wow, they took all the realms offline. 4 minutes after I was finally able to log in
#protection
weary notch
warm plinth
Yeah I'm not mad about ML being gone honestly; I can probably count on one hand the number of times I've been in a group where it was used. I'm not much of a raider.
I was just saying it might have a slight effect on guilds on farm.
blissful warren
Guess the servers are burning hotter than Teldrassil π€£
And all the people constantly pressing "Connect Again" probably doesn't help either
weary notch
as a former IT project manager I can confirm that
arctic harbor
probably just kill traffic via load balancers
warm plinth
So that actually does affect them fixing things, when people are constantly retrying?
weary notch
not if they're smart
but smart = $, and convincing a company to shell out more overhead to avoid downtime is REALLY hard
especially when it doesn't affect the bottom line
arctic harbor
eh load balancers are fairly common place in large clusters these days
im sure they have something in place
with all the DDOS stuff
weary notch
yeah, they are, but they're usually tuned for around 20% extra load. I always told the planning guys to tune for 100% extra load, but that's rare
arctic harbor
and fundamentally, people cycle logging in is no different than that
weary notch
right, it's just smaller
blissful warren
and in the end, in a couple of days all this hype will calm down
weary notch
also, lots of server farms with load balancing have the balancing servers (or sometimes all the servers) rented out from other companies. So your internal IT folks can be top notch and it can still all go wrong
I think blizz has all of their stuff in house, but I don't know for sure
weary notch
yeah, that's common for auth servers
but I've been out of the biz for 5 years now, so there's probably lots of new tech I don't know about.
lusty grotto
not much has changed
there's a lot of routing tech and stuff but the principle remains the same
stark wraith
tfw when furys tier gets updated for prepatch but prots doesnt
blissful warren
I just hope that we won't need "Protection Warrior Tank Guide (BfA 8.0.1) or How to Roll a Monk and Power Level It in Three Days up to 220 Item Level So You Actually Get Invited in Groups" type of guides.
inland mesa
What happened to DH that they fell so hard on tank rankings?
verbal socket
any trinkets doing OP dmg now?
merry cave
DH lost some damage and azerite trait that made sigils op. There still strong it's just monks seem to be the flavour for the last week or so
inland mesa
Yea, was looking at rankings and it seems to be Monk > Druid > Pala/DK > War > DH -- but I thought with AM and BV you could fill a lot of our mitigation gap with last stand bolster and and shield wall so we weren't in that bad a place
merry cave
Depends who your getting rankings from tbh
And if they are m+ or raid focused or both
inland mesa
sco's the newest one, but forums/discords seem similiar that the randos like kelani are jumping on it too haha
weary notch
sco is not a theorycrafter
merry cave
We really need a sco is an idiot icon
weary notch
do not listen to him
merry cave
Since that vid lots of the rankings changed -_-
inland mesa
this is what i've been doing since it's not like we can play the game XD
yeah, I take him with a grain of salt, that's why I didn't think reading marok's stuff it seemed like we were in a bad place, just got waffled in a mitigation gap, and the IP down to 50 sucked
merry cave
I haven't tried all on 120 so keep that in mind but all feel raid viable between what I've tried and a few friends have tried.
weary notch
also, tank variance in this game is usually small unless you're going for world first, in which case you're probably not coming here for info - you're probably working with your own in-house TCers
bottom line, unless you want world first or MDI, play what you enjoy
inland mesa
yeah, I just haven't liked feeling like I hold the guild back from time to time, so was going to have a back up tank. I've used warrior every expansion except wrath when I didn't play.
merry cave
There's definitely some sense of easier time in m+. We could of pushed a lot harder if I wasn't stubborn and went bdk. But definitely for raids all will work fine
I think wars will surprise people in raids tbh
The kit is good
weary notch
there's no safe option, though. Classes will get nerfed/buffed pretty constantly
merry cave
^^^β
inland mesa
RIP EN warrior
weary notch
grip has an edge, though, it's hard to argue that. If you really want a backup tank for M+, DK is usually a safe option. But it's more important to find the class you enjoy and get really good at it than it is to pick a class that you think is going to give you an edge
merry cave
Also sco ranks druid so high. I'd rather hold guild back 20 attempts than be bored to death most raids π΄
inland mesa
I've always enjoyed warrior, but usually have a back up in case they don't work or need a niche. Blood DK was the last tier because yay aggramar >.>
I just got annoyed with argus and just falling over if shield block wore off .1 seconds before a stupid scythe while the druid is like what, that tickeled
probably compounded by raid leading/calling, need a better set up to notice it was going to wear off in the hundredth of a second
weary notch
warrior is a tougher class to play than druid. That's one of the reasons so many people went druid. But SB is SUPER effective on scythes
inland mesa
feels more satisfying to be good at for sure
waxen cradle
I will try and have 2 tanks I try and keep relatively close to my Warrior, just because with 6 tank classes if I keep 1 the most geared and 2 relatively close but not quite at the level of my main I can switch to a different tank for that niche situations where its just needed
inland mesa
i haven't played with beta enough to see how horrible the azerite nerf was...it seemed really doable before that and not as horribly grindy as legion
waxen cradle
Well unless they change things the AP cost will scale down weekly instead of scaling up like crazy
That is what they said the plan was
merry cave
The fact it's character base not spec base helps a lot
I plan to have war and monk/dh ready to roll. DK seems a bit flimsy atm
inland mesa
yeah my initial plan was war and dh until monk got fotm
waxen cradle
is week to week the AP cost will go down it will make a huge difference if you need to level multiple Azerite pieces to stack certain traits which is pretty much a sure things in some cases for Warriors
inland mesa
is all that stuff up on the website already?
waxen cradle
I do not think so no
But more to point what I mean is things like the Deafening Crash trait, depending on how lucky you get with traits on gear as you gear up I for one will be building at least a set of Azerite gear that stacks at least 2 DCrash traits
amber siren
Traits are set in stone on the source they come from, a helmet from normal Uldir will have the same traits at Mythic
waxen cradle
Yeah true but I mean more in terms of what gear pieces you use. For example if you get a Azerite gear piece that is say a 20 to 30 ilvl upgrade while you farm for say your 3 DCrash traits pieces then who is not gonna use it even if means not using the DCrash gear piece because it is 20 to 30 ilvls lower
Unless people were going to use certain traits regardless of what they lose such as for Warriors the Str to Armor conversion, and the stam boost
amber siren
A 20-30 ilvl increase would be an upgrade no matter the trait (or lack-of). You're overthinking this.
waxen cradle
now granted it may not be much, but with Blizzards plan to make things be a upgrade more based off of primary stats and ilvl just being better I cannot see running around with multiple pieces of lower ilvl just over a trait and no one ever would do that
Not really over thinking I was just using it as a example
amber siren
It's a better system than not being able to replace a 910 relic with a 970 one because it didn't have bastion.
