Magic the Gathering

[twilit canyon]

we already discussed this card a while back today

[golden plover]

I think the only thing that could really work for companions is if they're toned back mega hard

So something like a serra angel with "your starting deck contains a basic plains"

You're never gonna p1p1 a serra angel

But having one in the sideboard is nice

Basically they should be french vanillas

[twilit canyon]

nah they can be nicer while holding restrictions

such as mana values

issue w current companions is they are too splashable

[golden plover]

If they're like super restricted, yeah. But I think dialing them back as a whole would be the solution

Just some french vanillas/very basic cards that you're not gonna feel the need to devote a deck to

Companions felt great in draft, so that's sorta what I was going for

[twilit canyon]

the core issue: lurrus can be ran in rakdos/orzhov/mono-white and black/azorius/selesnya/dimir/golgari/boros

[golden plover]

Yeah I think them all being hybrid mana was part of the issue

[twilit canyon]

the biggest imo

for some

[golden plover]

They should have all been more restrictive

I mean the biggest was having an 8th card that also generated value in hand for no downside

But yeah, if they were to be way more restrictive or dial companions back mega hard, I think they could try them again

But I think it's more reasonable they just don't

[twilit canyon]

eh but again if ur hard locking them to specific pairs

it gets better

we have plenty of absolutely insane cards locked to a single color

[golden plover]

True, more restrictive mana costs would have helped

[twilit canyon]

or specific requirements

example: skred

card is the best 1 mana red removal spell in theory

the new [[lay down arms]]

[lost widget]

https://scryfall.com/card/bro/11/lay-down-arms

Lay Down Arms <:manaw:1007102126813610074>

Sorcery
Exile target creature with mana value less than or equal to the number of Plains you control. Its controller gains 3 life.
She'll swing a blade all her life, but never again for war.

[golden plover]

Yeah I could see a companion in a commander precon in like 3 years that's "all permanents in your deck are snow permanents" or whatever

[twilit canyon]

best 1 mana spot removal of all time

at least close to it

but it requires plains

[golden plover]

I mean, this is probably 3rd best in white then?

Since it's worse than swords

[twilit canyon]

by the numbers no

this is better

but in terms of practicality

swords beats it cus u can play a white splash for swords

vs committing to white for lay down

[golden plover]

Ah, gotcha

[twilit canyon]

swords is better in 2 places

instant spot removal and vs reanimator/sneak

if you can afford it, run this over swords and run solitude over stp tll

*too

[golden plover]

Man this week's top 5 sucked

https://i.redd.it/c36ysr6kth6a1.jpg

This shit is broken as hell

[twilit canyon]

with how much "draw" mitigation exists yeah

make it a sorcery then maybe

[golden plover]

You can also just play dupes on the opponent's turn

But I think even then a 1 mana draw three once is still probably too good

[twilit canyon]

maybe change it to "you can only draw or add one card per turn"

[twilit canyon]

oh most likely yes

[golden plover]

Way I see it is it can't have a proper downside

Because it'll just be used to kill the opponent the turn you use it

[twilit canyon]

it can

[golden plover]

I mean giving it a higher mana cost historically works

[twilit canyon]

tbf that argument can be made about any cheap card advantage spell

heres one

1 mana draw 3, you lose the game

[golden plover]

Yeah that would work, but that really wouldn't feel good as a card design

[twilit canyon]

or 1 mana draw 3 sorcery, end the turn

[golden plover]

It'd just feel cheap and only get used in stuff like solemnity Combo

This is one of those ideas that usually never feel interesting as a design, like "fixed" lotus and sorcery speed counterspells

[twilit canyon]

sure but then you need to have played out 6 mana worth of cards before it works

[golden plover]

You can make it work, but it's not particularly interesting at best

[twilit canyon]

also yea the big issue w these customs is that wotc already fixed most of them

[[brainstorm]]

[lost widget]

https://scryfall.com/card/afc/79/brainstorm

Brainstorm <:manau:292901508754702338>

Instant
Draw three cards, then put two cards from your hand on top of your library in any order.
The mizzium-sphere array drove her mind deep into the thought field, where only the rarest motes of genius may be plucked.

[twilit canyon]

[[ponder]]

[lost widget]

https://scryfall.com/card/ncc/229/ponder

Ponder <:manau:292901508754702338>

Sorcery
Look at the top three cards of your library, then put them back in any order. You may shuffle.
Draw a card.
Tomorrow belongs to those who prepare for it today.

[twilit canyon]

[[ancestral visions]]

[lost widget]

https://scryfall.com/card/tsr/52/ancestral-vision

Ancestral Vision

Sorcery
Suspend 4— (Rather than cast this card from your hand, pay and exile it with four time counters on it. At the beginning of your upkeep, remove a time counter. When the last is removed, cast it without paying its mana cost.)
Target player draws three cards.

[golden plover]

Oh I just realized this doesn't hit impulse draw at all

So you can use it and then EI like normal right after

[twilit canyon]

yes

or reckless impulse

theres a lot of ways to mitigate

[[sleight of hand]]

[lost widget]

https://scryfall.com/card/uma/70/sleight-of-hand

Sleight of Hand <:manau:292901508754702338>

Sorcery
Look at the top two cards of your library. Put one of them into your hand and the other on the bottom of your library.
"Gambling with mages never is." —Remin, venerable monk

[twilit canyon]

works as well

[golden plover]

Yeah, it's not a meaningful drawback

https://i.redd.it/cfxrwc97st6a1.png

This one isn't particularly great either

[twilit canyon]

make it cost 1

then this is probably fine

[golden plover]

It's an okay design, but it's something that's never being used fairly

[twilit canyon]

its uniquely broken in urza or meira or whatever the rg urza is called

[golden plover]

Yeah at 1 it's probably fine, but there's no deck this goes in where it just sometimes taps and that's it

Oh right, Gruul Urza

[twilit canyon]

[[moonsnare prototype]]

[lost widget]

https://scryfall.com/card/neo/69/moonsnare-prototype

Moonsnare Prototype <:manau:292901508754702338>

Artifact
, Tap an untapped artifact or creature you control: Add .
Channel — , Discard Moonsnare Prototype: The owner of target nonland permanent puts it on the top or bottom of their library.

[twilit canyon]

theres a few ways to use it

but making it cost 1 is the baseline

and then also

magic cards that are good arent meant to be played fairly

[golden plover]

Yeah, not a fan of designs where the card is only ever gonna exist for the sake of some combo

[twilit canyon]

ie: expressive iteration

if a card is good, its very much not a fair card

with some minor exceptions

[golden plover]

I mean they're not, but most are more in interesting and not just "hey break this artifact"

[twilit canyon]

i like the idea of creating the conditional sol ring at 1 mana for decks that are entirely dedicated to artifacts

alternatively

eclipse ring 0 whenever its tapped, add 1 colorless

scale it back so that it doesnt become a dark ritual with the tap effects

[golden plover]

Oh hey we're 3/5 for too good combo pieces

And 2/5 on fixing banned cards

https://i.redd.it/hpkyuuyau26a1.png

[twilit canyon]

this is a meme

[golden plover]

Yeah the text is definitely memey, but it ended up in the top 5

[twilit canyon]

its just tolaria academy but with a tax bc lol us education system

[golden plover]

This one is more forgiveable

[twilit canyon]

this can be fixed

[golden plover]

Still insane every time, but it's a joke card at least

[twilit canyon]

change the stupid restriction to etb tapped (always) and culmitive upkeep - sacrifice an artifact

[golden plover]

Yeah that'd work

https://i.redd.it/nod3yxso6c6a1.png

This one is just kinda whatever

[twilit canyon]

overcosted

[sleek ferry]

That one is cool but 1 mana too much

[golden plover]

It's the most printable card in the top 5

[twilit canyon]

make it cost 4 and then we are talking

[golden plover]

Yeah at 4, it'd be something I could see them printing in a set that cares about day/night

[twilit canyon]

they really fucked up on the werewolves in innistrad ngl

they have such a mediocre whimper in the end

they lost a single card in pack leader and disappeared

they had some black and white and blue wolves but then never made the pairs matter

could see even further buffing this at 4 mana

[golden plover]

And the #1 spot this week is a memey "webcomic" design

https://i.redd.it/z7q5ghkh4j6a1.jpg

[twilit canyon]

magic players complain about alchemy designs and then make their own like this

good lord this is stupid

[golden plover]

I mean this is just "we threw two mechanics together for a joke"

[twilit canyon]

then why did it get #1

[golden plover]

Like there's nothing interesting about this card. It's just "haha isn't it funny it's got these two mechanics"

Because the subreddit upvoted it for some reason

[twilit canyon]

and no casting cost otherwise

dumb

[golden plover]

You're way more likely to get a meme upvoted to #1 than an actually balanced card

[twilit canyon]

this can be reanimated by [[extraction specialist]]

[lost widget]

https://scryfall.com/card/snc/12/extraction-specialist

Extraction Specialist <:mana2:292901509060886528><:manaw:1007102126813610074>

Creature — Human Rogue
Lifelink
When Extraction Specialist enters the battlefield, return target creature card with mana value 2 or less from your graveyard to the battlefield. That creature can't attack or block for as long as you control Extraction Specialist.
3/2

[twilit canyon]

or any reanimate spell that brings back x or less

[golden plover]

It's also got a cmc of 0 for all sorts of other shenanigans

[twilit canyon]

[[call of the death dweller]]

[lost widget]

https://scryfall.com/card/iko/78/call-of-the-death-dweller

Call of the Death-Dweller <:mana2:292901509060886528><:manab:292901508872273920>

Sorcery
Return up to two target creature cards with total mana value 3 or less from your graveyard to the battlefield. Put a deathtouch counter on either of them. Then put a menace counter on either of them.
The living fear Nethroi's whispers. The dead heed them.

