#battlefield-legacy-titles

1 messages · Page 2262 of 1

bronze rose
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I haven't added anything to today's discussions

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FUCK the new ttk

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And presto

sturdy osprey
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That'll do Mr

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Lol

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Rides horse off into the sunset to general

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Lol

bronze rose
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Fr though

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I hate it

sturdy osprey
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Same

bronze rose
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It's fucken annoying

sturdy osprey
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Plays a new game

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Yea trust me don't play it everyday play other stuff you just need a break

bronze rose
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Dude, fuck this bullshit man

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I can't play domination anymore because of this bullshit

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Like WHY THE FUCK

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SERIOUSLY, like WHY

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I want the developers or the community Managers to tell us now if the ttk change was good

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Nobody asked for it except the babies who complained about dying alot. And that's a MICRO minority of players

sturdy osprey
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I understand

solid hinge
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what

bronze rose
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Wdym WHAT

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now I'm using the FUCKEN carbines because they're the only good guns now

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FUCUUK

hot drum
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This update aint that bad tbh

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Sure this week tide of war sucks

bronze rose
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HOW THE FUCK do you like this update

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Literally all the guns are shit now

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Except the 100 I guess

hoary condor
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stg44 is ok

hot drum
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It feels like there is more team play mire revivevin going on

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Boys at rifle got a buff?

stoic breach
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More reviving because more people are dying cause their guns suck

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Boys AT got buffed ages ago

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With an extra round in its magazine

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@hot drum

bronze rose
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Fuck this bitch fucken shit

hot drum
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Its not that vad honestly

bronze rose
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Abgwuwuwvskd

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It's ok to be wrong @hot drum

hot drum
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I see more ppl bein aggresive

stoic breach
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Nah it is actually a terrible update, the gunplay is closer to CoD now, except its still good in CoD

solid hinge
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unpopular opinion, i dont think new ttk is that bad

orchid shore
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all hope is lost now

stoic breach
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Everything is a laser in CoD balanced on damage dropoff and rate of fire, everything in BFV is a laser but it does no damage

orchid shore
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5.2 TTK isn't going to get reverted at all

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was fun until it lasted

stoic breach
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It wouldnt be as bad if the damage dropoff ranges werent scuffed

solid hinge
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i like how pistols feel now at close range, ar's arent ridiculously OP and the game feels much smoother and tactical

stoic breach
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ARs were never OP

solid hinge
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i mean

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kinda are

stoic breach
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And some pistols have better ranged damage than some automatics

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M1912 pistol is a 450rpm 4BTK to 22m

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Thats more lethal than some primaries

bronze rose
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This update is a fucken handicap for trash tier players man

stoic breach
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Its not even a handicap for trash players

orchid shore
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it for the people who mastered the gunplay in the past year

stoic breach
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Better players can adjust and hold down M1 and keep aiming, but its always going to be the same weapons that shine through

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The older gunplay system helped worse players alot more

solid hinge
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aye

bronze rose
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Dude I play medic

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Wtf does mean for me?

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Fuck lmgs though right?

solid hinge
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i think the whole strike is a bit overdramatic and babyish

stoic breach
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Plus the older system actually had recoil that you could control if you wanted to squeeze the range a little further out

orchid shore
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honestly want my money back right now

solid hinge
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boohoo

stoic breach
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I dont think its that babyish, its a case of "if it aint broke, dont fix it"

orchid shore
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but i can't yikes

bronze rose
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@stoic breach he's right

hot drum
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Recoil is still there @stoic breach

bronze rose
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Dude has no one seen westie's videos on it

orchid shore
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BFV is in a doomed state if they plan to fuck up TTK even more

bronze rose
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Christ mate, it's hilarious how a handicap is the only thing that helps the go positive

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The trash players* go

orchid shore
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i can't imagine BFV in the next years

stoic breach
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Recoil has been mostly reduced so that landing shots has become easier

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Except for like M1907 which still has its old recoil

hot drum
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@stoic breach try ke7

hoary condor
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Not having fun? Don't play it aWeSmarter

stoic breach
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KE7 thatwhich was the worst LMG in the game

bronze rose
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Dude I've spent so many hours

stoic breach
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Is now extremely good

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Sad

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Also yeah I dont play it

hoary condor
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302 hours for me

stoic breach
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I uninstalled the game before 5.2

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I have 580 hours

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For some reason

brisk thistle
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yep

orchid shore
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same

brisk thistle
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It’s probably broken

stoic breach
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MW is doing me well

brisk thistle
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I’m lvl 82 with 200h

orchid shore
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honestly MW has much more better gunplay and variety at this point

stoic breach
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Well, MW has its own clear-cut meta thats really irritating to deal with

orchid shore
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say what you want but aleast that they have a battle pass that is 5x better than BFV

stoic breach
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M4A1 is still a one-size-fits-all weapon

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725 is still the most popular shotgun, so its just annoying to keep seeing

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BFV's old gunplay system had really good variety for weapons

bronze rose
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Honestly I may just switch to CoD or whatever

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Idk anymore

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I love battlefield v

stoic breach
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I would honestly rather play BF1 again if it was active

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Over MW

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But MW feels really nice and has some really cool mechanics

bronze rose
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It was my favorite in the franchise

orchid shore
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honestly it was a HUGE mistake paying $60 upfront to BFV

bronze rose
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It was my favorite in the franchise

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This was my favorite battlefield

orchid shore
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honestly thought this game would be my favorite battlefield until now

bronze rose
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I defended this game online

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I played this game to destress, I could share countless battlefield moments I've had with full parties where we just went ham

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I just don't get it

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Can someone explain logically the overrall upside to this shit

orchid shore
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it's the end of the road of BFV

hoary condor
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it's slowly losing it's way for me

bronze rose
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I want to get excited for the fucken wake island bullshit but HOW

hoary condor
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hasn't become enjoyable sal

bronze rose
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Let look up the hours I've had on this game

stoic breach
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Well, the upsides to 5.2 would be the spotting changes

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Actually thats the only upside

hoary condor
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Wake Island just look like Mercury but not as many hills/mountains

sonic rampart
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Wake island doenst look like mercury

hoary condor
sonic rampart
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Smh

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🎄GWshinodunHaaha

orchid shore
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5.2 is great without the TTK change and 3d spotting

hoary condor
stoic breach
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The spotting change is great, its clear player communition for the minimap, you can tell when you're spotted

bronze rose
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@orchid shore earned my respect

stoic breach
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Its fantastic

bronze rose
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I think the flares are a bit much though

stoic breach
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Also the spotting change isnt 3D spotting