Better gear should be a better upgrade
waxen cradle
Also with forced personal loot you will not be able to plan loot drops or divvy out loot in any way either
junior ivy
omg i got on wow
waxen cradle
Yeah I agree @amber siren its a huge improvement
crystal night
Does anyone know where the demo shout T-clap azerte armor will come from ?
waxen cradle
Like I said what I meant was building sets will be more luck based, you can run a dungeon or raid for several weeks and whether or not your planning to build up gear sets with stacking certain traits... it will be does the piece you want with a certain trait drop today, or for raids for that matter for that week.
blissful warren
Btw, about building sets. Did they dial the titanforging down to something sensible?
waxen cradle
Azerite gear does not titanforge as for the rest of your gear no idea
blissful warren
Getting a piece from the normal that's 25 levels higher than a heroic one was kinda demotivating.
weary notch
yeah, my realm is up
amber siren
@waxen cradle That's just with any loot, trait or not. This piece has crit and vers but is 10 ilvl higher than the mastery haste one I wanted. Traits or not the chances of you getting the exact gear you want is always a matter of luck and time.
waxen cradle
Yeah servers are up, several high pop servers went straight to full
weary notch
lol, but argus is down
chrome harbor
is our 4pc still broken or did they fix it form when we had beta character copies
amber siren
It's broken forever probably
waxen cradle
Well I would imagine broken for as long as it matters which is not too far into the launch of BFA
chrome harbor
alright guess ill keep my set bonus, was gonna go wild with ilvl
cause i know the 2pc sure as hell doesnt matter
waxen cradle
It does kind of suck you have to use a broken non working bonus to use another broken one , but on the bright side the 4 set is broken in a really good way π
blissful warren
I just wanted to put all of my legendaries on π€£ and go wild
chrome harbor
Yea thatβs be fun, not like pre expansion balance matters anyway
sharp dew
Yo wtf avatar isn't even on abilities
amber siren
@sharp dew Respec
blissful warren
holy moly, what are those new panels
waxen cradle
New panels ?
blissful warren
yeah
pseudo violet
is it me or is avatar missing, both on beta and live?
amber siren
@pseudo violet Respec into prot
pseudo violet
im in prot
pseudo violet
ohh nice that worked, thanks!
amber siren
π
blissful warren
What is these panels, I don't even.
blissful warren
No, those are edits
They just look unbalanced
As if some old addon screwed the UI π
junior ivy
where can i see what tal;ents to pick?
amber siren
Nah just blizzard's attempt to make it not look so clunky
If you don't like the new ones I know bartender has a preset for the old bars
junior ivy
ty
amber siren
Yw
blissful warren
Man, seeing such low item levels and stats is so weird
junior ivy
i dunno what to do without titan panel
warm plinth
Oh man, the expansion might actually get catfriend's addon count down below 100.
junior ivy
im already looking at titan panel replacements
i cant play without it
its where i store my PMs
undone sun
Lol
warm plinth
RIP
junior ivy
@undone sun e youre good at addons, youve never failed me before
what can i use instead of titanpanel?
if it never comes back
chrome harbor
anyone try any M+ yet?
storm slate
my quest ! are showing up as sparkle halos? is that new or addon bugging out?
looks awful imo
amber siren
I haven't noticed that
cinder nova
Should we go 4p now?
amber siren
Yeah it's very strong rn
amber siren
That doesn't look intended
storm slate
ill check my addons ty
blissful warren
Gah, the panels shifted two buttons to the right, I keep clicking IP instead of mounting up xD
junior ivy
i dunno how you people can even play with all these addons not working
warm plinth
Have you actually checked to see if they don't work? A lot will work even if it says they're out of date.
blissful warren
Eh, default UI is decent enough
junior ivy
titan panel is SO important
and it isnt working
and um astral keys keeps givin me errors π¦
prisma crane
i've been using default, so this is a small change
round vortex
His is titan panel SO important lol
fiery remnant
Hey guys what are the best legendarys for us rn and what talents are you taking?
round vortex
How is *
amber siren
blissful warren
I'm taking belt and bracers for the moment
junior ivy
i use bracers and gloves
blissful warren
And just bought the helm for the fury off-spec, oh yeah
fiery remnant
so are you guys taking devastator over booming voice?
amber siren
No
prisma crane
read the pinned guide
tepid echo
wait .. they removed battle cry .. so t21 is useless ?
prisma crane
Deva is a shell of its former self
undone sun
2pc is @tepid echo
prisma crane
and yea, 2p is 4p is broken atm
winged marsh
π
junior ivy
SO DO I PUT DEVESTATE BACK ON MY ACTION BAR?
prisma crane
yea...
junior ivy
sorry for caps im shocked
ugh no room for devestate
now i gotta find a place for it
junior ivy
oh. do i not have my artifact?
tepid echo
rip battle cry
amber siren
I had victory rush on 2 since I had nothing else to put on there till today
winged marsh
artifacts are disabled
amber siren
Nope artifact is dead
fiery remnant
idk if i wanna buy the belt or gloves with my essence
junior ivy
or something
amber siren
Battle cry & rallying shout
And intimidating shout
Wait and it's actrually battle shout
Wowie
prisma crane
belt is probably super OP now that base DS is 45 sec
fiery remnant
so i should pick up the belt first?
blissful warren
A lot of shouting, in other words
fiery remnant
can you give other alts essence?
prisma crane
but either works, gloves strong during Avatar
fiery remnant
or buy leggos for them?
prisma crane
yea
runic hare
I just noticed they forgot to update our Antorus 2 set bonus
tepid echo
isnt prot supposed to have recklessness ?