[twilit canyon]

get a lurrus and a tony back

give em keywords

[[agadeems awakening]]

[lost widget]

https://scryfall.com/card/znr/90/agadeems-awakening-agadeem-the-undercrypt

Agadeem's Awakening <:manax:292901509082120202><:manab:292901508872273920><:manab:292901508872273920><:manab:292901508872273920>

Sorcery
Return from your graveyard to the battlefield any number of target creature cards that each have a different mana value X or less.
"Now is the death-hour, just before dawn. Wake, sleepers, and haunt the living!" —Vivias, Witch Vessel

Agadeem, the Undercrypt
Land
As Agadeem, the Undercrypt enters the battlefield, you may pay 3 life. If you don't, it enters the battlefield tapped.
: Add .
"Here below the hedron fields, souls and secrets lie entombed." —Vivias, Witch Vessel

[twilit canyon]

grats on the free 4/3

[golden plover]

I guess technically Asmor does too, but Asmor has much more interesting text than "what if meme"

[twilit canyon]

asmo also has a deckbuilding requirement

shes not just a stat stick

[golden plover]

Yeah, Asmor is interesting. This is just "haha it's funny"

[twilit canyon]

funny and unintentionally broken

fixing it

make it a 4 drop

unearth for jund

blitz for jund

costs 1jund

sacrifice it at the next end step

or sacrifice it after combat

better yet

power it up to have deathtouch and a 4/4 statline

this makes it at least a real magic card that prevents abuse

is by all means a 3 mana 4 damage burn spell or removal spell

[golden plover]

So yeah, out of the whole top 5, I think one of them can be printed

[twilit canyon]

1/5 and that one is bad

[golden plover]

Midnight Assault would probably stay 5 in a standard set, but it'd probably be 4 if it skipped it

[twilit canyon]

midnight assault fix bc fucking christ werewolves suck

3b sorcery

[sleek ferry]

Considering the amount of actual insane removal we’ve gotten? No way midnight assault isn’t 4cmc over 5

2bb is already balancing

[golden plover]

Standard boardwipes trend higher

Or come with a tougher downside

[sleek ferry]

There’s also no good black werewolves

[golden plover]

And this is a conditional one, which Black usually doesn't get

[twilit canyon]

???

[golden plover]

So black would have to pay a premium

[twilit canyon]

[[graveyard trespasser]]

[lost widget]

https://scryfall.com/card/mid/104/graveyard-trespasser-graveyard-glutton

Graveyard Trespasser <:mana2:292901509060886528><:manab:292901508872273920>

Creature — Human Werewolf
Ward—Discard a card.
Whenever Graveyard Trespasser enters the battlefield or attacks, exile up to one target card from a graveyard. If a creature card was exiled this way, each opponent loses 1 life and you gain 1 life.
Daybound (If a player casts no spells during their own turn, it becomes night next turn.)
3/3

Graveyard Glutton
Creature — Werewolf
Ward—Discard a card.
Whenever Graveyard Glutton enters the battlefield or attacks, exile up to two target cards from graveyards. For each creature card exiled this way, each opponent loses 1 life and you gain 1 life.
Nightbound (If a player casts at least two spells during their own turn, it becomes day next turn.)
4/4

[golden plover]

The best werewolf in the game is the only black werewolf

[sleek ferry]

Forgot trespasser was a werewolf

[twilit canyon]

quite literally the single best wolf ever printed

[golden plover]

Yeah pretty much

[twilit canyon]

yea cus its a good card

so ppl forget

[golden plover]

Unfortunately this being in black would mean werewolves would have to splash in most formats, and can't play it in commander

[twilit canyon]

heres the rest of the fixed midnight assault

and it themes on what color tribe for wolves you go for

1b

sorcery

hmmmm

actually

this is tough to word

[golden plover]

Maybe if it was a blasphemous act instead?

[twilit canyon]

in essence i wanna give it kicker

[sleek ferry]

We need riot back as a keyword so we can return to Gruul glory

[twilit canyon]

for either ww/uu/bb/rr/gg

[golden plover]

So it'd be 4R and did X damage to anything that didn't transform?

X being the number of werewolves or something

I think that'd be way better and easier to include

[twilit canyon]

and you get an effect per kick

[sleek ferry]

If you control 2 or more werewolves, this spell costs bb instead

There I fixed it

[twilit canyon]

white would create two 2/2 white wolf creature tokens with vigilance
black destroys all creatures who dont transform when it turned to night this turn
blue draws a card per wolf that transformed this turn.
red gives +2/+0 and haste to all transformed wolves
green puts a +1/+1 counter on all transformed wolves and adds a boon that turns it to night the next time it would turn to day

oh

duh

[[collective brutality]]

[lost widget]

https://scryfall.com/card/emn/85/collective-brutality

Collective Brutality <:mana1:292901508373282827><:manab:292901508872273920>

Sorcery
Escalate—Discard a card. (Pay this cost for each mode chosen beyond the first.)
Choose one or more —
• Target opponent reveals their hand. You choose an instant or sorcery card from it. That player discards that card.
• Target creature gets -2/-2 until end of turn.
• Target opponent loses 2 life and you gain 2 life.

[twilit canyon]

give it escalate

throwback to a prior innistrad set

escalate - ww or uu or bb or rr or gg

probably can tone it down to just the core jund colors for space

but the baseline being

1b sorcery
escalate - bb, rr, gg
it turns to night. if the escalate cost was paid choose one or more -

• destroy all creatures who didnt transform this turn if you paid bb for the escalate
• all wolves and werewolves you control get +2/+0 and haste until end of turn if you paid rr for the escalate.
• all wolves and werewolves you control get +1/+1 and trample until end of turn if you paid gg for the escalate.

[golden plover]

This works, but I definitely think it's too much text on a single card

[twilit canyon]

yea

[golden plover]

I think just making it a blasphemous act for werewolves at 4R would probably be good enough for the archetype

[twilit canyon]

its wordy but idk how else to fix it in an interesting and meaningful way to help wolves

[golden plover]

They already tried giving werewolves a 2 mana bandaid fix

[[Unnatural Moonrise]]

[lost widget]

https://scryfall.com/card/mid/247/unnatural-moonrise

Unnatural Moonrise <:manar:292901508796645397><:manag:292901508654301185>

Sorcery
It becomes night. Until end of turn, target creature gets +1/+0 and gains trample and "Whenever this creature deals combat damage to a player, draw a card."
Flashback (You may cast this card from your graveyard for its flashback cost. Then exile it.)

[twilit canyon]

there is also that one enchantment

[sleek ferry]

They should have made it an instant

[twilit canyon]

that if an opp double spells you make a 2/2

[sleek ferry]

Would have at least given werewolves a way to threaten when it’s not their turn

[twilit canyon]

it could also have said

[golden plover]

There's also Into the Night and Tovolar

[twilit canyon]

all wolves and werewolves get "deals combat damage to a player draw"

[golden plover]

But werewolves are an archetype sorta trapped by their own mechanics as is

[twilit canyon]

wouldnt have been broken

[golden plover]

Doesn't Tovolar do that?

[[Tovolar]]

[lost widget]

Multiple cards match “Tovolar”, can you be more specific?

[golden plover]

[[Tovolar, Dire Something]]

[lost widget]

No card found for “Tovolar, Dire Something”

[twilit canyon]

tovolar does that

yes

[golden plover]

[[Tovolar, Dire Overlord]]?

