worth using t21 for the set bonus?
#protection
quiet delta
regal island
don't bring other plate to your groups Sev, stack ranged dps
old zephyr
2p is dead 4p Will cost you so much ilvl you'll be the one dying
regal island
no plate ranged dp 😃
serene shuttle
my guild is lacking in the dps department though lol
regal island
well then just tell them you need the stats and it's an upgrade for you that you're keeping it
a spine goes a long way too.
regal island
WQ when your ilvl 320ish
quiet delta
ah okay
serene shuttle
item restored from scrapping
strong forum
ashvane is literally bis, why would you scrap that ?!
serene shuttle
i didnt know that lol
strong forum
monkaS
plain ice
monkaS
serene shuttle
and i thought the traits were random anyways, so technically another piece could be bis depending on traits
limber tulip
MonkaS
jeeeeebus
talk about not knowing what you got
@undone sun have you done any more blockades testing
serene shuttle
i was looking at the traits on it thats all
ember arrow
thyme is offline
twin hazel
what are our other 'bis' azerite pieces? is that in the guide?
i also got an ashvane
ive mostly only received azerite pieces last week
that and 3 pairs of pants
strong forum
i only got 1 azerite piece, luckily bis helmet
twin hazel
blockades in the BiS gear section of the icy veins guide needs update
winged elm
strong forum
^this
cyan cargo
you all think the berserkers in kings rest are supposed to be doing that much bleed damage or just currently overtuned?
twin hazel
i think all bleeds are overtuned so far lol
twin hazel
ticks in underrot 😐
regal island
like 11k per stack so any more than 2-3 (especially on the two zerker pull) just kite
regal island
iirc immune to stuns and slow, so yeah hunter pets, shaman elemental, treants all help a lot
twin hazel
or CC one
wild atlas
We had two hunters. They used their pets to tank/eat a stack
regal island
same for the zul chick near the end of kings rest
twin hazel
they are trapable
regal island
the zul chick always kills me
it's like 30k every cast and cant do much about it so pop cd's and try to blow her up
the bosses all hit like wet noodles though so that's nice at least
wild atlas
Last boss surprised me. He spends more time doing different casts than he does actually fighting me. So that one was cheese
regal island
yeah just SB his wana be fel claws and it's cake
wild atlas
Yea. Trash was harder than the bosses lol. I enjoyed the DG tho. We’ve had 2 guildies get that mount so far this week 😮
gilded jasper
Anyone know if the change to the Darkmoon trinket makes it usable now?
serene shuttle
they went from like 80k on my server to now being 130k lol
regal island
yeah i picked it up cheap for 65k on mine, but i was just wanting ilvl to get to 305 asap
wild atlas
I bought 5 this morning for 50k apiece. Hope those prices rise!
gilded jasper
They are much more expensive on my server lol. I will have my boy make me one though if it's good.
stark sage
you will probably replace it early on during the raid, but until then its better than most dungeon trinkets
unless you get like a TF wolf trinket
regal island
honestly start of xpac gold price will only increase from last xpac so buying now is smarter than waiting
gilded jasper
I'm at 339 ATM I just have that stupid ass Pod trinket that heals and AoE
prisma crane
DMD price will drop
regal island
now that it's better?
gilded jasper
Was hoping this change made it viable to some degree.
twin hazel
it will go up for now
serene shuttle
i havent had any trinkets drop yet 😦
regal island
nah immortality never dropped in price, doubt blockades will with the buff
twin hazel
but it will drop again
prisma crane
prices will drop as the expac progresses because people wont need it
serene shuttle
i still have the dm trinket and plunderbeards flask
prisma crane
immortality was good throughout the expansion because armor
gilded jasper
I also have the flask.
prisma crane
this one wont behave the same
regal island
depends they might make them upgradeable for ilvl like they did in legion
twin hazel
well immortality was good despite the low iLvl so thus it never droipped
stark sage
it dropped slightly over the course of the xpac
prisma crane
this one is good because not many viable alternatives
stark sage
like maybe 20%
prisma crane
esp for the ilvl
stark sage
yeah atm its just a high ilvl defensive trinket
nothing to write home about
but not useless
gilded jasper
Alright I will have my boy make it for me and let you know how it goes :)
regal island
works well with indom, all i really care about
stark sage
indom 🤢
regal island
stable though
prisma crane
indom isnt great man
regal island
stuff that kills this xpac is not really blockable
i'm not dying to blockable attacks
hence indom
stark sage
i think the EHP gain would be the same, indom is a % increase
regal island
bolster is nice for blockable trash pulls, but indom helps with literally everything
stark sage
the reduced CD on last stand is also a huge part of the power of bolster ¯_(ツ)_/¯
prisma crane
you also get a shorter CD on LS which gives 30% HP on demand instead of 10% for w/e
quiet relic
Bolster-laststand-shout so sexy though
prisma crane
coupled with AM and you can use it all the time
stark sage
yeah really its AM's fault making bolster much better than indom
regal island
and has some synergy with my 3x bury the hatchet (once i unlock them anyways)
stark sage
if we didnt have AM then the choice would be competitive and largely based on how deadly blockable damage was
regal island
i mean a 36k base shield every 30 sec + a 20% hp heal every 30 sec is super nice.
prisma crane
AM is what makes the class more fun, would be better if we had better rage dumps, but w/e
regal island
which apparently is effected by vers so add 10% to those
prisma crane
it sounds like you're trying to play for self sustain
regal island
nah just gonna hop in heroic uld asap
i want 200k to survive the tank busters in there
with self shields etc i should be good.
