U'll have to front load your CDs on big packs.
#protection
signal plover
rancid palm
Ok cause its way cheaper on the AH so ill biy that one
timid jay
The rage per hit is adjusted for weapon attack speed
brave jetty
west kayak
The attack speed enchant is now at 100% proc rate. Does that help us or stick to Stalwart Nav?
modern brook
Bolster definitely one of the cooler talents
ember arrow
i jsut wanna say im loving the darkest dungeon esque quests in stormsong valley
grim prism
Isnt your ability damage based off your single-tick autoattack damage tho
i.e. using a fast dagger would reduce your actual ability damage without shortening the actual GCD
Or am I making that up
chilly brook
Can someone explain this please? Because I need clarification help from the community because you know, Blizz is a small indie company.
chilly brook
yea I see thaet
that*
But they don't give you followers that have that same counter :thonking
cyan cargo
you can just use followers that don't counter and still hit the 100%
only way to go about rn
chilly brook
It's completely "ok" in terms of it still works I just gotta shake my head
sick sentinel
'workout' clearing mythics been pretty skate for me after the first week.
still not top tier shield.
@sick sentinel stealth type missions cant use troops.
chilly brook
all you need is a 340 shield you don't need the BiS one
sick sentinel
waiting for a 355 oswain's w/ socket.
keen spire
@grim prism
prisma crane
@keen spire i heard that before, thanks for the link
cant wait to replace my fucking 300 weapon
NA Alli is finally coming through on this stupid RNG carousel that we call emissaries
sick sentinel
340 weapon, 325 tall dagger shield.
prisma crane
i wonder how much harder my SSs will hit once i get my 340 weapon to replace the 300
prisma crane
against 123 mobs?
sick sentinel
same level. more like 35%ish vs 123 mobs I assume.
idk how less it calculates.
unbuffed.
snow nest
mystic ferry
prisma crane
i mean buying a 300 or 310 shield isnt even pricey and that'll be leagues above that 266..
inland silo
i almost bought one
but i dont main prot and just tank a couple mythic dungeons at most a week and i dont really have problems with them
frosty wedge
I just made myself a 310 leveling smithing, lol
sick sentinel
shield slam tooltips for 10,6k now, tclap 10.5k
under avatar + demo shout.
The Dark Queen will be pleeeeased.
frosty wedge
is anyone macroing jes' howler or just using it on large packs/with lust, etc
sick sentinel
I'd macro it w/ avatar and/or demo shout for the big packs/bosses.
frosty wedge
good call
sick sentinel
seperate from avatar/demo shout individually.
cant be lazy with their uses. should still know when to use each selectively.
frosty wedge
nice
frosty wedge
yeah I'm pretty stoked for m+
junior ivy
can i get a contract for turtle people?
sick sentinel
you can.
junior ivy
frosty wedge
what mod are you using for the character page breakdown btw?
junior ivy
the only ones im not revered with
sick sentinel
I'd stick to coa/7th/honorbound tbh tho.
sick sentinel
oh. wtf turtles only honored wtf lol
frosty wedge
I'm essentially just using elvui for everything
sick sentinel
dejacharacterstats @frosty wedge
had to get it. I was getting annoyed af not knowing what my actual AP was with default blizz ui.
frosty wedge
fair, I think elvui has the same breakdown, just to the nearest integer, not as granular
sick sentinel
ya ya
junior ivy
how do i get a contract
topaz ember
sweet one hander for todays emissary quest
topaz ember
rip
frosty wedge
meh, i got 340 shoulders with deafening crash, soI'm not SUPER pissed, lol
marble pelican
so a goblin prot warrior pointless?
undone sun
@junior ivy inscription or auction house
topaz ember
Igot these kracken shell ones with crash crystalline and bulwark of the masses
frosty wedge
nice
topaz ember
i was pumped to see it drop
sick sentinel
deafening crash w/ azerite veins would be nice.
marble pelican
so a goblin prot warrior pointless? sorry if I said that once, I got dc'd
sick sentinel
or something similar or an arms piece with LoW/ToM w/ Azerite Fortifcations for pvp.
nice one @topaz ember
undone sun
what do you mean pointless? @marble pelican
dull granite
is there a list of spells that can be reflected in the current dungeons yet?
topaz ember
pins
uneven mason
I mean, if you take the literal meaning of the word, than the answer is no. @marble pelican
dull granite
derp, thx
uneven mason
Both their nose and ears are pointed.
marble pelican
i'm looking at a different race for a prot warrior just boredom really lol, I heard highmountain were the way to go but just curious with the 1% haste increase
frigid spindle
Anyone done some testing with azerite traits, and found any supreme once for protdmg ?(Seeing mythic /+ tank dps will be important)
grim prism
junior ivy
deafening crash
brace for impact
iron fortress
bloodspot
callous reprisal
reinforced plating
in that order. i think. unless it changed.
i have it written down on a piece of paper
sick sentinel
yeah basically.
I feel could go either way w/ iron fortress or brace. Brace allows theoretically more block gain w/ activity, fortress more passive but allow greater increase to AOE damage w/ packs + has some vs melee value for pvp.
compact sigil
upper spoke
340 haste over mastry ring or 350 crist over vers? ... w/ rings, do we still prefer perfect secondary stats over 5 or 10 ilvls?
not explicitly stated in guide in pins
grim prism
I am led to believe that stat budget on 10 ilvl is going to supersede itemization due to how close our secondaries appear to be performance-wise, but honestly I don't think we have to tools to give you a 100% certain answer to that right now @upper spoke
You may want to tag in an officer for a second opinion
vocal nimbus
i'd use the 350
hot locust
I'd use the 340.
crit is icky and since it's a ring with no primary might as well not deal with it.
prisma crane
it does feel similar to legion and rings had more leeway due to lack of STR
wild hamlet
Whatβs my strategy for dealing with magic damage? IP and hope SW is up?
junior ivy
ty
n ow that i finally gfot 340 weapon ill enchant it
got*
if im all 340s
i m,ready to raid right?
next tuesday?
