I don’t want to have to barely make a 1 minute adjustment when 2 means I look full port or starboard side
#battlefield-legacy-titles
prime pine
You can change the controls
main grove
robust mango
@prime pine let me see let me see!
fair lotus
Wot
sour stratus
Car go fast
prime pine
You should see the car fly as well
I should properly upload that to xbox and send it to the guy
sour stratus
Do it
prime pine
Xbox app no work for me
ancient ocean
Damn I've never seen a death cam follow like that before.
brave coral
i love when you get launched way out of the playable area and it still gives you the option to hold out for a revive
prime pine
YEAH
sour stratus
Ragdolls after bf1 can be stupidly weird
ancient ocean
Most dedicated medic ever
brave coral
i wonder if it’s like “well, you died in the playable area. i don’t care that you’re in the next country over, that’s not my problem anymore”
hmm
i wonder if technically you could still be revived lol
prime pine
Don't worry dr, im in narvik, can you fly down from the fjell mountain and save me?
brave coral
like if a medic jumped out of a plane, popped their parachute and landed on you to get the revive
prime pine
Hehe maybe
sour stratus
Would be pretty funny
prime pine
Hey actually
I have a small theory
Hear me out
Id theyre increasing the playing count, do you guys reckon they might combine maps?
Let's just say they are
Would you guys agree with that move?
brave coral
combine maps? in what sense
sour stratus
It would sound nice
prime pine
You know how narvik and fjell are close together
sour stratus
But the performance
prime pine
I know joined up it wouldn't be good for flow
But I mean, both of the those maps for the larger experience. Dice can half maps up for 64 p
brave coral
oh so like assume that 128p 'leak' is true, have one big map for the 128p mode and then divide it into two for conquest
prime pine
Yeah yeah
brave coral
i guess it would make sense in that case
ancient ocean
Narvik and fjell would be really cool as one breakthrough map, like pushing up the mountain
prime pine
Its funny
sour stratus
I don't see why not
prime pine
I had theorising but it makes you think
Yeah, though obviously make fjell and narvik a BIT closer just for the sake of flow but yeah xDD
I thought there was 5 sectors on narvik breakthrough cause of the city area
ancient ocean
Ballroom blitz and argonne Forest as one
brave coral
i will say one of my only real issues with breakthrough is that especially on certain maps, you miss out on getting to play in some cool areas from conquest
prime pine
Amiens and st quentin scar
brave coral
specifically rotterdam, the bombed out block of buildings at the corner of the docks area
prime pine
Actually dr kinda opposite in my experience, in breakthrough you kinda thoroughly learn about the area
But yeah
brave coral
conquest D
brave coral
but thats mostly due to the layout of the objectives and sectors and its a fairly minor complaint lol
prime pine
I was thinking of "A B... C.. D E... WHERES D"
I get you dont worry
Im dming people asolotls
I dont feel guilty
ancient ocean
About battlefield
prime pine
Its midnight : D
ancient ocean
Bro it's 10am
prime pine
To be honest..... I like the fact that the bridge is an objective on breakthrough
prime pine
Have you played breakthrough on rotterdam
ancient ocean
Also what other trench
prime pine
How could you hate rotterdam breakthrough
You can grab a panzer iv and hit an easy 50+kill game on it with the flare load out
But to be honest
The first sector is a load of bs
ancient ocean
Doesn't Rotterdam only have 3 sectors
sour stratus
The first sector is just a big choke point
brave coral
could have been a two-point sector more like one from provence, where its almost two sectors in one
prime pine
Sorta like marita
brave coral
keep the existing one but also have the bombed out area as a second objective
sour stratus
I prefer 2 point sectors
sick hamlet
Two point sectors are less likely to turn into a merry-go-round of captures as well.
brave coral
i think 3-point sectors work well as final sectors
brave coral
yeah both 1 and 3 layouts are cool
queen canopy
Operation underground is the best for that, the push to the HQ is honestly my favorite part of the map
robust mango
what are peoples thoughts on what they want to see for bf6 btw
im kinda hoping its not modern
sour stratus
Modern
queen canopy
It'll probably be modern
sour stratus
People want modern
robust mango
that timing
my only issues with modern are
-weapon diversity
-factions
-Too many urban maps
older time periods we get a lot of cool different weapon designs that aren't overbearing on eachother. modern we get m4 variant 1-10 and Ak variant 1-10. Since its always USA vs RU and China
if bf6 introduces a lot of different countries and original weapons, it will be cool
prime pine
I mean, modern can be fine it just depends how you do it
robust mango
id even rather have 2143
prime pine
I was about to say
I want a 2143 myself cause well
Modern movement with a cold ass setting
robust mango
fantasy modern means they can make up whatever they want
queen canopy
If the rumors I've heard are true, it sounds like its going to be bigger than anything we've seen in the franchise
prime pine
Thing is gecko
queen canopy
I'd almost prefer 2042. Still on earth, but still futuristic and grungy
prime pine
They try to do whatever that can to make it as big as possible and will say that
queen canopy
Fair point
robust mango
at the very least we will see 50v50
queen canopy
We don't know that, though
robust mango
even AA companies can handle 50v50 games now
prime pine
48v48 to me sounds fair but this time it sounds like cause of cod, they'll be pushing their numbers for the sake of pushing
You know?
robust mango
thats fair
prime pine
If they do it well then that's fine!
