Bolsters just godly.
#protection
sick sentinel
sick sentinel
yes.
regal island
pop all the cd's go HAM and u can take down huge packs in mythic even
that and disc + prot is not a good combo for me.
pretty much what i've gathered so far doing mythic this week
strong forum
MW / Pally is giga with prot
regal island
I'm liking shaman healz
strong forum
i'd imagine reso druid aswell, but i've only had disc hpal and mw as healer so far
sick sentinel
I'm loving hpal.
regal island
all my best groups have had shams so far and we just go nuts with pulls
sick sentinel
use/abusing my hpal bro to bop me on call to clear bleeds/physical debuffs, damage reduction aura, smooth heals.
made mythics a breeze.
regal island
packs get crazy and they just drop a spirit link and i pop cd's and we own it
spirit link + IP = the real mvp
strong forum
id imagine earthen shield being more useful
spirit link is more like a oh shit mechanic
imo
uneven mason
Shamans are extremely strong in early content
cause they heal harder the lower your HP drops
little star
got myself a 355 Mchimba's Ritual Bandages, only absorbs 16,769 damage though :/
uneven mason
extremely good for getting folks topped up.
little star
16k total
warm holly
The best heals I've had so far has been priest across the board.
Shaman I tend to get low and stay lowish and it's unnerving. lol
regal island
figured it had to be a per hit thing for 6 sec
@warm holly thats me with disc priests, they just kinda let me chill at 50% and i'm like no this is gonna go all bad.
little star
1min 30 cd so its not like its up alot
snow nest
Disc priests give me PTSD already
warm holly
Been tanking since I hit 120 but haven't gotten to play a ton so I'm only 289 iLvl and my weapon/shield are 266 and under.
strong forum
disc are good at keeping you topped
ember dagger
bought an ilvl 300 shield for 5k, recommend you try to do the same
strong forum
but if you drop low they have a hard time
warm holly
Trying to find times where I both need to use Ignore Pain and have the rage to use it feel clunky.
snow nest
Especially when there's no white on damage meter lol
warm holly
Ahh, i looked around but the 300 ilvl shields on my server were about 20k when I looked. Just need to run Atal again
for the shield and 1h
strong forum
gl in getting that
ember dagger
if you have the mats just see if you can hire a bs
warm holly
I'll try that haven't looked into blacksmithing weap/shield at all
regal island
decent ilvl 300/310 stuff
ember dagger
my new favorite feature is the really slow azerite farming whenever I do a dungeon. there's truly nothing more rewarding than going into a dungeon, killing four bosses and having 120 azerite to show for it.
snow nest
Lots of ppl complaining about too much prot dmg lol... I'm like would you rather we did no dps or what
regal island
there's a chest that spawns on the way into underroot which has a 320 in it pretty often
i've gotten 2x 320's and a 330 off it
grim prism
People complaining about prot damage have a serious lack of self-awareness
"Wahhh how come the tank does more damage than me"
grim prism
... because you are bad at DPS?
snow nest
Probably nerf IP
grim prism
Same, its bad
north coral
in legion prot did insane aoe damage too it always evens out as people get more gear
grim prism
Installed WAs in prepatch and have been too lazy to set them back up
warm holly
Do Island Expeditions help me out - gearwise? I'm trying to get iLvl up but not sure if best way is just dungeons and WQs or should I add in expeditions?
grim prism
Yeah once I was in m0s I was consistently getting outdamaged by every DPS on all but the biggest AoE pulls
The problem is that blizz appears to balance for "the average player"
And the average player apparently struggles to do more damage than a competent tank
So I will keep holding my breath and hope we dont get a throughput nerf
I doubt we will
But i also won't be surprised if we do
Blizz giveth and Blizz taketh away
ember arrow
Bliz giveth nothing to us though
prisma crane
idk Lev, they gave frustration imo
grim prism
They gave us 440% rev damage for four days a year and a half ago
What more do you want
ember arrow
20
prisma crane
idc, i just want everything reflected
grim prism
There was a lot you couldnt outright reflect before, at least it gave you meaningful DR outside that
warm holly
It was definitely too good in legion
ember arrow
Too good
warm holly
but now its dreadful.
ember arrow
Wut
uneven mason
Krotos - I don't care if it reflects anything I just want the 20% DR
grim prism
50%
uneven mason
50% OP, no nerf
we already have some sizeable magic reduction, just ffs they need to get rid of the 1 charg on spell reflect
feels so useless on trash
No reflection 20% damage reduction
muted wyvern
Is Strength in Numbers any good as a talent for my azerite chestpiece?
vagrant cape
signal plover
vagrant cape
Icyveins guide has all the info
grim prism
Just keep equipping your highest ilvl shit, it's week one and you'll be scrapping it before next reset
muted wyvern
I mean it says its B tier, but does it heal for the amount gained or just the cap?
its a 340 ilvl piece too so i wont scrap it super quick
grim prism
Im not sure we have an answer for that yet, tbh
Blizzard tooltips are notorious for being vague
Or just outright incorrect lol
I would assume it just increases the cap, but I havent used it
regal island
Yeah i think more AZ will balance out our spikyness. I'm only at neck15 so lack of traits hurts
Have to say Rally Cry is actually really nice on a lot of the mythic fights
grim prism
Yeah i feel like these fivemans have a lot more party damage than previous ones
vagrant cape
@warm holly notoced your question about islands didn't get answered, so here:
Islands are almost 100% for AP, they rarely give gear and when they do it's green. I've seen one person get a green from the 10 islands I've done. Stick to dungeons, WQs, and the ah for gear
grim prism
π
regal island
islands seem kinda like just cap weekly then forget
main vault
^
vagrant cape
Indeed
main vault
Pretty much it
regal island
but if you wq are all done, i guess oyu can spam the pvp one
main vault
It doesn't take long either
vagrant cape
But at least they give a good chunk of 7th Legion rep
The weekly does, anyway
Oh, shit, now people know I'm a filthy alliance player
strong forum
dw im alliance too
regal island
Hm i'm kinda thinking stormbolt might be a better goto for mythic dungeons
pliant charm
How could you have horde pride? They are clearly the bad guys
Torched teldrasill for literally no reason
worn knot
Haste or armor enchant?