jovial reef
ask your guild
junior ivy
i mean how cna they expect more than 340s π¦
junior ivy
they better not say that lol
hot locust
get lucky WF/TF duh
junior ivy
yay just got given quick nav enchant π
jovial reef
Just get lucky 4Head
grim prism
I've seen a lot of people with absurd requirements for their raid teams
grim prism
A guy on my realm told his guildies they had to be AP25 or they would be benched
for heroic
junior ivy
wow lmao
undone sun
π€£
junior ivy
im gonna be tanking with my guild BUT its on the second raid team
not the main raid team
jovial reef
i mean a guild can ask anything of their members, it's within their rights
grim prism
I would be surprised if there are ten people on my entire connected realm that are AP25 by next week
junior ivy
im still scared though
jovial reef
it's within your rights as a player to not agree with them and move to another guild
junior ivy
i am suuper intimidated by my guild
grim prism
Yeah, it just blows my mind that people actually feel obligated to comply
jovial reef
it depends on your goal with the game and how hard you want to push
junior ivy
i need an addon that tells me ifi im missing enchants or gems
wait i probably have one
but im not missing any
so its not telling me
grim prism
When I did mythic raiding there were pretty stringent expectations for farming M+, but they weren't exorbitant. And if they were, frankly I would have just quit. It blows my mind that people put so much mental energy into something that is supposed to be a game you play for fun and enjoyment. Dickhead GMs and tryhard raiders are just as cancerous irl as they are in-game. /rant
Like if you legitimately feel intimidated by your guild... i dunno man, is it really worth it?
wide juniper
@grim prism There's a guild for everyone
When I was progression raiding in EQ2, we didn't want people that weren't tryhards
We wanted world firsts
There were plenty of casual and semihardcore guilds out there to fill their needs
grim prism
And thats fine if youre pursuing world firsts
wide juniper
Right, so a blanket statement saying "tryhard raiders are just as cancerous irl as they are in-game." is silly.
grim prism
But the vast majority of people with these exorbitant requirements and loot contracts etc, frankly arent
hot locust
Just join a guild where the only thing they care about is you being a good player and don't put any requirements on you.
Easy.
grim prism
There's a difference between trying hard and being a tryhard
summer slate
Hey guys! Just started my old warrior again. Havent played him in ages. Trying to get my head around my mitigaton. With 2 charges of shield block, its impossible to keep it up 100% of the time, so I get that's not what im suppose to do. But what do I do instead? Use ignore pain while waiting for shield block to come back up? Or just dont mitigate from time to time?
wide juniper
Like i said, a guild for everyone
Cycle CDs the best you can based on mechanics. It's absolutely possible to not have mitigation up at any given time based on the encounter.
grim prism
@summer slate check the pinned guide for a breakdown of the talents you should be using for optimal mitigation
wide juniper
Plan ahead with rage so you can generally keep IP up
grim prism
You cant keep massive block uptimes anymore so its basically about using your personal defensives rotationally (e.g. demo shout more or less on cooldown) and using block/LS for facetanking big pulls
sick sentinel
and constantly striving for the best shield possible to increase the effectiveness of your AM cycles.
lusty grotto
i'm confused, when could we keep SB up indefinately?
grim prism
Basically youre keeping IP up as an uptime buff on top of your defensives, not just for mitigation but also to advance anger management and get your defensives back off cooldown faster (arguably more important)
lusty grotto
I'm guessing people that used legendary legs did? but did anyone really use them
grim prism
@lusty grotto you could keep pretty damn high uptimes early/mid last expac when HR was the optimal choice on tier 100. More than enough to block 90%+ of melees on most boss fights
grim prism
But thats not really the relevant part of my comment lol
lusty grotto
i was addressing zw00p
i dont understand the 2 charges thing
it has never been more than 2
except with leggo pants
err im not even sure if it was pants
grim prism
Yeah i dont think they were trying to imply it was possible, just more stating a fact
grim prism
Two charges isnt enough for 100% uptime
@signal plover jinx you owe me some napkins rofl rofl rofl.
signal plover
Hue hue hue
lusty grotto
right
toxic wadi
Does anyone find tanking as a prot warrior very hard?
You just keep pressing buttons non stop
very annoying
prisma crane
the that a lot of ppl neglect to pay attention to is that 100% uptime isnt required to block 100% of blockable dmg
signal plover
π€ at iksh
prisma crane
in raids*
lusty grotto
it's that time of the week boys and girls!!!
sleek raptor
./script PlaySound(109068)
prisma crane
@toxic wadi it's arguably the toughest tank to play well, but if anything, comapred to legion, we're slow as hell
grim prism
@toxic wadi pretty sure most classes are supposed to press a lot of buttons
toxic wadi
I heard bear tank presses 2 buttons
grim prism
But no, its not really hard. Just requires you to pay attention
prisma crane
among other reasons
grim prism
I mean if you want to play a class that only has two buttons then maybe dont pick prot... we have at least seven buttons
toxic wadi
how do prot paladins mitigate magic damage?
lusty grotto
honestly I don't think you would get a fair assessment at the skill cap here unless it comes from one on the multiclassers
toxic wadi
I find prot pally much much easier than prot warr
because you just press whatever c omes off cooldown next
lusty grotto
~hotp~? holy shield? spellwarding
prisma crane
as someone who almost only plays prot and is used to it and doesnt have issues, i hear that we're difficult to play, but fun for it
grim prism
So clearly we are not talking about skillcapping here
lusty grotto
those 3 help with magical damage
grim prism
Just throwing that out there
toxic wadi
oh ok
grim prism
I mean when we start evaluating spec difficulty as a function of how many buttons there are... lol
lusty grotto
sorry not hotp... i meant the heal
prisma crane
it's just a fundamental aspect of our type of mitigation that makes us more difficult, it's proactive vs being reactive
lusty grotto
welp hotp is the heal, so i nailed it
prisma crane
the difficulty isnt so much as what to press, the difficulty comes down to when you press it
toxic wadi
yeah
I did tol dagor heroic as tank prot warrior
and I was so exhausted by the endo f the run
I got a headache
toxic wadi
ya
prisma crane
i mean if you're not used to it, makes sense
grim prism
Prot is just a lot more proactive. You have to press the shit before you're going to need it. It's not a matter of spamming shit to stay caught up, it's a matter of never falling behind in the first place.
