RPGs could lock on to lazer locks in the beta I believe it was.
#battlefield-legacy-titles
spring aurora
midnight nimbus
RPGs were lock-on with the tracker dart in BFH
hollow mulch
Beep beep beepbeeeeeeeeeeeeeBOOM ded
spring aurora
I loved running tanks with incendiary secondary. That thing was crazy strong at crowd control. In rush it would nuke the MCOMS where no one could ever disarm it
limber anchor
Rouge transmission
spring aurora
Locker for me. Hate that spam fest.
hollow mulch
Oof locker is love hate for me
solid hinge
Metro is just worse tbh
limber anchor
I love locker and metro lol
solid hinge
It's more stalematey than the War on Terror
spring aurora
Ive had fun with it, but overall I wasnt a fan of how it played most the time. Always turned into a stalemate that wasnt fun overall.
hollow mulch
If your able to flank with smoke and spawn beacon, the back raging is the best feeling in the world. Stack those killstreaks.
solid hinge
Best map imo is Silk road
spring aurora
Lancang Dam was good in some modes, but awful in conquest. I hated that it had auto base AAs and then mobile AA. Literally killed the map for air vehicles.
hollow mulch
870 kills when appearing behind the entire enemy team:
"That's one kill, two kills, three kills, four kills."
Just bam bam bam and theres goes whole squads.
limber anchor
I loved golmud railway
solid hinge
and from base BF4, Siege of Shanghai and parcel storm
hollow mulch
Lancang dam would be better without mobile aa
spring aurora
Yeah, Siege and Paracel were my favorites. I did enjoy Lancang in some modes.
hollow mulch
Map is way too small for that thing
solid hinge
I really like the island in the middle imo
But I wish you were allowed to go on the dam
hollow mulch
^^^
spring aurora
@hollow mulch If the mobile AA had active radars, forget it. Map is locked down.
limber anchor
I liked gulf of Oman too
hollow mulch
Silk Road is a favorite for me. Basically golmud but with no aa
Best air map ever
Just wish it had attack jets too
spring aurora
Yeah, Silk road is like shooting fish in a barrel for an attack jet. Literally all you have to worry about is another jet.
solid hinge
Silk road I think harkens to the classic desert maps of old BF games
spring aurora
On rush I should say
hollow mulch
Silk road is also a great tank map too
solid hinge
I dunno, the feels
I just wish these sorts of maps had disguinishable attack lines
in silk road when the enemy team has their points tanks just attack wherever
Not really forming a line
hollow mulch
That would be rush
solid hinge
Or conquest assault
hollow mulch
Your looking for
midnight nimbus
yea, problem is that CQ is just a garbage mode
solid hinge
Rush is defined by strict boundaries
spring aurora
Operation Firestorm on rush was another map great for racking up attack jet kills.
hollow mulch
Conquest is a more open ended sandbox gameplay
midnight nimbus
no defined frontlines and inconsistent action on most modes
midnight nimbus
moment to moment action means nothing in terms of the greater outcome
solid hinge
Real armies don't capture unclaimed terrain
midnight nimbus
individual actions mean nothing
i think a Chain Link/CQA hybrid would be the ideal large scale mode
solid hinge
yeah
midnight nimbus
capture territory in a meaningful way
defined frontline action
none of the no-flow nonsense like CQ
solid hinge
maybe even one with specific landmark with points over them (Like refineries or power stations) that give the team extra planes or something
hollow mulch
Ehh
midnight nimbus
eh, extra vehicles breaks balance a bit much
hollow mulch
I'd still like my old fashioned conquest game modes
midnight nimbus
actually, with asymmetric CQA-like play, extra vehicles are fine
increases the attacker's momentum
hollow mulch
Let's me pick and choose my fights
spring aurora
I played Obliteration almost exclusively in BF4 until it came dead. Then I went to rush and cq finally.
midnight nimbus
you can pick and choose your fights in any mode
engage and disengage as you please
CQ is 1 KPM shitter nonsense
hollow mulch
Yeah, but none of them have massive vehicle warfare or the ability to parachute behind enemy lines and back cap
Pulling a clutch win in conquest is a great feeling
midnight nimbus
back capping contributes to the no-flow nonsense
hollow mulch
Also like the open ended choices
midnight nimbus
Chain Link = flanking still means something, and you have open ended choices
without breaking flow or defined areas of action
spring aurora
I will say, I did enjoy some BF5 matches in the beta where it was like 1 point wins. It lead to alot of nail biting games. Thank god they did away with BF1s awful conquest scoring
hollow mulch
Meh
midnight nimbus
BF1 CQ scoring statistically results in similar outcomes as older BFs
it's map design, not the scoring system
hollow mulch
Regular conquest still holds a special place in my heart, nothing can replace that
midnight nimbus
and the lack of comeback mechanics
solid hinge
yeah despite alot of "casual" outcry BF1 managed to have some non casual features
Like pilot and tanker kits
spring aurora
It was scoring system. It made comebacks like impossible due to how it worked. Majority didnt mean anything really.
hollow mulch
Extra modes are fine, but something about large scale conquest keeps me coming back to it
solid hinge
no one shotting tanks, tanks work more like armored transports
midnight nimbus
@spring aurora telemetry proves otherwise
solid hinge
conquest scoring
hollow mulch
Operations is something that I really, really like tho
midnight nimbus
the scoring system isn't what makes comebacks so impossible in BF1
majority rule had its own set of issues
hollow mulch
Charging forth blowing the whistle, taking objectives and pushing forward is a great feeling
midnight nimbus
and point scoring with the BF system should work in a less linear fashion
spring aurora
The need to hold pretty much every single flag in matches, just to make a 100 point comeback was terrible in BF1. I mean you hold like 6 of 7 and a 100 point lead would be like a mountain impossible to climb. BF4 and now BF5 can have huge swings in points if you hold more flags than enemy. Thats how it should have been in BF1.