runic hare
it still reads Battle Cry, and Avatar doesn't seem to bring our SS cd to 0
amber siren
We have avatar instead
undone sun
Reck was removed from prot
amber siren
@runic hare It's likely just not on their to-do list
prisma crane
if they made it avatar
it'd be the most broken shit in the game
and i'd love every second of it
undone sun
Definitely be busted
runic hare
Still kinda sucks that bonus became void, at least for the time being
prisma crane
think of how good it was with BC, then multiply the duration by 4....
blissful warren
Demoralizing Shout is pretty ridiculous with the legendary belt
waxen fulcrum
is 4set even worth going for? it looks a bit more appealing now than before but then again 2set doesn't work at all
fiery remnant
do i buy the actual lego and send that to an alt or send the essence?
eager phoenix
I finished the mage tower Prot Warr challenge but the tooltip says I haven't collected this appearance and when I checked my other 110 warrior I could not transmog to it
prisma crane
BoE thing and send that to the alt
amber siren
@eager phoenix A few people have reported that bug, send in a ticket
prisma crane
4 set is broken atm
chrome harbor
well we're definitly more healer dependent thats for sure
runic hare
2 set is useless, 4 set broken. Think we are off to a good start then XD
plain vapor
feels so awkward hitting devastate now Lol
sick sentinel
One message removed from a suspended account.
amber siren
Yeah those aren't scaled
blissful warren
"World of Warcraft: Wrath of the Training Dummy"
sick sentinel
One message removed from a suspended account.
One message removed from a suspended account.
amber siren
amber siren
Yep our mastery hasn't changed
warm plinth
The only thing block-wise that has changed is that your amount blocked is not a fixed 30%; instead, it's based on the block value of your shield.
Well, and it's maxed at 85% like armor is.
chrome harbor
hows the scaling in M+, either i joined a really dumb group for volcanic or everyones taking a lot more dmg
runic hare
aye, as I look right now its 44.69% for me. with crit block that'd be 89.38
if my 6 AM math turns out to be working correctly
warm plinth
Yeah, there wasn't before, since it was going up to 88% with Bastion 7/7. It's new with the pre-patch.
runic hare
So uhm, for raiding purposes, the leggos of choice remain the same I take it?
For let's say Argus
warm plinth
Yeah, still gloves/belt, with bracers thrown in for defense.
plain vapor
aggramar is bugged lol. his flame rend does no damage
undone sun
Hmmmm
runic hare
Bugged or severely undertuned :^)
brittle timber
the gloves really? figured it would be shoved aside since we rarely touch devastate now
warm plinth
Gloves buff comes from auto attacks, not devastate.
analog pewter
main vault
They 100% buff from Devastate
amber siren
Devastator isn't used anymore
runic hare
It's not?
upper spoke
Broken Shore world quests aren't on my map. I know WQGF no longer works, but why can't I see the locations of WQs on my map of the Broken Shore?
or broken isles. w/e it's called
warm plinth
Oh, I misunderstood. Devastator is not used anymore.
brittle timber
devastator is pretty much dead, not enough GCDs to devastate so i'm really assuming the gloves have lost a ton of value
amber siren
It doesn't provide anymore rage gen, we use booming voice instead
runic hare
I see
Well, seems I can switch my shield slam keybind with Devastate now, as that will be a new spam button XD
brittle timber
i moved it off to ` from 2
warm plinth
You shouldn't really have to spam it barring terrible luck. It's just a part of the rotation again.
amber siren
Vengeance is still OK defensively but it's up to you to weave that in
cinder nova
No it isn't.
It's 47 rage just for 1 IP without Revenge Procs
And IP costs 40 rage flat.
opaque pagoda
jesus, this is terrible
cinder nova
And it loses value if you don't have procs, so it's only really for fights where you got lots of adds
opaque pagoda
ignore pain on the GCD is a completely awful situation
upper spoke
simple question: do WQs appear on anyone's map of the broken isles?
main vault
I'm honestly amazed at the number if people who had no clue what the changes would bring
amber siren
Vengeance is OK for dungeon content, you wouldn't use it for a raid
cinder nova
It's really not worth it tbh
runic hare
Well, it's good that we have an amazing opportunity to catch up to all of it now Nexii XD
prisma crane
btw FWIW @timid jay against teh 113 dummy my block is 35.9% dmg reduction, 45.33 against 110
cinder nova
BV is better for dungeons for the burst
prisma crane
1180 on my shield
amber siren
Yeah for sure, like 99% BV is the go-to
cinder nova
Vengeance isn't OK if it's become super niche to add-heavy fights.
amber siren
True
runic hare
So right now I'm rolling 1-2-2-3-2-1-1 as talent choices. How far off the right setup am I?
warm plinth
Pretty much what it's supposed to be
undone sun
^
runic hare
Excellent, cheers!
warm plinth
Marok is gonna be sad if you guys don't read the guide he worked hard on though
π’
undone sun
π
warm plinth
I wonder if Discord could implement a feature where you can have a website display on the right side in place of the members pane, and we could just do a custom format for the guide and put it there for people to scroll through.
fiery remnant
so should we not touch the gloves now?
warm plinth
Gloves are still good. You just won't have the effect as often as you would with Devastator.
main vault
People won't read the guide no matter how much you shove it down their throat
warm plinth
Probably true. Fortunately I don't have much of a life and I type fast, so I'll answer them out of boredom.
