If only EA could stop fucking battlefront through its core though
#battlefield-legacy-titles
solid hinge
it would be amazing if they did something right for once
Think that goes for all EA games across the board
solid hinge
Yeah, agreed
You don’t play on PSN i’m guessing
@topaz dome Hbu? You got PSN?
Both of our names say xbox so I think thats a no
Lmao yeah i figured oops
I keep playing all the other battlefields but no matter what I’ll always stick with BF4, just my type of battlefield game
wild jacinth
so whens crossplay happening
solid hinge
Y’all seen the leak that’s happened?
topaz dome
no, pc, i'm not playing for a while
wild jacinth
?
short pecan
maybe in bf6
solid hinge
Leak for what?
Next battlefield game is based on Modern Generation, so like Battlefield 4 but a different title
It’s untitled at the moment but it’s rumoured to take place in modern day
rich ember
where?
solid hinge
Which would be amazing
rich ember
what leak?
solid hinge
Isnt that the theory jackfrags had
For the next battlefield game
Which sounds pretty plausible
rich ember
where's the leak sir
solid hinge
If JackFrags did a video about it then it’s most likely
I found it on reddit though, Was a forum and a bunch of people put in their possibilities
He did the video like 7 months ago now
short pecan
isnt the next bf rumored to be bc3? so a modern setting would make sense
rich ember
BC3 was rumored to be a PS5 launch title, although i still think the post that showed that said too much to be really plausible
solid hinge
Didnt they have a 3 game contract
They have more than that, but I’m pretty sure 3 of them is battlefront games yeah
I’m not liking the looks of the new star wars game though
The one that was shown at E3
I think it could be great
Didn’t we think that about the past two games xD
The gameplay was pretty bad though but afterwards they said its more like a mass effect style game
short pecan
looks kinda mediocre to me
solid hinge
tfw you make the company good at fps games do a third person adventure game
You get a crew and a ship etc
They know how make a trailer and catch the eye of the audience
but they really do know how to disappoint too.
tfw no dismemberment in a "realistic" lightsaber game
rich ember
tfw you have a company that's good at making third person games but you toss microtransactions into their game and kill them when their game doesn't do well
rich ember
RIP Visceral
solid hinge
Why are they making respawn do third person adventure games when they're experts at.. not that
I still play the old Battlefront game on my PC, with a bunch of mods installed, it’s so fun.
wild jacinth
yeah but i think the lightsaber combat from what we seen doesnt look to good
solid hinge
Reminds me of how battlefront should be lol
Didnt respawn choose to make that
Dont think EA forced them
wild jacinth
if battlefront 3 didn't come out and dice is now in control of making the 3rd battlefront they better make the best damn battlefront starwars games we ever played starting with a pilotable LAAT gunship that I can pickup and drop off people
solid hinge
The thing is, I’m sure they will this time. Because so far the first two battlefront games they’ve released caused them a lot of backlash
solid hinge
So i’m sure they finally learned from their fuck ups
dice couldn't even make swbf2 include vehicles that werent pilotable by solely one person
i dont have high Hope's
wild jacinth
to be honest i dont think ive ever seen my self on best squads since bf1
solid hinge
Every other squad had the same layout raptor
wild jacinth
@solid hinge yeah i still dont understand why to this day you can't do that. They rush both battlefronts? I mean the first one had a pilotable At ST that was fun.
solid hinge
2nd, 11th, 16th, 21st
I see my self in best squads shit loads
Daily pretty much
The movement in swbf2 feels bad in general
Guess they just didnt finish it properly
Agree with that
Clunky as hell
wild jacinth
i think there was times when my squad and i did the best but still no appreciation from the game
solid hinge
I’m usually first or on top 4 in leaderboards whenever I finish a match
The ground vehicles feel like Shit in swbf2
icy sluice
Also, I forgot to let the video render into onedrive, so the quality is pretty shit
wild jacinth
i hate how most maps in bf2 the original ones it just a cluster fuck. You just meet at one point of the map and thats how the battle begins its like dice looked at the old movies when it was Droids Vs clones and they'd just have a huge battle i mean guess it makes sense when you put it that way but when you guys know how to make a game called battlefield i cant understand why you didn't just reskin the game with the same battlefield knowledge
which is what they should of done bf2 should of felt little more like battlefield in a way
solid hinge
Yeah, I agree. Most maps In battlefront 2 are a complete mess
wild jacinth
or i mean battlefront in general
solid hinge
But some are acc really good
wild jacinth
i mean the first battlefront was actually decent i enjoyed it
rich ember
i still think the Dead Space people would've made a decent Star Wars game if they hadn't been killed by Dead Space 3
wild jacinth
it was sad when the dlc was all free and i tried playing dlc maps and literally 3 people were playing scariff from rogue one @_@
solid hinge
Yeah, lately all I’ve been playing is Battlefield 4 or Arma 3/Squad
wild jacinth
i never finished the first dead space but the second one was good
solid hinge
And somewhat of battlefront
wild jacinth
and the 3rd was good to from the demo i played
rich ember
@wild jacinth The third one was panned at launch due to microtransactions.
wild jacinth
i want to go back to swbf2 dice because they finally added skins for clones and all that i mean i waited like 6 months for them to finally add that it took them so long or was it a year?
rich ember
This is basically why Visceral doesn't make their own games anymore.
solid hinge
less horror more survival
they took like 2 years to add anything meaningful to swbf2
wild jacinth
@rich ember you mean dice bf3? or The other companies bf3?
wild jacinth
yeah feels bad when it took like 2 years to add a droideka like srsly and i remember they said they weren't going to add it when they had some promotional art with a droideka in the background like wtf?
now where the hell are my republic commandos
if they added them i would play battlefront 2 again
but maybe they shouldn't because dice will probably find a way to ruin them or they just shouldn't add commandos to an all ready ruined game?
solid hinge
My favourite type of clones are Phase 1, even though Phase 2 clones are really nice too.
they're only adding clone wars era stuff to it cause the hardcore fans are clone wars fanatics
and they're the only people left
;P
wild jacinth
) :
but yeah there really isn't even enough clone war era maps
) : literally genosis and the cloning facility like rlly dice
solid hinge
Well, kinda true, but after battlefront 1 They community got backlash, by the majority of players to add Clone wars, so they did exactly that. Because the majority of players want that
they added maps even slower than bfv
wild jacinth
yeah i guess battlefront 2 marks the demise of dice
solid hinge
Dice needs to step up their game if they wanna beat cod
wild jacinth
but not now now is not their time .
solid hinge
Lmao, They have been slapping every cod. But the new Modern warfare is a big step up towards dice.