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Its not a teammate communication tool

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Its only for you

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To cut through visual clutter and information so you can focus on a target under 15m

sonic rampart
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Thats basically 5.2 wouldve been good without ttk and spotting, if it had just some tweaks for the guns instead of this

stoic breach
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The spotting is a good change for alot of reasons

orchid shore
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oh hell

sonic rampart
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Not really

solid hinge
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5.2 brought glitches to the fetching report thing

stoic breach
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Its not a player handicap, the player still has to actually use the information

bronze rose
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No way @sonic rampart as much as I adore you for always being right

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This isn't the way

stoic breach
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Otherwise they still get shot and killed

orchid shore
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DICE didn't even brother to change the MG42 with the high-velocity rounds damage

bronze rose
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They should've just buffed the shit guns

stoic breach
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Yeah, alot of guns could've been buffed

sonic rampart
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^

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Thats what I meant

stoic breach
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Assault rifles, SLRs, bolt actions

solid hinge
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why cant dice just try tweaking the smgs or the mmgs

stoic breach
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Alot of shit

tepid moon
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So when is Battlefield Vietnam 2 coming out?

solid hinge
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like why did they nerf the SARs?

sonic rampart
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Instead they nerfed all guns

orchid shore
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HOW MANY times we going TEACH you, old man?!?!

stoic breach
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Yeah MMGs needed buffing as well

sonic rampart
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Except for snipers

bronze rose
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How do post a picture

sonic rampart
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Send it to me lmao

stoic breach
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The SAR nerf was just unfun

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Thats all it is

solid hinge
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exactly

orchid shore
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MG42 is still fun with high-velocity rounds

sonic rampart
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!!regular

ruby trailBOT
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The Regular role is earned by members who are active, welcoming and resourceful on the server.

hot drum
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@stoic breach no they dont

sonic rampart
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Can post

stoic breach
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What dont

stoic breach
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Actually MMGs didnt need "buffing" they needed "adjusting"

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Thats a better word for it

bronze rose
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That's how much hour's I've had on this game

stoic breach
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Because who actually enjoys having to bipod to use a gun

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Its not tactical, its sluggish

bronze rose
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Look at my win rate, tell how the FUCK is this a good update

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I've never complained about something so much in my life, I hate it.

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But I do it because I WANT THIS GAME TO THRIVE!!!

sonic rampart
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My win rate is low GWshinodunHaaha

ornate cliff
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😄

bronze rose
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Gahhhhhh!!!!

sonic rampart
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Because I always Join games on the losing team OkayChamp

hot drum
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Mm

stoic breach
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Yeah complaints are always valid

hot drum
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Mmg

orchid shore
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Battlefield Virgin

stoic breach
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Because DICE cant work off of a positivity echo-chamber

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Constructive criticism is probably better than complaining though

orchid shore
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Battlefield Virgin vs Halo Master Chad

stoic breach
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Master Chad Collection

orchid shore
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maybe that what V means for

sonic rampart
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Stands for*

bronze rose
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Like this is my criticism about the whole CM --> Developers thing

orchid shore
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😂

bronze rose
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There isn't COMMUNICATION

idle breach
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Wazzuo

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P

bronze rose
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You're supposed to represent US, not the other way arround

idle breach
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Huh

bronze rose
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The beta test environment for battlefield one for fucks sake!!

idle breach
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Sounds like dice announced another filthy shit

sonic rampart
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lol

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I think theyll change this

bronze rose
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the APOLOGY for the LAST TTK change

sonic rampart
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Since they dont really have a choice

bronze rose
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Look how they massacred my boy!

sonic rampart
orchid shore
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it either REVERT it or mass strikes will occur within the BFV community

stoic breach
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Well like, the main reason that people who actually like the update give is that weapons are more balanced for their respective ranges

orchid shore
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we done this last year

stoic breach
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The problem is that they already were

bronze rose
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goddamn, people shit on DICE and EA all the time and I get ridiculed for defending them.

idle breach
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Me too

bronze rose
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Goddamn it man...

stoic breach
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But since people were complaining about SMG and AR and SAR sniping

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5.2 is basically like a parent telling their child how to act

idle breach
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Even the usual dice defenders

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And wait-and-see guys

stoic breach
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By scuffing weapon damage ranges and saying "no, you cant use this here at this range"

sonic rampart
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@bronze rose idk if you have seen the Godfather, but the scene where Sonny gets killed is the ttk atm GWcorbinHolyFuck

idle breach
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Are now just

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Lol

bronze rose
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Like HOW tell me HOW they got to this point

stoic breach
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Weapons were already balanced for ranges, but it was based around flexbility vs efficiency, rather than being super restrictive

bronze rose
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Clearly this is on their end

solid hinge
sonic rampart
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What

raw orbit
tribal wraith
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How you send picture tf

solid hinge
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LUL its Greta

sonic rampart
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Hacks

idle breach
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Instead of meaningless strike and internet point

sonic rampart
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Oh she

stoic breach
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Sher

idle breach
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Can bfv community

bronze rose
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@solid hinge you got something to say right? Right?! Clearly we're not just having a circle jerk here

idle breach
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Raise some fund to

orchid shore
solid hinge
stoic breach
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Aight

sonic rampart
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Lets not talk about her in here cause if im honest I dont like her and it would cause a discussion GWshinodunHaaha

idle breach
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Hire the bitcoin assassin and resolve the dice problem

solid hinge
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wait it makes sense now

tribal wraith
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Well I can’t FACKING send bfv funny picture from reddit wtf

idle breach
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Me too i don't like her. Never met her. Don't really know much about.

bronze rose
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I honestly believe that the way to fix this whole mess is simple:

If there is a problem in the game, a VAST SUPER majority of people should say something

And then ONLY if that's the case should there be any changeq

idle breach
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I don't like everyone idont know

sonic rampart
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If I look at the reasons why dice did this, It kind of was a good idea, but the actual update didnt match the reasons Picard

solid hinge
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really?

idle breach
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Thr worst part is

stoic breach
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Idk that just sounds like mob-mentality

solid hinge
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where's team balance then?

idle breach
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Even if this is some

tribal wraith
stoic breach
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Mob mentality is what made planes so strong in BFV

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Because pilots in BF1 apprently werent good enough to just fly away from AA

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And Burton LMRs

bronze rose
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@sonic rampart I agree but you know how to see how to see if something works?

