And we have more dmg ๐
#protection
light fulcrum
glad venture
Then ill just Keep going protwar
queen agate
hi
timid jay
๐
sick sentinel
hey
shut summit
wide creek
could anyone tell me what your %'s are for crit, haste, mastery, and vers? just looking to see if im lacking in one particular stat...
timid jay
Dont look a the stats like that, you'll get what drops
Since we prioritize ilvl so heavily its not worth it looking at it like that
wide creek
Gotcha ty
Seems like i am heaily dependent on ignore pain in antorus. figured maybe it was a stat issue. maybe just the way it is
left meteor
Well what else would you be dependent on
Shield Block only reduces incoming damage and there's no great self healing outside of legendaries w/o Ignore Pain
wide creek
put up ignore pain, one swipe from the boss and its gone, put up another ignore pain, another swipe and its gone. maybe its just me but it feels like IP gets wrecked each boss hit
im definitely not a pro prot warrior-- maybe thats just the way it is
left meteor
It's ridicolous HPS
compact geyser
Imagine if you didn't ignore pain ๐ญ
wide creek
yeah -- it would definitely be a bad thing.
steel mauve
Tank dependent on his active mitigation, who would have thought
Both shield block and ignore pain are active mits, tanks rely on their active mits, if you didnt use your toolkit bosses would just destroy you
wide creek
i get it -- just want my active mitigation to be a little more resilient.
timid jay
Do note that only SB counts as active mitigation for AM checks
Not IP, NF or anything else
only SB
glad venture
Arent haste at 30% needed anymore?
timid jay
30% haste is a year old infomation by now
That was before 7.1.5 when we played HR and before devastator was a thing
compact geyser
So, I'm about to sound like a tard. What's the difference with AM checks and why SB is the only one that counts? If it's in the guide I'll totally reread, but I feel kinda stupid atm regarding this now.
sick sentinel
@wide creek i can u feel u there dude. I started prot 5 weeks ago and jumped right into hc pugs without even 2p first ID
timid jay
Illysaannas vengeful shear for example, you get a debuff that makes you take double damage for 10-20 seconds if you dont have shield block up when it hits
sick sentinel
saw my IPs melting live nothin
wide creek
Ditto
compact geyser
@timid jay ok thank you
left meteor
Make sure not to have SB up for Dargrul's AM check and just spell reflect it ๐
timid jay
Have they fixed it yet? Or does the boss still go flying
sick sentinel
Fixed. pretty sure.
left meteor
Nelth's has a lot of reflectable stuff actually
sick sentinel
Also they fixed BR issue on hounds.. if i saw it correctly yesterday
honest mantle
tiny sphinx
my bdk is blessed with the anti fear trinket for that fight
ethereal urn or some such
sacred hill
I'm thinking about playing protection in bfa, I know it's very early but how did the changes we've already seen look for prot?
prisma crane
just run up to the center of teh dog hit box, 2 other melee do the same and you dont need to worry about the BR
@sacred hill some are saying we're probably going to be the best tanks for magic dmg
since we're the only ones with a magic dr
we're also the only ones without a form of self heal
i think it's really going to come down to how IP will work with our rage pool
like, how quickly it will consume our current rage in that 4 seconds
as it stands, flat 60% DR for full 4 sec is really strong
timid jay
Also depends if they are keeping the armor working against magic
In which case bears would also be very strong against magic
Dont forget that we lose our artifact weapon, so SR will be 20% again
prisma crane
also doesnt reflect every cast...
but, even at 30%, we're the only ones with something like that
i'm most bummed by it no longer reflecting every cast for the duration
that's the best part about it
timid jay
If armor works then you can count out druids for exmaple
tiny sphinx
would love armour class to matter against weapon type as well as magic type, but that is a pipedream at best
tulip helm
I didn't see any aspect of our artifact weapon in the data mined notes. Suposedly elements of it are going to be baked into the class. I suspect that more significant changes are coming
@tiny sphinx im not sure what you mean, but armor reduces dmg from any type of weapon
did they change paladin? becuase new ip seems very similar to thier active to me.
tiny sphinx
talking about different armour classes being affected by different weapon types, i.e. different % mitigations or even effects
tulip helm
you have odd pipe dreams
tiny sphinx
mainly for pvp purposes, but also pve, plate would take different damage from a sword hit than a mace hit, etc.
tulip helm
it would just be more things to memorize and since oyu can't change armor in combat, it wouldnt add much to the game.
you would start a arena match and be like! damn im wearing the wrong armor type for this rogue who is using a none meta weapon
i guess ill just die now, cool
tiny sphinx
would add a ton to the game, more depth, more dynamic combat, your weapon choice would matter more
tiny sphinx
it wouldn't be random
tulip helm
yesterday a rogue did this much dmg and today it did this much, it would be percieved as random
how do you know what weapon they equip? what choices would you have to protect yourself?
tiny sphinx
im talking about rules for weapon types vs armour types, that is not random
sick sentinel
Well at the end of story we still gonna be angry badasses with HUGE shields cutting deep wounds into everything ... and refuse that god damn holy light!:thinking: So..prot gonna be awesome BfA! over
prisma crane
think is, you can't change armor type in combat, just weapon type, so it does what?
allows us to hit leather weapon macro
then swap to mail macro?
changes nothing to gameplay but adding a button
compact geyser
You'd have to take away the ability to mog into other weapon types as well
untold vigil
it's an idea that makes sense in table top, but maybe not in wow's concept
prisma crane
no @compact geyser
because you can't change armor type anyways
the only thing dynamic is weapon type
if that ever went live it'd be safe to assume whatever weapon they have is the ideal one
plus then warriors have more advantage since we can equip all weapon types
untold vigil
at some level this idea is akin to resistance gear from the old days, which was dropped because it was mostly tedious
tiny sphinx
weapon spec could make a comeback too
and it's not really akin to resistances since that only protected you against one specific thing
untold vigil
and in this case you have a weapon that is valuable against one specific thing
tiny sphinx
one specific armour class which covers many targets, and im talking about differences of maybe 10% damage just to make target choice require more thought, it's not a perfect concept but it adds more to the watered down crap we have now
prisma crane
but, it really doesnt add much
any decent player will just have weapon swap macros
meaning balance will be around correct weapon choice
prisma crane
meaning a nerf to less skilled players for no other reason than weapon swapping
that's what im getting at
at the end of the day it'd change almost nothing
so then you have to ask yourself, why?