Lets hope they actually listen to the community
rich ember
You have too much confidence.
solid hinge
Cod is fundamentally easier to pick up for most people
Cod is literally copying battlefield lmao
^ basically
by sucking?
rich ember
¯_(ツ)_/¯
wild jacinth
Yoda voice, "Confidence you must have"
solid hinge
You cant say cod is running out of ideas when bfv has a battle royale stuck in it
rich ember
@wild jacinth in things that actually matter, fortunately, a company's ability to make a decent video game is not one of those things.
solid hinge
Wait cant dice sue activison for copying them
main grove
They only make new skins for 8 base game weapons
solid hinge
Wait, doesn’t every other game though? LOL?
rich ember
@solid hinge no
wild jacinth
its great though take battlefields idea and what they've been all about and hit them when they're weak i think its all been planned lol they probably had this sketched out on a map and everything and probably have their meetings in BO1 array.
main grove
And I’m sick of it
wild jacinth
COD going to hit them were it hurts
solid hinge
case in point
Cod added battle royal before battle field even did.
Why not @rich ember
wild jacinth
@solid hinge why like how pubg can copyright fortnite for copying them?
and we all know how that turned out...
rich ember
because DICE doesn't have any specific rights to what CoD is trying to do
solid hinge
yeah so battlefields version is like the 50th and adds basically nothing new apart from inferior loot systems
wild jacinth
yeah its just a game mode its just features added to a game
solid hinge
True
main grove
How is cod copying battlefield now?
rich ember
and it'd be a gigantic waste of money and time
main grove
I don’t know
wild jacinth
i mean waw had tanks and now this newer cod going to have tanks in the multiplayer
main grove
That’s it
solid hinge
Their adding 64 players to be in a game
main grove
Vehicles and people
solid hinge
having larger amounts of players in one mode doesnt mean its gonna copy battlefield
wild jacinth
damn
main grove
Oh
main grove
That’s still not copying
rich ember
DICE doesn't own the trademark of having 64 players in a game
wild jacinth
thats what ive been dreaming of
main grove
Why are people mad about this again?
solid hinge
They're also getting 100 player modes apparently
It's not about the size of players lmfao.
main grove
This is only a good thing
wild jacinth
they're basically just doing what they should of done a long time ago to compete with battlefield and is the reason why i left cod to go play bf3 when mw3 was out i was sick of the copy and paste from mw2 with even more shittier graphics and gunplay
solid hinge
People can say whatever they want about battlefield
drowsy wagon
yo shouldnt i get more fps tahn 70 on ultra with 2080 and i79700k?????
rich ember
except you can't because again, no company can own the concept of having a specific amount of people in the same game
solid hinge
Cod will be the one game franchise to copy a lot of other games.
Mostly battlefield.
drowsy wagon
yo shouldnt i get more fps tahn 70 on ultra with 2080 and i79700k?????
rich ember
SHUT
main grove
Dae Cod bad?
solid hinge
@drowsy wagon #technology
wild jacinth
No dae cod good
main grove
If it’s more like battlefield yes
wild jacinth
i mean it look good
solid hinge
I played cod a few times, I was really ashamed I actually spent my money on a game like that.
solid hinge
No realism whatsoever, just have a bunch of minors jumping off buildings screaming they hit a hitmarker.
LOL
solid hinge
So basically cod is fortnite and pubg is battlefield
Remember the shitty mechanics from Cod WW2 when they tried adding planes to use in the Single player
V
rich ember
i donno
solid hinge
big L
wild jacinth
doesnt doom have big gay?
solid hinge
?
midnight nimbus
no reeeeeeeeeeeealism
rich ember
@steady nymph why play battlefield when you can play anything else
rich ember
you're just noticing this?
solid hinge
DOOM was a nice game in my opinion, if you've ever played the old DOOM games, you'd see they brought back a lot of the old mechanics and weapons/story line to it's modern franchise.
yeah, i already pre-ordered the second one.
I'm worried about God Of War though, lol
rich ember
it won an award, it'll be fine
solid hinge
The next game is apparently supposed to take place in Egyptian Mythology.
Which is cool and all
wild jacinth
Why are they adding sjw stuff to new gow
rich ember
is this a joke
wild jacinth
coughs bfv
dense bone
^
rich ember
oh god it's not a joke
icy sluice
tmw making you play as a daughter of some strong guy is SJW
solid hinge
I'm off to play some Battlefield 4, Catch y'all later
wild jacinth
He read that last statement and was like im out
solid hinge
LOL
wild jacinth
Not sure who hes talking to but ok.
wicked cloak
LFG
rich ember
@wild jacinth :|
wild jacinth
Yeah whats up
feral grotto
there are some weird people on bf ;o
this one guy.. out of no where "cky... make room in your squad"
"who are you..?"
"i want to play with good players"
me: ignore...
him: "add me when the round is over"
me: 
blazing ginkgo
kurwa
asdfvghnjkasdfvghnjmk,qawsdrftghnjmk,laszfgvhjkm/'
awsdfghjk;'
52sdrftgylp;'
5asgfvjk/'
feral grotto
@solid hinge
and @wild jacinth , he wasn't any good himself or wanted team work or what ever..
he just.. was there basically
wild jacinth
Well sometimes thats all you really need in life
feral grotto
....
man im in shock... my ISP did something.. maybe changed cables or what ever..
from avg of 100 ping to EU servers i went down to 56-60 ;o
wild jacinth
Someone just there ya know life lessons taught by bf
If its one thing dice cant do right is producing a game in time but the meaningful values you get out of the game timeless.
feral grotto
i have two separate issues with people i add..
-
they add me to have me on their friend list but they never join my game or chat or what ever..