[lost widget]

https://scryfall.com/card/mid/246/tovolar-dire-overlord-tovolar-the-midnight-scourge

Tovolar, Dire Overlord <:mana1:292901508373282827><:manar:292901508796645397><:manag:292901508654301185>

Legendary Creature — Human Werewolf
Whenever a Wolf or Werewolf you control deals combat damage to a player, draw a card.
At the beginning of your upkeep, if you control three or more Wolves and/or Werewolves, it becomes night. Then transform any number of Human Werewolves you control.
Daybound
3/3

Tovolar, the Midnight Scourge
Legendary Creature — Werewolf
Whenever a Wolf or Werewolf you control deals combat damage to a player, draw a card.
: Target Wolf or Werewolf you control gets +X/+0 and gains trample until end of turn.
Nightbound
4/4

[golden plover]

Ah that was right

[twilit canyon]

but having it as a 2 mana instant that gives +1/+0 and trample?

also they didnt errata prior wolves so

[golden plover]

I mean they probably didn't wanna make a 2 mana card that could potentially draw like 5

[twilit canyon]

half of a deck in older formats just dont work with each other

[golden plover]

Yeah the previous werewolves work off a different but similar mechanic

[twilit canyon]

[[huntsman of the fell]]

[lost widget]

No card found for “huntsman of the fell”

[golden plover]

Werewolves are sorta fucked because of that

[twilit canyon]

[[huntmaster of the fells]]

[lost widget]

https://scryfall.com/card/dka/140/huntmaster-of-the-fells-ravager-of-the-fells

Huntmaster of the Fells <:mana2:292901509060886528><:manar:292901508796645397><:manag:292901508654301185>

Creature — Human Werewolf
Whenever this creature enters the battlefield or transforms into Huntmaster of the Fells, create a 2/2 green Wolf creature token and you gain 2 life.
At the beginning of each upkeep, if no spells were cast last turn, transform Huntmaster of the Fells.
2/2

Ravager of the Fells
Creature — Werewolf
Trample
Whenever this creature transforms into Ravager of the Fells, it deals 2 damage to target opponent or planeswalker and 2 damage to up to one target creature that player or that planeswalker's controller controls.
At the beginning of each upkeep, if a player cast two or more spells last turn, transform Ravager of the Fells.
4/4

[twilit canyon]

literally just change the text to have dayboubd/nightbound

[golden plover]

They probably didn't want day/night on one-drops

[twilit canyon]

we precisely needed them on the 1 drops

[golden plover]

Since there's like 2 werewolf one drops

[twilit canyon]

like huntmaster is 1 of the sweetest magic cards

of all time

but its extremely outdated cus of daybound/nightbound not getting added to it

[golden plover]

Yeah but the issue becomes it'll almost always immediately become night on turn 2 in limited, and able to 50% of the time outside of it if there's a day/night one drop

[twilit canyon]

which is fine

like at worst what

it enables moonrager slash as a bolt on t2?

[copper pecan]

oh no you have to flip over the marker, how terrible

[twilit canyon]

plus they should focus on making the cards more interesting on both sides of the card if they wanted to fix the issue

[golden plover]

I think it was supposed to be a balancing thing, since it'd mean werewolves would come down early on the good side

[copper pecan]

for real though i don't get why people act like day/night is super hard to track or whatever, if you have the marker caard it's super easy

[copper pecan]

okay yeah that's fair

[golden plover]

It's sorta annoying to keep track of how many spells were cast every turn if the day/night player isn't the one tracking it

But they really should be the one tracking it if they're using it

[twilit canyon]

yes they should

same with storm count if you have storm cards

[golden plover]

It's not as bad as dungeons or initiative (which is actually awful to track) but it's sort of annoying

[twilit canyon]

all of those are also fine to track if you bring your stuff required to play

[golden plover]

But it was moreso they probably didn't want you to be able to have your werewolves coming in on the good side t3 because an opponent missed a early turn

Dungeons are luckily just the player who uses them

But initiative is annoying because everyone has to track it

[twilit canyon]

i chewed out a guy at my lgs a few weeks back for being intentionally misleading with his cards

he would make treasures off ragavan and use only a dice to keep track

an opponent took a line that sucked into open blue but opponent couldnt tell he had 2 treasures up

it was technically 3 but yeah

same deal

magic is really bad with tracking cards and restrictions or generating mechanics

[golden plover]

I try and use a token if possible, but if the dice could only be something like a treasure, I don't see the issue

[twilit canyon]

guy i chewed out was on murktide

which had dice to track counters on murktide itself

as well as dice for life

and dice for storm count for flusterstorm

and dice for jtms

opponent wasnt sure if the dice were treasures or spent dice

and murktide guy didnt make it clear

[lusty trench]

As in the opponent asked and they were being vague?

[twilit canyon]

no he didnt think to ask cus he hadnt used the treasures at all

[lusty trench]

That's fair enough

[twilit canyon]

murktide guy said "i forgot to say"

[lusty trench]

Bruhhhhh

[twilit canyon]

but remembered to spend the 2 treasures on counterspell and tapping out

[lusty trench]

"you see I simply forgot to mention the relevant information to my opponent that resulted in me getting the win"

[copper pecan]

mtg has so much angle shooting it's insane

[lusty trench]

"for you see judge I am just a silly little guy doing a silly"

[golden plover]

https://magic.wizards.com/en/news/announcements/format-legality-shifts-to-prerelease-with-phyrexia-all-will-be-one

This is a weird change

I'm not sure how impactful it is, but I can't help but feel like it's maybe not the right change

[lusty trench]

This just means if there's a tournament on pre release week, you best have the new cards or your gonna get fucked

[golden plover]

Yeah that's kinda the edge case I'm concerned about

The guy who traded for 4 of the new modern staple or whatever has a distinct advantage for a week

[languid quest]

MtG is already pay-to-win but that could only make it worse

not that WotC cares

[golden plover]

It's not gonna be a huge issue, but I can see various events where this does come up as an issue

No one else has access to X card yet, but a guy who went to 4 pre-releases does

[twilit canyon]

not pay to win

pay to compete

[golden plover]

Ehh, it's definitely both

You've gotta pay the baseline for a deck anyways

But if you're missing key cards, the person who spent more for the rest of the deck is gonna beat you

[lusty trench]

Game is actually free to play to begin with though with the start decks lgs' have

[golden plover]

True. But you'll quickly realize those aren't gonna get you far

Actually they don't even do those now

You get a few "welcome packs"

The starter decks are the commander ones that are $30

[sleek ferry]

I mean isn’t every tcg pay to win?

Nobody’s forcing you to Play Modern, Legacy or Vintage

Standard, Pioneer, Pauper and non CEDH commander has a very low barrier for entry

[golden plover]

I mean technically yeah, but the more you'd wanna win, even in standard, the more expensive it is

Standard decks are about $500

Same with Pioneer

[sleek ferry]

Even assuming a good majority of the decks are between 400-500, that’s still less of a barrier than Yugioh. While also having budget options in mono white for $250ish and mono red for a little over $100

[golden plover]

Yugioh decks are about $400 too

[sleek ferry]

Same thing for Pioneer, mono white humans is a little bit over $200, Gruul Midrange is a tad under $300

[golden plover]

I mean, that's still a pretty big barrier to entry nowadays

[sleek ferry]

What tcg is costing you less? Flesh and Blood and their mechanically unique $600 cards?

[trail anvil]

Starting Intensity 1

Draw 1 card, then perpetually increase this card's intensity everywhere by 1. If this card's intensity is 4, draw 3 cards instead.

[golden plover]

Flesh and Blood is actually pretty decently cheap to get into now that they've improved their starter decks and stuff

They're about $100 now

But FaB gameplay feels like every deck is too samey imo

Digimon is pretty cheap too

[sleek ferry]

Digimon has budget options, but it’s def starting to climb from where we were like a year ago. The good Rookies and eggs cost real money

[golden plover]

It's definitely more accessible than MTG still tho

Also, looking at FaB there seems to be 3 cards over $50 that aren't promos or alt arts

And only 1 of them doesn't have another printing from what I can tell

That one seems to be getting a reprint in their upcoming masters set it seems too

Since there's pre-listings for it

[zinc shard]

LOL Great Deals

[last glen]

we made it

[last glen]

You can buy 400 gems for 300 gems or 1500 gold today

[sudden lava]

no limit?

[steady onyx]

there has to be a alimit

or else you sox get infibite

[last glen]

I believe just once

It's in the Daily Deals

[sleek ferry]

Yeah that’s just once

[last glen]

Ahh, I won't be able to grind up to 1500 gold on my currently available quests

Unfortunate

I'll have to spend gems to make gems I guess

Actually, my daily quest resets before the deal expires

I may have a chance

[sleek ferry]

You can do it

At least you don’t have the stupid ass “attack with 49 creatures” quest

[zinc shard]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KpopatzC-gI

[sudden lava]

ah ok cuz I was like "wait cant this be abused to infinity?"