prisma crane
you also have more healers
and more effective uptime on LS
which means a very high "SB" uptime
prisma crane
so then embrace our strength and take no damage outside of those bleeds and magic...
you still have IP and SR
sick sentinel
im a noob tank, just stated this exp, how do i counter bleeds and magict hen?
grim prism
Ignore pain and defensive cooldowns
prisma crane
SR for magic, IP for bleed and CDs
cinder bridge
stoneform
sick sentinel
Cool thanks
regal island
IP + impending victory w/bury the hatchet is the best solution i've found
grim prism
Physical damage is what puts you in a position to be killes by magic and bleeds
regal island
it's actually pretty nice for trash as well since it resets on kill
grim prism
Kind of silly to just write off 90% of your damage intake as irrelevant
prisma crane
you're not going to take ITF in raids?
regal island
depends on the fight
grim prism
Just because we handle it better than other tanks doesnt make it a non-issue
regal island
and what's killing the tanks
prisma crane
like, you know your talent choices are the kind that get screen shotted and put here right?
next you're gonna say ravager has uses
quiet relic
The biggest strength of a warrior right now your low cooldowns on LS and DS not self healing
grim prism
Ravager DOES have uses
prisma crane
physical melee dmg, despite being something that's smooth, is still often our highest source of dmg
grim prism
That doesnt mean it is competitive or even viable lll
prisma crane
it has visual appeal, that's it
regal island
ravager = rancing rune weapon for warriors, it's definitly not horrible, but the damage component sucks
prisma crane
you can't look at talents in a vacuum
you have to look at what you lose when you select them
regal island
if you think about chaining your cd's. ravager fits into the chain. But it's rng of parry soo.
prisma crane
and losing AM is huge
quiet relic
Our talents are basically set in stone for us atm
prisma crane
tanking and RNG... there's a reason proc trinkets arent great
signal plover
Ravager is awful
grim prism
If physical damage isnt what kills you then why even remotely defend ravager 
regal island
yeah BV + AM just have great synergy.
modern junco
guys were invulnerable on the last boss in underrot, can just keep killing spores with thunderclap and spam victory rush
stark sage
all of our talents have synergy with AM, that's why the build fits together
modern junco
lul
regal island
because ravager doesn't really compete with tank buster attacks.
t1 talents =/= t100 talents
prisma crane
and you dont want IV, like, ever
quiet relic
^
regal island
15% haste vs a 40k bubble + 20% heal every 30 sec are not the same
prisma crane
in your ST dmg scenario, you'd be better off with punish than IV
punish also works for all dmg
quiet relic
Punish = sexy
prisma crane
also, fwiw, it's closer to 18%+ haste
in a raid with decent gear
plus that 20% heal is largely useless if you're preping for dmg taken
junior ivy
junior ivy
😄
prisma crane
damn nice
quiet relic
Gnome warrior best warrior but had to go human for rep uhh
signal plover
Still a gnome lel
grim prism
Kappa
signal plover
U could tank for Method and still be a fake warr
sick sentinel
gnomes are bis
junior ivy
^
signal plover
Kek
grim prism
Best in short
prisma crane
i have 1181 haste, w/e that is, armory says 17.2%, but idk if it's counting any ITF atm
signal plover
Get your minions outta here
twin hazel
I love that armor set on gnomes tho
actually i love gnomes in general
they are my guilty pleasure
pretty delicious
prisma crane
there's dozens of you guys, dozens
steel mauve
highmountain warrior best warrior
weak talon
What kind of haste would we be looking before looking into other stats? Base stat I mean
timid jay
I'd say 100% haste with ITF ;)
prisma crane
im sure others win for dps before then
quiet relic
DID SOME ONE SAY HASTE?
prisma crane
all that said, STR still better than haste
uneven mason
Letsee...116% haste is where you should aim for..
timid jay
Why 116%?
timid jay
For 💯 % SB uptime you need 173.9% haste before 5 itf stacks
prisma crane
so you need 73.9%
yea
god dammit
you beat me by like 2 sec
that's not 100% SB uptime though
timid jay
73.9% haste would give you 9 sec CD.with itf
prisma crane
then you need 160.9% haste
timid jay
math on phone is hard ok
twin hazel
heres a math problem for you what sort of haste would we need for 100% SB uptime with HR
uneven mason
affected by RNG
timid jay
But yeah, it's 160%
prisma crane
but regardless, as was teh 116% in legion, it's not obtainable, just know that haste is good for us
fierce juniper
If you count Bolster you'll need quite a bit less than 100% Haste to reach 100% effective uptime on SBlock/Block. But whatever that number is you won't be able to reach it unless Lust is up or something, so you'll never not go for Haste.
But if consistent 100% effective block uptime is reached somehow, Haste becomes the worst stat by far, defensively speaking.
prisma crane
even more than crit!
uneven mason
Crit gives you parry
prisma crane
but GL figuring out that math problem, cuz you have to figure out rough RPS to figure out CDR on LS
twin hazel
hey marok are the zone azerite traits measured?
are they shit and thats why they arent in the guide?
fierce juniper
Haven't looked into the uldir one specifically. afaik you'll want at least one, but that's it
other than that you'll always want a spec one
twin hazel
kay so they are possibly good but the spec ones are just way better
fierce juniper
yeah i mean generally speaking random procs will be worse than consistent increases or on-use stuff
unless those latter things provide significantly more stat or whatever
err i said that backwards
twin hazel
This glory in battle one we get from the US emissary seems nice
well idk how crit is these days
fierce juniper
unless those procs provide significantly more stat or whatever*
twin hazel
and an actual good proc rate
manic river
guys quick question, why does pawn stat weight differ from all the other guides? it is str>stam>versatility>=mastery>crit>haste
twin hazel
how are you getting your weights, when ther are no working sims
timid jay
Maybe AMR is working 4head
grim prism
There are no weights for tanking
manic river
well in icy-veins there are weights
fierce juniper
where are you seeing that?