sonic rampart
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Foreign Exchange student GWlulurdMegaLul

idle breach
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Fumdamental good idea went wrong they just dont talk what they are thinking

ornate cliff
tribal wraith
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Guys check out the png

bronze rose
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@sonic rampart
Playable
Test
Environment

sonic rampart
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GWshinodunHaaha its questionable what they are doing tbh

bronze rose
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It's like self sabotage

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And this isn't the FIRST time they did this

solid hinge
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why cant dice create an algorithm that will place the beginners lvl 1 - 10 into servers with the current TTK and then after that, the original TTK with all levels???

bronze rose
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They apologized, the bastards apologized

stoic breach
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Nah that just sucks

solid hinge
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this will solve the issues with the newcomers or whatsoever

tribal wraith
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What is ttk again

stoic breach
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Current TTK is bad for muscle memory

bronze rose
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No FUCKEN WAY

stoic breach
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Just spray and pray and switch off your brain

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Highly skillful

bronze rose
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Revert the ttk, and let the noobs perish

solid hinge
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they need noobs

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for money

stoic breach
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Thats true

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The game should be easy for everyone playing it

solid hinge
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thats the thing

bronze rose
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Let the them climb the hill too

ornate cliff
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Maybe its the noobs whining about the new ttk ? kregmeTilt

bronze rose
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We all did it, clearly

stoic breach
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Good players will ALWAYS be better than bad players, might as well make the game easier for bad players too

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Casuals make money

solid hinge
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but smg dominate from far distances so why not tweak just that and why did the hell did they touched the SARs?

bronze rose
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No way?!!

stoic breach
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SMGs didn't dominate from distance

solid hinge
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Funny thing: friend of mine ( a n00b ) bought this game and said with the new ttk its far from noob friendly its just bad game Ballance

tribal wraith
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There is no good nor bad players. It just a game

idle breach
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Oh shut up about noob friendly 5.2 ttk theory please

bronze rose
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It's the hardcore base that drops the most money

stoic breach
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Unless you couldnt heal, you were getting shot by multple people, or you werent paying attention

solid hinge
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I mean you can spot enemies through fences and smoke

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nope

idle breach
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Nothing in 5.2 is noob friendly

solid hinge
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doesnt work

bronze rose
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Hell no this bitch update is literally just and handicap

solid hinge
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It’s just bad not noob friendly

tribal wraith
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The updates killed off the msg

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Smg

bronze rose
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Actually yeah I take it back

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It's just bad

solid hinge
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Wut

sonic rampart
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5.2 made it even harder for noobs

stoic breach
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Casuals spend money initially

tribal wraith
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I missed the smg overpower weapon last update

hot drum
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@tribal wraith actually no and yes

sonic rampart
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Cause now they cant have Lucky kills

solid hinge
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Type 100 it’s the best rn

stoic breach
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Hardcore players just continue to spend money

sonic rampart
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Because they have to shoot a lot of bullets

solid hinge
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Beside stg 44

bronze rose
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I spent 40$ on skins in this game

tribal wraith
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Stg is literally 3 shits

stoic breach
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Type 100 is better than FG42 at every range peter peter

sonic rampart
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Mg42 high velocity bullets is the best atm

tribal wraith
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@bronze rose why spending 40 bucks on each single set? Why not collection

solid hinge
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Even m1911 is better then fg 42

sonic rampart
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Its the broken gun

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It acts like it was before the change

raw orbit
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The skill in the game went from positioning and recoil control to just knowing what the broken weapons are. And the noobs can't even unlock the broken weapons now lmao

bronze rose
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@tribal wraith no lmao, like the skin sets they have

sonic rampart
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They forgot to change it so its op except for the fact that its a mmg.. and I dont like mmgs

stoic breach
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Tfw an LMG does less damage at range than slow firing 9mm SMGs

solid hinge
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I actually wanted to buy the premium starter pack to kind off thank dice for the pacific but now with 5.2 they can f*ck off

stoic breach
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"CQB LMG"
Worse than SMGs

tribal wraith
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M1911 is good but it doesn’t have advantage nor disadvantages

bronze rose
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@tribal wraith I bought the Halloween pack, the sushi collection and both of the U.S skin packs

tribal wraith
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Ruby is good for fire rates

stoic breach
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Not even broken weapons, just less-shit

tribal wraith
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@bronze rose lmfao you mean senshin collection

raw orbit
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Some of then are broken good though

solid hinge
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Even the unreleased weapons will be shit

tribal wraith
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And burnt collection right

raw orbit
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And the mg42 is actually broken

bronze rose
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@tribal wraith the pistols are now primaries

stoic breach
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They'd probably seem broken

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Yeah MG42 is legit broken lul

tribal wraith
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I see funny about pistol I got free uncommon pistol

bronze rose
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@tribal wraith I'm not taking it back lol

tribal wraith
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I’m curious is melee weapons worth it from skin collection?

bronze rose
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The model 27 RAPES people dide

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Dude*

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Literally the pistols and revolvers melt people

sonic rampart
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The model 27 is better than a primary

raw orbit
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Do you think ifnthey rebalance pistols too would they forget to rebalance the weird skin pistols monkaHmm like the m1911 silver plated

tribal wraith
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Revolver is deadly

bronze rose
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@sonic rampart remember the screenshot I posted a day ago with my pistol only game

sonic rampart
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ye lmao

tribal wraith
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Oh there is pistol only?

bronze rose
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Do you have it still @sonic rampart

tribal wraith
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Is it worth it for off hand trophy?

sonic rampart
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No

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Ye

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I only need the bomb stationary

bronze rose
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Lemme show you my best game post 5.2 ttk

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@sonic rampart thanks

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This was only using a revolver (model 27)

hot drum
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Well u used the op revolver so that explaind why u got so many kills

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Do the same thing wuth m1911

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And the revovler will be the only pistol that i wont use

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Its just too op

gentle garnet
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any news on weapon changes post meeting?

idle breach
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No news

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They busy doing lines

gentle garnet
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fuck

gray glade
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wiesel tank, when dice?