ember dagger
ew
vagrant cape
Alliance fucking burns the horde alive in their houses in the stormsong campaign
regal island
cmon we all know sylvanus is gonna get 86'ed and nathanos will lead forsaken....
vagrant cape
@regal island what's the CD on storm bolt? I feel it could be helpful on dungeons like underrot with the death bolt worms
regal island
30 sec
vagrant cape
Hmmm
regal island
but thats 2x stuns
vagrant cape
Yeah, and menace
regal island
vs shockwave on cd i'm getting pwned...
inland mesa
I had the str with haste proc trinket roll to 345 \o/ but not sure what to get for 2nd since blockades is bad
regal island
doesn't menace break on dmg though?
vagrant cape
Yeah, but it still works as an aoe interrupt
regal island
blockades* is not great but no tank trinket is great atm
vagrant cape
Oh, right, menace is the talent. I just meant the base skill
inland mesa
My other is the mastery with the massive strength on use that decays at 340
wintry salmon
hey guys can someone provide a somewhat decent pawn string for ~340 ilvl or a way to "sim" to create it myself?
regal island
idk i never fear stuff, risk of getting another pack... no bueno
but stunning say the swirly boi's in kings rest sounds really good.
undone sun
@wintry salmon don't use pawn defensively and we don't have working sims offensviely
inland mesa
While my shield is still 281, might just buy the block set one when prices keep plummeting
regal island
well prot sims are either max defensive IP's or max offensive with revenge.
vagrant cape
When I run with a frost mage or two (or three. Woo class diversity) the fear is super safe to use
regal island
i've seen the epic shield boe as low as 125k and blockades trinket for like 50k now
sick sentinel
is blockades even good?
regal island
i was tempted to get the shield probably the highest preraid barring a lucky forge
sick sentinel
compared to for example versi stat stick 340
vagrant cape
@regal island i might try running storm bolt. It's also a 4s stun, too. And it's ranged. Hmmm
regal island
@vagrant cape yeah kinda what i'm thinking
hexed notch
rezans gleaming eye and which second one?
inland mesa
Isn't the stam low too? Searching the channel everytime it was asked about blockades it was said it's not worth it
regal island
there's the crit proc one just like rezans
it's a 225 str stat stick tbh
the stam is just a secondary effect
vagrant cape
I'm worried about losing the constant aoe stuns though. There are so many times when I look at my bar when I need it and it's only one second away from coming up and I'm like, "aww yeah"
regal island
i've noticed there's really only 1 or 2 dangerous mobs in a pack
two stuns lets me chain a deadly one or shut down another while i deal with big boi ( if hard one is unstunnable)
does Punish stack at all?
inland mesa
I have emblem of zandalar 225 str and 414 haste proc, and then vial of animated blood 143 mastery which gives strength and then it decays atm. I have a blockades but think giving it to my monk is better. Not sure what other trinket to go for
graceful dagger
I have 300ilvl chest with bloodsport and a 325ilvl chest with Deafning Crash, which one should i go for? or keep both depending on situation?
vagrant cape
ember dagger
^
vagrant cape
But that's an easy deafening crash
ember dagger
but DC is #1 priority
I wish our other traits were as interesting as DC, might be cool to be able to do something like stack punish traits /talents and just do stupid dmg with it
vagrant cape
Deafening crash is worth losing 25 ilvls. So if the traits were flipped and DC was on a 300 compared to a 325 bloodsport, you'd still pick the DC as long as you didn't already have a DC
jagged bay
thanks for the updated weakaura marok!
fierce juniper
np
graceful dagger
awesome, tyvm
severe steeple
i mean..
vagrant cape
"If your current Azerite piece has Deafening Crash Icon Deafening Crash on it, you only want to replace it with another piece that has Deafening Crash on it. The exception to this being if you have a 25+ item level increase."
From the icyveins guide
fierce juniper
if you don't have a deafening crash trait it definitely is. Well, in terms of pure survivability it's probably worth losing more, but no reason give up the damage from Strength at that point.
severe steeple
I still trust the guys that do the math but for casual play I don't know if I wanna care
grim prism
Its called trust but verify
fierce juniper
It also varies ofc. Not a hard rule. Depends on the other traits, your other gear, what you're doing, etc, etc.
grim prism
And it sounds like if you already have one then it certainly wouldnt be worth it
So saying it as a blanket statement with new warriors in the room
severe steeple
It's ofc a really tasy trait
grim prism
Ehhh
vagrant cape
DC extends your demo shout by about 24 seconds during avatar. With booming voice that's a huge dps and survivability increase.
severe steeple
Wasn't it increasing by 2 sec the first time?
If it's like you say then yeah it's OP
undone sun
yes
severe steeple
does it increase in every TC cast?
vagrant cape
Yes
So if you take the talent to make thunderclap have a 2s CD during avatar you can get permanent demo shout on a pack during avatar
That azerite trait alone is why this spec does so much goddamn dps
ember dagger
35% extra damage + double damage TCs
vagrant cape
(but don't nerf it. It's fine.)
vagrant cape
And the trait increases TC damage by a small amount on top of that
It's just so goddamn good. 25 ilvls may not even be enough to fill the void left by not having DC
ember dagger
I wonder if thats added to TCs damage or is a separate DC proc
vagrant cape
It would just feel so bad to not have DC
ember dagger
because if it just flat adds to TC its stupid good
ember dagger
Hmm
Avatar/DM shout/DC crits are 17.3k dmg right now for me before damage mitigation
vagrant cape
Deafening crash is a MUST in your azerite gear. If you don't have it, you're missing out on a ton of survivability and damage
next ermine
You should see prot aoe as a lightforged. I love it
floral hatch
Lightforged is a race.
vagrant cape
Oh.
next ermine
Lol
vagrant cape
Why the hell do we have two specs named prot
next ermine
Cause blizz
vagrant cape
Name prot pallies guardi- damn it
undone sun
pally dps is one of the lowest, yes
next ermine
But ya. Light forged racial is a 5yd AoE for 18k per target. For me at ilvl 330
vagrant cape
I immediately associate lightforged with paladin
floral hatch
Name is protector! .... wait.
vagrant cape
My b
next ermine
Light forged racial > charge/avatar > demo. Tons of AoE dmg
vagrant cape
Change bears to warden druids and paladins to guardians. Easy. No confusion at all.