adding something meaningful to prevent watering down is a good thing, but i dont think that solution would work
tulip helm
I don't think anyone but that one random dude is talking about that, its not in the bfa notes
timid jay
Feels like it would be needlesly complicated, haivng several weapons with different ilvl and stats and you have to figure out on the fly which one deals the highest damage
prisma crane
yea, we're being hypothetical
tiny sphinx
weapon spec choice would matter, it would make what you choose and what you take into a fight matter, you can't be perfectly optimized against everyone and thing out there anyway, and yes it's just a pipedream
tulip helm
it would be exactly like what krotos said
prisma crane
my point is that
tulip helm
you'd have 4 macro's and swap between them based on what you wer ehitting
prisma crane
at the end of the day, it wouldnt matter, because you'll just have what you need already
tulip helm
then casual players would complain about need 4 weapon drops
then blizzard would nerf any weapon type that was doing to much dmg to the point that all weapon types did the same dmg
prisma crane
dont get me wrong, the concept sounds nice, im not knocking that, im just saying that in actual play it just makes some mechanics a chore rather than engaging
tulip helm
and we were back to where we have always been with armor just being armor, becuase anything else is silly without value
well im saying the concept is not nice
final mist
The concept is cool, but it wouldn't work in practice.
There's a lot of things that are cool concepts but don't work in practice.
untold vigil
i also agree with the lack of individual class flavor
final mist
Look at AP and how long it took Blizzard to figure that out.
tulip helm
i mean what is cool about it?
so plate protects against a hammer better then what?
a stabby thing? plate also protects against that better
final mist
Plate actually protects against hammers worse.
quartz pond
^
tulip helm
then chainmail?
quartz pond
hammers
tulip helm
then cloth armor?
quartz pond
are what hurts plate
tiny sphinx
that is where I was going with it, it would be a rock paper scissors approach
final mist
It brings some more RPG back into it, but it's one of those things like resist gear that's just tedious.
final mist
Plate protects against blades but not hammers.
tiny sphinx
maces would be most effective against plate and least against cloth, differences of maybe 10% scaling
tulip helm
ok
untold vigil
10% is huge
quartz pond
maces are quite effective vs cloth
tulip helm
so then what does cloth protect against?
final mist
But the thing is shit like that is just tedious in practice Jokan.
tiny sphinx
swords would be more effective against cloth and less against plate, axes would be a middle ground
tulip helm
ok
tiny sphinx
it would be 'tedious' if all you wanted to do is be super optimal against all things
tulip helm
so cloth armor is less protection then plate?
quartz pond
yes
tiny sphinx
it would force people to choose a weapon type and stick with it and choose their targets with more thought
tulip helm
is leather better then cloth?
quartz pond
cuz we're going back and forth
tiny sphinx
obviously it doesn't translate super realistically
tulip helm
im saying that when you finish thinking about this idea
you have the exact same system
we have right now
with some minor various for plate and chain
timid jay
Kevlar is a type of cloth 4Head
tiny sphinx
weapon specs would make a return for everyone and spells type would also matter against amour class
prisma crane
but only good against piercing , not blunt dmg
final mist
But Jokan, it'd be changed and nerfed and at the end of the day things would be balanced to the point where'd there'd be no difference like there is now.
prisma crane
which is why i said i like the idea, but it wouldnt work
tiny sphinx
yes well, again, I don't expect it to ever be implemented, people are too spoiled by the watered down combat we have as is
final mist
It's a cool concept, but people wouldn't like it in practice and it'd be changed or flat out removed.
junior ivy
what are weapon specs?
tulip helm
forget the getting nerf'd thing
rancid sedge
Thundergod's Vigor n The Walls Fell = 44% hast or Kakushan's Stormscale Gauntlets n The Walls Fell = 35% hast? same ilvl
tulip helm
the idea itself is not that interesting
prisma crane
that's subjective though
tulip helm
you believe some weapons should hit plate armor at different dmg values
what about cloth armor?
what about leather?
prisma crane
having weapon specializations was kinda neat back in the day
tulip helm
what about mail?
prisma crane
+5 skill to axes for orc for example
quartz pond
its flavor
tulip helm
sure but that is differnt then what he is talking about
all weapons woudl do this regardless of who was using them
quartz pond
but when it becomes relevant to the experience
prisma crane
@rancid sedge we dont chose legos based on secondary stats
quartz pond
it becomes resist gear
and nobody likes resist gear
even though its great flavor for the game
in practice it doesnt work that well
its what sal
tiny sphinx
swords would do maybe 10-15% more to cloth, 8-10 to leather, 5-8 for mail, no bonus to plate, etc.
quartz pond
already said
final mist
10-15% is huge
tiny sphinx
again, im just spitballing numbers
final mist
Think about how much DPS people do today and add or take away 15%.
quartz pond
also
final mist
Now add RNG drops from raids for weapons.
quartz pond
that couldnt affect ur shield slam
tulip helm
no do the enxt weapon
quartz pond
cuz u needed a different
modifier for that xD
and thunder clap either
so it would affect revenge deva and autos
tiny sphinx
spells would be handled differently
timid jay
For the system to work they would have to redesign weapon drops
tulip helm
everytime someone says this is a great idea
final mist
They'd also have to redesign armor.
tulip helm
they say that each armor type reduces dmg the same way it already does
final mist
Cloth gets fucked by everything.