-
the opposite typical human.. that basically stalks me..
he can be offline.. i jump into a game, suddenly poof he's in my squad
rapid moth
absolute same
feral grotto
there's no in the middle for some reason 
wild jacinth
"Good soldiers follow orders"
feral grotto
im not planning on enlisting again.. so i'll follow my own orders
thx
lol .. terrible idea..
people in the same clan/platoon what ever are terrible 97.6% of the times
maybe its diff on xbox
rapid moth
Ya I have noticed same tag=good squad mates on xbox
feral grotto
man.. i've seen some terrible clan mates on pc
oh lol.. well yeah pc is just "gotta be 15 with mic... you're in" at least from what ive seen
i just got 3-4 friends from bf4 that i play with.. all i need
wild jacinth
@feral grotto its a star wars reference
feral grotto
i don't like star wars
i got one that moved to pubg.. idk why..
the other one is busy with his child.. and the 3rd and 4th are playing basically every day
and they are as good as me.. so we dominating games most of the times
rich ember
I used to play BF1 with friends. We all stopped and that was basically the end of that
feral grotto
rich ember
meh i ain't bothered about it, it wasn't particularly fun anyway, we had a better time playing Armello or PD2.
feral grotto
yeah.. bf1 was terrible
carmine eagle
Blyatfeld V
plush flume
Bloopfield V
rich ember
beepfield V
proper perch
Hay guys why their are no new esttreggs I bfv
feral grotto
maybe there are
pulsar valve
sorry, easter egg factory stopped working
tribal cairn
Hey I wonder, are servers down on the PS4? It says I'm offline despite having perfect internet connection
Ah, nevermind,
It just spontaneously came back online now
short pecan
not even a single new set for CC available this week 
wary tapir
is the "kill or down 3 enemies using melee weapons or bayonet charge" bugged?
ive been killing dozen with melee so far it wont seem to count
solid hinge
Which melee you using
wary tapir
Ilse's axe
indigo sedge
Ilse's pickaxe is bugged for the "Mudslinger" node. Try a different melee weapon.
(There's a JIRA ticket on this, just saw this morning.)
coral fiber
Hmmm
fathom pebble
yeh when I used it thought it was odd, but changed it and tried with another and a bayonet and worked
coral fiber
Well that sucks
fathom pebble
screenshot contest 
icy sluice
I have been encountering very unlucky players
feral grotto
Brad, it seems also that if you melee kill someone (without animation) it also don't count on that node
icy sluice
One thing that doesn't seem to help is that, the counter doesn't always show when progress is made
or it gets delayed
feral grotto
Delayed most likely
icy sluice
Really hard to tell sometimes.
warm atlas
I just did bayonet charges with the MP-34.
Never used the bayonet in V, but it’s cheese. Took a few minutes on a game of devastation.
feral grotto
Satisfying, isn't it?
warm atlas
It feels a bit dirty. Lol
feral grotto
Specially with a smg or shotgun
warm atlas
Yeah. I mean I ain’t complaining. I’ll probably keep it on there. 
feral grotto
feral grotto
Oh yeah
And it feel better than bf1 bayonet charges
And more special than what it was on bf1
visual blade
yea I feel that lol
although I wish you can Meele with them
Without have to charge with it and scream
feral grotto
They should add a special button for melee with the weapon itself with bayonet or butt stock
Would be great to have a diff way of melee
dense bone
cavalry big dumb
visual blade
they should arrive with the Russians
feral grotto
If it's between you and me.. than yes, you the only one 🤔
Didn't like it at all
Well than again.. never used that class
dense bone
i shot a dead on a horse a bunch of times, but now the person is a tank
feral grotto
The horse is the most powerful thing in the game
visual blade
especially if you act as a dragoon you’re set
phase out the sword and just use the carbine
feral grotto
I wonder if Japanese pilots on bfv will get extra points for crashing into things
sweet fulcrum
Imagine if you could use the 5 and 6 button on the keyboard to equip (without using) nades and knives
feral grotto
To equip the melee you just hold F @sweet fulcrum
And well.. you could equip the nade on bf4 couldn't you?
Maybe it is an option
icy sluice
F is to melee for you?
sweet fulcrum
I mean equip without attacking
feral grotto
It attack once and then you hold it
sweet fulcrum
And yeah I meant the same way to equip as bf4
feral grotto
Hold the melee not The button
sweet fulcrum
wut
feral grotto
You hold F.. it attack once and then you can see the melee in your hand
carmine eagle
Blyatfeld V
feral grotto
Like you wanted .. to walk around only with the melee
I walk around with my cricket bat all the time
feral grotto
Yeah.. so it's just attack once..don't see the issue
sweet fulcrum
it just bugs me having to attack once everytime I want to see my knife
or just run around with it
feral grotto
Why does it bother you if you still gets to hold it and run with it?
It's just once..
icy sluice
Either I am really lucky, or these guys are incredibly unlucky
https://streamable.com/0hvm1
sweet fulcrum
both probably
carmine eagle
You are sniper
icy sluice
Yes, wanna read my name? 
feral grotto
Like there's a problem with being a sniper
icy sluice
I went 35-5 on Twisted Steel as a Sniper and was the reason my squad was best squad, are there any problems here?
carmine eagle
No, unless you camp and don’t cap
icy sluice
If you can tell by the gameplay I just posted 👀
carmine eagle
Didn’t watch it
feral grotto
icy sluice
ok 👌 😆
feral grotto
carmine eagle
One bar of internet and an LTE connection
icy sluice
👌 Using School Wifi to talk on discord
solid hinge
Imagine being in school rn lol
icy sluice
Imagine getting an education
solid hinge
Imagine
Imagine update notes that fix 3 very minor aspects of a game but the update is 88.82 GB large 
carmine eagle
Highschool sucks
carmine eagle
It kinda does
solid hinge
It really doesn’t tho
Without high school i would have even less of a social life than i do now
It would matter if it was European secondary school but US high school is a joke
static sigil
the only classes that actually matter in all of highschool are math and sciences
solid hinge
I would argue that too cuz depending on the university you attend they might make you retake that shit anyways
static sigil
Universities actually care what your marks are in them, so unless you want to take them again and pay for them, then you'd better do decent in highschool in those classes
solid hinge
Many universities are just out for profit these days, so they won’t care what classes you have to take, how you perform, or what you want to do as long as they can pull as much money out of your wallet in the process
static sigil
well speaking from personal experience, all of the universities around me require either you have a decent grade from highschool in math/sciences, or you have to retake them and pay for it, likely about $500+ per. Assuming you're taking a course related to them
note that I'm not in the US
woeful snow
Man, this game is kind of getting boring lol.
static sigil
I came back to play it like a week ago, kind of disappointed they removed frontlines and now you can only play it on one map
and squad conquest is fun, but nobody plays it
woeful snow
Yeah when they first fixed the invis soldiers I was seeing a ton of lobbies for my conquest settings. Now it's back to no lobbies. I don't know if anyone is really playing this game if the big modes are lacking for lobbies.