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it's the cutest tank ever made

shy badger
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Have you not seen the italian L3 tank?

gray glade
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i have now

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they are both very cute

gentle garnet
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i think the ft17 would be the cutest of the bunch

gray glade
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look at that cute little tank 😄

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imagine zooming around in that on panzerstorm

shy badger
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Tonk

gray glade
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vrooooooooom

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like 70-80 km/h top speed if i remember correctly

hot drum
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Wtf i heard british troop scream beyound call of duty

nova cedar
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Baby tiger

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That's a cub

tawny spear
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Next BF should be set in Stone Age

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When people fight with stick and spear

gray glade
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thrown rock OP

hot drum
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I just went 30 to 1

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And with a smg

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But i can see many of the good players are gone

gentle garnet
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honestly

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i think this update is even worse for noobs

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who struggle to hit mooving targets

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its just shit for literally everyone

gray glade
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depends on what the noobs are struggling with

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but yeah I think it might be harder for new players now because they need to aim longer at the target

mellow flint
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Did they make the time to kill faster or slower ?

hot drum
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@mellow flint test it mate

karmic sleet
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@mellow flint depends on the gun

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slower for most

gentle garnet
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i mean, from a noobs perspective

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it is harder for me to trace people for longer

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especially now that they got time to react and start to dodge around

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its frustrating af

solid hinge
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I don't think a single gun kills faster now

autumn bane
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hm?

tall finch
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What about the mg 42 bug

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If you attach a specific specialization DICE forgot to add the new changes, meaning you get the old mg 42

stoic breach
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No weapons kill faster than they used to

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TTK is not the same

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If the TTK was to remain the same, weapons would need to somehow fire faster at range

gray glade
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yeah that bug actually works @tall finch

tall finch
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Yea ik

gray glade
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the gun kicks like a mule that way, but i mean, doing like 23 damage or something instead of 8

tall finch
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I saw it from westie lol

gray glade
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im using it as much as i can tbh lol

tall finch
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But yea the 42 is really good with old ttk

gray glade
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yeah

tall finch
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I havent unlocked it

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I only played assault for the longest time

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Now ttk changes happened I have to use the madsen

gentle garnet
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god, this new ttk is so fucking trash

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its literally ruined the game

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i thought it wasnt so bad when it just came out

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but i just hate it more and fucking more

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with literally every single match

bronze ferry
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Yes TTK and Spoting auto ruin the game. I dont' play it since the patch

autumn bane
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idgaf

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not that i care but my kd actually went up quite alot bcuz i rush like an idiot

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and rushing is easier when ppl kill u slowly

solid hinge
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Lmfao
They wont revert the ttk

gentle garnet
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yup, you dont need to worry about assault rifles and smg's at all at any range thats not shotgun range

solid hinge
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Anyone wanna play bf4?

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Btw in future dlcs with Americans, will we still have access to the corsair and LVT ?

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Prob not

gentle garnet
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and auto rifles are far less effective as well unless youre a crack shoot

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basically, the only good way now to take someone down is to go for the head

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unless you got an automatic gun of any sort, then youre just fucked

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since, apparantly, headshoots dont do shit

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3 bullets to the head? no problem, just brush taht shit off

autumn bane
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4 shot to kill with agm42 isnt bad. if ur at range and in an open area

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chances are ull die

gentle garnet
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idk, i cant kill at range anymore

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unless i got a bolt action

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i even struggle a lot with auto rifles

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like, hitting a dude 4 times in a row is fucking hard at range

solid hinge
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300rpm 4btk is pretty slow

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well.. it used to be

gentle garnet
#

so basically, i only get kills at range with my gewher 43 if i get lucky and get a headshoot

solid hinge
#

ZH is easier to get kills with now

gentle garnet
#

whats that

#

maybe it would be a little better if i could use my fucking stg44

#

but since weapon unlocking isnt a thing anymore in bf5, i guess not

warm crypt
#

I'm gona try bfv (pc) for the first time. What weapons do u recommend for the medic class after the balance? I prefer weapons as all-around as possible

gray saffron
#

Probably type 100 i think

#

Fast and good range

shy badger
#

I personally like the emp

#

Good damage and recoil is easy enough

ebon trench
#

I'm just not subjecting myself to the pure rage I had last night again

#

That was fucked

#

This update needs sorting right quick

shy badger
#

mp34 is my ranged smg choice, if you want to extend your range even further the jungle carbine is my go to rifle

#

Though it's a bit harder

ebon trench
#

Otherwise I'm gonna go commit redeploy

#

I can't use assault upclose anymore

tough lodge
#

Can you imagine a world where Söderlund's daughter didn't ask him why she can't play as a woman in a ww2 game

ebon trench
#

I have to be at least away from someone to be effective otherwise I get slaughtered

tough lodge
shy badger
#

Playing CQB with anything but the medic is impossible for me rn

#

The attrition system was fine before because you could kill people without getting damaged

#

Now it's nearly impossible

#

So you better have that quick heal pouch on you if you're planning on CQB

sleek tartan
#

If it's so hard to kill people with the new ttk why am I doing even better than ever before?

#

And maybe it sounds crazy, but aren't smgs supposed to be at their best on cqb?

shy badger
#

You're doing better because it's harder to aim consistently*****

terse lintel
#

harder to aim ? yikes

shy badger
#

So people whose aim isn't that good are struggling

terse lintel
#

how is it harder to aim

sleek tartan
#

Didn't reddit say this change to ttk helps the new players?

#

I'm so confused 😕

terse lintel
#

nice edit WoahTea

shy badger
#

Well there are different kinds of skills

terse lintel
#

it is supposed to help new players

#

cuz now it doesnt matter if they run out into the open

shy badger
#

Positioning isn't as important

terse lintel
#

cuz ttk is longer

shy badger
#

Yea

terse lintel
#

so its not as punishing

sleek tartan
#

Oh yeah, positioning. So, in a game where you often have no cover, there's people shooting from all angles, there's bombs and tanks around, you should depend heavily on your positioning? It makes a better game?

#

I'm still confused.

shy badger
#

I don't think newer players will have an easier time, it'a just that they won't find it 'unfair'

terse lintel
#

if you didnt use cover or the maps landscape to your advantage you wouldn't be alive for very long. this new ttk will help newer players survive, but they still wont have an easy time killing people as it takes more bullets

#

there's plenty of cover, just gotta use your brain ThinkHmm

sleek tartan
#

I find cover distribution in this game horrible, especially taken into consideration how the player counts are often very big. So it's not about not having something, but how you are shot by too many angles. No matter how much you use "your brain" a bullet blocking won't spawn where you need it.

tall finch
#

I feel it would depend on the map

shy badger
#

It really coes

#

You can also abuse it

gray saffron
#

main reason i don't like aerodrome. not enough cover 😦 however, it's breakthrough version does 🤔

tall finch
#

Iwo jima doesnt have much cover inland, but on the beach it has some nice dunes for hiding behind

gray saffron
#

oh btw blackout

tall finch
#

Is arras, a big open field doesnt have much cover, other than some little ditches along the sides

nova cedar
#

I gave up on trying to play infantry, I now play tanks or planes, The guns feel boring to me

