Guys, any news on new melee animations?
#battlefield-legacy-titles
solid hinge
violet locust
Sign up for the Newsletter, and get an in-game emblem for BFV https://www.ea.com/games/battlefield/newsletter
solid hinge
only thing we had so far was t1gge saying about its coming soon and with air takedowns too
violet locust
zinc vessel
violet locust
Pretty neat
solid hinge
wondering if air takedowns are still going to be a thing
acoustic shell
isnt bfv out?
violet locust
for Premier, 15th for Deluxe, 20th for Standard
zealous void
"isnt bfv out"
wat
hybrid steppe
Guys
Did anyone buy the bfv via cdkeys or some other store that offer a lower price
hybrid steppe
Well I saw a lot of people and someof my friends bought games from cdkeys
And they got the actuall game
Me too when it bf1,i bought it on sale
Yeah,they say
You pay,they send you the activarion codd
violet locust
Let's not, since none of that money actually goes towards the developer/publisher if bought from 3rd party sites. They aren't legit sites.
hybrid steppe
Then you just type it in origin
I have never bought it from another sites that aren't legit so am afraid of getting stole my card informations
zealous void
Same, except maybe Greenmangaming, but i have no reason to go there now
violet locust
There's a list for Trusted Retailers: https://help.ea.com/en-us/help/faq/where-to-buy-ea-games-v2/
gray glade
dont wanna put myself into a position where someone gets a hold of my mastercard tbh
hybrid steppe
Is it real?
Thanks for site
Maybe i should buy the game from local sote
Store*
I will only get the key
violet locust
trail flame
Real chads buy it from Walmart 
violet locust
Lol
hybrid steppe
This gamestop offers the lowest price
violet locust
They usually do have pretty good deals
violet locust
lol
steep radish
Im not gonna lie
there’s nothing more scary than playing in HC BF1
and seeing your teammate getting shot from unknown fire
solid hinge
or being shot and not knowing where its from
steep radish
Nah
Id say the latter is scarier
especially as medic because it blocks my ability to help them lol
hazy lynx
Whats the worst situation you could get into as a support player?
Oh wait...
Close range SMG ambush?...
Yeah
Pray he has to reload and you manage to kill him with your LMG
Or running out of ammo
inland cloud
Man playing bf1 makes me so excited for bfv because of immersion the battles will! Especially ww2 and the invasion of france
midnight nimbus
lmao just use burton
inland cloud
Those inner city battles were amazing
I havent tried hardcore in bf1
Is it good!?
inland cloud
Lol
misty moat
hmmgmfmfmgn m lmg snipers ghjfjfndndf
amber notch
@misty moat what
misty moat
i hate
lmg
users
theyre like
so accurate when proned
and
so much damage
and no scope glint
and they have insane range
for what they are
yrah but snipers shoot slow and have glint
whereas lmgs can even be hipfired at close range
pure veldt
A scout should win a one on one every time > 100 yards vs an lmg
misty moat
yeah but as an assault theres not much you can do
pure veldt
And I get pissed turning a corner trying to hip fire an lmg vs assault
The game is Rock paper scissors
You'd have to use an optical
Which makes close encounters harder
Some lmgs are close quarters but have bad longer range
raven otter
What's a good medic gun for battlefield one ? Btw I don't have premium/dlc pass
pure veldt
The ones that can lock down people farther away require prone
trail flame
Autoloading 8 factory
violet locust
Sweeper is good too
misty moat
sometimes they require prone, but the first time i played support out of sheer distaste towards the class, I got two bipod snipe kills and one trench hipfire kill
i hated myself even
amber notch
laughs in Automatico update 1.2
sacred junco
Feels like the new 1907 SL is gonna be the new Automatico
that 700 rpm with 16 rounds
violet locust
sacred junco
Its just kinda funny
ppl complained STG is was too good in CQ
but the other 2 ars seemed to be basically less accurate higher rpm guns
violet locust
It was good 👀
sacred junco
Wonder if they are gonna basically be upgunned smgs
violet locust
Dunno, guess we'll have to wait and see
raven otter
Auto loading 8 factory is only 5 ammo
Any other good guns for medic? Again btw I dont have premium/dlc lol
violet locust
Sweeper
raven otter
Which one ?
violet locust
Factory
sacred junco
Autoloading 8 is pretty good and extended is good for cq
1907 SL is a good cq gun, but I hate the sight
violet locust
Premium was free, how'd you miss that .-.
sacred junco
Mondragon was king of the SLR in release but its kinda okay now
raven otter
Lol I was too caught on on bo4
violet locust
rip
raven otter
I have a good trigger finger but the auto loading range wasn't great for me. Recoil was my problem
N low ammo
I pre ordered battlefield v already just tryna get the hang of battlefield playing the recent one
violet locust
👌
solid hinge
@raven otter autoloading factory/marksman are god guns 😍
raven otter
I'll try that out... ty for the tip
solid hinge
But there skill weapons 👀
topaz dome
I like the auto loading extended
trail flame
1907 SL Factory is also pretty poggs
solid hinge
Autoloading extended and xim4 😍 perfect combo
icy sluice
um...
solid hinge
🤔🤔
little lark
bfv looks dead ass
violet locust
icy sluice
The fuck does that mean?
cold trail
😮
solid hinge
Today I go back to battlefield 4 after months without playing it
Hope it goes well 😃
The other marksman @raven otter
I forgot what its called but it basically is the autoloading except with a 16 round clip and a zoom scope, its really good
Just look for the medic rifle with 16 rounds in it, thats not the sweeper, something like that
raven otter
Thanks
orchid iris
stupid question, in road to bf5 there are daily tasks where you earn scraps, are those scraps for bf1 or bf5?