solid hinge
playerbase in general is small
that's why they removed modes
people don't want to play a buggy laggy mess with no balancing
weak marsh
solid hinge
Gadgets are a big thing I think
woeful snow
@solid hinge very true. It's insanely laggy when the tides of war is new and tracking and I forgot I have assignments on too. Yikes lol.
solid hinge
Theres not enough options
Frags suck so the majority of grenades you see are smoke and incendiary
Medic has either smoke or AP mines for gadgets, and ap mines suck super bad on medic
woeful snow
It's wonderful you can't cook frags anymore 
solid hinge
same deal for support
woeful snow
Impacts are really good on support.
solid hinge
AT mines are broken not that more than 1% of people used them anyway
AT pistol is borked
Impacts really are neat, but cant bust walls or anything so just a small source of damage
Panzerfaust is shit so everyone runs piat
Then either frag launcher which is suffering since the nerf or dynamite
woeful snow
Yeah Panzerfaust can't break down walls in 1 shot smh.
Impacts are good for throwing at weak enemies in corners lol.
solid hinge
Recon has a couple of gadgets but spawn beacon takes the cake
woeful snow
Dynamite is so weak against opponents. Weird honestly.
solid hinge
like.. people legit only have a couple of viable gadgets
If even two
Medic is usually just pouches and smoke launcher
Dynamite is pretty strong considering the angles you can throw it at
Being able to toss it round corners and stuff is nice
And it super hurts tanks
woeful snow
You get a lot of enemy hit unless it's right on their feet. It's good against tanks tho.
solid hinge
Multipurpose
None of the explosives have a very large kill radius
Dynamite is useless against infantry
it's all the guns now
which again, are super similar
the smgs literally all have the same damage model apart from one which is ever so slightly different
the lmgs and mmgs straight up have the same damage model
assault rifles have the same damage model
the semis change it up a little which is actually nice
but still multiple guns that do effectively the same thing
recon has some guns with significantly different damage models but the bolts suck and the SLRs arent exactly peak power
gloomy kraken
I havent used impact grenades yet, only AT grenade on assault, fire grenade on medic and support and throwing knives on recon.
solid hinge
I use fire on assault unless im specifically going to dunk on tanks
I like fire a lot but impact is super good for getting peoples health down fast
Or finishing off someone who ran round a corner
gloomy kraken
I would use the sticky on support if it didnt stick to walls it should go past.
solid hinge
Yeah.. sticky is pretty awful currently
Does do high damage to tanks but like
That's assault's forte
and sticky sucks worse vs infantry than AT nade
gloomy kraken
Would love to get some sticky kills 
Sticky does high damage to tanks? When i last time used one (halfway chapter 3) i propably did 14 dmg on Valentines ass
woeful snow
Yeah I really enjoy the semi autos. A lot of similar ones but they are fun to use.
The problem with SLRs is they reload to slow and shoot way too slow for this game. They worked in BF1.
Factor in some of them take 3 shots at range to kill and you only have 5 or 6 rounds.
woeful snow
Makes them totally useless when you can just use an assault semi, pick up ammo from dead enemies and better equipment.
woeful snow
The ZH has best 2 shot range. Only 1 worth using tbh.
solid hinge
they have higher fire rates in exchange for the lower range compared to the ZH and selb 1906
gloomy kraken
Luckily there was a friendly tank who killed it after the sticky and 4 ap pistol rounds
solid hinge
I honestly think the ZH is the best ranged weapon recon has
woeful snow
Ap pistol rounds at tanks. I love getting that last one to kill the tank but if you're alone against it. OOF LOL.
solid hinge
Selb has the higher fire rate but the ZH has that detachable mag
woeful snow
The P08 needs some kind of velocity buff too. It's atrocious. It'd be really fun to use if so.
solid hinge
The p08 is sick
gloomy kraken
Well the ap does nice if shot on the booty
solid hinge
It was honestly already good and then they buffed it twice
woeful snow
I'd rather use the M1a1 lol.
No reason to use that either.
Only the ZH in that class. Everything else is badddd
solid hinge
Cause its on recon!
static sigil
elephant gun op
solid hinge
p08 isnt even that bad close up
It's just pish at range
you sneak onto a point with flares and the p08 and you can wipe people
woeful snow
Close up but at range it's very bad and why use that when you have the M1a1 or the Swedish semi. Can do much more easily.
solid hinge
it's also literally got 0 recoil so even though it sucks at range you can still dink people
It's designed to be a close up gun anyway
solid hinge
Faster kill time than the m1a1 under 10 metres with a bigger mag and better hipfire
it's the only recon weapon that has more than 6 bullets
viral badger
😔
woeful snow
Yeah that is sad lol.
gloomy kraken
C96
soon...
viral badger
I say we get blyat tanks
solid hinge
I main recon so im very glad to have a weapon that actually has ammo
woeful snow
The problem is that they should've given some semis to the kit.
They forced certain classes into certain situations.
solid hinge
Semis are the best weapon type by far so if everyone had them that's the only thing you'd see be used
gloomy kraken
But was the repetielpistole carbine automatic in bf1? Because the bfv clip of it was frommer stop auto fast
solid hinge
Most of the classes have options for every range
Medic is the one who suffers the most from lack of range capacity but the ZK and trombone dont do too bad for that
woeful snow
Medic is literally busted on console if you can keep the distance medium range lol. Not talking the carbines either lol.
Unlimited self heal but take it away from everyone else. Good stuff guys.