Or juggernaut warriors. Gimme dat
Then you could play a Tauren and have huge jugs on your huge jugg
uneven mason
"Paladins - the class that can't have its own spec names"
ember dagger
tbh I've hated pallies since BC
exotic spoke
Oh, why only BC?
ember dagger
because I started playing in BC
also they were kinda good at everything?
0 hybrid tax annoyed me
exotic spoke
Do you play horde or alliance?
I remember in vanilla... bitching about not having windfury
uneven mason
I played Horde, so I got to see Paladins in TBC for the first time (not really I had some alliance characters during vanilla too)
weary notch
yeah, I remember leveling a pally in TBC just so I could get dungeon invites
uneven mason
Tanking in TBC was hilariously bad
You had Druids and Paladins who were exceptional at dungeons
and then sucked at raids
Warriors who were great for raids, but couldn't hold AE threat.
exotic spoke
I was horde once.... did a goblin prot flag running towards end of cata after my team transferred servers / factions. Went back to alliance though
uneven mason
+++ when they added Thunderclap to defensive stance in 2.1
exotic spoke
Jesus Christ that was amazing.
ember dagger
ugh I'd forgotten stance dancing
uneven mason
night and day
ember dagger
its been years
atomic fractal
Have a question, how have you experience prot damage to be in dungeon scenarios as of right now? Not going to say numbers before i hear if someone else has noticed
uneven mason
getting taunt to use hit rather than spell hit
exotic spoke
Fuck that noise! My guild had 6 dwarf priests. I did stance dance in pvp but never really had to in pve
uneven mason
AE damage is second to none in dungeons
grim prism
Damage DONE or damage TAKEN
atomic fractal
Damage done
hot locust
both
exotic spoke
Itβs great isnβt it?
hot locust
Prots pretty sick
exotic spoke
Sick damage out for aoe
uneven mason
We're doing ok
atomic fractal
It is huge, got 45k on about 8 targets in a dungeon and on average pulls of 4-5 i do 23k
hot locust
Can't wait to get nerfed.
grim prism
^
ember dagger
as much as we do sick damage i'm still getting aggro ripped off of me early in fights, but thats also partly the dps's fault
hot locust
I have no problems whatsoever with threat.
uneven mason
I like how folks are like "The Thunderclap build"
What other F**King build is there?
atomic fractal
Me neither, just be sure to thunderclap and get one revenge off before using buffs
uneven mason
Cause
ember dagger
its our only build
uneven mason
yeah
atomic fractal
xD
grim prism
The sad part is we dont even do apeshit damage relative to other DPS in mythics so far, but we will possibly get downscaled just for doing so much in heroic cheese
exotic spoke
Pretty much
atomic fractal
I mean, there is still the revenge route, but no one wants that shit
uneven mason
no
ember dagger
I said it earlier
uneven mason
no there isn't
exotic spoke
I stand by my 4 prot 1 resto idea
weary notch
TBC is now ThunderClap Build
grim prism
Just call it The Build because it's the only viable one
uneven mason
BSC is a DPS loss vs the other 2 talents in that tier.
ember dagger
but it'd be cool if we had more than one build
grim prism
The Build of Claps
atomic fractal
But as of right now im satisfied, it feels amazing, but kinda sucks on singletarget π
hot locust
if you are in a truly single target encounter
atomic fractal
But when pulling a lot, it just makes for the most satisfying experience i have experienced
hot locust
devastator actually does a lot of dps
I'm at around 4.5k to 5k without
and around 6k with
It IS a survivability loss though
atomic fractal
True, also what is up with into the fray? it was just enemies beforehand right? I can literally see no reason not to take a 15% increase in most situations (includes allies now)
hot locust
and as soon as you introduce some AoE or cleave it's not as good as BV
quaint kiln
Is it just me or did they remove rfdt? Because I feel starved AF in most situations
uneven mason
I can see you're late to the game, please read the changes in BFA section in the pins @quaint kiln
jaunty reef
wtf I just got ass blasted by a bear druid
digital arrow
lol @ "The Thunderclap Build"
vagrant cape
Out of curiosity, what % of people in random heroics do you think have looked up a class guide, been on their discord, and/or watched a video on how to play their spec?
jaunty reef
I'm 331 ilvl and he was level 118
digital arrow
seriously why is there only one viable build though? doesnt feel very flexible π¦
are prot wars in a bad spot
uneven mason
20% Byron - number from my left cheek, since there's no real way to check that.
Pockey - Tanks almost always come down to a single meta build
undone sun
A lot of specs don't have choices in most of their talents, that just how blizzard shipped it
sour oxide
People who look up guides/plan their characters are the upper echelon of this game
vagrant cape
@digital arrow we wear stiff metal armor and a shield. Flexibility isn't part of our class fantasy π
timid jay
Tbh, its more uncommon to have more than one set build
uneven mason
its just that in Protection's situation the gap between optimal/not optimal is exasperated by talent synergy between the meta talents
timid jay
Usually its only utility talents that differ, or AoE/ST talents
uneven mason
Its been mentioned before, that for the most part, if you take each tier in a vacuum, there are 2 talents that are weighted fairly well and only 1 that is complete garbage or just not up to par
digital arrow
LMao good one @vagrant cape
vagrant cape
Booming voice, the avatar talent, and deafening crash wouldn't be mandatory if they were all in a vacuum, but they can a be used together so they cannot possibly be unseated by anything else. The synergy is just too much
uneven mason
the reasoning why the meta build is super strong, is because Anger Management magnifies the gap between talents that improve our CDs and those that do not.
vagrant cape
Oh yeah, and anger management
uneven mason
without AM, Booming voice actually becomes much weaker, Bolster is balanced vs Indomitable, Punish and ITF become much closer, and UF vs DR is a more interesting choice.
little star
did Crystalline Carapace get nerfed the trait sais it only gives 82 armor
uneven mason
I mena ITF and Punish are close to begin with
vagrant cape
The conglomeration of three talents and an azerite trait creates this beautiful machine we call β π
digital arrow
hmm
uneven mason
the azerite trait would be strong even without hte interaction
weary notch
are they? Guide says ITF beats punish at 2 stacks
vagrant cape
@little star different ilvl azerite pieces have different trait values. What ilvl is the piece you're looking at?
uneven mason
Yeah, they are.
little star
340
vagrant cape
Hmmm
hot locust
I mean.... if close means practically never taking punish...
little star
could just be tooltip is not accurate
hot locust
(literally not a single fight this tier I would)
vagrant cape
That's the problem with these choices; they're not choices at all, they're math problems.
weary notch
Into the Fray is better than Punish Icon Punish for survivability as long as you are able to consistently keep 2-3 stacks up on the buff, which is pretty much always the case. Punish has the potential to be better in situations where the majority of the damage is not blockable, or if for some reason you are consistently at 1 stack of Into the Fray.