quartz pond
^
final mist
Plate doesn't by anything but hammers
tulip helm
cloth currently gets fucked by everything
quartz pond
some magic would also be usefull
final mist
Mail gets fucked by blades
quartz pond
and some useless
final mist
Leather gets fucked by blades
final mist
Warlocks don't get fucked by anything atm Zula
tulip helm
so the end of this idea is that plate should get a dmg% increase from hammers
final mist
At the end of the day, it's a cool concept, but it won't work in practice because of how things work in wow.
quartz pond
that used lightning bolt and chain lighthing
tiny sphinx
cloth burns more easily, leather insulates, plate conducts electricity
prisma crane
@rancid sedge what legos do you have? and tier? if you arent running 4p t20 and 2p T21, a good safe bet for raids is bracers + gloves, and bracers + TWF ring if you're running 4p2p
final mist
It's an rpg but it's not like DnD
tulip helm
I just dont see all the flavor i guess, cloth is weaker then leather and leather is weaker then mail and mail is weaker then plate. sounds like the same AC we already have
quartz pond
not even DnD
final mist
Hell, even DnD doesn't have a system like this anymore
prisma crane
@quartz pond rubber suit you say... ๐ค
quartz pond
not often
tiny sphinx
I know, once again, it's just a concept combat system
final mist
It used to but it still has weapons classes from Ye olde eras
quartz pond
yes
final mist
But they don't affect things anymore
tulip helm
you used to have AC types in older system
quartz pond
either way warlocks would win
tulip helm
like slashing vs piercing vs crushing
quartz pond
and warlocks are already winning as it is
stark sage
damage types exist in dnd
tulip helm
but ultimately plate armor was better then mail so the simplified universal AC that wow uses is great
final mist
Yeah, weapon types still exist (slashing, piercing), but they're not taken into affect for AC anymore
quartz pond
slash crush stab
stark sage
yeah its only for damage reduction or special cases
final mist
Some magic damage still is
final mist
But not really
quartz pond
like runescape
prisma crane
the best you could hope for
quartz pond
and work with stab crush etc
prisma crane
is something like
some weapons have increased crit dmg, others have increased effect from mastery, etc
stark sage
that could be interesting
tulip helm
yes wow's thing was to bring different mechanics to weapons, though that has gone away
quartz pond
basically ur not happy that the only character customization u can do in terms of power
prisma crane
but, that's about all you could hope for
final mist
Warriors get a class-wide mastery, "Master of Arms", increases weapon damage from all classes
prisma crane
back when weapon speed mattered too
quartz pond
and artifacts
prisma crane
i do wish weapon speed came back
tulip helm
remember old arms
prisma crane
but it's not that huge
tiny sphinx
if I had my way each spec would have multiple masteries that you'd choose from
final mist
Eh, weapon speed didn't matter after they changed shit
tulip helm
each weapon type had differnet passives
quartz pond
a lot of things could be made
final mist
That's hell for balancing Jokan
quartz pond
like animation cancels
prisma crane
yea, i mean, you'd have to make things based on weapon dmg again
final mist
They can't balance stats now
quartz pond
tick auto attacks
prisma crane
which woud bring other issues
tiny sphinx
it would be hell for balancing
quartz pond
but u cant forget who the game is catering to
final mist
They can't even balance individual mysteries now
tulip helm
like specs?
prisma crane
as far as picking masteries
that's probably the only interesting thing that came out of the BfA Q&A
was a pool of talent choices
sacred hill
What is current protection mastery?
prisma crane
to better choose a focus on how to play
quartz pond
wasnt that only for PVE?
timid jay
That was pvp though
quartz pond
PVP*
quartz pond
its cool on paper
prisma crane
we're talking about pvp
tulip helm
maybe i should watch that q a
prisma crane
since boss "armor" isnt really a thing
quartz pond
and u will have a small pool
tulip helm
I hate the current talent system
final mist
They want to stop cookie cutter builds but they can't balance, so they exist anyways
Look at us
There's only one talent for each row for raiding
tulip helm
it so boring, adds nothing to the game but the wrong choices, it is stupid
prisma crane
well there's a reason for that, if they are truly balanced, the choice wouldnt matter
final mist
Theoretically you'd swap based on encounters
prisma crane
unless it's purely cosmetic or something
quartz pond
it would be preference
tulip helm
its just a bad game design
quartz pond
or convinience
prisma crane
like, hey i swing twice as fast but i do half dmg per auto
or, my fire is now green
tiny sphinx
swing speed changes a lot, like ppm, but if ppm is locked it won't matter
tulip helm
you have to pick talents for aoe, vs single vs cc vs movement or whatever, and there is a right choice. its more things to click on without adding anything to the game
prisma crane
and rage per swing too, most would prefer more steady rage gain
tulip helm
and worse now you can't do those tasks well without the right talents
prisma crane
they'd have to have it modify ppm , yes
tulip helm
they mostly use deterministic rng now
it would automatically modif ppm for variable swing times
zinc bear
Question, is the Kil'jaden shield wall cooldown trinket good, if I use the ToS 4 + Antorus 2 combo, with belt and shieldwall ring ? For heavy shieldwall usage ? Or not worth it ?
tulip helm
legion actually brought back more true random procs compared to wod which was pretty much 100% deterministic or past expansions wher ethe chance was essentially 100% and then icd
prisma crane
@zinc bear no
arguably less useful with combo, imo
plus, you already get SW to under 1 min anyways
just use bracers and TWF
zinc bear
Bracers are more for survivalism yeah, I usually just tank farmed HC content for the guild, when the other tank is off.
zinc bear
I thought the rage generation of the combo is just good enough, plus I got some really good titanforged pieces from ToS. I enjoy the playstyle, it is quite bursty with its shield generation.
I'll go reread some guides then, Im out of date.
What trinket should I hunt for if I already got tanking pantheons in first slot ?
timid jay
Depends on what you want, damage, survivability?
zinc bear
Well a tank should survive, I imagine. Something that would be viable on most encounters.