hollow mulch
I think the reason why conquest is my favorite game mode is of its sandbox nature
midnight nimbus
CQ is so inconsistent man
run around for 10 minutes, see no one
then run into a group 3x the size of yours
being a good player means so little
you just run around and shoot people in the back
hollow mulch
Just use transports a lot, and keep spawning near contested points
midnight nimbus
lack of forced action makes gunfights so boring and one-sided
hollow mulch
I never had issues clearing whole points
hollow mulch
Or lack of action.
midnight nimbus
if spawning near contested points is what makes the game good, why not make the only relevant points on the map the contested ones?
sacred junco
are really really boring
sacred junco
then might as well just dont bother with 64 players
hollow mulch
Because their not sandboxes. Their great for people who like rush, but some of us just like to screw around.
sacred junco
beyond 32 single frontlines are tacticless clusterfucks
midnight nimbus
beyond 32p for anything is a clusterfuck
sacred junco
conquest layouts can at least spread action
and allow you to engage at needed points
spring aurora
I still prefer conquest in 40-44 player servers. I like having a little less of the push waves of players into points. I like less players so you can sneak around a bit more. Also alot less getting shot randomly.
midnight nimbus
CQ small was nice
hollow mulch
For infantry maybe
spring aurora
I didnt like CQ small only due to map size.
CQ large maps with 40-44 players in BF4 was amazing.
hollow mulch
But I'm more vehicular focused nowadays
midnight nimbus
vehicles in ~40p counts is nice
hollow mulch
Yeh
hollow mulch
For medium sized maps I suppose like zavod
midnight nimbus
zavod 64p is tolerable
sacred junco
i can hardly call Zavod medium sized
spring aurora
64 players, especially in BF4, felt like almost too many players on some maps. They didnt have enough room to spread out.
hollow mulch
Maps like Caspian border or Golmud needs that 64
sacred junco
it just empty spaces with most combat in small corridors and ridges in one factoryt
sacred junco
Caspian's biggest issues is the C point
spring aurora
Yeah, there was maps that needed more players still, but alot of the vanilla BF4 maps were not quite big enough to warrant 64 players for me.
sacred junco
Its just not a very engaging spot to fight
and there its just a giant swamp under it that's not very fun to circle around or flank either
Issue with BF4 for me
hollow mulch
Slower gameplay is preferred for me sometimes. If I want a constant infantry CoD clusterfuck I'd go play metro
spring aurora
I preferred the slower 40 or so player conquest large cause it was more going with squad and capping stuff. Less of the 2 or 3 squads attacking flags with just sheer numbers moving across the map.
sacred junco
and slightly small concentrated maps are clusterfucks
solid hinge
I have a solution
hollow mulch
Sometimes defending a point against a couple of enemies is fun for me
solid hinge
lower the player speed
sacred junco
yeah
hollow mulch
More layed back
midnight nimbus
why does fast gameplay have to immediately draw the reeeee CoD is bad comparison
sacred junco
but still slow
midnight nimbus
you can have fast BF gameplay that can still be dialed back as the player chooses
solid hinge
Really I thought bf1 was faster
midnight nimbus
but slow BF gameplay cannot be sped up as the player chooses
solid hinge
ngl soldiers in bf4 ran around like literal headless chickens
hollow mulch
Bf1 ttk is way slower
spring aurora
They changed BF1 movement alot since launch.
sacred junco
I don't like the fact that modern BF games gave too much agency to a single person
All guise of being some kinda tacticool squad based gameplay becomes moot
when it becomes a twitch shooter
hollow mulch
Sure, but forced teamwork is frustrating af
sacred junco
where you have little need or reliance for team beside killing a jet or throwing packs once in a while
hollow mulch
Things like lower ammo count in bfv really irk me
hollow mulch
That's a simulator, not an arcade shooter
midnight nimbus
the individual should be strong, but the team should be stronger
solid hinge
No it's not lmao
sacred junco
Removing agency and capacity of individual units does force teamplay
midnight nimbus
you don't enable teamwork by making the individual weak
spring aurora
I like working as a squad. I dont think limiting ammo was the right way to push that though. Which is why that has changed since the beta.
sacred junco
if everyone could heal tank and dps
midnight nimbus
and incapable of operating without a team
sacred junco
then overwatch has less reliance on teamplay
midnight nimbus
you specialize your team with different roles that can do certain things better
sacred junco
Individual has to be weak
midnight nimbus
that's teamwork
solid hinge
It's an arcade shooter with massive elements of teamplay
sacred junco
to some extent
solid hinge
hence making it a "simulator"
hollow mulch
The best way to do it is to give us the option to teamwork or not. Dont punish us for going solo when we need or want to
midnight nimbus
teamwork is a mentality, not a prerequisite for play
sacred junco
the issue is BF is too large of a game
spring aurora
When I play with friends, regardless of the BF game, we still ran classes that helped the squad out.