I've been ignoring them, and now I'm worried I've been missing out on bf5 scraps D:
fading swan
no they are for bf 1
the only rewards for bf V are soldier tokens if im not mistaken
@orchid iris
remote edge
did you edit my post ?
zealous void
why you post message in both chats
steep radish
woag
amber notch
Cant wait for this
steep radish
man thats too violent
Im reporting this game for having a gun tbh
Hopefully there arent more guns in this game
1/1000000000 game
THERE’S TWO?!
FLIPS TABLE
No but in all seriousness this game looks p gud
Only gun I might use is the tommy or mg42 lol
or even the double barrel
Ye
or idk im just glad this game has more variety options
Unlike BF1
BF1 had
less variety than other games imo
It was either a experimental version of the gun
a scoped version
or an even powerful scoped version
but that was it lul
merry ivy
M1 Garand is the only gun I will ever use once its added
merry ivy
It’s not just a “ping”
solid hinge
"i challenge you to duel, good sir"
merry ivy
its a heavenly serenade perfectly crafted by John C. Garand after you send 8 rounds of 30-06 right at Adolf
such a sound that nobody can unhear
when reloading, thousands of germans within earshot would instantly defect due to that musical ping
just so they could have the chance to hear it up close for themselves
inland cloud
Woo boi I thought normal bf1 was immersive but hardcore took it to whole nother level
midnight nimbus
BF1 has the best variety and balance in the series
merry ivy
I found a way to be that camping twat with a sniper while still being extremely useful to the team
I know, I know, it sounds ridiculous
but its called the trench perescope
amber notch
@midnight nimbus 
merry ivy
and I also set myself up 150 metres away in the same line of sight that my team has on the enemy
and if I don’t miss my shots they end up too scared of it to move
I almost got a 5 for 5 with a G98 but the fifth person never appeared 😦
it was a crushing experience to get the fourth guy only for there to be no fifth guy to meet my final bullet that I had left in the mag
icy sluice
A person who was new to BF1 kept shooting Flash Flares in my squad
And it ruined my aim so many fucking times because I couldn't see shit!
He was in my squad and I swear it was the only time I saw flash flares
The only times I can see them being useful is to use them while rushing with numerous people
Like in Operations
merry ivy
flash flares + gas grenades on fort de vaux ops
solid hinge
oh no
merry ivy
that is a fucking scary situation
solid hinge
i hate that
merry ivy
I have done that to people before
merry ivy
and sometimes if my team already gassed them out, I’d run flash and smokes
creating a blinding, opaque mess where you have to wear the mask that already cuts down visibility
yeah, we took the sector pretty quick by being complete assholes
a few teammates grabbed M97s and fucked their shit up because they were completely blind by that point
pure veldt
gain an hour in US from time change but cant keep my eyes open at 11:30
merry ivy
I can’t get to sleep
too much noise from 100km/h gusts
miracle from john moses browning himself that the power is still on
pure veldt
is it the 14th yet
merry ivy
in my heart it is
storm marlin
its sad saying bye to battlefield 1, ill still play it, but its just not the same as 2 years ago
solid hinge
I'm getting into it rn
It's fine
some unique little things about it that I like
Like ship bases
storm marlin
i still have fun its just dying and its such a masterpiece
solid hinge
It's a well designed game
and the more you look into it it does have squad based mechanics
Like kits
and it does attempt to make gameplay less casualized
storm marlin
me?
solid hinge
yeah?
midnight nimbus
@amber notch BF1 objectively has the best variety and balance in the series, mathematically
solid hinge
Really like bruh?
