YEY
#creative-discussion
brazen lark
HFJDJD I'm LAUGHING bc my aggretsuko/sdv post got up to 140 notes but I'm also like, BLEASE REBLOG MY ART INSTEAD
why are memes like dis
fading hawk
its probably not a good idea for you to follow my blog then
im a rp blog and it does get graphic
shadow sail
i wanna say my tumblr is largely sfw in terms of images, like i don't post nudity or gore or anything like that
but like, you might see a tiddy every once in a while
echo mesa
my main tumblr is laciberi
I think it's pretty sfw?
I'm not rly a fan of nsfw stuff anyway
shadow sail
ancient statues with they dicks out
brazen lark
I don't ever plan on reblogging nsfw but it would def be tagged anyway, I'm trying to get in the habit of tagging "nsfw text" as well
frail adder
Pft it's not that i don't want to see it it's just my Tumblr has like my actual birthday and stuff
So i literally cannot
frail adder
Yes
lament turtle
I am a family friendly blog lesbians only on there
shadow sail
just change your birthdate 😛
frail adder
I can't
lament turtle
are you? are you really?
frail adder
Or if i can idk how
shadow sail
hax
lament turtle
ya
frail adder
I feel attacked
echo mesa
. . . o.o
frail adder
I'm a lesbian ok
lament turtle
ok bonch
frosty merlin
I'm a hardware store (ACE)
echo mesa
whispers Art
lament turtle
im a bad bonch who does art
echo mesa
this turned out better than expected
lone mountain
omg hes cute
lament turtle
tbh!
echo mesa
His name is Kiwi ^~^
lament turtle
sdifhsudghkjdsff cute
echo mesa
I joined a server with a channel, where you claim the person above, then draw one of their characters
And the person after draws one of urs
lone mountain
makes me think of ratchet and clank for some reason
echo mesa
I'm not rly sure what he's supposed to be from, was worried about doing the wrong shade of brown tho lol
urban minnow
I reblog stupid social issue junk on my main. I wish i set up a seperate blog for that
lone mountain
oof
shadow sail
it's cool, i have like, everything on mine
dip ya hand in the rattlesnake bag, what are u gonna get? no one knows.
lament turtle
my main used to be an aesthetic blog but then i remade into the blog i have now
shadow sail
feminism? socialism? anarchy? the occult? dnd shitposting? recipe for starfruit compote layer cake?
a cat picture? memes? it could be any
crimson field
Went to one of your guys' blogs, somehow landed on some random writing blog following random account links and like. Purple prose is so frustrating to read, especially when it's a very pretty shade of purple.
echo mesa
Is there such thing as a recipe for a starfruit cake?????
urban minnow
One minute a meme reblog, next minute is a reblog of why our society needs to chill tf out
lone mountain
yikes
echo mesa
I
wish I had an oven to bake one
brazen lark
Isnt there a blog that does a bunch of stardew valley recipes :0?
echo mesa
Yeah, I think I used to follow it
urban minnow
Real life food recipes?
lone mountain
thats cool
brazen lark
shadow sail
BLESSU
brazen lark
✌
urban minnow
I threw some mushrooms in a frying pan once does that count?
shadow sail
and honestly. i might just go devise a recipe for a starfruit cake like ???? i want now?
LMAO
if they're shiitakes, yes
shadow sail
it's ok i forgive u this once
echo mesa
makes vague quawk noise
I have
2 many art I need to scan
lament turtle
i wanna draw but i also dont wanna
shadow sail
draw something fun :))
lament turtle
i am trying dlsfjdslkgd
like i have the motivation to draw but everything i draw, i hate and i wanna perish
brazen lark
:( drawing funks are terrible but I believe in u
lament turtle
thank u ....
fading hawk
man im realizing i have A LOT of texturing to do for this game
lament turtle
oof
echo mesa
I did another claim
I'm
so enjoying getting to draw characters I've never seen before
browses through all the characters I'm allowed 2 draw now with heart eyes
slate yoke
You rock
shadow sail
is that the tinyhouse or whatever it's called thing that everyone did last night? :))
echo mesa
Artfight
It's a yearly competition thing?
shadow sail
oh okay! i've never heard of it admittedly
echo mesa
and it's toyhou.se ^~^ Which is a character website
It has forums too? I've never rly used them
Someone mentioned artfight here yesterday and I just
had to go to it and find characters to draw immediately
lament turtle
i feel like drawing haley in a pink leather jacket
echo mesa
go for it
I bet Haley totally would wear a pink leather jacket, they cute
brazen lark
👀 💕 pink leather
lament turtle
fjdslkjlk i found this cute ref and i love it
haley is gonna look so good i love her..........
here's a wip of leather jacket haley
bronze rivet
leather jackets are l o v e
frail adder
I'm with my friend who's an artist and akaldla do you guys wanna see her stuff??
bronze rivet
I wanna see
frail adder
She does traditional stuff so
bronze rivet
Psh, I do traditional
frail adder
frail adder
bronze rivet
demon babes
frail adder
This is her self portrait
slate yoke
Absolutely lovely
frail adder
She did Marilyn Monroe for her moms birthday
lament turtle
ghghghg looking back at this drawing, i do Not like it
lament turtle
idk i just don't like it
bronze rivet
;c i'm sure its still great
lament turtle
i am not satisfied with anything today maybe today just isn't an art day
elfin swan
Maybe you need a hug 
fading hawk
Jesus christ ive been trying to make this cutscene for two hours now and its just not working
i need a break
bronze rivet
take a food break
vagrant acorn
^
bronze rivet
I got some turkey bacon in the freezer
brazen lark
I'm doodling on paper again and I just, attempted to zoom in on the paper
////lays down,
Art is hard
frail adder
I really only eat chicken cause those creatures are EVIL
But cows and pigs are nice i love them ❤❤❤
lament turtle
I'm gonna try to draw in ms paint
maybe smth will come to me then
i believe in u mags!!! i really hope things get less rough for u. art block is a bitch and a half
lament turtle
aw yeah i just got inspo!!
im gonna draw all my ocs with pride stuff it's gonna be fun
AWH sweet im so happy for you!!!!! go get em!!!
slate yoke
lloro
lament turtle
chonis
echo mesa
at least after I buy more paint I can go to bed ;-;
chilly spear
Is anyone going to talk about how one of Harvey's favorite gifts is truffle oil despite him being a health nut
lament turtle
hey guys I just drank hot sauce
he gets a pass to indulge for a little while, i trust his odd tastes
glug glug glug
strong ingot
spocy
echo mesa
a wip of Abigail wearing Simeons jacket ^-^
bronze rivet
Project plan: Make a cute slime
slate yoke
Done tho
hearty wasp
bronze rivet
vagrant acorn
😍
lament turtle
Aww 😭 💖
strong ingot
cat slime ❤
crimson field
I need those slimes as emotes
fading hawk
I did it I created my first cutscene in my game
it took four hours to figure out dhfgsdf
crimson field
Sweeeeet. Nice work ❤
fading hawk
Its not even that long its like barely a min. it just took forever to figure out how to do it
topaz depot
oh, still super cool!!!