grim prism
There is a priority
manic river
so does noxxic
prisma crane
noxxic... 🤦
twin hazel
noxxic LUL
uneven mason
🤢
oak nebula
havent heard about noxxic in years
uneven mason
Noxxusia
timid jay
It's still surprising noxxic is still around
prisma crane
what kills me is idk how noxxic can STILL be that bad, for what feels like decades
green forge
stat priority =/= weight
timid jay
One would think people would stop using it
grim prism
We dont have any meaningful breakpoints, nor is there any effective way to sim for resilience, thus weights do not exist
fierce juniper
@manic river Stat weights and a stat priority are completely different. The stat priority in Pawn is determined by its built in weights, and those weights are wrong.
manic river
still, its not about noxxic here
uneven mason
when you do a search for something like "protection warrior stat weights"
or "how do me huntar"
manic river
@fierce juniper then i shouldnt be able to run dungeons, or even with those stats i might be able to play, how does this works
prisma crane
what?
fierce juniper
What do you mean?
prisma crane
you get gear, ilvl is most important (in 95% of cases) and then you follow stat priority if you have similar ilvl gear
trinkets are case by case
grim prism
You prioritize ilvl because that is where you get strength, stam, armor
And the rest is just comparing the relative value of each secondary stat
prisma crane
and the icy veins guide explains when to upgrade azerite armor
uneven mason
Like, can't run dungeons?
grim prism
Since there are no meaningful breakpoints, e.g. we dont ever need X stat in order to do Y, there is no reason to do weighting
prisma crane
you can run anything with shit gear, it's just going to be rougher
uneven mason
Hows that work "ERMAHGURD I DUNNO MAH STURT WERTS, BUTTNOS CAN'T PRESS"
grim prism
Reel it in kar. Lol
fierce juniper
That's not really accurate Balsaq, stat weights don't really have anything to do with breakpoints, weights just show the relative value of stats.
manic river
when did this discord channel became such a shit show
prisma crane
it's just a different mentality if you come from DPSing, tanks behave differently
uneven mason
I suppose.
timid jay
Ilvl matters a lot for us since armor and mainstat has a high value for us
prisma crane
you can't really sim for surv unless you build the sim around a fight
timid jay
Not to mentioned raw amount of stats
fierce juniper
@manic river We're trying to help you
manic river
@fierce juniper you do, others are just trying to mock me because i said something "funny" to them, i legit tried to avoid this place because of that kind of people, but since there is no information available, i came here, ill post what my stats look like, brb
timid jay
There are survivability weights you can plop into pawn, but the accuracy is highly questionable
prisma crane
forgive me, just know that noxxic isnt a great place to visit for useful info
the pins here are usually a great location to start to figure out what you need
vivid perch
Anyone know with the changes to DMC trinket, is it worth it to buy now?
prisma crane
it's mentioned in macro's trinket guide
uneven mason
@manic river Sorry, so, in general, item level, is going to be king for prot, the guides give you a solid guideline of what stats to prioritize, but weights are not something you can produce for tanking (IE there is no 1 point of haste is worth X EHP)
fierce juniper
I mean, you can make "fake" weights based on the stat priority if you really wanted to. and plug that into Pawn. but that's no better than just eyeballing gear anyway
prisma crane
if you think it's worth the cost, you can get it, but itll get replaced in uldir very likely
personally i love that i dont have to sim myself every time i need to know if gear is good or not
manic river
@prisma crane the same information posted on icy-veins is in noxxic, but idk, everyone and their mother can Ctr+C and then Ctr+V
prisma crane
if that's the case then noxxic is the most accurate i've ever seen it
uneven mason
Marok wrote the IV guide, its legit
prisma crane
the priority on the top is accurate, the weights kinda come from nowhere
uneven mason
But yeah, it was the terminology, tanks follow a stat priority, if there was a breakpoint for that priority (say, 30% haste) it would be in the guide
west snow
Just got the 340 weapon from Atal'Dazar with a socket. Is Stalwart enchant really better than Haste? Vers?
uneven mason
Armor > all
prisma crane
the talent section is decent for a single source of heavy dmg, but i'd still personally prefer ITF over Punish
west snow
It's just odd that they do 50/600 for every enchant when things don't exactly scale the same
uneven mason
I could see the vers enchant having some application in high magic situations, but since its RNG its not going to be very apperciable beyond just making yourself a bigger brick.
grim prism
So flavorful tho
uneven mason
Tanking enchants have always been more amazing for tanks than others
same for healer specific enchants for the most part ( what was that one during MoP?)
prisma crane
noxxic didnt update the gems, but that's ok, still showing haste
they weight stam flask way higher though, i'd still stick with STR flask
since STR gives armor as well
grim prism
If armor is your reason for taking a str flask over a stam flask you may want to doublecheck the napkin math
uneven mason
Stam flask is 1.5x the benefit of the str flask *shrug ymmv
prisma crane
well then fix IV
uneven mason
raw health has its uses
manic river
@fierce juniper ok so, my stats look like this, i havent got a problem while tanking, i feel very solid, https://puu.sh/Bi2JY/bde96c2744.png i have done every dungeon in mythic last week, my azerite traits are optimal, i do ran into problems with ranged mobs/casters but i think its because i cant efectively block shit
grim prism
I'd still run a str flask regardless due to habit and wanting to be a pad queen
Your stats are fine
prisma crane
you need more haste, but that all depends on what gear options you've had
sour crypt
is there a haste cap to hit for prot?
