technology

[red ingot]

especially since I will be working with lots of numbers in future and may end up wanting to use it

[storm osprey]

get rid of it imo, i like the extra space

[red ingot]

my desk is also pretty big tho

[storm osprey]

get separate numpad

[red ingot]

ohh

true

so many options

[storm osprey]

thats my set up

[red ingot]

gah

ohhh and rgb

[storm osprey]

rgb on GMMK isnt very bright

[red ingot]

that's fine

i don't need it to be super bright

well as long as it's not super dim i guess

[storm osprey]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/256196083196100608/514874271676235786/IMG_20181121_114528546.jpg?width=581&height=436

[red ingot]

but like it seems to be bright in the pics

[main anchor]

i should really ditch my dvd drive in my case

[red ingot]

oh yeah it is kinda dim

that's max brightness?

[storm osprey]

not sure really

probably

[red ingot]

😦

can barely see the rgb

Dx

[storm osprey]

picture doesnt do it justive

[main anchor]

i'm thinking of installing a 3.5" floppy drive

[red ingot]

true

[storm osprey]

but it is definitely not k70 bright

[red ingot]

ah

cause i have a k90 rn

[storm osprey]

my friend has that keeb and i brought mine to a lan once

[red ingot]

and

i guess his was brighter

[storm osprey]

oh yea

[red ingot]

hm

[storm osprey]

like twice as bright

[red ingot]

damn

that's a lot

well

i guess i can take a look - im assuming there's more than this keyboard

[storm osprey]

oh yea

if you want RGB

[red ingot]

nvm that's all i can find on this site

[storm osprey]

internet acting up

check "massdrop ctrl keyboard"

its basically GMMK on steroids

it might be best to figure out what switch you like and go from there

theres at least 50 easily obtainable switches out there atm

not including cherry clones

[red ingot]

Holy shit

Well

What would u suggest? I honestly know like nothing about switches and stuff

[storm osprey]

depends what you like lol

[red ingot]

I got the k90 as my first gaming kb years ago just cause my buddy said it was good

[storm osprey]

the general split in switches is linear, tactile or clicky

linear are reds, tactile is brown, clicky is blues

by cherry naming convention

[red ingot]

Ok

So like

Nvm I dont rven onow

Even know * Ffs autocorrect

[storm osprey]

what color are the switches on your board?

[red ingot]

Autocorrects correct spelling to incorrect... no idea

I'll google it

[storm osprey]

https://i.ytimg.com/vi/3FJPGpwyzOA/maxresdefault.jpg

just pop off they keycap

[red ingot]

I think its cherry mx red

[solemn vector]

yh i have cherry red too

[red ingot]

Oh okay if I take off the keycap I should be able to tell?

[storm osprey]

so cherry reds are linear

yea

[red ingot]

I'm not exactly at my keyboard rn but i can confirm after

[storm osprey]

taking off the cap will show you the switch color and will say cherry across the top

[red ingot]

Ok

[storm osprey]

or bottom

depends how that manufacturer orients them

do you like the linear feel?

or would you want a bump?

[red ingot]

What's the difference

Like, linear is same all the way down and bump is more resistance?

[storm osprey]

the feel of the switch, and sound depending on how its implremented

thats another part of divide

[red ingot]

Wow

[storm osprey]

you can have a linear switch that taked 80g of force to bottom out

[red ingot]

Ok

[storm osprey]

and a clicky switch could be 50g

just depends the springs that are used in that specific switch

[red ingot]

[storm osprey]

yea... theres a lot

[red ingot]

Yeah lol

RIP me

[storm osprey]

my friend and i bought "Swtich testers" just to see what swtiches we like

[red ingot]

Ah

Smart

[storm osprey]

we had like 120 different switches

[red ingot]

How much are

[storm osprey]

most were clones though

[red ingot]

Jesus

Ok

120

Holy shit

Lol

[wet notch]

120?

[storm osprey]

like there are cherry reds, and there are knock off reds from kailh, gateron, and so on

[red ingot]

So the knock offs are essentially the same shit

[storm osprey]

depends

[red ingot]

[storm osprey]

some are bad and "scratchy" when you press it down

[red ingot]

Scratchy doesnt sound nice

[storm osprey]

but some are actually better than real cherrys

gateron reds were better than cherry

[red ingot]

[storm osprey]

at least feel wise

[red ingot]

Oh God

[storm osprey]

at the time there wasnt a consensus on durability

https://kbdfans.cn/products/kbdfans-super-swithes-tester-60-switches-all-in-one

63 there

i bought one that had 24

he had another switch board for just cherry

and another one he mad

so yea, we had like 100 switches at least between us

and since then vendors have created more switches

imo you narrow down your switch type this way

type (linear, tactile, clicky)> weight > brand

[rose eagle]

do noctua dh15 ever go on sale?

[red ingot]

Holy fuck

[storm osprey]

oh, and now they are coming out with silent variants

[red ingot]

well why would u want that

i thought the whole point was the nice clicky sound

😄

and also just checked - my switches are red

[storm osprey]

i like the feel of the switches

and at work i dont want to be loud

so silents keep the feel and durability but arent loud af

[red ingot]

true

and the massdrop one looks kinda cool

idk how much it is tho cause i have to make an account to see the price... which is kinda annoying

[wet notch]

clicky keyboards feel good when you are typing yourself but not when someone else is doing it

like a fart

[red ingot]

loool

[storm osprey]

the ctrl is like 200 or 250

[red ingot]

oh damn isee

so like a corsair one

[storm osprey]

yep

but it comes with better keycaps for sure

[red ingot]

hm

[storm osprey]

and you can switch the switches easily

[red ingot]

one review said it was hard af

[storm osprey]

you dont have to know how to solder to change them like a corsair board

[red ingot]

although i guess that's anecdotal

[storm osprey]

whats hard?

[red ingot]

to swap the switches

[storm osprey]

to change the switch?

[red ingot]

yeah lol first review

[storm osprey]

not as hard as desoldering and soldering on a new one

[red ingot]

but 1 outta like 100

yeah prolly not

[unborn epoch]

fucken spastics everywhere

[storm osprey]

you just have to pull harder than expected

at least that was the case with my gmmk

[red ingot]

so the rgb on this one is a lot better tho

the only dif between it and the gmmk

[storm osprey]

probably better quality keycabs

that one comes with switches

i think its open source as well

[red ingot]

the ctrl one?