midnight nimbus
BFV balance is decent, but doesn't compare to BF1
solid hinge
midnight nimbus
one specialization tree is generally trash in comparison
BF4 balance, when you have <10 guns that are worth using 😂😂😂
midnight nimbus
if you play on console and you use the AR160 or AUG over the AK12, you're just stupid
using an objectively inferior weapon
BF1 has very few guns that are overpowered or underpowered
BF4: using the M416 or ACE23 when the L85 Exists
solid hinge
Ok what about this variant system and random spread
midnight nimbus
variant system is excellent
fathom pebble
Random spread 
solid hinge
Variant system was a cover up for lack of content
midnight nimbus
stops people from using stupid attachment combos
solid hinge
Random spread was bad like no skill
midnight nimbus
spread is nothing new
fathom pebble
Variant system 
midnight nimbus
BF1 guns have less spread than BF4 guns
solid hinge
fathom pebble
RBS been in multiple BF games since idk even
midnight nimbus
look at hitrate numbers
midnight nimbus
when people ask for "more recoil, less spread" that's literally what BF1 was compared to BF4
solid hinge
midnight nimbus
look at the stats and try to disprove that
solid hinge
When my bullets don’t land where I shoot I could careless about that
fathom pebble
I liked BF1. Maps and aesthetic is great ngl. The variant system was mehish. Planes were terrible. Tanks anything is fine except the artillery mortar delet that
midnight nimbus
Ribeyrolles has more recoil, less spread than AEK
while shooting slower
that's literally more recoil, less spread
solid hinge
Sure
solid hinge
I’m no nerd to know that
midnight nimbus
reeeeeeee i can't read numbers
fathom pebble
Just aim and shoot the enemy
solid hinge
Oh yeah what about the horrible vehicle balancing and grenade spam being so much worse than any battlefield game
Oh the elite classes that was bad
midnight nimbus
no Ammo 2.0 to prevent nade spam
solid hinge
So much was changed in battlefield 1 and not for the better
sacred junco
that too
midnight nimbus
play BF2 or BF3 if you wanna know what nade spam is like
solid hinge
Which is why it lost players so quickly
Like battlefield 1 was successful initially but couldn’t retain a high player base
sacred junco
its pretty consistent now
solid hinge
It’s still good but nowhere near the amount that played from the start
sacred junco
and I enjoy playing it at least for the time being
midnight nimbus
BF1 did a lot of things wrong
sacred junco
well every games gonna be like taht
solid hinge
And me and a ton of other people dropped the game for other FPS games
midnight nimbus
but gun variety and balance isn't it
sacred junco
I can't say about gun balance
fathom pebble
Dw most pc population are gonna be in BF5 this friday 
sacred junco
but class balance was probably better for sure
there was usually a decent reason to use most classes in most scenarios
midnight nimbus
name somewhere where BF1 gun balance is worse than BF3/BF4
solid hinge
I would still say battlefield 1 isn’t the worst battlefield game but one of the weakest
midnight nimbus
name more than one viable AEK attachment loadout
sacred junco
Sweet spot mechanics and laser bipods with 3d spotting on clusterfuck maps
solid hinge
Random bullet deviation killed the game for me
midnight nimbus
name more than 6 optimal assault rifles
sacred junco
That's annoying
midnight nimbus
RBD is a dumb myth, spread has always existed
fathom pebble
Random bullet deviation is in most BF games prior to BF1 
solid hinge
When my bullets don’t land where I shoot I could give a damn about other stats
midnight nimbus
that's in all BF games
BF1 actually has spread effect you for using the guns wrong
sacred junco
BF2 is the worst in my experience
solid hinge
Yeah but it was especially bad in battlefield 1
midnight nimbus
BF2 spread is obscene
fathom pebble
BF5 is one of the only maybe the actual only to have no RBD when ADSing
midnight nimbus
BF1 spread is lower than BF4
solid hinge
In battlefield 4 recoil was way more predictable than battlefield 1
midnight nimbus
BFV spread still exists
fathom pebble
And bf3
midnight nimbus
it's literally in the files
solid hinge
Oh what about the slow dlc release time
midnight nimbus
BFV spread is a bit lower than BF1
solid hinge
And lack of content battlefield 1 had
midnight nimbus
just decreases differently
solid hinge
By the time the first dlc released I already got bored of the game
fathom pebble
I prefer lack of content and free updates
midnight nimbus
a map the size of Argonne with 10 planes 😂😂😂
solid hinge
Like I can’t remember how many months it took for its big first dlc
Also the lack of content killed it
fathom pebble
Then lack of content and have to pay more 60$ for 4 dlcs
sacred junco
I mean I gave up playing most modern BF games after release becuase I didn't wanna pay premium
midnight nimbus
terrible visibility and UI/UX because they have devs who don't care about them
sacred junco
and I quit BF1 because Operations pissed me off so much
They improved it
quite a bit
solid hinge
Also the maps were dog shit in battlefield 1 like not a single map I really liked
midnight nimbus
> white text in white backgrounds
DICE: let's add forced TAA instead of just having black outlines for the text
sacred junco
Better than BF4 maps
midnight nimbus
Rotterdam and Narvik are garbage
solid hinge
Compared to battlefield 3 and 4 maps I prefer those more
sacred junco
the conquest maps were mostly okay compared to BF4
sacred junco
BF3 maps are kinda iffy imo
fathom pebble
Bf3 maps are running simulators
solid hinge
Rotterdam is okay but Narvik isn’t great
midnight nimbus
BFH had the best maps
sacred junco
Rotterdam was the map that restored my hope for the franchise
fathom pebble
Unless u play metro or the market one
midnight nimbus
Rotterdam has the worst layout I've ever seen in a BF game
sacred junco
Nah it works for me
sacred junco
What's do you want in a map?
solid hinge
I’ve got to say I can’t remember a single good map in battlefield 1
midnight nimbus
good flow?
solid hinge
Open fields ever where on most of them
midnight nimbus
achi baba plays excellently, even in shit modes
fathom pebble
Did u guys like seine crossing in bf3?
