
👌
grim prism
Ive always found tanking him in the actual corner of the room to be needlessly hectic, i tank him in the middle of the actual path where the corner is so it creates nice long avenues when he does crossfire as well as gives the whole group room to spread AoEs as well as avoid cannons
The cannons are so telegraphed that I find trying to cheese them pretty pointless
neon prawn
okay thanks the advice
toxic wadi
I'm dealing so much damage as prot warri in dungeons
I'm either 1st or 2nd in total damage done
it's insane
raven kernel
Welcome to prot
And then we sometimes have ppl in here complaining about holding threat
😂 😂 😂
toxic wadi
lol oh wow
frosty wedge
gah, running sniper, just say an oswains up for 225g, someone beat me to it :/
raven kernel
@wanton vapor wasnt really directed at you, sometimes we have ppl legit complaining about threat issues
wanton vapor
Damn really?
I mean theres been times ive had aggro ripped off me but its really not that bad
raven kernel
Usually it's nothing a simple taunt can't fix
wanton vapor
Although i am liking Veng tanking too
raven kernel
I don't enjoy venge man
Have like no cds
1 long ass cd meta
A single target shield wall
Prot has demo shout almost all the time, passively have block chance even when shield block is down (which is really low downtime with bolster)
Whereas venge don't have very high demon spikes uptime
And when it's down you are pretty naked
regal island
^ yep
feels more like trying to survive in a horror movie vs actually tanking
Prot warrior has that feeling of, i just popped cd's there's no way i'm gonna die for 20 sec
raven kernel
On venge I'm pressured into using meta pretty often
On prot I hardly need to pop shield wall
And when I do use it I get it back way quicker cos anger management
regal island
yeah i pop it just because i know there's x more pulls before the next boss but it makes you feel indestructable
raven kernel
Ya my healer can take his sweet ass time healing my warrior
Can freely heal others or add some dps himself
When he heals my dh he basically has to stay on me most of the time
If he has to heal the group I have to kite or meta
Venge = oh fuck I need to meta now or rip
Prot = oh might as well shield wall these 2 packs
toxic wadi
Why is brace for impact trait higher priority than iron fortress?
Iron fortress gives a flat increase in block
whereas brace for impact only increases block when you shield slam
raven kernel
Don't need to be very anal about prot traits tbh
As long as you have 1 tc trait
I was using 1 tc 2 ip trait for a long time
No issues
They're mostly decent
amber siren
BfI can get a decent stack up if you're lucky with SS resets
IF is just a static amount
wanton vapor
Someone let me invite to party real fast...makign changes to party UI on my priest
Horde
summer sequoia
icy-veins.com should have the top ranks of azerite traits per ring
so just pick based on priority order.. you'll be fine
junior ivy
i wrote it all down
front and back
outer and inner traits
but for each azerite piece i gotta read throuh all of these papers
and decide if #3 on outer ring and #1 on inner ring is better than #2 on outer ring and #4 on inner ring..e tc
for all 3 specs
crystal night
https://gyazo.com/85c73ff28fb2894898b8705ee85d5bc4 335 or 340 with lesser stats
i wanna say 335
undone sun
yup
junior ivy
omg thyme streams?
undone sun
i haven't in quite a while, computer has been pretty shit lately
crystal night
aww too bad
hopefully see u soon on there have a good ngiht everyone im off 2 bed
❤
junior ivy
ok. i got a stupid problem now
😦
my unit frames (player and target) cover part of the turtle games
but it would look stupid if moved them that far out of the center
what cna i do?
undone sun
my player and target frames go into mouseover when nothing is being targeted, otherwise i'd also have that problem
round vortex
What problem?
round vortex
Oh right. That looks like you can make do? Or just press CTRL Z to hide your interface and your bindings will still work 😃
undone sun
are you using elvui or default blizzard
junior ivy
default
undone sun
shame, idk then
undone sun
lol
junior ivy
i'md etermined to find a solution now
next goblet
ilvl 300 haste/vers ring or a 340 crit/mastery ring?
wanton vapor
Kicked from a guild because i wasnt friends with anyone....makes sense....