sacred junco
to make any kind of effort for teamplay really meaningful
midnight nimbus
especially in a 64p game where VOIP isn't realistic
sacred junco
if you can just go 60-1 on your own
if I can sprint around by myself with the best gun throwing medpacks
midnight nimbus
you can't force your friends to play with you, can you can't force blueberries to throw you ammo when you need it
sacred junco
I ain't gonna try to force some cohesion
hollow mulch
Bf4 had it right. You can do well by yourself, but if you team up you can be unstoppable. But the game doesnt punish for going solo.
spring aurora
Lets be real, blueberries dont throw ammo, or health or revive.
midnight nimbus
forced teamplay is an unnecessary arbitrary limit on player skill
50% of players have never thrown ammo in BF1
spring aurora
Sorry, they do revive, but its a poverty one and they stick me with 20 health so a sneeze can kill me.
sacred junco
its no an issue of force, its an issue of promoting cohesive behavior to ensure the basic dynamic is more team based
any kind of teamplay mechanic is forced to some extent
if I cant do anything that someone else does is that forced and bad?
midnight nimbus
yes, promote teamplay by making it strong, not a prerequisite to function
hollow mulch
You can be pretty effective with a tank in bf4, but get a soflam gunner and your suddenly a two man death machine.
midnight nimbus
^
sacred junco
Then BF is an utter shite game
where cohesion is impossible
and people who voip will stomp anyone
because the basic mechanic actively discourages any kind of effort at natural teamplay
spring aurora
@hollow mulch My friend and I would run tank with whatever setup he wanted, and I would run the incendiary setup and it was a death machine on rush. You can pretty much lock down large areas of maps due to the range of the fire. Was so good.
hollow mulch
Give us the ability to play well by ourselves, but make it so that teamwork enhances the effectiveness of your team by a lot. Because sometimes you just get stuck with a shitty team and I dont want to be punished for that.
midnight nimbus
BF1 teamwork is already really good
sacred junco
it just means that enemy with 10kpm and l33t skill wil carry
just because he shoots better
midnight nimbus
have you ever played against a good PC EU clanstack?
midnight nimbus
exactly
sacred junco
thats all it takes
midnight nimbus
that's all teamwork is man
sacred junco
No
hollow mulch
Cuz they work together
midnight nimbus
the mentality to coordinate
sacred junco
its mostly just they kill good
hollow mulch
No
sacred junco
ppl with 60-4 with 100 star assaults in fort de vaux will win by the nature of just killing things better
not in Red Orchestra necessarily in comaprison
or even BF2
hollow mulch
That is so far from the truth. Sure their good, but things as simple as talking is what makes them so unstoppable. Callouts and revives, solfams and coordination.
spring aurora
Being able to kill and communicate goes a long way in the game. Some squads can run trains on servers cause they are actually that good.
sacred junco
You won't fucking go 60-2 solo because you are a good shot by default
spring aurora
Sticking together and talking is huge.
hollow mulch
^^^
hollow mulch
That's the point I think
midnight nimbus
is VOIP not teamwork?
sacred junco
because the default gameplay is just a clusterfuck in most scenarios
midnight nimbus
teamwork needs to be optional in a blueberry game
sacred junco
its not like SQUAD where teamwork is mandatory
midnight nimbus
because BF isn't Squad
sacred junco
or like CoD where size is small enoguht that solo carry is still viable
hollow mulch
But BF is not fucking squad, or arma, or some other sim bs
sacred junco
but BF is in an awkward spot
sacred junco
but its fucking 64 players
midnight nimbus
arcade != casual by nature though
sacred junco
and 4 ppl in voip and good stats will always win
and in pub servers
thats all it takes
games are rarely balanced
hollow mulch
^^^
midnight nimbus
"thats all it takes"
sacred junco
You know a match is over the first 2 minutes 99% of the tiem
yet games last 30+ minutes
spring aurora
In a 64 player server, not always will that 4 ppl win out. A team full of players, regardless of communication, who know to stand on flags and cap stuff etc can overcome a really good squad. But to be fair, how often do you get 32 players on your team who play the objective.
Its rare.
sacred junco
because games are so lopsided by 4 people to carry everything yet game is supposed to pretend you can try to communicate and cooperate as a team somehow to overcome that
that just means then that team just has good solo palyers too
midnight nimbus
that's why attrition can't exist
sacred junco
attrition is fine by me
midnight nimbus
unconscious teamplay needs to be effective enough to overcome imbalances
sacred junco
because it at least forces cohesion
spring aurora
Well attrition is barely existing at this point. Its been tweaked alot already.
midnight nimbus
because it forces zerging
sacred junco
I don't need to run around in assault
sacred junco
and spawn wherever I want all the time being self sufficient
Not necesarily still
BFV is slow enough at least in what I played
midnight nimbus
increasing individual autonomy is what prevents the zerging and nade spam you hate so much
sacred junco
that zerging is too boring to form often
and spawn slow enough to not make it last long
plus revive is slow and unsafe
hollow mulch
I dont want to be forced to work with others in bf. Sure squadding up with friends is fun too, but at the end of the day I dont feel like getting bogged down by some random blueberries.
midnight nimbus
too boring doesn't stop zerging from happening man
midnight nimbus
zerging is always boring
sacred junco
Group mentality is all about seraching for action and fun
amber notch
medics are going to be pretty scary in BFV
midnight nimbus
but people love sitting in Metro/Locker stalemates
amber notch
Same with Supports
midnight nimbus
medic is by far the best class in BFV
sacred junco
but it requires someone to more actively tried to form zergs
amber notch
Assault not so much
sacred junco
because in BF1 maps are more closely knit
amber notch
Support will be nasty when people get the mg42
midnight nimbus
zergs aren't actively formed
sacred junco
and people are general fast
spring aurora
I like using support. Dropping ammo is free points left and right.