uneven mason
IP scales from Attack power too
prisma crane
yes, 73.9%
uneven mason
so chances are yeah, str flask
prisma crane
so no, no haste to hit
grim prism
@sour crypt no
prisma crane
73.9 for shortest GCD, 160.8 for 100% SB uptime, but less because of Bolster
again, not really, cuz neither are reachable
those both assume 5x ITF stacks
grim prism
Just get as much haste as possible without dumping ilvl
sour crypt
ah that answered my question ty
grim prism
That goes for @manic river as well
Your stam and armor are going to do more for you than haste or vers
Or mastery or anything
uneven mason
yeah as far as gearing goes with the holdout on keeping DC if you don't have another source of it, Item Level > 2ndaries
grim prism
Just assume ilvl > all until you have the option to sidegrade for secondaries
sour crypt
huh interesting didn’t know that held for prot given how strong haste seems to be
sankyu all
grim prism
Well
grim prism
Considering the long-ass cooldown on shield block and the fact that AM is so much stronger than HR on tier 100 with the recommended build
Haste isnt doing a hell of a lot beyond increasing your DPS and making it feel nicer to play
sour crypt
any of y’all have like recommended dungeons / bosses to run or avoid for gearing
little star
i recommend all of them
uneven mason
Armor / (Armor + k) rite?
grim prism
DR = 1 - (armor / armor + k)
uneven mason
k is a variable that is applied to whatever npc is interacting with your armor
yeah its 6300
chances are that will change
as teirs go up
to keep armor/block relevant
rather to make it so they're not hitting the non block tanks so hard that they turn into red mist the instant a boss looks at them
our block rating uses the same table/variable as well
rather uses the same scale
sour crypt
i love that block is so powerful tbh
uneven mason
different table
grim prism
Thank you for saying block is powerful
compact sigil
is the Darkmoon Deck Blockades any better now that it has been buffed?
uneven mason
don't let blizzard know
compact sigil
lol
grim prism
We dont hear it enough here
uneven mason
Yeah its solid
grim prism
@compact sigil yes, way better.
Idk how it compares to others
But its at least worth considering now lol
Unlike beforr
compact sigil
excellent, i saw them going for like 95k on my server, picked one up, was super glad to hear it got buffed, didnt notice much from it before
sour crypt
also just curious, are there any cases where reflecting a big spell is good vs just keeping the % reduction on a non reflectable effect?
uneven mason
There isn't anything reflectable in the raid sadly
You use SR for tankbusters, and hope an add doesn't flameshock it the fuck off before the Kamehameha rolls over you.
grim prism
But i'd rather keep the flat 20% than get one nice reflect and have my shit blown in half a secind later
compact sigil
sad times the only weapon I have gotten in mythic so far is the 2h sword from the last boss in King's Rest
grim prism
/taunt or /cast taunt
compact sigil
lmao, yeah, we have one in our guild that i'm pretty sure has me on ignore now
uneven mason
/cast taunt
kind prairie
Macro them together. Do both
compact sigil
has anyone played with the Retaliating Fury trait?
spring lotus
quick napkin math puts stamina flask well ahead of strength flask for effective health
but no napkin math on IP value gained or anything
compact sigil
i havent really seen it in any azerite trait lists
compact sigil
lol
spring lotus
150000/(10000*(1-(6316/(6316+6300)))) = 30.03 seconds time to live. strength flask,
157140/(10000*(1-(6209/(6209+6300)))) = 31.2 seconds time to live, stamina flask```if my math isn't off
strength flask is very very minor, but honestly it shouldn't matter unless you're pushing content super hard
and not taking into account IP
sour crypt
hmm I’m curious if the dps increase from the str flask is still worth it for some content (almost certainly not raids)
fierce juniper
@manic river Had to afk for a bit, sorry.
There's no such thing as stats that "look good".
You could have 5% haste but 99% Vers and that would be better than having 20% haste and 5% vers. That's why item level is important. Having more stats is generally always better.
There's not a specific amount of any stat you need to go for. Take item level upgrades while taking the stat priority into consideration.
And this is not directed at you at all Pragma, but when people link a picture of their stat percentages/values that information is literally useless when it comes to helping people because it doesn't actually tell you anything.
urban oak
Hi guys, I just started with protection warrior, you guys have any tips and tricks for me?
Im struggling abit with AoE tanking atm, single target isnt any issue for me atleast
covert fable
weary python
Avatar is what you use for AoE control
It let's you spam that thunderclap
If you are grouped with classes using large AoE, you can use your AoE fear to break uninteruptabke spellcasting if the mobs are ccable
They'll run but damage from AoE will break the fear immediately and their spellcasting will stop
twin hazel
just got a 350 Rezans gleaming eye 😄
twin hazel
mythic
copper basin
Hey guys, how is protected faring pre raid? Seen horror storys on forums.
oak nebula
warriors are fine, im doing fine ive cleared mythics with no issues at all
copper basin
Yeah I've seen tanks that were fine also, I just wondered if the people crying were trash or if there was an actual issue
copper basin
Cool, thank you all.
urban oak
@weary python tnx for the tip
grim prism
@copper basin tldr trash
Forums are always a cesspool at the start of a tier
... or just always
oak nebula
never browse wow forums at the very least its always bad
grim prism
@sour crypt my philosophy is if you already arent dying, you should be doing more DPS
Tanking fights is just rehearsing and refining
uneven mason
whats the ap coefficient on IP?
grim prism
Past a certain point there isnt much to do but add damage
grim prism
Str flask wont give as much raw ehp as stam, but it is still a decent option considering it boosts IP as well as damage throughput
I dont need a napkin to tell you i'm running str flasks regardless
uneven mason
well right, but as a warrior once we reach the 'I'm not going to die in an instant" raw health begins to lose value 😉
Do it for me
grim prism
It was objectively better in legion with the way IP scaled with attack power
It may or may not still be the case
Napkins aside, daddy needs to pad meters
leaden carbon
BEHOLD,... my stuff
final mist
Don't forget that Strength now also increases our Armor.
