Those boomers that play premodern are the worst
#Magic the Gathering
tardy echo
Premodern to vintage is the real pipeline
Once premodern players drop the pretense of wanting back and forth they just admit they want to stop you from activating cards
glad peak
Yugioh players? 
sleek ferry
Thank you for bringing that up, Edison players are also the worst
And nobody cares about goat players
glad peak
Yugioh to vintage is a legitimate pipeline 
sleek ferry
Not even their mothers
glad peak
My goal for another playgroup I have is whenever tries to flex with a format they say is good in any game, I show them exactly why they’re wrong
Because 100% of the time so far they’ve never actually played that format 
Funniest reaction so far has been goat where my opponent just got up and left after t1 duo thundra charity
twilit canyon
honestly i tried edison before and...
its alright
idk why ppl had hyped it up so much
glad peak
The Edison incident for me when t1 dupe lock and the guy’s just panicking and saying that’s not a fair deck and I should switch to a fair deck
I think something’s in California’s water
tardy echo
I was gonna say this is insane but it’s a sorcery
Still seems good for blink
But idk if we have enough in standard for an actual playstyle
stark skiff
I was gonna say this is insane but it’s a sorcery
lol same
golden plover
Rate my new cube ideas and tell me which is funnier:
-Generic Draft Archetype Cube (Azorious Fliers)
Or
-Generic Draft Archetype Cube but they're in the wrong colors (Rakdos Fliers)
golden plover
I think the second is way funnier
past socket
[[!Ophiomancer|SOC]]
lost widgetBOT
past socket
Finally, I can cast David Bowie
golden plover
Tell everyone "Oh it's just the normal draft archetypes don't worry"
And then they're playing Boros Landfall
Okay so I've got:
Rakdos Fliers
Boros Landfall
Golgari Go Wide
Dimir Aggro
Izzet Go Tall
Still need:
Selsenya?
Simic?
Azorious?
Orzhov (Burn)?
Gruul (God I wanna somehow make that one Control)
sleek ferry
Okay so I've got:
Rakdos Fliers
Boros Landfall
Golgari Go Wide
Dimir Aggro
Izze...
Gruul tokens
Selesnya control
Orzhov burn
Simic aggro
golden plover
Gruul Tokens is playable yeah.
Dunno how you'd make Selsenya control work
subtle sierra
white and green have removal options
golden plover
True. But then you'd be able to draft Azorious Control
subtle sierra
and you surely find a white and/or green wincon
golden plover
The idea is that you're forced to play a traditional draft archetype in the wrong colors
subtle sierra
then idk maybe [[buried in the garden]]
lost widgetBOT
golden plover
SELSENYA SPELLSLINGER
subtle sierra
idk if there's more shit like this
golden plover
So that just leaves Simic and Azorious
golden plover
Simic Control is a good option, but then you have the fear of people drafting Azorious Control
sleek ferry
Selesnya control was the way with cards like the boar imo
golden plover
Simic Artifacts?
golden plover
It'd let you build Jeskai Landfall
golden plover
simic artifacts was literally the mh2 archetype
Was it?
I don't think I can avoid hitting a few that have been used at least once
glad peak
officially it was simic junk but the junk happened to be tokens and things that get boosted from artifacts
glad peak
jeskai landfall would be funny
golden plover
Yeah I think Simic Artifacts is probably not supported enough
I like the idea of that
What fucking UW ramp cards do we have?
glad peak
how about simic reanimator
golden plover
Is that even doable?
tardy echo
What fucking UW ramp cards do we have?
Path to exile and erode 
glad peak
there's path and the new path
and there's some cards that ramp if you opponent has more cards
golden plover
I guess there's [[Reenact the Crime]]
lost widgetBOT
tardy echo
Uhh blue has a couple of rocks if you count those
Actually that would be a nice crux to build on
Blue ramps with artifacts so white lets you catchup ramp still
tardy echo
And then yeah it also works w the simic artifact thing
golden plover
Would let you build Bant Ramp theoretically
tardy echo
Once you get into 3c territory it doesn’t matter
Bant also normally doesn’t do a ton of ramp anyways
glad peak
bant ramp without green ramp pieces is fine
golden plover
Okay so the archetypes are:
Rakdos Fliers
Boros Landfall
Golgari Go Wide
Dimir Aggro
Izzet Go Tall
Selsenya Spellslinger
Simic Artifacts
Azorious Ramp
Orzhov Burn
Gruul Tokens
This is prefaced with "hey guys the cube is all the normal draft archetypes"
golden plover
Is there enough flash?
glad peak
there's a lot for green for sure
gruul control/enchantress would be funny too
if you change rakdos then golgari flyers is a funny nod too
the serra angel problem, if anyone remembers that
golden plover
True, but I think there's like no way to do Golgari fliers
There should be two open archetypes at any time btw: The intended one (bad) or the real archetype (bad)
glad peak
golgari flash turns into draw go most times actually
tbh i think that's a good inversion
the proactive midrange colors turning into a fully reactive control deck
golden plover
Oh hey Orzhov Burn gets to run extort
trail anvil
christ this chat is more active than gen yugioh these days
golden plover
UW ramp <:KEKW:622347587516628993>
This actually means esper is probably pretty good
You've got more mana to pay into extrort
vivid hatch
😭 modern deck prices
knotty ferry
christ this chat is more active than gen yugioh these days
You're welcome
glad peak
What’s the cheapest way to reanimate 3 creatures?
For 1 card I’m guessing it’s 5 mana but for 2 cards there victimize + reanimate
lusty trench
I'm assuming you dont mean reanimate by sacing stuff?
tardy echo
What’s the cheapest way to reanimate 3 creatures?