toxic wadi
just constantly pressing buttons, I felt like I was getting carpal tunnel
it was so stressful
lusty grotto
oh
prisma crane
my biggest problem in tol dagor is my teammates in the cannons
grim prism
Do you know what you were pressing? Like when to use what?
lusty grotto
the troll cannons lol
toxic wadi
that cannon is extremely annoying, it keeps knocking you back
grim prism
Or were you just OH SHIT mashing
toxic wadi
yes I was pressing normal rotation
prisma crane
it also hits like a truck lol
lusty grotto
i just pull mobs, stun, and let the cannon spam on them
toxic wadi
Demoralizing shout, shield block, ignore pain to avoid rage cap, shock wave, thunder clap
prisma crane
first things first @toxic wadi dont just use SB when it's available
sick sentinel
same @prisma crane @ hearing it, but still fun to play. rewarding even. not a lazy job to do about it as a tank.
toxic wadi
oh and it's also the fact that there are so many buttons to press I have no clue which one to press
like thunderclap is more important than revenge right?
lusty grotto
yes
there's a guide in the pins if you haven't checked it out, i'm sure they go over what to use
wowheads/icyveins
toxic wadi
ok when to use shield block then?
grim prism
So I'm not trying to call you out, but there is a bit of a disconnect between "i was doing the normal rotation" and "i have no clue what to press", and the reason i point that out is because so much of our strength relies on knowing what defensives to use and when
The guide in the pins will help a lot with explaining your personal cooldowns and defensive abilities
toxic wadi
well I guess the normal rotation meaning shield slam to gain rage, thudnerclap on cooldown, and ignore pain to prevent rage cap
and revenge when it procs
grim prism
But the short answer is you want to use shield block to soak up incoming melee damage while using IP to absorb what is left of that incoming damage, especially on larger pulls. Its also important that you keep your front facing the enemy, as it is very easy to take back hits while repositioning and those are impossible to block
toxic wadi
ok cool
grim prism
You also will want to use last stand on very large pulls with the bolster talent, as this functionally replaces shield block. You dont want to cast SB while bolstered LS is still running
lusty grotto
why are we being so nice about this instead of spamming ?
grim prism
lusty grotto
lol
undone sun
lol
grim prism
I mean seriously though, the guide in the pins will tell you all the basics probably better than we will explain
sick oriole
Anyone gotten a working simcraft for prot?
lusty grotto
you know what i take that back, lets keep being nice to that dude
grim prism
@sick oriole there isnt one at the moment
sick oriole
BUT HOW AM I SUPPOSED TO KNOW
grim prism
sick oriole
WHAT TRINKETS TO USE
lusty grotto
rofl
toxic wadi
ok thanks
prisma crane
saying things that are in the pins when directly asked is fine imo
it's just when ppl say, hey guys, how do i play
sick oriole
no no offensive trinkets, that guides on defensive
lusty grotto
ok thanks for that zoren seriously lol
prisma crane
what's best gear
undone sun
by using your brain
lusty grotto
rekt
prisma crane
grim prism
Using my brain goes against my class fantasy
sick oriole
See this guy gets it
lusty grotto
when in doubt, use haste
grim prism
Unfortunately we dont have working sims because the warrior module for simc badly needs updating
sick oriole
But then my ilvl goes down slightly and thats just not an option
grim prism
Just use blockades and the biggest-dicked str trink you have
sick oriole
Fair enough
grim prism
As long as you macro /train to all your abilties you will be fine
lusty grotto
i use razdunk's big red button with avatar/bv for shits and giggles
lusty grotto
instant fat agro
lusty grotto
hits like a truck
grim prism
20k a pop
sick oriole
Yeah ive been fucking around with it, feels nice but the cd kinda sucks
lusty grotto
yeah the cd
grim prism
Yeah it is a hefty one
Lots of base str on it though so its not a total loss
Disclaimer: absolutely nothing ive told you thus far is backed by data
sick oriole
Feelscraft>maths
lusty grotto
im not gonna lie, i like talking shit to my guild mates in dungeon runs
sick oriole
Yeah, kinda wish avatar wasnt either
grim prism
Its not awful once you get used to it. Given that it is only a 50% absorb and has been relegated to more of an uptime buff (with a cap of 1.3x a single IP) its not like you would gain much defensively by being able to cast it more often.
I dont disagree that having certain abilities on-GCD feels clunky, but it's my understanding that most tanks feel clunkier than they did in Legion, so I try not to overthink it
toxic wadi
meaning?
sick oriole
its like 29k
grim prism
meaning if I cast one IP for 20k then my max possible IP cap is 26k
sick oriole
you can cast it more than once but it just caps at that
stark sage
just keep the buff up
grim prism
Youre going to be casting it often enough that it wont matter
sick oriole
Maybe recast before a big hit
toxic wadi
oh
grim prism
You dont need to worry about recasting to stack
lusty grotto
WAs are particularly useful for it
grim prism
That was a Legion thing
sick oriole
ah my b
prisma crane
if you're gonna have IP off the GCD, you'd have to have it have it's own CD, otherwise people are just going to blow rage without even thinking about it and it'll promote poor play, honestly, we only care about wasted rage because of AM
grim prism
You'll be recasting it fairly often to advance Anger Management regardless, and it will fall off just as quickly in level-appropriate content. Just focus on keeping it active while you are taking damage and you will be fine as far as IP is concerned
But its important to note that IP is not your primary mitigation
IP helps soak up what is left after demo shout, shield block, etc
toxic wadi
kk
runic fjord
Good lord, I'm avoiding all meta discussions outside this discord cause I see so much stupid information being parroted by players who don't understand basic shit and want to sound smart.
The community at large still thinks warrior tanks are awful and bear druids are a must have for raiding, apparently. π
shut summit
π€·
undone sun
Β―_(γ)_/Β―
lusty grotto
it happens lol
meanwhile i continue to talk mad shit to my guild mates in dungeons
DONT YOU KNOW WARRIORS ARE BAD, ARE YOU SLEEPING?
"hey guys lets casually look at details/skada"
runic fjord
I made a guildy bear tank while I DPSed yesterday
sick sentinel
im prot and i do that aswell i love that meme
runic fjord
kept ripping threat and talking shit
as he slowly died
sucking all the healer's mana
stark sage
depends on the slot
sick sentinel
Gloves
stark sage
roughly maybe more
10 - 20 depending on the gem and stats of the gloves
although armor is good
so 20 is pushing it
sick sentinel
dont forget the 1 40 strength kraken gem to use before secondaries.