[storm osprey]

ye

[red ingot]

hm

well apparently the ctrl one isn't even in stock

[dreamy tinsel]

Nyphon?

[storm osprey]

yea just checked on my phone

itll come back

yes?

[dreamy tinsel]

Please hold me back...
I am so tempted to just go ham this black friday

https://gyazo.com/117c2bdb7de33ecf867afba365bb9b60

[red ingot]

do it

[storm osprey]

lol you came to the wrong place to tell you to not buy tech

[dreamy tinsel]

🤣

[unborn epoch]

how is that mousepad only half of that mouse

[dreamy tinsel]

lol

It's a big mouse

[unborn epoch]

or why is that mouse only double the cost of that pad

[dreamy tinsel]

idk haha

On sale

[storm osprey]

steelseries qck+ heavy mass is a boss pad though

and logitech g502 is old and popular

[unborn epoch]

i suggest buying one that has stitched finish

[storm osprey]

well, so is that pad

[dreamy tinsel]

I added that one for 69 as backup just because its cheap

I dont like "frames" on my mousepad 😛

[storm osprey]

ive had that exact pad for a few years now, its barely fraying

and i game a lot...

[red ingot]

yeah apparently the gmmk's lighting options aren't great

[unborn epoch]

mine are destroyed in a year 😦

[red ingot]

although the brightness does look alright

[unborn epoch]

i've had many in the earlier years

[dreamy tinsel]

Get rid of those long cat nails nick

😉

[unborn epoch]

bruh

[storm osprey]

the OPTIONS for lighting on the GMMK is actually pretty good

there are 6 categories for color effects, and each one has like 3-5 options

and you can manually select colors

[red ingot]

huh

some of the reviews said it wasn't good

[dreamy tinsel]

The new corsair keyboard software update is great

[storm osprey]

idk what they are comparing it to

but it definitely isnt bad imo

[dreamy tinsel]

Lets you make your keyboard colors change according to temperatures on hardware 😄

[storm osprey]

yea, if thats the level of corsair lighting options GMMK doesnt come close to that

[red ingot]

yeah

😦

[storm osprey]

doesnt mean GMMK isnt good for lighting

[red ingot]

true

would be cool tho

blue for cool pc

red for hot pc

[storm osprey]

although, the brightness on GMMK is just ok

[steep gust]

The issue with temperature color changes is my PC doesn't get hot

[storm osprey]

maybe people dont know how to pick their words correctly

[red ingot]

looked at some pics in the reviews

and the lighting does look pretty good

[dreamy tinsel]

Just set it lower Predator

if you play a game like BFV the hardware will change in temperature

[red ingot]

idk i just like options

especially with sexy rgb

[steep gust]

My CPU peaks at like 60-70C and my GPU barely breaks 60-65C

I prefer having more than two colors anyway

[red ingot]

yeah same here

idk

i dont like deciding

it's obviously impossible to find the perfect product cause everything will have its tradeoffs

[storm osprey]

yea if youre keyboard decisions are based heavily on the RGB i think corsair is going to be hard to beat

[dreamy tinsel]

Mine looks like this:
https://gyazo.com/76ae1abc6c4655793b980d009910557a

The space key is my CPU and the arrow keys are my GPU

[red ingot]

but should they be is the question

[storm osprey]

imo no

[red ingot]

i mean rn my k90 only has blue backlight and i've been fine with it..

[storm osprey]

durability and quality are my factors

[red ingot]

and honestly i turned off the rgb on my mouse and mousepad (just set it to static colors) so its not distracting while im in game

[storm osprey]

i doubt corsair keycaps are doubleshot

[red ingot]

hm

so i guess question for me is gmmk or ctrl

although u said ctrl is probably better build quality anyways right?

[storm osprey]

yea my friend had basically the prototype of the ctrl and it was solid

[red ingot]

okay

[storm osprey]

like SOLID

[red ingot]

oooh

but how long does it usually take for em to get in stock?

[storm osprey]

i hear corsair boards are as well

[red ingot]

i dont want to wait like a year

[storm osprey]

i didnt pick up my friends

[latent light]

@terse juniper you would be better off getting an i5-8400, 8600K, or a Ryzen 5 2600 tbh
6600k and 7600k are going to be bottlenecking GPUs a couple years down the line

[storm osprey]

https://blog.wooting.nl/wp-content/uploads/2015/11/Doubleshot-v2-1024x685.jpg

thats doubleshot keycap

[red ingot]

and lol i thought u said corsair keyboards were poorer quality (which makes sense i mean cause like they're a big company and it's all about the $$$)

[storm osprey]

meaning the lettering wont ever fade, and you cant "scratch" through the cap

[red ingot]

oh okay that's nice

[storm osprey]

i havent really messed with a corsair board

but i dont see what about it costs as much as they do

the software for the lighting?

[red ingot]

yeah, although the ctrl ones are expensive too from what u said

[storm osprey]

yea

[rose dawn]

I won an ASUS Claymore keyboard in a giveaway. Really nice, but I'd never pay full retail price for it

[storm osprey]

thats why i have the GMMK

[red ingot]

although i guess they have double shot and probably better build quality

[storm osprey]

got it on sale for like 70 bucks

alltogether

[red ingot]

and not soldered on keys

hm

well it says on the gmmk site their black friday sales start 12am CST

on the 23rd

[storm osprey]

yea corsair has laser etched keycaps

[red ingot]

up to 80% off

[storm osprey]

thats pretty damn cheap

[red ingot]

so maybe if like it's a big sale on the gmmk then i might just grab that

cause it starts at $60US, so fully customized im assuming is like $100 US, so like $130 CAD. so if I can even get like 30% off black friday deal, ill pay like $100 which is less than half of corsair equivalent

[storm osprey]

my gmmk for 70 bucks has doubleshot back lit keycaps..

the price of the gmmk will vary

but i recommend buying switches separate

[rose dawn]

anyone have suggestions for a 280mm cooler?