[sudden lava]

I wish they would do an episode with the transformer or Unfinity stuff

[trail anvil]

haven't played standard in a while, when did esper switch to an entirely creature based pile

last time I checked it had a legends matter theme but man, I didn't think I'd see it turn into literally all creatures and lands

[twilit canyon]

creatures are good

[last glen]

just in time

[golden plover]

Seeing Konami do the exact same idea for 25th anniversary but better is just sad

[twilit canyon]

ygo doesnt has a reserved list right?

[hidden ermine]

Nope

[twilit canyon]

and the game is much more frequent with reprinting too

[hidden ermine]

Yep

But its basically a way to get the old, janky versions of the cards (I think?)

Like pre-errata

[twilit canyon]

still pretty cool

[last glen]

Are they doing pre-errata printings for the 25th?

[twilit canyon]

kinda like the mtg prints of old card borders + text

[hidden ermine]

I think so? Theyre basically printing the sets again right?

But its not confirmed I suppose

[golden plover]

I'd assume they'd be updated to PSCT

Since they're listed as already legal and whatnot

They're also doing a little bundle that comes with a few packs of each and stuff

Might be fun to "draft"

[hidden ermine]

Yeah but old cards, pre-PSCT, are legal

[golden plover]

Yeah true

I guess we'll have to wait and see

[lusty trench]

Could you imagine if they weren't

[golden plover]

But it's a neat product either way. Especially since the packs are $3

[last glen]

I remember reading somewhere that currently those loose packs for like $8
in this bundle each pack comes to about... $5.50 or so, assuming all the guaranteed cards have no value to you

[golden plover]

True, most of these printings probably won't be worth anything

But there are a few meta cards from those sets

And it's a neat way to play really early formats for less than $3000

About $100 a LoB pack, $3000-5000 a box if you're lucky

[last glen]

1 pack of Legend of Blue-Eyes White Dragon
1 pack of Metal Raiders
1 pack of Spell Ruler
1 pack of Pharaoh’s Servant
1 pack of Dark Crisis
1 pack of Invasion of Chaos
and extras
for MRSP $31.99

[golden plover]

That's not bad all things considered

And individual boxes are gonna be $80 according to Amazon

[lusty trench]

Man do I go to my LGS tomorrow? I don't like leaving the house without my partner but they're with family for the holidays and I've been inside for like a month

[golden plover]

If you think you'll have a good time, I'd say go

It's important to get out of the house here and there

[sleek ferry]

Go and play digimon, you’re more guaranteed to have a good time

[golden plover]

True

[sleek ferry]

Idk what it is, I love mtg and nothing beats commander with friends

But the 1v1 environment of digimon is so clean

[lusty trench]

Digimons current format is poison to me

[granite badge]

you'll even be able to buy entire wholesale boxes of LOB

unlimited ed

its not just the promotional box with 4 packs + promo gods they're basically reprinting the first 4 sets again

it could have been better but its at least a okay treat

[sudden lava]

wanted to make a wedding themed commander deck, the dress is white though (and needs a Groom's Finery which is a black equipment to work) when the bride is red/black

[last glen]

simply do not follow the rules

[sudden lava]

5head just get someone else to play the white cards a wedding does take at minimum 2 people

[hidden ermine]

Just use a mardu commander and say that its the officiary

[sudden lava]

Olivia tho

[hidden ermine]

You can play her in the 99

[sudden lava]

but shouldnt the bride be the commander after all it IS her day after all.

but yeah vampire tribal with a wedding subtheme, good think I have Inistrad crimson vow for plenty of options like wedding ring, maid of dishonor, and so on

of course it's not commander without sol ring which fits

[last glen]

oh shit I was unaware

[sleek ferry]

They did this before, I want to say 5 years ago?

Maybe more

But the thing with old ygo sets is, sure it’s nice for nostalgia

But the first few sets are very whatever

[golden plover]

Yeah but nostalgia is the goal for 25th anniversary

[sleek ferry]

I would have rather if they did 5 meta staples from each era of Yugioh

Broke it down from the shows

That would have been sick

[golden plover]

True, but maybe that's what the surprises are

[golden plover]

So according to Sheldon new Norn is on watch for an edh ban??? New Norn of all things???

Bro Dockside is still around

Thoracle is still alive

[twilit canyon]

oh thats why ppl been throwing shade at the rc

[golden plover]

New Norn seems strong, but she's 5 mana and pretty fucking telegraphed. She also has no inherent protection

Yeah, this seems wack to wanna pre-ban new Norn

Like sure if she somehow becomes an auto-include in every white deck, do it but she's not even put yet

And as for auto includes Sol Ring, Mana Crypt, Command Tower, and Arcane Signet all still exist

[twilit canyon]

https://twitter.com/StarCityGames/status/1605973189636591617?t=wexFDYQDpOw-WYKJYW3CyA&s=19

Star City Games (@StarCityGames)

"As soon as I saw the card, I sent off an email saying, 'Please never print this card.' "

Sheldon weighs in on Elesh Norn, Mother of Machines and what it means for Commander.

https://t.co/kIPYfdAG4U

Twitter · Dec 22, 2022, 5:07 PM

lmfaooooo

[golden plover]

Sheldon freaks out about a mythic that's probably not gonna see much play in the format

I think it'll probably be good in standard and maybe pioneer, but it doesn't do anything on it's own

So I can't see it seeing play in anything else, outside of jankier commander decks

[twilit canyon]

shes better than that

cus shes a stax piece too

but yeah shes not format-warping

[sleek ferry]

Oh no not elesh norn, look at the possibilities

You can cheat her out and… not win the game that turn

[golden plover]

I mean she's a solid denial effect too, sometimes completely killing decks at the table

[lusty trench]

Honestly I view her how I do other cards like her

She's strong but like... You have removal for a reason

[golden plover]

But she's 5 mana, doesn't have removal, and she's not black

Just fucking doom blade her lmao

[sleek ferry]

Surely I can cheat out about 100 different cards that put me in a better position to win than elesh norn

Also she’s mono white. You’re not playing her as a commander if you want to win

[golden plover]

She's not even the best new white card in the past 2 sets

Their concern is how universally applicable she is

Loran is generally way more universal

We banning loran too?

Also again, Sol Ring

[copper pecan]

if norn is too "universally applicable" but sol ring, mana crypt, and arcane signet somehow aren't then sheldon's just a fucking idiot

and should not be in charge of a format

[golden plover]

Sol Ring is in 88% of decks in the format

[granite badge]

honestly the RC is kinda doo doo

[copper pecan]

sol ring should be in 100% of decks in the format

[granite badge]

I don't know how they've lasted this long

[copper pecan]

any deck that doesn't have sol ring is objectively worse than the same deck that does have sol ring

the rc only exists because wotc lets them exist

even though they really shouldn't

[hidden ermine]

My guess is the logic is Sol Ring is a "pillar of the format"

Which is a stupid term

[copper pecan]

sol ring being legal in the format makes the format objectively worse

so many games come down to who draws sol ring in their opening hand

[lusty trench]

99 card format

[sleek ferry]

RC is shit because they don’t actually represent the entire commander community, rather it always feels as if they represent 1 style

[copper pecan]

the rules committee is in denial over how people actually play the format

[lusty trench]

Issue is though where do you go from there

[copper pecan]

and also doesn't seem to understand what the point of a banlist is

[lusty trench]

Like do you hit all fast mana rocks?

The stupid good ones?

[copper pecan]

like, why is the banlist aimed at people who are the least likely to even know about the banlist

sol ring and mana crypt should be banned for sure

arcane signet probably should be also

just because it isn't healthy to have cards that are in literally every deck

but also sol ring and mana crypt are just way too strong

[languid quest]

personally I rather take good mana rocks than have to buy expensive mana base (shocks, fetches and OG duals)

[sleek ferry]

Eh we’ve had so much artifact removal with an upside come out lately, idk if I agree with banning sol ring and mana crypt anymore.

[lusty trench]

What about mana vault? Chrome mox? Lions eye?

[copper pecan]

lion's eye should probably be banned, idk about mana vault or chrome mox

[twilit canyon]

none of em should be banned or all of em should be

[copper pecan]

i don't agree with that

some of them are way stronger than others

[twilit canyon]

hmmm

not quite

[languid quest]

like do you really want to gatekeep even casual EDH by making it more expensive

[twilit canyon]

example: led is dog ass and unplayable in 90% of all decks

same with the othere

depends on the deck

the only must-runs are sol ring, crypt, vault

[sleek ferry]

The only cards that should be seriously looked at for a ban are dockside, breach and thoracle. And out of those the only actual immediate problem is dockside.

[twilit canyon]

technically lotus petal is must-run?