midnight nimbus
981 RPM 250 rnd or 1200 RPM 50 rnd 😂
sacred junco
Ofcourse I concede
midnight nimbus
4-6 BTK
spring aurora
I spend more time throwing ammo or meds than I do shooting it feels like.
sacred junco
that I don't think attrition works in linear clusterfucks even more so
hollow mulch
I just want the option to Rambo whenever and wherever I want
sacred junco
Airborne was awful imo
midnight nimbus
^
amber notch
@spring aurora you get unlimited ammo pouches now
hollow mulch
Why cant I have that?
midnight nimbus
the option to lone wolf should exist
sacred junco
Its not impossible tho
midnight nimbus
but squadplay should be better
sacred junco
its just kinda annoying to do it properly
hollow mulch
But your PUNISHED for it!
spring aurora
@amber notch Im gonna make it rain ammo
midnight nimbus
lone wolfing should be decently effective and viable
sometimes you just have to lone wolf man
sacred junco
why are people so angry at the idea of being punished for trying one playstyle>?
midnight nimbus
because it's a necessary reality in many cases
sacred junco
I am punished for trying to use a medic with no pouches
hollow mulch
Just give me my old ammo count back, without this extra busy work with this health bs and I'll be good to go
amber notch
You dont need to be put into a squad to play
sacred junco
Yes it is
midnight nimbus
using a medic with no pouches is your choice
amber notch
lone wolfing is pretty easy
sacred junco
are games just some giant hugbox where you are allowed to do anything you want?
amber notch
just use a powerful smg or lmg with a high firerate and you are in
hollow mulch
That's the core of Battlefield lol
sacred junco
See
hollow mulch
Being able to play however, whenever, wherever you want
midnight nimbus
if the rest of my squad wants to sit in place and get fucked by a zerg, what am i supposed to do, sit there and go 0.5 K/D with them?
amber notch
midnight nimbus
^ BF community loves being bad at the game
hollow mulch
Its why conquest is so popular, and why the massive sandbox gameplay is something that really sticks with me
midnight nimbus
BF reddit: i'm a 4-30 medic, but i run in and get revives and it's FUN
hollow mulch
Lol
midnight nimbus
"i go 0.5 KPM and revive people in terrible places!!!"
sacred junco
CSGO is not fun and doesn't encourage ppl to do whatever they want at the expense of getting bodied immdiately
Red Orchestra 2 is not THAT simulatory
amber notch
sacred junco
and it actively discourages certain behavior
midnight nimbus
BF community plays a shooter and doesn't even want to kill people
hollow mulch
CSGO is more for a hardcore audience
amber notch
same with hardline
hollow mulch
Cant even begin to compare the two
sacred junco
and it does force some cohesion even amongst players who can't even chat in voip
midnight nimbus
CS:GO community has a non-casual mindset
hollow mulch
^^^
sacred junco
I just want BF to be a bit more like RO
midnight nimbus
teamwork isn't a mechanic, casual isn't dictated by mechanics
sacred junco
rather than Rambos in giant field
hollow mulch
Well the old guard doesnt
midnight nimbus
they're both mindsets of the community
midnight nimbus
CS:GO could easily be a casual game
hollow mulch
Because thats not battlefield
sacred junco
But it isn't
midnight nimbus
because the community cares about winning
sacred junco
because the mechanics are harsh enough that it weeds out ppl wanting casual fun
hollow mulch
Pff
amber notch
Im not joking
midnight nimbus
mechanics can affect mindset, but it's still up to the community at the end of the day
hollow mulch
Bf esports is a joke
sacred junco
and the gameplay is curated to be heavily centric of winning short competitive rounds
midnight nimbus
problem with BF is that playing to win at its highest level is unfun
and cheesy
bc bad mechanics
no Ammo 2.0 man
amber notch
aek
sacred junco
Yes because everyone is rambo alone
amber notch
hollow mulch
What's wrong with playing for kills?
sacred junco
but the moment you put teamwork
hollow mulch
What's wrong with ramboing?
midnight nimbus
playing for kills = play to win
sacred junco
its just giant cheese clusterfuck
sacred junco
Trains of medics reviving each other in Seine
midnight nimbus
if you're ramboing and doing well, you're generally winning
amber notch
About 78% of the community play for kills
sacred junco
The game is made so easy to solo
midnight nimbus
if you're playing for max KPM, you're generally on an objective
sacred junco
small amt of teamwork breaks the game
amber notch
the other 22% play for wins
midnight nimbus
bc that's where enemies are
midnight nimbus
playing for kills and playing for wins aren't mutually exclusive at all
midnight nimbus
they're more mutually inclusive if anything
amber notch
you can play with your squad and cry when you are rekt by an Aek
sacred junco
kills are meaningless when they are medic training behind
amber notch
hollow mulch
I want the option to play any playstyle I want without penalties
sacred junco
its more important to properly clear areas
amber notch
sacred junco
I can go 20 ks with a shotgun to make no progress in attacks
hollow mulch
Dont punish me for picking a playstyle I've stuck with for most of my bf life
amber notch
Thats because your team is probably garbage
hollow mulch
^^^
sacred junco
Isn't that hard to go and pick up an ammo or med kit?
midnight nimbus
if you can go on a 20 killstreak with no progression towards winning, that's a map/game mode problem
sacred junco
Is no health regen bad mechanic?