Flash for protean hulk lets you reanimate infinite creatures for 2 mana gg
glad peak
wtf is that hairstyle
stark skiff
christ this chat is more active than gen yugioh these days
We’ve been sneaking them over
Even @atomic harness is about to start writing about mtg now for cash
trail anvil
no that's definitely go wide spells and not go tall
copying call the coppercoats can end games hard
glad peak
Flash for protean hulk lets you reanimate infinite creatures for 2 mana gg
Truuue, time to make that deck in vintage
tardy echo
Oh hey, bad Feather
Different from feather
golden plover
wtf is that hairstyle <:clearly:1247706297491656795>
She's a djinn
tardy echo
Feather is just voltron this copies anything
golden plover
Yeah true. This is more go wide spells, you're right
golden plover
She's a djinn
Honestly kinda surprised a djinn even has hair
tardy echo
What does being a djinn even mean when you’re on a plane overflowing with magic
tardy echo
Is it just when you’re born with funny colored skin and no hair
golden plover
I guess lol?
tardy echo
Is a child with jaundice considered a djinn on arcavios
tardy echo
I was gonna say the flip of this card has hair but the flip is an efreet
golden plover
She's not a Ravnica Djinn, they're fucked up
tardy echo
Whatever the fuck THAT means
golden plover
Not an Ixalan Djinn (of which we have one, total)
And Dominarian Djinns are more wind-based and blue (in body color)
Actually where the fuck is she from
copper pecan
Not an Ixalan Djinn (of which we have one, total)
that one isn't from ixalan, it's from a plane called "wildfire" which is also where city of brass is from
tardy echo
His nips are out
Ok after some brief research it seems efreets are just djinns that wotc didnt want to be djinns
They are also just humanoids gifted in magical abilities who sometimes have funny colored skin and dubious amounts of hair
copper pecan
yeah they stopped making efreets because they realized there was just no point in having them be separate types
tardy echo
Then isn’t that kind of cheating to let them in the school…
fallow citrus
idfk man
tardy echo
Imagine if you got into Harvard but you were competing in your class against some guy who has 2 brains
That’s unfair…
fallow citrus
well i would have said like
you get into harvard but you have einstein in your class
like yeah you're both smart he's just built different
tardy echo
Well idk I’m sorta built the same as Einstein
fallow citrus
ok buddy
glad peak
Imagine having 2 brains and losing the top score to a half brainer
golden plover
I guess she's from a plane we haven't seen yet then that's got humanoid djinn?
golden plover
that one isn't from ixalan, it's from a plane called "wildfire" which is also wh...
Ah gotcha. I thought this was just like the lizard thing on Ixalan where they exist but we have like 2 cards that show it
glad peak
So, funny thing about bolt wizard
He gets better with more copies out so you suddenly get to play with 3+ extra cards a turn
3 of him out turns on all of them and deals 9 for 3
tardy echo
An extremely realistic board state
Looking thru reveals and wow we have not seen a ton of green
glad peak
Just need 2 copies and it’s doable
tardy echo
The 1 drop rampant bear thing is good… I think
glad peak
Breach used to rely on 3 drcs on the field to win too
tardy echo
But doesn’t slot into current green decks very well
Aside from that the other two mono green cards have been troll
But golgari has gotten some decent cards if they actually slow the format down
atomic harness
The 1 drop rampant bear thing is good… I think
Sigh I said this but the kids dont like it
tardy echo
It would be good if green wasn’t like the primo aggro color of the format
But no green deck in current wants to play this
trail anvil
it's a commander card tbh
trail anvil
when you're confident your 1 drop isn't getting disrupted it's a perfect card
steve is 2 mana tbh
tardy echo
So you’re paying… 1 mana for your 1/1 that lets you have mana
trail anvil
this can trade with a 1 toughness creature but it's different
tardy echo
That is in fact very on rate
trail anvil
it's on rate but it's different
tardy echo
I mean yeah it’s a sidegrade
trail anvil
actually tbh I'd argue a 1/1 for 1 in current magic without the rampant growth isn't on rate these days
tardy echo
Have they powercrept wood elves stats
trail anvil
o y'know what wood elves is fair, and you can blink both
tardy echo
Yeah I guess elves is a better analogy
Mana cost is split so you can play it earlier but only gets basics
trail anvil
actually on second thought worse than blinking elves since you need to pay 2 mana each time
trail anvil
I feel like where this card is best in slot is where you want both ramp and you want to cast sorceries like magecraft
trail anvil
eh like I feel like if you're running wood elves you're either blink or an elf deck
these days
tardy echo
I mean I don’t think it’s best in slot compared to other og ramp dudes
But standard doesn’t have any of those ramp dudes
trail anvil
standard has some new ramp dudes 😎
tardy echo
Yeah I think the biggest indictment of this card is just that green doesn’t want to do what it’s doing
trail anvil
well not green alone no
but I think if you're in some kind of instant/sorcery deck with green this is really nice
trail anvil
jadzi 
tardy echo
Not the format I’m talking about
trail anvil
yeah this has no home in standard, it's a commander card
I don't think cards like this will ever have a home in standard until we go back to 2 year rotation tbh
tardy echo
Idk I think there’s a world where this would’ve been playable
But it’s not the one where cub gives you 6 mana on turn 3
glad peak
Questing Druid is technically still legal
Good? Hell nah not anymore
But I miss when miracle gro was a deck
trail anvil
you're a bit late to that but ye, path to exile sidegrade or probably upgrade in many circumstances
tardy echo
Notably u can do the cleansing wildfire thing in white now
Though idk how many indestructible guys still see play
fallow citrus
path to graveyard
tardy echo
Im actually so hype for this card
I’m gonna play orzhov in standard again and nobody can stop me
The silverquill cards in general have been v nice
Now they just need to make abzan good colors again and wotc will have my soul
glad peak
You can do the cleansing wildfire play in standard but it’s a whole lot easier to wildfire on indestructible lands and draw a card vs getting an indestructible creature and not drawing a card
That being said I wish wildfire was in standard
tardy echo
Indestructible lands are also only like propagated in like 2 formats no
tardy echo
Even if it was I don’t think many decks would be playing it
glad peak
If wildfire was in the format people would
tardy echo
Mby
glad peak
Especially in a format right now where basics are very light
You can pop a land and draw or occasionally ramp and draw
copper pecan
i don't think they want there to be artifact lands in standard forever
glad peak
Nah last time they had it, it was chill
Wait there’s one currently
[[scene of the crime]]
lost widgetBOT
Artifact Land — Clue
This land enters tapped.
: Add 
.
, Tap an untapped creature you control: Add one mana of any color.