#

What's annoying is the fact that if I have an smg and theres as sniper across from me all I can do is give up or try to rush him without getting bombed/getting killed by a tank/ or being shot

sleek tartan
#

I'm probably biased but I stopped playing this game due to how often I died shot by multiple people with no cover. This new update made me enjoy again. And trust me, I do well. But it s not about results in terms of kd, it's about enjoyment. Before it felt like a chore. Now at least you can soak up damage.

tall finch
#

Devastation theres a lot of cover

sleek tartan
#

I'll enjoy this patch for as long as it lasts

#

Then probably uninstall if we go back to the old ttk

ebon trench
shy badger
#

You just need to learn the maps

ebon trench
#

This update singlehandedly ruined all my goodwill for this game after the pacific update dropped

shy badger
#

And what zones are more dangerous

spare citrus
#

every time i engage i'm shot by somebody else, every time

gray saffron
#

arras is pretty well covered though, lots of bushes, buildings, walls, ditches etc

queen canopy
#

And to utilize cover and not to stay in one spot for too long

shy badger
#

Sometimes will be caught off guard but that's just the nature of battlefield

spare citrus
#

morning folks patch out yet?

ebon trench
#

Everyone's zerging lone wolf again and I hate it

tall finch
#

The fact that a guy with an smg was shooting me from behind at 10m, and I got the chance to turn around and do 90 damage to him with a bren is fucking insane

gray saffron
#

and no worries @sleek tartan it seems they're keeping the current ttk and tweak it instead.

terse lintel
#

think people just need to learn how to traverse the different maps JoyFish

main grove
#

He was just missing then

sleek tartan
#

@shy badger honestly I know the maps perfectly. And that's why I know many areas are totally horrible in terms of cover. And yet you need to go through them. It's not even optional.

#

Don't know the new ones too much but I'm not even talking about them

spare citrus
#

i'm owed alot of cc , when does the bank open?

main grove
#

Pacific storm is great for cover

sleek tartan
#

@gray saffron nah that's a statement they've done I'm sure they'll have to back up

terse lintel
#

if you knew the maps perfectly you wouldnt be having problems using cover to your advantage Omegalol

hoary condor
#

can i put CC into my bank account? haHAA

gray saffron
#

man, if i could cash out my cc, i'd be rich

sleek tartan
#

@terse lintel sure man 👍

spare citrus
#

with the sten i'm good , with the tommy i suck ....why did i spend a month leveling and spend 15k modding the tommy then? there is no reward in this game anymore

main grove
#

Aerodrome and any part of panzerstorm that isn't a flag has no cover

solid hinge
queen canopy
#

I wish. I dunno if dice is ever going to really do much

ebon trench
#

When does purple items become cc purchasable

main grove
#

Hamada is rather lacking

gray saffron
#

hahah

spare citrus
#

lol cel

shy badger
#

Hamada has some great fighting areas

queen canopy
#

Agreed

main grove
#

Do people say epic rarity is purple

#

It looks more magenta

queen canopy
#

People hate Hamada but I have no problems with it

spare citrus
#

hamada is ok

queen canopy
#

It’s Aerodrome that I hate

gray saffron
#

i disliked hamada for snipefest, but it has some good cover and decent stuff for the walk sim players

shy badger
#

Same, it's harde for me now personally but I still likenit

spare citrus
#

aero drom sucks

tall finch
#

The hills have alot of sniper camping areas which really is my only problem with hamada

spare citrus
#

i hate that map with a passion

#

al sundan on frontlines too

queen canopy
#

Yeah Hamada definitely isn’t the best map in game it’s just not terrible

sleek tartan
#

With all the different maps and styles there is in bf everyone's due to hate some map

gray saffron
#

They said they added more cover in 5.2, but honestly i'm not noticiing any of it, except in breakthrough

tall finch
#

Honestly I dont get why everyone hates aerodrome

sleek tartan
#

I hate Rotterdam with a passion

tall finch
#

I have no issues with it

queen canopy
#

^

gray saffron
#

rotterdam is one of mah fav maps 😦

spare citrus
#

rott , arras and devastation my fav maps outside of pac

shy badger
#

There's w lot more cover on the entrance to C from the allied side jer

solid hinge
sleek tartan
#

Rotterdam to me is just a map with a layout I dislike. That's all

queen canopy
#

I also like Panzerstorm

shy badger
#

I love Rotterdam

#

One of my tops

queen canopy
#

Gives me big vibes

shy badger
#

Next to arras

main grove
#

I liked the layout of BF1 Amiens

spare citrus
#

panzer is good too, the snipers on the tracks suck on rot but

#

youll have that

idle breach
#

I hate de_dust2

sleek tartan
#

I really like the new map called something storm

idle breach
#

fight me

spare citrus
#

then my whole game plan is ruined

tall finch
#

Pacific storm?

shy badger
#

Pacific storm

queen canopy
#

Snipers always find a way to snipe, even on more close range maps

spare citrus
#

cuz i'm on the tracks hunting them

idle breach
#

panzific storm

sleek tartan
#

Dust2 sucks, especially the remake

main grove
#

Pacific storm is one the best maps

shy badger
#

Wot

main grove
#

It's really fucking good

queen canopy
#

de_dust2 more like de_bad

shy badger
#

The remake is nearly copy pasted

idle breach
#

aztec is better than dust

tall finch
#

God I hate aerodrome's little hills on the side

queen canopy
#

de_stroyed

gray saffron
#

i want more urban maps imo. sprawling cities, interior sections :3 though the dense forest level seems to take that kind of design i'm looking for as well

sleek tartan
#

@shy badger yeah and all changes are bad

#

Lul

shy badger
#

Wot

stoic breach
#

Dense forest would be good

idle breach
#

yeah

#

de_forest

#

and

stoic breach
#

Yeah more urban maps would be good

idle breach
#

de_arras

tough lodge
#

The only thing i hate about pacific storm is the 2 small islands near us spawn. Players tend to land there instead near the obj on breakthrough

shy badger
#

Inferno still best map

stoic breach
#

And not just rubble and broken shit

queen canopy
#

They teased the jungle map in the Wake trailer

tall finch
#

Wait what

sleek tartan
#

So, is the world going to end with ttk 5.2 or not?