Its just, we're here right now waiting for the news of the next bf
robust mango
i mean to be honest i think cold war will seriously dampen call of duty hype from now on unless the next game is modern warfare 2
cold war really did not do anything special
prime pine
Cold war was rushed as hell
Cause sledgehammer was out fof
And treyarch kinda had to do what they could with the months they had
robust mango
after putting not even 2 hours into it, im already halfway through the campaign on realism. I usually beat cod campaigns in 1 sitting but i spent so little time on it im waiting until tomorrow
queen canopy
Is CW out?
robust mango
nah i just change time to NZD
ancient ocean
Is cold war already out?
robust mango
cold war is out in NZD
sour stratus
Wait it's already out?
robust mango
no
sour stratus
What the
prime pine
LOL thats the easy way to get the games
robust mango
only NZD and whatever the 13th is
robust mango
ive played a great deal of the game already
ancient ocean
They only announced it like 5 minutes ago
queen canopy
Had a feeling it would
robust mango
and the campaign has voice line options but theres no voice actor for the protagonist
queen canopy
Like I said, MW but worse.
prime pine
Whats your main gripes with cold war?
sour stratus
Silent protagonist
robust mango
Alright let me go over it quick
gunplay feels very light for some reason, half the guns are like pea shooters
XM4 and MP5 meta same as Mw2019 with no variety
game takes place in the 80's with guns not even designed and thought of until 1990's
campaign is unreal short
dialogue options are interesting but no real voice actor for your character so the convo feels weird
hit reg is still as bad as beta
tactical slot is just stim pack every time so no real cool use of other grenades
mp5 still shooting across maps
only a few maps are good most are poor
zombies is the best part about the entire game at this point as its very fleshed out, has interesting features to keep people playing
game is 190 gigs for some reason
sour stratus
190?!
robust mango
its roughly 160 starting on console
with a 10 gig day one patch
and then if you had 4k tv
its like 15 gigs for hd textures
and 11 gigs for ray tracing
its about 80 gigs if you take out some things on pc
queen canopy
Holy fuck so many gigs
prime pine
Hey sorry I should of mentioned this earlier, if we want to talk about cold war maybe gen chat would be a better chat?
But yeah there's a lot of weird things
queen canopy
Yeah this is probably general content
indigo spruce
people Russia
sour stratus
Hm?
versed rose
have you guys enjoyed thirsting xbox gamepass noobs recently?
quick temple
i`m russian
solid hinge
Inglese? Che? Sono italiano, io non capisco
wild kayak
So I tested out the different AT grenades in BFV and it turns out
Demoltion Grenade, Type 99 Mine and Sticky Grenade do the same damage to vehicles
quick temple
Привет
@solid hinge привет
solid hinge
:)
sour stratus
English only
wild kayak
Except Type 99 Mine has a shorter throwing range, but you can carry two
English only, I said
quick temple
yep
solid hinge
Yep
quick temple
i don`t like bf V)
wild kayak
I don't like people who type in ruski even though rules state only English is allowed
sour stratus
I like 5
quick temple
its not realy battlefield
sour stratus
It is
gilded zenith
I don't like people who type in ruski even though rules state only English is allowed
@wild kayak thats how russians are
They just go randomly and say
Pycckn?
Whatever they say
They assume everyone is russian
wild kayak
Or they just don't care. It's why they should suffer consequences and learn.
brave coral
bruh its not a big deal
you just go 'english only thanks' and 90% of the time they'll switch or just leave chat
strong niche
brave coral
suomi is more busted than the 2a lmao
prime pine
In terms of medic weapons I like the grease gun!
solid carbon
Damn i have 999 kills with the lewis gun, i have to launch the game
prime pine
LOL imperial
wild kayak
Suomi? Don't need accuracy with Type 2A
brave coral
2a is basically just effective up to like 15m
wild kayak
With how most maps are designed in BFV, higher RoF is always good
brave coral
anything past that it will be outclassed by a large amount of guns
sour stratus
Half the maps are open enough to make the type 2a outclassed
prime pine
Uhhh i think it has the same
I guess its subject to a tiny bit more harsh of penaltys
brave coral
suomi is just 95% of the power of the 2a but with a much longer firing time, better damage per shot and better range
wild kayak
Type 2A is very different from Suomi
brave coral
yeah thompson feels like the better hipfire gun out of the thompson and suomi
prime pine
Basically type 2 a has lots of bullets and slightly outdoes the suomi, but the suomi has more damage and better mag retention.
Its ultimately personal preferance
sour stratus
Mp40>
prime pine
How is sten better
wild kayak
I can go full auto on people 50 meters away with Sten
brave coral
sten is reliable but its not exactly super-powered
prime pine
Because you can control it
brave coral
i mean you can do that, its not going to be the most effective weapon for the job by a long way
prime pine
Its not even that good at a range
wild kayak
It's really good
brave coral
i mean that's just objectively not true
prime pine
Yes because you got the jump on some one
wild kayak
Not really no
prime pine
An assault rifle or lmg can easily outrun the sten
wild kayak
I've used it for a bit
brave coral
im getting the general vibe that you just can't use support well and blame the game rather than trying to improve
wild kayak
I like reviving/healing as medic
Not really shooting
because weapons are incredibly boring
but sometimes I have to shoot
prime pine
The weapons are incredible fun in this game
dry geyser
Is hardcore in bf5
wild kayak
Well, yeah
sour stratus
Not yet
solid carbon
smgs in bfv are really boring
prime pine
Jesus christ imperial I thought you were heaven
wild kayak
they are fun
dry geyser
Wha?
sour stratus
How
solid carbon
prime pine
Heafens previous name was imperial guard
wild kayak
@solid carbon I agree
sour stratus
Lmao
wild kayak
SMGs/ARs are boring as heck in BFV
dry geyser
Yea
brave coral
what makes a gun boring exactly?