^ from Marok
hot locust
in other words
grim prism
Bonus complication
hot locust
never
severe steeple
nope
grim prism
So if your haste is as shit as mine it might never be worth it
uneven mason
wat
thorny laurel
im pretty sure its flat haste
atomic fractal
Nope, adds direct 15% to your stat, not current stat
thorny laurel
if you are at 16 you will be at 31 with 5 stacks
severe steeple
@grim prism it's 3% haste per stack
vagrant cape
So if you have 10% haste, it would add 0.3%? What's the difference between that and the flat number?
timid jay
Worth noting is that it stacks multiplicatively
Like all haste buffs (that arent rating)
grim prism
Thats not what @final mist told me
atomic fractal
Literally just walk close to someone and you can see it adds direct 3%
grim prism
Someone's got some splaining to do
timid jay
I.e. if you have 10% haste before ITF, 5 stacks would give you 1.1*1.15 haste
vocal nimbus
:GWseremePeepoThink:
vagrant cape
Well I can't do that when I'm using my phone in bed at 3:00 in the afternoon, @atomic fractal show some consideration
atomic fractal
xD
vocal nimbus
Balsaq got heckin bamboozled
grim prism
Sure did
atomic fractal
I mean, i have to get you excited somehow π
grim prism
But you were wrong too
ashen shell
Is there anywhere for accurate stat weights/pawnstring? Simcraft is throwing errors at me so can't get one.
undone sun
No @ashen shell
uneven mason
You never pawn for prot
grim prism
Doesnt exist for tanks
vagrant cape
@atomic fractal UwU
ashen shell
Brah, does this mean I have to use brain. Respec to arcane it is.
uneven mason
Tyrrell - item level for armor pieces, weapon, and shield, haste if all other things equal
undone sun
- don't use pawn defensively, it's not possible
- we don't have working sims so you wouldn't get anything accurate to begin with
vagrant cape
Arcane warrior best warrior
timid jay
For example I have 5.97% haste with 5 stacks of ITF I have 21.87% haste, not 20.97% as you might think since its multiplicative and not additive.
vagrant cape
That makes no sense.
timid jay
Meaning high base haste makes ITF stronger
ashen shell
It's what I've done for most of the gear just ilvl then haste but its the trinkets that are throwing me off. Sorry for the stupid quest as well π
atomic fractal
I dont believe you cosmo, let me test real quick, current base stat is 11% haste, will not cast any spells to eliminate procs brb
timid jay
With 11% base haste and 5 stacks of ITF you should have 27.65% haste
grim prism
I told him half an hour ago to trust but verify
hot locust
That's definitely how it works
grim prism
This is healthy
hot locust
Cosmo is correct.
timid jay
Because its multiplicative, not additive
hot locust
All haste buff multipliers work that way.
timid jay
All % haste increases work that way
vagrant cape
What is this amount of the little more? Is it a flat 3% plus 3% of base?
timid jay
Say that you have 10% haste Byron
atomic fractal
Yep, my 11% went to 21% with 4 targets, if it was additive, it would be 20%
timid jay
And 1 stack of ITF
uneven mason
Best way to explain it is, the base is 1.0 not 0
atomic fractal
Yea
vagrant cape
If it were multiplication then it would multiply by 1.03 and wouldn't be reaching that high of a value. What exactly do you mean by multplicative?
grim prism
Whats 3% of zero @uneven mason
timid jay
Then you would get 1.1*1.03=1.133or 13.3% haste
grim prism
Gottem
timid jay
A increase of 3.3%, not a flat 3%
vagrant cape
Oooooooh
uneven mason
Balsaq I said the base is 1.0 not 0
vagrant cape
@uneven mason that clears it up entirely
final mist
I didn't say it was 3% of your haste, I said what Cosmo said, in that it stacks multiplicatively.
hot locust
Nah Sal you dumb
vagrant cape
If you have 0% haste, you actually have 100% haste. If you have 10% tool tip haste, you actually have 110% haste. I get it.
atomic fractal
1.1xx * 1.09 actually gave ~1,21, so it does really work well with stacking haste
Interesting
vocal nimbus
#saldumb
vagrant cape
Wow. Haste stacking is too good
atomic fractal
xD
uneven mason
Right, the tooltip and actual calculation is different, reason being, you can't multiply by 0 (you can, but it doesn't do much)
vagrant cape
Everything about prot warrior is OP but no one sees it. This is perfect. Let the rumors spread so we can maintain this delicious power.
hot locust
π€
atomic fractal
Also find arms mastery to be broken, it is way to easy to break the 100% mark and it does little to no difference dpswise
vagrant cape
@fresh dragon quick answer,
vocal nimbus
The base of any stat is 1.0, if you have X% you add that so you have 1.X in the formula, then you multiply by 3% which would be 1.03
fresh dragon
@vagrant cape they are both in the same RANK TIER
vagrant cape
@fresh dragon then flip a coin
vocal nimbus
Blizzard just doesnt want to put formulae in the tool tip
fresh dragon
both are in 4.3. B Tier
vagrant cape
Or consider which one works better in your least comfortable dungeon
That's how I break ties
vagrant cape
Now the real coin flip test: before you looked at the result, were you hoping for a specific outcome?
