2nd question: I know there's some bias against crafted legendaries but, after reading Rethu's Incessant Courage... it seems pretty good? Clearly not the best, but people seem to really dislike it. Any reason why?
#protection
brave halo
warm plinth
It's okay; it's just that pretty much every other legendary is better
timid jay
Higher ilvl trinkets from antorus will outclass dmd
prisma crane
it just sounds better than it is in practice Rek
it's not the worst, but others far outclass it
brave halo
Even just 930 ones, Cosmo? Immortality is ranked pretty high on the trinket spreadsheet linked under the FAQ.
timid jay
Pretty low health pool of Prot warriors and the general strength of our legendaries makes it a poor choice
brave halo
For example, DMD Immortality is ranked 6th on "increasing EHP" and 3rd on "reducing healing required" against all trinkets.
That makes sense, Cosmo.
timid jay
Wouldnt call 930 higher ilvl, heroic and upwards is what I mean
Dmd is very strong at what it does but there are some other very strong trinkets from antorus
junior ivy
is that one with all the stats better than dmd too?
prisma crane
broke 3500 score
timid jay
👏
prisma crane
3 of my recent high keys have been failed by under 40 sec
timid jay
Ouch
prisma crane
still have a 17 NL lol
junior ivy
too bad we just barely missed that dht 16 timer right?
brave halo
Why do I see a lot of emphasis for offensive legendaries? (At my admittedly starting level) I never seem to have problems with holding aggro even with much better geared DPS.
prisma crane
since if youre not dying
timid jay
Where and what are you looking at?
prisma crane
might as well do more dmg
brave halo
Heh, fair.
timid jay
Simply looking at wcl and you'll most likely have it sorted by damage
prisma crane
that too
brave halo
Cosmo - for example, I looked at the top ranked Prot Warriors and most of them have Revenge based Relics
At least one
Sometimes 2
timid jay
Top ranked where?
timid jay
If it's all-star points on WCL it's simply top DPS Prot warriors so that makes perfect sense
prisma crane
what is that site?
brave halo
World of Wargraphs
timid jay
Never heard about it either
prisma crane
also
timid jay
/shrug
prisma crane
that's alot of prot 11/11
prisma crane
seems weird
junior ivy
i immediately looked for sense on that list lol
brave halo
I'm having a hard time believing that these Method people are only 11/11 heroic and not 11/11 Mythic
I mean, c'mon
prisma crane
you know what?
its going off of achieves
so
anyone with any prot warr alt counts
timid jay
^
brave halo
...
timid jay
Just because you have a character in method doesn't make it a character that has killed mythic argus
brave halo
You can visit them in the armory
timid jay
Just pull up the armory
brave halo
If these are alts, they are pretty serious, bleeding-edge alts
timid jay
I randomly pressed 3 of them s bit down
warm plinth
They've been full clearing since like week 2? or 3? So
They probably have alts going through Mythic now since they feed them gear in heroics
timid jay
Not a single mythic antorus kill
brave halo
Do you have a better site?
timid jay
What exactly are you looking for?
prisma crane
raider.io / WCL, but as far as who's good at "tanking" as in, not taking dmg, there really isnt a place for that
timid jay
Just pull up the first character in that list you have
9/11 mythic while the website says 11/11
brave halo
Cosmo - to see gear, optimization, talents, etc.
Which legendaries they choose, and so forth
prisma crane
legendaries are fight specific
timid jay
Talents we basically never change
prisma crane
talents almost never change
timid jay
Gear is the same except trinkets basically
prisma crane
and gear, with WF/TF, isnt really something to look at
just look for 2p T21 and the rest just happens
timid jay
Unless its something very specific you're looking for when it comes to legendaries and you run t21 4p, you'll use gloves/bracers for a defensive setup
Unless its AHC or enonar where you'll use bracers/belt (AoE)
Trinkets do become a bit more interesting, but it mostly comes down to what you need on certain fights
prisma crane
and somewhat personal preference
timid jay
Just following what others are doing can be detrimental because of different tactics and healer setups
And simply what trinkets they have available at different ilvls
prisma crane
and different levels of skill/familiarity with fights
not to say looking at others is bda
bad*
but usually it's best to see what you have
and go from there
brave halo
I'm not sure who you get in here typically, but I think there's some serious underestimation of intelligence going on. For example, (1) of course trinkets and legendaries change from fight to fight, but you can gain very valuable information regarding trends. There are patterns. (2) Even if these people don't have 11/11 M on their Prot Warrior, chances are if they're playing at that level and are members of the world's top guilds, they have excessively theorycrafted, and that will be reflected in their choices.
Looking at warriors who are likely to have access to the best legendaries and trinkets, it's still telling to see what they choose to use.
prisma crane
except you have people like Sco talking about HR and indom
and, the first time i killed imonar i used differnt shit than i do now
warm plinth
I think you're overestimating intelligence just because they've killed a boss
timid jay
https://worldofwarcraft.com/en-gb/character/howling-fjord/Пухх
second on that list you linked, indom
https://worldofwarcraft.com/en-gb/character/howling-fjord/Пухх
3rd, also indom
Please explain to me again how indom shows that exessive theorycrafting
prisma crane
the issue isnt us assuming you're stupid, because we're def not, we're just trying to figure out what exactly you're looking to do
timid jay
Because I'd love to see it
warm plinth
Sco is literally using Heavy Repercussions right now on his warrior
shut summit
does this website show anything specific or is it just link to armory
brave halo
Strawman. I'm talking about trends.
timid jay
Not to mention a lot of those warriors dont have a single logged dungeon/raid as prot
shut summit
use warcraftlogs to see specifics per fight for all that stuff, easy
brave halo
If 80% of them were running Heavy Repercussions, I'd concede your point.
prisma crane
you could just ask
there isnt much deeper there
and yea, WCL will show gear and everything, all but NLC relic choices
timid jay
@brave halo Please just take a look at the armories linked and just see how many of them dont have any mythic kills on that warrior or are simply playing another spec
warm plinth
How would you concede the point if 80% were running it? If 80% were running it, we probably all would be running it too, since they'd obviously be using it for a reason. You said that the end-game raiders are obviously intelligent because they killed a mythic boss, yet a tank from the top guild in the world is using the wrong talent.