amber notch
Just because you get 20kills with a shotgun doesn't mean your team is good?
midnight nimbus
if you're playing a shooter, killing people should be tied to success
hollow mulch
It's pointless and extra busywork that nobody needs
sacred junco
Yes, but BF is an intersection of a lot of mechanics
amber notch
I get avg 65kills a game and yet we still manage to lose
sacred junco
that breaks with actual cohesion
amber notch
🤔
midnight nimbus
BFV = unnecessary busyworkfield
hollow mulch
^^^
midnight nimbus
press E to do everything
sacred junco
I like unnecssray busy work
midnight nimbus
when so many things can be automated
sacred junco
because it forces ppl to slow down
midnight nimbus
then add input buffers
sacred junco
rather than hop into wherever instantly
sacred junco
I don't like the idea RDR2 is going for
but there is a reason R* put silly slowness to the game
midnight nimbus
there's ways to slow the pace down without increasing busywork
sacred junco
to give you time to make considerations and make decisions before just going straight into the fray
midnight nimbus
RDR2 has silly slowness because Rockstar is fucking retarded
hollow mulch
RDR2 works becuase theres a world to immerse and enjoy yourself. But in BF nobody gives a crap about that.
midnight nimbus
busywork != increased decision making
sacred junco
It is
midnight nimbus
in BFV, you have press E to get ammo
sacred junco
I have to decide if I want to just sprint or delay myself to grab ammo
amber notch
you do
sacred junco
thats a decison with imapct
midnight nimbus
how does that increase decison making
sacred junco
that is more than enough to at least curtail absolutely chicken headed gameplay
sacred junco
of just spawn->run->shoot->die->spawn
hollow mulch
Yeah, impact as in wsting extra time doing pointless busy work just so I can get more then the three kills my current ammo count allows
amber notch
just push them, they cant do anything
midnight nimbus
if you want to break spawn -> shoot -> die, repeat, you add input buffers
sacred junco
if DICE can't go back to making Refractor and want to slow down the game whilst still allowing people to rambo
this is probably what they thought best
sacred junco
BFV is still a very rambo centric game
hollow mulch
Pff
sacred junco
But ppl are getting mad because it added busy work
midnight nimbus
DICE also thinks forced TAA is the best method of making white text visible on white background
sacred junco
if its enough to get ppl riled up
amber notch
LOL
midnight nimbus
so they're clearly not making great choices in BFV
sacred junco
its meainginful
hollow mulch
Just give me the extra ammo right off the bat, and I'll be good
sacred junco
We are discussing it as actual fans here tho
hollow mulch
Having to constantly refill every single time after respawning is a chore
amber notch
Just have a support with you
midnight nimbus
"lets add attrition to increase teamwork"
no one throws ammo anyways
"no one has ammo, and people can't play the game, what do we do?"
adds ammo depots, so people have ammo, teamwork isn't increased
sacred junco
Dying is inconsequential enough in BF anyways
hollow mulch
Punished for dying
midnight nimbus
dying is the punishment man
amber notch
They have no limit on ammo pouches now
sacred junco
And spawn in 10 seconds?
hollow mulch
As if dying and getting g sent back to spawn isnt enough
amber notch
so just chuck them
midnight nimbus
not being able to shoot people in a shooter is the punishment
hollow mulch
^^^
sacred junco
pretty inconsequentail for anything not Rush
amber notch
tbh
midnight nimbus
too bad tanks are furniture in BFV
amber notch
still are in BFV
hollow mulch
Forcing teamwork in a casual game like bf is never a good idea
amber notch
tbh
solid hinge
Like they had auto regen health ggs
midnight nimbus
yeah, maybe because tanks are indestructible killing machines
midnight nimbus
upon conception
solid hinge
They're not supposed to be
hollow mulch
It has always been casual lol
sacred junco
BF2 was boring as fuck solo
midnight nimbus
lets make BF non-casual and realistic now
amber notch
battlefield will always be a casual game
midnight nimbus
tanks now require 36 RPG shots to disable
solid hinge
I wonder if people during Battlefield 2's release complained about it being too casual like this
Did they?
sacred junco
you can't tell me BF2 is the same as BFBC2 mechanically
solid hinge
I really honestly wonder
sacred junco
You mean
sacred junco
have a single IED disable tanks instantly
hollow mulch
BFV tanks operate more like war thunder now lol
amber notch
^
sacred junco
and tanks accelerate really slowly
midnight nimbus
a single IED might disable a WW2 tank man
you need a big ass IED to slow down an M1 Abrams
hollow mulch
Same goes for planes, although in the beta they REALLY fucked up plane mechanics
sacred junco
I did enjoy the upgunned Valentine getting really shaky
midnight nimbus
shoot at moving pixels and hope they die
solid hinge
At least the plane ammo mechanics function the same as bf1942
solid hinge
use up ammo, return to the airfield / resupply base
midnight nimbus
just have 3D spotting
sacred junco
low settings and kill wookies
hollow mulch
Also, the machine gun in tanks, for some reason the bullets travel really, really slowly
amber notch
Nah
hollow mulch
More like a water hose really
amber notch
they travel fine
midnight nimbus
is clicking an orange icon inherently more casual than clicking a soldier?