[copper pecan]

lion's eye costs hundreds of dollars

[twilit canyon]

price shouldnt be a metric for a ban

especially in a casual format that is proxy friendly

[languid quest]

yes Dockside is biggest problem right now

[twilit canyon]

disagree

[copper pecan]

dockside absolutely should be banned

[twilit canyon]

its thassas oracle

by a long shot

[trail anvil]

honestly while she's probably not gonna warp any format I'm gonna be really annoyed facing her in historic brawl

[copper pecan]

it's genuinely insane that thoracle isn't banned

[trail anvil]

so many of my decks rely on ETBs

[twilit canyon]

even then idt she should be banned

(thoracle and norn)

[last glen]

tbh the most egregious part of the article was where he said it would be naive to ignore commander when designing a card

[twilit canyon]

ppl are already mad that wotc prints so many direct to commander stuff every year

[languid quest]

Mom is going to be mean if you don't have removal at hand (which I tend to do)

[copper pecan]

it would be pretty naive to ignore the most popular format when designing but his logic for it is pretty stupid given that he ignores the way people actually play the format

[sleek ferry]

I think the issue is, thoracle is a win con, dockside is an enabler. Dockside has more applicable uses than just outright winning. Sometimes people drop dockside in cedh and put themselves in such a commanding position that you know if it makes it back to their turn they’re winning regardless of what you do.

[copper pecan]

the banlist shouldn't be aimed at the people who are the most likely to not even know that there is a banlist

[last glen]

Call me biased because Yu-Gi-Oh has only one public format
But why should WotC design around a self-confessed noncompetitive side format that is only barely official?

[copper pecan]

commander is far and away the most popular way to play the game

[sleek ferry]

Because it’s the most popular format by a long shot

[languid quest]

yes EDH is popular and they can make money from it

[lusty trench]

I don't care about this new elesh

I want to see the atraxa

My take on the edh banlist is I will simply ignore it

I can talk to my group if something's too strong or annoying

[copper pecan]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/636013795507961892/1055630213800796241/image.png?width=426&height=662

[lusty trench]

Listen okay, I need more room for the engines

[last glen]

just play all gas

no handtraps power utility cards

[lusty trench]

Gonna build sakashima krark I think

[sleek ferry]

One of my favorite cedh decks

It just takes a LOT of work

[fallow citrus]

only thing i don't like about that deck is how long winning combos can take and they can just fizzle if you're unlucky

[sleek ferry]

Yeah I only pull it out for special occasions now

[lusty trench]

Oh no I'm gonna be silly with it

Like I'm gonna have people playing 3 goblin games in a row

[clever sun]

This shit is so funny NGL

[last glen]

Wait Sol Ring is 1 mana?

I thought it was 2 mana

lol

[twilit canyon]

its 1 mana yea

[copper pecan]

sol ring would still be broken at 2 mana ngl

not anywhere near as broken

but still too good for the majority of formats

[broken fjord]

Got to try out my Preston Stax deck. Still optimizing it, but it plays pretty well.

[languid quest]

lol Saltdust is really salty about Sol Ring

[granite badge]

honestly if Sol Ring wasn't constantly reprinted I'd have more of an issue with it

I remember the days where Ring was a $3-4 dollar card

if you have a card that is ubiquitously needed in every single deck ever its important for said card to be accessable(Arcane Signet is also a pretty common reprint now)

[languid quest]

yeah most if not all precons have both

[golden plover]

I mean look at Mana Crypt. It's very similar to sol ring and is $200

Sol Ring is an issue card that's only excused because everyone has it

[sleek ferry]

1 mana vs 0 mana is relevant. Also at the highest level, there’s been way too many times I’ve seen people lose due to the chip damage from mana crypt

[golden plover]

Both are mana positive rocks that sway the course of the game if they come down early

And yeah you remember all the times someone died to their own crypt because it's not all that common

You don't track all the times someone won because they got ring/crypt down early and just won like normal from there

Sol Ring, Mana Crypt, Arcane Signet, and Command Tower are basically required in the 99 of every single commander

[sleek ferry]

I’ve seen plenty of times people drop 5+ mana turn 1 and still lose. I don’t think there’s nothing inherently wrong with staples that speed up the game (even in cedh, games still last 20-25 minutes frequently)

Outside of cedh you’re looking at 45 minute games

[golden plover]

The issue, and this is mainly sol ring and crypt, is that they make a huge imbalance the second they come down

The player who gets a t1 sol ring/crypt is leagues ahead of the rest of the table all game

But the other point is "too universally applicable"

If Norn is too universally applicable in white decks (she's not, Loran is way more universal), then Sol Ring is absolutely worse

Literally every deck is just made better by sol ring

It's in 88% of the decks in the format according to EDHRec

They'll never ban Sol Ring at this point, but sol ring is a major problem card that everyone is okay with because it's cheap and feels good when you're the one to use it

[sleek ferry]

That depends on the variance of their hand. I’ve seen many times people drop 6, 7, 8 mana t1 and not be able to win from that fast start

[golden plover]

Obviously there's always variance, but most of the time, an early sol ring is an early lead

[sleek ferry]

Early lead is nice, but how do you explain just about every deck in casual edh running sol ring, yet still having long games? Assuming 4 players at a table and everybody takes a free mulligan, there’s close to a 40% chance 1 player opens sol ring

[golden plover]

I mean sol ring isn't a free win button. But my point is that the player who sees it first is usually far ahead off a single card

[sleek ferry]

Politics also makes your early lead very irrelevant on a game to game basis

[golden plover]

There's a reason sol ring is banned in literally every other format

The only reason it's seen as okay in Edh is because they wanna keep it as a "pillar of the format" and everyone has access to it

If it was a $100 card still, you'd see way more calls for it to be banned

[sleek ferry]

Or maybe because as soon as 2 players decide you’re public enemy #1 you can be out that game just as fast as you took that lead

[golden plover]

Depends on the table and game. There's always situations to disprove anything "just hit it with doomblade", "just use angel's grace in response to Thoracle" but overall, the ring is a huge advantage

[glad peak]

If politics really was the end all reason for a card not being broken, why have a ban list at all

[sleek ferry]

Well some bans would still make sense if politics were taken into account

Hullbreaker (I think that’s what the card is called right?) makes it harder for people to be able to gang up on you

[golden plover]

The politics excuse is also what the RC says half the time about a card. "just ban it at your personal tables"

[glad peak]

Yeah, the ban list really is a joke tbh

[golden plover]

But it's a lot harder to argue for a table ban of a card people would wanna use than it is to argue for an unban

If you sit down with 3 randoms at an LGS and go "hey guys can we all not play dockside/Thoracle/breach/sol ring/whatever", you're gonna come off like you're complaining

It's much easier to do it in reverse with a "hey I know Rofellos is banned, but I'm using him as a commander for 8/8 tribal, is it cool to do a game with him" or whatever

[glad peak]

Also it’s true people are only ok with Sol ring because it’s cheap, it can legitimately win games on its own, even with politics involved

[sleek ferry]

Anyways, we can see the banlist has no principle seeing as how golos is deemed too strong (despite us having over 25 better, more consistent win cons in the command zone)

[glad peak]

Also if we go by cards should be banned because it makes it harder for your opponents to win, then there’s a whole archetype waiting to get banned

[golden plover]

Like I said, in more casual pods, people are way more likely to have issue with mana crypt when it and sol ring are super similar

Thats because crypt is $200 and Sol Ring is $0.10

[sleek ferry]

That’s because casual is a broad term that can mean literally anything

[golden plover]

Golos wasn't banned because it's too strong. It's banned because it's too centralizing

The issue with golos is that it's a better commander for a ton of playstyles than their intended commander

[glad peak]

No, I can guarantee if crypt was $0.10 and ring was $200, then people would call for a ring ban even if crypt is better

[sleek ferry]

If I’m not playing cedh, and somebody’s like “hey you want to play casual” my definition of casual is just no thoracle, breach, demonic con, etc

[golden plover]

And they didn't want golos to be everywhere because you can just play any strategy with him

[sleek ferry]

While somebody else would be like “no, casual means no card in your deck is worth over $10”

[golden plover]

Gates? Sure
Tribal? Sure
Reanimator? Yup
Cheat in big stuff? Sure

[sleek ferry]

Saint, here’s the thing, golos wouldn’t make the 99 of most cedh decks.

[golden plover]

That's not the point

[sleek ferry]

And if you’re playing golos and claiming you’re playing casual edh then that’s an eyebrow raise to you

[golden plover]

The point is that he was too easy to put in the command zone for too many different decks

They banned him because you could just put him in and then do whatever you want with the 99

And Golos doesn't give you any idea of what that 99 is gonna be

[sleek ferry]

I mean, that’s fine? It encourages creative deck building.