fading hawk
my internet is reallllly slow so i cant like look up shit like i usually would so im having to figure it out without any help
if i had good steady interwebs i would look up how tos
i still need to finish the first town though
lament turtle
i believe in you!!!
haughty tendon
wiip
fading hawk
thats so pretty
i think im gonna stop for the day because boy howdy that has me all dsjfgbdsfjkgsd
haughty tendon
thank youu aaa
strong ingot
aww im loving it already callie
haughty tendon
thankyousm ;; it should be done by tonight or tomorrow!
brazen lark
for some reason my hand cant stop drawing clarissa
when im NOT trying to draw maggie's farmer, the drawing just turns into her
lament turtle
jvsdfljlk she's cursed you
crimson field
I needed to take a break from the Lyell piece so I started sketching my dumb alien because I have zero self control
brazen lark
ooo the pose looks really cool
lament turtle
i am updating my desktop theme again bc i was unsatisfied with it i am a mess
brazen lark
i dont wanna shove in a mspaint doodle into the creative channel but this is ur oc so https://puu.sh/AB7oc/e2f185e3eb.png
//wonks
this took embarrassing long but only bc i was fighting against no pressure and my yiynova tablet refusing to work on any program that isnt csp
crimson field
Might work on this a bit more while watching Critical Role. Hmm.
crimson field
lort bless sam riegel tbh
It's even relevant to this convo because he's showing off "drawings" he did right now
onyx island
who's that? 😮
crimson field
A voice actor. Critical Role is a bunch of nerdy voice actors playing D&D and they stream their games live every Thursday night, it's just started.
onyx island
that sounds epic
crimson field
It is. Google "critical role twitch" if you want to watch it (it's also live on YT)
lament turtle
woohoo i finally updated my blog
onyx island
👍
frosty merlin
A Day Off Work: A Shane and Jas story
onyx island
Maybe something that your farmer does every day that's completelly normal in the context of the game but if done in real life it would be really awkward
frosty merlin
In which Jas convinces Shane to take her on a walk through the woods, only to find a mysterious tall building
ooooo
(then they meet the wizard and shenanigans ensue)
strong ingot
hmmm should i draw linus or just a big o pig
frosty merlin
Linus meets a wild pig
strong ingot
ooooo linus that has a secret pasture of pigs for his truffle stash
crimson field
Normal in context of the game but awkward IRL: Going around the bar and giving booze to literally everyone. Alternatively, giving Sebastian sashimi while he's still in bed.
frosty merlin
Someone reacting as a normal person to being given the same gift every single day
strong ingot
if someone gave me sashimi in bed, i would love them too
crimson field
I would stab them
onyx island
Yeah, get that raw fish out of here
crimson field
Get fish-anythings outta here
strong ingot
well more like take it and then be like "thanks now gtfo"
frosty merlin
Day 1: Thanks! This looks delicious!
Day 2: Another one? Well, it does look pretty good...
Day 3: Did you give me one yesterday? I'm still finishing the second one!
Day 4: Ok this is getting old. Don't you have work to do?
Day 5: Look, I love your cooking, and you're a great person, but I really don't need five of these.
Day 6: I'm serious, please stop.
Day 7: If you don't stop I'm calling the cops
Day 8 canceled due to restraining order
crimson field
pfff
onyx island
and that's the reason we can only gift twice a week 🤣
frosty merlin
From that day on, a new law, the first new law since grandpa's age, arose: Gifts are to be given to another member of Pelican Town no more than twice in a week. Furthermore, if sufficient gifts are given, and the giver asks, the receiver must pursue a romantic relationship with that person, regardless of past conversations or experiences. Lastly, if the [Mermaid Pendant] is somehow acquired and given after sufficient gifts, the receiver must organize a marriage between the two involved, to happen after exactly three [3] days.
That'd be a hell of a fanfic, if anyone wants to get on that that can actually write
onyx island
"Here's your second gift of the week. See you next sunday!"
frosty merlin
under breath damn these new laws...
onyx island
Uh oh, now to try and draw animals for challenge #7 DX
strong ingot
how i feel when i draw people
edgy wren
me when I draw anything but objects
crimson field
me when I draw literally anything at all
strong ingot
me at art
onyx island
Oh well. Wouldn't be a challenge if it didn't made me leave my comfort zone. 🤣
brazen lark
i have drawn something Incredibly stupid
analog fjord
showww
brazen lark
but i am very very pleased at the same time
brazen lark
IM EXPORTIN IT
lament turtle
H
analog fjord
👀 👀 
lament turtle
I deleted my art blog bc I don’t wanna have two of them sndndnd
If I don’t need smth I don’t keep it around I am considerinf deleting my misc blog but I like the url so I wont
echo mesa
Urls ;-;
I accidentally hoard those
And I dont like having urls I dont actively use
lament turtle
Tbh!
echo mesa
My Grandparents bought me water colour pencils 
Nana said they wanna encourage my art
brazen lark
i was honestly Shocked that i managed to get the punkgarden url
AWWWW
thats so kind of them
onyx island
Best grandparents ever ❤
lament turtle
I am spoiled when it comes to getting things for my hobbies
echo mesa
they just showed up with them
ye, definitely best grandparents
gave them both giant hugs
Nana wants me to draw lots of landscapes ^-^
lament turtle
I made my parents buy me a piano key board dmdndndd
echo mesa
My Grandparents definitely spoil me when they can lol
onyx island
mine do too lol
strong ingot
Can your grandparents adopt me?
echo mesa
yes
Nana has so many adopted internet grandkids lmao
She asks about them too???
she asks about LoociMoo and RainbowSong all the time
Had someone draw my Arabella <3
Their discord is Pink#5481
onyx island
Cutie! ❤
lone mountain
doing spiky hairstyles for women is hard
crimson field
I know you're having a tricky art day, Maggie. But it's just one day, and tomorrow is a fresh start dear. ❤
Just remember that we adore your art, and I am totally claiming the ability to speak for everyone here.
onyx island
Yup, Maiz sounds good! She'll be named after corn! hehe
lone mountain
yeah her name has to be based on a vegetable
vagrant acorn
SHES ADORABLE
is drinking soda, and gets an email about new kudos on main story
sees its almost at 500 views
forgets how to drink any liquids
oh man... next chapter is the toughest one yet imo
its the one i put my own abuise into.
lets not edit that tonight
last urchin
i has desire to draw other ppls farmers @ me with ur farmer and a description if u want a cute freebie doodle XD
im sorry to the person i accidentally tagged >>
onyx island
Why not, here's my farmer!
lament turtle
Mine gets drawn A Lot so I’ll pass
onyx island
I'm trying to draw one of the OC I might create, it's fun to have freedom and not to have to draw a specific char with all their charasteristics 🤣
brazen lark
woops
onyx island
My farmer never get drawn, even though three different people said they would!
waxen veldt
I wish I had Get Dressed.
edgy wren
this is the best front veiw of my multiplayer character, try drawing her
waxen veldt
I'd be able to make a pretty icon reference like that.
edgy wren
@last urchin
late ingot
-pats Makco- you're not alone, no one has drawn my farmer yet either.
vagrant acorn
jade did mine, the Kiwi, now Ash, im like flailing
echo mesa
what's your farmers name? ;o @onyx island He's married to Penny right?