sacred junco
they just drop very quickly
amber notch
its just the mg34 in the tanks tbh, and probably latency
hollow mulch
Like were not shooting 9mm rounds here, please go faster
midnight nimbus
nah, BFV tank MG velocity is really low
amber notch
Seeming as the first 2 bullets wont actually register
midnight nimbus
bc BF reddit loves watching bullet drop
sacred junco
and if you can spot someone you can't actually see by spamming it yes
inland flax
noob here- what do you guys think is a good starting lmg to get after the lewis gun? im only rank 0-1 btw
amber notch
@inland flax BF1?
midnight nimbus
time-based passive spotting man
inland flax
yea
midnight nimbus
metal gear style
inland flax
on xbox also
hollow mulch
Bf4 tanks were glass cannons, far from indestructible
midnight nimbus
if you're looking at someone long enough, you're clearly trying to spot them
hollow mulch
Just one jihad jeep and your dead
amber notch
sacred junco
I can kinda dig that
inland flax
yea
sacred junco
Spotting was just q macroable
sacred junco
It does work for everyone
midnight nimbus
with buffers
sacred junco
its just harder
hollow mulch
People need to stand out more in bfv
amber notch
and the pixel turning out to be an enemy somewhere in their spawn
inland flax
also how do I get my squad to spot enimies better
sacred junco
lets see what the haze effect does
hollow mulch
Near impossible to see the enemy sometimes
midnight nimbus
BFV visibility is just atrocious
inland flax
so then i can see them on the mortar interface
sacred junco
I found it easy to spot ppl in the sun
hollow mulch
Sure the sun
sacred junco
room contrast was an issue for me
hollow mulch
But the SHADE
hollow mulch
Literally invisible
sacred junco
hope that's an across the board fix
midnight nimbus
uh lets see if that tweet holds true
limber anchor
The particle effects were insane too
hollow mulch
I've looked straight at people who were hiding in a dark corner and I never spot them
midnight nimbus
little faith, after the forced TAA thing
hollow mulch
Not spotting lol
atomic willow
bunch of nansies
sacred junco
You'd love Killzone 2
hollow mulch
Just, I mean I couldn't see them
sacred junco
Blur and ashes off the wazoo
midnight nimbus
not being able to see anything is skill!
real skilled players just spam into random dark corners, hoping someone is there
hollow mulch
Literally blending into the wall
amber notch
lol
midnight nimbus
ah yes, sitting in dark corners is skill
amber notch
sacred junco
by my calculation
midnight nimbus
BF isn't a stealth game
sacred junco
a black female is the best soldier with best camo and small hitbox
hollow mulch
Omg, again with the realism argument
In a casual arcade shooter.
sacred junco
tho they hitbox is technically the same
midnight nimbus
hitboxes don't change with customization
pure veldt
the stupid game just needs to come out
sacred junco
yeah
midnight nimbus
needs to come out in 6 months
hollow mulch
It's either one or the other, you cant mix realism and casual
sacred junco
it just mixes the realism bit rather weakly
atomic willow
its coming out this month chill out
hollow mulch
BF is the farthest thing from realism as far as gameplay goes
pure veldt
pretend you have no ammo and have to only scavenge exact weapon ammo
midnight nimbus
you can have arcade mechanics with elements of authenticity
pure veldt
thatll help your realism
hollow mulch
Nothing about BF is "realistic" apart from the visuals
midnight nimbus
but fuck realism
hollow mulch
And even then
atomic willow
IE most fps titles
midnight nimbus
BF is an arcade combined arms shooters with objective modes that aim to further enable shooting people
midnight nimbus
and for some reason, BFV has mechanics that want to do away with the shooting part
arcade is a broad definition
hollow mulch
If you want your impossible to see camo, forced team play, and objective based only gameplay go play arma, becuade bf is definitely not for you.
midnight nimbus
BF is very much arcade
hollow mulch
It's very, very arcade
sacred junco
But then BF4 tries to add so much to the shooting part
atomic willow
its arcade under the broadest of definitions
atomic willow
anyone who claims the only realistic aspect is the visuals clearly hasnt played kingdom hearts
midnight nimbus
BF4 is painfully slow outside of locker and metro man
blissful otter
adds so much to the shooting part
midnight nimbus
1 KPM shitter play 🤢
blissful otter
Can you further explain that?
hollow mulch
Why is slower gameplay an issue
sacred junco
hard to balance either way it feels like to me
fast sparrow
@midnight nimbus and its a good thing
sacred junco
I don't think it is
hollow mulch
I prefer it that way sometimes
sacred junco
But fast BF4 is just too much for me
midnight nimbus
maps should be fast by default, because as a player, you can play as slowly as you want
hollow mulch
Reason why I like conquest is cuz I can choose between the two
midnight nimbus
you can be a conservative 1 KPM shitter in CoD
solid hinge
Yeah I played bf4 and its waaaaay too fast
midnight nimbus
you can't be a 5 KPM player on open world no-flow CQ
sacred junco
There is a threshold for some ppl
hollow mulch
My goodness, it's not that fast
midnight nimbus
fast by default = allows you to control how slow you play
slow by default = can't control how fast you can play
blissful otter
Half the speed on the crouch speed
sacred junco
you can be slow
blissful otter
Running was fine
midnight nimbus
the option for fast should exist
atomic willow
fair point
hollow mulch
Its there
sacred junco
If every option is allowed
fast sparrow
If people want to run and gun without brains there are more arcade games for that
fast sparrow
Imo
sacred junco
than game is just nothing but a playground with no intent behind it
hollow mulch
Or play pearl market
midnight nimbus
you can run and gun fast while still having thoughtful action
blissful otter
Bo4 is actually a pretty good example for that
hollow mulch
@sacred junco way that's basically bf at its core lol
midnight nimbus
making center points the only source of good gameplay is just garbage design
blissful otter
No hate for the game it is pretty good for what it is supposed to be
hollow mulch
Thats... what it is
midnight nimbus
that's because BFBC2 movement is garbage
amber notch
Will I keep my premier stuff?