[storm osprey]

and keycaps...

to get the best value

and technically buying a case and pcb board would be the cheapest all around, and still be nice

[rose dawn]

I noticed my 7700K gets pretty hot in BFV :/

[red ingot]

ok

[storm osprey]

https://ko.aliexpress.com/store/product/stainless-steel-bent-case-for-xd84-eepw84-75-custom-keyboard-enclosed-case-upper-and-lower-case/3034003_32821807795.html?spm=a2g12.12010612.8148356.13.458c7048idTkGh

[red ingot]

so i guess they dont have any cherry switches

[storm osprey]

aluminum plate, pcb board, switches, caps

theres a lot of options

[red ingot]

well on the gmmk

[storm osprey]

that set up with a certain board could do the underglow affect

switch prices vary dramatically too

something high end like zealpc switches are like 1 dollar per switch

[red ingot]

wow

[storm osprey]

i think they go up to like 1.50 per switch

while you can get other brands for .35 cents per switch

[red ingot]

like the gmmk with switches and keycaps is $146 CAD (found the currency switch option)

[storm osprey]

what swtiches did you pick?!

thats kinda high

[red ingot]

Gateron Red

$29.99

which is lowest switch price

goes $29.99 -$34.99

[storm osprey]

thats... more than i expected

[red ingot]

i guess Canadians get fucked

[storm osprey]

like i said, i paid like 80 for mine

[red ingot]

yeah

although this is w/out sale

idk what the sales will be like

[storm osprey]

true

they usually have just the board for sale commonly

[red ingot]

i expect i can get at least 30% off

so it'll be more like $100 total

which isn't horrible

[storm osprey]

theres a bunch of vendors for switches too

[red ingot]

cheaper than $30 for full set?

of comparable/better quality?

curious

i mean $30 won't kill me but if i can get something better then why not

[storm osprey]

https://novelkeys.xyz/
https://kbdfans.cn/
https://www.cherryamericas.com/
https://mechanicalkeyboards.com/

those are the main ones i check

[latent light]

friend might give me his Asus rog strix 1080Ti for $400

[storm osprey]

i think the gmmk tkl has like 83 switches

[steep gust]

gib

[storm osprey]

so youll have to buy 90

[steep gust]

ROG Strix 1080ti is a long card tho

and at that length I'd get a FTW3 for that power limit

[latent light]

3 fans are better than 2

[steep gust]

Its more of its fucking overkill

[red ingot]

question is whether or not these other sites ship to Canada or not

[latent light]

3 fans = lower noise levels and better temperatures

[storm osprey]

you can pay 22 bucks for 90 switches

[steep gust]

uh yeah not how fans work

[latent light]

it simply is

[steep gust]

Bigger heatsink = lower temps

[storm osprey]

https://novelkeys.xyz/collections/switches/products/kailh-switches

[red ingot]

i mean like $8 won't kill me

[steep gust]

more fans doesn't always mean better temps

[red ingot]

unless they're better quality

[latent light]

well it does have more heatsink than a 2 fan card

it needs extra heatsink to stretch out for the 3rd fan obviously

[storm osprey]

same fans, but more of them will equal lower temps and lower noise

[steep gust]

also the power limit lock means that the extra heatsink is generally worthless

[storm osprey]

thats just a given

[latent light]

more heatsink surface area the better

[red ingot]

more fans = lower noise? wat

[storm osprey]

they have to do less work to cool

[latent light]

yes

[steep gust]

3 fans at lower RPM

[red ingot]

oh

[steep gust]

2 fans at higher

[red ingot]

makes sense

[steep gust]

generally

[storm osprey]

now the question is if its worth the cost of adding fans vs the temps and noise level

[latent light]

might change my 120mm case fans to 140mm fans

[steep gust]

meh

[latent light]

move more air at lower RPM

[storm osprey]

140mm = less noise more air

[steep gust]

or just buy a bunch of 120mm chromax nocuta fans

[storm osprey]

at a cost of like 2-5 bucks more per fan

[steep gust]

and not worry about fans when changing cases

a lot of cases only support 120mm

[storm osprey]

a lot of modern cases support 140mm

[latent light]

i got a NZXT S340 lol

[storm osprey]

especially in the front

[steep gust]

S340 Elite has some shit airflow

So static pressure > airflow

[storm osprey]

most cases support 2 140mm up front and 1 140mm up top

[steep gust]

and bigger fans means more airflow, not more static pressure

[latent light]

my S340 doesn't have bad airflow, maybe if you use an overclocked intel cpu lmao

[storm osprey]

not sure how much static pressure will work for an open case scenario

after a few inches it loses its push

you use those for rads

[steep gust]

ha my case supports 3x120mm in the front, 2x140mm on the top, and 120mm on the rear and is smaller than a S340 Elite

The S340 as a chassis has bad airflow

[latent light]

I got my Ryzen 5 1600 to 3.9 GHz at 1.37V on the stock cooler max temps are 72C on stress test

[storm osprey]

first time im hearing s340 has bad airflow

people gotta learn that not as good as something else doesnt mean its just bad

[latent light]

^

[storm osprey]

2600 isnt bad just because an 8400 is better

[sonic osprey]

its like in games, top1% of top 1% players are good, rest are bad

[storm osprey]

exactly

[pulsar totem]

I have a non BF question for you guys

I have triple pane windows in my house. I wanna put a nest outdoor cam outside about maybe.... 40 feet away from my house
I have direct line of sight from the window to where it would go, if I get a google wifi (I already have 3) and put it in the window sill would it penetrate the glass and communicate with it well?

[storm osprey]

afaik s340 has good airflow

[latent light]

i'd pick a 2600 over a 8400 anyday because 6 more threads will be more futureproof

[steep gust]

It has no proper airflow for the front

Air has to make a 90 degree turn

Which is well

bad

[latent light]

mine has 2 intake and 2 exhaust fans

[storm osprey]

not optimal does not equal bad

[latent light]

2 intake on front, 1 exhaust on back and 1 on top right above the motherboard

[steep gust]

Compared to other cases in the price range, the airflow is less than ideal

[storm osprey]

but still good enough

easily

[steep gust]

and yeah I know how an S430 Elite is, one is sitting on the ground beside me

[storm osprey]

your case flow sucks because its not an open bench

[steep gust]

Since I bought a different case and need to sell it

open air benches suck for VRM airflow

since they generally have no fans

[latent light]

Fractal Design have the best cases for airflow tbh

[steep gust]

tbh yeah

My Meshify C is leagues better than the S340 Elite I had for airflow

[pseudo mulch]

Have DICE changed the computer requirements from the beta?