Never been much of a 
person
runic hare
Hmh, the titan trinkets at max level seem to be 280, while our legendaries are on 265
A rather odd change seeing they both had the same ilevel originally
languid sigil
So, this happened? https://puu.sh/AYnzT/990b055579.png
languid sigil
:omega
undone sun
Give us 2 shields
EZ
warm plinth
Like the meme double shield builds in DS1
languid sigil
Btw, is anyone else having issues with their WA?
broken kite
Lots will be broken
languid sigil
Never play on patch day I guess
warm plinth
A lot of people probably. They changed how the API pulls spells or something.
languid sigil
Well my problem is, the game does not recognize the saved variables folder
languid sigil
Which means none of my WA show at all LUL
warm plinth
UnitAura no longer accepts a spell name as a filter. This is probably a main part of it
marble iris
Lols yeah it killed my IP absorb amount tracker, I need to rewrite it.
chilly brook
Mine was perfect π
broken kite
Check the wa discord
warm plinth
If it's set up to pull by name instead of ID, it won't work
merry cave
I don't understand why they change stuff like that
chilly brook
I guess I should just go play something braindead like guardian
warm plinth
Streamlining, improvements, no reason, etc. I'm sure π
chilly brook
Until they fix the addons
marble iris
You can't pull by ID either, you can only pull by an index between 1 and 40, so you basically need to make a loop that checks the name of each aura.
warm plinth
Ah okay
Sorry, not an addon author so I was guessing based on the API changes documented. Thanks for clarifying Aerxies.
marble iris
Neither am I, just spent like 40 minutes digging through why my weak auras was screaming at me in errors.
warm plinth
Rename addon to AngryWeakAuras
marble iris
Anyway, have they decreased the maximum percentage of HP that IP stacks to?
amber siren
1.3
warm plinth
It's not a percentage of HP anymore. It's based on attack power and versatility only I believe. And you can only have a cap of 1.3 casts of IP.
(attackPower * 2.5) * (1 + Versatility) is the formula on live
marble iris
Oh? Okay.
Man that sounds like there's gonna be little actual stacking then. Hey at least it frees up more rage.
I like the IP has a constant cost now, I can predict my rage spendage now, it's nice.
warm plinth
Yeah you're gonna have to choose carefully where to use IP in most situations if I understand it correctly. And it's much more important to track your IPs since you can't stack them very high past a single cast.
Easy to waste rage if you're not paying attention, which is not something we can waste in this patch.
marble iris
Yeah absolutely.
Kinda wish they kept that talent that had the flat damage reduction, would be handy to dump extra rage into.
warm plinth
I guess if nothing else good comes from putting IP on GCD, it'll at least help me correct the muscle memory of just mashing it out of habit.
marble iris
Speaking of talents it seems like devastator is kind of stronger than ever, since even defensive cooldowns are on GCD, taking your filler off GCD seems pretty damn handy all of a sudden.
full spruce
Segway; why is everyone trying to snatch up wrath mats all a sudden? trade is blowing up looking for mats
runic hare
I guess it has smth to do with the profession rework?
warm plinth
It's actually not unfortunately. Devastator is inferior to the other talents in its row now with the talent moves. It's competing with Booming Voice now.
undone sun
Bv
warm plinth
It's basically a rage generation tier, and BV provides the most constant rage and gives more damage bonus than Devastator by a lot
Especially with Anger Management
Consistent, not constant.
marble iris
Damn, when did demoralizing shout get the reduction in cooldown? Last time I played it was like a minute and a half CD.
warm plinth
With this patch.
warm plinth
I wonder if the uptime is similar to 7.3.5 numbers actually, since we still use the belt and still use Anger Management. With the 50% CD reduction, it's probably close.
fiery remnant
so should i only be using revenge when its free?
warm plinth
Either that, or you're at risk of capping rage and don't need to cast IP.
fiery remnant
Thank you
weary notch
you can use it whenever you want, but using IP instead is always the better defensive option
if you're not going to die, feel free to revenge away
plain vapor
just killed mythic aggramar AMA
runic hare
Whats it like with the stat changes
warm plinth
Did Flame Rend do damage?
plain vapor
lets get that CHEDDAR fam
nah flame rend does very little damage. you can soak 2 back to back with no cds lol
runic hare
And besides his Flame Rend, anything that stands out?
plain vapor
his melee attacks tickle when you arent tanking
runic hare
Did you kill him faster than you normally would, or did it take longer?
weary notch
I haven't made Weak Auras in so long my brain has exploded
weary notch
anyone have the spell ID for Shield Block on hand?
warm plinth
Is DBM totally screwed atm?
dim portal
is avatar just not showing up in spellbooks atm?
plain vapor
its working fine. the aggramar technique weakaura is broken though
warm plinth
@dim portal Swap specs, then back to prot. It'll show up.
dim portal
thx
warm plinth
I guess Dargrul is broken in Nelth's. Casts things at random times, sometimes doesn't do Molten Crash after Landslide, etc.
runic hare
He can't control the hammer, don't hate
warm plinth
They tried to tell him, didn't they Craq
warm plinth
inb4 scythe didn't get scaled and you just die instantly
runic hare
Cant wait to try him later tonight
opaque pagoda
I gotta say, this feels pretty awful, I might have to think about dusting off the paladin or DK
cinder nova
DK is just as bad
runic hare
Dk became very slow iirc
cinder nova
Paladin is good, but it feels like you're sorta just AOEing all the time
VH is spam city for shear
Monk is alright
Druid is meh,
plain vapor
π€ no parses on argus
main vault
Doesn't even have shear anymore
little star
@weary notch 2565 is the id for shield block
weary notch
thanks. That's what I thought, but WAs doesn't recognize it. Something else must be wrong
warm plinth
VDH has shear. I believe the go-to build does not utilize fracture. I only briefly glanced over their updated guide though.
main vault
Fracture replaces Shear
warm plinth
@weary notch As someone mentioned earlier, they changed how addons have to pull spells from the API. They can't use spell IDs or names anymore. That might be the problem.
weary notch
hmm. The weird thing is that it worked on the PTR
warm plinth
Yes @main vault but Fracture is not part of the suggested talent build for them. So they would have Shear.
stuck coral
hi, some1 has coded the IP LUA function?
main vault
Yes it is
warm plinth
Never mind, I'm reading it wrong. I should have done more than glance over it.