, Sacrifice this land: Draw a card.
tardy echo
Yeah there’s a reason this is fine in standard
glad peak
The dual ones would be fine too
tardy echo
I think that’s just something they don’t want to entertain in standard
trail anvil
eh like your biggest worry is krang ig?
I don't think it's that bad as long as you don't print too many affinity cards into standard. tapped lands are a real cost in a meta this fast too
atomic harness
I don't think it's that bad as long as you don't print too many affinity cards i...
Free the artifact lands
We've waited too long
@twilit canyon 
[[pinnacle emissary]]
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Artifact Creature — Robot
Whenever you cast an artifact spell, create a 1/1 colorless Drone artifact creature token with flying and "This token can block only creatures with flying."
Warp 
(You may cast this card from your hand for its warp cost. Exile this creature at the beginning of the next end step, then you may cast it from exile on a later turn.)
3/3
atomic harness
seat of the synod pinnacle mopal etc etc
twilit canyon
pogging for a card from 4 sets ago nearly?
twilit canyon
ren has to keep up with magic...
sleek ferry
[[ravenous robots]]
atomic harness
Oh I'm pogging at seat...
lost widgetBOT
Artifact Creature — Robot
Whenever you cast an artifact spell, create a 1/1 colorless Robot artifact creature token.
, : Creature tokens you control gain haste until end of turn.
"The mousers have a new command: to consume everything here . . . all of you will be destroyed!" —Baxter Stockman
2/1
sleek ferry
I played around with it in Temur, but black is probably the better color to splash
past socket
robbits
tardy echo
Flashback target geyser is infinite mana btw
sudden lava
Flashback target geyser is infinite mana btw
how?
glad peak
But also yes flashback makes any deck that runs intuition slightly better since drawing a intuition target doesn’t make it awkward
sudden lava
Flashback target geyser, cast geyser, its exiled now
glad peak
Flashback makes tainted pact a 2 card combo
Another *
Tainted pact grab thoracle, play thoracle, trigger on the stack flashback tainted pact
Makes gale and kess irrelevant
tardy echo
Flashback target geyser, cast geyser, its exiled now
Chatter learns what hyperbole is
If you need to resolve more than 2 geysers in one turn idk what deck you’re playing
A lot of decks win resolving 1
glad peak
No, I’m working on marchesa now and I think I’m unironically playing buried alive and living death now
tardy echo
Makes gale and kess irrelevant
I mean having it in the command zone is def still nice
Unless u mean playing kess in the 99 then yeah
glad peak
I don’t see how getting 3 mana for 5 mana helps
golden plover
OH MY GOD I JUST REALIZED EVERY QUINTORIUS CARD COSTS 5 MANA
I can't believe I didn't get the bit until now
glad peak
But yeah I’ve heard of some people running kess and past in flames for intuition but it never made sense for me, mana’s rough
tardy echo
OH MY GOD I JUST REALIZED EVERY QUINTORIUS CARD COSTS 5 MANA
The new one doesn’t
Actually
But the first 3 all did
tardy echo
He does have 5 loyalty though
trail anvil
christ this is 1 mana?
stark skiff
zinc shard
This feels like bullying
tardy echo
I hate to say it but jeskai control is like actually v good after this set no
subtle sierra
well yeah it was good before
tardy echo
I never respect that deck
subtle sierra
your loss 
tardy echo
That’s why I hate to say that it’s a massive winner
tardy echo
your loss <:cheems:683182129668292685>
You say it’s my loss yet I haven’t lost to it this format yet. Curious!
subtle sierra
ngl all the control players i meet either on arena or irl are fucking stupid
subtle sierra
like yeah man you will win the mirror by surveiling 2 revelations to gy and then using your other 2 to bounce mine
tardy echo
Jeskai just got a ton of upgrades to cards it was already playing
tardy echo
The 5 mana draw 4/ deal 4 to all seems good too idk
tardy echo
People actually paid 5 mana for lorien revealed
There’s other options for high curve stuff
trail anvil
flashback on jeskai revelation after the first jeskai revelation sounds vomit inducing
tardy echo
Lorehold, the lute, the prismari looting thing
twilit canyon
well yeah it was good before
jim davis has been so off of jeskai (i bring it up cus im in semi frequent contact w him)
he prefers pure blue/white
tho after this coming set hes def considering jeskai more
subtle sierra
i was rocking jeskai black for a while
trail anvil
does he like the focus vs having a solid finisher?
subtle sierra
i'm on 5c rn but mostly due to lessons from life
twilit canyon
yeah generally
subtle sierra
but the izzet wipe is changing that
twilit canyon
jim's been playing control for nearly as long as i've been alive so i do trust his opinion a lot though some of it is def preference
i myself, would play jeskai if i wanted control rn
subtle sierra
the set gives too much good red/izzet stuff not to play red
tardy echo
tho after this coming set hes def considering jeskai more
Tell jim to consider atraxa colors 
I forget the names of the 4c combos
trail anvil
damn jim's that old?
twilit canyon
greed
tardy echo
Witch maw…?
trail anvil
dude is baby faced
trail anvil
if you told me he was in his 20s I would've believed you tbh
twilit canyon
married ass man
trail anvil
Greed is good that’s what my favorite novel the great gatsby taught me
great gatsby taught me a bisexual love triangle is a fantastic setting for a drama
twilit canyon
woah hold on dont drag love triangles into the sins of bisexuals
tardy echo
great gatsby taught me a bisexual love triangle is a fantastic setting for a dra...
I thought that would’ve been apparent
Didn’t you watch twilight??
trail anvil
love triangles don't discriminate with orientations
trail anvil
Didn’t you watch twilight??
nope
twilit canyon
you both missed out and got lucky
tardy echo
Chat do we think withering curse is gonna be good
Black doesn’t rlly have any board wipes right now but also most of the black decks that would like one are already in white
twilit canyon
i think it'll be solid
tardy echo
However… it is v good in golgari
trail anvil
tbh I think -2 wipes are already okay but how much incidental lifegain is there rn
subtle sierra
Black doesn’t rlly have any board wipes right now but also most of the black dec...
what
tardy echo
If people ever play those cards again
twilit canyon
i think the req set up to gain life before it board wipes is nonessential
twilit canyon
a -2/-2 board wipe is already decent enough for sb play
trail anvil
time for people to cope on orzhov lifegain some more 
subtle sierra
idk how you can say deadly sucks when it's also a pseudo wincon
twilit canyon
empty deep cavern bat swing gain life kill their whole board sounds toxic
subtle sierra
the exile is, but it's still a good wipe
tardy echo
A majority of black decks aren’t on it for a reason
subtle sierra
yeah cause they aren't control
if a deck wants an early wipe there are -2/-2 stuff for 3 in the format
trail anvil
[[day of black sun]]
lost widgetBOT
tardy echo
time for people to cope on orzhov lifegain some more <:copium:901139245056528444...