@late ingot Do you have a pic of your farmer?
vagrant acorn
I have so much art
echo mesa
I've been loving doing art for others, so lemme just help u both
I got new paint and pencils today even
vagrant acorn
i wish discord would let you have a slideshow like windows desktops can do
echo mesa
holy crapola
I love water colour pencils??? I've never had them before
waxen veldt
Watercolor pencils are amazing.
echo mesa
Im in awe lmao
late ingot
O-oh! You really don't have to! o.o but I guess if you want to I could post a pic of her
frosty merlin
Alright, Imma put my farmer here as well, but I have a lot of images so it's gonna go in #images-and-memes
vagrant acorn
oh those are so cool!!!
echo mesa
I'd love to draw your farmer WindYoshi! ;D
I can only put SDV art in my current sketchbook, so it'd be nice to draw some different farmers ^~^
vagrant acorn
Yoshi has been here longer than I have, but never got drew.... this is so strange
late ingot
Lmao, cause I'm so dang quiet >.>; it makes it hard to make friends
echo mesa
It can be a lil easy to be overlooked
Toe drew one of my farmers once
And I think that's about it? I feel like I'm forgetting something tho
vagrant acorn
I dont think ive ever gotten a toe drawing
echo mesa
I think Toe was just randomly doing lil draws
vagrant acorn
also yeah there is that difference Yoshi, I am like never quiet
echo mesa
With how easy it is to get drowned out, I probably do tend to talk heaps to make up for it lol
onyx island
no shit lol
late ingot
I really hate being as quiet as I am, but I'm super shy and yeahhhhh.... not that great at talking either....
onyx island
it is a lucky day today that this chat didn't turned into a unreadable mess like it does almost every night
vagrant acorn
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
late ingot
I know, it has been really quiet
echo mesa
I love having lots of people chatting, but I wish we'd all take care to not ignore anyone or stray from art?
mmmmm, dese pencils r beautiful
vagrant acorn
i agree Jas
onyx island
I use regular pencils. How those water color pencils work, exactly? 😮
echo mesa
Did you find a picture of your farmer for a reference ? @ Windyoshi
echo mesa
You sorta colour small peices, then use a paintbrush to add water to kind of spread the colour
You can fix the colours more like that too?
onyx island
ohhh
lone mountain
my rough drafts designs are always so messy
echo mesa
I totally recommend giving them a go
late ingot
Here's farmer Rudy!
echo mesa
oooh, that's cute, Jev
Doesnt look messy at all lol
I love how you draw hair
ooooh, she's cute
Does she have a spouse at all?
late ingot
Thank! Yep, and it's Seb
echo mesa
casually starts collecting references of everyones farmers so I can draw them lots 
vagrant acorn
i mean, jas youve seen the art jade did of me and maggie
cause you had one in that set
.>
echo mesa
had one in that set ?
echo mesa
I added what I have now, but I wasn't rly at war xD
Was that pic in #art-gallery ?
I know I saw it, just been a while since it was posted
So many art since lol
vagrant acorn
the war? yeah it was
late ingot
I thought the other person was Jay? Or did I miss one?
cloud flicker
Yes, twas me
vagrant acorn
ahh ok
onyx island
Hmm I just noticed I have three orange pencils of different shades. Cool, this will come in handy!
echo mesa
perfect for drawing mooooar Penny hair
onyx island
Exactly! I've wasted so many opportunities because I didn't paid attention!
vagrant acorn
👀
echo mesa
lol
I would happily draw Abi for all, but I'm trying to have variety and draw NPCs I havent drawn
late ingot
I need to catch up on the challenge. I haven't drawn anything after day 3.
echo mesa
if you want to, then totally ^~^ I'd love to see what you draw for the different days
late ingot
I plan on it, though I think I'm going to wait till the weekend. I do commission work during the week so it doesn't leave me much time for much else.
echo mesa
it's good that you've got the weekend for your own personal art then ^~^
late ingot
Yeah, it's def a needed break. I used to do commissions throughout the whole week and I learned kinda quick that it wasn't a good idea.
echo mesa
Do you have any recommendations for starting to offer commissions?
My case worker seems to think I should sell my art lol
crimson field
Didn't get much done during Critical Role but eh, have the latest wip (:
brazen lark
(THATS A HUGE MOOD STRANGER, @ CR) and its looking great so far! :0
echo mesa
the colours on that look so nice
brazen lark
also jar do u have any specific questions?
late ingot
Ummm, well I guess it all depends on what you want to know. I'm still a little new to it so I may not know too much but I can try to help as much as I can.
echo mesa
idk? I've just literally never offered commissions
I have no clue where to start
Like, how to get attention to the fact I am offering commissions, how to decide prices
Do they pay before or after the art is done? And what's the best payment method?
brazen lark
draw fanart and shove ur commission info in the desc dfkjgkdfgbdf
echo mesa
lol, I do love drawing art for others
crimson field
Really the first step to doing commissions is forming a fanbase of your work
echo mesa
I seem to struggle to gain attention towards my art anywhere rip
crimson field
Alternatively, being part of something big enough that anything you post garners attention. But that audience has to have disposable income - aka not a bunch of 12 years olds.
brazen lark
^^^^ !
cloud flicker
yeah thats a good start is getting a fanbase but as someone who also buys comms i also look into the tags for commissions
crimson field
Anything you want to do for money you have to figure out your target audience. Who is going to look for your art, who is going to buy it, and who has the money to do just that.
brazen lark
i def wouldnt have nearly as many commission requests if it wasnt for critical role / dnd haha
echo mesa
so I should practise more fantasy-esque art?
crimson field
Practice what you love.
brazen lark
^^^ yeah!
late ingot
For payment, I have them pay before I start the commission. Though you don't have to go that route and it may make some people back off since you haven't built a reputation yet. If you don't want to do what I do you can make them pay half up front and half after it's done. And I use PayPal. I don't really know any other method for that.
Draw what you love
crimson field
Don't fit your commissions to what you think will get you money. Do what you love and find the audience that will pay for it.
cloud flicker
Yeah exactly
echo mesa
I love lots of things
Could totally do stuff styled around Skyrim armours lol
brazen lark
wait are u a minor or not
crimson field
Otherwise you come across as tailoring to a fanbase and it just... doesn't work.
brazen lark
bc paypal Will fuck you if they find out if ur a minor
echo mesa
I'm 20 lol
cloud flicker
sometimes it can, but when u love what you draw it really shows
brazen lark
JUST CHECKIN
echo mesa
its gucci ^~^ you never know online who is a minor
crimson field
Preach
brazen lark
prices should typically be dependent on how long it takes for u to draw and minimum wage (i sorta, weakly hand gestures to this)
crimson field
Pricing is hard tbh
late ingot
HA, I can't do that
crimson field
You have to know how to price yourself competitively.
late ingot
I take way too long to draw
vagrant acorn
https://www.tenor.co/ygGC.gif did someone say underage?