I forgot about those
strong forum
tomorrow is finally the day
prisma crane
what do you get from exalted again?
strong forum
dank iron inc
twin hazel
what confuses me is what do dark iron dwarfs/mag'har orcs have to do with those reps in particular
not sure why they are gated behind those reps
lore wise
strong forum
dank iron cuz on zuldazar its the race thats mainly occupying it on the coast
twin hazel
okay thats acceptable
topaz ember
did you do th islands for the 1500 rep yet?
twin hazel
mag'har on the other hand
topaz ember
i will get mine today after i do my isnalds
strong forum
well im EU so no reset yet anyway
topaz ember
oh makes sense
final mist
Mag'har is, "Oh hey, remember those guys who said they'd come help us if we ever needed them? Well, clearly wer didn't need them for the Legion, but the Alliance is the real fuckin' deal, so let's go assimilate them!"
topaz ember
oh course we are the real deal we killed the legion
strong forum
be horde
start war out of nowhere
ask for help
....
ask for help
dark fossil
But, is Azeroth really turning?
Also, such a beautiful thing. Last night restored my faith in Prot when I tanked a few mythics with no trouble whatsoever.
dark fossil
Woot!
I have a 330 with a 325 shield. Just getting to tank mythics though! So happy to have passable gear.
twin hazel
still have my 300 weapon and shield after 2 weeks of M0's
dark fossil
Ow. ><
My guild was a bit slow getting to mythic gear, and I...uh. Forgot about lfg.
twin hazel
i just need to spam heroics for procs
chrome falcon
really hope UF doesn't get nerfed
prot warrior dps is absurdly out of line but please blizz just let us have this
just this once
dark fossil
Eh, I find it's reasonable on harder content. It's only absurd in AoE and only if you're not using as much active mitigation. Let it stay as it is. ^^
strong forum
@open bluff thanks dude, exactly the meme I had in mind π π
chrome falcon
i think the strength really shows when you alternate TC and IP on aoe
pumping out huge damage and still reasonably tanky
twin hazel
yah
chrome falcon
i think it's going to be a lot rougher in raid encounters and hard m+ bosses, but goddamn it feels so insane in m0 right now
also when you get to the point that you have a demo shout ready to pop and a 6 second demo shout debuff on the mob
and we're still at PRE-RAID haste levels
dark fossil
Yesssss. I love that.
dark fossil
Into The Fray is honestly a bit broken.
chrome falcon
and it fucking reduced the duration
that was a tilter
yeah, +15% haste is a completely wild talent lol
dark fossil
It's so easy to keep up. And only 15% haste at a really high stagger.
strong forum
Thing is, without the talents we have, we'd be trash
dark fossil
The talents are absolutely key. Absolutely.
open bluff
super easy to keep up though, but the main thing keeping it from being nerfed is brewmasters avoid haste when they can
dark fossil
True. Legion I mained DK and played Brewmaster secondary.
open bluff
tbh i see UF getting nerfed before into the fray
dark fossil
Haste just isn't as important.
chrome falcon
yeah ItF, UF and AM are just
dark fossil
UF is...nngg. So nice. And sadly so critical to our burst damage.
open bluff
they could nerf UF to a 50% increase and it would still be the best talent
pine sparrow
NIce Game
weak spindle
Balanced class for heroics π€
open bluff
at 308 ilvl a 50% increase vs 100% increase to TC puts it even with shield slam
so still a solid increase
err 311
prisma crane
that scaling ratio should remain the same regardless of ilvl, no?
open bluff
yeah
open bluff
not that i'm advocating for a UF nerf, but knowing blizzard it's inevitable
strong forum
It's ALL THE THINGS @junior ivy
open bluff
50% may be a bit harsh but still ahead of the revenge and dragon roar talents
junior ivy
thanks so much
crystal night
12% haste good for pre raid?
strong forum
Ye it's okay
dark fossil
No, but you can stack the two.
crystal night
guess its kinda scuffed to look at that
strong forum
I'm sitting at 17.75% but that's almost max
strong forum
That or armor, depends what you need more
crystal night
https://gyazo.com/50cb1b1899394252a6f15f349c70f824 is that im sitting at
strong forum
Every bit of haste reduced the CD of SB, get as much as you can
strong forum
I wouldn't look at armor, since it's "basically" linear to ilvl
chrome falcon
strong forum
Pretty much
chrome falcon
i'm sorry if that's too much of a shitpost but i'm high on avatar
dark fossil
I still love SS in single target. But mostly I want haste enough to have 100% SB uptime... ^^
dark fossil
Yup. Too much.
Think about it. 15s CD, 6s uptime.
Reducing that CD to 6s would be absurd. Getting it to 9 might make it able to stick with Heavy Repercussions however.
weak spindle
dark fossil
R? You people have weird keybinds.
weak spindle
i like snapping my fingers
open bluff
i use 7 for mine 
pine sparrow
7?????
weak spindle
Poggers
dark fossil
Also pardon. I'm currently... The Drunk Tank.
open bluff
g600, everything on the thumb buttons makes reaching stupid easy
weak spindle
man i still like to use my keyboard without having a keyboard on my mouse (have g600 too just memeing)
dark fossil
I use my left hand on that, right hand on my mouse.