So that was my proof that that isn't always the case.
clear sapphire
Or he just isnt very good at the class anymore
royal cobalt
Doesn’t sco main Druid now?
prisma crane
but he's in top guild, must theory craft
warm plinth
That's likely the case. But it doesn't counter my point
My point is that just because he's in a top guild doesn't mean he's a good theorycrafter
prisma crane
esp on a site that drags in alts as well
id say im great on my warr
but not my ele
with same achieves
brave halo
Wroldcrusher, that's exactly my point. If 80% of them are running a talent, or using a legendary, it's probably right. That's why I don't use just one or two samples.
*Worldcrusher
timid jay
https://www.worldofwargraphs.com/news/1791#comments
is the latest update on the website btw
But yeah, you can see trends but please dont use that website
prisma crane
meanwhile, it is objectively the wrong talent
brave halo
Cosmo, look at the date on my first link. 11 Feb 2018.
timid jay
Just stop defending this website
prisma crane
NA > EU
timid jay
https://www.worldofwargraphs.com/pve-stats/best-guilds
I mean it doesnt even sort it correctly
Unless its by the arbitary score
Which apparantly puts alts without mythic kills in the top 5 for a spec
warm plinth
https://worldofwarcraft.com/en-gb/character/tarren-mill/scogun/pve Sco's newer warrior, shows as one of the 11/11, yet his armory shows 0/11. If it can't even pull raid progression properly, idk how you could really trust it as a resource.
warm plinth
But that kind of ruins the usefulness of the site doesn't it? Since you have to double check the information you get from it
timid jay
Take a look a WCL instead in that case
prisma crane
TLDR, we can drop the site, what are you looking for?
timid jay
Go down a few pages and look for legendaries/trinkets there
prisma crane
best legos: bracers/gloves/belt/TWF(with 4p2p)
timid jay
But as I said, you can see trends but it can depend a lot on tactics /needs of that tank
warm plinth
I can use that now Krotos 😮
prisma crane
nice
warm plinth
But I go from 949 to 934 🙃
prisma crane
lol
warm plinth
that LFR T20 though
T21 on its own is pretty crazy. I got a cloak for one of the pieces so I don't lose much there, and then a 20 ilevel loss on the chestpiece
And I finally got the belt legendary so I'm running 2pc T21 and gloves/belt most of the time
formal night
Just curious, is it possible i could get a list of bis gear from ATB so i know what to look for?
prisma crane
haste heavy gear
timid jay
No real point in making a BiS list with m+ and titanforging
prisma crane
also that, since ilvl > all for us
timid jay
It'll depend a lot on TF/WF and tier pieces
formal night
Aight thanks :^)
brave halo
Why isn't the 4p of T21 considered good? Too low of an absorb?
prisma crane
i said it was
timid jay
It worked differently on the PTR, so the post in pins is outdated about it
brave halo
Ah
timid jay
Its a strong bonus and I'd recommend getting it, the biggest benefit of using the tier combo is the CDR
Going for t21 4p does provide similar selfhealing and a lot higher EHP
wild sandal
with 6 pc i get 963 ilvl and 4pc t21 i get 967, shoild i go for the 4pc only or stick to 6pc?
royal cobalt
Do you care about ilvl at that point?
timid jay
If you dont need the extra CDR from the tier combo it might be worth trying out 4p with gloves, mainly because you dont really need that much ilvl for any content
When you reach that high you might as well reach for some more damage, should be similar in selfhealing because of the already big IP's going out so bracers wont be doing much
brave halo
How do most warriors avoid overwriting a higher Ignore Pain? When I'm on a test dummy, I noticed I can lower the absorb amount if I use the ability again at a lower rage point.
wild sandal
thanks
timid jay
That only happens if you get a dragon scales proc or any str/versa proc that you had up for previous IP's that later fade
Ideally you wouldnt waste that but its most of the time better to lower your own IP just to avoid overcapping on rage
Its simply something that comes with the high RPS we currently have going
prisma crane
in practice that doesnt happen often on anything difficult
timid jay
^
yeah, generally in harder content your IP wont be capped unless you're offtanking at which point it doesnt really matter
It can still happen during your DS/BC combo, its just something you have to live with
brave halo
I see almost everyone take Bounding Stride but tier 4 seems to be more of a personal choice (unless there are a lot of adds). Is there something I'm missing on its usefulness?
timid jay
Just nice to have the extra mobility, speed taunt comes in handy sometimes and crackling thunder is mostly wasted
prisma crane
i use CT on Eonar and big aoe with belt
timid jay
Its just a utility tier unless you play with t20 4p
junior ivy
is that the tier with the talent that goives infinite taunt for 6 seconds?
timid jay
Thats just the talent
prisma crane
not that bad
junior ivy
my co-tank doesnt use it, hes also warrior tank, and it drivexs me crazy
prisma crane
just leap if you fuck up taunt
brave halo
When would you take Booming Voice over Vengeance? Several of these warriors on WCL do.
timid jay
As soon as you get t21 2p
Basically as soon as you get t21 2p you wont have much time to weave since you'll be inside BC so much of the time
The talent loses a lot of value and the straight up extra rage from BV makes it very strong
prisma crane
not to mention dmg
brave halo
Most of the guides still recommend Vengeance, though, even with the top gear. It does seem like a pretty big boost (assuming no Soul of the Battlelord or Thundergod's Vigor)
It's because you don't have the GCDs for Revenge?
timid jay
Basically yes¨
You only get a few in a fight, its not really worth it
BV does bring you a lot of extra rage which in turn means even more CDR and higher uptime on battle cry
timid jay
Then you simply want BV for damage and because its insane with the belt
I would never recommend vengeance for m+
Maybe if you push really high keys and you dont have t21 2p for some reason and no SotB
open rose
If there is a 10 ilvl differnce between rings, shoul i go with the lower ring that had better stats?
timid jay
yes
open rose
alright thanks
brave halo
I'm having a hard time finding the best moment to use Nelth's Fury, since I have Shield Slam up so much. I'm guessing you want to make sure Thunderclap debuff isn't going to fall off and you're not in a Battle Cry but... any other recommendations?