solid carbon
ARs are fine but i prefer the semi auto
dry geyser
I prefer battle rifles
wild kayak
it's odd that Assault got semis tho
imo longest range assault should have should be STG44
which is already not-so-short-range
true niche
m1 garand is my babygirl
brave coral
not really, assault is supposed to be the standard infantry kinda and semi autos were being phased in s standard issue for a lot of ww2
true niche
such a godtier rifle
wild kayak
lol and Assault semis can have 3x scope
brave coral
garand is very nice i agree
wild kayak
but for some reason MMGs can't
prime pine
I wonder why genius
wild kayak
M1919A6 with 3X scope pls
solid carbon
What would he hilarious
wild kayak
BF4 and BF1 had scoped MGs and it worked REALLY well
dry geyser
Yes
sour stratus
Why don't you just put a 40x scope to a tank gun at this point
wild kayak
@solid carbon my fav
dry geyser
Why can't a mg42 have a 6x scope
wild kayak
Would be a bit impractical
dry geyser
Its battlefield
wild kayak
But M1919A6 with 3x/6x would be perfect
yeah
You're right
it should be allowed imo
dry geyser
It's meant to be sandbox
brave coral
it does fine with iron sights tbh
dry geyser
Yea but memes
solid carbon
Give 40x scope for MG4 please
sour stratus
How "it's battlefield" an argument
wild kayak
M1919A6 would be actually very decent with a scope
brave coral
the sten would probably be pretty decent with a 3x scope
wild kayak
MG4 is an actual modern gun
sour stratus
No shit Sherlock
dry geyser
Last time I played it I had a AMD rx560
solid carbon
I know lol
wild kayak
iirc Bundeswehr uses MG4 (mebbe MG3?) with a special tripod
and it's computer-controlled
solid carbon
what
brave coral
...ok?
wild kayak
Imagine BF6 had a deployable computer-controlled machine gun
dry geyser
What
brave coral
hmm that sounds like one of the worst ideas ive heard for a good long time
complains bfv is boring
'bf6 should just have remote control gun turrets'
solid carbon
hmm that sounds like one of the worst ideas ive heard for a good long time
are you sure?
brave coral
one of
solid carbon
I am still waiting for the next hardcore competitive player who will make this chat entertaining
sour stratus
A sentry gun in a battlefield game sounds the worst idea imaginable
brave coral
at most a deployable manned HMG turret could work
basically like the buildable stationary guns in bfv
wild kayak
Sorry, I was wrong
it wasn't computer controlled
it's MG5 and has some cool apparatus for controlling though
sour stratus
Still
brave coral
but as a pickup or something, you find it at a station on the map, carry it round and place it somewhere so you can use it
sour stratus
Dumb idea for a game
brave coral
ok so what would it bring to the game?
sour stratus
It's basically free kills in exchange to no effort
wild kayak
It is basically the same as mortar, drones or RAWR
brave coral
its literally not
dense bone
@wild kayak you can share at a specific time
wild kayak
Aka you have a remotely-controlled gadget that leaves the user blind and immobile
brave coral
i mean people disliked the remote control mortar in bf4 anyway, for good reason, because it sucked as a concept
wild kayak
soldier-wise
sour stratus
One thing is remotely controling a gun
wild kayak
@dense bone Oh? It works with Discord now? Last time I checked Discord made it broken
sour stratus
The other thing is an ai having free aimbot machine
wild kayak
I never mentioned AI
By computer-controlled I meant remotely controlled
I think the video I sent is a better idea tho
dense bone
brave coral
drone-type things make a bit more sense, but a RC or autonomous gun turret basically just means you can place it down, go into a building or back to spawn or something and get some free kills at no risk to yourself
dense bone
worked for me
sour stratus
Still
brave coral
and just generally doesnt fit the flow or style of the game
wild kayak
Allow Support to deploy his MG on an EXTREMELY stable firing platform/tripod
wild kayak
The drawback would be: almost no mobility - you'd have to disassemble the platform to move it or even use the MG while standing
brave coral
just have stationary mg turrets that can be built in the map
wild kayak
You'd need to be right by the gun if you wanted to use it
brave coral
makes a lot more sense considering the game
wild kayak
Though judging by how sniping is becoming more and more casual by every Battlefield, it'd be easily countered
brave coral
they made sniping easy mode in bf1, it's significantly harder in bfv though
prime pine
Whew
Im surprised I can play the way I am now
So pillow. If you see the message, what makes the 44 dumb?
Im curious
Cause it doesn't do anything special
Angra stahp lurking
uneven hollow
brave coral
if a stray 
appears as a reaction it's angra 99% of the time lol
sour stratus
Yup
uneven hollow
Basically I can confirm this is be but true
wild kayak
It's really good for what Assault is
One Assault gun that doesn't seem too overpowered
sour stratus
Sure its outclassed close range but medium it's good
brave coral
shot-for-shot, it can't but the 1907, 1-5 and m2 are all more designed for closer ranges
brave coral
it's still very much competitive up close on account of being a 670rpm assault rifle
wild kayak
It's odd that Assault doesn't have shotguns
dense bone
assault probably has the best array of weapons for filling out roles though
brave coral
i mean the assault rifles can all do close and medium range, just the 44 leans more to the medium end of the spectrum
not as much as the ribey though
dense bone
they really only lack extreme close and extreme range
dense bone
i mean m2 is gonna be beat by a lot of other better close range weapons...
brave coral
1907 is better up close than the m2 lol
wild kayak
idk
dense bone
all the shotgun class, 2a, suomi
wild kayak
I ran around like a normie tard with M2 on Fjell - mostly because I was using Luftfaust and enemy infantry was annoying me
brave coral
1907 is one of the most fun weapons in the game honestly, fairly challenging to use but very rewarding
wild kayak
M2 shreds at CQC
dense bone
yea it does good cqc
brave coral
m1907 kills faster at any range in theory
especially in CQC where you're able to hit all your shots reasonably easily
plus it comes with a bayonet
dense bone
ehh, imo only 3 weapons are really op: g1-5, zh/1906
idle breach
nyphon and me both agreed on G1-5 is the most op gun
wild kayak
gee what could go wrong
idle breach
yes
idle breach
comes with 30+1 stock
dense bone
360 RPM, 20 rounds semiauto that takes 3-4 bullets to kill?
@wild kayak if those are the stats the g1-5 has the same stats, except g1-5 has 30 bullets and a regular reload
wild kayak
that's stupid
wild kayak
that's ridiculously overpowered
idle breach
one is being stupid ugly
dense bone
xD
idle breach
another one is the reload itself is pretty slow compared with other "30 rounds mag" gun like
dense bone
pretty sure turner has a longer range btk though, g1-5 is 30
dense bone
all SARS do
idle breach
i think only reason it doesnt got nerfed seriously was
dense bone
yea turner maintains a longer BTK than g1-5
idle breach
1-tab is probably far harder in console?