:p
Thanks for correcting me!
low fulcrum
am i an idiot, I cant find avatar in my spellbook
weary notch
I'm trying to make a WA that shows the icon for Shield Block when I pop Last Stand. Worked on PTR, doesn't work on live
low fulcrum
kk
little star
you have to find the icon id for shield block then
spell id and icon id are completely different
weary notch
oh okay
little star
or just type shield block into the search in weakauras icon
weary notch
I did that, and it just gives me a green box
little star
132110 is the icon id
weary notch
that worked! ty! how did you find that? Is it: /run print((select(3,GetSpellInfo("Rend"))))
with SB replacing rend, obv
little star
nah i just know how to use weakauras π
weary notch
okay, cool. Thanks again!
little star
np
plain vapor
good lord argus' scythes are so much scarier
weary notch
you using bolster?
plain vapor
just figuring out a rotation
weary notch
yes it is
warm plinth
The one that made it to live was Last Stand granting you 100% block while it's up
warm plinth
Oh, I figured you were referring to the armor from str going up by 40% for 10 seconds
My bad.
weary notch
with anger management you can get Last Stand's CD to close to 60 seconds
stuck coral
do you have an IP WA with amount?
weary notch
I don't
weary notch
but I would love one
ashen trellis
I really doubt gloves are the best leggo right now. I legit never have time to Devastate. Maybe a few times here and there but other that then Im getting 0 value from the gloves. Im just gonna run wrists belt.
I have 62% haste
SS and TC come off cd too fast
giving me no time to Devastate
warm plinth
Well wrists and gloves are for two different purposes. Some offensive benefit is better than no offensive benefit.
pseudo ravine
Lesser Sparring Partner in Skyhold wrecked my face repeatedly. Sustain is waaaaay down. This will take getting used to.
little star
belt seems like a good one now
west kayak
@pseudo ravine I just sparred against that dummy as well and I am getting my ass handed to me.
ashen trellis
im getting 0 value from it
plain vapor
holy moyl
argus scythes are a joke with bolster
LMAO
you take scythe 3+4 with last stand
pseudo ravine
Um. Leap Shoulders definitely best leggo till 115.
warm plinth
You could run Walls Fell for damage instead if you think it's not performing well enough. The rage gain on SS will be a slight damage increase assuming you're dumping rage with Revenge.
amber siren
@weary notch I pulled this out of another users WA pack, works fine - https://wago.io/BJ5Hpr27Q
cinder nova
Why would you rage dump with revenge
pseudo ravine
Warmode plus getaway leaps = profit.
warm plinth
We're talking about damage legendaries
He said he's getting no value from gloves, so I offered an alternative.
weary notch
oh, nice. let me try that
pseudo ravine
Bolster seems OP, tbh. Just on the face of it.
weary notch
I still expect a bolster nerf
warm plinth
Insignia Ring is likely better for damage actually than TWF, or Sephuz if you can proc it.
pseudo ravine
Artifact Trait, but not channeled PLUS reduced Last Stand CD.
proper pecan
Sup everyone, can u plz link me working IP wa
ashen trellis
Bolster will either get nerfed or moved. It wayyyy too good to compete against the shitty talents in that row
warm plinth
Tbf, the other two talents in the row are extra shitty compared to most talents. I can't believe Never Surrender didn't see changes. It's so bad.
weary notch
these are the dudes who won't change 
amber siren
π€’
warm plinth
You have a point there
ashen trellis
Never surrender, Indomitable, ravager, all deserve second looks. I dont under stand how talents that have like 1 % pick rate didnt get looked at.
warm plinth
But Indom did get a second look. It just got worse each time they changed it π
weary notch
BSC needs another look. IV. Devastator. Maybe even crackling thunder
warm plinth
Blizzard doesn't do rushed xpacks π
weary notch
lots of other tanks have pretty nice talent trees
warm plinth
They have about as much actual choice as we do though. Or their choices are based on situation, which also isn't really a choice.
weary notch
but the delta between their worse choices is far smaller
cinder nova
Our talents are the warlock of BFA
warm plinth
Idk, I don't think the gap is important personally. If a talent is 1% better, I'm going to use it.
I don't speak for everyone obviously. Just my opinion on it.
cinder nova
See, that's the problem, though.
weary notch
even if you hate it? 1% is tiny
amber siren
Idk like I'm ok with UF and DR bcs I know that I always have the option of the slow if I need it, there's never going to be a situation I take indomb
cinder nova
And there's a wealth of dead talents
amber siren
Ravager is the worst example to me, it was a dead talent in legion and it was dead on arrival
for BFA
stuck coral
@amber siren thx a lot
cinder nova
I'm still not sure why they tampered with us at all
amber siren
@stuck coral π
cinder nova
Our spec was working fine with devastator
cinder nova
Not really.
weary notch
I prefer it
warm plinth
I didn't play warrior pre-legion because Legion was the first expansion where I enjoyed prot. I wish they would have left the playstyle the same at least.
weary notch
I quit legion in 7.1.5 because I hated the playstyle so fully
warm plinth
Was that the focused rage era?
I started my warrior after FR was gone so I'm not familiar with that particular patch.
weary notch
7.1.5 was the patch they removed focused rage and put in devastator
warm plinth
Ah okay
main vault
7.1.5 was devastator
weary notch
and put TC in the rotation and made Revenge cost rage
warm plinth
I might have made mine in that patch then.
weary notch
and made everything reset SS
warm plinth
That would've been right before NH right?
weary notch
yup
warm plinth
Yeah so that was pretty close to when I made my warrior.
warm plinth
For IP?
stuck coral
full suite
warm plinth
π
round vortex
Anyone else considering wearing 4 pce TOS gear now? lol
hollow kite
everyone still running booming voice/anger management?
warm plinth
@hollow kite Yeah
lavish gale
Pretty sure you want to wear 4pc Antorus and be lazy with IP
fierce juniper
^
warm plinth
Shame you have to deal with that atrocious GCD once every 12 seconds :p
lavish gale
Could be worse
plain vapor
ok nvm dont bank on using just bolster for scythes 3+4 lmao
warm plinth
lol, backfire on you?
plain vapor
yeah scythe 4 got me good
warm plinth
FeelsBad
slate obsidian
anyone else didn't get avatar in their spellbook?
lavish gale
Spec out and in to prot
chrome wyvern
So wait, T21 4p is better than T20 4p now?
slate obsidian
okay, thanks
vivid orchid
4pc t21 is godlike
lavish gale
Nop
slate obsidian
maybe in p1 depending on the spellqueue
astral ermine
I maybe blind, but I can't see Avatar on my spellbook
plain vapor
change to arms then back
astral ermine
Ops, now. Changing specialization back and forth and now it appears.
solemn kelp
curious coin no longer dropping?
warm plinth
No reason it wouldn't, unless they screwed it up.