If so, go with it
That's what your gut wants
timid jay
@vocal nimbus I see it more as your base speed is 1, looking at crit like that makes no sense for example
Thats like saying your base crit is 100%
velvet stone
Did you guys also get a 2h weapon from the emissary?
uneven mason
when you're calculating stuff in code you don't use "percentages" you use decimals. I mena, they COULD make it so its a flat 3% rather than Baseratingbuff
timid jay
Its deliberate that its stacking multiplicativedly
uneven mason
I figured it was.
fiery remnant
What talents do you guys take for island expeditions?
uneven mason
the same ones we take for everywhere else
sick sentinel
^
vagrant cape
Rigid armor, rigid talents. #ClassFantasy
sick sentinel
The talents that make me an undercover tank God.
vagrant cape
Shhh
fiery remnant
uhhhh ok then
vagrant cape
You better be wearing your tin foil hat while typing that, @sick sentinel
Don't want blizz to know our secrets
vagrant cape
Excellent
vagrant cape
I'm glad my bribes to method are working
sick sentinel
feels good already breaking 50% dr from armor and still green shield.
vagrant cape
Also, puts on second tin foil hat it's in Sco's best interest to spread lies about the best tanks so their opponents don't pick up on it. The world first uldir clear will be done with a prot warrior, mark my words.
sick sentinel
:D
Too bad I'm a casual normie these days for guild. No time to raid.
Do plenty of mythic+s tho
uneven mason
Double Prot warrior - when you like having a tank specific external
on a 15s CD
π
sick sentinel
Our 'main tanks' are BM and Prot pally and all I hear from the other groups is trying their tanks keep dying.
SMH
errant ledge
Dont share our secrets, let the bad warriors stay bad so we dont get the nerf hammer
uneven mason
I Mean, I guess
I do occasionally pug M+
so I don't want public perceptio nto be all negative
acoustic kettle
how good is avoidance compared to versatility
uneven mason
two different stat things Reknosz
undone sun
They aren't really comparable
uneven mason
Avoidance is a tertiary "bonus roll" stat
jolly coyote
Hello guys. Im starting to tank mythics and later on m+. My current ilvl is 329. Didnt play prot for a year,can anyone help me if the icy veins talent build is optimal or not? (booming voice,anger management etc)
uneven mason
that reduces AE damage
vagrant cape
@tall parcel yep. Storm bolt may be taken situationally based on how important ST stuns are in a dungeon
undone sun
@tall parcel @jolly coyote yes
acoustic kettle
ahh i see so its just bonus ty
timid jay
Thyme is now our Yes man
tall parcel
awesome, thanks!
errant ledge
Too late, we were the best in legion, did more dmg,mitigation and self healing then any other tank (check warcraft logs) and we got a bad name because noone could play prots fast paced spec. The public eye will only listen to whatever some guy on youtube that dosnt even main the class says.
uneven mason
Versatility is a 2ndary stat, increases damage and healing done by%/reduces damage taken by half that %
undone sun
now π€
timid jay
You were a parrot before π’
uneven mason
in general yes.
uneven mason
so your base for crit is 1.05
vocal nimbus
ye
uneven mason
Thats a throwback to the oldendays
when they decided it was an exceptional idea to give all agi specs bonus crit cause they were making agi not give crit anymore.
jolly coyote
thanks buddy
uneven mason
Took them a whiel to figure out that it wasn't just rogues and hunters that used crit
vocal nimbus
Does anyone else notice weird effects with the followers?
vagrant cape
so would it make sense to say that your crit value is 1 + (crit% / 100%) but you crit chance is (crit value - 1)/1 ?
timid jay
What, your crit chance is the one stated in the sheet
vocal nimbus
both are the same thign
timber nest
whats the rule of thumb with replacing azerite gear that has bis traits? right now im using 2 BfI and a DC trait. Im looking to use 340 shoulders and head that arent the same traits
sitll worth upgrade from the 325 to 340?
timber nest
Bloodsport and Iron Fortress
1 DC and 1 Brace for Impact
id be gaining bloodsport and IF
timber nest
shoulders are the ones with IF
head has bloodsport
so i cant do that
i guess dont use either then
fierce juniper
oh wait your shoulders have the DC?
timber nest
yes
fierce juniper
oh
sick sentinel
Rip
timber nest
Overwhelming Power, Blood siphon and Winds of War, Gem hide, Impassive vissage
candid vine
I have 285 shoulders and a 340 dropped from mythic. The problem is I don't enough AP for any of the traits on the 340
timber nest
str is strong still @candid vine
sick sentinel
Mmm gemhide
fierce juniper
Yeah, equip the 340 helm and take Gemhide
Keep the DC shouldes
uneven mason
Harkonnenn ilvl is generally going to win, just from armor/str/sta
but I mean, ymmv, DC is worth quite a pretty bit of stats
vocal nimbus
you should be 21 when mythic opens
fierce juniper
@timber nest oh in that case wait
you'll probably get another, better piece anyway so
by the time you can use that 340
fierce juniper
np
weak marsh
Done all mythic, still have a 268 shield from leveling. FeelsGood
uneven mason
hit the AH
candid vine
Any thoughts on if using the Fathoms trinket is worth while? Currently using a 300, and 355 blockades
undone sun
well
uneven mason
but IIRC DMD is uniqu equipped?
undone sun
fathoms effect is particularly strong for all melees, blockades effect is almost Zero
both grant lots of strength so at the moment it's much better to go with the one that'll grant you a noticeable benefit aside from the main stat
verbal sorrel
Is it me, or is prot clunky as shit now? I kinda wish shield block was on the GCD instead of ignore pain
stark sage
no you dont
if you miss a block you die
if you miss a IP then your healer has to heal you a bit more
verbal sorrel
Yea but block can stays up a couple secs, keeping it up is easier
languid cairn
I also feel like pror is clunky
prisma crane
trust me, you DONT want SB on the GCD
languid cairn
Esp on lower ilvls
stark sage
oof yeah, i remember hc kj missing a claw cuz i didnt account for NF gcd and dying like a bitch
undone sun
lol
vocal nimbus
I know that feeling kelade
verbal sorrel
I lvled my prot warrior 1st and i didnt mind it. Then i lvled my brewmaster monk and was just................eh when i went back to warrior
vocal nimbus
I did the opposite and BrM is the meh one :lul
vagrant cape
did the WQ for the 2h axe. it WFed to 325 :\
uneven mason
gg
uneven mason
Razor #1 reason why IP on the GCD feels bad - you're using it too much.
weak marsh
Where ist the weaponquest?