Hell from the ppl I've seen, medic is busted on pc too lol.
solid hinge
To be fair the smgs arent the most powerful weapons
unless you trade recoil for rpm
suomi and Thompson are beastly
woeful snow
ZK too with the fire rate. Even the smooth smgs destroy ppl. They're like assault rifles at medium range.
sage thorn
solid hinge
The lower rpm smgs suffer from notably higher damage fall off than other autos
and by extension weaker close up capability cause smaller rof
They're damn accurate though
gloomy kraken
The mp34? The smg with the bayonet i switched from extended mag to light bolt because of its low dps
haughty pawn
every fucking breaktrough game one side has 50% less players,this is getting ridiculous
static sigil
M E G A fucked
solid hinge
imagine having a game out for 9 entire months and your balancer still adds new players to the team with more people
woeful snow
No team balance either.
haughty pawn
last 5 games were like 10 vs 5 ppl
solid hinge
should be absolutely on the top of their priority list
woeful snow
Yeah, it's amazing we're 9 months in and this game still has a ton of trash issues.
haughty pawn
finally found a full server,1 min later 30 vs 16
gloomy kraken
Or having balanced teams and then fuck it up?
haughty pawn
my favorite map 
woeful snow
The map rotation is pretty bad too lol.
gloomy kraken
Hamada is not made for infantry, tanks or planes (conquest)
gray glade
do ppl get penalized for leaving a game? like is it a loss on their scoresheet after the game?
haughty pawn
what else can you do,wanna play 400 tickets with 5 ppl on each side ?
solid hinge
did a devastation breakthrough with 10 vs 10 earlier
woeful snow
Ppl don't care about winning. Can't tell you how many teams I've seen in Conquest just stop trying and sit in their home spawn sniping all capped out. PATHETIC players honestly. Wonder if they're cod kids coming over or something.
haughty pawn
takes my about 10 games to find even a full server that's not already fucked up
solid hinge
no one new joined
short pecan
ded game
solid hinge
I dont think people take conquest as seriously
Seems to be the designated piss around in mode
haughty pawn
rage mode
static sigil
I'm guessing the player count is definitely under 2k daily on pc
haughty pawn
solo play mode
solid hinge
that being said you get a godawful amount of american sniper wannabees
haughty pawn
and always funny to see those 150-250 ping snipers
woeful snow
Yeah my search settings went from 50 servers after the invis soldier fix back to down to 25 servers. No one plays this game. Hopefully the next on brings players back. Tired of 100 pingers and clans every round. So 
haughty pawn
who ofc are top of the score list
gloomy kraken
Meanwhile i started using the M95/30 with iron sights
woeful snow
Yeah, God forbid Dice have the guts and put a ping limiter in their laggy ass mess of a game 
haughty pawn
we don't need bug fixing,we need more boin cosmetics
solid hinge
its fucking annoying that they broke the game and then went on vacation
i really dont mind the vacation, time off is super important in work
but they straight up broke it
woeful snow
Boin cosmetics 
Can't lie I did buy Ilse tho. I think I stuck out like a sore thumb tho so I stopped using her lol.
haughty pawn
i want the alpha or beta game state back,that was almost perfect lol
solid hinge
and then went "oh well see you in TWO MONTHS"
haughty pawn
compared to now
solid hinge
the invisible soldiers was bad enough to justify a roll-back
haughty pawn
yeah,with the pacific update there will be a zillion players with no bugs !!!
solid hinge
they also busted AT mines and the AT pistol with that patch
midnight nimbus
"Seems to be the designated piss around in mode"
can't take away muh sandbox
woeful snow
Don't forget you still have the enemy hit damage bug 😄
gloomy kraken
At mines are still not fixed?
midnight nimbus
conquest is designed to make people not care about winning
solid hinge
they spent a whole month for the july patch and delayed it to "slip more fixes in" and then literally only fixed one bug the previous patch introduced
haughty pawn
easier to tell what is actually working
solid hinge
when theres already a billion bugs in the game
woeful snow
Enemy Hit 125 oh he's not 1 shot!!? He has 70% of his health 😄
gloomy kraken
Great because next chapter week has a node that you can only do with AT mines or Boys rifle.
solid hinge
..you serious?
dark dawn
Well shit
gloomy kraken
Yup
haughty pawn
solid hinge
they have a node for a fucking broken gadget?
haughty pawn
sounds about right lol
solid hinge
have anyone working at dice ever heard of quality control
gloomy kraken
”Do 300 damage to vehicles useing AT mines or anti-materiel rifles”
woeful snow
I don't need their trash chapter challenges anymore. FInal level in like 100k xp lol.
solid hinge
THREE HUNDRED
THERES ONLY ONE FUCKING ANTI TANK GUN
BECAUSE YOU DELAYED THE OTHER ONE
woeful snow
300
midnight nimbus
solution is once again to stop playing BFV
woeful snow
300 damage with the Boys! Whew! We'll be playing with the boys baby! LOL
haughty pawn
what do you get?another skin ?
woeful snow
A vehicle skin LOL
haughty pawn
lee,drilling or the others ?
woeful snow
😄
gloomy kraken
And we dont even know if Pzb 39 is for week 11 or 12
solid hinge
so they broke anti tank mines, delayed the anti-materiel rifle that was designed for actually hurting tanks, and then give us an assignment based on using these two things
dark dawn
I thought that Reddit page was bad
woeful snow
They just need to add weapons every week. I need more playerbase on here LOL.
gloomy kraken
The skin is for Panzer 38b
solid hinge
why do they keep doing utterly stupid things
haughty pawn
easy,fix bugs,get players back,or at least don't lose more
solid hinge
@midnight nimbus I need that bottle
gloomy kraken
This chapter 4 has been a let down
solid hinge
It's been awful
woeful snow
This chapter has been a BIG
dark dawn
Got a long wait for chapter 5
midnight nimbus
open origin -> right click BFV -> uninstall
gloomy kraken
Chapter 3 was good as every week accually had new gun/vehicle
strange dome
dont worry guys we got a 5v5 mode coming with 2 maps maybe.
solid hinge
was that the one that had 5k cc
strange dome
🙃
dark dawn
Chapter 5 should be packed with new content
gloomy kraken
And we have no news about the welrod, suppressed ppk or m1911, bazooka and all the trailer shown other guns/gadgets.
solid hinge
It's not on the roadmap!!!
haughty pawn
no need for a 5vs5 mode,just play breaktrough
woeful snow
I definitely play Battlefield for small game modes
solid hinge
I'd play it over squad conquest
I literally havent played a single squad conquest match in the last two months that wasnt a spawn camp
apart from the only map that has a spawn big enough to get out of, arras
solid hinge
the clan dudes
strange dome
i got a assignment for squad conquest. am like meh that shat is stale.
woeful snow
I just can't wait to do my Boys Challenges next week. Definitely want to use that slow piece of trash lol.
solid hinge
they can go dunk on 5v5 people
haughty pawn
even medics prone camp now,says it all
visual blade
there are clans for bfv?
woeful snow
Yeah I have a buddy who asked me to join his clan and they play tdm/squad conquest and just dunk on ppl lol. Not my thing tho.