Yes you will!
If you are like most people and end up purchasing the premier origin access and cancelling it, you will have all your inventory saved.
you keep anything that's in your inventory, so likely the paratrooper skins and any other items you get in the first few weekly air drops. However when your subscription expires you will no longer have access to any of the air drops or assignments that are given after that point.
midnight nimbus
BF2 is barely even a shooter
hollow mulch
You guys just have no idea how to choose your fights lol
solid hinge
I like bf4 hate bf1
fast sparrow
Bf2 is a great shooter
solid hinge
Least fav battlefield of all
sacred junco
This is I guess why I stopped playing BF for a long time
midnight nimbus
0.7 base spread 😂
sacred junco
Game caters to ppl who like BF4
blissful otter
@amber notch would it be possible to buy the premier with a vpn and keep it on the account or would it fuck something up?
midnight nimbus
everyone has insane amounts of nades
sacred junco
and I didn't like it
BF4 is pinnacle to most while the worst for me
That's just my preference in the end, but I find it really hard to really find a medium in what ppl want in BF anyways
solid hinge
I would say hard-line was bette r then BF1 explosion fest
sacred junco
since there are still those who think it has to be a spiritual succesor to Project Reality somehow
hollow mulch
I just like the vehicle meta in bf4 a lot
midnight nimbus
Hardline had really good infy play
hollow mulch
And the ability to do whatever I want
blissful otter
Thank good for no annoying mortars tho
sacred junco
I don't like the extremities involved in BF vehicles
fast sparrow
Bf1 is probably the worst pc bf for me. Utter casual shitfest. And yes hardline isnt even a bf game.
hollow mulch
It's how I roll
solid hinge
Dea couldn't agree more
fast sparrow
Yeah
midnight nimbus
but it's a good shooter
blissful otter
It was something going back to bf1 to get the rewards after playing the beta
hollow mulch
Bf1 was fun
midnight nimbus
mortars are definitely an aspect where BF could draw inspiration from realism
hollow mulch
But way to easy to get good at lol
midnight nimbus
gunplay has a really good skill ceiling in BF1
unlike BF3/BF4
click fast to win lol
sacred junco
I could just grab a Huot and press to win
midnight nimbus
people jerk off BF3/BF4 gunplay so hard when it's just microburstfield
hollow mulch
Bf4 gunplay imo is more enjoyable then bf1
solid hinge
I died more in BF1 from explosion and gas then players shooting at me.
midnight nimbus
what's the difference between microbursting and BF1 hold LMB LMGs, besides clicktax?
hollow mulch
Bf1 theres less skill involved, just hip fire central with not much in the way of recoil management
midnight nimbus
you maintain a rate of fire to minimize spread
so is clicking fast skill?
and BF1 has more recoil than BF4 btw
hollow mulch
Clicking and aiming
sacred junco
thing I don't get about hipfire argument is that it assumes every engagement occurs in 5m or something
hollow mulch
Bursting while staying on target is a skill all on it's own
sacred junco
I know its common
midnight nimbus
microbursting is just clicking as fast as you can all the time
hollow mulch
Just a different play style
midnight nimbus
really not any less brainless than hold LMB
sacred junco
but jeeze is an automatico really gonna kill someone in 30m in hipfire against someone adsing?
midnight nimbus
BF1 hipfire is fine
atomic willow
fuck that gun lol
midnight nimbus
similar to BF4 hipfire
hipfire crosshairs just scale properly with FoV, so it looks more accurate
but it's not really any more accurate than BF3/BF4
hollow mulch
Idk I just find bf4 gunplay more enjoyable le in the end, it's more nuanced for me
Bf1 was just too easy, or maybe I've just been playing fps games for too long lol
midnight nimbus
probably the latter
i hopped into BF4 after playing BF1
and microbursting all the time is boring
hollow mulch
Maybe I just like the modern theme too
sacred junco
you could just use shitty guns on purpose
hollow mulch
And helicopters are the best
sacred junco
Groza's kinda interesting
hollow mulch
Scout heli is basically the attack plane from bf1 except even better
midnight nimbus
scout heli is so fun man
hollow mulch
25mm ftw
hollow mulch
Bleh, I can dogfight with 25mm just fine
midnight nimbus
25mm is the versatility pick, miniguns are more specialized
hollow mulch
It's the ability to mop up infantry is why I use it
midnight nimbus
miniguns are better against infy with good aim, but 25mm has its place
hollow mulch
Heatseekers are what I use for anti air mostly
midnight nimbus
getting people behind cover
heatseekers + miniguns to just fry everything out of the air
hollow mulch
Yeh, but then I might as well go stealth jet lol
hollow mulch
Maybe
I just feel like I dont need the extra leg up when it comes to dogfighting
Miniguns make air to air comically easy
hollow mulch
Yeh
midnight nimbus
ones harder to use against air, ones harder to use on infy
hollow mulch
Thing is, I play on a console, so 25mm is a lot more forgiving
midnight nimbus
that makes sense
sacred junco
isn't console control okay for heli?