Nothing that you’re saying is a bad thing

[golden plover]

Not really. It circles back around to the "too universally applicable" issue

There's a lot of more specific commanders that while golos was legal were "why would I play this when I can play golos and get access to more colors and still have the same gameplan"

[glad peak]

It’s the same problem we have with kenrith right now, there’s like 10 different variants of kenrith but only like 8 cards are different

[golden plover]

Yeah Kenrith sorta has the issue too, but he's not as bad about it

[sleek ferry]

I was about to say, kenrith does the same thing and is even more flexible than golos

[golden plover]

Golos being a colorless initial cast and helping you cheat out things made him more problematic

Well that and the ramp

[glad peak]

Golos is definitely more flexible being able to get any land

[golden plover]

Golos has a way more flexible package

There's 0 investment of anything you're forced to play to play Golos

Kenrith loses options if you're missing the color needed to cast them, and initially has to be cast for white

So if you don't see any white lands off the start, Kenrith is sitting in the zone until you do

[glad peak]

That’s just a player issue if you keep a hand that can’t cast your commander

[golden plover]

Golos didn't have that issue because you just had to see 5 lands, and you could tutor a color you're missing for his ability

I mean yeah, it's definitely a player issue

But it restricts Kenrith a bit more than golos

Hell, you could sometimes cast Golos on 1 off sol ring + crypt

Kenrith is still really strong, but Golos' issue was universal application

[languid quest]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F48lEuFtCv4&ab_channel=TolarianCommunityCollege

[golden plover]

https://mobile.twitter.com/LegalEagle/status/1606074082239213568

LegalEagle (@LegalEagle)

Happy holidays to everyone except people that play Portal to Phyrexia.

Likes

1637

Twitter · Dec 22, 2022, 11:47 PM

LeaglEagle doesn't run counterspells

[twilit canyon]

or artifact removal

[golden plover]

Isn't Abrade even in standard?

[sudden lava]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FkraJmWUUAAW5l6?format=jpg&name=900x900

[sudden lava]

best turn 1 commander play, land+sol ring

[golden plover]

Forgetting into mana crypt, into arcane signet, into commander

[languid quest]

what time we are living when Konami out of all companies is less greedy than WotC

[languid quest]

that's optimal but it doesn't always happen

[twilit canyon]

wrong

[glad peak]

Best turn 1 commander play is to win

[golden plover]

Usually not yeah

[twilit canyon]

theres plenty of t1 wins

[languid quest]

having 1 copy of each card among 99 does make it less likely to happen

[twilit canyon]

heres one: lotus petal dark rit arcane signet thoracle consult land

[glad peak]

Imagine being a lawyer and not knowing that you can stop portal to phyrexia

[twilit canyon]

u can replace signet with felwar if ur not going 1st, felwar with gemstone caverns if ur not going 1st

and tainted pact also works if you can generate an extra mana which shouldnt be out of the question with all the fast mana in the format

t1 kills arent the average but are not uncommon

another effective game ender

land sol ring crypt vault petal windfall/timetwister/wheel

you mulligan everyone except you took your 1st turn to develop cards in play

[sudden lava]

t1 kills in commander

[twilit canyon]

another t1: food chain, eternal scourge, dark ritual, mana crypt, lotus petal, land, wall of roots

if ukkima is your commander this instant kills

[twilit canyon]

yes is how the format works when played optimally and is the best t1 play

[glad peak]

Yes, commander is not a very fun format if you judge it through the lens of the random commander player

[sleek ferry]

Not true, casual edh is your normal street fight, cedh is more like dbz style fights

Unless you’re playing stax, then you turn dbz style fights into more of the naruto variety

[glad peak]

We are wizards throwing spells

[sleek ferry]

You’re a wizard

[sudden lava]

You're a nerd

[glad peak]

No u

[sudden lava]

ty

[glad peak]

You’re welcome

[copper pecan]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/948945461597831218/1055950083427942550/image.png?width=945&height=662

the ultimate combo

[lusty trench]

Choose a cup of water

[trail anvil]

ngl when I saw a folding chair and a wrestling themed card I thought this would end differently, but this is hilarious too

[hidden ermine]

I mean

It does also work for the meme

"By god its Slaying Mantis with a steel chair!"

[sudden lava]

Animate Object a blue-eyes white dragon

or better, a Magic the Gathering card

[golden plover]

This feels really underwhelming

I guess if you pay 5 and cheat out something cool for 6 mana, it's okay

[fallow citrus]

man this sucks

we get green suns zenith and twilight

nevermind i take back what i was about to say due to a lack of information

card seems very fine

as i like to say

standard playable

[trail anvil]

seems pretty standard playable but inferior to storm the festival for now?

[copper pecan]

doesn't storm need 3 pips of green though

[[storm the festival]]

[lost widget]

https://scryfall.com/card/mid/200/storm-the-festival

Storm the Festival <:mana3:292901508771610624><:manag:292901508654301185><:manag:292901508654301185><:manag:292901508654301185>

Sorcery
Look at the top five cards of your library. You may put up to two permanent cards with mana value 5 or less from among them onto the battlefield. Put the rest on the bottom of your library in a random order.
Flashback (You may cast this card from your graveyard for its flashback cost. Then exile it.)

[trail anvil]

unless you're trying to cheat something with 6+ mana cost, but I feel like there's not many good cards in standard like that rn

[copper pecan]

true

maybe something like city smasher?

[last glen]

Also Storm is flashback-able

[trail anvil]

titan of industry is the best example off the top of my head, but idk if that's superior to reanimating

[copper pecan]

realistically, when are you ever gonna flashback storm the festival

[trail anvil]

tbh monowhite midrange is a good deck in standard, so maybe vs that when the games go long?

[last glen]

surely some heavy monogreen ramp decks can

Storm is pay 6 to check top 5 and summon 2
Green Sun pay 6 checks top 7 to summon 1

or you can pay only 4 to check top 5, but you can't summon then

hrmmm

[trail anvil]

tbh I kinda wanna play storm rn

[last glen]

the festival or the mechanic?

[trail anvil]

the festival

lay down arms handles a lot of threats that I put out but idk midrange with green is so fun

[golden plover]

Storm is seeing play in pioneer

Because devotion

[glad peak]

twilight is fine

1 mana draw 1 with potential upside at 6 mana is always fine

[last glen]

Does green not have any other cantrips?

[languid quest]

[[harmonize]]

[lost widget]

https://scryfall.com/card/ncc/295/harmonize

Harmonize <:mana2:292901509060886528><:manag:292901508654301185><:manag:292901508654301185>

Sorcery
Draw three cards.
"Animals commune with their environment without the need for language. Theirs is a fundamental connection that surpasses flimsy words." —Vivien Reid

[glad peak]

Harmonize is not a cantrip

But yeah green has some cantrips

[last glen]

I misread Green Sun

It puts two cards into your hand or onto the field

But it must be one creature and one land

so best case scenarios are
pay 2, check 2, reveal a creature and land to put in your hand
or
Pay 6, check 6, summon a creature and a land

[golden plover]

Yeah it's sorta fine at 2 or 6, but you've gotta be lucky

[glad peak]

it's honestly fine at 1

6 is good case

[golden plover]

Depends on the deck

At 1 there's a good chance it whiffs

[zinc shard]

Spoiler from the latest Legen VD Video

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OXo7hWeD9tQ

[glad peak]

at 1 on turn 1 with 7 in the grip (if you built your deck right), there's about a 5.7% chance you whiff which is acceptable

[golden plover]

Kaito is safe

Also throws off them all being monocolor

[zinc shard]

interesting design

[golden plover]

He's pretty solid for a rare

This does add credence to "the mythics are compleated, the rares are safe"

[lusty trench]

He's actually really good for ninjas what the heck

Like better than his kamigawa card

[golden plover]

Yeah he's genuinely really solid

[lusty trench]

Alright so calling it now

It's gonna be just a zigzag pattern for the walkers

[golden plover]

I think I'm right in my list

[lusty trench]

It's either that or it's teyvar being converted and not Kaya

Cause we know ||nahiri is safe||

[lusty trench]

Nah I think wanderer will be fine tbh

[golden plover]

I think this is the end result

[lusty trench]

At any point she feels she's going to be converted she can just distract herself

And poof

[golden plover]

I disagree. Maximum drama is to split the Kamigawa duo

[lusty trench]

It is but the one it'd make more sense to convert is kaito

They also could've had Jace converted and not vraska for more drama

[golden plover]

Not if they're trying to do it based on color

[lusty trench]

My thoughts on it

[golden plover]

I could see it, but I think The Wanderer is more likely

[lusty trench]

I honestly think wanderer is too strong to give to the phyrexians

Like she's stupidly strong

As in she causes narrative problems by being on their side

Realistically only nahiri here would have a chance of facing her out of your selection

[waxen timber]

I feel like the wanderer wouldn't make sense lore wise. Her character arc was about her troubles to control herself and control her empire. It would be weird to then just turn her into someone who has control of her own body and controls her subordients absolutly.