wild kayak
Yeah, it is
dense bone
assault isnt op
idle breach
like
dense bone
they are focused on killing
wild kayak
it's why people played more assault and less medic on console
idle breach
i think g1-5 is fucking op and
idle breach
ag m/42 is actually a good gun but i can see why console players consider ag m/42 a sht
shitgun
dense bone
imo medic is easily the best class
idle breach
medic is the best class
dense bone
medic > assault > recon > support
idle breach
you dont even need other class
wild kayak
Just like in BF 1942
idle breach
fuck assault 32 team medic can win everything, just smoke the tank
wild kayak
Medic was best in 1942
along with engineer
bf 1942 was fun
but unbalanced as heck
dense bone
i might put recon above assault if the recon player is good
wild kayak
BFV sniping is better than BF1, but it's still incredibly easy
But it still requires more skill than Assault
dense bone
bf1 had sweet spots though
dense bone
so bf1 sniping should be easier
wild kayak
it was literally the easiest of all Battlefields
most casual
you don't even need to aim for the head to get a 1-shot kill
At least there was suppression in BF1
dense bone
idk what you mean by "bfv sniping is better than bf1"
wild kayak
so MGs weren't insta-rekt by snipers
dense bone
because im thinking better as in terms of effectiveness
dense bone
sorry, that was confusing
wild kayak
very satisfying
BF4 has the best balance of ALL Battlefield games
AND it has classless weapons
Coincidence? I think not.
wild kayak
What if Assault semis didn't have scopes?
prime pine
Wouldn't change anything
dense bone
thatd be frustrating
brave coral
i mean it would make them marginally less used at range
wild kayak
encourage them to get up closer
brave coral
doesnt actually change anything in game though
dense bone
for pc i dont think it will change much
wild kayak
and it would make Assault less frustrating to play against
It would actually change much more for PC
ADSing and 1-tapping is much stronger on PC
brave coral
i rarely use scopes on semi autos and you can still snipe people fairly easily with iron sights or even a 1x sight lol
wild kayak
would give MGs more potential at range too
dense bone
on pc people sit close enough to see far anyway, plus they can change FOV
wild kayak
and discourage camping
prime pine
Mgs do have a use at range, theyre just not as good as semis at a range
dense bone
i strictly use nydar/reflex and im easily landing far shots
wild kayak
just like MGs were as good as DMRs in BF4
prime pine
Then why run a semi when the mg just does better all round
wild kayak
it doesn't
MMGs cannot hipfire
they cannot ADS without bipod
they're more stationary
and don't have scopes
uneven hollow
Bodie lad
prime pine
Yes angra?
uneven hollow
prime pine
Oh god
brave coral
just keep them all as lmgs
or if you do have lmgs and mmgs, keep mostly the same mechanics and just change some things like available attachments or base stats
sick hamlet
Sweetspots were pretty much the best balanced bolt-actions have ever been. And about the only way to balance them and keep any meaningful distinction to boot.
Like, BF4 had the problem of so many bolt-actions just being palette swaps and people just defaulting to whatever had the highest muzzle velocity.
brave coral
i do agree that its a good way of creating a distinction between them
wild kayak
Sweetspots are awful lol
sick hamlet
Not really. Statistically? They finally brought performance of the bolt-actions up to par with the other weapon classes.
brave coral
especially if you've got stuff that is otherwise identical, maybe one has like 7rpm more and one has a marginally better stat but ultimately its just a reskin
wild kayak
BF1 had the problem of so many bolt-actions just being palette and sweetspot swaps
I agree that BF4 snipers were not too different from each other
brave coral
i think the idea is actually quite good, just could be executed better
wild kayak
BUT the sniping itself was balanced and fun
sick hamlet
High-risk/low-reward defines bolt actions in BF4 and BFV.
wild kayak
wrong
dense bone
sweetspots did balance but its a wack mechanic and i dont think every play style has to have the same skill floor/ceiling
wild kayak
BF4 recon has rangefinding, zeroing, 20x scopes
sick hamlet
The ones with the highest muzzle velocity were most often chosen because they had the greatest ease of use in getting that headshot to be remotely competitive.
dense bone
thats the keyword, competitive
bf titles are not competitive so that kind of balance isnt necessary
its a casual sandbox
sick hamlet
You can’t meaningfully balance an entire class of weapons to be competitive against the other weapons in the game around just headshots alone.
wild kayak
and definitely not fun to play against
brave coral
agreed nova
dense bone
again, its not a competitive game
sick hamlet
In BF4 90% defaulted to the M95 or whatever had the highest muzzle velocity because there wasn’t much point in using anything else.
brave coral
its not a competitive game, but that doesnt mean that one class should be severely limited with their weapon mechanics
wild kayak
the only thing BF4 is missing in that regard would be BFV's attrition system
dense bone
i mean its not limiited, its just not beginner friendly
wild kayak
So you can snipe someone and they cannot just hide and regen all their HP
dense bone
the skill ceiling on bolts is really high
brave coral
im not saying necessarily have sweet spot, but for example bfv should have straight pull while ADS at least as an option with scoped rifles
sick hamlet
And that skill ceiling doesn’t have sufficient reward
dense bone
1 shot kills at any range sounds like sufficient reward
sick hamlet
The entire reason the sweetspot was implemented was to lower that while still not breaking them.