Mythics are trivial at this point.
timid jay
apoc or diimas
prisma crane
you're not out of date
untold vigil
it's a decent vers stat stick
junior ivy
when should apoc be used instead of dimas?
soft condor
Hounds are early enought that pretty much anyone can have good ones
prisma crane
lots of melee swings that are heavy, but not really heavy hits
also, it only works on melee hits, whereas diimas works on stuff that we cant block/parry, etc, like aoe in EoA or kingaroth hammer, etc
junior ivy
so dimas seems better
prisma crane
diimas is also STR which is great, good dmg in aoe, and more useful all around
in most cases
but if you can utilize apoc drive well, it's much stronger
soft condor
in m+ mythic situations you can have some very different trinkets though
*m+ aoe situations
jawbone for one
junior ivy
my key this week is lower kara 15, will that be hard?
prisma crane
tyrannical makes moroes annoying, but no, not really
soft condor
it's a pretty easy week, compared to other possibilites, for all stones
zinc bear
Well I tank 15's with absolute easy, got like 950 gear, honestly I pick up lots of offspec gear, and relics are very good too, so honestly, Im not worried about mythics. I just got bonked on heroic high command down from 5 mil to zero, after getting 3 debuffs, and kind of overestimating my toughness, so Im just looking through stuff again raid wise x.x
junior ivy
im the opposite of you i find i tank raids easily and struggle so much in m+
soft condor
what exactly killed you there? didn't block an expose weakness?
besides just taunt on 2 stacks^^
zinc bear
I think it was expose weakness into 3rd stack, and a very quick meele after it.
Yeah it was mistake on our tanks part, too.
Biehler, I tank since TBC, and mostly dungeons, never in raids since most ppl I meet are aleady MT's in guilds, I know tanking a dungeon is a lot about approach and just being careful and taking care of your team too, and my friends appriciate that part.
soft condor
Yeah, then you should know that with the current warriortank it's hard to prepare for moments where you are unprepared. As in another tank missing taunt. Too much stuff we have to do in advance of shit happening
timid jay
You can plan for that though, especially with how short our CD's are
soft condor
Well, when you expect no dmg to come in and it comes anyway there isn't much to do aside from Last Stand, is there? Maybe Aggramar-Trinket. I'd rather think about passive buffers like stam or armor statsticks
To preprare for such a situation. At least, that's how I understood the question.
timid jay
Planing SB so you have cover for a few seconds untill after the tank swap was supposed to happen
So you have time to react with the bigger CD's
soft condor
Humn
junior ivy
on argus heroic how come in p1 i could barely take 3 stacks of the tank debuff and sometimes died at 3rd stack, but in p2 and p4 i could take 5-6 stacks?
soft condor
Well, to be honest. You'd taunt directly after the Expose normally, so maybe if that's not coming you can prepare for the other tank to fail
junior ivy
are they different debuffs?
timid jay
Its the same
junior ivy
hm just weird that i died so easily in p1
timid jay
Maybe just played better in p2 and p4
junior ivy
but not later phases
timid jay
ยฏ_(ใ)_/ยฏ
soft condor
well, they are different, As in different names/ids
junior ivy
maybe haha but seemed like that every pull
maybe healers had less to dela with in later phases
deal&
soft condor
p4 is the different one though
timid jay
Its the same damage, just that the debuff doesnt drop off
junior ivy
p4 was fun, for some reason i really enjoy fights where tank stacks never drop
like imonar heroic too
prisma crane
psychological @junior ivy
junior ivy
im so happy to finally deserve my aotc lol
prisma crane
earned*
but it's not like you did it poorly with us
you moved to hte right markers and went to the correct places
junior ivy
truee, the easy stuff lol
prisma crane
not for everyone...
junior ivy
cant believe how hard p1 is though on heroic argus
i wasnt expecting it to be ahrdest phase
hardest*
soft condor
Why would you say that?
junior ivy
huh
soft condor
I'd say p1 is the easiest, maybe p4 when you just have to wing it somehow, but p2 and especially p3 seemed much harder for us
junior ivy
we had 20-30 pulls last night on heroic argus (first time attempting him) and we only made it out of p1 maybve.. 5 times?
or maybe 4
soft condor
but it's pretty much the same as normal
junior ivy
yeah, i dunno lol. people never moved properly for fog
or put the debuff thigny in the middle of melee
soft condor
yeah, we get that as well, but it's just people fucking about, can't really call that hard
people getting greedy for the buffs and stuff
junior ivy
i was not expecting to get the buff every time as a tank either
that was weird
i had no idea where to put it first few times lol
zinc bear
Thanks everyone and @prisma crane for advice.
prisma crane
no problem Kefe
lapis topaz
New(ish) to tanking question: What do you guys think about nameplates showing threat? I've been trying out Tidy Plates: Threat Plates, and while it seems like a great idea, I'm not sure how I feel about the extra visual clutter. Maybe I just need to work on the settings and turn off scaling and what not...
junior ivy
i couldnt play without threat plates
sick sentinel
i dont think its necessary i have threat meter above my targets hp and color change if adds target someone else
junior ivy
but im an addon addict
timid jay
I've been running with it since I started tanking
Makes it really easy to see in m+ if you lose aggro on something
prisma crane
to be honest
if i could have only one addon in the game
it would be threat plates
timid jay
??
junior ivy
^^
timid jay
Not weak auras
prisma crane
nope
timid jay
Make threat plates inside weak auras
prisma crane
ok, fair enough there
sick sentinel
maybe what i have is threat generation thing also lol
timid jay
weak auras is the only addon I'd say is absolutely essential to raiding
junior ivy
weak auras barely counts as an addon lol its like a repository of addons
lapis topaz
@sick sentinel is that available in the default UI?