strange dome
"community clans"
visual blade
yea def not my thing either
woeful snow
Clans always dunk in my games in conquest too. So many brain dead players who do nothing all game. I don't know why they even play the game tbh lol.
solid hinge
One squad is okay, having half your team be organized is just unfair
strange dome
al-soon™ dan soon? 😒
solid hinge
Even one organized squad can turn the entire game around
woeful snow
And unfortunately my friends are smart and don't even play this game so I'm solo always. It is what it is tho lol.
solid hinge
10 organized people vs 10 randoms is just cruelty
gray glade
we need to punish players who leave the game cuz they are losing
solid hinge
fuckin al sundan
short pecan
i did the 2k resupply points in squad conquest
gray glade
give them a loss on the record
strange dome
has duel comeback for firestorm yet? not touched that gamemode since its first week
woeful snow
Yeah honestly 2 good squads run a conquest lobby. It's so boring tho so I don't like stacking or them being on my team.
midnight nimbus
BF players ask DICE for more teamplay, but hate it when people teamplay against them
solid hinge
i leave the match when I'm losing sometimes when it's like 13 vs 24
haughty pawn
no they ask for fucking balance...
solid hinge
im not hanging around to get repeatedly shat on
midnight nimbus
maybe the solution was to make it easier to teamplay worth randoms 🤔🤔🤔
short pecan
the average bf players idea of teamwork is "press 3"
gray glade
players whined when they got teamswitched because of balance tho
woeful snow
I do't want no fucking team play bud. Don't need no team play. Can stand on my own two feet. Just want ppl who actually have their monitor turned on my team.
solid hinge
your average players actually press 3?
gray glade
even when it was between maps like in BF1
short pecan
nonono they want others to press 3 on them when they need it since they only play recon/assault
strange dome
I got to shoot at my squads and then shoot at my supply crates to get them to use them.
woeful snow
I'm tired of the timid losers who play this game. You respawn, it's not real life. Play the game. Move. Help cap points.
Bob the Builders winners too. Just get off the game.
short pecan
nothing wrong with defending
solid hinge
heh
true
I'd appreciate a couple of supports who actually know what to build
Theres some really useful fortifications sometimes but I dont have time to build them
acoustic grove
anyone playing bf1
short pecan
reminder to ALWAYS blow up the bridges on rotterdam as defender
acoustic grove
it is better than bf5
woeful snow
Some things are good to build but the random dugouts in the middle of nowhere are funny LOL.
dense bone
imo engineer build speed should be default, and egnineers should build even faster
strange dome
I like digging all the trenches on maps.
woeful snow
@dense bone True.
strange dome
some of them randoms house AA guns etc.
short pecan
the build speed is baseline on supports not just engineers
gloomy kraken
Some of the fortifications should be pre build tho, because they are in the open in the middle of gun fight so people dont have time to build all
solid hinge
tfw engineer is a useless combat role
solid hinge
Theres definitely not enough prebuilt fortifications
short pecan
(if the tanker is good)
gloomy kraken
And why is Narvik the only map with fortifications for demolished buildings?!
solid hinge
Im in like top 0.6% for repairs and I barely ever do it
gray glade
that stress on breakthrough on rotterdam to build all the fortifications on the 2nd sector
short pecan
if AA guns were better the other trait would be useful as well :^)
woeful snow
Yeah tanks can be destroyed very easy but a good tanker is insane.
gloomy kraken
I like combat engineer, i can build fortifications double the speed.
solid hinge
tfw the only good stationary is the AT gun and it doesnt benefit from engineer
short pecan
wait doesnt it also increase heat limit on the 3rd seat of the halftrack? so its not useless at all
strange dome
on twisted steel you can build some good stuff and D got 4 AT guns near it and C got 2 on the road and A got 1 watching the Bridge and F go one looking toward C.
dark sorrel
Man I wish Wolfenstein Enemy Territory was still popular
solid hinge
that thing already fires for years
short pecan
what if you want to fire for decades
solid hinge
@gloomy kraken support builds at double speed naturally, machinegunner support still has double build speed
solid hinge
Engineer literally only repairs tanks faster and overheats stationary weapons slower
it's super niche
gloomy kraken
But it says in the selection otherways
strange dome
I like to troll main spawn AA gunners by towing them around the map lol.
solid hinge
Its phrased badly in the menu
short pecan
i got 310 kills in half tracks
solid hinge
I thought engineer had it only as well
dark sorrel
Yeah Engineer is like the most situational subclass I reckon
solid hinge
But it's a natural support ability
gloomy kraken
Need to change it then... but i do accually repair tanks too...
dark sorrel
Have they let classes that aren't Medics use smoke grenades yet?
solid hinge
Honest to god they could combine the combat roles for every class and it wouldnt make a difference
strange dome
Dice has given up the class role system. at best there like some for the 5v5 mode with limits and buffs playstyles.
short pecan
recons have smokes
solid hinge
they're so shite
currently theres no reason not to have both combat roles bundled together and given to the class as natural abilities
strange dome
i want squad buffs back ;|(
solid hinge
one of them is always far more situational than the other
gloomy kraken
But dosent machinegunners suppressed spot work with engineer as well?
dark sorrel
I'd honestly prefer a class system where any class can use any gun but you get different load outs and abilities
short pecan
it only spots for yourself as engineer
solid hinge
If you suppress someone normally you get a weird shape over their head
strange dome
spotting is bugged.
dark sorrel
Like running a scout with an SMH would be sick
gloomy kraken
Aaah
dark sorrel
Smg
solid hinge
The regular suppression spot is like.. those weird stacked red lines
midnight nimbus
at this point, BFV class design is bad enough for me to want create a class
gloomy kraken
I do like the sniper spot + P08 carbine
solid hinge
like an empty triangle
strange dome
its like flares only spot for you but you get assists for a spotted kill ever tho your teammate doesnt see them on radar
woeful snow
@dark sorrel this game could use that.
solid hinge
Pathfinder is a terrible combat role
hazy wasp
they need to redo the class sytem again and make classes work properly
solid hinge
It literally only has effect when spawning
hazy wasp
also lock customizations and looks to specific classes
midnight nimbus
Pathfinder is just squad swapping with less input tax
woeful snow
Yeah the class thing and attrition is pretty bad.