[steep gust]

uh yeah the game runs like shit compared to the beta

[pseudo mulch]

I had 60 fps in the beta and now I have 30

[steep gust]

Sounds about right

[latent light]

my RX 580 did amazing in the beta lol

performance was on par to BF1

then the final release, feels like 20% drop

[flint locust]

[storm osprey]

theres much more content from beta to launch

just give it time

how much you get that for @flint locust ?

[steep gust]

@flint locust hey gonna be buying one of those soonTM

$135

Right now

[storm osprey]

WTF

[latent light]

1TB for $135??

[flint locust]

Yea i got it for $125

cheap as fuck

[latent light]

[storm osprey]

110 FEW MONTHS AGO WAS A GOOD DEAL FOR 500GB

[steep gust]

NAND flash is hella cheap rn

[flint locust]

black friday... amazon... now

[steep gust]

RAM is getting cheap

$120 for 3200mhz CL16 TridentZ RGB (2x8)

[storm osprey]

im still holding out, ssd prices are expected to keep dropping into next year

[latent light]

amd graphics cards are selling out it seems

anyone seen the cooler master mastercase H500M lmao

has two 200mm fans on front

[steep gust]

@latent light Pascal is out of production

So the stock they have is it

[latent light]

was saying AMD cards because they are all on a huge sale on newegg right now

[steep gust]

@flint locust Use the 240GB as a boot SSD since speeds aren't super important for booting

[latent light]

RX 580 $180 and RX 570 $140

[flint locust]

I have an m.2 drive for my OS

[steep gust]

2080ti $1300

I will probably buy the M.2 version of the 1TB 860 evo since it cost the same

And no cables

[dreamy tinsel]

I approve!

I have one

[flint locust]

i have 2.2 TB of SSD storage now

[dreamy tinsel]

M.2 is amazing

[flint locust]

yea i love my m.2 drive, so nice

[steep gust]

NVMe isn't worth the cost to me tbh

[latent light]

I have a 512GB 970 EVO NVMe

[steep gust]

M.2 is nice when you don't pay a premium

[flint locust]

i use my pc a lot, so i don't mind paying

[steep gust]

NVMe isn't really worth it to the average consumer since it only gets to flex the speeds on really large file transfers

And most consumers use a bunch of small files

[latent light]

I use it because it doesn't use cables

I like cable management

[steep gust]

I only have one proper M.2 slot on my motherboard

Fucking asus uses a riser for the second slot that look like shit

[latent light]

lol

[flint locust]

Same the fact that i was able to remove a shit ton of cables by shrinking down the hard drives i have is the best feeling

[steep gust]

Make a NAS and get a motherboard with 10GbE

[latent light]

my B350 AM4 motherboard has 2 slots I think one in front next to GPU and one on back

[steep gust]

The back is terrible for heat

Since no airflow means it will get really hot

And really slow

[latent light]

all mini-ITX boards have the m.2 on the back

[steep gust]

Eh

[latent light]

which is funny

[steep gust]

Not all

But yeah generally they put it there for advertising

[rose eagle]

noctua d15 seems like it never goes on sale....

i need somethin to cool this incoming 9700k hot sob

[steep gust]

Not worth the cost

Buy a Scythe Mugen 5 for the same performance

[latent light]

I want a low profile fan for my R5 1600 that faces the motherboard like the stock cooler but more effectively

[steep gust]

9700k is a shit chip tbh

Nocuta has some low profile coolers that are solid

[latent light]

i like fans that blow towards the motherboard because it helps with cooling MOSFETs

[steep gust]

VRMs really don't get that hot and if you have a proper heatsink then case airflow is enough

[latent light]

I put aftermarket heatsinks on my VRMs lmao

made out of copper

[agile quarry]

https://gyazo.com/abac59cf7f1d8d60a70870265cfc78ae

Can anyone explain why my gpu usage is 3% when playing online

[steep gust]

You don't have BFV on screen

[agile quarry]

I did

[latent light]

that's showing your integrated graphics usage i believe

[steep gust]

Set it to borderless

[agile quarry]

It was on screen

Ill try fraps

[steep gust]

iGPU gets disabled with a dedicated GPU

[latent light]

not completely

you can completely disable it in bios

[steep gust]

Unless it's a software that supports FastSync (or whatever its called) on a Intel CPU and you enable it

The BIOS disables the iGPU automatically

[latent light]

yeah it usually does

i seen so many forums of people plugging their monitor to the motherboard and not their gpu lmao

then they get mad and say that graphics card sucks or some shit lol

@agile quarry go to the performance tab in task manager and click on GPU

[steep gust]

And make sure it's in borderless. If you play in fullscreen then it stops rendering when you alt tab

[latent light]

yeah

[agile quarry]

I have 2 screen setup

Took a photo with my phone, so I actually wasx in-game

Ill try again now

[storm osprey]

wait, how is the 9700k shit?

[agile quarry]

Still 1%

GPU usage

[wet notch]

and you're not alt+tabbing out?

[agile quarry]

Nope

Typing on my phone now

[storm osprey]

is this some "its not actually shit, predator is just saying everything is shit again"

[agile quarry]

I need help with this

[storm osprey]

use hwmonitor

[agile quarry]

For usage?