Not just things like IP.
I would say that Str flasks win regardless just because having more Stam isn't always necessarily the call - even on progression.
leaden carbon
the stam potion feels underwhelming
grim prism
Thst was mentioned above
I just meant disregarding the attack power boost, stam is going to add more spongines than str
But yeah, I agree. Str is the way
sick sentinel
warriors are fine. anything otherwise is ignorance or l2p issue
uneven mason
Sal thats what the EHP above was charting, the raw HP vs the armor benefit
uneven mason
I think without ocnsidreing IP stam wins
minscule amount wins
but considering IP< str wins
sick sentinel
STR life
prisma crane
but you have to also account for healers
sick sentinel
get more than enough stam from ilvl anyway.
prisma crane
that math assumes no heals
uneven mason
right, its a EHP
prisma crane
100x your HP would make that math better
uneven mason
EHP is literally just a snapshot of how long you take to die.
if no outside intervention
prisma crane
but once you're able to survive without being one shot with proper play, extra stam becomes less valuable
grim prism
Which, by the way, literally everyone can at 120
uneven mason
Right, beyond situations where you might need the padding (or the padding allows you to perform a mechanic in a different way - See Druids )
prisma crane
well yea, we dont have those legion situations (atm)
grim prism
Unless youre trying to do mythics at 280 or something
uneven mason
I'm sure a few of the mythics could be tanked at 280 without much problem
a few of them though
plain ice
what would ya'll choose between the following trinkets for mythic dungeons (currently at 337 ilvl equipped): 340 briny barnacle, 345 jes' howler, 325 rezan's gleaming eye, 320 emblem of zandalar
uneven mason
splat
Big trolls in temple 🤢 tanking those at 302
that was a "NOPE" and kite moment
uneven mason
Yeah, I don't think my healer was expecting that much damage to come in hah
grim prism
Captain bigdick over here tanking the whole universe 
prisma crane
but a lot of this, to me at least, is still just trial and error until i learn the dungeons
no, just wanted to do mythics in the limited time i've played lately lol
it's a "bit" smoother now over 320 lol
im still far behind a bunch of you guys though
grim prism
Yeah im just razzing you
grim prism
Best way to gear is to do shit before the game allows you to
Idk why they require 305 for heroics
prisma crane
cuz average player base and pugs
grim prism
Fkn drag getting carried until i could queue
prisma crane
they still want people to be able to complete shit they random queue for
grim prism
My irl friends who had the week off dragging me through heroics while they are 325
Until i could queue myself for gear lol
I feel like it took me longer to go from 280 to 305 than it did from 305 to 330
prisma crane
i need to do more solo Qs anyways for the caches, ez gold
muted wyvern
did they buff the darkmoon deck? i saw something in notes saying it was healing for less than intended?
quiet delta
guys where is prot warr now on top5?
daring marlin
@leaden carbon nice shield my dude
leaden carbon
best shield
grim geyser
Where? @quiet delta
leaden carbon
ì hadd a 266 until recently
grim geyser
I got a 340 weapon this morning... keeping aggro is a lot easier..
daring marlin
Same until I bought a 300 and immediately got a 325 from rezan lol
grim geyser
i had a 280 wep.
daring marlin
rip
daring marlin
@grim prism raid finder requires 300 and heroic dungeons is 305 🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔
grim prism
Whats your point
grim prism
I agree. Lol
Sorry, i was on pretilt
Youre right
For an expansion that seems so dedicated to making the game casual-centric, they sure do make it weirdly difficult for fresh toons to get over the hump
Not sure what they were going for there
Maybe they are trying to steer people toward Communities
leaden carbon
in lergion it was mostly the same
grim prism
Dont WQs only drop 300 gear at first? Or am I making that up
leaden carbon
now?
sick sentinel
WQ's scale to a degree with your ilvl average.
leaden carbon
up to 330 :c
chilly barn
are there any handy professions forprot besides BS being able to make own gear ?
topaz ember
i got from level 110 to 112 just herbing on mining on my warlock
and*
and the belt sheild is engineering only but it can go on any belt so thats anice
prisma crane
im not taking rocket boots off my belt
topaz ember
both are pretty cheap to make so ill probably just witch for raid night
one is just the tinker kit which is like a gold and the other is only a few ore
wide juniper
wowhead is down? monkaS
dapper cliff
Any one play with the DMC trinket post buff?
regal island
it's just more stam/healing
@prisma crane have you noticed the boots failing a lot more at lvl 120?