timid jay
Generally its not used unless you need to crit block something or just block somethign with SB on CD
I dont use it all that much tbh
brave halo
How important is it to wait for a Dragon Sclaes proc to use Ignore Pain?
timid jay
not at all
And you shouldnt do it
You'd overcap on rage way before getting a dragon scales proc most of the time
brave halo
Is it worth it to go back and get T20, if I already have 4p T21?
timid jay
Most likely not
warm plinth
Why does it drive you crazy that your co-tank doesn't run it? It's not needed in raids unless you have T20 equipped
timid jay
Drives who crazy?
warm plinth
catfriend said it drove her crazy that her co-tank didn't run it
It being WCL
Er,
WLC
timid jay
ooooh
brave halo
I've read conflicting sources on relics: some say I should just take the highest ilvl, and others say I should prioritize Dragon Skin/Bastion of the Aspects even if it is lower ilvl. Any consensus here?
timid jay
Prioritize bastion is the consensus here
Dragon skin is nice but it has no where near as much of a impact as bastion
brave halo
Can it be any Bastion/X, or does it need to be Bastion/Bastion
Talking about T1/T3 Netherlight traits, that is
warm plinth
You can't have Bastion/bastion
timid jay
You cant roll double of the same trait
warm plinth
Bastion/bastion would be insane; 94% crit block 😮
brave halo
I'm sure there's some ilvl difference where it's better to upgrade, though?
warm plinth
Defensively, probably not.
brave halo
20 ilvl? 40? 60?
timid jay
For bastion, I'd say well above 100 ilvl
warm plinth
That's the only trait I lose ilevel for though
timid jay
Its actually stupid how strong it is
brave halo
Wow, so you guys do all the relic WQs and use those if you roll it?
warm plinth
You're more likely to get the trait from T3 than T1
timid jay
I have better relics that have rolled bastion now anyway
warm plinth
There are only two bosses that drop it as a first trait and they're in raids
timid jay
But yeah, farming relics in m+ and hoping they roll bastion is the best way
If you raid doesnt want to give you relics in hoep you roll bastion
brave halo
Which ones, Cosmo?
timid jay
Just any random relic and hope they roll bastion
Its what, 1/6 that they roll bastion?
warm plinth
Something like that. Pretty good chance
brave halo
Sorry, I meant Worldcrusher. "There are only two bosses that drop it as a first trait and they're in raids" Which ones?
timid jay
Its actually 1/3 to roll bastion
brave halo
Is everyone race changing to Highmountain for the Versatility?
timid jay
Its not a big bonus, doubt people feel like its worth the bonus
If you're really cutting edge, maybe
brave halo
Because of the Artifact trait Might of the Vrykul, should I try to synchronize my Demo Shout and Battle Cry?
prisma crane
when you can
brave halo
nod
brave halo
I imagine it's only necessary when y ou're taking ridiculous spike damage.
prisma crane
i use it for more dmg
brave halo
Because that's a LOT of absorb.
prisma crane
and more rage for more CDR
warm plinth
Yeah tbh I just use them both when they come off CD lol
But I'll use them together at the start of a pull or something
daring patrol
is there a point where you would ever drop haste for mastery?
hallow phoenix
I'm at like 15% haste and 60 something% mastery just because of ilvl upgrades @daring patrol
Works fine
brave halo
Are you using Ararat's?
hallow phoenix
I imagine Argus would be fun with extremely high mastery too. Like 100%
I'm using belt and gloves
prisma crane
for dps, you could start to prioritize mastery/vers after around 25% haste, but
still
not at the expense of ilvl
brave halo
Is 28% Haste, 39% Mastery a decent balance? I'm low-geared, so both will be low.
Or is there a good ratio to aim for?
hallow phoenix
Worry about ilvl
Your secondary stats will sometimes be all over the place. It's fine
brave halo
It's not possible to get 100% uptime on Shield Block without Heavy Repercussions, right?
hallow phoenix
Someone here had like 50% crit once
brave halo
Wouldn't you have to get it down to 6 second cooldown, since it's on the charge system?
hallow phoenix
Yeah I think before 2pc t21 you needed like 50% haste with heavy repur to get 100% uptime?
You don't need 100% though
brave halo
Why would 2p T21 change it?
prisma crane
more SS
brave halo
Ah, but you'd still need Heavy Repercussion, I think.
daring patrol
how about avoidance? does it work on a whole lot?
warm plinth
Yeah, but you don't need 100% uptime.
Yeah, it works on a lot in Antorus.
http://www.tanknotes.tk/ Check midway down on the left; it lists for each boss what is affected by avoidance.
hallow phoenix
Deadly scythe :)
daring patrol
i can drop about 5 overall ilvl, gain 17% avoidance, i drop down to 27% haste 44% mastery 10%vers
hallow phoenix
That's something I'd do on certain fights
Well probably just one or two
Argus and I guess.... Hounds?
warm plinth
Can block Hounds special attack though so idk that it's necessary
Argus I would only worry about if you were trying to take extra stacks. Typically it's not necessary to drop ilevel for avoidance.
It's just a nice bonus
hallow phoenix
Gives you an excuse to try to tank both idk
warm plinth
😂 Ah the joys of cheesing trivial content :p
hallow phoenix
17% scythe dr seems worth losing 5 ilvls
warm plinth
It's not gonna hurt you but it's not really necessary either
hallow phoenix
Think of how jealous the other tank would be of his high stacks
You can't put an ilvl value on that
prisma crane
lol
lyric vector
How important is it to keep 2pc of t21? I'll be losing 20 ilvls in the slot to keep 2pc if I put on my new pants
timid jay
Definitely worth it to keep 2p then
prisma crane
i wouldnt drop 2p for anything
hallow phoenix
Tomorrow I'm doing mythic portal keeper. Heroic hasabel sometimes kicks my ass with that dot. Think eye of shatug will be enough or should I drop agg's conviction for something as well?
Or maybe I'll just convince my guild to 3tank it
timid jay
I went with shatug for our first kill, the extra EHP and versa feels good to have there imo
Shouldnt be too hard to 2 tank it as long as your portal group isnt too slow
timid jay
Its one of those fights where bracers really shine
hallow phoenix
They are the last legendary I can get...
timid jay
Pray for a good paladin healer
hallow phoenix
Really peeves me
hallow phoenix
Tuesday I buy them lol
warm plinth
Always reassuring when starting a dungeon when someone asks how to get there
timid jay
That sounds a bit dicey
brave halo
Should I ever make sure I'm out of Shield Slam charges before I Battle Cry? Or just Battle Cry on CD?
hallow phoenix
Wut
brave halo
Should I delay my Battle Cry until I'm out of Shield Slam charges?
brave halo
Okay, thank you.