[storm osprey]

yes

anything other than windows task manager

and that will say what gpu is it for

[agile quarry]

hwmonitor only sees my gpu memory

[storm osprey]

im looking at it right now

in utilization it says
GPU
MEMORY
FRAME BUFFER
VIDEO ENGINE
BUSINTERFACE

if hw monitor isnt picking it up something is wrong

reseat gpu

update drivers

do all the standard shit and try again

[latent light]

i7-9700K is pretty good

they put too much solder between the IHS and the die though

on the new gen

[storm osprey]

i dont see what is bad about the 9700k

its the best performing cpu for gaming

the price isnt ideal, and im sure there are problems with it

but nothing that could make it shit

[latent light]

the price doesn't justify it though

$410 for a i7 lmao

8700K is $340

[storm osprey]

no, i wouldnt pay that, but like i said, that doesnt make it shit

"9700k is a shit chip tbh"

thats, just false

[latent light]

yeah it's not shit at all

but the price makes it where the 8700K is a better option

https://gyazo.com/b181385e37d188e87c0e7f3d02eef73f

https://gyazo.com/255257f1db9e53b25dc1b7e30f91fcce

https://gyazo.com/dd2500fdd29119038baffe7f744a777f

they perform the same lmao

[storm osprey]

they should, id imagine once you start streaming one is better than the other

still not worth the price differnce though

but still, doesnt make it shit

[half comet]

I would take the newer gen if building a new pc. 70$ price diff.

Its not about core clocks anymore, its about how many underlying core instruction Per clock are going

[molten bramble]

I wouldn’t, I’d spend the extra $70 on maximizing memory.

[latent light]

^

[half comet]

Id maximize memory too.,

I save up for builds, never build them on a whim

[molten bramble]

Same

Love the pfp @latent light thought about getting one of those

I need a doggy 😔

[half comet]

You want shit everywhere lol

[latent light]

lol

[molten bramble]

Haha

[storm osprey]

cats>dogs

[latent light]

you guys see that the 9700K beats the 9900K in most games lmao

even though intel said the 9900K is the best gaming cpu in the world

[molten bramble]

Why wouldn’t they though?

Every CPU a manufacturer builds they are gonna hype because they need to move units.

[storm osprey]

logic says that the 9700k would beat the 9900k though

[molten bramble]

What does TH or OC say about it? That’s where I’d go to find out the real story.

[storm osprey]

everywhere says the 9900k just doesnt make sense

[molten bramble]

Doesn’t it run stupid hot?

[latent light]

9900K requires a $400 Z390 board with 12 phases to reach its max potential

[steep gust]

@molten bramble not really

Also no

[latent light]

most Z370 and cheaper Z390 boards limit the power consumption

[steep gust]

Phase count =/= better

[molten bramble]

I was looking at Z370 for my future build

[steep gust]

The 9700k doesn't make sense

[storm osprey]

explain

[molten bramble]

I’m going with the 8700K I think for whatever final build I decide on.

[steep gust]

Its price is shit

[latent light]

all I can say now is wait or you will regret it lol

[storm osprey]

you like the word shit

[steep gust]

The thick die for no reason is stupid

[storm osprey]

... is that really a problem?

[steep gust]

Yes?

It ruins thermals

[storm osprey]

are the thermals for 9700k bad?

[steep gust]

Yes

[storm osprey]

first im hearing of this

[steep gust]

Thermals are bad for the entire 9th gen

[latent light]

Zen 2 comes out Q2 2019 will have 15% IPC increase and much higher clock speeds than Zen+

[steep gust]

@latent light leaks aren't accurate

[storm osprey]

i only heard about the 9900k

[fallow fog]

8700k op

[steep gust]

You also didn't hear the 9900k thermals at stock are fine

But they are

[storm osprey]

link saying 9700k thermals are bad?

[latent light]

next gen Ryzen will have equal/higher IPC than Intel, it's basically a fact at this point

[steep gust]

Source?

From AMD?

[latent light]

7nm and 5 GHz clocks ofc it will be equal or better lmao

plus refinement to the infinity fabric

[storm osprey]

wtf are you talking about @steep gust ?

[latent light]

i mean going from 14nm to 12nm gave Ryzen 8% higher IPC

i don't see why going from 12nm to 7nm won't be atleast a 15% improvement

[steep gust]

Sources that Zen2 will hit 5.0ghz

[latent light]

all I can saw now is, wait a few months before building a pc because it won't be long before we see much better options

[storm osprey]

i asked you for a link saying 9700k has bad thermals

[steep gust]

@storm osprey 9900k and the 9700k share the same die, the 9900k sucks at thermals.

The 9700k also sucks

[languid acorn]

I wish I would have waited until black Friday to buy all of my shit

[steep gust]

Its fun to find since 95% of reviews don't have thermals

[storm osprey]

they have different applications

you dont expect the same cpu cooler to have the same thermals when you OC

at same speeds, ambient, etc

i cant find anything saying 9700k gets hot

9900k, yes

but thats a different cpu

[latent light]

if an engineering sample of an 8-core Zen 2 prototype can hit 4.5 GHz on boost, it should be able to hit atleast 5GHz when the final product comes out

[storm osprey]

slap the 9900k die onto a fucking pentium and youre not gonna say that the pentium has bad thermals

[latent light]

https://www.techradar.com/news/amd-zen-2-leak-points-to-a-cpu-with-8-cores-that-can-run-up-to-45ghz

[steep gust]

https://www.anandtech.com/tag/i7-9700k

It gets toasty

[storm osprey]

toatsy does not equal bad

and that link shows nothing about thermals

[latent light]

disabling hyperthreading on i7 was a mistake tbh

[steep gust]

@latent light Not how engineering samples work

Also Threadripper 2 hit 4.4ghz

@storm osprey yes it does under overclocking

[storm osprey]

under what kind of OC

extreme OC

[latent light]

explain how that's not how engineering samples work lol

[storm osprey]

small OC?

[steep gust]

It's the standard CPU but not perfectly refined

[storm osprey]

i feel bad for anyone who takes your words serious, such extreme blanket terms

[steep gust]

Not bad enough to mount a 500mhz gain

Look at the leaks for 9th gen Intel?

[storm osprey]

why am i looking at leaks? the products are out

[steep gust]

I want my goddamn 5.2ghz on air 8c 16t CPU

[storm osprey]

and when you dont get it, its shit

we know

[steep gust]

Leaks said the 9900k would easily do 5.0ghz+

Without anything extreme

[latent light]

9900K will do 5.0 GHz all cores if you have a 360mm radiator lmao

[storm osprey]

wait, we take leaks seriously here?