[copper pecan]

yeah also i don't think she'd be able to stay on the plane for long enough for the phyrexians to compleate her in the first place

[clever sun]

He's kinda cracked huh

Resets ETBs and can potentially just draw two

Probably more than good enough

[golden plover]

Yeah the more I consider him, the more I realize he's really strong

[sleek ferry]

He’s really good, but still a 4 drop

I have to compare it to the other 3-4 drop planeswalkers I’m currently dropping in standard

[clever sun]

I think he's better than three mana Kaito in most cases

Unless your deck actually cares about the ult

[golden plover]

Yeah I think I'd rather him most of the time

[last glen]

Is Mana Confluence a real card?
It seems like decks with a lot of colors would want to play it.

[languid quest]

oh it's real alright

[fallow citrus]

it would be played in more things if it had land types

[copper pecan]

it would be busted if it had land types

imagine being able to get that with fetchlands

[fallow citrus]

well yeah

[languid quest]

it's basically better city of Brass since it deals you damage when you tap it for mana instead of when ever it's tapped

[last glen]

[city of brass]

[waxen holly]

Floowandereeze and the Dreaming Town

Effect

During the Main Phase: Immediately after this effect resolves, Normal Summon 1 Level 4 or lower Winged Beast monster. If you Tribute Summon a Level 7 or higher monster while this card is in your GY: You can banish this card; change all monsters your opponent controls to face-down Defense Position. You can only use this effect of "Floowandereeze and the Dreaming Town" once per turn.

F/L Status: Unlimited (TCG/OCG)

[fallow citrus]

it just isn't really played because it doesn't have land types which is big because you can't fetch it and it doesn't count towards domain for leyline binding, and burns you every time you tap it

[last glen]

[[city of brass]]

[lost widget]

https://scryfall.com/card/2x2/321/city-of-brass

City of Brass

Land
Whenever City of Brass becomes tapped, it deals 1 damage to you.
: Add one mana of any color.
"There is much to learn here, but few can endure the ringing of the spires." —Nulakam the Archivist

[fallow citrus]

most decks playing enough colours to warrant confluence are probably playing something like leyline binding

[glad peak]

Or in the case of decks that want to run it and don’t care about land types, there’s [[gemstone mine]]

[lost widget]

https://scryfall.com/card/dmr/247/gemstone-mine

Gemstone Mine

Land
Gemstone Mine enters the battlefield with three mining counters on it.
, Remove a mining counter from Gemstone Mine: Add one mana of any color. If there are no mining counters on Gemstone Mine, sacrifice it.

[glad peak]

It’s mostly not played due to taking too much damage when using it and because it lowers the amount of fetches/fetchable lands you can run in any deck

[trail anvil]

I kinda like the standard meta right now, it feels like there are more options than before this set

lay down arms is actually insane for white and they have a whole plethora of value creatures rn

you can actually pretty much run control with removal that efficient, and aggro is showing up in droves with monored

tempo showing up with monoblue is nice too

[sleek ferry]

Standard has been bomb for pretty much a calendar year

Don’t sleep

[trail anvil]

idk fam I wasn't about the whole format being midrange with esper or fable of the mirror breaker

actually it still kinda is in a way but still

[sleek ferry]

Well fable of the mirror breaker is an issue

But like it’s at that borderline point

Where it’s banworthy or not in standard

Other formats I’d imagine it’s way more insane

[trail anvil]

yeah it's weird cause like it's in a lot of decks but it doesn't feel overbearing like meathook did, it's just a huge value pile

[sleek ferry]

It’s because you need high value etb’s that take advantage of it, and the deck that has the most unfair etb’s rn is grixis

[trail anvil]

it's interesting cause while that has the best ETBs, white has the best sustained value and esper gets... raffine

[sleek ferry]

Yeah but infinite corpse appraisers/bloodtithe harvester just runs away with games

[golden plover]

Oh wow. That sure is a Christmas deal

10% off random packs

Wasnt the food sleeve basically free last Christmas?

And there was that 90% off draft token one holiday

[trail anvil]

man wotc why you do us like this

[sleek ferry]

Just lost when I had game

I’m rusty as hell, my sequencing is off

https://youtu.be/VtaggGTetcc

The guys doing non cedh content

[trail anvil]

I'm trying to take more time on turns cause I kept doing that too

[sleek ferry]

My rank just reset to the lowest, so my mind is on autopilot for these low elo games

High key going to switch to anvil rakdos with mechanized warfare, that seems funny enough

[trail anvil]

what are you grinding with out of curiosity

[sleek ferry]

I’m on grixis

But I had game with the x6 grixis artifact with tithe already on board

I just forgot to cast the grixis artifact first

Before using tithe

[trail anvil]

bladecoil serpent?

[sleek ferry]

Yeah that thing

[trail anvil]

rip

I'm so glad this card is seeing use btw, I figured it could be a nice top end when it was revealed

it was pretty hard to gauge what was going to end up in the meta before tbh

[sleek ferry]

I don’t feel as if the meta changed much tbh

Grixis, rakdos, mono white and mono red improved/held their spots in the meta

[last glen]

man is it even worth buying packs at 10% off when I don't have a lot of gold

trying to save up for if osmething I do want goes on sale

[sleek ferry]

Usually you can save 2k and get anything that goes on sale

[golden plover]

It's almost all mediocre rotated packs too

Strixhaven is good at least

[sudden lava]

https://youtu.be/UVf0KDitnLA

[languid quest]

it's always nice to see some budget decks that are also good decks

and people say that you can't get good for cheap

[glad peak]

That deck seems… bad

[sleek ferry]

I used to recommend commander quarters to people first getting into commander, but ever since Mitch went all bat shit crazy over the walking dead cards I stopped recommending it to people

We don’t need people in this game that are going to be irrationally negative

[rigid scarab]

You know what

No

I want Sol Ring to stay legal

In EDH

What an early Sol Ring does is instigate action early

And get the game moving

Without the lead being so overbearing that the other players can't posibly slow the Sol Ring player down

[sleek ferry]

People don’t like action in edh for some god forsaken reason

They rather play 50-60 minute snail pace games

[glad peak]

I want mana vault, crypt, and jeweled lotus to be printed to the ground to facilitate early action

[lusty trench]

Honestly have 0 clue why jeweled lotus is so expensive

It's a good card... In the decks that actually want it and can use it well, but man I have never used it enough for it to matter

[golden plover]

I'd be fine with all the expensive necessary cards being printed into the ground, would even out the format more

https://www.reddit.com/r/EDH/comments/zw8oip/ban_list_is_a_joke/

This is the funniest post

Like yeah, the Edh banlist is awful, but banning stuff like Bolas' Citadel is somehow worse

They don't get a single reason a card is banned right, and also call for banning Satoru Umezawa

Lmao and unbanning [[Erayo]]

[lost widget]

https://scryfall.com/card/sok/35/erayo-soratami-ascendant-erayos-essence

Erayo, Soratami Ascendant <:mana1:292901508373282827><:manau:292901508754702338>

Legendary Creature — Moonfolk Monk
Flying
Whenever the fourth spell of a turn is cast, flip Erayo, Soratami Ascendant.
1/1

Erayo's Essence
Legendary Enchantment
Whenever an opponent casts their first spell each turn, counter that spell.

[merry owl]

are there any interesting ways to run zur the enchanter? got a copy of it and would rather not let it sit

[trail anvil]

you can do 5c for a 1-mana flash o-ring

and other 5c general good stuff like the kami saga

[merry owl]

5c? like putting him in the 99?

[trail anvil]

nah like in standard, but you can run him in brawl if you want

[twilit canyon]

zur the enchanter is the og zur

[twilit canyon]

doomsday combos is pretty broken

[merry owl]

yeah doomsday is cool, though i'm digging for some weirder wincons

[twilit canyon]

heliod ballista is a zur combo too

[[heliod sun crowned]]

[lost widget]

https://scryfall.com/card/thb/18/heliod-sun-crowned

Heliod, Sun-Crowned <:mana2:292901509060886528><:manaw:1007102126813610074>

Legendary Enchantment Creature — God
Indestructible
As long as your devotion to white is less than five, Heliod isn't a creature.
Whenever you gain life, put a +1/+1 counter on target creature or enchantment you control.
: Another target creature gains lifelink until end of turn.
5/5

[glad peak]

The edh banlist is a joke but damn this is a funnier joke

[copper pecan]

love how op didn't at all realize that people would try to get griselbrand onto the field without casting it

[granite badge]

"sol ring was created for commander" well gee wonder what format this person started playing in

and what timeframe

this dude just screams "I started playing edh, I only play edh, and I have never once touched any other format"

banning a card cause "its expensive" is also a lol take

[fallow citrus]

lmfao this person does not understand the game

[granite badge]

if you ban a card purely on price it'll go down because demand plumments and then people can buy it for cheap

but then the moment it gets unbanned the demand goes back up(arguably higher than what it was before because now you likely have more people that want it and less copies in circulation from people that bought low)

[copper pecan]

penny dreadful is a fun format but i wouldn't want an actual widely played format to be run like that

if there are enough people playing that kind of format it would very quickly cause all of the good cards to be banned

[glad peak]

Wait wasn’t griselbrand banned because of it as a commander?