mine seem to
prisma crane
feels about the same if you mean the belt
but yea, rocket boots, w/e still stupid its on the belt
lol
regal island
yeah rocket boots eng enchant. Mine fails like 50% of the time and dots me
plain ice
what would ya'll choose between the following trinkets for mythic dungeons (currently at 337 ilvl equipped): 340 briny barnacle, 345 jes' howler, 325 rezan's gleaming eye, 320 emblem of zandalar
prisma crane
i love when it fails while doing WQ
can just glider far AF
it's like a launchpad in fortnite lol
prisma crane
you almost never need it in raids
it's pretty worth in M+
usually if you hit it in M+ it's an oh shit moment anyways, it'll either save you or it wont
lone cobalt
any reflect wekauras available for bfa dungeons ?
regal island
i noticed the belt fear works on the berserkers and guardian in seth and kings
muted wyvern
I just bought a blockades hoping its buff is decent
simple flicker
is the stat "Callous reprisal" better than Retaliatiory fury?
also already have another peice with Callout reprisal as my artifact power
vagrant cape
Which two of these trinkets do y'all think I should equip? I'm stumped.
vocal nimbus
flask and clock
vagrant cape
so a socket isn't worth 5 ilvls?
silk mortar
All better tjam crot
vocal nimbus
but you have the socket in the flask?
vagrant cape
also, I heard the clock is bugged and only gives like 98 haste
oh, so I do
I'm distracted
wraith ginkgo
Guys on the blockable/reflectable pin, what is meant by a move being blockable?
prisma crane
it means shield block will mitigate the damage you take from said ability
that and during Last Stand if you have bolster
wraith ginkgo
So it means if its a YES then we shield block before that move is cast?
prisma crane
it just means that it's blockable, so yes, in most cases
wraith ginkgo
and a yes on spell reflect moves we should sr then a
what of the non-blockable casts? we just avoid them? or fight through them
prisma crane
but, just because one thing is blockable, doesnt mean something else blockable is better to have block up (assuming there's a scenario you have to make this choice)
avoid anything if you can
but otherwise it's just time for a CD or external or man mode through it
wraith ginkgo
The good thing about this lsit is its perfect for giving me an idea about the big boss casts i need to be aware of beforehand to time my blocks well
thanks for clarifying
prisma crane
yep, when used properly, block is incredibly powerful
wraith ginkgo
cuz what i fell in the trap of
prisma crane
same with SR
wraith ginkgo
is just using it as soon as its available.
prisma crane
yea
wraith ginkgo
and thats not actually the best way
wraith ginkgo
i need to time it well. and what if ignore pain?
we dont use that unless we r really getting rekt right?
I guess the pin can answer that for me
thanks Krot
prisma crane
oh sry
IP you just use if you have the rage and need the extra mitigation
and if you have the open GCD
junior ivy
i hate the fact that im using a fist weapon
!!
it feels so stupid
fist weapon as a tank
strong forum
thats bad cuz you lack the strength from it
junior ivy
it has strength actually
junior ivy
strong forum
huh thats rare
grim prism
It is blue, so
zealous heart
prisma crane
she has that item
the picture says so
i love fist weapons because they hide when sheathed
uneven mason
Str Fist weapon? Time to Xmog that!
tidal field
Would be cool to use the Drake claw from bwl or the giant molten fist from (sorry, raid escapes me).
uneven mason
Hyjal
wild atlas
TK!
somber light
anyone test darkmoon deck blockades since they buffed it?
uneven mason
Its worth getting now.
tidal field
One of the BIS trinkets now potentially?
safe perch
they fixed stam/healing procs
urban oak
How do you guys go when you go in for an aoe pull?
Just random packs of mobs in dungeons
toxic wadi
Does anyone feel like thunder clap is out of place for warriors?
thematically it feels like an enh shaman spell
tidal field
If it's a large pull I use avatar and charge in to get quick thunder clap refreshes
Just keep using that to keep agro
@toxic wadi I see it as you hit the ground so hard it displaces air causing a thunder clap
signal plover
Make sure ur using the UF talent
It's just your warrior balls smashing against the dirt
Class fantasy
toxic wadi
@tidal field Yeah I get the idea, although they might need to remove the lightning then lkol
then lol*
oh wait I think that's my glyph
tidal field
@toxic wadi lightning is the rule of cool lol, plus odeen and thunder kinda makes sense
toxic wadi
right
tidal field
Yes that is the glyph lol
toxic wadi
is it better to select spec-agnostic azerite traits so you can switch between specs, say arms and prot?
fossil sparrow
probably, whenever I find a sword to try out tanking, I'll have a fury specific trait 
plain ice
sorry to ask again, but which two of the following trinket would ya'll choose: 340 briny barnacle, 345 jes' howler, 325 rezan's gleaming eye, 320 emblem of zandalar
broken kite
Jes+rezan
little star
jes's howler and rezans
little star
it is now
leaden carbon
more or less the best we can get... for now
little star
versus the 340 channel trinket that you can't block during ye
nvm was thinking of the sethralis trinket
plain ice
thanks all 🙌 - that's what i figured and had equipped
severe steeple
seth trinket is 💩
floral hatch
How do you guys deal with the shadow of zul before the final boss in Kings Rest? I wall and use spell relect but still die every time there. Is there a mechanic I'm missing? Or is it on the healer?