languid cairn
Emissary
weak marsh
Ah, kk. Thanks alot
vagrant cape
I'm alliance, tho
weak marsh
Me too
uneven mason
at least generally thats what I see the issue
vagrant cape
it may change depending on faction, not sure
the best time for ignore pain is between packs for me. It feels so bad to use it during avatar
uneven mason
I'll press it over Revenge between TCs if SS doesn't proc
Unless I'm trying to make the DPS look bad
then fuckem, Shield wall up and Rev/TC spam
regal island
so how does Never Surrender work with the IP 1.3x cap?
regal island
like if we get off a big +75% NS IP and then refresh it when we are at say 80% HP what's the new max IP?
uneven mason
What the current cast value is * 1.3
regal island
NS is generally bad yeah but useful for magic dmg mythics
vocal nimbus
Even if NS isnt meta he is just asking how it works
uneven mason
IP cap is always "Current cast *1.3"
regal island
it's not like we need more physical mit most of the time
fierce juniper
It works like any other increase to IP, e.g. an AP increase or Vers increase.
If your Ignore Pain is being increased by 50% from NS, your cap increases accordingly.
So yeah it's just your on-cast IP * 1.3
regal island
even with a current IP up?
uneven mason
Yes
Meaning if you have a 75% Buffed IP up
and you cast it again at 80% health (20% buff) you actually reduce your absorb
beacause you refreshed the buff, and it brings it back down to cap
regal island
so NS basically = more revenges then for the most part when rage dumping
uneven mason
Like, that isn't how this works
regal island
not gonna spend it on an IP that reduces your current IP
uneven mason
But I suppose if you take it way around the park, you could get to "NS = more revenges"
young oasis
What is harder? Siege of Boralus or Kings rest?
regal island
kings rest mobs, those whirly boi's....
kings rest bosses are cake though, trash is harder
especially shadow chick zul at the end
sick sentinel
Nothing is hard atm.
Besides loot rng.
Super hard mode.
Kings rest trash is a bitch(4 kings mainly if you dont target prio), and Shadow of Zul.
sick sentinel
If got a good shield and solid dps, I feel be alright.
From my POV shield mainly. Holy fuck shield when
uneven mason
Just rename us to π‘ π
sick sentinel
Shield meat.
uneven mason
πΆ π‘ π
vernal sand
Walking shield basket?
grim prism
WSB OP
uneven mason
π₯ π π₯
pulsar grove
I feel like I have threat issues on every trash pull in mythic 0+ Anyone else feel this way? Will prot warrs get better threat generation or is threat set for 8.0 now?
long lake
I feel the same
strong forum
im having 0 issues
long lake
Even while gearing up?
strong forum
ye
sick sentinel
zero issues also. threat and dps amazing.
pulsar grove
A guildie of mine literally just Bladestorms and I've lost aggro
wide juniper
Generally the threat has been okay for me. Sometimes one gets loose.
Avatar is nice because you can just tc on those bitches
chrome raft
just tell your arms warrior guildie to get the discreet spellthread enchant
that fixed my threat issues with BS
I was ripping threat off tanks all the time before I got that
pulsar grove
Do you need to be tailor for that?
chrome raft
ya
inland silo
aggro has felt pretty weird to me. ill be doing top damage and still lose aggro on half the mobs
chrome raft
kinda amusing that they put it on tailoring since melee are the only ones that should ever need it
but it's worth getting imo
was for me anyway
pulsar grove
Idk, he's not tailor unfortunately
Do you guys down prio mitigation in the start of the pull for threat gen?
chrome raft
it's gonna depend on the pull
toxic wadi
how fast does prot kill mobs while leveling?
vocal nimbus
quite fast
wide juniper
Not as fast as plenty of classes.
I would disagree with quite fast.
I would say, reasonable. But the best is we can just gather a bunch of mobs and kill them at once with victory.
cinder pasture
You kill them pretty fast when you pull a lot, 1 at a time is fairly slow
wide juniper
Yes. That.
candid cove
Tanks work well by having more targets hitting them for more damage proccing more abilities/resources
wide juniper
If you AoE 5 mobs, you'll kill all 5 faster than just pulling one and AoEing it
Plus Revenge/SS procs
Better rage gen
What @candid cove said
cinder pasture
Also the 15% haste from into the fray helps too
toxic wadi
ah ok nice
wide juniper
Heck yeah
toxic wadi
does prot warr kill faster than prot pally?
toxic wadi
oh ok nice
grim prism
@toxic wadi you do decent damage to single mobs. If you do the same damage to 12 mobs at once, you are now doing a lot of damage.
Its not that youre actually killing them faster with more pulled
Youre just killing more at once
And ideally pulling far more than a DPS spec would be able to handle without dying
wraith ginkgo
what addons r u guys running for prot threat management
wraith ginkgo
lol
Im an arms main.. any easy ways to find a 1hander and shield that r somewhat decent ilevel for my offspec?
weary notch
I just updated to ver 1.92 of nothing earlier today. Seems to run
strong forum
set lootspec to prot
wraith ginkgo
it defo helps that haste is up there for both prot and arms.
yeah i may do that during some hc runs since i already got a strong 2 hander.
Thanks Nomeratur
need to get them insta queue feels π
wide juniper
I've had issues getting any of my haste armor.
Hopefully this week will be better to me.
wraith ginkgo
guys how does loot probabilities work in bfa dungeons? Like is there a minimum i can get per run, and a mximum?
strong forum
rule of thumb is 1 item per run
rare to get more than one
not unusual to get nothing
wide juniper
Got two yesterday. Both garbage.
wraith ginkgo
Thanks guys. and any ideas on how to optimize a secondary gear set for prot if u dps main?