Keyboard is only used occasionally.
weak spindle
π
open bluff
keyboard's best saved for shitposting in discord
weak spindle
^
dark fossil
That too. Granted I'm on my phone. Keyboard not included.
crystal night
crystal night
wait what?
weak spindle
can get in any spec i think
dark fossil
I want the fang so badly.
weak spindle
its gonna get nerfed, just fun to play with mate as 2 tanks, pulling all trash to boss then both TC and using trinkets
candid cove
Sad that our melee damage is so much of our damage though
dark fossil
The spore thing from underrot is a huge [CENSORED] disappointment.
weak spindle
Pulled the entire of motherload from 2 to 3rd boss and it died about 25 seconds flat
dark fossil
Even at 355.
tidal fjord
Whoa whoa this is the first Iβve heard of it is this a trinket?
chrome falcon
I wouldn't be surprised
dark fossil
Yeah. Temple of Sethraliss I'm pretty sure.
candid cove
Isn't it a channel?
chrome falcon
Prot warrior got a lot of nerfs in legion based on our performance in heroic dungeons
pine sparrow
weak spindle
4 prot 1 heal :>
chrome falcon
And since that's pretty much all blizz has to go on right now i wouldn't be surprised if we got a nerf before uldir
tidal fjord
Cool, our AoE is astonishing
candid cove
Maybe we'll get the "community tank sucks" buff like monks did
chrome falcon
I think it'd be really interesting if they kept our dps this insane
Because our utility for m+ still kind of blows compared to DK and stuff like that
dark fossil
That's true.
chrome falcon
But the payoff of having so much extra dps could be worth it with a good team
weak spindle
i think prot is weak survival wise compared to other classes
chrome falcon
It is
weak spindle
like pala and shit, so the damage is our bonus for now
dark fossil
Our biggest thing is great mobility. Even then, not sure how it compares to DH.
weak spindle
kill it before it kills you
dark fossil
I love when something throws me away and I intercept back in. 'Thanks for the rage!'
weak spindle
charge random allies under you when two stacks too o/
chrome falcon
The problem with good mobility is that having good mobility is irrelevant in m+
dark fossil
Yep! I've done that plenty too.
chrome falcon
Because... what are you doing with it?
It's not hard to kite shit and you don't want to run ahead of your group
And classes like DK can do good dps WHILE they kite. Like I'm not trying to sound pessimistic, i'm happy with how we are right now, I'm just worried about getting a nerfbat now that people are realising how good our dps is
But hey I guess we'll see in a week
dark fossil
I'm worried about the Nerf too. Also hoping for a mild survivability buff. Decrease SB CD by 1-2 or increase stacking or value of IP.
crystal night
Yeah man Mattacate i share the same concerns
like people looking at our damage as an outlier and choosing to nerf that and ignoring our survivability
sick sentinel
Seeing how unpopular we already are, it don't think they would just nerf us without compensation
chrome falcon
I'll never forget the random 8% revenge damage nerfbat for literally no reason in Legion
candid cove
Gotta keep it below ss in damage per gcd
weak spindle
mat vengence was broken
weaving ignore pain and revenge made it so you would be able to cast free max ignore pains later on
kinda why they nerfed it to try stop the spammy playstyle and reduced the 50% to 33% if i remember
something along the lines ofit. back when we was actually broken class at start of legion before the like 5 nerf bats to ignore pain
topaz ember
just got 345 wrists from a wq
lofty condor
how do you guys deal with the pack before Vol'Kaal. I seem to just get annihilated even popping all my cooldowns
crystal night
Kings Rest ?
lofty condor
Atal'Dazar
crystal night
Spell reflect if you know you have to walk over the poison
Precast avatar before the pull . Go in and demo should then spam the T-clap and keep your feet off poison
Demo shout *
Make sure every over global is tclap
lofty condor
ok cool Ill try that. Spell reflect was the missing element there I think
crystal night
Nd weakest ignore pains for more demo shoults in there
It will lreduce the nature damage the poison does
When u have to walk over it and will reduce all nature damage u take by 15% I beleive
And if u have at least 1/3 of the deafening crash trait your T-clap will keep demo shout on them forever
Also NUKE the totems
Asap
lofty condor
I was definitely prioritizing IP because of the poison
and popped last stand for the 15 second block
While attempting to kite, it just seems like I always die at that point
chilly brook
I'm ecstatic rn
crystal night
Use Ur first shield blocks before that so u get shield block x2 then last stand then 2 more shield blocks after that
lofty condor
good point
crystal night
Should be like 40 seconds if block/mitigation and keep demo shout and spell reflect going
chilly brook
Replaced both my 315 prot weapon with a 340 and got the 2h sword for arms from King's Rest
lofty condor
cool. thanks for the thorough answer
topaz ember
does arms or fury have closer stat weights to prot. idk what to pick for an off spec
chilly brook
I mean haste is strong for arms as well
prisma crane
yea but same with fury
chilly brook
And prot really is ilvl>haste>rest
compact mulch
hello
primal rain
Is there a way to make ThreatPlates to put debuffs on the left and not have a numerical timer?
sick sentinel
crit/haste for arms pve, haste/vers for arms pvp.
sick sentinel
someone wanna tank mythic atal dazar
finite bolt
Why the fuk are ppl calling prot warrior trash am mad and should prob stop ranting now but yer rargggggg
undone sun
nice
junior ivy
i see someone with the brutosaur on the boat
and i wanna cry
casue i dont have one
sick sentinel
I feel like im extremely squishy as a prot warrior. Anyone having the same experience or am I doing something wrong?
vagrant cape
I feel tanky af.
What's the ilvl on your shield? Are you running the right talents? What's your zodiac sign? What dungeons are you running? Are you using CDs?
amber siren
Talents and your shield ilvl will make a very big difference
sick sentinel
Might be due to the shield then
only 310
More or less following whats on icy veins
finite cairn
Magic and bleeds just hit so hard in general
zinc creek
Shield really makes a difference. Once you get a 340 one it will change
sick sentinel
Hey guys, so how's prot feeling in Mythic?
Prot seems to be one of the squishier tanks, at least from healing standpoint for me.
sick sentinel
Yea, just didn't know if it was the class, or the player. π
lapis tartan
So do we want 1 thundering crash and 2 brace for impacts? as 1st traits
lucid kelp
accordiong to the guide. Yes...as a basic guide
dark fossil
That's what I'm using.