crimson field
jfc
vagrant acorn
LMAO I LEVELD UP WITH THAT
echo mesa
I can draw pretty fast, but I've been teaching myself to slow down because I get better results when I dont rush
cloud flicker
i'm only fast when its headshots hghd
lone mountain
just a headsup that advertising isnt allowed here
crimson field
Yeah like I would never do comissions because I know I seldom finish anything ever (you really need to know yourself) but I also know that if I did I tend to take like... 2-3x longer than others who do similar work to my own style just because of my habits, my wrist pains, etc. That doesn't mean my work is 2-3x more valuable. So you have to do research.
echo mesa
I think I'll focus on doing fanart for shows/books I like, and just more art for people Ik online before starting comissions, try gather some followers ^~^
but thank u all so much for your advice/help
brazen lark
np!
crimson field
Being active in fandoms/communities is a++++++
Definitely a good way to start building that audience. But the most important thing is consistancy.
echo mesa
I used to be pretty active in minecraft lol
I'd create a skin for minecraft, then make it into a non-blocky art
I'm not good with consistancy but I'm workin on it
crimson field
You really need to post consistently. Funny thing is that the statistics on most sites have found that the exact frequency doesn't matter as much as said consistency. So posting every day for a couple weeks, taking a break, then returning a couple weeks later is LESS effective than posting 2x weekly every single week.
all hail data
crimson field
Finding out when people tend to be most active on your chosen social media is also v helpful
cloud flicker
thats interesting though, i never knew
yeah thats what i do i always put my art on a queue
echo mesa
this artist I follow, is extremely inconsistant
She gathered up an audience ages ago with help of another artist
And now just picks up projects, only to abandon them after a bit
She doesnt seem to get why she's slowly getting less attention either
And I love her art, but she expects lots of attention when she doesn't have consistancy
And the fact she doesnt get attention, makes her slip towards being less consistant
cloud flicker
so it posts at like 4:30PM PST which is when tumblr is most active
crimson field
EST is a really great example. A huge portion of internet views hit between 8-10pm EST all across the web. So things posted in that timeframe are far more likely to be viewed, statistically.
That depends upon your platform, of course.
brazen lark
(also please dont forget to include in your guidelines what you are NOT okay with drawing )
crimson field
^
echo mesa
I post my art on Tumblr/dA/Instagram
But not all art goes on all three
waxen veldt
Oh goodness, yeah.
crimson field
Don't be a "I do it all!" er. It's better to specialize. People think that having more options = more commissions, but the inverse is the real truth.
last urchin
omg i see a legitimate conversation about comms *lurks to learn
waxen veldt
I hear people sometimes like some very strange things drawn.
crimson field
Instagram is really more for photography than art, though it's not a bad idea for art. Tumblr/da seem to be the largest art platforms still.
echo mesa
I definitely couldnt do all lol
Like no nsfw stuff ever
brazen lark
i put in mine that i wouldnt draw furries and its just bc i suck at drawing them LMAO
crimson field
Being honest is important. Better to filter out things you won't be able to do up to your standards from the beginning than have disappointed customers.
crimson field
Draw and post what you enjoy doing frequently. People will get a sense of what you are good at, and they'll have a good sense of what it'd look like if they commissioned you to do what they have in mind.
waxen veldt
In the end if you have a good enough sample, people can at least tell if they'll like your style.
... yeah, Stranger said it better.
crimson field
Like if I wanted a really damn adorable and happy-feeling, kinda cartoon-y bust of my SDV farmer, I might commission Maggie. If I wanted something more realistic with slightly more muted colors, I'd commission Clown.
Know what your style is, and how people think of your style.
echo mesa
I think my art on paper has been better than my digital lately
So probably gonna stick to water colour stuff ^~^
brazen lark
also as a note, people do not want to do math, try avoid using percentages Anywhere in your commission sheet
cloud flicker
unless its like 50% off
brazen lark
(this was big advice i got from my friends who have done commissions for years)
echo mesa
math sucks, I understand that
cloud flicker
god me
crimson field
The trick with traditional is knowing how to present it in the end. You need to have a good scanner and knowledge of how to edit scans well.
cloud flicker
im gay whats addition
onyx island
it's not hard to do percentages
vagrant acorn
ill just go somewhere else
crimson field
On math/percentages - don't do sales. Just don't.
vagrant acorn
makco
last urchin
stares at my hands what is my style
crimson field
Yeah, avoid math. ALSO avoid having a billion different prices.
onyx island
just divide the amount by 100 and multiply the result for the percentage you want
vagrant acorn
not grab a calc
echo mesa
I get confused online too
Everyone always talks in USD when they offer comissions lmao, USD makes no sense toooo meeee
crimson field
A good rule of thumb is 3-4
waxen veldt
I find it hard to do percentages on a brainfog day.
cloud flicker
oh as someone who buys comms too like,
waxen veldt
Like mentally, at least
crimson field
Don't worry too much about currency - google can easily convert currency tbh
cloud flicker
do update ur commissioner if ur gonna take a while
waxen veldt
I can do it fine with a calculator.
crimson field
Price in your own currency and don't worry about it.
cloud flicker
if its been more than a month give them a heads-up
late ingot
You could create a tos for your art. I have one myself and it pretty much gives the commissioner info to what they should need to know before commissioning you.
cloud flicker
one time i commissioned someone and it took a year and i asked whats up and they told "oh shit i forgot" and just drew it the very next day shgdg
brazen lark
OH AND A REALLY IMPORTANT THING, paypal taxes the seller so when someone sends you money thru the correct option, paypal will Take a bit of your money
echo mesa
Guess it's time to get my own paypal account
So I'll be ready when I start doing comissions ^~^
brazen lark
some people include that tax within their commissions, some dont
(i dont, i just die)
echo mesa
Yes! @ Jay
I agreed to an art trade
Forgot about it
The person messages me a month later asking about it
And I just pretended I hadnt forgot and got it done that day
crimson field
But yeah, pricing-wise don't be like "$x for a headshot, $x for a colored headshot, $x for bust, $x for colored bust" etc etc etc. Just don't. Instead, offer 3-4 examples of work and how much you'd charge for something similar. And if you end up doing more because you got into the piece (which generally you shouldn't do, just do the comm) you never charge them for that.
As for payment: always request 50% upfront
last urchin
im learning so much
crimson field
If they want to bitch about it, just politely decline their comm.
echo mesa
crimson field
I mean if it's a quickie $5 one that's one thing, but if it's $30+ then yeah
edgy wren
@last urchin I love what you made and i require you know that
brazen lark
ohhhh thats cute!
echo mesa
I love my new pencils so much ;-;
I should totally get some Expensive Fancy ones next month
Gonna keep to cheap paint tho lmao
crimson field
The most important things:
-
Garner an audience. This takes time and dedication. Most important, understand your audience. If your audience is a bunch of 12 year olds who would, by default, have no disposable income, you really aren't going to make money from them. So try to cultivate an audience that includes people who are working and would have disposable income.
-
Post art consistently to your social media platform.
-
Do your research. Just because you spend 10 hours on a piece doesn't mean that piece is worth $100. It might be to you, but if others are charging $40 for similar quality then it's probably worth around $40.