[steep gust]

This kid is

About Zen2

[storm osprey]

but, you just used leaks for you case

[steep gust]

To prove that leaks aren't accurate

[latent light]

Threadripper 2 leaks were pinpoint accurate months before it came out

from clock speeds to power consumption

[steep gust]

Threadripper 2 was also easy to guess since it's literally just EYPC cpus for consumers

Not an entirely new architecture

[latent light]

Zen 2 isn't a new architecture, it's a smaller node process and improvement

refinement to the Infinity fabric and shrinking transistor size from 12nm to 7nm

[steep gust]

12nm to 7nm generally means new manufacturing techniques, etc

The infinity fabric is the reason AMD lags behind

It's better to have one die than 2

Zen to Zen+ was a gain, but nothing crazy

Really all the 2700x has over the 1700x is slightly higher clocks and better memory compatibility

And as seen on FX, clock speed is not a marker for performance

[latent light]

yeah lol

4 GHz Fx = 2 GHz Ryzen basically

[steep gust]

I also agree with a lot of hardcore overclockers that the current core count race is worthless to consumers

[latent light]

btw, only bad thing about infinity fabric is that it uses more wattage curve with every increase in clock speed

[storm osprey]

worthless to which consumers?

[latent light]

https://www.anandtech.com/show/13124/the-amd-threadripper-2990wx-and-2950x-review/4

[languid acorn]

@storm osprey I looked in my case and I found out that I can have 1 fan on the top, 2 fans on the right side, and 1 fan on the left side. Currently I only have the 120mm on the left side(which will be the outtake), I plan on having two 140mm on the right side(for intake), so do you think that I should have the top fan as intake or outtake?

[storm osprey]

minimal you need 1 intake 1 exhaust

preff intake front, exhaust back

[red ingot]

or just do both intake no exhaust

[storm osprey]

doing 2 fans in front for intake, and 1 exhaust is "optimal"

every fan after that barely drops temps, but will lower noise

to which degree depends on the fans

and your fan curve

[steep gust]

@storm osprey everyone? Tell me what good is 32 cores to you

Also remember that half of the cores have shit memory bandwidth

[languid acorn]

to which degree depends on the fans-pun intended?

[red ingot]

hah

[storm osprey]

lol no pun intended

[latent light]

no reason to have more than 8 cores for gaming

[storm osprey]

@steep gust not everyone, because servers and work applications that use those cores benefit

[steep gust]

The average consumer games

I said consumer

[storm osprey]

and consumer means a person who purchases goods and services for personal use.

[steep gust]

8c is already excessive for gaming and 8c CPUs aren't super new

[storm osprey]

video editing is personal use

[steep gust]

If its your job then it's not really personal use

[latent light]

10+ cores are for productivity

[storm osprey]

what if its not a job?

[steep gust]

Who needs a hardcore video editing rig that isn't making money from it?

[storm osprey]

someone who makes videos for youtube?

[red ingot]

idk maybe u just want productivity?

[steep gust]

That's a job? @storm osprey

[red ingot]

can be if you're a big youtuber

[storm osprey]

youre trying really hard to not be wrong here

[steep gust]

If you are getting paid you are stepping out of the realm of consumer usage

[storm osprey]

not a lot of youtubers get paid

and if they do, its not job level of income

[red ingot]

hey, i used to get paid from youtube, and it definitely wasnt a job

[steep gust]

Consumers game, browse, and do mild photo editing

Not editing 4k videos

[red ingot]

made a solid $30/month

[languid acorn]

better than me

[red ingot]

definitely not enough to live off of

but hey enough to buy a few games here and there

[storm osprey]

dont try to argue the definition of consumer

its the definition

[steep gust]

If you can afford a video editing rig for YouTube, and you can validate it

[red ingot]

plus lots of consumers like productivity

[steep gust]

Then you are not a general user

[storm osprey]

general user does not equal consumer

[red ingot]

if i had extra $$$ lying around and i was big into editing i'd probably buy a high end cpu

[storm osprey]

that is not the definition of consumer

[latent light]

if you're into video editing, streaming, gaming, 8 cores and 16 threads is perfect

[red ingot]

Consumer: a person or thing that consumes.

[steep gust]

The average consumer of CONSUMER CPUs does not video edit

Most users of a 2700x don't video edit

[red ingot]

Consumer: one that utilizes economic goods

these are the definitions im finding

[storm osprey]

but you didnt say the average consumer

[steep gust]

Threadripper is a HEDT CPU

[storm osprey]

you just said its worthless to consumers

meaning everyone

which its not

[red ingot]

[steep gust]

Your entire argument is a definition

Instead of saying why adding a ton of cores benefits everyone

[storm osprey]

still trying really hard to not be wrong...

[red ingot]

i believe his argument is that you are wrong sir

[storm osprey]

geesh

[steep gust]

And you have no actual argument

[red ingot]

neither do you?

[storm osprey]

you make extreme blanket statements, its easy to call you wrong

[red ingot]

🍿

[latent light]

games in 2013 only utilized 2 cores/threads, games in 2018 can utilize 6 cores/threads
see a pattern?

[storm osprey]

why the sudden use of emojis?

[latent light]

by 2025, i bet 6 cores will stutter heavy in new games like a Celeron does now

[red ingot]

what do u mean sudden use

emojis are life

[steep gust]

Uh yes?

The 2990WX to the average user will perform worse than a 2700x and isn't worth the cost.

Now if the 2990WX falls to $300 tomorrow, should everyone go out and buy it for the 32c?

Hell no, it's not beneficial to the average users

[storm osprey]

dont bring logic into this grim, everything is shit for everyone

[steep gust]

@latent light most games don't use 6 cores in 2018

Most use 4

[latent light]

not saying most games

[steep gust]

From years of Intel making 4c 8t CPUs

[storm osprey]

BUT HE DIDNT SAY MOST GAMES USE 6 CORES

[red ingot]

he said games can use

[steep gust]

There are games that use 8 cores

And 10 cores

And multiple GPUs will proper scaling

[storm osprey]

this guy...