plain vapor
got one from an emmisary today
solemn kelp
Awesome, thx for confirming.
narrow ocean
Are the Hands/Wrists legendary combo still BiS?
amber siren
Hands/belt atm
twin hazel
is the tier 21 4 set still overtuned?
vivid orchid
yes
amber siren
Yeah it's still stacking full IP's on top of each other
narrow ocean
Belt better now since Demoralizing Shout CD was reduced?
amber siren
That and RPM is heavily reduced so bracers aren't as strong
narrow ocean
Makes sense. All I've been hearing is that we suck now so I'm skeptical to log on and play my Warrior haha
vivid orchid
I think people are overstating things
amber siren
@plain vapor Was just tanking mythic argus and seemed to be enoying the new changes, I wouldn't stress too much
plain vapor
yeah we just finished for the night
narrow ocean
That's good to know. Glad the grapevine isn't right on this one then.
plain vapor
closet was got was 13% orso
druid co tank still figuring out his scythe rotation
hes getting clapped by them
amber siren
Bears smh
old zephyr
Can't find avatar in my spellbook ... meh
vivid orchid
spec out and back
undone sun
Respec
old zephyr
Worked ty
sick sentinel
One message removed from a suspended account.
amber siren
It's p bad now
finite bolt
warrior is prity bad now
stuck coral
go play monk
finite bolt
just haveing difculty chooseing another buttion for devastate
copper path
Is warrior that bad for raids now? and will it be better on release date?
amber siren
We're fine for raids on live and beta
fresh dragon
T21 2 pcs bonus.....yes..... how? lol
amber siren
It doesn't work anymore
fresh dragon
vivid orchid
not at all, just go 4pc
undone sun
You don't have to
soft glen
so to start an encounter. intercept > shout > sb > ss > ip ?
coral jasper
amber siren
Respec
cinder nova
@coral jasper π π
cinder nova
But yes respec out and back into prot
In retrospect
That is not pinned and I wonder as to why
Seems like a pretty frequent inquiry
Leave it up for a week or so then take it down
fair crystal
hope this is the right place to ask but anyone got a good Link for a New IP Weakaura
amber siren
It feels p gross linking my own stolen weakaura but; https://wago.io/BJ5Hpr27Q
soft glen
morale killer sets shout to 15 seconds lol
fair crystal
nah thats fine man THANK YOU its prefect for what im trying to build much luff
@soft glen yeah dude and with the lego belt its baller as
soft glen
yeah thats what i got on rn plus AM
crude saddle
Has any NA player managed to do some mythic atb ? Wondering how the tuning feels rn
undone sun
Afaik all but Argus is killable
steep condor
what does that mean? is pretty meme.
amber siren
He doesn't hit very hard compared to pre-patch
steep condor
so meme is like lol?
main vault
Means I took two flame things back to back solo
steep condor
ps these are genuine questions
amber siren
Yeah he means it's a joke, like, not very hard
steep condor
ahhh ok thanks
main vault
^
undone sun
Literally unplayable
main vault
You literally can't survive them
jagged pier
quick question should be going 4 set right now right?
main vault
Yes
jagged pier
cool
crude saddle
Well, that's not good lol
slate obsidian
why does demoshout and IP have to be on the gcd, I hate my life on every pull rn, feelsbad
zealous crest
Fuck me, I am fucking paper
undone sun
Β―_(γ)_/Β―
subtle fable
Not sure if I'm doing something wrong but the tanking dummy is killing me pretty quick now ..
undone sun
It does sure suck
Gcd issues are here to stay though
slate obsidian
well, no selfheal, what can you do
subtle fable
Die quickly apparently hah
slate obsidian
it wouldn't be that bad if we at least still had some gcds to spare due to old devastator...
but rn there's just too much stuff you wanna do at once
torn vigil
Just pulling mobs feels clunky.
random jay
Normally I've been doing 20s but 17s feel rough, anyone else feeling this slow rage gain and heavy rage cost bs? Also Nelth is kind of broken lol
random jay
big problem is getting used to the cost of s block/ip and the slower rage gain and filling voids with cds
amber siren
What's happening in nelth?
red cave
so, i dont have avatar, known problem?
random jay
he drops like 1-2 crystals and then magmas, sometimes he doesnt cast a guy, just wonky
amber siren
@red cave Respec back to prot
red cave
ty
torn vigil
In dungeons, rage is far from a problem from what I'm seeing.
fringe marten
Been a while since I played..thinking of returning for BFA, what's this new thing with depleted relic weapons? Is it just lore flavor for the inevitable stat squish?
undone sun
Correct, rps is fine on AOE
torn vigil
I'm doing Charge-->Demo+Block-->Tclap--> Avatar --> SS --> Tclap-->Whatever-->Tclap-->Whatever
fringe marten
I think my guild basically shut down raiding like..? start of the year? Wasn't much left but the last couple mythic mobs anyway....any major prot changes since then? (aside from the stuff that hit today?)
torn vigil
and not having any real issue with stuff
and making sure to charge between pulls
and spamming tclap on cd
to maintain rage
that helps the clunkyness quite a bit
slate obsidian
anyone else getting brutally raped by the doggos on hc? zulul RIP the days of stacking them on mythic
fringe marten
With the raid set bonuses the way they were, it was literally a chore to actually spend rage fast enough IIRC, did something change?
..holy crap I've forgotten how to edit my weak auras and even play the game LOL.
Omni is that an issue with the stat squish or depletion of the relic weapon power?
red cave
ignore pain is on the gcd, so you cant dump your rage on demand anymore without stop attacking
fringe marten
..WHAA?
I did a quick scroll back of old patch notes and didn't see that, when did that hit?
red cave
today
hot locust
It's been that way on PTR/Beta for months.
fringe marten
ohh ok. Guess I'll go check that out right quick..
the final post by marok said the channel was locked and will be deleted soon
Is there a link to important changes somewhere in there?
nm 'check the pins' I shoulda' remembered lol
Wow, was reading the pins for BFA changes...i would say these seem to be titanic nerfs but I'm guessing they're (hopefully) in line with where the game is going? you guys feeling weaker/ is everyone weaker (tanking) ?
red cave
everything feels slower
hot locust
Yeah, everyone is weaker tank-wise. Definitely takes some getting used to but it isn't all bad.
undone sun
Everyone got hit with a Nerf bat one way or the other with the artifact loss
hot locust
Still doing low/mid 20+ keys ok.