The circle isn't whats killing me either, it's just the barrage.
little star
it does require alot of healing ye and its just spend all rage on IP SR on cd and rotate cds
floral hatch
Ok, that's what I'm doing. Guess I just need an external with magic damage.
little star
call for an external if u need it aswell
floral hatch
Thanks.
plain ice
had the same problem last night doing it for the first time
hoooo weeee that was a lot of damage
imagine it on fortified/grevious weeks
strong forum
kings rest wasnt in the beta for the longest time cuz it was bugged / overtuned
from what i can tell mobs are still overtuned in the dungeon
bosses are fairly ez but some of the mobs just shred through me
strong forum
berserkers
plain ice
ya those
cloud bone
the bleed from the berserkers is killer even at 1 stack
plain ice
fuck those guys
cloud bone
like It was better for my group to kill them and let me die from the bleed than for my healer to try and heal me
strong forum
we burned through everything
plain ice
only pulling one of those at a time
strong forum
but still hurt a lot
wasnt lotta fun
too many casters
"we intent to have less magic dmg"
yet kings rest is more casts than anything
so you get fucked over as prot
that was my experience
we didnt wipe, i only died twice
but still
felt awful
literally the only dungeon where i died more than once
cant imagine how bad it would be on higher m+
junior ivy
is there gonna be fishing dailies eventually?
wraith ginkgo
Id love that.. fishing feels kind of bland this expansion compared to legion
there was so much fishing content in legion with the angler
tropic star
does anyone know who gives the call to arms quest
strong forum
pvp headquarters in boralus
strong forum
most likely
summer sequoia
so is the darkmoon tank trinket good now?
summer sequoia
serious?
is there a post or anything
want verification before i drop like 200k on it
quiet relic
200k? Ooooffff I paid 48k for mine xD
strong forum
its the best defensive trinket
ember arrow
there are no good def trinkets atm
ye but a turd with whipped cream on it is still a turd
ember arrow
it is the best def trinket for raid start
but it will be replaced quickly probably
keepo that in mind mokhu
strong forum
i thought that was implied
summer sequoia
for 80k and knowing my luck with trinkets probably fine
ember arrow
its not the same caliber as dmd immortality was
steel mauve
imo its cheap enough to buy for raid start just to be replaced
any thing for that little bit of edge
ember arrow
depends how much you value gold, how much gold you have and if u really want it
strong forum
for me it was giga worth cuz 20k is literally nothing
summer sequoia
wow tokens tanked too, dang it. I knew I should have bought one before bfa
steel mauve
i got mine piece by piece for 35k
summer sequoia
im running the alch trinket and a +STR with haste proc (294)
summer sequoia
k ty
sick sentinel
Hey guys! I'm thinking on making a tank alter, and I was wondering how is warrior feeling / performing? Pre-patch everyone said it was sheet, so yeah, I wanted to have an updated opinion on this 😃
vocal nimbus
@timid jay 2xDC already on 340 :POGGERS
timid jay
2xDC?
vocal nimbus
deafsomething crash
steel mauve
DC doesnt stack
timid jay
h
severe steeple
you need only one
vocal nimbus
the damage tho
severe steeple
but that gives you flexibility with gear
vocal nimbus
ill be using my warr mainly for memedamage on dungeons
inner trail
do you stack deafening crash for m+ dps seems like a pretty insane increase
whereas iron fortress is like 2%
signal plover
BiS for surv
cinder nova
Nevermind.
median anvil
What talents would you switch out from the pinned talent guide if you wanted to focus on dps over survival?
cinder nova
Nothing really tbh. It has dumb strong cleave with ava and the haste just increases DPS overall
timid jay
The same talents
olive wigeon
Is it just me or anyone else having problems tanking ? 😛
prisma crane
not jsut you, but it just comes down to playing incorrectly
olive wigeon
<- previous blood dk
prisma crane
and yes, some mobs are just bad atm, likely need balancing
topaz ember
I am having massive problems tanking (in warmode )
ember arrow
im playing warriro and bdk
vestal fossil
Same
prisma crane
this new warmode shit, i wish we could wpvp like in legion, my god i'd love it, missed opportunity
topaz ember
i got an idea lets make tank do 40% less dps and take 40$ more dps!
grim geyser
When does ilvl outweigh secondaries? 10? 15? 25?
prisma crane
and azerite armor
vocal nimbus
@ember arrow just finished kings rest at 315, the bleed and the shadow were the onyl problems
tender phoenix
Is Skewer(Yasma in Atal'Dazar) Physical or magic as Shield block does nothing?
grim geyser
What about for azerite if my neck isn't max for the gear?
vocal nimbus
Skewer is supposed to be blocked, horkams
undone sun
vocal nimbus
Maybe it got hotfixed
undone sun
in the pins
timid jay
It was blockable when I tested it a few days ago
tender phoenix
Shield block does nothing to it i just get eaten
vocal nimbus
I did ataldazar today and i felt that i was blocking it, i ate one unblocked and it hit harder
vocal nimbus
Are bleeds blockable now?
timid jay
Its not a bleed
vocal nimbus
Or just some
undone sun
still incredibly situational
grim geyser
Is it better to wear a piece of azerite gear with no traits but 25 ilv higher?
undone sun
it's not blockable https://puu.sh/Bib8W/bcdc931ae6.png
vocal nimbus
Make sure you have block and/or cd during debuff
undone sun
hmmmm
vocal nimbus
Maybe he forgot to change the description
timid jay
Easiest is to always log in the background
vocal nimbus
Sometimes i point at interesting things 🤷
prisma crane
that mechanic on Rezan honestly feels like an AM check where you dont get the dot if you have it up
fierce juniper
@grim geyser I would say if your current piece has Deafening Crash, no, otherwise, yes.
vocal nimbus
DC prolongs demo by 1 or 2 seconds?