It’s not cope it’s real!!!1!1 bats will destroy the meta!!!!
twilit canyon
if a deck wants an early wipe there are -2/-2 stuff for 3 in the format
yeah and getting one that some decks will accidentally turn it into god is actually strong
trail anvil
isn't this the common sideboard wipe rn
subtle sierra
i'm just saying that there are wipes in the format and curse upside is not as easy to achieve as you might think
trail anvil
cause it hits earthbended lands
subtle sierra
it doesn't
subtle sierra
no
tardy echo
isn't this the common sideboard wipe rn
It’s the most popular in non control decks and it still feels terrible to resolve
Sigh we need to reprint pest control in standard again before it rotates 
tardy echo
However… it is v good in golgari
Anyways I think these cards are so close to being ok
subtle sierra
both are literally played extensively idk what you're on about cake
tardy echo
But glissa rotated and now it’s just like how do these colors play on curve
subtle sierra
almost every excruciator mains 2 of each
tardy echo
Show what decks are playing cover up
subtle sierra
tardy echo
Because if a notable amount of non excruciator decks are playing cover up I’ll take back every mean thing I’ve ever said about that bum ass card
Ok. It’s just excruciator
subtle sierra
there's a decent bit of the meta
tardy echo
I hate to sound mean but yes of course the card that lobotomizes is good in that deck
subtle sierra
Black doesn’t rlly have any board wipes right now
i'm trying to point out that there are good wipes rn
not that they're like deck specific
black is supposed to have wipes for 1 more mana than white
it doesn't make them bad
bad wipes are like, [[vilainous wrath]]
lost widgetBOT
subtle sierra
which i will be the first to say is ass
deadly is miles above this
and if you need to wipe early, as a pseudo split up, you have the -2/-2 wipes
tardy echo
> Black doesn’t rlly have any board wipes right now
i'm trying to point out that...
Chatter discovers hyperbole
Black also doesn’t have good cards in general hope this helps!
subtle sierra
ok w/e i can't be bothered by this
twilit canyon
is black the worst color rn...? i actually kinda think it may be
in standard at least
tardy echo
It’s close between that and red
twilit canyon
i think red saves itself thanks to prowess/lessons being really strong
tardy echo
80% of good red cards right now are good because of blue cards… but also 100% of good black cards right now only see play because of blue cards
twilit canyon
but ig if u go outside of izzet...
tardy echo
Mono red is playable
Better than u can say about mono black
Rotation was not kind to that deck
Lotv and sheoldred carried that deck and now both are gone
twilit canyon
new ral should help but
twilit canyon
what better way to use him than to support him with good cards from blue and red
maybe white
especially cus mana is good rn
tardy echo
This standard is also just not kind to planeswalkers atm
Especially not when ral is in the set that just printed path for planeswalkers
This standard also just isn’t kind to anything mono black does
Have fun with single target removal against cub decks
Or even better against the 20 different decks that don’t even care about removal
twilit canyon
ye
tho idt the new path will be nearly as imactful tbqh
its gonna be good but the flaw of path is the land it grants
even if it can hit walkers...
tardy echo
I mean path was still a v v good card
twilit canyon
if they have a beneficial ability, then you are letting them get their loyalty off + give them a land
tardy echo
Unless u just mean specifically for hitting a planeswalker
twilit canyon
I mean path was still a v v good card
that was in a different era of magic tbh. nowdays an extra land is a really bad downside
tardy echo
It depends on the mu imo
twilit canyon
also the most powerful walker u want to hit with this cant get hit by it
and the deck its played in: loves getting more lands into play
tardy echo
Well it’s okay because he’s gonna be hit by rotation soon
twilit canyon
kaito will be-
yeah
but
i still dont trust in the card
it'll see play
but i will guess it wont see as much play
tardy echo
I think it will prob be like
Complementary to seam rip
Unless ur playing decks where u can actually synergize with the white rampant growth…
Which is somewhat non negligible
This will be what sephiroth needed to be good…
trail anvil
not being able to kill enduring curiosity cleanly is unfortunate too
tardy echo
Fortunately, you know what does hit that card
I’ll give you a hint it’s the same thing that kills Kaito
twilit canyon
conceding?
trail anvil
[[time stop]] on cast
lost widgetBOT
tardy echo
TRUE
trail anvil
😌
twilit canyon
end the turn, fuck you
tardy echo
And they said blue doesn’t have permanent removal
twilit canyon
god time stop/end turn effects are just so fun to me
tardy echo
Time stop with a creature on the stack what are you gonna do about it
trail anvil
ending the turn is one of the funnest mechanics in magic, at least for the one doing the turn ending lol
especially in applications like sundial of the infinite
trail anvil
[[discontinuity]] is my favorite application of it though
lost widgetBOT
Instant
During your turn, this spell costs 
less to cast.