midnight nimbus
Seine Crossing is great
fathom pebble
Rotterdam has the same flag layout
sacred junco
Rotterdam to me staggers flows a bit to ensure that groups aren't formed into zergs
midnight nimbus
most BFH maps were great
sacred junco
if map flows well it will just be Achi Baba
solid hinge
Hardline was good with a bad setting
brisk field
Metro was basically frag spamming and spawntrapping for me at least
sacred junco
with mass of people moving along waves
midnight nimbus
Hardline was a mediocre game with an excellent setting
fathom pebble
Lmao devs even stated on the article that rotterdam layout is inspired out of seine crossing fron bf3
brisk field
Zavod was pretty lit
sacred junco
Rotterdam breaks it up enough and it seems to stagger waves pretty well for a small map
midnight nimbus
its only flaws were terrible weapon balance and the fact that it was a non military game under the Battlefield name
solid hinge
I mean battlefield 1 was to please the causal market so many hardcore elements of battlefield got removed therefore many players like myself didn’t stick around
midnight nimbus
Rotterdam is a terrible attempt at Seine Crossing layout
sacred junco
Man Seine sucked
midnight nimbus
BF1 has a lot of casual elements, except gunplay
sacred junco
most BF3 maps had its issues as well
brisk field
When does America come in at tides of war
midnight nimbus
casual is a meaningless buzzword anyways
sacred junco
Well I think this discussion really demonstrates how fractured the BF base is
fathom pebble
No clue on it
solid hinge
Battlefield 1 has probably the worst gunplay in the series like all you do is hipfire and spray until he enemy is dead where in battlefield 4 it’s controlled bursting
midnight nimbus
BFV gun mechanics are incredibly good, implemented in the worst way possible
BF4 hipfire is better than BF1's
same with BF3's
solid hinge
Worst mainline battlefield game but not the worst battlefield game I played once again
midnight nimbus
difference is the BF1 hipfire crosshairs properly scale to FoV
so it looks smaller
brisk field
Sucks alot that we only get 3 AR's at launch
sacred junco
Beyond 3 ARs you are gonna get even less historically accurate guns
midnight nimbus
nothing wrong with good hipfire though
sacred junco
gonna get more ppl whining about that
solid hinge
I thought battlefield 4’s grenade spam was bad but battlefield 1 is worse
solid hinge
Also the variant system like why?
midnight nimbus
variant system is a better attachment system
sacred junco
I don't mind the variant system
brisk field
Well we already saw a woman with a bionic arm so might as well
sacred junco
I didn't like attachments as well
midnight nimbus
BFV specializations are basically the same as BF1 variants
solid hinge
I prefer customizing my own gun for my own load out
fathom pebble
They removed the prosthetics I think
midnight nimbus
most guns had 2 viable attachment combos max
solid hinge
Also it was like a cover up for lack of content because battlefield 1 didn’t have much at the beginning for weapons
sacred junco
I just wanted Kobra sights on a Nato gun without grinding
midnight nimbus
e.g. if you use anything but AEK comp stubby, you're doing it wrong
sacred junco
Hey ACE 23
solid hinge
No I would want to grind for attachments
brisk field
Personally I don't like the look of the holographic sights. It makes it seem like there's been eotechs in ww2
midnight nimbus
L85 hbar stubby
sacred junco
and tbh no reason to not use SMG08 in cqb
brisk field
Could have just been paint on a glass
solid hinge
There also wasn’t much depth in battlefield 1
midnight nimbus
SMG08 is good at like hipfire ranges
solid hinge
Like there wasn’t a whole lot in it
sacred junco
Like good terrible or bad terrible
sacred junco
Because its just a mp18 with worse spread and more ammo right?
solid hinge
Battlefield 1 had the least amount of depth for a battlefield title
Wasn’t a whole lot really
brisk field
12 or 15 minute matches would be pretty nice
midnight nimbus
BF1 has infinitely better gunplay depth
BF3/4 = click fast with every gun to win
sacred junco
The clash of philosophers here
midnight nimbus
just microburst
solid hinge
No I beg to differ when my bullets don’t land where I shoot
midnight nimbus
not an opinion
BF1 guns are very accurate
unless you're trash
objectively accurate
midnight nimbus
if you're hipfiring with non Trench guns you're doing it wrong
sacred junco
With the automatico exclusively tho
midnight nimbus
and what's unskilled about hipfiring?
sacred junco
even in base launch SLRs had horrible hipfire
solid hinge
Because you’re really not learning the weapon with hipfiring
midnight nimbus
???
solid hinge
Rather when you aim down sight you can learn the weapons predicable recoil
sacred junco
its random spread unlike CSGO
solid hinge
It does but it doesn’t matter because it’s all spray and pray at that point
sacred junco
But its predetermined
midnight nimbus
it's almost BF2 levels of spread
sacred junco
so ppl learn that stuff
midnight nimbus
no it's not
it's random
you have random base spread in CSGO
just fixed recoil patterns
solid hinge
got a hacker in my game called longweihu
solid hinge
Ok so if battlefield 1 is a good game according to you then how did it make initial good sales but then couldn’t retain a player base not as large as at the beginning
solid hinge
It’s still up and running don’t get me wrong but it’s no where near as high as before
sacred junco
and BFBC2 was a bad step
midnight nimbus
BF1 did a lot of things wrong
don't get me wrong there
but gunplay isn't what it did wrong
solid hinge
That’s why I dropped it
sacred junco
popularity doesn't correlate to objective greatness
midnight nimbus
poor communication in how the gunplay changed is a bad thing about it
solid hinge
And yes gunplay is less skilled then ever in a battlefield game where my bullets don’t land where I aim
midnight nimbus
it's objectively the most skilled BF gunplay
solid hinge
I’m definitely not the only one that thinks this
midnight nimbus
BF3/BF4 = click fast to win
is that skill?