How do you meaningfully distinguish 6+ weapons around a binary 1BTK/2BTK model?
brave coral
yeah its high skill req for relatively low reward - almost any good sniper could do much better with basically any other class honestly
dense bone
im not talking about distinguishing weapons at all
sick hamlet
The implementation of the sweetspot, alongside things like the Italian carbine that can’t get a headshot past 100m, added much needed variety.
brave coral
eg people like stodeh - hes a great sniper, sure, and he plays recon because it makes for good content. but put him on a different class and he'll almost certainly do better
sick hamlet
Then why have anything other than one bolt-action?
dense bone
i mean, outside of making snipers good up close they will always be the "less effective" play style
its inherent
wild kayak
imo it should be like in BF4 BUT
with BFV attrition system
'light' sniper rifles which have very high muzzle velocity but cannot kill with headshot AND 'heavy' sniper rifles which have low muzzle velocity but can kill with headshots
or 'light' that have high vel. and can kill with headshots and 'heavy' that have low vel. but can kill within 1 hit up to certain range or use the sweet spot mechanic
brave coral
straight pull bolts would at least make them a little more reasonable both in a gunfight and for longer range sniping
gray glade
He even said that on stream once, i asked "why not use a better weapon" but in a nice way. And he said he thought bolt actions was more fun
sick hamlet
And again, statistically? Bolt-actions were underperforming at all skill levels relative to that players performance with other weapon types. BF1 is the only one where that isn’t the case.
BF1 is the first time in the series where they perform on par
brave coral
yeah i remember him talking about it in a video, basically he finds it a fun challenge to use bolt actions but he could be more effective with almost any given weapon
wild kayak
not really no
dense bone
i agree with dr on straight pulls and making bolts better in other meaningful ways
dense bone
but sweetspots or one shot body shots in general are wack
sick hamlet
How? Rate of fire doesn’t matter, because the necessity to unscope means functionally the rate of fire for bolt-actions is near identical unless it’s a straight pull
dense bone
low velocity doesnt make sense and imo is dumb too
wild kayak
It does make sense
wild kayak
you cannot hit moving targets as well with low velocity
brave coral
possibly have a pseudo sweet spot where the there's a bit of a curve for bodyshots but it doesnt actually reach 100 damage
dense bone
also straight pull doesnt change rof either
wild kayak
sniper RoF is high in BFV
sick hamlet
It’s true, because RoF is capped by the bolt-cycling animation and need to unscope.
wild kayak
I can easily 2-tap people with Krag in BFV
brave coral
especially in combination with attrition where you're not guaranteed to have 100% health
sick hamlet
The Lee-Enfield in BFV falls from around 80 RPM to less than 50 with a scope just from the animation alone.
brave coral
straight pull is more for keeping your aim on target while you ready another shot
sick hamlet
Which, incidentally, is another reason why the Krag and Kar98 are so much more popular. They have the highest muzzle velocity and suffer the least from animations capping RoF
dense bone
and you can more reliably watch your bullet to see where you need to make adjustments
wild kayak
BFV's attrition system rewards hitting players even without killing them
brave coral
since (from a game perspective) it allows you to remain in ADS while you work the bolt, thus increasing your effective RoF and massively improving tracking
dense bone
animation doesnt cap rof
sick hamlet
You will never actually get the Lee-Enfield’s stated RoF if you use a scope.
dense bone
they can easily change the animation to fit whatever rof they want
sick hamlet
Not unless you hipfire
wild kayak
also ADSing down scope is too quick imo
idle breach
just delete it
wild kayak
a wee too quick
brave coral
it does reduce your effective RoF since you have to re-acquire your target between shots though
dense bone
also ADSing down scope is too quick imo
@wild kayak nah its fine, they cant one shot body shot so i like it
it does reduce your effective RoF since you have to re-acquire your target between shots though
@brave coral yea but that doesnt have to do with animation like other dude is saying
wild kayak
also I encountered someone who could 1-shot me at full health with Arisaka
which was odd
I don't think Arisaka can do that
dense bone
had to be headshots, you cant 1 shot body shot with arisaka at all
dense bone
were you full health?
wild kayak
yep
idle breach
or mistaken
dense bone
idk of hacks that increase bullet dmg?
wild kayak
Full health, not headshot
sick hamlet
Animations absolutely impact bolt action rate of fire.
wild kayak
@dense bone these exist
sick hamlet
brave coral
if it was just once or twice probably just coincidental simultaneous hits
you cannot alter weapon damage in bfv
sick hamlet
Documented video proof for you. It’s the mandatory cycling animation and need to leave ADS that causes the reduction
wild kayak
Yeah, I know
dense bone
ugh you dont get it
wild kayak
I use sniper rifles
dense bone
idk how else to explain to you
brave coral
due to how the damage calculations are done
dense bone
they can have a much faster rof weapon if they just increased the animation speed...
its literally a video game where they can do this
animations do not dictate rof
wild kayak
much faster rof if they increased animation speed
animations do not dictate rof
what
sick hamlet
No, I do get it. You just don’t know how it works. The bolt action does not start cycling until you leave ADS, and it starts that cycling animation once you do. You then have to go into ADS again to take another aimed shot.
dense bone
we said to give them straight pull
and they can alsways increase that animation to reduce rof still...
sick hamlet
You will ONLY get the stated RoF worth bolt actions if you either hipfire or use iron sights. That’s it.
dense bone
much faster rof if they increased animation speed
animations do not dictate rof
what
@wild kayak devs pick rof, make animations around that
sick hamlet
Which is why there’s no point to using the Lee-Enfield unless you’re going to use iron sights.
wild kayak
Either way, I think ADS speed with scopes is too fast
brave coral
personally i'd like straight pull as at least some sort of attachment, allowing you to remain in ADS while you work the bolt, and a damage curve for each sniper that doesn't peak at 100 damage but means that at certain ranges a bodyshot has a good chance to kill someone if they're not at 100% health
dense bone
i mean, who is using lee at range? its not built for that...
brave coral
the range at which it peaks being dependent on weapon
sick hamlet
Because the moment you slap on anything other than iron sights, the Lee-Enfield falls to about 53 RPM and you’d be better off using a Kar98.