hollow mulch
Harder to aim on a controller while balancing a chopper at the same time
midnight nimbus
miniguns were meta for top PC pilots bc mouse aim
midnight nimbus
really not that much harder to use if you have decent aim
hollow mulch
Aiming, not so much
sacred junco
explains all the complaints about admins in 24/7 Shanghai maps w/o personal aa
hollow mulch
Doesnt mean I haven't mastered it, just means its generally harder
midnight nimbus
yeah, controller vs MK+B is a fair tradeoff
there's good PC pilots that use controller
bc it's still more constant than flying with MK+B, you just give up aim
sacred junco
why not stick + m?
midnight nimbus
with interesting guns
hollow mulch
Wait
midnight nimbus
don't have enough hands for controller + mouse
hollow mulch
I think I know what we all secretly want
midnight nimbus
tried it, it sucks
sacred junco
there should be a peripheral for one stick still
hollow mulch
Battlefield 2142!
midnight nimbus
2143
sacred junco
not sure how itd work
hollow mulch
plays bf theme
midnight nimbus
2142 = good setting, garbage game
hollow mulch
I want a proper remaster of carrier assault
midnight nimbus
that's the general theme with BF
sacred junco
BF is an ideal
midnight nimbus
you have something good, but then it's terribly implemented
hollow mulch
Not that shitty thing we got in naval strike
midnight nimbus
BF1 gunplay = great mechanics, bad implementation
sacred junco
The ideal that you want from the concept it sells doesn't really exist
midnight nimbus
BFV gunplay = way better mechanics, garbage implementation
i'd say the same about attrition and class balance as well
great concepts, terrible implementation
hollow mulch
What's the best bf4 carbine in your opinion
midnight nimbus
ACE 52 is statistically the best
hollow mulch
Really?
midnight nimbus
but don't use carbines
hollow mulch
Oh
midnight nimbus
PDWs are better than carbines at relevant ranges
that flat upgrade better
the Groza PDW is borderline broken
midnight nimbus
use P90 instead of MP7
hollow mulch
Groza is pretty good too
hollow mulch
It really is
midnight nimbus
MP7 skips frames
and kills way faster than it should
and skips frames means skips recoil as well
hollow mulch
That's why?
hollow mulch
Lol I had no idea, I just thought it was a really good gun
midnight nimbus
same reason why AR160 and AUG are useless on console
just use AK12
because of frostbite frame rounding, AK12 kills just as fast
while being more accurate
FAMAS is good too bc of frame rounding
you have multiple bullets landing on the same frame
you can theoretically insta kill people with it
hollow mulch
I should probably try out the PDWs more often, since their more difficult recoil management is something I tend to avoid
hollow mulch
Also, I spend way more time in vehicles then on the ground nowadays lol
You know what I hate as a vahicle main?
Actually, more like despise
Is when I'm trying to repair my tank or heli then some random asshole just hops in and drives off!
midnight nimbus
BF1 tank repair is good
hollow mulch
Is the worst feeling in the world, especially when you see that guy get blown up a minute later cuz hes an idiot
midnight nimbus
just shouldn't have been hold to repair, just press once
BF1 did a lot right with vehicles
hollow mulch
Maybe
midnight nimbus
too bad the vehicles themselves were too limiting
hollow mulch
Bf1 vehicles in general were even more unstoppable death balls imo
midnight nimbus
AT tools should've been stronger
tanks aren't too strong, counters are just too weak
hollow mulch
Bf4 tanks were powerful, but were also glass cannons. One jihad jeep and it's all over
midnight nimbus
full parts based damage would've been great
hollow mulch
Or just a squad in cqb with rpgs
hollow mulch
Yeah, better counters would have been nice
the pilot within me sheds a single tear at the betrayal
midnight nimbus
man, BF1 really could've been something amazing
so many things were done so well
hollow mulch
I thought it was amazing
midnight nimbus
but a lot of poor decisions as well
hollow mulch
Just got too easy
midnight nimbus
infy gameplay is pretty good
kinda too easy for vehicles tbh
there's just several guns that BF1 nailed so well
hollow mulch
Lol infy was pretty good for me, not so much for the other side that I'm ripping into
midnight nimbus
AL8 35 is one of the most fun guns in the entire series
Ribey has really satisfying recoil for its rate of fire
hollow mulch
I remember one of my early favorites was the sebstlater marksmen
Not sure if I spelt that right
midnight nimbus
kills too slow man
everyone thought it was super good on launch
bc muh 26 rounds
hollow mulch
Maybe, I just liked it long ranged capability
midnight nimbus
yeah, it's a good CQ or Ops pick
if you just sit back
it's fun if you're good at headshots
midnight nimbus
max RoFing the AL8 35 and just melting people is great
1916 just kills way too slow to play aggressively with
hollow mulch
Ramboing is literally the only way to describe my playstyle lol
midnight nimbus
unless you're Nickel and you can just headshot people all the time
hollow mulch
Hellriegel and BAR were also early favorites, alongside the trench shotgun
Oh, the Trench shotgun
hollow mulch
Was so broken at launch
midnight nimbus
oh yeah, pre hrec nerfs
midnight nimbus
DICE forgot that they made spread lower in BF1 so they gave a bunch of guns BF4 levels of hrec on launch
and a bunch of automatic weapons were just broken as shit
launch BAR Storm man
hollow mulch
Oof
midnight nimbus
how many nerf hammers is the BFV Suomi gonna get
hollow mulch
Nothing says one man killing machine like the BAR
midnight nimbus
they made BFV spread way lower than BF1