round vortex
@junior ivy your bindings should still work though. Just remember what key is each direction there are only 3 of them lol
junior ivy
maybe i can make a weakaura to show my action bar
finite escarp
What trinkets do you guys use
junior ivy
in a different locatiomn
wanton vapor
I use DMD and Rezans
round vortex
You’re over complicating it cat lol
junior ivy
i use..
round vortex
Can you not remember 3 buttons?
round vortex
Pogchamp lol
junior ivy
lol true i could jsut memorize the 3 buttons
next goblet
i was thinking go with 340 but had to make sure
inland mesa
I'm between 340 Gilded Loa Figurine, 345 Emblem of Zandalar, and 345 Jes' Howler, or I could buy Blockades, not sure what to use
undone sun
jes howler is bis defensively, offensively just use higher strength
wanton vapor
I bet the HPally discord went mad to find out they werent getting a 2h weapon for healing
RIP xmog xD
amber siren
they can still mog to their 2h artifact
wanton vapor
Oh...didnt know that
static lance
yeah, no matter what weapon you're using, you'll be able to mog to your artifact weapon
broken kite
Yeah but griving them that means we can't mix and match ours :(
static lance
unfortunately, you have to mog both the sword and shield. so we can't mix and match.
which sucks, because i was looking forward to using Iron Soldier's Saber with the hidden appearance shield
undone sun
indeed, also dealing with that on paladin. the flail really sucks
broken kite
I love the pvp protpally one
sharp steeple
On the topic of artifacts, duids should be able to glyph the feral and guardian skins imo
jade socket
you can just mog them
undone sun
can mog them in their respective specs, yes
but i think he means cross spec
guardian using the feral mage tower skin in cat form, etc.
undone sun
indeed
fringe marten
Race c hanged to dark iron dwarf...they look so sick in Blackrock foundry Xmog. I know it's basicbitch warrior xmog..but its so lit~
jovial reef
"basicbitch" if it looks good use it
don't use tiresome "zomg full set" restrictions
winter bone
what is the max block % we should aim for or benefit from ?
fringe marten
you really don't worry about that; you block actively. that passive block % will slowly rise over time as you get more mastery gear. Just follow the basic rules of itemization and worry more about 'how' you're playing than stat tuning.
undone sun
there isn't a set amount that you need to aim for
fringe marten
no, that 40% is the actual damage mitigation 'when' you block. And that's going to also come from azerite traits, and shield quality.
winter bone
k thnx
fringe marten
Right now..anyone who's really pushing their warrior forward has crested the 340 ilevel mark..and with a blue 330 shield (3 weeks of every mythic, can't get a shield drop) my block % is right near 40..like 39.7% with 2 iron fortress traits in my 5 man setup.
my 'passive' block chance is like 27%
Really wish I could find more brace for impact pieces. I only have 1..and I think I have darn near every azerite piece
At the end of legion with the right socketed runes I think we were blocking 44% damage? That seems to be the curve they're shooting for here..as we progress through ilevels of heroic/mythic raid gear for Uldir that's where we'll get to, if not slightly exceed it.
fringe marten
You have a purple shield you cheater.
Brace is nice though; if you can get a couple pieces with it and stack it up quick...it would be very powerful.
upper spoke
wowhead says 1% drop chance of shields from dungeons.
does uldir drop just 2 shields? a boe and that vector thing?
no % drop rate listed of that one
amber siren
1% doesn't sound right at all
unkempt fox
hey guys, havent played for a year or so , is tanking still fun with all the GCD and aggro changes? (i know fun is subjective but still)
fringe marten
No one else can define 'fun' for you..that's up to you. Prot 4 life~
winter bone
i just started tanking at prepatch played a monk and a warrior , after getting used to the warrior and being proactive i find it much fun to play than the monk
still sigil
i know defeaning crush is required, but if all i plan to do is M+ and an occasional raid, is wouldnt iron fortress be better then brace for impact?
grim minnow
not gonna lie, into the fray looks way better than Punish every tim
amber siren
ItF stacks, IF doesn't
vagrant cape
Do reflected spells show up in the meters?
undone sun
no @vagrant cape
amber siren
BfI can stack higher with shield slams, IF is a static block amount
winter bone
were can i find guides for tanking dungeons/raids specifice to warriors usually ?
still sigil
altho iron fortress can stil stack with each other?
like 2 iron fortress's will stack ?