#

Reading reddit I thought so

queen canopy
#

To reddit yes

gray saffron
#

oh yeah, i meant jungle. not forest xD

queen canopy
#

Lmao

shy badger
#

Meh

main grove
#

Guadalcanal/Solomon islands will be good if you like dense vegetation

queen canopy
#

It’s not that bad IMO

shy badger
#

People will probably get used to it eventually

queen canopy
#

It feels absolutely awful in places, but reddit acts like the game is completely unplayable

sleek tartan
#

For me long range damage is quite shitty but close its fine

queen canopy
#

Yeah

main grove
#

I think SMGs are perfect now

shy badger
#

Seems like Dice aren'tvplanning on reverting

queen canopy
#

They need to at least increase the range

main grove
#

But ARs and LMGs are underpowered

sleek tartan
#

@main grove I agree

unreal frigate
#

What annoys me the most so far is the 38 damage melees

queen canopy
#

Also the amount of ammo everyone spawns with bugs me now

sleek tartan
#

No please no I wanted to like u @queen canopy

main grove
#

SMGs are meant to be low recoil low damage

idle breach
#

oh

#

I get it

queen canopy
#

150 reserve ammo on the STEN Omegalol

sleek tartan
#

Spawning with no ammo makes the game worse change my mind

main grove
#

While LMGs are meant to be high recoil high damage

sleek tartan
#

Also the old max ammo was crap

idle breach
#

pacific launch was so smooth, so they're compensating it with 5.2

main grove
#

Unless you bipod

queen canopy
#

What’s the point of playing support anymore? Half the guns are peashooters and no one needs ammo anymore

main grove
#

ARs should be in between SMGs and LMGs

tall finch
#

Madsen has very controllable recoil and high damage

unreal frigate
#

Imagine not using bolt actions

main grove
#

Support got mugged off the most with this update

tough lodge
#

They killed attrition

sleek tartan
#

@queen canopy I still run out of ammo, and many people do

shy badger
#

The m1907 should be stronger

sleek tartan
#

Attrition needed to be killed

tough lodge
#

It was good for the game

sleek tartan
#

And there are still bits of it that have to go

#

Lul

tough lodge
#

@sleek tartan lmao

gray saffron
#

i think support needs to go back to med rifles only. it was better i think

tough lodge
#

Attrition was the best addition to the game

main grove
#

Most support points in BF1 were from restoring gadget ammo

sleek tartan
#

Lmao no

#

It only made it worse

queen canopy
#

And give the assaults all the SMGS again?

sleek tartan
#

But it's debatable I guess

tough lodge
#

You should have only 3 extra mags

sleek tartan
#

More like up to different opinions

main grove
#

Attrition I would have prefered not to have

tough lodge
#

We have 5+ now

unreal frigate
#

Next patch they're probs gonna focus on bipods or some shut

#

Shit

main grove
#

BF1 had a fine ammo system

unreal frigate
#

Fml

sleek tartan
#

@tough lodge what for? To make sure you can't kill many people?

main grove
#

Based on hidden cooldown

queen canopy
#

I would prefer not every soldier having a warehouse of ammo in their back pocket

gray saffron
#

patch 5.3 released: all knifes now have a bipod!

spare citrus
#

welp i'm prob done with ea for good

shy badger
#

hey jer are you free for a game of bf4 rn?

spare citrus
main grove
#

Rather than wait to get all ammo back at one

gray saffron
#

Sure 😄

sleek tartan
#

@queen canopy real life soldiers carry much more ammo

#

300 bullets by average

tall finch
#

@gray saffron 5.4 - knifes have scopes

queen canopy
#

Modern soldiers, yes

gray saffron
#

lemme start up origin ;D

viscid crater
#

@tall finch lmao

queen canopy
#

Not your average WW2 foot soldier

unreal frigate
#

5.5 knives have ammo

tough lodge
#

OMEGALUL rigin

tall finch
#

Stab a person 5 times before reloading

tough lodge
#

Still waiting for steam version

shy badger
#

@tall finch 5.8 knives have a bipod

viscid crater
#

5.6 ammo has bayonet

tall finch
#

Chapter 6 - Knives, Knives, Knives

main grove
#

Real solders are meant to conserve ammo since if you're out in the field your 300 rounds won't be resuplied for a week or so

queen canopy
#

Chapter 7 - Gas, Gas, Gas

unreal frigate
#

5.7 knife cluster strike

tough lodge
#

Chapter 6, soviets in pacific

sleek tartan
#

@main grove rofl bs, you get rwsuplied even in the field if necessary

#

Do you have military training, p

#

?

viscid crater
#

chapter 8 furries with machine guns

tough lodge
#

How many chapters will bfv get?

tribal cairn
#

To be fair, that war wouldn't last long, if the Soviets actually invaded

unreal frigate
#

They be like woops forgot to fix fjiels snow animations

main grove
#

I meant if you're stranded from the rest of the main bulk of your forces

queen canopy
#

They did attack the Japanese in mainland Asia right at the end of the war

main grove
#

Hopefully 10

#

Chapters

sleek tartan
#

Yeah then maybe

main grove
#

I want a good vehicle focused chapter

unreal frigate
#

I'm gonna be pissed if we don't get Stalingrad

tough lodge
#

@main grove kursk

main grove
#

Adding a few new tanks and planes to every faction

tall finch
#

Dude I feel so bad looking back on the pacific trailer and seeing how good it was

tribal cairn
#

Who knows? Maybe history would repeat itself like with the mongols when they invaded

unreal frigate
#

Battle of the bulge

tough lodge
#

Man, i hope they kept their promise to the least seen theatres of war

main grove
#

Brits could get Sherman firefly as a call in while the German equivalent is a Panther

idle breach
#

it's not like the soviets did nothing against japan, but the red army took out the japanese army garrisoned in northern china so quickly

#

it's not really interesting topic to most of the people

tough lodge
#

I mean not conpletely but I hope they will add maps that are least seen

#

Like battle of manila

spare citrus
#

you guys are all looking forward after dice screwed you again? this is exactly what they want ....unbelievable how beta the world is today

tough lodge
#

Urban pacific maps

main grove
#

Soviets were already hardened to fuck from Eastern front

unreal frigate
#

Tabruk @tough lodge

main grove
#

Japan would be nothing to them

tribal cairn
#

As what I'm saying

main grove
#

One side is suicidal and good

idle breach
#

especially in army

main grove
#

The other is suicidal and bad

tough lodge
#

Would you guys want a urban pacific map?

tribal cairn
#

Russia was an unrivaled might in Manpower

unreal frigate
#

They should do crete

idle breach
#

no the pure manpower dudes are chinese

tribal cairn
#

You couldn't Outlast them without good preparation

main grove
#

If Japan actually placed an emphasis on conserving human life

tall finch
#

I would love to see some paratrooper night raid maps

idle breach
#

russians were just masters of "concentrating" massive manpower in specific occasion

main grove
#

It would have been like Britain

#

Not much manpower but made up for in decent tactics and espionage

queen canopy
#

If we do ever get D-day I would love a map of the night before when the paratroopers dropped

idle breach
#

so a map with players just waiting?