[red ingot]

"games in 2018 can utilize 6 cores/threads"

[latent light]

lmfao

[steep gust]

And DX12 properly

[red ingot]

that's what he said

not most games use, games can use

[steep gust]

And DX12 multiple GPU setups properly

[storm osprey]

i dont think he knows how words work

[red ingot]

no

[latent light]

Battlefield V can fully utilize 6 cores

[red ingot]

we'd make great lawyers

he'd make a poor one

[storm osprey]

for sure

[steep gust]

@storm osprey You have added nothing

[storm osprey]

"your client is SHIT"

[steep gust]

So every 5 years games use 4 more cores

[storm osprey]

ironic he says i have added nothing

[latent light]

you gotta remember, 2 cores/threads was considered enough in 2013

[red ingot]

^

[steep gust]

I'll see you in 7 years for games to support 32c

[storm osprey]

i guess calling everything shit under the sun counts as contributing

[red ingot]

apparently

[storm osprey]

that comment is shit yagman

[red ingot]

😦

💔

[steep gust]

Logically if in 2013 2 core is enough, and 6c in 2018 is enough.

Then 2025 is good for 32 core CPUs following your progression

[storm osprey]

shit emoticon

[red ingot]

[steep gust]

Just remeber that optimization for more and more cores takes more time and is a lot more work

[storm osprey]

sorry, im getting antsy for this 4 day weekend

[red ingot]

me toooooo

[latent light]

Pentium G3258 has 2 cores/2 threads and was released in 2014 and it played games pretty decently at the time, but now it even struggles with new games that aren't even considered demanding on new low/mid-range hardware

[red ingot]

black friday in 2 days woot

[steep gust]

You know what would be better than a 32 core CPU for the average user?

[red ingot]

what

[steep gust]

Proper DX12 support in games

[storm osprey]

consoles are currently using 8 cores, i think thats a good indication of where gaming is going

considering console makes up the bulk of it

[red ingot]

true

[latent light]

lmao console CPUs are trash

[storm osprey]

they are

[red ingot]

next gen console rumored for 2020 afaik

[storm osprey]

but its gonna dictate a lot

[steep gust]

Yeah consoles aren't exactly a fair comparison

[storm osprey]

its not a comparison per se

but a factor

[steep gust]

DX12 support for next gen consoles pls

[storm osprey]

you think devs want to develope games for two drastically different scenarios?

[red ingot]

nooope

[steep gust]

They already have to

[latent light]

xbox one and PS4 is a AMD Jaguar CPU which is basically a Fx-8100 underclocked to 1.8 GHz

[steep gust]

It's also 3 different scenarios

[storm osprey]

its changing

[red ingot]

have to =/= want to

[steep gust]

Xbox, Playstation, and the desktop world

[red ingot]

if they had the choice they would develop for 1 scenario, in a perfect world

[storm osprey]

yep

[steep gust]

In the perfect world only one console would exist

[red ingot]

it would be my setup ofc

[steep gust]

Since graphics are perfect

[storm osprey]

nintendo doesnt exist?

[red ingot]

in a perfect world

[steep gust]

You pay $50 to get a console that does a resolution so high its impossible to tell the difference, does it at 1000fps, and has full on real time ray tracing

[storm osprey]

perfect would be that i dont even have to pay

[latent light]

I'm really interested in seeing future AMD APUs

[steep gust]

But perfect worlds don't exist so now we have Intel and AMD trying to show off high core count CPUs as if it matters to average users

[red ingot]

mebbe by 2050

[latent light]

there is rumors of a Ryzen 7 APU with Vega 20 I think

[storm osprey]

thanks for the wording =]

[unborn epoch]

It doesn't matter now

high core count will matter later

[steep gust]

I hope next gen consoles use dedicated GPUs

[latent light]

Intel grabbed one of AMD's graphics partners which means Intel might be releasing good APUs in the future too

[storm osprey]

intel is making gpus

got a long while till they talk "apu"

[latent light]

they already have APUs in all of their CPUs

well iGPU

[storm osprey]

true

[steep gust]

And you don't see people using the extreme edition 6c CPUs from years ago.

Architecture improvements are going to invalidate the current high core count CPUs before they are really usable to average users

[storm osprey]

thats why i quotated apu

[steep gust]

Intel has tried GPUs before

[latent light]

the competition between Intel and AMD is going to be intense by 2020 lmao

[steep gust]

Just because they are doing it, doesn't mean it will happen

[latent light]

probably more intense than it has ever been

[steep gust]

See Intel 10nm

[latent light]

10nm lmfao

intel been talking about 10nm since 2015

[red ingot]

pls no i want 10nm

[steep gust]

All they have to do is use EUV

[latent light]

why didn't intel go from 14nm to 12nm like AMD did without a sweat

[steep gust]

Different manufacturing processes

Also AMD doesn't make their CPUs

TSMC does for AMD

[latent light]

yes

TSMC has better engineers

[steep gust]

Uh no

Intel uses a different approach to manufacturing CPUs

TSMC had a 12nm manufacturing node

AMD used that, they didn't create it

[latent light]

Intel is nearly worth $200 billion but they are stuck with 14nm

amd is like $6 billion lmao

AMD doesn't have a lot of money to pay TSMC

[steep gust]

Again

AMD pays TSMC most likely a % of each CPU tray sold

Intel has to make the infrastructure for 10nm

[latent light]

do you think AMD would be a lot better off if they didn't buy ATI in 2005 lmao

[steep gust]

Also net worth =/= actually having money

[red ingot]

true

[latent light]

yes i know

but intel has a lot more money than AMD

[steep gust]

Intel also does a lot more than AMD

[latent light]

like 10 times the amount at least

[steep gust]

And has huge amounts of market share in laptops, phones, etc

[red ingot]

i think it'd be fair to assume that intel has more capital available to invest in r&d than amd does

[steep gust]

Ever see an AMD wifi adapter?