End the turn. (Exile all spells and abilities from the stack, including this card. The player whose turn it is discards down to their maximum hand size. Damage wears off, and "this turn" and "until end of turn" effects end.)
trail anvil
potential counterspell as well
tardy echo
[[shadow of the second sun]]
lost widgetBOT
tardy echo
What a funny card
trail anvil
wilderness reclamation plus
tardy echo
It is in effect a wilderness rec in blue
Yeah
Not something that those cards were meant to have but.
tardy echo
Word
trail anvil
oh man now I wanna copy this enchantment
twilit canyon
who do I need to contact for this to happen
also just like
run your own pioneer atp
fuck it
maybe it gets more traction that wotc
tardy echo
oh man now I wanna copy this enchantment
How many ways are there to copy player auras
trail anvil
lmao it'd be more supported by default
trail anvil
How many ways are there to copy player auras <:icant:1310294700384714813>
I think a decent amount? lots of stuff that copies nonland permanents in blue
tardy echo
But if it just copies an aura it won’t be attached to you
trail anvil
ik some are non-aura but I think that's just one kind of copy spell
tardy echo
No?
trail anvil
pretty sure when you copy an aura you need to declare the target when you do so
trail anvil
i.e. [[arna kennerud, skycaptain]]
lost widgetBOT
trail anvil
this works with auras (it damn well better considering the colors it's in)
actually bad example
tardy echo
Well yeah but it also distinguishes attached to
twilit canyon
god i forget that this card is cool asf
if only they could have made it cost 3
why did nadu get to cost 3
trail anvil
yeah idk!
twilit canyon
literally wtf was their problem
trail anvil
arna even comes down slow in commander games tbh. you can set up before her but it's pretty damn telegraphed
tardy echo
Sometimes I wonder if nadu really was that way because of a single misplayed quotation mark
Like did wotc do that on accident
twilit canyon
doubt tbh
trail anvil
I think wotc wanted to do a strong ramp card but forgot other formats existed
tardy echo
Ok but bro even got banned in commander
trail anvil
and then didn't realize how out of control 2x on each creature would get
tardy echo
Did they just forget shuko existed
trail anvil
and that probably
tardy echo
I wish that people found a way to break nadu in vintage too
twilit canyon
nah cus they even printed a combo piece with nadu in the same set
tardy echo
Just so he could do what lurrus couldn’t
twilit canyon
genuinely dont believe they didnt see it
tardy echo
Get banned in commander and vintage at once
tardy echo
nah cus they even printed a combo piece *with* nadu in the same set
Yeah nantuko was crazy work
twilit canyon
on the flipside, ik not to attribute to malice what can be explained by incompetence
tardy echo
Like how impossible is it that they just misplaced the quotation
trail anvil
afaik it was like skullclamp where it was an untested change
tardy echo
Ok but skullclamp is based
trail anvil
it is tbh
tardy echo
Nadu is also… a little based
glad peak
People often label things they’ve never experienced as based
tardy echo
Chat might not like hearing this but the only thing more fun than an infinite is a non-deterministic infinite
tardy echo
People often label things they’ve never experienced as based <:dubismile:1470819...
People often label people they dont agree with as inexperienced
glad peak
That being said I do like playing nadu, deck was funny
trail anvil
okay look I was a nexus of fate abuser but even then fuck nadu
glad peak
Everyone is inexperienced
tardy echo
No actually you can shut up if you played nexus you’re no better than me
You’re worse actually
trail anvil
it was fun sitting on exactly one wincon in the entire deck and just looping until you slowly killed them with a 1/1
tardy echo
But don’t pretend that fog turbo into infinite turns was cool when it had just as little actual gameplay
glad peak
You haven’t lived unless you’ve played te5eri and nexus in the same deck
trail anvil
bant nexus
🤮
glad peak
With te5eri being your only win con
trail anvil
pick a lane nerd, winconless azorius control or 1 wincon nexus tbh
tardy echo
The actual misunderstood combo deck was amalia but chat might actually crucify me for that one
glad peak
Nah you’d just exile everything with teferi with all the time you get and draw go while tucking him back in over and over again
glad peak
The actual misunderstood combo deck was amalia but chat might actually crucify m...
Nah that too new school
tardy echo
People just hated her because they ain’t her 
trail anvil
was amalia combo not the face of wizards neglecting pioneer as a format for a while
tardy echo
Ok but it was a cool deck
glad peak
Amelia combo was fine ngl
tardy echo
I think amalia combo was sort of iconic to a lot of ppl for pioneer in general
glad peak
Lifegain combo isnt something you see everyday
tardy echo
Like if u ask 100 ppl what decks come to mind when they think of pioneer
I think like a very solid chunk will say Amalia
glad peak
Well, now they’d say amalia, it’s a newer deck 
trail anvil
not greasefang, the eternal deck in the format?
tardy echo
Weird combo deck that was bad in other formats and only existed with jank draft chaff
That’s like peak pioneer
trail anvil
are you calling wildgrowth walker draft chaff wtf
glad peak
Yes
trail anvil
that card was core in sultai midrange during its meta??
tardy echo
???
trail anvil
you farmed the shit out of monored with it
trail anvil
more RNA than ixalan standard
glad peak
Standard was pretty ass in ixalan ngl
trail anvil
RNA + GRN standard was peak though
sultai midrange, monoblue, azorius control, monored, monowhite, monogreen were all viable
glad peak
Yep, mono blue tempo is my all time fav
trail anvil
yeah that iteration of monoblue was clean as fuck
glad peak
Won so many boxes in gpla from it and sold them all at the venue
trail anvil
temur rec was my favorite deck of all time in that standard
half control half combo that could hang at instant speed
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glad peak
Yeah I couldn’t remember if it was before or after RNA
Holy [[hydroid krasis]] got such a glow down
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trail anvil
I still have a soft spot in my heart for that card
triggering on cast was so nice vs all the counter magic
wan shi tong really mogs it though
glad peak
Best in class before all the power acceleration
I don’t think siege rhino would even be good in current standard
glad peak
Yes I know the real star is thoughtseize but even with that other decks use it so much better than rhino
Jeskai ascendancy aged well, good to see that type of deck still in standard
trail anvil
is this a proxy
atomic harness
@subtle sierra @glad peak @trail anvil would sheoldred the apocalypse still be good in standard today?
since siege rhino sucks ass
trail anvil
sheoldred is still sheoldred tbh
subtle sierra
the decks would have to adapt to outing her
she also has just enough toughness to need 3 lessons for combustion to out, which you kinda wanna prevent anyway
sear can't out her either
so it becomes akward for izzet decks which is like idk, 15-20% of the meta?
since most of their digging comes from card draw
the only ones that don't are stock up and wisdom
and granted they're good if they don't find the out, you're stuck with opt and attachments
other decks can kinda just out her, dimir has enough tools for that, granted, again, they'd have to retool their main decks for her since hex or nowhere to run don't out her
the recent rise in slight momo numbers can just ignore her i think
trail anvil
dimir is the deck that would run her the most too though tbh
subtle sierra
true
and control usually has tools for her but she's good to land once the 1 to 1 trading is over
add in erode and control is fine
so tldr she'd be good but not format breaking
atomic harness
Yeah that's fine
subtle sierra
god i want so many strixhaven cards in my cope deck
i wonder if the blue capstone is good
tardy echo
<@271408742849839115> <@149916954331709440> <@166336091941634048> would sheoldre...