tall finch
#

I really just wanna defend as the germans and mow americans down with an mg 42

#

Except I'll just do 8 damage from that range

unreal frigate
#

👌

delicate herald
#

Lol

main grove
#

MG42 is the most overhyped gun ever

tribal cairn
#

Imagine the use of spider holes in the Pacific

main grove
#

Same with Garand really

queen canopy
#

Well right now it is

unreal frigate
#

Ke7 gang

queen canopy
#

Nah Garand slaps

main grove
#

Like they're good

unreal frigate
#

Bren gang

tribal cairn
#

Garand is actually fucking awesome

deep forge
#

i cant wait to kill those japs at wake island

tall finch
#

Garand + Heavy Load

delicate herald
#

Garand + Bayonet

#

Only way to go

deep forge
#

yeah its fun

main grove
#

But if the MG42 is so God tier then why did the side that used it lost?

tall finch
#

I dont think bayonet is worth it

tribal cairn
#

Because of a horrible economy,

#

Oil,

delicate herald
#

Outnumbered

tribal cairn
#

Leadership issues,

delicate herald
#

Two front ear

tribal cairn
#

Fighting on three fronts,

tall finch
#

@main grove you said the same thing for the garand except it was on the side that won

delicate herald
#

War*

main grove
#

It's only well known property is its fast

ebon trench
#

Lack of steep

#

Steel

deep forge
#

BANZAI

unreal frigate
#

They def should add more specializationsb

ebon trench
#

That's a big thing the Germans needed was steel

tribal cairn
#

It wasn't that the weapons were bad,

#

They were actually quite advanced,

main grove
#

Im sayibg that I think I'd prefer other MGs other 42

tribal cairn
#

But Germany itself

delicate herald
#

Germany had some of the best weapons and troops of the war, but everything else fell apart around them.

main grove
#

34

#

For instance

tribal cairn
#

Was In a horrible state

deep forge
#

you know what would be awesome?if factions used their own guns like in real life

queen canopy
#

A lot of modern European militaries use variants/derivatives of the MG-42

slate oak
#

German tanks was overengineered

idle breach
#

that would not be awesome

tribal cairn
#

I believe the M60 was reverse engineered from it

deep forge
#

yes it would

unreal frigate
#

We need the maus tank

deep forge
#

in my opinion

slate oak
#

Most Gimpies I see are derivatives of the M2 Browning

queen canopy
#

Do not mention that cursed thing here.

ebon trench
#

I think the reason they lost was what @slate oak said, everything the Germans had was overly complicated

unreal frigate
#

Lol

idle breach
#

it would be horribly unbalanced

tribal cairn
#

Not everything they had

ebon trench
#

If it broke you had to spend ages yanking it apart to fix it

idle breach
#

not just overly complicated, some things are just poorly designed and manufacturered

tribal cairn
#

Mainly just the vehicles that were overloaded with engineering

ebon trench
#

That too

idle breach
#

fundamental idea was sometimes just wrong

ebon trench
#

I think the UK tank museum has a panther that Brits finished when they captured the factory

main grove
#

We have the only working Tiger

unreal frigate
#

They could've done something with behemoths that cld be interesting

main grove
#

Tiger 131

ebon trench
#

And the difference between German and Brit handiwork was night and day

#

Germans were handmaking the chains on the equipment holds by hand.

#

The Brits just laughed and yeeted out a simple chain

idle breach
#

german engineering was good at small details but not really good with drawing big pictures

solid hinge
#

yeah that was the inspiration for the captain hadlow stug skin a few months back

slate oak
#

Most of the well known German tanks were designed by Ferdinand Porsche, a member of the natsee party. They also founded that Porsche Car Company

idle breach
#

not the most of the well known

#

most of his design was failure

#

and most importantly the ones who asking requirements were pretty dumb

slate oak
#

Did they not design the Tigers, and quite a few Panzers

unreal frigate
#

Shoulda just stuck an mg on top of a 911

#

Pingin

slate oak
#

Also many WW2 designs from all sides were scrapped

idle breach
#

oh no porsche design was not accepted

#

ended up being ferdinand

#

no matter how you are a good engineer if your client is idiot you're gonna end up making a stupid stuff lol

#

a well made stupid stuff

tribal cairn
#

Yep, Porsche got the short end of the stick regarding companies

#

They made some stuff, yes,

#

But they didn't make up the largest bulk of panzers

slate oak
#

The post war Messerschmitts cars look hilarious

idle breach
#

Pz3 were DB chassis, Pz4 were mixed designes of Krupp, Rheinmetall

tribal cairn
#

Mhm

idle breach
#

Panther was basically prototype built by MAN, engine was maybac

#

h

#

porsche never got involved in panther, failed in tiger oh the tiger A turret was kinda based on porsche prototype

deep forge
#

gun nerds

idle breach
#

gun don't kill people

slate oak
#

*tank

idle breach
#

vaccine does

slate oak
#

🤨

ebon trench
#

....

idle breach
#

wut

queen canopy
tribal cairn
#

Can't argue with that logic.

queen canopy
#

Guys

idle breach
#

porsche was making uh

queen canopy
#

I don’t wanna say the Birds did it

#

But

#

The plane flew

idle breach
#

train cars and things in ww2

slate oak
#

Anti Vaxxers are second hand murderers

idle breach
#

some cars

deep forge
#

Who wants a talk from D?

idle breach
#

many cars

tall finch
#

Uh oh...

ebon trench
#

It was them fucken birds wunnit

tall finch
#

Train cars in ww2

#

Ummmmmm

deep forge
#

Who wants a talk from D?

slate oak
#

Gustav Railway Gun behemoth pls

queen canopy
#

AN ENEMY ARMORED TRAIN HAS ARRIVED

tribal cairn
#

Takes the entire match to reload

idle breach
#

not the whole packacge but some

tall finch
#

Nononono

#

Train cars

idle breach
#

uh like this and that eh

tall finch
#

Ww2

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Holocaust

slate oak
#

A SENTRY KIT IS AVAILABLE NEAR YOUR LOCATION

tall finch
#

He was making this stuff for the germans as well

idle breach
#

his train suspension/chassis design is still used till today

queen canopy
#

WE HAVE TAKEN OBJECTIVE BUTTER

slate oak
#

Female Battlefield 1 Announcer >>>>>> all of BFVs

idle breach
#

in most of the railway vehicles

tribal cairn
#

WE HAVE LOST OBJECTIVE KAISER

idle breach
#

and most of the trains run by hybrid motors

ebon trench
#

japan: we got this kaboom broom thing down pat.