dark sorrel
Tbh locking guns to classes has always been dumb but it feels worse this time around
solid hinge
slap a beacon down and swap back to sniper
hazy wasp
gadgts should be locked to roles too
gloomy kraken
Yeah, pathfinder forces the spawn beacon and i like the decoy
hazy wasp
only a pathfinder should have the spawn beacon
solid hinge
The main reason I play recon is for the spawn beacon
hazy wasp
yep
solid hinge
fuck relying on teammates for spawns
hazy wasp
also Pathfinders should have surpressed SMG's insetad of bolts
short pecan
well that was in the concept image
dark sorrel
Like why the fuck should a medic carry an SMG when most the time you need to take out the guy who killed your guy at a distance
solid hinge
tfw the only class in the game with a suppressed weapon is MEDIC
woeful snow
How about the spawns when you choose a flag. If the enemy team is there they spawn you directly on the flag lol.
strange dome
@solid hinge you not a guy who puts a spawn bacon down and retakes a point after its taken and its a back and forward..?
gloomy kraken
Also the assaults tank buster is bad. ”Spot tanks you damage” yeah and now the tank knows about me.
solid hinge
@strange dome 95% of my spawns are on my own beacon
i like holding forwards at all times
strange dome
rottendam when you want to spawn on C and you get put closer to A. /claps
woeful snow
@gloomy kraken LMAO
solid hinge
being able to spawn just outside a place is really useful
people are so dumb you can literally put a beacon down while being shot at and they'll leave it alone
it's the best gadget
gloomy kraken
Sometimes its so hard to find the beacon
solid hinge
I only use tank buster when im spawning to kill a specific tank
woeful snow
People run by beacons all the time. Hey what's that beeping? 
solid hinge
The beacon deserves a nerf honestly
strange dome
flare it up
solid hinge
should be easier to find
gloomy kraken
Well the beeping is so quiet
hazy wasp
they should of leaned into class roles more
gloomy kraken
75% time i find a beacon is when i see its glint.
solid hinge
also the beacons are bugged as well and show up as enemy beacons when friendly sometimes
short pecan
yeah just flare it, the icon even appears through walls
solid hinge
Cant rely on teammates for flares though
strange dome
or a squadmember just starts fighting from the beacons.
solid hinge
Which leads me back to maining recon
strange dome
ffs
solid hinge
woeful snow
A lot of ppl have no idea how flares work in this game. They just shoot them into the ground, wall or ceiling lol.
solid hinge
I try putting my beacons in annoying places so if a teammate spawns they'll move away from it so they dont give it away
strange dome
I miss getting flare kills from bf1 😦
dark sorrel
It's kinda weird how they perfected loads of this stuff with BF1 and now it's a massive mess IDK
solid hinge
unironically flares are useful indoors as minor area denial
gloomy kraken
Decoy only has one problem i can think of: teammates can destroy it.
solid hinge
i killed a dude earlier who was stair camping cause I shot a flare at him real quick and it made him reposition, then let me know his position when he ran back over it
short pecan
flares are super op in bf1
solid hinge
wouldn't have been able to do that without the face fire
short pecan
cant even destroy them
strange dome
barely anyone shoots at flares in bfv
woeful snow
Shooting flares at ppl in BF1 lol.
strange dome
gives no points so no point in doing it.
woeful snow
You can shoot down enemy flares in BFV. That's a nice touch tbh.
gloomy kraken
Bfv flares are too good at times as well, only smoke grenades can hide you from them.
short pecan
just shoot them
gloomy kraken
What if no line of sight?
dark sorrel
Man my dream BF game would basically be BF 2142 with the aesthetics of BF1 set in a Scythe version of the 1920s
strange dome
MAGIC FLARE
dark sorrel
Fucking mechs and shit yeee
gloomy kraken
And sometimes the hitbox is fucked
strange dome
dont worry guys we getting EA PLAY emblem codes. ( who the fuck wants EA as they emblem )
gray glade
its not bad in breakthrough
midnight nimbus
not when you're in a tank
hazy wasp
all the dumb dumbs crowd C and avoid all the other objectives
gray glade
i quite enjoy it on breakthrough, even as defense even though attackers usually win
hazy wasp
you know fuck this
strange dome
you can change up Aerodrome if you dig up the trenches
midnight nimbus
muh epic big maps where only one flag is fun to play
short pecan
aerodrome is super unbalanced in conquest
hazy wasp
sorry for the rant but im looking around and nobody is doing anything remotely tactical
short pecan
F flag should just be removed
hazy wasp
I wouldn;t mind either but I got into the hanger, killed 3 enemies and only got shot in the back, like you can get inside
just pathetic play
strange dome
and tanks sniping from main spawn. ugggh
hazy wasp
yep thats awful
strange dome
specially on the british side.
short pecan
uhh i mean E should just be removed on aerodrome
hazy wasp
they need to make tanks more durable so theyll push
dark sorrel
Breakthrough seems like the best way to play the game tbh
hazy wasp
that BF1 shit is breaking the game
short pecan
and maybe a new point between b and f
dark sorrel
Gives me big Bridges of Druzhina vibes
hazy wasp
they need an outpost between B and F for sure
midnight nimbus
tanks are plenty durable
short pecan
and some fucking cover
hazy wasp
put a camp in the valley area
midnight nimbus
they're just too slow to push
hazy wasp
speed is another factor
strange dome
but every tank now is a arty truck on most maps.
hazy wasp
yep
midnight nimbus
and assaults already carry much less rockets
short pecan
Panzerfaust does like 13-16 damage on heavy tanks
hazy wasp
just you don;t need a specialist class to kill them
short pecan
hazy wasp
you have the most popular class being the one that is the tank killer too
strange dome
Mercury is such a bad design. again the british side just main spawn camping.
midnight nimbus
maybe because playing on a epic big map fucking sucks when you're completely helpless against vehicles
strange dome
EPIC? that costs boins bruh 🙃
woeful snow
B I N S
strange dome
ill buy a cute anime cat girl for boins if they release one for the japanese.
solid hinge
aerodrome sucks on conquest
actually it sucks always
it's just also unbalanced on conquest
dark dawn
Honestly imo everyone needs to stop complaining about boins because the mtx in bf5 isn’t actually that bad
woeful snow
Yeah the flag placements on a few maps are really bad.
solid hinge
hamada is in favour of germans
their spawn gives them access to basically the entire map
once you grab the back three if you hold them you've won
strange dome
remember when the germans just started with all the flag already captured lol
solid hinge
if germans get the back three then their spawn is RIGHT next to D
so its piss easy to take that as well
woeful snow
They spawn next to C too right?