-
Understand payment methods and research them, too. As stated, paypal takes a cut.
brazen lark
i recommend learning how to use invoices on paypal
echo mesa
Awesome ;D
I'm thinking, I could try post at least one of my lower effort drawings a day? I mean
I draw now everyday anyway
crimson field
Learning more about your payment method is important, but that's kind of a "down the road" thing.
Jar - whatever you think is sustainable. The last thing you want to do is burn yourself out (LOOKING AT YOU MAGGIE)
If you're going to post regularly (daily, weekly, or otherwise), building up a queue is important. You should always have at least the next couple posts ready in queue.
echo mesa
I've burned out so many times in the past tbh
So I'm definitely careful about that now
I'm slowly getting into making art themed videos on youtube now
But I don't really see youtube as a money thing
Just a 'lemme babble about art,' thing
crimson field
Youtube is absolutely a valid method of income these days.
waxen veldt
In the US, at least.
echo mesa
With how youtube has been, I just dont want to rely on it or get my hopes up for it lol
crimson field
No matter how you want to go about earning your dollah billz - Do. Your. Damn. Research. I can't stress that enough. Hours and hours and hours of research will begin to scratch the surface.
echo mesa
always research everything ofc
Even outside of art
rly, thank you all so much
I'm learning so many thing o.o
pearl iris
h
waxen veldt
... Whoa, I meant to only write 500 words, and I wrote over 700.
brazen lark
:0 do u wanna see an example of how i set up my commission prices? (and what im giving out as Options)
echo mesa
Sure ;D
brazen lark
damn NICE
crimson field
When I say "research" I don't just mean looking up certain things. I mean absolutely devouring anything even remotely related to what you might be trying to learn
waxen veldt
I should stop now. Leave some words for later. And ink.
echo mesa
ooooh, you're handwriting ???
brazen lark
waxen veldt
so they start to become sort-of-acceptable drawings
echo mesa
phew
I murdered my hand writing my stories out on paper lmao
brazen lark
here u go! :0
waxen veldt
The first long story I wrote, though, was handwritten 😄
crimson field
(Also if you do art, look into all the ways you can monetize that art. Commissions are just one small part of it. Prints, physical goods, etc are all really good options as well, like pins, mugs, etc.)
brazen lark
its a lot better to go simple with fewer options
waxen veldt
(nowhere near as long as this one, I think I'm bad at this whole concise thing)
echo mesa
thank you! it's so useful to see other peoples ideas of pricing
waxen veldt
I wonder if I can coax my broken intuos into working.
echo mesa
In highschool, I didnt have access to a computer at home
So I wrote everything out by hand rip
waxen veldt
or I'll have to fetch my surface instead.
echo mesa
I have piles of paper with shitty handwriting
brazen lark
i also included in my description that if people dont give me an art reference of the character they want drawn, i charge them extra dfkjghdfg bc theyre Basically asking me to design their character for them
if it takes u more effort than usual, charge more! :D
echo mesa
do you ever sell adopts? that always seemed kinda fun ;o
crimson field
It's also a good idea to include how many edits to a piece you're willing to do, as well as your process. Like showing them a sketch for their OK, then finalizing, then max 2 edits at that point, as an example.
waxen veldt
Offer them both. Gives the customer a choice?
brazen lark
^^ yeah i dont think 2 is too much
crimson field
Offering both is fine, but that means you should also limit the options. You don't want 6 pricing options x 2 styles of art, that's too much
crimson field
That's reasonable
echo mesa
my case worker was talking about me painting on canvas and just like
going to markets and selling physical art lol
But I'd rather manage it online tbh
crimson field
It's also perfectly reasonable to only offer certain things. Like if you really don't like coloring, only offer lineart commissions. If you always color everything you do, don't offer lineart versions. It can really tidy up your pricing sheet.
brazen lark
(im looking at an artist i know who auctions off adoptables and they go up into the $100s and im just, holy shit )
crimson field
Like personally I'd never offer lineart comms even if I did comms, which I prob won't ever do. I color everything, I work on things with color in mind.
waxen veldt
hey, I think I managed to pull the cable enough to work.
crimson field
I seriously don't understand adoptables tbh, like wtf even is that community about
last urchin
yeah i dont offer lineart comms 🤔
crimson field
But it's a good way to make money if you can sell adopts
last urchin
how does one even get into adopts lmao
waxen veldt
I swear, I'm SO mad at the person who wound up the cable SO hard, it broke
last urchin
omg ur poor intuos
brazen lark
from what i can tell, there isnt really like, a Community
brazen lark
its like, idk, an artist selling their oc designs
waxen veldt
I know!!!! 
brazen lark
and it can just be literally any kind of ocs
crimson field
Sometimes? It depends. There are tons of different types.
brazen lark
ive seen some for furries, gijinkas, regular ass humans
crimson field
They can be OCs or "unique" color/style variants of things, from animals to fantasy creatures to humanoids.
last urchin
the ones i mainly see are outfits and weapons
echo mesa
I keep my OCs on toyhou.se tradable now
Juuuuust in case I get into selling characters later
crimson field
I really don't understand weapon and outfit adopts like wtf
waxen veldt
I actually ordered a replacement USB connector and intend to slice open the cable and affixing a new connector. But the connectors aren't here yet. They're shipping from China, and it'll be aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaages before they get here.
brazen lark
hey if it makes u money
waxen veldt
In the meantime, I duct-taped the cable and stuffed some plastic in it.
last urchin
if it makes u money
crimson field
I mean, yes, but s t i l l
waxen veldt
Keeps it at roughly the angle it works at.
crimson field
I guess I just don't understand the point
echo mesa
can i make money making asmr videos of me smelling these pencils
they
have that good wood smell 
brazen lark
DFJGBDFLGNDF
last urchin
i like my ocs too much to sell them orz
brazen lark
GOD ME
crimson field
a s m r
brazen lark
thats also why i cant do adoptables,,,,,i get attached to my designs,,,
they are Mine™
echo mesa
also asmr of me smelling cats
waxen veldt
WHOA,someone seems to have also broken my pen?!
echo mesa
I get super attached to certain OCs
But other OCs I'd happily just throw at people
crimson field
tbh there's a market for damn near anything and everything. So probably.
waxen veldt
SIGH who keeps getting at my stuff?!
frosty merlin
me
echo mesa
is all your stuff, like, in your own place ? Do people have access to it?
crimson field
I absolutely ruined the original pen my tablet came with a few months ago, Blue. I was devestated. My bff/roommate helped me buy a new one.
cause i has no dollah billz lol
waxen veldt
I put the pen in like, a pencil box, since I can't really put away the tablet or the cable temp fix will get wrecked.