sick sentinel
im using elvUI
lapis topaz
Ah, yeah, ok
sick sentinel
i think its base there i changed colors and stuff tho since im colorblind
junior ivy
i lost all my weakauras yesterday to a power outage (i sure hate canadian winters) and i got them all back plus way more. somehow i have like twice as many i had before the outage
i gotta stay off wago.io
its not good
lapis topaz
I feel like I'd love just a little additional line under their helath to show threat/aggro
junior ivy
shadowed unit frames lets you do that
lapis topaz
lol
junior ivy
it lets you colour nameplates by threat
and you can make them tiny
SUF is reeeeeeeeeally customizable but kinda confusing to learn
prisma crane
i didnt use WA until sept '17 @timid jay
lapis topaz
Cool, I've used SUF some in the past, but haven't turned them on yet for my warrior
prisma crane
but yea, they're pretty nice
timid jay
omg
sick sentinel
i started using elvUI this year but weakauras for so loong
junior ivy
ill never use elvui probably
sick sentinel
it helps shit ton
junior ivy
i have 180 addons and probably 30-40 weakauras ๐
lapis topaz
so you've basically got elvui already ๐
prisma crane
stock UI baby
junior ivy
my friend asked me to raid at his house the other night, said he has wow installed and i could just log in from there. yeha right. i wouldnt have my addons and WAs !!
sick sentinel
you can just copy wow addons folder
junior ivy
his PC would never be able to handle my addons/WAs lol
sick sentinel
ohh thats sad
lapis topaz
So nameplates is your #1 addon, what are #2 and #3 @junior ivy ?
junior ivy
bartender would have to be one
timid jay
- WA
lapis topaz
agrees
junior ivy
and titanpanel DONT JUDGE ME everyone is like wtf when they see i use titan panel
timid jay
- Bigwigs
- moveanything
soft condor
tidy plates for nameplates all the way
junior ivy
moveanyhting thats another important one
and WIM
how has no one said WIM?
WIM is necessity to me
im surprised wow hasnt built in something like WIM yet
default whisper situation is terrible
timid jay
I dont even know what WIm is
sick sentinel
dont need WIM if you dont have friends
lapis topaz
I'm surprised to see MA listed... I mean, I use it, but I rarely use it... What do you like to move around?
junior ivy
wow instant messenger
timid jay
oh
tiny sphinx
prefer prat over wim, wim is intrusive
lapis topaz
I used to do use chatter, but these days I play solo mostly, so yeah, no friends, no need to mess with it.
junior ivy
i dont wanna do a key ๐ฆ
junior ivy
lolol
oh, unit plate adodn necessary for me too casue i hate when buffs are in top right corner
soft condor
just WA all important buffs
soft condor
Make your own WAs, teaches you a lot about the class mechanics
lapis topaz
ah yes, sort by star
soft condor
but you might need a couple dozen hours extra ๐
lapis topaz
to date, I have three, for my prot warrior, that I made all by myself ๐
but learning from others can speed things up.
junior ivy
i made my own WA for prot and then i lostr it when my power went out
i havenbt remade it yet ๐ฆ
soft condor
whenever I import a WA and look into the custom code I just shut down, need to do everything step by step myself. Guess I'm just not used to lua enough
lapis topaz
It helps that my char is only level 30, so I don't even have some of these crazy powers and I'm not doing mechanics-intensive raids. I get to build up organically.
junior ivy
when i do ill upload to wago./io so i dont lsoe it again
awww youre only lvl 30?
little baby prot warrior
i love it
lapis topaz
Yep, little itty bitty at this point.
junior ivy
cute
lapis topaz
Hah, I guess I just realized that people actually build their (player) unit frames entirely out of WA? That's madness, but beautiful in it's way... Feels kinda like how people use Excel for everything.
junior ivy
my favourite weakauras are: the one that plays owen wilson saying wow when i crit, the one that tells me what mount someone is on and wehre to get it when i click them, the one that tells me to repair, the one that tells me when heroism is active, ojne that adds a quest counter, and my warrior bars that show duration of ignore pain, shield block, etc.
i have lots of wealkauras but those are my most important
lapis topaz
Wow! ๐
soft condor
my favourite WA is my own Ignore Pain Icon that fills and emptys according to amount and potential cap
sick sentinel
my favorite weakaura is the one i made that counts how many times i jump during a pull
sick sentinel
honestly i miss the bejewled addon
sick sentinel
sorry its for subs only
vagrant cape
hey y'all, I got back from a 6-month break. I mained prot pally up until a month after tomb came out. since I'd have to regear my paladin anyway, I decided now might be a good time to try out another tank. I have a warrior sitting at 100 and I wanted to ask y'all a few questions:
-
How do warriors feel right now? ie, paladin felt like a game of whack-a-mole, stacking haste and hitting as many abilities as possible.
-
How do warriors do at solo stuff like WQs?
-
Can a well-geared warrior pull an entire low-level dungeon (heroic or m+0) and be fine? I don't know how much sustain they have.
-
How desirable are warrior tanks in m+ and raiding atm?
Thanks!
sick sentinel
- fun
- fine
- yes
- desireable
vagrant cape
oh, 5: How dependent are warriors on getting 1-2 core legendaries? is there a big gap between the best ones and the rest?
junior ivy
what are subs?
sick sentinel
- for survivability and cdr, big gap. for dps, not really that much on st.
vagrant cape
Also, is there a new system for making specific legendaries or are they still random drops?
topaz ember
sandwitches that are usually longer than they are wide
sick sentinel
cant target specific legs
junior ivy
lol
vagrant cape
damn. I feel like I woke up from cryostasis and I'm disappointed by how little changed.
I guess that's wow
soft condor
prot warriors are fun and interactive, though
sick sentinel
you can technically target a slot, with argunite... but its still really small chance of a leggo
soft condor
tons of apm needed
vagrant cape
does playing one fill you with a sense of pride and accomplishment, though?
that's what I live for
sick sentinel
theres a sense of pride and accomplishment when your spec has less than 100 kills on a boss
and you're one of them
soft condor
Mostly exhaustion and the feeling of a job well done no one will ever congratulate on
In your own mind though, there you can really appreciate what magic you just made real
dusky summit
Feels good in m+ when you're compariable in damage with your dps and you outheal your healer
vagrant cape
as a prot pally, I used to get smacked and die randomly because my active mitigation wasn't on. When shield of the righteous isn't up, I'm basically paper. Are warriors like that?