ABT looks like it might need a little more tuning but isn't bad otherwise.
fringe marten
..vanguard? stamina..? WTF Is stamina?
undone sun
fringe marten
OH nm..derp..they mean the stamina stat..as in HP
slate obsidian
umm, how do I take foe breaker right now?
fringe marten
Dude I've been coop'ing dark souls 1, 2, 3 and playing Nioh the past few months (along with Fortnite) I'm thinking stamina is a new active/usable resource LOL.
vestal palm
where is the Avatar? its not in my spellbook
undone sun
Respec
slate obsidian
yeah, but is shieldblock still enough, or do I need to throw laststang, demo or SW in?
red cave
might as well throw in demo, where else are you using it
slate obsidian
on CD?
fringe marten
Foebreaker was...IIRC the physical attack you had to block,..and you can't take 2 in succession (not intended anyway..but you used to use cd's to solo the whole wombo combo cycle)
hot locust
Nah SB should be fine for first if you aren't high as hell on technique stacks.
slate obsidian
btw guys, do yourself a favour and don't try to tank doggos
slate obsidian
they smashed through me on fucking hc, whilst tanking them apart
vestal palm
this will be a funny raid this evening
red cave
so, is demo shout even worth using for dps 15% for 6.5 seconds worth of dps increase seems like id need a lot of haste, or not have any good buttons to press at all for it to math out
hot locust
I mean I think a lot of them cancelled because of the server stability.
undone sun
Month from now
hot locust
Not because of the difficulty.
undone sun
That's true
slate obsidian
demo also gives you rage, and has like 20 sec CD with belt and AM
fringe marten
Voyle; I haven't played in a while but seeing as that threat gen went from 900% to 350%...you need to be pushing as much dps as you can..while surviving...IE..nothing really changed for tanking.
But anything that increases your dps may also be an important tool for holding threat now..instead of JUST increasing dps.
slate obsidian
well... revenge: minus 30 rage, Demo: plus 40 rage
red cave
350% is still more than double skitish, threat isnt an issue
undone sun
Defensively and offensviely if you're talented into bv, yes it's worth using
fringe marten
good lord now I have to learn how to play all over again..ugh
undone sun
As do most with the class reworks
fringe marten
well..but I also had 6 months of not playing
my fingers won't even know what keybinds did what
hot locust
Easy, you don't have habits built up from playing this whole time.
Nothing but fresh learning to do. π
undone sun
Like a short cut
fringe marten
if I had kept playing, at least I could just look at patch notes...edit weak auras accordingly, and slightly adjust rotation
red cave
what patch notes? lol they were a joke
fringe marten
now I don't even remember wtf to do
red cave
"many abilites are now changed" - blizzard
fringe marten
well I'm reading the little guide that they linked through icy veins I think
fiery remnant
I feel like everyone is sleeping on prot warrior
hot locust
Same.
undone sun
I am sleeping. Period.
dusky sentinel
A jumping rock is kinda cool tho
fringe marten
The worst prot warriors ever were was during...what was it? Nighthold? when magic damage was like the jam...since then we've been competitive for top tier tanking; we just weren't great for HIGHLY difficulty mythic+ keys so..again..people fealt other tanks were 'better'
dusky sentinel
Lets not even jump into that discussion π
fringe marten
Prot warriors simply have a higher skill cap, you have to do a lot more button manipulation with warriors than most any other tank except monk. Not sure how that'll all change in BFA.
hot locust
I guess we did have a few good bosses in BRF.
fiery remnant
It could just be me but I feel like my monk is easier to play then my prot warrior
fringe marten
That's why there's a handful of good prot warriors that do top tier content...then a bunch of chumps that make the class look bad...'cause it takes a lot of work to really make warrior compete with FOTM tanks.
dusky sentinel
Mostly the case, @fringe marten Most ppl just listen to what others say. for instance. Gorefiends grasp is op af! The 10 ppl tuning in go like: "... Yeah. ill main my dk"
swift willow
It's not just you dude, Monk is the easiest tank to play
fair crystal
sorry again guys anyone got a good battle Shout Weakaura so i rember to use it
fringe marten
anyway; i'm all patched up I'll probably log in tomorrow and start learning again..
dusky sentinel
Anyways. Work. Have fun in prepatch guys
fringe marten
As far as how content has scaled...is everything but the dogs 'squished' properly?
hot locust
Some bosses harder than before other than dogs, but are still doable.
Argus being one of them.
errr well
fringe marten
Also...they really aren't ever bringing our banners back are they? /sigh
fringe marten
I'm guessing that's due to block not being a flat % any more
undone sun
No
hot locust
I mean, we block more than that right now.
undone sun
Its for all tanks
torn vigil
It's not doable by any tanks, bears included.
hot locust
It's just the scaling.
torn vigil
It's his scythe damage.
fringe marten
ah
undone sun
Unkillable
fringe marten
well I was as geared as I was getting unless I got some set pieces from the last couple mythic bosses anyway
gear I'm not concerned with....I just want to be able to play properly again in time for BFA
so I don't even have to raid really
Wasn't there some M+ changes too?
torn vigil
M+ are fine.
fringe marten
no to loot? like you get more loot?
torn vigil
I've done some 17s already, some guildies have done some 20s
No idea about that aspect.