BF1 = proper burst lengths, variable on range
solid hinge
You have controlled bursting in those games for battlefield 3 and 4
solid hinge
Click fast to win?
midnight nimbus
bc of insane SDEC
yes
microbursting is the best way to play BF3/BF4
jjika bursting if you're super good, in BF3
solid hinge
I think it’s more skill than random spread
sacred junco
But would BF4 be a better game in your view, if the SDEC was paired down so that microbursting was ineffective?
solid hinge
Yes but it’s no where near as bad as battlefield 1
solid hinge
Like I still learn a weapon and master it
midnight nimbus
microbursting just mitigated it, which is retarded
you can learn and master guns in BF1
play with harder guns
solid hinge
In battlefield 1 I hipfire and spray and pray nothing to it
midnight nimbus
yeah, you're not learning and mastering shit
that's not how you optimally play guns
solid hinge
Like it’s so easy to run around with my head chopped off in battlefield 1 than it is in battlefield 3 and 4
solid hinge
Sure
solid hinge
No it’s not
midnight nimbus
they all microburst
solid hinge
I do they mostly do controlled bursting and full auto in close range
midnight nimbus
except jjika, who did his own bursts in BF3
relaaa full autos in CQB, but that's bc he just plays locker
solid hinge
And hipfire when absolutely necessary
midnight nimbus
and he still microbursts at range
solid hinge
I don’t know any of them
midnight nimbus
bc you don't know what good players do
solid hinge
Oh yeah because battlefield esports doesn’t really exist
midnight nimbus
doesn't mean good players don't exist
sacred junco
BF shouldn't be an esports game anyways...
sacred junco
I feel like gun mechanics are such a bad segway about what makes BF good or bad
sacred junco
Like I heard CTE was planning to adjust the overall mechanics of the game but instead opted to just rebalance guns mostly isntead
solid hinge
Or some one who’s infantry that gets 50-11
midnight nimbus
someone who gets high KD, high SPM, and beats good teams
sacred junco
A player who is able to solidly defend and secure objectives
solid hinge
Oh and yes I can master predicable in battlefield 3 and 4 and still go like 40-11
Where in battlefield 1 I can run around like a headless chicken hipfiring people
midnight nimbus
nothing inherently less predictable about BF1 gunplay
midnight nimbus
it still exists in BFV
guns still have spread
jfc
literally look at the gun files
and you see that they have spread
solid hinge
Yes it does but the gunplay is like 1000x better than battlefield 1s gameplay
midnight nimbus
i have performance charts showing that they have spread
BFV gunplay is braindead as shit
solid hinge
They do but it’s no where near as bad as battlefield 1
sacred junco
anyone have a good video showing the spread in bf1 vs bf4?
solid hinge
Yes it is
midnight nimbus
there's an objectively superior strategy
5 round burst
it's how all the guns are designed
jjika burst is meta
solid hinge
Your opinion man
midnight nimbus
it's not an opinon
it's literally DICE's gunplay design
recoil increases after the fifth round to show you that you should 5rb
solid hinge
I prefer battlefield 4 and 3s gunplay over battlefield 1s
midnight nimbus
spread increases sharply after the fifth round in BFV as well
solid hinge
Your opinion is battlefield 1s gunplay is better which I find real bizarre
spiral adder
Single fire>burst fire
midnight nimbus
burst fire is how BF weapons are intended to be used anyways
solid hinge
And yes battlefield v has 1000x better gunplay than battlefield 1s
solid hinge
I think battlefield 1=cod with vehicles and planes
solid hinge
Sure it’s your opinion
sacred junco
Cod has almost no spread tho
midnight nimbus
CoD doesn't have spread at all
sacred junco
with a lot of ARs
midnight nimbus
except from the hip
solid hinge
What are you even trying to prove like my opinion doesn’t change from this
sacred junco
in infantry combat
midnight nimbus
yeah, because you aren't educated on what you're trying to talk about
solid hinge
Uneducated here we go
solid hinge
Yeah they do but it’s no where on the level of battlefield 1
solid hinge
Sure
midnight nimbus
literally just read numbers
midnight nimbus
you can lead a horse to water, but you can't make it drink 🤷
solid hinge
I gotta say battlefield 1 has the worst gun play and I’m not the only one to say this
I left the game for that
midnight nimbus
yeah, because the BF community hates looking at numbers
say at 60m, why would you do anything but 5 round burst the BFV StG?
solid hinge
We’re not gonna spend our time reading numbers when it’s clearly noticeable
sacred junco
Just as a thought experiment. I'm comparing Groza-4 to M1907 because I remember those guns being very erratic in long bursts
not sure if the best set to compare
midnight nimbus
BFV SLRs have 100% accuracy to the end of their 3 hit kill range
with a 3 round burst
solid hinge
Battlefield v has way better gunplay
midnight nimbus
if you're aiming right and you're in your min BTK range, you physically cannot miss
sacred junco
with full rpm?
solid hinge
Even dice admitted that they screwed up gunplay in battlefield 1 by stating they’ll remove random bullet deviation
And add predicable recoil
midnight nimbus
because they cater to reddit
what's unpredictable about BF1 recoil?
it works the same exact way it did in BF3/BF4
midnight nimbus
literally nothing new about BF1 recoil
except there's more of it than there was in BF4
solid hinge
Compared to 4 battlefield 1 has shit recoil patterns
sacred junco
What is exactly random reviation
solid hinge
When my bullets don’t land where I shoot
sacred junco
every shot after first shot has an added deviation in spread?
and increases over time until it resets?