[latent light]

Seems like AMD dropped a lot of value whenever they bought ATI and started making GPUs

[red ingot]

less profitable maybe?

or low ROI?

i.e. long time horizon

shareholders never like long term plays cause they all want their $$ now

[latent light]

AMD is fighting on two fronts lol

Intel will be soon too

AMD is having more trouble competing with Nvidia than they are with Intel

[steep gust]

AMD has Intel crushed in CPUs

[latent light]

in price to performance competition, yes

[steep gust]

You can buy a 12c 24t threadripper for less than a 9900k

[latent light]

but for the people that want the best of the best, intel is winning

[steep gust]

Price to performance is the only thing that matters for average users

[latent light]

true

you have people that will spent 100% more for only 10% more performance

[steep gust]

9900k says hi

[latent light]

yep lol

[steep gust]

Intel knows they can charge whatever they want

[latent light]

I always consider Ryzen 5 lineup the best for price-to-performance

Ryzen 5 2600 for example is only $160 and comes with a good stock cooler

[steep gust]

People clearly buy Intel even when AMD performs within margins in most games for average users

[latent light]

6c/12t for only $160

[steep gust]

Or $340 from Intel

[latent light]

lol

https://cpu.userbenchmark.com/Compare/Intel-Core-i7-8700K-vs-AMD-Ryzen-5-2600X/3937vs3956

17% difference for $150 more

[steep gust]

Most users don't enable XMP, so comparing the best performance isn't accurate

Also userbenchmark

[latent light]

lol

[steep gust]

[latent light]

userbenchmark works

[steep gust]

Eh not really

Since Rzyen seees massive gains in just enabling XMP

Yet most people can't even get to their BIOS

[latent light]

yeah lol

[steep gust]

And lots of people leave stuff running in the background

That drag down performance

[latent light]

yeah, you have to have only the benchmark running, like even task manager and HWMonitor will affect scores

[steep gust]

Also set the benchmark to high priority in task manager

[latent light]

anyway, Ryzen benefits more from 3600MHz ram than intel does

[steep gust]

And lots of windows process can be killed for performance

Infinity Fabric runs at half the speed of memory

So it scales greatly with memory

But it can't really run pass 3600mhz on high end motherboards

[latent light]

infinity fabric is a bit of a blessing, but it sets a higher wattage curve with every clock increase

which is why 4GHz Ryzen consumes a lot more wattage than 4GHz intel

but Ryzen is still a new architecture

Intel has had 8 years of improvement

[steep gust]

Infinity fabric always loses to a proper ring bus

[latent light]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XEPmLM6RZMg

this is a simple explanation lol

[steep gust]

Yeah it's not hard to understand why it's better

Although having a separate ratio would be sweet

Like the mesh ratio on X299

[latent light]

DDR5 is already leaking and I'm sure it will be a huge benefit for Ryzen

[red ingot]

isn't DDR5 at least 2-3 years out? (for consumers at least)

[latent light]

DDR4 was released for consumers in 2015 I believe

DDR5 is set for 2020

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=45UUBCWW3ik

Steve from Gamers Nexus talks about DDR5 leak here

5200MHz DDR5 lmao

[red ingot]

2020 for consumer?

[steep gust]

DDR5 wasn't leaked

[red ingot]

and holy shit

5200MHz

[steep gust]

DDR5 standards have been around for a long time

SK Hynix just created the first DIMM that can do it

[dreamy tinsel]

I know G.Skill have some 4600 ones

[red ingot]

greeeat im thinking of doing a CPU upgrade next year (I'm on DDR3), which means I'm gonna be a gen behind right when the next upgrade comes out

rip

[steep gust]

JEDEC has had the standards around for a long time

The best DDR3 is around the speed of the slowest possible DDR4

[dreamy tinsel]

What CPU do you have now?

[red ingot]

don't wanna do a cpu/mobo/ram upgrade twice

[steep gust]

Also DDR5 for consumers is most likely 2022

[red ingot]

4770k

okay

[dreamy tinsel]

ahh

[red ingot]

well 2022 makes me feel better

[steep gust]

And wont be worth jumping ship immediately

[red ingot]

no i know

[dreamy tinsel]

How many GHz is 4770K, I forgetty

[red ingot]

but if its 2020 for consumer

3.5 stock

[latent light]

yeah Steve was talking about SK Hynix DDR5 in that video

[steep gust]

It's like 4.3ghz turbo

[haughty thistle]

how could it possibly still be crashing... crazy

[red ingot]

3.8 turbo

[steep gust]

Oof

[red ingot]

i have it oc'd to 4.2 tho

[dreamy tinsel]

My CPU is 5 GHz Turbo

[haughty thistle]

was running perfectly fine for an hour then suddenly half way through grand ops it just crashed

[red ingot]

what cpu u got nethrex

[steep gust]

Yeah that is how crashes work

[dreamy tinsel]

i7 - 8086K

[steep gust]

My 8600k can do 5.3ghz daily

[red ingot]

damn

i feel slow

[latent light]

DDR5 - 5200MHz - 1.1v

[red ingot]

when your ram clock is higher than ur cpu

[steep gust]

DDR3 -> DDR4 was the same way

[dreamy tinsel]

lol 😄

[latent light]

yeah lol

[steep gust]

Large gains in speed / efficiency

[narrow fable]

Your ram should never clock higher than your cpu

[latent light]

that's the future though

[red ingot]

yeah

[steep gust]

You can buy 5000mhz DDR4 kits

[red ingot]

ddr5 will not be compatible with my cpu

lol

[narrow fable]

^

Better cpus

[red ingot]

just crazy how much tech advances

[narrow fable]

Well

[steep gust]

Getting a motherboard to post that isn't fun, but it exists

[latent light]

DDR5 will be compatible with Zen 3 I'm sure

[steep gust]

Duh

Zen 3 is years away

[narrow fable]

GDDR5 already clocks at 11000mhz

Which is 11ghz

[steep gust]

GDDR5 is old

[narrow fable]

Imagine a cpu running at 11ghz

[latent light]

oh sweet, DDR5 will have 288-pins which makes it backwards compatible with DDR4

[steep gust]

Uh no

[latent light]

uh yes

[narrow fable]

DDR5 will NOT be

[steep gust]

DDR5 is curved differently

[narrow fable]

It has a different socket

[latent light]

it will have the notch in the same spot

[steep gust]

But the socket is different

[narrow fable]

But it has a different socket

[steep gust]

So it might BIG MIGHT work with an adapter

[narrow fable]

Na

[red ingot]

oh awesome

[narrow fable]

I doubt it

[red ingot]

so ddr5 compat with ddr4?

[steep gust]

Most likely no

[narrow fable]

No

[red ingot]

😦

[narrow fable]