Someone seems to have forced something into the pencil box
and knocked off the pen's button.
echo mesa
tbh, I wouldnt have gotten watercolour pencils ever if my grandparents didnt surprise me with them
crimson field
That's probably easily fixable
I literally somehow pulled the thing apart and accidentally ripped off a super fine wire from its solder
waxen veldt
Ooof, yeah, it fortunately was just knocked loose.
crimson field
Tablet pens are way more durable than people think.
waxen veldt
I think I'll just get a whole pencil case out here to put it in.
waxen veldt
One of the first things I did to my poor surface pen... was to acccidentally drop it
it struck the floor... RIGHT on the nib.
lone mountain
oof
onyx island
waxen veldt
Fortunately I was still in time to get a fairly cheap replacement nib. But dang, that hurt.
crimson field
that's why they come with a billion replacement nibs even though you might use like one ever
echo mesa
I used to be soooo careful with my tech
But my secondary laptop has a bulk of the hinge ripped off and still works
So I'm not obsessive now
waxen veldt
Yeah, it doesn't help that my hands are about as stable as a caffeine addict even though I'm not one.
crimson field
My hands shake like a mofo
waxen veldt
THat's why I can't do good linework
crimson field
You gotta learn how to use the pen tool
echo mesa
is casually looking at prices now
is a caffeine addict with mostly steady hands
crimson field
It just draws pathways
waxen veldt
My hands shake too much
crimson field
Nononono
waxen veldt
and just suddenly make jerky movements I can't control
crimson field
Not the one you do. The pathway pen tool.
waxen veldt
Oh
onyx island
Ugh I have so much coloring to do, why do I do this to myself? 😵
waxen veldt
Seems hard, though!!!
crimson field
I mean, so is existing
Pathway pen tool is a blessing for people with shaky hands
Who want to do clean lines
echo mesa
wow @ dat cintiq
crimson field
Cintiq is so expensive. I've heard great things about the Huion or whatever it's called.
crimson field
But I use an Intuos 4 I think?
waxen veldt
with a screen.
... then I got my surface and I realized
Yeah, it's a lot more like drawing on paper
crimson field
Surface =/= screen tablet
crimson field
Yeah, but it depends on the nib you use
waxen veldt
is the texture on the cintiq different?
crimson field
I wouldn't know, I haven't used one. Supposedly it's a tiny bit different, but not hugely. Not like an actual tablet. But you can use different nibs to simulate exture.
Texture* even
echo mesa
I might save up for the $113 one, just to get a vague idea if I'd even like a tablet
waxen veldt
Yeah, I have a felt nib for my surface
crimson field
Some nibs have a design that increases friction a little, which makes it feel more authentic.
waxen veldt
I like it, but the screen is slippery.
And my hands get in the way all the time
SUPER good for on-the-go stuff, though.
brazen lark
did u guys know that wacom had licensed the way their pens are designed so that no other company can do the same thing? (basically not ever having to replace the battery of the pen)
its Wild
waxen veldt
And super great for playing with brushes on the new paint thing windows has.
I figured.
brazen lark
i dislike the way they do things sometimes because they intentionally make things wear out faster so you have to buy and replace
cloud flicker
damn holy shit wacom
brazen lark
i have NEVER Had to replace my pen nib since i bought my yiynova tablet
frosty merlin
That happens with a lot of things Kyle
cloud flicker
hahah stares at my nibs that i have to replace...
brazen lark
(but the batteries......weh....)
echo mesa
my phone has a little pen
the nib in it is lasting okay - but if I actually used it on a regular basis it wouldnt last at all
frosty merlin
My parents bought our house, and our fridge was already there. This was almost 20 years ago, and the fridge only just went out. However, modern refrigerators only last about 5 years
cloud flicker
although i havent replaced my nibs in years and its still okay knock on wood
frosty merlin
Companies, most prominently Apple, does this so you buy their stuff
brazen lark
///lifts up my android phone into the air
frosty merlin
Android master race
echo mesa
I have an ipod that I've had for nearly 10 yrs now
. . . still works
onyx island
the wonderful thing called "planned obsolescense"
cloud flicker
stares at my iPhone
echo mesa
perk of colouring pencils: cant make pencils designed to need replacements sooner
onyx island
you could make the lead more brittle
frosty merlin
I mean, if you make the drawing bit that goes in the middle less dense, it makes it so you gotta press down harder and use more
crimson field
Makco is correct. Android does it too, but not as bad as Apple does.
frosty merlin
Basically that thanks Makco for englishing better than I
onyx island
👍
crimson field
Pretty much everything does planned obsolescense nowadays tbh
brazen lark
i thought that the battery pen thing was the wild part
echo mesa
Idk why anyone would want to buy a pencil you gotta press hard on tho
crimson field
I don't understand pens that need batteries because I've only ever used wacom
cloud flicker
same here
crimson field
Jar - not intentionally, unless it's a high H lead in which case you want it to be light.
brazen lark
///lays the fuck down with my 1000 packs of batteries
crimson field
Like a 9h barely leaves a mark, but that's the point.
frosty merlin
all I do is plug in my keyboard hehehe
onyx island
why would a pencil need batteries anyways? wouldn't it take the electricity it needs to work with from the tablet itself?
cloud flicker
i dont understand ppl who eat on their tablet
echo mesa
mmmm, new paints
I love that the white is lorger
crimson field
I toss my tablet pen into a drawer and pull it out the few times a year I get the inkling to art and a+++++++
brazen lark
iirc (dont quote me on this bc i am not smart) thats how wacom does it
but they licensed it
so no one else can
crimson field
(I saw the HP laptop a minute too late rip)
logo, not laptop, wtf
Those a huge tubs for watercolors
echo mesa
HP is my preferred laptop brand for no particular reason
crimson field
W o w my spelling tonight.
cloud flicker
please teach me traditional
echo mesa
I got that set for 5 NZD ?????
crimson field
HP is... eh.
echo mesa
I want to make a few youtube videos of me doing art and talking through it
I'm still learning traditional, but hey, if they help you at all, cool!
brazen lark
me, drawing traditionally: great! ive drawn one eye!
"draw the other one"
me: oh noooooooooooooooooooooo
waxen veldt
Nope. This cable fix is basically gone. My poor tablet. I can't do much until the USB connector is replaced 😦
echo mesa
I find digital eyes harder lmao
crimson field
That's literally the reason so many beginning artists use hair to cover the second eye
cloud flicker
dont tell anyone but sometimes i just
echo mesa
I did digital art a while back of Abigail
The eyes
are so wonk, I never get that wonk with pencil
cloud flicker
copy + paste + free deform the other eye
frail adder
CHEATER!!!!
crimson field
That's what a lot of digital artists do tbh
cloud flicker
AHAHAHA
brazen lark
KJSGDFJGDFGD AH THE DIGITAL ARTIST STRATS
onyx island
I always thought digital could just copypasta the eyes 🤣
frail adder
CHEAT
ER
cloud flicker
ITS NOT CHEATING IF THE TOOL IS THERE!!!
frail adder
C H E A T E R
crimson field
Definitely not cheating
brazen lark
///lifts up clip studio paint and the SYMMETRICAL RULER
crimson field
Utilizing your available tools and working smarter instead of harder is never cheating.
echo mesa
I used to have a folder just to keep certain lil peices of art I'd done lol
So I wouldnt always have to redraw a whole sword and stuff like that
onyx island
I would call a folder like that "Props" 🤣
crimson field
Pfff
echo mesa
prtty much, idk what I called it, would have to turn on my old laptop
frail adder
it was a joke pls
crimson field
You should always try to do it by hand first, just to stretch that muscle.