Sometimes I get several procs right when BC comes back up.
*right before BC comes back up
prisma crane
yea
timid jay
Yeah, I'd say its worth it to wait with BC untill you have SS on CD and a free GCD ready
prisma crane
for dps i'll often delay BC untill i have a fresh SB charge to keep the extra dmg
unless it's way off
brave halo
nod It seemed much easier to sync with Demo Shout that way, too
low otter
Wut be better a 910 eggshell for the haste proc or a 940 Argus dps trink fr tht raw strength
warm plinth
The argus DPS trinket
candid vine
any suggestions for which adds on moroes to CC this week? running 1 melee 2 ranged
low otter
Ty
warm plinth
With a good group, probably do Dorothea and do the other 3 at once
Trap Dorothea*
As long as people aren't getting hit with Willbreaker, the rest aren't too hard to aoe dow
down*
warm plinth
That moment when after all the trash talking you do about 
, it saves your scrub prot pally's life after I was pissed I got it from a relinq token
long jay
Hi Guys ans Girls, dös anyone have experiences in tanking aggramar mythic as prot warrior
Does
ember arrow
not atm butr i might answer some questions
timid jay
Its certainly better for your raid
timid jay
Cant tell without ilvl
timid jay
Id go arcano and agramar then
gloomy light
ok ty
timid jay
I generally never focus on survivability in m+
long jay
What Happens with the tanking Player, if noone Otter tank is nearby, will je her 2 stacks?
He get
@ember arrow
I wanna try solo tank the boss for the duration where the dk tank wants to grip the intermission adds
I would say it does Not hurt so much, Even with 20 stacks
Because its blockable damage
timid jay
If you're solotanking him you'll take double damage unless a unlucky melee walks close enough and he gets hit by the cleave
the taechelach reach works exactly the same on all difficulties
frozen bison
Any1 that got link to Mythic+ Tanking guide which trash to pull and which to dont pull?
calm cove
I always used SW after comboes to move the boss back into position
which most of the time led to taking both hits but it does fuck all dmg
compact geyser
Raise your hand if you a bitch...
tank on Varimathras
😭
timid jay
You wont get 2 stacks, you'll take 2 attacks at the same time though
It wont hurt too much
long jay
Do u know how mich it hits
I have 70% armor reduce and shieldblock
How much would it hit, without critical block
So why does everybody Uses 3 tanks
I walked through many videos and dont get the critical point where there are 3 needed
timid jay
Just makes it easier, can have one bdk out just focusing on gripping then
Besides, the dps check isnt hard so you can easily get away with it
glacial olive
do we still run Warlords Challenge (berserker rage talent) if we arent using t20?
glacial olive
ty
compact geyser
Be warned!
You don't know how useful Warlords Challenge is until you spec out of it lol. But then Heroic leap takes forever to recharge qq😭
tired python
How many ilvls is BotA in relics worth?
tiny sphinx
many
tired python
currently have 925 BotA/haste/will to survive equipped and i have 960 IP/haste/will to survive sitting in the bags
+10ilvl upgrade
fleet galleon
Defensively, bastion is better than any amount of ilvl
So if you need that defense, don't lose out on bastion
If not, probably worth going for weapon ilvl
tired python
is there any way to sim this
final mist
No, and simming for defense wouldn't work anyways.
Offensively that 960 relic is better, but Bastion is invaluable for defensive purposes.
wild sandal
any advice for bridge clearing on mythic imonar? last week i was to slow and didnt have a lock to help out
spark mortar
So it is essentially as long as the 3 relics have Bastion mixed in there SOMEWHERE (T1 or T3) we're solid defensively?
gritty arch
Skystep should get you to the end without a portal. Get a freedom and tigers lust or some other boost to help if it's not enough
compact geyser
@wild sandal I skystep the last crossing. I think we Roar the 2nd. Leap is pretty good for getting to the boss quickly to stop the winds.
We have our BDK and rogues clearing for the most part. My job is basically to interrupt at the right time and hold him until the rest of the raid catches up.
wild sandal
ok thank you
calm cove
@spark mortar pmuch
if you get avoidance cap in relics aswell through MoS if you cant get it on gear thats a big plus
opaque hull
Question:is it viable to run hands ring with CoF and a 2 set?
cinder pasture
CoF does nothing for prot
cinder pasture
The equip effect of CoF is disabled for prot
opaque hull
Ah
sick sentinel
it doesnt work at all
opaque hull
Well that makes sense. :p
sick sentinel
if cof worked right now with AM prot warriors would be top dps lol
opaque hull
I just started dabbling in prot for the heck of it don't got no trinkets tho
compact geyser
Idk the math, but if you wanted super CD cdr you could run belt ring lol
spark mortar
@stable flame How many pieces of T21?
spark mortar
Equipped in the design you have, and which pieces?
stable flame
Cloak hands chest legs
For that set
I have the other pieces just not at the level I want them at
lofty drum
hello fellow warriors! I remeber back in WoD there was an option where it showed threat % over bosses heads where is this option? cant seem to find it
timid jay
In the standard UI its on the target frame
lofty drum
I know but iwould love to see the % so i dont over aggro
I can only see it if i hover over the target but then it shows up down in my right corner
wich is annoying because there is other stuff there 😛
also, im using tidy plates and whenever im tanking its blue (when i have aggro) but when my co tank its red is there anyway i can change it to be another collor?
like purple or something and red if a dps or a healer has it?
cause on boss fights with adds its always nice to not have to click on adds to make sure my co tank ahs the aggro vice versa
shut summit
not sure if you can do that with tidy plate s but I know kui nameplates can be diff color for offtank aggro vs healer/dps
lofty drum
is kui nameplates as plane as tidy plates? :3
fierce juniper
junior ivy
ooo i'm gonna check out kui
it looks prettier than tidy plates
okay about to try kui. i hope thjey have a colour by threat option!~
im getting lua errors. weird
astral swan
which legendaries are the casual bis with 2 piece t21?