Italy: has failed to even show a shred of competence

Germany: GUSTAV YEETENIN GUN

idle breach
#

anaaanyway

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oh no

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actually I give italian 10/10 performance

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they were like supersoldiers

ebon trench
#

For not showing up in this game?

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Cheers ill drink to that bro

idle breach
#

no like

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when they invaded greece

ebon trench
idle breach
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they were unable to break through the greek defense line which had shitty equipment

queen canopy
#

It’d be cool if we get Italy at some point

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But I can without

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We have Italian gear on German side anyways Omegalol

idle breach
#

because soldiers were too clever to "over-soldiering"

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and one day the greeks were desperately defending like they were out of supply

slate oak
#

8th Army fighting in South Italy should come to the game

idle breach
#

one of the greek barrack greek soldiers found a fucking italian soldier just casually sleeping between them

slate oak
#

Britain was also fighting in Greece

idle breach
#

and when asked the italian simply said "our barracks are too cold so"

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"your barracks are located in warmer side so I decided to sleep in here"

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entire army can't penetrate the defense line but one soldier boi easily can

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that's the true martial arts

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their military history were full of not just "how to win a battle" but "what next?"

solid hinge
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im sorry ehat

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bf3 russian announcer>>>>> everything

idle breach
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even in 21th century, when bush invaded afghanistan with bunch of other nato nations

solid hinge
idle breach
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taliban forces were strangely, not attacking italian garrison and turns out they just fucking straight bribed the talibanman

silver tide
#

Ahh these goatfuckers need to be wiped off this planet

slate oak
#

I can’t remember which early 2000s invasion this was, but at the Battle of Danny Boy, the Argyll and Sutherland Highlanders were badly pinned down by Taliban forces....

so they bayonet charged them and ended up either killing or capturing every single one of the taliban

idle breach
#

tbf goats are cute

storm sigil
#

I m dead in the firestorm in the game mode firestrom 😭😭😭

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I m noob 😂😂😂😂

idle breach
#

goat is cute

solid hinge
#

Firestorm OMEGALUL

idle breach
#

firestorm

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wow

#

never played it like

#

after two days

solid hinge
#

Worst game mode in my opinion

hoary condor
#

it was good if it was maintained

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which is isn't

solid hinge
#

Yeah

left barn
#

what do you say about the new ttk? My opinion: 🤮

solid hinge
#

No one likes it

idle breach
#

even the 5.2 ttk's mom hates 5.2 ttk

echo turtle
#

I like what dice was going for

idle breach
#

yeah i kinda see what this is all about but

solid hinge
#

not true, some people have no problem with it

echo turtle
#

Just that some of the changes really screwed a couple of weapons

idle breach
#

in this state? complete shit

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if they planning some big changes this was too hasty

slate oak
#

I thought I was playing with Nerf Dart Guns

silver tide
#

I think someone needs to walk into dice studios and test the ttk on the executives that work there.

slate oak
#

No

idle breach
#

i wouldnt mind like longer TTK with overall okay balance and things

solid hinge
#

theres also a lot of people over reacting to a couple of CQBers who were gaslighting the community before it was even released

idle breach
#

but this is just

echo turtle
#

Some guns just need their effective range brought up a bit more

slate oak
#

Broke: Boys AT Rifle

Woke: Panzerbusche

Bespoke: Tankgewehr M1918

solid hinge
#

one guy even said "I hate this new TTK even though my K/d is up and I'm winning more games" ..like wtf yo

tiny mist
#

imagine caring about statistics

slate oak
#

^

idle breach
#

should we have some rating system and quarantine them into ranked server?

lilac umbra
#

come on now 4days in a row COULD NOT FETCH YOUR REPORT when is it gonna get fixed

slate oak
#

I don’t care about statistics, I just wanna have fun

idle breach
#

next year

#

yeah if you care about stats

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just..play games with stats....

spare citrus
#

jade i have a fix for the fetch report

slate oak
#

Having played stuff like Shiren, dying can sometimes be fun if it’s a decent and fun challenge

idle breach
#

some actual competitve thing

solid hinge
#

oh yeah there are several bugs, not going to argue there and I do not like them cutting up aerodrome

slate oak
#

Incursions 2: Electric Boogaloo?

lilac umbra
#

im not deleting this 100gb piece of bug nest

soft storm
#

Bruh this patch actually made it worse for new players

solid hinge
#

disagree

soft storm
#

Cause new players can’t unlock anything

#

Cause can’t fetch your report

spare citrus
#

also there is a fix for guns not unlocking

tiny mist
#

why in the fuck are there problems with packet loss if everything was fine

solid hinge
#

now a noob can actually get a few kills and not get steamrolled

soft storm
#

Celestine

echo turtle
#

It really doesn't benefit anyone who is picking up the game over Christmas

slate oak
#

That’s not the point

soft storm
#

I’m not even referring to gunplay

slate oak
#

They were talking about broken unlocks

soft storm
#

Lmao

slate oak
#

Melon

echo turtle
#

The guys who already have the good shit unlocked will be steamrolling

soft storm
#

Bingo

solid hinge
#

oh yeah, they have a few broken arrays somewhere

spare citrus
#

this update is for people ..................wait for it ...................that literally , aren't even playing the game ............the ea way, greed over gaming

soft storm
#

This patch just made it so established players are better off cause they have their unlocks

slate oak
#

Is the Japanese faction still unable to use the Throwing Knife

echo turtle
#

The only way I can see them doing well is by picking up the year 2 edition

slate oak
#

Does that unlock stuff?

tiny mist
#

id sparta

echo turtle
#

All of the tow weapons afaik

spare citrus
solid hinge
#

they fixed it last time it happened, so I imagine the same will happen this time, people will get their guns and in a few cases CCs

silver tide
#

I hope dice keeps the changes

slate oak
#

I hope not

solid hinge
#

some people haven't received the 3000 cc for ranking up, its a reported bug

silver tide
#

Im so glad dice doesn't listen to reddit

spare citrus
#

a few cases? everyone should get 10k cc

left barn
#

i hope dice sees what they have done and change it back.

silver tide
#

And i guys

slate oak
#

People still use reddit?

echo turtle
#

They have lmao

slate oak
#

Reddit is obsolete

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Outdated