Prot can drop quickly. It seems to have a higher skill ceiling. Higher azerite levels should help too. I'm seeing a lot of benefit from stuff like impassive visage. Using skills intelligently in certain fights matters. Mythic Underrot I was using the throw to kill the spores during the Abomination to keep recharging victory rush. It was a little absurd.
zinc creek
Tbh I feel more squishy when playing prot vs brm. But my prot deals tons of damage though
fringe marten
Overwhelming power stacks right? so you can theoretically get 50 stacks of 20 haste each?
gaunt igloo
@dark fossil yea, that's awesome, I pretty much soloed that boss the first week of mythics because my group died at like, 50%
modern fox
Day 87, got my hidden prot weapon
sick tree
Can two azerite veins stack
undone sun
the healing stacks
lucid kelp
my life will be complete if I can kill a raid boss with my Lightforged death explosion
toxic wadi
how do I mitigate damage when shield block is on coodlown?
crystal night
Guyssss cool thing I found out
woeful reef
I knew prot wasn't performing as well as the other tanks, but man watching my buddy stream with a DH in his group who doesn't drop below 95% HP and has like 500k self healing on average per pull in Motherload really makes me realize how much easier it would be for a group to play as something else. I really hope they look at warrior for 8.1. Sure its fine and gets the job done but it doesnt perform as well as others right now and its a pretty wide gap.
cloud bone
350 Mastery Vers ring or 340 Haste Msatery?
weary notch
350
cloud bone
even tho the 340 has haste?
weary notch
mo stats = mo better
cloud bone
I woulda thought the one with haste would be better cus of haste but ok
weary notch
mastery and vers are still good stats. Very good. I've not seen anything that suggests that anything is not worth the ilvl upgrade aside from deafening crash
cloud bone
hmm ok
dark fossil
@woeful reef May be a wide gap, but a skilled prot tank just doesn't take damage. I've gone whole mythics without dropping below 80%.
gaunt igloo
@dark fossil depends on the pulls/cc as well, i've had the same pulls where either shit goes wild and we almost wipe or smooth as butter ride
weary notch
yeah, it's about pull size and amount of casters in a pull
if it's all melee it's nothing. If it's mostly casters. Well...
gaunt igloo
I really dislike the spell reflect change (or rather, nerf) that it doesnt last the full 5 secs if there was a reflectable spell
toxic wadi
how do I mitigate damage when shield block is on coodlown?
gaunt igloo
last stand (with bolster), demo shout, shield wall...
weary notch
Demo, IP, SW
gaunt igloo
in the mean time, IP should be rolling
weary notch
this is not that
I honestly like having to work for it. It's a nice change after legion mythics pre-raid, when I literally stood in all the bad and never lost health
toxic wadi
yeah this game is so much harder than legion
weary notch
I do think we need a slight defensive buff, though
frosty holly
I would honestly be happy with a tiny buff to ignore pain. It almost dosn't feel worth to do with it's cost and lasting 1 hit
toxic wadi
yeah
dark fossil
@gaunt igloo True, the pulls make a difference. CC helps. I abuse the hell out of Shockwave.
weary notch
I still wonder why they didn't just make spell reflect reduce magic dmg by 20%, have it reflect all spells and give it a cost of 40 rage
instead of IP
gaunt igloo
nah, no rage cost, or they would put in the GCD
weary notch
but knowing when to properly use IP is a lot of the trick right now
that and having a group that uses all their tools
gaunt igloo
Yea, it feels like Cata dungeons all over again, every little thing could kill you if you misstep, and it actually feels nice once in a while to have to work for your loot π
weary notch
but all the healers I talk to say the other tanks are easier to heal, and bear is about the same as us
toxic wadi
blood dks heal themselves
weary notch
not like they used to
toxic wadi
oh ok
gaunt igloo
anyway, what I'd like to know is: would you get DMF trinket over a 325 vial (133 mastery, 936 str decaying for 18 sec, 1.5min cd)?
weary notch
probably. I'm 342 with DMF trink and one Strength in numbers trait, and I spike to nearly 190k health at times
DMF heals more than IP for me
gaunt igloo
it feels weird using the trinket, I either use it on pull, and it never lines up with avatar for dps, or try to use it defensively, and it kinda falls short
frosty holly
DMF trinket is actually good now
gaunt igloo
yea, i saw it was buffed, averaging about 20k hp and about 300 hps (if my math is right)
dark fossil
DMF?
gaunt igloo
dark moon faire
dark fossil
Got it.
dark fossil
Right, just didn't know the DMF acronym. π
Not enough gold to get it right now, but I'm tempted to try that, or one of the other decks.
gaunt igloo
if you still dont have the gold, either get the tank one or dont buy a deck, the dps ones usually are much more expensive and not worth that much gold so early in the expansion
(unless, obviously, you can spare that much gold)
dark fossil
Not really planning to buy a deck.
Running with a 340 gilded load figurine and a 355 lingering sporepods with a socket.
sage breach
oswain shield worth buying?
weary notch
depends on the price. It's BiS pre raid due to the ilvl alone
sage breach
what would you buy it for? 100k?
weary notch
but you'll replace it in raid, and your chance of replacing it is inversely proportional to the percentage of your gold you spend on it π
sage breach
lol
modern pulsar
Any cast macros you guys recommend? Trying to lump some abilities like avatar and demo shout
modern pulsar
Bc of gcd?
weary notch
yup
I macro my on use trinket to avatar
oh yikes, the cheapest Oswain's on my server is 300k and it's Warforged to 355
of course, if I buy it, a shield will drop next week
weary notch
if I don't, I won't get a shield until 8.1
sage breach
this guy's offering his for 160k
sick sentinel
600k on my server. 1 of 2, other was 350.
upgrade from heroic 325 riot shield.
was going to wait for a 355 socket oswain. but got impatient.
weary notch
yeah, that's tempting. My shield is also 325
static pilot
300 :(
bleak wyvern
put it into perspective a blood dk that is 20il lower than a protection warr is tankier
wary crystal
:/
bleak wyvern
like feels like shit going into a dung and healer leaves cus ur warr prot
wary crystal
Feels like ignore pain does almost nothing sometimes
bleak wyvern
waste of a click
static lance
use shield block instead.
static pilot
Not gonna lie, I feel like I have to work a hell of a lot harder to keep up than other classes when clearing a mythic dungeon. We can do it but it sure as hell doesn't feel good. I feel especially squishy in the opening pull before I can get my mitigation online and whenever avatar is on CD
bleak wyvern
reroll blood dk and actually enjoy tanking
static lance
ignore pain supplements whatever current CD you have up, it is not your main mitigation tool.