sick sentinel
IF is static block component with stacking reflected damage scaling with blocks (more AOE dps). BFI increasingly higher block from shield slams esp w/ x2, that gets better with gear haste.
wouldn't hurt to have sets of both you can swap for relevant content.
still sigil
cool
hollow zinc
Quick question - Resonating Crystal Scimitar with avoidance OR Saber of Dread Pirate Lockwood without avoidance? buoth are the same ilvl
still sigil
and does strength in numbers increase current hp when it procs and increases ur max? or just max hp with no current hp adjustment?
next goblet
prot on island expeditions.. is it ok?
smoky wave
Prot on expeditions is great fun. You can rattle around doing loads of aoe, letting your mates get azerite.
Someone was saying they pull loads of stuff then run over to the alliance, when then either die or kill it for them.
lucid glade
is prot any good atm?
sick oriole
Can you equip 2 darkmoon decks 🤔
sick oriole
Like its unique equip, but does that count other decks
north bloom
they should really take ip off the gcd
haughty lantern
seriously why is ip still on gcd
next goblet
wait no
it was in the trinket guide
lol
IP on the GCD def doesn't feel right.. but i feel like if devastator got reworked and buffed it could fix it a little because it'd remove a GCD for us
lucid glade
where does prot rank when compared to the other tank specs?
sick oriole
oh hey it says you can use both
north bloom
prot is shit
dont play it
ip on gcd worst tank in the game
reroll is best choice
next goblet
thats what the general populous says.. but i enjoy it, and it performs alright
sick oriole
Prots fine for everything but top of the line world 20 mythic raiders and mdi m+
brittle timber
the difference between a good prot warrior and a bad one is just...so drastic
smoky wave
I like ip on the gcd. Means I have to choose between damage and survival
next goblet
so im assuming we're going haste food
undone sun
yes
next goblet
alright
frail cedar
Any ideas on Blood Sport vs Blood Rite? It doesn't seem like either of them are ideal but
vagrant cape
344.75 ilvl
Doing specific heroics because all I want in life is an upgrade to my 320 shield
Galvagina boss in temple (boss who drops shield) drops a 345 titanforged belt
It's same ilvl as mine, worse stats
I trade it to only other plate wearing noob in this goddamn heroic
Their happiness made it worth it my disappointment
FeelsGoodMan
long pelican
I tanked my first few mythics ever! Fun stuff, got popped pretty hard by a couple mobs in King’s Rest. I can’t decide what I should focus first, the shadow Blademasters, or Shadow Witchdoctors
merry cave
I gave up 3 weeks mythic and stupid amount of heroic no shield seen so went and bought the350 one
Was totally worth
Except it has no sheath animation still 🤔
long pelican
Oswain?
vagrant cape
isn't that one 355?
charred void
has there been any blue post addressing prot in bfa?
I really hope they make some changes
undone sun
no
vagrant cape
addressing what, Tay?
charred void
0 self sustain making us miles behind in m+
vagrant cape
well, we don't have zero
long pelican
On that topic what actually triggers victory rush
surreal stump
killing blows
vagrant cape
minor azerite traits and victory rush are bad, but they aren't zero
long pelican
Oh the actual last hit needs to be by the tank?