Like, without sotr I'd basically get chunked by boss autoattacks or trash autos
topaz ember
my last 15 maw i was highest dps and healer xD
vagrant cape
can warriors survive with their passive defenses against that stuff?
dusky summit
without active migitation, you'll take a lot of dmg...
vagrant cape
true, yes, but don't warriors have more block chance and armor and hp than paladins or something?
sick sentinel
what passive defenses? ๐ค
dusky summit
but our downtime for shield block is a few seconds, and with proper play, you shouldn't get one shot ever
topaz ember
dont we have the lowest hp?
dusky summit
just like any class
sick sentinel
we have the same amount of armor as a boomkin
vagrant cape
dang. I may look into brewmaster or guardian, then, because they can easily get 100% uptime and have great damage smoothing
from what I've heard in Sco's tank ranking video at least
sick sentinel
sco is awful
dusky summit
sco ๐ค
sick sentinel
he's literally a gray parsing tank
final mist
sco
dusky summit
LOL
final mist
vagrant cape
I have no idea what authorities to listen to with regard to tanking, but I saw he was in method so I figured he might have known what he was talking about
topaz ember
Hi welcome to my tank ranking video druid is on top and the other tanks suck see you next week!
vagrant cape
I mean, yeah, that's basically the video.
sick sentinel
tank responsibility on mythic is not really something that is difficult, most fights are literally just taunt at this specific moment and make sure you mit when needed
vagrant cape
But I'm not planning on mythic raiding world first bullshit, so I just want a fun tank that does a lot of damage and doesn't die too often
sick sentinel
there is a huge difference when playing for world first or just normaly progressing or doing high m+
the learning curve isnt really a challenge
junior ivy
derakkor is your jumping weakaura really not available to anyone?\
final mist
If you want to do damage, play Vengeance or Prot
junior ivy
you made me really want it now
sick sentinel
well... when your guild does 7 split runs, of course you'll be ahead of a 2-day guild that does no split runs
perspective is everything
dusky summit
warriors are in a good place in antorus
vagrant cape
How has warrior life improved since the days of ToV? I heard they just get wrecked by magic damage
dusky summit
mostly everything in antorus is blockable
sick sentinel
imo best tanks around is the guys that doing highest keys
with leggo pants we have mit for almost any magic damage
vagrant cape
are vengeance DHs good in m+? I saw that the top m+ team uses one
maybe I'll ask their discord about em
dusky summit
dh and bdk is bis
sick sentinel
shakib is good player tho
topaz ember
bdk is best because you can take 4 dps xD
vagrant cape
I care a lot more about m+ tanking than raid tanking
sick sentinel
if you want to have easier time go bdk
dusky summit
go bdk then
sick sentinel
vdh is more proc based and needs a bit more planning
in raids its boring as fuck tho
vagrant cape
hmmm, no w the question becomes, do I want to level a DK from 60 for a better experience or play a DH straight from 110 because laziness?
dusky summit
they're the best m+ class, but vdh is really good if you're good at the class
sick sentinel
if you want to have easier time go bdk
dont forget that you can do high keys with every tank spec
vagrant cape
So question then, what makes y'all play warrior over the other tanks? what makes them stand out/fun for y'all?
sick sentinel
and probably prot warrior is better then blood dk if you are not going for really high keys
dusky summit
dmg
sick sentinel
dmg and its more rewarding if played right
vagrant cape
oh yeah, I don't care about high keys, I just wanna farm 15s or so
topaz ember
i like thost 2mil sheild slams
dusky summit
you can frm 15's with any tank spec, just play w.e u want
if you wanan go easy route, braindead classes, go bdk or guardian
vagrant cape
I know, but I just wanted to see what warriors had that other tanks don't
it seems they do a lot of damage.
do they do more ST or AoE?
dusky summit
both
stark sage
mobility/damage/ very strong physical mitigation
vagrant cape
oh yeah, they can leap and shit. I forgot
topaz ember
we just donbt have raid utility besides some leech
vagrant cape
from a paladin, that sounds wonderufl
sick sentinel
check logs if you want to see damage difference
stark sage
they are easy to heal if played well
vagrant cape
alright, thanks y'all! If I settle on warrior, I'll be seeing y'all around
sick sentinel
our healers sometimes not even healing me when im using bracers
stark sage
spell reflect has some utility, especially in m+
inspiring presence brings a lot of raid healing
dark junco
Spell reflect cheese the fuck out of upper kara
stark sage
does prot get commanding shout
surreal stump
ive played warrior since wrath, because i love the class, charging all over slaping things in the face with shield, to this day it has always been my most enjoyed toon. 100% block cheese, spell reflect cheese, last stand cheese< some trinkets and such effects> and my cow looks bad ass lol
stark sage
thats good utility
glad plume
Which one is better cape ilvl920 and pants 935 t21 for the 2p bonus or cape ilvl950 and pants 965 but no t21 bonus.... I'm ilvl 960 without t21 and ilvl 955 with t21 set.... so the question is ilvl or t21 2p bonus. Thanks you
sick sentinel
t21 is good worth lots of ilvl both for dps and survivability
surreal stump
remember cata tier? where u had to hold SW for when raid needed it? lol
sick sentinel
at least use 2pc
sick sentinel
2pc t21 adds way more dps and survivability than higher ilvl without bonus
mellow maple
best legends ?
west kayak
Baba Yaga and Zorro!
sick sentinel
how hard is 1/0/29 on varimathras
west kayak
Or you can check the pins. ๐
prisma crane
pins arent as helpful in that dept anymore : /
bracers/gloves/belt/TWF
AHR is up there too
sacred hill
I told a friend I was planning on boosting a prot warrior, and he said to beware they aren't particularly fun or strong, thoughts?