Any tips other than to snipe 1h and shield from dungeons if u dont need a 2 hander?
prisma crane
i mean
it's not any different to any other xpac
tailor the items you get
prot cares about ilvl
then secondaries, secondaries which more closely align with fury fwiw
wraith ginkgo
well so right now arms and prot have around same main stats Haste.
prisma crane
trinkets matter, but tbh none are great atm
wraith ginkgo
ah ok
so its mainly about getting the good 1h and shield and tanking trinkets right now.
prisma crane
yea and a second set of azerite armors
wraith ginkgo
and later on it'll be a more substantial second set with diff azerite pieces etc.
timid jay
There arent really any good tanking trinkets
wraith ginkgo
ok
polar rose
jes' howler or rezans gleaming eye are good starts
polar rose
^^
wide juniper
haste procs all day
wraith ginkgo
thankss
prisma crane
np
polar rose
we have a selection of 1h pre raid, any reason to take one over the other?
vagrant cape
More haste means using IP feels less awful which is a nice bonus.
timid jay
Take the highest ilvl or best stats that you can get your hands on
Theres no other difference really
prisma crane
haste makes GCD shorter, which makes everything feel less awful
polar rose
simple enough. ty cosmo
south scarab
Do you guys try and keep 100% uptime on ignore pain?
prisma crane
i still get slightly upset that i can't equip wands
prisma crane
100% uptime on IP is either A) impossible, or B) means you hit DS and IP and stood still in a town
you cant get 100% SB uptime
south scarab
^
vagrant cape
@south scarab depends on what you're fighting. Against things that do a lot of blockable phys damage, ignore pain isn't necessary unless you're getting trucked. Against magical damage, it's your best defensive use of a gcd
toxic wadi
looks like prot warriors are best against heavy melee attacks, and not magic
toxic wadi
lol
vagrant cape
Indeed. But spell reflect had a relatively short CD and IP is still decently powerful
opaque pagoda
Never press Ignore Pain, boycott until blizzard fixes the class
polar rose
embrace pain
opaque pagoda
There is nothing rocking about Prot right now
vagrant cape
points at forehead Don't need to use ignore pain if all your enemies are dead.
Ignore pain feels best when you use it between packs
opaque pagoda
In other words, it feels like shit
opaque pagoda
βHold on team, I found a big pile of straw out back, Iβm going to duct tape it to myself before we kill the bad guysβ
vagrant cape
Would we still complain this much?
pulsar grove
Anyone have a resource for BiS trinkets?
vagrant cape
The guide in the pins has some useful info on that I believe
junior ivy
what is the link to invite people to this discord?
pulsar grove
Icyveins doesnt provide that good info
opaque pagoda
My guess is that protection is broken for the foreseeable future, which is why Iβve switched to Prot Paladin in the meantime
Someday when they fix warriors, at least Iβll have shield transmogs ready
timid jay
discord.gg/skyhold @junior ivy
junior ivy
ty
prisma crane
@pulsar grove literally in the pins "Is the Darkmoon Deck a good buy? Itβs effect is very weak, although strength is a good defensive stat. It is a very high item level strength trinket compared to current available ones so you may want to consider it regardless, and none of the other available defensive trinkets are very good anyway. A trinket guide is to come out some time in the next couple of weeks, so please keep an eye out for it."
just look for STR/Haste stat sticks
wild hamlet
Is Warrior really that bad?
undone sun
no
wild hamlet
Then why is everyone complaining
vagrant cape
Because we don't want to get nerfed from our throne so we're trying to make blizzard think we're bad
Er, I mean, cuz we're bad
undone sun
there's always something to complain about
prisma crane
it's a WAY different style of tanking than Legion
i personally hate how slow everything is, but w/e
vagrant cape
Yeah, in Legion we were tanks, now we're a fucking thunderstorm
prisma crane
im still spamming stuff like TC for it to come off CD, just to hit DS once and spam the next thing only to forget that if i dont spam DS it wont go off
polar rose
i just picked up warrior this xpac. i wish i understood
vagrant cape
β π
wild hamlet
Shame orcs can't be paladins
Them and Humans look the best in Paladin and Warrior armour sets
dapper fog
Do multiple instances of "Iron Fortress" Stack?
hot locust
Yes.
cinder nova
@opaque pagoda it's just growing pains
IP plays different now. I still find plenty of time and rage to roll it between block to space the CD more evenly
It feels very weird at first compared to spamming it in ATB, but it's fast to get over that.
opaque pagoda
To each their own, I think it fucking blows and isnβt worth pushing, but as long as youβre having fun
cinder nova
From what I see a lot of healers seem to find warriors dumb easy to heal compared to other tanks because of how trickled our intake is
I dunno, I was doing better in damage taken and prevented than all our other tanks when they out geared me by 20 ilvl
opaque pagoda
Warriors have pretty decent physical mitigation just from sitting there and pressing shield block when itβs up, but I donβt think that makes it fun
fierce juniper
You don't think Ignore Pain is worth pressing?
delicate tide
pressing ignore pain just makes me feel bad π¦
cinder nova
Why
delicate tide
i could do so much more within that gcd window, like thunderclapping more
cinder nova
The fuck else are you doing with your rage if not IP π€
tender imp
revenge
cinder nova
I never need to spend rage on it
opaque pagoda
You can press it, and youβll probably have to if you have anger management, but itβs still sad and anemic
cinder nova
Procs infinitely these days
delicate tide
its just not what it used to be
cinder nova
Of course not, if it was we'd be op af
Every other tanks secondary survival is gcd gated
delicate tide
i understand why it is the way it is right now, it just feels so much worse and makes me sad π¦
opaque pagoda
Thereβs nothing interesting about it at all
They could make shield slam buff it or something
Or have another devastate-like ability that used rage and also buffed your next IP, that could maybe work
All kinds of stuff would make it better than the rotation tumor it currently is
That would actually be kind of interesting, a rage dump ability that boosted IP, I would probably like that
frigid blaze
Hey, guys. Is there a way to make my IP show the shield amount as well as what percent of my health that shield is? I imagine it can't be too difficult, I just don't have much experience with code.
prisma crane
an off GCD rage dump would be nice, IP doesnt have to be it though
sitting either starved or capped is FeelsBadMan
frigid blaze
Should probably post this in the ui-weakauras-addons channel, actually. Woops.
prisma crane
does the % of your hp matter much though?
from a practical standpoint?
hell even the number doesnt matter much, you just want to avoid over capping (which doesnt really happen much anymore anyways)
frigid blaze
I was questioning that, too. I don't see how having the information hurts but I don't see the immediate value in having it, either. Just something I'd like to be able to see on demand.
fierce juniper
@frigid blaze I can add that as an option to the IP Tracker weakaura if you want
frigid blaze
That'd be really neat, Marok! Using your WA already.