as in run with all the time legendaries
dusky sedge
normal prot spec when being bitch on vari?
timid jay
Gloves and bracers @astral swan
long bronze
yay just got the gloves
timid jay
👏
long bronze
just need the bracers now haha
timid jay
@dusky sedge havent done it myself but I dont see why the normal spec wouldnt work for it
timid jay
Would depend on AoE or not really
long bronze
yikes
left meteor
Her item level is 961 ¯_(ツ)_/¯
fresh ember
Hey fellow warriors 😄
How's Prot doing in teh new raid? My guild really needs a tank and I was thinking of respecin from Arms
sick sentinel
warriors are good right now
there is no big difference beetwen tanks
they all have their strong points
but you wont have any problem as prot warrior lots of ability in antorus is blockable and there are good gearing setups you can use for different bosses
astral swan
@timid jay how about the shield wall ring, is that close to the gloves?
timid jay
Yes but gloves are stronger for raw RPS
might be some situations where you need the extra CDR on SW but thats a bit niche
glacial olive
we just 3shot coven mythic WutFace
oh that was meant for fury chat but close enough
hallow phoenix
Grats
icy pond
SO
Leggy belt+ Bracers for M+ or Leggy belt+ Gauntlets for M+
Cant decide
I think for trashpacks
is Belt first priop
left meteor
Belt is super strong in AoE
If you don't desperately need Bracers on Trash you can go Sephuz
Sephuz+Belt is pretty strong
sick sentinel
go kakushan it worth more then sephuz for warriors
sephuz is strong yeah but best dps build for m+ is belt/gloves
prisma crane
lol @glacial olive grats
glacial olive
😄
stable flame
people keep making fun of my hp, its 9.1m am I doing something wrong?
fiery pike
is there any reason not to have deevastator talent
tiny sphinx
I don't understand the question
you make it sound like there are other choices aside from devastator
hallow phoenix
People that make fun of warrior hp clearly know nothing about the spec and can be safely ignored
fiery pike
if you need the health pool fine but devastator is the better choice
tiny sphinx
9.1mil is actually pretty beefy overall
warm plinth
"Need the health pool" means you're being 1-shot with proper play
glacial sage
Not supposed to take never surrender?
tiny sphinx
why would you?
glacial sage
why would you not?
tiny sphinx
because then your dps will suck, your rage gen plummets and you can't take advantage of it anyway
fiery pike
^
hallow phoenix
I must confess
glacial sage
Okay, thanks
hallow phoenix
I sometimes take never surrender in world pvp to troll low ilvl plauers
glacial sage
can you tell me if any of my other talents are bad or need to be changed?
hallow phoenix
Players
glacial sage
I'm running warbringer safegaurd avatar bounding strike never surrender into the fray and ravager
timid jay
I hope you're trolling now
hallow phoenix
Yikes
glacial sage
Why would i troll?
timid jay
because never surrender, into the fray and ravager are so bad you might as well have no talent there at all
hallow phoenix
Read the pins mordrie
While on the topic of talents
Thoughts on avatar for mythic hasabel?
timid jay
But, why?
broken kite
hey team, where's the best place to find a list of externals a tank should track?
glacial sage
Renewed fury gives you a 10% increase to damage that is up basically the entire fight, while avatar gives 20% for 20seconds every 1m30s
0 downtime vs. 1m10s
slow gazelle
@broken kite exorsus raid tools
hallow phoenix
Aha @glacial sage I knew you were troll
glacial sage
what? never
broken kite
was after just the tank specific ones, however i can just sort the list there - good suggestion, thanks 😃 @slow gazelle
glacial sage
I'm a dwarf, not a troll
hallow phoenix
That's the alliance troll
glacial sage
heck
spring topaz
whats the ilvl value of bastion of the aspects?
warm plinth
Over 100 defensively
spring topaz
so you would never replace with something else no matter the ilvl increase?
warm plinth
I wouldn't, unless it also had Bastion
spring topaz
i figured as much
warm plinth
That being said, it's not a required trait. It's just super strong from a defensive standpoint. If you'd rather do all revenge/TC relics with higher ilevel, that's fine too. No other trait is worth ilevel though really
glacial sage
With the curcible it isn't too hard to find a relic with bastion
Depends on what you need
warm plinth
Yeah you have like a 1 in 9 chance or something for it to be there, and WQs drop a lot of primary trait Bastion relics
spring topaz
yeah its the only place to get a fire one
glacial sage
I got mine from world quests until I could find higher ones
glacial sage
Not the worst
warm plinth
I actually think my fire is the one I fucked up on...
Took the wrong T2 and wasn't able to get Bastion
spring topaz
yeah i wish u could respec it
warm plinth
Honestly didn't think I'd have the relic as long as I did lol
spring topaz
or have 2 relics a slot u could swap between
warm plinth
and I didn't know how strong Bastion was at the time
Oh, nah, it was my blood I fucked up
I got decently lucky and got a 925 fire
spring topaz
damn kj is only place to get that one lol
glacial sage
same
left meteor
I have 7/7 RotF, I have legit seen Bastion on a relic once
warm plinth
That's bad luck
left meteor
I'm not main spec Prot so I can handle it
novel helm
Hello anyone have CrucibleWeight ?
left meteor
I just go ham in M+ most of the time so RotF is pretty fun
warm plinth
We don't have CrucibleWeights
novel helm
you've a good addon for neither light ?