hazy yacht
feels like it
wary crystal
lol
static lance
i am leveling a paladin rn, tanking on it is so fucking dull. maybe it will change at mythic, but holy shit there are so many dead periods where I'm doing absolutely fuck all
bleak wyvern
just become a thicc arms boy
static pilot
I'm holding out hope that the problem really is my shield and replacing it will help but I feel like bringing a warrior for m+ is gonna be a liability when we have monks and DH available
bleak wyvern
dh is okayand blood decent
hazy yacht
DH and DK are gonna be the go-tos
bleak wyvern
prot pallys are gods
static lance
why are prot warriors going to be a liability?
digital vale
bleak wyvern
no self sustain
static pilot
Haven't run with a geared DK yet but DH and monk is solid for sure
hazy yacht
no utility, we're just punching bags
static pilot
No self sustain, patchy mitigation, very cool down dependent.
bleak wyvern
insane apm for little reward
digital vale
protection is very good π
upper spoke
are wowheads % drop chances of bfa mythic dungeon shields accurate? showing about 1% chance for motherlode shield and others
hazy yacht
seems right
sick sentinel
π€
bleak wyvern
yes
hazy yacht
i had to buy both a weapon and shield
sick sentinel
I dont understand this complaint comparison of prot tank slower than DK tank.
digital vale
i loot in mytic all item
bleak wyvern
done mythics since first week no shield but 5 weapons
static pilot
Who said slower?
hazy yacht
we do plenty of damage
bleak wyvern
atleast dk can tank and mitigate
hazy yacht
DKs EHP is so much higher with the sustain
bleak wyvern
go to any healer discord and ask who they hate healing
bleak wyvern
go ask
sick sentinel
prot warrs are not.
hazy yacht
and its better than out patchy mitigation
sick sentinel
thats the kit you're accepting playing one or the other.
modern fox
Can I macro intercept to mouse over
bleak wyvern
warrior sucks rn tank wise
static pilot
I did do that actually, resto shammies threw warriors under the bus
sick sentinel
if you dont like the AM style of prot warr, play the DK?
static lance
i've personally asked every single healer i did a mythic with how my damage intake was, because I am always concerned about my survivability.
They all said "You're fine, it was easy."
hazy yacht
oh, our damage intake is pretty consistant\
bleak wyvern
whybtake prot warriors over amything else they are detrimental to a raid
wary crystal
Pretty sure you can same way as heals
hazy yacht
warrios will be fine for raid
hazy yacht
yeah
static lance
actually, why are you guys even here?
sick sentinel
smh
static lance
i mean, if you're so certain DKs and DHs, are better, go play them.
then go to arms channel.
this is the prot channel.
wary crystal
I'm a masochist
bleak wyvern
offspec bro
static pilot
Because I love warrior and don't want to give up the dream
But it feels like an abusive relationship atm
bleak wyvern
warr is coinflip class
modern fox
Iβd rather tank as warrior than dk
static lance
the only complaint i can empathize with is the APM one.
cos yeah, its a really busy class compared to the rest.
bleak wyvern
thats biggest issue
vagrant cape
I'm glad we're getting different opinions on prot warrior. I haven't played the beta so I'm slightly worried about their m+ performance, but I'm incredibly happy with them right now
bleak wyvern
with rhe apm you would imagine a reward but yoy get less than anyone else
static pilot
Warrior APM feels a lot lower now though?
bleak wyvern
not really
weary notch
than in legion? much
static pilot
GCD lock on ignore pain etc slows the rotation down a lot
bleak wyvern
its more apm than fury
sick sentinel
im not worried. and didn't play the beta. feels better to me what prot warrior was in Legion where I did upto mythic +14 before I quit at Nighthold.
static lance
yeah, there's no more IP to spam off-GCD.
static pilot
I played Prot from start to finish on legion
Nothing cutting edge but I cleared hc and did keys up to about +20,loved the hell out of it
bleak wyvern
mage tank inc
undone sun
legion prot was π
static pilot
And now it feels like Im getting hit in the face by a shovel whenever I try to play it
vagrant cape
If there was an instant cast ability off the GCD that did absolutely nothing aside from spend 10 rage I'd be so happy. My problem is too much rage during trash pulls. You can't spend it all which means your anger management isn't being used to the fullest.
static pilot
I dunno, just doesn't gel at all for me
sick sentinel
yeah, doesn't feel different to me. definitely not worse.
weary notch
you mean heroic strike? π
wary crystal
Triggered
sick sentinel
the talents with demo synergy and everything else. hardly notice or care with the IP GCD.
inland silo
prots a snail class now
bleak wyvern
if u think warr isnt worse off than in legion yikes
inland silo
compared to what it was in legion
sick sentinel
I do miss heroic strike/focused rage.
vagrant cape
All tanks are worse off
sick sentinel
but w/e.
inland silo
its really not that fast anymore
vagrant cape
Than in Legion that is
hazy yacht
well, the game isnt as fast as legion was right now
sick sentinel
just because its not fast doesn't mean its worse for it. lol
lost a whole bunch of gear for it and dont have leggos either since then.
welcome to fresh again.
prisma crane
hitting 52% haste is pretty fun
static pilot
That's the thing, warrior doesn't feel fresh
hazy yacht
IP was pretty dumb at legion launch so we steamrolled everything out the gate
sick sentinel
then go play DK.
or something else.
and I was referring to ilvl fresh. not class fresh.
static pilot
Or.... We could make warriors better
sick sentinel
fresh expansion.
static pilot
It's not a zero sum game
sick sentinel
why? warriors are fine. they're what they're designed to be.
vagrant cape
I'm all for discussions about the drawbacks of warriors, but feeling fresh is rather subjective for a discussion about how well it's doing
static pilot
That's fair
sick sentinel
just because you don't like it, decides that it the absolute state of warriors now prot wise.
bleak wyvern
dude it really says something when a dk comes up to me and drops little tiny plates of metal in my cup saying i need it more than him cus he thinks im mitigationless
hazy yacht
i think i'd be happy if every other trash mob wasn;t stun immune
inland silo
i mean in current content prots more than fine
static pilot
Well, look around. I don't feel like I'm alone in being unhappy about how Prot plays atm
vagrant cape
Are there any trash mobs that are stun immune but NOT fear immune?
inland silo
i have a 266 shield and dont have any problems with any dungeons
hazy yacht
everything in kings rest?
static pilot
Can't think of one off the top of my head
inland silo
and we do dps damage
static pilot
266? Good lord, what level are you?
sick sentinel
mythics just plain boring now. mythic+ needs to come already.
inland silo
340 :^)
sick sentinel
and I havent even finished my 355 BS pieces yet.
static pilot
Link Armory please :)
hazy yacht
i did one, i'll finish the other next reset
inland silo
one sec
hazy yacht
rather, i can do one now
sick sentinel
just havent had time to mine.
hazy yacht
its like 3k worth of ore
sick sentinel
sitting on 30 hydrocores now. but load of explusum. zzz
vagrant cape
Some dungeons are going to favor one tank over others.