Lessons would lose half their life trying to get rid of her
There’s a ton of decks that sort of durdle around in mid game right now without an actual super efficient way to end the game
And sheoldred punishes them very hard
trail anvil
god i want so many strixhaven cards in my cope deck
so the wincon here is mill?
subtle sierra
multiple wincons
caller is one, and avatar gets you churn if you need it
there's also just the common control wincon of "stabilize and punch them with good creature"
which is avatar
trail anvil
fair enough
subtle sierra
ral and washington are great for that too
trail anvil
and traumatic critique as a finisher
trail anvil
or if you get enough mana
subtle sierra
well it can deal 22 damage max but i doubt i get all 24 lands out
you can just fish for the one of flashback and there's one in side
trail anvil
well I'd imagine most of the time you'd have poked them down by other means
subtle sierra
yeah
subtle sierra
that's why it's burst lightning over say lightning magic
oh yeah sculpt can help
honestly if someone does a big swing that you counter it would be funny to critique them back
but it's unlikely
oh and worst case great hall is a body that grows off spellslinging
it's something but i don't expect it to kill
sleek ferry
Sheoldred is a very centralizing card. It would undoubtedly see success, regardless of the meta you put her in
Imagine excruciator with atraxa access too lol
subtle sierra
hmm true you could look at it that way
trail anvil
tbh I imagine you could do 3 burst lightning 1 fire magic considering how much draw power you have though
subtle sierra
lightning magic*
trail anvil
yeah that one
trail anvil
well either tbh
subtle sierra
charm can get rid of stuff sear can't, say if a chocobo gets big or smth
like, fuck, i like this charm a lot for this kind of deck
it just does everything
trail anvil
and thunder/fire magic seem like practical uses to pour mana sculpt mana into as well
subtle sierra
true, maybe i should play that in side over pyroclasm
trail anvil
the uncommon signpost instant/sorcery cycle this time around is so much better
eh I think pyroclasm has its use at 2 mana, I just think a 1-of of those pays off with so much consistency
subtle sierra
fair, maybe i'll drop a snare for it
splatter is your main wipe tho
and prismari pings 2 things so sometimes it's that too
trail anvil
you think snare's less important than burst lightning?
subtle sierra
i don't have 4 irl
trail anvil
I think burst lightning is nice to have for face damage but I don't imagine you need all 4 yeah?
trail anvil
lightning, thunder, same difference
trail anvil
this is too nerdy for me, I don't play final fantasy
subtle sierra
dnd
anyway, thunder is 4 mana deal 4
holy it's kinda garbo
lv3 is like, fine but
trail anvil
burst lightning is 5 mana deal 4 smile
trail anvil
well yeah sear is a primo spell rn
but thunder magic is modal and has the 2 damage at 1 mana as well
subtle sierra
true i'll think on it
fire magic i prob wanna add tho
anyways, i think the deck will be fun for me even if it's not the best thing
tardy echo
lightning, thunder, same difference
Ackshaully lightning is a character in final fantasy and thunder is not 
subtle sierra
why is she on the card then
atomic harness
Sheoldred is a very centralizing card. It would undoubtedly see success, regardl...
Thank you son
atomic harness
@subtle sierra @twilit canyon 
subtle sierra
It's not good
Like at all
Lmao
The +1 is like fine for a draft/limited common
The card advantage is not happening more than once before it eats shit
atomic harness
yeah it's probably a limited thing
subtle sierra
even in limited this is meh
flying vigilance is good but i'm not sure if i want it for 3 mana
sleek ferry
In limited this is great
Flying vigilance on a good body
It’s a good blocker at worst
tardy echo
Do we get more reveals today or no
sleek ferry
It’s time
subtle sierra
this isn't strixhaven...
zinc shard
But they are peak
sleek ferry
I missed on the top 5 mythics in Tarkir and didn’t get a special guest
But holy fuck, it’s impossible to minus on edge of eternities
My box wasn’t even insane, but I pulled 4 shocks, 3 of the good mythic lands, a stellar sights strip mine
2x Icetill
tardy echo
eoe is infinite money glitch
past socket
Still super pumped about my Stellar Sights Ancient Tomb to this day from the first day I was in the LGS when EOE finally came back after 6 months
trail anvil
damn you actually managed to find an eoe box? I assumed new ones didn't exist at this point
subtle sierra
our store still had some
but ofc they open them for singles
i still haven't pulled anything from eoe packs besides a nice plains
tardy echo
I think it’s time we unban bargain in legacy @glad peak @atomic harness @twilit canyon
Surely this will be the meta shakeup we’ve all been waiting for
twilit canyon
bargain bin
honestly
they need to insert some cocaine into legacy
bargain would be cute but it'd be a bit too easy tbh
sleek ferry
damn you actually managed to find an eoe box? I assumed new ones didn't exist at...
Market going for 140, but tbh I can see why
Also, I think I’m the only person that’s a fan of aetherdrift
tardy echo
It’s hard to think of like
sleek ferry
they need to insert some cocaine into legacy
Wait till mh4 at this point. Modern is basically having the same issue where even though standard power is up, cards aren’t hitting high enough in non rotating formats rn
tardy echo
What could be a deep cut for legacy
sleek ferry
Which tbh, it’s fine
tardy echo
That wouldn’t also be ridiculously broken
twilit canyon
Wait till mh4 at this point. Modern is basically having the same issue where eve...
h maybe
tardy echo
Actual real question is arcums still too good
I feel like that card got banned because it was boring
twilit canyon
kinda yea
it allowed for 4c blood moon decks
idt its good good, rather its boring
sleek ferry
I wouldn’t mind if they made mh sets every 3-4 years, but just make it clear. But like, are people actually happy with energy/storm/prime time being t1/t2 decks for 3-4 years?
twilit canyon
titan will always be good until they ban the problem card which is titan itself
tardy echo
Ok I have an attack plan to make legacy cool again
twilit canyon
and modern players will shoot themselves before they ever consider banning it
sleek ferry
That’s mainly what I was getting at, modern players love bitching about mh sets, but then the meta will literally be stale for years and they’ll be like “damn, this is so fucking peak”
tardy echo
Unban [[earthcraft]] deathrite shaman and mycospawn
lost widgetBOT
tardy echo
Let’s make cradle broken again gg
glad peak
Didnt they already confirm no mh sets for the foreseeable future?