How's that different from a simple spread system?
midnight nimbus
that's how it worked in BF3 and BF4 as well
solid hinge
Well it’s random as opposed to predicable
midnight nimbus
it's not
it predictably increases every time
your spread increases the same way every time
midnight nimbus
you literally cannot prove it doesn't
sacred junco
midnight nimbus
spread is inherently random
sacred junco
solid hinge
You can’t prove it does
midnight nimbus
there's literally hitrate charts for this
solid hinge
You haven’t proven a point yet at all
midnight nimbus
sacred junco
but looks like BF1 has an added randomness in the spread
solid hinge
Like I’m not convinced
amber notch
sacred junco
Man Mondragon's worse than the 1906?
amber notch
What’s the conversation?
sacred junco
Spread autism
midnight nimbus
with 0.3 total horizontal recoil, 0.12 base spread, and 0.0625 SIPS, the Autoloading 8 Marksman can land 3 bullets with perfect accuracy to the 0.5m wide chest at up to 70m
after 70m, it falls apart
solid hinge
I mean all in all I’m not convinced I like battlefield 1s recoil
sacred junco
Was this always the case since release?
solid hinge
Also battlefield 1 has shit ttk
midnight nimbus
in BF4, the AEK has 0.117 SIPS, and the QBZ-95 has 0.084 SIPS. the QBZ will always beat the AEK past 50m
BF1 does have shit TTK
too long
BF1 recoil works the same way it did in BF4
it just decreases slower
solid hinge
Yeah that’s bad
midnight nimbus
can't click fast to win
sacred junco
I like low ttk myself tho
midnight nimbus
you actually have to control recoil in BF1
sacred junco
but that's less of a stat problem
midnight nimbus
with 0.117 SIPS and 7.7 SDEC, you can recover each AEK shot in one frame
solid hinge
Mhm
midnight nimbus
why do 3 or 4 round bursts when you can 2 round burst as fast as possible?
0.117/7.7 = 15 millliseconds, rounds to 1 60Hz frame
sacred junco
wasn't that why AN94 was broken in BF3?
midnight nimbus
yes
the ACE-23 in BF4 has 0.1 SIPS and 10.5 SIPS. both a 2 round burst and 3 round burst reset in the same amount of time
solid hinge
Anyways I’m gonna leave it at the fact that battlefield 3/4 had better gunplay than battlefield 1 and battlefield v has improved upon it by 1000x
midnight nimbus
so why not click 3 round bursts as fast as possible?
midnight nimbus
reeeeeee i'm not good enough to use skillcannons or burst properly
sacred junco
DICE really put itself in a pickle here
solid hinge
Because random bullet deviation is dumb and predictable recoil is best
midnight nimbus
BFV throws away everything we learned from BF4 with weapon balance
solid hinge
Whatever at this point
midnight nimbus
if you're using the StG with anything but right tree specializations, what are you doing?
back to BF4 attachment meta
except with the specialization tree
solid hinge
Reeeee I’m a causal player
midnight nimbus
the StG with right tree is a legitimately good 100m gun
left tree sucks past 50m
solid hinge
Battlefield 1 a game full of casuals
sacred junco
BF is just a casual game man
I don't really care myself at this point. I ain't playing Siege or CSGO
solid hinge
Battlefield 1 the most casual yet hence the game lost their player base really quickly
sacred junco
Is that why CoD is losing playerbase?
solid hinge
It’s still alive but not as good as past battlefield games in terms of retaining players
sacred junco
With that ttk?
midnight nimbus
SMGs have trash TTK
sacred junco
Not that I mind
midnight nimbus
but it's a good quickscoping game
solid hinge
the game is trash
always has been
always will be
I mean I’m just gonna agree to disagree at this point as this is going nowhere
also this isnt #general
midnight nimbus
CoD is fun
sacred junco
We are talking in context of BF tho
midnight nimbus
but anyways, BFV tosses a lot of good lessons in gun balance
midnight nimbus
https://www.reddit.com/r/BattlefieldV/comments/9te2kd/battlefield_v_beta_framestokill_timetokill_charts/ literally mathematically proved it is
midnight nimbus
Sten is just a straight downgrade from the MP40
solid hinge
math doesnt matter
sacred junco
🍿
solid hinge
Yeah math don’t matter
you can kill someone if you get the jump on them 100% of the time if you aim properly
midnight nimbus
there is nothing that the Sten does that the MP40 doesn't flat-out do better
is that balance?