I want more discussion about where each tank shines and sputters and with what healers they do well with. Blanket statements like "prot is bad" don't really help any.
static pilot
I think it helps to home in on what it is that making warrior feel bad
inland silo
alright so 335 as prot
vagrant cape
We all know that already. IP and no self heal
static pilot
Because I agree, bad/clunky/slow doesn't really help
vagrant cape
I'd like to talk about specific places where people feel warriors suffer. What dungeons? What pulls? What team comps? What healers?
hazy yacht
at least buy a 300 shield...
inland silo
im waiting for that 340 emissary shield
vagrant cape
And get revered with CoA
hazy yacht
lol
static pilot
Hm... Let's see. I did a siege of borealis today, got chunked pretty good by the last pack before the ogre kiting boss
wary crystal
Wtf?
sick sentinel
still 10/10'd.
raven kernel
I have zero issues in mythic 0 dungeons
inland silo
ya
sick sentinel
end of 2nd week, got 325 from heroic tall dagger
static pilot
Still not sure what happened, but went from 100 to 20% health in less than 4 gcds
inland silo
i dont really wanna spend money when theres no issues with tanking lol
vagrant cape
I don't think anyone properly geared is having issues in m0. Where do we foresee problems in m+ though?
static pilot
Popped avatar, charged, tc, demoralizing shout, tc etc
sick sentinel
raven kernel
I don't forsee problems in m+ either
sick sentinel
have str flasks, runes, bountiful feasts ready ez for ez skate mythic+. minimum +7 expectations.
might get a fathoms. idk yet.
raven kernel
I'm clearing a 10 for sure
vagrant cape
Same
sick sentinel
blockades + fathoms if I dont get a jes howls
same.
thats the goal anyway. I didn't beta.
π
hazy yacht
i had a warforge proc on the emmisary the other day so a 350 vers trink
and blockades
vagrant cape
Sorry for changing the subject, but how do y'all prevent your stupid party members from facepulling pats and accidentally hitting other packs?
static pilot
Shock collars
vagrant cape
Yeah, but if I'm already doing a big pull I don't want more
In m+ I like to figure out how big of a pull I can do without dying
raven kernel
It's not your fault if others are bad
static pilot
It's not about assigning fault, it's about avoiding the situation entirely
vagrant cape
Knowing I'm faultless doesn't really prevent wipes though, so are there any tricks?
hazy yacht
at least if you see it coming and grab everything yourself you have a little more control over the situation
sick sentinel
I dont pug mythics @vagrant cape
static pilot
You can never 100% guarantee that, but you can try to mitigate it by hedging your bets
sick sentinel
and well heroics, I just grab all the shit, or let them die and then kill the shit.
static pilot
Los pulls and fighting in areas with minimal chance to pull more etc
vagrant cape
Pugging mythics is pretty bad, but my guildies are all asleep at 4 am apparently
sick sentinel
cus my battlegroup has non-english speakers, so often have those in my random heroics.
cant be helped.
static pilot
Really depends on the dungeon though, some are easier to set up than others. Good luck finding safe places to tank in Motherlode
static pilot
You are not wrong
vagrant cape
It's gonna be my +10 key, calling it now
sick sentinel
a lot of the trash is mostly physical, or shit to dodge/reflect.
raven kernel
Yeah that's a real easy place to get adds
uneven warren
Pawn addon is recommending Vers-first stat weights but most guides say Haste>Vers/Mastery. Raidbots doesn't load weights for prot. Is Vers build viable for spell fights?
sick sentinel
really isn't that bad unless you aren't paying attention.
pawn is trash. doesn't work for prot. dont trust pawn.
hazy yacht
i think thats most my problem with prot at the moment is the demonic trash pulls
sick sentinel
raid bots/sims don't work either. APL doesn't exist for prot.
hazy yacht
bosses are cake. no issues with anything
vagrant cape
It's not the damage the trash does (aside from the earth Lancer things that apply those nature dots. They can get scary)
My issue with motherlode trash is that it takes forever to kill those big mechs toward the end
uneven warren
I just memorize stats then I guess
static pilot
The peace keepers?
vagrant cape
Yeah. I feel like dps don't use CDs because they're close to a boss
But the boss is a fucking joke
static pilot
Most of them can be avoided with some creative routing
sick sentinel
usually why you'll find yourself (the knowledgeable tank) top DPS in pug heroic cus you are popping them sweet dank CDs.
static pilot
But Good luck getting pug dps to target mech jocks :-/
hazy yacht
skull macro works wonders in pugs
believe it or not, most people know what it means
anyone had bad experiences with a disc priest yet?
static pilot
Haven't spent any time with one in mythic but I've heard some stories
hazy yacht
negative?
lilac onyx
anyone else feel like prot warrior is a little lacking compared to the rest of the tanks?
broken kite
Ya but what ya gonna do
static pilot
Both. Seems like a high ceiling low floor class atm
lilac onyx
just curious what yalls thoughts are
sick sentinel
usually run a disc/holy priest or paladin.
raven kernel
Prot is definitely low floor
sick sentinel
no issues mythics.
raven kernel
Real easy to play bad on prot
sick sentinel
heroic pugs, dont notice unless its some bad that purposely just DPSes.
raven kernel
Which leads to public stigma
sick sentinel
as a healer.
static pilot
Not loving it but holding out hope for better days. Feels like we have to work harder than other tanks to keep up
lilac onyx
ive played prot since wod, doing mythics/heroic. i just seem to be taking a lot more damage than my monk tank i run with
static pilot
You're not alone, a lot of people feel that way atm
raven kernel
I feel mitigation is good