[golden plover]

I think this one is my favorite actually. It's so off

[glad peak]

I can’t remember the history of it

[golden plover]

Nah, you reanimated it

You've got much more life to pay in commander

[glad peak]

I know you can reanimate it but wasn’t it first banned as commander back when that was a thing?

Also I know, I play necropotence

[golden plover]

Either way, Grislebrand was an issue all around in commander

[lusty trench]

Return him to the format, I am not saying this because I am a reainmator player

[glad peak]

Honestly I’m fine with him in the format

[lusty trench]

Do it, I can be trusted with griselbrand

I will not reanimate him turn 2 and draw my entire deck

[golden plover]

I think it's for the best he stays gone, but it's reanimator now and not in the command zone

[glad peak]

Create another variant of black deck other than ad naus

[golden plover]

I love that the dude wanted to ban [[Bolas'Citadel]] tho

[lost widget]

https://scryfall.com/card/war/79/bolass-citadel

Bolas's Citadel <:mana3:292901508771610624><:manab:292901508872273920><:manab:292901508872273920><:manab:292901508872273920>

Legendary Artifact
You may look at the top card of your library any time.
You may play lands and cast spells from the top of your library. If you cast a spell this way, pay life equal to its mana value rather than pay its mana cost.
, Sacrifice ten nonland permanents: Each opponent loses 10 life.

[glad peak]

You can already do something similar turn 1

[lusty trench]

Tell me

I can be trusted with this knowledge

[golden plover]

That was like the most possibly logical thing he said, and then he gave the wackiest reason

[glad peak]

[[ad nauseum]]

[lost widget]

No card found for “ad nauseum”

[glad peak]

[[ad naus]]

[lost widget]

https://scryfall.com/card/2xm/76/ad-nauseam

Ad Nauseam <:mana3:292901508771610624><:manab:292901508872273920><:manab:292901508872273920>

Instant
Reveal the top card of your library and put that card into your hand. You lose life equal to its mana value. You may repeat this process any number of times.
When the task spilled over into undeath, he stopped calling it his life's work.

[golden plover]

"You worldfire into a grapeshot"

How often does that happen

[lusty trench]

So how does this work you just run a bunch of mana rocks and fast mana draw your entire deck then thassas?

[golden plover]

Because I can think of a lot more realistic ways to abuse citadel

[lusty trench]

I stand by thassas was a mistake and makes the format worse

But I am not above using it

[golden plover]

Yeah Thassa's needs to go

[glad peak]

You draw as many cards as you need, play mana rocks, then play an infinite with anything + a ton of protection

[lusty trench]

[golden plover]

I'll use it where I can, but it's a problem card

I'm also teching [[Angel's Grace]] into things now to stop it

[lost widget]

https://scryfall.com/card/tsr/4/angels-grace

Angel's Grace <:manaw:1007102126813610074>

Instant
Split second (As long as this spell is on the stack, players can't cast spells or activate abilities that aren't mana abilities.)
You can't lose the game this turn and your opponents can't win the game this turn. Until end of turn, damage that would reduce your life total to less than 1 reduces it to 1 instead.

[lusty trench]

Had a guy show up to my lgs

Every deck they played

Always had a thassas loop in it

Always had all the tutors

[golden plover]

It's the most efficient win in the format

But yeah, fuck that card

[lusty trench]

They'd swap out the commander multiple times

[golden plover]

Thoracle needs to go

[lusty trench]

And every time for a while we were like Charlie brown to a football

[golden plover]

Dockside needs to go too, but Thoracle should have been banned in 2020

I'll laugh my ass off if they ban Elesh Norn before Thoracle

[lusty trench]

I will actually cry

Especially since most of the best decks don't care about etb effects that much

[glad peak]

Not enough people beat Sheldon with thoracle

[lusty trench]

Brb gonna beat him with storm crow

[golden plover]

I'm gonna find Sheldon and kick his ass with Thoracle over and over

Until he bans it

Also, have you seen his decks? No wonder he wants to ban Norn

Dude runs NO INTERACTION

[lusty trench]

Wait seriously?

[golden plover]

Yup

[glad peak]

Of course he doesn’t

He’s a commander player

[lusty trench]

I mean I run no interaction either but that's cause I'm bad and rely on the other players to deal with it all

[golden plover]

He had some Esper deck with a counterspell and a cyclonic rift

[lusty trench]

(and they do)

[golden plover]

That's the only two pieces of interaction in the entire deck

[lusty trench]

Damn

[golden plover]

Like bro, just Doom Blade it

[glad peak]

Meanwhile I can’t play a deck without 40 pieces of interaction

[lusty trench]

Not even a damnation wrath of God?

Toxic deluge

[golden plover]

I think he had a wrath

But I don't count sweepers

[lusty trench]

That's fair specific interaction is important too

[golden plover]

Yeah, I can't build a deck without as much interaction as possible

[lusty trench]

No solitude?

[glad peak]

Sweepers are interaction

[golden plover]

In Rogarkh/Yoshimaru, I run Pyroblast, Red Elemental Blast, Trickery, and both White Counterspells

[glad peak]

Stax pieces are interaction

[golden plover]

Technically yes, but they're a different category and you don't always wanna use them to kill a single target

[lusty trench]

I talk to people as my interaction

Politics mechanics are fun

Thinking of condensing some my decks to just their best parts

[glad peak]

Oh have I got a deck for your parasitic self

[golden plover]

Oh the Esper one is WAY WORSE than I thought

Count the interaction here

[glad peak]

[[old stickfingers]] with only 1 creature in deck

[lost widget]

https://scryfall.com/card/mid/234/old-stickfingers

Old Stickfingers <:manax:292901509082120202><:manab:292901508872273920><:manag:292901508654301185>

Legendary Creature — Horror
When you cast this spell, reveal cards from the top of your library until you reveal X creature cards. Put all creature cards revealed this way into your graveyard, then put the rest on the bottom of your library in a random order.
Old Stickfingers's power and toughness are each equal to the number of creature cards in your graveyard.
*/*

[golden plover]

1 card?

[glad peak]

Yep

[golden plover]

I was counting the interaction

There's an sweeper

And path

Oh and swords

[lusty trench]

How does this work?

[golden plover]

So 3 whole cards in the 99

Okay this is Sheldon's "signature deck"

There are 3 sweepers and exactly 0 targeted removal

No wonder this man is so afraid of Norn

[glad peak]

Oh I guess dryad arbor is a creature too

But there’s a whole combo you can do with razaketh and 20 life

Leading to a professor onyx + chain of smog combo kill

[lusty trench]

I'll consider it

Tempted to rebuild atraxa but I don't like the attention playing atraxa gets

[glad peak]

People will talk about how cool old stickfingers is

Until you kill them turn 2

[golden plover]

Atraxa is fun, too bad she's also hated on site

[sleek ferry]

Casual players be like: what do you mean you can cheat out high cost stuff

[copper pecan]

casual players be like

"what the heck is monster reborn"

[sudden lava]

same

[glad peak]

I want turn 1 collector ouphe every game

See? We can’t all get what we want

[copper pecan]

i want them to reprint dreadmaw in caverns of ixalan

[glad peak]

That’s actually very likely

[copper pecan]

if it doesn't happen i will genuinely be surprised

[golden plover]

I'm like 75% sure we'll get it

[lusty trench]

Dreadmaw retrain at legendary

[golden plover]

They unironically might

[copper pecan]

[[vorinclex, monstrous invader]] was the real dreadmaw retrain all along

[lost widget]

https://scryfall.com/card/khm/199/vorinclex-monstrous-raider

Vorinclex, Monstrous Raider <:mana4:292901508712890379><:manag:292901508654301185><:manag:292901508654301185>

Legendary Creature — Phyrexian Praetor
Trample, haste
If you would put one or more counters on a permanent or player, put twice that many of each of those kinds of counters on that permanent or player instead.
If an opponent would put one or more counters on a permanent or player, they put half that many of each of those kinds of counters on that permanent or player instead, rounded down.
6/6