vagrant cape
yep
it's actually really powerful on the final boss of underrot. the spores have one hp
so you can spam victory rush there
long pelican
Rofl
charred void
also the playstyle, pressing ignore pain feels shitty
long pelican
Tight
surreal stump
heroic throw boom victory rush
long pelican
Exactly
vagrant cape
The problem with ignore pain is that it's a very delicate balancing act
at the moment, ignore pain feels shitty and thsu we don't invest any talents or traits into it
astral hare
yeah, especially if compared to the old IP
charred void
its not even the GCD
vagrant cape
but if IP were to suddenly become good to use, we'd make it ridiculously OP through all the tools available
surreal stump
meh i just brut force everything, kill it before it kills you profit
charred void
they just need to bake it into something
astral hare
but for magic heavy fights, I sometimes even hit IP and not shield block
vagrant cape
We need another spender that can actually guarantee we spend rage
getting revenge procs when you're rage capped feels bad
charred void
and generates threat
vagrant cape
Ignore pain is a pretty powerful button to press in magic-heavy encounters
charred void
like if IP felts a little more like deathstrike
long pelican
I feel like I’m keeping IP up like 70% or more of the time, is that wrong/inefficient
charred void
hit the target and such
vagrant cape
it depends entirely on the fight, xanthyr
astral hare
Xanthyr, me too. I'm constatcly checking is my IP up or not, because SB comes already naturally but IP i have to check
long pelican
I dig, I mean, in general I’m just doing it a lot across the board
vagrant cape
if it's magic-heavy and survival is top priority (threat is fine) then yeah, go for high IP uptime
but there's also spell reflect and shield wall in case you need em
long pelican
At the very least to refresh AM cooldown
vagrant cape
and demo shout of course
in spicier fights, using a lot of IP (but not overcapping) is very good for getting AM going
astral hare
true, it is our biggest rage consuming skill
long pelican
Avatar Lust is pretty hilarious
vagrant cape
I generally use a spectrum that ranges from "No ignore pains, just revenges" to "no revenges, just ignore pains" depending on how dangerous/magicky the fight is
long pelican
Every time I just think of Stomp the Yard
vagrant cape
I put revenge and IP in the same slot in my rotation in my head
long pelican
A one man Queen We Are the Champions
vagrant cape
if I want more surviviability, I use IP. If I want to make the dps feel bad, I use revenge
astral hare
Avatar DS is truly a fun moment every 1.5 mins
vagrant cape
it should be happening every minute at most
astral hare
and less with AM
long pelican
DS?
vagrant cape
demo shout
long pelican
Ah yeah
vagrant cape
I hope you're using booming voice
long pelican
Still learning the skills. Been playing warrior tank for just a few days
vagrant cape
gotcha
demo shout is a dps CD and a survivability one
with booming voice talented
astral hare
only bad thing is, I have to spend the first GCD of Avatar to do DS, and it feels bad ^^
vagrant cape
a big mistake I see new players making (for all classes and specs) is not using their CDs enough
long pelican
I’m dropping demos and avatars all the damn time, feels like 45 seconds CD but time flies when your dps buttpulls everything
vagrant cape
indeed
long pelican
I asked a bit earlier, but in kings rest the shadow mobs, who should we burn first? The blademasters or the casters
I want to say blademasters since they were actually dunking on me but my group were saying otherwise
After the entombing boss
vagrant cape
I've only done king's rest once, so I'm not the best source on that
long pelican
We did it but it felt like I died to every pack along that bridge
vagrant cape
I generally always go for casters because they're harder to maneuver around
but the blademasters ARE pretty disgusting
it depends on how well your team manages interrupts, I feel
long pelican
The last death I had I got chunked 49k on one tick of their big attack
Didn’t know if that was from a few factors or if I just failed to mitigate
lucid ginkgo
Are blademasters the ones that do the bleed?
lucid ginkgo
When they leap away, dont go running after them, let them come to you
And wait for them to cast the bleed attack
Super fast cast, but you want that bleed to be gone
long pelican
And just jump away? Is it an aoe or single target
undone sun
berserkers do the bleed
lucid ginkgo
Oh berserkers
Well there you go for them
The bleed is a frontal melee range slash
They will leap away and do another slash seconds after even if youre not in range
If someone else is and they get, their fault
Blademasters i cant remember much
Worse comes to worse, cc and deal with as few as you can
Of each
long pelican
Guess it is the berserker yeah
lucid ginkgo
Berserker shouldnt give you trouble once you learn their gimmick
long pelican
I may have misremembered combinsinf berserker and beastmaster
undone sun
stunnable, ez
fair crystal
lucid ginkgo
And if you dont have a stun, they will do 1 bleed, leap at a party member, walk a few steps, cast bleed
And repeat
So you have a few options, which is good
long pelican
Alright, that is good info
lucid ginkgo
Lots of gimmicks on trash this expansion. Pretty nice.