left meteor
Look at the pins
there's a general ranking for traits
no crucible weights so no addon to use ¯_(ツ)_/¯
clear sapphire
Having 3 bastion is so nice :)
hallow phoenix
44% block <3
cloud hound
is 8. 6 mil hp low? 958 equipped with 2pt20 2pt21
hallow phoenix
seems about right
cloud hound
and this combo makes me run with 19% haste that i hate
cloud hound
dropping t20 makes me have 25% haste and again it isnt high
broken kite
I'd stick with it if you feel you need the defensive ability
if you don't, I'd feel free to replace it and just use t21 <shrug>
hallow phoenix
t21 4 pc ❤
tiny sphinx
t21 4pc is meh at best
hallow phoenix
Its really not that bad
tiny sphinx
it's not bad, but it's not really good either
hallow phoenix
the tooltip is bugged
increases an existing IP or if you dont have an active IP, the next IP
tiny sphinx
still a pittance overall compared to everything else below it
tiny sphinx
blizzard seems to throw darts at a board when coming up with sequential set bonuses
hallow phoenix
So tonight for hasabel I'm at 9.7m hp and 12.46% versatility
Not happy with not having wrists though 😦
Maybe I'll be sneaky and take off aggramar's conviction
candid vine
I accidentally got dps trinket first week, still no tank trinket drop feelsbadman
hallow phoenix
yikes
yeah i got mine right away
but that dps trink wont drop for me XD
I heard you can get it even if the wrong loot spec
candid vine
Yes once you get your primary the rest are random. My paly friend plays holy and ret, he got holy rjen the tank one, whiles in dps spec
I ended up upgrading the dps one to 890 and wearing it :P for now, w/e. My guild has 2 leggo trinks
Or 3
hallow phoenix
890 khazgoroth's :^)
worldly zinc
Hi! I'm pretty new at Prot War, and I see everyone playing with the Devastator talent. In doing so, we loose our filler step, or do I have missed something?
hallow phoenix
Nope you'll have empty gcds sometimes
worldly zinc
So its normal if i'm just sitting there doing nothing for like 2-3 sec?
Just waiting fo CDs
hallow phoenix
Yeah occasionally i'll find myself waiting for a shield slam proc
its never long though
Can always press revenge if you dont need the IP
worldly zinc
Ok, thanks^^
hallow phoenix
That being said
Shield Block and Ignore Pain are off the GCD
so there's always something to pres
press*
worldly zinc
But when I have both buffs up, and no other CDs, I just sitting in front of the boss wainting for a Shield Slam proc, right?
undone sun
3
warm plinth
And Shield Block extends its duration, so unless you need to hold a charge for something in the near future, there's no reason not to use it
hallow phoenix
Why does my IP weak aura say max 4.58m and my normal IP says up to 1.8m 😦
4.58/1.8=2.5444... D:
worldly zinc
It feels so weird not having a button to spam when the rest is off CD...
hallow phoenix
But yeah @worldly zinc, if you have max IP and shield block up, and no procs, just auto
warm plinth
Sounds like your WA is broken.
hallow phoenix
hmmm maybe its giving me the actual absorb part of it
hallow phoenix
yeah
and the 1.8 number from my spellbook is rounded down if anything so
hmm
Damn I really like this one too
warm plinth
Tbf, my tooltip is wrong
My tooltip says 1.6 mil, but casting Demo+IP (which should be a max rage IP) shows a 1.5 mil IP
hallow phoenix
I'll compare the IP buff I get and what the weakaura says
OK I trust the WA more
it and the actual buff tooltips agree
@worldly zinc if you always want something to do... On fights like coven you can fill your empty GCDs with heroic throws
Its a complete disadvantage but you'll always be pressing something
broken kite
idk about you but I have very, very few empty globals
tiny sphinx
with enough haste you have almost 0 idle time anyway
glacial sage
I'm at 48% haste and I don't ever have idle time
signal plover
thinking
worldly zinc
48%... My war is a reroll, I'm far from that^^
glacial sage
Thats with me taking legos, tier, and other stuff
but if I want to get up there, I can get to 62%
sick sentinel
anyone having problems with aggro lately
both in m+ and raids
in my UI i have the threat but for some fucked up reason boss ignores me and attacks other people
happened with antoran command and portal keeper
and in one m+ key
glacial sage
Someone might be taunting? Maybe the M+ was a skittish?
sick sentinel
nah my co-tank said he didnt spam taunt at all for both bosses
glacial sage
Other than those 2 reasons I don't think you would lose aggro as long as you hit the boss
sick sentinel
yeah i was doing burst with BC and boss just turned and meleed two dps
glacial sage
Is the boss going to your co-tank?
sick sentinel
after that came back to me
no just to some random dps
specialy when im doing burst
and half of the raid was upstairs at portals
round vortex
Every single time that has ever happened to me I checked the replays and someone had ALWAYS taunted like a fucken window licker
albeit that's in the normal i pug and not guild raids lol
sick sentinel
its the problem i can hold 1.1m dps and for some reason boss just melees dps and they blamed me
and with that dps and taunting often i should be able to keep the boss on me
glacial sage
log the fights and see if someone taunted
sick sentinel
will do after i upload
broken kite
I've had Portal keeper once drop aggro completely when a tank went to portals
nuked 2 dps before it would switch back
sick sentinel
it happened once in two bosses
checked logs no taunting
boss just had get threat out of nowhere
weird
amber siren
in raids there's no way a dps should be pulling threat off you (or 99% of situations in M+), either the boss has a mechanic that isn't being handled correctly or the DPS are doing something screwy. Def not accusing you of poor play because even the worst player can hold threat off DPS
broken kite
nah there's something weird with PK
ive seen it happen in heroic and my co-tank also saw it happen in mythic
broken kite
no reason it wouldnt default to 2nd tank
yeah
at 2:36
looks pretty funky to me
prisma crane
@sick sentinel aggramar's for sure
warm plinth
@broken kite You used Heroic Leap at 2:35, which means she would go for the next highest threat within her melee range
Which explains why she's hitting other people at 2:36
hallow phoenix
Heroic leaping causes her to target the next highest threat?
Why wouldnt she just chase you
warm plinth
If you go out of melee range, yes
It's a bug
She's the only non-stationary boss that does it afaik
warm plinth
Hasabel is just a bitch
undone sun
likely stat stick, lack of main stat on legacy
brave halo
How bad is a 950 Riftworld Codex compared to good 930 trinkets?
undone sun
entirely depends on what those other trinkets are and for what situation
codex is good for keystones, and particularly for aoe packs but a diima's/shivermaw/glaives/apoc drive will do better
lethal rapids
does anyone have or know where i can find a crucible weights import string? I don't see one in the guides.
undone sun
we don't have one, if we did it would be in the guides
most if not all of the crucible weights for tanks are entirely offensive and that requires working sims
which we do not have
lethal rapids
ah I see, thanks for the info
jade socket
desert pond
so i dont play prot much, but im trying to update my relics with all the crp i have in my bags, how many artifact ilvls/actual relic ilvls does an upgrade need to be to drop a relic with bastion for one without ?
brave halo
I was told Bastion is worth 100 ilvls yesterday.