Likewise with the other faster firing bolt actions
dense bone
this is why we wanted straight pull
sick hamlet
The way the cycling works with scopes means that it inherently favors the Kar98 and Krag. And because they’re tied for highest muzzle velocity, there’s no reason not to pick the Krag with the slightly larger magazine and a reload that isn’t impacted by scopes.
brave coral
@sick hamlet you are aware when we talk about straight pull, we mean allowing you to stay aimed down sights while you bring another round into the chamber?
idle willow
Nashee
sick hamlet
Yes, they could do that like they did for the carbines.
It’d be one way to somewhat diversify them.
brave coral
yeah that's what we were saying the entire time
and the thing about damage curves which kinda retain some of the sweet spot mechanic but without actually doing 100 damage to the body
dense bone
staying in ADS would mean you can hit max ROF..
wild kayak
I just wish the gameplay in BFV was a bit more tactical
brave coral
just improves your chances of getting a one-tap due to attrition meaning you're not guaranteed to be at 100% health
sick hamlet
Damage curve without a sweet-spot wouldn’t fundamentally solve it.
Not a lot of players are going to be running around at 15 health or less.
brave coral
? yeah its going to be effective at people who are on like 80-95 health
sick hamlet
Especially as, with every player having a bandage, there’s greater availability of healing than ever before in a battlefield game.
brave coral
that was the point
dense bone
idc what they do with snipers, as long as they dont get any sort of 1 shot body shots
shits wack
brave coral
i agree about body shots not doing 100 damage
dense bone
skill floor to one shot body shots is probably lower than anything else really
sick hamlet
As low as spray and pray with an SMG or AR?
dense bone
mechanically yes
wild kayak
not as low LOL
sick hamlet
Because that’s the metric you’re comparing it against.
That’s what made them balanced in BF1.
dense bone
at least with spray and pray you are likely moving and have to control recoil
sick hamlet
It’s also more forgiving.
dense bone
is it though?
sick hamlet
Only need to hit a handful of bullets in the spray.
dense bone
idk if being in the middle of a bunch of fights is more forgiving than be able to body shot 50+ m away
wild kayak
SMGs / ARs in last 3 battlefield games have neglible recoil
dense bone
still have recoil
sick hamlet
See the semi-autos outsniping bolt-actions in BFV.
wild kayak
Recoil?
They have recoil which at the ranges they engage at is actually a pro more than a con
The targets are so big it just elevates the aim to head
dense bone
thats kind of a meme response
dense bone
and technically other than bfv that wasnt the case
brave coral
a very basic mock-up of damage graphs, so basically sweetspot but it caps at say, 95 damage
dense bone
previous bf titles had spread
wild kayak
It was the same story with BF1
sick hamlet
Nah, even in BF4 it was. And BFV still has spread.
dense bone
bfv has recoil "patterns"
wild kayak
It was kinda better in BF4, but still not really
brave coral
obviously its a very rough sketch lol, just to give the point that it peaks at different ranges
wild kayak
in BFV SMGs and ARs have pretty much no recoil
dense bone
yes bfv has spread but its not even close to previous bf titles
wild kayak
imo SMGs and ARs should have more horizontal recoil
and more horizontal than vertical
dense bone
even csgo has spread, thats to stop every gun from being a laser and being able to headshot with a pee shooter
sick hamlet
No, BFV has the same amount of spread. It just jumps your sights to where the bullet is going instead of keeping sights stationary.
brave coral
bfv has 'spread' random horizontal recoil, but as nyphon said its less present and also, more importantly, the gun actually moves to show it
dense bone
it doesnt have the same amount of spread though...
sick hamlet
BFV only has the illusion of minimal spread.
brave coral
bf1 spread you didnt get visual feedback on the gun, you just had to watch the tracers to see where the bullet went rather than where the gun bounced to
sick hamlet
BFV converts the spread roll to recoil and moves your sights to that location.
brave coral
because it's a recoil pattern/trend rather than random bullet deviation
dense bone
^
sick hamlet
It looks like there’s minimal spread, but that’s just an illusion.
wild kayak
BFV noobtubes (SMGs/ARs) barely have any recoil
dense bone
barely having recoil IS STILL RECOIL
wild kayak
I'm using Type 100 rn and the amount of kick it has is so gentle I can pinpoint people at 65m
dense bone
#doubt
sick hamlet
...the Sten can laser someone from over 50m away.
wild kayak
I just tried it
dense bone
sten is built to be accurate but weak AF
wild kayak
literally in-game
Sten can laser from 50m+ lol
It's just not too accurate
but you can definitely maintain the stability
brave coral
its an smg
wild kayak
and I'm talking full auto
brave coral
they shoot pistol calibre rounds
sick hamlet
The Sten isn’t noticeably weaker than the other SMGs outside close range, especially given its more likely to get hits than with others.
dense bone
pretty sure sten is in the same category of weapons
brave coral
its a stable gun by nature, it might be able to hit shots at a bit of range but it isnt going to have much kill potential on account of weak bullets
dense bone
tri just said sten is weaker in CQC though...
sick hamlet
Because in CQC RoF typically trumps accuracy
dense bone
right i agree, it seems 17 misunderstood you
unreal jolt
brave coral
it's 'weaker' in that it wont perform as well as say, a thompson which has a significantly higher rate of fire
wild kayak
SMGs just deal too much damage at range
dense bone
no they dont...
wild kayak
12dmg at range
they shoot tiny bullets
for comparision, MGs deal just 3 dmg more at range
3
sick hamlet
But the Sten is going to land a much higher proportion of its shots at range than other SMGs.
wild kayak
they deal 15
dense bone
o god not the real life caliber comparison
dense bone
because bullets have a fixed number of dmg to a standard humans natural 100 hit points...