hazy wasp
its almsot like the game had fuck all time in development
solid hinge
..I might be confusing C and D
hazy wasp
and is now suffering because the changes decided upon in haste are fucking up our enjoyment
solid hinge
germans have the advantage on aerodrome as well
their spawn is right next to the points while allied spawn is super far back
dark sorrel
Idk what they were thinking with the turnaround on BFV
woeful snow
Yeah control the C flag at Aerodrome and you win the game
solid hinge
and DFG is super easy for germans to hold while C is really hard for brits to hold
strange dome
when you read about the map makers. They only have 1 person actually making the map.
woeful snow
I like Marita and the flag placement is pretty bad there too.
dark sorrel
Especially as BF 1 was super polished even at launch and has great map variety
short pecan
aerodrome map layout reminds me of rogue transmission in bf4
solid hinge
brits again can get spawn camped a lot easier on marita
strange dome
Marita got a big fuck off castle. "its for show". like Mercary there lot of wasted space.
solid hinge
holding C on marita is SO much easier as germans
woeful snow
This game needs a Tsaristyn type map lol. Just 3 flags and meat grind it up.
dark sorrel
I feel that they were made to make BF V whereas 1 was a passion project
strange dome
no one asked for it!
short pecan
so you'll get your meatgrinder
strange dome
give me a original design!
woeful snow
@dark sorrel Yeah 1 felt like they wanted to capture ww1. This feels like they just made it to make it.
hazy wasp
the lewis gun 1 frame killing me is getting really old
dark sorrel
Like so much about it feels so weird in comparison
Like the launch trailer for 1 vs V
short pecan
bf5 is just a regular shooter just with ww2 era weapons and vehicles
woeful snow
Lewis gun is pretty insane.
strange dome
I want to skii in MP. ( tbh that "war story" is pretty bad ).
woeful snow
BF1 had some good war stories. This game I haven't even tried any of them.
solid hinge
they're shite
dark sorrel
Also how 1 managed to successfully problematise diversity and representation during the First World War and V fucked it up big time
strange dome
behavoir alyla
short pecan
the screams
solid hinge
im naughty now
strange dome
SCREAMING AWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWW MEDIC
woeful snow
I'm fawking dying here medic! Medic looks at you and runs away. Ayee lol.
solid hinge
tfw every bayonet voiceline as a lady is KEINE GNADE
strange dome
the two elite females skin. uggh
hazy wasp
''Aghhh fuckin medic''
dark sorrel
1 challenged the perception of World War I as being a conflict solely fought by white people in Europe and was backed up by loads of research, cool uniforms and shit
V was just like "well you can be a woman in Fortnite"
hazy wasp
hey to be fair medics tend to lsiten
strange dome
and hearing your tanker with a female voice just makes me cringe alittle.
hazy wasp
oh great devastation another shit conquest map
solid hinge
you get the MAB
hazy wasp
Add emotes in BC3
vestal locust
Goes to revive teammates and sees elite skin .... walks away to pick up non elite skin player
woeful snow
Hey the MAB is fun tho!
vestal locust
Yes... I did that 😏
short pecan
elites would have been so much better if they were modular
dark sorrel
I honestly think they could pull off the gender equal armies and fucking stupid uniforms if they set the game 200 years in the future in a contuinity where World War 1 never ended
woeful snow
Elites would be much better if they were the Trench Raider LOL.
vestal locust
Don’t get me started on wahmen lol
woeful snow
That kit was ridiculous lmao.
solid hinge
i think the intent was some kind of follow up from bf1s alternate telling
they dont seem to have actually said that anywhere
strange dome
I mean they made some interesting single player characters. put them in MP? ;x
solid hinge
If I had to see Billy Bridger in multiplayer I would unironically stop playing
woeful snow
Phantom of the Opera ftw
hazy wasp
is it too much to ask for a balanced, low bug level game over half a year into the games life cycle
short pecan
yes
solid hinge
yes
hazy wasp
Billy fackin bridger
strange dome
but his pal is good. and you can sing with them.
solid hinge
swbf2 has been out for like 2 and a half years and it's still got bugs from launch in it
bfv is doing well by comparison
woeful snow
Yes too much to ask. Plz purchase your boins and move out of line plz.
solid hinge
honestly as bad as the invisibility bug was it's not as bad as when they broke explosive shot in battlefront
strange dome
reading up on the new APEX EA Surprise mechanics. BFV is next O_O
upper vault
Rip the AT mines
It’s nerfed so badly
One at mine is 7 damage?
lol dice what are you doing?
short pecan
"nerfed"
solid hinge
they didnt nerf the AT mines they just broke them
dark sorrel
What's even the point
gray glade
and they disappear when you die
short pecan
they are bugged
strange dome
my mines do 6!
woeful snow
I purchased Battlefront 2 but have never played it. Went on Star Wars kick one day lol.
solid hinge
cause they're competent developers!
short pecan
sometimes they do literally ZERO damage
solid hinge
Battlefront 2 is unironically fun sometimes
short pecan
sometimes they'll do like ... 6
solid hinge
just.. dont play any hero characters
woeful snow
Man I miss Limpet charges.
upper vault
I remember when I put 2 mines and the tank exploded but that was months ago
DICE what are you doing
woeful snow
Blowing up walls. Throwing them on Tanks.
solid hinge
limpet charges are in single player
upper vault
This is genuinely funny right now
short pecan
yeah limpets were cool
solid hinge
or the magnetic mine at least
upper vault
7 damage for one mine
dark sorrel
Battlefront 2 dissapointed me because I went into it expecting Battlefield with star wars skins
gloomy kraken
Panzerknacker
short pecan
class-based tps i guess
strange dome
i like the rolly bois 😦
hazy wasp
like as someone whos come in and salvaged steaming firestorms of prohjcts back together, they need a project manager to get heads of areas and fix them asap
solid hinge
original battlefront 2 was more like battlefield
upper vault
It’s interesting how in one game I played I had 12 deaths and 1 kill.
rich ember
@hazy wasp what projects?
solid hinge
they borked the recent ones
upper vault
It’s been another week
hazy wasp
Web, design, marketing projects
upper vault
And no news of Al Soondone
solid hinge
as expected of dice
solid hinge
they're still feexing that blob
rich ember
those things are different than video game projects i'd think
solid hinge
my honest theory is that they just cant use frostbite properly