timid jay
Fun is very subjective, but we are viable for everything
glass rain
Hello everyone, I'm completely new to prot warrior but I'm trying to make it my main potentially. I just got my first leggo which was the Thunder Clap belt, is this at least decent? it seems good for M+ but I'm not entirely sure. Also, I thought we were supposed to use vengeance but the 7.3 prot guide says booming voice. Should I just go booming voice regardless since I have the belt too?
sacred hill
What about prot warr do you find fun?
timid jay
@glass rain TC belt is BiS by far for m+, its extremely strong
we mainly play BV nowadays
especially once you get t21 2p
@sacred hill High APM spec, and punishing if you fuck up
Dont like the tanks where you basically fall asleep and healers just handle everything
glass rain
@timid jay when you say fuck up, what should I be careful of? I'm kind of intimidated D:
I used to play BM so that's what I'm used to
untold vigil
have shield block up when you have a blockable ability coming
timid jay
having bad SB usage can fuck you hard
glass rain
Sorry BM monk
timid jay
A good example is KJ, if you dont have SB up for all felclaws you're basically dead
Unless you use big CD's to cover it
Basically its low health pool combined with not having 100% uptime on AM that makes it a bit punishing
glass rain
this is gonna be cringe but what does AM stand for?
timid jay
active mitigation
glass rain
oh lol
timid jay
basically ironskin brew or whatever its called for BRM
glass rain
gotcha
stone imp
As opposed to the other AM meaning
prisma crane
anger management (talent) or active mitigation (game mechanic)
damage reduction or diminishing returns
Shield Block (most common use of SB here) or shadowbind (NLC trait)
there's lot of these things, context helps ๐
twin thunder
ignore pain, inspiring presence
prisma crane
oh, yea, that one too
i try to say insp pres
when i can
then all the BC BR CDR LS SW SR NF
SB is also stormbolt too lol
SW shockwave
or shieldwall
ugh
look at that
Marok is hiding in the Val'kyr
did you give up server ownership?
fierce juniper
nope
timid jay
One can dream krotos
fierce juniper
they had this Server Owner crown thing
timid jay
:^)
prisma crane
oh they removed that crown thing
fierce juniper
cntrl+r
timid jay
I like the crown
fierce juniper
it will probably go away
prisma crane
lol
timid jay
Maybe I want you to have the crown
prisma crane
๐
tiny sphinx
what kind of service takes away someone's goddamn crown
prisma crane
๐ฎ
timid jay
๐
prisma crane
there
some sort of secret service?
but the odyn rank isnt separate anymor
anymore*
fierce juniper
Yeah, well I figured since the crown was there, there was no need to have Odyn be seperate
but now the crown is gone
:(
although, the crown is still there in other servers
hmm
tiny sphinx
maybe there was a coup
prisma crane
the green in the middle of the blue is weird, but i guess Vel is hiding in orange so there's that
timid jay
Yeah, crown gone after ctrl+f5
tiny sphinx
so just do the opposite of ctrl+f5 - 5 F lrtc
prisma crane
ahhh, alt for those other ones
timid jay
what
prisma crane
it's so weird how some stuff stays and other is under shift and alt
like
shift 3 is # for me
but shift 4 is $
% is back to shift 5
timid jay
The blue ones are alt+gr
untold vigil
some sort of moon language there
prisma crane
[]{} are their own buttons for us
untold vigil
bork bork bork
untold vigil
having a ยต on the keyboard might be fun
prisma crane
for those COSMOnauts out there
prisma crane
i figured lol
untold vigil
i once worked on a finnish keyboard. that was messed up if you don't speak finnish
prisma crane
it's what i always assumed it was from
idk why but your robot guy made me think of it
sick sentinel
crown not appearing for "obvious admin roles"
sick sentinel
#SecretlyADruid
timid jay
Scroll down a bit to fix that
sick sentinel
OWO
timid jay
Krotos
sick sentinel
thanks Sco*
hard wyvern
Playing warrior in 2018 LUL
prisma crane
Cosmo is on top!
timid jay
Need so scroll further
prisma crane
lol
to make up for my lack of work ethic here AT work...
some day i will take off my hat
prisma crane
soviet regime, all officers must be in lockstep!
timid jay
Naeno is in on it too
prisma crane
As F
jovial reef
would you run heavy repercussions or anger management for M agg?
prisma crane
AM
prisma crane
last night our other tank died at the end of a technique
solo tanked up to and through the next technique
with AM
that said, it was a bit scary and im really just bummed that i didnt set a new block record yet
prisma crane
yup
sacred hill
How is prot on damage compared to the other tanks?
prisma crane
towards the top end
timid jay
Middle of the pack on AoE, better on ST
prisma crane
but in heavy aoe we generally fall back
yea
if sotb ring gave us HR/AM instead of vengeance we'd prob be top ST dmg
timid jay
We'd also be completely OP
sacred hill
OK good to know, ty, trying to decide on a tank to boost and usurp my guilds bdk and pally
prisma crane
both of those tanks are arguably "better" than warrior
in ABT
but, we compete just fine
and if you're better than them you'll do better
timid jay
Its not like its really hard for any fight
All of them are more then doable if you play well
prisma crane
that BDK is going to be irreplaceable for Agg lol
jovial reef
tyvm ppl, asked for a guildie
sacred hill
Plate + zandalari makes warrior pretty enticing
timid jay
Nightborne all the way!
prisma crane
im curious what the zand racials will be
jovial reef
they better be decent for melee dps
sacred hill
Yeah, I don't plan on displacing them for out abt progression, more like going into bfa
proven sandal
Check the changes cause warrior is changing a decent bit before BfA, not a ton, but things will be slightly different gameplay wise than now. Pally and BDK don't seem to be changing a ton.