So an 880 relic with it is the same as a 980 without it.
undone sun
yeah, defensively it's nearly invaluable
calm sequoia
Thrash relic for Prot Warriors
solid mist
So. Heroic ABT. I've cleared normal a bunch. But for tanking H (and pugging) anything that I shoudl keep in mind? I've only done the first 2 bosses so far. I've read all the fight differences, but is there anything that isnt' immidiately obvious just by reading that I should keep a look out for?
ruby stirrup
What gear shld i be spending the argunite crystals on? trying for arcano or relics?
undone sun
depends what you need more, how're your relics? how're your trinkets?
ruby stirrup
they be all piss poor at ilvl 890+..just played back
broken kite
I'd get the stuff you know will be an upgrade first (slots under 910). After that you can always waste tens of thousands on arcanocrystal dream
merry cave
Hey guys anyone got a dk alt, no idea what cd's to use for aggs lol
maybe i should talent runetap lol
fallow knot
@merry cave should probably hit up acherus (the DK discord, their blood channel is really good about helping with things like that).
merry cave
Yeah guess i should, was just being lazy 😛
fallow knot
put < > arund the link and it'll get rid of that stupid auto-preview nonsense haha
fallow knot
@solid mist The only thing I noticed on my prot warrior in heroic is that AHC felt way spikier to me than I anticipated. A lot of it was the melee adds being aggrod to me when I had exploit weakness also happening. nothing that can't be handled but I wasn't prepared right from the outset.
solid mist
so I did that fight twice (didn't beat it) but wow yeah, by the tmie that 2nd Exploit hit I was getting trucked. def needed to save and overlap cooldowns for that 2nd hit it seems 😮
warm plinth
Just use Shield Block for the hit and your co-tank needs to be on top of taunting
Er, nelth's fury I mean
No reason you should be getting trucked if he's taunting right after the stack hits. It's the auto attack after it that hurts
fallow knot
yep. I often times just use things on cooldown but that fight I feel like it wouldn't be bad (until you're overgeared anyway) to try and use demo shout if you've got 2 stacks and the adds are still running around. just to help a little there
warm plinth
There's no real times that you need CDs in that fight either so you can be liberal with them, as Humantelope was saying
junior ivy
or cna it be master looter?
fallow knot
the melees from the adds hit like bastards when you've got 2 stacks
warm plinth
Old raids are always personal loot now I believe
warm plinth
They changed it in 7.3.5
junior ivy
so im wondering if they can enforce that
warm plinth
I mean, I'm sure they probably could do that
fallow knot
BRF is WoD right ?
warm plinth
Yeah
fallow knot
I don't think WoD raids were part of that change
junior ivy
im not gonna join then
fallow knot
pretty sure only MoP and earlier was part of that stupid change
warm plinth
STUPID change
fallow knot
concur 😃
warm plinth
Needed more emphasis
fallow knot
ah sorry
warm plinth
lol
fallow knot
didnt mean to offend with my lack of emphasis haha
warm plinth
My gf and I ran through Hellfire night before last I think, and there were bosses where we didn't even get drops...
broken kite
Raids you can change
fallow knot
ew
broken kite
As long as you're in a raid group (including listed in group finder
whole sapphire
question at which point is versil better than mastery ?
i have round about 60 % mastery and 32 % haste but only 8 % versil
should i switch enchants to versil or stick with stacking mastery ?
junior ivy
is hfc only one difficulty?
wait nm
i think it has more
ok i got a question.
did wod only have TWO RAIDS?
junior ivy
any mounts?
undone sun
nope
fallow knot
highmaul was soooo dumb.
undone sun
yeah i wasn't a fan
fallow knot
I will say I enjoyed HFC though, BRF was alright. was a cool setting at least in my opinion
the dude that rolled around in BRF was goofy
fallow knot
was that the one that had the crazy bulky plate with fire/lava type stuff coming out of it ?
junior ivy
yup
fallow knot
niice. those look so absurd on gnomes I love it
junior ivy
i just collect every raid tier xmog set lol
i own every single one up to and including cata raids
and about 75% of mop xmog sets
fallow knot
wow
junior ivy
and most of legion
im mostly just missing wod
i aslo own every single pvp tier xmog set
fallow knot
did you get the tier 2.5 set from AQ? The little armor stands in the class hall are awesome. neat little touch
junior ivy
i did 😄
fallow knot
sweeet
junior ivy
the number is lower than it should be cause old xpac raid finder sets are impossible to get
cause you cant even queueu for the raid finder versions anymore
😦
fallow knot
aw
undone sun
you can for MoP
junior ivy
i bet its personal loot.
which would mean it would take ona verage 4683 years to collect it
on average*
fallow knot
LOL
junior ivy
i did dragon soul raid finder a few times, for that set (you can enter it at that difficulty by tralking to someone in cacverns of time)
did entire raid and not a single boss dropped loot 😦
so i gave up
or maybe one did but it wasnt a tier piece
i forget
so ill always have that "0/8" taunting me
but i wont go back
fallow knot
ooo that set looks cool. I might have to go back and do some xmog farming
warm plinth
Can't you still queue LFR for those raids as long as you're the appropriate level for it?