Modern is pretty healthy rn ngl
And legacy’s in the middle of a shakeup where they’re playing modern decks that force of will doesn’t hurt
glad peak
Probably because the new art
People are just trying to dump at a high price and they have time to do it anyways
tardy echo
I feel like normally it’s the opposite
Idk though
Hopefully archive brings down the price a little bit
glad peak
Usually when it’s announced it goes up again, goes down by a bit, then when the set comes out the price jumps then dips at an average of slightly less than what it started at
tardy echo
Shrug
glad peak
Depends on how much supply there is of course
And commander did put a wrench in that since the price jump was formerly driven by people opening one and needing to buy 3 more
atomic harness
I think it’s time we unban bargain in legacy <@149916954331709440> <@24031057792...
I know how to fix modern son
unban the artifact lands, fury and grief
Holy
glad peak
there's nothing needed to fix in modern
well, there's 1 thing and that's to make prowess better
i guess boros energy might be a bit too good at all stages of the game but that's just jund bay beeeeee
golden plover
glad peak
huh it sure is
copper pecan
i mean, you could also just use [[young pyromancer]]
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copper pecan
oh wait never mind i understand the syngery now
stark skiff
That’s mainly what I was getting at, modern players love bitching about mh sets,...
Yo thugs need some guidance pops
sleek ferry
What you need son
stark skiff
What you need son
Surge Heroes in a Half Shelf or Fracture Bloom Tender
Which do we get
sleek ferry
Surge Heroes in a Half Shelf or Fracture Bloom Tender
Fracture bloom tender
It will hold better
Btw
You know I missed out on a pixel splinter during a break
stark skiff
The surge has less listings tho like 12 compared to like 30 blooms is what made me reconsider
stark skiff
You know I missed out on a pixel splinter during a break
How lol
copper pecan
heroes in a hawk shell
tuah power
think that might be the worst post i've ever made
sleek ferry
How lol
I was doing a break with this whatnot creator I support and I had gotten the number 9. So I was like damn, I really wanted #1, so the guy was like, yeah I’ll give it to you
And 9 got the pixel splinter
stark skiff
I’m actually thinking of making a deck around him sometime but ninja cards too up there now
glad peak
Time to get your shit kicked in little one
knotty ferry
glad peak
i'm hearing something regarding something called hexhaven as an alt reality to strixhaven and it's allied colored dragonlords?
mayhaps tarkir dragons established a school after being trapped in the dragonstorms lol
subtle sierra
what's this card?
copper pecan
it's an example card that wotc gives to focus testers
glad peak
Test Cardname, it's pretty self-explanatory
but yeah i just realized Ral's watermark is something we haven't seen before
glad peak
oh huh
weird watermark
ral might not be from alt college and might just be from alt ravnica or just a random place jace picked him up from
lusty trench
"I NEED THIS." - Jace when asked why he is destroying the multiverse to procreate with a snake
glad peak
I mean, he already can, just no babies
glad peak
Garruk and chandra vs garruk and chandra art is pretty damn nice
He already can on his own without vraska
Well
I guess a baby illusion is technically possible
lusty trench
Whats fucked up is if jace really wanted to he could make a baby illusion and then make vraska think the made an actual child
glad peak
It’ll be like when they met at the duel decks
lusty trench
Memory manipulation is such a crazy unethical power, imagine being able to gaslight the shit out of people
glad peak
Yeah he can force vraska to think she gave birth to loot if she didn’t want to adopt the little goober
sleek ferry
"I NEED THIS." - Jace when asked why he is destroying the multiverse to procreat...
There’s a joke to be made here, but I won’t make it
copper pecan
Memory manipulation is such a crazy unethical power, imagine being able to gasli...
canonically he used to use hypnosis to make people think he was more muscular than he actually was
but during ixalan he got swole for real and stopped doing that
subtle sierra
but during ixalan he got swole for real and stopped doing that
that's what they want you to think
glad peak
I love how all the anti-Jace discourse ended when he became swole
subtle sierra
that's why i go to the gym
stark skiff
I love how all the anti-Jace discourse ended when he became swole
Amnesia fixes all
glad peak
It does help that the writing does get a bit better at that point
golden plover
Ya know... Playing Commander tonight made me realize there's literally 0 reason not to put the one ring in literally every deck in the format. Card needs to be banned in commander
sleek ferry
There’s already decks that don’t run the one ring in cedh
stark skiff
Finally got the last dragon scale Fetch I was missing @atomic harness @sleek ferry @knotty ferry
subtle sierra
????
trail anvil
idk 4 mana for this seems pretty expensive
you can't even use the tap ability on curve unless you just wanna load your graveyard
trail anvil
the synergy seems decent enough to run it in commander maybe but you really gotta be in lorehold
subtle sierra
the text is good, but the cost is too much for current standard
If it was 2 it would be great
3 would be passable
fallow citrus
Finally got the last dragon scale Fetch I was missing <@240310577925193729> <@30...
holy
trail anvil
2 mana tap draw a card each turn + drain each time you synergy sounds busto
subtle sierra
Hmm maybe, 3 cost then
But i feel like that's too much
Annex is 3 and you don't lose the card
And has an upside
trail anvil
annex costs you life up until you have a specific synergy though
firdoch core made that easier but before it was a lot easier to lose life to it
I feel like this is a lot more synergy-focused too. annex was a generic staple while this is specifically meant to be strong with leaves the gy effects. I think at 3 mana it'd be perfect tbh (but still probably too slow for this meta)
sleek ferry
You could [[repurposing bay]] it out ig
lost widgetBOT
Artifact
, , Sacrifice another artifact: Search your library for an artifact card with mana value equal to 1 plus the sacrificed artifact's mana value, put that card onto the battlefield, then shuffle. Activate only as a sorcery.