echo mesa
I'm so glad to be having this lovely chat with y'all tbh???? Like I feel like I dont talk with some of you vry much
frail adder
akdkakkda off topic but i feel diskusteng because some OLD MAN hit me up on THAT ONE GAY APP and i have never cringed so hard in my life
crimson field
Honestly things will usually look better when they're done by hand. Looks more authentic. Style > perfect lines.
echo mesa
old men, ugh
crimson field
get off grindr you're too young for that
brazen lark
>:0 CAN I SHOW U GUYS A COOL QUICK ART THING
echo mesa
YES
brazen lark
frail adder
I AM OLD ENOUGH TO SEX I AM OLD ENOUGH TO GRINDR
brazen lark
SYMMETRICAL RULER!!
crimson field
No you're not
echo mesa
;ooo
frail adder
But really i just have it to look at the boys
onyx island
crimson field
tbh symmetry actually isn't what you want
waxen veldt
declares tablet dead until cable is fixed.
crimson field
Human faces are never perfectly symmetrical
frozen plaza
fun fact: scientific studies have shown people think you're sexier if your face is mirrored on pics
crimson field
Bodies either
brazen lark
yes but it makes some designs Easier
cloud flicker
Hahaa its okay narc i knew u were joking
waxen veldt
This is why I have a surface. I can still ink.
brazen lark
also it makes for really good tattoo designs as well
cloud flicker
I constantly have to flip the canvas
echo mesa
I'm putting my watercolour pencils in a pencilcase so I dont internally die trying to keep them perfectly arranged in the box lol
I dont understand how flipping the canvas helps?
crimson field
Honestly the best thing I can recommend to everyone is to just do anatomy studies. Learn the bones and muscle structure that lie under what you're trying to draw and you will immediately have a better understanding of your subject matter and it will help tremendously.
cloud flicker
Oh yeah most definitely
crimson field
Flipping the canvas is a trick to help your eyes seem something from a different perspective to check for strange anatomy that may look okay from the angle you've been staring at it from for awhile now, but when flipped gives you a new perspective that'll often make problems immediately visible
onyx island
Stares long and hard at a skull to learn how to draw eyes better
cloud flicker
thats so cool
crimson field
Don't stare at the skull, Makco. Go draw skulls.
You have to draw the material to really learn it and train your muscle memory.
echo mesa
looks at all the pages of fruit I now have
. . . I can draw good oranges now
But I also hate looking at fruit
frozen plaza
why do those remind me of lightbulb filaments?
crimson field
Also: use references people
I don't do fruit studies, but I occasionally do anatomy studies. I'm a terribly lazy "artist"
echo mesa
I only did fruit studies for a week
I was going to study something different each week
After I started hating fruit I ditched that lol
crimson field
Like I can tell you how to improve but I'm kind of an outlier. I don't do art consistently, my improvements to to occur in very infrequent chunks via studying specific things. 2/10 do not recommend
cloud flicker
studies are good to do before drawing an actual thing idk i find i'm more loose when i do warm ups
echo mesa
my improvements also happen kinda infrequent??
Like, every few months I'll have a sudden understanding of how to do something better
crimson field
Warm ups are invaluable
cloud flicker
cause my hand is starting to remember how to draw
waxen veldt
oh, speaking of references... I need hand references. brb finding hand references.
crimson field
Don't be afraid to take photos for your own references.
late ingot
^^^^^^^^^
brazen lark
ive been spendin over 4 years doin comic stuff so the only advice i'll give is just take shortcuts, take all the shortcuts, please, no one cares, take care of yourself, no one will judge you for taking an easy route
crimson field
And don't be afraid to trace things as studies to learn what the lines of something look like, as they're often much different than you'd imagine in your head.
echo mesa
if you ever need hand references of hands in striped fingerless gloves
I got u
Because I love taking pics of my hands and I always wear these gloves
crimson field
If you trace something to learn the lines, though, freehand it immediately after without it to check your understanding.
echo mesa
do you have a comic going now? ;o @ kyle
brazen lark
i dooooo but im mostly keeping that stuff away from this server for privacy ;w;
i live a double life
echo mesa
lol, a non lame Hannah Montanna
onyx island
or Batman, for a cooler comparison!
echo mesa
lol
brazen lark
lego batman
echo mesa
I love these pencils
brazen lark
they look great!!
onyx island
Ohhh looking so good!
echo mesa
I love how they work wayyy more than the paint tbh
And it goes on this paper better
onyx island
I'm coloring the drawing I made of one of my possible future OCs and I want to go to bed so bad but I want to finish first... x.x
crimson field
watercolor pencils are super fun
echo mesa
you could always scrawl some notes about the drawing to give you a boost on what you were doing when you come back to it
crimson field
Honestly, stopping somewhere at night where you can easily pick up the next morning is a really really good artistic productivity trick
Like writing-wise a lot of writers wouldn't think to stop in the middle of a sentence, but it's actually a super helpful way to immediately pick up in the am.
onyx island
I'm so close though, I'm close to finishing her hair and then I'll only have the skin left to color! 😩
crimson field
But if you stop when you just don't know what else to do, you probably will stumble a bit the next day.
late ingot
Eh, it all depends. Sometimes a fresh mind can help
echo mesa
I looooove using notes
Doesnt have to be complicated
Just little
"Future me, you were thinking this, try this, or this, and look at this"
brazen lark
we're all a lil diff i think
late ingot
That is true!
brazen lark
sometimes if i take a break from something, i end up not touching it for months LMAO
thats usually if my motivation is way down tho fdkgdf
echo mesa
Short focus, I've learned to work around needing to stop and start lol
late ingot
......... I’ve done that too many times >.>
onyx island
lol reminds me of a scene from one of the simpsons episode. "Homer, I owe you one emergency donut. Signed, Future Homer." "Damn Future Homer, always one step ahead of me."
crimson field
One reason it's a useful productivity tool is also because you very quickly can cross out a to-do-list item, at least mentally.
Which, psychologically, is very beneficial.
brazen lark
i just realized something
last urchin
I need an emergency donut
crimson field
pffff
brazen lark
cant escape my roots
crimson field
good job
last urchin
Ho oh
onyx island
I don't have emergency donuts but I have emergency chocolate chip cookies
last urchin
I accept
last urchin
Make a note and maybe I'll do it
crimson field
They're pretty easy tbh
echo mesa
I cant keep emergency food
I gotta eats food if I like it
I cant just leave it
last urchin
But one does not just eat at 3am
echo mesa
slowly draws while chugging down too much energy drink because no self control
crimson field
says you
echo mesa
I go to bed at 10am often
I gotta eat at night lol
crimson field
what even is a normal schedule tbh
echo mesa
same
last urchin
What is sleeping
frail adder
I remember i had this A:TLA how to draw book when i was a kid
echo mesa
what is it with artists and shitty sleeping habits, man
waxen veldt
inking is going to be harder than I thought.