Not that you'd probably form a group; I'm just curious lol
warm plinth
Yeah I know. I'm just curious if you still technically can
sick sentinel
I think you can queue for old raids by talking to a npc
junior ivy
oh i dunno
and yeah you fcan for some pople its just.. personal loot
so itd take years to collect the whole set
maybe 1 boss out of 5 or 6 even drops something
warm plinth
Well, personal loot vs other loot shouldn't really limit whether you get the drop or not should it? Since you can't gain the transmog if you can't use it on that toon. The likelihood is the same isn't it?
warm plinth
It limits the total drops, yeah, because it won't drop things you can't use
junior ivy
on personal loot youre lucky if 1 in 5 bosses drops ANY loot
but on regular loot if evreyr boss drops 4-6 items, chances are theres at least 1 item i need from each boss
like in BRF tonight
every single boss dropped 2-3 things i needed
eveyr one!
i got probably 10-15 appearances total
warm plinth
Solo?
warm plinth
Ah
junior ivy
other 2 were leather
warm plinth
So what loot type did you have it on?
junior ivy
just group loot
warm plinth
Oh
junior ivy
need and greed
warm plinth
So if you're in a group you can still have it on other loot types?
warm plinth
Good to know; wish I'd known that before my gf and I did HFC
Probably lost some opportunities
Had 3 or 4 bosses that dropped nothing for either of us
junior ivy
yeahh that sucks i hate personal loot so much 😦
ive been wanting to farm this old BC dungeon set, its like a purple skirt outfit
warm plinth
I guess that makes us lucky since we always have each other to run with haha
junior ivy
but you cant change BC dungeons off personal loot anymore
so id do entire dungeons and get 1 thing
i gave up
warm plinth
The Tier 2.5 or 3.5 or whatever?
junior ivy
not sure just know its purple and a skirt lol
junior ivy
yup
like id go in a dungeon and if first boss gave me loot, i already knew i was screwed and no point even continuing to the boss i actualyl need
cause only one boss per dungeon every gives loot on personal in BC dungeons
its so messed up
warm plinth
Really? That's silly
junior ivy
i dunno why blizz did that
warm plinth
Honestly they probably changed it so people can't farm old raids for money anymore
junior ivy
well i hope they re think it or come up with some way to let us farm xmog
warm plinth
Would be cool if they gave us a currency similar to Marks of Honor but for PvE sets
junior ivy
yeah!
warm plinth
And you could get the currency from killing the bosses of old raids
junior ivy
thatd be a fine solution
i have so many marks of honour right now
and dunno what to do with em
i have 80
junior ivy
i basiclaly get all mine from WQs
but i do every WQ that awards marks of honour
i check them ewvery day
every*
warm plinth
I did more WQ today than I have in a long time
junior ivy
i hate wq. i hate having to do emissary every day
fallow knot
so 2? 😃
junior ivy
but i want those mounts from the rep caches..
i thought those mounts would be so easy to get
i was so wrong
warm plinth
I did every single Army of the Light and elite WQ on Argus because I was super close to Exalted with both of the factions
On the very last Army of the Light WQ I had available after doing all the elite ones, I got exalted lol
I needed 8 more rep before that one
fallow knot
is there a mount for each faction? I got the stormheim mount WAY early in the expansion then I don't think I've seen one since
junior ivy
i got the dreamweavers one like immediately
first rep cache
havent seen another since
fallow knot
ughh
warm plinth
Dreamweaver is the hippogryph right?
junior ivy
nooo
warm plinth
Or is that Court?
junior ivy
its the pretty green unicorn
fallow knot
I have 7 or 8 110 characters.. I really dont want to feel obligated to do the WQs for that chance catfriend. why'd you have to say yeah 😦
junior ivy
tbhj its the best one so im glad i got it first
warm plinth
My gf wants the hippogryph.
She already has the carpet, the stormdrake and the unicorn
warm plinth
She's been stupid lucky
junior ivy
always wanted a magic carpet but im not a tailor
fallow knot
daaang
warm plinth
Yeah the Nightfallen one is the only one I care about
Because I don't have a tailor
And I wanna fly through Dalaran going "A WHOLLEEEE NEWWWW WOOOOOORLD"
warm plinth
Only 1:35 here :p
junior ivy
im gonna head to bed gnight
warm plinth
👋
fallow knot
ciao
viscid narwhal
@undone sun 👋
undone sun
👋
broken kite
@junior ivy yeah pretty sure Dsoul LFR is bugged, loot chance is veeeeeeeeeeeery small there
mild sinew
how does the DPS-Argus-Trinket works for tanks?
mild sinew
too bad, ty
unborn vapor
Hey y'all, what are you guys hoping for as far as prot changes in BFA?
slate obsidian
😍 ⭐ Glad-stance ⭐ 😍
modest crest
Aggramar was tougher than I expected last night and I admittedly struggled to stay up. I think it’s mostly due to the continued hits when not actively tanking. Is there a way to avoid this? Saving mitigation for the foe breaker and my active time made it painful. I used the raid trinket and apocalypse for the help on the hits. We finally got him but I haven’t struggled on a fight like that in a long time. Feels like I’m missing something
This is heroic btw.
slate obsidian
you don't need your CDs for foebreaker, your artifact ability is enough to cover that, so you can make use of them to mitigate damage when your not tanking
modest crest
Well I was keeping artifact open in case I accidentally had to burn a shield block or had to eat 2 on short notice
Was kinda funny, other tank died at some point and didn’t have a Rez so I got up to like 15 stacks and took 2 foe breakers. Ended up dying still but blocked 107M lol
slate obsidian
I mean you can also just SB the foebreaker without any other CD without getting into trouble, my only advice is to make use of SW, DS and LS when you're offtanking. Don't safe CDs for scenarios that will end up in wipes anyways
modest crest
So the off tank hits are not avoidable then. Was thinking it wasn’t a cleave but just the way the mechanic worked
slate obsidian
no it's not a cleave, but you can actually block them.
slate obsidian
aggramars is a highly situational trinket
if you don't take huge bursts of damage there's really no point in wearing it
I also don't see how its usage would alter when you get Amanthuls
gloomy light
@slate obsidian you cant equip them simultaneously duh
timid jay
He means aggramars convictions fwiw, but yeah basically yes
slate obsidian
oh yeah maybe I'm too used to calling items by the bosses that drop them...
vocal nimbus
@ the Biggest Weeb™ 👋
gaunt coyote
Only saccing darkmoon deck for 3% more haste
proper pecan
no crit blocks for u
dark junco
Unless M, dont really need critblock at this point: better off dpsing as a tank
crisp slate
Can somebody explain the pants choice for M Argus?
Do the Scythes ever do Magic dmg?
turbid horizon
Scythes are blockable
sick sentinel
1 more shield block
turbid horizon
Pants = more shield block uptime
calm cove
if youre the 3rd tank youll want them for SR in p3
cuz the balls hurt a lot
can get them for the same reason as a regular tank if they are an issue and you dont need other legos
proper pecan
@dark junco Dont u think that dps will be qute low with that mastery?