midnight nimbus
the Bren and FE7 are just garbage StGs
solid hinge
yes but if one gun is better
it doesnt matter
because all the guns kill so fast
One bullet miss from the user with the better gun, and they lose
it literally does not matter
and its much more skill based
Legit I’m kinda happy battlefield 1 didn’t do as well
Dice learned a hard lesson on that
if your better at controlling recoil and better at aiming you will win 100% of the time
midnight nimbus
spread control in BFV is still a thing
solid hinge
unless someone gets the jump on you
midnight nimbus
if you're dumping and have perfect recoil control, you'll lose to someone 5 round bursting and controlling recoil
gun balance is a thing
and it's not balanced around average shitters
solid hinge
The person who puts down more bullets is gonna win with accuracy
in ww2, werent some weapons used more than others because they were better
No matter your skill, or recoil control. Nothing saves you from that sniper halfway across the map.
midnight nimbus
the person who puts down the necessary amount of bullets faster is gonna win
solid hinge
not always
midnight nimbus
sniper rifles in BFV are garbage so it's fine
midnight nimbus
yes
solid hinge
x
Tf ... are they really
Yeah that’s my question for this really casual player here
midnight nimbus
played the shit out of alpha and beta
midnight nimbus
same way i have with every recent BF
south lynx
@solid hinge They're fine.
midnight nimbus
the snipers are objective downgrades from like BF4 rifles
solid hinge
Sure man you’re a causal
solid hinge
because people enjoy sniping?
I’m kinda happy battlefield 1 didn’t do as well so dice can learn a hard lesson on that
even if guns are more op
south lynx
ZH 29 is a sniper rifle.
solid hinge
people will use what they enjoy
solid hinge
because not everyone enjoys using the stg
midnight nimbus
drinking paint when you have a nice glass of water at hand
midnight nimbus
StG isn't even OP
sacred junco
None of the nitty gritty matters
solid hinge
Not everyone wants to use the best weapons
its like drinking coca cola when pepsi is right there
pepsi is better
but people still will use coca cola
because they enjoy it more
midnight nimbus
sniper rifles are objectively trash next to the ZH-29
sacred junco
The only thing that matters is what the overall mechanics will entail in terms of how engagements work
solid hinge
Your opinion
midnight nimbus
i guess some people enjoy drinking paint
south lynx
@solid hinge Shots fired.
solid hinge
@midnight nimbus you’ve pretty given opinion statements
sacred junco
And I like using the 1906 factory even tho it is objectively worse than the auto loading 8
midnight nimbus
nothing opinionated about hard numbers
sacred junco
but not enough so that it will be a life and death difference in pubs
midnight nimbus
1906 Factory is objectively superior to AL8 in a lot of situations
bad comparison
sacred junco
I dunno about that
solid hinge
yes the numbers do matter, but nothing matters if you are a better playe
sacred junco
besides the 3 shot kill range
solid hinge
a gun is op
midnight nimbus
flat out better past 70m
solid hinge
Not in battlefield games numbers don’t mean anything besides damage and fire rate
south lynx
ZH 29 was a better weapon, but that doesn't mean the bolt-action rifles were bad, it means ZH 29 was a bit too good.
solid hinge
And ammo capacity
sacred junco
most engagements don't go that far in BF1 still and autoloading provides better rpm and accuracy still
south lynx
The sniper rifles were good, ZH 29 was godly.
solid hinge
if a player that is 20x better than another, will lose to the worse player more than 50% of the time, the gun is OP that the worse player is using
Again I hated battlefield 1 solely for bad gunplay
Like I left so quickly
When I knew my bullets don’t land where I shoot
That stg wont do shit against a sniper a quarter mile off.
Good luck trying
sacred junco
ehhh
solid hinge
Called random bullet deviation
midnight nimbus
StG is a good >100m weapon
sacred junco
Why would you even snipe at quarter mile off
solid hinge
Why not
midnight nimbus
wasting time and ammo?
sacred junco
cause you ain't doing anything
solid hinge
Some want to try that option
south lynx
StG was actually capable of counter-sniping pretty decently in the beta. Wouldn't win straight up if the sniper was aware of you, but I popped snipers at range with it more than a few times.
midnight nimbus
some people want to try drinking paint too
sacred junco
thats fine, but its not something you are actively worried about
solid hinge
Like I wouldn’t always use the best guns in the game because that would ruin the fun
south lynx
A quarter mile is only 400m.
midnight nimbus
MP40 is a decent 100m gun too
solid hinge
think about it, weapons dont matter when someone just V-1 rockets your house
south lynx
That's well inside reasonable sniping range.
midnight nimbus
not in BF, and not with BFV sniper rifles
solid hinge
Why always use the best guns when you can try the other options and maybe that might fit you more than the best guns
midnight nimbus
BFV bolt actions have terrible velocity
midnight nimbus
why not always use the best guns, do you not like winning?
solid hinge
like not everyone will enjoy the way a gun fires, or how it sounds
i love the martini henry not because im good with it
because i love the sound it makes when fired
and the amazing reload
south lynx
@midnight nimbus Some people enjoy challenging themselves.