wild kayak
SMGs should be easy to control
dense bone
why not? ITS A GAME
sick hamlet
There is some value in the low-damage laser pointer weapon niche as a long ranged weapon.
wild kayak
Hmmm
Maybe Assault semiautos should have their range damage nerfed too
It would be still a ranged option for Assault (which is incredibly weird) BUT you'd actually have to try to kill someone at 100m
sick hamlet
I’ve been in favor of the M1 Garand being a 2-3BTK sitting as in-between of semi-autos and recon SLRs, assuming a reduced rate of fire.
wild kayak
lol Assault semiautos deal 23-28 DMG at range
lol
IMO MGs' min damage (aka at range) should be buffed from 15 to 18
sick hamlet
The assault semi-autos as a whole could benefit from having damage values reworked and RoF brought a step down to make them less of a spam cannon.
sick hamlet
Remember 257 RPM G43 in Beta?
wild kayak
One thing which I think would definitely fix the semiautos is proper recoil
and maybe actually giving them horizontal recoil
rn with semiautos you don't even have to re-aim
sick hamlet
360 RPM for the M1 Carbine, horizontal recoil for all of them, rebalance damage drop offs for longer range with slower rate of fire.
wild kayak
you just point at the enemy, press LMB, wait for the recoil to go away without actually moving the mouse, press LMB again, repeat
sick hamlet
And get carpal tunnel from using the 450 RPM spam cannons
wild kayak
or just leave the RPM be and give semiautos actual recoil
maiden glade
dense bone
you just point at the enemy, press LMB, wait for the recoil to go away without actually moving the mouse, press LMB again, repeat
@wild kayak thats a good way to kill someone in 3 seconds....
wild kayak
Sniper rifles literally have more horizontal recoil than semiautos
sniper rifle vertical recoil is 2°-4°
sick hamlet
Eh, 360 I feel should be the upper limit for semi-auto RPM, not least because 450 RPM starts to get into the territory of scripts to achieve that because it’s basically low-end automatic fire.
dense bone
its only 1...
wild kayak
meanwhile semiautos are 1°-1.5°
dense bone
so they are the same
next herald
BF6 isn’t coming once again
dense bone
even though snipers have long enough time between shots it doesnt matter
wild kayak
Just give semiautos horizontal recoil
dense bone
sure thats fine, but dont make up reasons/stats
sick hamlet
Some left and right bouncing would go a long way to not making them broken
It’d also give a purpose to the barrel bedding spec
As far as I can tell, the only thing the barrel bedding spec does is tighten the range of values the roll on vertical recoil can be on semis
But you still wind up better off with VRec reduction.
wild kayak
lol I'd love to see my death-by-weapon stats
it'd be probably something like
50% died to assault, 35% died to medic, 10% died to sniper, 5% died to support
dense bone
congrats, you died in order to whats popular
and dont try to correlate popularity to how good said class is
sick hamlet
Speaking of: S2-200 with flat 5BTK. Give it SOMETHING devs.
dense bone
type 2a has and is popular despite being a fairly mediocre weapon
wild kayak
🤔 I wonder why Support weapons aren't as popular..
dense bone
well in general the support class is useless
wild kayak
gotta buff Support
dense bone
no one needs ammo, hardly anyone builds, let alone needs to build faster
wild kayak
But yeah, BFV support IS underpowered
sick hamlet
Support class, like so many others, had a great deal of unexplored potential with weapons.
dense bone
the weapons are fine really
wild kayak
@sick hamlet no it does not
dense bone
its just everything else about the class that lacks
dense bone
so why pick ok weapons in a class that offers nothing else
sick hamlet
The choice of gadgets for support is...odd
dense bone
lewis is one of my better performing weapons too
sick hamlet
Like, it’d make sense for support to be the one with the mines.
Engineers in past BF games got those and Engineer kinda merged into the class at this point.
dense bone
well assaults used to have the med kits so 🤷
sick hamlet
Eh, assault/medic merger was the dumbest idea they ever had.
Yes, let’s give the primary combat class unlimited healing.
big brain time
dense bone
granted, that was the time the most healing came along so that was nice
tough fable
any one tried COD cold war ?
sick hamlet
ptsd from chain rezzing assaults with defibs
sick hamlet
Early Cold War BF would be fun to see at least.
wild kayak
Exactly. Assault should have good primary weapons (and they do, in all last 3 Battlefields) and mediocre gadgets - but in BF4 they have infinite healing and reviving, in BF1 they have best AT gadgets which can be easily abused against infantry and in in BFV they have best AT and AP gadgets
Meanwhile in BF1 and BFV (where Support weapons are underpowered) Support gadgets are literally weaker versions of Assault gadgets
in BF1 the crossbow is weaker AT gun, limpet charge is weaker dynamite
and Assault has AT mines but support doesn't
in BFV at nade pistol is weaker panzerfaust
shaped charge is weaker dynamite
Assault has mortar instead of Support
sick hamlet
If we get another modernish BF, I think it will be Assault with assault rifles and battle rifles, Support with LMGs/Shotguns, Medics with SMGs/Carbines, Recon with DMRs/Snipers.
wild kayak
I disagree, Support should get battle rifles and assault should get shotguns
sick hamlet
That could work as well.
wild kayak
Better yet - snipers for recon, SMGs for medics, ARs for assault, MGs for support and have other weapon types (carbines, shotguns, DMRs etc.) available for every class
Best balance
And hey, one Battlefield tried it and it turned out excellent
sick hamlet
All class weapons fuck interclass and intraclass balance hard.
wild kayak
no they don't
They balance it
You want to play medium-long range medic, you can
enemy can too
Close range recon? No problem
dense bone
youre only looking at weapons and classes kill potential, not what the classes bring as a whole
sick hamlet
Not really. Why use any of the SMGs/PDWs as support when I can take a carbine in BF4?
wild kayak
Because SMGs/PDWs are better at CQC than carbines
sick hamlet
Suddenly, you have to balance cross-class weapons against the class-specific weapons of all classes.