long pelican
Speaking of that, the one caster mob on shrine of the storm after you kill the ironbull/caster boss
Does the aoe spell that can be interrupted
I’ve pugged that dungeon like 6 times and have always wiped on that mob 100% of the time even when I warn people about her
vagrant cape
you MUST interrupt the majority of its casts
luckily it can also be stunned or feared
it applies a stacking damage taken increase
long pelican
Yeah, I interrupt it 3 times with my punch racial and SW and no one else does anything and we die LOL
vagrant cape
and it'll kill you if it gets too high
I'd just remind people to interrupt in a friendly manner before the pull
and put the skull raid marker on it
people tend to kick things more often when I use that marker for some reason
long pelican
Yeah, I do all of that. Good to know I had the right idea, just gotta do it
vagrant cape
if shit starts hitting the fan, rallying cry sooner rather than later
long pelican
I don’t know what felt worse, the fact that the water elemental boss spawned and punted me off map, or that my team dunked on the boss without me there, or that we wiped on trash immediately after with me there
Thanks for the tips, helps a lot
vagrant cape
to be fair, the tank check on the elemental boss is super weak. When he splits, you're supposed to make sure each mini one has someone to melee or else they cast sea blast repeatedly. Sea blast does absolutely no damage so there's no real reason to even do that in lower level dungeons
and he spends os much time casting that the boss melee damage isn't significant
merry cave
Just sit on one and hit lust and melt them
vagrant cape
mhm
merry cave
Honestly there's only really one big glaring issue to protect war atm
All the good pirate transmogs is leather 👎
raven kernel
Can't wait for alliance pvp plate set
cobalt swallow
vocal nimbus
a bit late but dont berserkers cast at the closest target? @lucid ginkgo
i still havent done kings this week but the last two saves when i was kiting them they turned around and casted at melee dps
timid nacelle
Need help on trinket selection, all 340 ilvl, Vial, Fang or Gilded Loa? Using Blockades in other slot
warm nimbus
vial
warm nimbus
Vial. Mastery, imo is very importante. Great for burst and AoE aggro.
dull pilot
dont have aproblem with aggo tbh
warm nimbus
Still Vial. More survivability. Unless you don't want to have another button to press.
tiny sphinx
205 static str is better than 146 static mast no matter how you slice it, the haste proc is dece, guess it depends if you want to/can time the activatable well enough to take advantage of it
the fact that is decays at all would make me immediately shard it, unless you just want ilvl boost
dull pilot
kinda toren i like the 205 str static but the aoe is nice
na dont need ilvl in a nice guild
ilvl means nothen on trinkets
well not nothen
dull pilot
i am leaning to the 205 str one
warm nimbus
I'd argue that the strength from vial give better damage, expecially when coupled with avatar.
warm nimbus
I thought we were still doing a compare and contrast between vial and emblem.
dull pilot
think emblem won
timid nacelle
@vocal nimbus thanks mate
ember arrow
@warm nimbus trinkets dont benefit from dps cds
tawny panther
Currently using the strength trinket with the spore aoe, more for base strength but the proc is constant so adds a bit of healing n damage at least, and then the emblem. Was wondering if the newly buffed red button/other was better than spore?
undone sun
🤔
undone sun
i'm almost positive spore is by no means bis
dull pilot
is that so can u show me somrthing better
warm nimbus
@ember arrow you don’t say.
undone sun
Defensively, Jes Howler, Blockades, Rezan's, Bygone's Bee
Offensively, Fathoms, Rezan's, Fang, Stat sticks
vocal nimbus
Trinkets dont benefit from damage increases this xpac?
At least they can crit, or some at least
Noticed red button hitting for 34k with my bdk
dull pilot
dont know i still love http://prntscr.com/koliql
ember arrow
sick 1.8k dmg
undone sun
split
hearty sandal
are prot warriors bad state atm like dmg wise? seem like i see prot warriors geting wrecked in these mythic pluses
vocal nimbus
Prot warrs have the highest aoe damage right now
undone sun
~1.69+haste rppm on it as well, i can't imagine it'll heal for much at all
hearty sandal
i mean dmg taken they seem squishy
vocal nimbus
Thats gotta be poor CD usage
dull pilot
done over 30 M+o had np at all
undone sun
i can almost guarantee it wasn't because of the trinket ¯_(ツ)_/¯
dull pilot
just got the trinket
i am talking about warriors as a whole
seam fine
got out of bed the wrong side ?
vocal nimbus
dont gang up on riderr because he likes mushrooms
undone sun
what is wrong with you?
when someone is obviously trying to objectively push something which is well known to be quite trash one would interfere and correct them.
vocal nimbus
thyme, he was talking about the class now 🤔
undone sun
stated that sporepod was bis