But scaling is fine.
fiery remnant
Have you guys gotten your addons to work?
fringe marten
oh I didn't even think about that...yeah there will be all new versions to get. Good time to come back I guess.
torn vigil
Everything I have is working so far, except FlyPlateBuffs
vocal nimbus
i dont have avatar in my spell book
torn vigil
and XCT, but I haven't tried to fix XCT yet
fringe marten
FlyPlateBuffs?
torn vigil
@vocal nimbus respec
celest arrow
I cant for the life of me find
fringe marten
eh...? mannn...they better not mess with video settings stuff too much; every time they do it screws with my Gsync monitor working properly.
vivid orchid
they did and it did
celest arrow
cant for the life of me find avatar in my spellbook, anyone els having this issue?
fringe marten
Chamber did it 'cause Gsync to not work?
vivid orchid
yup
fringe marten
...
vivid orchid
thats more microsofts fault than blizzards
fringe marten
? How does Microsoft factor into Gsync in any way?
vivid orchid
because they build dx12
vocal nimbus
@celest arrow spec arms/fury and back to prot again
fringe marten
Well gsync does have an option for windowed and fullscreen ...do neither work right now?
slate obsidian
I'd honestly recommend not speccing back to prot until they put either IP or demo shout off the gcd
vivid orchid
one of the windows updates broke that functionality
undone sun
Lol so never @slate obsidian
vivid orchid
if IP lost its gcd as is and no other changes, we'd be one of the best tanks
fringe marten
Yeah it'll feel 'clunky' (slow) if IP and demoshout are on GCD...that's just going to make the whole tanking rotation feel sluggish.
torn vigil
If anything it doesn't feel sluggish
it feels crowded
But it's likely that this is what was intended.
fringe marten
the gsync thing is going to piss me off once I fire up wow tomorrow.
Nvidia may address it with a driver patch
vivid orchid
also doesnt help that blizzard messed up their dx12 implementation for nvidia cards
fiery remnant
So how do you guys fit ip in the priority system?
fringe marten
I'm guessing it's still used secondary to shield block?
torn vigil
Am I taking lots of Damage --> If yes, Is shield block up? --> If yes, IP.
torn vigil
That's it.
undone sun
EZ
vivid orchid
thats about it right there
that said, for the moment our t21 4pc makes IP disgustingly good
fringe marten
IP also has a much much lower cap than before.
undone sun
Yup
undone sun
Roughly that, yeah
fringe marten
so you spend 40 rage, if you had ? (is it dragon scales?) up...you're done...
fiery remnant
So if Iβm capping on rage and donβt need the ip just waste it on revenge?
fringe marten
yes.
you can't really stack too much IP any more, from the numbers it would seem...so you'd just do 1 cast..once it's tore off you'd want to make sure you had another on...that's about it.
astral harness
When should I be using revenge versus devastate?
fringe marten
but it would still be secondary to maintaining your shield block uptime
torn vigil
^
fiery remnant
Kk simple enough
fringe marten
is uhh...? the thing? Devastator? Still the best thing?
torn vigil
Nope. No one's really taking it anymore.
undone sun
No
fringe marten
eh? really?
vivid orchid
doesnt provide rage
fiery remnant
Whatβs the better waist/bracers or bracers/hands?
vivid orchid
belt is very good now
hot locust
I'd just drop bracers now tbh
Not gonna have 'em in BFA, might as well get used to it.
carmine cobalt
Hands waist are best i think atm
fringe marten
belt was one of the better choices even when I quit...I think it was belt/bracers? and then gloves/belt for dps?
undone sun
Yeah, though bracers lost some value with the rps drop
Gloves might be a bit shotty with devastator being phased out, who knows
torn vigil
Hands Belt is very very powerful atm in dungeons.
fringe marten
Not surprising...but I will say the self sustainability those provided will feel like almost a hole in the warrior class when BFA actually hits.
torn vigil
You're going to have to train yourself to use your shout properly with hands-belt.
fringe marten
So what is everyone running now if devastator is out?
torn vigil
But it's an incredible combo
undone sun
Bv
torn vigil
Booming Voice has insane synergy atm.
fringe marten
But I was? OHH..I think I used that ring a lot...so I had devastator and BV.
fiery remnant
How fast can you guys farm essence to buy legendary?
undone sun
Ring gave vengeance
fringe marten
I think? holy crap I don't remember anything now.
Yeah sorry.
I know I was using booming voice
but wasn't it on a different tier?
north oar
What legos would a shitcunt prot warrior use?
vivid orchid
it was yea
torn vigil
You can get well over 2-2.5k per week now, given the world quests.
fringe marten
Everyone was using BV because of the set bonus right?
oh they shifted the tier it was on? holy crap that's horrible
so do we have to go back to perma fluttering 'devastate' again?
undone sun
Yes, talents got reworked and rearranged
torn vigil
@fringe marten Yep. You don't use it often on trash, but you do on bosses.
Standard talents atm are 1-(1/2)-2-3-2-1-1
fringe marten
...nooooooo....that's why I liked devastator so much, not the dps..not the rage...just the fact that it cleaned up the rotation because you weren't perma spamming F (my devastate key)
prime oxide
What spec will you guys level as?
fringe marten
Tclap and revenge are going to be your allstars in a dungeon every time
fringe marten
Does devastate not have the 30% chance to reset other abilities?
torn vigil
So it doesn't feel nearly as bad.
timid jay
It does
torn vigil
It does, but you're hitting Tclap and SS and Revenge often enough
fringe marten
hmm.
fringe marten
yeah I'll just have to play again
obviously the class has shifted quite a bit
yeah I'm just gonna' go smash world content until my weak auras are set right..then run a bunch of weak M+
ionic fern
undone sun
old zephyr
I tried hitting a dummy as prod this morning and got smashed by the small one (in skyhold) is that just me that is doing crap or are healer that much needed now?
hot locust
The dummies are scaled super funky.
They hit way harder than practically anything else right now.
old zephyr
that explains it then π
slow warren
anyone got a working IP value WA?
slow siren
hey guys! just logged in and I cant find avatar anywhere on my spellbook, anyone knows whats up?
undone sun
Respec
slow siren
sweet thanks!
tender imp
but yeah gloves just seems very meh in 5mans without devastator
stable knoll
hi i cant find avatar, is that a bugg?
tender imp
respec
undone sun
Yes it's a bug, fix it by respecing
stable knoll
okay nice, ty
old zephyr
maybe we should pin This π
timid jay
Good call
stable knoll
yea ^^
undone sun
Yeah @timid jay pin it
manic perch
the pins no one uses? π
junior igloo
As if anyone would read it before asking
naive lagoon
is anyone else noticing that avatar isn't in the spellbook as prot ?
tender imp
xd
undone sun
manic perch
#protection (check pins) can work yeah
fierce juniper
If you don't have Avatar on your bars/in your spellbook, change your spec to Fury/Arms and then back to Prot. Avatar will appear.
undone sun
Lol