sacred hill
I could look at the changes but I don't really have a good frame of reference for how things are currently, what do you think about the bfa changes?
timid jay
Looks like the drastically want to lower the APM of prot warriors with the changes
prisma crane
thats the only part that sucks for me
the rest is just an adjustment
which is expected
i already had to learn to live without MoP vengeance
that was a hard pill to swallow
so i think i'll survive this
fierce juniper
Lower APM, lower rage gen, lower AM uptime
IP isn't something you're going to spam like you do now. It's a short CD that will be used for mechanics/high damage periods
sacred hill
Lower rage gen? I've heard rage gen is already kinda slow
Would you agree or have I heard false things
timid jay
We have really high RPS atm
prisma crane
emphasis on the really
it's the only reason we can get by with our shit IP scaling at the moment
olive trench
anyone quick tips for coven mythic fight? lego recomms?
timid jay
Its a pretty chill fight, I went heavy on damage
timid jay
If you're gonna stay outside safe zones during storm bracers are helpful
turbid horizon
prisma crane
oh Cosmo
turbid horizon
MMMM
prisma crane
i got a Diima's
timid jay
Pretty dope
turbid horizon
prisma crane
with vers procs up it crits over 2.3m
turbid horizon
I ate haste food
timid jay
monkaS
timid jay
Welcome to the club
prisma crane
that was the first one i've ever seen
turbid horizon
But I got 50% haste with 2p 21
prisma crane
i got to 55% with 2p2p
no food
and no haste on my legs
lol
but it's worthless
fun to mess around with though
rotund heart
void basalt
how is highmountain looking for tanking?
prisma crane
well, even if it scales better it wont make or break
that said, as far as dmg reduction, even if it's minor, that's still better than say... 1% increased magic dmg
prisma crane
belf, hello?
turbid horizon
Got riftworld codex
lets see if I get diimas this run too
Riftworld codex good for M+ right?
turbid horizon
That's about how I do M+ anyway, moving is a dps loss
timid jay
The fire proc is really nice
turbid horizon
@rotund heart at 50.26% haste the cooldown is 8.65s
timid jay
๐ ๐ค
turbid horizon
NEEEERD
prisma crane
lmao
turbid horizon
remember when nerd was a brutal insult
wind scroll
Any good farmable trinkets for offensive use?
timid jay
Chronoshard or whatever the one from MoS is called
wind scroll
Memento of Angerboda ?
timid jay
Thats the one
iirc chronoshard is slightly stronger if you dont count in deaths of friendlies
Simply because the crit proc is almost always wasted
wind scroll
I see
scarlet juniper
Is dark slash reflectable?
turbid horizon
yes
scarlet juniper
Thanks
timid jay
Theres a good pinned spreadsheet for blockable and reflectable abilites
for antorus and all dungeons
wind scroll
Thanks for the info btw. ๐
timid jay
npnp
humble patio
accidentally coined mythic kingaroth as prot and got a 965 leech apocalypse drive, is that trinket shit?
fleet galleon
Is a 910 Arcanocrystal is better than a 910 Memento for dps?
And no, that trinket is defensively really good for M+
timid jay
Apoc dive is among the best trinkets for survivability
timid jay
As for Hauger, cant really tell with any accuracy since we have no dps sims and all
fleet galleon
Yeah, Idk if the strength is worth all the stats on an arcanocrystal.
timid jay
But my gut feeling says chronoshard
fleet galleon
Chronoshard ๐ค
Hadn't considered it cos I don't have it. Could run some Arcway to get it though. Didn't realized it was so highly recommended. Been focusing on getting a high level Memento so far
fleet galleon
Ah gotcha
prisma crane
can't wait to try Diima's on Eonar now
fleet galleon
I've only ever run Eonar on heroic but no way things live long enough to make use of the buff. Or indeed the damage...
Heroic and below
prisma crane
im talking about for dmg
since the dmg is instant
2.2m per target hit
plus a slow
fleet galleon
What ilvl did you get it at?
fleet galleon
Ah
prisma crane
and assuming average vers procs
fleet galleon
Concordance?
random cliff
my guild's usual 3rd tank isnt here tonight and im 3rd tank on Argus for tonight, am I stupid for using legs for 2nd spell reflect for orbs? I survive p2 easily with guardian
timid jay
Sounds like a decent idea
Havent tanked it myself so I cant comment too much but I heard they are a pain to soak as warrior so the extra SR charge should come in handy
south patrol
Thoughts on Impenetrable Nerubian Husk?
timid jay
Not very good
Procs on your attacks so it can happen when you're offtankin in raids
the proc is kinda underwhelimg as well
oblique pike
so i did some napkin math and log review, and it looks like shatter the bones is a TERRIBLE relic. like it would be a dmg increase of maybe .2% at best
timid jay
It used to be good, especially back when we played HR
oblique pike
on a 3 minute training dummy fight, i'm looking at about 15 ss casts in shield block, outside battlecry (on average)
with about 7 crits, 8 hits
which means a 5% crit chance increase on ss outside of BC, inside of SB is about a damage increase of 500k in 3 minutes
and i'm consistently doing 200m+ in 3 minutes
then again, looks like rage of the fallen isnt doing much better at a .35% dps increase
and i have thundercrash at a .5% dps increase
stone imp
Those are all likely true. rage of the fallen ends up being something like 3500 DPS increase ST, but can scale up on AoE
sick sentinel
I tried switching to my prot warrior from my prot pally recently. Does anyone else feel like warrior is a lot more squishy?
oblique pike
yea this is all just pure sT
timid jay
@sick sentinel Lego / tier dependant, not to mention punishing if you missplay
oblique pike
also im seeing that my torment the weak did 3.7% of my dmg with 1 point while chaotic darkness did 3.9% with 2 points
stone imp
I also did some napkin math based on Marok's math. I don't actually believe the offensive 3rd tier talents are really worth anything at all. The 2nd level ones matter a lot.
timid jay
But if you count missplays into squishy then sure, we're squishy