But that’s only one usage scenario and carbines aren’t that far behind.
wild kayak
Yeah. But people take PDWs anyway
sick hamlet
While carbines remain much more effective at all other combat ranges
wild kayak
because PDWs win with carbines
also PDWs are perfect for vehicle users
they sometimes have to get out and fight the enemy next to their vic
sick hamlet
Don’t forget the DMRs in BF4 for Support and Assault
It’s rather telling that in the three titles since BF4, none have revisited all-class primary weapons.
wild kayak
@sick hamlet what about them?
solid carbon
Because SMGs/PDWs are better at CQC than carbines
Laughs in MTAR-21
amber drift
Heya can someone help me with the game crashing? EA Help isn't much help.. they've suggested reinstalling the game (which I installed it less than a week ago) that its my mouse drivers (I cant see at any point where this would cause a game crash, but they were updated anyways) or to update my bios (unnecessary and won't fix anything, its a pretty new mobo)
sick hamlet
Infinite healing snipers and infinite ammo snipers.
dense bone
@amber drift whats the problem?
wild kayak
Uhhh.. DMRs aren't that good tho
sick hamlet
Or Engineers in BF4 having carbines almost as capable as assault rifles while also having the best anti-vehicle loadout
amber drift
The game crashes within 2 hours of gameplay. @dense bone
wild kayak
Yeah but engineers can't super-heal
dense bone
ONLY bfv does this?
wild kayak
though ye BF4 needs attrition system
dense bone
no other titles?
amber drift
Yes, only bfv
solid carbon
MGs are better than DMRs
FLIR + DMR = eZ mode
amber drift
My specs are more than enough to run the game, I can run 144 fps on ultra with dx12 enabled
sick hamlet
Why superheal with health regen?
wild kayak
ezier mode
solid carbon
Sad to see how some weapons from bf3 became worse, sometimes better
sick hamlet
Cross-class weapons completely fucks the intended balance of classes, and this is something DICE seems to have recognized.
random citrus
That is pain right there
wild kayak
Cross-class weapons actually are an excellent idea
sour stratus
I had 3 planes on my tail once and none of them took me down
wild kayak
and balance out the game
look at BF4
it had cross-class weapons and best balance of all BF games
prime pine
I was in the party with the guys in the corsair and we sorta wanted some pics
queen canopy
SMGs for recon would be cool
random citrus
I'm saying something though
queen canopy
They almost did that for BFV, didn't they?
random citrus
Carbines on recon don't belong imo
prime pine
Its good because of no suppression =/= spread
solid hinge
yep
sick hamlet
BF4 best balance? Lol no.
prime pine
Personally I can't argue on balance as much as the gunplay, with how quickly the spread increase was present
sick hamlet
See the tapfire AR meta and medic assaults in BF4.
Closely followed by do-everything engineers
wild kayak
That meta is easily countered
BF4 has the best class balance
BF1 has well-done tanks
BFV has well-done planes
sick hamlet
The engineers in BF4 have the same problem assault does in BFV
wild kayak
PDWs aren't that good at range
sick hamlet
Carbines
sick hamlet
The overwhelming bulk of LMGs in BF4 are just worse bigmag ARs
wild kayak
@sick hamlet literally no
sick hamlet
Assaults are the do everything class in BFV
sick hamlet
Could also use an AR with a bipod and maintain effectiveness on the move and not have an ADS penalty
prime pine
Ahhhh
sick hamlet
LMGs pay for that larger magazine in BF4 hard
prime pine
Yeah they really do
wild kayak
LMGs are literally most powerful in BF4
ARs with bipod can't do what LMGs with bipod can
prime pine
Bf4 support i dislike straight up due to the lmgs, which yay big belt but shit all accuracy and require you to play passively to take advantage of.
wild kayak
BF1 MGs are much more situational and require or rather allow less skill
'passively'
You mean defensively
sick hamlet
True. But also pretty much irrelevant as outside that tiny niche AR is better and can still perform with bipod quite adequately.
prime pine
Bfh battle rifles in my opinion was the best support during that era
scenic beacon
Battle rifles were fun as hell
wild kayak
MGameplay: carries super high risk, requires spatial awareness, timing, planning, and reading the battlefield to understand when its safe to redeploy, and is more team orientated with surpressing, overall requires more thinking and planning than diving into a flank with an AEK
Most players: yeah that's not for me
prime pine
Though im not sure what you think of bfh, tri.
Battle rifles were basically more snipey AR's
sick hamlet
Also, BF4 had a shit bipod system that hampers LMGs even more
prime pine
Is it the whole deploy mechanic associated?
wild kayak
Yes. But LMGs were still powerful in BF4
Very powerful
and had MUCH higher skill ceiling
sick hamlet
LMGs are severely gimped by their own mechanics because of the shoddy bipod system though.
Like, I might agree if it had the bipod system of BF1 or BFV. But BF4’s was TERRIBLE.
wild kayak
Agreed
prime pine
You mean the system whereas it was really locky tri
wild kayak
but BF4 LMGs are best
and most powerful of the trio
also well-balanced
with high skill ceiling
sick hamlet
Really locky, fixed in position, often gave you really awkward firing angles
prime pine
They really were weird
sick hamlet
And inconsistent.
prime pine
Im sorta glad for bf5's lmgs in a way, as they aren't glorified ammo dumpers
prime pine
They have slower handling but they generally have lower recoil than ar's
formal solar
Not so much
prime pine
Mmgs are just needlessly annoying
sick hamlet
Eh, MMGs it depends.
sick hamlet
The recoil multiplier on their first shot really gimped them hard.
formal solar
Hmm
sick hamlet
Especially the S2-200
formal solar
They’re still lasers
prime pine
The fg42, bar, bren, lewis, type 11 and madsen are the best support weapons
scenic beacon
and mg42!