midnight nimbus
winning is the challenge
solid hinge
I like winning but I don’t feel the need to use the best guns every time
midnight nimbus
why not always try to win?
south lynx
Why play Dark Souls at SL1?
solid hinge
because people enjoy having fun
Why not always try different options
same reason people will use the kolibri
because its funny
sacred junco
BF isn't esports
solid hinge
you feel superior when you kill someone with it
south lynx
Exctly.
sacred junco
Yeah
south lynx
Exactly*
sacred junco
Even in Overwatch if they aren't in ranked
midnight nimbus
guess i'll start playing wheelchair basketball man
sacred junco
they goof around for fun
south lynx
Some people enjoy doing silly challenges in games.
solid hinge
Sometimes a close range weapon cant get the job done. Sometimes you need someone to pick off a tough enemy from range or shake them up a bit
I like using try hard weapons some days and other days I’m less sweaty and I’ll challenge myself and explore other options
if you start killing people that are using a better weapon when you use a worse weapon, you feel accomplishment
sacred junco
not laying down on you
south lynx
Dude, wheelchair basketball is vicious, don't knock it.
sacred junco
but BF isn't the game to really pick fights over people doing stupid shit
in a 64 player pub game...
solid hinge
wheelchair basketball is vicious as hell
sacred junco
if there is a legit attempt at esports
sacred junco
then the bitching will be more meaningful
solid hinge
they like push them off the wheel chairs
rip the wheels off
destroy the wheelchair
in the middle of the game
I’ve seen people pull off some stuff in wheel chair basket ball
sacred junco
what a pivot
solid hinge
Also not everyone is a competitive esports tryhard battlefield player
So why not try other options and not always use the best guns
yeah
personally i hate the way ARs fire, and reload, and just how they sound in general
sacred junco
But I don't like the idea still of one thing being that much more effective
solid hinge
i love lmgs
I like winning but I don’t feel the need to always pick the best guns to do so
because they shoot for ages
and have really cool reloads
Also what you classify as the best gun may not suit someone else
Like everyone might think this gun is the best but this one other player might not have the right play style for it
sacred junco
I bet still if there is a ranked match you guys will still go for the meta gun
I goof around choosing whatever tank I want most of the time
solid hinge
Math doesn’t matter in battlefield
sacred junco
but even in frontlines
solid hinge
Science and physics don’t matter in battlefield
solid hinge
No it doesn’t
@sacred junco
actually
if its ranked
i try hard
but i wont exactly use the best weapon
in overwatch
i try my hardest
sacred junco
I mean I played WoWS for a while
solid hinge
but i one trick bastion
Maybe for fire rate and ammo capacity and base damage but whatever else it is doesn’t matter
solid hinge
i still do well, win games, but i dont play the most OP character
i play what i enjoy
sacred junco
Ranked pressure is real
solid hinge
Like I siege I don’t always play meta operators in ranked
I’ll try different strats for certain objectives
If it works great if it doesn’t then never do it again
sacred junco
Depends on the stake, skill level, and the room for error
sacred junco
Experimentation is bad at a certain skill level
midnight nimbus
too brainlet to understand probability
solid hinge
The only numbers I’ll consider in a game for weapons is the fire rate and ammo capacity and maybe base and drop off damage
Other than that I don’t know what else
midnight nimbus
all the fire rate, damage, and ammo capacity in the world doesn't mean anything if you can't physically hit your shots
this is what makes BF casual
people who don't wanna understand the game
meanwhile in games like League and DotA
solid hinge
Ok but wouldn’t they give you beneficial stats to help you hit your shots
midnight nimbus
every number is understood and deeply analyzed
solid hinge
but when did bf want to be compettitive?
midnight nimbus
that's exactly what spread and horizontal recoil are
sacred junco
I dunno
midnight nimbus
beneficial stats to help you hit your shots
solid hinge
ill accept that it is competitive when we get a competitive mode
Like high fire rate would give you more bullets to put down range
i think its doing perfectly fine as a casual game
midnight nimbus
spread and hrec = limits your bullets at range to hit
solid hinge
I mean this issue has us divided
sacred junco
Too random to be a hyper competitive arena shooter
solid hinge
its casual
sacred junco
Nobody cares about gun stats that much in shit like Squad
solid hinge
Weapon stats do matter in games which is how the best weapons are determined
sacred junco
Maybe they do but mostly just accuracy I assume
solid hinge
What ever other math related stuff really doesn’t matter
sacred junco
But BF is neither a milsim or a hyper curated arcade shooter
midnight nimbus
nothing wrong with sitting in the middle
solid hinge
Like why would I care about the nitty gritty details of how fast I’ll kill my enemies
sacred junco
But it will never be both
midnight nimbus
because killing your enemy faster than they can kill you is important?
solid hinge
Yeah that’s where fire rate comes in
but @sacred junco when does it need to be both? when does it need to be any?
Not that math crap you’re shoving at me
its fine as just a casual game like it is
Whoever spits out more bullets faster per rpm is gonna kill the person quicker with decent accuracy
midnight nimbus
all the fire rate in the world doesn't matter if your spread and hrec are inadequate
sacred junco
The issue is you can't expect DICE to make something that can not get the Project Reality nerds and competitive players happy at the same time
solid hinge
You lost me there