I think the image is way too big for my tablet to properly handle.
crimson field
it's the "just gotta finish the hair then skin" mentality
frail adder
It was amazing although i skipped all the tutorials and tried to trace the characters outright kek
crimson field
Us nerdy gamers do the same shit
waxen veldt
I keep erasing and it keeps re-doing the lines because it can't keep up.
crimson field
Writers, programmers. Everyone.
brazen lark
DFKJGHNDF I STARTED OFF THE SAME WAY NARC
except it was with a how to draw an animal kinda book
echo mesa
This pic I'm doing of Abigail lowkey reminds me of the seventies or eighties era fashion? with her curly hair
onyx island
Hmmm wonder if Penny has a naturally curly hair or if it's only curly because she curls it artificially to make her hairdo... 
brazen lark
if we go by her mom, its prob natural?
onyx island
I just got a Pam badge for that level up, that's a signal 🤣
echo mesa
Probably natural? I imagine Penny wants to get out of the caravan as soon as she can each day
She wont want to waste time preparing for the day, so simple hair routine and stuff
crimson field
pam badges for all
echo mesa
he left, doesnt Pam reference it?
onyx island
Personal headcanon says she sleeps with hair rollers 🤣
crimson field
As someone who grew up in a very similar environment, let's just say: Who Even Knows
onyx island
Penny mentions her father leaving both her and Pam because he "felt imprisoned"
echo mesa
makes sense
Pam probably wasn't a loving/supportive partner either
frail adder
I support Pam and I want her to change because I believe in her and i don't want more tragic characters that remind me of things God damn it!!!!
echo mesa
marriageable Pam when?
onyx island
Eh, that's an excuse to leave Pam but not for stopping seeing Penny
crimson field
People are falliable
Not everyone wants a kid, even if they have one.
It's shitty but people kinda just are they way they are.
echo mesa
or Pam could have even made it difficult on him to see Penny
shrugs in French
But yeah, some people are just like that
crimson field
It's also possible he just wasn't fit to be around her. And if Pam thought he was unfit, compared to her, just i m a g i n e
onyx island
Yeah, like my own father <_<
lone mountain
both are garbo 👏
onyx island
He died shortly after so I suppose that's karma at work 🤣
frail adder
I don't like the idea of abusive Pam, I like the idea of Pam who doesn't know how to take care of herself let alone another person. She needs to work on herself before she can make amends with Penny and who knows if Penny will ever forgive her but all she can do is try her best and be a Good Woman
lone mountain
well people dont just abuse people cause they want to
crimson field
The thing is that Pam is so caught up in her own life circumstances.
echo mesa
I like your version of Penny @ Narc
crimson field
Like she feels like a victim of circumstance.
echo mesa
I mean Pam
crimson field
As in that's how she feels about herself.
frail adder
Some people just have a very victimizing personality and not saying that's good but if SDV were "real" and she worked to change that then i think she could really be a positive character
echo mesa
its okay to acknowledge being a victim in some circumstances
But you also need to push forward and seek out change
onyx island
it's ok though, Penny can come to live on my farm! 
crimson field
If you compare the two most obviously depressed characters in the game - Pam and Shane - Shane clearly has unresolved trauma likely related to the death of Jas' parents that has catalysed his depression. Meanwhile, Pam is focused on bandaids to her problems. They have very different forms.
frail adder
Hurt people hurt people and it isn't good but it's just how it is
Shane makes me sad
lone mountain
well shane and pam both use alcohol as a bandaid
crimson field
That too
But for different reasons, when you delve into the deep psychology of their characterization.
lone mountain
ofc
echo mesa
I love Shane as a character
But its like
Even if Shane and Pam decide to self-improve
It's going to be a life-long thing
They won't ever be 'fixed people'
They'll always have problems and need to work further on themselves
frail adder
Shane is like the alcoholic that drinks their grief away and Pam is the alcoholic that drinks either A just to drink or B to mask her issues
onyx island
I don't mind helping them get to the point they feel somewhat comfortable with themselves sooner though! Hehe
crimson field
Like Shane is an alcoholic as a symptom of his depression. He uses it as escapism. Pam drinks because she doesn't want to do anything else.
lone mountain
not wanting to do anything is also a symptom of depression tho
so its a possibility she has it too
onyx island
though she mentions feeling "alive again" once she gets back her bus job, I like that
crimson field
The main point is that they both have very different forms of depression and coping that happen to have very similar outward symptoms.
Yeah, but Shane says he's drinking less in an event but still has the same daily bar routine.
lone mountain
mhm
crimson field
Which is something we are looking to address in our mod.
lone mountain
could be intentional could be unintentional who knows
idk if anyone has brought it up it CA
onyx island
he goes to the bar even after marriage?
crimson field
Believe so. I mainly mean after the event with Jas. He specifically says he's drinking way less, sparkling water instead.
frail adder
I feel like Pam thinks there's no hope left for her. She's middle aged and has pissed away her youth, so like.. Maybe she feels like there's no point in getting help. She also pushed out her daughter, I feel like that's because she feels like an unfit mother. I think Pam is very self aware.. She just doesn't know how to help herself, and has nobody that believes in her or is willing to help her anymore
crimson field
Quite likely
late ingot
I think it is Jev, since it only happens at one event.
onyx island
the little fic I wrote about Pam and I need to properly format kinda talks about Pam's point of view and it has some of that. I should really format it so I can share it with you all
echo mesa
A Pam fic
sounds cool, Im looking forward to it
crimson field
It's called Cycle of Life. The basic concept behind it is to age the NPCs and players and, as they pass on, gradually replaces them with custom NPCs at the town continues to thrive. The PC will eventually be able to play as their own child as well, when the child is of age.
crimson field
east coast best coast
crimson field
Yeah, it's a hugely ambitious project. Not my brainchild, but I'm apparently managing it.
As well as heading character development and writing.
frail adder
It's a feature I loved so much in Harvest Moon: A Wonderful Life and I'd love to see it implemented in SDV!!!
crimson field
If you liked that you should look into Kynseed
frail adder
Amsmsmma
crimson field
That's the core concept behind Kynseed actually
crimson field
It seems promising.
frail adder
I love quality of life stuff and ultra dynamic environmental shit
And I love life sims so skmamda kinda go hand in hand sorta
crimson field
Anyway, I should attempt the sleep thing. Night folks.
onyx island
Gnight!
late ingot
Same, I’m heading off too. Night everyone!
onyx island
Hehe, can always compare it to your oown hand
waxen veldt
That's sort of how I know it maybe kind of sort of looks like a hand.
onyx island
I often use my own hand as reference for drawing since it saves me the time of looking up for a pic of a hand in the position I really need
waxen veldt
My hand is very tiny and it throws off my sense of how long fingers should be.
But it works well enough for positioning.
onyx island
Hands, just an artist's best friends and worst enemies! 🤣
waxen veldt
One more hand and I finish roughly ONE character inking.
Working on my surface wasn't a great idea.
(or maybe I just shouldn't have such a giant image)
waxen veldt
I guess I can post the one inked character along with the totally-not-inked ones??
like a wip???
frail adder
Yess do
echo mesa
always fun to share wips
waxen veldt
One character looks slightly less like a terrible sketch now
echo mesa
almost looks like the dude is grabbing the middle ones wing