By the end of the race, few of the Aether Rangers' vehicles resembled what they started as.
trail anvil
which 3 mana artifact are you sacrificing though
sleek ferry
Probably a starlight starcage that already served its purpose
subtle sierra
that'd uncage stuff
sleek ferry
Yeah, which you do anyways currently in synthesizer builds to reset your cryogen’s
tardy echo
Phyrexian arena for 4 mana is crazy
Actually let me correct
Significantly worse phyrexian arena
There’s also a 3 mana enchantment that impulse draws every upkeep in red and that card is already horrid
sleek ferry
If this was in rakdos, it would be an ob nix card, word me @glad peak @atomic harness
atomic harness
sleek ferry
Why are all the fun rakdos cedh viable commanders stupid expensive btw
(Outside of partners)
sleek ferry
Rakdos the muscle is cheap
Good ob nix is over $20
Mom aftermath is actually worth money now
Probably because nobody bought it
glad peak
A whole bunch of the rakdoses are fringe playable
I think I prefer Rowan as a deck though
[[rakdos the muscle]] is actually better too
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atomic harness
sleek ferry
@golden plover there’s lowkey something almost here, I just feel like there’s one piece missing, but idk what
sleek ferry
@fallow citrus you would enjoy this
glad peak
If you think this is sick you should play Modern yawg
fallow citrus
I also think that deck is sick
glad peak
Welp emiritus is a bad win con if you’re not already running kitten or ska but hes so funny
Dead card on his own even with the recall or reanimate package
With flashback now in the game, I might actually add snappy so intuition is a guaranteed win
Wait that’s stupid to do in grixis, I have tutors out the wazoo
sleek ferry
I mean he’s 5 mana, I could have told you that
glad peak
nah, reanimator cheats that well enough
the problem is actually with how there's no efficient ways to get all three of them on the field
sleek ferry
nah, reanimator cheats that well enough
Issue here is two fold, you need emeritus + displacer kitten at the min, emeritus + displace + ska to go infinite, why would I not just want to have Esper sentinel + ranger captain of eos
sleek ferry
It’s not, but it’s a hell of 2 cards to have on the board
I feel like we discussed this when talking about [[lively dirge]]
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Sorcery
Spree (Choose one or more additional costs.)
— Search your library for a card, put it into your graveyard, then shuffle.- — Return up to two creature cards with total mana value 4 or less from your graveyard to the battlefield.
"Now rip your partner from the grave, and form an undead killing wave!"
glad peak
Yeah but I’m specifically looking for the win line because it’s an uninterruptible win if you have more instants than opponents have counterspells
The correct way for me to do this might actually just be to turbo out sire of insanity and do a regular win line ngl
knotty ferry
Holy shit I've been facing this lessons deck you kids talk about and it's so hard to beat
I feel like if I don't see tishana's tidebinder fast enough, that monument enchantment artifact thing just goes +5000 and burns me to death
tardy echo
It has a pretty polarized MU spread
Some decks are able to answer endurance/talent very efficiently and then you’re just playing against a middling control shell, some decks race it to death before it can get online, and then vs other decks it feels v oppressive
It’s a pretty unique deck in the format though I’m glad it’s around
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Instant
Return target nonland permanent you don't control to its owner's hand.
Overload 
(You may cast this spell for its overload cost. If you do, change "target" in its text to "each.")
The Izzet specialize in unnatural disaster.
subtle sierra
omg poor kitty
zinc shard
subtle sierra
looks decent
idk if i'd wanna drop this over t1 elves or a chocobo in current green decks tho
trail anvil
jesus this thing can pump out bodies hard in commander
trail anvil
4 mana 6/6 land
yeah they really have been giving green a ton of stats lately
atomic harness
Zimic pog
stark skiff
oh each end step 
subtle sierra
i mean you need to put a counter on her
idk how frequent that is in commander and stuff
sleek ferry
Ambitious augmenter replacing itself is kinda cute
glad peak
4 mana 6/6 rhystic study copy
gritty nest
and this
is the color pie as of like, 2 years ago
white
blue
black
red
(white blue black red) green
glad peak
Nah green still doesn’t have good removal
Sadly red has become #2 in bad removal since blue keeps getting amazing permanent removal for only 1 mana
atomic harness
Sadly red has become #2 in bad removal since blue keeps getting amazing permanen...
👀
subtle sierra
is this about commander?
subtle sierra
oh ok
cause if you told me there's good 1 cost blue removal in standard i'd call you crazy
floodmaw is good but it ain't it
sleek ferry
I mean, into the floodmaw was elite removal, the meta just shifted around it
sleek ferry
There’s too many good etb’s you don’t want to reset now, which makes floodmaw w.e
glad peak
Floodmaw is still pretty good
If you can capitalize on it and win with it before the extra value from the opponent matters
sleek ferry
Yeah it’s still good in cedh, I was talking about in standard
glad peak
Yeah I mean in standard
The problem is there aren’t really any decks that can capitalize on it fast enough
sleek ferry
The issue with floodmaw now is that it competes with boomerang and bounce off
glad peak
[[bounce off]]
lost widgetBOT
glad peak
Oh right this one
sleek ferry
Elemental decks use it to reset their elementals yeah
glad peak
Have we seen the red one yet?
Also yep it’s not giant growth
Oh right the red one doesn’t enter prepared 
sleek ferry
Regrowth is very nice for cedh, though probably not for 5 mana
glad peak
There’s enough ways to loop this but there’s better options than regrowth
sleek ferry
Actually I’m lying, we still run eternal witness lmao
But that’s also 3 mana
Yeah nvm
This is kinda bad
glad peak
Eternal witness being one of them yeah
sleek ferry
Fuck me, for a second I thought this was going to say 4 lands
glad peak
You can snap + 8 cradle + this to have a more expensive ewit combo
sleek ferry
This is probably a decent lumra card though
stark skiff