simple flicker
hey guys does anyone know if the artifact trait "Callous reprisal" stack with other gear?
vital plover
I just got a 350 First Mate's spyglass . I currently have Gilded Loa Figurine 335 and Vial of Animated Blood 340. Should I switch it out with one of those?
fierce juniper
@simple flicker Are you asking if the trait stacks?
simple flicker
Yeah
fierce juniper
It does
fierce juniper
the % stacks as well, which is a bit unusual as far a stacking goes with traits
i.e. at three traits you, with 3 stacks, you'd be at 4.5% DR
yeah
fierce juniper
yep
undone sun
hmmm
broken kite
Does the block one stack? The damage on block I mean?
vital plover
I just got a 350 First Mate's spyglass . I currently have Gilded Loa Figurine 335 and Vial of Animated Blood 340. Should I switch it out with one of those?
simple flicker
because the Deafing Crash does not stack
the dmg works but doesnt add 4 secs with stack
strong forum
vial @vital plover
vital plover
Switch vial out with first mate's?
lucid ginkgo
I remember Lord Parrot Thyme having an anneurysm when repeating how traits stacked in damage numbers, but the multipliers and extension parts wouldn't
There are exceptions, like this callous?
π¦
undone sun
Β―_(γ)_/Β―
timid nacelle
Does the fact it stacks the DR component make it more attractive than the recommended double BfI
broken kite
I like the mini dragon scales one, even if it isn't that great
timid nacelle
I know BfI will still come out ahead, just hoping there's something to make at least one of our rage dumps feel more meaningful
broken kite
You might want to add a pin about ITF being bugged (stuck on a certain stack) too - can fix by swapping out and back in to the talent @fierce juniper
frigid blaze
@fierce juniper not to rush you, but just wondering if we can get an ETA to that % health option? Don't want to miss it when it goes out.
ember arrow
marok getting pinged like its #off-topic π
frigid blaze
They are pings of love.
ember arrow
i personally dont see the value of seeing what % of hp my IP is, since its not like it can help me
uncut fractal
355 darkmoon deck blockades is good for tanking? it gives stamina looks like
uncut fractal
I can get one for 35k gold, isn't that worth?
undone sun
yeah, chances are it'll get a buff eventually
spice summit
Wasnt there alrdy a post from Blizz about they are aware that every card except Fathoms is underwhelming rn
Iunno someone said that
itll prob get buffed ye
35k sounds like a fair deal tbh
Its a pretty shit trinket tho
vocal nimbus
No way to change the honorbound emmisary type of weapon right?
spice summit
Be glad you got weapon Emissary c,c
topaz ember
I'm using a random dps triket b/c ig ot nothing else and it gives +179 str
sick tree
Hey so
bloodsport vs glory in battle
I assume bloodsport is better just for more reliability ?
tiny rapids
@undone sun give me some of that loot honey man. I've been sitting with a 300 shield/main hand while the rest is full mythic. My friend share!
undone sun
π€£
tiny rapids
Nice shield by the way.
sick tree
So what is the fastest way to get more azerite
Is there no artifact research that speeds it up
topaz ember
i'm at 334 with a 289 sheild AMA
mild mortar
Why havent you crafted a shield or bought a crafted shield?
topaz ember
because Mythics reset tomorrow so i'm just going to try them again
mild mortar
fair enough good luck
delicate bone
Do you guys think protβll het buffed anytime/soon?
delicate bone
Or at least changed a little bit?
It fells like playing an unfinished clumsy char
ember arrow
It feels bad is subjective
topaz ember
ip on the gcd feels like trash. In the open world i'm yet to even cast it
crimson sentinel
Sigh
mild mortar
we dont need a buff, we need drop rates on shields buffed
delicate bone
True
topaz ember
I'm probably goiong to farm boes for a few hours tonight hoping to the new blazing sword or a sheild
for*
delicate bone
Maybe itβs just my βcomfort-legion-Guardianβ view
topaz ember
knowing my luck ill probably get nothing or like mail bracers
willow holly
I'm hoping prot gets a little more rework and polish
I think IP is really clunky and poorly designed
topaz ember
chancers are after the first raid tier is over we will get a slight ip buff and it will still be on the gcd and suck
crimson sentinel
It doesnt βsuckβ... lol
toxic remnant
Ignoe Pain doesn't even ignore pain FeelsBadMan
steel mauve
its not bad, its just awkward to fill in, the spell itself does what its supposed to do
most of the complaints are people thinking ignore pain should be some thing, and when it isnt its trash
delicate bone
So tell us what it is xD
topaz ember
IP is what i cast to lower my avatar cooldown by 5 seconds
steel mauve
a damage smoother, not a complete absorb shield that absorbs almost all damage that we spam
toxic remnant
a very expensive one
steel mauve
and you cant really base a judgement on an ability because of its use open world questing, i barely used ignore pain questing because it wasnt needed
topaz ember
I'm saying weither or not it is good i'm saying that it feels bad
ember arrow
its not expensive at all
topaz ember
and i hate it
willow holly
The problem with ignore pain is that it doesn't have a defined use.
delicate bone
Itβs clearly defined
ember arrow
its use is to smooth dmg intake
topaz ember
and go what monk?
willow holly
telling people to reroll is toxic and not constructive
ember arrow
haha
topaz ember
they think their cool with all there fancy dmg smoothing
ember arrow
using toxic unironically
toxic remnant
Every time I use Ignore Pain on a mythic dungeon I feel like asking for a rage refund
crimson sentinel
Yet these discussion went on aswell
delicate bone
I think they should remove IP from GDC or increase the stacking to 1.5/2.0 or something.
willow holly
ignore pain was added in legion
crimson sentinel
U do realise ignore pain being of GCD makes it way to strong
topaz ember
yea if it was off the gcd all mythic guilds would be running warriors
delicate bone
The 90% reduction from legion was way to much.
crimson sentinel
In legion? No
topaz ember
i don't mind the 50% i find it nice
sick sentinel
Well in Legion the first worlds didnt run warriors but druids and monk
willow holly
the problem with IP is its a badly designed ability. if they make it good it replaces SB
vagrant cape
would mythic guilds run warriors if IP was on the half-gcd like charge is?
willow holly
so it has to be bad
ember arrow
and saying what world first run is a great way to asses a tanks viability