vocal nimbus
The damage is, the effect not
vocal nimbus
@fierce juniper its a small thing but in the IV guide you linked the beta tooltip of DC from wowdb
In the beta the effect was 1s and the tooltip still says so
fierce juniper
oh interesting
ty
i dont actually control the links or anything, they're auto generated
ill get them to fix that
vocal nimbus
just get rid of the beta. at the beginning
and it automatically redirects to current wowdb
fierce juniper
no im saying i dont control the links
like there are no links in the actual writing
they get generated by IV after the fact
oh, well, apparently all the links on that page are pulling from the beta database
they're gonna fix it
half jewel
Sorry if this has been asked already a bunch today but I didnt see a pin. Is the DMF trinket still bad for us even after the buff?
vocal nimbus
Its one of the strongest pre raid trinkets now
half jewel
damn that was quick lol
half jewel
thankfully a scribe buddy gave me one to hold on to lol
vocal nimbus
The trinket guide has been update after the DMD fixes
half jewel
oh cool
topaz ember
did they hot fix the upgrade chance? i just did all my wqs and got 6/7 items to warforge has anyone else seen anything similar ?
broken kite
They apparently buffed the number of loot drops from m0
undone sun
stark sage
🙏
broken kite
Yeah
vocal nimbus
Thats today in US?
broken kite
Not end bosses
pine ibex
undone sun
non-end bosses
broken kite
Lol
undone sun
😄
vocal nimbus
Is everyone getting to many azerite helms?
timid jay
I've gotten 5 helms from m0
vocal nimbus
I thought it was just me
vagrant cape
So in case it wasn't mentioned before, there's a clock trinket with a haste/mastery proc and I got it from a wq today. It is bugged as of a few hours ago and only grants 99 (it said it would grant me 518 at ilvl 330).
Don't scrap your other trinket until they fix it.
vocal nimbus
You get both 99 for mast and haste?
weary notch
I can't hear you through all of these helms
vocal nimbus
I mean, each buff give only 99 when they proc?
serene shuttle
Razdunk's Big Red Button lol
vagrant cape
The tool tip on the trinket says it grants 518 haste or mastery for six seconds. It only grants 99
vagrant cape
Really? That was fast if so. I tested it personally only three hours ago tops
stark sage
i havnt been on to test, but i have seen people saying its fixed now
vagrant cape
Good to know, I'll try again later
vocal nimbus
My warr has 340+socket jes howl and blockades 😛
vestal sparrow
our stat priority is hate>vers=mastery right
supple path
Has there been any good analysis of how many ilvls the various azerite traits are worth? Having the standard "mm high level gear vs more unlocked traits" tradeoff.
vestal sparrow
ok just wanted to make sure pawn is telling me other wise
serene shuttle
Are yall talking about the Ticking Clock trinket?
Is it really not giving the full haste amount
censuras
supple path
Did they update that with the information I was asking about?
Guess they have a general rule of thumb section up top now.
They don't actually say, but implication there is that losing the trait entirely rather than downgrading to a worse one would need something like a 25+ ilvl gain then?
strong forum
it literally says it in the 1st section
If your current Azerite piece has Deafening Crash Icon Deafening Crash on it, you only want to replace it with another piece that has Deafening Crash on it. The exception to this being if you have a 25+ item level increase.
You can of course replace your Deafening Crash piece with a non Deafening Crash piece if you have a piece in another slot with Deafening Crash. You want to be using the best combination of your Azerite gear.
If going to a higher item level Azerite piece results in a trait downgrade, only use that piece if it is 10-15+ item levels higher. Azerite pieces have a fixed item level (they cannot Warforge/Titanforge), so generally speaking you will be getting 15 item level upgrades on your pieces anyway. This does not apply to Deafening Crash Icon Deafening Crash. You want to avoid losing your Deafening Crash trait if possible.
If a higher item level Azerite piece has the same or similar strength traits, equip it.
supple path
Yes, it just talks about deafening crashes, then "trait downgrades"
but doesn't clarify if it means e.g. going from a good trait to a bad trait, good trait to no trait, etc.
arctic venture
so for wep enchant do I want the armor or haste for M+ mainly?
strong forum
anything else is an uprade
supple path
that's...not what that says.
strong forum
If going to a higher item level Azerite piece results in a trait downgrade, only use that piece if it is 10-15+ item
literally right there
supple path
Okay at this point I'd just be retyping what I said about that exact line the last time
supple path
I am looking for information on: How many ilvls are the various traits worth relative to one another, and relative to no trait at all. That sticky does not have that information.
So the answe ris "nope, sorry"
strong forum
anything but deafening is not worth dropping 15ilvls
supple path
It actually says the exact opposite of that
supple path
If going to a higher item level Azerite piece results in a trait downgrade, only use that piece if it is 10-15+ item levels higher.
well yeah actually my bad
you're right on that one
I just can't tell if 'trait downgrade' means '5th best traits vs 2nd best' or 'zero trait vs second best' you know?
supple path
Yeah, the vagueness about if downgrade meant "no trait at all" rather than "inferior trait" is my confusion point.
strong forum
well its implying you cant unlock the 1st trait of your new piece
but they fixed that
supple path
yeah I'm sitting at the AH during this conversation trying to buy one. good ol' area 52 ah.
sick tree
I'm on thrall-US
half jewel
I want a second opinion, 325 belt with haste and socket or 340 vers crit belt no socket? I am guessing stick with 325
vivid orchid
so how does the alchemist stone actually compare to the other options?
guide says good, but
strong forum
340 > 325
vivid orchid
how good
half jewel
but haste tho
next lagoon
Excuse me, I'm a bit sorry to ask but was thinking about creating a iron dwarf war => protection // But before, just out of wonder as i don't see any war tank while doing dongeon, are they in bad state or what?